This is the Litterbox, a Detroit Lions podcast
with your hosts, Shet West and Bill Patterson.
Lions Litterbox listeners, we have an exciting
tilt this week. Monday night football against
the Baltimore Ravens. The Lions are four and
a half point dogs. However, this host is feeling
optimistic that the Lions are gonna get their
first victory in the city of Baltimore since
1977. I'm gonna go early on my prediction and
say that the Lions win this 24 to 23. Chet, what
do you have to say? I think your prediction is
optimistic, to say the least. I do not believe
we win this game. And I think there are too many
things. that have to happen right for the Lions
to pull out a victory here. I'm taking 31 to
17 as a final score. And I'll be curious to see
if the Lions can even score that much on this
Ravens defense. They aren't the Ravens defense
of yesteryear that was dominating, but they are
still quite good. They have a few key injuries
which I think could play to the Lions favor on
this. I know that I'm coming off very Pollyanna
-ish. I just know that the Lions are six and
one all time against the Ravens. That 1977 victory
actually happened against the Baltimore Colts.
But hear me out on this. One of the key injuries,
and I'm going to probably mispronounce this name,
but it's in Domine Maduke is their defensive
tackle and he is out. Isaiah, likely their backup
tight end or second tight end is out. Another
gentleman who they utilize quite a bit, Patrick
Ricard, a fullback, is also out. I think the
secret to their defense the last, say, few seasons
has been a familiar name to us. Chet, he was
a Lions draft pick that the Lions couldn't figure
out how to utilize, yet had a very successful
Pro Bowl career in New England and also in Baltimore,
and that's Kyle Van Noy, who is also out. The
only player out for the Lions right now, Chet,
is a very familiar face, Marcus Davenport, or
should we call him Marcus Always Hurt? Well,
He's not out for the season, so he's just out
for the week at this point. Usually Davenport
gets these injuries that take him out for the
season. And I think he did a pretty good job
pronouncing Marabuke's name there, Namdi Marabuke.
I think he's, I think he's, I think it's Namdi
Marabuke, but he's probably their biggest loss.
He was a guy that really scared me. in the initial
offing here, because you know how our interior
O -line has had its struggles between the center
and the guard there. So him being out does help.
Yeah, I mean, the same keys to the game that
we've talked about the previous two weeks. Chet
are going to be present here and that is going
to be a Glasgow at center and then the two young
guards flanking him on either side, both the
left and right and Tate Ratledge. played much,
much better week two over that of week one. And
I would say that Christian Mahogany also did
the same. Glasgow, you know, we've been critical
of him. However, having a key disruptor, a three
technique defensive tackle out can only help
the Lions in this. I know that I'm optimistic
in my prediction and that is contingent on the
Lions being able to run the football like they
did against the Bears. I'm more worried in this
game. I'm more worried about our defense containing
their offense. Well, that's a bigger worry. That
is the crazy part. And the statistic that we
mentioned in our recap on the Bears is that Lamar
Jackson is 26 and two against the NFC, which
is otherworldly. And the question I have for
you is why do we think that is? And then number
two, does that revert more to a norm? Because
I did a little digging on this chat. And I've
never seen an AFC, NFC quarterback split quite
like this. Yeah. I don't, I don't know that there's
anything to it other than the fact that, you
know, who has he played in the NFC in his 32
outings? I don't, I'm not going to sit and say
that it's like he's got the NFC number because
that doesn't make any sense. Why would it be
any different than versus the AFC? But he is
a very good quarterback. He is a mobile quarterback,
which we know the Lions haven't dealt well with
a mobile quarterback in years. So he presents
a lot of threats. And with Derrick Henry in the
backfield, our run defense is going to have to
be on point. Absolutely. And I think if I can
give my opinion or hypothesis on this. He's a
dual threat quarterback, but he operates at the
highest level possible. So if Jayden Daniels
did what he did to the Lions beat up defense
last year in the playoffs, Lamar Jackson would
be Coke from Mexico with cane sugar. And Jayden
Daniels would be diet Coke with, or he's tab.
Do you remember tab? He's tab. He's got saccharin.
There's some saccharin in there. He's very light.
I agree with you. I agree with what you're saying
there. I think he poses a threat and I think
for the Lions to win this game, first and foremost,
I'm going to present a sentence to you. What
do the Lions have to do to win this game, Bill?
Win the turnover battle and they have to dominate
time of possession, meaning they have to be able
to run the ball and stop the run and have at
least three explosive plays. I'm with you up
to the explosive plays. I'm less worried about
explosive plays. We need to make sure we win
the turnover battle. We need the defense to make
a couple plays in this game to turn the tide.
Number two is keep Lamar Jackson on the bench,
i .e. time of possession. Keep the ball in our
offense's hands. Couldn't agree more. We cannot
get into, against this defense, and they still
have some talent out there, we cannot get into
third and long. We've got to stay out of third
and long. Jared Goff in third and nine is, it's
a, he's, it just isn't his best down. And it's
not for anybody, right? Like nobody wants to
be in third and long, but Jared Goff in third
and long becomes very predictable passing down
and then we lose a lot of our edge and leverage
there. And to that, to your point on that, the
play action offense, which is what Jared Goff
is so successful at, whether Ben Johnson's is
OC, whether Johnny Morton's is OC. They can predicate
throwing on first downs to set up second and
third and shorts. Mm -hmm. Keep the Ravens offense,
which is a two -headed monster. Mm -hmm. Three
if you add in Zay Flowers, although I think Terryon
Arnold has his best game of the season this week.
Don't forget, you got to contain D -Hop, too.
Yeah. I mean... No, they've got weapons everywhere.
They've got weapons all over. I love this Lions
roster, and I agree with Dan Campbell saying
this is the most talented roster he's ever had.
However... When I look across at the Ravens lineup
and their roster, it is stacked. It is proof
of an organization that just continues to draft
well and pick their spots in free agency, meaning
D Hopkins, Derek Henry. Just how successful of
a franchise you can be. Kyle Van Noyce also,
you know, Rokan Smith. Rokan Smith's one of the
best middle linebackers in the game. They seem
to first and second round picks and not only
reclaim them but make them even better. Derek
Henry being the exception, he was awesome. And
Tennessee as well. I just think the margin of
error in this game is minimal for the Lions.
So can I give you three players that I, these
are my picks to click if the Lions are going
to win the upset. Yes. Number one, Jack Fox.
When the Lions do have to punt, he has to be
excellent, which he has been the first two weeks,
pin the Ravens deep in their own territory. Number
two, And I know he's playing with an ankle that's
been bothering him. We have to see Jack Campbell
really be a great run stopper and be the quarterback
of the defense. The last guy I would say was
also on the defensive side of the ball, and that's
going to be Brian Branch. He needs to do what
he's been doing in the first two games this season,
flying around, creating havoc, creating turnovers,
because again, that turnover battle is going
to be paramount to this. And then the interior
of the offensive line. I know you and I have
talked about this ad nauseam. I hope they can
continue the path that they had last week. I
know they're going to go up against much steeper
competition. However, we don't need to lay a
50 burger on the Ravens. I do think first team
to 24 probably gets this done. I just, Chet,
I have to say, when I look down the schedule,
and you and I have texted about this offline,
how exciting is it that the Lions are in so many
prime time? Well, and they're against all good
teams. Their schedule is very tough. And now
that Green Bay looks like probably one of the
best teams in the NFL at this point, makes it
even more difficult because you're adding them
into the mix. Yeah. And I'm not, look, Carson
Lentz taking over the helm for the Vikings. This,
this may last longer than one game. Are you,
are you giving us some insider info from the
Twin Cities? I just think that I, you know, I
have this feeling. that Carson Wentz is gonna
bring some things out of that offense that J
.J. McCarthy couldn't. I don't know if it's permanent.
I don't know that McCarthy doesn't, you know,
doesn't take over the, you know, get back into
the starting spot. I mean, they're gonna give
him, they've invested in him, they're gonna give
him a chance. I'm just saying it could be interesting
to see what Carson Wentz is able to do with this
offense. And then maybe what McCarthy can learn
from it. But not a Vikings podcast, but the NFC
North. I'm just looking at it. And like the Bears
look like the pushover, obviously, they're absolutely
horrifying. But the rest of the division between
Minnesota and Green Bay isn't going to be a pushover.
They're going to be a challenge. So we'll see
what happens. I feel like this game is kind of
the tipping point. I mean, here we are in week
three. What do you do against the Ravens? Do
you compete? Or do you look hapless like you
did against Green Bay and their defense or the
Ravens game last year for our listeners? If I
remember that. Yeah. No, the Lions were out of
it by the end of the first quarter. Yeah, it
was. And my that's my fear. Yes. If we can't
contain Henry and keep and just minimize his
damage. The next thing is the pass rush. We have
to have a pass rush. If we don't pressure Lamar
Jackson and contain Henry, this game will be
over by halftime. For sure. We have to get pressure
on Lamar Jackson. And their line is beat up.
Their line isn't that good. So we can get pressure
on him. We can do it. But we have to get the
pressure on him and contain Henry. And for listeners,
because we're not on video, Chet raised both
eyebrows. I did. Very curiously when I brought
up Jack Fox. Yes. Do you have any players that
we should keep an eye on? Jake Fox? Jake Fox?
Jake Fox. Jake Fox. I don't know who Jack Fox
is. He's like your milk guy or something. No,
no, no. But like, Jake Fox. Wasn't he like an
actor on... Jack Fox? He might have been. He
might have been an actor. On Lost or something
like that. But you're not going to get... But
that's Matthew Fox. These inside looks that we're
giving you folks here, I mean, who else has the
punning game? a key to victory out there in the
podcast, Lion's podcast world. Nobody, nobody's
written that up. But Bill, if Fox sticks a couple
of punts inside the 10 and flips a field for
us or something, I'm coming right back to you
next episode and saying, good work, my friend.
You pointed something out the rest of the world
didn't see. So that might mean that some stadium
mustard might be on its way. Maybe some stadium
mustard will be on its way, a little gift for
a good pick on your behalf. So Bill, if you're
a betting man, and I know you are to a degree
or another, as am I, we're looking at a line
of four and a half, Baltimore minus four and
a half. I actually think I would take Baltimore
giving that four and a half in this game, per
my score that I gave you earlier. And the total
at 53 points, which that's a lot of scoring.
I'm going to take the under. on the points for
this one. I just don't see... I don't know that
I see the Lions. If the Lions win, I don't think...
I think they're gonna do it by limiting Baltimore
and keeping them off the board and off the field,
which would drive the points a little lower.
And I don't see the Lions putting up 52 in this
game against this defense. I think it'll be more
of a street fight. if the Lions actually win.
I could see Baltimore crushing them, but if that
happens, I don't see the Lions putting anything
on the board and Baltimore would be getting all
the points. Your thoughts? My thoughts are, I
agree with you on the under. I'm seeing, you
know, between 53 and 53 and a half. And both
of our predictions let us, I think your total
would have been 51 points. I think you said 31,
17. Oh no, so 48. And, uh, mine was a much lower
score than that, uh, 24 or 23. And I still kind
of like the Lions getting four and a half points.
I think the Lions too low, meaning that if I
wanted the Ravens, I'd. The Lions I'd want at
least plus seven plus seven and a half. You'd
want a tiny in there. Yeah Yeah, so, you know
some just interesting facts The Ravens have scored
the opening touchdown in one game out of two
that they've played so far each one of the touchdowns
on their Opening touchdown drive has been via
the air and the Ravens have not scored in the
first quarter a touchdown this year. So just
interesting stats if we want to go to the fantasy
angles Lamar Jackson is all world in fantasy.
And again, we talked about his unbelievable record
26 and two against the NFC. He was a plug and
play against any defense as far as I'm concerned.
I think if you had to look at the receivers and
tight ends for the Ravens, Zay Flowers is the
best bet. I don't know that DeAndre Hopkins or
Mark Andrews. is going to get you really what
you need, depending on who else you have out
there. And then Derek Henry is going to be feast
or famine. He's either going to have a 940 yards
or he's going to have 40. Yeah. 90 plus yards
and two touchdowns, or he's going to have 12
carries in, like you said, 40 yards and be a
bust. But you still have to start him if you
have him, because he's amazing. What do you think
of the Ravens wide receivers, though? Because
I'm kind of keying on Zay Flowers. Zay Flowers.
Do you think Zay is the guy? I think Zay is the
play. OK. All right. Very good. What about you?
Do you agree? I think DHOP could surprise in
this game, too. OK. I mean, I think Zay might
get the coverage. Who knows? I don't know that
I'm sold on Terry and Arnold being the lockdown
corner or anything. So he's going to get his
catches, but I'm wondering if DHOP blows up a
little bit in this game. Yeah, we'll see. We'll
see. And then Mark Andrews is battling some injuries.
He's up there in years as well. I would not start
him unless you had to. And Isaiah likely is battling
a foot injury. He is out. But everything that
I've heard listening to other pods reading is
that Isaiah likely is going to be the Starting
in main focus tight end. I don't think when he
gets healthy tight ends. I don't think the Baltimore
Titans are a player Yeah, so let's talk about
the Lions. Yep Jared Goff is complete and total
feast or famine I don't think he's gonna have
the fantasy outlook that he had last week So
I have three players that I would focus on if
you were focusing on the Lions number one would
be Amun Ra st. Brown. I think he's gonna still
have eight plus catches Don't know if he's going
to find the end zone, especially not three times
like he did last week, but he would be my go
-to. Like Lamar on the other side, he's the auto
-start on the Detroit side. Auto -start. And
then the second auto -start would be Jameer Gibbs.
He's going to get his. In terms of carries and
touches, I just don't know how... I disagree.
You? Okay, great. I disagree here. I like disagreements.
I think this is going to be a David Montgomery
game. Okay. All right. Well, we will see on that.
It's a little more smash mouth, a little more
of a physical running game for the Lions in this
game. So you think, I'm going with David Montgomery
over Gibbs in this one. So Knuckles gets more
carries and more touches. You know what's really
fascinating about the Lions backs is that not
only are they both complimentary to each other,
but they're both great at blocking. catching
and running the ball, which is so rare in today's
NFL. Something you notice about this Lions team,
and I think this comes from the coaching and
the way they build the team, they expect their
receivers and their backs to block and be good
at it. So you can't work in this offense if you
aren't good at blocking and doing those little
things. Tislaw is, I mean, part of the reason
they draft the guys because he's so physical
and good at that aspect of the game. Jameson
Williams is actually a great blocker. Out on
the edge, when these guys go out around the edge
and you got a wide receiver blocking, Williams
actually does a really good job of blocking,
which kind of, you know, maybe an unsung portion
of his repertoire. So my last fantasy play would
be if you have Sam Laporta. This is a game that
I can see him being a mismatch for the I agree.
Baltimore linebackers. Yeah, he obviously will
be brought into block, but that's primarily Brock
Wright's job Brocktober. So I can see Sam Laporta
also having a pretty big game. So Quan Smith
is a good middle linebacker and a good running.
defense linebacker. I don't know that they have
the pass coverage at the linebacker level to
keep up with Laporta. So that is an interesting
call. Can I go into just Lamar Jackson player
props briefly? Sure. Yeah. Okay. Give us some
player props. So his over under four passing
yards is 234 .5. I like that. I think I would
take the over on that. Because if they're down,
they're going to start throwing. And if they're
up, they're going to throw. Is it going to be
up because they're throwing? Okay. I disagree,
but that's, that's what's fun about this. His
rushing yard prop, the over -under is 44 .5.
I don't know that he's going to get that. I don't
think he gets that. Do you go under on that?
Okay. So I'm the exact opposite. Okay. I am going
under because he's averaging so far this year,
217 yards through the air. I know it's two games,
small sample size, and then I'm going to go over
the 44 and a half. He has not gone over his passing
yard total in this season. And he does have a
passing touchdown in both games and has had multiple
passing touchdowns. Last statistic, this is getting
away from Lamar Jackson, but the Lions are ranked
second in the NFL for scoring two touchdowns.
in the first quarter this year. So if they get
off to a quick start, it could be fantastic.
Optimistic for the Lions. Anything else you'd
like to add? I think we've covered it pretty
well here on the betting angles and the fantasy.
I don't have anything extra to throw in there.
I've got one more and it's Derrick Henry's rushing
yards over under is at 86 .5. We already talked
about it. He's either going to go well beyond
that. That's a boom or bust. I don't know that
it's a bet. I don't know that that's a prop I'm
putting any money on just because it could go
either way. I've been awful on player props.
He's in our idea to start things off. I don't
think we have enough sample size yet. I don't
know. That bet to me says - Take every, the opposite
of everything I give you guys, just take. Because
right now I've been terrible with it. Well that
one I'm just saying just send Vegas your your
yeah Just give them your whatever your your scene
out or whatever it is. You're putting on that
player prop All right. I do have a food. Yeah,
I asked you Do you have any picks to click in
the game before I get into the click my picks
to click for this game? I think that our defense
needs to have a good game as a whole our run
defense I'm not gonna I'm gonna go out and say
that yes Campbell needs to be effective, but
our line needs to stop the run at the line. We
need to have pressure and penetration. So DJ,
if Eric Henry gets to the linebackers, we're
in trouble because I don't see if I really don't
want to see our linebackers making tackles four
or five yards across the line of scrimmage. I
want to see him getting stuffed up at the line.
So if he gets the second level, we're in trouble
and the pressure on the quarterback. So the defense
is my number one pick to click. I know that sounds,
it's like a cheat because I picked the whole
damn defense, but okay. That's not picking the
punter. The other pick to click, the intermediate
yardage. We need to see Goff completing passes
to the likes of Laporta and Aman Ra, who's going
to be a part of the game regardless, probably.
But I wouldn't mind seeing Tisla. Get introduced
a little more an intermediate yardage. I feel
like he could be a very good possession receiver
He's got the size So we'll see if he can run
the route over the middle or if he's just good
on the fly pattern down the sideline We'll see
we'll see what happens. I like it coleslaw to
food And so I'm gonna do an extension of what
we talked about when the Tigers in our sister
podcast Detroit Tigers litter box We talked about
food in Baltimore's famous for two things primarily.
Crab cakes and natural bohemian beer. But they
also put old base seasoning on their french fries,
their crabs, their crab boils, their shrimp boils,
crab cakes. Chet, the question for you is...
How familiar are you with Old Bay and how do
you feel about it? I'm very familiar now because
you've gone through this before on our Tiger's
Pod when we played the Orioles. You did a deep
dive. Folks, go over to the Litterbox Detroit
Tigers podcast, find the Orioles game recap,
and you can hear Bill talk about his Old Bay
there. But I'm very familiar. It's a wonderful
seasoning for seafood. I'm less about seasoning
my seafood, though. I like to put some drawn
butter on my crab. And that's really how I go
with it. I don't know so much, like, about the
spices and whatnot. I'm not that into it. Yeah.
And I may be violating some Chesapeake Bay mandate.
I don't know. I just am not the biggest Old Bay
fan. And the balloon popped for me when I was
told to order crab fries. And I was expecting...
I had fries. A chin. It's basically fries with
Old Bay seasoning. Sounds delightful. Okay, but
I was don't ask me why I was expecting like tachos,
you know fries with like cold crab meat and maybe
like a You're about to say takis. By the way,
do you know what a taki is? Yeah, they give them
away. Yeah, they're spicy. I love them. Yeah
Post bowls game, but you're gonna try to compare
a crab fry to a taki, you know, never he's gonna
really we're really stretching the bounds here
two different spice levels. Okay So I agree with
a little bit of seasoning for a boil. I don't
necessarily like adding it to, and I thought
crab fries were going to be this wonderful, I
don't know, like crab topping on it or cheese
or something like that. And all it really was
was Old Bay. And I have to admit it was kind
of wah, wah, because I like to let the natural
crab meat do the work. Exactly. I'm not sure.
Like just a little drawn butter to bring some
out. Kind of, you know, I don't really need spices
on my seafood, especially my crustaceans, but
whatever, you know, maybe it's like if you have
bad crab meat. Is there bad crab meat? I'm sure
there's bad, like cheap crab meat. Like if you've
got a Long John Silver, do you need the spices
on the meats? Do they even have crab? I don't
think so. I think they just have clam. They have,
like, clam. And shrimp. And shrimp. It has to
be fried. Fried. It's like shrimp and clam. And
they fry it, and they put it in all sorts of
spices to hide the fact that it's seven years
old, probably. I don't know. All right. Go Lions.
And we'll be back with you to talk about this
post game and then preview the Cleveland Browns
upcoming next.