Hello and welcome to the Ball Card Show, the
sports podcast for the Sports Collector. This
is Season 5, Episode 21. We've got a lot coming
up this month in the hobby. It's really just
one thing, if we're being honest about it. We're
less than a month out. It's one major thing,
but leading up to it, at least for us, it feels
like it is... Big week after big week after big
week. We're in a gauntlet of shows right now.
Bigger shows and the stress of sourcing and all
that stuff is upon us. The summer season. We
just finished up a local show last week in Lancaster,
Ohio. I'll give a quick rundown of the next few
weeks. This Sunday, July the 6th. at Central
Crossing Schools in Grove City, Ohio. We'll be
set up at Card Fest. It's going to be another
great show. These are the same people that have
promoted the Shipshuana show. Card Collector
2 has partnered with this show. There will be
a lot of familiar faces in the hobby. How many
tables are set up at this? Over 200. Really good
show. It'll be Sunday. So come say hey to us
there. The following week, we'll be in Xenia,
Ohio. The week after that, we will be at the
Eastgate Show in Cincinnati. And then two weeks
after that, we'll be at the National. Yeah. We
might take a break the weekend before. I probably
won't. You may. I have a feeling we're going
to be very inventory poor. Yes, that's entirely
possible. Not my favorite situation to be in,
but it is fun to buy. Oh, yeah. It's always fun
to source. It's sourcing properly. That is the
challenge. Yeah. But, well, somehow we pull it
off. Quick reminder to you as you're checking
in with us, if maybe you've just been introduced
to the podcast through the socials or whatever,
be sure to give us a like, follow, subscribe,
whatever platform you're on. If you're on socials,
we tend to chop up clips all through the week
from the weekly podcast. If you want the full
-length video of the podcast, click on the link
in the bio wherever you are. It'll take you to
our YouTube page. You can check it out there.
We drop new episodes every Thursday. And speaking
of every Thursday. What do we do Thursday nights?
We go live on Whatnot at 7 o 'clock every Thursday
night, 7 p .m. Eastern time. And this week, once
again, thank you to the folks over at Juicebox.
We dropped a video a few weeks ago. You guys
that watch and listen every week are probably
sick of hearing us saying this, but this is for
the new folks. We ripped a whole case of their
repack product that they sent to us, and the
deal we made with them was this. We don't want
you to pay us. We're not going to keep these
cards. We will give you an honest review if that's
what you want. Make sure it's actually what you
want. because we're going to be honest. And the
deal is we get to give away all these slaps.
So that's what we've been doing the last two
weeks on Whatnot. Again, this week and then for
two more weeks, we will be doing that. Some of
the highlights that we will be giving away this
week. How about a Yamamoto and Otani PSA 10?
We've got a really cool orange disco fast break.
Some people call it whatever. Jamar Chase color
match and an SGC 10. This is a fun one you don't
see too often. How about Faces of the Future,
Shai Gilgeous-Alexander rookie card in an SGC
10? Really high grade on the Z -Force Zuperman
Kobe Bryant. And the big giveaway of the night.
How about the Bijan Robinson Select RPA numbered
to $199. All those are going to be buyer's giveaways
along with 10 more things. And then we will have
10 regular giveaways. So come hang out with us.
Hop in the stream. One of our favorite things
that we see happening. Every week in our Whatnot
stream is the number of folks who start with
us at 7 o 'clock and are still there at 10 o
'clock. And when we're pulling orders, one person
has order number three and order number 280.
It's a fun thing. It feels like this podcast
for three hours. That's what we shoot for. Come
hang out with us. You don't have to buy anything.
You can just hang out, see some cool cards, be
a part of the stream. Who needs fireworks? You
know what I mean? I can't stand it. There are
more people that actually don't like fireworks
than you realize. I don't mind fireworks. I can't
stand crowds of people, though. That's the worst.
We have a thing here in Columbus called Red,
White, and Boom. Kind of a big deal. Hard pass.
It's a hard pass for me. I like it, but only
from certain places. And they're not where all
the people are. If I sound rather hoarse, I am.
If Gary talks a lot in this episode, it's a good
thing. I'm not going to complain about it as
much as normal. As we jump in, we're real excited.
We've got a special guest coming up here in a
little bit, Alyx with Collectors MD. We're going
to be diving into a little more of the darker
side of the hobby. I guess we're getting a little
bit of a label with the trolls that we just talk
about negative things. And that's not true. Just
a lot more people tend to watch the negative
things apparently because there's a lot of the
other kind of clips in there as well. Go to our
actual page and just scroll through our clips.
You'll see one negative clip for every 20 positive
clips. Or for context, watch an episode. Yeah,
watch the whole episode. All right. Caitlin Clark
seems to be getting completely hosed by the player
vote for the All -Star game. Ninth among the...
Let's backtrack. Back it up. WNBA All -Star voting
has concluded. And the fan vote, Kaitlyn Clark,
was number one overall by miles. Hundreds of
thousands of votes. She had almost 1 .3 million
votes. Which, to put it in context, until last
year, I don't think 1 .3 million people had watched
the WNBA. Like, had attended games in the total
in the 20 years of the league. Just absolutely
annihilated it. That was a little bit of exaggeration.
Not much of one. You have no idea. I don't, but
that's a bet I would be willing to make. A blind.
I would make that bet blind. Hey, you heard it
here. But anybody who watches the games at all
knows how good Kaitlin Clark is. It's not close.
So number one in fan voting by leaps and bounds.
Ninth, not overall, among the player vote. Ninth
among guards in the player vote. What are they
looking for that they're not seeing? I mean,
there's multiple factors, but I'm trying to understand
why that might not happen. Like, ninth place
among guards in the player vote. Yeah. What are
they voting on? Not basketball skill. It doesn't
seem to be that. Feel free to let us know what
you think is causing it. The players definitely
lead the troop of hate ones. Yeah, it seems to
be that way. Not the most loved amongst players.
You know what they won't be hating? They're definitely
going to want her at the bargaining table with
the next CBA. Oh, yeah. They're going to be happy
she's there for that. So we'll let you all draw
your own conclusions as to what's going on there.
But it's, yeah, it was shocking to say the least.
Place among guards. Galen Clark. She's aight.
Other players are like, she's aight. Some salty
bitterness going on in there. I don't understand
it. It's not that there can't be other ones.
And maybe she's not the number one. There's the
concept of the time they've been in the league,
how long they've been playing, longevity, team
leadership. But for the players to put her at
ninth is a statement. Diana Taurasi being ahead
of her in the player vote? No issue with that.
Brittany Sykes being ahead of her in the player
vote? You don't know about that one. How does
that happen? All right. Let's move on. National,
less than a month out. We're going to be there.
Everyone's going to be there. You should be there.
If you want to. You don't have to go. I've got
to get the numbers out for this. We do have something
to share specifically about the National. Gary
and I will be up from Wednesday through Saturday.
Staying close to the... Convention Center there.
If any of you want to catch up, be sure to reach
out. Hit us up on socials if there's a day you're
at the show. I know there's some of you we've
already talked with we'll be catching up with.
But, yeah, we'd love to meet you, get to know
you a little bit. Look for the What's Your Highest
shirts. Yeah. And look for my hats. Maybe we
get some fresh T -shirts for that. Yeah, maybe
we do. Fire up the cricket, dog. Hey, all you
guys out there, by the way, who are giving my
hat game love, thank you so much. It really bothers
Jason. I'm glad we talk about it every week.
Because that's the only reason an adult would
wear cartoons. I know. Is for it to be talked
about. I enjoy it immensely. The attention. I
enjoy the product. The reaction. No. Yeah. Just
the product. It's okay. Yeah, I'm a fan. I'm
grumpy. I don't feel great. It's okay. You're
allowed. It happens sometimes. I feel like I
could do a really good, like, hold on, let me
think. I feel like I could do a good Stone Temple
Pilots with my voice right now. I was thinking
Oscar the Grouch. Well, that too. We can get
you a little trash can to pop out. The National's
up in less than a month. We just saw something
on socials. PSA must have had a typo. There must
have been something that was off. Because when
we looked at this, you said it to me. I'm not
going to say the words that you used because
I'm not sure they're appropriate. But shock and
awe. Shock and awe. Well, less shock, more awe.
Yeah, we went, after we saw this, we was like,
okay, let's make sure this is real. So I have
PSA's website in front of me. Let's go over the
on -site costs, both for grading and for crossover
service. On -site express grading with card value
up to $2 ,500. This one isn't terrible. It's
$149. Drop it off. You'll have it by the end
of the show. However, it just continues to climb.
The highest tier is $9 ,999 and up on cards,
maximum insured value of $250 ,000. A little
crazy. Now, if I have a high -grade mantle rookie,
maybe I don't care too much. What's shocking
is how many people will be standing in line for
this stuff with their $300 cards. And that will
happen. But here's the one that really got me.
This is what really got me. You ever look at
something and you're like, this information cannot
be correct. Where's the typo? What am I misreading?
You look over it five times and you're like,
no, that's it. That's what it says. That is what
it says. The crossover process. And if you're
not familiar with what the crossover is, is instead
of taking a card that's in, say, an SGC slab
and cracking it out of there yourself and sending
it to PSA directly. You give it to PSA inside
that slab, and they will grade it inside the
slab. And if they think it will cross over to
the minimum grade you're requesting, they will
crack it out and holder it. At the National,
and I heard someone say that this was the we
don't want to do this price, which that's the
only thing that makes sense. At the National,
the fee that PSA is charging you to just look
at the card. and if they say no, you still have
to pay the fee, is $599. I hand them this slab.
I say, hey, I want to cross this. I need it to
be a 10. And they look at it and they go, yeah,
it's not going to be a 10. That'll be $600, please.
Now, what's really fun is if they say yes, you
pay the $600, then you pay the grading fee on
top of it. But wait, there's more. Which starts.
At $400. For cards up to what value? $25 ,000.
That's the lowest price you will pay at the National
to have this done on site is $1 ,000. Yikes.
Or you pay $600 to find out you should not submit
it. You're going to have to stand in line to
do that, too. You saved yourself $400. Wait,
no, you didn't. You lost $600. And you're going
to have to stand in line for the right to have
them just hold you up at gunpoint. It's insane.
I hope that none of you are silly enough to do
this. To all of you glazing PSA is king. Do not
expect less of this. No. Expect more of this.
And if SGC is fading into the background, which
we don't know for certain, but there are some
things that indicate it's certainly possible,
expect more of this. This isn't going to get
better. Yeah, the monopolization of the hobby
is in. Full force. We're catching full stride.
We've got to get all those licenses under the
same umbrella, and then we're there. And don't
get us wrong. We're not those guys out here saying
that, oh, you should grade somewhere else. We
live in reality. The reality is that PSA is king
of the market. Your cards in a PSA slab are going
to sell for more money. They are going to, in
the market, be worth more money. Whether you
like it or not, that's just the reality. Your
SGC10 is not worth as much as a PSA10. Your BGS95
is not worth as much as a PSA10 in the market.
It may be to you, and if it is to you, you'll
just own that card for a long time because it
ain't going to sell for what a PSA10 does. However,
PSA is absolutely leveraging that reality. So
let's think through the math on this. let's say
that you're in that bottom tier, which 99 % of
what gets submitted that week will be, card worth
less than, this is for a crossover, and to have
it slabbed. You're in $599 and then another $400
to get it slabbed. So you're in $1 ,000 on grading
costs. How valuable would a card need to be for
you in its current slab at the current market
for you to invest $1 ,000 where that makes sense?
It's got to be $8 ,000 plus at a minimum. Maybe
you've got to... an SGC nine five or a BGS nine
five of a card that in a PSA 10 is worth 15 grand,
13 grand. And it's worth eight or nine in the
slab that it's in. Okay. I guess that probably
makes sense, but you better be damn sure that
it's going to cross. Otherwise it's 600 bucks
out your pocket. Oh, and it probably matters
more how you got into the cart, right? Did you
hit it and grade it yourself? You know, you might
have the margin there, but man, thousand bucks
to find out. Yeah, that's. Like, there's a part
of me that's like, it would be nice with that
Cassius Clay rookie to know if that BVG 85 would
cross over to a PSA 8. Because we're talking
thousands of dollars. Yeah, is it worth $600
to see? But if I'm wrong, that car will be worth
negative dollars. Yeah. Yeah. Really quickly.
$600 to find out. You can find out while you're
there. I don't want to know that bad. I don't
want to know that bad. Hey, for the value box
today, I'm really excited to set this up. I know
last week we talked about one of the biggest
Ponzi schemes getting exposed with Chad Smith,
Chad Smith cards. Some of you reached out to
that. We had some of you commenting that you
have had less than pleasant interactions with
this guy clear back into the 90s. In some ways,
it's like you don't like highlighting the negative
side of the hobby, but it's really important
that people are aware of how this happens, that
people are exposed when they do this kind of
stuff, and that you do things to prevent that
going forward. We also talked about scams last
week and how we can avoid common pitfalls. For
some of you, you were commenting, this is so
obvious. Cool. Wasn't for you then. Don't get
scammed. For the rest of you that hadn't heard,
there's some ways to avoid it. But today I'm
really excited. We're still talking about a side
of the hobby that is a little bit on the darker
side, a little bit something that people can
be down a little bit more negative about. But
I think it's super, super important with the
way that the space is going, the way that cards
get into collectors' hands, the methods we use
for that. And so we're going to be talking with
Alyx from Collectors MD. Who's going to share
in this conversation not only how to become aware
of a time where you can go from collecting to
perhaps an addiction that could have devastating
consequences in someone's life to finding help
and support to appreciate the hobby in a way
that doesn't cause unnecessary harm. Right. So
we're looking forward to this conversation. We'll
definitely be following up with that here in
just a moment. All right, today we are joined
by Alyx Effron from Collectors MD. Alyx, thanks
so much for being here today. We appreciate you
making some time to talk to us. Thank you, guys.
Thanks so much for having me. It's great to be
on the show. Really excited to talk about Collectors MD
and the direction we're headed. Lots of momentum,
lots of exciting things going on. And yeah, I
just really appreciate you guys giving me the
platform and the stage to continue carrying this
really incredibly important message. Yeah, absolutely.
Good introduction there. So tell us just a little
bit before we get too deep into the weeds and
questions, just an overview. What is Collectors
MD? Yeah, so Collectors MD, and I can kind of
talk about the origin before I dive into exactly
what it is and what we do. But Collectors MD
started because I personally was living this.
issue firsthand. I wasn't some outsider observing
the space, observing the hobby. I was fully immersed
in it. I was deep, deep in the hobby and the
art of collecting. And over time, what started
as a fun passion turned into something a lot
more overwhelming. I felt like I was chasing
constantly. I was ripping late into the night,
wee hours of the morning. I was justifying purchases
that didn't make sense. And worse, I wasn't really
enjoying any of it. I was constantly waking up
the next day with a pit in my stomach, just feeling
disgusted with the amount of money I spent and
sort of the rabbit hole that I went down the
night prior. That moment where you look at a
stack of packages or a bank statement and think,
how did I get here? That's what really pushed
me to start Collectors MD. I realized there were
just so many people out there quietly struggling,
but no one was really talking about this openly
and honestly. There were hot takes, jokes, memes,
meme accounts reposting people who... you know
open up and talk about what they're going through
but there really was no space for real honest
support so i built what i wish had existed for
me a safe place for collectors who need to hit
pause sort of recalibrate and feel a sense of
being understood and a sense of community. So
with that, what Collectors MD is, it's a movement
for collectors navigating compulsive collecting
and spending, especially break culture and hobby
burnout. We're not anti -hobby. We're pro -accountability
and we're pro -awareness. Those are really important
things. And it was created. for collectors by
collectors. So when you talk about that pity
or stomach feeling, right? Like you're looking
over the bank statement or the next morning,
you're like, man, did I really, did I really
convince myself two or three more breaks were
going to get me back to where I needed to be
to chase this deficit or whatever it may be.
Somewhere along the way, it was something you
were very passionate about and excited about,
and something began to change. Are you able to
look at your story or the genesis of this and
figure out? Here's where it went from a passion
to something that may be destructive or addictive.
What were the things that you started to notice
where maybe some red flags were going up? Maybe
you were suppressing them or shutting them up.
You're saying that there wasn't really any type
of peer network to keep you accountable, to check
on you, to check on your well -being. What were
those things you were seeing that were, hey,
this has gone from passion to maybe something
a little different? Yeah, it's a great question.
And it's one of the hardest things to spot and
identify because it blurs so easily, right? Like
one day you're just collecting your favorite
team, your favorite players. And the next day
you're chasing a case hit. You don't even really
care about spending the money you told yourself
you wouldn't touch, right? The hobby is an amazing
place. It really is. It combines nostalgia, creativity.
It's community driven. But when you mix in 24
-7 access. And gambling like mechanics and just
this constant pressure to always keep up and
be a part of the next, you know, big group break
or product coming out. It can just it can start
to turn on you. And, you know, we're seeing it
happen more and more. People are just becoming
so burnt out. Relationships are getting strained.
Finances are getting wrecked. because it still
looks like a hobby something that you know we
we enjoyed since we were kids it's hard to call
it what it really is which for a lot of people
is compulsion and i always say it's it's not
about villainizing collecting it's about helping
people recognize when that joy is gone and the
behavior has just you know completely consumed
you and taken over interesting that's that kind
of leads to to a question for me because When
I think about the hobby and you reference break
culture, we talk a lot about how breaking in
and of itself isn't necessarily a bad thing,
but it can become something really ugly sometimes.
The chase aspect of what this hobby is about,
in my opinion, has been around since the hobby
started. Whether you were chasing a Mickey Mantle
rookie to stick in your bike spokes in 1952 and
flipping cards with your friends to chasing Ken
Griffey Jr. in 89 Upper Deck at 36 bucks a box
to now when the stakes have exponentially gotten
higher, the cost of wax has gotten exponentially
higher. do you think that addiction and compulsive
behavior is something that has always existed
in the hobby? Or do you see that as something
that is become a relatively recent trend due
to outside forces? Yeah, that's another great
question because the hobby has been around for
decades, if not centuries, right? Like people
have been collecting cards for over a hundred
years. And the idea of the chase has sort of
always been baked into. the hobby like since
the very beginning whether it was trying to complete
an entire set or you know just land your favorite
player in you know a pack that you picked up
from the local store or just finding that elusive
rookie there's always been a sense of pursuit
right and over time that pursuit has really just
shifted from playful passion to high stakes pressure
i was actually talking to my dad about this when
he was younger you know He collected cards. He
was into sports. But, like, it was completely
different, right? They would take cards and put
them in the spokes of their bicycle wheels. They
would flip coins and, like, you know, try to
win each other's cards. And it was all, like,
very engaging. And you were physically touching
them. And nobody really cared about the condition.
You know, it was an enjoyable experience that
you got to. uh do with your friends with your
with your family and um you know i think it's
just it's shifted so much um and so the the question
that you asked do i think addiction has always
been a part of the hobby in some ways yes but
not like it is now the difference today is the
environment the digital environment specifically
we now have 24 7 access there's constant product
drops live stream breaks instant comps And social
validation tied to every single purchase you
make. So it's no longer just a hobby you engage
with at your own pace. It's become something
that's actively hunting for your attention and
for your wallet. That social validation piece,
I think, is probably and mistake me if you think
or correct me if you think I'm mistaken here.
But that piece has probably been the thing that
has blossomed the most out of the hobby, where
in some ways, you know, Fanatics has been. unapologetic
that they are evangelizing the hobby like big
picture vision for them is that globally there
are more people collecting in the sports space
right yeah but with that and the money that comes
with it are the brands are the content creators
are the people that are filming vlogs and so
one thing that's it's not shocking anymore to
gary and i but we're set up at over 40 shows
a year there's kids walking up to us with deep
into the five figures in their case that they've
been wheeling and dealing. 12 -year -old kids,
not 18 -year -old kids. Yeah, and they've been
doing a trade -up challenge for four years, and
this is where they are. But when you look at
the, I guess, the fractional selling piece, the
gambling aspect, if you will, I think it's safe
to call it that. There is a gambling aspect in
this. Like, there doesn't seem to be much in
the way of safeguards. Hey, along the way, if
you have like in reading your article, you know,
that just recently dropped, you shared that,
you know, when it comes to the sports book, there's
all kinds of warnings. There's all kinds of ways
where, hey, if you need help, here's all the
resources. Yet we have a group of kids where
if your parents are cool with you breaking cards
on Whatnot, you're allowed to have your own stream
as a teenager. And so I guess where do you see?
How could this be more healthy, I guess is what
I'm trying to say when it comes to that social
validation piece that we're rewarding what we
want repeated, right? We tell the algorithm what
we want to see, but how could we do this in a
more healthy way? Or what could be added to the
conversation? What's a truth that needs to be
understood as people talk about having that big
hit or buying that big collection or flipping
that prospect card that they were chasing? What's
missing in the conversation? Yeah, Jason, that's
a really great question. And honestly, it's a
multi -part answer because there's a lot that
goes into responding to those things and layering
in these different levels of support and guidance
for collectors, especially young collectors,
some of these kids. So when you look at the gambling
-like behavior that is... has become so prevalent
in the hobby especially again with younger collectors
there currently are no real safeguards in place
there are zero safeguards there are no age gates
on streams there's no spending limits there's
no built -in accountability tools like when you're
playing uh casino live casino on a on an app
or you know sports betting uh generally There
are tools in place where you can set a cool off
period. You can self -exclude. You can set deposit
limits. None of that exists on the current platforms
that we have access to. It's an environment where
kids can basically rip product at a rapid pace,
spend money they don't necessarily have, and
subsequently be publicly celebrated for hitting
a nuke or a banger, what these breakers call
them these days, all while internalizing this
idea that value equals worth. you know which
equals attention and you know let's be honest
this isn't just a hobby anymore it's become a
gamified ecosystem like you know from from wheels
in these uh live streams to random team breaks
to you know trade backs uh to these hype driven
countdowns and you know uh repacks it's it's
operating exactly like online gambling but with
with no protections uh so what collectors md
is doing about it um again multi -part answers
so first and foremost there's a long question
of course yeah um first and foremost awareness
and education awareness and education so we're
starting the conversation that many in this industry
just have avoided for far too long we have daily
content Daily Reflection specifically is a series
of daily journal entries that I post every single
day to make sure that we are staying relevant
and mindful based on all of the news and industry
related things that are going on. Obviously,
sharing all of this across social through. additional
content. We have our weekly peer support meetings.
We're naming what's really happening. And that
includes the ways kids are being exposed to gambling
-like behavior at younger and younger ages, which
again, is just not acceptable. The next is strategic
partnerships. So we've partnered with groups
like Birches Health, which is a professional
mental health clinic that focuses on problematic
gambling and behavioral addiction so that we
can offer our members professional guidance and
therapy as they need it. We recently partnered
with a company called Gamban, which offers basically
like app blocking software. to gambling -related
apps and platforms. They've now added Whatnot
and Fanatics Live, among several others, where
people can download that software and be able
to block themselves from accessing those apps.
And we're also speaking with... you know, other
companies and professionals who specialize in
youth addiction and digital wellness to help
inform our next step. So there are going to be
more partnerships rolling out, but Birches and
Kanban specifically are the two that we rolled
out earlier this month or earlier in June. Now
that today is July 1st. The next is support for
parents. So we're developing resources and eventually
toolkits to not just help. you know kids and
adults who are in the hobby but also the parents
of those kids understand the risks and learn
how to talk to their kids about what's happening
in the hobby because many parents just don't
even understand or realize what live breaks or
you know, Discord rooms or, you know, a lot of
these different social platforms actually look
like. And then lastly, one of the most important,
which is industry reform. So we're pushing for
real platform accountability, whether that's
age verification, just clear warnings, limits
on live spending, or more transparency from breakers
and marketplaces. We're not trying to shut anything
down. keep preaching we are not anti -hobby we
just want to be safer smarter and more responsible
across the board so all of this uh we recognize
is a marathon it's not a sprint but if we want
the hobby to have a future that is sustainable
and healthy we can't ignore what's happening
especially with this next generation so collectors
md is here to make sure we support protect and
empower those who are most vulnerable before
the harm starts becoming irreversible Gotcha.
So with that being said, and I think this is
a question that I don't know if you've gotten
before. You probably have. I'm not that original.
It sounds like there's a lot of partnerships
happening peripherally that affect what's going
on, which is fantastic. Have you had any success
or have you had any conversations or do you find
that the main players like. Whatnot or Fanatics
live, are you getting pushback? Are you, are
you being seen as adversarial to them? Do you
see a path towards them being part of the solution
or do you think this is going to be a fight?
Yeah, that's a great question. And it's something
that again is really, really important. The industry
reform initiative that we have on our website
is directed at those bigger players, the higher
powers within the space. And, you know, honestly,
Having those conversations, getting those conversations
rolling are challenging. You know, it's really
hard to sort of shout into a void and get a response.
Right. I mean, these companies have so much going
on. And the last thing they want to do is open
up a can of worms as it pertains to a governing
body overlooking what they're doing and reforming
their apps and platforms and everything like
that. But it's it's. really important. And I
think it's probably best for them if they act,
you know, proactively before somebody actually
comes in and makes those changes. So we have
reached out to Whatnot and Fanatics and we've
had positive responses and feedback. Nothing
sort of concrete yet in terms of actionable items.
However, things are being looked at. Things are
being passed to the appropriate departments.
I had a really positive conversation last night,
actually, with somebody from Fanatics Live on
the trust and safety team who is actively looking
at what we're doing and passing it to the appropriate
individuals. But to answer your question, we
haven't had any really serious. pushback. Nobody
has really questioned what we're doing. I think
a lot of this is glaringly obvious and people
do realize that the nature of the hobby has gone
in this sort of negative direction as it pertains
to having these gambling -like mechanics and
just becoming so synonymous with risk reward
type, type of features. So, um, we're, we're
headed in that direction, but, uh, you know,
it's going to take, it's going to take time.
It's definitely a battle. So we have a tendency
in our podcast to attract a couple of different
audiences because we're not the young, cool guys
on Instagram, but we're not the old set builder
only kind of guys either. Uh, we're kind of somewhere
in the middle with our age and we tend to have
no problem. pointing out some of the things that
we're talking about being an issue, but I can
be certain that there are people watching this
or listening right now that are saying, is it
really? All right. I hear what you're saying.
There's been some people that have spent too
much. They racked up with some credit card debt.
Is it really that, is it really that is you guys
being dramatic with this? Is this too much? What
like, while maintaining the dignity that should
be in each person's story as they navigate this.
Can you help us get a snapshot of just how quickly
and exponentially this challenge becomes a compounding
problem? I know Gary and I can think back early
on when it was all on Facebook, right? People
would go live and break. The first couple of
times we saw somebody post about, I'm trying
to save my family. I'm getting out of the hobby
now. Everything's for sale. I don't care. Don't
tag me in anything. I remember us being like,
what is happening here? To those listening that
may be skeptical, is there a way that you could
paint a picture of how far this can go and how
deeply it's impacting lives? And maybe even some
of the things that family members may notice
that should be a cause for concern. They shouldn't
be asking a question. They should be making some
help available and doing what they can. Yeah,
it's a great question. And it's something that.
uh is a little bit of a challenge right because
a lot of people outside of the hobby especially
parents they don't understand the full scope
they don't understand how collecting sports cards
or trading cards pokemon can um you know become
an addiction or become something that looks like
gambling right it just they don't understand
the nature of what a live break is and all of
the nuances that come with that you know how
predatory some of these individuals can be. And
we're not saying that, again, we're not villainizing
the hobby or saying that every single breaker
is a bad actor. You know, at the end of the day,
folks are just doing their jobs. They're trying
to make money, put food on the table. And we
respect that. We get that. But there just needs
to be some accountability and some reform in
terms of how these breaks are being conducted.
So to answer your question, to illustrate kind
of what this sort of, you know. process can look
like let's just say you hypothetically hop into
a break last night monday night just you know
you decide to grab one team or just you know
one box just to sort of scratch that itch you
don't hit anything so you stay for the next break
or you know you go after the next box just to
sort of, just in case, you know, that the case
hit or whatever you were chasing is still lurking,
right? Because the worst feeling is when somebody
else comes in and grabs the next box and steals
whatever you were looking for, snipes whatever
you were looking for, right? And you got the
breaker who's operating as, you know, the dealer,
the marketer, the entertainer, all in one. Yeah,
exactly. They're hyping everything up. They're
like, great value. great take you know what is
steel uh you know like can't believe these teams
are going for for solo they're just they're creating
the sense of fomo right and so you kind of just
get sucked in you're mindlessly pressing buttons
and and bidding uh on teams or players or whatever
the format of the break is uh so you get in and
then next break still nothing so now you're in
a couple hundred bucks uh but that dopamine spike
hasn't hit yet so you continue chasing and all
of this is sort of happening kind of subconsciously
because you know you're you're feeling disappointed
but now you're in it deep enough where like you
got just got to keep going right you have that
devil on your shoulder that's that's egging you
on um and then you see someone else pull the
car that you were you're after the one that you
uh almost took you know the team for like you
maybe you traded one of your teams or you had
an opportunity to trade one of your teams right
before the break started but you didn't and so
that fomo just hits right and so you you get
into the next break and you buy two teams this
time and still nothing and now you're 500 in
the hole and you continue to just uh you know
hit nothing and so you you just decide to go
and Rip a personal box and one becomes two and
two becomes three. And next thing you know, you're
a half case deep. And by the end of the night,
you've spent thousands of dollars and you've
sort of convinced yourself all of this is fine
because, you know, you might you might hit something
huge to replenish all the money you just spent.
And at the end of the day, 99 % of the time,
you're just left with a. a pile of base cards
and low -end autos or numbered veterans that
are worth a fraction of what you paid. And this
isn't just a one -time loss or a one -time thing.
It's the start of a cycle. And if you're not
careful, that entire cycle, everything I just
repeated can start to happen night after night
after night. And the losses compound and the
guilt compounds and the urge to chase the next
break, the next hit, the next dopamine spike.
They all compound. So what starts out as like
an innocent $30 quickly becomes 300. And then
it becomes 3000. And it's all in the name of
just having fun. It's just that, you know, again,
hobby positivity, hobby, exactly. But for many,
it's just not fun anymore. It's emotional, it's
financial, and psychological whiplash. And that's
why awareness and intention matters so much.
And why, you know, Collectors MD exists, because
it's no longer just collecting. There, there
are just too many layers to this and it's just,
it's become a, such a slippery slope as it pertains
to chasing. And it's just so, so dangerous for
so many people and they just don't realize it.
Yeah. So what, what you're describing sounds
a lot to me like traditional gambling addiction.
Now, I think a lot of our listeners and people
in general know. the signs of drug addiction
or alcohol addiction. What are some of the signs
that a family member might notice as somebody
who's for a family member that may be falling
into this type of addiction? Is there something
that people should look for to start asking questions
to try to bring it to awareness? Yeah, it's a
great question. So you mentioned alcohol addiction,
drug addiction. Obviously there's gambling addiction
and Personally, candidly, I had a gambling addiction
myself and I attended gamblers anonymous meetings
and I learned a lot through that experience.
But, you know, as as far as collecting goes,
there was a missing link for me when I was in
those rooms. My story didn't necessarily resonate
with these folks because they just couldn't wrap
their heads around the idea of collecting being
an addiction. They just, again, they were on
the outside looking in and they didn't understand
the full scope of what I was talking about. And
one thing fueled the other, you know, as far
as like whether it was the sports cards fueling
the gambling or the gambling fueling the sports
cards. There are a lot of signs to look out for
that family members and friends and loved ones,
especially spouses, can look for when it comes
to those warning signs. I think it starts with
the financial red flags, right? Money sort of
just disappearing quickly with little to show
for it, obviously, first and foremost. Frequent
borrowing of money or asking for loans with...
vague explanations, unpaid bills or sudden financial
hardship despite a steady income, selling personal
items or collectibles they previously cherished,
hiding bank statements or getting defensive about
finances. These are things we see all the time,
especially among spouses. And then beyond just
the finances, there's the time and the behaviorships,
right? hours spent watching live breaks auctions
or just scrolling marketplaces often late into
the night so just spending way too much time
on our devices neglecting responsibilities that
um should come first things you know at home
work school etc uh canceling plans are becoming
sort of withdrawn to stay home so that you can
uh join the break or you know um not feel that
sense of FOMO that your favorite breaker is going
live at midnight and you want to make sure you're
in the live chat rooting everybody on. And then
lying about the time spent online or in hobby
-related forums or live chats. There's a lot
of dishonesty that's going on with this where
people are just lying to protect themselves or
protect their addiction and they don't even realize
they're doing it. Sorry, go ahead. I was going
to say there are a few others. There's obviously
emotional and psychological changes, just becoming
more irritable, moody or anxious, especially
just after a bad night of ripping or financial
loss, obsessing over that next product drop or
hit or grail piece that you're chasing, justifying
purchases with things like I had to, it was a
great deal, I was due. And again, defensiveness
and secrecy when people put you on the spot and
ask you, what's going on with your, with your
hobby habits. There's also compulsive patterns,
just like chasing losses, never feeling satisfied
saying this is going to be the last one, but
then just jumping right back in difficulty stopping.
And then lastly, like the mental and emotional
strain of all this just feeling or expressing
guilt, shame or regret after purchasing or ripping
and mentioning feelings like. I can't stop or
I think I have a problem or I don't even really
want this stuff. And then most importantly, I
think a lot of people just sort of use the hobby
as an escape from stress, anxiety, or depression
or whatever issues they're dealing with in their
personal life almost as like a band -aid of sorts.
I know that's something that definitely helped
me when I was feeling down two in the morning
after my wife falls asleep or sometimes even
later, just hop into a live break and... you
know, unwind that way and everything just like
reality kind of disappears for a little while.
And, you know, you're just chasing after that
dopamine hit. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. So you,
you talked about like noticing behavioral shifts,
emotional shifts. When we on the podcast talk
about just the math on the value in breaks. We
have a tendency to have, I think Gary referred
to this as like a legion of people who they have
their favorite breaker. They're believing this
person knows how far down each of them are, and
they're going to do everything they can to sprinkle
their magic pixie dust on the next pack and take
care of them. But I've noticed this real sharp
defensiveness around this conversation with people,
almost as if. You're going to ruin everything
that's good about the hobby if you point out
some of these harsh realities. It's like they're
defending their dealer. Right. A little bit.
Right. Because they're still down. With claws
out. Right. But how has fractional buying or
fractional participation impacted this? Because
almost every time we get a strong wave of reactions,
it's when we're talking about breaking. Now,
just to be completely clear, Gary will jump in
a break. I'll jump in a break. We talk about
our business model. We both sell cards for a
living. We do not recommend breaking at any point
as a model for making any kind of money in this
space. Right. But it does seem like they're tethered
together somehow. Like the people that have a
really tough time talking about this getting
out of hand are the people that seem to 90 %
of their sports card engagement seems to be around
breaking. Is it just as simple as it releases
the dopamine a lot quicker? There's more of a
chase? What's the element? I'm making an assumption
that breaking is a big part of this. Why specifically
do you think that fractional selling may be gas
on the fire, if you will? And why do the people
who are almost victims of it? defend it so that's
a better way of asking that question yeah yeah
it's it's again a multi -part answer i think
breaking specifically um breaking culture is
what has led us to a lot of this addictive behavior
uh because it just mimics gambling so much so
and there are no guardrails in place so people
get sucked in really easily um you know they're
the There's the excitement within the live streams,
the lights and the overlays. And again, the breaker
just pumping up the chat. Everything is chat,
chat, chat. There's so much pressure and creates
this sense of FOMO, fear of missing out, where
you feel like you're a part of something. You
feel like you're a part of, like you found a
place where you belong. So there are a few things.
The first is sort of the predatory selling tactics
and the misinformation in the hobby. And that's
something we had chatted about before we went
live. I think a big issue is the predatory approach
to selling cards and to pushing breaks. Breakers
will lean heavily into hype and mislead with
information or comps. push urgency or like use
different gimmicks again, like the wheels and
the trade backs, the repacks just, it's all very,
very, you know, scammy. And it's all framed again
as entertainment, but underneath it's, it's just,
it's a pressure cooker. People are spending more
than they can afford because they're being manipulated
by momentum and not logic. And, you know, again,
the misinformation, it's like calling out comps
that are flat out wrong. you know, is like the
biggest defense there ever was. Let's call it
what it is, a flat out lie. Yeah, it's crazy.
What drives me crazy is when breakers just use
eBay to look up a comp and then they inflate
the comp, but you really got to use like 130
point or card ladder to see what like a best
offer was accepted for. It's, you know, we're
getting into semantics of it, but breakers do
that all the time. Like, wow. Or they see something
in the chat and they just. they consider it Bible.
Like, it must be true. I saw it recently where
they, it was a couple nights ago, I was watching
a live stream because, you know, I'm still actively
involved. And especially from like this side
of the fence now, watching breaks or like watching
a lot of this activity is important because I
need to stay in the know and see what's going
on, right? And so the breaker hit. It was a Brian
or what's his name? Brian Thomas Jr. on the Jaguars
from the Mosaic Sparkle Packs number to eight.
Nice card. Don't get me wrong. Nice looking card.
But somebody in the chat said, oh, last one did
$700. And I'm scratching my head. I'm like, there's
no way that's true. And I'm not going to sit
there and call anybody out because that's just
not what I do, especially these days. But $700.
So I look it up and it's like. The last one did
like 140 bucks. And next thing you know, the
breaker's telling the guy who hit the card that
he tripled his money. And the guy's super excited,
freaking out. I mean, it's just, it's, it's.
Your next break is free. And then, right. And
then the next break is free. You already paid
for your next two breaks free. I have a list
of buzzwords or like keywords that drive me absolutely
crazy. And I keep it in a notes app. And the
number one phrase on that list is paid. paid
you know when they when they tell tell you that
you're paid and it's like it's just the lie it's
a straight -up lie so um you know with that uh
you know the kicker is like when somebody calls
that out it's it's just like use a word that
i really liked earlier an adjective uh visceral
um it's it's like visceral it's almost like tribal
tribal backlash and why and so yeah within that
ecosystem what's happening is You have this community
introduced through breaking that probably digitally
were exposed to card collecting first. They're
being introduced through socials and all this.
They're getting their case full of cards that
were these hits that are $700. They're walking
into card shows, interacting with real humans
that they're seeing face to face. I do this for
a living digitally. They're interacting as well.
That's a little harsh. I shouldn't say it like
that, but they're face to face with other collectors
in a room. Yeah. And what they believe is $10
,000 of equity. or whatever they want to call
it. They're learning they have less than half
of that. So they say, well, I'm not going to
any more shows. Those dealers are crazy. Those
collectors don't know what they're talking about.
They only go for the lowest comp. And then they're
just creating an echo chamber and staying insulated
with the same group that's feeding. I mean, is
that what you're seeing too? 100%. I'm seeing
that pretty forward, but it seems to be like
a self -compounding issue. Absolutely. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. These breakers have like stands now,
you know, this army of keyboard warriors that
just will defend them to the very end. And so,
you know, you asked why that is. And I think
it's because for some collectors, these breakers
have become more than just breakers, more than
just sellers to them. They've become these personalities,
these, you know, higher, you know, than. These
holy heroes of sorts. And it's become like a
community. And in some cases for them, it's like
an emotional anchor, right? They look forward
to watching their favorite breaker go live. It's
like watching your favorite TV show, right? And
when someone critiques that breaker, that person,
it can feel like an attack, a personal attack
on the entire group identity. So it's not just
like you're wrong. It's you're threatening the
place where I found this belonging. And there's
also this like sort of cognitive dissonance,
right? You've spent thousands with a breaker,
let's say, and someone points out that they're
giving you bad info or, you know, scamming you
or manipulating comps or whatever the case may
be. And, you know, that could just be a really,
really hard truth to swallow. So instead of like
sort of reevaluating and, you know, taking a
step back and thinking, hey, this person might
actually be wrong for a change, people double
down and just defend it at all costs. It's tough
because a lot of people are just so stuck in
their ways and they're not going to be convinced
one way or another whether this is predatory
behavior or not. It's almost like they're brainwashed,
sadly. Again, it's pushing the awareness and
getting this message out there before it's too
late across the board. Well, let's talk about
that. We've talked about... a lot of what this
looks like, how it affects people, the really
negative impact a lot of this can have on somebody's
life. Let's talk about your tagline and mission
statement. Tell us what collecting with intention
means and how that is implemented. Yeah, no,
it's honestly our North Star. It's the most important
part of Collectors MD, collecting with intention.
It's not about telling people. what to collect
or how to collect it's about asking why right
why this card why this purchase and it doesn't
necessarily have to just be uh cards sports cards
tcg it could be any collectible item it could
be uh you know memorabilia it could be sneakers
watches handbags nfts uh 67 cars exactly like
uh you know um there's digital items or currency
within gaming now? Like, so, you know, it's all
about evaluating why this purchase? Why now?
Is it for nostalgia? Is it for connection? Or
are you just trying to fill a void? Are you just
trying to, you know, get that, that quick hit,
and then move on to the next. So collecting with
intention just means being honest with yourself.
It means slowing down, taking a beat, choosing
quality over quantity, and defining your own
path in the hobby or your hobby instead of letting
hype steer you. And it's also about community,
having honest conversations, supporting one another,
and making sure or making it okay to say, hey,
I'm struggling right now. I need help. That's
okay. Because when intention leads the way, when
intention is, you know, again, your North Star,
your guiding light. you actually get so much
more out of the hobby, not less. Like for me
personally, I at a point had over 500 pairs of
sneakers when I was really deep into collecting
sneakers. I had over a dozen cases or those Zion
cases filled with slabs and top loaded cards,
you know, just completely packed to the brim.
And, you know. I couldn't really enjoy or appreciate
what I had because one person doesn't need to
have that much stuff. You have more than most
dealers. I know exactly. Like when you, when
you break it down, when you curate it, it allows
you to appreciate what you have so much more.
Again, one person doesn't need all that. So,
you know, I now I've, again, I've, I've reduced
the size of, of my collection across the board,
sneakers, memorabilia. cards, hats, jerseys,
everything that I've collected over throughout
my life, I have consolidated it into much smaller
sizes. And I just appreciate it so much more
because again, I'm collecting with intention,
not compulsion. So that's, that's just, that's
so incredibly important and something that I
think people don't even take a beat to think
about. I'm curious. this is one that we didn't
talk about before but as you're mentioning that
does building a pc help you to collect with more
intention like kind of defining it's like for
me eric davis from the reds is my pc luckily
for me he's very affordable but as a kid he was
somebody that was a legend to me um does when
you're setting like setting intention around
it Like, do you have a PC right now? Here's an
athlete or here's a team. Does that help you
in some way or not necessarily? Yeah, I mean,
I think it depends. You know, it depends how
you're going about collecting that specific player
or specific set. Obviously, focusing on a PC
gives you a more clear target. So instead of
like ripping everything that's new or like, you
know. getting that sense of FOMO. So you have
to join every single random break. You start
asking yourself, does this card or does this
set fit my collection? Is this a card I've genuinely
been looking for? This simple sort of filter
you can call it can dramatically reduce impulsive
purchases. It's helped me a lot because like
I've decided, you know, there are certain boundaries
and it's, they're not that serious. It's like,
I just no longer collect horizontal cards or
I no longer collect. jersey pieces if there's
no ink on them. You know, I no longer really
collect like die cuts or, I mean, it's like specific
cards. Like I don't really collect defensive
players in football anymore. You kind of just
create these like personal limits that gives
you a more refined, a more curated focus on what
you're looking for. And it helps you collect
smarter, right? A focused PC forces you to research.
which cards matter most for your player or your
theme, like whatever the case may be, what price
ranges make sense, what, you know, where to find
real value versus just the hype driven chasing.
You're more informed, you're less reactive, and
that can make the hobby feel more meaningful
and just like less chaotic. It also builds like
an emotional connection, you know, whether it's
like your hometown team or a player just who
you grew up. rooting for uh like kind of brings
back memories um a pc is is very personal in
that sense and that kind of collecting again
like it roots you in nostalgia connection and
joy just not just that that dopamine hit um but
you know it can also be dangerous right because
if you start to uh overextend and you're like
i need every single parallel in the rainbow for
a specific player you're never going to get there
right it's just it becomes lucrative because
these sets now just every year they they add
more and more parallels more 41 of ones this
year you know more and more formats like one
of ones have lost their uh sort of um intrigue
and their their value because there's such an
oversaturation of them like Victor Wembanyama
had thousands if not tens of thousands of different
one -of -ones across every Panini set every top
set you know in his rookie year like that's absurd
you know so it's like and then everything is
everything is the true everything's right like
if everything is the true then what is the actual
true it's it's don't let the market or the the
hobby or the industry manipulate that You get
to make that decision with your own collection.
And then the industry tries to hand you on a
silver platter, a product like Mercury, knowing
that that value is never, ever going to be seen.
And within three months, it may fall out. Now,
is it unique? Is this a generational player?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And
they're going to find one of those every year
in one sport. It's going to be there. That's
something that drives me insane. Because they're
here to make money. Right. The players are being,
the athletes are being exploited now because
the manufacturers, the platforms, the breakers,
they're taking advantage of the fact that these
players sell and they're using their likeness
in a way that, again, is predatory, right? They're
like, you have to have Caitlin Clark. This product
that came out yesterday. I mean, everybody sort
of feels the same way. A $30 ,000 ceiling on
a Dutch auction. What are we doing? For two cards.
For two cards. And like, I respect the heck out
of the fact that the WNBA has burst onto the
scene. Yeah. Caitlin Clark has redefined what
women's basketball looks like and how it's. perceived
and spectated like i love that one of those cards
i love the direction it's going in but like the
fact that you know people are willing to pay
that kind of money to chase the kaboom or the
one of one or the what are they the lady logo
man or the logo lady it's it's silly it's it's
ridiculous honestly and uh every year we have
something new thrown at us when i was reintroduced
to the sports card hobby early on in the pandemic
Everybody was all about Zion and Ja. I mean,
Zion and Ja couldn't be more yesterday's news
if they tried. Every year, it's something new.
The following year, it was Ant -Man, LaMelo.
I mean, it was more so LaMelo, actually. And
now LaMelo, people don't really care as much
about him. It's all about him. And Halliburton
in that class. The following year, it was Cade
Cunningham and Jalen Green. Jalen Green just
got shipped off to Phoenix. Nobody cares about
him anymore. Following year, we had Paolo and
Chet. You know, it's like every year it's something
new. Now Cooper Flagg is all the hype. So next
year, I'm telling you, it's going to happen all
over again. There's a kid coming into the league.
His name is AJ DePansa, I think you pronounce
his last name. He's another generational talent,
once -in -a -lifetime player that we're never
going to see again. Apparently the top five picks
for the 2026 NBA draft are all arguably number
one picks. You got Carlos Boozer's kid. There's
a few others. But we get fed the same story every
single year. Yeah, it's all hype. It's all manufactured
hype. Yeah. So we've had a really good conversation
here. Bring this to a close. A couple questions
that go together and then one to finish out with
because we want to give you a chance to kind
of cast your vision and share some other ways
that people can find you and your community.
But I guess what resources do you guys offer
to people and how can people reach out to you
to get started on that recovery? Yeah. So we
offer a variety of things right now. So we talked
briefly about the weekly support meetings. Again,
those are private, safe and confidential virtual
video calls where collectors can share openly
and connect with others navigating similar challenges.
There is a Google form that you can fill out.
It's basically just a screening form, but it
allows us to collect your information, your email
address and understand. sort of your story and
what kind of support you need. And then from
there, we add you to the weekly meeting. And,
you know, it's obviously not mandatory or anything
like that, but you can come and go as you please.
It's completely free, no strings attached. You
join, you talk about what you're going through,
share with others, hear from others. And it's
just a really, really great way to sort of go
through. your first stage of recovery and therapy.
It's very cathartic. So we've, we've created
a community through that, which has been amazing.
We also produce content on a daily basis. So
we have daily reflections. Those are basically
thought provoking essays and journal entries
designed to inspire clarity and intention in
your collecting journey. Those are published
every single day. Haven't missed a day since
we launched a collector's MD on March 26th. We
have Other forms of content. So expert informed
breakdowns, resources and personal stories designed
to educate, inspire and help collectors reflect
more intentionally. We have our podcast, The
Collector's Compass, it's called The Collector's
Compass. Those are honest conversations with
collectors, industry voices and mental health
advocates just talking about, you know, the nature
of all this and why. Collecting with intention
is so incredibly important. We have recovery
tools and educational resources. So those are
tools and materials to help better understand
compulsive collecting behaviors and how to manage
them. We have our strategic partnerships, which
we mentioned with Birches and Gamban. And then
lastly, the industry advocacy. We're actively
pushing for reform across platforms, breakers
and mortar places to create a safer and more
transparent collecting environment. So you want
to check out any of that. I know I just gave
you a lot. You go to collectorsmd .com. At the
top, there are two different drop -down menus,
one for Discover, which is basically all of our
content, our news and announcements, inspiring
quotes, things like that. And then there's one
for Resources. So that's where you can find access
to the Google form for the weekly meetings, the
Collector's MD Recovery Guide, which is the foundation
of our meetings, which was adapted from the Gambler's
Anonymous Yellow Book, which we use in GA meetings.
It looks like this. This is the GA Yellow Book
that it was adapted from. The industry. reform
initiative that I mentioned. We have a collector's
MD hobby dictionary so that you can stay in the
know and educated and go about your hobby journey
responsibly. And, you know, so you're not falling
behind. There's a get help section. And then
there's two sections that touch on our partnerships
with Birches and Gambin. So lots going on. We're
on social as well across the board. You can check
us out on Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, YouTube.
X. We're also on Mantle. That's a really great
place to join the conversation and just be part
of the daily content that we put out. Are you
guys familiar with Mantle? I am familiar. Only
recently I've been seeing a lot more on it. I
have no idea. It's basically like a Discord type
of platform, but it's specifically designed for
the hobby. um so there's not like you know all
the extra fluff that you you would see on on
discord or reddit um but it's it's a really really
great place where you can um you know join different
types of groups uh or marketplaces and uh be
a part of the the daily discussion so we're on
there as well Awesome. Perfect. Well, Alyx, we
can't thank you enough for your time to do this.
I know that when you reached out, we were like,
somebody wants to talk with us in the podcast.
But the more we dove into what you're doing,
I think what you're doing is essential. I think
it's needed. I really hope that in the short
future, anyone that's in this community of collectors
that finds themselves in a place or comes to
a place of awareness that they could use some
help sees that that's what this is. This is not
a place to just dump shame on people, but it's
a place to provide help and a way forward and
a way to collect with intention. I really love
that. That's a really beautiful resolve with
what you're doing is that you're helping to kind
of restore what's beautiful about the hobby.
essentially. Um, and, uh, we can't thank you
enough for your time. Uh, we'll be definitely
encouraging any listeners. If you're listening
in and take advantage of these resources, they
are available to you. And we know we'll only
be hearing more, uh, from you and collectors,
uh, MD in the future. So thank you so much, Jason,
Gary, really appreciate it. Uh, it was a pleasure
chatting with you guys and, um, yeah, I'm really,
really excited to see where. collectors md takes
us in the coming weeks in the coming months so
uh thank you again for giving me this opportunity
to to talk to go into great detail about what
we're doing and uh appreciate you guys being
a part of the journey Absolutely. Thanks again,
man. All right. Thanks so much, Alyx, for joining
us. Hopefully you guys found that interview to
be helpful. I know we learned a lot of things
from it. And if you have any questions or you
want to reach out, Alyx gave you all the ways
that you can follow them. And if you need support,
join their support group that is free and you
can get some of the support that you need. One
thing I would add, too, we talked about it last
week. that element of guilt and shame that people
can feel in dealing with that reality. And for
you and I, we have firsthand seen people that
we know in this space, very active in the hobby,
lose way more than they ever should. And we're
not talking about cards or money. So if you're
in that place, just know that there's help and
there's support. And we encourage you to get
that. And we want to help you any way we can
to find what you need. So be sure to check them
out on that. Up next, let's move into low -end
liquid. This one is kind of a fun one. This is
your world, my friend. There's different tiers
of low -end liquid. There's low -end liquid,
and some of you think $20 cards. There's low
-end liquid that moves for $5. And then there's
the low -end liquid you're probably going to
get offers at like $175 free shipping on. Yeah.
And we're down. in the bargain basement today
for this set. The only reason I'm bringing this
set up is when I sell one, I usually sell five
to ten of them at a time. And that is the Collector's
Choice Stick 'ems. Now. If you're a product of
the 80s or 90s, you definitely remember these.
There were some even later in the 90s. Oh, that's
my favorite variation of these. This is not the
stickums, but in the same family, the bobble
heads, the bobbing heads is what they're called.
Technically, where you could that's a Clemens
right there where you pop the head out, put it
on a stand. A lot of these other ones that there
are multiple stickers of each player. Just look
at here. I've got Kenny Lofton. There's Cal Ripken
Jr. A lot of big stars in the game. And chances
are you had one of these on. your trapper keeper
in the 90s really good chance of it or it was
stuck underneath the desk at school or you put
it on the wall and left it there for a couple
months and then your parents wanted you to peel
it off and you peel paint with it whatever whatever
the cause sounds like a memory more than anything
else uh if you're buying these buy them as cheap
as possible this is stuff that usually is in
like a a bulk box of nothing and you go pick
through and there's 20 of them in there. You're
in them under a penny a piece because you bought
thousands and thousands of cards. What's your
sell -through rate on something like that? I
don't know exactly the sell -through rate on
this, to be fair, because I don't want to project
it. But what I can say is when it sells... It
may not be super quick, but when it sells, you're
selling in multiple quantities. So this is more
of a multi -quantity slash low -end liquid. It's
not something where it's like, oh, good, a new
Stickums is out. There's a ton of these out there.
But this is more of a nostalgic piece for people.
That's why they're buying this. It's a really
cheap set if somebody does do that kind of stuff.
But I think if I've dropped in maybe 50 of these,
I've sold over half in the last few months. Yeah,
there you go. Could be off a little bit on that,
but definitely one to keep an eye out for. You
will see them in, like, bulk. So don't sleep
on that. If you're evaluating a bulk deal, hopefully,
if you're selling low in liquid, when I talk
about some of these low in liquids cards, like,
when you're looking at the four -row box, if
you start seeing five, six, or seven of the different
low in liquid cards we've brought up in the last
20 episodes. That means, hey, there's stuff in
here that's going to sell for me. That's the
reason we're doing that. So hopefully it helps
you buy a little bit better, make a little bit
more, and move that money a little bit quicker.
Ooh, that kind of had a nice ring to it. Perfect.
Low and liquid. You want to talk about some baseball?
Let's talk about some baseball. So it's time
for the lookout. Now, a couple things I want
to say. The player I wanted to talk about this
week, I didn't get the chance to because he got
called up before we could record this episode,
and that was Yankeel Fernandez. Sure you did.
I was high on him. We talked about him last year.
Big power hitter for the Rockies. And then I
also want to talk about another call -up that
happened before we could record this episode,
which is a guy we talked about probably six weeks
ago, and that was Colby Thomas for the A's. He
is now on the Major League roster. This week,
we're going to talk about Joe Mack, who is a
catcher for the Miami Marlins organization. He's
in AAA. Joe was a first -round competitive balance
round A pick. So he was the number 31 overall
pick out of high school in 2021. Never had any
questions about his defensive prowess. Offense
was a struggle for the first two to three years
of his career, mostly because he really, really
struggled with breaking balls. he still struggles
to an extent with breaking balls. He's gotten
better at laying off them. However, he used to
be relatively passive early in counts, and last
year he changed his approach and started really
attacking anything that looked like it was a
fastball. in the zone early in counts, and it
made a massive impact in his overall game. Last
year, he was fifth overall in the minor leagues
among catchers in home runs. He hit 24, and he
won the minor league gold glove award for catchers
in 2024. So far this year, he's gotten the bump
to AAA. He's got eight home runs. He's hitting
260 with a 343 OBP and a 420 slugging percentage.
Now, that's only a 763 OPS, and you might be
going, why are you talking about this guy? Very
simple. If you are a catcher in today's baseball
and you are even moderately average at the plate,
you're a big league starter if you're a great
defender. Can I interject? I never do during
this segment. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Does what
you just said point out how crazy big of a deal
it is that Cal Raleigh's doing what he's doing?
Yeah, absolutely. It's insane. The Cal Raleigh's...
Don't exist. Hasn't happened since Piazza. We
were talking about this. The Cal rallies, the
Adley Rutchmans, the guys who are above average
to really good at the plate and decent defense.
Adley's a gold glove caliber defensive catcher.
Cal rally is not, but he's not a detriment back
there. But Joe Mack is a guy who is going to
be a gold glove caliber catcher defensively.
He just handled a no hitter the other day, as
a matter of fact. But he also. has some pop,
and can hit. The Marlins are in a position now
to have a really, really strong platoon back
there between Augustin Ramirez and Joe Mack.
Joe Mack, his cards are in 2021 Bowman Draft.
They're still relatively affordable. Very reminiscent
to me of a guy like Hunter Goodman, who's really
made waves this year for the Rockies. He doesn't
have quite the pop that Goodman has, but he can
be a high -end 70 % guy of a platoon and DH the
other 30 % of the time and get a day or two off
a week to Ramirez behind the plate. But overall,
I think, again, a guy that's going to be up after
the All -Star break, which is sneaking up on
us really quick here. But his cards, one more
time, 2021 Bowman Draft, still very affordable
and on a team that's starved for as much help
as it can get. I don't think he's down too much
longer. Yeah, yeah. Quick reminder before we
head out today. For the end of this episode,
we'll see you tonight, 7 p .m. Eastern on Whatnot.
Every single Thursday, one of the nice little
buyer givies, this nice little B. John Robinson
RPA out of select to $199, along with nine other
buyer's givies, another 10 giveaway slabs as
well. Be a part of it. Bookmark it. Hang out
with us. Yeah. Anything else? No, we always go
live on TikTok right before our Whatnot show,
so if you want to come hang out with us for about
a half hour there too, come hang out with us.
This has been the Ball Card Show, the esports
podcast. For the Esports Collector. Bye now.
Peace.