WEBVTT 00:00:04.690 --> 00:00:08.650 Look, we get it, Tiger fans. We know the baseball 00:00:08.650 --> 00:00:11.650 season can be a grind. Luckily, when you're ready 00:00:11.650 --> 00:00:14.929 to trade hot dogs for tailgates, we've got you 00:00:14.929 --> 00:00:18.210 covered with Litterbox, a Detroit Lions podcast. 00:00:18.789 --> 00:00:20.989 It's the same unfiltered Detroit sports talk 00:00:20.989 --> 00:00:23.809 you get here, just with more biting kneecaps 00:00:23.809 --> 00:00:27.050 and fewer bullpen meltdowns. So when Sunday rolls 00:00:27.050 --> 00:00:29.850 around, don't just pace around like AJ Hinch 00:00:29.850 --> 00:00:33.229 waiting for a reliever. Fire up Litterbox, a 00:00:33.229 --> 00:00:35.729 Detroit Lions podcast, wherever you're listening 00:00:35.729 --> 00:00:39.009 now, and roar with us through the NFL season. 00:00:48.000 --> 00:00:51.399 Billy P from The D and Chet here. Thank you all 00:00:51.399 --> 00:00:53.560 for listening to Litterbox, a Detroit Tigers 00:00:53.560 --> 00:00:55.979 podcast. If you enjoyed the show, please make 00:00:55.979 --> 00:00:57.740 sure you hit that subscribe button so that you 00:00:57.740 --> 00:01:00.280 never miss an episode. We love hearing your thoughts 00:01:00.280 --> 00:01:03.200 too. Leave us a rating or just drop us a comment. 00:01:03.439 --> 00:01:05.340 Please let us know what you think and whatever 00:01:05.340 --> 00:01:07.819 you want us to cover next. Your feedback really 00:01:07.819 --> 00:01:10.359 helps us grow and keeps the Tigers talk rolling 00:01:10.359 --> 00:01:20.439 all season long. Go Tigers and thank you. You're 00:01:20.439 --> 00:01:23.239 listening to The Litterbox, a Detroit Tigers 00:01:23.239 --> 00:01:27.859 podcast with your hosts, Chet West and Bill Patterson. 00:02:12.219 --> 00:02:15.419 Welcome back to Litterbox, the Detroit Tigers 00:02:15.419 --> 00:02:18.819 podcast. I am Chet West. The gentleman across 00:02:18.819 --> 00:02:21.939 from me here is Bill Patterson, Billy P from 00:02:21.939 --> 00:02:25.680 the D. And we just watched our Tigers end their 00:02:25.680 --> 00:02:30.879 2025 season in a fashion that was somewhat predictable 00:02:30.879 --> 00:02:34.460 to a degree. I sat there at some point in the 00:02:34.460 --> 00:02:37.319 game thinking to myself, when will the bullpen 00:02:37.319 --> 00:02:40.780 finally relent and blow this thing? And as the 00:02:40.780 --> 00:02:44.460 innings started to progress. I kinda thought, 00:02:45.479 --> 00:02:48.639 are we gonna see Tommy Canley eventually? And 00:02:48.639 --> 00:02:52.719 Bill, we got Tommy Canley in the 15th inning 00:02:52.719 --> 00:02:54.960 of one of the longest games I think I've seen 00:02:54.960 --> 00:02:58.099 in quite some time. And he did not disappoint. 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:02.080 Your thoughts? If one single game could ever 00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:07.060 encapsulate the season that was the 25 Tigers, 00:03:07.219 --> 00:03:10.620 it was exactly what happened last night. got 00:03:10.620 --> 00:03:13.259 off to kind of a rough start. The Tigers are 00:03:13.259 --> 00:03:16.819 down one, nothing. They come back with a Javi 00:03:16.819 --> 00:03:21.819 double saw bones. Karp gets him in with a dong. 00:03:22.439 --> 00:03:25.500 We're up to one. They tie it to two. So that's 00:03:25.500 --> 00:03:27.699 now we're post all star break Tigers. If you're 00:03:27.699 --> 00:03:29.460 kind of tracking where I'm going through the 00:03:29.460 --> 00:03:32.860 season, I see where you're going. And then we 00:03:32.860 --> 00:03:37.409 go to extras and Didn't text you because it was 00:03:37.409 --> 00:03:40.370 late for everybody it was just we had early kids 00:03:40.370 --> 00:03:42.629 sports you had early kids sports No excuses. 00:03:42.689 --> 00:03:44.629 I watched the whole thing, but I just kind of 00:03:44.629 --> 00:03:46.610 turned off my text messaging Is there anything 00:03:46.610 --> 00:03:50.930 more befitting of this season than? Tk being 00:03:50.930 --> 00:03:54.810 up there throwing thing nothing fit this whole 00:03:54.810 --> 00:03:59.330 thing this whole story Had to end that way it 00:03:59.330 --> 00:04:03.729 had to end and with general futility from the 00:04:03.729 --> 00:04:07.030 bats along the way. It was just so perfect. It 00:04:07.030 --> 00:04:10.409 was like we can't play to run to save our lives. 00:04:10.990 --> 00:04:13.590 You know, in the same one or two guys were kind 00:04:13.590 --> 00:04:16.350 of generating the offense. And then you'd get 00:04:16.350 --> 00:04:20.990 in position and you just couldn't. It was almost 00:04:20.990 --> 00:04:24.009 like we didn't have an approach. A lot of these 00:04:24.009 --> 00:04:26.810 hitters got up there flailing away, especially 00:04:26.810 --> 00:04:29.149 in the 11th, 12th, 13th, as the game started 00:04:29.149 --> 00:04:32.339 going on. It looked like it was a people were 00:04:32.339 --> 00:04:35.800 in survival mode of some sort. And I started 00:04:35.800 --> 00:04:37.860 thinking to myself that, you know, like, I think 00:04:37.860 --> 00:04:40.100 Z Mack got up there at some point in the latter 00:04:40.100 --> 00:04:42.360 innings and had an at bat that some of these 00:04:42.360 --> 00:04:44.879 pictures are really right over the heart of the 00:04:44.879 --> 00:04:49.000 plate with not drastic movement, but he just 00:04:49.000 --> 00:04:51.910 kind of looked exhausted. He looked exhausted 00:04:51.910 --> 00:04:53.389 with the whole thing. He just didn't have an 00:04:53.389 --> 00:04:56.430 answer at the plate. And I'm going, this is why 00:04:56.430 --> 00:04:58.970 Z -Mac is Z -Mac, and he's not at All -Star every 00:04:58.970 --> 00:05:01.769 year. This is why he is who he is. And then I 00:05:01.769 --> 00:05:03.490 started thinking, like, we're going to see more 00:05:03.490 --> 00:05:05.230 of this in the next couple innings. And sure 00:05:05.230 --> 00:05:08.110 enough, Tommy Canley did Tommy Canley things. 00:05:08.350 --> 00:05:10.050 I think you're picking on the wrong guy here, 00:05:10.189 --> 00:05:11.709 though, because I could be. I mean, I could pick 00:05:11.709 --> 00:05:13.790 out almost any of these guys, right? Well, the 00:05:13.790 --> 00:05:16.949 one that is immune to everything hitting wise 00:05:16.949 --> 00:05:19.970 has to be Carrie Carpenter. He went four for 00:05:19.970 --> 00:05:23.670 five from the plate and he had two walks. He 00:05:23.670 --> 00:05:26.629 only struck out once. He generated both runs 00:05:26.629 --> 00:05:29.889 in terms of two RBI's. He was immune is a good 00:05:29.889 --> 00:05:33.250 way of putting it. OK, the rest of the roster 00:05:33.250 --> 00:05:38.050 had a disease or an ailment because Glabar is 00:05:38.050 --> 00:05:41.029 done as far as I'm concerned. I pray the Tigers 00:05:41.029 --> 00:05:45.230 do not know sign him into any capacity. And you 00:05:45.230 --> 00:05:47.750 want to hey, real quick, good news, Tiger fans. 00:05:48.490 --> 00:05:51.790 Guess what? Between his salary and Alex Cobb, 00:05:51.870 --> 00:05:54.730 you have 30 million more to spend next year. 00:05:55.129 --> 00:05:58.449 It's amazing. Yeah, it's amazing to look up and 00:05:58.449 --> 00:06:01.829 down these final stats for the division series. 00:06:01.870 --> 00:06:07.689 He was 0 for 6. Riley Green was 0 for 6. Spencer 00:06:07.689 --> 00:06:12.350 Torkerson was 0 for 6 with 4 K's. Yeah, Spencer 00:06:12.350 --> 00:06:16.670 had a rough go. Colt Keith 0 for 5 with 3 K's. 00:06:17.009 --> 00:06:19.100 Yeah. Zach McKinn Street. I'm not saying he was 00:06:19.100 --> 00:06:21.600 good, but he was one for six, which is good considering 00:06:21.600 --> 00:06:26.160 this abysmal lineup. Dylan Dingler, two for six. 00:06:26.519 --> 00:06:28.459 Parker Meadows went 0 for five. My prediction 00:06:28.459 --> 00:06:30.699 was 0 for four, but I also didn't think he would 00:06:30.699 --> 00:06:33.339 in our text exchange. Remember I said, oh, Meadows 00:06:33.339 --> 00:06:35.959 is starting instead of Jemima Jones. Here comes 00:06:35.959 --> 00:06:39.639 here comes 0 and four and or 0 for five. Yeah. 00:06:39.759 --> 00:06:41.500 Well, I didn't know the game would go. I didn't 00:06:41.500 --> 00:06:43.560 know it would go that long. Yeah. He had more 00:06:43.560 --> 00:06:45.670 opportunities to strike out. And then my pick 00:06:45.670 --> 00:06:49.730 to click for the game was Javi and he went one 00:06:49.730 --> 00:06:53.790 for six. So Chet, since the All -Star break, 00:06:53.970 --> 00:06:56.149 I know the pitching hasn't been great. This team 00:06:56.149 --> 00:06:58.649 going into next off season and we'll talk about 00:06:58.649 --> 00:07:00.949 who the stalwarts are going to be just briefly, 00:07:01.110 --> 00:07:04.110 you know, who's under contract, who's arbitration 00:07:04.110 --> 00:07:06.170 eligible that they should settle, you know, on 00:07:06.170 --> 00:07:08.709 something fair. Meaning there's interest on both 00:07:08.709 --> 00:07:12.870 sides this team needs to big boy at bats And 00:07:12.870 --> 00:07:16.529 I'm not talking about the eerie guys Max Clark 00:07:16.529 --> 00:07:21.410 They need like a real batter. I think to compete 00:07:21.410 --> 00:07:25.089 in the regular season They've got almost enough, 00:07:25.230 --> 00:07:28.370 but you now we have these expectations now the 00:07:28.370 --> 00:07:29.870 postseason What are you gonna do when you get 00:07:29.870 --> 00:07:32.730 to the postseason? And it was bore proof that 00:07:32.730 --> 00:07:35.490 we didn't have the hitters to go up against the 00:07:35.490 --> 00:07:38.189 good pitching We didn't have guys who put at 00:07:38.189 --> 00:07:40.569 bats together now, you know You can look at the 00:07:40.569 --> 00:07:42.629 Mariners lineup and they got some pretty pretty 00:07:42.629 --> 00:07:44.529 big lemons up and down too from the division 00:07:44.529 --> 00:07:47.290 series and Couldn't handle our pitching as well 00:07:47.290 --> 00:07:49.350 either but they had a couple guys that really 00:07:49.350 --> 00:07:52.389 shone through they have what the Guardians have 00:07:52.389 --> 00:07:55.370 and yeah, and I think this is relevant even though 00:07:55.370 --> 00:07:57.649 Stephen Kwan didn't have a really good wild card 00:07:57.649 --> 00:08:02.750 he and Ramirez are the stalwarts of that lineup. 00:08:02.750 --> 00:08:05.290 Yeah. And, and the guys that you can kind of 00:08:05.290 --> 00:08:07.930 rely on to do something, they'll get a walk. 00:08:07.990 --> 00:08:09.990 They'll take a long at bat. They'll get on base. 00:08:10.430 --> 00:08:14.110 And I felt the same way with rally. Um, and then 00:08:14.110 --> 00:08:16.029 there were probably a couple Mariners that you 00:08:16.029 --> 00:08:18.949 could probably slot into that. Uh, Naylor, you 00:08:18.949 --> 00:08:21.250 know, had a really good game last night. Polanco, 00:08:21.490 --> 00:08:23.949 Polanco St. Nicholas, J .P. Crawford. I mean 00:08:23.949 --> 00:08:27.720 Crawford. So where I'm saying that Like we can't 00:08:27.720 --> 00:08:29.680 compare ourselves to the Guardians anymore. I 00:08:29.680 --> 00:08:31.600 know that's the team we need to be in the division. 00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:36.320 But to your point to go further, I think you 00:08:36.320 --> 00:08:38.379 and I are saying similar things in this that 00:08:38.379 --> 00:08:43.279 we need two big boy at bats, meaning Riley Green, 00:08:43.340 --> 00:08:47.659 I think can thrive between now and when he turns 00:08:47.659 --> 00:08:51.740 27, 28, but he has got to be protected better 00:08:51.740 --> 00:08:56.100 than the production he's getting now. Well, I 00:08:56.100 --> 00:08:58.639 think You look at a team like the Dodgers, you 00:08:58.639 --> 00:09:00.139 look at a team like the Yankees, you look at 00:09:00.139 --> 00:09:01.960 a team like the Mets, maybe even you look at 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:05.230 a team like... The Blue Jays. The Blue Jays, 00:09:05.230 --> 00:09:07.830 you could go to... Well, I'm not even picking... 00:09:07.830 --> 00:09:10.049 I guess the Blue Jays aren't applicable to what 00:09:10.049 --> 00:09:12.289 I'm trying to get at here, but some of these 00:09:12.289 --> 00:09:17.149 teams, the Padres, they're building themselves 00:09:17.149 --> 00:09:19.529 for the postseason. They're building themselves 00:09:19.529 --> 00:09:22.309 to be a postseason team and win in the postseason. 00:09:22.850 --> 00:09:24.769 The idea is to get back to the World Series. 00:09:25.029 --> 00:09:28.129 They kind of know what they need for that to 00:09:28.129 --> 00:09:30.970 happen. Whereas then you've got the teams like 00:09:30.970 --> 00:09:34.539 the Tigers, the Indians, the competitive teams 00:09:34.539 --> 00:09:36.919 during the regular season, but they typically 00:09:36.919 --> 00:09:39.100 can't get past the division series. They just 00:09:39.100 --> 00:09:41.539 don't have the horses. These other teams have 00:09:41.539 --> 00:09:44.539 the horses. And I'm wondering if we need to start 00:09:44.539 --> 00:09:47.700 thinking along the lines of what do we have to 00:09:47.700 --> 00:09:49.740 do to win in the postseason? The scary part of 00:09:49.740 --> 00:09:52.320 that is you got to spend to do that. And I don't 00:09:52.320 --> 00:09:54.259 know that they're going to do this. I just don't 00:09:54.259 --> 00:09:55.820 think they're going to. I think they're fine 00:09:55.820 --> 00:09:58.299 getting to the postseason. Maybe they get lucky 00:09:58.299 --> 00:10:01.200 and squeak into the ALCS. You know, maybe they 00:10:01.200 --> 00:10:05.100 pull a T Tampa Bay Devil Rays back in circa whenever 00:10:05.100 --> 00:10:07.299 it was when Madden was their coach get into the 00:10:07.299 --> 00:10:11.720 World Series 2009. Yeah, 2009. You know, they 00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:14.919 just don't they aren't building for that sustained 00:10:14.919 --> 00:10:17.840 postseason run year after year after year. It's 00:10:17.840 --> 00:10:19.340 almost like they're kind of just trying to slap 00:10:19.340 --> 00:10:21.820 it together and see if they can get in. And they're 00:10:21.820 --> 00:10:23.679 doing it because they've drafted well and they 00:10:23.679 --> 00:10:25.919 have this young talent, but they need those extra 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:27.860 bats, like you say, to get them over the hump. 00:10:27.980 --> 00:10:31.090 And by the way, They don't just need bats. They 00:10:31.090 --> 00:10:33.549 need some pitching too. That's strikeout pitching. 00:10:33.629 --> 00:10:36.389 Let's talk about that because what I'd like to 00:10:36.389 --> 00:10:38.490 do is talk about who we know is coming back. 00:10:39.350 --> 00:10:41.750 The Tigers lost last night, three to two, 15 00:10:41.750 --> 00:10:44.009 innings. If you're a Tigers fan and you listen 00:10:44.009 --> 00:10:46.110 to this, I'm sure you stayed awake on a Friday 00:10:46.110 --> 00:10:48.129 evening, regardless of what you had going on 00:10:48.129 --> 00:10:50.629 this Saturday. You should have. And if you didn't 00:10:50.629 --> 00:10:53.049 Google the highlights, record it on whatever 00:10:53.049 --> 00:10:56.679 streaming service you have. It was as fun as 00:10:56.679 --> 00:11:00.080 fun could possibly be. And I think that's a great 00:11:00.080 --> 00:11:02.840 start for the Tigers. After last year's surprise 00:11:02.840 --> 00:11:06.019 run to the playoffs, this year's really dominant, 00:11:06.019 --> 00:11:08.940 you know, first half or first hundred games of 00:11:08.940 --> 00:11:11.460 baseball, more is needed. I agree with you on 00:11:11.460 --> 00:11:14.659 pitching. And it was so interesting having the 00:11:14.659 --> 00:11:17.740 crew they had in the booth last night. It was 00:11:17.740 --> 00:11:20.220 Adam Amin, who I respect immensely, but I think 00:11:20.220 --> 00:11:22.720 he spread himself too thin. He does bowls games 00:11:22.720 --> 00:11:26.210 and a ton of NBA. He does a ton of college football. 00:11:29.250 --> 00:11:31.870 And he also does baseball, but like when he does 00:11:31.870 --> 00:11:34.090 it, he's usually doing like a day game for the 00:11:34.090 --> 00:11:38.730 White Sox type thing. Sure. He was out of his 00:11:38.730 --> 00:11:41.129 depth and I'm giving this as a shout out to a 00:11:41.129 --> 00:11:44.690 lot of our loyal listeners when they compared 00:11:44.690 --> 00:11:51.240 the Seattle reliever to senior smoke. Yeah. Almost 00:11:51.240 --> 00:11:53.740 had an aneurysm because there is only one there 00:11:53.740 --> 00:11:56.120 is only one scene and his name is a really low 00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:58.740 kind of haphazardly Through that in there after 00:11:58.740 --> 00:12:01.159 they said it they've been calling him this many 00:12:01.159 --> 00:12:02.679 announcers have been calling him this I'll see 00:12:02.679 --> 00:12:05.480 they've stolen this nickname for him And then 00:12:05.480 --> 00:12:07.360 they kind of haphazardly threw in and there was 00:12:07.360 --> 00:12:09.600 another senior smoke or really a Lopez in the 00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:12.799 1984 Tigers I'm going guys you'd had to do better 00:12:12.799 --> 00:12:15.929 on that And you can't take the nickname. Anyways, 00:12:16.269 --> 00:12:19.029 not to get hung up on that. But yeah, you think 00:12:19.029 --> 00:12:20.970 we need some strikeout guys, though, is what 00:12:20.970 --> 00:12:22.929 we're getting at. And they have them in Seattle. 00:12:22.990 --> 00:12:25.070 They had those types of power pitchers in their 00:12:25.070 --> 00:12:28.909 pen. They rolled the same guys. Spear and Brash 00:12:28.909 --> 00:12:31.470 picked up. I felt like every game a starter would 00:12:31.470 --> 00:12:35.029 go. And then we'd see some combination of Spear, 00:12:35.149 --> 00:12:38.230 Spire and Brash and then Munoz. It was like boom, 00:12:38.269 --> 00:12:40.730 boom, boom. They had the lockdown ready to go. 00:12:41.029 --> 00:12:43.639 And it worked for the most part. It worked for 00:12:43.639 --> 00:12:47.720 the most part. All right. So let's talk about 00:12:47.720 --> 00:12:51.000 next season and here's why I'm not super optimistic 00:12:51.000 --> 00:12:54.480 unless some free agent signings do happen. Sure. 00:12:55.139 --> 00:12:56.759 I mean, it's going to be more of the same. You're 00:12:56.759 --> 00:12:58.740 going to have Carpenter in right field, Keith, 00:12:59.379 --> 00:13:01.500 I guess at second base, but let's just say second 00:13:01.500 --> 00:13:04.460 base. Green in left field, torque at first, Stingler 00:13:04.460 --> 00:13:06.759 at catcher. I've heard, even though he's not 00:13:06.759 --> 00:13:09.080 under contract, Viraline, you've heard the same 00:13:09.080 --> 00:13:11.019 thing. They want Matt Viraline back. He wants 00:13:11.019 --> 00:13:13.500 to come back. I'm penciling him at third base 00:13:13.500 --> 00:13:15.659 unless they make a free agent acquisition. I've 00:13:15.659 --> 00:13:18.340 seen enough and I've said this, but he's young 00:13:18.340 --> 00:13:20.279 and he's under contract. Parker Meadows will 00:13:20.279 --> 00:13:23.980 be your starting center fielder. And then until 00:13:23.980 --> 00:13:27.500 his contract ends, Javier Baez, Javi Baez, will 00:13:27.500 --> 00:13:30.600 be your shortstop. Bench is going to be ZMAC. 00:13:31.620 --> 00:13:33.759 Justin Henry -Molloy will be in the mix. I don't 00:13:33.759 --> 00:13:37.080 know if he'll make the 26 -man or the 25 -man 00:13:37.080 --> 00:13:42.220 or the 40 -man. And then Andi Abyañez is a shoe 00:13:42.220 --> 00:13:46.799 -in for utility. That is your lineup right now. 00:13:47.100 --> 00:13:50.120 So nothing's changing other than the second base 00:13:50.120 --> 00:13:54.059 Gleyber Torres slot. You need two to three big 00:13:54.059 --> 00:13:56.679 time at bats to balance that out. How are you 00:13:56.679 --> 00:13:58.600 going to do that? Because who are you benching? 00:13:59.080 --> 00:14:02.879 Parker Meadows? Parker could go and Verling could 00:14:02.879 --> 00:14:04.019 go as far as - Are they going to be willing to 00:14:04.019 --> 00:14:06.200 bench Parker? Are they going to trade him? I 00:14:06.200 --> 00:14:08.700 don't know. Does he become a trade piece? I wonder 00:14:08.700 --> 00:14:11.779 if the trade market is where we're going to seek 00:14:11.779 --> 00:14:14.019 people. Or if they're just going to roll this 00:14:14.019 --> 00:14:15.960 out again and say everybody's a year older and 00:14:15.960 --> 00:14:18.730 we'll be that much better. Please don't do that 00:14:18.730 --> 00:14:21.450 to me. Well, this is what scares me is this standing 00:14:21.450 --> 00:14:23.909 pat. We made the playoffs. This is Bill. This 00:14:23.909 --> 00:14:25.789 is my biggest problem with all this. You look 00:14:25.789 --> 00:14:28.629 at what we have. They've built a lot of this 00:14:28.629 --> 00:14:30.789 up through some of these players, these young 00:14:30.789 --> 00:14:33.789 guys. I mean, what if you're you've got to either 00:14:33.789 --> 00:14:36.850 get rid of some of them or. You got to hope they 00:14:36.850 --> 00:14:38.990 get better and you keep them and you try to do 00:14:38.990 --> 00:14:41.649 the same thing all over again next season I just 00:14:41.649 --> 00:14:43.429 don't see where you're gonna have McGonagall 00:14:43.429 --> 00:14:46.169 is gonna be up next season. He's gonna play I 00:14:46.169 --> 00:14:48.090 don't I think he's gonna play second base So 00:14:48.090 --> 00:14:50.629 Gleyber's taking care of Gleyber's gone McGonagall's 00:14:50.629 --> 00:14:53.110 in so insert McGonagall in there Which means 00:14:53.110 --> 00:14:55.230 you're gonna have another young hitter in there 00:14:55.230 --> 00:14:58.990 who's going to have some Youth, you know a little 00:14:58.990 --> 00:15:02.389 bit of he may surprise us We may love not surprise 00:15:02.389 --> 00:15:04.309 us, but we may love what he's doing at times, 00:15:04.309 --> 00:15:07.350 but he's also gonna have those youthful spurts 00:15:07.350 --> 00:15:11.129 of just Garbage where he swings at everything 00:15:11.129 --> 00:15:13.070 or he's not patient. You know, you're just gonna 00:15:13.070 --> 00:15:15.769 have it you're gonna have growing pains So I'm 00:15:15.769 --> 00:15:18.529 a little afraid of the fact that we are going 00:15:18.529 --> 00:15:22.129 to very much roll out the same line up next year 00:15:22.129 --> 00:15:25.779 Come game one after spring training and maybe 00:15:25.779 --> 00:15:27.360 we're going to come back and talk about this 00:15:27.360 --> 00:15:30.759 in four or five, six months. But I am terrified 00:15:30.759 --> 00:15:32.440 of the fact that they're going to stay in patent. 00:15:32.539 --> 00:15:34.340 They're good with what they got. You want two 00:15:34.340 --> 00:15:36.019 big bats. I don't see where they're coming from 00:15:36.019 --> 00:15:38.879 or where they're going to put them. OK, I don't 00:15:38.879 --> 00:15:41.620 base. Maybe I think we're asking the wrong question. 00:15:41.820 --> 00:15:44.299 We don't have a D .H. in there. And the fact 00:15:44.299 --> 00:15:47.000 is. You and I both agree they need the bats. 00:15:47.399 --> 00:15:50.399 Where to put them is, I don't want to say inconsequential. 00:15:50.580 --> 00:15:55.120 Don't re -sign Matt Virling. Know that ZMAC is 00:15:55.120 --> 00:15:58.740 what ZMAC is. And, you know, you're paying them 00:15:58.740 --> 00:16:00.899 all the money in the world, Chris Illich. It 00:16:00.899 --> 00:16:02.799 doesn't mean you have to start Javi every day. 00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:06.220 I think you're onto something there with the 00:16:06.220 --> 00:16:08.740 don't bring Veerling back. We have a lot of Veerling 00:16:08.740 --> 00:16:11.919 we need more. I'm seeing a trade, a Parker Meadows 00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:14.639 or a Spencer Torkelson trade somewhere with someone. 00:16:15.139 --> 00:16:17.360 I could see that happening. And I hate to say 00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:19.960 it, my boy Torque, but he ain't hitting like 00:16:19.960 --> 00:16:22.200 a prototypical first baseman. We need a Pete 00:16:22.200 --> 00:16:24.480 Alonso over there. We don't need a Torque. And 00:16:24.480 --> 00:16:26.100 then you just start talking, well, will they 00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:28.679 pay for that? Are they going to pay for an Alonso? 00:16:28.799 --> 00:16:32.149 Are they going to pay for a, you know? That level 00:16:32.149 --> 00:16:34.789 of first baseman. Then we go to the other side 00:16:34.789 --> 00:16:37.009 of things, and this is where it gets interesting. 00:16:38.090 --> 00:16:41.230 Okay. Do you, Tarek Scoobel's value will never 00:16:41.230 --> 00:16:43.529 be higher than it will be at the winter meetings 00:16:43.529 --> 00:16:47.809 in this off season. The second he pitches for 00:16:47.809 --> 00:16:51.190 the Tigers next opening day, his value starts 00:16:51.190 --> 00:16:56.309 to decline because you will be getting pennies 00:16:56.309 --> 00:16:59.820 on the dollar. If you and Scott Boris can't figure 00:16:59.820 --> 00:17:03.039 out something, which I don't think that's going 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:04.980 to happen. The Tigers have had every opportunity 00:17:04.980 --> 00:17:07.980 to do that. Apparently they've made very fair 00:17:07.980 --> 00:17:11.000 offers and overtures and it's being turned down 00:17:11.000 --> 00:17:13.859 because they want to, they being scubal and Boris 00:17:13.859 --> 00:17:17.319 want to go to the open market. So I don't know 00:17:17.319 --> 00:17:19.299 that it's in the Tigers best interest to have 00:17:19.299 --> 00:17:22.200 him as the opening day starter. I couldn't agree 00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:25.140 more. I mean, I just don't know. I don't know 00:17:25.140 --> 00:17:28.099 if you. He's gonna win a second Cy Young here. 00:17:28.660 --> 00:17:30.400 Okay, he I can't figure out who's gonna beat 00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:33.339 him And if he doesn't he should have so you look 00:17:33.339 --> 00:17:35.099 at that and you say well Do we just keep him 00:17:35.099 --> 00:17:38.339 around for this final season play it out? We're 00:17:38.339 --> 00:17:42.000 not gonna get anything or near his value or your 00:17:42.000 --> 00:17:44.700 chances are what one and five at the best to 00:17:44.700 --> 00:17:47.700 resign them One and five, maybe maybe they got 00:17:47.700 --> 00:17:52.700 no that's the highest. Yeah. Yeah What the other 00:17:52.700 --> 00:17:54.420 thing I started thinking was, you know, he pitched 00:17:54.420 --> 00:17:57.640 two games in this series for us. We didn't win 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:01.180 either one of them. At the end of the day, the 00:18:01.180 --> 00:18:04.079 sum of the whole is more than the individual 00:18:04.079 --> 00:18:08.140 players that we have. We needed more to win those 00:18:08.140 --> 00:18:10.599 games than just a Tarik Scoob will start a Tarik 00:18:10.599 --> 00:18:13.259 Scoob will start in a great lineup would have 00:18:13.259 --> 00:18:15.640 sealed the deal. Yeah, but a Tarik Scoob will 00:18:15.640 --> 00:18:17.900 start in the lineup. We got in doing it and. 00:18:18.029 --> 00:18:20.529 I fear if we spent the money to sign him, that's 00:18:20.529 --> 00:18:22.230 what we would be living with for the rest of 00:18:22.230 --> 00:18:25.730 the time, you know? So I just don't... If he 00:18:25.730 --> 00:18:28.250 can bring a bunch of prospects, if he can bring 00:18:28.250 --> 00:18:30.289 a bunch of players who are ready to play now 00:18:30.289 --> 00:18:32.269 that we have some control over, I think you've 00:18:32.269 --> 00:18:35.549 got to trade him. But at the same time, who knows 00:18:35.549 --> 00:18:37.609 if that happens or not. I don't know if they're 00:18:37.609 --> 00:18:40.230 willing to go that route. They'll get skewered. 00:18:40.349 --> 00:18:42.970 The common fan will not be happy if Tarek Skubal 00:18:42.970 --> 00:18:46.599 is traded away before next season. I just don't 00:18:46.599 --> 00:18:49.480 see it being a good, a good look, if you know 00:18:49.480 --> 00:18:52.819 what I mean. So then the other thing is that 00:18:52.819 --> 00:18:56.880 Flaherty has his own option. He can opt out of 00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:00.380 the tiger's contract, which I think he pitched 00:19:00.380 --> 00:19:03.359 well enough to probably do so and get more on 00:19:03.359 --> 00:19:06.220 the open market. Okay. I know that's not going 00:19:06.220 --> 00:19:08.700 to lose any sleep over losing Flaherty. I mean, 00:19:09.339 --> 00:19:12.799 but now you are looking at these gentlemen is 00:19:12.799 --> 00:19:15.940 your essentially starting pitchers for next year. 00:19:16.160 --> 00:19:18.240 If Scoobel's gone and Flaherty's gone is what 00:19:18.240 --> 00:19:20.299 you're saying. Or are you saying with Scoobel 00:19:20.299 --> 00:19:22.299 even? Okay. I mean, these guys are all part of 00:19:22.299 --> 00:19:25.880 it. Yeah. So Casey Mize is under contract. We'll 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:28.539 be there next year. Reese Olsen. Let's hope he's 00:19:28.539 --> 00:19:31.039 healthy. He'll be there. Yeah. Paul Seewald is 00:19:31.039 --> 00:19:33.119 under contract for two more years. He will be 00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:35.819 there. All right. How you utilize him, I don't 00:19:35.819 --> 00:19:40.599 know. Yeah. Okay. But okay. Jose Urquarty. Yeah. 00:19:41.400 --> 00:19:44.700 Urquarty. Yeah. That's interesting because the 00:19:44.700 --> 00:19:46.779 Tigers control that option. So they can opt out 00:19:46.779 --> 00:19:49.680 of that. And then you've got Troy Melton. And 00:19:49.680 --> 00:19:52.319 that's kind of your starting pitchers as I see 00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:54.619 it. I'm not counting Jackson Jobe because I don't 00:19:54.619 --> 00:19:57.420 expect him back at any time next year. Am I missing 00:19:57.420 --> 00:20:01.640 anything on that? No, I do think Troy Melton, 00:20:02.039 --> 00:20:05.619 I would love actually, if we do keep Scubal, 00:20:06.039 --> 00:20:08.799 pairing Scubal and Melton is our one -two punch 00:20:08.799 --> 00:20:11.660 at the top of that starting rotation. I think 00:20:11.660 --> 00:20:14.099 Melton's got something. I think he could be a 00:20:14.099 --> 00:20:17.400 very, very good starter for us. I'm saying it 00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:19.539 all season. And I think everybody, you know, 00:20:19.539 --> 00:20:21.440 on the broadcast last night, they made those 00:20:21.440 --> 00:20:24.660 exact same words. I think it was Adam Wainwright 00:20:24.660 --> 00:20:26.980 was like, can you imagine having a Scoobel Melton 00:20:26.980 --> 00:20:30.019 1 -2? They might make a really good 1 -2 punch. 00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:32.180 And I sat there and I was like, yep, yep, yep. 00:20:32.339 --> 00:20:35.259 Give me more of that. My is Reese Olsen. I hope 00:20:35.259 --> 00:20:37.799 Reese is back. I'm thinking he should be for 00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:40.180 the start of next season based on what I was 00:20:40.180 --> 00:20:42.819 reading, but maybe he won't be back. Right at 00:20:42.819 --> 00:20:45.279 the start. Then you have Mize. You'll have Seewald 00:20:45.279 --> 00:20:47.200 in there somewhere. You got to find a fifth. 00:20:47.740 --> 00:20:50.579 That could be Keider Montero for a while. We 00:20:50.579 --> 00:20:54.019 may see some combination of that. Maybe Flaherty 00:20:54.019 --> 00:20:56.579 does resign. Maybe Flaherty resigning or picking 00:20:56.579 --> 00:20:59.880 us. I don't know. It's, it's an option. So he 00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:02.859 may try to test his value on the market. Like 00:21:02.859 --> 00:21:04.559 I said, though, I'm not losing any sleep either 00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:06.359 way. I think we have people we can fill in there 00:21:06.359 --> 00:21:09.750 to do just fine without him. I don't know, Bill. 00:21:09.950 --> 00:21:12.670 I mean, this team still has a lot of needs. Isn't 00:21:12.670 --> 00:21:15.630 that odd that we can go to the ALDS, get to the 00:21:15.630 --> 00:21:17.349 fifth game and we still have a ton of needs? 00:21:17.529 --> 00:21:20.269 Two years in a row. Crazy that we have so many 00:21:20.269 --> 00:21:23.990 needs yet. Yeah, yeah, no. And so then the bullpen, 00:21:24.569 --> 00:21:27.130 really the only pieces that are under contract 00:21:27.130 --> 00:21:31.009 that I see being brought back are Tyler Holton. 00:21:31.989 --> 00:21:35.069 Brandt Herder, Will Vest, Kyle Finnegan. And 00:21:35.069 --> 00:21:37.549 then I don't know what they're going to do with 00:21:37.549 --> 00:21:40.789 two guys. Beau Briski is one. Yeah. And then 00:21:40.789 --> 00:21:43.150 Jason Foley is the other. I think it's both injury 00:21:43.150 --> 00:21:45.950 related. Yeah. But they're both under control 00:21:45.950 --> 00:21:48.789 as well. So when I look at it from a numbers 00:21:48.789 --> 00:21:50.789 standpoint, you know, just the names we just 00:21:50.789 --> 00:21:52.730 talked about. We have Finnegan for one more year. 00:21:52.930 --> 00:21:55.119 Before you go further, is it just one more? No, 00:21:55.259 --> 00:21:57.480 two more years. Two more years. So next year 00:21:57.480 --> 00:22:00.380 and then for a while. And he's not expensive 00:22:00.380 --> 00:22:03.799 either. I think the Nationals signed him to a 00:22:03.799 --> 00:22:05.599 pretty good deal. I think it's like five million 00:22:05.599 --> 00:22:09.119 or something like that. So I feel good about 00:22:09.119 --> 00:22:13.779 all that in terms of who is signed. I look at 00:22:13.779 --> 00:22:15.980 it and I'm like, oh, there's seven starting pitchers. 00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:17.920 Like we have so much depth. And then you think 00:22:17.920 --> 00:22:20.680 about it and you're like, wait a second. Like 00:22:20.680 --> 00:22:23.119 is Melton, I think you and I would both love 00:22:23.369 --> 00:22:26.170 to be a starter. Yeah, he needs to be a starter. 00:22:26.349 --> 00:22:29.990 No idea what Seewald is. Olsen is great, but 00:22:29.990 --> 00:22:34.349 he's never healthy. You know, Mize could be more 00:22:34.349 --> 00:22:37.970 consistent. And then Urquide, like, who the heck 00:22:37.970 --> 00:22:39.930 knows? I mean, who knows what's going to happen 00:22:39.930 --> 00:22:42.450 with him, right? So and then you lose Scoobble 00:22:42.450 --> 00:22:44.970 or you trade Scoobble, you lose Flaherty, and 00:22:44.970 --> 00:22:47.009 all of a sudden things aren't looking so hot. 00:22:47.170 --> 00:22:49.890 Yep. You might have to keep scubal around I mean 00:22:49.890 --> 00:22:52.170 might literally may not be able to trade him 00:22:52.170 --> 00:22:55.589 and put together a rotation Depends on what you 00:22:55.589 --> 00:22:58.650 can get out on the market. That's still taking 00:22:58.650 --> 00:23:02.089 shape to one degree or another I don't I don't 00:23:02.089 --> 00:23:04.309 know bill. There seem to be a lot of needs. We 00:23:04.309 --> 00:23:06.369 have needs in the rotation We have needs in the 00:23:06.369 --> 00:23:08.880 pen. We have needs in the lineup Core positions 00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:11.380 like we do need to get, I love torque, but we 00:23:11.380 --> 00:23:13.920 do need to find somebody who consistently hits 00:23:13.920 --> 00:23:16.880 for more power to play that first base position. 00:23:17.420 --> 00:23:20.779 Colt Keith, is he the guy? I don't know. He's 00:23:20.779 --> 00:23:23.099 borderline for me, you know, and he's been DHing 00:23:23.099 --> 00:23:25.750 a lot. So what do we do with Colt Keith? Do we 00:23:25.750 --> 00:23:28.289 put him back at first? Do we shift him to second? 00:23:28.529 --> 00:23:30.970 There's some questions there. I'd rather see 00:23:30.970 --> 00:23:33.049 him back playing his original position at second 00:23:33.049 --> 00:23:34.789 baseman because I don't think he's a prototypical 00:23:34.789 --> 00:23:37.750 first baseman. We may not get that prototypical 00:23:37.750 --> 00:23:40.490 first baseman. We may stand packed with one of 00:23:40.490 --> 00:23:42.809 those two guys. I think third base is an opportunity 00:23:42.809 --> 00:23:45.410 to upgrade there. I think we can go out and find 00:23:45.410 --> 00:23:47.549 a third baseman to upgrade that spot and get 00:23:47.549 --> 00:23:50.509 some power out of that spot. Outfield seems pretty 00:23:50.509 --> 00:23:54.190 set if Meadows stays in the center. So we got 00:23:54.190 --> 00:23:57.589 a lot of needs and some interesting positional 00:23:57.589 --> 00:24:01.130 things to consider So last point before we kind 00:24:01.130 --> 00:24:04.990 of wrap up 2026 season opens rough to the Tigers 00:24:04.990 --> 00:24:08.150 open on the West Coast again Yeah, three in San 00:24:08.150 --> 00:24:11.630 Diego three at Arizona. Then they come home for 00:24:11.630 --> 00:24:14.670 a weird three game set against the Cardinals 00:24:14.670 --> 00:24:16.869 So nine straight against the National League. 00:24:16.869 --> 00:24:22.160 Mm -hmm. Then they go to the Twin Cities for 00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:25.519 four games and then come home to play the Marlins. 00:24:25.839 --> 00:24:28.119 That four games against the Twins might be the 00:24:28.119 --> 00:24:31.480 respite they need after nine against the National 00:24:31.480 --> 00:24:33.259 League. Yeah, but like one's going to get rained 00:24:33.259 --> 00:24:36.599 out. One's going to get snowed out. I mean, like. 00:24:37.940 --> 00:24:41.559 Yeah, I mean, yeah, so the other part is I don't 00:24:41.559 --> 00:24:44.559 know that they're going to start super hot, so 00:24:44.559 --> 00:24:48.319 it could also be the time to somewhat hit reset. 00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:51.369 Maybe you go after one of. The big free agents, 00:24:51.609 --> 00:24:55.549 Kyle Tucker, Alex Bregman can opt out. We could 00:24:55.549 --> 00:24:57.670 give that another run. I don't know why we would. 00:24:58.170 --> 00:25:00.849 Corbin Burns, Walker Bueller. So there's obviously 00:25:00.849 --> 00:25:02.950 going to be a lot of options on the free agent 00:25:02.950 --> 00:25:06.369 market to build this team up. But where do you 00:25:06.369 --> 00:25:09.150 fit them? Where do they fit in our payroll? Where 00:25:09.150 --> 00:25:11.369 do you fit them on the field based on some of 00:25:11.369 --> 00:25:14.150 the positional challenges we have? Bill, we're 00:25:14.150 --> 00:25:15.970 going to do another episode. We're going to cover 00:25:15.970 --> 00:25:19.869 all that, kind of do a wrap up on the 2025 season. 00:25:19.990 --> 00:25:22.029 We'll wrap it up a nice little bow, nice little 00:25:22.029 --> 00:25:25.309 package for everybody. We'll preview 2026 and 00:25:25.309 --> 00:25:28.250 that'll be our sign off for the season. But everybody 00:25:28.250 --> 00:25:31.990 kind of just sit, let this 15 inning game marinate 00:25:31.990 --> 00:25:34.809 a little bit and then forget about it and go 00:25:34.809 --> 00:25:37.089 watch some football. And we'll start talking 00:25:37.089 --> 00:25:39.369 about the future here in a couple of weeks with 00:25:39.369 --> 00:25:43.250 our wrap up episode. Until then. Enjoy your Lions 00:25:43.250 --> 00:25:46.150 football, enjoy your college football on Saturdays, 00:25:46.210 --> 00:25:48.670 whomever you may be cheering for, and Go Tigers. 00:25:49.029 --> 00:25:51.349 I don't know why I even say Go Tigers, the season's 00:25:51.349 --> 00:26:00.269 over. Enjoy your off season. All right, that's 00:26:00.269 --> 00:26:02.190 gonna do it for this episode of the Litterbox, 00:26:02.269 --> 00:26:04.910 a Detroit Tigers podcast. Thanks for hanging 00:26:04.910 --> 00:26:07.329 out with us. We're Bill and Chet, we'll be back 00:26:07.329 --> 00:26:10.150 soon with more Tigers Talk. If you're enjoying 00:26:10.150 --> 00:26:13.210 the show, be sure to follow or subscribe on Spotify, 00:26:13.750 --> 00:26:16.849 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 00:26:17.369 --> 00:26:19.710 And hey, if you got a minute, leave us a quick 00:26:19.710 --> 00:26:22.930 review. Till next time, Go Tigers!