Are you listening All right, welcome to Hey,
Are You Listening? This is a podcast exploring
the past, present and future of Christian music.
My name is Joel. I'm here with my good friend,
Brandon, and we connected over a mutual love
of some particular artists, but also have pretty
different tastes when it comes to things. So
we get to expose each other to new stuff while
sometimes inviting some friends along for the
ride. And we have a friend back with us today.
Um, she was our first guest ever on the podcast.
I think that's right. Right. And just so also
happens to be married to Brandon. It's Jordan,
everybody. Surprise. We're so glad you're back.
This I think officially Jordan makes you. the
most frequent guest i think so because this is
number three right yeah yeah we've had a few
number twos but you're the first number three
so number three congratulations three baby i
just turned 33 so how appropriate that's perfect
perfect it couldn't be any better um well today
we are talking about um Something that's different
than what we've normally done. We're gonna cover
an EP So not a full -length record, but just
a few songs the EP Everything you ever wanted
by Grace Graber and so I'm looking forward to
talking about that But before we get into it,
it's time to check the mail All right. Well,
today our friend of the show, Sarah writes this
in, dear Brandon and Joel, why do you think the
Christian music industry shifted from CCM, contemporary
Christian music to worship? When do you think
that shift started happening? And do you think
that things will ever go back? What do you guys
think about this? It's a big question. We've
touched on this a little bit, but it's kind of
one of the big the big themes that's happened
out there in the world of Christian music. Brandon,
what are your thoughts? I think, I feel like
there's like that really like short answer that's
kind of, it's not the purest of heart when it's
like, this is the reason. But I think that for
me, the shift started, I would say maybe 2009
or 2010 is when I started noticing it because
there was bands that I really loved and they
were putting out stuff that was really cool.
And then all of a sudden they would get this
radio hit and they would realize, oh, this gets
a lot more plays, a lot more money, a lot more
like recognition. And so there was this shift
to that's what like radio wants, that's what
people want. So let's put that out there. So
I feel like for me, and it might be a cynical
reason, I think a lot of it has to do with money.
And I think that you can either say it as an
artist being greedy, which I think that's not
fair for a lot of artists, or you can say it's
the supply and demand. I can criticize that band,
but if they have a million people that want to
hear them sing worship songs and there's only
10 ,000 of me that want them to write whatever,
you know, it doesn't make sense to, you know,
like stick to that. But yeah, I think for me
it just it comes down to like a money thing.
And I personally think that with the rise of
Like indie record labels and I think with streaming
I think that you kind of are getting to see a
little bit of Combating that where it's not these
gatekeepers to radio You have people that are
able to You put out whatever like I think about
15 years ago Like if I wanted to put out music
it would be how do I get on a label? How do I
get a band? How do we do whatever? Whereas now
it's like I could...tonight, me and you could
go to your house and say, hey, let's record some
stuff, and we could have it on Spotify within
an hour or two. So I think that we're kind of
starting to see, at least in my opinion, a returning
to...there's a place for worship, but there's
also a place for, you know, like faith. I feel
like faith -inspired is maybe better than CCM
or Christian music, but like punk and rock and
metal and just every other is on route there.
But Brandon, this is worship. How can worship
be about money? Well, you can't even say that
without laughing. Because I feel like that's
my same reasoning. It's all money driven because
the artist, a lot of artists, if they're signed
onto a record label, they're not making decisions.
The record label is making the decision. And
at the end of the day, it's a business. they're
selling what's selling. And if a nice light airy
song about like driving and seeing God in the
driving is released, it's not going to get as
many listens as a song about who God is and what
he's done for us. So I feel like that is the
main reason is just the money. and what is popular.
But I do agree that like kind of late 2000s,
2010s, that era, I think we saw such a rise with
like Hillsong and Elevation and all of those
type of bands that only did worship songs. And
so I think because they became so popular, that's
what the record labels were like, oh, this is
what we need to release. But now we're having
more artists come out with just regular Christian
songs and it's not worship songs and they're
becoming more popular. But I think because of
the shift of having TikTok and Instagram that
they're releasing their stuff on there. And so
the audiences are there finding them. So then
that's driving up sales for those types of artists.
So yes, it is money. Yeah, and you probably can't
argue that it's not, at least at its base, a
money thing. Because certainly I think that this
did start from record labels making decisions.
The interesting thing is most artists today probably
aren't that impacted by the desires of a label
anymore because labels don't actually do a lot
for artists. I know that people are still on
labels. So in like the really big artists situations,
it's probably the case, but so many people now
are just doing their own thing or they're part
of a collective instead of a label or whatever
it may be. And so I feel like that influence
is gone. In some ways you see see how that changes
the industry but a lot of people are still putting
out worship music even in the midst of that but
probably because that's what's popular and that's
what people are listening to and so and you hate
to say well that's that's because it's about
money but but ultimately that that's certainly
a big part of it what can you guys remember what's
the first artist that you can think of that like
was like just a Christian artist that like released
a worship record. Can you think of the earliest
version of that? I think the first one that comes
to mind, because there was people that were going
more CCM, but I think full -on worship was Jeremy
Camp. I remember him being like, he had, I think
it was Stay. and then he released that. He did
do a random worship project like early his career.
Then he had Beyond Measure, Speaking Louder Than
Before, and then there was I think it was We
Cry Out maybe of his, and I feel like from that
point on it went all like worship. I think for
me, it was weird. And I think maybe this, it
kind of just soured me on worship for a long
time, was that I almost felt, like, deserted
by, like, artists. Like, I felt like I, like,
hey, I was here when you guys were, like, doing
y 'all's thing, and I appreciated it, but then
it felt like other people showed up, and it was
like, this is the cooler crowd. Like, we want
to be the people getting the... Dove Awards,
we want to get the people that are getting like
asked to be in the Pure Flix movies or whatever.
And like, so for me, it was kind of just this,
oh, I guess if you do worship stuff, like you're
selling out. And like it soured me on worship
music like for years. Like I hadn't, it wasn't
just I don't care for this. It was like an active
like... No, we're not like you like that, you
know, like it was a And I think that's like I
said just comes from feeling like Why are you
guys? Like this this isn't who you are like it
see and I think what's sad is I think some of
those are the bands that you see ultimately come
out and they're What are you deconstructing and
all? because it felt like they were at this point
where they're like, man, we're making music we
like, we're talking about Jesus, and all of a
sudden it's every night a, oh, you guys need
a little more Jesus, or, oh, you went out there
and mentioned, like, that you watch the football
game, well, you can't watch that team because
their quarterback's not a Christian, you know,
it just felt like it's everything is planned
whenever money comes into the picture. So, yeah,
Jeremy Camps first. worship record was, um, 2010.
Um, so there were artists like a third day that
put out their first worship record offerings.
It was their fourth album in 2000. Um, and so
there were bands doing this like really early
on and that's not the only worship record that
they released. Um, they put out more, um, after
that. Am I going to be Smith's? like worship,
it's called worship album that he released was
his first big record in a while when it came
out. It came out in 2001 and then he released
a second one in 2002. And so you saw a shift
of a guy who's like done even progressive, like
on the edge of Christian music and mainstream
in 2001, all of a sudden he's putting out a worship
record and then he puts out another worship record.
And it hasn't Like he's kind of kept to that
cadence a little bit of just releasing worship
music Then I went back and looked and we just
talked about Petra on a previous episode their
first worship record Petra praise came out in
1989 So talk about a band that's ahead of the
times when it comes to this stuff But that's
just kind of interesting to me that I do think
There was a moment when worship music killed
the industry. And I think you're right, that
probably was somewhere in the late 2000s, around
2010. But things were progressing in that direction
for a while before they actually got there. And
by the time you get to... 2010, it's either,
well, you're making worship records or you're
not making any music because we're not going
to release anything other than this because this
is the only thing that's selling right now. And
so it just does really interesting things to
an industry. But I think you're right. You guys
are right in the sense that with indie labels
and people more focused on even just releasing
singles for online for TikTok or for whatever,
then there's creativity begins to step in again
and artists get to make what they want to make
versus what somebody tells them to make. And
so one of the main reasons that we, Brandon,
wanted to even do this podcast is because we
felt like there was a rebirth happening of something
that... this idea of what it means to be a Christian
making music. We're shifting back to something
and I'm beginning to be reborn. And so it's kind
of fun to be able to talk about this while we
kind of feel it happening and see it happening.
So yeah, any other thoughts on this? I don't
think so. Well, Sarah, thanks for that question.
Don't forget that you can reach out to us with
your own questions for us to talk about on the
podcast. Just email. Hey, are you listening pod
at gmail .com? And we'll look forward to answering
your questions on the air as well. But now let's
play a game. All right, well today we're gonna
play another round of CCM 20 questions. Jordan,
I know you're excited about this. I'm so excited,
but also very nervous because I like to win,
but I don't think I'm gonna win. Well, you never
know. And so here's how 20 questions works. You
get to ask 20 yes or no. questions and I will
answer them simply with a yes or a no and the
goal is that you move in the direction of honing
in on a specific album so if you get to an artist
first and you want to say is it this artist I'll
give you a yes or no but the goal is that you
hone in on the album that I have in my head for
them Um, and see if you can get there within
20 questions. So before we start counting the
questions, do you have any questions about the
game itself? No, I don't think so. All right.
Brandon, you ready for this? I'm ready. All right.
Let's do it. Ask away. Um, is this band, does
it feature a female lead singer? No. Okay. That's
always my go -to question. Is it a band? Yes.
Is it AI? No. Was this band popular? Like would
you say the height of their popularity was between
2000 and 2010? Yes. Okay. Both of you looked
at me and I've got nothing. Is the album genre
rock? In a broad sense, yes. That answers nothing.
Was this band on Tooth and Nail Records? No.
Was this band on Goatee Records? Yes. Brandon,
you gotta bring it home. Okay. That only narrows
it down to 30 people. Does this band feature
four gentlemen in it? Or historically, is it
represented by four people? I think for the most
part, yes. Okay. I think that's seven questions.
I haven't been keeping track. So, um, Oh goodness.
So you said it was a rock ish, uh, tooth early
2000s or 2000, 2010. Oh, are they still popular
today? i .e. like still a band making music um
hang on i'll answer that question just a second
um i don't i don't want to mislead you i probably
should do a better job thinking about these things
ahead of time the longer you're waiting because
i feel like i know the know what band you're
talking about but the more you're having to research
it the more i'm like um Will say yes, I think
technically this band is not broken up. Okay
Is this band House of Heroes No, oh that's ten
oh Man, I I was getting really cocky there for
a second cuz I'm like, I know who it is I'll
just play around a little bit She said 2010.
Rock -ish. Four members. Okay. You know this
band. I do? Yeah. Oh, I have no idea who this
is. Is the band Reliant K? Yes. Oh, okay. I do
know this band. Okay, so I'm... Is the album,
was it five score and - You're just going straight
into that? Yeah. So I didn't, I wasn't clear
on this. I can't ask if it - If you ask an album
and you're wrong, that ends the game. Oh no.
So make sure you know the album before you -
Okay, here's a question. Okay. Does the album
cover have an overhead shot of them with the
like sepia filter photo? No. Does this album...
Does it feature a trailer? On the cover? Oh,
no, I forget that's like two albums. Does this
album, is the band on the cover of the album,
or is it, or yeah, is the band, like is the members
of Reliant K on the cover? No. Okay. Is it the
album with the flower on it? Yes. Oh gosh, what's
the name of that one? It's a yellow flower with
the like One of the pedals is kind of falling.
No, I can't ask that. I'm glad you said that
because I forgot completely about that. I literally
jumped from... What is that album? Is the album
called... Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Yes, you got it.
I think that's on 15. Oh, man. Isn't this one
of the more popular L .A. K records? Maybe the
most popular L .A. K record? Yeah, probably I'm
trying I feel like that one in the five score
Yeah, that one. I don't even know the second
part of the title of that one. Is it five score
and yeah and Yeah, so I jumped immediately in
my brain um I thought of um five score and seven
years ago So that one and then I immediately
went to the two lefts don't make a right. Yeah,
and I forgot all about Well, you guys got there
and that's good. So congratulations. I shouldn't
have been nervous. Our friend Miranda is going
to be really upset that it took us that long.
She's kind of a like the Reliant K historian
of the group. So it's like I I've always liked
Reliant K, but again, I I found them through
limewire so there were no pictures of any albums
on anything and it was all just like hey here
you go here's a big old stack of music no like
filing into any album it was just song song song
yeah so i just listened to all the songs didn't
know where they belonged but i liked them that's
really awesome yeah i um i got into relink like
Even before their first record came out Somehow
I got a pre -release like set with two of the
songs on it or something and then listen to it,
but That's fun. Yeah, I'm glad you guys were
able to land on it. So thought it would be fitting
considering the fact that we're dealing with
something in the pop -punk territory today, so
All right. Well, let's talk a little bit about
what we've been listening to lately What have
you guys been listening to? I was revisiting
the Classic Crime, their Vagabond's album. It's
a Tooth and Nail band, right? Congratulations.
Thank you. In preparation for this, we kind of
got into a discussion about like, what is pop
punk? Because like you go on the internet and
there's a lot of just random things that people
are saying oh this band's pop punk this one because
like house of heroes was listed as like pop punk
and i was like that's not like i don't see them
as that and even uh the classic crime i was playing
this album and i'm like this doesn't strike me
as pop punk and um so i just started listening
and so yes this album and then a lot of just
playing random things and being like i don't
think this like What is pop punk? Which I will,
I guess we'll discuss in a little bit, but yeah,
I would say that classic crime Vagabonds, um,
that's what I've been having on repeat recently.
Cool. Yeah. I feel like for me, I've been listening
to, well, a lot of Grace Graber, which we're
going to cover. Um, and then also some Christian
pop punk bands as well. Um, I've been listening,
like there's a couple of the almost songs, Um,
then reliant k consider the almost pop punk.
Yeah interesting They're a little bit heavier,
but I would not consider them. I feel like they're
more punk, but I feel like they're pop because
they're they're more like popular so but then
um reliant k Um a band called run kid run. Have
you heard of them? Yep. I like them. Um, but
yeah those kind of bands, and then Stellar Cart.
I've had a lot of Stellar Cart on repeat lately.
Nice. Throwing it back. Yeah, that's cool. Well,
what I've been listening to isn't pop -pock,
but Brandon, it's actually something that you
recommended that actually took the time to stop
and listen to. And it's that, I don't know how
to say it, fa pest, fa peste. Oh, okay. This
world ain't mine to change. Yeah, I really enjoyed
that. It's, uh, I mean, the vocals are kind of
interesting, but the music I really like it's
chill, but it's catchy. There's a lot of like
beach boys vibes, which I love the beach boys.
So, um, so I like, um, the production and the,
like, just the simplicity, but creativity that's
there in it. So that's what I was revisiting
that the other day. Um, And I think that's just
what has stuck with me is that it's just so simple
that I could see someone not liking it But I
think that's just what impresses me is that I
have Really like there's I've listened through
it so many times and I've yet to get Like tired
of it or be like, okay. Yeah, this is kind of
like war I was welcome. So but that's pretty
cool. I'm I'm glad I feel like velvet blue right
now is just leading the way in like producing
like stuff that's just all over the map, but
just quality with each release. Yeah. It's pretty
fun. All right. So obviously we want to get into
this conversation about Grace Graber, but we've
had kind of an interesting conversation about
this idea of pop punk. So I don't know if you
guys want to talk more about this, like what
is pop punk before we start talking about this
EP specifically. Um, but brandy you kind of brought
up this idea like what are your thoughts there?
I I told jordan that I feel like pop punk. Um
When I think of pop punk, I think of You have
a guitar that's just going fast. So it's just
like the And then you have someone doing something
on drums and then you have a A singer that has
to both go He has to be like nasally but then
also he has to go like, whoa, oh, or oh, oh.
There's a lot of just, oh, thrown into there.
That's what I think of when I hear of pop punk.
I think of like a little bit of a Whaley guitar,
but very like sharp guitar as well. And then
drums, there's a lot of like kicks with the drums.
It's the, again, it's very sharp. It's not like
a, Lucy goosey melodic. Yes type rhythm. It's
like don't don't don't it's like Yeah, I'm sure
if Chris Blanchard was here he would definitely
agree with my take on it And I feel I do feel
like you do need a very distinct voice. Uh -huh.
I agree I feel like it helps whenever you have
that like little accent type almost like a blink
182 sort of sound I feel like that lends itself
to that pop punk sound. Yeah. So I think that
you guys are right for the most part on this.
I think the drums, the drums are super key to
this. And I think you're right. And it's just
that there's like a steady beat. It's not a lot
of flow or feel. It's just kind of a really steady
kind of hit and um in more punk territory and
even in a lot of pop punk you'll get like the
really fast kick and snare like that happens
um and so you see um more of that in punk punk
but i mean still it shows up in pop punk pretty
frequently like if you listen to a band like
mxpx or slick shoes um more 90s punk you're probably
going to see more of that than 2000s punk Punk
kind of mellowed out a little bit in the 2000s
and got a little more easier on the ears. Um,
and so, but, um, but, so I think you guys are
right about that. And the vocals, uh, and the
guitars, you get a lot of just power chords,
um, that are, that are happening in punk rock.
Um, and a lot of playing fast, um, bass playing,
you gotta have a good bass player for a punk
band. Um, that's a, that's a key thing. So. Um,
yeah, I, so, um, I don't consider the almost
to be a punk band, a pop punk band. What do you
consider them? Um, just like, uh, I think they
were trying to be like an emo rock band. Um,
back in that day, Aaron Gillespie was at Under
Oath and he wanted to do something a little chiller.
Um, and so, um, that was a step back from Under
Oath and some more just like an indie emo rock.
thing um but i do like the almost for sure see
i would argue that they are pop punk because
under oath is more heavy right like the heavy
screams and more rock guitar and drums whereas
the almost the almost is a little bit of an uptick
in the rhythm it's like faster rhythm which is
pop punk Do you have any uh ideas on this Brandon?
Have you even heard any of the almost songs?
Yeah, i've i've heard I wouldn't I feel like
I wouldn't put them on because i'm When I think
of the almost I think of the monster monster
ep And then I think of like southern weather,
so I feel like I definitely put it more into
like a rock category um Yeah, because when I
think of like um Like pop -punk I think of like
Hawking Elson, Capital Lights I'm trying to think
of who else FM static I think is a really good
example of pop -punk But I feel like it's just
kind of this weird It's almost like alternative
like there's some stuff where I'm like like alternative
bleed so much There's stuff that I think oh,
that's not rock. That's like alternative rock
or that's not whatever it's like alternative
or indie so they're definitely a blend of things
so um google ai would say that they're primarily
an alternative rock band with strong ties to
emo post -grunge and alternative ccm um although
when it lists styles later it says alternative
rock emo slash pop punk Post -Grunge. So there's
definitely some influence in there. Yeah, they're
they're all of the above. Yeah, for sure. First
pop punk band that you ever listened to. Hmm.
I don't even remember. But I know that I liked
it after I listened to it. Is it that's my favorite
genre of music? Yeah. You liked it, but not well
enough to remember who you liked. I feel like
I heard it and then I did a deep dive into, I
need more of this. And I probably listened to
like 20 different artists all in one day, just
like eating and consuming as much as I could.
So I feel like I don't even remember, but I remember
I used to really like Forever the Sickest Kids.
And that was kind of like, I guess, Forever the
Sickest Kids and maybe Family Force 5, those
two, I'm gonna say that because I just remember
hearing them and saying, oh man, I need more
of this. And then I would just spend hours on
YouTube, like just watching videos of all of
these different pop punk bands. all of the music
videos and things and i was like man i love this
so that's cool yeah uh for me it's hawk nelson
yeah i think back to their friend like that album
uh they came to winter jam one year and after
that like i dove in and then i think after that
like then came like reliant k and all because
i found reliant k from um like from go t records
So I think that Blank K was kind of more of a
2009, but I think it was like, I knew a few of
their songs, but Hawk Nelson was the first that
I like bought an album and I could tell you like
about the band. So I think Hawk Nelson would
fall into that for me. Cool. I think the first,
like the first true pop punk that I ever heard
was probably Green Day, um, and their album,
Dookie. Um, but when I come around and all those
songs there, And yeah, it was unlike anything
I'd ever heard and I'm like I I need this in
my life And then there wasn't much in the Christian
world. There were bands like One Bad Pig that
came out of the 80s that were like Christian
punk bands, but they were a little more edgier
punk and so it wasn't until I went to Um, my
local Christian bookstore and looked at the poster
of if you like blah, blah, blah, you would like,
and it said, if you like green day, you will
like MXPX. Um, and they have one record out their
first record on teeth and nail called Poconaccia
and I bought it and it changed my life. Um, not
at all anywhere close to being their best record
or maybe even a good record. But I loved it.
But a record nonetheless. Yes. And I was a huge
MXPX fan after that. And so, yeah. All right.
Well, let's transition and talk about this Grace
Graber EP. All right. So just some info on this.
Grace Graber released her EP, Everything You
Ever Wanted, on October 10th, 2025. So this is
a new recent record, we're talking current. The
EP is named after the Hawk Nelson cover, which
Graeber chose after being asked that same question
by someone in the music industry. The project
serves as a lifeline for Graeber, documenting
her realization that she needed to rely on God's
strength rather than her own during a period
of intense burnout. So this is a four -track
EP. I'm put out by Grace. It is the first long
form anything that I've ever listened to by her.
But I'd love just kind of some opening thoughts
for you guys. Like how did you start listening
to Grace Graber and where did she kind of enter
into the picture musically? For me, she's pulling
a Josiah Queen. She showed up on TikTok and I,
like I had seen her. And I kind of just like
scrolled past, but then I started watching more
and she actually covered the Forrest Frank Lemonade
song and was like, what if Forrest Frank went
punk? And then she played her song. And I argue
it's better than the original. But that's that's
how I first saw her. And then I started having
more and more things come up on like TikTok and
Instagram. and um I know she got a lot of hate
from people who were like you're a Christian
you need to act like one because they didn't
like that she was dancing around on stage and
she wore shorts and had a crop top on but she
was saying that she was a Christian I was like
she's talking about Jesus in her songs, how much
more Christian can you be as an artist? Like
you're presenting the gospel every single night
at your shows. Like what does it matter? But
I just like really started following her on Instagram.
And then I heard more and more songs from her
come up. And then Brandon actually, he showed
me, I don't even remember what song it was. But
it might have been the pressure song. Brandon
was like, hey, have you heard this girl? She
sounds really cool. I think you'll like her.
And he showed me a song and I was like, Brandon,
I've been listening to this girl. I know her.
I like her. So that's how I found her. That's
cool. What about you, Brandon? Yeah, for me,
she came up on... Don't know what what it was
on Spotify. I don't know if it was just it came
up Maybe you know when you finish an album it'll
start playing suggested ones related ones and
so her her cover of Everything you ever wanted
came on there, and I felt like it was like really
cool And so I kind of just started like diving
in and I was like oh, this is like this is cool
because i even featured her on my like best releases
of last year and um i said that like it like
it it i feel like i'm transported back to like
the like early to mid -2000s for all the right
reasons and um so i just felt like it was really
cool to have someone that was taking this sound
that was so instrumental in so many like people's
lives back then and now she is doing that again
um it was kind of like a few years ago i i'm
trying to think of who i know i'm gonna mess
up her name but there was like there's this girl
she's like really popular but she does like kind
of this like pop punk like avril lavigne type
thing is it i don't even know like olivia olivia
rodrigo i think so I might be mixing it up, but
it's kind of sounds like the like, um the paramour
song Yeah, yeah, olivia rodrigo. It's kind of
that whole thing that I was like, oh this is
cool that there's this person doing this like
Sound that like was way popular back then but
you know now is maybe not um so yeah, I it popped
up and Thought it was cool. And then yeah, I
saw her. Um her like cover of his favorite Christmas
story and I like those two songs are like really
like um I get like special for me so I'm like
man it takes a lot whenever you start covering
like songs that like other people regard as like
really good because it's easy to like mess like
mess them up or kind of like push fans away so
Well, you and her obviously listen to a lot of
the same music. So that works in her favor. Me
and Grace. Yeah. We're on a first name basis.
So Ms. Graber. I guess we're going to have her
on the podcast. You know, who knows? She might
say yes. Yeah. You never know. Yeah. Well, what
I like about this is it is something that's new
and that's current. And so it's fun for us to
be able to talk about Um, something like that.
I hadn't really had much of an exposure to her.
I remember I think a while back you told me when
the single was out, but maybe not the EP to this.
Um, because I, it was actually already in my
Apple music library that everything you ever
wanted song when it came out. Um, and so I remembered
listening to it and then I had heard the lemonade
cover. Um, but, um, being able to sit down and
listen to this EP was something, um, new for
me that I hadn't done yet. And so, um, so it's
fun to get to hear like a 2026 what is pop punk,
um, in the year of our Lord 2026, um, or 2025,
I guess, technically, but, um, but so it's, it's
fun. I'm excited to dig into it and talk through
this with you guys. So you ready? All right.
Let's talk about track one pressure. Jordan,
why don't you lead us in your thoughts? I feel
like I, I like it. It's very much like a reminiscent
song. Um, and it kind of reminds like, I think
it's, it sort of reminds me a little bit of fly
leaf, but I think it's just the like whale -y
guitars on it. I really liked the guitars and
there's, um, There's one part where it's like
everything backs out and then it's just guitar
and it's like I like that part. Yeah, that's
all I got for that one. I didn't make a lot of
notes on this one. Jordan's too busy enjoying
the song. Yeah. Brandon, what did you think about
it? Yeah, I I really enjoy this. I feel like
the approach to like a release being a concert
like really fit this because it kind of this
kind of made me think of like at Winter Jam you
have these or they used to haven't been to Winter
Jam probably 10 years, but it used to have these
like New artists spotlight. They would have like
15 minutes. So they have to cram everything they
can into that show Feel like it it does a really
good job of from the bat. I'm like, yeah, I I'm
enjoying this I really like the intro It feels
it feels genuine, too Like it doesn't feel like
it's Let me just do this because people are like
applauding or no one else is doing this I I can
go grab like it it feels as though she's like
this is when I step behind the microphone or
whatever, this is the music I want to make. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. The first note that I have on this
is that I like her voice. Um, I think it fits
well with what she's trying to do. I did note
on this that it felt more pop than punk. Um,
and so, and, but later on, like there's big guitars
kick in, um, but they're not really punk rock
guitars. They're more just like rock guitars.
And so, Um, but I do like those guitars and they
kick in. I think the strings are cool. Um, my
it, the production's good. I think it fits really
well with what, when you're talking about pop
punk, um, I mean, you, you want something that's
like pretty well produced. That's pretty slick
sounding. And so I think it fits really well.
Um, but there's also some creative elements happening
along the way. My favorite thing about this song
is the line. Every day's a step on the stairway
to heaven. Um, I just thought that was a cool
a cool line, but yeah, I liked that I like that
one too Yeah, um next we move to run Um, joel
what were your thoughts on run? Yeah, so this
is more pop punk feeling. Um, I feel like we're
we're in the in the genre right now um, I think
that um, the pre -chorus and the chorus to this
one are cool Um, really good melodies that are
happening there. Um, there's a lead guitar that
kicks in after the first chorus that I thought
was cool. And then like a drop to just guitar
and vocal, like during the second verse, um,
which was just a cool change. Um, and so I thought,
yeah, I thought there were some cool creative
elements at play. Um, here's the thing about
pop punk. It's really easy for it just to kind
of all run together. Yeah feel samey But she
does enough like creative changes to like keep
it fresh on a song like this. And so I enjoyed
it Jordan I liked it. I liked her vocals in it.
I feel like they were a little bit more like
pop punk sounding In this one and I I like Had
like just the whole idea of how like she's running
Like at first she was running away, but now she's
running to God. Yeah, and Even like through all
of the sweat like she says that sweat on my face.
You're still there for me and Just how like it's
it's about a struggle and a lot of a lot of artists
they want to like make the song that's like,
oh yeah, I don't struggle because I know Jesus.
Or it's like this whole big thing of like, yeah,
I struggle all the time because I'm following
Jesus. And I feel like this is kind of like middle
of the road where it's like, hey, I've struggled,
but I also have goodness in my life. Cause it
talks about like, I'm gonna breathe and run to
you just like on the first day that I believed
in who you are. So I think that's pretty cool.
Yeah, I like that she changes up a little bit.
And I was kind of laughing to myself because
my notes it auto corrected. So this is what this
is what my notes say. This may be unpopular,
but pop punk can be receptive. What what I meant
to say is repetitive So, I don't know if it's
unpopular opinion not unpopular I think that's
the same thing but so yeah, so I appreciate the
changes When you aren't being like fed the same
recipe over and over. Yeah Because like like
I said earlier, I feel like a lot of times like
when when it works It's such an incredible genre,
but other times it turns into and I mean there's
been bands before where it'll like there'll be
like four different bands and I think it's one
band because of how their stuff sounds so it's
kind of like if someone was to ask me what's
the difference between band a and band b I wouldn't
be able to tell them you know other than well
these people are from Canada and these people
are from Michigan you know or whatever um but
yeah I felt like it was um It was really cool
to uh have that little bit of change. Um, so
you don't start getting tired of hearing it Yeah,
that's good. That's good. It's a good one All
right. Well track three is the cover and the
self like the title track for the ep everything
you ever wanted Jordan what'd you think about
this cover? I loved it, which I love the original
hawk nelson is a favorite of mine um, I feel
like I've always loved Honk Nelson, but I liked
this take. Is it better? No. But is it equal?
Yes. I would say it's right there with the original.
I liked the, almost like the screams that are
on there towards the end. Um, which I think it's
like the guy that's on their audio file. I've
never heard of him, but maybe I would like him.
I need to look into him more. But um, like the
screams at the end, I really liked that and I
liked that. Um, I don't know. I just, it was
more punchy than the original. I did like that,
but I feel like it's, I like it is equally as
I do the original. Sometimes when you hear a
cover of a song that you know, well, it's interesting
how it can bring like new life to it in ways
that you haven't thought about it before. And
so I think for me listening to it, I mean, I
knew the Hawk Nelson song too, and I always enjoyed
that song, but I think even listening to this,
it made me like appreciate that song even more
because I'm like, this is a good, it's a great
song. Like a really standout song that that Hawk
Nelson wrote and and I think this is a good a
good a good great cover of it too. It doesn't
stray like crazily from the original but It fits
with like the production of the record, which
the production of this is much different from
the production of the Hawk Nelson album. And
so it's almost like it's bringing it into a new
era, but still keeping like the things that made
the song good, the song. And so I liked that.
And I knew that the screaming at the end too,
because I'm like, hey, we're getting a little
edgy here. Yeah. I also really enjoyed the screams
to Sarah at the bat. I think it's such a it's
so tough to cover such an iconic song and I think
for with this song it's kind of in that same
group as a um uh like a dare you to move by switch
foot like you just have this group of people
that they're like this this is my song like this
is and I think those songs are because that that's
the same way like a dare you to move like it
would be It'd be so hard to recreate that song
and have the fans that grew up with Switchfoots
to love or to think that it's better or the same
as. But I think that they did such a good job
of keeping the heart of the song while putting
a new spin on, kind of echoing what y 'all said.
I think the screams work well. And I think that
the multiple voices It was cool because like
I said it reminded me of This is the song that
when you're in person you have songs like friend
like that that people are singing but like this
is the song you have people like in tears being
like you This is my story and so I think there's
just there's something cool about having voices
because I think back to like You know, I think
I keep referring back to like dare you to move
Feel like that voice is like, you know, if you
had different people like singing with it it
would add to it as well So I think that the having
like two different vocalist on it does a lot
for the track And then we move to our final song
on here better now Joel what are your thoughts?
Yeah, I think this is my favorite track on the
record It's cool because when you think about
what the album is like like she's coming out
of a hard season and what I could learn about
Grace Graber is She's done a lot in the world
of like faith and mental health. Yeah, and that's
a big theme for her and her music and so I felt
like this was a good cap to the EP since this
EP is like coming out of a hard season. Yeah,
it's not that like It's not that like oh everything's
fixed and perfect. But there's hope in it still
that things are better now because she can just
realize and trust that God is her hope in the
midst of a tough season. I thought the chorus
was great. I love the palm muting that's happening.
It feels very punk rock. There's a great lead
guitar that's at work here. Obviously, Track
number three might everything you ever wanted
might be like the The like the really standout
track of the record. Yeah, but as far as like
the original songs go on here I think this one
is my favorite of them. So no I I would say pressure
is my favorite but I did like this one and I
I feel like this one was very Reliant K ish.
I feel like the sounds of it reminded me of like
some old school Reliant K. But I liked the message
of it of like, I've been in a dark place and
I felt like I had no hope at all. But now I'm
starting to realize, no, it's OK. God's on my
side. But it's still like she's not there yet.
She's better, but she's not there. And so I think
just like saying, hey, it's OK to be processing.
And working through the thing because we're all
on a journey. We are all we all have a story
to tell And we're getting there day by day. Mm
-hmm. So I like that message. It's good Yeah,
I um, I I really love the course of this song
Like I was telling Jordan last night. I was like,
I just feel like this is like I could be having
the the roughest day, but this song would just
like like lift up my spirits um i also really
like that she like ends with this because it's
kind of like i go back to like the whole concert
like example like i feel like if i went to a
concert and a band ends with a cover of another
band i kind of think that's how we're ending
is you just saying hey we did some cool stuff
but nothing beats what you know this band did
like 20 years ago. So I think that just the layout
of the EP shines so much because I definitely
think this EP would not be as good if this song
was at the beginning or you know whatever. I
think like y 'all said there's this really cool
kind of shift in this journey and Yeah, I think
we're kind of moving into thoughts about it I
think that this EP to be so short it covers so
much like it's kind of surprising me how much
She was able to fit in to only four songs is
I feel like there's nothing here that's like
Repetitive like I'm getting four different songs
and all So yeah, I felt like there was a really
really cool way to end the EP I feel like to
touch on like song order, I feel like that's
such a big thing with this EP because it's like
you start off with pressure. It's like I have
all of this pressure on me and I feel like I'm
crumbling under the pressure, but then I'm gonna
run away from my problems, but also I need to
run towards God because He can handle that pressure,
but then also I'm I kind of teeter back and forth
between the comparison game because I want to
be everything that you need But I know that I
can't be but I'm gonna try but then it's like
you have that realization that you don't need
to be everything and Things are gonna get better.
Yeah better now. Yeah, so I feel like it tells
the whole story of like mental health and How
like it's you can just like Finish the EP and
then start again because I feel like we constantly
go in that circle of like We we start to feel
the pressure and then we run away and run towards
God and then yeah It's just like you can continue
to do it over and over again. Yeah, that's good
Yeah, I I think that I'm thankful that this was
my first like exposure to her music and kind
of like Form beyond like just listening to a
song Um, because I think it worked really well,
um, for me, uh, especially in short firm form.
And I think now, now I'll be ready to like listen
to something a little more lengthy, um, from
her, um, just because I was able to enjoy getting,
getting that kind of brief, brief nature of this.
And I think that if the first thing that I listened
to would have been a 12 track record. then it
probably would have like worn on me after a little
while. And I probably wouldn't have enjoyed it
as much as I enjoyed just like these four songs
together, which I thought were all like pretty
strong. And so the fact that it's short, I think
worked for me as an introduction, especially.
And so I'm going to go ahead and give this a
four because I really, I really enjoyed it. And
And I'll be excited to dig into more of her music
along the way and see what comes of it. So, yeah.
I'm going to give it a four point two. There
you go. Yeah, I like it. I feel like it's it's
a good introduction to who she is. And I feel
like it it tells the story of like an album,
basically. But yeah, it's like a condensed form.
So yeah, I feel like she covers a lot in it So
yeah 4 .2 I think um So I I thought a lot about
this because like me and Joel talked and i'm
like and I was gonna be 10 songs you automatically
get points off if you're not this and honestly,
I think that An ep could never kind of get above
like a four like I think in my scale because
it's just To me, like, it's hard to say, okay,
this four song EP you did is on the same level
as this 13 song, you know, album. But you have
to rate it as a four song EP. Yeah. So I feel
like taking your advice on it. I think for me,
it's it's five stars. Just because like there
wasn't anything about it that I felt like. I
could like nitpick and like change or there wasn't
a song that I feel like didn't like I feel like
this EP does Like even just the weird rules I
have about like what if this was a concert cuz
I'm like if this is a concert I would be delighted
for this to be the opening, you know act So yeah,
that's that's what I'm going with. That's cool
Is that the second five -star rating on the podcast
ever? Grace Graber cable price and friends If
your band starts with a G, so if we ever do any
Garth Brooks stuff, get ready. Garfunkel. Brandon
so far has given out the only two five stars.
Just wait till that Eugene Peterson album. Am
I mixing it up? Eugene Peterson is a writer.
I don't know. Oh, I'm forgetting the guy's name.
He did the Rich Mollins thing. Andrew Peterson.
One of them Peterson boys. Yeah, no, I don't
mean I don't think I would give that a five,
but one of these days a five for me is coming.
So we'll just have to be surprised and wait and
see when it happens. It'll be a random like unexpected
album that you give five stars. Maybe. Yeah.
I feel like that's one thing I appreciate is
that Like both of the things so far that's gotten
a five -star has been released in the past two
years and I think that for so many people they
hear like these older albums we go through and
they're like well that's when music was good
like the 90s or the 2000s and I feel like it's
just such a testament to like There's there are
bands out there now that are producing like amazing
stuff You know, and I just look at like even
our top 10 list. Like, I recommend people listening
to that because, I mean, I feel like there was
like one or two albums that were on the same,
but I mean, there was like eight, I would say
probably eight or seven of the albums you listed.
I'm like, I've never heard of that person or
I've never listened to that album. And it's just
like cool to think that that's, you know, a combined
17 or 18 albums that last year that both me and
you were like... you need to go listen to this
it's that good so I feel like that's cool just
kind of looking at how there's still good music
out there yeah I do love that too and I'm really
excited for what is to come this year and what
new might pop into our ears that we can enjoy
along the way so let's talk a little bit about
the lyric of the week Our lyric comes from pressure.
It is, the pressure I'm under takes my breath
away every single day. I've lost all my wonder,
but I see your praise in the simple things, in
the simple things. That's cool. I really like
that I've lost all my wonder line. I feel like
that's just been a thing I've heard a lot recently
is like how we're losing our wonder. So, yeah.
I think that's pretty cool. It's easy for us
to forget. I mean, I think it's just like on
a Sunday morning, you think about how like many
times you miss like the little things. Yeah.
And so. Yeah, that's really good. That's such
a key idea because I do think that we forget
not just the blessings that we experience from
God on a consistent basis, but we lose the wonder
of the gospel and the good news of it. And so
Um, yeah, it's always a good reminder to us to
be able to hold out on that. So it's really good.
Jordan, thanks for joining us again. Thanks for
having me. It's always a pleasure. I'm thankful
that we get to invite you on for these, um, pop
punk and whatever else. Hey, I love pop punk.
So, and I love talking about it. That's awesome.
Uh, anywhere that you want people to come and
find you on the interwebs. Oh, I thought you
were just going to say, come and find me. Um,
I have Instagram. I am JoJoTheWizard257. I'm
on Facebook, JordanNoellLorek, and I'm on TikTok
too. I think I'm JoNolo257, so check me out.
She'll be on The Tonight Show this Thursday.
With musical guest, Grace Kraber. I will not
be joining you on TikTok, but I'm pretty sure
I'll follow you on Instagram and we're friends
on Facebook, so it works out. Yeah. That's good.
That's good. Well, we're super excited that you
were able to join us for this episode. You again
can find us on Facebook at heyareelistening at
heyareepod on X. Don't forget to send in mail.
We would love to answer your questions online.
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