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I'm Dr.

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Rob Winn and you're listening
to Real Cancer Talk

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from VCU Massey
Comprehensive Cancer Center.

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Hello.

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This is Doctor Rob
Winn And welcome to another

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episode of Real Cancer Talk.

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We're going to bring some attention
to prostate cancer.

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But instead of just talking about it,
you know, for the importance of screening,

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I wanted to really have a conversation,
a conversation

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with not only an outstanding
community leader.

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And I have to say, just an outstanding

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representation of a human being and,
and really what commitment looks like,

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but also happens to be a prostate cancer
survivor.

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I'm here, to today to really, talk to,

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and have an amazing conversation
with, Reverend Charles Cheeks,

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pastor of the Kingdom United Fellowship
in Hampton, the Hampton Roads area, y'all.

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A leader in Facts Faith Friday

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and a prostate cancer survivor himself.

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what I'm not saying to you is how
important he has been as just a person.

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Reverend Cheeks, I’m
really glad to have you with us, sir.

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Well, I'm happy to be

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here, and, you know, no other time
would I rather be

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with somebody than be with you
at this particular moment in time.

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I appreciate that.

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Now let's jump right, let's jump right in.

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Now, listen, here's
the reality of prostate cancer.

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We understand that
as, that one prostate cancer,

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you know, certainly behind lung cancer
for men, but it's really high up there

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in the context of one of the reasons why
we cut men's lives short on this planet.

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We know that prostate cancer, certainly,

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is something that can be screened.

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And we also know that prostate cancer

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isn't the way, 
grandfathers used to experience it.

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And what I mean by that is, 40 thou,

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for every 40 people,
for every 100,000 people,

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that die from prostate
cancer in 1993, 40 would die.

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Today, that number is half.

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That didn't happen because I think people,
I would love to think that

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that happened because people are eating
more kale and healthier diets

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and getting out the exercise
and drinking carrot juice.

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But we know that's probably not true.

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And so as we think about that,
particularly in African-American men,

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the one thing that the cautionary tale,
which is why I really, you know,

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Pastor Cheeks wanted to talk to you today.

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Is that the group that is lagging
still behind

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by substantial margins,
by the way, African-American men.

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So as you think about, you know,

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your, walk we're going
to get into the prostate cancer.

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But before I get there, I want to know
a little bit of something about you.

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Well, first of all, you know,
you were drawn to faith.

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How did that even happen.

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Which part? I mean, you asking me.

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How are you?

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How are you drawn to your calling
of being a person of faith?

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How did that happen?

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Well, it was a long road.

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The,
because I was like every other person

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that walked in this profession, 
I was not living the most holiest of life.

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And I was,

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even though
I was raised in a family of faith,

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grandfather, preacher, grandfather
before him, uncles and everybody else.

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I just kind of like, you know,
this is not for me.

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I want to experience the world
and see what it has to offer.

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I mean, I started off, military college.

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Typical thing.

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And it was in law enforcement for like,
ten years.

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And, and then, you know, got into

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some other activities, my own businesses.

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And I was just enjoying the world,

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but something still wasn't right. And.

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And something just was
it was just tugging at me.

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So finally I yield.

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I mean one day it happened,

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I was actually I was dreaming one evening
and I was laying in a casket.

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That was the dream.

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And I woke up in sweat,

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you know, it was just valley of sweat and,

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and I, you know,
I'm gonna do the short part of it.

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But I reached over.
It was a Bible on a table.

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I was in a motel room,
and I grabbed the Bible and.

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Come on now.

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And it opened up and said, put away
the old man.

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The new man is coming. And that was it.

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Oh no, come on now.

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That's how it all started.

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That was that was the walk.

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And I was,
ever since that time, about 20 years ago.

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I've been walking that walk,

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through, you know, all kinds of struggles
and temptations.

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But, the idea is that, I know God said,
you know, you've got all this spirit.

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Now, you use it
for the betterment of mankind.

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You know, you know,
thank you for sharing that with me.

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I know sometimes when we talk
about these science that we want to talk

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about our prostate, but I usually sort of
say that there is a story

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that gets people committed to figuring out
how to actually do good works.

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By the way, your work,
can you tell us a little bit of the work?

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And I want to highlight some of the work
you've been doing through Covid, but

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can you tell us a little bit of the work

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that you've been doing in the Hampton Road
area?

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Yeah.

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Actually,
since I moved back to this area,

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you know, just I tell everybody the story
that when I left Maryland to come back,

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I was actually headed
to North Carolina, and,

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I stopped here in Hampton,
and ran into an old girlfriend.

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That's history. Took over from there.

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So, and while I'm here,
I just noticed some things.

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I say, well, this area,
I left here back in

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1980, 85, and,
I said nothing has changed.

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People like they’re in a time warp.

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You know, as I examined what was going on,
I was just like the system

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was building upon itself,
but the people were left behind.

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There was nothing connecting community.

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Community was gone.
It was like disappearing.

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And people didn't care much
about each other because that opportunity

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had been gifted to others, like,
you know, to the social service system.

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The churches weren't
in control of community anymore.

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They were just an afterthought.

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They were just there on Sunday mornings.

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So I just started doing my thing

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as, as I always did,
and that was to go into the community,

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start working with the community
and, and develop and lift people up.

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I go by an old Chinese proverb that saying

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that, “go to the people,
live with them, empower them.

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And at the end, people will say,

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look what we’ve done.”
So that was my driving force,

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to empower people so they would take
whatever is needed and run with it.

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So since that time, we formed
what's called a marketplace ministry

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instead of planning a traditional church
is one that has,

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that has all the resources in it
that the community so desires.

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Not build something and...

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hope they come, but it's them building it.

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Now Pastor Cheeks,
what inspired you to do that?

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Because that's a very different model.

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I mean, in fact, I you know what
I really love about the problem,

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you sort of said that, you know,
that really centers in on the community.

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So that's a different model.
What inspired you?

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How did you come up with this new model

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to essentially connect with the people?

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Well, it's not new.

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I mean, if you look at the Bible,
where was Jesus?

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In the marketplace. Come on,

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now. And

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that's where people gather to exchange

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goods, services and ideas and,
and to gain knowledge.

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And so, and so it was easy.

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I was like, okay, this is something
was there why are we doing something

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opposite?

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I mean, because what we're doing
opposite is not working.

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So we need to go back to what
what does the Bible say?

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It's not just a story.

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It's given us a model.

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And so that's that's where it came from.

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We just worked off that model, you know,
and just as we surveyed the people

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knocking on doors
and finding out what their needs are and

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what's happening in their households,
they named it,

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we listened.

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And because we had already
formed alliances with all these different

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nonprofits and other groups saying,
hey, y'all, let’s come together.

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This is a need in this community,

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let's build this here
and then replicate it in other places.

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Instead of just being a church
where people come on Sunday,

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let's be a seven day
a week, 24/7 healing place.

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Man, I love that.

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By the way, as you talk about partners,
kids, what you just sort of

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said, you indicated that the works
and the great works

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that you're doing within that area
takes more than just a single unit.

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How did you go about

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forming those partnerships,
or were those partnerships

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and networks are already in place,
and you just plugged into it?

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How did, what was, how did you how did you
figure out that you needed other people?

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Well, collaboration is the key.

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And being in community engagement,
community

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development most of my life,
that's something I learned.

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So, one of the things that happened
when I moved back here, there were,

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you know, it is as it is in most cities.

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There are a lot of great groups
doing a lot of good things.

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But the problem is
nobody is talking to each other.

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And so people get territorial
and they don't want to hand off

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because they figure people belong to them,
you know?

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And so those relationships weren't there.

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So actually, the first day
when they announced Covid in January,

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I held a meeting, a luncheon meeting.

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brought 15 people groups together
and said, look, this is

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I got this harebrained idea.

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This is what,
I think we can put this thing together.

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We're going to call it lunch table
talk. We’re going to do it once a month.

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We're going to just keep growing
the group, and we're going to bring in

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everybody to the table.

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And we're going to talk about
how we're going to work together.

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And so it just grew and grew.

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We started out with 15
and now it's like 60 different

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organizations
state, federal, nonprofit, etc., etc..

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We come together and we talk about
how are we going to work together

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for the betterment of the community. So.

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Wow, you know, that's that whole thing,
you know, here at Massey,

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we talk about this concept
of really one team, one fight

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and that whole concept that,
you know, to to, you know,

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what most people may not know is that,
while we certainly have a ways to go,

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we now know that 36% fewer

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Americans are dying from cancer
relative to 1991.

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And that 36% fewer, you know, people
dying from cancer means that 36%

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more people are showing up to baseball
games and family reunions and to weddings.

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And that happened
because not a one institution.

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It's not at MD Anderson, it's
not at Massey it's not the NIH.

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It's all of us, including people like
your organizations within the community.

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So I want to I want to ask you now,
you know, so in the context of cancer,

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you know, we've said that
we're certainly making progress

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in cancer, by the way,
we've actually said we've reduced

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the number of prostate cancer deaths
in the United States since 1993 by half.

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But when you

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heard
that you got the diagnosis of cancer,

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what was the first thing
that ran through your mind?

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And then the second question
is going to be, what were the events

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that then led you to actually
getting some help in seeking health care?

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Well, my story was, I don't know
if it's typical, but it was a strange one.

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Actually it was, you know, at two
different, doctors that I see every year.

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One is that the Veterans Administration,
because I'm a vet.

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The other, the second one is
my primary care physician

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on the outside
because I do have additional insurance.

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And actually, the blood tests at the VA,

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came back and it was hives showing up.

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It was out of whack.

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So the VA doctor told me,
he said, you have a private doctor.

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I suggest you actually go
to your private doctor,

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take this information, because by the time
the VA gets around to it,

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it might be a little worse.

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And so,

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that's what I did.

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I contacted, my private doctor
went to see him with the results, and,

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and he told me this, he said, well,
why don't we just wait?

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Because all the evidence is not in.

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And, doing something now,
we may just wait and see if it does take.

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So I mean, something that happens,
a miracle, I guess, wheathe was saying,

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And I was like, I left his office
and that was the last time I saw him.

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I called another physician and
got into their office, and he immediately,

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contacted the urologist
and got me referred to the urologist.

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And so during this whole process,
I'm thinking you my mind is going through

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all kinds of things, like, you know, the
what ifs, the what ifs and...

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And so I'm thinking of all these things.

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And finally, when I get to the appointment
with the urologist and they do

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the typical thing
they do, with the with the tests,

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and then when they called me
with the immediate results,

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I started not to answer the phone,

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I was just hoping he just left a message,
but I went on to answer it and,

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and so they told me it was like, whatever.

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I can't remember exact phrase,
but it was like,

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high grade We need to go
possibly do what we need to do.

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We want to get you
in, get an MRI, something else done,

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because we want to make sure
it hasn't gone up to your spine.

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Wow, wow.

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Well, you know, you know,
you know, there's two things

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I want to back up
and talk about a little bit.

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One, you know,
and what you just sort of said.

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One you were going to see the doc.

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There's so many men.

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It's just not an African-American
male thing.

00;14;04;08 - 00;14;08;25
It is men across the United States,
who unfortunately,

00;14;09;05 - 00;14;12;15
you know, for one reason or another,
just don't get themselves checked

00;14;12;15 - 00;14;14;13
or don't have a doctor
or don't see anybody.

00;14;14;13 - 00;14;17;08
So, you know,
your story is that you were in the system,

00;14;17;08 - 00;14;21;01
and so you were doing the first rung
of things, you know, self-care, self-care,

00;14;21;01 - 00;14;23;24
sometimes being part of the system
where you can have people say,

00;14;23;24 - 00;14;25;01
just like you would check your car.

00;14;25;01 - 00;14;26;21
Yeah, your oil was a little low.

00;14;26;21 - 00;14;28;08
You know, we need to do x, y, z.

00;14;28;08 - 00;14;30;26
The second thing that you said,
which I think is the most powerful,

00;14;30;26 - 00;14;34;22
which I'm going to get to in a second
and drill down just a little bit more, is

00;14;34;22 - 00;14;38;12
you said that when you got information
that you were just not,

00;14;39;04 - 00;14;42;13
you know, aware of,
you had the wherewithal

00;14;42;18 - 00;14;46;03
and the insight to be able to say,
you know, let me get a second opinion

00;14;46;19 - 00;14;47;24
and what happens

00;14;47;24 - 00;14;51;15
in general with many people is that
we don't ever get that second opinion.

00;14;51;23 - 00;14;55;22
I think both of your, you know,
both of your point of your story was one,

00;14;56;03 - 00;14;58;26
you know, that being, you know, cared for,

00;14;58;26 - 00;15;02;14
and being part of a health system
isn't something that's a negative.

00;15;02;14 - 00;15;03;12
It's a positive.

00;15;03;12 - 00;15;07;08
And by the way, that it's always important
to probably get a second opinion.

00;15;07;08 - 00;15;11;04
But when you're seeing men
that you take care of in your congregation

00;15;11;04 - 00;15;14;09
or your community,
what are typically the stumbling blocks

00;15;14;09 - 00;15;17;12
they give you for not being screened
or not seeing the doctor

00;15;17;12 - 00;15;20;26
because your story just said
that had you not done that,

00;15;21;17 - 00;15;26;08
then how would we have picked up
one, the PSA that was high and then two,

00;15;26;15 - 00;15;29;22
how would we have gone down that path
without being part of a system?

00;15;29;25 - 00;15;31;14
So when you're taking care of people

00;15;31;14 - 00;15;33;03
within a community,
particularly Hampton Roads,

00;15;33;03 - 00;15;35;17
which has some of the poorest outcomes
right now,

00;15;35;17 - 00;15;38;13
in the Commonwealth of Virginia,
what are the obstacles

00;15;38;13 - 00;15;40;23
that people that you meet with, men
that you meet with

00;15;40;23 - 00;15;44;03
about either getting themselves checked
or getting screened for prostate cancer?

00;15;44;29 - 00;15;47;29
Well, what I see in the community,

00;15;48;04 - 00;15;51;04
because I tell a lot of my, my story,
when it

00;15;51;12 - 00;15;54;25
when I get objections about different
things around prostate, even health.

00;15;55;10 - 00;15;58;12
It's not I said, you know,
I could have been pushing up daisies,

00;15;58;28 - 00;16;01;18
you know, if I had ignored something.

00;16;01;18 - 00;16;03;05
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

00;16;03;05 - 00;16;08;18
Yes. So, you know, I kind of
look at what they're most men I talked to.

00;16;08;28 - 00;16;09;15
They have this

00;16;10;15 - 00;16;12;19
fear or this

00;16;12;19 - 00;16;16;00
ego tripping thing that they're going to,
they're invincible,

00;16;16;18 - 00;16;19;26
and that certain things
are not going to happen to them.

00;16;20;11 - 00;16;24;07
Truth
telling is missing in the black community.

00;16;25;01 - 00;16;27;14
So, so you know

00;16;27;14 - 00;16;30;14
that there are certain
things called facts.

00;16;30;15 - 00;16;33;01
Builds that data, that's for sure.

00;16;33;01 - 00;16;36;13
And so as long as they figure
they can go to work

00;16;36;21 - 00;16;41;10
or they can do the hustle or do whatever
it did, they're they're the mindset.

00;16;41;10 - 00;16;44;23
Because I think because of
what is happening in the community

00;16;45;04 - 00;16;47;10
that they see themselves as invincible.

00;16;47;10 - 00;16;49;23
And whatever's going to happen
is going to happen.

00;16;49;23 - 00;16;52;23
There's no caring about the other person,

00;16;52;26 - 00;16;56;19
whoever that may be, wife, spouse
or your child, whoever

00;16;57;06 - 00;17;01;04
or in some cases,
just in just the community itself.

00;17;01;13 - 00;17;06;17
So we've gotten away from that,
that caring mode where, when I grew up

00;17;06;17 - 00;17;12;15
and I'm a lot older, you guys, that
we cared about everybody and each other.

00;17;12;15 - 00;17;15;13
And there was a community doctor,

00;17;15;13 - 00;17;19;13
and whatever happened,
everybody went to that community doctor.

00;17;19;13 - 00;17;24;20
Now days is so splintered
and so isolated that people

00;17;24;22 - 00;17;27;25
there's not this system anymore
to wrap people.

00;17;27;26 - 00;17;31;29
So therefore, the black male
becomes unto themselves,

00;17;32;13 - 00;17;35;24
a little island by themselves
for survival purposes.

00;17;35;24 - 00;17;38;26
And so that survival
does not include medical care.

00;17;39;05 - 00;17;42;04
That is, because it's not a truth anymore.

00;17;42;04 - 00;17;44;02
It’s an option.

00;17;44;02 - 00;17;47;02
A you know, what that, that
what you just sort of said is that,

00;17;47;06 - 00;17;50;05
you know, many men
sort of one, feeling invincible are like,

00;17;50;05 - 00;17;51;19
you know, it
ain’t going to happened to me.

00;17;51;19 - 00;17;52;23
I was going to share with you.

00;17;52;23 - 00;17;55;23
You know, the funny part
is that they took, I don't know,

00;17;55;26 - 00;18;01;11
the NIH actually took a large number
of people across all of America.

00;18;01;19 - 00;18;05;11
And they asked them, you know, 
do you think you'll get cancer?

00;18;05;18 - 00;18;09;15
Now, the funny part about
that was that 74% of the people,

00;18;09;15 - 00;18;12;06
almost 75% of the people in United States,
sort of say, well,

00;18;12;06 - 00;18;14;22
we know cancer happens,
but it's not going to happen to me.

00;18;14;22 - 00;18;17;09
But, you know,
you know, but here's some math.

00;18;17;09 - 00;18;21;14
1 in 2 men in the United States
will get cancer in their lifetime.

00;18;21;14 - 00;18;24;29
1 in 3 women
will get cancer in their lifetime.

00;18;25;07 - 00;18;27;20
And so my my grandfather, who, you know,

00;18;27;20 - 00;18;29;24
he didn't graduate,
he wasn't a college guy or any that

00;18;29;24 - 00;18;33;03
but he would look at those numbers and
just say somehow that math ain't mathing.

00;18;33;03 - 00;18;36;19
And so I think your, your,
your point about the fact

00;18;36;19 - 00;18;39;22
that most people believing
that somehow they're different

00;18;40;13 - 00;18;43;14
and that they're going to be
the ones like in Vegas that wins

00;18;43;14 - 00;18;46;15
it all, you
know, is a little bit naive and foolhardy.

00;18;46;15 - 00;18;48;23
And that's going back to the getting
checked.

00;18;48;23 - 00;18;51;17
By the way,
when we think about prostate cancer

00;18;51;17 - 00;18;54;27
and we think about how do you get checked,
we know that there's a digital

00;18;54;27 - 00;18;57;29
rectal exam that, you know, most men
have got some issues with.

00;18;57;29 - 00;18;59;29
But, you know, listen,
nobody wants to do it

00;18;59;29 - 00;19;03;01
and y'all don't want to have it, but
it winds up being that it's not so bad.

00;19;03;01 - 00;19;04;17
And you know, it's a way of doing it.

00;19;04;17 - 00;19;08;06
But we do have ways of the PSA test now,
which is just the blood test.

00;19;08;13 - 00;19;11;13
We also have imaging things
that we can do for people.

00;19;11;16 - 00;19;15;25
And I think if there's anything
I'd wanted to say about the screening

00;19;15;25 - 00;19;17;21
is that we're getting better

00;19;17;21 - 00;19;20;18
and we're getting more thoughtful
and as a result of getting better,

00;19;20;18 - 00;19;24;24
we're getting more accurate about
who to have treatment for and who not to.

00;19;24;24 - 00;19;26;23
Now turning to the treatment part.

00;19;26;23 - 00;19;30;20
When you did have to have your treatment,
you know, can you can you tell us,

00;19;30;20 - 00;19;31;09
you know,

00;19;31;09 - 00;19;35;09
how did the doctors go about explaining
what the options were to you and, and

00;19;36;29 - 00;19;37;18
by the way,

00;19;37;18 - 00;19;41;15
when they explain the options,
how ultimately,

00;19;41;15 - 00;19;44;15
as a, as a result of the treatment,
are you feeling today?

00;19;45;14 - 00;19;47;03
Well,

00;19;47;03 - 00;19;49;16
I think I explained
what treatment I wanted

00;19;49;16 - 00;19;52;16
before they get to telling me
what the treatment is going to be.

00;19;52;19 - 00;19;55;19
So, so
so it was like a give and take, almost.

00;19;56;08 - 00;19;59;08
Because I have some cousins
that in the medical field, and I was like,

00;19;59;20 - 00;20;02;20
pumping them for information
before I even get to that point.

00;20;03;00 - 00;20;06;25
And, when the doctor, one of the things

00;20;07;10 - 00;20;11;02
they said, I joke about this a lot,
and because I was getting those shots,

00;20;11;02 - 00;20;15;07
I can't remember the names of them,
in my stomach and and the radiation.

00;20;15;25 - 00;20;18;08
And one of the things they told me said,

00;20;18;08 - 00;20;21;00
your chest will now become breast.

00;20;21;00 - 00;20;22;24
And you are having,

00;20;23;24 - 00;20;25;18
hot sweats, you know, sweats.

00;20;25;18 - 00;20;27;05
We went, and so...

00;20;27;05 - 00;20;30;15
Did he say you was going to have
those night sweats, like, like you said,

00;20;30;15 - 00;20;31;16
those women in menopause?

00;20;31;16 - 00;20;34;16
You said you were going to have hot 
sweats?

00;20;34;19 - 00;20;36;03
Yeah, they were telling me that.

00;20;36;03 - 00;20;38;26
And I was like, well, okay, that's that's
no big deal.

00;20;38;26 - 00;20;40;12
I said, well, I carry a training bra.

00;20;40;12 - 00;20;41;12
I'm going to breast, you know.

00;20;41;12 - 00;20;46;20
So, so I made it to some, like,
you know, like I'm joking and,

00;20;46;27 - 00;20;50;14
and doing all this and, and, and one day

00;20;50;14 - 00;20;53;14
I was preaching and I started breaking out
in a sweat, and it was.

00;20;54;02 - 00;20;55;23
It was, It had to be.

00;20;55;23 - 00;20;57;10
It wasn't hot in the church.

00;20;57;10 - 00;20;59;15
And and people say, what's wrong with you?
You alright?

00;20;59;15 - 00;21;04;00
I said, yeah, I said, but you know,
I will never, ever again

00;21;04;24 - 00;21;08;23
chastise a woman or make
joke of a woman having sweats and stuff.

00;21;09;27 - 00;21;11;17
That's right.

00;21;11;17 - 00;21;12;16
That's just.

00;21;12;16 - 00;21;16;13
So. And, you know, and even when I went
in, when I was in a waiting room

00;21;16;13 - 00;21;20;12
and, you know, women in there mostly,
and they were talking about

00;21;20;12 - 00;21;24;25
their treatment and what they're going
through, and what they've been through.

00;21;24;25 - 00;21;29;02
And, and so when they talk to me
about mine, I would look at them and like,

00;21;29;15 - 00;21;31;20
you know what? I have nothing to say.

00;21;31;20 - 00;21;36;07
You know, I'm just praying for you all,
because compared to what I'm going through

00;21;36;07 - 00;21;39;07
right now, it just
it doesn't even compare on your level.

00;21;40;05 - 00;21;44;02
And so I was getting encouragement
from them at the same time.

00;21;44;04 - 00;21;45;01
Yeah. Wow.

00;21;45;01 - 00;21;48;20
And so even during that,
during the whole process,

00;21;49;00 - 00;21;53;19
actually, I was able to get four other men
to go get their exams.

00;21;53;20 - 00;21;57;27
It turns out two of them had prostate
cancer, like, wow.

00;21;58;05 - 00;22;02;00
And so when I told them
that it's not that big of a deal.

00;22;02;00 - 00;22;05;16
And so we started supporting each other
and talking to each other,

00;22;05;16 - 00;22;09;03
and then eventually talking to other men
and getting them to go.

00;22;09;13 - 00;22;12;11
But what I found out was the younger,

00;22;12;11 - 00;22;17;00
the younger guys, I mean, anything below
the age of 50 is young to me

00;22;17;00 - 00;22;21;08
but they,
they just still think they're invincible.

00;22;22;15 - 00;22;24;14
Even though I tell them it, it’s not.

00;22;24;14 - 00;22;26;21
I said
you can make light of the treatment.

00;22;26;21 - 00;22;28;09
It doesn't have to be serious.

00;22;28;09 - 00;22;31;13
You know, I said there's
some attitude changes that occur, but,

00;22;31;13 - 00;22;35;08
you know, I would tell my wife that’s only
because something else is affecting me.

00;22;35;08 - 00;22;37;14
So forgive me if you'll get a divorce.

00;22;37;14 - 00;22;40;14
Make sure you sue the right person,
you know? So,

00;22;42;21 - 00;22;44;18
Anyway,

00;22;44;18 - 00;22;49;23
long story short, it
it became a sense of learning

00;22;50;00 - 00;22;52;29
and and
and I guess God was taking me through it

00;22;52;29 - 00;22;57;15
so I could take that and do and taken it
transferred to some others

00;22;57;15 - 00;23;01;20
and make it into a learning moment
and not something really serious.

00;23;01;20 - 00;23;04;20
That sounds like a death sentence.

00;23;05;14 - 00;23;06;00
That's right.

00;23;06;00 - 00;23;08;02
You know, and,
and you think about the treatment options.

00;23;08;02 - 00;23;08;08
Right.

00;23;08;08 - 00;23;11;12
You have the hormonal therapies is other
there are other therapies.

00;23;11;12 - 00;23;12;08
There's surgery.

00;23;12;08 - 00;23;13;25
There are a number of options.

00;23;13;25 - 00;23;15;15
And what I love about what you said

00;23;15;15 - 00;23;17;19
is that you were able to sit down
with your doctor

00;23;17;19 - 00;23;20;26
and you were able to say,
hey, I've done my own research too.

00;23;20;26 - 00;23;23;21
Let's talk this through
for the best possible treatment.

00;23;23;21 - 00;23;25;07
Now, I know
we only got a couple minutes left,

00;23;25;07 - 00;23;29;20
but I had to ask
if you were to do it all over again.

00;23;29;29 - 00;23;33;11
And, now going through this journey,

00;23;33;22 - 00;23;38;25
of a prostate cancer person
with the diagnosis, but also a survivor,

00;23;39;10 - 00;23;44;22
if you had to leave somebody particularly,
say, a 50 year old guy, with,

00;23;45;21 - 00;23;48;21
you know,
2 or 3 things, you know, words of wisdom,

00;23;48;25 - 00;23;53;13
what were those two or 1 or 2 things,
be that you would say, hey, listen,

00;23;53;26 - 00;23;56;26
if you, you know, one, you know,

00;23;57;02 - 00;23;59;29
do X, and two, if X happened, here's why.

00;23;59;29 - 00;24;03;07
What would be the 1 or 2 things
you would let, a 50 year old guy

00;24;03;07 - 00;24;06;07
right now know about prostate cancer

00;24;06;17 - 00;24;09;17
based on your journey?

00;24;09;26 - 00;24;15;12
Well, if that is you ask that question
actually did that last week.

00;24;15;13 - 00;24;20;17
So, it's sort of an opportune time,
but what I told it was two gentlemen.

00;24;20;17 - 00;24;23;17
I said, number one, you're not alone.

00;24;24;15 - 00;24;26;04
I'm going to be there with you.

00;24;26;04 - 00;24;28;10
If I'm not there,
I may have somebody else with you.

00;24;28;10 - 00;24;32;04
So you're not going to go
through this thing all by yourself, and.

00;24;32;04 - 00;24;33;11
And you gotta look at it just.

00;24;33;11 - 00;24;37;22
It's just like having a stomachache
and seeking out the best treatment.

00;24;38;09 - 00;24;41;01
I just don't think it is
a death sentence.

00;24;41;01 - 00;24;43;00
Think of it as life.

00;24;43;00 - 00;24;45;04
It’s something that's giving me life. And.

00;24;45;04 - 00;24;48;04
And then life will allow me
to do something else.

00;24;48;06 - 00;24;51;16
So to take to look at is not so much is

00;24;51;29 - 00;24;54;29
I mean, yes, it's serious,
but at the same time,

00;24;55;18 - 00;25;00;08
I mean, medicine has come so far
that things that were scary....

00;25;00;11 - 00;25;04;28
ten, 20, 30 years ago are now more like,
I'm not gonna say routine,

00;25;04;28 - 00;25;07;28
but they're less invasive

00;25;08;00 - 00;25;10;27
and we can look at it
in a different light.

00;25;10;27 - 00;25;14;29
And, and
and that's kind of the way I looked at it.

00;25;14;29 - 00;25;19;25
And it's kind of we, I tell people
now is that prostate cancer is just

00;25;20;21 - 00;25;25;12
another step in life
to get somewhere else.

00;25;26;01 - 00;25;28;19
And, you know, really
there's some maybe it's time.

00;25;28;19 - 00;25;30;25
And I kind of took it during that time.

00;25;30;25 - 00;25;33;12
I needed that time to
step back and do something.

00;25;34;12 - 00;25;35;20
And it gave me

00;25;35;20 - 00;25;39;18
opportunity to examine
and look at what that what I need to do.

00;25;40;00 - 00;25;42;18
And this is led to where I am at today.

00;25;42;18 - 00;25;45;20
Because the way I was going
100 miles an hour,

00;25;47;02 - 00;25;50;02
you know, I would’ve bypassed everything
else and never got to this point.

00;25;50;23 - 00;25;52;27
Yes, sir. And so, you know what?

00;25;52;27 - 00;25;56;03
Thank you for leaving with this,
leaving us with that.

00;25;56;16 - 00;25;59;18
I do want to say a couple things
before we wrap up here.

00;25;59;18 - 00;26;02;21
One, and,
you can cover yours if you want to,

00;26;02;21 - 00;26;06;19
but I actually, 
am so glad you made time to be with us,

00;26;06;19 - 00;26;09;19
because you were not only a shining light,

00;26;09;22 - 00;26;12;22
but actually, you are a model.

00;26;13;01 - 00;26;17;07
And an inspiration for many men,
independent of who they are, what color

00;26;17;07 - 00;26;21;08
they are about taking responsibility
and accountability

00;26;21;08 - 00;26;25;03
for your own health and by continuing
to walk the path, you know.

00;26;25;03 - 00;26;28;04
It's, you know, we have this facts
and Faith Friday thing where

00;26;28;06 - 00;26;31;12
we know that the facts are not at war
with our faith.

00;26;31;18 - 00;26;35;02
And you exemplify that,
I mean, all the way through.

00;26;35;02 - 00;26;38;02
So, Pastor Cheeks,
I just want to say a particular

00;26;38;03 - 00;26;40;27
thank you to you for actually giving us

00;26;40;27 - 00;26;43;27
the opportunity of hearing from you.

00;26;43;29 - 00;26;48;02
And, I just think that we will definitely
have you back if that takes you.

00;26;48;02 - 00;26;48;15
Okay.

00;26;49;15 - 00;26;50;00
That's okay.

00;26;50;00 - 00;26;53;02
Next time we do lunch, we can, There
you go.

00;26;53;10 - 00;26;55;16
There you go. There you go. Well, listen.

00;26;55;16 - 00;26;56;06
Thank you.

00;26;56;06 - 00;27;00;06
Pastor Cheeks, for your story,
for your leadership,

00;27;00;06 - 00;27;04;19
just for being you, and for your example
of how to live as a real man.

00;27;05;00 - 00;27;09;16
And, thank you to everyone listening
to another episode of Real Talk.

00;27;09;16 - 00;27;13;08
And, that, that will
this will be a wrap and Pastor Cheeks.

00;27;13;13 - 00;27;16;18
Have a blessed day and
we will talk to you, hopefully yet again.

00;27;17;06 - 00;27;19;18
Be blessed. Be blessed. Take care now.

00;27;19;18 - 00;27;19;28
But I.