I'm Travis. And I'm Taylor. And this is Bestie
Approved. What was the last song you listened
to? Oh, my gosh. I did this really magical thing
where I was desperate to feel something. And
so I shuffled every single song that I have.
I love doing that. Oh, yeah. Like when I'm in
like a deep episode. Yeah. Yeah. I the last thing
on that shuffle was No Complaints by Noah Kahn.
I love that. I love that. And I love him. What
was the last song you listened to? And then I
have a question for you. A Little Bit by Demi
Lovato. What album is that from? It's off the
new one. Oh, really? That came out like two weeks
ago. Oh, my. I didn't even know she did that.
Yeah. OK, what's your question? Have you ever
been in like a deep episode where you shuffle
your songs and you're like, OK, the next song
that comes on has a message that I need to hear?
No. Just me. I did that a lot. right right okay
anyways me neither honestly um i did that a lot
when i was in my last relationship and i was
like god if you're listening send me a sign with
the next song that i shuffle and of course every
time it was like leave him you're in a bad situation
and i was like hey god it's me taylor hey god
it's me again i did that do you ever do that
i don't know how you would but i did that with
license plates too i was like if i see an indiana
plate I'm meant to be in Indiana. Can I just
tell you, Josh, I love you to no end. I love
you. You are a person that looks for messages
in a lot of places. I love I love trying to find
meaning and purpose in things that probably don't
have any meaning or purpose. Yeah, I love it.
And I wish I could be more like you at that,
because like I. float through life. And I'm like,
whatever happens happens, I guess. Well, I think
that that's great, too. I think that there is
good in both situations. And I also think that
I'm in a really good place now where I don't
have to do that. And I think that if you're genuinely
trying to find messages or purposes in the mundane,
then that means. You're lacking something. Yeah.
And you're trying to find things through those
messages, through that purpose that you're trying
to search for. So I think that that's probably
a good thing that neither of us are in the position
to need that. Yeah. Yeah. I've just never been
a person that's like because like I. I guess
like if if if something like presents itself
to me and like it's very evident what the message
is or whatever, like I guess I can like. pull
something from that but like I don't know if
it's like a leaf floating in the wind or something
I'm just like okay or if like all of a sudden
a little bit by Demi Lovato comes on and you're
like yeah I meant to listen to this for a reason
right now in this moment I mean maybe I am meant
to listen to it for a reason because Demi Lovato
is the voice of a generation and she is and I've
always I've literally always said that I'm telling
you like maybe 12 to 15 years ago she was my
absolute idol it was when it was like the uh
the don't forget album oh god i i needed it so
bad i tried to dress in all like black white
and red because i was so obsessed with her i
love that yeah literally my era with her was
the confident era of course what's wrong with
being i love that song yeah for sure she she
really is a pop culture icon that has withstood
the test of time. She's always good. Well, her
story is actually super interesting, too, because
like she was she was on. No, she was on Wizards
of Waverly Place. Selena Gomez was Selena Gomez
was on Wizards of Waverly Place. She was on a
show called Sunny with a Chance. Yes. Yes. OK.
Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to be so real. I, for a
very long time, thought Timmy Lovato and Selena
Gomez were the same person. Oh. They were best
friends. Were they? Yes. Which one dated Justin
Bieber? Selena Gomez. Selena Gomez. Okay. Yeah,
for sure. I'm going to cut that because I don't
know. No, it's really great. Well, when they
were younger, they looked a lot alike. You know,
like in their teenage to early adult era, they
had similar characteristics. And of course, both
of them being on Disney Channel at the same time
and best friends and all that stuff. I'm sure
it was easy for... Was Jimmy Lovato the one that
was on Barney? They were both on Barney, actually.
OK, cute. I think that's how they met. Oh, OK,
cool. Yeah. I was a big, fat Demi Lovato fan
when like in middle school and high school. So
like, you know who else I was a huge fan of so
much that I don't know if you remember this,
but in elementary school, I made a club, a fan
club for a particular celebrity that was also
on Disney Channel. Can you guess who it was?
I'll give you one guess and then I'm going to
tell you. you'll die i'm trying to think about
who is on it is a man if that is a hint whether
the no jonas brothers or nickelodeon uh no they
were disney channel were they yes they were i
did love nick jonas i was a nick girl but no
i have no idea corbin blue shut up he he was
my first like sexual awakening really oh my god
the hottest thing i've ever seen the hottest
thing since sliced bread so hot oh corbin blue
was high school musical i was thinking about
uh the friend from that's so raven the one the
guy friend uh Orlando Brown. Yes. That's who
I was thinking about. Nevermind. I'm sorry. Did
you imagine? No, not him. No Corbin blue. He,
and that was also my first concert that our aunt
Tina took, took me to. That was my very first
concert. It was, wasn't it? And I think Bailey
and Logan went as well. Yeah. It was incredible.
I barely remember a second of it, but I do remember
it was at the fairgrounds. Yeah. Um, I was so
obsessed with him. I had a pillow with his face
on it. I had like, I remember the pillow. I do
remember this. Yes. It was like a satiny pillow.
Um, and at the elementary school I made a fan
club and I was the leader of it. And we would
just sit during lunch and read this biography
of him. Yes. I don't know who published it, but
it had a bunch of pictures of him, his whole
life story. I was, I was the leader. I was the
president of the club. Like, At least four other
girls. I love that. And I think one of them was
a guy. I think there was one guy that was in
it. Have you checked on that guy lately? I have
no clue who he is. OK, perfect. I could not tell
you who he is or who he was. I don't know the
first thing about whoever that man is today.
I love that. But I do know about Corbin Bleu
and I love him. Now he's a little Broadway guy.
Is he? Broadway dance. He loves it. Oh, good
for him. I keep up. I think I follow him on Instagram.
I love that. I'm so happy. Yeah. Tell me about
your week. Tell me about the week in the life
of a teacher. Thank you so much for asking. I
actually have a couple of things that I can discuss
about it. But this week was really fun for me,
actually. And this was actually the first week
where I'm like, I've been waiting for this moment
since the beginning of the school year, because
we're in the unit where we read a novel and the
novel is Of Mice and Men. I've read. and taught
this story every single year that I've been a
teacher. And I do love it every single time.
I do know that it's really debatable amongst
the masses, whether or not it should be taught
in schools. There's all kinds of things that,
I mean, literally, oh, sexism, ageism, ableism,
racism, using the N word, murder. You name it,
it's in the book. All in 107 pages. That's wild.
It's called a novella because it's so tiny. But
the whole gist of it and like why it's continued
to be taught in schools is because we're supposed
to see how the world once was so that we know
what not to do in the future. And so that history
doesn't repeat itself because how are we supposed
to. I mean, you literally just said this earlier.
How do we know what's good and what's bad if
we don't see what's good and what's bad? And
if we don't know. Yeah. So. But like that book
has been taught in schools for like ever, right?
Years and years and years. It was published in
the 30s. We read it when I was in high school
for sure. It's in a lot of schools curriculum.
Everybody, most people read it. And even though
there's so many like crazy things in it like
that. Um, it's the one book where every year
when I see parents come in and like, we have
like a parent teacher day and we all meet the
teacher or whatever. I tell the parents some
highlights of the curriculum for the whole year.
And they're like, of mice and men is the only
book I remember from high school. And I loved
it. Or it's the only book that I cared about.
It was the only one that made me feel something,
blah, blah, blah, blah. And it's a, I think it's
a beautiful story in the grand scheme of things.
And so when we finally finished it this week,
I was like chapter five and chapter six. Those
are the last two chapters. The kids are going
to freak. I hope I because I get really invested.
And that's why, like, I loved I love the act
of teaching because I like teaching things that
I enjoy and I enjoy reading that book and teaching
that book. So I want them to be excited, too.
So when some big, crazy things happen in chapter
five and chapter six, I was so happy to see that
the kids were like, oh, you're kidding. No, you're
joking. I had a couple of kids cry. Really? Yep.
Thank God. I cried, too. I've taught this book.
If you count like each period over the past six
years that I've taught this book, I probably
read and taught this book. 25 26 times okay and
every single time I cry at least every single
year I cry and I and I'm like I'm in touch with
my emotions and what about you so that's good
if you want to if you want to see me cry look
my way if not you can mind your business whatever
you want so it was really fun and Everybody was
really invested. No phones. They were into it.
They were listening to the audio. They were reacting.
I was like, this is what I've been waiting for.
Thank God. That's the only thing that rejuvenates
me with this job is. That's really cool, though,
that you have like it's like something that gets
you back into the flow state, because I feel
like I've got a couple of professors like that
where like you can tell that they really, really,
really love what they're talking about. I love
that. I love that you have that. Yeah. So this
week we finished the book. We had like, you know,
tests and quizzes over it, whatever. And now
that it's almost Thanksgiving break, I'm like,
guys, we're obviously just going to watch the
movie rest of the week. And then the rest of
this upcoming week, starting tomorrow, because
we started the movie on Friday and we'll continue
watching it on Monday, finish it on Tuesday.
And I'm like, it's. Before Thanksgiving break.
Let's just have a chill little time. Let's have
a chill little time. Yeah. I love that. This
has been like a relatively good week. Good. In
regards to teaching, pretty easy, pretty simple.
Except this week, I do have to make sub plans
for three separate days for three separate classes
because I'm having a little staycation for my
birthday. Good for you. Yeah. It just, it does
suck a little bit to do sub plans, but. I try
to make it as simple as possible because most
of the subs are like old ladies. And I don't
want to. We I feel like we never had like it
was always like moms that were subs for us. Now,
at my school, I think there are particular subs
that only choose particular classes or subjects.
So I see a lot of the same two subs and both
of those women are. Like 60s. In their 60s. That's
OK. Yeah. I do have a new girl that's taking
over my birthday days and I don't know a thing
about her. I've never heard of her, but she might
be old as dirt as far as I know, considering
I guess we'll find out record. Yeah. Yeah. So
that's the only thing that's going to be pretty
annoying about the next two days is I have to
make sure that I get those sub plans done. But
my. department trusts me with my sub plans they
every single time I have a sub they're like your
sub binder is so organized and so beautiful and
I'm like I know well you've always been a very
thorough and organized person I've never known
you to like not be that person so yeah that's
okay it's i always get compliments on my sub
plans in my sub binder and i always get compliments
on my canvas course because everything's so well
organized and by the day and that's amazing yeah
and i always tell people i really only do it
for my brain because my brain needs all of that
um i need to make sure that everything all the
t's are crossed and eyes are dotted So and then
if it benefits everybody else, then that's just
a bonus. So it's really only for me. I'm actually
a pretty selfish person. That's OK. I think so,
too. I'm glad you had a good week. Thank you.
The only thing was that I had to. I a few weeks
ago, I emailed a mom. I email all of the parents
of kids who have an F in my class on Fridays.
Being like, hey, just want to let you know that
your kid has an F in my class. If you want to
know why, you can check his or her grades. Otherwise,
if you have any specific questions or concerns,
please message me and let me know. And for the
first time, now this kid has literally like a
7 % in my class, right? How do you do that? I'm
telling you right now, it is not turning in a
single assignment and getting like a 2 out of
20 on quizzes. every so often, not a single assignment.
And now keep that in mind, because then for the
first time this school year, mind you, I've emailed
his mom every single week of the school year.
She messages me for the first time and she's
like, thanks so much for letting me know. I have
talked to him about his missing assignments and
I'm making sure that he keeps track of them.
Thank you so much. And I'm like. I don't know
who's lying to who. I don't know if you're lying
to your son. I don't know if you're lying to
me or if your son's lying to you. She's lying
to herself. Or if you're lying to yourself. Yes.
Because your son has literally not turned in
a single assignment this quarter, not a single
assignment. And at that point, there was 10,
10 classwork assignments and maybe one or two
quizzes. So I was like. thanks so much for responding.
I love the support and the help. I just wanted
to give you some specifics. And I told her all
that. And then I was like, I'll make sure that
now we have something called win periods now,
which is basically what I do with them is it's
25 minutes where I'm pulling those kids that
have F's in my class. And I'm like, get to work.
get to work now. And then I talk to each one
individually and show them their grade and tell
them what to do to fix it. And I give them a
place, whatever. He's always been in my win period,
obviously. And so I told her he's in my win period.
So I'm just going to, I'm just going to start
keeping you updated on what he does and doesn't
do. And I probably message her like two or three
times a week being like, Yeah. So, so far I've
told him to do this. He's not doing it. I've
told him to do that. He's not doing it. I've
reminded him about this. He's not doing it. Can
I just be so for real with you? My, you know,
that dear listener, you know, I don't know if
you do know this, but you know that Granny and
Papaw like raised me for the most part. I can
definitively tell you that if Papaw ever would
have gotten an email. From any teacher at Triton
Central saying, hey, Travis is failing this class.
I'm just letting you know. I just wanted to keep
you in the loop. I he would have gone to the
school with me and he would have sat in the class
with me. I believe it. And I do. I am telling
you right now, if there would have been follow
up emails, I don't know that I would have made
it out alive. Literally. I know. I'm just I'm
just telling you. And like we had knocked down
drag out fights over like a C in Mr. Bridgewater's
class. Like I I can't imagine what a seven percent.
I don't know that I would have lived through
the night. And it's so hard to imagine because
I think that what's good about us is we're very.
Like we want to do good. We want to do good and
we want to do well. Sure. And so I mean, have
you ever failed a class before? Like F failed?
Because I haven't. No, no. Right. No. And I think
that's a mix of you probably wouldn't want to
fail. And you also know that there would be major
consequences if you did. Right. And I think that
we're also pretty ambitious for the most part.
Like we. We want we know that our actions have
consequences and we know that the good things
we do lead to good things in the future, whatever,
whatever. Well, there's a level of accountability
there. Exactly. That I think. was either forced
on us or like we just like inherently had i don't
know that i care either way but like exactly
i i think that either way it's made us better
people sure and it's made us be very um very
self -aware of what we want to accomplish and
what we need to do in order to accomplish that
and i think that those are great qualities any
normal person would be like great and there is
such a lack of that a lack so severe and so dark
and foul that it makes this job almost impossible.
It's like, I don't know how to work with you
if you fear nothing. And if you care about nothing,
like I'm not that way. And I, and I hate being
that like back in my day, blah, blah, blah, blah.
But back in my day, I just simply cared. Like
you said, either because I was forced to, or
because that wasn't. a trait of mine that like,
I don't think I should fail. I don't think that
I don't think that an F in English is the right
thing to do. No, it's it's that. And then it's
also like. I don't like I've never understood
this, this notion of like. I like I get like
everyone's forced to go to school, right? Like
for for kindergarten through senior year of high
school, you're forced to go to school. You don't
have a way around that unless you drop out, I
guess. In my mind, though, I guess I don't really
understand the idea that you're going to show
up and you're going to do this every single day
and like you're going to get nothing out of it.
Like like what? Like, I guess I just I've never
gotten that. Like what a waste of time you're
making it if you are not at least listening to
what's happening. Because I told you this earlier,
it's nearly impossible to fail my class. If you
turn in any work, you're going to get points.
The only way that you ever get a zero in my class
is if you do not turn things in. And so for this
kid to have a 7%, mind you, that's his semester
grade. quarter one was and what quarter two is
so far, that 7 % is those is the average of those
two. So, I mean, he probably had like a 5 % in
quarter one and whatever it is for, I don't know.
I don't know math, but like he so severely doesn't
care. And I did recently get a message back from
that mom this week being like, thank you for
letting me know. I've been talking to him about
it. I've taken away his friends and his video
games to see if that does anything. And so far,
no luck. So it's like you don't care about school
and you don't even care about consequences such
as like the things that you love and the things
you enjoy. Like, is nothing going to change you?
And then what are you going to do outside of
high school? Like, are you going to have a job?
Are you? going to go to college are you like
he has i don't think college is in the cards
of course seven percent well what's funny about
this is at the beginning of this quarter i had
them do an american dream presentation where
like the book has to do with you know the 1930s
it was the great depression and before that was
the whole idea and concept of the american dream
i asked them to do a four slide, one of them
being a title slide. So basically a three slide
presentation on what is your American dream?
Any aspect of it? What home do you want? Do you
want a family? Do you want kids? Do you want
dogs? What kind of hobbies do you want? What
kind of cars do you want? All those things. If
you could achieve anything you dreamed of, what
would it be? Slide one. Slide two is what would
be your hypothetical plan to achieve that dream?
If in this world, 2025, if that was possible,
i .e. it's absolutely not. And then slide three
would be what are some potential obstacles in
your way? So. easiest thing in the entire world.
You don't need any internet for it. It's all
opinion based, basically. And he still won't
do that. So me asking this question, like, what
are you ambitious about? I don't even know. I
don't know what this kid wants. I don't know
what he dreams. I don't know what kind of job
he wants in the future. I don't know if he wants
to go to college. And it's funny because I asked
him those things through this incredibly easy
presentation and he won't do that. So I can't
even tell you like. What does this kid want?
Have you ever asked him directly? Like, just
like, hey, like, what's good? What do you what
are you doing? Absolutely. What's the answer?
He shrugs. He doesn't talk. He I've heard him
say words before a few, but he is so just like
I think it's a mix of. He's completely disconnected,
and so he just doesn't need to talk to people
or teachers or anything. But like I've asked
him, I said. this assignment is now four and
a half weeks past its due date and I've asked
you to do it for the past three weeks in when
period and you haven't done it so like is there
a reason and he shrugs and I'm like okay do you
just feel like not motivated to do to do this
particular assignment or like just not motivated
for school in general like what's what's the
deal shrug and at that point I'm like OK, go
away. I can't. I need something. I can't help
you more than you're helping yourself. And that's
sometimes where I become. Well, that's the hard
part is like with anything you you genuinely
can. I mean, it's it's with addiction. It's with
like this education system. It's with any of
it. You cannot help someone more than they want
to help themselves. Absolutely. And that's hard.
And it's very hard when you're a teacher because
you internalize it in different ways. Like. I
want to make sure that all of my students succeed
at some capacity, even if that means like they
get a D and that's the best they can do. I want
them to have that, but I also want them to earn
that. And I'm not going to spoon feed them every
step of the way. And I'm not going to bend over
backwards if they're not willing to make any
commitments to better themselves in that way.
And so sometimes over the years, there have just
been kids where. I can't get through to them.
I never will. And some of them have even told
me like, you should just stop trying so hard.
That happened to me last year. I had a kid that
was again, like failing, failing, failing, failing,
failing. And every single week I'd be like, okay,
all I need from you this week is this assignment.
Turn it in. I'm begging you. I would do anything
possible. And one day he was like, you know,
you don't have to try this hard. Right. And I
was like, what do you mean? He's like, I'm going
to be really real with you. I truly don't care
about this class and it's not you and it's not
this class. I just don't care in general. I'm
not going to do the work that you asked me to
do. I'm OK with you giving me zeros and I'll
sit and I'll listen and I won't be on my phone.
But you can stop trying. How sad is that? I feel
so conflicted about that because on some level,
like I think if I was in your position, that's
like if that's kind of the position I'm in, you
don't have to hide your drink. I don't want them
to hear me slur. They're not going to hear it.
It's fine. On some level, I think if I was in
your position, I think that's the answer I would
want to hear. I'm like, OK, there's nothing I
can do. But at that point, I think it's like,
OK. What do I have to do to change that answer?
And like, I don't know that there is an answer
to that question. So that's hard. Because at
that point, I think that all I did was I went
ahead and contacted mom and I was like, hey,
this kid's not in trouble at all. But I do want
you to know where his head is at in case you've
seen this, because that also just sounds it almost
sounds like a cry for help. I mean, yeah, how
how sad it is to just like. I don't care stop
caring stop trying to help me stop trying to
fix me it seems like some sort of cry for help
so I did reach out to mom and be like this kid
is not in trouble in any way shape or form I'm
happy that he was open and honest with me but
this is what he said today and I just wanted
it to be on your radar and apparently I mean
he had some other stuff going on he I mean he
was failing all of his classes basically and
there was some crazy things going on like not
in his home life but like with his friends and
like a significant other like kids go through
things uh crazy things i think that we don't
give kids enough credit for that but yeah for
sure at the same time like i think on some level
you i mean not you i thought parents and like
a society in general like we have to figure out
a way to like how to like shield kids from that
because like it growing up is hard like and i
i think that's something that we don't like actually
think about enough like i mean like you and me
like like when we had for like all intents and
purposes like incredible lives growing up we
had incredible people yeah but Our lives were
like on some level still kind of nightmares in
a lot of ways. Like the divorce, we had like
addiction issues in the family. We had like so
many other things that were like extenuating
circumstances. And I don't think that people
give that enough credit sometimes. Absolutely.
And I think that we deserve a lot of credit from
that as well, that we had really powered through
that despite all of the things and all of the
adversities. all the terrible things that were
happening on the sidelines where we're still
very successful and well -rounded people. I don't
mean to toot my horn and I don't mean to toot
yours, but here we are. Toot, toot. The boot's
down. You know what I mean? So that's great.
And what sucks is I see a lot of my kids going
through a lot of things. I have very much a lot
of faith that they're going to power through
it and come out successful on the other side.
And then I see kids that I'm like, this is going
to eat you alive. And what also sucks is I'm
now at the point in my career where I mean, this
happens at any point, literally, like it happened
my first year of teaching. But like kids are
dying. Kids are missing. Kids have cancer. Kids
have all kinds of things. I Jesus Christ. It's
when my first year of teaching, I also coached
cheerleading. One of my cheerleaders died and
it was the most devastating. I was like, this
is the this is the lowest I will ever be in this
career. It was the most devastating thing that
had ever happened to me at that point. I have
a girl right now who's very sweet, very quiet,
very so incredibly smart. She has a cyst on her
brain and she has to get surgery for that. Like,
I think during Thanksgiving break, if I'm not
mistaken. And I'm told she's now having seizures
and eye problems because of it. And I'm like,
oh, my. And then a boy's kid, a boy's kid, a
boy's dad just died. like 15 years old and you
don't have your dad anymore. Like it's all so
devastating. Yeah. And that's an interesting
thing about being a teacher is I think that at
some level, if you're a teacher, you have some
form of empathy or some level of it. Oh, you
have to. Yeah. And it's incredibly difficult
to see the things that kids go through these
days, or at least people in general that I've,
I've been very privileged to not experience.
And To imagine being in their shoes and going
through what they're going through. It's devastating.
Well, you've also always been the person you
like. You've always had very big feelings. And
like you more than anyone I know have like you
take on other people's feelings. Like Emma's
the same way. Like she feels like other people's
pain on a level that like I either like disassociate
from or like I just don't feel because I'm like,
I know. Well, I think that's very healthy at
a general level to not take that on. But it's
I always say it's a gift and a curse to, you
know, have empathy and to be as empathetic as
like what you're talking about with Emma and
with me, where like we we feel for a person so
severely that it physically hurts. It it it drains
the life out of you. Especially my first couple
of years of teaching. It was so hard. Like I'm
being a first year and second year teacher is
hard enough. But then on top of I'm really internalizing
everything that's coming my way. And it was just
constant crying, constant crying. And I'm a little
better about that now. But something like this
happens, like someone's dad dying or, you know,
kids get cancer all the time. My sister Bailey
had. a student at her school a few years ago
that had cancer and died and just the you know
in elementary school especially it's it's like
a community yeah and like those kids when you're
a kid you just kind of hang out with anybody
and you just know everybody and the school was
absolutely devastated well like first of all
like you don't really have a concept of death
right like I remember when you were too young
to remember this but when grandma joe died i
like i remember because papa and huck were the
ones that like went and found her like that was
that's a whole that's a whole different story
i'll tell you that one day wow but yeah like
so they went to her house they knew she was dead
and then like this was before i was in third
grade so i don't think that we had cell phones
yet and um i remember them pulling into the driveway
and like I just remember like like because it
was Denise's grandma and I remember like just
the entire world shattering for her and I like
I could not conceptualize what was happening
because like we had never been exposed to death
like we never knew that and then even like when
Roy died like because you remember Roy's funeral
like it was like I mean vicky throwing herself
like on the ground like the whole song and dance
of it like rt who i mean he was like 19 years
old at the time like getting up and like having
to to talk about it and like like like at 16
i was like okay like i i knew what death was
but like we'd never really experienced death
and so like for a kid to like see like one of
their friends that's just not there anymore like
Where do you put that? What do you do with that?
I don't know. It's absolutely insane. I do also
talk about all the time how privileged and how
blessed we are that we still have our granny
and papa. Yeah. The world is going to end when
one of them or both of them are gone. Emma and
I have talked a lot about that. We're like. Like,
I think it will fundamentally like change, like
the foundation of who we are as people, because
like. I don't know what to do with that. Like
I like even. Like I like because I mean, for
me, like they were my parents, like I like that's
just like that's just what that is. Yeah. So
I don't know. I don't know. And hopefully we
don't have to know for a while longer. Hopefully.
Hopefully. This week at school was good. I'm
glad it was a good week for you. My week was
trash. What happened? I was sick as a dog this
week. No way. I woke up on Sunday. And I felt
like I had been run over by a train. I like and
do you remember the beginning of covid where
like there was some bug going around and like
everyone was like, oh, this is like the flu is
bad this year, like that whole song and dance
that people were doing. And then like we hear
about the novel coronavirus coming out of out
of Wuhan, China or whatever it was. And I'm like,
I. It's giving very much like pre -COVID vibes.
Oh no. Because like I talked to like six or seven
people that had the exact same thing. But like
I, it was bad. Like I got to the point on like
Tuesday or Wednesday night where I was like laying
in the bed and I was like, I think I might need
to go to the ER. Like I could not breathe. Like
it was bad. Oh my God. And like I took a COVID
test. It wasn't COVID. Like it wasn't anything.
And then like I had the. like a virtual appointment
with my doctor. And she was like, yeah, this
is like a, it's like an upper respiratory thing
going around. It's really, really, really rough.
And I still have like, I'm still like signed
to see or whatever, but I'm fine now. But like,
yeah, it was a trash week. Oh, what a nightmare.
Yeah. I've been kind of waiting for something
like that to happen to me because every single
year that I've been a teacher, I've gotten COVID.
Mind you, I've had all my shots, whatever, whatever.
And thankfully. Every time I've gotten COVID
because I've had the shots, it's not as bad,
but I've had it and I've had to quarantine every
single year. But this year I haven't. And I'm
waiting for the ball to drop. I'm expecting it.
I'm kind of cut this because it sounds bad. I'm
kind of looking forward to it because I love
not going to work and I love just quarantining
at home. I have a question. Yeah. If you had
to redo. Like the shutdown, like all of it all
over again. Like if we had what we were told
was going to be two weeks, it ended up being
like a year. What would you do differently? This
is like a fun question I do like to ask people.
Like, would you would you like, I guess, do anything
differently? Here's I honestly had a had a really
OK time in quarantine and I. You know, I did
what everybody else did. You know, I stayed home
and I I was on TikTok. TikTok was like very,
very new at that time. And everybody was making
the the frothed coffee and was, you know, doing
all the lip syncing and the dancing and stuff.
And I really enjoyed doing silly things like
that. I actually have a lot of really good memories
of that time. I'm very. blessed that nobody around
me was terribly affected by COVID or anything
like that but there were like my sister Bailey
and I we were still technically in college I
when COVID happened I was in the middle of my
student teaching and so I was still when COVID
right when COVID started I was taking over the
Canvas courses and the Canvas pages and Taking
over the lessons, I was actually supposed to
completely take the reins of the classes that
I was student teaching in. And I was supposed
to be like the teacher. And so I did that for
a couple of weeks. And during those couple of
weeks, my sister and I, we would drive to the
parking lot of a Starbucks in Whitestown. And
we would just sit in the car at that. In the
Starbucks parking lot and take the Wi -Fi and
just do work together in the car. I love that.
It was beautiful. Honestly, it was really fun
because I'm also a very independent and very
introverted person. We talked about this a little
bit last episode. And so I really enjoyed not
having to be so around so much around people.
I'm actually really OK being alone and I'm really
comfortable in being alone. And even when I was
just with Bailey or just with my family, I really
enjoyed that, honestly. And I think that it was
a rest that as a really stressed out 22 year
old college student, I needed that. But of course,
that's also kind of a crazy thing to say, because
so many people were dying and so many people
were having a horrible time. And there's also
even if we. look past the atrocities of COVID
itself during that time there were lots of people
that are very much extroverted and very much
social beings that were desperate for connection
at that time and I did feel for that at some
level of course I didn't agree just based on
my own experiences but I felt so bad for people
that wanted something so bad and couldn't have
it do you remember My birthday in 2020? No. You
don't remember this? No, tell me about it. Where
you and Paley brought Olive Garden to my apartment
at Solana because I was that person that, like,
I think I called you in the middle of the night
one night and I was like... i'm going to kill
myself like i cannot handle being alone i cannot
handle any of this because like it was it was
two weeks to stop the spread like that's what
we were told the whole time and i was like i'm
like i can do two weeks like whatever like we
we all went home from work like it was like we
were sent home and like i remember like And the
like, I remember like it was yesterday, like
we like because it was like we have to figure
out how to work from home. So like they sent
us home with like these Wi -Fi boxes that like
connected to like our works network, but like
didn't like it. It was a whole song and dance.
But I remember like walking out of there with
my monitors and I was like, wow, this is a lot
for just two weeks. And I remember thinking that.
And then I remember going to my apartment at
Solana and I was like, OK, here we go. Two weeks.
Two weeks. And then I remember calling you and
I was like, it's been a little more than two
weeks, Josh. I don't know. And then my birthday
rolls around. And yeah, you and Bailey had to
bring me Olive Garden because like I was on the
verge of literally throwing myself off a balcony.
See, that's so tough. Do you not remember that?
Well, mind you, that was also the time in which
I was starting. Now, I. I don't have a thyroid
anymore. And it was because it literally started
like erasing my memory. Like my thyroid doctor
told me I was in the early stages of like early
onset dementia. So there are a lot of times between
2017 to 2022. I actually don't remember. Oh,
there's a lot of things that I don't remember
during those times. I forgot so many things and
it cost me so much money. I mean, we shouldn't
even talk about the fact that I forgot about
oil changes. I do remember you forgetting about
an oil change. Dear listener, I forgot that oil
changes were a thing. I don't even I don't even
know how long I drove my car without an oil change.
It's like three years. Probably. Yeah. And then
I remember Huck opening it up and be like, huh,
there's nothing in here. Yeah. I had to get that
thing out of my body for sure. It was rotting
me from the inside out. So there's a lot of things
I actually don't remember. Well, now we know.
Isn't that kind of silly? Yeah. So, yeah, I'm
glad that we did that. That seems like a nice
thing to do. It was a nice thing to do. Thank
God. Cool. So in order to prepare for today's
reality roundup, you watched the first half of
season one of The Real Housewives of Salt Lake
City. Oh, yeah. And that for me. Is a gift I
wish I could give myself because this is your
first this is the first time you've really watched
The Real Housewives in general. It's my first
dive into any Real Housewives ever. Yes. So my
first time I think about that and like I think
to myself. So Real Housewives of Salt Lake City
was announced, I think, 2019 or 2020. I think
that, yeah, they wrapped filming right before
the shutdown. So, OK, 2020, 2021 is when it was
premiering. And I remember thinking to myself,
I thought the same thing about Salt Lake City
that I thought about Potomac before it premiered,
where I was like, get this off of my TV. I don't
want these like what I thought were mid -tier
cities. Because when you think of Real Housewives,
you think of like Miami, Orange County, New York,
Beverly Hills. And I was like, I cannot believe
how wrong I was, because I remember it was we
were in the middle of covid and I had nothing
else to do. So I was like, well, let me let me
just fire up the real house. I was a Salt Lake
City. Yeah. And oh, Lord, have mercy. Am I glad
that I did that? Because I like I loved it so
much. Tell me about what your experience has
been watching the first nine episodes of season
one. Yes, of course. And first of all, thank
you for it. You said it best, the gift that it
is to not just start this like Real Housewives
journey, but to start it with Salt Lake City.
I already love the now going into it very late,
like five years late is really good for me because
I'm already obsessed with the secret lives of
Mormon wives. And so the idea of like Utah, Mormon,
all this stuff I'm I'm familiar with. I. I enjoy
having some sense of familiarity when it comes
to jumping into new things like this. So I had
that. You had me sold. And then so let me give
you a rundown of the things that I've learned
and the things that I've been enjoying. You've
mentioned the name, the first and last name of
Jen Shaw before. Yes. So when I heard that this
is Jen, the Jen Shaw, I was like. it's baby's
first time with Jen Sean. I'm so excited. I was
like, let me just sit in this moment. Let me
hold space for it. It was so exciting. And then
I also remember the name Meredith Marks. I don't
know if it was like from the episodes you and
Emma had done or whatever, but I was like, I
recognize that name as well. So I had taken very
extensive notes of the first three episodes because
I just wanted to make sure that I got all my
bearings, that I knew who everyone was, who everyone
was connected to, who's friends with who, who's
not friends with who. Um, I am almost so thankful
and so blessed to have experienced some piece
of the Jen and Mary saga. Every single episode,
one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight
and nine. It is always mentioned. And I honestly
think it's really funny. I thought that it was
the funniest. Now, I remember you and Emma doing
this episode talking about how. Jen had come
from the hospital because her aunt had her legs
amputated. And then Mary said that it smelled
like hospital. And first of all, I think that's
so funny. I think that's the funniest thing in
the whole world. And I thought that it was even
funnier when Jen had confronted her about it.
And Mary was like, I did say that. And what?
Like, what do we do now? A gift. And so very
early on, I. started making notes of like, OK,
who do I love and why? And where is this going
to go? And my list of who I love and who I hate
has changed every episode. It will change every
episode. It will change every season. Yeah, it's
wild. I'm really excited to see where that takes
me. But, you know, it hasn't changed through
episodes one through nine. Tell me. I love Whitney.
I love that girl. She's she's my girl. I love
her. And I remember you asking Emma and Emma
asking you if you could be friends with anybody
in this season, who would it be? I hope and pray
that I could be friends with Whitney. I think
she's so funny. I think she's so cool. I think
she's so gorgeous. And I think that she's also
beyond what we saw in episode nine. The most.
level -headed and well -rounded and i think that's
because she's had now i know that they've all
had their fair share of um like things happening
in their lives and adversities and stuff but
i think that whitney is so real because she has
seen and has been so deeply ingrained into the
process of getting through her dad's addiction
and stuff like that and i feel like that probably
made her Grow up very quickly, especially because
she's I mean, throughout these episodes, she's,
you know, insinuating that she's paid thirty
thousand dollars for his rehab and that she is
felt like he thinks he's entitled to that. Yes.
Which is so sick to think of your daughter in
that way. Like you owe me because I. I think
in one of these recent episodes I watched that
she had explained my dad made a list of everything.
All the things that he had paid for growing up.
Yes, like dances, sports, cars, everything. And
I'm like, how absolutely sick and twisted is
that? And that's what addiction does to you.
It really shifts your priorities and what matters
to you and things like that. And it's just so
sad to. See her having to go through all these
things, but I think that that made her a very
well -rounded woman with a good head on her shoulders.
Although I am so excited to talk about it. I
am excited to talk about episode nine. I will
tell you in episode nine, it will shift for you.
And I'm going to tell you. So I will say Whitney
Rose is. Of all of the Housewives of Salt Lake
City, between her, Heather and Meredith Marks,
those are really my top three that I would want
to meet and be friends with. Absolutely. You
will have a hard time with Whitney in season
three. I'm just going to tell you that right
now. Keep it to yourself. Well, that's actually
now that I'm saying this out loud, I think you
might not have as hard of a time as I did with
her because. Yeah. So you're I'm going to I'm
just going to let you experience it on your own.
The journey she goes on in season three and.
Season four, part of season four. And I think
you and I are going to view it in two very, very
different ways. Not like, OK, not like not that
I view as what she did negatively, but I think
that I got to the point where I was like, if
I have to hear about this one more time, like
I'm going to shut the TV off for sure. You, I
think, will be much more open to it. OK, I can't
wait. So before we jump into reality roundup
for episode nine, I am so excited because Christmas
is coming early. Miss Jennifer Shaw is being
released from prison on December 10th. Merry
Christmas. She is going to get to spend Christmas
with Coach Shaw. I bet she misses him bad. I
bet she does, too. She's been lonely. She's been
lonely. Episode one through nine. Him being away
recruiting. How about you being in jail, Mama?
How are you doing? How about? I hope he's been
visiting. How are they doing? Now, mind you,
I literally don't know. So I know that he has
been running her social media as far as I know.
So, like, I assume that. Well, she can't run
it from prison. Well, I feel like you just shouldn't
be running it at all if you're in prison. I got
to tell you, Jen Shaw's never been one to shy
away from the spotlight. But I. I don't know.
I assume they're doing fine. Like, I, I don't
know. Great. I would like if she doesn't come
back to Real Housewives of Salt Lake City, because
Andy Cohen did say, like, I don't want to see
her again. I hope he changes his mind on that.
But if she doesn't come back, I would really
like to see, like, just a sit down interview
with the two of them just to be like, hey, this
is the story. Incredible idea. You were convicted
of it. Let's just call it what it is. Let's just
put it out all out on the table. And everybody
already knows. Yeah, it's OK. No, it's not OK,
but everybody already knows. So it's OK for you
to just say what happened. Everybody wants to
know everybody. And you should hold yourself
accountable because I only know as far as what
you've said in previous episodes, like she stole
money from old people. Or like what's. Yes. Can
you give me like a 10 second recap? So she her
companies that it was all. OK, so she it all
surrounded a telemarketing scheme where she would
reach out to people like her and her associates
and they would sell them like a business opportunity
and they would like get them on a subscription
where it was like charging their credit card
every month for whatever the business consulting
services were. that had no value and said they
were like selling them a website and then like
it was like okay you're you're in too deep okay
like how do we get you out of this so then I
guess they were and I don't know that I don't
know the details of how this happened but then
I guess on the other side of it there was like
okay well how do we get you in touch with the
debt consolidation company and they were like
getting kickbacks from the debt consolidation
company maybe I don't know but it was just selling
services of no value is what the The long and
short of it was. Now, was the purpose of that
for Jen Shaw to get more money? Mm hmm. What's
now? Here's the thing that I don't understand.
And maybe because I'm just not in this position,
but I feel like when you are at a certain amount
of rich, you just don't need to have more money
and you don't need to want to have more money.
That's where the money was coming from, though.
What? All of her money? All of it? I think there
were like other marketing deals or something,
but like the majority of the money was coming
in from that telemarketing scheme and then Coach
Shaw's income. Well, I was going to say, doesn't
Coach Shaw just have enough income as a as a
college football coach? I think he was making
like four hundred thousand a year. Like here's
here's the thing. And this is this is what a
lot of people. Will tell you about the real housewives
that have been caught up in this thing, like
Teresa Giudice, like Tom Girardi, like these.
These real housewives that were like at the level
of mega, mega, mega wealth. There's a there's
like a need to keep this facade going. We're
like Teresa Giudice and Joe Giudice, like their
whole thing became I think it was mortgage fraud
is what they ended up mortgage fraud or wire
fraud. One of the two. Where. It not if it was
real, it was all smoke and mirrors, and then
the same thing with Tom Girardi, where like it
became like a Ponzi scheme, like where he was,
he was the Aaron Brockovich lawyer where he was
bringing in like money from class action lawsuits
and he was paying the money from like a previous
lawsuit with the money from the current lawsuit.
And. some clients weren't getting paid out at
all. So, like, the wheels start to fall off.
And then, like, you look at the optics of, like,
how is this going? And then it's like, you've
got the same thing going on in Potomac right
now where Wendy and Eddie Acefo just got arrested
for insurance fraud. There's, I mean, housewives
will tell you there's a need to, like, keep up
a facade that's not there. But that's what happened
with Jen Shah is... The money was coming in from
the telemarketing scheme that there wasn't money
there to begin with. Mm hmm. Yeah. Horrible.
Hate that. Very crazy. I guess I just can't.
I can't really wrap my mind around. And it's
kind of like the whole thing with, you know,
Jeff Bezos and all these terribly, terribly rich
people. It's like, what do you what is the purpose
of having this? amount of money and like the
need and the drive to just constantly constantly
constantly work and have more and more and more
which kind of at a very much like lower level
is kind of what Lisa is exuding is she is she
even said like her work comes first always and
it's like you have a husband and kids like and
she doesn't want to she wants to keep having
projects she wants to keep having opportunities
and I feel so bad to For her that she's in that
mindset that like that's what she needs. And
I know that we know people like that. Our Papal
is like that. Absolutely. But it's not about
the money, I don't think. For Lisa? For Papal.
Well, for Papal, probably not. But what about
Lisa? I think Lisa's like our Papal. Like, I
don't know that it's about the money. I think
the money is probably a really good incentive.
I don't think for her it's about the money, though.
I think that there is a level of worth you put
on. at the end of the day did i accomplish something
i i true i like with with lisa i do see that
right i i don't think it's about the money at
all for lisa barlow good well you know more than
i do so i trust that there's that um are you
ready to jump into episode nine i couldn't be
more ready okay hip -hop and heartbreak so We
start with opening shots. Heather and Whitney
are horseback riding. And I like that instructor.
I thought he was very hot. For sure. And I'm
really into. Heather and her sexual bag. Yes.
I need it so desperately. I need it so desperately.
I want I feel so bad for her through all these
episodes of her talking about our divorce and
how she really only did it for, you know, being
a perfect little Mormon. And like, I mean, how
could you get a more. perfect Mormon husband
than this. Than Billy. Than Billy. Yeah. And
I think I heard probably in this episode or the
last one that she said that she just started
saying no to him. It was this episode. It was
this episode. I have notes about that. Yeah.
So like, how sad is that? Like you start being
your own person and setting boundaries and then
your husband leaves you. What a nightmare. Yeah.
I mean, I don't know if that's all that was happening,
but I mean, I believe it. She talks about it
in her book. I mean, that's basically what happened.
She's got two books. Well, I have to read them
because I'll also be reading Macy's soon. Oh,
I can't wait to read Macy's book. I can't wait.
We should read it at the same time. OK. Bad Mormon
is the first book and then Good Time Girl is
the second book. I've read Bad Mormon. I'm like
halfway through Good Time Girl. Bad Mormon is
a very good book because it like. Like as far
as Housewives books are concerned, it's all about
like, oh, yeah, this is my life. And they give
you a little bit of like behind the scenes, like
about the other women or like the show itself.
But like, I think Heather was very. I think she
was like, I really want to tell this story to
like help people who are struggling with like
faith or whatever. So I think that was a really
cool book for her. Awesome. We head over to Lisa's
house and she asked Jack if he wants anything
for breakfast. And Jack says, I'm not really
craving a microwave hot dog right now, but thanks.
I thought that was the funniest thing. So funny.
That was so funny. Because like a lot of these
housewives are like, oh, I never cook like I
never cook. And, you know, it's like all a crock.
I wholeheartedly believe what Lisa presents to
us on TV where she's constantly going through
a Taco Bell drive through or. Like driving to
get a Diet Coke. I wholeheartedly believe that
is her when the cameras are off. I believe it.
So like I believe it in my bones. And that was
one of the big notes that I had for episode one
was like her talking about, oh, we're not the
kind of family that's together at dinner. We're
going through the Taco Bell drive through going
through this drive through going through that
drive through hitting this gas station. I thought
that was so funny because that's not necessarily
the facade. Or like the energy that she exudes.
Like I had told you through texts this week that
like I feel like Lisa in a lot of ways is so
chic and so cool and so classy. And I really
love the dichotomy of her giving classy chic
boots and her going through the Taco Bell drive
through and getting Diet Cokes at the gas station
three times a day. I think that's the funniest
thing in the world. I love it. And like, you're
going to get to an episode, I think at the end
of season two, where Mary Cosby looks at her
and she goes, you eat Taco Bell. And Lisa Barlow's
like, I love Taco Bell. I love it so much. She
goes, love that. Love Taco Bell. Love Taco Bell.
I also love Lisa Barlow's voice. Like, I know
it's a little bit like controversial because
some people think it's so grating. I love Lisa
Barlow's voice. I think it's so. funny yeah i
love it so much i love i in a lot of ways i love
lisa i do too but then it like the i don't know
which episode it was but i was like i hate this
woman i think she's so mean and so rude was it
the ski trip episode probably yeah the one where
they went to the ski lodge and like she was so
hateful to whitney and heather yeah i i wrote
it down i did yeah yeah it was it was episode
two yeah she was a nightmare in that episode
i hate her for it We head over to Jen's house
and Jen and her assistant are planning Sharif's
surprise birthday party. You will come to find
out that this assistant, I think it's season
three, we find out that she's multi -talented
because she's got a side gig being a twerking
instructor and her name is Crystal Pussy. Incredible.
She and Whitney would be good friends based on
what we've seen in previous episodes. Maybe.
Maybe. Everyone's invited to Sharif's party except
for Mary. And then we cut over to Mary at her
house and she doesn't know how many houses she
owns. But we find out she has a house in Carmel.
I feel like I've heard about this. I don't know
if it was through like my dad's husband or something
or if it was. I don't know who it was, but somebody
had told me that a housewife does have a house
in Carmel, Indiana. And I could not for the life
of me figure out who it was. So then when I heard
that, I was like, it's her. It was like five
minutes from where I lived at the rail yard.
Really? Yeah. And I did hear what she said is
true. That is completely empty all year round.
I don't know. I wish I could remember who told
me that. But that person said the exact same
thing. Nobody's in that house. Yeah. Well, so
I remember reading an article from someone that
lived in the neighborhood because it's like I'm
not going to dox her, but like it's I know this
neighborhood very well. Yeah. And. The one of
the neighbors was like, yeah, we've never met
her. We don't know who this woman is. Yeah, that's
so funny. A couple of things about this surprise
party. I want you to know that if you ever find
out that somebody's throwing me a surprise party.
I need you to either shoot them or shoot me beforehand.
I. I hate the idea of a surprise party. Why?
I have to know everything. I like the idea of
a surprise party. I like I like the idea. This
is so sick. I like the idea of pretending to
be surprised. I think I'd want to know because
like what an honor and a privilege. Someone's
planning a surprise. Actually, you know what?
I take that back. I would want a surprise party.
OK. Yeah. And I love that for you. I think that
a part of it is also I don't want to party. I
don't want to party. If I want to hang out with
people on my birthday, it can probably be like
two or three people. I would much I would much
rather be smaller. I agree with you on that.
Yeah. Yeah. Like Mary wants. Yes. Small and intimate.
Oh, God. I think that was all I was going to
say. OK. So we got over to Mary at her house
and she's on FaceTime with. Wait, is this? Yeah.
She's on FaceTime with Robert Sr. And. She starts
to have a little bit of a breakdown and starts
crying about the issues with Jen. And I've I've
said several times that, like, I do not know
that the actual issue really revolves around
the hospital spell comment. I think what what
Jen Shaw has done with Mary up to this point
is like, I'm going to make an enemy out of you
and I'm going to make you feel othered. And I
think that's what she's experiencing here. And
she also feels like the other girls took Jen's
side. because the other girls are terrified of
Jen. Right. And we've seen like three or four
times up until this point, like Jen having full
blown meltdowns, like like having freakouts,
like the complete explosions. And I will buy
that on some level. I don't know if terrified
is the word, but I will buy on some level that
people are like, I can't handle this. Yeah. Like
growing up, like and like love him to death now.
But like Miles was like this growing up. Like
it was like, I'm going to make your life a living
hell. And I'm just going to scream at you and
scream at you until the point where it's like,
OK, whatever you want. I don't care. I don't
want to do this with you anymore. Right. Yeah.
And I think that as 30 and 40 year old women,
I don't think that you have to subject yourself
to people who have that kind of attitude. and
have that issue where you're just going to blow
up. Like, that's what, you know, by the end of
episode nine, I'm like, you're a 40 something
year old woman. What are you doing in public
in front of 150 plus people acting like this?
Oh, I have a lot of thoughts about this. We will
get to this because like the we'll get to it.
Yeah. Yeah. um we had we had over to have we
head over to heather's house for valentine's
day and uh billy comes over with gifts for the
girls and i love i actually really just love
that heather was honest about this she goes billy
was tall cool and rich which checked all of her
boxes for sure as the boxes should be there yes
absolutely and tall cool and rich is really Those
are my boxes, too. So that'll do it. Whatever.
That'll do it. They get engaged after three months
of knowing each other. And then we find out that,
like, just we get a sneak peek into, like, how
their marriage was. And I guess the beginning
of the end was they went to see Scary Movie 3,
which is an old choice for a Mormon couple, by
the way. Absolutely. I was also like, hmm, that
is a choice that you made. Yeah. Interesting.
But when the scene with the Gloria happened,
Billy stormed out and Heather didn't really see
a problem with it. So Billy decided that he was
just going to be rotten to her. And that's where
things start to fall apart. Right. And then ultimately,
Billy left. And you mentioned this earlier because
Heather wouldn't change the time of a baptism
for one of their daughters to accommodate a sister.
So he said, OK, make it whenever you want. And
I'll just move out next week. And that is so
I mean, I don't even have to say how disgusting
and crazy that is and how sad it is. And I think
that it also makes me really sad that Heather
is so really torn up about it. And maybe it's
just because it is a divorce of a marriage. And
there's also other cultural and societal expectations
given them being Mormon that she's so devastated
about this divorce. Whereas like if I were with
somebody like that and like some time has passed,
I'd be like, thank God. I so I have. Tried to
piece this timeline together in my head. I think
that it was much more recent than we knew, because
like, I don't I don't know if she's mentioned
it up until this point, but like, I don't think
that that much time had passed. But like, I also
think that it makes me really sad for Heather.
But on some level, I feel. Not sad for Billy,
but like I feel bad that like that's that was
Billy's worldview where like he said. The Mormonism
thing is like is the number one important thing
to me. Everything else is a deal breaker. And
if you aren't going to conform to like exactly
what I want, it's over. And I'm like, why? Why
wasn't that more important to you? I guess like
that's kind of my question. And that makes me
sad a little bit. It's extremely sad, especially
because, I mean, I know that when you're from
what I've gathered from this season of Housewives
and Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, like when you
are married to somebody from the Mormon church,
you are married, not just. like for the rest
of your lives, but for eternity. And like, even
if you divorce that person, you're also stuck
with them in eternity. This is something that
comes up in the reunion of season one. Yeah.
So it's being called sealed in the church. So
you can get married and then it's just like a
normal marriage or whatever. But then if you
get sealed in the church, you're sealed for all
eternity to your husband. And this is some, was
it? I think Miranda on The Secret Lives of Mormon
Wives talked about where she said she's. Like,
well, what was it like? She's like just kind
of like stuck out in the middle of nowhere because
her husband or her ex -husband got married to
someone else. So. So she can't be with her husband.
Well, ex -husband. I don't remember what it is
like, but it sounds very daunting and scary.
Yes. No matter what it is. You know, my whole
feelings about religion, but like that's that's
what it all is, is just to scare people. Honestly,
yeah. Yeah. And I just feel so bad for everybody
involved that like, especially if. I don't know
how old Billy and Heather were when they got
married, but for a lot of 23. Yeah. For like
a lot of Mormons, you're in your late teens,
early twenties, making this serious commitment
after only a lot of the times, a few months of
dating. And I'm sure that especially being brought
up in that kind of religion and that kind of
society, you just want to be as perfect as you
can and you just want to do the right thing.
And I think that it's also devastating and. Heather
is a big person to be talking about this in this
season where when you're Mormon, you're striving
for perfection and the endless pursuit of perfection
and all things. Absolutely. And so I feel so
bad that that is so deeply ingrained in Heather
that she probably has this internalized notion
of like, I'm so deeply not perfect because my
marriage is failing because of this, because
of that. And and with. It's just so it's it's
devastating to imagine what actually is going
on in her heart and her mind after knowing that
you are supposed to be perfect and everything
had fallen apart for her. Well, she does get
into that a little bit. She she talks a lot about
it, like when it's when she's like writing the
bad Mormon book and like. So a lot of this does
come up, but like she does acknowledge in this
episode that she only got married. to be married
and to have an eternal family because like that's,
that's the, that's the vision you're sold. And
we grew up in a church like this, by the way,
like we, we were told the most important thing
you can do as a woman is be a mother. Like that's,
I very vividly remember hearing that in Sunday
school classes. Right. And I'm like, you, if,
if you're like, I mean, I guess it is indoctrinated.
Like that's the word, but it's like, if that's,
if that's the vision you're sold. on some level
yeah you you feel like you have to check that
box right yeah but and I think she feels a little
bit conflicted because she's she does she does
say that she feels thankful that they're divorced
but like she feels like she's out on an island
because you're living in the Mormon capital of
the world and like and I mean even today like
because your mom talked about this where she
felt like after she got divorced there was like
a Like a cloud over her at some point. So I think
there's still like a stigma to it. That's kind
of gross. Absolutely. I feel so bad about that.
She did say it in this episode. Like, I don't
know if like ostracized was the word, but that's
like, you know, a synonym to it. She just feels
ostracized and she's worried sick about her kids
feeling the same way, especially because they're
kind of like not going to church, kind of going
when they want kind of situation. And she she
just knows that a lot of things. are going to
affect her and affect her family in the way that
she and her family are perceived. And what a
what a huge weight on your shoulders, especially
having all of that just in your community and
then also putting it on TV. Well, putting it
on TV. And then I think the level between that
is like. I look at Heather and I look at all
the moms on Salt Lake City and like these are
these are good, good, good moms. I cannot imagine
what it's like to say. Yeah, like there's there's
a dark cloud floating over me, but like you also
found I don't know if you found out later in
the season or if you find out. I don't know when
we got it up, but I know she talks about. Yeah,
like the girls stop getting invited to birthday
parties at one point. And like. What do you do
with that? Yeah. And like, I hate that there's
a lot of. There's a lot of things happening in
these past few episodes where these moms are
blaming themselves for what's happening in their
kids' lives. I think it was Meredith blaming
herself for Seth not going to Brooks' fashion
show. She blamed herself. And I'm like, Meredith
has got to stop doing that. I can't hear this
out of her mouth one more time. It's Seth's choice
to stay, to like. Be with his son in an important
moment. If he if he genuinely wants to give Meredith
space, they can sit three chairs away from each
other. They can sit across the room from each
other. Be there for your son. Don't ever put
the blame on Meredith for that. I hate that.
Meredith blamed herself. I don't think I've ever
blamed Meredith. I think. Yes, that is true.
What I will buy is that. Seth probably could
have done more. Yes, absolutely. But at some
point, like I do feel like Meredith said, I need
space. And I think Seth with the best of intentions
was trying to do that. And I like but you know,
the road to hell is paved with the best of intentions.
So I like I can't entirely blame Seth, but like
I. I don't ever want to blame Meredith for anything.
Exactly. It was very damned if you do, damned
if you don't. Right. But then we see Whitney
heading over to Mary's house. Mary counts out
her chicken nuggets at the beginning of that
scene. Did you notice that where she goes one,
two, three on the plate? I did not notice. Why
did you do that? I don't know, but that was the
most insane thing ever to me because I've. Never
once in my life thought about how many chicken
nuggets I eat in a sitting. That's just unless
it is a 10 piece nugget from McDonald's and I'm
making sure that there are 10 or more in there.
That's the only time I'm counting my nuggets.
I never knew. But Whitney walks into the house
and Mary makes people that walk into her house
where those little construction booty things.
Yeah, she does. I'd be so offended, honestly.
I totally get the premise of like shoes are so
dirty. And I even get the premise of like, I
don't want you to wear your outside clothes on
the bed. I totally get all of those things. Sure.
But like, I would be a tiny bit offended if somebody
was like, I need you to wear these little booties.
I just assume when I go to anyone's house and
it's like a shoes off house, like. I don't see
why you wouldn't just say, hey, like, can you
pop your shoes off or whatever? Like, I don't.
Let her have her dogs out. That is so crazy.
Yeah. In her literal stilettos that she wears
24 -7. Absolutely insane. She has to wear booties
over stilettos in somebody's house. God bless.
Nobody else is going to do it. Whitney might
as well. I won't be walking around in stilettos
in somebody's house. No, no. Let the dogs out.
Exactly. We get a peek into Mary's closet, which
so we get a peek into one of the closets, which
is a bedroom with just racks and racks and racks
of clothes in it. And then we find out that her
love of fashion stems from a trip to Dillard's.
Have you ever been to a Dillard's? Of course
I haven't. It made me think of Granny immediately.
She's also the type. I've driven granny to to
Louisville thousands of times so she can go to
Dillard's. I know. Isn't that funny? I yeah,
that was so interesting and it made me immediately
think of our granny and it was so endearing.
But it's funny that it goes from Dillard's to
like Louis Vuitton, Balmain, all these things.
And one thing about Mary is as much as I hate
90 percent of her outfits, I love her wearing
them. I do, too. I do, too. I think she's so
silly. I think she's so in touch with her own
style and what makes her happy and fulfilled.
Because, of course, I love that she supports
her own marriage to her step grandfather. I love
that she supports it. I do. But I can't imagine
being very happy being married to my step grandfather.
So if I could find any shred of happiness in
thousands of dollars worth of. like Louis Vuitton
shawls. Yeah, I'm going to find it and I'm going
to get it. I feel that. I guess I love that she's
in touch with her style and what makes it so
unique. It's it's it's beautiful to see. Would
I wear it? Not in a million years. No, no. But
I love it for her. I love it for her. And that's
that's where it is. Mary brings up the fact that
she's left out of Cherie's surprise party and
she does get into the I guess. Lisa and Meredith
told her that they're afraid of Jen. Yes. And
Mary was simply the wrong. I'm sorry. Whitney
was simply the wrong person to tell this information
to. I have a thing right now that I'm trying.
I have this idea in my head that I'm trying to
work with as I continue to watch these episodes
that I think Whitney is a very. important person
to have on this show because she kind of knows
a little bit about everything from everybody
and she's kind of she has all this information
and i i'm wanting her to harness it and like
really use it for good i think she's kind of
like i want her to use it for evil go on go on
I think that she's a lot like how Layla is in
Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, where Layla is
also the kind of person that just starts knowing
things. And then like in the confessional, she's
like, I know all this information. I just don't
know what to do with it. Well, I think it's because
they're both incredibly approachable people and
they're. In some ways, trustworthy people. Yeah.
And I do believe that about Whitney. And, you
know, speaking of trustworthiness, I don't I
don't know if we're going to talk about it. In
regards to this episode, Jen Shaw's pissing me
off. Why? She she ratted out Meredith's situation
with Seth. Oh, we can talk about that. I I don't
know what episode that was. I think it was seven
or eight. It was. I think so, too. I. I heard
that. I don't know if I was doing so. I think
I was cooking dinner or something and I was watching
it on TV in the kitchen. And I heard that I didn't
see it. I was I was doing something. Are you
talking about where she goes? You'll just have
to ask Meredith. No, not even that. She was mad.
She was going off about something. And then she
mentioned. I think she was mentioning how. Meredith
is putting on this whole charade about her. Oh,
yeah. But she was saying it to somebody like
it wasn't in a confessional or anything. And
I was at the thing about. The trunk show where
she was talking about how she met the guy in
New York. No, I guess I don't really know what
I'm thinking, but she told somebody about that.
And I was like, you've got to be absolutely kidding
me like. Jen is just a bad friend. She's not
trustworthy in the slightest. She's done that
twice. She's done it with Meredith and she's
done it with something else. I don't remember
what it was. And obviously she called Mary. Grandpa
ever. Yeah. So there's that. But there was something
else. This is the thing that I struggle with
with Jen Shaw. Jen Shaw is. She's so fabulous
in so many ways and she's so cool and like she's
she's a larger than life personality. And that's
her redeeming quality, right? We're like you
take the good with the bad. This is where I struggle
so much because I'm like, Jen, you're you're
checking off a lot of boxes that are going to
like get rid of a lot of the redeeming qualities
and. If she could just change a little. Actually,
I don't know if she can change a little bit.
I'll probably cut that. But like I, I get what
you're saying. And like that's I think that's
always the struggle with Jen Shaw, though, is
like she's like she's larger than life. She's
so great. She's so cool. Why do you do that?
Get out of your own way. Exactly. I think that's
so much. And I'm sorry to completely derail talking
about Whitney being. trustworthy or whether or
not she is um but i think that's such a huge
problem you said it best like jen just gets in
her own way yeah and i think that like you said
like her being so larger than life it's such
a beautiful quality to her she has so much personality
so much amazing things she's crazy awesome but
like i think that she's putting on this mask
Because she is so I feel like she's deeply insecure.
And I think that's why she portrays herself to
be so large and just larger than life and have
this incredibly charismatic personality and all
this stuff. But like, she's so insecure within
herself that when things get messy, that's what
I think. She's so insecure that when things get
messy, she needs to derail it before her insecurities
show. And that's why she's constantly lonely.
That's why she constantly needs people around
her. Oh, this is deep. Okay. I think it's a deep
problem that she has. Yeah. That's my perspective
of Jen is that she's so deeply insecure that
she needs to hide that with having the personality
she does, with having all the people around her
that she does, by having the friends around her
that she has. And I think that's fair. And that's
why at some level, even though I literally can't
stand her half the time and even though she's
absolutely insane half the time, I feel bad.
Yeah, I do empathize with her because that's
how I'm seeing it, is that she's deeply insecure.
Fair. OK, that's fair. And it's sad. It is sad.
We can go back to Whitney, Whitney and Mary.
Well, that was it for Whitney and Mary. Next,
we go over to Meredith's house and they're trying
to figure out what they want for dinner. And.
Meredith looks at Seth and goes, what is it you
want? And I just thought that was the funniest
way to ask. I love her so much. I know. Well,
he kept being like you. And Brooks is. What is
it you want? To order in. What is it you want?
And Brooks is like, I literally can't do it.
I. I love Brooks. I like Brooks. I think Brooks
is funny. I think he's beautiful. I love his
lip gloss. He's very cute. He's a very handsome
boy. As in like he's 21 years old and I call
him a little boy. It's fine. Little boy. Yeah.
And that scene was pretty quick. But we go over
with Whitney to her friend Sarah MacArthur's
house. What a woman. Do you know about this woman?
I don't. I know she's on her third marriage.
Yeah. You want to know. So this is the same woman.
Do you remember the very first episode? With
Meredith. Birthday party. Yes. And she's like,
happy birthday. Do you want to know another fun
fact about Sarah MacArthur? I'd do anything for
one. She was at January 6th. So Sarah MacArthur,
I'll give you a little context about this woman.
And Emma and I have talked about this woman before.
This was supposed to be. Either one of the housewives
or a friend of. The. So. Have you noticed I haven't
spoken since you. Since you said that. I. I'm
so shocked. Honestly, am I really? Do you want
to know something else? I'd do anything to know.
This episode aired January 6th of 2021. The.
The quickness that the Internet found out who
this woman was is wild. So I was reading an article
not too long ago about her being canceled. And
she talks about this being her episode. This
scene was three minutes long, by the way. Yeah,
it was nothing. The way that she's like, it was
taken away from me. And I'm going to like I'm
going to get into that article one day on this
show. But. This one was at January 6th. We'll
just leave it at that. So they're kind of getting
into the like the past with the marriages and
everything. We find out that Justin's parents,
so Whitney's husband, have Whitney and Justin's
wedding photo next to a photo. of justin with
his ex -wife and then the ex -wife's wedding
photo to her new husband are all just out there
together and i get i get that whitney and justin's
relationship didn't start in the most conventional
way the most classiest of ways whatever the way
that like I don't know that I'd be able to deal
with the parents after that. Like I don't know
what I would do with that. The level of disrespect
that that portrays is so astonishing. And it's
like. In the grand scheme of things, you can't
control your kids. They're going to do whatever
they want to do, no matter how you raise them,
whatever, whatever. I think that's so insane.
When Whitney said it took about six or seven
years for mine and Justin's wedding photo to
get up on the wall next to the original wedding
photo of Justin and his ex -wife. And then like,
how are you so? I mean, I know that lots of parents
-in -law love their. daughters -in -law or sons
-in -laws but like how do you have so good of
a connection and relationship with your ex -daughter
-in -law that you also have her wedding photo
with her current husband yeah i don't understand
that dynamic that's wild i i thought it was the
my my jaw dropped to the floor when i heard whitney
say that and that it took six to seven years
of them being married for her picture to end
up on that wall absolutely crazy yeah sick and
twisted then they start kind of like talking
about well what's what's gonna happen at sherry's
party and then sarah encourages whitney to talk
to jen at sherry's birthday party and i just
want to say sarah doesn't have a good track record
for decision making really Between that January
6th. Heard. Well, when she said that, I honestly
agreed. I was like, I guess in the grand scheme
of things, if Jen is her best self when Sharif
is around, then maybe it would be a good time
for her to. In that moment, I agree. I think
in the best of conditions. Yeah, sure. You can
you can approach it then. I think if you're looking
at reality and who Jen shies as a person, if
you think that was a good decision, you are out
of your ever loving mind. Heard. What do you
think would have made it better if it wasn't
his birthday party or like. I think that was
the wrong night to do it. On the birthday party.
100%. I would probably agree that like. In the
grand scheme of things, it's somebody else's
day. Don't ruin it. Whatever, whatever. I do
agree with that. So Lisa and John take Jack and
Henry to an aquarium and they got to do a little
penguin experience. Oh, my God. How did you feel?
I thought it was the coolest thing ever. And
I want to see if the Indianapolis Zoo does this.
I would do anything. I thought it was the cutest
thing I've ever seen in my life. I started liking
penguins after that. I love that. It was so cute.
You know, I would love to do that with dolphins.
I know a lot of zoos do where you can swim with
the dolphins. I want to do that so bad. Well,
you know, I was. absolutely obsessed with dolphins
when i was little do you know that and i very
vividly remember that dear listener i had a literal
collection of dolphin figurines the glass dolphins
there were these beautiful glass dolphins um
they would also be like just little statues little
like just dolphin figurines and I had dolphin
necklaces I have an incredibly iconic you did
have a dolphin necklace oh and I have an I have
it actually in my room and students can like
they know that it's me and I have an iconic picture
a school picture of me in this beautiful green
sweater with a collar with the dolphin necklace
and I have my arms crossed I look like a little
businesswoman I'll literally send it to you and
you can post it like on the Instagram or something
we have it in this house I know we have it somewhere
if not it's on my phone I love it's iconic and
it's that dolphin necklace that really seals
the deal I love that so much yeah so I would
love to Swim with dolphins at the zoo or something
like that. I think that would be so much fun.
Yeah, the penguin thing was absolutely adorable.
And I do love that Lisa and John are trying to
do things with their kids like that. Little excursions.
One thing about Lisa is I think out of almost
all of the moms, Lisa is one of the greatest
in the way that their sons can do anything. And
Lisa will be so proud. I agree. I agree. I don't
know if this is a popular or unpopular opinion,
but Henry's annoying. He's an annoying little
eight year old. He's eight. I think I do think
all eight year olds are really annoying. All
kids are annoying in general, actually. By God,
does Lisa love that kid? She thinks that Henry
hangs the moon in her sky. Yes. And I think that's
beautiful. Somebody ought to. Fair. So I do love
that. But of course, earlier we were talking
about how their work is always first. And I know
that John wants to change that. But Lisa's having
a really hard time wrapping her mind around that.
But she also knows that she's kind of leaving
her kids behind. And she's like, every night
I go to bed thinking, do my sons feel loved?
And stuff like that. So I know that she's aware
of the potential consequences of being so busy
and so ingrained in her work. But I don't know
if... The effort to change that is there, but
obviously this episode showing she's trying.
Lisa is someone else that cannot get out of her
own way and not a negative. Well, depending on
how you look at it, I don't look at it as a negative
because I'm like, this is someone who is conscious
of you have to do more with the kids like you
like. And I think she's trying. And I have to
tell you, Taylor, if I. It was Jack or Henry.
I would consider myself one of the luckiest kids
in the world. Yeah. In the same way with any
of these moms, if I'm being 100 percent honest,
like. I all of these moms, I think, are the best
moms that they can possibly be. And so I don't
think Jack or Henry are on or in a negative place
because Lisa and John can't stop working. Yeah.
I do see it in every episode. And if I have to
play devil's advocate, we are only seeing what
is being portrayed on the show. But if that's
what we're taking in and what we are discussing,
I will say that these moms adore their kids.
And not only adore their kids, but adore each
other's kids, too, which I think is beautiful.
Like Jen loves Meredith's kids and wore Brooks's
tracksuit. I think that's. So endearing. I cannot
wait for you to see the beginning of season two.
Don't. Was she like, I'm just doing that for
Meredith? No, no, no, no, no. It's much worse.
Much worse. I can't wait. I almost want you to
spoil it for me. No, no, no, no. You have to
experience that yourself because I want I want
I want to see how you feel about it. Jen, I think,
does get. I think she earns her redemption arc
in this in season two, though. Well, that's good.
So it starts off real, real tough. It's so you
get part of it with the reunion and then you
get more fallout when they're like they're ice
fishing in the beginning of season two. It's
really bad. I bet that this reunion episode for
this season would be so good. It's three parts.
It's very good. Three parts. I don't think they've
ever had that many. No, no, no. I don't think
they've ever had less than a three part reunion.
Oh, really? Every every Salt Lake City. If Salt
Lake City. I think there might be one season
where there's a two part. I could be wrong. But
no, their reunions are good. Incredible. Is there
yelling, kicking, screaming, crying? Yes. Incredible.
Yes, yes, yes, yes. I'm on my way. So good. But
everyone starts to get ready for the surprise
party. Yes. It's at a Topgolf. There's that.
Strike one. No, if he likes it, I love it. If
he likes it, I love it. But. It's hip hop. That's
what really threw me. It's disjointed. Yeah.
It felt like, okay, what are we doing? How do
these two themes fit together? I think the party
was put together very well, though. I think that
it's very, very clear to me that Jen wanted to
make Sharif happy. I do wholeheartedly buy that.
Yeah. So. With that being said, I think the party
looked really, really fun. I would have loved
to have been there. They started to have a little
dance battle. That was crazy. I thought that
was so cool. Sharif seems like he's very fun.
Like, I think he seems very buttoned up. I think
he seems. Like he's very, very serious a lot
of the time. But like, I think when he lets loose,
like that's where I really like love to see Sharif
like be silly because like he's fun. He's very
fun. And I'm sure that that's a side of him that
really only Jen knows because he's he's coach
Shaw 24 seven. And, you know, he's in the grand
scheme of things when you're recruiting and you're
doing all things, all these things, you kind
of have to be this man. Yeah. And so when he's
home and he's with his wife. Oh, my God. I love
it when he is like, yes, my love. And like just
calls her these beautiful little endearing names.
It's so beautiful to see that side of him, whereas
I'm sure very few people ever get to see that.
Right. So we got to see it. I love it. It was
such a treat. Yes. He looked like he was having
a great time. I love that everybody wanted him
to have a great time. They were all feeding into
it. Very adorable. You get Whitney. dancing on
the floor. And I think there's something that
I think is so fun about Whitney where like, I
think she's a person who truly is very comfortable
with herself. And she says, I'm just going to
do the splits. I'm going to do whatever I want
to do. And then I think someone like Lisa, who
is doing the constant pursuit of perfection at
all things, sees that. And I think she's just
like, not jealous of it, but it's like, like.
She's having too much fun almost. So she makes
a little dig at Whitney and she says that Whitney
obviously needs a lot of attention. Well, when
he's doing that, Justin's just off on his own
little world, like playing golf. And I was like,
I love Justin. He's just that is so funny. I
do. Now, when I first heard in episode one, how
Whitney and Justin came to be, I did almost immediately
show a bias in the way of like. Oh, that's really.
Yes, it's really dramatic, for lack of a better
word. But the more I see them interacting with
each other in the way that Whitney talks about
Justin and her saying things like we're beating
the odds, like it's I think it's very beautiful.
I do, too. I think that those are two people
that are meant to be together and that the circumstances
on how they met, if only it were different. Yeah,
well, that and like, I think. Eileen Davidson
in Beverly Hills met her husband in the same
way where they both they both had affairs and
like they ended up together. If you can be honest
about that and you could say, listen, didn't
meet in the most ideal of circumstances, but
here we are. I can almost accept that. I think
I can, too. It's not my place to accept it, by
the way. It's your marriage. Like, absolutely.
Absolutely. And Heather said. said this best
in multiple ways where like um heather has mentioned
in regards to meredith the meredith and seth
situation she's like it's literally none of my
business it's not my marriage it's not my business
jenny even said that at one point too i agree
um and then also in regards to whitney being
her true authentic self heather also said it
um in a i think it was on Justin's birthday episode
where Heather was like Whitney is so comfortable
with herself she's in her 30s she knows who she
is and she is just going to do what she wants
basically and I think that that's really beautiful
and I think that in a lot of ways I really respect
Whitney in this way because I do hold her to
a high standard And she does meet that standard
for me. And I like that she does that even being
younger than the rest. And I think that I just
have a lot of respect for young, pretty, classy
people that are also just really fun and true
and authentic. And also that are in relationships
for the right reasons and just loves people for
the right reasons. And I think that Whitney checks
a lot of those boxes for me. And I just continue
to love her even. Even through the end of this
episode, I'm still on Team Whitney. I love Whitney.
We're getting into the end of the episode. Can
we please? So Whitney is wasted and she decides
it's time to talk to Jen. What a nightmare. She
should have done that stone cold sober. So. Jen
immediately starts getting worked up as soon
as she hears Mary's name. Oh, yeah, she did.
And this tells me it's not about the hospital,
small comment. It's not about the time that Whitney
brought it up, which is like, I don't know if
Whitney, if there was a good time to bring this
up. No. But this was definitely the wrong time,
right? I also think that Whitney went into it
being incredibly confusing because she was so
trash wasted. Yes, yes, yes, yes. And like she
just couldn't get those words out. And if I were
Jen, too, I'd be like, spit it out, spit it out.
Right. But she starts hulking out. She starts
doing the thing. And then she walks away with
Lisa and. And as Jen is off with Lisa, Whitney
decides that it's also the right time to tell
Meredith that Jen has been talking about the
rumors about Seth and Meredith's marriage. Which
I love, actually. I was wanting it so bad, honestly.
What I do love about Whitney. Because say what
you will. She said, you know what? Here we are.
Let's just see how much worse it can get. Yeah.
And like, actually, that's not the right way
to say it. What I love about Whitney is that.
Here we are. Let's just go all in. It's already
as bad as she's already hulking out. Let's just
let it all out. Yeah. And I think that it it
all needed to be said. It all needed, especially
because I've already said it in this episode.
I. I can't stand that Jen had opened her mouth
and blabbed about the Meredith and Seth thing,
because we all know that Meredith was trying
to keep that under wraps, trying to be calm and
cool about it. And now Jen's just. opening her
big fat mouth about it and i was i thought that
was so rude and ridiculous so i wanted whitney
to say something about it i wanted whitney to
call her out and be like okay well meredith by
the way uh she's not being a good friend to you
because this is what's happening in in at some
other situation where whitney is stone cold sober
i wanted that i don't care i don't care how drunk
whitney was because like i don't think whitney
said anything That wasn't accurate and true.
Yes, that's true. I I think where the entire
crux of it comes down to, it was not the right
place. It was not the right time because then
Mary or I'm sorry, Jen does the whole thing where
she's like, I don't want to talk about Mary.
Like, shut up about Mary. And she's like screaming,
screaming, screaming, throws the glass, does
the whole song and dance. Absolutely crazy. And
like part of that, I do believe because I have
said this a couple of times about Jen. I think
some of this is put on for the show. I think
it's like, do you remember you? I don't I don't
know if you've ever seen it, but there is a famous
episode of The Real Housewives of New Jersey
where Teresa flips the table and does the whole
like song and dance and like blows up a dinner
because of Daniel Staub being at the dinner.
Wow. So I I think we're we're. I don't know that
Teresa put that on for the show, but I think
that was like that became an iconic Real Housewives
moment. Right. And you. You're like in your head,
you're like, how do I how do I make a viral moment?
Like, how do I do this? Right. And Jen, I think
part of that was put on the show. I also think
that Jen's a little bit unstable. And so she's
like throwing the glass. She's doing the thing.
She's at a top golf. They're not getting their
deposit back. That's the first thing I thought
when she broke that glass. I'm like, someone's
going to have to clean that up. Someone's going
to have to pay for that. Right. I'm just like,
okay, you're mad. Okay, we get it. Calm down,
Gypsy Rose. You're mad. We get it. And so they're
doing the whole thing. And then as she's storming
off, she goes to grab Sharif. And she's like,
we're leaving. We're going. By the way, it's
his birthday. Yeah. What a nightmare. And so.
And coming at him so strong. I mean, then the
last scene, he was he was dancing with everybody.
He was having such a good time. And then having
your wife come at you with that energy and that
demeanor and that volume like. I think that one
of his first words were, what happened? Like
he was actually freaked out. Like you're freaking
out your husband on his birthday. You did all
of this for him, for you to show that you are
thinking of him and you want him to be happy.
She said that multiple times throughout the episode.
This is for him to see how much I love him and
how much I care about him. And then you're going
to turn it all around, make it about you in the
grand scheme of things, and then make him leave
his own party. Mind you, in front of 150 guests
acting like that, I thought it was the most embarrassing
thing I'd ever seen on television. Well, so then
you you you have that. And then, like, I don't
know if it's during this episode or at the beginning
of the next episode. She ends up in the car with
Omar trying to calm her down. And then Sharif
is very visibly mortified. And then Sharif Jr.
is like, what happened? And then he's like screaming.
He's like, your mom's just drinking and being
stupid. And like, this always happens. This isn't
the first time something like this has happened
with Jen and Sharif. Really? I know that to be
the truth. Like he didn't say that. But when
he's like when he starts saying that, I'm like,
oh, she's she's done this before. Yes, of course.
Well, you wouldn't say that if it hasn't happened.
And what a nightmare. I I do hate. You know,
after talking about this, I do hate that the
whole thing happened. Looking at it from a thousand
feet away as an audience member watching this
happening. Was it the most entertaining episode
thus far? Yes, absolutely. Absolutely incredible.
Was it extremely exhilarating seeing her Hulk
out and throw a glass at the Topgolf? Yeah, I.
I would do anything in her Beyonce outfit. I
would do anything to keep that memory ingrained
into my brain for the rest of my days. But I
looking in into it, I feel so bad for everybody
involved. Like it like you said, this was truly
mortifying for a lot of people. That would be
so if. And I like the idea that you have that
maybe Jen is hyperbolizing a lot of this and
just really trying to go crazy for the show.
I love the idea about that, especially because
it's season one. It's Salt Lake City. We got
to really amp it up. We're dealing with Beverly
Hills. We're dealing with New York. We're dealing
with all this. Put the Real Housewives of Salt
Lake City on the map. Sure. Love the idea. I
don't know if this is the way to do it. Don't
know if that's. the way to do it is it the way
to do it to get views yeah for sure maybe in
the way of making yourself look like the good
guy oh god did you do that so at the end of this
episode do you still think that Whitney should
have said that like do you like do you think
that like It's a it's that we should have waited.
Like, what do you what do you what would you
have done differently if you were Whitney? I
guess, if anything, if I were Whitney, I would
have not been drunk. Sure. Because I think that
otherwise Whitney is really good at communicating.
And you've said this before in other episodes
with Emma that these some of these women are
very good communicators. And I saw that in very
early episodes. I think that Mary and Meredith
are very introspective people and very empathetic
people. I saw that in their communicating. Whitney
is a very good communicator. A lot of these people
are very good at communicating with each other
and being honest and being aware. Yes. And a
lot of them can take accountability. I think
that Whitney could have done. these things a
lot better if she were sober I know that she
thought she needed her liquid courage but then
she just had too much and then she couldn't work
with it um I do think that it I would have liked
the conversation to have been Whitney sober with
Heather I think that Heather is helpful in those
situations and with Jen I think that it should
have been maybe at somebody's house now that
we've had this full conversation somebody's house
the three of them not a party of 150 160 people
no because now jen just looks so embarrassing
and she looks crazy she looks unhinged yes unhinged
crazy and sharif is mortified at his own party
and that's disgusting i feel terrible for him
and i think that jen should feel so humiliated
to have acted that way at his own birthday party
in front of Every single person at that party
and making him leave his own party. I think that's
sick. I so you are right. I think it shouldn't
have been at this party. And I am right that
I don't think that Whitney should have been drunk
for it. OK, I think that maybe she needed it,
but I don't think that it worked out. So sober
Whitney with Heather, with Jen. At somebody's
house in the hot tub. In the hot tub. Why not?
They're having a good time in the hot tubs. Yeah.
Keep the good times rolling. And of course, it
got really messy when Lisa and Meredith came
into it, too. That was wild. Absolutely. Well,
so and I think we get into the beginning of the
next episode. Lisa, here's here's the thing.
Do I believe that Lisa and I'm sorry, Lisa and
Meredith said to Mary. Yeah, we're scared of
Jen. Now, do I believe that they said some semblance
of God, she goes off the rails and like, I don't
know what to do when she's doing that. I'm not
willing to do that. Yeah. A million percent by
that. Yes. Do I think that Mary took that as
she's scary to be around? Maybe. But. Can. If
I put myself in Lisa and Meredith's shoes, can
I see on some level where what I said versus
what was presented by Mary, how it got lost in
the translation? Probably. Do I think it's helpful
on any level for them to go? We're not afraid
of you. We're not afraid of you. Because then
that puts someone like Jen in this place of like,
this is what people are saying about me. I 100
% believe that Jen believed that. Yeah. Where
she's like, oh. this is like this is the narrative
around me and like i'm i'm gonna be labeled this
person and like i think that's part of like where
the craziness comes from is like how do i do
damage control like how do i like and it just
goes off the rails yeah and i think that at this
point it would be good to pull mary in because
mary's never lied about what she said i thought
it was really funny the first couple of episodes
where she's like Yes, I did say that she smells
like hospital. And what are we going to do about
it? I said it and I believed it. So what? I think
back to that episode all the time where she's
like, yeah, I said that. And you smell like hospital,
too. I think that was so funny. But she's always
been honest about what she has said and what
she's heard. And so at that point, as long as
we can figure out how to get Jen to a place where
she has. accepted what has been told to her by
Whitney and potentially Heather. And now this
thing with Lisa and Meredith, we have to go to
the source. Now, Jen should not be going to the
source. No, absolutely not. But maybe Lisa and
Meredith, maybe Whitney and Heather. Some some
collection of those four women should go to Mary
and be like, Mary, what exactly did you say and
to who? Because didn't she say it to Whitney
that. lisa and meredith are afraid of jen yes
yeah so well whitney heard that and we also have
like the video i i do vividly remember mary saying
lisa meredith says that they're afraid but But
then again, that's not lost in translation. What's
lost in translation is between what Lisa and
Meredith said to Mary. So there's a lot of things
that actually need to be clarified and need to
be stated from the source herself. But now there's
just now there's even more drama with Jen and
Mary. I cannot believe there's any more than
there could possibly be. And I now I'm sad because
there's too many women now that are fighting
and I can't and I can keep track of. who's mad
at who and who's not mad at who but it makes
me sad that now there's a lot of people being
mad at people because now everybody's mad at
Whitney and I feel bad for Whitney I do feel
bad for Whitney and that because this does happen
to Whitney a lot you will see she ends up being
kind of the group not punching bag but like I
think it becomes very easy for people to get
mad at her because and you and I have experienced
this where it gets it's very very easy to to
be mad at the people that are just honest But
you mentioned that Mary's never lied about anything
she said. And that took me back to one of my
favorite quotes. Can I share with you one of
my favorite quotes that Mary's ever said on this
show? Could you please? It's. Yeah. She's talking
about Jen's aunt after getting her legs cut off.
And I have it written down right here. It's.
I don't know what you want me to do about your
aunt. Her legs are gone. Why are you getting
your legs cut off at 60? That means your diet
is bad. You know, it's just like she didn't eat
right. Like drink water. I think about that quote
and I'm not exaggerating once every single day.
I love her candor. I do, too. More than anything,
I think. I think about what what are these women's
best qualities? Mary is one of her very similar
to Whitney. She's very comfortable with herself
and her decisions. And she's going to work with
what she has. And she's going to she's going
to do what she wants. And she's going to do it
times 10 and all these things. Another one of
Mary's great qualities is she's honest. You are
never not going to know where you stand with
Miss Mary Cosby. For sure. Thank God. Wow. Who
are you? Who are you loving? Who are you hating
these days? In the current season or based on
where we're at right now? In the current season.
How about both? Tell me the current season. OK,
the current season, which is what season six.
Oh, no, no, no. I meant where we are now is in
what we're talking about. Season one. Current
season. Start with one. Give us six. OK, season
one. I. I don't have an issue with any of them.
I love all of the women. I think the one that
I feel the most conflicted about is probably
Jen because she goes off the rails so much. Yeah.
But I love all of them. That's kind of how I'm
starting to feel now. I had some pretty strong
opinions about each of the girls in the first
three episodes. But at this point, episode nine,
all of them have really good. qualities about
them that make them very endearing to me um i
especially love whitney if i haven't made that
clear i love that i love i i love whitney i love
i think of all of the women i think she would
be the easiest to be friends with yeah for sure
between her and heather that's i said heather
would be the easiest to be friends with too i
think heather is probably Heather's probably
someone that I think is a very, very nurturing
friend. Whitney is probably one of the most present
friends that I can imagine. She's very present.
She's very intuitive. She's very self -aware,
socially aware. I think, like I said, she's a
great communicator. I think she's very, very
much a present friend. That's also always going
to be there for you. I feel like she's like that
for everybody. She is friends with everybody
in this season. Obviously, her and Lisa had a
little turbulence in the first couple episodes
and stuff like that. But I think that she's been
there for everybody. Yes. Which makes me sad
to hear that she's kind of just the one to put
blame on the most because she's just trying to
get. everybody to where she's at where everybody
can be friends with each other as long as we're
honest we're open and like we all have problems
and we all have our own lives that have problems
but then we also have problems in each other
let's fix it yeah so yeah well how are you feeling
oh yeah and then for me i agree i in regards
to who i'm really not like jen's off her rocker
yes and i can't condone 99 of it right it's been
pretty tough so Whitney's my number one. Kisses
all around. Kisses. You said this current season
is six. Current season is six. How are you feeling?
Mind you, I don't know a single thing about seasons
two through six, but I'm willing to hear all
about it. You're going to learn a lot about Lisa.
Really? And that makes me. I. Here's the thing.
I'm always going to have a place for baby gorgeous
in my heart. I think that this the season six
is probably the season where she gets the villain
at it. That's just very hard for me. And she
has some of it coming because she's she does
some really mean and rotten things. You're going
to meet Angie Katzen Davis and Bronwyn. Yeah,
Angie Kay and Bronwyn. And there, I love both
of them. I love, love, love both of them. Yeah,
but I still like all of them. Mary takes a break
from the show and comes back, and I think that
she needed that break. And you'll learn a lot
about that, too. Love. It's a good, good, good,
good, good show. like it's i i love it i'm so
excited now coming from somebody who this is
their first experience ever with real housewives
if i were to also eventually start watching another
housewives housewives what new york really yes
very quick new york uh miami and beverly hills
In that particular order? I don't think the order
matters. I think. So Miami is interesting because
Miami was around, you know, Larsa Pippen is.
Pippen sounds familiar. Well, Scottie Pippen
was the NBA player and then Larsa Pippen is her
ex -wife or his ex -wife. Miami is interesting
because they took a break and then there was
so much demand for them to come back. They brought
it back on Peacock. And I mean, it was lightning
in a bottle. Like you had like you have like
real, real, real life stuff happening. And I
think this is I say Beverly Hills, New York and
Miami, because those are the three cities. Aside
from Salt Lake City, where. Actually, no, it's
like Potomac, Potomac, New York, Miami, because
I think you get the realest of the three of those
cities. Really? Beverly Hills, I think, is like
is the iconic like. The pinnacle of wealth, but
I don't think you get their real lives. I say
that now I am doing the season. Lord have mercy.
It's like season 15 premiere with. Husbands watching
Housewives. And I'm going to go into that knowing
that like I feel very differently about this
show than Scott and Jeff do. Perfect. But yeah,
Miami, New York and Potomac. Amazing. Where's
Potomac? Maryland. Maryland? Right outside of
D .C. Really? That sounds classy, chic. Well,
so the interesting thing about all these shows
is that none of them were started as housewives.
They were all like so Potomac was supposed to
be a show about. Potomac was supposed to be a
show about like etiquette or something. New York
was supposed to be a show about like moms in
New York. Beverly Hills was never supposed to
exist. Dallas was supposed to be a show about.
Like the charity scene in Dallas or something
like the business that goes into charity. Salt
Lake City was just supposed to be about like
businesses in Salt Lake City because like it
kind of all started around Lisa's marketing business
and beauty lab. And then I want to say like Miami,
D .C. and Orange County were the only ones that
were ever started as like this is going to be
like real housewives. Really? Yeah. what a crazy
shift yeah it's so like that's the interesting
thing about all of it and i love i love these
shows like this is like this like i like people
are like oh it's so stupid i love it anyway amazing
uh did you have a good time again i had an incredible
time are we are we doing this again absolutely
whatever whatever episode We're leading. We're
leaning towards. I'm watching the next episode
and then we'll do it again. Perfect. Gorgeous.
How many episodes are in the season? 18. Oh,
good. Yeah. OK, great. Cool. Well, just come
back again next week. I'll be your listener.
Thank you for being here. Thank you for loving
us. Thank you for living with us. Keep it bestie
approved. We love you. Bye. Bye.