I think we also have a few ritual things. Like,
for example, every day, once we get up, I make
her coffee and bring it to her. And once she
gets out of the shower, I immediately bring the
towel and towel her off. Those are just a couple
of... You make the bed every day. Yeah, and I
make the bed. I think one of the most important
things that someone will learn, a wife who is
not stressed starts thinking about sex more.
A super stressed wife... does not think about
sex very much. This podcast contains explicit
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about sex, dominance, power exchange, and ethical
non -monogamy. It is intended for audiences 18
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The views expressed by our guests are theirs
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isn't the show for you. But if you're ready to
step into your masculine edge and embrace a lifestyle
that demands mastery, welcome to the Brotherhood.
Welcome to the Bull Brotherhood podcast, where
we talk power, pleasure, and the art of dominance
in ethical non -monogamy. This is not your average
lifestyle podcast. and men who leave a lasting
impression. If you're here, you're not just curious.
You're ready to elevate. So to all the bulls,
hot wives, stags, and open -minded explorers,
we see you. Let's go. Good evening, ladies and
gentlemen, and welcome to another exhilarating
episode of the Bull Brotherhood podcast. I'm
the one and only Sigma male themself, Brian Morgan,
a .k .a. the Long Wolf. One third of the podcast
family, along with my couple, the lovely Siren.
Hey, baby. Hey, Brian. I don't know why you deceived
me. I'm tired, but this always rejuvenates my
spirit, so I'm excited. Outstanding. And of course,
ladies and gentlemen, the nephew himself, Socrates.
What's up, big boy? What's good, Unc? How you
doing? I'm doing wonderful, and Happy New Year
to you guys, if I did not tell you earlier. But
ladies and gentlemen, this is the... episode
that brings us back. It is 2026. We are at the
start of another new year and I'm very, very
excited along with Socrates and Siren to get
this thing started again. And tonight we actually
have a couple that comes from the Pacific Northwest,
I believe, and they are very, very good friends
with Socrates and Siren. They are Victoria and
James. Hello, couple. Hi. Hey, how are you guys?
Doing wonderful. Thank you for being on the podcast.
This is my first time hearing about you guys,
so I'm very, very excited to get your origin
story and find out what this true female -led
relationship couple is all about. So I'm going
to turn it over, ladies and gentlemen, to Socrates
and Siren, and they're going to lead this tonight.
Believe me, I will chime in when I hear something
to talk about. But I'm just going to sit here
and let Victoria and James get with Socrates
and Simon and let them tell their story. Go ahead,
nephew. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So first off, I want
to say Happy New Year to everybody. I'm really,
really excited. Happy New Year. Thank you. Thank
you. This is actually our second episode of the
New Year. Our first one was the. You know, kind
of our intro, what we're doing this year. So
that will come out. And I'm really excited for
this new year. I want to talk about that for
half a second. Then we're going to get to Victoria
and James. We're really excited about what we
have for our future. One of the things, this
is new me. I'm no longer the perpetual student.
Because I've sat under my unk and he's taught
me the ways of the force, I've graduated to Jedi.
And I'm no longer a perpetual student. I'm always
in my mastery form, learning to be, you know,
like my uncle and all of my masters and all the
guys that take this craft seriously and truly
care for the people that are in this community.
And I'm really excited to make that announcement
because my uncle and all of my mentors and this
brotherhood of ours, that is truly a fraternity
of brothers that love this lifestyle. have elevated
me, and I just want to say thank you all. I'm
going to give a shout -out to Brian Morgan, who
was my direct unc, my mentor, and the guy that
I choose who has the final word that was established
in the triangle debate as the man. I want to
shout -out to Dimitri. I want to shout -out to
my boy D, Dimitri. D, you have lightened my fire,
man. You have encouraged me and built me up.
I want to shout -out to my boy Damien. I'm sorry,
Mr. Mocha. We'll switch that out. I want to shout
out to my boy, Mr. Mocha, who, you know, recently
accepted me into his home and got me on the right
track. To Pagan, who's taught me about sex magic
and the power of his word. And Michael C., who
is the, that's the mouthpiece right there, bro.
That man has the gifts of gab. And, you know,
he can talk his way into anything, including
to a beautiful woman's arms. So that's the new
me. So let's get started and talk about Victoria
and James. So I met them at Splash Smoke in 2023.
And a little story about my journey is that she
is the epitome of what I value, which is tall
and curvaceous and just feminine and beautiful
and elegant and classy. And the vibe is always
number one. That guy is dope, man. I admire that
guy so much. James is just a cool dude, good
heart, and represents the power of a cook. And
I'm so sad that these guys out here in the world
don't understand the power of that. And then,
so I saw her, and she went up to Michael C. And
Michael C. is like 5 '6 or something. I don't
know, 6 '11 or something. I don't know. The dude's
tall. And so is Victoria. And she went up to
him and I met them in a seminar. And she went
up to him and she hugged him and she said, I
just love a tall man. And because I didn't have
the ways of the force back then, I didn't know
that that has nothing to do with attracting a
woman. It has to do with my confidence. So I
told myself a lie. Well, I'm only six. And so
maybe she won't be interested in me. And I did
not approach her. And that was one of the biggest
mistakes. And we end up. meeting at the end of
splash and we're all tired and we sat down and
my wife siren reminded me that you know we sat
down have a really great conversation with them
and they had this nice little business card and
we we talked and we shared and we realized you
know what we're vibing the next time we see each
other we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna connect
and so that's where it started so Victoria, talk
to me about your origin story. What got you guys
into the lifestyle? What got you guys to decide
to make that lifestyle decision? Oh, gosh. Well,
it was probably about four to five years ago
that we were in a position that our kids were
getting ready to leave the nest. We were trying
to figure out, actually, I was really motivated
to figure out what to do next. I spent a lot
of time putting everything I had into helping
make sure that the kids were successful and giving
everything I could to them. And I was not exactly
sure what the next step was going to be. And
so we were on our way to an event. We were driving
along the lake and I had talked to James and
said, okay, what do you think we should do when
the kids are graduated? Should we go hiking?
Should we try out new breweries? And he said,
I think you should dominate me. And I almost
drove into the lake. I'm like, I don't even know
what that means. Very, very vanilla lifestyle.
We'd been married for over 20 years at that point.
Very, very vanilla lifestyle. And I said, well,
does that mean I have to wear leather? What is
that? So anyway, all of that state just opened
a really big conversation about a part of our
life that we didn't really spend a lot of time
paying attention to. And yeah, and then about
a month after that, he said, hey, I wouldn't
mind if you were. with another guy. And I'm like,
yeah, I just got used to this other idea. What
are you talking about? Right, like you're throwing
them at me too quick. Yeah, I'm like, this is
absolutely nuts. No, no, I'm not interested in
having sex with another guy. That's like absolutely
insane. There's not really, even if I was, there's
not really a market. This was my opinion. There's
not really a market for guys who are interested.
in middle -aged women who've had children. And,
you know, anyway, and that started another conversation.
Well, I've since found that that was an inaccurate
perception on my part. So, yeah, so that's kind
of what started the conversation, a lot of research
into female -led relationships. I hadn't ever
heard that term. I had never heard the term cuckold.
I hadn't ever, I knew nothing about that. So
I just delved into, once the shock wore off,
I just delved into researching as much as I could
because I figured we'd been together long enough
that if it was important for him to bring up.
then it was important for me to figure out and
at least understand what he was asking. So James,
had you already researched this before you asked
her to dominate, build another guy? I guess in
the sense research, watching a lot of porn of
female dominatrix and also huckled stuff. And
yeah, so I did a lot of research with that, certainly.
If you can call it research. We call it Pornhub
research. Yeah. That's definitely research. That's
definitely research. Yeah. I mean, you consider
me the lead researcher then. Yes, I did a lot
of research. I have several papers written on
it. Seeing is believing, okay? You can read about
it all damn day, but until you actually see it,
then you know what, you know. So great. Good.
That's a very good, that's a very good cook.
Please continue. Please continue. Yep. So, Victoria.
Oh, go ahead. No, no, go ahead. What happened
after that? Actually, I was going to let you
go ahead. There's, I guess there's, I mean, you
know, that led into going into Adult Friend Finder,
which was the worst thing in the world. Because
it felt like, you know, from going to nothing,
when we met and started dating, you know, at
this point. As of today, we've been together
for 30 years. Dating apps were not a thing. The
internet was barely a thing. And so he said,
hey, let's get on Adult Friend Finder. And I'm
like, it was awful. I said, get me off of this
thing. It feels like I just have like dongs flying
at my face all day long. I just, I'm overwhelmed.
This is, it's not attractive. There's yeah, there's
no communication. I'm not interested. So I said,
yeah, I'm going to take the reins on this and
I'm going to figure this out. So I basically
Googled because I told him that I said, you know,
I think this is the single male thing is probably
too complicated. I think swinging is going to
be easier. Obviously another terrible assumption,
but so I said, yeah, it was awful. So I Googled,
how do you find swingers in the state that we're
in? And it led me to Cassidy, which was a site.
And so we got on Cassidy and I told James, I
said, okay, if we're going to do this and if
we're going to try this, we're going to go where
swingers congregate. So we're going to go on
a cruise. And we're going to be locked at sea
with all these swingers. And by the end of this,
we're going to know if we like it or not. We
don't like it. We can just stay in our room and
order room service. So that's what we did. And
we basically scheduled a cruise and started talking
with people. And I kind of got over that thing,
thinking that I was too old or, you know, all
of the things that one thinks, the negative talk
that people have about themselves. And we booked
this cruise. and it was all alcohol was included
and i said we're gonna we're gonna find a way
to have a good time even if we don't like that
part of it and then we started talking with couples
and single males and the weekend before the cruise
we're like okay we're gonna rip the band -aid
off and so we spent one night with a couple and
another night with a single male and we said
okay this worked great let's go on the cruise
and so that's kind of how we started and the
it was it was it was honestly and you guys know
this by now since we've met that it was really
my intentions were pure of the single male and
then she brought up doing the couple thing and
swinging I'm like well you know if you're gonna
call me up to smash and pussy I guess I'll guess
I'll jump in if I have to he was such a trooper
yeah he was such a so we really dabbled in Both,
you know. Yeah. And our philosophy was we're
going to try everything twice because we don't
know anything about anything. And I'm not going
to have any idea of what I enjoy or not until
I do all the things. And so that started a year
of what I call drinking from a fire hose, so
to speak, of us. gone like all the weekends,
every other weekend, always doing something,
always going somewhere, traveling, traveling,
traveling, meeting people, doing things. And
yeah, that was about for the first year. And
then we kind of got into our groove and kind
of really figured what we liked. And during that
time, we were, it was couples and single males.
both and kind of navigating both of those realms
and still doing things. FLR, we had contract,
we have a contract between us. We had rules and,
and things that we had. And so it, we were doing,
we were kind of living in both existences and
really it was, James gave me the, the space to
really figure out what I liked and he just went
at the direction of it. So it was really great,
and he was always really, really great and supportive
for whatever I want. And he still is this way.
Whatever I want to do, wherever I want to go.
If I want to take a break, I take a break. If
I don't, I don't. And he's just along to support
me along with it, which is amazing. Okay, let's
rewind. Tell me about the contract. Well, so,
yeah, we started the contract because, you know,
we Googled it, and we figured out what do we
do. This is something. And I was trying to figure
it out. I'd done books and stuff, and we Googled
how to put together a contract. And so the contract
was really clear as to what his position was,
what the philosophy was with me, and what he
deferred to me in. There were areas where he's
actually better at things than me. That sounds
really actually rude, but of course he's better
at things than I am. But I, yeah, so I deferred
to him to those things, but I have the final
say in things. We have rules that he, from that
moment when we made that decision, there was
no masturbation on his part. You know, I cage
him when I want to. That's completely my decision.
And, and kind of, you know, just that he is in
all things. It's the basis of him doing things
for me. Today is about how you think? Yeah, that
roughly sums it up. Did I miss anything in there?
I'll tell you if you miss something. Whatever,
shut up. Just kidding. I love that. You guys
didn't think that was as funny as we did. I'm
going to beat his ass after this, and you won't
be able to see the mark. I didn't want to sound
like a total pussy in front of everybody, so
I'll try to sound tough for a moment. I know.
I say that I beat his ass, but he'd like it too
much. Yeah. Or I could help out with that, you
know. I like to help you sometimes. Yes. Sorry,
Brain. Did that answer your question? Yeah, that
pretty much tapped into everything. Sounds good.
And then we'd go to Sunday breakfast and we'd
kind of review it for a bit. And we just did
re -up of it probably about three or four months
ago. We went through it and updated it and went
through it and made sure that everything looked
correct. And sometimes if we feel like we're
getting off base, we'll go back to it and return
to it. Yeah, and part of that is obviously that
she has complete sexual freedom. regardless of
checking with me or not. I love that. But I actually
don't exercise that because I also understand
that when I'm given such incredible freedom and
power within the relationship, that I'm also,
you know, that's an incredible responsibility
and I need to be very cautious and careful about
how I wield that kind of power. Nice Spider -Man
quote. Stop it. It's not a Spider -Man quote.
With great power comes great responsibility.
I did not say that. You were pretty close. Thanks
for the backup on that. I selfishly want to get
to the juicy part of how we know Victoria and
James and how we... had an interaction with them,
our first interaction with them. Can we talk
about that? Patience, siren, patience. We'll
get to it. Yeah, that was fantastic. Oh, yeah.
I mean, trust me, we're going to get into that
one. I want to tell my listeners, I make bold
statements. This is not, Victoria and James are
too humble for this, so I'm going to speak for
them. In my humble opinion, this is an exemplary
couple. Let me review what they said. They had
a conversation. The cuck. did his own research
first. And go back to our episode in season one
about research. I don't know what number it is,
but we'll put that in the show notes. So they
started off with their own kind of research,
and porn is research. That's fine. I wouldn't
recommend porn, but because I did with, actually
I started with the porn and Adult Friend Finder,
and I loved it. So we can talk about that end
of it. But they started with research. Then they
had a good conversation. Then they researched
more, and she mentioned some books. I'd love
to hear what those books are later. And then
they did more research, and then they just jumped
in. I mean, after that, they came up with a contract
because the research said that might be the best
way to handle these things. Write them down.
We just helped another couple, and they called
it a constitution, and we love that. You write
it down because people forget, people don't remember.
You might be in the moment. That's beautiful.
And then they execute it. And then they go back
and they sit down and they review everything.
That is the best way to do it. In my opinion,
again, there's other ways. I'm not saying that
there isn't other models of starting. But I believe
this couple is exemplary because of those foundational
principles that we always talk about in this
episode. And they're too humble to say it, so
I'm going to toot their horn. And that's why
I have them on because, or I invited them to
come share their story because there's many ways
to do it. But she's authentically this, guys.
Like, these couple, this is who they authentically
are. And my theory is that because they took
their professionalism as professionals, as parents,
as adults in this world, and they took some of
those things. and they applied it into their
everyday life and their lifestyle, it was easy
transition. Would you guys agree, Victoria and
James? Well, I mean, I think that that's incredibly
complimentary of you. We totally left out all
of the parts where we totally fucked up, and
we had to, you know, things blew up, and we had
to pick up the pieces and kind of figure out
what to do. So, I mean, which we would now tell
you that none of that was bad. It was all wonderful
way, I should say. a segue into great communication
hard at the time but we like when i said we tried
everything we did and we just kind of did it
and then figured out about how we felt about
it afterwards so i mean i think that you give
us a lot of accolades and a lot of a lot of credit
and we did have a very very very solid foundation
prior to engaging in all of this but like people
say time and time again if if you when you engage
in this it definitely highlights any cracks in
your foundation and you quickly figure out how
to resolve those you know if you're going to
have any sort of longevity i would think in this
and i think you brought up a great point about
research i mean now i certainly have like many
many more better resources where if some guy
is thinking of talking to his wife and introducing
these concepts there's a lot of stuff out there
that are much much better than obviously porn
because it's it's counter to what you should
be doing i mean like evolvingyourman .com and
some other books there's some really good stuff
out there that you can introduce to your wife
that is really that will introduce it in the
correct way where she can digest it better i
think yeah but anyway thank you for for the for
the thoughtful comments for us Yeah, and, you
know, I pride myself on being authentic. Like,
I got some couples I'm like, I just told a couple,
I think you need to get out and take a break
because y 'all are tripping. I have no compunction
telling people, you know, where I think they
are because I'm always coming from a place of
love and I want to see everybody in this lifestyle
win. And, yeah, and some people, you know, me
and Siren didn't have 30 years under our belt,
but I worked extremely hard. And she put up with
my craziness to build a really— I still am. Oh,
yes. To build a really strong, solid foundation.
And I drilled her. And I practiced. And we talked.
And we went over a lot of things. And to her
credit, she said, bet. I will meet it and exceed
it. And she did. And she leapfrogged me in some
ways. In some ways, I'm learning from her. I
just really love that foundation. So talk to
us about the FLR part. I think it just kind of
goes back to the contract and that at the end
of the day, I am the person who calls the shots
on it. I think we also have a few ritual things.
Like, for example, every day once we get up,
I make her coffee and bring it to her. And once
she gets out of the shower, I immediately bring
the towel and towel her off. Those are just a
couple of... You make the bed every day. Yeah,
and I make the bed. I think one of the most important
things that someone will learn, a wife who is
not stressed starts thinking about sex more.
A super stressed wife... Does not think about
sex very much. Hallelujah. Preach. Amen. James,
you're turning me on. Oh, yeah. James, hold on.
Should I say non -stressed wife a few more times?
Hold on. Hold the fuck. Gentlemen out there.
Doing dishes. James. I'm touching my nipples
now. Okay. So I'm going to be talking about this
in the future. It's called frame in the manosphere
community. What that means is, is that when you
give a woman the space and freedom to feel secure
and safe and non -judged, and like I said, and
quiet her mind, and that's what he's talking
about, relieving the stress, then that helps
activate a woman's natural juices, her natural
desires, her natural fantasies. And so that's
why I say this is an exemplary couple because
James is a smart motherfucker. He knows what
he's talking about, y 'all. So gentlemen out
there, listen. Love it, love it. So, okay, Siren,
I'll let you go ahead. So what happened is we
had connected. And I'll let you take over from
that point to leading up to the juicy stuff because
I know you're really excited about that. Hey,
I know James is too. And James and I, it's funny
with the female lead because then, you know,
James and I kind of took over this part. So we
had talked about having my back. Okay, there
we go. And I don't remember who brought up the
whole thing, but I had talked to Michael C. about
cuck sitting. And for those of you not familiar
with that, because it's it's really, you know,
not talked about a lot, but it's really fun.
And I had talked to Michael C. and he said, well,
what why do you want to do it? And I said, because
I just feel so excited by the idea of watching
my husband sit there, you know. play with this
woman and please her and ravish her while sitting
next to her husband and talking to him about
it. And I said, you know, whether that helps
him to, you know, be more calm about the situation,
to enjoy that situation, etc. I just want to
be in service to that cuckold couple. So I think
what kind of brought it up is that at the second
Splash Mocha that we went to, My husband was
playing with this woman and I ended up sitting
next to her husband and just watching. And I
said, do you want me to like suck a dick or something?
Like, you know, can I do something for you? I
was just like, he's like, oh, no, no, no. I just
watch. And he's like, but we can talk. And I
was like, oh, OK. And then at that same event,
I watched him play with another woman and sat
next to the husband. And that husband, he's like,
I said, OK, so we just sit here and talk, you
know. And he said, oh, he's like, well, he's
like, these are her events, but I do play outside
of here. So it kind of just brought the idea
going. Well, then we started talking to Victoria
and James. And kind of brought the idea of cucksitting
to them. And we kind of just explored the idea
and how it would work with them. And kind of
all four of us learned together. And it was really
a really cool thing. Did you have something,
Socrates? Yeah, I was going to say, that's because
I'm fun to watch, y 'all. I'm fun to watch. If
you do say so yourself. And we had actually.
Oh, I'm probably jumping ahead about this, but
we had actually dabbled in this once before,
not to necessarily the same level, but I had
played with the power exchange of giving the
key to another woman before. And that was kind
of the conversation that you and I had had. siren
about, okay, you know, what does this look like?
What does it do? And so for me, it was a bit
of a ritualistic thing to say, okay, if you're
going to cook sit him and you're going to manage
it, I'm going to give you this key. So I'm not
going to worry about it anymore. I now provide
you with the responsibility of this and do what
you will with it. I've subcontracted. Right.
And from my perspective, when you're talking
about this, you're describing that other event
and the guy says, yeah, I'm just watching. And
I'm thinking like, wait a minute, my wife getting
ravaged by some other guy and I'm sitting there
with his wife and she's dirty talking about how
great it is. Like, fuck yeah, sign me up. This
sounds amazing. And it was, yeah, it was even
better than that when it happened. Right. So
I messaged Victoria privately and I said, hey,
so I've never done this. I'm very excited, but
I want to know what your guidelines are. What
are my do's? What are my don'ts? And then, like
she said, she brought up giving me the key. And
I said, whew, I immediately caught my breath.
I said, that is a lot of responsibility. And
I said, let me talk to my husband about that
because. I don't know, you know, if I want to
do that, should I do that? So Socrates and I
talked it over and, you know, and he said, she's
offering it to you. Just find out all the do's
and don'ts and you'll be fine. And I said, okay.
And then I was very like, whew, angsty, you know,
about that whole key thing. And so in the group
chat, I know Socrates and Victoria were flirting
back and forth. And then James and I, we were
creating the fantasy. James right away had a
lot of ideas of what would be going on. And it
was hilarious because, you know, Victoria was
very generous with her do's and don'ts as well.
I have since cuck sat for a couple of other couples
and they weren't quite so, the wife wasn't quite
as generous and that is totally fine. I said,
I can do anything from sit there and just sit
with him and be quiet. all the way to whatever
you want, which you will hear more about in a
second. Or you can either sit there or sit on
my face. Yeah. Are those two choices? Right.
So when we asked, I said, well, James, what does
this look like for you? And he said, well, you
know, go ahead and say what you, you know, what
one of your ideas was. Oh, God, I'm trying to,
because I had a lot of ideas. Well, James should
be an erotic writer. He should. The man has nothing
but... It was like unending fantasies. I just
don't want to like not do it justice. It was
so descriptive. It like, I was like, I didn't
know that I was going to get all turned on by
this. I went in, I was a very service minded,
you know, going to help out and everything. And
I didn't realize how great it would be, you know,
for a turn on for everyone. So he described,
you know, like basically like me sitting on his
face. and just telling him about what was going
on with his wife and my husband. And it would
basically be something like this. Yeah. So Victoria
and Socrates will be blah, blah, blah, blah,
blah, blah. And then he it was like very boring.
And then whatever him and I were doing, he was
very descriptive and very erotic. He was very
excited about being cucksat, you know, very excited.
And that just made it even more fun because,
you know, you could just feel his excitement
coming out. So then we get to, you know, it's
probably four months of us all talking and planning
everything. And then we get to Fort Lauderdale
Splash Mocha. And, you know, we go and talk to
them. It was Wednesday night. And, you know,
we're all excited. We're going to go do this.
And we only talked very shortly. And then we
said, let's just go, you know. So I had planned
out an outfit. Very strappy, very dominatrix
looking. I had a flogger. She was going to give
me his key, this whole thing. So I was really,
you know, getting into the character of this
cucksitter. I think we planned more about that
aspect of it than... actually victorian socrates
playing oh because that's the only reason because
the day i saw her i already had my plan set i
was like i've been waiting on this shit for a
year i know what i'm gonna do and i you know
and in all fairness i am such a like black and
white Type A. Black and white. Oh, black and
white. That too. But I am very literal. I am
not a creative person and he's the fantasy person.
He's the one who has the ideas. I am so literal
that I would never even be able to imagine that
in a million years. So it's really, really handy
for him to be able to have that creative aspect
of it. And for me. It actually feels really great
to have no plans and to say, Siren, you're a
fantastic grown ass woman. Here's the key. Do
what you will. He knows if it's something he
shouldn't do and he'll let you know. And then
I'm going to go about my business. I don't have
to worry about it. i'm business y 'all i'm the
business she was talking about but i mean it's
actually very freeing and the our relationship
is so much in my turn on that i found out over
all of this is the power differential it's all
about the power differential for me and And it
was very, very fun and freeing. It's not for
everyone. There are many in similar relationships
to ours that would absolutely think this is a
terrible idea and that I should never do that.
I disagree. It's amazing. But at the end of the
day, we do what works for us. And we are not
kind of pigeonholed into any sort of box. talk
to each other and we figure out what we enjoy
and we go from there and we trust one another
that we'll, we'll be able to manage whatever
way we go. So all of that to say, that was kind
of the disclaimer of people think I'm a terrible
cuckoldress. Yeah. It's, you know, that's why
I say it's all the way from, Hey, I'll just sit
quietly with him to, you know, what ended up
happening, you know? So, you know, so we will
arrive at the room. I had something over my outfit.
as to not distract regular hotel patrons. And
we go to the room. They have done a beautiful
job with lighting and just really setting the
mood. The music is going. It's a very welcoming
and erotic environment. And immediately, as soon
as I am in the room and the door is closed and
Socrates is behind me, James falls down in front
of me and says, May I undress you? And I don't
remember if he if he called me a queen or something.
I don't I have no idea. I can't remember that
part. But I just remember he just immediately
fell down and was like just shaking with excitement
and asked to help me undress. And so, you know,
he helped me take the outfit on that was over
it. And he was just his eyes were as big as saucers.
And it was just such so exciting the entire time
and the entire focus. You know, we thought. That
maybe, you know, we were going to sit and we
were going to do all of this stuff. And Socrates
and Victoria were going to get into their play.
And that is not what happened at all. So the
focus of the... Red strappy outfit. You remember,
you remember that? It's a good thing he's caged.
We're going to keep that boner under control.
And I, and I didn't, I had a hard idea. Hard,
sorry. Now I'm distracted. I had a hard time
with the concept of punishing someone, but James
was very disobedient. And so he got punished.
And so that was, that was very easy after that,
you know, and then I made him. undress himself
and then you know just began running the flogger
over him and and doing various things socrates
who raised your hand Yeah, no, I want you to
keep going. And there's one part I really want
to just say myself. So just keep going. I just
want to raise your hand when you want to say
that. So we just proceeded. I just was teasing
him. And, you know, he's like, may I touch you?
And then I'd let him touch me. And then I'd say
no. And I just, you know, we just played around
with it because it was a first for me of, you
know, having that control over another man. I
never. had done anything like it before I never
do anything dominating with my husband nor do
I want to but because I was borrowing the power
from Victoria it made it fun it made it excitement
exciting it made it something you know that we
were exploring so as we got further into it I
did end up ordering him to lie down on the couch
and then I was going to ride his face but then
he touched me And I said, you did not have permission
to touch me, and now you will wait. And then
I got back up, and I wouldn't let him touch me,
and he was just shaking with excitement the entire
time. And, you know, just, you know, Socrates
and Victoria, you know, began to get started.
I began to reference to them, and then Socrates
wants to tell this part. Yeah, so let me set
the scene for y 'all. Yeah. I have expanded my
palette of the ladies. And I always put vibe
first. But you guys have to understand, when
I designed in my mind the kind of elegant, classy,
curvy, tall, and delicious woman, Victoria's
it, y 'all. And I always said, pussy focuses
me. I'm not the type of, I can be in a room,
a crowded room, and what's in front of me, it
focuses me. I'm always, I'm always mastering
my craft. I'm always focused on the woman in
front of me to give her the best experience I
can. And I'm sitting here and they're doing their
thing and I'm like, okay, you know, let's move
towards, I don't even remember what I did, but
we moved slowly and we got to the point where
she's laying on the bed and I'm telling you,
nine times out of 10, 99 times out of 100, I'm
like, Whatever is going on, I don't care. I got
this beautiful, classy, delicious, good vibe
woman in front of me. And this time I had, like
she said, I don't ever get to see a dominant
siren because she don't do that with me. She
doesn't want to and she ain't doing it, even
if she wanted to. And I saw that for the first
time. And for the first time ever, I could not
take my eyes off of those two guys. I was like.
What the fuck is going on? Not two guys. I mean
these two people, you know what I mean? I don't
mean guys. Let's correct that, folks, quickly.
These, you know, my wife and James. And I was
like, I don't know what's going on. But at the
same time, I feel like, Victoria, you felt the
same way, right? Oh, 100%. But I had been in
swinging positions with James. And he... James
is very animated and he can definitely with his
animation it causes and so a James Siren combo
with all of this was like I mean it was so distracting
in all of the best ways There was no way that
you and I were going to be able to get done anything
that we needed to get done while that amount
of fireworks was happening. It was just a display.
You could not help but stop and watch just at
this really great power exchange and just great
energy. And it was great to watch. And it was
super fun for me to watch. handing over that
power to someone else and seeing what they did
with it because it was very it was similar to
what i did but it had a different flavor so it
was kind of a little artful watching someone
else paint on the same canvas so to speak and
it was so funny that as siren you're talking
about this and and not being into dominating
and i guess you looking back maybe you were a
little bit reticent initially but boy you took
it very quickly and it was amazing Took to it
quite well. Girls, a quick study. Well, I guess
it was, you know, in the vanilla world, you know,
outside world, I have to do a lot of, you know,
decision making and stuff for work. And so I
had never really wanted to be in the dominating
space, you know, in the lifestyle. And so. You
know, that's still that personality came through,
but it came through in such a fun way. It was
like I didn't have to be there doing any of that.
I got to be I got the privilege. You know, my
husband was allowing me to to be there to do
that. Those things. Victoria was giving me the
power, you know, over her husband. And so that
just made it a privilege. It made it fun. It
didn't seem like any sort of work or anything
that I would have imagined that it would be.
And then I just got into it, you know, and at
one point I shoved him up against the wall and
I said, do you think that you're going to be
able to fuck me with that little tiny dick? You
better try. You better try because your queen
over there is not going to let you be cuckset
again unless you give it your full effort. And
it was just fun. It was just moments like that.
Or when I did finally ride his face and I waterboarded
him with my squirt. We did that a couple of times.
In the end, when we did, I did, you know, try
to get the cage off at one point, and that was
kind of comical because I imagined very differently.
I imagined, like, just something with a padlock,
and his, it was, like, fit together. So she had
to get off the bed and come help me. You know,
so just moments like that where we were learning
and, you know, but then just as the scene was
unfolding. I should have given you a chastity
cage 101. Right, a little YouTube video of, like,
how to take it apart and put it back together.
to practice yes but i was yes the cylinder lock
is not intuitive yeah i have one you can take
off right now as we speak so right that thing's
not coming off for a while it was you know and
it's it was a lot of fun and it was trust in
the individuals involved and it was great communication
you guys it was fantastic to communicate with
you And it was actually something we haven't
replicated since because it's just a very selective,
it's a very selective energy and situation. It's
something that I enjoy, but I'm just selective
as to who I would do that with. Yeah, I don't
know about you guys that that could be replicated.
You guys are amazing. And it was just the excitement
and energy behind doing it. It was the complete
respect of what was. happening and what I was
doing by providing you with that power and it
was yeah it the setup was perfect and I and I
you know even though you know Socrates and I
Did not in the moment accomplish what I think
we had originally set out to do because we were
distracted by the show, the three ring circus
that was happening in the corner. Eventually
I just asked if I could take your cuck to my
room and we ate snacks and got in our jammies
and let you guys have your fun. And that was
really, really. Yeah. And that's the part of
giving over the power is that you also have to
be able to take care, do the aftercare with it
too. So you did a lovely, lovely job with that.
And before we cover any other part, I'd also
like to say. premature ejaculation is the highest
form of flattery. That has nothing to do with
anything specific, just a general statement.
Well, I got to tell you too, guys, that everything
was so amazing and so stimulating and so hot
that, you know what, that might've been the first
time that it actually happened looking back,
but James was unable, even though we took the
cage off, he didn't get an erection really, even
though he was so turned on. And then he, came
anyways just trying to kind of like flop his
little penis around on me and then i squirted
i squirted all over him and he was not inside
me just and he wasn't rubbing on me really he
was just sort of flopping it on me like a little
gummy worm and and it was so just the whole thing
of being watched by socrates and victoria and
that happening it i squirted on him and now i've
been able to like squirt without really being
like you know penetrated or you know specifically
stimulated so I think that might have been the
first time that that happened for me so that
was a cool thing too that happened I thought
was like why why am I this guy is not even inside
me and I'm just like this whole situation is
so cool that my body just responded that way
so and then you know you gave me extra you're
like for the rest of the weekend you know he
can help you know do whatever you need him to
do so he was my suntan lotion cook and ran and
got us drinks and different things. And then
when we, you know, saw you again, you allowed
me the privilege of teasing him a little bit
still, which, you know, not everyone wants to
continue outside that. So I appreciate that privilege
as well. Well, I think you bring up a really
good point, though, that the mental stimulation,
I think for us specifically, and that's why why
cuckolding is just so. where we've landed i mean
since that experience with you in 23 we have
gone very much i mean very rarely the swinging
situation and almost exclusively interracial
cuckolding situations that have gotten you know,
really, really clear that that is where we have
landed in our journey. We never count anything
out ever because you never know what kind of
people you meet. We still go to swinging events
because we have friends that are. We enjoy the
fun, sexy atmosphere. But when we go to like
utopia, the cuckold specific events, that is
where we shine and flourish and are our freest,
most wonderful sexual selves. I just heard there's
possibly a chance I may get some strange in the
future. Very small chance. God love them. You
know what? That's part of what my job is, just
to keep a little hope alive for them. What did
I missed? What did you say, James? You might
get what? I said there's a small chance I may
get some strange in the future somewhere. Yeah,
that's what I heard. Yeah. No, he's not. So we
shall see. I have one question about Utopia regarding
James. And then I really want to talk about the
future of Victoria and James. I am a researcher.
I love asking questions because I love seeing
from other people's perspectives because perspective
is one of the most powerful things. So I asked
everybody, because I had worked with my boy Michael
C., and we were helping cook and do all these
other things for Utopia. You know, it's great.
You guys should check it out. You know, check
out Michael C.'s website and look into it. And
so, but I was asking everybody. I really wanted
to know their feedback. And James, do you remember
what you had told me? Because that changed my
whole perspective on co -coding, and it changed
the trajectory of... of my lifestyle journey.
Gosh, I guess I don't remember what I specifically
said. You said something super profound. You
did. So what I was asking everybody and he was
like, he was like, you know, there's no place
where we're like 100 % celebrated and 100 % accepted
and we could just be our authentic selves. And
I was like, wow. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And I was
like, wow, you mean, you know, All we need to
do, and everybody wants this, they want their
own place, their own home, their own community
where they can just let loose and be themselves
and not worry about, you know, people thinking
it's weird or wrong or whatever they think. And
that really inspired me because I was like, I
can do that. You know, me and my wife, Siren,
have been doing some form of events our entire
lives. And we learned the ways of the lifestyle.
And we're now learning how to integrate that.
And we're looking forward to doing some cook
-hold specific events ourselves. But, James,
you were the one that gave me the framework to
move forward. And now Brian already knew this,
right? And, you know, he's been in the game for
30 years, right? He knew it, but I had to see
it for myself, right? It's like giving people
a space. to be themselves and i love that calling
it's like a calling to me now and it's really
really difficult to find that an event that curates
to cuckolds it's just it's very rare and you
find that the people that attend it's like going
somewhere where you have your own secret handshake
it is absolutely nirvana for us I mean I hate
to say they named it utopia but I mean truly
that's what it is that is where when we attended
that event then we attended the subsequent event
we just said everything makes sense it is now
we had dabbled in a lot of things we were kind
of doing a lot of things simultaneously and we
said this is really it this is where we both
have such a great feeling of Absolute freedom
that we can do whatever we want, however we want.
We can try whatever we want. And it was absolutely
phenomenal. So they're rare events to find, but
gosh, they're magical when you do find them.
We're going to be doing them. And the Bull Brotherhood
is gearing up to that. And because of that. And
another thing that Victoria said is we were,
you know, after the whole event, we were talking
and she said, you know what? I have realized
I am never. And I don't know what you guys have
done since then, but she's like, I am never going
to do anything where my husband is not 100 percent
a part of this. And I was like, you go, girl.
That's what I'm talking about. You know, you
discover yourself and you realize this is where
we belong. We discovered some very specific dynamics
that we enjoy that we would have not found necessarily
at an event like that. It was really just, it
was such a, it was a time of really a lot of
growth for us that was just kind of compounded
by the next event. So yeah, keep us on our list.
Keep us on your mailing list if you have events
because. We're, we, we love them. It's just,
it, it is, we find it's just rejuvenating for
our soul and we, it's, it's wonderful. We just,
we're, we're super grateful to have those opportunities.
I love it. And let me add too, it was, it was
beautiful for me, like Socrates and I are in
a stag and vixen relationship. So here we are
at this event, just helping out with all these.
cuckold couples and it was beautiful for me because
I got to just learn so much by watching and being
around and asking questions of just the different
ways that everyone moved in their dynamics and
that's was my intention for the weekend is to
just go there and just to learn and to be a student
of what was going on and because that is an underserved
community. in the lifestyle you know as you mentioned
there's not as many events and so it was great
to just go there and be a part of that in a small
way to you know just learn more about and just
you know because sometimes people will be like
oh cuckold you know that's weird or whatever
I was probably one of them for sure you know
but as you learn about it and you just see the
love that you guys have for each other and the
respect and how you practice that, then it's
just beautiful just to watch and to know about
it. And I just had a huge growth and appreciation
for that dynamic after that weekend. So thank
you guys for being a part of that. And thank
you for saying that. I mean, that's always been
one of my biggest concerns to keep that bit hidden
from many because, I mean, obviously. We try
to be very hidden just based on our jobs and
things like that. But even in the community,
the hot wiping, the splash, the splash community,
the swinging community, we're pretty quiet about
the cock holding piece because it comes with
so many negative connotations. And I cannot stand
the idea of anyone looking at James. and thinking
him any less than the absolutely phenomenal individual
that he is. The thought of anyone thinking anything
less than he is absolutely amazing is sickening
to me. So I guard it and I'm very, very, very
cautious with it, which is probably even more
why cuckold events are so wonderful because no
one... everyone it's just and that's why i think
it's so important for you know people outside
the cuckold dynamic to learn about it and to
you know that's why i wanted to go because i
feel like you know with my mouthpiece as having
my own podcast with the siren of freedom and
you know people are starting to you know recognize
me and so it's important for someone to know
and understand all dynamics so that when people
come to you, you know, they will listen. They'll
say, oh, well, you know, maybe we need to open
our minds to more things. And so the more we
educate ourselves and the more non -cuckold couples
can educate other non -cuckold couples about
it, the more we can grow that respect and just
cherish it because what you guys have is beautiful
and it's amazing. And I wish everyone could see
that. Yeah, I do too. I love it. Did you guys
have one comment on that? I have one more question.
We're coming up on time and we want to be cognizant
of you guys' time. Did you want to comment on
anything she just said? Yeah, all I was going
to say is everything that Victoria said, you
know, with all that, she still has no problem
humiliating me in many, many ways. I love it.
It's actually one of my, I actually do that with
our vanilla friends and they think I'm just being
cheeky. Well, we did have a lot of fun. But I'm
being accurate. We did. also go with Victoria
and James just to a little weekend getaway last
year and that was quite fun and I think Victoria
and I were like she was teaching me all the small
penis references and jokes and and things over
the weekend, so that was quite fun. And Siren
will tell you she was kicking our asses in every
game we played and drove Siren to the point of
wanting to fucking leave. No, no, no. I said,
good thing I love you so much because I'm very
competitive and I do not like to lose. And that
weekend was still great. Siren and I share that
attribute. I am wicked competitive. It's terrible.
It's not my best self. But you guys are a blast.
wonderful and kind and we this is why we love
the lifestyle is because we get to meet people
like you that we would have never probably never
would have met so we're really really grateful
and maybe one day i'll we'll be lucky enough
to meet mr morgan in person and yeah who knows
maybe maybe we'll get into some mischief yeah
and if you're ever lucky enough for victoria
to give you the privilege of letting you borrow
her cook he gives a amazing nude massage so What's
the future for Victoria and James? What are you
guys looking forward to in the coming years?
Oh, that's a really good question. I'm going
to go ahead and answer it because that's how
we do things, as you've probably seen. I answer
all questions. But, you know, we have cultivated,
and Utopia has helped with this, really network
with some really great... cuckold couples. And
we're actually meeting up with some friends of
ours who we met through Utopia in Orlando. And
we're doing kind of like just a small curated
event that's very cuckold centric with some gentlemen
that they are familiar with in Florida. And so
we're going to be doing that. Splash is in our
future, but we're also going to go on a bliss
cruise with some friends in November. The great
thing about that is that there are some gentlemen
that I've met through Splash and Utopia that
are also going to be on the Bliss Cruise, which
is fantastic. So I think really we have gone
away so much from couple stuff. That really is
not so much in our wheelhouse. Although I think
at each event, I think... And James looks at
me for the nod like, okay, yeah, we're going
to do the swinging thing at this event. But part
of it is that I just tease him and make him think
that it might happen. And then I just rip the
carpet out from underneath his feet. I'm waiting
in the bullpen just every day. Like one day the
phone's going to ring and I'm coming in. And
I just don't know when that is. Isn't that so
sweet? He's not in the bullpen. The man thinks
he's in the bullpen. Yeah, I was going to say,
no, sorry. You're outside just hoping to have
a little sip of their water. He really does.
But in answer to your questions, Socrates, what
I think a lot of it is just connections we've
made. And then we will travel and go meet with
people we have great connections with that love
and appreciate our dynamic. And it works out
very well for us. I'm in a position that I can
do getaways quarterly or even less than that.
And I don't mind that, you know, that those kind
of play experiences or there's time in between
of that. So that works well for us for where
we're located. But I know that that's not everyone's
dynamic, but it works for us. I think he would
probably enjoy more frequent fun times, but I
got a lot of shit that I'm working on. So, you
know, I compartmentalize this with every other
part of my life. I got shit to do. I'll try to
remember to send him nudes more often. Oh, he
would love that. The man is a... Yes, please.
Yes, please. He's a connoisseur of curvaceous
women. He loves that. Amen, brother. Did you
have anything you wanted to add to Socrates'
question? Because I answered all of it. Did you
have anything? Oh, sorry. I was thinking about
getting nude from sirens. He's a singular -minded
man. Yeah. I love distracting him. Thank you
so much for letting me tease your cut. Of course.
Of course. Of course. Did you have any other
plans for us for the future? I don't think so.
I'm sure he has like a thousand fantasies. He's
just waiting to dole them out slowly to not overwhelm
me. Maybe I should, you know, you need to send
me one of your written little fantasies and then
I'll send you some nudes. Because I do like hearing
your stories because they give me ideas for things.
Oh, the man could write erotic fiction. We'll
charge him. And I'd love to read it. All right,
well, we are. I love it. We are coming up on
time. Unk, is there anything you want to ask
or anything like that? No, I think you guys covered
everything. I was just here to listen to what
I heard. Well, take it over, Unk. I'm so sorry.
I don't want you to feel like we excluded you
from the conversation. Oh, he would have jumped
in. He would have jumped in if he wanted to.
Believe me, he doesn't need anyone's permission
to jump into the podcast for sure. Okay. All
right. I think, Unk, it's you now. All right.
Yep. Take us away. Well, ladies and gentlemen,
I would like to thank Victoria and James for
coming on tonight to another very, very interesting
episode of the Bull Brotherhood podcast. And
for myself, Soccer Keys and Siren, wishing all
the Bulls out there of the Brotherhood a good
night. And to all my sexy ladies, you know the
routine. Good morning. Until we meet again, talk
again. Everybody. I'll be saying cheers. Bye
-bye. Good night.