00:00:00:15 - 00:00:07:11 Dr. Winn I'm Dr. Rob Winn and you're listening to Real Cancer Talk from VCU Massey Comprehensive Cancer Center. 00:00:07:13 - 00:00:28:17 Dr. Winn We want to welcome Doctor Olopade. Many of you know, that this is a month in which we have reflections on all of those people who have contributed immensely, to the impact of advancing our field, in cancer and I couldn't want anybody better than to have Dr. Olopade with me. In fact, I'm honored. 00:00:28:18 - 00:00:51:16 Dr. Winn In fact, I'm a little bit more than excited that you're on. For those of you who don't know, Dr. Olopade is not only the director of the center for Clinical Cancer Genetics and Global Health at the University of Chicago. But let's get real. What she is is really a giant in the field and internationally renowned in the context of her expertise in breast cancer. 00:00:51:16 - 00:01:13:22 Dr. Winn And she'll get we're going to get to that in this conversation. And by the way, for those of you who thought you knew Olopade, remember that she is a really rare not only National Academy, but in that top 1% of 1% of the 2025 MacArthur fellowship, also known as the Genius Grant. Just for those who wanted to just think about this. 00:01:13:24 - 00:01:35:15 Dr. Winn So Dr. Olopade, I'm so happy to be with you today. And in fact, this is going to be just one of these things of just trying to get to know you a little bit better, because I believe that your career, the arc of your career, the mission of your career, the commitment to this career actually can inspire many others. So thank you for being with us. 00:01:35:17 - 00:01:50:03 Dr. Olopade Oh, thank you for having me. And, you know, I know you had that beautiful introduction, but I still can't forgive you for leaving me in Chicago to go to one or wherever. 00:01:50:05 - 00:02:04:02 Dr. Olopade You know, I'm in my office and I'm overlooking the skyline in Chicago, and it's freezing. Everybody is complaining, and I'm happy because Chicago has been a happy place for me. 00:02:04:08 - 00:02:18:24 Dr. Winn I know that's right. Well, let's get let's jump right into it. So the question always starts with, how did you get to picking a career in medicine and in science? Well, I mean, how did that happen? 00:02:19:01 - 00:02:19:20 Dr. Olopade Well, you know 00:02:19:20 - 00:02:40:09 Dr. Olopade it. You know, for us to honor Black History Month, we have to honor all of the people who mentored us, who were ahead of us. And so for me, my father was a pastor, and my parents really wanted a doctor. I had big, you know, brothers and sisters. And I was number five of six children. 00:02:40:09 - 00:03:08:19 Dr. Olopade And there was just one last chance to find a doctor in the family, because in those days, you know, growing up in Nigeria, you were either a teacher, you know, a pastor or, you know, and then, you know, in his generation, he became a pastor and then the next generation, he wanted, you know, scientist and economist and doctor. So, you know, I had people ahead of me who were in science and engineering. 00:03:08:20 - 00:03:39:07 Dr. Olopade So but I really, you know, listened to my dad and then my mother supported me to stay in medicine and not drop out. So that's really how I, you know, came to, medicine because, as you know, our community really prays a lot. Our community wants good outcomes. And when you have nothing, the only thing you have is God. 00:03:39:09 - 00:04:06:11 Dr. Olopade And, and in my culture and you're about culture, we believe in a lot of natural phenomena. But my father was exposed to science early because, you know, he, you know, the, the missionaries took him to school at a very old age. But then, you know, if he would pray and then bad things still happened. He said, maybe I should hedge my bet on science. 00:04:06:13 - 00:04:35:23 Dr. Olopade So all of us became scientists, and, and I've been fortunate to, have, you know, I came to Chicago in a cold, wintry, and cold, wintry weather. Landed at Cook County Hospital, and I saw a lot of black folks. And those black folks were just like the people I left behind in Nigeria. And that's why it was like, genetics is strong no matter where you go. 00:04:36:01 - 00:04:54:06 Dr. Winn That's right. You know. Yes. You so, so, so getting to that point, what I love about what you just said is that, and again, you know, Dr. Olopade, we do this thing that we actually sort of say, you know, there's no war with science and religion unless it's either bad science or bad religion, because they are working together. 00:04:54:08 - 00:05:19:10 Dr. Winn This issue of genetics. Oh, you were just going to touch on it. Right, you could have done so many other fields, but at the time that you chose genetics, how did that happen? Because I was thinking back to your career, thinking that you could have gone in multiple different directions, and yet you landed on genetics at a time where it wasn't so popular by the way. 00:05:19:12 - 00:05:22:09 Dr. Olopade Yeah. Well, so, you know, you know, 00:05:22:11 - 00:05:47:15 Dr. Olopade the good thing about science is that scientists are always asking questions. So coming to America, what I thought I was going to do was to do cardiology, because all I saw when I was in medical school were children with rheumatic heart disease. They had damage to their heart from not getting access to penicillin. 00:05:47:17 - 00:06:21:19 Dr. Olopade Okay. And then I got to county, and we were having people who had heart attacks. We were saving people in the critical care unit. And then we're asking people to change their lifestyle. And I thought, oh, well, that's been solved because we knew the risk factors for heart disease. And then I then remembered that, in fact, I saw patients with Burkitt lymphoma when I was in Nigeria. 00:06:21:21 - 00:06:59:07 Dr. Olopade And as an intern, we would get that red medicine that everybody calls Red Devil in America. And these tumors will melt away. And I knew some tumors melted away. And even at Cook County Hospital when we gave patients chemotherapy, many of them wanted more. But unfortunately some of them came and it was already advanced. So that was why when I was reading my textbook of medicine, which is what I love doing, is, you know, reading textbooks cover to cover. 00:06:59:09 - 00:07:27:20 Dr. Olopade You know, I came across generally and this amazing, you know, description of chromosomes and leukemia and lymphoma. And then I kept, you know, putting two and two together. And, you know, I was fortunate to have been, you know, and then, you know, just a one year rotation at the old Michael Reese Hospital and, and, you know, some of the University of Chicago, you know, faculty and residents were there. 00:07:27:22 - 00:07:32:02 Dr. Olopade And I went there from county and I said, oh, these people don't have two heads. 00:07:32:04 - 00:07:39:06 Dr. Olopade I can go to University of Chicago. I'm studying genetics. That's what happened. 00:07:39:08 - 00:07:59:00 Dr. Winn So it's oh, so you may...you remind me you were around that era where Michael Reese, for those who don't know, was historic. I'm talking about some of the luminaries. Can you mention some of the luminaries or big giants that had an impact, on you in the context of, you know, again, oncology or science? 00:07:59:02 - 00:08:06:17 Dr. Olopade Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, the Georgie, Doctor Jordan was the chairman of medicine. 00:08:06:19 - 00:08:08:01 Crazy. 00:08:08:03 - 00:08:13:15 Dr. Olopade Amazing, right? Amazing. So many, wonderful people 00:08:13:21 - 00:08:32:24 Dr. Olopade who practice the highest level of, you know, science, medicine and, our pharmacogenomics team, you know, Margaret Kane, all those, Everett Vogues, they were all at Michael Reese and have Harvey Golomb took me in to the fellowship program. 00:08:33:01 - 00:08:35:21 Dr. Winn God, that's right. 00:08:35:23 - 00:09:08:07 Dr. Olopade Right, and so, you know, just it was let's just say the stars were aligned. I didn't know what I was doing, but I kept putting one foot in front of the other. And from the minute I met Harvey Golomb, I who interviewed me for fellowship and really became, great mentor and asked me to go work in Janet's lab, I was set because between, you know, Harvey Golomb and Janet Rowley, I couldn't quite just love genetics. 00:09:08:09 - 00:09:43:14 Dr. Winn Listen. Absolutely. You know, I was thinking around that time and we again, talking about Nigeria, but also talking about Chicago, particularly the South side of Chicago, which, you know, you talked about Cook County, you talked about all these other things. But one of the things that I actually have always been sort of actually just really impressed, not impressed, just connected with you around was this issue of you could do science, but the science impacting the community, whether it's in Nigeria 00:09:43:16 - 00:09:46:12 Dr. Winn or whether it's on the south side of Chicago, where did that come from? 00:09:46:12 - 00:09:56:06 Dr. Winn Because sometimes people love science a lot, but it doesn't always mean that that science translates to impacting communities. How did you put those two pieces together? 00:09:56:08 - 00:10:08:24 Dr. Olopade Well, so, you know, the that certain things that happen to women in science and that is sometimes they get pregnant and then they have children. 00:10:09:01 - 00:10:11:17 Dr. Winn Oh that little thing. 00:10:11:19 - 00:10:34:21 Dr. Olopade So, you know, I was having a hard time during fellowship because everyone says when you have children, go to the suburbs. So here was I trying to come back from, you know, this suburb in southwest Chicago to come to my fellowship at the University of Chicago, going through that traffic. 00:10:34:23 - 00:10:50:00 Dr. Olopade And, you know, by the third month of my fellowship, I went to my boss, Harvey Golomb, I said, this is hard. I have to drop my children in in a daycare very early commute in. 00:10:50:02 - 00:11:00:02 Dr. Olopade And I was failing at being a hematology oncology fellowship. And Harvey Golomb said, oh, have you thought about living in Hyde Park? 00:11:00:04 - 00:11:07:09 Dr. Olopade And I said, Hyde Park. But they told me, don't live on the South Side. 00:11:07:11 - 00:11:19:03 Dr. Olopade And that was the game changer, because, you know, the cycle is so racially segregated and you're new in the city and they tell you where you to live. 00:11:19:05 - 00:11:50:17 Dr. Olopade And the minute I discovered Hyde Park and the University of Chicago and my neighbors, of course, that's why I do work that impacts the community, because these are my neighbors. And so, you know, the the brilliance of working at a place like University of Chicago that is small and we're all on the same campus, and we have global ambition is that, you know, people tell you your neighbor might win the Nobel Prize. 00:11:50:19 - 00:12:17:02 Dr. Olopade And, you know, my mentor was waiting to win the Nobel Prize. Everybody just loves doing science. So I had no choice but to be, you know, in that environment. And I want to say something about genetics because we talk about it now. And I think if you take genetics in isolation, you will realize that none of that is going to impact society, right? 00:12:17:04 - 00:12:49:15 Dr. Olopade Right. So, right. Doctor Harvey always said risk adopted treatment for leukemia. And then I wanted to not compete with my mentor. So I went to look at risk adopted treatment for breast cancer. And that's when we started talking about triple negative breast cancer. Because if you just look at all the women who were walking into my door, why is it that just black women were coming in with young girls had triple negative breast cancer and no one was studying it? 00:12:49:17 - 00:12:59:02 Dr. Olopade In fact, Doctor Bowman, who God bless his heart, tried to start a sickle cell program at the University of Chicago after... 00:12:59:02 - 00:13:02:06 Dr. Winn Yes he did. Talk about another historic figure. 00:13:02:08 - 00:13:34:18 Dr. Olopade Absolutely. And these are all my neighbors, right. So when you have such greatness, when you have Michelle Obama and Barack Obama as your neighbors who are thinking about great things, you cannot but think about the community. And that community influences you when you are in medical and when you, look at, Otis Brawley, who also was, UFC alum, all these people, people that you take for granted. 00:13:34:18 - 00:13:37:18 Dr. Olopade But they are all my homies. 00:13:37:20 - 00:14:01:05 Dr. Winn Do you know, I have totally forgotten, but those two, talk about people who have made also impact. So you were walking around people who were just not only were you influenced by the community, but you're bringing in the context that you just actually were blessed with having talent, all kinds of talent, from the basic to the clinical to the translational to the community outreach in and around you. 00:14:01:07 - 00:14:07:21 Dr. Olopade Absolutely. And, you know, to, you know, former first lady Michelle Obama's credit, 00:14:07:23 - 00:14:34:00 Dr. Olopade you know, whenever I had anything to do, I would say, could you help me or get your husband to come and do, you know, survivorship. And I have a photograph of them in my office on a Sunday. I still drag her husband. And he will come because these are good neighbors. You know, Valerie Jarrett, good neighbors, all of them wanting to make the South Side of Chicago the place to come to. 00:14:34:06 - 00:14:46:02 Dr. Olopade And of course, the University of Chicago pushing us to do the best science. So I've just been blessed. And that's why when people ask me, why are you still in Chicago? I'm like, well. 00:14:46:04 - 00:14:49:16 Dr. Winn You better stop, haha. 00:14:49:18 - 00:15:11:19 Dr. Winn So, so one important question. You also on in Chicago, but you also have paid attention to what's happening internationally with global. How and why did you maintain that sort of balance of what was on the South Side of Chicago and greater Chicago, and what the work that you're doing outside of the United States. How did...what was the framework for that? 00:15:11:23 - 00:15:39:14 Dr. Olopade Well, so, you know, when you do genetics, you're going to understand that the genetic basis of every cancer or everything we do starts in Africa, right? So for us as clinicians and for the fundamental thing we were doing, it was the phenotype. We saw breast cancer cases. And then we saw gene expression that wasn't quite right. Right. But the question is if we begin to say how did it start? 00:15:39:16 - 00:16:05:05 Dr. Olopade Then you have to begin to appreciate the diversity that makes Chicago a great city, right? Because every single patient who came through my clinic was unique and different. They brought many things to that appointment. So that's why when you write a grant and you have an idea to study a particular disease, you have to then ask, okay, how can you get to the root? 00:16:05:08 - 00:16:07:08 Dr. Olopade So what I was trying to do by 00:16:07:08 - 00:16:32:06 Dr. Olopade going to Nigeria and I could tell you when my husband, who happens to be a pulmonologist like you, that's why I've been tracking your career. We wanted to go and study. He was so interested in studying asthma, and I was coming with and I was coming with breast cancer. And we had the idea that, why is it that black children have the highest mortality rate in Chicago? 00:16:32:11 - 00:16:55:00 Dr. Olopade Black women have a high mortality rate in Chicago. I mean, why? And I will come across people who absolutely said it was the system was rigged against them, and I couldn't stay in my ivory tower and say, no, it wasn't rigged against them, because I knew the challenges that my patients faced when they came to the same doctor. Right. 00:16:55:00 - 00:17:36:12 Dr. Olopade And you have different outcomes, right? Because I would say, you know, all the wealthy white women came to me because we had the best science in those days, right? Dennis Lehmann, who was also a U of C alum, brought clinical trials to us at the University of Chicago. I met Laura. I mean, so everybody was really, you know, Laura Esserman, who happens to be one of my best friends in science, was born at Ingalls Hospital because there were a lot of people who made Chicago home before they left for L.A., before they left to other places. 00:17:36:15 - 00:18:03:05 Dr. Olopade So whenever we wanted to actually talk about real genetics and science, everywhere I went, I met people who said, oh, yeah, my parents grew up in Chicago. I'm now in L.A. so we did Stand Up to Cancer. Everybody came. They wanted to launch it at the old Comiskey Park to raise money and AACR was a wonderful, community that I found myself in. 00:18:03:09 - 00:18:08:13 Dr. Olopade So everybody was really excited about their science, and they brought me along. 00:18:08:17 - 00:18:27:21 Dr. Olopade So to cut a long story short, women wanted to have a march that we had a march on Washington. We had a national breast cancer action plan, and I said, I have an idea. Could I study breast cancer in Nigeria and compare those women to the women that are in my. 00:18:27:23 - 00:18:34:15 Dr. Olopade Because every time I see a black woman, I was like, she's my long lost cousin. 00:18:34:17 - 00:18:35:11 Dr. Winn Yes. 00:18:35:13 - 00:19:06:11 Dr. Olopade I go to Brazil and I was like, this person looks like my long lost cousin. So we may have been divided by the slave trade and the waters, but the culture, right? The culture of being happy, thinking about your spiritual being, thinking about your ancestors has stayed with us. Yeah. And so my Yoruba culture really worships our ancestors and the people before us. 00:19:06:13 - 00:19:06:24 Dr. Olopade And so 00:19:06:24 - 00:19:34:06 Dr. Olopade that's why I was able to really say, okay, let's lay the foundation for genetics, let's go to Nigeria. When my husband also went, he was like, okay, let's see what we can do about the environment because he was interested in the environment. And it turns out that the environment was so dramatically different. The genetics may be the same, but the environment acts on your genes. 00:19:34:12 - 00:19:58:10 Dr. Olopade And that's why we can reconcile both issues. Right. I'm not going to move my the women on the south side out of the south side, but I'm going to take trials to them. I'm not going to move everybody out of Nigeria, but I'm going to take research to them and I'm going to do clinical trials there. So I kept telling people, you can't all run out of Africa. 00:19:58:12 - 00:20:06:02 Dr. Olopade We can't forget that there's so many billions of people on the planet who need our care. 00:20:06:07 - 00:20:16:22 Dr. Olopade So that's why I became really passionate, and I'm so happy that they have it named Global Research after you Robert Winn. 00:20:16:24 - 00:20:22:15 Dr. Olopade Because you can bring the money. I just talk about it. 00:20:22:17 - 00:20:55:15 You know, you bring up one really, really good point, though, that sometimes when people are thinking about this type of research, what I love, what you just did, is you set out that there is rigor around the science, that it is absolutely steeped in the scientific methodology, and that by understanding things like what's going on, with groups that are, you know, descendants in a context of Brazil or Nigeria or...By the way, you wouldn't know this, but my, least my, my what do you say? 00:20:55:15 - 00:21:02:17 Dr. Winn Genetic test says that I'm 37% Nigerian. But, you know, we’ll get back to that later, you know, somewhere, you know. 00:21:02:19 - 00:21:09:04 Dr. Olopade From the first day I saw you, I knew you were so don’t worry about that. 00:21:09:06 - 00:21:39:10 Dr. Winn But to the point you talked about about using learning the scientific methodology and then applying the scientific methodology for outcome. Can you actually talk a little bit more about how that is a framework? It's not just, things that you're doing, but you are seeing it through rigor frameworks of through steeped in methodology of research and science. How does how do you, how do you counsel young people about the power of using that methodology? 00:21:39:13 - 00:21:43:22 Dr. Winn Because you can feel but how do you use the tool of science to make impact? 00:21:43:24 - 00:21:49:12 Dr. Olopade Yeah. So you know that throughout my career, what I heard was that, 00:21:49:14 - 00:22:12:05 Dr. Olopade you know, it's too expensive for you to be in science because you can practice medicine and make a lot of money is right. But the intellectual curiosity is the most important thing you need to be a scientist, right? If you are really, asking questions, why? 00:22:12:07 - 00:22:40:19 Dr. Olopade Right. And so, to me, I know that it's very hard to come from a place where you have nothing, where you are poor, and then expect to dedicate your life to science. And one of the things that my mentor and I would say this to Doctor Golomb was that he often would say, well, you may not become rich, but you're going to be famous. 00:22:40:21 - 00:23:10:13 Dr. Olopade And I never expected to be either rich or famous. I just wanted to be able to ask questions. So once I got the buck. And the thing is that, you know, even when you are in medical school, right, there's a pedagogy that we learned in our medical school in Nigeria, which was, you know, as a doctor, you are in the ivory tower. 00:23:10:15 - 00:23:36:23 Dr. Olopade You are always asking your questions and learning from your questions. So that clinical foundation was there. But then I didn't know the science that was driving that, and that was why I, I that it was really important for me to, to be able to just lock myself in the lab and make the commitment that I was going to work in the lab. 00:23:37:00 - 00:24:00:18 Dr. Olopade So for four years of post-doctoral work at the University of Chicago, living in the community, coming back, you know, I could go home and have dinner and then just come back to the lab. It provided the best integration for me. It doesn't work for any everybody. But research is research, and this is one of the things that I really want to make sure everybody understand. 00:24:00:20 - 00:24:27:09 Dr. Olopade Yes, this time I got my first RO1, the time I got my first American Cancer Society award. My mentor taught me how to write a grant. And once you get that first grant, you it's like sugar rush, right? It's like, oh my God, I got that. Let me write another one and let me write another one. And and then you learn how to write grants. 00:24:27:11 - 00:24:57:17 Dr. Olopade It's not for everybody. And that's why, you know, I've stayed in the lab, you know, people do, epidemiology. You were a fantastic pulmonologist. You did, you know, research. So research is research, but if it is with the intention of saving lives. And that's why I think for MDs, it's a lot easier for us. For me, when cancer has no cure, how can I say I got this? 00:24:57:19 - 00:25:00:20 Dr. Olopade So that's the motivating factor. 00:25:00:22 - 00:25:17:16 Dr. Olopade And, it will get me up every day because we have to find cause when young women are dying of breast cancer, I have to ask the question why? And then when people started talking about young black women, I was like, this is personal. 00:25:17:18 - 00:25:43:16 Dr. Winn This is personal. You know, I, you know what? Every time I get to sit on a panel with you or every time I get to do anything with you, I always leave better off. I'm just letting you know that it's so I just always, I'm much more, much more aware. And I think also much more even motivated about the work that you and others have been doing and why it actually matters. 00:25:43:18 - 00:26:05:17 Dr. Winn To that end, I have a question for you. If you were in today sitting across the table with young people, which you do, what advice would you give them today in a context of wanting to go down the path of being a physician, scientist, or just a scientist or a physician? What general advice would you have for them? 00:26:05:19 - 00:26:16:24 Dr. Olopade Well, you know, today is a different story because it's even harder to be a physician scientist and you have fewer role models. 00:26:16:24 - 00:26:17:19 Dr. Winn Yes. 00:26:17:21 - 00:26:22:08 Dr. Olopade Right. A lot of people who were physician scientists, 00:26:22:10 - 00:26:47:21 Dr. Olopade the story was that they were dodging the Vietnam War. So they went to fight the war at the NIH. Now, you know, today, all of that infrastructure to get people excited about science is been re organized. So it would be very challenging to say I'm going to take that on because guess what? 00:26:47:23 - 00:27:00:03 Dr. Olopade It's too hot. And what I tell them is that nothing in life comes easy. We are privileged to be scientists. 00:27:00:05 - 00:27:00:20 Dr. Winn True. 00:27:00:22 - 00:27:17:11 Dr. Olopade So what I just tell them is that it doesn't matter what you do. If you set your heart in it, it's hard work, right? And so you just need to be honest with yourself, true to yourself, and do the hard work. 00:27:17:11 - 00:27:19:06 Dr. Olopade Go to school. 00:27:19:08 - 00:27:48:11 Dr. Olopade So when my children were coming up, none of them, by the way, went to medicine and I was, it’s okay. You get to do whatever you want. What I want you to do is show up, go to school. Because if you just go to school and listen to what's going on in class, you will be inspired. There will be one teacher that's going to inspire you, and that teacher make them your mentor, because that's really what it's about. 00:27:48:13 - 00:28:16:01 Dr. Olopade It's not everybody wants to you to get everything from home. No, some people are lucky to have a home where they're going to be able to have all the privilege, and some people are not. And that's why for me, our generation, we have to continue showing up. Yes, because if they don't see people who have gone through a lot of hardship and stayed with it, they're going to say, oh, this is too hard. 00:28:16:03 - 00:28:40:08 Dr. Winn Yes. Yes, yes, right. In fact, sometimes we talk about the hard part, but, you know, at the end of the day when I get the opportunities, the things that talk to you, we always also talk about what makes us happy, what brings us joy, you know, from the science as well. So I think sometimes these young people understand the struggle without understanding that within the struggle there is joy, there is happiness, there is excitement. 00:28:40:10 - 00:28:51:14 Dr. Olopade And I think it's just that we are not telling the story of the joy that comes right. Right. And so I'll tell you a story, because 00:28:51:19 - 00:29:08:03 Dr. Olopade that story is what really when I’m in clinic, I tell everybody. You know, when I was at County, I didn't used to go to the clinic in my Sunday best. And I remember one of my patients say, doctor, why aren't you wearing stockings? 00:29:08:08 - 00:29:43:07 Dr. Olopade And I was like, oh, she expects me to be in my Sunday dress because she respects herself, and she respects the...expects the doctor to respect her. Guess what? From that moment on, I don't go to clinic without looking my best. Because patients see you. So when I'm telling people, look, make sure you respect your patient. You treat them with dignity, treat yourself with dignity, whatever that means to you and all those good vibes and the things that motivate you. 00:29:43:09 - 00:30:09:11 Dr. Olopade And and don't be angry. Just be patient because I can't tell you that we don't have racism in Chicago. We have a lot of it. But you know what? I'm standing up for my community and this moment is a time for us to stand for with our communities. And the young people need to just really know that this time, too, shall pass. 00:30:09:13 - 00:30:45:05 Dr. Olopade When I was coming up, there were they said you had to write ten grants to get one. And I was like, fine, I'll write ten grants. If I get one, that would be great. But sometimes you get one before you even have written your second grant. So just ground yourself in knowing that others have done it. And in honor of Black History Month, I just have to say that there’s just so many brilliant people in the world and surround yourself with brilliant people and it doesn't matter about black, white or brown. 00:30:45:11 - 00:30:49:02 Dr. Olopade Just surround yourself with good people. 00:30:49:04 - 00:31:07:17 Dr. Winn You just said something that is, I mean an absolute truth. Surround yourself with good people, and if they're good and they're brilliant, we're the better off for it. So my last two questions I have, because we're ending up this session, I have two questions. And I'll start off with the first one. 00:31:07:19 - 00:31:29:15 Dr. Winn who are some of the historic figures, that if you think about the, as we think about the Charles Drews or are they historic figures in either in Africa or in, you know, Brazil or in America, who are the historic figures of science, African-Americans or what have you, that have actually had an influence on you? 00:31:29:17 - 00:31:43:04 Dr. Winn We talked about Dr. James Bowman Jr., who, was amazing. But have there been others, if you think about it back, like who have you sort of said had an influence on you, or somebody that you just admire? 00:31:43:06 - 00:31:51:02 Dr. Olopade one of the first places I came to in America was Harlem Hospital. 00:31:51:04 - 00:31:51:23 Dr. Winn Yes. 00:31:52:00 - 00:31:58:10 Dr. Olopade Right. And, and and you know that at Harlem Hospital, we had great surgeons 00:31:58:12 - 00:32:29:03 Dr. Olopade who founded Ralph Lauren Center. Okay. And whenever I went to talk about genetics, you know, those guys always said, think about the social determinants, and then they planted themselves, and they would challenge me that it's not about the genetics. It's about the fact that people can't even get their breast cancers diagnosed. 00:32:29:07 - 00:33:07:03 Dr. Olopade So there's so many black giants in oncology that I don't want to name specific names. But let me tell you, perhaps one person that I think sometimes, we forget it's Lucio Luzzatto. Lucio Luzzatto is an Italian who in 1960 went to Nigeria. Okay. And he spent ten years in my medical school. 00:33:07:05 - 00:33:11:18 Dr. Olopade He discovered d6pd deficiency. 00:33:11:20 - 00:33:15:18 Dr. Winn No way. That. Oh my God, that's right. Yes. 00:33:15:20 - 00:33:27:09 Dr. Olopade Okay. And he adopted children from Nigeria and he ended up becoming the head of genetics at Memorial Sloan-Kettering. Okay. 00:33:27:11 - 00:33:41:18 Dr. Olopade And the reason why I'm giving the this example is that you have to be in a place to be able to influence people, you understand? So if you are in a place. 00:33:41:20 - 00:33:42:19 Dr. Winn Yes. 00:33:42:21 - 00:33:58:02 Dr. Olopade You will be able to influence the next generation and it doesn't matter. So I didn't grow up in America, okay? But I grew up in Nigeria and you know my name, Olufunmilayo is Olufunmilayo Ransome-Kuti. 00:33:58:04 - 00:34:00:21 Dr. Winn Fela Ransome-Kuti. 00:34:00:23 - 00:34:22:03 Dr. Olopade There's no one who doesn't know. Fela. Fela finally got his life time achievement award at the last Grammy. Yes, because Fela's mother was the first woman to go buy a car in China come back to Nigeria. And he was a, she was a political figure. 00:34:22:05 - 00:34:27:24 Dr. Olopade All of his all of two of her children were doctors, except, Fela said, you know what? 00:34:28:03 - 00:34:42:18 Dr. Olopade I'm not going to buy that because that's western. His father sent him to go and learn Western music. But he then studied Afro pop music, and you can see how that has been influential around the world, 00:34:42:20 - 00:34:46:20 Dr. Olopade around the world. So we have a global movement where 00:34:46:22 - 00:34:54:21 Dr. Olopade brilliance can come, people can inspire you through arts, right? And we have arts in medicine. 00:34:54:21 - 00:35:20:05 Dr. Olopade So when I'm talking about medicine now, I actually think we should talk about STEM right? It's not just chem, it's arts. And Chicago has beautiful art. People need to be able to have the other side of their brain work. So Fumi Ransome-Kuti, when people called me Fumi, I was like, we lived on the same compound with this woman. 00:35:20:05 - 00:35:26:17 Dr. Olopade She was a what people call her feminist now, but she was just a brilliant woman. 00:35:26:19 - 00:35:27:00 Yes. 00:35:27:06 - 00:35:46:23 Dr. Winn Oh my God. Yes, yes. So my last question for you is maybe the hardest of all the questions. It's probably going to be the hardest of all the questions. What gives you hope in the context of science, of either where it's going or what it could be? What brings you hope today? 00:35:47:00 - 00:36:21:18 Dr. Olopade Oh, look at how many people are in science now that were not even allowed to be part of a scientific community. Right? Look at how many when I, when I talk about people getting a great education and influencing their community, whether it's, you know, the person who gave me the most joy when I first came to Chicago was Michael Jordan, right? 00:36:21:19 - 00:36:33:11 Dr. Olopade I know that you remember he was on the West Side and the West Side as, as soon as we were, he was coming to County. We knew this is what we needed to do. 00:36:33:13 - 00:36:34:07 Right? 00:36:34:09 - 00:36:41:21 Dr. Olopade We go study and we watch Michael Jordan. And then at the end of the year, we're winning. Chicago was winning. And then, 00:36:42:01 - 00:37:00:21 Dr. Olopade you know, whether it's a bit what I'm saying is the community can influence you. And I'm hopeful. And I know that not only NIH supports our research. Foundations support research, we have now people from our communities that are wealthy. 00:37:01:02 - 00:37:35:17 Dr. Olopade They're telling the stories. Right. How many MacArthur geniuses have come up since I was doing my work? And they gave me a MacArthur Genius award, and all these geniuses are in every community, we just need to make sure that they can see role models in their own communities. That's why I'm so grateful for the work you're doing to get funds, to get clinical trials, to get people to stay in place and have funding to do the work that they need to do. 00:37:35:21 - 00:37:38:02 Dr. Olapade What gives me hope is the next generation. 00:37:38:03 - 00:37:39:00 Dr. Winn I love this, so. 00:37:39:06 - 00:38:04:24 Dr. Olapade I, I was looking to apply for a small grant. You know, or not, after climbing Kilimanjaro. I, my daughter, who had just really finished her MBA, said, why are you always writing grants? Why don't you start a company? I'm going to go to both to help you find people at both. Maybe they can help bring your idea to market. 00:38:05:01 - 00:38:31:12 Dr. Olapade And we wrote this when she was saying this is a way to have other ways of funding your ideas. And I have only raised this whiteboard. Like you need to have ideas. And ideas can come from young people. So that's what gives me hope. I hang out with my children. I hang out with young people, and they come up with the most brilliant ideas. 00:38:31:17 - 00:39:02:17 Dr. Olapade So if I'm going to give I. You know, one last thing. It's that we need to have multi-generational interaction. Oh, I love that where where we are impacting wisdom, but we're learning from these young people because these young people really have great ideas. And if we're open minded about it, great things will happen. So Kass IQ is a company that is now been in, in, in the, population Health management for ten years. 00:39:02:17 - 00:39:06:13 Dr. Olapade It started as an idea that's still on my whiteboard. 00:39:06:15 - 00:39:21:04 Dr. Winn You know what? Listen, that was brilliant. And what a way to end. And again, thank you for taking. I know you're really busy, so thank you for taking the time out of your ridiculously busy schedule to spend with me. Grateful. Appreciate you. 00:39:21:06 - 00:39:22:15 Dr. Olapade Thank you. Okay.