Are you listening? Well, welcome to Hey, Are
You Listening? This is a podcast exploring the
past, present and future of Christian music.
My name is Joel. I'm here with my good friend
Brandon. We connected over a mutual love of some
particular audits, but also have some pretty
different tastes when it comes to things. And
so we get to experience new stuff from each other
while inviting some friends along for the ride.
Brandon, you doing all right today? I'm doing
great. It's a beautiful sunny day down here in
South Carolina, which is awesome. And today is
an exciting one for us because we do have a special
guest with us. And so you may know him as the
creator of Tooth and Nail News on your favorite
social media. Join us today in welcoming Cameron
George. All right. What's up? Hey, man. Thanks
for having me. We are super pumped. This is really
awesome to be able to have you on you reached
out to us and I was immediately like, oh my goodness,
I follow that site that shows up in my feed like
every day, which is really, really cool. So it's
awesome that you reached out to us. And how did
you find out about the podcast? Just I was looking
for an episode talking about the hunger because.
I needed one as I was going to do an episode
myself as a guest And came across your guys.
You were the only one that had one and I listened
to I was like I like this So I listened to a
little bit more and it's like that's how you
guys had the thing I was like, well, I might
as well reach out. I'm looking to get on more
podcasts. I enjoy doing it. So that's really
cool Yeah, I can't wait to hear your take on
the hunger too. So that'll be fun when you mention
that Joel I was trying to go back and be like
man. I hope that's an album I liked I think you
were kind of meh on it. Maybe a little positive,
but maybe. Yeah, I don't know, Brandon. I, you
know, you just never know. So we'll see how it
goes. Um, well, Cameron, man, again, just thank
you. We're super pleased to have you on. And,
um, we're going to kind of jump into this thing
by talking about what's in the news. So it seems
kind of silly for us to do a new segment when
we have a news guy On the podcast and so I asked
you Cameron if you might be willing just to run
our new segment and tell us What's going on out
there? Okay, so take it away All right, here
are some of the biggest headlines of the last
month. These are the ones that I covered Beginning
of February. We saw the blamed announced that
they were working on a new album for 2026 Family
Force five also tease new music and were announced
for warp tour, which is pretty big for me. I'm
excited for that Haste Today announced their
new album dissenter and then idle threat also
announced a new album. You'll forget the Sun
Mmm, another one. I'm definitely excited for
me to meet you. It's gonna be so good Jason Dunn
of Hawk Nelson announced formerly known as his
new album that's coming out in May We got August
brings red released the first single of their
upcoming album that is still Untitled at the
time of recording this The dingy's announced
their album Armageddon massive on vinyl with
unoriginal. I pre -ordered that I did not but
I'm really wanting to Ronnie Martin of Joy Electric
Launched his new podcast rambles with Ronnie
Sent by Ravens kind of launched their comeback
with getting announced for louder than life festival,
which is cool and also announced new music Josh
Porter from show bread released his new book
It's a long title and I'm not going to read it
all And then lastly I've got Ethan Luck who is
in a handful of tooth and nail and solid state
bands announced his new album give up the ghost
That's really cool. What which so you I know
you mentioned a couple that you're pumped about
but yeah What why tell me about those that you're
really excited about? Family force five. That's
just a big nostalgia thing for me. I'm Was like
huge into them like middle school age like when
they were just kind of ending their career there
and so That's super exciting. I'm excited to
see them do a new stuff. I got to talk with Solomon
the singer a little bit, but I'm not going to
say anything more than that because I don't I
do one. I don't have any huge news and two, I
don't want to say anything too soon for them.
Brandon is like thirsty right now after you said
that. He's off the record. Yeah. But then the
other one, I'm really excited for Idle Threat.
They're just. Awesome. I love their music. I'm
stoked for their new album. I recently just did
an episode of Tooth and Nail Alumni React to
New School Tooth and Nail Music. And I got to
play the new song, Evermind, for Adam Knight,
who's in Craig's brother in Too Bad Eugene. He's
like, man, this is good. I'm like, right? So,
yeah. Love love that new song and I love their
blurred visions album so much I got I saw them
at furnace fest a year and a half ago Yeah, a
year and a half ago and was just blown away by
them and also just like how cool of guys they
are Yeah getting to meet them. So I'm really
yeah, they're really sweet guys. I did the trivia
night October last year and I reach out to them
as if they'd want to be They want to donate any
merch for prizes and they're like, yeah, and
they sent me a few different things. That was
really cool. That's really awesome. I love that.
I love that. Yeah. Brandon's been really excited
about the family force five thing too. Um, yeah,
Brandon is, I think last time we talked about
on the podcast, it was more of just like something's
happening. Yeah. There was rumblings. There was
random like Catholics being posted on Instagram
or whatnot. Yeah. And we know more now, right?
Yeah. So yeah, it's really exciting. For me,
Family Force V, I got into them in, it would
have been like 2007. So it's when they were just
released their extended version of Business Up
Front. And I feel like that's cool. So for you,
were you, did you get into them when like Solomon
was still like fronting the band or when like
Crouton, which by the way, Joel really likes
when I just start, Joel's like, are you making
these up? Um, were you like into it whenever
soul glow was there or like whenever crouton
got in like was that the version of family force
5 that you hopped into I was right in between
Like I got into them around the time that chainsaw
came out since like 2013 2012 something like
that. So right around there Yes, they were pretty
hot right off of three coming out and everything
and then I was pretty devastated That soul go
left the band and then but I was it was cool
to be into a band as they were releasing a new
album And so they put out time standstill and
I love that album I don't know if it holds up
as well now But I really loved it then just because
my favorite band was putting out a new album
at the time I described it to jill that And I
you you might disagree or agree with this, but
I feel like family force 5 They're like the the
star wars of like music where i feel like each
of their like kind of like there's these three
distinct ones where it's like the business up
front era then you have like the dancer die to
three and then you have like the time still like
stand still and it's like there's some people
that are like man all of it's amazing there's
some people that's like well no this these three
years were amazing and i feel like family force
five is just it was a band that was always like
kind of like like evolving and like trying different
stuff and so I feel like it's always interesting
for people who were like you know for me where
it was like kind of on this front end of it then
you have people like on the back end of it where
they're like you know the more of the last album
stuff My favorite thing though about this whole
thing is, I think in our second episode we covered
a Family Force V album, their second record,
right? Yeah. Love that album. And so I'm like,
I know this is one of Brandon's favorite bands.
He's just going to be over the moon for this.
And then he gave it like a two and a half out
of five. And I'm like, oh, I thought you loved
these guys. It's a really complicated relation.
So Brandon falls into the category of someone
who really loves an era of a band. No, that's
funny. The answer to that is probably my favorite
for the first five album. That's how I wanted
on vinyl. That was my holy grail. And I spent
more money on it than I probably should have.
But it's cool to have. That was I bought it when
it when they first released it. So I got it for
like probably twenty twenty five dollars and
I got it and I didn't even own a record player.
So the first year I had it, it was just like
sit in my room and I was like. Man, so I wonder
how those things work. And then finally I found
like a, I think someone was selling a record
player for like $2 at the flea market. And I
was like, all right, there we go. Now I can go
home and listen to this. And then you're like,
I'm just going to drop this needle. How does
this work? I still have no, I love vinyl so much.
I have no idea how it really works. It's fascinating.
Cool. Well, Cameron, thanks for walking us through
the news and what's going on. Let's talk a little
bit about what we've been listening to lately.
What are things that you guys have been spending
time listening to that you've enjoyed? I'll go
ahead, I guess. Seven day Jesus has been a big
one for me because I did that last podcast It's
just been in my rotation recently, but I listen
I went back and listened to their second album
a little more It's like, oh, it's not as bad
as I think I remember being pretty good Audio
adrenaline has been big. I don't know where it
came from. I just gotten this kick for like 90s
audio adrenaline So that's all I've been listening
to some Copeland obviously idle threat. I'm excited
and then specifically a song By hunter plake.
He's on bec right now called west coast babies
and there's just something about that song that's
just Hit just right. I've had it on repeat lately.
Mm -hmm. That's awesome um Yeah, the 70 jesus
thing. I remember as when I was younger and super
into them um, the hunger was like a perfect album
in my estimation at that point in time and so
when The second record the forefront record came
out. I'm like, what is this super polished garbage?
Like what did they do? Um, but now I go back
and listen to that album and i'm like, this is
really good So, I don't know. I maybe I was too
mean to it Yeah, absolutely. I definitely was
but I love I love both of those records for their
own their own unique things branded would much
more be a fan of the second album The self -titled,
you know me That's cool. So I was curious when
you brought audio adrenaline um, so is it kind
of just going to their catalog and hitting like
shuffle or is there like a particular album that
you've gravitated more towards or You know, I
so I started off with this like i'm gonna listen
to all the albums So I just I started well I
skipped the first one because I couldn't do it.
I just couldn't it's too hip -hopy for me and
it's not my thing Uh, so that I just went from
there and listened up through is it world? Why
is it what that was called? I think I listened
through to that one And then i've just kind of
gone back and forth here and there to certain
songs now I actually spent time listening to
to um bloom because they just had the 30th anniversary
for that Um, and that's probably my favorite
audio adrenaline record because it's like a rock
and roll record Yeah, more so than like the rest
of their stuff and yeah, that's good. The guitar
works phenomenal Um, yeah, I love that album.
I'm pretty divided between bloom and some kind
of a zombie. Yeah, I like both those. I do I
do too. Yeah, that's good Brandon, what about
you? What have you been listening to? Uh, so
it's not a it's It's not a new release, but it
is his new release It's one of those albums that
you know, like you're listening to it one day
then the next day It just mysteriously disappears
from all platforms And you're like, oh, why did
that happen? Um So The Last Bison, they released
an EP about 10, 11 years ago called Dorado. And
I think it was after, I want to say it was after
they released their VA album. And it was just
like incredible. And I don't know what it is
about Last Bison. I mean, their albums are good,
but I feel like their EPs are just, it's like
you give them four songs and they give you something
that's perfect. And so it's been really cool
because there was a couple of like tracks from
there that I'd been thinking a lot about recently
and just thought like, man, I wish that there
was a way I could have like bought this or whatever.
And so I got the EP from them when they were
selling them back in December. And but they announced
they were releasing it. And I feel like it's
just easier to listen to something like streaming
versus like finding somewhere to put the CD in.
And so it was just really cool to kind of get
to listen to those and like kind of like. Transport
back to like 2015 so it's like in the middle
of college and you're finding this amazing band
and all that stuff So I've been having that on
pretty much non -stop. That's cool. I love that
I feel like we're still in that phase of when
is new music really gonna start hitting? And
so I've kind of been struggling with what to
listen to that's new, but I put together a playlist
a couple of years ago that I keep adding to on
Apple Music called Christians Rock. And so it's
not like Christian Rock, but it's rock music
by Christians. And I was listening to it the
other day, and anytime I feel like I'm in a...
kind of a lull I'll like throw that playlist
on and then it'll take me to I'm like oh I need
to go listen to that record by that band and
so the one that it drew me to that I've spent
a lot of time with is one of my favorite albums
by 238 regulate the chemicals and I just have
spent a ton of time listening to that record
and that's a band that my band got to tour with
several times just phenomenal phenomenal band
and maybe One of my favorite albums of all time.
So I really would take it down, but i'm afraid
i'm not gonna get back on the wall, but I have
a poster Like a touring poster of uh, you should
be living. Oh, that's awesome. That's awesome
That's one of my favorite albums. I love you
should be living. I have a I have um an end An
end of 238 poster, um from Basically like some
of their last shows with my band like on the
lineup of the poster for that day It's like it's
a treasure for me. It's hanging up in my upstairs.
Yeah So, um, yeah me and that band was incredible
and phenomenal live just unbelievable. So Awesome.
Well, let's check the mail Well our question
today Comes from Jordan Brandon. You might know
this person. I've met her a few times friend
of the show Jordan asks what artists alive or
dead? If you could see them in concert like go
back and see them at any point or stage in their
career Like what what show would you want to
go to? Who's an artist and what stage in there
in their kind of career as a musician? What would
you want to jump into? I've, uh, I've thought
a lot about this so I can go first and let you
guys take some time to think through it. Now
I was trying to think through for me, um, what
it would be. And I think honestly, I'm going
to go with the, the artist who's passed, um,
just as an opportunity, but for me, it would
probably be rich Mullins, um, that if I could
go see rich Mullins on like, a tour from the
era of Liturgy Legacy and Ragamuffin Band with
his full band. I just feel like that would be
incredible and I never got to see Rich live and
I hate that I missed that opportunity. That's
one that one that I'll never get back for sure.
I think the two that came to mind for me and
I tried to think of people like like a Hat and
Zine because honestly that Comey Without You
show if they were doing a reunion tour Like if
they announced it tomorrow, I'd go buy a ticket.
But Rich Mullins came to mind and more I feel
like it's it's almost less of the concert and
more of I'd love to just like chat with them
afterwards. Like at the merch table. Yeah. And
get to hang out. And another band that like like
is this band called Children 18 .3 and they were
on Tooth and Nell and like the like late 2000s
and um it was like three siblings and they like
toured close to here like one time and i wasn't
able to go to it and um i've been revisiting
some of their music and i feel like it was just
such a cool like just a cool band and um once
again i feel like i feel like for me the show's
cool but i'd love just like chat with them afterwards
so like that's that's the caveat is it's like
If I can chat with them afterwards i'm going
with this one, but um brandon Maybe we can track
them down and have them on the podcast. I've
thought about reaching out to them. Yeah, so
it'd be cool It could be uh the I don't remember
her name, but the girl that was in the band She's
pretty active on social media from what i've
seen. So, you know, there's a chance Lisa if
you're listening this Awesome Cameron, what about
you? Okay, this is this is tough Um, I would
have like prior to last year would have said
as cities burn But then I finally got to see
them last year open for emery and that was super
cool. That's all that is my all -time favorite
band. So um I think i'm gonna go with zeo but
in the blood and fire era Okay, like with brett
on guitar and stuff. Like I think that would
be the band I would want to see There's just
something about their shows like I hate watching
the videos cuz I kind of just get jealous Like
I wish I would have been there to see them one
time and my dad actually saw them Like right
as Julianna theory was starting. Mm -hmm. So
it would have been like shortly after Brett lost
the band Yeah, which we can dig more into that
later about my dad being into Tooth and Nail
and that's what got me into it. But yes, I Yeah,
I probably I could have easily picked a Brett
lineup, but it would have been Juliana Theory
for me, for sure. I I remember one time I drove
three hours from Jackson, Mississippi to Birmingham,
Alabama to see the Juliana Theory play. And and
they canceled like I was thinking as we got there.
They canceled. They totally canceled. And we
were so so bummed about that. And so I never
got to like see them in like the heyday. Um,
but I have been able to see them I think twice
at furnace fest So thanks to furnace fest. Um,
yep, you know really awesome rest in peace furnace
fest. Oh man Yeah, that's a whole conversation
for yeah, there's a whole nother episode. Yeah,
I need to make a correction real fast Okay, her
name was lee marie. Okay, so if Lee, if you are
listening to this, I want you to apologize for
two minutes ago when I got your name wrong. It's
good, Brandon. Yeah, we don't want to we don't
want to hurt the chances of that happening. So
you imagine the odds of like if you did have
someone listening and that was what they like
the one time John Rubin listens is the one time
I don't mention like, I'd love to see him live.
Right. He's like, yes, he doesn't want to see
me anymore. Yeah, let's just start listening
off every single band we'd ever want to see.
And then we'll get him on the podcast. We definitely
have names that get repeated a lot. on here so
it's pretty funny but all right Brandon I hear
you have a game for us today so let's let's get
into that and let's play yeah so today's game
you know as we sometimes do we've stumbled upon
some secret news So today's prompt is we have
found out that tooth and now is Releasing some
new merchandise for some of their current artists
as well as alumni. All right, okay and we're
gonna have you and Cameron you're gonna be the
The secret shoppers or just give some feedback.
Okay, so I'm gonna give you some products that
are totally real these But they need your help
to pre -order them Alright our Nick our first
um one is it is an album called Hawk to the chief
It is Hawk Nelson releases a compilation album
featuring songs about each US president So there
is a pop punk song dedicated to each of our presidents
Do you think that's are you pre -ordering that
or do you feel like tooth and nail Hawk Nelson
should not be releasing an album? How interested
are you tooth and nail Hawk Nelson? Yeah I originally
thought that this was going to be Hog Nelson
covering the Radiohead record. Yeah. So I don't
know. That might be more interesting to me, but,
um, um, I mean, I'm sure there are thousands
of people that would jump on this if it came
out. So sure. I mean, yeah. It would be a hit.
Yes, that's the thing. Personally, I don't know
if I'd buy it, but I could get behind it, I guess.
I feel like I would immediately go to the most
obscure present I could think of, just to be
like, what did they find? Because you know those
are probably going to be the best ones as you're
like, yeah, let's see what Taft was doing. Next
one. It is MXPX Marks the Spot, a treasure hunting
board game where you find the secret to what
is punk. So it's a board game a pirate themed
MXPX board game Let's say $40 is what they're
gonna charge for it. Does it come with an album
or is it just a board game? Just a board game
You know, I think I could go for that it's a
cool novelty item yeah, I Can't imagine I'm shocked
that honestly this would happen considering.
I think there's pretty good Bad blood between
mxpx and tooth and nail at this point but uh
Yeah, I would I would buy it if I if the figurines
are like little like a little my career A little
yuri like i'm in. Yeah, that'd be pretty cool.
Yeah, that'd be awesome I will say at this point
for transparency each of these products I was
making up was something I would buy because it
reminded me of like years ago. They made like
john rubin toilet paper and they were selling
it for 50 dollars a roll and I sometimes I regret
not buying a roll of it And so I felt like the
next ones I had to step up and be like, okay
How can I put a twist to where it's not not like
the coolest product? Okay. Gotcha. Um, so the
next one is star flyer 59 ounce branded energy
drinks So 59 ounces of star flyer themed energy,
uh featuring flavors such as blueberry collar
and minor key lime splash Those titles are awesome
Yeah, I think the boys at a corporate they I've
only had one energy drink my entire life, but
I would 100 % buy that Probably that's sitting
on a shelf versus drinking just a half gallon
can Yeah, I'd probably buy it but same thing
it might sit on a shelf for a very long time
All right. Next up we have slick shoes laces
Each pair features the band logo and a guarantee
that these shoelaces will never stay tied They're
just too slick Um Slick shoes is my favorite
punk band. Uh -huh. Um, but I Yeah, I don't know.
I don't know how I would display laces And I
probably wouldn't put them on my shoes. So that's
probably one that I would be like I don't have
to buy that one Yeah, I don't know man, you know,
I think maybe you get I think vans Sells shoes
with like blue flames on them. So they kind of
look like burnout and you lay some on a pair
of those There's a good display. I'd I'd buy
them for that reason so I could display them
on some burnout shoes All right, uh oc super
soaker, uh, each blast features a song resembling,
uh the blair of five trumpets and horns And you
cannot turn it off I'm sold All right The classic
crime True crime starter kit the members of the
bands will help you through it so you can become
the best local sleuth in your neighborhood So
the members of the band are walking you through
how to become a true crime Leader well I'll just
be honest in that, um, as the old guy in the
room right now, um, classic crime was a little
like they were in a phase that I wasn't like
paying as close of attention. Um, and so I never
really got, I just never really got into their
stuff or listen to them. So, um, I don't have
any nostalgic reason to buy that, but just for
the true crime, I love true crime. So I might
buy it just for that reason. You know, I saw
them live last year. They're pretty cool. I'll
buy it. All right our final reason only You imagine
walking up to the merch booth like at a concert
and you'd have like here's your $30 t -shirt
Here's like maybe a ten fifteen dollar like CD
and then here's just this like hundred dollar
true crime kit All right, the last one is the
may ever glow nightlight a nightlight that glows
glows brighter and brighter with each day No
batteries or power needed. It just mysteriously
glows. It keeps getting brighter. Yeah, every
single day it gets brighter. There's nothing
you can do to turn it off. That is quite the
item. I I think that's pretty awesome. I definitely
do you have to plug it in or is it just It just
like it just glows it just glows. I you know,
it's kind of convenient Don't plug it in, you
know energy saving I guess but yeah, can we use
it to solve the energy crisis? You probably could
I mean you like you'd probably find but once
you give it like passed it down to your kids
It's probably gonna start like, you know Shooting
through like like is me a laser just like shooting
through the light of a thousand sons Yeah, I
mean the everglow is one of my favorite records
of all time. So I'm probably a yes This potentially
like life -threatening cool Brandon, thank you
It's good to know what tooth and nail is spending
their time and energy on these days They could
work a little harder at getting records out faster
that I don't throughout records been in the works
for a while Come on Brandon Just get on it. No,
I'm not you Brandon. Yeah at first I was I was
like y 'all see what I can do I'm just helping
a market. I'm not really in the hardy deployment
of the yeah, gotcha. Gotcha. All right Well,
let's transition and get into our conversation
about tooth and nail news Well Cameron again,
man, it's a joy to have you on I've enjoyed talking
about this stuff already but kind of want to
just get your story and how you got into this
and What it's led to and what's going on with
with tooth and nail news But just to kind of
kick things off. Tell us a little bit about yourself
Yeah Well, obviously I love music. I love tooth
and nail stuff. That's kind of my my niche I
grew up around music My dad has always been in
music, like whatever churches were a part of,
both my parents were usually in music, and then
my parents had a youth ministry in the 90s, and
so obviously tooth and nail was a big part of
that, and so I grew up with a lot of this, and
I'm a musician myself. I mainly play drums, but
I play some other stuff, and a lot of this stuff
that I do with tooth and nail just kind of plays
into my background and my love for music. That's
cool. That's cool. So like what what kind of
led to having that like love of music? Like where
did it take from where you were like? Oh like
this this sounds good or whatever to like man
I want to I want to be a part of this like I
don't want to just like put a CD on and listen
I want to like be a part of this world. Yeah
You know, I remember being very little like listening
to striper was like huge for me Which is funny
being you know, I was In the two thousands in
an elementary school listening to striper. That's
awesome. But you know stuff like that and you
know, like I said, my parents were listening
to it all the time and so it never really like
I was into it. It was awesome. I loved music
just The idea of music and everything and then
when I got into middle school band was an option
I was like well I want to play drums like my
dad So that's what kind of started becoming a
little more real in that sense like mm -hmm Oh,
well, I can do what they're doing and so as I
got into high school, you know I started the
band and wanted to do more stuff with music and
it just became more important because I'm like
I Love what they're doing. What if I did it?
Mm -hmm. So you've got a dad who's Was like a
youth pastor in the 90s teeth and nails a big
part of it um, so obviously it's playing kind
of in your In in the background of your life
like in a lot of ways But how did how did that
really become something? Because I play music
for my kids all the time. They're 11 and 12 And
uh, they're getting to the stage where they just
kind of roll their eyes when I play like what
I want um, they want to listen to forest frank
or whatever but um, what like how how did you
begin to like fall in love with a thing that
you're dad loved you know honestly like i i can't
look back on it and have like a like it clicked
there was just at some point as i was getting
in music i liked more of that stuff uh you know
i had a dc talk phase so that was big for me
we all did yeah yeah it happens to the best of
us uh um but you know i remember as i was playing
music and my dad's trying to get me into stuff
it was just kind of That almost a natural progression
of things. I grew up around it. I Remember actually
I remember I went to a garage sale and I bought
my dad a disciple CD It was scars remain and
I that was his Christmas gift that year and he
picked me up the one day from school and Had
it play in the car. I'm like dude. This sucks.
I don't like this. He's screaming It's not my
thing and then about a year later That was when
I started getting to the same use. I'm like,
I'm sorry dad, you know, this is actually really
good. I I think one of my very, like, biggest
memories I remember of, like, finally digging
into the tooth and nail stuff and the stuff my
dad was listening to was, uh, we have over here
in Ohio, we had a channel that would play, it
was there, it was called JCTV, and they had a
music video blender, um, that would play, like,
and I think it was, like, Wednesday nights at
seven, and they would have an hour long of just...
Contemporary metal anything in the christian
scene. They're playing those music videos and
the music video for meltdown by love and death
came on Um, I don't know you guys familiar with
love and death i've heard uh, yeah brian had
welch from core and it was his band after he
left And I just remember watching like dude.
This is good Like I like this heavy stuff and
something clicked I think uh, there's a blindside
song that played shortly after that too, and
I love that one us I don't know if that kind
of answers the question. Yeah There was just
some random moment that it clicked. So how did
you come up with the idea of creating a new site,
like for Tooth & Nail? You know, it just kind
of randomly hit me. I was kind of... I saw other
labels supporting bands after they left, and
I was like, that's cool. I wish Tooth & Nail
would do that. You know, i've obviously been
big into tooth and nail for a while and i was
like I wish tooth and nail would do that It's
like I wish they would share anniversaries and
this and that's not to hate on the label. I love
everything they do obviously Uh, but I was like,
you know, I could do that like that could be
something I do and so I just started Started
doing it here and there, you know, I had some
uh negative interactions too prior to that with
some other groups, you know not mentioning names
or anything just because I I you know, I try
to Send love to everybody but you know, I was
like I want to try to create a space that's maybe
a little more positive And I think I think so
far it's gone pretty well I've had very few negative
interactions, but that was just like I want to
try to just make a positive page I think the
news I'm sharing you it's it's all positive stuff
in the sense of like bands are coming back together
I want to be able to support them. Yeah That's
one thing. I I really love about the page Because
when Joel first mentioned you I was like, yeah,
I know that guy because my Instagram feed like
it will come up and what I love is that it's
a mix of like bands that you know, you maybe
not have heard from like in 20 years versus like
bands now and It's cool cuz kind of like this
podcast like there's all these bands that like
I used to I used in my friend groups I was like,
oh, I'm the band guy like I knew all these bands
and then like driving into this it's like, oh
my gosh, like that's I'm not some expert where
it's like, I'm at 95 % of knowing bands. It's
like, oh, there's thousands of bands that I don't
know of. And I feel like for you, you give a
really good opportunity for people to like jump
in with a nostalgia light for me, like a Family
Force V and be like, oh man, like I want to learn
about them coming back. What's it going to look
like? Then there's also like these newer bands.
It's cool to pop up and be like, man, like I
should go check them out because here's a band
that maybe You know just got signed the tooth
and nail and like it's cool to go check them
out and You know, I feel like it's awkward when
you're trying to support bands Like 20 years
later and you're trying to find stuff on ebay
and I think oh I wish I could have could have
supported them when they were active, you know
versus now so It's always cool whenever I can
find bands that still have active like merch
shops or are touring So I don't have to sit there
and say back in the day. They were nice. And
so i've enjoyed that about your page Yeah, that's
definitely one of the things i've tried to keep
is like Bringing everything together, you know,
there's the old school tooth and nail group on
facebook There's a new school and it's like I
don't have anything against either of those groups.
It's awesome That's where I got a lot of my start
with all this stuff is right seeing what those
people are sharing But it's like I want to bring
all that together. I don't want there to be a
dividing line I think it's cool to be able to
keep it all together and i've had some really
cool interactions with people because of that.
Mm -hmm Yeah, and i'm gonna give cameron credit
for um john van deusen seemingly Finally releasing.
I am origami part four on vinyl Finally, I feel
like he was pushing it out there and just like
wanting it to happen. I commented on it I'm pretty
sure it's our interaction that led John Van Dusen
to be like it's time. I'm just gonna finally
do it Yeah, it's been way too long. Yeah. Yeah
pumped about that So what's it been like for
you to kind of watch it grow since you started
obviously? You've got a lot of followers a lot
of people who are engaging in the content What
how's that been just to sit back and see? Oh,
this is awesome It's been crazy. Like I'd never
expected it. Like I was telling you before we
started here It was in April of last year. So
I'm coming up on a year here and I have 2 .3
thousand followers on Instagram and 600 on Facebook
and it's like that's crazy I I would have never
thought it would kick off. I honestly in my brain
anticipated like getting into this get 500 followers
and maybe just kind of fizzle out like I was
like yeah you know I've done social media pages
before nothing big and I just like aside it'll
be like all the rest this will be a phase it'll
fizzle up but no it's been crazy and going back
to like The different bands of different generations.
It's cool. See all people come together and just
a general love for the community There's definitely
a big community I've got to do different events
and stuff and that's seeing all the people come
together for those events Like I did the trivia
night last year and it was cool I had people
that were super into the old school stuff and
people that are into like the 2000 stuff and
they're all answering question It's cool to just
have all these people come together like that.
Yeah Love that and I feel like you're that you're
right and the reason that any of this stuff works
and is successful is because There are so many
people out there who this this is like deeply
ingrained in their heart They grew up in this
like it they have so much connection to it and
for the longest time It's like we were all just
a bunch of disconnected people who loved some
of the same things and so I feel like it's cool
to get to be like a part of of creating community
and bringing people together around some of this
music that we all love. And it's cool to have
an opportunity like this for you to come on.
A podcast like this and us to interact about
it I feel like the more that we can do things
like this the more that we can like help build
and create Even more community around this stuff.
I think it's really cool always seen like I've
had tons of opportunities to talk to people that
are you know They were into the Christian music
before tooth and nail was the thing and so tooth
and nail was big because they were doing something
different And so it's cool being where I grew
up, Tooth and Nail was established. There was
a Christian music scene because of that. And
so it's cool to be able to talk to people and
be like, yeah, because of that generation, I
got to have good music growing up. That's great.
That's really cool. So next question, who's your
Mount Rushmore of Tooth and Nail artist? And
I mean, I don't know if you want to take this
as your personal favorite or the ones you felt
like Were the most influential? So whichever
way you interpret that question. I made a list
of both because I was like, I don't know. I don't
want to sound too biased here. So just a general
importance. I went with MXPX, Under Oath, The
Supertones, and Demon Hunter. I think they all
play very huge roles in the scene. But for me
personally, I went with As Cities Burn. Like
I mentioned, they're my favorite band. Amberlynn,
John Van Dusen, and Luxury. They're probably
my favorites of the roster. Come on. Come on.
Yeah, I love it. I love it. That's great I'm
glad to be amongst other John Van Dusen fans
because there's not enough of us and I don't
understand that honestly, I can't I mean It's
hard to find for me guys that are making music
today That are putting out anything like it's
like genuine and thoughtful as the stuff that
he's doing. And he's doing it at such a high
level. Not just creatively in quality, but quantity
too. Putting out so much stuff and it's all so
good. And I don't understand why he's not just
one of the biggest things in the world. Yeah,
he's so original. It's hard to find super super
super original music Yeah, because it's all been
done. So it's cool to have somebody like him.
That's just going and doing something That's
you know sounds like other stuff, but it's very
unique. Yeah. Yeah, it's so true So what what
tooth and nail band or Elise do you think is
like? Pretty like criminally underrated and that
they and we were just talking about John Vadice
and maybe that's one but yes, I have him highlighted
But yeah some others that just maybe like never
got the fair shake that they deserved as a as
an artist or a band Yeah, um, you know, this
was another very tough question because I think
there's a lot of really cool and especially over
the past year I've really got to dig into some
of these artists What I'm always bringing up
is the Undertaking. They were on Solid State
a few years ago. I love their stuff. It's just
fast, heavy, chaotic, chariot, Norba Jean kind
of stuff. It's great. Don't Know, which was on
Tooth and Nail really early on. Super funky kind
of punk stuff awesome stuff 50 pound Bible is
a great song I'm always always trying to push
that one on people cuz I think it's cool. So
that's like said John Van Dusen But I won't get
into that one because we already talked about
I don't want a fan fanboy over here And then
luxury. I love luxury. They're my second favorite
band. So foreshadowing to Our next recording
session here I get to talk some more about luxury.
So maybe I'll keep that all to myself right now
Yeah, I can't can't wait to have that conversation.
Honestly, i'm pretty pumped about that Um, so
for tooth and now I I feel like it's it's really
safe to say it's one of the most beloved like
record labels out there Um, like it holds a really
special place in people's hearts. Um, what do
you attribute that to? like why do you think
that tooth and now after all these years is still
something that like so many people hold or love
um i mean i think a huge part of its community
you know they were creating something that was
before its time almost in a sense like they were
they were the first to do christian outlier music
per se that was it was different it was they
were the first to that because you know you had
bands like um you know mortification was out
there doing stuff and tourniquet and right a
lot of the metal and there was some hardcore
bands out there and but it wasn't They were still
on bigger labels and they are far and few between
I think maybe mortal was really one of the few
that was super underground that was getting some
play But then they came in and tooth and nail
start putting all these albums that was like,
yeah These are Christian bands, but we're not
not marketing them as Christian and so that created
a bigger community with that and I don't know.
I think a lot of it just comes from like longevity
and Creativity behind all their artists. They're
all very unique and they're always something
different even today Like the artists are still
fairly unique that they're signing. I was actually
talking to my dad the other day we went we usually
go out to record stores on our days off and go
see what we can find and we're always seeing
tooth and nail stuff and I was told like, you
know, if it weren't for tooth and nail we wouldn't
be walking to record store today and finding
Christian artists right there with the rest of
the secular secular artists, right? Like it's
cool that I can go in and scroll through all
these metal CDs and stuff. And I find dead poetic
in there. Like, that's so cool because without
tooth and nail and five minute walk and all these
labels that were ahead of that curve there, we
wouldn't have anything now. Yeah. Mm hmm. It's
such a true thing. And it's hard to even imagine
for me like my. I mean, it sounds weird to say,
but my, like my life and my like trajectory of
my life, like if tooth and nail hadn't been a
part of the story, um, for me and they were,
yeah, they were doing something different, but
I think you're exactly right that they really
were creating a community and, um, making some
of us who, um, got a little like the traditional
CCM stuff just got maybe a little, um, wearing
on us or old for us. um to create a place and
what was beautiful about the community they were
creating is you could go to a concert and see
um a metal band with a punk band and um and then
just like an alternative kind of band at the
same time and it's like everybody in the room
could still be a fan of all of those things um
and that was the norm like it wasn't just metal
bands touring with each other like you would
go they they really built a whole music scene
um that was more around the people that liked
these bands more so than like the kind of music
that the bands were making. And I just feel like,
man, it was such a cool thing to be a part of.
And it's something that is totally lacking today.
Like, it's hard to find out there. So yeah, I'm
trying to fill that void as much as I can. Keep
working on it together, man. For sure. What what
are other? other labels you mentioned five minute
walk a minute ago but what are some other ones
that have like been influential for you or um
yeah just just other um labels that put out stuff
that kind of impacted you yeah uh face down records
was a pretty big one for me which they're more
primarily hardcore and stuff but um as i was
getting you know i was playing music and getting
into christian metal Solid state and face down
were like my big two. It was cool finding those
bands, but like said five -minute walk I love
obviously seven -day Jesus. They're there. They're
pretty awesome five iron frenzy. They're one
of my favorites like there's a lot of cool Adjacent
stuff to tooth and hell like that. Yeah, that's
kind of what was big for me. But yeah face down
I think would probably be my big one I actually
started cataloging face down records stuff after
I was doing the tooth and nail stuff. I'm like,
oh, I need a break from cataloging stuff. This
is too much. That's so cool. I love it. Yeah.
A five minute walk was probably up there for
me with tooth and nail. Mostly because I and
it probably started with fiber and frenzy, but
then 70 Jesus and I ended up. you would get those
like take time to listen samplers and that's
the most bizarre thing in the world that again
you would have like a CD that would have a ska
band and then they would have this like scottish
like the electrics band and you're like what
is this and punk punk bands the smiley kids and
the w's and just such variety But um, but yeah,
you could create this like beautiful community
around it. So yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's cool seeing
like Even through the 2000s tooth and nail was
still putting out stuff. That was Different it
was where all these people are still coming together
because cornerstone was still a thing and all
these stuff So that was really cool about furnace
fest was all these bands are having reunite and
bands come together and it's there's so many
different genres But that's so cool to see You
know people going and checking out roadside monument
and then going to the next stage over and seeing
zeo like That's cool. That's really awesome.
I love it. Uh, do you have any any fun plans
for the future of tooth and nail news? Well,
you know i've I guess i'll try to share not share
too much because I hate saying like yeah This
is gonna happen and then it doesn't happen Um,
you know, i'm still gonna continue doing the
tooth and nail alumni reacts to stuff that series
has been cool I've got to talk to some cool people
I've got some guests lined up. I've got some
people maybe going to do it cool Maybe I'll tell
you guys that when we're not recording But that's
cool, I've been doing a lot of stuff with the
roster music club those guys are really cool
I've done graphics for them off and on but Kind
of stepping into working a little more closely
with the guys and we they've got some tournaments
coming up in the club that are really cool doing
a Tooth and nail second 100 releases tournament.
So I was recently got to share my top ten from
those second hundred releases. That was a lot
of fun but it's ultimately it's just continuing
on and Seeing what comes of it my wife and I
expecting our first kid this year. So I'm trying
to Thank you. Thank you. I'm trying to kind of
Kick back a little bit on making time. So we'll
see where the year takes me You know, I want
to keep doing some events and stuff. I'd like
to do another trivia night this year Different
stuff like that. I did the secret Santa this
Christmas. That was a lot of fun I thought about
doing a Christmas in July. So we'll see how that
goes Mm -hmm. But yeah, just stuff like that
to seeing where things are going yeah, what conversations
I have and where things go. I love that. Well,
man, we're we're really grateful for you. We've
talked a lot about creating community, but it's
been really fun to see you be able to do that
and bring some of these people together and and
just create a space where we can see, oh, man,
I love that record. It's whatever anniversary
or, oh, one of my favorite bands has something
that they've been teasing. I feel like that's
such a. Such an important thing for us and we're
just grateful for all you're doing there. And
man, I hope there's opportunities for us to continue
to like maybe partner and work together. Yeah,
absolutely. To help build some of this community
as well. Yeah, I'm always looking to collab with
people on stuff. So yeah, I love doing that.
It's you know, it's furthering that community
thing. I'm always like reach out to people like,
hey, you want to do something? Hey, you want
to like I've got to do a giveaway when. Focused
to their seven inch last year like that was really
cool. I like doing that kind of stuff. Yeah,
I love that. That's awesome Cool. Well, man,
thanks again for jumping on with us to chat through
this stuff We're excited about where this is
all gonna go. But before we say bye, we're gonna
talk through our lyric of the week So the lyric
of the week this week, as we're not covering
an album today, we always go and talk about a
Starfire 59 lyric because Starfire is a band
that Brandon and I connected over and our podcast
is named after a Starfire 59 song. And so today's
lyric comes from the album, Lust for Gold, the
song Everyone Seems Strange. It says the Christians
have found their own different ways. Oh, God,
please help me find the ones that stayed. That
song ever since I heard it just impacted me and
connected with me like on a deep level. And so
I love that. Can't wait to get to cover. We covered
Star Flyer for our first episode. We're probably
getting close to being about time to hit another.
And I agree. So that'll be good. All right. Cameron
again, man, thanks. Where where can people find
tooth and nail news like what's out there for
people to connect with? Yeah, I'm on Instagram.
That's kind of my main thing if you shoot me
a message on Instagram I'm probably a little
more likely to respond than other places But
I'm also on Facebook and I try to keep up with
messages there so and then YouTube now With this
new series I'm doing and then you can catch me
in the Roger music club from time to time as
well So that's cool. That's cool. Yeah, we encourage
you to good you that there's some great content
that is happening there You can of course find
us at heyareulistening on Facebook. We're also
on X and other random places, but we just appreciate
you guys sticking with us, listening, digging
into this as we work to create community around
this music. And so we're looking forward to continuing
the conversation and we'll see you back next
time. I'm