Welcome again to another episode of the Interfaith
Podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Iqbal Akhtar, and
I'm here with two of our colleagues, Pastor Candy
and Bianca, from Christ Congregational Youth.
United Church of Christ. I'm just making sure
I got it right. And so, well, we're very honored
for them to join us today. They're part of many
interfaith organizations, including the Mosaic
Interfaith Clergy Dialogue. And particularly
Pastor Candy is an institution here in Miami.
And she's done amazing work in, you know, sort
of the moral upliftment of our community here
in Miami. um is a really important voice i think
moral voice for the challenging times that we
live in right now so i think what we're going
to do is we'll do um we'll start off with kind
of you talking a little bit about your life um
and your experiences and then we'll go to you
bianca and we'll just go back and forth um so
talk to us a little bit about um where you come
from where you grew up and sort of how faith
became important in your life okay um my My full
title is the Reverend Candace Thomas. And I say
that because I'm an ordained minister in the
United Church of Christ. And that means something.
It's something I've worked hard for. I think
my faith journey began before I was even in confirmation
class, which was seventh grade. I grew up in
First Evangelical and Reformed Church in Sandusky,
Ohio, which in 1957, we had four different denominations
joined together to become the United Church of
Christ. So it became First United Church of Christ.
And I was one of those kids that the neighbors
take to Sunday school. We played with the neighbor's
kids, and they just took us to Sunday school.
And part of the faith journey was when you got
to be about in seventh grade, you had confirmation,
which was that you studied to renew the baptismal
vows your parents had made for you. They promised
to bring you up as a Christian. I guess around
12 was seen as the age when you could start making
your own decisions. And so we learned a lot about
the Bible and the history of the church and how
we're supposed to live our lives as followers
of Jesus Christ. And I was the kid with all the
questions. I'm sure the other kids in the class
wish that Candy would just be quiet so they could
leave. A big part of my faith has been with questions.
So anyway, I moved along, was active in church,
graduated from high school, went to college,
to Kent State University in Ohio, and studied
to be an English teacher, minored in library
science, graduated, taught English for a year.
was not great at discipline, did not like that
part of things, loved literature. And so I'd
had a summer work experience as a social worker
in a children's services agency, which I really
did like. And so at that time, I took the test
to become a social worker. On and off for the
next 19 years, I worked as a social worker in
children's services, took time off to have my
three kids. I was married and did that and found
it fulfilling, but remained involved in a church
of the United Church of Christ, no matter where
we lived. And as I got to be in my latter 40s,
I got even more. involved in the church. I was
a deacon, and I decided that I was being called
to ministry. In our denomination, we take the
idea of calls seriously. It's not a call you
hear with your ears. It's a call you feel. It's
really hard to describe, but it's so important
that one of the steps in being certified, if
you will, by the denomination to be ordained
is you have to be able to talk about and write
about your sense of call. And other people help
you decide if that's real or just somehow you've
got this in your head, you think that would be
a good idea. But call for me has been a very
real thing. And so when I was about 50, I began
seminary and was fortunate enough to be a student
pastor full time in a UCC church. We had a deal
where I would go to seminary. I had to drive
about 90 miles and would work for the church
the rest of the time. And I learned and it was
a great congregation to be in for me. And so
I did that. I graduated from the Methodist Theological
School in Ohio in Delaware in 1998 and was ordained
like a month later. And that was a big deal.
That was really a wonderful thing. And stayed
at that church for 12 years in all. until I decided
that it was time to explore other types of ministry.
And I took training to be an intentional interim
or a transitional minister where you go to a
church that's between a called pastor and you
do certain work with them to help them discern,
you know, what they're really looking to be as
a church. And then you help them as they prepare
their profile to call a pastor. And so in a nutshell,
I've been the pastor of five churches. And this
one that I'm in right now, I've been there for
seven years at Christ Congregational and feel
very fortunate to be in a progressive congregation.
which mean we're really liberal. If you want
to define what progressive means, but it's a
joy to work with the congregation, especially
focused on issues of social justice. So in a
nutshell. That's amazing. It's a remarkable journey.
When were women ordained in the church? Well.
One of our predecessors, it was in the late 1800s,
I believe. I haven't looked at my church history
for a while. But it hasn't been that common probably
for the last, I mean, 40 years. When I was growing
up, I certainly didn't know of any women pastors.
But it's really evolved until, I don't know what
the percentages are in the UCC, but I know a
lot of women pastors now. But even in my first
church, there were a couple of members who left
because they didn't think they should call a
member, and they didn't think they should call,
or as a minister, they didn't think they should
call someone who was divorced. They actually
left the church. So, you know, that was... back
in 1995 when I started there. So even at that
time, at least this was a country church and
maybe was a little more conservative. But, you
know, I was still out there. I've had people,
not lately, but still dubious about that. Wow.
That's amazing. Yeah, it's remarkable. So how
did you come to Miami? I moved to Miami because
my youngest daughter adopted two children, two
Haitian children. And I had told her that if
she adopted, I would be family support. So this
was in 2014. They got the kids in July, and I
was down here by September. And she was calling
me on the way down saying, How fast can you get
here? The kids were, I think, about seven and
nine, then brother and sister. And my daughter
didn't have any children, so no experience. So
I continued to live around the corner from her,
and now they're 21 and 18. That's remarkable.
Wow. Okay. All right, let's get to Bianca. Talk
to us a little bit about who are you. So my story
is quite a bit different from Pastor Candy's.
I was born in Romania, communist at the time.
And I lived there until I was about seven, seven
and a half, almost eight. And we came here. My
father escaped Romania at the time and went to
a refugee camp in Austria. and then um and so
he applied for political asylum here and was
granted and then he requested for us to have
political asylum here and we were also granted
that so we were able to come um And that's how
we became citizens was through our political
asylum. And there's a lot of like stuff going
on in Romania that we don't need to get into.
But needless to say, we made it here. My mom
and I, for many reasons, ended up separating
from my dad. And so we went to Michigan for a
while. Long story short, it was pretty turbulent.
childhood time um but at the center of all of
it was always our faith um my I mean I grew up
in a house of faith um it was Romanian Orthodox
so it was quite conservative uh but I think always
at the center was this like idea that um God
not just like loves everybody right that's true
in all ways but that we have a responsibility
to be good and kind to each other no matter what
like even if the other person isn't really the
same as you or thinks the same as you. And I
think maybe growing up in a turbulent space and
there was a lot of times in Romania where you
weren't allowed to go to church or you could
even get in trouble for saying certain things.
So that space, I mean, I was really little, so
it didn't affect me in the same way, but it affected
the adults around me. It was an interesting way
to start your faith journey from this like conservative
angle, but also not as conservative as you would
think. So when I came to the United States and
then I became a teenager and I learned about
the Baptist faith and I was like, wow, that's
super different from what I grew up in. And I
didn't resonate with a lot of things like, you
know, there's this whole premise that. When babies
are born, they're already born inherently bad
because that's just, you know, what they believe.
And like women in the Orthodox religion, they
can't even go to church. Like you can't step
on church property if you're like menstruating,
for example. So there's all these like rules
that it just like never sat well with me. And
I will say that when we came to the U .S. and
we were in Michigan for a while. the church community
was our second home. It's where we found comfort,
even though there was bickering and drama as
in any space that you're ever in, any relationships,
there's all kinds of drama. But we did find like
kind of home here in the U .S. because it was
a Romanian church. They did a lot of wonderful
things for us. It was our first Christmas in
Michigan. We had nothing. We literally had one
little tiny room, a room with a bathroom and
a little tiny kitchen. That's it. And no furniture.
We each had a bag, a plastic bag of our things.
And we laid it on the floor to make a bed. And
that's like... what we had we had no food in
the refrigerator we probably had like a plastic
cup and a plastic plate that we got from goodwill
or something um and the church folk got together
and they showed up at our door before christmas
and fully outfitted our little apartment yes
it really was it's like a miracle it was a very
beautiful thing um and so i have a lot of like
you know good wonderful memories that were made
as a child where people come together because
um not just of their faith but you know their
love for each other and stuff um and so then
i learned a little bit in the baptist world wow
you know what it what it means to like be saved
quote unquote and there was a lot more freedom
in it um but i still had issues and becoming
an adult you really start to learn more things
you diversify your thoughts and all these wonderful
stuff and so I had a lot of friends and people
that I really cared about who were like of the
LGBTQ plus community and It just made me question
everything. Wait a minute, why would somebody
go to hell just because of who they love? So
then I went through that journey. And for a long
time, I was just like, well, I live in my own
bubble of faith. I didn't know UCC existed. And
I was just like, in my heart, I know God loves
everybody. I know that there's nothing that can
separate me from that love. And so that's, you
know, where I came from. And three years ago
now, almost three years ago now, it was my birthday
was on a Sunday coming up. Yes, I will tell the
Bible story. And so for whatever reason, I had
been thinking for maybe like two years, I'd gone
like trying different little churches to see
what felt. And in my heart, I was like, man,
I really need a good church home that I could
feel comfortable in. But a lot of it didn't resonate
with what I felt in my heart for everybody, for
people in general. And I did a Google search.
One of the Google searches was like a place that
was positive about LGBTQ plus communities. And
I came across. this UCC church, Christ Congregational.
And I was like, you're only 15 minutes away from
me. I have to go try that. So I told my mom,
look, for my birthday, I want to go to church.
You know, wild thing to say. So please remember,
I'm coming from a Romanian Orthodox and Baptist
background. So I'm showing up to church with
Bible in hand because that's how I know to show
up to church. wonderful experience, immediately
fell in love with the church, fell in love with
the message, fell in love with Pastor Candy.
I was like, wow, I am home. I'm like, this is
peace. And everybody was incredibly welcoming.
And I was like, this is wonderful. Then later
on, Pastor Candy tells me, you know, I wasn't
really sure about you because you showed up with
Bible in hand. And I totally thought that you
were like an undercover, like. christian nationalists
trying to scope us out and i was like oh um nope
uh you know and then cut to three years later
and i am now the uh church program manager and
one of the reasons why um I took the job why
they wanted me to take the job was because I
have like two decades of experience in the community.
So I've been working with nonprofits for a really
long time. I work for the Children's Trust. I've
worked for City of Miami Beach. You know, nonprofit
has kind of just been in my blood since I got
out of high school. I just wished a lot in my
life. that there were more programs that could
have helped my mom being a single mom raising
me on her own and so when i got out of high school
i was like i i want to do i mean originally i
was going to be a teacher and then i thought
better of it that's where our um stories align
a little but then i realized like you know i
want to be out in the world helping so i worked
you know switchboard of miami and the lifeline
things so i have a lot of connections in the
community And our church truly, really believes.
I mean, we say, or I like to say, we're a small
church doing big things. But yes, even though
we're a smaller church, we're doing a lot of
stuff in the community. And that's my passion.
So it really aligned quite well. And then Pastor
Candy and I had many conversations about my future.
And so, you know, in those conversations, I've
kind of been. steered like i'm being led towards
being a student uh pastor hopefully starting
next year that's amazing so wow that'd be that's
a That's a great, great journey to be on and
I think a very rewarding one to be. So I think
that's something that all faith communities are
always looking for, the next generation of leaders
that are going to be able to help keep the message
going forward. And you definitely have the energy,
which is wonderful. Thank you. Yeah. And the
motivation and the drive, which is remarkable.
And I'm really heartened by the work that you
guys are doing. particularly regarding immigration
and kind of the challenges that we're having
right now, just being out there. And I know that's
sometimes not popular and there can be a lot
of challenges for the work that you're doing.
How did you come to Miami then? That's a longer
story. I will try and be as quick as possible.
My uncle helped a friend of his a lot. I don't
like it's a long story, so we're not going to
go into it. It was a really big help. And so
he owed him one. And my mom's lifelong dream
was to live somewhere where there are palm trees.
So my uncle, before he passed, was like you to
his friend who lived in Miami. you owe me one
help my sister get from michigan to miami that's
like all i need from you is just like help her
figure everything out help her find an apartment
like you don't have to pay for her or anything
just like help her to get it done um and he did
and so like that was my mom's dream like we had
a mural in our little tiny apartment in romania
with like the beach and palm trees because that
was her like lifelong dream was to live somewhere
with palm trees and so she made it happen my
mom is a person who makes things happen she wanted
the american dream she wanted to own her own
place she made it happen so yeah it's a good
inspiration that's wonderful that's how i got
here you both are quite remarkable people um
so pastor candy i mean what is your um what are
the main challenges that you see our community
facing right now? It's hard to know where to
even start. The justice issues. What are you
working on? What am I working on? Were you concentrating
your efforts? I think we're concentrating our
efforts on immigration. Helping nonprofits that
do the basic work, you know, feeding people.
We've been very fortunate. We sold our property,
but we have a 20 -year lease back, and our property
was valuable property. So now we have what I've
never experienced before, actually. is having
money to do things in addition to what we do
as people with social justice. As you know, so
many social programs have been cut. Jesus was
real clear about what his followers are supposed
to do to love and to serve, and we try to do
that. We're part of a group that is an interfaith
group that is sponsoring and seeing the interfaith
prayer vigils happen currently at the cruelly
named Alligator Alcatraz every Sunday at 5 o
'clock in the evening. for an hour and those
have been a real powerful experience for those
of us who participate. We're aligned with the
Florida Immigrant Coalition that helped sponsor
events where people can come and get legal help
on their immigration issues. contribute to SOS
in Homestead, which provides a lot of services
for immigrants and for people experiencing abuse
at home, where the families have to be separated.
So we have people who volunteer to... get things
for them. And then like one of Bianca's jobs
is coordinating with them and setting up where
the church will provide lunch for everybody who
comes to the events. We have a lot of irons in
the fire, basically, with providing goods and
services. Of course, as a church, we see that
worship is the core. And so in worship, we praise
God, we pray to God, we thank God, we get filled
up ourselves for the work that is being done
because it's very draining. But I try to focus
on remembering we aren't doing this alone. And
that helps me anyway. Talk to us a little bit
about, yeah, what does the day -to -day look
like? Yeah, so just to piggyback off of something,
we are, maybe a month ago, we had a conversation,
outreach conversation, and we decided, you know,
we made a little bit of money off of the money
that we have in stocks and stuff. And so we were
like, well, we're not a dragon in a cave hoarding
money. We are Jesus following folks. So let's
do good. So one of the things that we decided
that we're going to do is what we're calling
15 for 15. So we're going to be giving $15 ,000
to 15 different nonprofit organizations in our
community. We're really excited to have the.
honor the blessing to be able to do that for
people so that's really exciting and a day -to
-day is a lot of work with the community I sit
as vice chair of SOS and I also chair for En
Familia in the Homestead area so there's a lot
of work done there. SOS is moving out of their
space and into a new space right now. So there's
a lot of just collaborating with them, seeing
what their needs are and how we can step in.
Florida Immigrant Coalition, shout out to them.
This weekend is a big deal for them. They're
doing a huge mega drive, I think is what they
call it, all around immigration. So we do little
ones. We do little citizenship drives. We usually
have like maybe 30 to 40 people show up to those.
They're doing like really big, like hundreds
of people showing up to those this weekend. And
so I'll help with that and our involvement and
pact. Shout out to them. People acting in community
together. So there's a lot of a lot of fighting
for. Right now housing related issues. So the
big thing is the last night which I haven't even
checked yet What the outcome was of the Miami
-Dade County budget hearing But in April we had
our Nehemiah action where I was able to speak
I was gonna have a dialogue with a commissioner,
but he didn't show up so There was a lot of that
kind of work where you're literally out in the
community talking to people from Miami Workers
Center, going to those kinds of events, press
conferences. I've never had my face in the newspaper
this many times. So it's just a lot of that sort
of coordination. I should mention, too, that
we are an open and affirming church, which means
that we're open and affirming to everybody, and
especially to GLBTQ plus folks. We have our rainbow
flag out every Sunday, and we have members of
the congregation who are in that community who
are valued members. I attend the PFLAG meetings
monthly, which are the parents and friends of
LBGTQ plus people. So that's an important thing
to us. Yeah. This past spring, we went to the
Capitol, the state Capitol in Tallahassee. They
have pride at the Capitol for a week and we plan
on going again. And we go with Equality Florida.
One more shout out to them. And we speak to legislators
about LGBTQ plus rights and try and convince
them and help them to understand that some of
the legislation they're trying to put out is
very, very harmful to people. Merged in the let
us live transgender parade. Yeah. So like when
we like to say that we live what we. say we want
to live if you're going to say love like jesus
then you have to walk the walk not just talk
the talk sure um two more questions one is pastor
candy what is um you know there's a lot of uh
narratives or stories of what it means to be
a christian what is your understanding of jesus's
message well i I believe Jesus is the son of
God. And I believe that he was very clear with
his words and his actions about what God expects
of us. I, you know, to love and to serve is the
basic thing. And by love, I don't mean necessarily
that emotion. I mean that you demonstrate that
love by the golden rule. As simple as that, you
do unto others as you would have them do unto
you. And it troubles me. Christian nationalism
troubles me greatly because they have so twisted
the message of Jesus. And I don't like that being
co -opted. You know, we're given one precious
life, and you can do so much for it to have meaning.
We are just here to mark time, and that's a gift
because it means God has expectations of us,
and you don't have expectations of somebody unless
you know they can do it. Every life can have
a purpose. You don't have to be a professional,
so to speak. Whether you're in any profession
or no profession, you can live out Christian
faith and the Abrahamic faiths. We share many
of the same values. I just encourage any students
watching, let your life have meaning. Your faith
isn't separate from how you live your other part
of your life. It isn't in a compartment. And
you have abilities to make this world a better
place. I preach about hope a lot and about peace.
We have Peace Sunday coming up this Sunday. We
are people of hope, Christians, and that hope
is founded in God's love. Bianca, do you have
any last words for our students? Come to worship
with us on Sunday at 11 a .m. every Sunday. We
are welcoming people and I 100 % agree with Pastor
Candy. You know, Jesus's message was love and
not money hoarding, not... Kick your immigrants
out. He said the opposite. So if I could give
advice to students, it would be your career is
your career. You can change it. You can love
teaching today and hate it tomorrow. You can
love being in tech today and hate it tomorrow.
So. Put your passion into it if you want to,
but remember to love the people around you. Bring
kindness into the world. Bring peace into the
world. When you see somebody struggling, don't
be silent about it. Stand up for what you think
is right, whether you believe in God or not,
whether you have a faith or not. The moral compass
is still there to love one another, to be kind
to each other, and to stand up for what is right.
I think that would be no matter what your career
is, whatever your path may be, you're still a
human being and the next person is just as human
as you. And so we're all in it together, guys.
That's beautiful. Pastor Candy, anything else
you'd like to say? I don't know. The world is
a challenging place right now. But you have the
gift of youth. Some of you, maybe some of you
are older students, but know this. I turned 80
yesterday. Congratulations. Thanks. This is your
whole life. Your career might stop when you think
you're retired at 65 or whatever, but think in
terms of your whole life of learning and growing
and doing and pay attention to this beautiful
world that God has made and given us that has
just one sign after another of the goodness and
the creativity that God has. Don't go through
life with blinders on. And do good. Do good.
Well, thank you for those inspirational words.
Thank you so much, Pastor Candy and Bianca, for
coming in today. We really appreciate your time
and your wisdom. And hopefully that will be something
to inspire people as well. Thanks for having
us. It's an honor and a pleasure.