Welcome to her comeback. I'm so glad you're back
with me. This is where 50 isn't your finish line.
It is your starting point. The starting point
of everything you want your life to be. The person
that you are meant to be. I'm your host Michelle
Thompson, and we are proving that your best chapter
may just be the one you haven't written yet.
We'll continue each episode featuring honest
conversation with women who have stopped going
at it alone and have found their way to fulfillment,
joy, and purpose in their second act. You'll
hear about their struggles, their breakthroughs,
and the practical steps that they took to create
lives that they actually love. This podcast will
show you how other women have made their comeback
and how you can too. Welcome back. Welcome to
her come back. I am your host, Michelle Thompson.
And I'm so glad that you're back with me again
this week. I decided to do something a little
different. We're about halfway through our episodes
with season two. And I decided that I wanted
to share something with you. I have finished
writing my book. Yay. I'm so excited. It's been
such an amazing experience. And now I have still
in front of me that publishing process. So there's
a whole lot more to come on that and you'll be
hearing more over the coming weeks. But I wanted
to share with you a little excerpt and talk a
little bit about something that I talk about
in the book that I really have not talked about
on the show up to this point. And in fact, I
almost didn't have it at all in my book. The
topic of spirituality was not at all something
that I had included in my original book outline
when I started. And I wanted to keep it that
way because the, I guess my initial thoughts
was that the minute you say spirituality or maybe
even worse God, people lean in. One way or another
or they're out the door So just before I go any
further in this just let me say very clearly.
I'm not here to preach This is not anything like
that. I'm not here to convert or tell you what
to believe or suggest What path is right for
you? I grew up a preacher's kid and trust me.
I had enough of that in my lifetime so What I
am here to do is to share something that's just
deeply personal, something that if I'm being
completely honest has been truly the greatest
transformation in my life. And I think wherever
you land on the spectrum of faith, religion,
skepticism, or somewhere in between. There's
something in this conversation for you because
it's not really about god it's about the beliefs
that we carry sometimes for decades that we're
really never hours to begin with it's about what
happens when you finally give yourself permission
to question them just take a breath stay open
and let's just walk through some of this together.
So. And Eckhart Tolle's book, The Power of Now,
he speaks about how the use of the word God evokes
such powerful emotion, ranging from great conviction
to just a complete denial of such a presence.
And the moment that the word is even uttered,
there's often a mental image that's created of
something or someone outside of you. And then
it begs the question, How does this image help
or hinder you in enabling your experience? And
there's truly no word that can capture that we
as finite beings cannot comprehend infinite.
We may try to put God in a box, so to speak,
something that we can contain, that we can define
with form, but it's not possible. At least that's
been my experience. I'll talk just a little bit
about where I started in my journey here and
then just how far I've come along the way. As
I mentioned, I was a preacher's kid and we were
independent Baptists. Those Southern Baptists
were a little bit too liberal for us. And I was
in church services three times a week. I played
the piano. I sang in ensembles. I did youth group
activities, Sunday school. It was just being
fully immersed in the church environment. And
that's the way I grew up. And I rarely missed
a service. There was a not in any way subtle
expectation that if you were the preacher's kid,
you had to be perfect. And if you weren't perfect,
people love to tattle on preacher's kids too.
You do something wrong and somehow always it
got back to my father. So that kind of grew up
in that around that type of stuff. In the church
itself, there was always one thing that just
rattled me to the core and that was just the
hypocrisy. I just hated it. I felt like I've
got to be perfect all the time and show up in
my Sunday best and other people come in here
and they're just here for one, two hours tops
and they go back to live in whatever life they
had before they came in the doors. And sometimes
that looked like Sunday sermon and sometimes
it didn't. And maybe I was a little bit jealous
of that. I'd like to be able to be that way or
have those options? And then there were church
politics. Oh my goodness. Those showed up in
so many forms. There was petty infighting over
the color of the church carpet or the pew cushions,
just gossip and personal agendas and divided
interests and just a lack of trust and transparency.
And then you can't forget about the Jimmy Swaggart's
of the world that preached furiously about the
sins of adultery and all the while falling prey
to that. primal human instinct, just many, many
situations over the years that I could describe.
And while I talk about some of these things in
less than positive light, I must also acknowledge
that there were some really good people in the
church as well, sort of the earth type people.
They were kind, loving, faithful, supportive.
And it was because of people like them that my
dad, my father stayed in the ministry for 20
years. But after he retired, it was after my
senior year in high school and I was going off
to college and I really had made a decision at
that point that it's pretty much done with church.
I'd been there for 18 years of my life and I'd
done my time. That's just not something that
I was interested in doing anymore. And for me
at the time, I saw church, God, spirituality,
religion, all of those words were like the same
thing. There was no differentiation in those.
And it was all fear -based. We were sinful. If
we didn't do what we needed to do, go to hell.
And it was just this fear -based. And then if
you wanted to be in God's will, you needed to
surrender your life to God. And then that meant
you had to be a preacher's wife or a missionary.
You got to go to Africa or some other far corner
of the earth. That's how I interpreted all of
that. That may have not really been what was
said, but that's what I heard. And so I interpreted
that if I surrendered to God's will, then because
I didn't want to do any of those things like
preacher's wife and missionary, and I didn't
want to do any of those things. So then God's
will was going to be something I wouldn't like.
And that's what I internalized. And that belief
carried me for like, decades, believing that
whatever God wanted for my life and whatever
God's will was for my life, I wasn't going to
like it. There was a time when I was single mom,
my kids were young, some really low points that
I had. I thought, okay, God must be punishing
me, not going to church or not doing these things.
So I started to feel like as bad things happened
that this was punishment. And nothing really
changed in terms of those beliefs until I got
into the rooms of 12 step recovery and off the
bat the there was the use of the word God and
then in fact the very first group support meeting
that I went to was actually held in a church
and. Oh my goodness, I just thought, this is
a deal breaker. This program is not going to
work for me. I went back. This is when I was
in a treatment facility and I wrote my therapist
saying, this is just not going to work. I don't
do church. I don't do God. This, this program
is not going to work for me. And so when we met
and she kind of listened to my diatribe, she
said, Michelle, you're in luck because there
are actually some of these group meetings that
are not in church. So you don't have to go to
a church. And I was like, okay. Well, that's
good news. And, and then she said, as far as
God, you really can get your own concept of that.
All you need to believe is that there is a higher
power, a greater presence than you. And it's
not you that there is something greater. She's
like, that's really all you have to believe.
I was like, okay, well, maybe I'm sure there
is a greater spirit. out there. Um, I was willing
to believe just enough that I, to keep me curious,
I guess, just as like, okay, well, let me just
see where this all goes. And it was a, during
the same period that I heard for the first time,
a differentiation between religion and spirituality.
Again, as I mentioned, I just always thought
those were the same, but there's a native American
author, Vine Deloria Jr. It's a theologian, historian,
activist as well. And one of his famous quotes
is, religion is for people who are afraid of
going to hell. Spirituality is for those who've
already been there. Provocative, right? And I
understand what I interpret to be the thoughts
behind it, that people that follow certain religious
rules and rituals and doctrines that they do
it primarily out of fear. And then there's others
that have had their own personal sufferings,
whether what some type of trauma or addiction
or just other types of losses. And they're not
really motivated to spirituality by fear of suffering
because they've suffered so much already. And
that concept of just making a distinction between
those. It really gave me a much broader perspective
and it challenged me to ask why I believed what
I believed and whether faith came from fear or
from just a genuine inner searching. And over
the next months, even into the next couple of
years, I continued to maintain the belief that
there's definitely a higher power. There is a
power that's greater than me. And I could see
that power working in other people's life. I
hadn't yet connected it to me, but I could definitely
agree that power was at work in other people's
life. That worked for a while. And then as life
went on, challenging times at home, life shows
up. And I found that, okay, that concept of what
I had thought about how it works for others.
It's not working for me anymore. It had never
become personal and I could no longer keep that
god of my understanding or god of my misunderstanding.
I couldn't keep it at arm's length anymore. I
had to take on something more meaningful. My
mentor Took me back in some steps in the program
where we talk about defining the qualities of
our higher power and she's okay. Let's just your
higher power healing is your higher power punishing
or forgiving loving or mean Judgmental or accepting
all of those types of things and then she's reinforced
that the decision was mine to make the choice
was mine to make I just needed to connect with,
make that connection with something that was
personal to me. And this kind of started me on
a new path again, continuing to open my perspective
to possibilities of how that, how I can maintain
a relationship with that God of my understanding.
And i started giving more consideration to all
of the many blessings and the good things that
i had i could clearly see at this point there's
many gifts many blessings and i'm just grateful
for the good things that i have and i could look
and say no didn't. A loving power have a hand
in all those things to it i really began to hold
on to that. And I still would go back and forth
over the next couple of years. And I give God
the credit for the good stuff. But when things
went wrong, my initial response was still just
to blame God. And then I'd get mad at God. And
I would try to talk myself down from that position
to see other perspectives that just I wasn't
seeing. And then I'd ask others who Have these
beliefs. How do you not get mad at God? How are
you not angry that this happened to you? This
was really bad and All of them pretty much said
the same thing They just said that they have
their own track record where that they've seen
for themselves over the years that when those
bad things did happen Somehow it worked out.
Okay, there was something good that came of it.
And then sometimes that things got The things
that worked out for the better that were much
more than they ever could have imagined. And
that was fascinating to me. I was fascinated
by that. But I still would just question. I was
like, well, if God is all powerful, omnipotent,
yet bad things happen, how is it not his fault?
Didn't he allow it? I still just struggled with
that. And also I held on to that belief I mentioned
a few minutes ago, that underlying belief that
whatever God's will was for my life, I wasn't
going to like it. So I'm continuing. is best
I can to run my life in the direction that I
feel like I should be running it fueled on my
own self -sufficiency. And how is any single
mom out there, how are you anything but self
-sufficient, like for your own well -being, the
well -being of your children. It depends on it.
Your life depends on it. I am the most self -sufficient,
motivated, running the show, single mom out there.
One day, I just hit a wall with everything. I
had just... had it with everyone everything in
my life all i was doing to try to make the best
of the situation and things were just not going
according to plan they just weren't working out
and i even it's like questions like well maybe
this recovery group something going to that's
just isn't working i would just question the
whole thing maybe these spiritual principles
just aren't going to work after all And then
I went and had a conversation with my mentor
at the time and she said, well, perhaps Michelle,
you need to do some more time in your meditation
practice. She noted that I didn't seem to be
getting the benefits from practicing mindfulness
and getting quiet and being open to the guidance
of a higher presence in my life. No. And that
was no real shocker because i didn't have a meditation
practice to get those benefits from so that was
that was pretty clear there. And the thing with
this particular person when i met her years earlier
she had gone on a meditation retreat it was for
ten days and during the time you could not speak
you could not talk to the people around you.
And it consisted of these 10 days of sitting
in meditation, like more than 12 hours a day.
You'd get breaks for like meals and a bathroom,
that kind of stuff. But it was long days of meditation
and there were no cell phones. There's no contact
with the outside world. I mean, can you imagine?
Yeah. When I met her and she went through that
whole experience, I was like, Oh, I'll never
do that. Well, this is now about four years later.
I'm asking her about that very same retreat and.
I was so disgusted with my life and I thought
that, okay, maybe going away for this meditation
retreat is a good idea for me. I've been going
at this thing on my own. I've had enough. I felt
like that old Calgon commercial in the Calgon,
take me away. That I was having one of those
moments. So I went, but. The meditation retreat
was nothing like the Calgon commercial. Let me
tell you, once again, I kind of managed to get
myself into something. I had no idea what I was
really getting myself into. I have a way of doing
that. And the first couple of days were actually
okay. I actually did feel some relief from just
being quiet for a couple of days and clearing
that headspace that I'd been in. But then it
got exponentially harder. Oh my goodness, the
more I sat with myself, the more things would
come up. And as things come up, it was part of
the practice that you practice releasing those
things and practicing equanimity within your
body and the different sensations that you would
feel and acknowledge things rising and passing
away that kind of impermanence of rising and
passing away. So there's a real methodology to
all of it, if you will. Well, By the eighth day,
we were no longer in group meditation. We had
been up in a group up to that point. But on the
eighth day, we went to the individual cells in
the pagoda. There's like these small closets
where you would go and sit and then you'd practice
your meditation alone. Like you're in solitary
confinement. They are practicing your meditation
alone. And something happened that day. I had
this powerful, just overwhelming sense, a profound
realization that I can no longer go at my life
alone. I have got to have spiritual help. I need
a loving, healing spirit to guide me and to help
me through. for whatever life brought my way
and I just kind of said the prayer like that
asking that higher presence just please stay
with me no matter what I don't want to ever be
alone please stay with me and it truly it was
another transformation there so not only after
completing that retreat from that point on meditation
truly became a regular recurrence in my routine
but I also have a new understanding of that divine
presence in my life and i knew it was a spiritual
relationship that i wanted and needed in my life.
So as the years followed that i continue to improve
approach life using the spiritual framework spiritual
principles but now really. having that individual
relationship with a spiritual presence. And when
my plans didn't work, I kind of yield to Spirit's
plan, acknowledging that there's a better way.
I just need to trust and have faith that in what's
to come, that it's okay. And what happened is,
as I strengthened that relationship and my own
spirituality strengthened, I began to see my
own track record. I think I had my own track
record all along, but I couldn't see it. Now
I really began to see it. Like, oh my goodness,
now I can look at those things that happened
then and they were... Awful and what somehow
it worked out and maybe there's a few of them
that I can say oh how it worked out was actually
a gift that was the best thing that could have
happened to me. And so I saw that there and I
knew it and I could see that my higher power
had never left me my higher power had always
been there and through the ups and downs of everything.
Cory Ten Boom, she's non -Jewish and she's a
Dutch woman from the 1940s. She was arrested
by the Nazis with her family for hiding Jewish
people, Jewish families in her home during the
Holocaust. She was imprisoned and eventually
she was in the Ravensburg concentration camp.
And during this time, through it all, the extreme
cruelty and torture. She never lost her faith
in God, and she believed that God was there with
her in the midst of the persecution. And one
of her famous quotes, she says that there is
no pit so deep that God's love is not deeper
still. So despite the loss of her father and
her sister in those camps, in those death camps,
upon the release, she made it out alive. She
continued her spiritual walk. She continued practicing
love and forgiveness and helping others heal.
Just a really amazing lady. And then there's
another lady, Dr. Edith Ager. She is a renowned
psychologist and survivor of Auschwitz. She wrote
a heartfelt inspirational memoir, The Choice,
Embrace the Possible. And it's about surviving
trauma rising above and choosing to create the
life you want. While in captivity, Dr. Ager acknowledged
there were those who, like her own sister, had
lost her faith. They said, how could God let
this happen? And she understood what they meant.
She understood where they were coming from. But
from her perspective, she never found it difficult
to believe that it wasn't God who was killing
them. God didn't run the death camps. People
did. She pictured God being like a dancing child
that's lively, innocent, curious. And if she
wanted to be close to God now, she must be as
well. So she wondered if there was anyone who
knew that she was there. She wondered if her
parents could see her. She wondered if anybody
else knew what was going on there. She wondered.
She wondered. She convinced herself that her
worst transgression would be to relinquish that
curiosity. So certainly, for most of us, our
circumstances in life are nowhere near the suffering
of these horrific camps, but the same principles
apply. Dr. Ager said she wanted people to hear
her story and to think, what if she can do it?
I can too. In her clinical experience and practice,
she dedicated her life to helping others transcend
their life circumstances. She wrote about taking
risks, making choices, embracing fears so that
we're not imprisoned by them. And she also talked
about how the greatest prison walls are not made
of concrete or steel or any other man -made materials,
but rather they're the construct of ones on mine.
She believed that as long as we courageously
took action, walked through fear, that we would
discover possibilities we never knew existed.
So today, I don't blame or get angry at God when
bad things happen. I know today that I too have
a choice. Through the most recent spiritually
challenging times that I've been in starting
a new business and all the uncertainty and fears
that are involved in that I've learned that when
my plans not working I Need to let go and just
trust that greater plan that's in play I do my
best to remain willing and open to what the universe
brings my way. And as long as I'm doing my part
and the best that I can do, I'm just going to
trust the outcome to my higher power. And it's
a daily spiritual practice for me, daily humility,
ego deflation and acceptance that I do not, nor
could I possibly have all the answers. And while
I can only see the stitches of the pattern that's
right in front of me today, I believe my Creator
can see the whole tapestry and how it all comes
together. And outcomes are often out of my hands.
My role is to continue to show up and do my best
and trust that God's going to do for me the things
that I can't do for myself. And if the results
that I get today are not what I want, I can still
trust that things are happening as they should
and continue to ask spirit for guidance and direction.
Ultimately, things will work out and they may
not look at all what I imagined, but that's okay.
Far too often I sell myself short of what's possible.
I know that in letting go, there's opportunities
for doors to open to even greater things. And
this can be really hard work for a self -sufficient
control freak, right? Believe me, I spent years
in pain and problems of my own making because
I refuse to accept and practice these simple
principles. There's a Zen proverb that says,
let go or be dragged. I can identify with that
because it's been in my clinging. Whether it's
an attachment, a resentment, or just a resistance
to what is, it is those things that have caused
my pain and suffering. It is through redefining
my relationship with the divine that my life
today is immensely better than it ever has been.
And it doesn't make life easier. It just makes
it deeper and more meaningful. And I no longer
look to the future with Fear and uncertainty
those days everybody has bad days But most days
I don't and I face each day just for today with
courage and I ask my higher power to take away
those fears and to relieve me of the need to
know for my outcomes and just help me do what's
in front of me and Those are the only things
that are in my controllers. Just what's in front
of me today and just trust that things will work
out. So I practiced a daily meditation, a prayer,
I read spiritual readings, I journal my thoughts
and reflections. Journally gives me clarity and
it gets everything that's kind of wadded up in
my head onto paper and helps me organize it so
that I can understand it and kind of grasp what's
going on there. So it's really important practices
for me. And so I don't live today with these
gripping outcomes or bracing for disappointment.
I live willing, willing to trust, willing to
let go of control, willing to believe that even
when I can't see the whole tapestry, there is
a loving presence that's weaving the threads
that I don't yet understand. And at this stage
of my life, I I don't need the certainty. What
I know I need is connection. And in choosing
faith, I've discovered something I've been searching
for all along, and that's that I was never walking
alone. And I'm going to continue to walk forward,
guided, supported, and open. And I invite you
to do the same. Redefine the divine for you,
for yourself. Release what no longer search you
build a relationship with a higher being that
strengthens you not scares you Step into the
second half of your life anchored in faith not
fear There's a life that's waiting for you that
requires nothing less I have a few questions
that I just want to close with and you can think
about these in the coming weeks and see where
you fall with some of these questions in terms
of re -examining your old beliefs what's a long
-held spiritual or religious belief that shaped
your life which ones might be worth re -examining
have they held you back and then in terms of
religious religion versus spirituality how would
you define the difference between the two. Where
do you land on that spectrum? What is your concept
of a higher power? If you give yourself the freedom
and the permission to define your higher power
on your terms, what qualities does it have? Has
that concept changed over time? And then how
are you doing in surrendering control? I talked
about my struggles with it. Can you relate to
that tension between self -reliance and surrender?
Is there an area in your life right now where
letting go might open new doors? And then what
about your own personal track record? Can you
look back at a difficult chapter in your life
and See how it may have worked out differently,
maybe better than you expected at the time that
there was something good that came from it. Think
about those things. Thank you so much for joining
me today. And I'm glad that we were able to talk
about a topic that we usually don't talk about.
And thank you for being willing just to be open
and think about these things with me. I so look
forward to seeing you again next week with another
podcast episode. Until then, this is her comeback.
I hope this conversation inspired you to keep
moving forward no matter where you are in your
own journey. If you love this episode, I'd be
so grateful if you would subscribe to the show
on my YouTube channel, Michelle Thompson dash
life coaching. Go there for more encouragement,
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with other women in our amazing community who
are rewriting their stories. Remember, your setback
isn't your final chapter. It's just the setup
for your greatest comeback yet. I'll see you
next time. Until then.