WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.480 Welcome back to the Deep Dive. I want to start 00:00:02.480 --> 00:00:05.299 today by asking you, the listener, to check in 00:00:05.299 --> 00:00:07.339 with your body for a second. And I mean, seriously, 00:00:07.500 --> 00:00:10.179 literally check in. Think about the last time 00:00:10.179 --> 00:00:12.599 you opened a news app, or maybe you clicked on 00:00:12.599 --> 00:00:15.099 a trending topic on X or whatever social media 00:00:15.099 --> 00:00:18.480 you use, and you saw an opinion that was just 00:00:18.480 --> 00:00:21.739 the exact opposite of yours. Oh, I know exactly 00:00:21.739 --> 00:00:23.960 where you're going with this. I feel it already. 00:00:24.219 --> 00:00:26.300 You do, right. It's not just an intellectual 00:00:26.300 --> 00:00:28.440 thought. It's not just, oh, I disagree with that 00:00:28.440 --> 00:00:31.480 policy. It's... physical. It's a tightness in 00:00:31.480 --> 00:00:32.979 the chest. Maybe your stomach drops a little 00:00:32.979 --> 00:00:35.119 bit. Your heart rate actually goes up. It feels, 00:00:35.179 --> 00:00:37.560 well, it feels dangerous. Right. It's the fight 00:00:37.560 --> 00:00:40.000 or flight response. Literally, your nervous system 00:00:40.000 --> 00:00:42.520 is reacting as if a tiger just walked into the 00:00:42.520 --> 00:00:45.159 room. Exactly. And we're so used to hearing that 00:00:45.159 --> 00:00:48.619 this is just. just how politics is in the 21st 00:00:48.619 --> 00:00:50.579 century. We're told it's because of polarization 00:00:50.579 --> 00:00:54.299 or the algorithms or, you know, fake news. And 00:00:54.299 --> 00:00:56.159 sure, those are the accelerants. But we have 00:00:56.159 --> 00:00:59.140 a stack of research today that suggests the fuel 00:00:59.140 --> 00:01:02.299 for this fire, the actual root cause, is something 00:01:02.299 --> 00:01:05.180 much, much deeper. It's about the very way we 00:01:05.180 --> 00:01:07.239 define who we are. It's about this concept we 00:01:07.239 --> 00:01:10.659 cling to called identity. And here is where it 00:01:10.659 --> 00:01:13.659 gets fascinating and honestly, a little confronting 00:01:13.659 --> 00:01:16.340 right out of the gate. The central thesis of 00:01:16.340 --> 00:01:18.459 the material we're diving into today, it's centered 00:01:18.459 --> 00:01:21.040 around an essay titled Idolatry of Identity. 00:01:21.549 --> 00:01:24.170 And it argues that the way we think about identity 00:01:24.170 --> 00:01:26.950 is actually a mistake. It's a category error. 00:01:27.150 --> 00:01:29.409 A category error. Yeah. It argues that we have 00:01:29.409 --> 00:01:32.569 taken these labels, race, party, nation, gender, 00:01:32.730 --> 00:01:34.750 and we've made them bear more weight than they 00:01:34.750 --> 00:01:36.849 can possibly hold. We have turned them effectively 00:01:36.849 --> 00:01:39.590 into idols. Idolatry of identity. That is, I 00:01:39.590 --> 00:01:41.450 mean, that's a heavy title. It sounds extremely 00:01:41.450 --> 00:01:43.750 biblical. And I have to ask right off the bat, 00:01:43.890 --> 00:01:46.530 isn't idolatry a bit of a loaded religious term 00:01:46.530 --> 00:01:48.489 for what is essentially a political and sociological 00:01:48.489 --> 00:01:51.819 discussion? It is entirely. intended to be loaded 00:01:51.819 --> 00:01:54.700 the authors are using it very specifically in 00:01:54.700 --> 00:01:56.819 a theological sense an idol isn't just a golden 00:01:56.819 --> 00:01:59.120 calf it's something finite that you treat as 00:01:59.120 --> 00:02:01.299 if it were infinite it's something created that 00:02:01.299 --> 00:02:03.640 you worship as the creator okay finite treated 00:02:03.640 --> 00:02:06.099 as infinite right and the argument here is that 00:02:06.099 --> 00:02:08.199 we are in a crisis not because we have identities 00:02:08.199 --> 00:02:10.560 obviously we have them but because we've elevated 00:02:10.560 --> 00:02:13.199 them to the status of gods we look to our political 00:02:13.199 --> 00:02:15.719 tribes or our social labels for our salvation 00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:19.060 our absolute worth our ultimate meaning and because 00:02:19.060 --> 00:02:22.219 they are just fragile human -made constructs, 00:02:22.219 --> 00:02:24.860 they are cracking under the pressure. That's 00:02:24.860 --> 00:02:26.500 the part I want to unpack right away. You said 00:02:26.500 --> 00:02:29.199 human -made constructs, because it feels like 00:02:29.199 --> 00:02:32.639 who I am, my identity, is the most natural, ancient, 00:02:32.840 --> 00:02:35.439 rock -solid thing in the world. But you're saying, 00:02:35.479 --> 00:02:38.099 based on this research, that identity as we know 00:02:38.099 --> 00:02:40.569 it is actually a modern invention. That is probably 00:02:40.569 --> 00:02:43.050 the biggest shocker in the research. We tend 00:02:43.050 --> 00:02:45.069 to think human beings have always walked around 00:02:45.069 --> 00:02:47.849 worrying about their identity. But the sources 00:02:47.849 --> 00:02:50.909 argue that a medieval peasant or a member of 00:02:50.909 --> 00:02:53.750 a classical Islamic polity or a Roman citizen, 00:02:54.009 --> 00:02:56.830 they didn't have an identity crisis in the way 00:02:56.830 --> 00:02:58.330 we do. They didn't have to go find themselves. 00:02:58.610 --> 00:03:00.729 Wait, so if I'm a peasant in 12th century France, 00:03:00.990 --> 00:03:04.240 I don't have an identity. Not in the modern sense. 00:03:04.319 --> 00:03:07.099 You have a role. You have a place. And that's 00:03:07.099 --> 00:03:08.979 the journey we're going on today. We are going 00:03:08.979 --> 00:03:11.900 to look at how we invented the modern self, how 00:03:11.900 --> 00:03:14.500 that invention has been weaponized into the polarization 00:03:14.500 --> 00:03:18.020 we hate. And then, and this is the really ambitious 00:03:18.020 --> 00:03:20.800 part of the deep dive, we are going to see if 00:03:20.800 --> 00:03:23.360 ancient religious traditions offer us a way out. 00:03:23.460 --> 00:03:25.580 And just to be clear for the listener, because 00:03:25.580 --> 00:03:27.379 we're bringing up religion and ancient traditions, 00:03:27.599 --> 00:03:30.199 this isn't a sermon. We aren't here to convert 00:03:30.199 --> 00:03:32.800 anyone today. Not at all. We are looking at these 00:03:32.800 --> 00:03:36.120 traditions, Islam, Hinduism, Jainism, Judaism, 00:03:36.500 --> 00:03:39.159 Christianity, as deep reservoirs of psychology 00:03:39.159 --> 00:03:42.099 and sociology. These are systems that have spent 00:03:42.099 --> 00:03:44.500 thousands of years thinking about the human ego, 00:03:44.699 --> 00:03:47.900 the self, and community. The argument is that 00:03:47.900 --> 00:03:49.879 they might have the intellectual tools to repair 00:03:49.879 --> 00:03:53.259 our broken politics. Tools that secular liberalism 00:03:53.259 --> 00:03:56.430 just doesn't have in its current toolkit. So 00:03:56.430 --> 00:03:58.830 the mission is to figure out why we are so angry 00:03:58.830 --> 00:04:01.689 at each other and how ancient wisdom might fix 00:04:01.689 --> 00:04:04.050 it. Let's start with that history lesson. You 00:04:04.050 --> 00:04:06.629 said identity is invented. Take us back to that 00:04:06.629 --> 00:04:09.009 medieval peasant. Right. To understand this, 00:04:09.069 --> 00:04:10.590 we have to look at the work of the philosopher 00:04:10.590 --> 00:04:13.189 Charles Taylor. He wrote this massive, dense 00:04:13.189 --> 00:04:15.669 book called Sources of the Self. It's a complete 00:04:15.669 --> 00:04:18.250 doorstop, but it's brilliant. Taylor draws a 00:04:18.250 --> 00:04:20.310 fundamental distinction between the pre -modern 00:04:20.310 --> 00:04:22.589 self and the modern self. Okay, set the scene 00:04:22.589 --> 00:04:24.069 for the pre -modern. So imagine you are that 00:04:24.069 --> 00:04:26.730 peasant in 12th century France. You do not wake 00:04:26.730 --> 00:04:28.569 up in the morning wondering, who am I, really? 00:04:28.730 --> 00:04:30.930 You don't take a personality test. You don't 00:04:30.930 --> 00:04:33.389 curate a bio. Your identity is given to you. 00:04:33.529 --> 00:04:36.500 Given by whom? By your circumstances. by your 00:04:36.500 --> 00:04:39.240 family, your guild, your village, and ultimately 00:04:39.240 --> 00:04:42.939 by the cosmos or God. You are the son of John. 00:04:43.019 --> 00:04:44.939 You are a blacksmith. You are a subject of the 00:04:44.939 --> 00:04:47.519 king. You are a child of the church. Your place 00:04:47.519 --> 00:04:49.800 in the hierarchy is fixed. It's external to you. 00:04:50.480 --> 00:04:53.680 Taylor calls this the porous self. Porous, meaning 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:55.779 things pass through it. Yes, meaning you are 00:04:55.779 --> 00:04:58.350 open to the world. The meaning of your life comes 00:04:58.350 --> 00:05:00.170 from outside of you, from the spiritual world, 00:05:00.230 --> 00:05:02.850 from the community structure. You are a node 00:05:02.850 --> 00:05:05.509 in a network that already exists. You don't have 00:05:05.509 --> 00:05:07.649 to invent the network. That sounds, well, on 00:05:07.649 --> 00:05:09.430 the one hand, incredibly restrictive. You're 00:05:09.430 --> 00:05:11.589 stuck. If you're born a blacksmith's son, you're 00:05:11.589 --> 00:05:13.689 a blacksmith. There's no upward mobility, no 00:05:13.689 --> 00:05:15.949 following your dreams. Absolutely. It was incredibly 00:05:15.949 --> 00:05:18.389 restrictive. But, and Taylor makes a huge point 00:05:18.389 --> 00:05:20.350 of this, it was also psychologically restful. 00:05:20.670 --> 00:05:23.529 Yes. You didn't have the anxiety of definition. 00:05:23.769 --> 00:05:26.029 You didn't have to constantly prove your existence 00:05:26.029 --> 00:05:28.810 or your validity. Because your existence was 00:05:28.810 --> 00:05:31.649 an objective fact of society, you fit. Okay, 00:05:31.730 --> 00:05:34.410 I can see that. There's a certain safety in knowing 00:05:34.410 --> 00:05:36.970 your exact place. But we obviously don't live 00:05:36.970 --> 00:05:38.730 there anymore. We don't want to live there. What 00:05:38.730 --> 00:05:42.670 changed? Modernity. The Enlightenment. The Romantic 00:05:42.670 --> 00:05:46.720 Era. Taylor describes this massive shift as radical 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:49.160 reflexivity. Radical reflexivity. Break that 00:05:49.160 --> 00:05:52.180 down for us. It's the turn inward. Think about 00:05:52.180 --> 00:05:55.040 Descartes, I think, therefore I am. Think about 00:05:55.040 --> 00:05:57.399 the romantics who believed you had to find your 00:05:57.399 --> 00:06:00.699 unique inner voice. The source of meaning moves 00:06:00.699 --> 00:06:02.819 from the outside world, the stars, the king, 00:06:02.959 --> 00:06:05.939 the church, to the inside of your own head. The 00:06:05.939 --> 00:06:08.449 self becomes a project. So instead of looking 00:06:08.449 --> 00:06:10.569 at the stars to know who I am, I look into my 00:06:10.569 --> 00:06:13.769 own feelings. Precisely. And this is a massive 00:06:13.769 --> 00:06:16.149 shift in human history. Identity stops being 00:06:16.149 --> 00:06:17.930 something you receive and starts being something 00:06:17.930 --> 00:06:19.949 you construct. You have to discover your inner 00:06:19.949 --> 00:06:22.069 truth, interpret it, and then, and this is the 00:06:22.069 --> 00:06:24.269 crucial part for our politics, express it to 00:06:24.269 --> 00:06:26.209 the world. Express yourself. That is the ultimate 00:06:26.209 --> 00:06:29.209 modern mantra. It is. But this creates a totally 00:06:29.209 --> 00:06:31.610 new problem that the medieval peasant never had 00:06:31.610 --> 00:06:34.129 to deal with. Taylor calls it the politics of 00:06:34.129 --> 00:06:36.860 recognition. Recognition. Okay, explain that 00:06:36.860 --> 00:06:38.759 mechanism. How does that work? Well, think about 00:06:38.759 --> 00:06:41.560 it. If my identity is given by the village, if 00:06:41.560 --> 00:06:43.939 I am the blacksmith, I don't need you to validate 00:06:43.939 --> 00:06:46.339 me. Everyone sees the anvil. Everyone knows who 00:06:46.339 --> 00:06:48.759 I am. It's an objective fact. But if my identity 00:06:48.759 --> 00:06:50.959 is something I discovered inside myself, something 00:06:50.959 --> 00:06:54.259 unique, personal, maybe a little fragile, then 00:06:54.259 --> 00:06:57.019 it's invisible to you unless I express it. And 00:06:57.019 --> 00:06:59.199 once I express it, I desperately need you to 00:06:59.199 --> 00:07:02.339 confirm it. Yeah. So I need you to say, yes, 00:07:02.360 --> 00:07:06.240 I see you. Your identity is valid. Exactly. If 00:07:06.240 --> 00:07:09.040 you ignore me or if you misrecognize me, if you 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:11.560 use the wrong label or you mock my inner truth, 00:07:11.779 --> 00:07:13.439 it doesn't just feel like you're being rude. 00:07:13.540 --> 00:07:15.279 It feels like you are erasing my very existence. 00:07:16.349 --> 00:07:18.889 Taylor argues that because identity is now constructed 00:07:18.889 --> 00:07:21.470 internally but formed in dialogue with others, 00:07:21.689 --> 00:07:24.389 we have developed an insatiable need for external 00:07:24.389 --> 00:07:26.629 validation. That resonates so much with the social 00:07:26.629 --> 00:07:28.649 media age. It's not enough to just be something. 00:07:28.750 --> 00:07:30.990 I have to post about it. And if I post it and 00:07:30.990 --> 00:07:33.310 get zero likes or if people criticize it in the 00:07:33.310 --> 00:07:35.829 comments, I feel this crushing weight. It's not 00:07:35.829 --> 00:07:37.790 just embarrassment. It feels like an existential 00:07:37.790 --> 00:07:40.910 crisis. It is exhausting. We've created a world 00:07:40.910 --> 00:07:43.290 where everyone is walking around holding a fragile 00:07:43.290 --> 00:07:46.350 glass sculpture of their own ego. go, basically 00:07:46.350 --> 00:07:49.470 begging everyone else not to drop it. But hold 00:07:49.470 --> 00:07:52.930 on a second. Is this just about us being sensitive, 00:07:53.129 --> 00:07:56.350 you know, snowflakes? Or is there something philosophical 00:07:56.350 --> 00:07:58.769 missing here? Because it feels like we've also 00:07:58.769 --> 00:08:01.689 lost the ability to even argue about what's good 00:08:01.689 --> 00:08:03.730 or bad in the public square. You hit the nail 00:08:03.730 --> 00:08:06.050 on the head. That brings us to the second pillar 00:08:06.050 --> 00:08:08.970 of our history lesson here, the work of Alistair 00:08:08.970 --> 00:08:12.329 McIntyre and his book After Virtue. McIntyre 00:08:12.329 --> 00:08:15.470 argues that that period where we embraced reason 00:08:15.470 --> 00:08:17.949 and science actually broke our moral compass 00:08:17.949 --> 00:08:20.490 entirely. How so? I thought the Enlightenment 00:08:20.490 --> 00:08:22.550 was supposed to liberate us from superstitions. 00:08:22.829 --> 00:08:25.100 Reason was supposed to fix everything. Give us 00:08:25.100 --> 00:08:27.779 a solid foundation. It tried to. The Enlightenment 00:08:27.779 --> 00:08:30.180 thinkers tried to base morality on pure reason 00:08:30.180 --> 00:08:32.759 alone. They wanted to discard the old superstitions 00:08:32.759 --> 00:08:35.500 about God or cosmic order. But McIntyre says 00:08:35.500 --> 00:08:37.860 they failed because they discarded a vital concept 00:08:37.860 --> 00:08:40.460 called teleology. Teleology. That comes from 00:08:40.460 --> 00:08:42.779 the Greek word telos, right? Meaning purpose. 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:47.159 Right. Telos means the end or the goal or the 00:08:47.159 --> 00:08:49.620 purpose of a thing. Let's use a really simple 00:08:49.620 --> 00:08:53.860 example. A watch. What is the talos of a watch? 00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:57.000 To tell time accurately. Correct. Because you 00:08:57.000 --> 00:08:59.299 know the talos of a watch, you can make an objective 00:08:59.299 --> 00:09:01.940 moral statement about it. You can say, this is 00:09:01.940 --> 00:09:04.100 a good watch if it keeps time, or this is a bad 00:09:04.100 --> 00:09:06.860 watch if it's slow. The goodness is defined by 00:09:06.860 --> 00:09:09.720 how well it fulfills its inherent purpose. Okay, 00:09:09.779 --> 00:09:11.559 that makes total sense for a machine or a tool. 00:09:12.000 --> 00:09:14.019 Well, in the pre -modern world, we believed human 00:09:14.019 --> 00:09:16.919 beings had a telos too. Maybe it was to glorify 00:09:16.919 --> 00:09:19.460 God or to live in accordance with nature or to 00:09:19.460 --> 00:09:22.399 serve the polis in ancient Greece. Because we 00:09:22.399 --> 00:09:24.620 had a shared definition of what a human was for, 00:09:24.860 --> 00:09:27.100 we could agree on what a good human was. We could 00:09:27.100 --> 00:09:29.039 agree on virtues. But we don't agree on what 00:09:29.039 --> 00:09:31.259 humans are for anymore. Exactly. Science doesn't 00:09:31.259 --> 00:09:33.320 do telos. Science tells you how the mechanism 00:09:33.320 --> 00:09:35.120 works, not what the purpose of the mechanism 00:09:35.120 --> 00:09:37.899 is. We discarded the idea of a shared purpose. 00:09:38.000 --> 00:09:41.710 So now we are left with moral rules. Don't kill, 00:09:41.889 --> 00:09:45.110 be free, treat people fairly, but we have no 00:09:45.110 --> 00:09:49.210 context for why. McIntyre calls the result emotivism. 00:09:49.470 --> 00:09:51.909 Emotivism. That sounds like acting on your emotions. 00:09:52.230 --> 00:09:54.629 Essentially, yes. It's the philosophical view 00:09:54.629 --> 00:09:57.269 that all moral claims like abortion is wrong, 00:09:57.409 --> 00:10:00.490 freedom is good, taxation is theft, are actually 00:10:00.490 --> 00:10:02.649 nothing more than expressions of personal preference. 00:10:03.129 --> 00:10:05.629 It's like saying, I like vanilla ice cream, but 00:10:05.629 --> 00:10:07.789 we dress it up in fancy language to sound like 00:10:07.789 --> 00:10:10.779 objective truth. So when I say this policy is 00:10:10.779 --> 00:10:13.259 unjust, I'm not actually stating a fact about 00:10:13.259 --> 00:10:16.200 the universe. I'm just saying, boo, I don't like 00:10:16.200 --> 00:10:19.600 this. According to McIntyre, that is exactly 00:10:19.600 --> 00:10:22.279 how our public discourse functions now. We shout 00:10:22.279 --> 00:10:24.279 justice and rights at each other. But because 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:26.759 we have no shared standard of truth or purpose 00:10:26.759 --> 00:10:29.740 to adjudicate the argument, we are just shouting 00:10:29.740 --> 00:10:31.919 our emotional preferences. And this connects 00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:34.850 back to identity. How exactly? Well. If we can't 00:10:34.850 --> 00:10:36.509 agree on what is true or what is the purpose 00:10:36.509 --> 00:10:39.009 of life, we retreat to the only thing we have 00:10:39.009 --> 00:10:42.750 left. Who I am. Identity replaces truth as the 00:10:42.750 --> 00:10:45.289 basis for political argument. I can't prove I'm 00:10:45.289 --> 00:10:47.649 right based on a universal standard, so I claim 00:10:47.649 --> 00:10:49.990 that my identity demands this view. As a blank, 00:10:50.169 --> 00:10:52.789 I believe this. And if you disagree with me, 00:10:52.929 --> 00:10:55.169 you aren't just disagreeing with my logic. You 00:10:55.169 --> 00:10:57.529 are attacking me. You are attacking my existence. 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:00.559 Bingo. And that seems to be where all the anger 00:11:00.559 --> 00:11:03.039 comes from. If we're just debating tax rates 00:11:03.039 --> 00:11:05.080 and we both agree the goal is economic growth, 00:11:05.440 --> 00:11:08.500 that's a math problem. We can solve math. We 00:11:08.500 --> 00:11:11.120 can look at data. But if we're debating my identity, 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:15.240 my existence, my recognition, that's a war. And 00:11:15.240 --> 00:11:17.200 this brings us to the weaponization of identity. 00:11:17.800 --> 00:11:20.919 Because it's not just that we are isolated individuals 00:11:20.919 --> 00:11:24.039 wandering around with these fragile selves. We 00:11:24.039 --> 00:11:27.340 are clumping into tribes. Huge tribes. This is 00:11:27.340 --> 00:11:29.399 where we get into the work of Liliana Mason, 00:11:29.539 --> 00:11:32.559 specifically her book Uncivil Agreement. I found 00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:34.500 this part of the deep dive totally fascinating 00:11:34.500 --> 00:11:37.740 because she uses hard data to explain why politics 00:11:37.740 --> 00:11:40.580 feels so much more toxic now than it did 50 years 00:11:40.580 --> 00:11:42.700 ago. She uses the term social sorting, right? 00:11:42.860 --> 00:11:45.110 Yes. Social sorting. Explain that. Because I 00:11:45.110 --> 00:11:46.929 think people assume we've always been fiercely 00:11:46.929 --> 00:11:49.289 divided. We have, but the structure of the division 00:11:49.289 --> 00:11:51.789 was entirely different. Imagine the U .S. in 00:11:51.789 --> 00:11:54.250 the 1960s or 70s. You might be a Republican, 00:11:54.389 --> 00:11:56.909 but you might also be a union member. You might 00:11:56.909 --> 00:11:58.929 be a Catholic living in the Northeast. Okay, 00:11:59.009 --> 00:12:01.529 I'm picturing that guy. Now, generally, unions 00:12:01.529 --> 00:12:04.629 leaned Democrat, but you're a Republican, so 00:12:04.629 --> 00:12:06.509 your identities are cross -cutting. You have 00:12:06.509 --> 00:12:08.190 friends at the union hall who are Democrats, 00:12:08.350 --> 00:12:10.470 but you agree on labor issues. You have friends 00:12:10.470 --> 00:12:12.950 at church who are Democrats, but you agree on 00:12:12.950 --> 00:12:16.379 theology. Your Republican -ness was just one 00:12:16.379 --> 00:12:19.399 slice of your pie. It didn't consume the whole 00:12:19.399 --> 00:12:23.240 thing. So I had social pressure to not hate Democrats 00:12:23.240 --> 00:12:26.000 because my bowling partner was a Democrat. We 00:12:26.000 --> 00:12:27.740 had other things keeping us together. Exactly. 00:12:27.820 --> 00:12:30.659 You had overlapping circles of belonging. But 00:12:30.659 --> 00:12:33.419 Mason shows that over the last few decades, these 00:12:33.419 --> 00:12:35.960 identities have sorted. They have stacked up 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:38.080 on top of each other. Stacked up how? What does 00:12:38.080 --> 00:12:40.100 that look like today? Today, if you tell me your 00:12:40.100 --> 00:12:42.419 political party, I can probably guess your religion, 00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:44.720 your race, whether you live in a city or the 00:12:44.720 --> 00:12:47.240 country, what kind of car you drive, and even 00:12:47.240 --> 00:12:49.759 what grocery store you shop at. The circles have 00:12:49.759 --> 00:12:52.559 all merged into one giant circle. We've created 00:12:52.559 --> 00:12:55.120 what the source calls the mega identity. The 00:12:55.120 --> 00:12:58.159 mega identity. And the stakes go through the 00:12:58.159 --> 00:13:01.559 absolute roof. Because now, if our party loses 00:13:01.559 --> 00:13:04.159 an election, it's not just that my taxes might 00:13:04.159 --> 00:13:07.289 go up. It feels like my religion, my culture, 00:13:07.450 --> 00:13:10.330 my race, and my geographic way of life have all 00:13:10.330 --> 00:13:13.090 been rejected by the country. It feels like an 00:13:13.090 --> 00:13:15.629 existential referendum on me. And the data backs 00:13:15.629 --> 00:13:17.850 this up in a terrifying way. There was a study 00:13:17.850 --> 00:13:21.090 by Iyengar and Westwood in 2015 that the source 00:13:21.090 --> 00:13:23.629 cites. They found that partisan discrimination 00:13:23.629 --> 00:13:26.509 in the U .S. now exceeds racial discrimination. 00:13:26.870 --> 00:13:28.809 Wait, say that again? That is a massive claim. 00:13:28.889 --> 00:13:30.789 Partisan discrimination is higher than racial 00:13:30.789 --> 00:13:33.129 discrimination. In experimental settings, yes. 00:13:33.950 --> 00:13:36.309 They gave people resumes to review for a scholarship 00:13:36.309 --> 00:13:39.129 or a job. They found that people were significantly 00:13:39.129 --> 00:13:41.330 more likely to discriminate against someone from 00:13:41.330 --> 00:13:43.129 the opposing political party than against someone 00:13:43.129 --> 00:13:46.289 of a different race. That is wild. But if you 00:13:46.289 --> 00:13:48.889 think about it, we have very strong social norms 00:13:48.889 --> 00:13:50.809 that say do not be racist. You get fired for 00:13:50.809 --> 00:13:53.309 being racist. But we have absolutely no social 00:13:53.309 --> 00:13:54.950 norms that say don't hate the other political 00:13:54.950 --> 00:13:57.320 party. In fact, you get rewarded for it. It's 00:13:57.320 --> 00:14:00.059 social currency. It's the last acceptable prejudice. 00:14:00.259 --> 00:14:02.639 It allows us to vent all that tribal aggression 00:14:02.639 --> 00:14:04.879 that we can't use elsewhere. So we have these 00:14:04.879 --> 00:14:09.000 mega identities and they are fueled by this insatiable 00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:11.080 need for recognition that Taylor talked about. 00:14:11.659 --> 00:14:14.039 Francis Fukuyama has a term for this in the research, 00:14:14.120 --> 00:14:16.700 right? Yes. In his book Identity, he talks about 00:14:16.700 --> 00:14:18.960 thymos. It's a concept originally from Plato. 00:14:19.179 --> 00:14:21.820 It refers to the part of the soul that craves 00:14:21.820 --> 00:14:24.659 recognition and dignity. Fukuyama says there 00:14:24.659 --> 00:14:27.639 are two types. There is isothemia. Isothemia, 00:14:27.799 --> 00:14:30.700 like an isosceles triangle. Equal. Right. The 00:14:30.700 --> 00:14:33.259 desire to be recognized as equal. I am just as 00:14:33.259 --> 00:14:36.240 good as you. This is the basis of the civil rights 00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:40.539 movement, feminism. Gay rights. It's the drive 00:14:40.539 --> 00:14:42.879 for equal dignity. And that's good. We want that 00:14:42.879 --> 00:14:45.519 in democracy. But there's a dark side. But Fukuyama 00:14:45.519 --> 00:14:47.919 warns that isothemia has a very dangerous tendency 00:14:47.919 --> 00:14:50.419 to slide into megalothemia. Megalothemia. That 00:14:50.419 --> 00:14:52.789 sounds like a Godzilla villain. It's the desire 00:14:52.789 --> 00:14:56.269 to be recognized as superior, to have your group 00:14:56.269 --> 00:14:58.690 acknowledged not just as equal, but as the best, 00:14:58.769 --> 00:15:01.830 the real Americans, the enlightened ones, the 00:15:01.830 --> 00:15:04.210 chosen ones. When you combine the mega identity 00:15:04.210 --> 00:15:07.149 with megalithemia, you get a recipe for civil 00:15:07.149 --> 00:15:10.210 conflict. You get a zero -sum game where my dignity 00:15:10.210 --> 00:15:13.070 practically requires your humiliation. The irony, 00:15:13.370 --> 00:15:15.190 and this is the part that might upset some people, 00:15:15.230 --> 00:15:16.669 but we have to go there to understand the source 00:15:16.669 --> 00:15:18.970 material, is that the things we are fighting 00:15:18.970 --> 00:15:21.370 over, these categories, might not even... be 00:15:21.370 --> 00:15:23.330 as real as we think they are this is the core 00:15:23.330 --> 00:15:26.409 paradox of the whole thing kwame anthony appear 00:15:26.409 --> 00:15:29.389 wrote a book called the lies that bind he argues 00:15:29.389 --> 00:15:31.370 that we are ready to go to war for categories 00:15:31.370 --> 00:15:34.029 that are in his words riddled with contradictions 00:15:34.029 --> 00:15:36.809 take race for example right now we have to be 00:15:36.809 --> 00:15:39.909 very careful here racism is incredibly real the 00:15:39.909 --> 00:15:42.750 sociological effects of race are undeniably real 00:15:42.750 --> 00:15:45.809 absolutely sociologically historically race is 00:15:45.809 --> 00:15:49.409 a massive reality with massive consequences but 00:15:49.409 --> 00:15:52.970 apia is talking about biology and ontology. He 00:15:52.970 --> 00:15:55.909 points out a stunning fact. 90 % of genetic variation 00:15:55.909 --> 00:15:58.370 in humans exists within racial groups, not between 00:15:58.370 --> 00:16:00.950 them. Meaning there's more genetic difference 00:16:00.950 --> 00:16:03.929 between two random white guys than between the 00:16:03.929 --> 00:16:06.029 average white guy and the average black guy. 00:16:06.169 --> 00:16:09.470 Often, yes. Biologically, race is not a coherent 00:16:09.470 --> 00:16:12.590 category. It's a sloppy historical shorthand 00:16:12.590 --> 00:16:15.950 we invented based on superficial traits. Or take 00:16:15.950 --> 00:16:19.440 nationality. Most modern nations are very recent 00:16:19.440 --> 00:16:21.919 inventions, or religion traditions are internally 00:16:21.919 --> 00:16:25.019 fractured with thousands of sects. But we treat 00:16:25.019 --> 00:16:28.220 these fluid sociological constructions as if 00:16:28.220 --> 00:16:31.259 they are fixed, hard realities. We treat them 00:16:31.259 --> 00:16:34.159 as ontological, as the very ground of our being. 00:16:34.360 --> 00:16:36.360 That's the idolatry part from the title. We've 00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:38.940 taken a costume that society handed us, and we've 00:16:38.940 --> 00:16:41.500 convinced ourselves it's our actual skin. Precisely. 00:16:41.789 --> 00:16:43.190 We've forgotten that we made these categories 00:16:43.190 --> 00:16:45.470 up. And because we treat them as fixed gods, 00:16:45.690 --> 00:16:47.950 we are trapped in them. We worship the label. 00:16:48.129 --> 00:16:50.610 So let's take a breath and look at the diagnosis 00:16:50.610 --> 00:16:53.549 we have so far. We have a modern self that is 00:16:53.549 --> 00:16:56.190 anxious, turned inward, and desperate for external 00:16:56.190 --> 00:16:59.009 validation. We have lost our shared moral language, 00:16:59.049 --> 00:17:00.649 so we just shout our feelings at each other. 00:17:00.750 --> 00:17:03.230 We have stacked our identities into megatribes. 00:17:03.230 --> 00:17:05.450 And we are worshiping these tribes as if they 00:17:05.450 --> 00:17:08.119 are the ultimate biological truth. That is the 00:17:08.119 --> 00:17:11.359 incredibly bleak picture. It is bleak. If this 00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:13.799 were a standard political show, this is where 00:17:13.799 --> 00:17:15.519 we would say, so vote for this candidate, they'll 00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:18.660 fix it or pass this law. But the source material 00:17:18.660 --> 00:17:22.599 strongly suggests that politics cannot fix this 00:17:22.599 --> 00:17:25.839 because politics is just the symptom. The cure 00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:28.279 has to go much deeper. Into the spiritual and 00:17:28.279 --> 00:17:30.799 psychological. Yeah. And again, not in a thoughts 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:33.700 and prayers kind of way, but in a let's deconstruct 00:17:33.700 --> 00:17:36.180 the human psyche kind of way. The argument is 00:17:36.180 --> 00:17:38.200 that ancient spiritual traditions have actually 00:17:38.200 --> 00:17:42.200 known about this idolatry of the self for millennia. 00:17:42.200 --> 00:17:44.019 They have. They've been essentially debugging 00:17:44.019 --> 00:17:46.720 the human operating system for 3 ,000 years. 00:17:47.019 --> 00:17:50.279 And they offer a profound corrective. If the 00:17:50.279 --> 00:17:52.740 problem is a rigid, constructed self that demands 00:17:52.740 --> 00:17:55.420 constant worship and validation, the solution 00:17:55.420 --> 00:17:57.640 is to realize that this rigid self is an illusion. 00:17:58.250 --> 00:17:59.910 Let's start with the East. I was really struck 00:17:59.910 --> 00:18:02.269 by the section on Islam and the research, specifically 00:18:02.269 --> 00:18:04.170 the Sufi tradition. They have a concept called 00:18:04.170 --> 00:18:07.170 the nafs. The nafs. It's usually translated into 00:18:07.170 --> 00:18:10.650 English as the ego or the lower self. But what 00:18:10.650 --> 00:18:13.690 I love about the Sufi perspective is that the 00:18:13.690 --> 00:18:16.609 self isn't a statue. It isn't a fixed thing you 00:18:16.609 --> 00:18:19.170 have to defend. It's a process. It's incredibly 00:18:19.170 --> 00:18:22.660 fluid. So I'm not just one thing forever. I don't 00:18:22.660 --> 00:18:25.799 have a true self I have to protect. No. The Quran 00:18:25.799 --> 00:18:28.859 describes stages of the self. It's almost like 00:18:28.859 --> 00:18:31.160 a developmental ladder you climb. You start at 00:18:31.160 --> 00:18:33.559 the bottom with nafs al -amara. The commanding 00:18:33.559 --> 00:18:35.859 self. Right. This is the self that commands you 00:18:35.859 --> 00:18:38.440 to do evil or just gives in to base desires. 00:18:38.759 --> 00:18:41.819 It's pure impulse, pure ego. It's the toddler 00:18:41.819 --> 00:18:44.160 in your brain screaming, I want. It's the part 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:46.200 of you that wants to dunk on someone on Twitter 00:18:46.200 --> 00:18:48.160 because it feels really good in the moment to 00:18:48.160 --> 00:18:50.660 be superior. We've all been there. It does feel 00:18:50.660 --> 00:18:52.240 good in the moment. We all live there sometimes. 00:18:52.519 --> 00:18:55.720 But then, ideally, you mature and move to Nafs 00:18:55.720 --> 00:18:57.900 al -Awamah, the self -blaming conscience. This 00:18:57.900 --> 00:19:00.500 is when you realize you messed up. You feel guilt. 00:19:00.559 --> 00:19:02.519 You look at your own anger online and say, you 00:19:02.519 --> 00:19:04.700 know, that wasn't the real me. I can do better. 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:08.299 And the final goal. The goal is to reach Nafs 00:19:08.299 --> 00:19:11.700 al -Mumain, the soul, at peace. And ultimately, 00:19:11.859 --> 00:19:15.640 in Sufism, the ultimate spiritual goal is Fana. 00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:18.180 Fana. That translates to annihilation, right? 00:19:18.779 --> 00:19:21.039 That sounds terrifying to a modern person. It 00:19:21.039 --> 00:19:23.440 sounds totally scary to the modern ear because 00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:25.420 we are so obsessed with preserving ourselves, 00:19:25.579 --> 00:19:28.440 recognizing ourselves. But fauna isn't destruction 00:19:28.440 --> 00:19:31.579 in a violent or nihilistic sense. It's the passing 00:19:31.579 --> 00:19:34.440 away of the ego. It's the deep realization that 00:19:34.440 --> 00:19:37.119 I am not the center of the universe. It's just 00:19:37.119 --> 00:19:39.619 getting over yourself. Exactly. William Chittick, 00:19:39.720 --> 00:19:41.839 who is a great scholar of Sufism, has this wonderful 00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:44.940 quote in the material. Each moment of the self 00:19:44.940 --> 00:19:48.079 is unique. It liberates you. If the self is fluid, 00:19:48.259 --> 00:19:50.400 changing every single moment in relation to God 00:19:50.400 --> 00:19:52.259 and the world, then you don't have to defend 00:19:52.259 --> 00:19:55.180 a giant, rigid fortress of me. That is actually 00:19:55.180 --> 00:19:57.180 very freeing. If I mess up or if someone attacks 00:19:57.180 --> 00:19:59.400 my identity, I can say, well, that was just a 00:19:59.400 --> 00:20:01.519 fleeting state. That label isn't my soul. I don't 00:20:01.519 --> 00:20:03.500 have to burn the world down to defend it. It 00:20:03.500 --> 00:20:05.599 loosens the grip of the idol. It turns the idol 00:20:05.599 --> 00:20:08.299 back into dust. Now, Hinduism does something 00:20:08.299 --> 00:20:10.059 very similar, but it uses a different metaphor. 00:20:10.740 --> 00:20:14.069 The costume. The actor and the role. This comes 00:20:14.069 --> 00:20:15.910 from the Gita, doesn't it? Yes, the Bhagavad 00:20:15.910 --> 00:20:18.789 Gita and the Upanishads. They draw a very sharp, 00:20:18.809 --> 00:20:21.750 clear distinction between the Atman, the eternal 00:20:21.750 --> 00:20:24.670 self, the unchanging spark of the divine inside 00:20:24.670 --> 00:20:27.890 you, and the empirical self. The empirical self 00:20:27.890 --> 00:20:30.910 being your body, your caste, your job, your gender, 00:20:31.109 --> 00:20:33.490 your political party. Exactly. And the empirical 00:20:33.490 --> 00:20:36.170 self, the political party, the job, the social 00:20:36.170 --> 00:20:39.349 status, that's all part of Maya. Maya. Illusion. 00:20:39.529 --> 00:20:42.460 Maya. Illusion. Now, illusion doesn't mean it 00:20:42.460 --> 00:20:44.940 doesn't exist. The traffic jam is real. The election 00:20:44.940 --> 00:20:47.380 is real. It means it's not the ultimate reality. 00:20:47.660 --> 00:20:50.680 It's a cosmic play. Imagine you are a method 00:20:50.680 --> 00:20:53.400 actor on Broadway. You're playing a king. You 00:20:53.400 --> 00:20:55.220 wear the crown. You give the orders. You feel 00:20:55.220 --> 00:20:57.299 the power of the scene. But deep down, you have 00:20:57.299 --> 00:20:59.859 to know, I am not actually the king. I am the 00:20:59.859 --> 00:21:01.720 actor playing the king. I have to take the crown 00:21:01.720 --> 00:21:04.539 off and go home. But in our modern politics, 00:21:04.700 --> 00:21:07.400 we've completely forgotten we're actors. We think 00:21:07.400 --> 00:21:09.950 the costume is super glued to our skin. We think 00:21:09.950 --> 00:21:12.650 we are the role. And that's exactly why we fight 00:21:12.650 --> 00:21:15.069 so viciously. Because if the costume is all I 00:21:15.069 --> 00:21:17.410 have, if my political label is my entire existence, 00:21:17.789 --> 00:21:20.470 then an attack on the costume is a lethal attack 00:21:20.470 --> 00:21:23.630 on my existence. If my party loses the election, 00:21:23.950 --> 00:21:26.509 I psychologically die. So the spiritual practice 00:21:26.509 --> 00:21:28.970 here is to wake up on stage. To wake up and realize, 00:21:29.210 --> 00:21:32.009 I am playing the role of a Democrat, or I am 00:21:32.009 --> 00:21:33.990 playing the role of a conservative. And I will 00:21:33.990 --> 00:21:36.410 play it well. I will fight for justice as I see 00:21:36.410 --> 00:21:39.460 it. But I know that the person across the stage 00:21:39.460 --> 00:21:43.279 from me, the quote unquote villain, is also just 00:21:43.279 --> 00:21:46.160 an actor. They have the same eternal Atman. The 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:48.039 Gita has a beautiful line about this, the equal 00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:50.579 vision. Yes. It says the wise person sees with 00:21:50.579 --> 00:21:53.579 equal vision a Brahmin, a priest, a cow, an elephant 00:21:53.579 --> 00:21:56.319 or a dog eater, which means an outcast. They 00:21:56.319 --> 00:21:58.960 see the exact same divine spark in all of them, 00:21:58.980 --> 00:22:00.700 regardless of the costume they are wearing in 00:22:00.700 --> 00:22:03.690 this life. That is radical equality. But let's 00:22:03.690 --> 00:22:06.109 be perfectly honest here. It's really hard to 00:22:06.109 --> 00:22:08.289 look at a political troll on the Internet, someone 00:22:08.289 --> 00:22:11.289 saying vile things and see a divine spark. It's 00:22:11.289 --> 00:22:13.329 incredibly hard. That's why it's called a spiritual 00:22:13.329 --> 00:22:16.410 discipline and not a weekend hobby. It goes against 00:22:16.410 --> 00:22:19.970 our tribal nature. Now, if we want a practical 00:22:19.970 --> 00:22:22.750 tool for how to actually talk to that troll or 00:22:22.750 --> 00:22:25.430 talk to someone we fiercely disagree with, Jainism 00:22:25.430 --> 00:22:28.349 is the absolute gold standard in the research. 00:22:29.049 --> 00:22:31.130 Jainism. These are the folks who are strictly 00:22:31.130 --> 00:22:34.029 nonviolent, right? Yeah. They wear masks sometimes 00:22:34.029 --> 00:22:36.710 to avoid inhaling and killing microscopic insects. 00:22:37.009 --> 00:22:40.150 Yes, ahisa perfect nonviolence is their core 00:22:40.150 --> 00:22:42.849 tenet. But the source material highlights something 00:22:42.849 --> 00:22:45.190 brilliant they developed called intellectual 00:22:45.190 --> 00:22:48.509 ahisa. Intellectual nonviolence. I love that 00:22:48.509 --> 00:22:50.730 concept. Let's dig into that. It's based on a 00:22:50.730 --> 00:22:53.880 philosophical doctrine called anekantavada. Did 00:22:53.880 --> 00:22:55.359 I pronounce that right? You sounded very confident, 00:22:55.440 --> 00:22:57.720 so let's go with yes, anacondavada. It translates 00:22:57.720 --> 00:23:00.019 to the many -sidedness of truth. The classic 00:23:00.019 --> 00:23:01.740 analogy they use, which you've probably heard, 00:23:01.859 --> 00:23:04.279 is the blind man and the elephant. Right. One 00:23:04.279 --> 00:23:06.140 touches the trunk and says truth is a snake. 00:23:06.500 --> 00:23:08.680 One touches the leg and says truth is a tree. 00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:11.059 One touches the ear and says truth is a fan. 00:23:11.420 --> 00:23:14.099 Exactly. They are all right based on their experience, 00:23:14.319 --> 00:23:17.210 but they are all wrong about the whole. Janes 00:23:17.210 --> 00:23:19.950 believe that reality is so massive and so complex 00:23:19.950 --> 00:23:22.730 that no single human view can possibly capture 00:23:22.730 --> 00:23:26.269 it all. Only a fully enlightened being, a Kevelin, 00:23:26.390 --> 00:23:29.009 can see the whole truth at once. For the rest 00:23:29.009 --> 00:23:31.650 of us, our view is always inherently partial. 00:23:32.150 --> 00:23:35.579 So how does a Jane argue politics then? Do they 00:23:35.579 --> 00:23:37.640 just say, well, everything is true, there is 00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:39.859 no right answer? That sounds like relativism. 00:23:39.980 --> 00:23:42.039 No, they aren't relativists. They use a system 00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:44.859 of logic called sadvada. It means conditional 00:23:44.859 --> 00:23:48.059 predication. Basically, every statement you make 00:23:48.059 --> 00:23:49.940 should have an invisible asterisk next to it 00:23:49.940 --> 00:23:52.640 that says, from a certain perspective. So instead 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:54.759 of saying, the economy is failing, which is an 00:23:54.759 --> 00:23:57.750 absolute dogmatic statement. You would say from 00:23:57.750 --> 00:24:00.069 the perspective of a wage earner in the manufacturing 00:24:00.069 --> 00:24:02.710 sector, the economy is failing. And someone else 00:24:02.710 --> 00:24:04.650 might say, well, from the perspective of a tech 00:24:04.650 --> 00:24:07.049 shareholder, the economy is booming. And both 00:24:07.049 --> 00:24:09.089 are true. Both are true. Neither is the whole 00:24:09.089 --> 00:24:11.890 truth. They are facets of the diamond. If we 00:24:11.890 --> 00:24:13.769 actually spoke like that, cable news would cease 00:24:13.769 --> 00:24:17.630 to exist entirely. Tonight on Primetime. From 00:24:17.630 --> 00:24:19.930 a certain perspective, the other side has a valid 00:24:19.930 --> 00:24:22.779 point. The ratings would plummet to zero. they 00:24:22.779 --> 00:24:25.059 would absolutely plummet. But think about the 00:24:25.059 --> 00:24:28.200 profound epistemic humility that requires. It 00:24:28.200 --> 00:24:31.019 frames dogmatic attachment to your own view as 00:24:31.019 --> 00:24:33.640 a form of actual violence. To claim I possess 00:24:33.640 --> 00:24:36.019 the absolute final truth and you are absolutely 00:24:36.019 --> 00:24:39.500 100 % wrong is to do violence to the complexity 00:24:39.500 --> 00:24:42.440 of reality. That is a powerful reframe. Dogma 00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:45.440 as violence. So we have this massive deconstruction 00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:48.319 of the ego from the Eastern traditions. Sufism 00:24:48.319 --> 00:24:50.960 says the self is fluid. Hinduism says it's just 00:24:50.960 --> 00:24:53.460 a costume. Jainism says your truth is only partial. 00:24:53.640 --> 00:24:55.799 But there's another side to this puzzle. Because 00:24:55.799 --> 00:24:57.680 if you just deconstruct everything, you might 00:24:57.680 --> 00:24:59.460 end up with nihilism. You still need to build 00:24:59.460 --> 00:25:01.869 something back up. Right. We don't just need 00:25:01.869 --> 00:25:04.650 to humble ourselves. We need to actively honor 00:25:04.650 --> 00:25:07.690 the other person. We need a solid basis for human 00:25:07.690 --> 00:25:10.549 dignity. And this is where the Western Abrahamic 00:25:10.549 --> 00:25:12.809 traditions, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, 00:25:12.990 --> 00:25:16.289 really shine in the source material. They give 00:25:16.289 --> 00:25:18.670 us an undeniable reason to respect the person 00:25:18.670 --> 00:25:21.250 we disagree with, even if we think they're dangerously 00:25:21.250 --> 00:25:23.690 wrong. Let's talk about the Jewish concept of 00:25:23.690 --> 00:25:26.390 the image of God. B'tzalem Elohim. It comes from 00:25:26.390 --> 00:25:30.049 Genesis 1 .27. God created man in his own image. 00:25:30.410 --> 00:25:33.289 This is the absolute bedrock of Western human 00:25:33.289 --> 00:25:36.849 rights. Even if our secular society often forgets 00:25:36.849 --> 00:25:39.349 the theological root of it, it means that every 00:25:39.349 --> 00:25:41.549 single human being, regardless of their utility, 00:25:41.769 --> 00:25:43.650 their intelligence, their wealth, or their politics, 00:25:43.809 --> 00:25:46.529 has infinite value. Because they bear the stamp 00:25:46.529 --> 00:25:49.130 of the creator. And the Talmud raises the stakes 00:25:49.130 --> 00:25:51.190 on this even higher. The Talmud says one who 00:25:51.190 --> 00:25:53.910 destroys a single life, it is as if he destroyed 00:25:53.910 --> 00:25:56.309 an entire world. Think about the gravity of that. 00:25:56.539 --> 00:25:58.900 Every person is a universe. Leo Beck, the great 00:25:58.900 --> 00:26:01.359 Jewish thinker, had a specific insight on this 00:26:01.359 --> 00:26:03.619 regarding diversity and how we view each other. 00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:07.559 Yes. He wrote that above all castes, classes, 00:26:07.680 --> 00:26:11.299 and nations stands one certainty, man or humanity. 00:26:11.920 --> 00:26:15.619 But the specific brilliant Jewish genius here 00:26:15.619 --> 00:26:17.799 is holding the tension between the particular 00:26:17.799 --> 00:26:20.720 and the universal. What do you mean by that tension, 00:26:20.900 --> 00:26:23.480 the particular versus universal? Well, Judaism 00:26:23.480 --> 00:26:25.920 is a tribal religion. It's a covenant with a 00:26:25.920 --> 00:26:28.819 very specific people, the Jews. They have particular 00:26:28.819 --> 00:26:31.180 laws, particular lands, particular traditions. 00:26:31.559 --> 00:26:34.039 But the theology affirms the universal dignity 00:26:34.039 --> 00:26:36.359 of everyone, regardless of whether they are in 00:26:36.359 --> 00:26:39.339 that covenant or not. I can be deeply, passionately 00:26:39.339 --> 00:26:41.920 committed to my tribe, but I must also recognize 00:26:41.920 --> 00:26:44.869 the infinite worth. of the stranger that feels 00:26:44.869 --> 00:26:47.430 like exactly the balance we are completely missing 00:26:47.430 --> 00:26:49.589 right now we either have people who are all tribe 00:26:49.589 --> 00:26:52.390 and they hate the stranger or we have people 00:26:52.390 --> 00:26:54.930 who want to be enlightened global citizens but 00:26:54.930 --> 00:26:57.250 they have no local roots no tribe at all exactly 00:26:57.250 --> 00:27:00.390 judaism models how to be both you have a distinct 00:27:00.390 --> 00:27:03.170 home you love your home but you deeply respect 00:27:03.170 --> 00:27:06.369 the neighbor christianity takes this universalism 00:27:06.369 --> 00:27:08.730 and really blasts it out to the empire there's 00:27:08.730 --> 00:27:10.789 that famous verse in galatians the source mentions 00:27:10.789 --> 00:27:20.900 galatians 3 .28 Now, I've heard intense arguments 00:27:20.900 --> 00:27:23.759 about this verse. Is Paul saying those categories 00:27:23.759 --> 00:27:26.200 literally don't exist anymore? Is he being colorblind 00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:28.660 or genderblind? Because saying there is no male 00:27:28.660 --> 00:27:32.950 and female seems biologically... obviously untrue. 00:27:33.069 --> 00:27:35.789 It's a great question and it gets debated a lot, 00:27:35.970 --> 00:27:38.630 but most scholars argue he's not saying they 00:27:38.630 --> 00:27:40.990 physically vanish. He's not saying differences 00:27:40.990 --> 00:27:43.289 aren't real or don't shape our lives. He's saying 00:27:43.289 --> 00:27:45.990 they are secondary. They are no longer the fundamental 00:27:45.990 --> 00:27:48.750 standing of a person before God or the community. 00:27:49.029 --> 00:27:50.809 Context really matters here, right? Because of 00:27:50.809 --> 00:27:54.079 Rome. Huge context. In the Roman world, being 00:27:54.079 --> 00:27:57.180 a slave or free was absolutely everything. It 00:27:57.180 --> 00:27:59.079 determined if you were a human person with rights 00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:02.279 or literally a talking farm tool. Being Jew or 00:28:02.279 --> 00:28:04.240 Greek determined your entire legal and social 00:28:04.240 --> 00:28:06.900 status. Paul is saying, no, those labels are 00:28:06.900 --> 00:28:09.380 surface level. Your ultimate worth is determined 00:28:09.380 --> 00:28:11.920 by something that transcends those labels. He 00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.380 is relativizing the entire social hierarchy of 00:28:14.380 --> 00:28:18.059 the Roman Empire. So to apply it today, Democrat 00:28:18.059 --> 00:28:21.140 or Republican might describe how I vote. But 00:28:21.140 --> 00:28:23.700 it doesn't describe my ultimate worth as a human 00:28:23.700 --> 00:28:26.599 being. Exactly. It renders the political label 00:28:26.599 --> 00:28:29.599 penultimate. It's important, but it's not the 00:28:29.599 --> 00:28:32.339 ultimate truth about you. The mega -identity 00:28:32.339 --> 00:28:35.059 gets demoted. And Islam has a beautiful parallel 00:28:35.059 --> 00:28:37.200 to this in the Quran regarding why diversity 00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:41.230 even exists in the first place. Sura 49 .13 it 00:28:41.230 --> 00:28:44.210 says we made you into nations and tribes so that 00:28:44.210 --> 00:28:48.609 you may know one another yes the idea is that 00:28:48.609 --> 00:28:51.450 diversity isn't a mistake it isn't a bug in the 00:28:51.450 --> 00:28:54.430 system it's a deliberate feature god didn't make 00:28:54.430 --> 00:28:55.990 us different so we would fight and sort into 00:28:55.990 --> 00:28:58.319 mega tribes but so we would learn If everyone 00:28:58.319 --> 00:29:00.720 was exactly the same, there would be no knowing. 00:29:00.799 --> 00:29:02.599 There would be no friction, no curiosity, no 00:29:02.599 --> 00:29:04.980 growth. And there's that Islamic concept of fitra 00:29:04.980 --> 00:29:07.720 too, which I find really hopeful for the idea 00:29:07.720 --> 00:29:10.539 of a secular democracy. Fitra is the primordial 00:29:10.539 --> 00:29:12.819 nature. Think of it as the factory settings of 00:29:12.819 --> 00:29:16.240 the human soul. Abdulaziz Saqedina, a major scholar 00:29:16.240 --> 00:29:18.920 in this field, argues that fitra is what actually 00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:21.460 allows us to have a functioning pluralistic society. 00:29:21.819 --> 00:29:25.440 How so? How does fitra help us politically? Because 00:29:25.440 --> 00:29:27.799 Fitcher implies that every single human being 00:29:27.799 --> 00:29:31.119 has a God -given moral compass. Even if you are 00:29:31.119 --> 00:29:34.119 an atheist and I am a Muslim or you are a hardcore 00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:37.319 Republican and I am a progressive Democrat, we 00:29:37.319 --> 00:29:40.220 both have this innate capacity for reason, for 00:29:40.220 --> 00:29:42.720 conscience, for knowing right from wrong. So 00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:44.619 we aren't total aliens to each other, even across 00:29:44.619 --> 00:29:47.359 massive divides. We aren't aliens. We share a 00:29:47.359 --> 00:29:50.299 common language of moral justification that exists 00:29:50.299 --> 00:29:53.160 before our religious or political labels even 00:29:53.160 --> 00:29:56.099 enter the picture. We can reason together because 00:29:56.099 --> 00:29:58.849 we come from the exact same source code. So let's 00:29:58.849 --> 00:30:00.730 bring all these threads together. The Eastern 00:30:00.730 --> 00:30:02.990 traditions tell us, hey, your ego is a costume. 00:30:03.150 --> 00:30:05.470 Don't worship it. The Western traditions tell 00:30:05.470 --> 00:30:07.789 us, hey, that person you hate is made in the 00:30:07.789 --> 00:30:09.890 image of God. Treat them with ultimate dignity. 00:30:10.210 --> 00:30:12.410 That's the theory. Deconstruction of the idol 00:30:12.410 --> 00:30:15.150 and restoration of true dignity. But now we have 00:30:15.150 --> 00:30:17.849 to land the plane. How do we actually do this? 00:30:17.910 --> 00:30:20.029 How do we build a modern functioning society 00:30:20.029 --> 00:30:22.670 on this? Because right now it feels like we are 00:30:22.670 --> 00:30:26.029 ripping apart at the seams. Telling people to 00:30:26.029 --> 00:30:28.609 see the image of God in a Twitter troll is a 00:30:28.609 --> 00:30:31.049 very tall order, especially on Election Day. 00:30:31.130 --> 00:30:33.650 It is a massive order. And this brings us to 00:30:33.650 --> 00:30:35.890 the final piece of our source material. and the 00:30:35.890 --> 00:30:38.450 profound work of the late great rabbi Jonathan 00:30:38.450 --> 00:30:42.289 Sacks. He was a total giant in this field. He 00:30:42.289 --> 00:30:44.150 wrote a book called The Dignity of Difference. 00:30:44.269 --> 00:30:45.990 Great title, by the way. It's a wonderful book. 00:30:46.190 --> 00:30:48.650 And in it, he makes a crucial distinction that 00:30:48.650 --> 00:30:51.210 I think perfectly explains why our current politics 00:30:51.210 --> 00:30:54.210 is failing so miserably. He distinguishes between 00:30:54.210 --> 00:30:57.730 a social contract and a social covenant. Okay, 00:30:57.849 --> 00:31:00.849 political science nerds, wake up. This is your 00:31:00.849 --> 00:31:02.920 moment. Contract versus covenant. Break it down 00:31:02.920 --> 00:31:05.799 for us. A social contract, which is what modern 00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:08.079 liberal democracy is entirely built on, going 00:31:08.079 --> 00:31:10.420 all the way back to Hobbes and Locke and Rousseau, 00:31:10.500 --> 00:31:12.940 is fundamentally transactional. It's a business 00:31:12.940 --> 00:31:15.059 deal. Meaning I give you something, you give 00:31:15.059 --> 00:31:18.220 me something. Meaning I pay my taxes. The government 00:31:18.220 --> 00:31:21.500 fixes the road. I obey the law. The state protects 00:31:21.500 --> 00:31:24.539 my private property. It is completely based on 00:31:24.539 --> 00:31:27.160 mutual self -interest. I do this so that you 00:31:27.160 --> 00:31:29.240 do that. That pretty much describes most of my 00:31:29.240 --> 00:31:31.279 interactions with the state. Right. And Sachs 00:31:31.279 --> 00:31:33.819 says the contract is necessary. You absolutely 00:31:33.819 --> 00:31:36.400 need it to run a state, collect taxes and pave 00:31:36.400 --> 00:31:39.839 roads. But it is entirely insufficient to run 00:31:39.839 --> 00:31:42.099 a society. Because what happens when the deal 00:31:42.099 --> 00:31:44.299 goes bad? If the government stops fixing the 00:31:44.299 --> 00:31:46.940 road, I want to stop paying. If the deal isn't 00:31:46.940 --> 00:31:49.349 working for me anymore. I want out of the contract. 00:31:49.430 --> 00:31:52.329 Exactly. It's fragile. If the society is just 00:31:52.329 --> 00:31:54.589 based on interests, then as soon as our interests 00:31:54.589 --> 00:31:57.569 diverge, which they inevitably will, we are enemies. 00:31:57.670 --> 00:31:59.789 We have nothing holding us together. A covenant, 00:31:59.910 --> 00:32:02.170 however, is completely different. How so? What 00:32:02.170 --> 00:32:05.069 is a covenant? A covenant is relational. It's 00:32:05.069 --> 00:32:07.210 transformative. Think of a healthy marriage. 00:32:07.690 --> 00:32:09.769 A marriage isn't, or at least it shouldn't be, 00:32:09.910 --> 00:32:12.509 a contract where I will wash the dishes only 00:32:12.509 --> 00:32:14.930 if you mow the lawn, and if you don't, the marriage 00:32:14.930 --> 00:32:18.609 is void. It's much deeper. It's I am bound to 00:32:18.609 --> 00:32:21.450 you. Your fate is my fate. I am loyal to this 00:32:21.450 --> 00:32:23.630 bond regardless of whether it is currently convenient 00:32:23.630 --> 00:32:25.730 for my self -interest. For better or for worse. 00:32:25.970 --> 00:32:29.130 Exactly. A covenant creates a we. A contract 00:32:29.130 --> 00:32:32.609 just manages a bunch of isolated I's. Sachs argues 00:32:32.609 --> 00:32:35.069 that in the modern West, we have moved from a 00:32:35.069 --> 00:32:37.200 politics of solidarity, which is covenant, covenant 00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:39.400 to a politics of identity, which is contract. 00:32:39.700 --> 00:32:42.400 We basically view the country as a giant hotel 00:32:42.400 --> 00:32:44.200 where we are all just trying to get the best 00:32:44.200 --> 00:32:46.720 room service for our specific tribe rather than 00:32:46.720 --> 00:32:49.140 a home that we actively build and maintain together. 00:32:49.420 --> 00:32:52.720 So we urgently need to recover covenantal thinking. 00:32:53.180 --> 00:32:54.839 But does that mean we all have to believe the 00:32:54.839 --> 00:32:57.279 exact same thing? Because that sounds a lot like 00:32:57.279 --> 00:32:59.880 assimilation, which people rightly push back 00:32:59.880 --> 00:33:02.440 against. No, and this is Sack's true brilliance 00:33:02.440 --> 00:33:04.859 here. He calls for integration without assimilation. 00:33:05.140 --> 00:33:07.460 Explain the difference between those two. Assimilation 00:33:07.460 --> 00:33:10.660 is the classic melting pot. You throw everyone 00:33:10.660 --> 00:33:13.079 in, turn up the heat, and they melt into one 00:33:13.079 --> 00:33:16.079 uniform sludge. You lose your distinctiveness, 00:33:16.240 --> 00:33:19.180 your heritage, your specific beliefs. Sack says 00:33:19.180 --> 00:33:23.680 no. Monotheism. The belief in one God does not 00:33:23.680 --> 00:33:26.619 mean monism. The belief in only one valid path 00:33:26.619 --> 00:33:30.079 or one uniform way to be human. The creator actually 00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:32.799 loves diversity. You can be fully Jewish, fully 00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:36.460 Muslim, fully Texan, fully Californian. You absolutely 00:33:36.460 --> 00:33:38.700 keep your distinct identity. So I get to keep 00:33:38.700 --> 00:33:40.920 my costume. You keep your costume. It's a beautiful 00:33:40.920 --> 00:33:43.519 costume. But you are bound to the whole society 00:33:43.519 --> 00:33:45.680 in a way that supersedes your private interest. 00:33:45.920 --> 00:33:47.740 You are committed to the relationship, to the 00:33:47.740 --> 00:33:49.940 covenant, more than you are committed to winning 00:33:49.940 --> 00:33:52.539 every single argument. That sounds incredible 00:33:52.539 --> 00:33:54.960 in theory, but it also sounds really hard in 00:33:54.960 --> 00:33:57.460 practice. Is there any empirical evidence that 00:33:57.460 --> 00:33:59.940 this actually works, or is it just nice philosophy? 00:34:00.259 --> 00:34:02.420 There is actual evidence. The source points to 00:34:02.420 --> 00:34:04.619 research by scholars like Ibrat Patel and Mohammed 00:34:04.619 --> 00:34:07.220 Abernumer. They study interfaith engagement and 00:34:07.220 --> 00:34:09.199 conflict resolution on the ground. And what do 00:34:09.199 --> 00:34:10.820 they find when they put these groups together? 00:34:11.230 --> 00:34:13.250 They find that when people actually engage across 00:34:13.250 --> 00:34:16.050 lines of difference, but not just sitting in 00:34:16.050 --> 00:34:18.150 a conference room debating theology, because 00:34:18.150 --> 00:34:20.170 that usually goes nowhere and just entrenches 00:34:20.170 --> 00:34:22.809 people. Right. Debates just trigger the megalithymia. 00:34:22.849 --> 00:34:25.570 Exactly. But when they engage by actually working 00:34:25.570 --> 00:34:28.530 on a shared project, building a Habitat for Humanity 00:34:28.530 --> 00:34:32.110 house together, running a local food bank, cleaning 00:34:32.110 --> 00:34:35.190 up a park. Shared action. Shared action toward 00:34:35.190 --> 00:34:38.150 a common good. When they do that, the research 00:34:38.150 --> 00:34:41.630 shows they develop shared moral frameworks. They 00:34:41.630 --> 00:34:44.210 build a covenant. And they don't lose their religion 00:34:44.210 --> 00:34:47.230 in the process. A Christian often becomes a better 00:34:47.230 --> 00:34:49.750 Christian by working alongside a Muslim because 00:34:49.750 --> 00:34:51.650 they are challenged to actually live up to their 00:34:51.650 --> 00:34:54.389 own charitable values. But the crucial shift 00:34:54.389 --> 00:34:56.909 is that the other stops being an existential 00:34:56.909 --> 00:35:00.480 threat. It's the contact hypothesis, right? It's 00:35:00.480 --> 00:35:02.639 really hard to hate people close up. It's practically 00:35:02.639 --> 00:35:04.440 impossible to hate people when you are sweating 00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:06.599 alongside them, passing them a hammer. The abstraction 00:35:06.599 --> 00:35:09.320 falls away. The mega identity crumbles. You stop 00:35:09.320 --> 00:35:11.139 seeing a representative of the evil opposing 00:35:11.139 --> 00:35:14.000 party and you just see Dave. Just Dave, who is 00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:16.219 bad at using a hammer, but tells good jokes. 00:35:16.480 --> 00:35:19.960 And that mundane connection is the literal beginning 00:35:19.960 --> 00:35:22.659 of a covenant. You know, this whole deep dive 00:35:22.659 --> 00:35:24.920 has been quite a journey. We started with that 00:35:24.920 --> 00:35:27.420 physical tightness in our chest, the deep anxiety 00:35:27.420 --> 00:35:29.659 of the modern self scrolling through social media. 00:35:29.920 --> 00:35:32.840 We looked at how we turned identity into an idol, 00:35:32.940 --> 00:35:36.159 demanding constant recognition. And we ended 00:35:36.159 --> 00:35:38.820 up with Rabbi Sachs basically telling us to get 00:35:38.820 --> 00:35:40.820 married to our neighbors. It is a lot of ground 00:35:40.820 --> 00:35:43.719 to cover, but I think the core takeaway, despite 00:35:43.719 --> 00:35:46.679 all the heavy philosophy, is actually quite simple. 00:35:47.360 --> 00:35:49.820 Summarize it for us. What is the one thing the 00:35:49.820 --> 00:35:51.420 listener should take away from all this source 00:35:51.420 --> 00:35:53.719 material? The idolatry of identity is making 00:35:53.719 --> 00:35:56.579 us completely miserable. We are worshiping labels 00:35:56.579 --> 00:35:59.679 and categories that we invented ourselves. The 00:35:59.679 --> 00:36:01.679 way out of this trap is not to pretend we don't 00:36:01.679 --> 00:36:04.219 have identities. We do, and they matter. They 00:36:04.219 --> 00:36:06.539 shape our lives. The way out is to just hold 00:36:06.539 --> 00:36:08.989 them lightly. I see them as costumes. To see 00:36:08.989 --> 00:36:11.550 them as costumes. To practice the intellectual 00:36:11.550 --> 00:36:14.710 humility of the Jains, knowing our truth is always 00:36:14.710 --> 00:36:17.750 partial. To see the image of God like the Jews 00:36:17.750 --> 00:36:20.590 and Christians, knowing the other person is fundamentally 00:36:20.590 --> 00:36:23.710 sacred. And to see the fluid process like the 00:36:23.710 --> 00:36:26.869 Sufis, knowing that we are always changing moment 00:36:26.869 --> 00:36:29.230 to moment. And to realize that the person shouting 00:36:29.230 --> 00:36:31.989 at you on Twitter is also just a person in a 00:36:31.989 --> 00:36:34.710 costume, probably really scared, probably looking 00:36:34.710 --> 00:36:37.269 for validation and recognition, just like you 00:36:37.269 --> 00:36:40.260 are. Precisely. We are all just seeking dignity. 00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:42.880 Here is a provocative thought to leave you with 00:36:42.880 --> 00:36:45.260 to mull over on your own. The source suggests 00:36:45.260 --> 00:36:48.659 that all idols eventually must be transcended. 00:36:48.800 --> 00:36:51.599 If we can actually do this, if we can look at 00:36:51.599 --> 00:36:54.000 our own political party, our own tribe, our most 00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:56.539 cherished labels and say, this is important to 00:36:56.539 --> 00:36:59.820 me, but it's not God, we might actually find 00:36:59.820 --> 00:37:02.059 the freedom to connect with the human being behind 00:37:02.059 --> 00:37:05.199 the label. And maybe, just maybe, the cost of 00:37:05.199 --> 00:37:06.920 that freedom is admitting we don't have it all 00:37:06.920 --> 00:37:09.289 figured out. And that epistemic humility might 00:37:09.289 --> 00:37:11.429 literally be the only way we survive this century 00:37:11.429 --> 00:37:14.570 together. A huge challenge. But hey, that's exactly 00:37:14.570 --> 00:37:17.170 why we dive deep. We certainly do. Thanks for 00:37:17.170 --> 00:37:20.170 joining us for this one. Let us know. Are you 00:37:20.170 --> 00:37:22.570 ready to take off the costume? Even just a little 00:37:22.570 --> 00:37:23.670 bit. We'll see you next time.