WEBVTT

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.799
Bamboo Lab is a company most of you have never

00:00:02.799 --> 00:00:06.540
heard of, making a product most of you have never

00:00:06.540 --> 00:00:10.000
used. But we picked this company anyways because

00:00:10.000 --> 00:00:12.359
they happen to be one of the fastest growing

00:00:12.359 --> 00:00:16.339
hardware companies on earth. They went from zero

00:00:16.339 --> 00:00:19.660
to undisputed market leader and from zero to

00:00:19.660 --> 00:00:23.359
multi -billion dollar valuation, both within

00:00:23.359 --> 00:00:27.480
the span of five short years. What Bamboo Lab

00:00:27.480 --> 00:00:31.059
makes is Desktop 3D printers. Before they released

00:00:31.059 --> 00:00:33.780
their first product in 2022, the entire industry

00:00:33.780 --> 00:00:37.359
assumed at -home 3D printing was destined to

00:00:37.359 --> 00:00:40.719
stay a fringe hobbyist niche. That everyday people

00:00:40.719 --> 00:00:43.740
just weren't interested. Bamboo's founders didn't

00:00:43.740 --> 00:00:47.060
buy that. They blamed the product instead. They

00:00:47.060 --> 00:00:49.000
believed that the hardware itself was broken.

00:00:49.630 --> 00:00:52.109
While everyone in the industry, even the users

00:00:52.109 --> 00:00:55.009
themselves, accepted that 3D printing would always

00:00:55.009 --> 00:00:58.570
be slow and somewhat unreliable, Bamboo saw this

00:00:58.570 --> 00:01:01.630
as a massive opportunity. And it turns out they

00:01:01.630 --> 00:01:04.769
were absolutely right. They applied precision

00:01:04.769 --> 00:01:07.730
robotics to turn 3D printing into a push -button

00:01:07.730 --> 00:01:11.010
appliance, offering consumers a combination of

00:01:11.010 --> 00:01:13.689
fast printing speeds, zero -friction setup, and

00:01:13.689 --> 00:01:16.629
rock -solid reliability. They easily won over

00:01:16.629 --> 00:01:19.530
the experienced users while also attracting a

00:01:19.530 --> 00:01:22.250
huge number of new buyers, growing the market

00:01:22.250 --> 00:01:25.709
far beyond anyone's expectations. The reward

00:01:25.709 --> 00:01:28.870
is a total domination of an industry, almost

00:01:28.870 --> 00:01:32.730
overnight. In this episode, we're breaking down

00:01:32.730 --> 00:01:36.030
who they are, exactly how they did it, but also

00:01:36.030 --> 00:01:38.609
the fierce challenges they're now facing as the

00:01:38.609 --> 00:01:42.150
new incumbent market leader. I'm Linda. And I'm

00:01:42.150 --> 00:01:44.709
Pin. And welcome to another episode of Ascent.

00:02:21.710 --> 00:02:24.810
start with who are the founders and how do they

00:02:24.810 --> 00:02:27.650
meet each other? All right, on to chapter one.

00:02:27.930 --> 00:02:31.030
Before Bamboo Lab is Bamboo Lab. This is always

00:02:31.030 --> 00:02:33.770
how we started. So the first person that is of

00:02:33.770 --> 00:02:37.610
particular interest, Dr. Tao Ye, or Dr. Tao,

00:02:37.729 --> 00:02:39.530
let's just call him that way. Or later on, as

00:02:39.530 --> 00:02:42.530
people from DJI would call him, Dr. Turbo. But

00:02:42.530 --> 00:02:46.789
let's go back to Dr. Tao. Without Dr. Tao, none

00:02:46.789 --> 00:02:49.909
of it would happen. And for some reason, I guess

00:02:49.909 --> 00:02:53.949
he probably had his information removed on a

00:02:53.949 --> 00:02:56.069
lot of websites, which is why you cannot find

00:02:56.069 --> 00:02:59.469
his exact birthday. He entered college at the

00:02:59.469 --> 00:03:02.870
age of 16. And somehow I have him on LinkedIn,

00:03:02.889 --> 00:03:04.849
though I've never chatted with him officially.

00:03:05.569 --> 00:03:10.009
But if you add up the math, he would be born

00:03:10.009 --> 00:03:13.250
in 1986 and he was born in the countryside of

00:03:13.250 --> 00:03:16.370
China. And rumor has it that the places that

00:03:16.370 --> 00:03:18.750
he was growing up in. He had a bamboo forest.

00:03:19.050 --> 00:03:21.789
He had a jolly childhood. That is pretty much

00:03:21.789 --> 00:03:25.490
it. And at the age of 16, he entered the University

00:03:25.490 --> 00:03:29.349
of Science and Technology of China, USTC, to

00:03:29.349 --> 00:03:32.449
study astrophysics. And he did a brief exchange

00:03:32.449 --> 00:03:36.990
to HKU of Science and Technology in 2005. You

00:03:36.990 --> 00:03:39.330
know, in some universities in China, they take

00:03:39.330 --> 00:03:44.060
young genius kid as the age of 16. not 18. And

00:03:44.060 --> 00:03:46.840
he was one of those young genius kid who started

00:03:46.840 --> 00:03:49.860
college at the age of 16. And typically, you

00:03:49.860 --> 00:03:53.639
have to have a very strong suit in STEM majors

00:03:53.639 --> 00:03:57.080
to be able to qualify to that kind of universities.

00:03:57.419 --> 00:04:01.180
And after undergrad, he then received a master's

00:04:01.180 --> 00:04:05.379
slash PhD degree in fluid dynamics, which is

00:04:05.379 --> 00:04:09.419
astrophysics and more 3D modeling in Jacobs University

00:04:09.419 --> 00:04:12.310
Bremen, Germany. where he won an Outstanding

00:04:12.310 --> 00:04:14.110
Student Presentation Award from the American

00:04:14.110 --> 00:04:16.490
Geophysical Union. And very interesting quick

00:04:16.490 --> 00:04:18.949
plug, you know, Jacobs University in Bremen,

00:04:19.009 --> 00:04:22.189
which is no longer the name of that school, is

00:04:22.189 --> 00:04:24.410
currently called the Constructor University.

00:04:24.850 --> 00:04:28.129
A what? Yeah. So it's a STEM kind of mechanical

00:04:28.129 --> 00:04:31.069
engineering type of... It is. Well, yes, it is.

00:04:31.149 --> 00:04:34.990
It is an international and private and residential

00:04:34.990 --> 00:04:38.829
university located in Germany. offers a variety

00:04:38.829 --> 00:04:41.610
of subjects, but mostly engineering. It kind

00:04:41.610 --> 00:04:44.670
of is the private university that really champions

00:04:44.670 --> 00:04:48.529
the sort of the maker society and, you know,

00:04:48.529 --> 00:04:51.170
tinker around. And it has a lot of international

00:04:51.170 --> 00:04:53.769
students. More than 80 % of the students are

00:04:53.769 --> 00:04:55.889
foreign students. That's a lot. That's a lot.

00:04:56.029 --> 00:04:59.189
Yeah. Well, it has, it received students from

00:04:59.189 --> 00:05:03.069
more than 100 countries. Dr. Tao graduated PhD

00:05:03.069 --> 00:05:07.910
there. And at the year 2012, he then went to

00:05:07.910 --> 00:05:12.790
DJI to become a sort of a scientist -turned -engineer

00:05:12.790 --> 00:05:15.290
because he believes that he is a lifelong maker.

00:05:15.589 --> 00:05:18.689
And I try to look for different sources and piecing

00:05:18.689 --> 00:05:20.529
together the information to get a sense of, at

00:05:20.529 --> 00:05:24.209
the age of, you know, 20 -something, 2012, you're

00:05:24.209 --> 00:05:29.040
graduated. How... could you possibly find DJI

00:05:29.040 --> 00:05:31.180
at the time? Well, first of all, what is DJI?

00:05:31.680 --> 00:05:37.759
DJI is likely the number one consumer -level

00:05:37.759 --> 00:05:41.699
drone camera company in the world. In the world.

00:05:41.779 --> 00:05:43.980
In the world. We will probably cover the whole

00:05:43.980 --> 00:05:46.259
story in a different episode. Dr. Tao didn't

00:05:46.259 --> 00:05:49.220
start with Bamboo Lab. He started with... dji

00:05:49.220 --> 00:05:51.680
yeah he's actually a late comer to the 3d printing

00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:54.939
industry yeah he's a super late comer a bit yeah

00:05:54.939 --> 00:05:57.199
but dji will definitely cover this in another

00:05:57.199 --> 00:06:01.879
episode but legendary company uh that started

00:06:01.879 --> 00:06:06.279
in china not only dominated the industry i think

00:06:06.279 --> 00:06:08.660
they actually propelled the industry to what

00:06:08.660 --> 00:06:12.920
it is today absolutely so Dr. Tao only ever worked

00:06:12.920 --> 00:06:15.519
for two companies his whole life. One is DJI

00:06:15.519 --> 00:06:17.899
and the other one is Bamboo Lab. Lucky him. Yeah,

00:06:17.920 --> 00:06:21.240
lucky him. 2012 is the time that DJI is still

00:06:21.240 --> 00:06:24.379
quite small, less than 100 people. DJI founded

00:06:24.379 --> 00:06:28.860
in 2006. And by the time DJI was the only super

00:06:28.860 --> 00:06:33.920
well -known hardware company that is taking form

00:06:33.920 --> 00:06:36.800
in Shenzhen. So there is a fair possibility that

00:06:36.800 --> 00:06:40.740
the founder of DJI, Wang Tao Frank, interviewed...

00:06:41.180 --> 00:06:44.740
dr tau himself and both of them have a lot of

00:06:44.740 --> 00:06:48.759
sort of tinker maker uh spirit in them hit it

00:06:48.759 --> 00:06:51.740
off decided to work together so he joined a promising

00:06:51.740 --> 00:06:58.259
startup ish ish like not not a global company

00:06:58.259 --> 00:07:05.230
as of today not at all he he joined a a mid -sized

00:07:05.230 --> 00:07:09.089
yeah yeah mid -sized company with a lot of potential

00:07:09.089 --> 00:07:13.889
but no one really at 2012 saw what dji it is

00:07:13.889 --> 00:07:19.269
as today right yes because okay what what he

00:07:19.269 --> 00:07:23.470
has done after he had joined dji became a true

00:07:23.470 --> 00:07:26.589
milestone for dji and made him who he is today

00:07:26.589 --> 00:07:30.540
and also made dji who DJI is today the drone

00:07:30.540 --> 00:07:33.240
camera so what what is his trajectory all right

00:07:33.240 --> 00:07:39.160
so Dr. Tao entered DJI in 2012 his early strength

00:07:39.160 --> 00:07:43.519
was quite directly what he had studied aerodynamics

00:07:43.519 --> 00:07:48.240
and motor design so he started off 2012 in DJI

00:07:48.240 --> 00:07:51.199
as just an engineer and started working on drones

00:07:51.199 --> 00:07:54.160
but drones back then didn't look like the drones

00:07:54.160 --> 00:07:56.879
that we have today drone cameras it looked more

00:07:56.879 --> 00:08:01.620
like like like this let me show you a mini helicopter

00:08:01.620 --> 00:08:04.220
it's not even a mini helicopter it's quite big

00:08:04.220 --> 00:08:07.720
to be honest that's the first generation of dji

00:08:07.720 --> 00:08:12.240
drone camera as a real shrink -sized helicopter

00:08:12.240 --> 00:08:15.240
it's very it's bigger than what we're seeing

00:08:15.240 --> 00:08:17.040
today. Right. It doesn't look like it's that

00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:19.639
foldable. But it's four -legged. Four -legged.

00:08:20.399 --> 00:08:23.120
And it stands. Very different. Yeah. It's more

00:08:23.120 --> 00:08:26.779
like a mini helicopter, four -legged, has a platform,

00:08:26.819 --> 00:08:30.180
carries a camera. So that's the first generation

00:08:30.180 --> 00:08:34.840
of DJI camera that Wen Taoyue joined. So he started

00:08:34.840 --> 00:08:38.960
working on drones in 2012 to 2014. DJI had started,

00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:41.960
has shipped this one product that's called Phantom

00:08:41.960 --> 00:08:45.190
1. which is the four -legged one that we looked

00:08:45.190 --> 00:08:50.269
at. As Dr. Tao moved on with the project, he

00:08:50.269 --> 00:08:52.669
started to working on something that's more interesting

00:08:52.669 --> 00:08:56.110
because he realized that, oh, but this is not

00:08:56.110 --> 00:09:00.629
convenient though. How do I make this a, as you

00:09:00.629 --> 00:09:04.730
said, one button, one push ready product? And

00:09:04.730 --> 00:09:09.210
that is easier for everyone to use. So from 2014

00:09:09.210 --> 00:09:12.970
to 2016, he gets put on a different... And that

00:09:12.970 --> 00:09:17.509
project is called Mavic. It's still in the market

00:09:17.509 --> 00:09:19.330
today. It's still in the market today, yeah.

00:09:19.809 --> 00:09:23.049
Maybe it's called Mavic 2 or Mavic Pro. But Mavic

00:09:23.049 --> 00:09:25.490
is the one that changed everyone's life. And

00:09:25.490 --> 00:09:27.970
Mavic was the camera that got really famous.

00:09:28.149 --> 00:09:33.470
And Mavic already looked like this. Which is

00:09:33.470 --> 00:09:36.129
kind of what we're seeing in DJI shops today.

00:09:36.350 --> 00:09:42.320
Yes, it is a boxy, small pack that... extends

00:09:42.320 --> 00:09:46.440
and can fly and can navigate and can take photos

00:09:46.440 --> 00:09:50.159
so that was mavic so did did dr tau actually

00:09:50.159 --> 00:09:54.100
change the whole product direction of dji and

00:09:54.100 --> 00:09:56.620
therefore you can actually attribute him to the

00:09:56.620 --> 00:09:59.500
ultimate success of dji let me just quickly walk

00:09:59.500 --> 00:10:02.080
through his whole trajectory in dji and then

00:10:02.080 --> 00:10:05.779
we'll come back to that 2016 to 2019 because

00:10:05.779 --> 00:10:10.120
of project mavic Dr. Tao then immediately get

00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:12.919
promoted to senior product manager and gets to

00:10:12.919 --> 00:10:16.299
work on Mavic 2. And Mavic 2 was launched later

00:10:16.299 --> 00:10:18.620
on with Hasselbalch camera reinforcement. And

00:10:18.620 --> 00:10:21.460
then he was then directly promoted to the director

00:10:21.460 --> 00:10:25.019
of the whole department. 2019 to 2020, he was

00:10:25.019 --> 00:10:28.659
continuously working on the newer generations

00:10:28.659 --> 00:10:32.759
of Mavic. That's also the time that he... left

00:10:32.759 --> 00:10:34.600
the company. So he left the company at a high

00:10:34.600 --> 00:10:36.580
point. He didn't leave the company as, oh, like

00:10:36.580 --> 00:10:39.440
DJI is shrinking. Not necessarily that. Dr. Tao

00:10:39.440 --> 00:10:42.779
has one specific design logic, I think, answer

00:10:42.779 --> 00:10:45.299
the question that you just had, which was the

00:10:45.299 --> 00:10:48.200
sort of the King Midas touch of consumer electronics

00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:52.320
that turn a four -legged mini helicopter into

00:10:52.320 --> 00:10:56.940
a small mainstream product, which is he realized

00:10:56.940 --> 00:11:02.309
that average consumer will not try to use a scrappy

00:11:02.309 --> 00:11:05.830
product that breaks easily and is not convenient

00:11:05.830 --> 00:11:08.889
for repetitive use. That sounds so familiar for

00:11:08.889 --> 00:11:12.830
3D printing. The question becomes, as a good

00:11:12.830 --> 00:11:15.830
product manager, how can you make any consumer

00:11:15.830 --> 00:11:20.370
electronics unbox ready and plug and play, basically?

00:11:20.590 --> 00:11:22.750
Of course, that's what consumers want. Right.

00:11:22.850 --> 00:11:26.690
So while he was designing Mavic with the rest

00:11:26.690 --> 00:11:29.830
of his team, The question was, can this drone

00:11:29.830 --> 00:11:34.769
fly right out of your box as you, you know, as

00:11:34.769 --> 00:11:37.230
you as you open like literally when you unpack

00:11:37.230 --> 00:11:42.850
it, it flies out. So that was as a hardware product

00:11:42.850 --> 00:11:47.409
manager. He is really obsessed with, oh, I just

00:11:47.409 --> 00:11:48.929
want to make it very convenient for everyone.

00:11:49.009 --> 00:11:51.330
If we want to design this, then we need to design

00:11:51.330 --> 00:11:54.129
it. We need to really. Think about how do we

00:11:54.129 --> 00:11:56.850
make it into a flagship product, not shrinking

00:11:56.850 --> 00:12:01.149
the product, not making it cheaper, but to redesign

00:12:01.149 --> 00:12:04.090
completely that fits the customer's need. There's

00:12:04.090 --> 00:12:06.470
a really good product manager. I think it's a

00:12:06.470 --> 00:12:08.809
very simple concept, right? If you're a product

00:12:08.809 --> 00:12:11.590
manager, design your product based on consumer

00:12:11.590 --> 00:12:15.570
wants and needs. But in reality, there's so much

00:12:15.570 --> 00:12:18.929
things to consider. especially in hardware development,

00:12:19.230 --> 00:12:22.629
that actually sticking by this rule and making

00:12:22.629 --> 00:12:24.549
all the decisions based on this rule is very

00:12:24.549 --> 00:12:26.509
hard. Excellent point. That's a really good point.

00:12:26.590 --> 00:12:32.409
In DJI, they really champion an idea of if you

00:12:32.409 --> 00:12:35.730
want to be one of the best of the best in hardware

00:12:35.730 --> 00:12:39.830
product management, then you have to go through

00:12:39.830 --> 00:12:43.350
the DJI School of Training because... Is that

00:12:43.350 --> 00:12:46.049
an actual phrase? DJI School of Training? They

00:12:46.049 --> 00:12:49.070
have the DJI Talent Formula. Should you have

00:12:49.070 --> 00:12:52.169
these four skill sets, you will be able to dominate

00:12:52.169 --> 00:12:55.450
the hardware market for whatever hardware that

00:12:55.450 --> 00:12:57.509
you create. You have to, as a hardware talent,

00:12:57.809 --> 00:13:01.370
you have to have the four. And which is why DJI

00:13:01.370 --> 00:13:05.600
itself has spun off so many other... hardware

00:13:05.600 --> 00:13:08.639
companies, right? The employees of DJ who left.

00:13:08.840 --> 00:13:12.620
Exactly. Took these four, what do you call it?

00:13:12.639 --> 00:13:15.539
The four... The talent formula for DJ. Talent

00:13:15.539 --> 00:13:18.720
formula outside. And people call it, if you were

00:13:18.720 --> 00:13:21.059
to be in DJ for one year, it will be the equivalent

00:13:21.059 --> 00:13:24.259
of three years somewhere else. Are you just working

00:13:24.259 --> 00:13:28.860
overtime every year? That too. But here's a formula.

00:13:28.940 --> 00:13:30.519
Let's hear it out. Let's hear it out. Number

00:13:30.519 --> 00:13:34.230
one thing is you can't just be a... single subject

00:13:34.230 --> 00:13:36.809
matter hardware engineer. You have to be a full

00:13:36.809 --> 00:13:39.110
stack hardware engineer, which is kind of a new

00:13:39.110 --> 00:13:42.049
idea. With that, you need to understand the science

00:13:42.049 --> 00:13:45.370
behind it, the software behind it, the commercial

00:13:45.370 --> 00:13:48.610
GTM and supply chain. And you personally will

00:13:48.610 --> 00:13:50.470
have to glue everything together. That's number

00:13:50.470 --> 00:13:53.269
one. That's only number one. And number two is

00:13:53.269 --> 00:13:56.269
you need to be able to build every product in

00:13:56.269 --> 00:13:59.330
mind with the full commercialization cycles that

00:13:59.330 --> 00:14:02.240
comes after that. Number two. You can't just

00:14:02.240 --> 00:14:04.500
build. It's a lot of work already. It's a lot

00:14:04.500 --> 00:14:06.799
of work. Number two, if you build something,

00:14:06.879 --> 00:14:08.799
it can't sell it. That's a failed product, failed

00:14:08.799 --> 00:14:12.059
consumer product, right? Number three is you

00:14:12.059 --> 00:14:13.740
need to understand the supply chain. Okay, fun

00:14:13.740 --> 00:14:16.899
fact, DJI is started in Shenzhen, which is kind

00:14:16.899 --> 00:14:19.679
of the heart of supply chain within China. So

00:14:19.679 --> 00:14:22.639
understanding the supply chain is a must. And

00:14:22.639 --> 00:14:25.980
last bit, number four, if you want to be a DJI

00:14:25.980 --> 00:14:28.779
engineering talent, then you have to be obsessed.

00:14:29.389 --> 00:14:32.830
with using upon unboxing. Otherwise, everyday

00:14:32.830 --> 00:14:35.590
user will not use your product every day. That's

00:14:35.590 --> 00:14:38.629
the most important one. So then if he's so successful

00:14:38.629 --> 00:14:44.610
in DJI, why did he leave? In 2020, Mavic has

00:14:44.610 --> 00:14:48.809
already proved that it is a sellable product.

00:14:49.110 --> 00:14:52.509
It's doing very well. And so of course, as a

00:14:52.509 --> 00:14:56.590
maker, also as an excellent engineer, Tao Ye...

00:14:57.330 --> 00:14:59.330
proposed in one of the meetings and obviously

00:14:59.330 --> 00:15:02.090
this proposal is not just off of his head he

00:15:02.090 --> 00:15:05.649
thought about this he had actually been discussing

00:15:05.649 --> 00:15:08.730
with other fellow engineers for a while that

00:15:08.730 --> 00:15:12.529
maybe 3d printing would be a good idea and this

00:15:12.529 --> 00:15:16.330
is one year one year in advance and so they are

00:15:16.330 --> 00:15:18.570
starting to pitch in that idea within the company

00:15:18.570 --> 00:15:22.690
and he said he claimed in one of the news articles

00:15:22.690 --> 00:15:25.210
that i've read said within five minutes of that

00:15:26.619 --> 00:15:30.740
ideation pitching and meeting, it was vetoed.

00:15:30.740 --> 00:15:34.700
It wasn't deemed to be a sustainable product

00:15:34.700 --> 00:15:38.100
because everyone is rushing to the bottom in

00:15:38.100 --> 00:15:42.139
terms of price. And it's very hard to use any

00:15:42.139 --> 00:15:44.720
current product in 3D printing at the time. And

00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:47.940
this is 2019. That is so wrong if we think about

00:15:47.940 --> 00:15:50.600
it. But it is also very true. It reflects the

00:15:50.600 --> 00:15:53.240
market at the time, the sentiment at the time.

00:15:53.340 --> 00:15:56.899
So his ideas got shut down and he wasn't very

00:15:56.899 --> 00:16:00.399
happy. And so that's when he started. He didn't

00:16:00.399 --> 00:16:03.639
obviously leave the job, but he... But it got

00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:06.309
him thinking. It got him thinking that... oh,

00:16:06.389 --> 00:16:08.509
I still do think this is a very good idea and

00:16:08.509 --> 00:16:11.090
I really want to be making this. What do I do?

00:16:11.769 --> 00:16:15.309
And before, I guess, we move on to the next segment,

00:16:15.409 --> 00:16:18.070
I just wanted to point out one thing. Leaving

00:16:18.070 --> 00:16:21.409
DJI obviously is not an uncommon thing to do.

00:16:21.649 --> 00:16:24.409
You would think that, oh, is Bamboo Lab the first

00:16:24.409 --> 00:16:30.070
company that, you know, left DJI? There are actually...

00:16:30.620 --> 00:16:33.080
Two dozen. Well, more than one dozen of companies.

00:16:33.100 --> 00:16:35.620
That's a very long list. That's a very long list

00:16:35.620 --> 00:16:38.620
of companies who have left DJI before. All the

00:16:38.620 --> 00:16:44.059
way starting from 2014, there were robotics companies,

00:16:44.440 --> 00:16:47.340
there were battery companies, there were different

00:16:47.340 --> 00:16:51.720
drone companies. Bamboo Lab was the first 3D

00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:54.340
printing company that had spinoffs from DJI.

00:16:54.480 --> 00:16:58.559
Very interesting. Because it's not like the spinoffs

00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:01.779
are all drone -related. It's actually other consumer

00:17:01.779 --> 00:17:05.619
electronics. So you can apply the same principles,

00:17:05.880 --> 00:17:10.180
work in Shenzhen with the supply chain, build

00:17:10.180 --> 00:17:13.359
any consumer electronics. Exactly. That's exactly

00:17:13.359 --> 00:17:16.950
right. And let's talk about the people who have

00:17:16.950 --> 00:17:20.150
left the company. He didn't leave alone? No,

00:17:20.190 --> 00:17:23.549
he didn't. He actually, he has an army who left

00:17:23.549 --> 00:17:27.190
with him. There were four other people who left

00:17:27.190 --> 00:17:32.450
DJI with Dr. Turbo. Number one comes Gao Xiufeng.

00:17:32.509 --> 00:17:36.089
We'll just call him Gao. The CTO of Bamboo Lab.

00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:40.299
PhD in automation, another PhD. He actually graduated

00:17:40.299 --> 00:17:42.619
from the same undergrad with Tao Ye. So there

00:17:42.619 --> 00:17:45.759
is a chance that they know each other from way

00:17:45.759 --> 00:17:48.700
back. And he specialized in embedded software

00:17:48.700 --> 00:17:52.480
systems and AI. And to be honest, he is known

00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:55.380
as the person who is the largest product manager.

00:17:55.440 --> 00:18:00.079
He has the biggest ownership within Dr. Tao's

00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:03.799
scope. Oh, he reports to Dr. Tao directly. Yes,

00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:07.349
on Mavic projects. So obviously you would take

00:18:07.349 --> 00:18:12.329
your number one with you. Yes. Sorry, DJI. It's

00:18:12.329 --> 00:18:16.109
a big hit, five people. Yeah. And at DJI, he

00:18:16.109 --> 00:18:18.809
was the head of DJI's system engineering department

00:18:18.809 --> 00:18:21.730
and leading R &D and technical solution design

00:18:21.730 --> 00:18:25.750
across multiple major product lines. He was known

00:18:25.750 --> 00:18:30.430
as effectively DJI's biggest internal project

00:18:30.430 --> 00:18:33.950
owner in that era. To start in Bamboo Lab, he

00:18:33.950 --> 00:18:38.180
famously said one thing. 2020 was an era that

00:18:38.180 --> 00:18:41.839
3D printer was essentially a no -brainer. It's

00:18:41.839 --> 00:18:45.799
just a motion platform. Users wanted to play

00:18:45.799 --> 00:18:48.579
with 3D printing, but ended up spending their

00:18:48.579 --> 00:18:52.460
time repairing and babysitting the machine. It's

00:18:52.460 --> 00:18:54.319
a pretty good thesis. It's a pretty good summary

00:18:54.319 --> 00:19:02.200
of 2020. Second person, Liu Huaiyu, who later

00:19:02.200 --> 00:19:06.730
became COO of Bamboo Lab. Software management

00:19:06.730 --> 00:19:10.849
background. And he used to work at Marvell Semiconductors.

00:19:11.049 --> 00:19:14.750
Oh, actually, Gao Xufeng also had a brief time

00:19:14.750 --> 00:19:17.269
working at a semiconductor industry. He was in

00:19:17.269 --> 00:19:20.269
Marvell for six years. So the two of them, you

00:19:20.269 --> 00:19:23.170
know, shared a working relationship before. And

00:19:23.170 --> 00:19:26.990
in DJI, Liu Huaiyu, he was the product manager

00:19:26.990 --> 00:19:31.430
for DJI's FPV, First Person View product line.

00:19:31.869 --> 00:19:33.950
which is when your drone is flying, you can be

00:19:33.950 --> 00:19:37.509
holding a pad that shows where your drone is

00:19:37.509 --> 00:19:40.970
going. It's basically the screen monitoring system.

00:19:42.509 --> 00:19:47.029
And he later became COO for Bamboo Lab, the operations

00:19:47.029 --> 00:19:50.910
lead. Given his FPV and transmission background,

00:19:51.230 --> 00:19:54.730
and also this is just me assuming, it is reasonable

00:19:54.730 --> 00:19:58.230
to infer that although not confirmed, that his

00:19:58.230 --> 00:20:01.490
DJI expertise around real -time video and data

00:20:01.490 --> 00:20:04.470
transmission systems could be used to help Bamboo's

00:20:04.470 --> 00:20:07.309
camera monitoring and cloud connectivity. That

00:20:07.309 --> 00:20:09.950
makes sense. Yeah. The next person is called

00:20:09.950 --> 00:20:12.309
Chen Zihan. He's the chief engineer and also

00:20:12.309 --> 00:20:16.150
known as the gimbal guy. And gimbal is the handheld

00:20:16.150 --> 00:20:20.289
pivot device that stabilizes the camera. And

00:20:20.289 --> 00:20:23.970
so he has a lot of deep expertise in motion control.

00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:28.220
and active stabilization algorithms. That's it.

00:20:29.079 --> 00:20:34.200
And the last person is Wei. He is a senior engineer.

00:20:34.440 --> 00:20:40.640
He contributed a lot in DJI's Mavic Air 2. He's

00:20:40.640 --> 00:20:44.039
also a software system specialist. All right.

00:20:44.180 --> 00:20:47.339
And I think he specializes in LiDAR, which also

00:20:47.339 --> 00:20:50.920
is used in bamboo labs. Absolutely. So that's

00:20:50.920 --> 00:20:54.670
all five of them. Wow. That's a lot of senior

00:20:54.670 --> 00:20:58.970
people that Dr. Tao took with them altogether.

00:20:59.509 --> 00:21:02.109
It's like everyone in the entire DJI for Mavic

00:21:02.109 --> 00:21:05.630
Pro. And Mavic is their... The MVP product. Exactly.

00:21:05.849 --> 00:21:09.069
For DJI. So DJI might have taken a pretty big

00:21:09.069 --> 00:21:12.769
hit back then. Huge loss. So when they targeted

00:21:12.769 --> 00:21:18.549
3D printing after leaving DJI, what did the 3D

00:21:18.549 --> 00:21:22.039
printing landscape look like? Why were they so

00:21:22.039 --> 00:21:26.039
convinced that this was the industry to go? Like,

00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:28.539
what technologies do they use? Which stage were

00:21:28.539 --> 00:21:32.099
their ads? Why did they pick a particular type

00:21:32.099 --> 00:21:35.500
of 3D printers that, you know, extrude plastic?

00:21:36.220 --> 00:21:41.059
Right. And actually, out of Linda and me, Linda

00:21:41.059 --> 00:21:44.099
is actually a 3D printer owner. I'm not. But

00:21:44.099 --> 00:21:48.059
out of all that, I did go do some... research

00:21:48.059 --> 00:21:51.200
on YouTube and learn the various types of 3D

00:21:51.200 --> 00:21:54.440
printing. Please share. I'm only like owner of

00:21:54.440 --> 00:21:57.380
one machine. I think we'll rely the history part

00:21:57.380 --> 00:22:00.900
with you. It is very interesting to study the

00:22:00.900 --> 00:22:02.940
brief commercial history of 3D printing. So let's

00:22:02.940 --> 00:22:06.640
start with that. There are three major types

00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:09.240
of 3D printing technology. Well, obviously, with

00:22:09.240 --> 00:22:11.859
the technological development, there are a lot

00:22:11.859 --> 00:22:16.119
more right now. But for the ones that are fully

00:22:16.119 --> 00:22:18.420
commercialized and being used in different scenarios,

00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:21.019
it has longer histories are three main ones.

00:22:21.180 --> 00:22:24.299
And the first one. Well, so my suspicion is,

00:22:24.319 --> 00:22:27.519
did it start with military? However, the actual

00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:31.079
first ever 3D printer was created in the commercial

00:22:31.079 --> 00:22:35.349
space and it was not military. In 1981. A Japanese

00:22:35.349 --> 00:22:37.789
researcher, his name is Dr. Hideo Kodama, of

00:22:37.789 --> 00:22:40.109
course there's always a Japanese researcher that

00:22:40.109 --> 00:22:42.869
started everything in the 80s, the prime time

00:22:42.869 --> 00:22:46.670
of Japanese research, published a paper describing

00:22:46.670 --> 00:22:49.430
a layer -by -layer rapid prototyping system,

00:22:49.609 --> 00:22:52.390
but he never commercialized it. Until someone

00:22:52.390 --> 00:22:56.170
whose name is Charles Chuck Hall, he patent filed

00:22:56.170 --> 00:23:01.630
in 1984, stereolithography, SLA, and this guy

00:23:01.630 --> 00:23:06.579
is still alive. Basically, What SLA is, is curing

00:23:06.579 --> 00:23:10.400
liquid polymer resin layer by layer with UV light.

00:23:11.019 --> 00:23:14.319
And this technology is created mostly because

00:23:14.319 --> 00:23:18.799
of the frustration was real in Detroit's automakers,

00:23:18.799 --> 00:23:22.980
you know, prototyping. What's the minimum amount

00:23:22.980 --> 00:23:26.099
of time that you could turn a CAD design into

00:23:26.099 --> 00:23:29.440
an actual physical prototype part? The fun fact

00:23:29.440 --> 00:23:32.549
is, you know, actually in the... early 2000,

00:23:32.769 --> 00:23:36.150
I did take a CADIS, computer -aided design class,

00:23:36.430 --> 00:23:39.369
working in one of those computer labs. And you

00:23:39.369 --> 00:23:43.029
have to hand snap to grid. Then that took a really

00:23:43.029 --> 00:23:45.089
long time. Just think about that. And it was

00:23:45.089 --> 00:23:47.650
way before that. I cannot possibly imagine how

00:23:47.650 --> 00:23:51.630
much time it took them. And SLA was used to fix

00:23:51.630 --> 00:23:54.289
that specific problem. It was a competition problem.

00:23:55.289 --> 00:23:58.680
Automotive prototyping speed in the 80s. U .S.

00:23:58.759 --> 00:24:01.680
automakers were losing ground to the faster -moving

00:24:01.680 --> 00:24:04.460
Japanese competitors, partly because turning

00:24:04.460 --> 00:24:07.420
a new dashboard bracket design into a physical

00:24:07.420 --> 00:24:13.200
test part took weeks, right? And SLA was the

00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:16.900
cure to that, and Chuck Hall, he commercialized

00:24:16.900 --> 00:24:19.640
that, and he also created a company which is

00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:22.059
called 3D System, which is going to come back

00:24:22.059 --> 00:24:25.440
later in the story. That company allowed engineers

00:24:25.440 --> 00:24:29.029
to print an overnight prototype for the automotive

00:24:29.029 --> 00:24:33.009
industry. The pros of it would be high resolution,

00:24:33.369 --> 00:24:35.730
a lot of detail, smooth, and you can achieve

00:24:35.730 --> 00:24:37.430
very fine features, you know, like the smooth

00:24:37.430 --> 00:24:40.250
figures. The con of it would be parts are usually

00:24:40.250 --> 00:24:44.170
quite brittle, liquor resin is messy and toxic,

00:24:44.269 --> 00:24:47.529
and it's weaker mechanically than the FDM parts

00:24:47.529 --> 00:24:49.529
that we're going to talk about later on. Number

00:24:49.529 --> 00:24:52.170
two, start it with military funding this time.

00:24:52.569 --> 00:24:56.109
As Cold War era defense R &D spending ramped

00:24:56.109 --> 00:24:59.799
up, Towards the end, agencies including DARPA,

00:24:59.940 --> 00:25:02.480
Office of Naval Research, Air Force, and NASA

00:25:02.480 --> 00:25:07.400
funded work on powder bed fusion method of 3D

00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:10.279
printing. That sounds very complicated. That

00:25:10.279 --> 00:25:14.819
technology, laser, became SLS, Selective Laser

00:25:14.819 --> 00:25:19.299
Centering. And it was developed fully in 1986

00:25:19.299 --> 00:25:22.880
by Carl Deckard and Joseph Eman at UT Austin.

00:25:23.339 --> 00:25:26.740
And later, that eventually became... metal 3D

00:25:26.740 --> 00:25:33.480
printing. You can use various powders to consolidate

00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:36.940
that final printing product. And the military's

00:25:36.940 --> 00:25:40.519
interest specifically was to drive the logistics

00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:44.119
down. You're printing spare parts on demand near

00:25:44.119 --> 00:25:46.279
the battlefield instead of stockpiling and shipping

00:25:46.279 --> 00:25:49.000
them, which makes sense. And also remember, this

00:25:49.000 --> 00:25:50.859
goes back to the Cold War era, so that's why

00:25:50.859 --> 00:25:56.190
it was needed. And how it works is... laser selectively

00:25:56.190 --> 00:25:59.569
fuses or centers it's like heating but not fully

00:25:59.569 --> 00:26:02.750
melts the fine powder and It could be plastic.

00:26:02.930 --> 00:26:05.890
It could be metal layer by layer inside of a

00:26:05.890 --> 00:26:09.970
heated powder bed it's like a heated powder cubic

00:26:09.970 --> 00:26:13.789
and Unfused powder around the parts stays in

00:26:13.789 --> 00:26:16.069
place and act as sort of a support structure

00:26:16.069 --> 00:26:18.369
So it just stays like that and once it's done

00:26:18.369 --> 00:26:20.529
you can take it out, but it requires a little

00:26:20.529 --> 00:26:23.579
polishing and cleaning It's like if you imagine

00:26:23.579 --> 00:26:26.579
anthropologists digging up stuff from dirt and

00:26:26.579 --> 00:26:28.759
like brushing it off, that's how you dig up the

00:26:28.759 --> 00:26:31.779
SLS prints. Exactly. Oh, that is very accurate.

00:26:32.759 --> 00:26:35.440
So the pros of it will be you don't need to have

00:26:35.440 --> 00:26:37.380
a support structure. It happens in our strong

00:26:37.380 --> 00:26:41.079
powder bed. It's very strong. It's durable. It's

00:26:41.079 --> 00:26:43.859
functioning. It's good for complex assembly,

00:26:43.960 --> 00:26:46.059
which is why I guess the military developed it

00:26:46.059 --> 00:26:47.920
in the first place. But the cons of it is also

00:26:47.920 --> 00:26:51.670
very obvious. It is very expensive. And the parts

00:26:51.670 --> 00:26:55.289
would have a grainy, a matte surface finish and

00:26:55.289 --> 00:26:58.690
requires more cosmetic polishing after everything

00:26:58.690 --> 00:27:00.630
if you want to be using it for different purposes.

00:27:00.930 --> 00:27:05.130
And powder handling requires equipment and safety

00:27:05.130 --> 00:27:08.089
precautions, so it's slower. Not the most consumer

00:27:08.089 --> 00:27:12.990
-friendly. Not at all consumer -friendly. And

00:27:12.990 --> 00:27:16.670
then the last one is called the FDM. which is

00:27:16.670 --> 00:27:20.130
the one that became more widely used later on,

00:27:20.210 --> 00:27:24.250
and it was a complete commercial and DIY story.

00:27:25.130 --> 00:27:29.390
It happened in a garage, of course. Scott Crump,

00:27:29.509 --> 00:27:32.890
an engineer, was trying to make a toy frog for

00:27:32.890 --> 00:27:34.450
his daughter, a toy anything. That's so cute.

00:27:34.529 --> 00:27:38.890
I know, it's really cute. In 1988, using a hot

00:27:38.890 --> 00:27:43.400
glue gun, loaded with a mix of polyethylene and

00:27:43.400 --> 00:27:47.119
candle wax, which is plastic materials of sorts,

00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:50.859
and extruding it layer by layer to build a shape.

00:27:51.180 --> 00:27:55.299
It worked well enough. I can't believe it. I

00:27:55.299 --> 00:27:57.599
want a dad that built stuff for me when I was

00:27:57.599 --> 00:28:00.579
young. He realized that, oh, this works, that

00:28:00.579 --> 00:28:03.839
he saw the commercial potential of it. And in

00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:07.400
1989, him and his wife, Lisa, co -founded...

00:28:07.759 --> 00:28:11.119
Stratasys and filed a patent for the process

00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:13.680
that we just talked about and trademarked it

00:28:13.680 --> 00:28:17.859
as fused deposition modeling which is FDM and

00:28:17.859 --> 00:28:23.779
later competitors when they develop similar technology

00:28:23.779 --> 00:28:27.299
they cannot even call it FDM because they trademarked

00:28:27.299 --> 00:28:31.019
it so the competitors have to call it FFF, which

00:28:31.019 --> 00:28:33.380
is Fused Filament Fabrication. It's more or less

00:28:33.380 --> 00:28:36.319
the same thing. It's just something to prevent

00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:38.640
you from getting sued while the patent is still

00:28:38.640 --> 00:28:42.420
in place. Exactly. So how it works is exactly

00:28:42.420 --> 00:28:45.380
what you think how it works. Thermoplastic filament,

00:28:45.660 --> 00:28:49.180
aka mostly plastic, heated to a melting point,

00:28:49.240 --> 00:28:53.440
and you extrude the melting plastic through a

00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:56.619
nozzle, depositing materials layer by layer onto

00:28:56.619 --> 00:29:00.019
a plate. And you're building a precision hot

00:29:00.019 --> 00:29:02.599
glue gun printing. And that's how it's invented.

00:29:02.819 --> 00:29:08.579
And back in 1992, a 3D modeler, which is Stratis'

00:29:08.740 --> 00:29:13.420
first 3D printing commercial machine, was priced

00:29:13.420 --> 00:29:17.720
around $130 ,000. That's a lot of money. Would

00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:20.920
not buy that. It is more expensive than a computer.

00:29:21.500 --> 00:29:23.420
a lot more expensive than a computer in 1992.

00:29:23.819 --> 00:29:26.960
Yeah, back then it was not really for consumer

00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:29.940
use. Their target market was industrial. Definitely.

00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:34.500
The pros of it would be cheap, fast. You cannot

00:29:34.500 --> 00:29:37.599
really hurt anybody with cheap plastics and parts

00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:40.680
are generally pretty tough and it's easy to operate

00:29:40.680 --> 00:29:44.299
and maintain. The cons would be it is the lowest

00:29:44.299 --> 00:29:46.599
resolution of 3D printing of all. As you can

00:29:46.599 --> 00:29:48.339
tell, there's no precision that comes into that.

00:29:48.559 --> 00:29:53.000
It needs support. And historically, for whatever

00:29:53.000 --> 00:29:55.380
equipment that you use, that's going to be needing

00:29:55.380 --> 00:29:59.859
a lot of manual tuning and babysitting. The end

00:29:59.859 --> 00:30:04.339
of the 1980s, mostly three separate technologies

00:30:04.339 --> 00:30:08.680
all trying to solve one problem, which is why

00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:15.400
does prototyping take so long? And, well, the

00:30:15.400 --> 00:30:17.720
situation is most of these technologies were

00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:22.529
very... patent locked and industry only. So one

00:30:22.529 --> 00:30:29.309
thing on patent. FDM technology was under U .S.

00:30:29.349 --> 00:30:32.609
patent. So like most countries, patent grants

00:30:32.609 --> 00:30:36.559
an inventor a fixed monopoly period. in exchange

00:30:36.559 --> 00:30:39.920
for publicly disclosing exactly how this invention

00:30:39.920 --> 00:30:42.059
works so you can patent it you're the only person

00:30:42.059 --> 00:30:43.960
who are using it but you you just have to let

00:30:43.960 --> 00:30:45.500
everyone know that oh this is how i'm going to

00:30:45.500 --> 00:30:48.079
do it which is melting plastic doesn't seem to

00:30:48.079 --> 00:30:50.619
like to be like like transparency in exchange

00:30:50.619 --> 00:30:53.259
for protection for monopoly protection exactly

00:30:53.259 --> 00:30:58.319
and for u .s patent that time in the 90s is 20

00:30:58.319 --> 00:31:02.930
years so in that 20 years It's non -negotiable.

00:31:03.029 --> 00:31:05.829
It's not renewable. It doesn't depend on whether

00:31:05.829 --> 00:31:08.990
your invention succeed commercially or not at

00:31:08.990 --> 00:31:11.990
all. It's just a physical lock that starts taking

00:31:11.990 --> 00:31:14.890
the day the application is filed and runs out

00:31:14.890 --> 00:31:19.269
in 20 years. Scott Crump filed FDM patent in

00:31:19.269 --> 00:31:22.950
1989. So that put the expiration date on October

00:31:22.950 --> 00:31:28.230
30th, 2009. And when the clock ran out, this

00:31:28.230 --> 00:31:31.799
patent will be released to... the public domain

00:31:31.799 --> 00:31:36.680
and when it released to the public domain a couple

00:31:36.680 --> 00:31:40.099
things typically will happen number one more

00:31:40.099 --> 00:31:42.720
people will be building this hardware very likely

00:31:42.720 --> 00:31:45.579
building and selling these machines because you

00:31:45.579 --> 00:31:48.680
couldn't you can build but you can't sell before

00:31:48.680 --> 00:31:51.160
the patent expires right there you go number

00:31:51.160 --> 00:31:54.440
one number two once the hardware is in place

00:31:54.440 --> 00:31:57.579
you therefore must need a software or at least

00:31:57.579 --> 00:32:00.839
like an interfacing level that allows people

00:32:00.839 --> 00:32:03.640
to contribute more things onto it, firmware designs,

00:32:03.960 --> 00:32:06.839
that community will be developed. And number

00:32:06.839 --> 00:32:08.880
three, as more people will be building hardware

00:32:08.880 --> 00:32:11.700
and having that interface level, there will just

00:32:11.700 --> 00:32:14.640
be a lot more people coming into the space and

00:32:14.640 --> 00:32:17.619
do things around it. It could be, you know, SMB,

00:32:17.700 --> 00:32:20.319
small manufacturers, or it could be hobbyist

00:32:20.319 --> 00:32:23.720
kit sellers. Yeah, and that's exactly what happened.

00:32:24.339 --> 00:32:29.109
So five years. before the patent expired even

00:32:29.109 --> 00:32:31.990
a bit before that a lot of people had their eyes

00:32:31.990 --> 00:32:35.170
on this technology and they were literally waiting

00:32:35.170 --> 00:32:38.289
for it to expire and like you said they actually

00:32:38.289 --> 00:32:41.690
created the terminology FFF to avoid this clash

00:32:41.690 --> 00:32:44.910
while they develop based on top of this technology

00:32:44.910 --> 00:32:49.490
so one thing that was really notable is a community

00:32:49.490 --> 00:32:55.910
group online that popped up in 2004, five years

00:32:55.910 --> 00:33:00.569
before the patent expiration. This is attributed

00:33:00.569 --> 00:33:05.170
to the growth of FDM as is today. This project

00:33:05.170 --> 00:33:08.069
is called the REPREP project, and it stands for

00:33:08.069 --> 00:33:14.880
Replicating Rapid Prototyper. It started by a

00:33:14.880 --> 00:33:17.180
mechanical engineering lecture at the University

00:33:17.180 --> 00:33:21.920
of Bath. His name is Dr. Adrian Boyer. Dr. Boyer's

00:33:21.920 --> 00:33:25.259
objective for this project is to produce a 3D

00:33:25.259 --> 00:33:28.559
printer that can print a significant portion

00:33:28.559 --> 00:33:32.480
of its own replacement part, which is where the

00:33:32.480 --> 00:33:35.740
replicating name, REP, in the REPRAP project

00:33:35.740 --> 00:33:41.750
starts from. When you can reproduce yourself,

00:33:41.890 --> 00:33:45.849
that means you can make 3D printing cheap and

00:33:45.849 --> 00:33:49.289
available for everyone. And he wanted to do this

00:33:49.289 --> 00:33:52.069
because his university, and he was lucky enough

00:33:52.069 --> 00:33:54.349
that he's in the university where the university

00:33:54.349 --> 00:33:57.809
contributed to a fund that bought some high -end

00:33:57.809 --> 00:34:02.750
3D printers that's worth 40 to 50K in one instance.

00:34:03.029 --> 00:34:04.890
And he mentioned that there's one that's actually

00:34:04.890 --> 00:34:07.900
a quarter of a million dollars. Yeah, and he

00:34:07.900 --> 00:34:10.659
was using this, but he thought it was life -changing.

00:34:10.860 --> 00:34:14.380
The first time you come across a 3D printer in

00:34:14.380 --> 00:34:16.579
the early 2000s. So he thought it was a massive

00:34:16.579 --> 00:34:19.679
breakthrough. He wanted to become cheaper and

00:34:19.679 --> 00:34:22.500
make it available for everyone. Super altruistic

00:34:22.500 --> 00:34:25.679
on starting this community. And he literally

00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:29.079
said it felt like a writer moving from using

00:34:29.079 --> 00:34:31.340
an old typewriter to a modern word processor.

00:34:32.429 --> 00:34:35.070
So he knew this technology was going to change

00:34:35.070 --> 00:34:39.530
the world, and he wanted it to be less expensive.

00:34:40.329 --> 00:34:42.889
And he doesn't want it to be in the hands of

00:34:42.889 --> 00:34:45.789
only corporate and large institutions. So he

00:34:45.789 --> 00:34:48.090
wrote this vision down, posted on University

00:34:48.090 --> 00:34:51.190
of Bath this website, and he also applied for

00:34:51.190 --> 00:34:53.710
a tiny grant, which is the smallest grant he's

00:34:53.710 --> 00:34:58.210
ever received, which is 27 ,000 pounds. And I

00:34:58.210 --> 00:35:00.369
think he did this on purpose because he was trying

00:35:00.369 --> 00:35:04.409
to prove that the grant that he needs to build

00:35:04.409 --> 00:35:07.889
this machine costs less than the cheapest machine.

00:35:08.699 --> 00:35:10.980
that he bought or the university bought yeah

00:35:10.980 --> 00:35:13.860
and but then he didn't get count he mentioned

00:35:13.860 --> 00:35:16.659
he didn't account for the ph student salary that

00:35:16.659 --> 00:35:19.440
worked for him but regardless you know it's a

00:35:19.440 --> 00:35:23.800
university project but a lot of people gravitated

00:35:23.800 --> 00:35:26.219
toward this project hobbyists all over the world

00:35:27.790 --> 00:35:32.210
And also because the philosophy was to make 3D

00:35:32.210 --> 00:35:35.809
printing available for everyone, he decided that

00:35:35.809 --> 00:35:38.469
it made just no sense to patent any of the design

00:35:38.469 --> 00:35:41.150
that he published. So he intentionally released

00:35:41.150 --> 00:35:44.590
every blueprint under something called the open

00:35:44.590 --> 00:35:48.630
source GPL license. So this means anywhere in

00:35:48.630 --> 00:35:52.809
the world could download his blueprints, even

00:35:52.809 --> 00:35:56.570
modify them, build on top of them. and use, not

00:35:56.570 --> 00:36:00.050
only use, but sell their own versions without

00:36:00.050 --> 00:36:04.150
loyalties after the patent expires, obviously.

00:36:04.809 --> 00:36:08.010
So it was all open source, university -based

00:36:08.010 --> 00:36:10.889
project. And that built the foundation of FDM

00:36:10.889 --> 00:36:14.409
printing as is today. Because his goal wasn't

00:36:14.409 --> 00:36:17.429
to make money. It was just he wanted the conversation.

00:36:17.730 --> 00:36:22.090
This type of license can help a project go viral.

00:36:22.699 --> 00:36:25.380
Because you're almost supporting conversations,

00:36:25.619 --> 00:36:28.380
supporting people building on top of each other.

00:36:29.099 --> 00:36:32.800
And it did exactly that. So after he published

00:36:32.800 --> 00:36:36.300
his initial design in 2007, which is a printer

00:36:36.300 --> 00:36:39.179
called Darwin, and he named it after a famous

00:36:39.179 --> 00:36:43.460
English biologist. So only one year after, someone

00:36:43.460 --> 00:36:46.820
in the Reparac community used this blueprint

00:36:46.820 --> 00:36:53.409
and successfully built his own Darwin. and printed

00:36:53.409 --> 00:36:58.050
a working copy of itself. And this is 2008, right,

00:36:58.070 --> 00:37:01.090
2008. The community then further developed over

00:37:01.090 --> 00:37:05.730
the years. By 2010, Dr. Boyer took some of the

00:37:05.730 --> 00:37:08.090
ideas and built the second version, an improved

00:37:08.090 --> 00:37:11.409
version of the Darwin. He called it Mendel after

00:37:11.409 --> 00:37:14.909
another biologist, the father of modern genetics.

00:37:15.110 --> 00:37:18.050
And he picked these names because biology itself

00:37:18.050 --> 00:37:20.030
is the study of things that copy themselves.

00:37:20.750 --> 00:37:23.570
Cute. Yeah, I really like the name. To replicate

00:37:23.570 --> 00:37:27.690
the lineage completely. And so this version,

00:37:27.789 --> 00:37:30.369
the Mendo actually became the direct ancestor

00:37:30.369 --> 00:37:34.210
of nearly every hobbyist printer that follows.

00:37:34.570 --> 00:37:38.730
And among those in this community was a young

00:37:38.730 --> 00:37:42.110
Czech contributor. His name is Joseph Prusa.

00:37:42.289 --> 00:37:45.909
Oh, that rings a bell, surely. So if you do follow

00:37:45.909 --> 00:37:50.929
the 3D printing community. In actually true open

00:37:50.929 --> 00:37:55.389
source spirit, Prusa, Joseph Prusa, took Dr.

00:37:55.590 --> 00:37:59.230
Boyer's Mendo design and he improved upon it

00:37:59.230 --> 00:38:02.829
over several iterations, in fact, and finally

00:38:02.829 --> 00:38:07.489
landed on a very popular machine called the Prusa

00:38:07.489 --> 00:38:11.070
i3, which he also then open sourced the blueprint

00:38:11.070 --> 00:38:15.630
in 2012. So at the start, he wasn't trying to

00:38:15.630 --> 00:38:19.429
make money. But because it's so popular among

00:38:19.429 --> 00:38:22.730
the community, it's often dubbed the 4 Model

00:38:22.730 --> 00:38:26.170
T of 3D printers. For three years followed, he

00:38:26.170 --> 00:38:28.210
sold a lot of parts to help others build their

00:38:28.210 --> 00:38:32.730
printers. And by this time, the patent that Stratasys

00:38:32.730 --> 00:38:37.670
owned have already expired. So also, other companies

00:38:37.670 --> 00:38:41.030
or other individuals download his file, which

00:38:41.030 --> 00:38:44.869
is for free, and started sourcing materials on

00:38:44.869 --> 00:38:48.239
their own. And they could actually, with a very

00:38:48.239 --> 00:38:52.099
low cost, create their own product and sell them

00:38:52.099 --> 00:38:54.920
on the internet to other hobbyists around the

00:38:54.920 --> 00:38:58.320
world. And this gave way to the first group of

00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:00.980
3D printing companies, a lot of them based in

00:39:00.980 --> 00:39:04.559
Shenzhen. Wow. It's almost like a gray area,

00:39:04.639 --> 00:39:06.619
like the tricky time leading up to the patent

00:39:06.619 --> 00:39:12.079
expiration. Right? It's tricky because Adrian...

00:39:12.429 --> 00:39:16.230
But for the sake of benefiting everyone, open

00:39:16.230 --> 00:39:18.929
sourced his project. But it was in a university.

00:39:18.929 --> 00:39:22.150
It was non -profit. And as a result, other people

00:39:22.150 --> 00:39:24.309
built on top of it. And because of this open

00:39:24.309 --> 00:39:27.130
source license, anyone who wants to make a profit

00:39:27.130 --> 00:39:29.590
then can come in and make a profit. And more

00:39:29.590 --> 00:39:31.969
people came in. Right. Of course, because they

00:39:31.969 --> 00:39:36.750
smell money. I mean, you can't blame them. So

00:39:36.750 --> 00:39:39.650
a lot of companies were created. And so Joseph

00:39:39.650 --> 00:39:43.150
Prusa, who originally created this design, and

00:39:43.150 --> 00:39:45.590
he hasn't been monetizing it that much since

00:39:45.590 --> 00:39:49.130
he published it, thought, well, if other people

00:39:49.130 --> 00:39:52.949
are making money out of my designs. I should

00:39:52.949 --> 00:39:56.230
do this, right? He officially and finally decided

00:39:56.230 --> 00:39:59.909
to release what's called the original Prusa i3

00:39:59.909 --> 00:40:02.829
kit. So he then sourced all the components put

00:40:02.829 --> 00:40:05.949
together in a kit and then started selling it

00:40:05.949 --> 00:40:08.969
in 2015, which is three years after he released

00:40:08.969 --> 00:40:12.750
the design. And it was selling for 750 -ish US

00:40:12.750 --> 00:40:15.670
dollars. So he started making these machines

00:40:15.670 --> 00:40:19.429
himself. And this is after a lot of people started

00:40:19.429 --> 00:40:21.590
selling them on the market already. For sure.

00:40:21.829 --> 00:40:23.750
Different versions of it. Yeah, and I remember

00:40:23.750 --> 00:40:26.409
his name can be found on YouTube. There were

00:40:26.409 --> 00:40:28.369
a lot of 3D printing videos that's related to

00:40:28.369 --> 00:40:31.869
Prusa, and it's titled Prusa Research. Yes. Yes,

00:40:31.889 --> 00:40:33.989
that's right. Yeah, because when he originally

00:40:33.989 --> 00:40:36.469
established Prusa Research, it was more kind

00:40:36.469 --> 00:40:39.550
of R &D. We'll publish more blueprints. It's

00:40:39.550 --> 00:40:42.929
only after around 2015 that he's really going,

00:40:43.030 --> 00:40:46.389
I'm going to commercialize this, and I should

00:40:46.389 --> 00:40:51.769
be. Right. So besides the college journey, Prusa

00:40:51.769 --> 00:40:54.449
is kind of the OG in the 3D industry. It is,

00:40:54.489 --> 00:40:58.449
yeah. Got it. And RepRap actually, there was

00:40:58.449 --> 00:41:01.309
a spinoff project called RepRap Pro that wanted

00:41:01.309 --> 00:41:05.570
to commercialize the same idea. Never kicked

00:41:05.570 --> 00:41:10.440
off as much as Prusa. did in the end but and

00:41:10.440 --> 00:41:13.420
today reprap isn't really an active project anymore

00:41:13.420 --> 00:41:15.599
as you can imagine but what it actually left

00:41:15.599 --> 00:41:18.980
behind is the foundation of this entire desktop

00:41:18.980 --> 00:41:23.079
3d printing industry that we still sit on uh

00:41:23.079 --> 00:41:27.599
which you know it's open source it's based on

00:41:27.599 --> 00:41:31.139
uh the foundation that we want this to be in

00:41:31.139 --> 00:41:34.940
the hands of consumers and not a selected few

00:41:34.940 --> 00:41:38.440
corporates if you're Listening to the timeline,

00:41:38.820 --> 00:41:42.440
Bamboo Lab is not here yet. Bamboo Lab does not

00:41:42.440 --> 00:41:46.500
participate at all during this phase. I mean,

00:41:46.519 --> 00:41:50.360
2009, Dr. Tao isn't even in DJI yet. Exactly.

00:41:51.690 --> 00:41:55.170
So later on, I think Bamboo also goes by a slightly

00:41:55.170 --> 00:41:58.110
different philosophy that ultimately, spoiler,

00:41:58.409 --> 00:42:02.110
clashed with this community. The second importance,

00:42:02.250 --> 00:42:05.190
which is I think less talked about, is the contribution

00:42:05.190 --> 00:42:10.170
of this RepRap community to popularizing the

00:42:10.170 --> 00:42:13.510
FFF or the FDM technology. Because you mentioned

00:42:13.510 --> 00:42:17.030
there are three patents going on at the same

00:42:17.030 --> 00:42:21.679
time, all commercializable after expired. Obviously,

00:42:21.820 --> 00:42:24.500
the other two had other complications, but I

00:42:24.500 --> 00:42:27.360
think RepRap actually contributed a lot in making

00:42:27.360 --> 00:42:33.900
FDM, FFF the de facto one for consumer desktop

00:42:33.900 --> 00:42:37.659
printers. At this point, if we were to look at

00:42:37.659 --> 00:42:41.739
the group of vintage, I guess, can I call them

00:42:41.739 --> 00:42:44.940
vintage? Vintage 3D printers, a .k .a. those

00:42:44.940 --> 00:42:49.679
who develop in between the time 2009 to 2020.

00:42:50.599 --> 00:42:52.860
There are a couple of them who tried, but they

00:42:52.860 --> 00:42:56.920
more or less all ran into the same problem. So

00:42:56.920 --> 00:42:58.679
at this point, actually, a lot of companies are

00:42:58.679 --> 00:43:01.679
trying to commercialize, right, including Prusa,

00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:06.179
which we've mentioned, and also RepRap Pro, the

00:43:06.179 --> 00:43:09.260
commercial arm of RepRap, and a bunch of Chinese

00:43:09.260 --> 00:43:13.320
supplier -turned -printer brands. There's, at

00:43:13.320 --> 00:43:17.099
this point, also no patent protections, so why

00:43:17.099 --> 00:43:19.260
did it take seven years for Bamboo Lab to pop

00:43:19.260 --> 00:43:21.960
up? In reality, actually, a few of these companies

00:43:21.960 --> 00:43:27.300
were successful in those day standards. So if

00:43:27.300 --> 00:43:30.300
you look at Prusa, right, they sold over 10 ,000

00:43:30.300 --> 00:43:34.300
machines per month. And Creality, which is the

00:43:34.300 --> 00:43:39.420
Shenzhen -based startup, peaked around 870 ,000

00:43:39.420 --> 00:43:44.920
in 2023. So they were selling, you know. Just

00:43:44.920 --> 00:43:47.679
nothing at the scale of bamboo because bamboo

00:43:47.679 --> 00:43:50.639
last year actually already reached 1 .5 million

00:43:50.639 --> 00:43:55.739
units. So surpassing anyone in that era. And

00:43:55.739 --> 00:43:58.340
they were making a very good margin. So what

00:43:58.340 --> 00:44:02.519
drove this gap? We're talking about 2015 era.

00:44:02.880 --> 00:44:06.719
It's really not. for your average consumer at

00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:09.519
all. You don't buy a 3D printer expecting it

00:44:09.519 --> 00:44:12.139
to work. In fact, you don't even buy printers.

00:44:12.239 --> 00:44:13.860
You buy something called the kit and then you

00:44:13.860 --> 00:44:15.579
build it yourself. It's like assembling your

00:44:15.579 --> 00:44:18.420
own PC. The reliability is super low. There's

00:44:18.420 --> 00:44:20.579
actually a lot of factors that can destroy a

00:44:20.579 --> 00:44:24.480
print job. So one example, right? If your millimeters...

00:44:24.960 --> 00:44:28.199
off on the print bed leveling your melted plastic

00:44:28.199 --> 00:44:30.380
is not going to stick to the bed and that destroys

00:44:30.380 --> 00:44:33.320
everything right or if that motor that moves

00:44:33.320 --> 00:44:37.440
around to eject melted plastic somehow you like

00:44:37.440 --> 00:44:40.280
touched it and it's off by a millimeter whole

00:44:40.280 --> 00:44:42.659
print destroyed oh boy so there are a lot of

00:44:42.659 --> 00:44:45.840
things that destroys prints so you don't actually

00:44:45.840 --> 00:44:48.559
send your job like today and come back like 10

00:44:48.559 --> 00:44:51.500
hours or five hours later And you see like the

00:44:51.500 --> 00:44:54.820
finished product. So if you're interested. I

00:44:54.820 --> 00:44:59.199
am. There is a YouTube video. It's actually titled

00:44:59.199 --> 00:45:02.059
10 years ago, 3D printing was really hard. Wow.

00:45:02.300 --> 00:45:05.340
Straight to the point is by the channel called

00:45:05.340 --> 00:45:09.239
Teaching Tech. And there's so many things that

00:45:09.239 --> 00:45:13.739
can go wrong. And if you do fail, there's this,

00:45:13.820 --> 00:45:17.920
I really like the term. One of the type of failures

00:45:17.920 --> 00:45:20.780
is if you don't have anything to extrude on top

00:45:20.780 --> 00:45:23.699
of because something moved along the way, but

00:45:23.699 --> 00:45:26.679
the 3D printer will continue to move because

00:45:26.679 --> 00:45:28.219
it doesn't know something went wrong, right?

00:45:28.360 --> 00:45:30.099
Because there's no monitoring system back then.

00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:32.860
So then it keeps on printing and it just prints

00:45:32.860 --> 00:45:35.780
on air because there's no support anymore. And

00:45:35.780 --> 00:45:38.699
so the next day or a few hours later when you

00:45:38.699 --> 00:45:40.519
come back, you'll see something called the...

00:45:40.519 --> 00:45:43.559
A beautiful mess. A beautiful mess and it's turned

00:45:43.559 --> 00:45:46.030
by the community spaghetti monsters. Oh, boy.

00:45:46.190 --> 00:45:49.750
Which you can kind of visualize, right? And funny

00:45:49.750 --> 00:45:52.650
thing, in China, spaghetti monsters, and we don't

00:45:52.650 --> 00:45:55.170
eat spaghetti, obviously, so they're not called

00:45:55.170 --> 00:45:57.210
spaghetti monsters. Noodle monsters. Exactly.

00:45:57.710 --> 00:46:01.409
They're called chow mein, which is fried noodles.

00:46:01.849 --> 00:46:05.070
Fried noodle monsters. Yes. Completely sidetracked,

00:46:05.070 --> 00:46:09.489
but the conclusion is nothing kicked off because

00:46:09.489 --> 00:46:13.070
it wasn't for the masses. It was for people who...

00:46:13.690 --> 00:46:16.809
enjoy tinkering enjoy building and is willing

00:46:16.809 --> 00:46:20.849
to sacrifice time and effort to build something

00:46:20.849 --> 00:46:25.690
definitely so the reliability issue and for i

00:46:25.690 --> 00:46:28.590
think a lot of the old users and even for the

00:46:28.590 --> 00:46:32.510
users who wants to be taming 3d printers it can

00:46:32.510 --> 00:46:35.349
be very intimidating yeah entry barrier quite

00:46:35.349 --> 00:46:38.110
high you can not be able to assemble everything

00:46:38.110 --> 00:46:40.869
and then you could have might as well generate

00:46:40.869 --> 00:46:43.489
spaghetti monsters exactly for the first batches

00:46:43.489 --> 00:46:45.250
and it will be a waste of all of your filaments

00:46:45.250 --> 00:46:48.750
which Maybe not cheap. Yeah. So during this time,

00:46:48.769 --> 00:46:50.889
actually, most of the headlines in 3D printing

00:46:50.889 --> 00:46:54.110
was actually in the industrial and medical use.

00:46:54.369 --> 00:46:58.090
If you ever come across news about 3D printing

00:46:58.090 --> 00:47:01.670
during this time, it's like we printed 3D prosthetics

00:47:01.670 --> 00:47:06.389
to help people with walking, or we printed 3D

00:47:06.389 --> 00:47:10.750
cells. We printed even houses. They did concrete

00:47:10.750 --> 00:47:13.989
3D printing on a very large scale, or 3D printed

00:47:13.989 --> 00:47:18.300
cars. Airbus has a 3D printing arm for rapid

00:47:18.300 --> 00:47:20.599
prototyping as well and for replacement parts.

00:47:20.960 --> 00:47:24.800
So on the consumer end, all in all, it's not

00:47:24.800 --> 00:47:28.699
really in the forefront of 3D printing. There

00:47:28.699 --> 00:47:32.179
are actually, though, a couple of companies that

00:47:32.179 --> 00:47:36.500
made some headlines. Unfortunately, they eventually

00:47:36.500 --> 00:47:41.760
somehow failed, died off. And so one of them

00:47:41.760 --> 00:47:44.619
is called MakerBot. the biggest cautionary tale

00:47:44.619 --> 00:47:47.059
that everyone can learn from, which is kind of

00:47:47.059 --> 00:47:49.780
the poster child of 3D printing in many ways.

00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:53.119
Yes. It was founded, and of course, in 2009.

00:47:53.920 --> 00:47:56.719
Rode right off of the patent expiration date

00:47:56.719 --> 00:48:02.039
and sold 40 ,000 printers before 2013. And Stratis'

00:48:02.179 --> 00:48:06.199
incomes acquired MakerBot for, not cheap, $600

00:48:06.199 --> 00:48:14.460
million. Stratis' strategy was, if I can't be

00:48:14.460 --> 00:48:17.219
the patent holder of FDM anymore, then I'm going

00:48:17.219 --> 00:48:20.059
to buy the leader in FDM. So that's why they

00:48:20.059 --> 00:48:23.139
acquired MakerBot. And after the acquisition

00:48:23.139 --> 00:48:26.440
was made, they had one good year, 2014. It was

00:48:26.440 --> 00:48:30.900
the peak before it collapsed again, because MakerBot

00:48:30.900 --> 00:48:34.360
has shipped out the so -called smart extruder.

00:48:35.019 --> 00:48:38.500
which obviously entailed reliable but ended up

00:48:38.500 --> 00:48:41.719
being catastrophically defective. The 3D printers

00:48:41.719 --> 00:48:45.659
were unusable for a lot of those who have received

00:48:45.659 --> 00:48:49.119
them. And it was so bad there was a single bad

00:48:49.119 --> 00:48:52.079
component that triggered this whole series of

00:48:52.079 --> 00:48:56.139
nightmare. A class action lawsuit against MakerBot

00:48:56.139 --> 00:49:00.699
slash Stratasys was filed in July 2015 alleging

00:49:00.699 --> 00:49:04.469
that You companies concealed a known design flaw.

00:49:04.630 --> 00:49:06.730
You know this is not working, but you keep selling

00:49:06.730 --> 00:49:11.889
it. And as a result, CEO of MakerBot, Brie, or

00:49:11.889 --> 00:49:14.909
Brett Pettis, which is a dude who looks incredibly

00:49:14.909 --> 00:49:17.250
like Steve Jobs in many ways, and who was also

00:49:17.250 --> 00:49:19.630
branded as the Steve Jobs of 3D printing. There

00:49:19.630 --> 00:49:22.469
was a video of him. He's kind of the artist -creator

00:49:22.469 --> 00:49:25.530
kind of style. He was ousted by the company completely.

00:49:25.869 --> 00:49:29.010
And later, his successor, Jenny Lawton, who also

00:49:29.010 --> 00:49:31.989
didn't solve this problem, was... else did and

00:49:31.989 --> 00:49:35.050
there were mass layoffs and manufacturing was

00:49:35.050 --> 00:49:38.650
completely outsourced to china to china and the

00:49:38.650 --> 00:49:42.190
closure of makerbot retail stores was also done

00:49:42.190 --> 00:49:46.889
at around that time the damage was so big that

00:49:46.889 --> 00:49:48.929
caused the parent company which is strategists

00:49:48.929 --> 00:49:54.480
having a 938 million quarterly losses just because

00:49:54.480 --> 00:49:56.880
of the acquisition of MakerBot. Wow, they not

00:49:56.880 --> 00:50:01.059
only paid 600 million for them, they continue

00:50:01.059 --> 00:50:03.880
to pay 900 plus every quarter. I know, I know,

00:50:03.880 --> 00:50:06.820
yes. So it's not a good acquisition. And so by

00:50:06.820 --> 00:50:11.860
October 2015, MakerBot has to continuously lay

00:50:11.860 --> 00:50:14.199
off the staff member and then more layoff and

00:50:14.199 --> 00:50:17.980
more layoff. So it was proved, at least for Stratasys,

00:50:17.980 --> 00:50:21.469
that... This is for the hobbyist market isn't

00:50:21.469 --> 00:50:25.070
sustaining. And we tried. We didn't make it.

00:50:25.090 --> 00:50:27.449
We're just going to leave it as this. And that

00:50:27.449 --> 00:50:29.829
was your losses. Yeah. And then that was MakerBot's

00:50:29.829 --> 00:50:33.090
experience. And another field example, we mentioned

00:50:33.090 --> 00:50:36.989
3D systems before, right? It was a company filed

00:50:36.989 --> 00:50:39.530
by Chuck Hall, which is the SLA patent holder.

00:50:39.670 --> 00:50:44.179
He also tried and he launched a. company called

00:50:44.179 --> 00:50:48.420
cube within 3d systems in january 2012 and he

00:50:48.420 --> 00:50:50.500
did a bunch of things also trying to recruit

00:50:50.500 --> 00:50:53.099
will .i .am as the chief creator officer in 2014

00:50:53.099 --> 00:50:57.780
however after trying to sell this to hobbyist

00:50:57.780 --> 00:51:01.139
and he came to a very sad conclusion which is

00:51:01.139 --> 00:51:03.219
this kind of thing well first is the reliability

00:51:03.219 --> 00:51:05.760
thing and if you want to solve that and continuously

00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:07.980
sell more machines and then when the market isn't

00:51:07.980 --> 00:51:11.000
ready There is no way to improve your profitability

00:51:11.000 --> 00:51:16.860
out of that. So very quickly, he decided to exit

00:51:16.860 --> 00:51:19.119
that business. And then the consumer division

00:51:19.119 --> 00:51:23.480
of Cube was proved to be a money loser. And they

00:51:23.480 --> 00:51:26.380
dropped that business in total. And then there

00:51:26.380 --> 00:51:27.639
were a bunch of business who were like that.

00:51:27.679 --> 00:51:29.460
You probably also have a few other examples as

00:51:29.460 --> 00:51:32.880
well. Yeah. So, well, I mean, one thing this

00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:37.630
whole influx of... people trying to commercialize

00:51:37.630 --> 00:51:40.929
on consumer desktop printing actually helped

00:51:40.929 --> 00:51:45.289
drove the industry in China. Because you mentioned

00:51:45.289 --> 00:51:49.050
how MakerBot ended up getting everything created

00:51:49.050 --> 00:51:53.250
and made in China. A lot of these parts are created

00:51:53.250 --> 00:51:56.030
in Shenzhen. So the whole, starting from the

00:51:56.030 --> 00:52:00.309
rep rep community, then to MakerBot, Cube, everyone

00:52:00.309 --> 00:52:04.110
who entered. Imagine where they're getting their

00:52:04.110 --> 00:52:06.650
printheads, their print beds, their circuit boards,

00:52:06.869 --> 00:52:10.230
their stepper motors. A lot of them will be in

00:52:10.230 --> 00:52:14.449
Shenzhen. And so the demand for supply has been

00:52:14.449 --> 00:52:16.690
just felt throughout Shenzhen. And some of the

00:52:16.690 --> 00:52:19.469
suppliers realize, hey, I can sell you parts

00:52:19.469 --> 00:52:22.010
for minimum margin, and then you make the profit.

00:52:22.429 --> 00:52:24.670
But then why don't I just slap, put the printer

00:52:24.670 --> 00:52:27.329
together, slap my own logo, and then sell it

00:52:27.329 --> 00:52:29.789
direct to consumers, make that margin, and I

00:52:29.789 --> 00:52:31.920
can sell it for cheaper because I'm closer. to

00:52:31.920 --> 00:52:37.659
the suppliers. So there's a bunch that kind of

00:52:37.659 --> 00:52:40.179
came up around that era in Shenzhen as well,

00:52:40.260 --> 00:52:42.460
and they compete on price, not exactly quality.

00:52:42.860 --> 00:52:46.280
And that's how, in general, China manufacturing

00:52:46.280 --> 00:52:48.119
in general, that's how it works, right? You start

00:52:48.119 --> 00:52:50.179
by copying, start by doing cheaper, and then

00:52:50.179 --> 00:52:53.739
slowly you upgrade the quality. And they have

00:52:53.739 --> 00:52:56.900
the advantage of not relying heavily on R &D

00:52:56.900 --> 00:53:01.159
because of open source, the instruction. and

00:53:01.159 --> 00:53:03.699
the blueprints are free to grab online. They

00:53:03.699 --> 00:53:06.920
can invest in some R &D to get... a slight competitive

00:53:06.920 --> 00:53:10.099
advantage. And that's what some of them did.

00:53:10.340 --> 00:53:12.440
And at that time, the VCs in China are actually

00:53:12.440 --> 00:53:15.239
more than happy to pay because they also look

00:53:15.239 --> 00:53:17.599
at the picture and they see the combination of

00:53:17.599 --> 00:53:20.639
a high market ceiling, a recently expired patent,

00:53:20.860 --> 00:53:23.559
and cheap parts available in China. So all those

00:53:23.559 --> 00:53:26.420
combined, the VCs are like, take my money. Take

00:53:26.420 --> 00:53:30.920
my money. So within that period, a company called

00:53:30.920 --> 00:53:35.039
Creality was created in 2014, who was... number

00:53:35.039 --> 00:53:38.280
one before bamboo got into the market, and they're

00:53:38.280 --> 00:53:40.760
currently still number two and recently IPO'd.

00:53:40.880 --> 00:53:43.440
Can I just add, to be honest, I think for consumer

00:53:43.440 --> 00:53:46.880
electronics, the competitors are never overseas.

00:53:46.940 --> 00:53:50.059
It's usually the competitors back home. You always

00:53:50.059 --> 00:53:52.000
have to watch out for that. Like, for example,

00:53:52.219 --> 00:53:55.059
DJI Acer 360 and so on and so forth. But yes,

00:53:55.119 --> 00:53:58.400
so Creality started 2014. Because Chinese manufacturing,

00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:02.400
China is the hub of especially consumer electronics.

00:54:03.280 --> 00:54:08.320
So it's hard to compete on price, at least. Another

00:54:08.320 --> 00:54:12.159
company called Elegoo started in 2015. I hope

00:54:12.159 --> 00:54:15.500
I pronounced that right. Another company called

00:54:15.500 --> 00:54:18.940
Anycubic also started in 2015. And together,

00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:22.199
Creality, Elegoo, Anycubic, and Bamboo are the

00:54:22.199 --> 00:54:25.619
top four that dominates the market today. 96

00:54:25.619 --> 00:54:30.519
% combined market share. What about that 4 %?

00:54:30.920 --> 00:54:34.920
I think Prusa holds some of it. But you're right.

00:54:35.000 --> 00:54:38.559
They do need to compete in Shenzhen and not elsewhere.

00:54:38.880 --> 00:54:44.400
But even with a head start, you asked, why didn't

00:54:44.400 --> 00:54:47.480
something kick off in 2015, 2016 when everyone

00:54:47.480 --> 00:54:49.980
got into this? So many money were put into this.

00:54:50.179 --> 00:54:54.500
Why did they have to wait for Bamboo Lab in 20...

00:54:54.829 --> 00:54:57.929
wait for a bigger competitor to show up exactly

00:54:57.929 --> 00:55:03.010
like what happened during this time so next let's

00:55:03.010 --> 00:55:08.710
talk about how bamboo did it and why did it take

00:55:08.710 --> 00:55:11.969
so long so going back to the beginning of bamboo

00:55:11.969 --> 00:55:16.630
lab's own story in 2020 is when the five founders

00:55:16.630 --> 00:55:20.739
walked away from dji Well, for the first 22 months

00:55:20.739 --> 00:55:23.500
of this company, it isn't all that exciting.

00:55:23.599 --> 00:55:25.920
And in fact, it's a little boring. And it also

00:55:25.920 --> 00:55:29.559
coincided with the time of COVID. So what's better

00:55:29.559 --> 00:55:31.679
than doing R &D during COVID time? Because you

00:55:31.679 --> 00:55:33.880
can't leave the house. There's not much of an

00:55:33.880 --> 00:55:36.760
option, right? Yeah. So it took in total about

00:55:36.760 --> 00:55:41.360
22 months. And they just kept pouring more engineers

00:55:41.360 --> 00:55:44.699
on the project. It start with five and it quickly

00:55:44.699 --> 00:55:49.179
multiply into at about 100 engineers. And those

00:55:49.179 --> 00:55:54.500
100 engineers burn through seven full prototype

00:55:54.500 --> 00:55:58.320
iterations by DJI engineering standard. And they

00:55:58.320 --> 00:56:02.699
run hundreds of physical tests. And yes, you

00:56:02.699 --> 00:56:05.840
guessed it right. They used up three metric tons

00:56:05.840 --> 00:56:09.820
of printing materials before anything can be

00:56:09.820 --> 00:56:13.320
allowed to ship. That is a lot of plastic. High

00:56:13.320 --> 00:56:15.760
standards. High standards. They will not make

00:56:15.760 --> 00:56:20.329
something that is not... competable and not i

00:56:20.329 --> 00:56:23.329
guess frankly perfect before they can figure

00:56:23.329 --> 00:56:28.050
out that this is new flagship of 3d printing

00:56:28.950 --> 00:56:33.889
And then comes X1 and X1C. Yeah, so they were

00:56:33.889 --> 00:56:36.949
in complete stealth mode, trying to kind of hide

00:56:36.949 --> 00:56:39.449
their development from everyone, actually. Fun

00:56:39.449 --> 00:56:41.309
fact, it's very easy to hide during COVID time.

00:56:42.690 --> 00:56:45.170
Which actually played to their advantage. It's

00:56:45.170 --> 00:56:47.969
encouraged. So they finally broke stealth mode

00:56:47.969 --> 00:56:51.610
in May 2018. 22 is when they launched the x1

00:56:51.610 --> 00:56:54.650
series on kickstarter and kickstarter is actually

00:56:54.650 --> 00:56:57.369
the forum where a lot of 3d printing companies

00:56:57.369 --> 00:57:01.869
launch their product and so this is an unknown

00:57:01.869 --> 00:57:04.130
startup at the time right they were under stealth

00:57:04.130 --> 00:57:07.590
mode nobody knew about them And they were promising

00:57:07.590 --> 00:57:10.389
super fast printing, high success rate. And they

00:57:10.389 --> 00:57:13.030
were using buzzwords on their Kickstarter campaign,

00:57:13.090 --> 00:57:17.469
like AI, neural processing unit, automated calibration,

00:57:17.809 --> 00:57:20.130
just all those words thrown at users who've been

00:57:20.130 --> 00:57:22.130
waiting for someone like this. And when you were

00:57:22.130 --> 00:57:24.190
looking at it, you're like, is it really necessary

00:57:24.190 --> 00:57:27.889
to throw all of these words into one 3D printer?

00:57:28.110 --> 00:57:31.230
Let's see how it goes. But they literally researched

00:57:31.230 --> 00:57:34.449
all the pain points and basically used those

00:57:34.449 --> 00:57:37.300
pain points to... formulate their Kickstarter

00:57:37.300 --> 00:57:41.360
campaign message. And it worked, right? So for

00:57:41.360 --> 00:57:48.440
$1 ,000 to $1 ,500, they're selling this machine

00:57:48.440 --> 00:57:52.030
that they claim to be revolutionary. And Kickstarter

00:57:52.030 --> 00:57:55.090
has seen a dozen of revolutionary 3D printer

00:57:55.090 --> 00:57:57.769
campaigns that crashed and burned before. Oh,

00:57:57.849 --> 00:58:00.789
definitely. Yeah. So ultimately, what they're

00:58:00.789 --> 00:58:05.409
promising sounds so enticing that 5 ,575 backers

00:58:05.409 --> 00:58:09.349
rolled the dice that month and paid. The campaign

00:58:09.349 --> 00:58:14.510
actually ranked over just about $7 billion during

00:58:14.510 --> 00:58:18.239
the span of only one month. And it's only the

00:58:18.239 --> 00:58:21.360
third most successful 3D printing hardware campaigns

00:58:21.360 --> 00:58:25.840
at the time. So ironically, the second one was

00:58:25.840 --> 00:58:29.440
by Anker, another Chinese consumer electric company

00:58:29.440 --> 00:58:32.460
producing chargers, and they want to try their

00:58:32.460 --> 00:58:35.460
hands at 3D printing. That ultimately failed.

00:58:35.539 --> 00:58:38.699
That specific campaign ultimately failed. And

00:58:38.699 --> 00:58:43.019
two months later, in August, backers received

00:58:43.019 --> 00:58:46.780
their shipments. Two months later. So this is

00:58:46.780 --> 00:58:49.420
why you're hypothesizing that this is just a

00:58:49.420 --> 00:58:52.619
marketing campaign, because typically how Kickstarter

00:58:52.619 --> 00:58:56.039
works is that you. publish something and say

00:58:56.039 --> 00:58:58.219
hey we're prototyping we're making it please

00:58:58.219 --> 00:59:01.579
support us and then you update on a regular basis

00:59:01.579 --> 00:59:04.179
saying that oh here's the newest prototype here's

00:59:04.179 --> 00:59:06.739
the updates we're developing it you wait for

00:59:06.739 --> 00:59:09.000
a few months before you do the first shipment

00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:13.159
so what bamboo did is i developed everything

00:59:13.159 --> 00:59:16.019
actually created enough machine for the shipment

00:59:16.019 --> 00:59:19.429
then i published it Then I went out of stealth

00:59:19.429 --> 00:59:22.530
mode. And then immediately when I got the orders

00:59:22.530 --> 00:59:25.670
within that span of a month, I ship those shipments.

00:59:25.889 --> 00:59:30.449
So it's all planned, right? And soon enough,

00:59:30.550 --> 00:59:34.510
as soon as the backers got their machine starting

00:59:34.510 --> 00:59:37.550
from August, An overwhelming amount of gadget

00:59:37.550 --> 00:59:41.329
reviews started populating on various places,

00:59:41.489 --> 00:59:44.710
mainly YouTube. And it just sent a shockwave

00:59:44.710 --> 00:59:46.769
throughout the entire industry. And if you go

00:59:46.769 --> 00:59:49.730
back to watch the early YouTube reviewers talking

00:59:49.730 --> 00:59:53.170
about X1, there's one thing that they echo over

00:59:53.170 --> 00:59:55.630
and over again is probably the main selling point,

00:59:55.789 --> 00:59:59.789
which is this machine was fast. It's not marginally

00:59:59.789 --> 01:00:02.489
fast. It's like two to three times faster. And

01:00:02.489 --> 01:00:05.400
that's a huge pain point for a lot of... yeah

01:00:05.400 --> 01:00:07.940
users back then you kind of you wait for five

01:00:07.940 --> 01:00:10.300
hours for like something tiny to print or like

01:00:10.300 --> 01:00:13.420
a spaghetti yeah or or a spaghetti and then you

01:00:13.420 --> 01:00:15.039
wait for another five hours to print another

01:00:15.039 --> 01:00:17.820
spaghetti monster it must be really frustrating

01:00:17.820 --> 01:00:21.059
to see your 3d printer like spit spaghetti and

01:00:21.059 --> 01:00:23.420
then there's no way for you to stop it effectively

01:00:23.420 --> 01:00:26.079
and it burns your hand if you try to touch the

01:00:26.079 --> 01:00:29.159
nozzle which you have had that experience And

01:00:29.159 --> 01:00:32.619
yeah. And so I think when people bought X1 and

01:00:32.619 --> 01:00:34.800
have it in their houses, maybe their expectations

01:00:34.800 --> 01:00:37.800
were quite low. Oh, if it crashes and burn, I

01:00:37.800 --> 01:00:40.400
won't be surprised. Yeah. But it didn't. It didn't

01:00:40.400 --> 01:00:42.559
for the most part. I mean, OK, just a caveat.

01:00:43.619 --> 01:00:46.440
As a bamboo owner, there's still crash and burn.

01:00:47.380 --> 01:00:50.699
But the rate of crash and burn is much lower

01:00:50.699 --> 01:00:55.099
than the, you know, earlier 2022. other branded

01:00:55.099 --> 01:00:59.579
printers. And the opportunity cost is low because

01:00:59.579 --> 01:01:03.940
it prints fast, it feels fast. So anyways, there's

01:01:03.940 --> 01:01:06.099
two things I think that actually made the difference

01:01:06.099 --> 01:01:09.179
of why they're printing so fast. Remember, you

01:01:09.179 --> 01:01:11.880
talked about one of the guys that left with Dr.

01:01:12.539 --> 01:01:16.400
Tao, whose name is Chen Zihan. He's the gimbal

01:01:16.400 --> 01:01:21.360
guy. So he actually leveraged his knowledge from

01:01:21.360 --> 01:01:25.679
DJ on how to stabilize cameras into the desktop

01:01:25.679 --> 01:01:30.079
3D printing space. And he did that by using sensors

01:01:30.079 --> 01:01:33.159
to measure the mechanical vibration of rapid

01:01:33.159 --> 01:01:38.099
movements of the two head. And then he would

01:01:38.099 --> 01:01:41.130
then use the motor that's actually already. in

01:01:41.130 --> 01:01:44.409
the 3D printer to offset and actively cancel

01:01:44.409 --> 01:01:47.670
out that vibration. Ooh, algorithm. So minimize

01:01:47.670 --> 01:01:52.070
vibration from the printer by using what you

01:01:52.070 --> 01:01:55.010
already have, which is the motor. It optimizes

01:01:55.010 --> 01:01:57.989
the output. Right, and what they've done is they

01:01:57.989 --> 01:02:01.889
eliminated the printer from shaking so much when

01:02:01.889 --> 01:02:04.889
the printhead goes faster, which allowed the

01:02:04.889 --> 01:02:07.809
printhead to go faster, which allowed the print

01:02:07.809 --> 01:02:11.309
time. to be faster. Whoa. Positively reinforcing.

01:02:11.630 --> 01:02:17.170
Good engineer. So taking something from DJI gimbal,

01:02:17.449 --> 01:02:22.170
completely turning it, applying it, somehow use

01:02:22.170 --> 01:02:24.570
existing parts that's on your machine anyways.

01:02:25.329 --> 01:02:28.679
It's just very clever. Yeah. And it's who would

01:02:28.679 --> 01:02:31.719
have thought like the one thing that makes a

01:02:31.719 --> 01:02:34.219
huge difference in 3D printing was coming from

01:02:34.219 --> 01:02:37.739
a gimbal engineer. Right. And there's much more

01:02:37.739 --> 01:02:41.980
that they've used. So the second thing that helped

01:02:41.980 --> 01:02:46.480
the printer move faster is the clever use of

01:02:46.480 --> 01:02:50.440
conveyor belts. So at the time. Pre -bamboo,

01:02:50.500 --> 01:02:54.679
the norm for 3D printer is to use three conveyor

01:02:54.679 --> 01:03:00.119
belts for each of the XYZ accesses. So that resolved

01:03:00.119 --> 01:03:06.500
in a design we often call bed slingers. how it

01:03:06.500 --> 01:03:08.840
works is that the printhead is attached to a

01:03:08.840 --> 01:03:12.019
horizontal bar that can move the printhead left

01:03:12.019 --> 01:03:14.400
and right so that horizontal bar with the conveyor

01:03:14.400 --> 01:03:17.059
belt moves it left and right that bar then is

01:03:17.059 --> 01:03:20.000
attached to a rectangular frame most of the time

01:03:20.000 --> 01:03:23.179
and that rectangular frame then allows the bar

01:03:23.179 --> 01:03:25.699
to move up and down so you got the left right

01:03:25.699 --> 01:03:28.659
movement the x -axis movement the up -down movement

01:03:28.659 --> 01:03:31.400
which is the z or z -axis movement taken care

01:03:31.400 --> 01:03:35.900
of But there's no front and back motion for the

01:03:35.900 --> 01:03:39.099
print head. And that had to be done by the print

01:03:39.099 --> 01:03:43.039
bed, the bottom layer that needs to take care

01:03:43.039 --> 01:03:46.260
of the front and back, which is why printers,

01:03:46.440 --> 01:03:50.000
the print bed needs to sling front and back back

01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:52.559
in those days. And you can imagine when you're

01:03:52.559 --> 01:03:56.380
trying to print and your base, your ground moves

01:03:56.380 --> 01:03:59.880
front and back. you can't print that fast. You

01:03:59.880 --> 01:04:02.440
can't. Yeah, because it shakes. It feels like

01:04:02.440 --> 01:04:07.199
a grandma. Don't break. Yeah. And so that's how

01:04:07.199 --> 01:04:09.960
it got the name bed slinger because the print

01:04:09.960 --> 01:04:13.940
bed slings, right? And bamboo didn't want this

01:04:13.940 --> 01:04:17.099
for the X1 because they want the X1 to be flagship

01:04:17.099 --> 01:04:20.380
and they want it to be wowing everyone. So it

01:04:20.380 --> 01:04:23.159
can't use what everyone else is using in the

01:04:23.159 --> 01:04:26.880
industry. and so what they've adopted is something

01:04:26.880 --> 01:04:31.480
called the core xy mechanism and i want to note

01:04:31.480 --> 01:04:34.519
that they didn't invent this this again like

01:04:34.519 --> 01:04:37.460
everything else is open sourced and they just

01:04:37.460 --> 01:04:40.500
copy the design and they can copy it because

01:04:40.500 --> 01:04:43.000
it's open source and there won't be any infringement

01:04:43.000 --> 01:04:47.539
issues so the motor then in this design is now

01:04:47.539 --> 01:04:50.380
attached to a much more sophisticated conveyor

01:04:50.380 --> 01:04:53.360
belt system so it's just not one way times three

01:04:53.360 --> 01:04:56.760
right so if you if you're interested i'm not

01:04:56.760 --> 01:04:59.139
going to explain the intricacies if you're interested

01:04:59.139 --> 01:05:03.659
this has a much longer conveyor belt system that

01:05:03.659 --> 01:05:05.940
allows the printhead to move left right front

01:05:05.940 --> 01:05:09.000
back and diagonally so it takes care of all the

01:05:09.000 --> 01:05:12.179
x y movements on a flat surface so the the bed

01:05:12.179 --> 01:05:15.400
doesn't need to sling front and back, what the

01:05:15.400 --> 01:05:18.780
bed only needs to do is go up and down. And if

01:05:18.780 --> 01:05:21.579
you think about, just envision how 3D printing

01:05:21.579 --> 01:05:24.500
works, the left, right, front, back actually

01:05:24.500 --> 01:05:28.380
moves a lot more because in each layer, your

01:05:28.380 --> 01:05:30.760
printhead moves, right? The up -down movement,

01:05:30.820 --> 01:05:35.500
it's only one per layer and minimum movement

01:05:35.500 --> 01:05:40.489
of a few millimeters. the Y movement is then

01:05:40.489 --> 01:05:43.489
attributed to the print bed or that significantly

01:05:43.489 --> 01:05:47.869
contributed to lower vibration and lower likelihood

01:05:47.869 --> 01:05:53.090
of a print bed or printing failure. I hope that

01:05:53.090 --> 01:05:55.949
makes sense. If it doesn't, YouTube is there.

01:05:56.250 --> 01:06:00.750
So on top of the speed improver, which is huge,

01:06:00.869 --> 01:06:02.570
right? They also did a couple of other things.

01:06:02.909 --> 01:06:05.469
One is they're practically plug and play. So

01:06:05.469 --> 01:06:09.320
going back to the DJI philosophy of I want this

01:06:09.320 --> 01:06:11.800
machine to come out of a box and just print.

01:06:12.780 --> 01:06:15.480
There's a few setups, but pretty much plug and

01:06:15.480 --> 01:06:17.880
play. There's something called the automatic

01:06:17.880 --> 01:06:21.699
material system, which you no longer have to

01:06:21.699 --> 01:06:24.340
manage changing color halfway manually for a

01:06:24.340 --> 01:06:28.980
print. It just feeds the printer automatically

01:06:28.980 --> 01:06:32.260
and switch between filaments, which actually

01:06:32.260 --> 01:06:34.480
uses a very simple piece of technology called

01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:38.139
the RFID. which is you know our batch to go into

01:06:38.139 --> 01:06:42.079
the office right yeah it just scans the different

01:06:42.079 --> 01:06:45.059
filament and understands which color which texture

01:06:45.059 --> 01:06:47.880
it is and then it would automatically pull that

01:06:47.880 --> 01:06:51.719
filament into the nozzle yeah interesting nothing

01:06:51.719 --> 01:06:54.800
you know super fancy just like core xy you know

01:06:54.800 --> 01:06:57.780
it's already there they decided after so many

01:06:57.780 --> 01:06:59.659
rounds of testing that this is the best system

01:06:59.659 --> 01:07:03.730
the other thing is also DJI adopted slightly.

01:07:04.030 --> 01:07:08.050
It's the LiDAR, the micro LiDAR. So in DJI, it's

01:07:08.050 --> 01:07:10.369
you're scanning surroundings for your drone.

01:07:10.510 --> 01:07:13.389
Here, you're scanning the surface of your first

01:07:13.389 --> 01:07:15.969
printed layer to make sure that it's smooth.

01:07:16.170 --> 01:07:20.610
And if it isn't, you pause the print. Using LiDAR

01:07:20.610 --> 01:07:23.050
was a bit surprising for me because LiDAR in

01:07:23.050 --> 01:07:26.530
modern day technology all around us is typically

01:07:26.530 --> 01:07:29.949
like geospatial analysis, autonomous driving

01:07:29.949 --> 01:07:33.550
and all of that. It is being on such a micro

01:07:33.550 --> 01:07:37.050
level on just a plate of 3D printing. Wouldn't

01:07:37.050 --> 01:07:39.489
have thought that they're actually applying like

01:07:39.489 --> 01:07:43.869
some really high level technology into one piece

01:07:43.869 --> 01:07:45.909
of well -designed machine. It's almost like designing

01:07:45.909 --> 01:07:49.769
3D printing, but like robotics. Yes. Yeah, it

01:07:49.769 --> 01:07:51.409
feels that way. Yeah. And something else they've

01:07:51.409 --> 01:07:53.650
added to the printer that's also a technology

01:07:53.650 --> 01:07:58.139
that existed. So they added a camera. And printers,

01:07:58.239 --> 01:08:00.659
other printers have cameras too, but they added

01:08:00.659 --> 01:08:06.699
a camera and embedded kind of AI into it so that

01:08:06.699 --> 01:08:10.260
you can monitor your print. And if it doesn't

01:08:10.260 --> 01:08:12.920
look like what it should be printing out, also

01:08:12.920 --> 01:08:15.840
alerts the system. So a lot of it is actually

01:08:15.840 --> 01:08:18.819
software builds as well after they managed to

01:08:18.819 --> 01:08:21.500
figure out the hardware. So all in all, it feels

01:08:21.500 --> 01:08:23.680
like if we're talking about it in hindsight,

01:08:23.779 --> 01:08:27.949
it's... Technology isn't that difficult, right?

01:08:28.069 --> 01:08:30.329
And that's why a lot of their competitors actually

01:08:30.329 --> 01:08:35.390
copied what they have. But to use that two years

01:08:35.390 --> 01:08:39.289
of stealth mode and understanding how they fit

01:08:39.289 --> 01:08:41.149
together and putting in a piece of machinery,

01:08:41.510 --> 01:08:44.569
they've managed to do what the entire industry

01:08:44.569 --> 01:08:47.729
of hundreds of companies wasn't able to figure

01:08:47.729 --> 01:08:51.250
out for the past seven, eight years. And that's

01:08:51.250 --> 01:08:53.909
what made the difference. Yeah. Stitching everything

01:08:53.909 --> 01:08:58.289
effectively and delivering and, you know, 90

01:08:58.289 --> 01:09:02.210
% ish ready product to, to the market. And it's

01:09:02.210 --> 01:09:04.109
very well designed. People didn't see that. Yeah.

01:09:04.329 --> 01:09:08.119
Yeah. And. I want to kind of read a blog post

01:09:08.119 --> 01:09:11.960
that Bamboo posted earlier this year when they

01:09:11.960 --> 01:09:15.319
sunsetted X1, but for a better version of the

01:09:15.319 --> 01:09:19.899
products. So they said in 2022, the desktop 3D

01:09:19.899 --> 01:09:21.960
printing was for the patient and the forgiving.

01:09:22.720 --> 01:09:25.020
Calibration before every print was a ritual,

01:09:25.199 --> 01:09:28.560
not a routine. Very poetic. Hours spent tweaking

01:09:28.560 --> 01:09:31.300
parameters. The first layer was an act of faith,

01:09:31.420 --> 01:09:35.239
not creation. This is really funny. The market

01:09:35.239 --> 01:09:38.159
was dominated by bed slingers. CoreXY existed,

01:09:38.420 --> 01:09:41.739
but as an alternative. Multicolor printing was

01:09:41.739 --> 01:09:43.819
technically possible, but can stretch into a

01:09:43.819 --> 01:09:47.020
week -long project. Enclosed chambers were available,

01:09:47.140 --> 01:09:49.560
but only in machines costing thousands of dollars

01:09:49.560 --> 01:09:52.550
aimed at professionals. BambooLab hacked all

01:09:52.550 --> 01:09:54.770
of this into a single device and priced it in

01:09:54.770 --> 01:09:56.909
a way that forced the entire high -end segment

01:09:56.909 --> 01:10:00.890
to rethink its strategy. Since X1, CoreXY has

01:10:00.890 --> 01:10:03.789
become the industry standard, enclosed chambers

01:10:03.789 --> 01:10:06.710
have gone from luxury to expectation, and bamboo

01:10:06.710 --> 01:10:09.029
extruder design has been copied by competitors

01:10:09.029 --> 01:10:13.670
after competitors. I really like this last sentence,

01:10:13.789 --> 01:10:17.649
which is imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

01:10:17.649 --> 01:10:20.670
And this 3D printing industry has never flattered

01:10:20.670 --> 01:10:25.550
anyone so unanimously. They are obviously publishing

01:10:25.550 --> 01:10:27.550
their own blog posts. So a lot of, you know,

01:10:27.609 --> 01:10:30.189
lights is put on the X1. In reality, this is

01:10:30.189 --> 01:10:35.430
what happened. X1 made a game changer device

01:10:35.430 --> 01:10:41.930
within an industry that have already been accustomed

01:10:41.930 --> 01:10:48.430
to slow and unreliable printers. And for that,

01:10:48.470 --> 01:10:51.649
they get rewarded in terms of market share and

01:10:51.649 --> 01:10:55.770
revenue. And customer lifetime value and a lot

01:10:55.770 --> 01:10:59.329
of faith. Exactly. So with that momentum, they

01:10:59.329 --> 01:11:01.729
didn't stop. They immediately start to build

01:11:01.729 --> 01:11:04.270
and release more product to capture even more

01:11:04.270 --> 01:11:07.869
of the market. So in November 2022, there is...

01:11:08.079 --> 01:11:10.739
right after they shipped the X1 actually, they

01:11:10.739 --> 01:11:14.760
announced the P1P. So the P series, which is

01:11:14.760 --> 01:11:17.800
open frame high speed printer at a lower price

01:11:17.800 --> 01:11:21.819
point. And so the P series stripped out some

01:11:21.819 --> 01:11:24.279
things like side panels and color touchscreen,

01:11:24.439 --> 01:11:28.300
but it kept the main thing, which is speed. And

01:11:28.300 --> 01:11:31.180
quickly after that came around the entry level

01:11:31.180 --> 01:11:34.600
A series, which is A1 and A1 mini in September,

01:11:34.920 --> 01:11:39.310
2023. So about a year after. was released, the

01:11:39.310 --> 01:11:43.090
A1 Mini, which is their starter machine, launched

01:11:43.090 --> 01:11:49.670
at $299, which is kind of a genuinely impulse

01:11:49.670 --> 01:11:53.489
buy territory for someone who wants to try out

01:11:53.489 --> 01:11:57.970
a 3D printer, but isn't really into tinkering,

01:11:58.109 --> 01:12:00.770
right? It's cheap enough so that you can be like,

01:12:00.829 --> 01:12:02.789
oh, maybe I'll try it out and see what's up.

01:12:03.029 --> 01:12:08.500
And that's what I did. So A1 actually, A1 and

01:12:08.500 --> 01:12:12.479
A1 Mini is what's been credit for a huge jump

01:12:12.479 --> 01:12:17.140
in their company revenue because the X1 targets

01:12:17.140 --> 01:12:20.279
OGs, people who have been in this industry and

01:12:20.279 --> 01:12:22.260
users and they were trying to wow them and getting

01:12:22.260 --> 01:12:26.739
them to post on YouTube. P is somewhat also targeting

01:12:26.739 --> 01:12:30.060
people who have used 3D printing before. The

01:12:30.060 --> 01:12:34.420
A series is... Going after a completely new set

01:12:34.420 --> 01:12:37.020
of customers and therefore expanding the market

01:12:37.020 --> 01:12:39.859
to people like me who would otherwise not purchase

01:12:39.859 --> 01:12:44.159
a 3D printer. They recently updated the H series,

01:12:44.260 --> 01:12:46.680
which is the super luxurious and professional

01:12:46.680 --> 01:12:50.220
ones for, I guess, the users if they want to

01:12:50.220 --> 01:12:52.779
upgrade or for those who are into professional

01:12:52.779 --> 01:12:55.720
use who can just naturally. you know, upgrade

01:12:55.720 --> 01:12:58.779
into the H series. Yeah. So before the H series,

01:12:58.880 --> 01:13:01.539
they actually paused for a year in product releases.

01:13:01.760 --> 01:13:04.539
So you'll notice that in 2024, they didn't release

01:13:04.539 --> 01:13:08.060
any new product. It was quite quiet when it comes

01:13:08.060 --> 01:13:11.039
to new launches. And H was actually published.

01:13:11.800 --> 01:13:14.579
Last year. 2025, yes. Yeah, adding kind of laser

01:13:14.579 --> 01:13:18.340
cutting and drag knife cutting kind of capabilities.

01:13:18.720 --> 01:13:23.500
So what happened in 2024 is rather than pushing

01:13:23.500 --> 01:13:27.000
out more new products, they took a pause and

01:13:27.000 --> 01:13:30.199
they opened R &D centers in both Shenzhen and

01:13:30.199 --> 01:13:33.340
Shanghai. They also opened international branches

01:13:33.340 --> 01:13:36.760
like US, Europe, and Japan. And this is that

01:13:36.760 --> 01:13:39.880
year that bamboo just... kind of stopped being

01:13:39.880 --> 01:13:42.760
a hot Chinese startup and just became a generally

01:13:42.760 --> 01:13:47.600
global company. And it's also that year that

01:13:47.600 --> 01:13:50.560
they surpassed Creality to become the number

01:13:50.560 --> 01:13:54.600
one 3D printer brand in terms of both market

01:13:54.600 --> 01:13:57.920
share by revenue and market share by unit shipped.

01:13:58.239 --> 01:14:01.159
Wow, interesting. In the year that you don't...

01:14:01.550 --> 01:14:04.170
publish any new product don't ship anything new

01:14:04.170 --> 01:14:06.890
you become number one you make the sales you

01:14:06.890 --> 01:14:10.090
deliver the sales and i think i suspect there's

01:14:10.090 --> 01:14:13.449
a little bit of a manufacturing jam in terms

01:14:13.449 --> 01:14:18.170
of productivity or production capacity i'm not

01:14:18.170 --> 01:14:20.649
sure if they completely anticipated the level

01:14:20.649 --> 01:14:23.369
of demand that they will get with the a1 release

01:14:23.369 --> 01:14:26.270
right I guess the only parallel that I can think

01:14:26.270 --> 01:14:30.550
of, well, two of them, with the publishing of,

01:14:30.569 --> 01:14:33.670
with the shipping of X and P and A and then to

01:14:33.670 --> 01:14:38.189
H would be, well, there is Tesla. Tesla did ship

01:14:38.189 --> 01:14:40.710
out the Roadster first, which is the flagship

01:14:40.710 --> 01:14:44.909
of its kind. And then it tried to strip out of

01:14:44.909 --> 01:14:47.750
a few more expensive things and created a, you

01:14:47.750 --> 01:14:52.149
know, mass. friendly version, which is the Model

01:14:52.149 --> 01:14:55.630
S. And later on, they created the version with

01:14:55.630 --> 01:14:57.649
the cheaper battery options, which I guess could

01:14:57.649 --> 01:15:02.369
be the parallel of Series A. And I guess that's

01:15:02.369 --> 01:15:05.109
also in iPhone. You have the regular iPhone.

01:15:05.350 --> 01:15:07.489
Oh, and then you have the iPhone Pro, and then

01:15:07.489 --> 01:15:09.289
you have the Pro Max, and you have all of that.

01:15:09.390 --> 01:15:12.689
So it's kind of very similar hardware product

01:15:12.689 --> 01:15:14.630
design logic that they follow into, and it's

01:15:14.630 --> 01:15:19.140
very clear. Yeah. So by the year 2025, they are

01:15:19.140 --> 01:15:20.979
the market leader. They're number one. Yeah.

01:15:21.039 --> 01:15:23.220
And one thing I want to go back and notice that

01:15:23.220 --> 01:15:25.279
something else they did also, I think it's an

01:15:25.279 --> 01:15:28.920
amazing play is 2023. They launched something

01:15:28.920 --> 01:15:32.939
called Maker World, which is a community that.

01:15:33.340 --> 01:15:36.460
people can publish their models and can download,

01:15:36.720 --> 01:15:40.300
right? And by now, they claim that MakerWorld

01:15:40.300 --> 01:15:43.819
has claimed has crossed 10 million monthly active

01:15:43.819 --> 01:15:46.560
users. That's a lot. Yeah. And not only that,

01:15:46.640 --> 01:15:50.399
there's an 83 % one -year retention rate. So

01:15:50.399 --> 01:15:53.880
for context, that's very unusual. That's very

01:15:53.880 --> 01:15:57.329
sticky. For this kind of platform, for most content

01:15:57.329 --> 01:16:00.449
communities, you don't expect people to come

01:16:00.449 --> 01:16:03.909
back continuously during the first and even the

01:16:03.909 --> 01:16:06.609
second year of using it. You expect losing at

01:16:06.609 --> 01:16:10.829
least half of your community after a year. So

01:16:10.829 --> 01:16:14.170
83 % is nothing short of amazing. They do offer

01:16:14.170 --> 01:16:17.010
a lot of incentives that they pay out of their

01:16:17.010 --> 01:16:20.409
revenue for people to stay on it. But the amount

01:16:20.409 --> 01:16:23.670
of models, which is about 2 .6 million as of

01:16:23.670 --> 01:16:26.180
end of last year, year that's been posted on

01:16:26.180 --> 01:16:28.380
there for other people like me to download for

01:16:28.380 --> 01:16:32.619
free and sometimes we can also click on something

01:16:32.619 --> 01:16:35.260
called boost and bamboo will pay the creator

01:16:35.260 --> 01:16:39.960
yeah and so that number really jumps out and

01:16:39.960 --> 01:16:42.340
that's one of the reasons and i think that's

01:16:42.340 --> 01:16:45.260
actually a genuine competitive mode that they've

01:16:45.260 --> 01:16:49.399
created because 3D printers can be challenged

01:16:49.399 --> 01:16:51.659
and we will see how they are getting challenged

01:16:51.659 --> 01:16:55.159
right now. But having the community of 10 million

01:16:55.159 --> 01:17:00.100
people, it's hard to rebuild. Right. You're basically

01:17:00.100 --> 01:17:03.199
attracting all the capable creators to be on

01:17:03.199 --> 01:17:06.439
your platform first and then they will continuously

01:17:06.439 --> 01:17:09.340
produce and you'll reward them and they will

01:17:09.340 --> 01:17:11.840
attract more people who want to use and download

01:17:11.840 --> 01:17:14.479
the models and recreate or just print out of.

01:17:15.199 --> 01:17:20.520
their own laptop. And for that, I think the community

01:17:20.520 --> 01:17:24.659
itself, it really regenerates. Yeah, it reinforces

01:17:24.659 --> 01:17:27.500
the hardware and the hardware reinforces your

01:17:27.500 --> 01:17:30.779
community. Yeah. But it is worth remembering

01:17:30.779 --> 01:17:34.539
there's over 100 companies in China trying to

01:17:34.539 --> 01:17:37.899
get that piece of the pie. So the competition

01:17:37.899 --> 01:17:42.199
within China is super fierce. Yes. Even though

01:17:42.199 --> 01:17:47.430
bamboo is now the As you can imagine, a lot of

01:17:47.430 --> 01:17:49.750
people would have their eyes on the pie. And

01:17:49.750 --> 01:17:53.850
remember, bamboo did grow this user base. So

01:17:53.850 --> 01:17:58.770
with a growing market and the fact that some

01:17:58.770 --> 01:18:00.989
of the technology we talked about is actually

01:18:00.989 --> 01:18:06.609
easily replicable. It's only the same village

01:18:06.609 --> 01:18:10.649
or the same factories. Imagine someone saying

01:18:10.649 --> 01:18:14.890
that, hey, I want a piece of this pie. And one

01:18:14.890 --> 01:18:17.729
company I wanted, there's a lot of company targeting

01:18:17.729 --> 01:18:19.630
this area, but there's one company that actually

01:18:19.630 --> 01:18:21.970
made a bit of a dent last year that I do want

01:18:21.970 --> 01:18:24.930
to comment on. They're called Snapmaker. They're

01:18:24.930 --> 01:18:28.329
founded in Shenzhen in 2016. So during that era,

01:18:28.489 --> 01:18:32.149
which is about four years before Bamboo was even

01:18:32.149 --> 01:18:35.069
founded. An older incumbent. Previous incumbent.

01:18:35.569 --> 01:18:38.569
And they actually did gain a pretty good reputation

01:18:38.569 --> 01:18:41.369
on Kickstarter. So they're pretty decent. 3D

01:18:41.369 --> 01:18:44.970
printing company. 2017, they launched a campaign

01:18:44.970 --> 01:18:48.329
on Kickstarter and another one on 2019. These

01:18:48.329 --> 01:18:51.449
two campaigns together raised $10 million, which

01:18:51.449 --> 01:18:53.630
is actually higher than the $7 million that Bamboo

01:18:53.630 --> 01:18:57.649
raised for X1. If I had met Linda way back and

01:18:57.649 --> 01:19:00.390
started Ascend in 2019, we would be making an

01:19:00.390 --> 01:19:03.250
episode on StatMaker, not Bamboo. That's true.

01:19:03.510 --> 01:19:07.470
Because they did $7 million on the second, right?

01:19:09.470 --> 01:19:15.229
They had a hiatus after the 2019 release. They

01:19:15.229 --> 01:19:19.550
came back to Kickstarter in 2025 of August, so

01:19:19.550 --> 01:19:22.069
August of last year, with something called the

01:19:22.069 --> 01:19:26.970
U1. And this campaign raised over $20 million.

01:19:27.649 --> 01:19:31.329
So $20 million is three times of what Bamboo

01:19:31.329 --> 01:19:36.010
X1 pulled in. And so the threat to Bamboo that

01:19:36.010 --> 01:19:42.579
U1 created, actually, is that UN managed to solve

01:19:42.579 --> 01:19:46.140
a longstanding pain point of bamboo users. So

01:19:46.140 --> 01:19:48.819
they kind of looked at the bamboo user forum

01:19:48.819 --> 01:19:51.939
and said, what could we solve and improve upon?

01:19:52.399 --> 01:19:55.760
And one of the thing is multicolor printing.

01:19:56.039 --> 01:19:59.779
So I talked about how bamboo solved the automatic

01:19:59.779 --> 01:20:02.449
feeding, right? But at the same time, there's

01:20:02.449 --> 01:20:05.689
a lot of material and filament wastage with bamboo's

01:20:05.689 --> 01:20:08.350
version of multicolored printing because in bamboo's

01:20:08.350 --> 01:20:10.770
machine, there's one nozzle. So when you change

01:20:10.770 --> 01:20:13.149
a color, you have to extrude everything from

01:20:13.149 --> 01:20:16.810
the first color, cut it, and then fill in the

01:20:16.810 --> 01:20:19.829
second color. But then you can't just print immediately

01:20:19.829 --> 01:20:22.689
because there's color mixing with a bit of melted

01:20:22.689 --> 01:20:25.210
plastic. So you waste some. So depending on what

01:20:25.210 --> 01:20:27.529
you're printing, sometimes you can waste more

01:20:27.529 --> 01:20:32.310
in terms of grams. on a print than you actually

01:20:32.310 --> 01:20:35.789
produce. So a lot of people are complaining about

01:20:35.789 --> 01:20:39.329
this. My personal experience is that I gave up

01:20:39.329 --> 01:20:41.869
on using bamboo for color printing because of

01:20:41.869 --> 01:20:43.810
the wastage. So I just do single color prints

01:20:43.810 --> 01:20:47.550
right now. Snapmaker, being super smart, tackled

01:20:47.550 --> 01:20:52.829
this problem with four extruders. So each one

01:20:52.829 --> 01:20:55.010
of your filaments. It's very intuitive. Right?

01:20:55.449 --> 01:20:58.289
Again, a very simple way of solving this, but

01:20:58.289 --> 01:21:00.890
the trade -off is your machine needs to fit for

01:21:00.890 --> 01:21:04.770
extruders on the side. But because it solved

01:21:04.770 --> 01:21:07.590
this big pain point that Bamboo has created for

01:21:07.590 --> 01:21:11.670
its users, a lot of people thought that this

01:21:11.670 --> 01:21:14.369
is, you know, something I'm willing to contribute

01:21:14.369 --> 01:21:19.390
to, and therefore the $20 million raised. And

01:21:19.390 --> 01:21:23.039
that... actually send a round of panic within

01:21:23.039 --> 01:21:27.119
bamboo and we believe it send a round of panic

01:21:27.119 --> 01:21:30.939
because just one week later after the kickstarter

01:21:30.939 --> 01:21:35.479
initiated on august 26 bamboo published a blog

01:21:35.479 --> 01:21:38.659
post saying that hey you guys wait it's coming

01:21:38.659 --> 01:21:41.579
like we're doing this it's coming please wait

01:21:41.579 --> 01:21:45.659
it's coming in november um and so they basically

01:21:45.659 --> 01:21:48.439
said hey we're releasing our next product it's

01:21:48.439 --> 01:21:52.189
called the htc it has the similar different but

01:21:52.189 --> 01:21:55.270
similar technology reducing waste so if you're

01:21:55.270 --> 01:21:59.470
willing to stick around maybe just don't purchase

01:21:59.470 --> 01:22:02.909
that and wait for our product. But it was a defensive

01:22:02.909 --> 01:22:05.909
move because they just released something a while

01:22:05.909 --> 01:22:10.970
ago. And so the smart way, if StatMaker haven't

01:22:10.970 --> 01:22:14.189
released the U1, they would wait for a few months

01:22:14.189 --> 01:22:16.189
before the announcement because that kind of

01:22:16.189 --> 01:22:19.329
cannibalizes your current product. So they were

01:22:19.329 --> 01:22:21.850
kind of caught off guard and they published that

01:22:21.850 --> 01:22:26.470
and managed to help a little bit. But at the

01:22:26.470 --> 01:22:34.569
same time, U1 is $800, $900. The H2C, which is

01:22:34.569 --> 01:22:36.569
a product Bamboo wants to release in the future,

01:22:36.670 --> 01:22:40.770
is $2 ,000. The difference is not because of

01:22:40.770 --> 01:22:43.630
the wastage part. It's because H2C is actually

01:22:43.630 --> 01:22:48.329
the higher -end product. So it does other things

01:22:48.329 --> 01:22:51.229
like laser cutting. The additional functions.

01:22:51.229 --> 01:22:53.850
It's not a stripped -down version. Right. But

01:22:53.850 --> 01:22:57.390
because Snapmaker took a... took this advantage.

01:22:57.710 --> 01:23:01.229
They got free publicity through comparisons on

01:23:01.229 --> 01:23:06.710
YouTube of creators comparing the U1 and the

01:23:06.710 --> 01:23:10.890
H2C when they eventually released it. And all

01:23:10.890 --> 01:23:12.789
of the companies that we've mentioned thus far

01:23:12.789 --> 01:23:18.189
are 3D printing companies who are in FDM. I think

01:23:18.189 --> 01:23:22.510
right now there are companies who will just,

01:23:22.550 --> 01:23:26.560
you know, stand up and say, you know what? FDM

01:23:26.560 --> 01:23:28.319
seems to be pretty saturated. You guys doing

01:23:28.319 --> 01:23:29.739
what you're doing, we're going to do something

01:23:29.739 --> 01:23:31.699
else. So there are new companies doing other

01:23:31.699 --> 01:23:36.180
printing. So within FDM, all of the incumbents

01:23:36.180 --> 01:23:39.819
are likely within the names that we talked about,

01:23:40.039 --> 01:23:43.000
right? Yeah. And funny you've mentioned that.

01:23:44.340 --> 01:23:47.920
We did not plan this transition at all. But you

01:23:47.920 --> 01:23:50.699
talked about resin printing, right? And how it

01:23:50.699 --> 01:23:55.510
wasn't so popular because slightly... Toxic.

01:23:55.550 --> 01:23:59.869
Toxic. And UV light. UV light. And there wasn't

01:23:59.869 --> 01:24:04.470
a resin printing equivalent in RepRap to make

01:24:04.470 --> 01:24:08.090
this type of printers more popular back in the

01:24:08.090 --> 01:24:10.909
days. Because it wasn't a slicer style. Yeah.

01:24:10.989 --> 01:24:14.170
Right. Yeah. It was a little bit more, I guess,

01:24:14.189 --> 01:24:16.250
industrial if you look at how the machine is

01:24:16.250 --> 01:24:21.289
made. But the technology is friendly for desktop

01:24:21.289 --> 01:24:26.279
3D printing. And the quality of resin printing

01:24:26.279 --> 01:24:28.619
is very high. True. But one of the downsides

01:24:28.619 --> 01:24:31.539
is that no one managed to really crack color

01:24:31.539 --> 01:24:34.060
printing. Color resin printing, ooh, that would

01:24:34.060 --> 01:24:36.439
be hard. Exactly. If it's liquid or dumped in

01:24:36.439 --> 01:24:38.819
one place, then it's liquid in one color. Exactly.

01:24:38.979 --> 01:24:41.140
And that's what Formlabs did, which is an MIT

01:24:41.140 --> 01:24:44.920
spinoff company that was created out of MIT Media

01:24:44.920 --> 01:24:47.619
Lab. But you were going to say someone cracked

01:24:47.619 --> 01:24:51.359
that problem. Yes. Oh. And someone is called

01:24:51.359 --> 01:24:53.960
Formlabs. And I'm going to, before I mention

01:24:53.960 --> 01:24:57.000
this someone. The technology itself is called

01:24:57.000 --> 01:25:00.359
inkjet printing or material jetting. Does that

01:25:00.359 --> 01:25:03.000
sound familiar? That sounds like HP. Right? And

01:25:03.000 --> 01:25:08.159
HP exactly has this printer. So the idea of inkjet

01:25:08.159 --> 01:25:09.920
printing, you probably already envisioned this,

01:25:10.039 --> 01:25:12.100
which is, you know how we have 2D color printers?

01:25:12.260 --> 01:25:14.840
Yeah. So instead of printing in ink, you just

01:25:14.840 --> 01:25:17.760
jet out thin layers of resin. Oh, you color the

01:25:17.760 --> 01:25:20.899
surface? You color the surface. So it's like

01:25:20.899 --> 01:25:23.739
thicker than your 2D prints. Okay. And then you

01:25:23.739 --> 01:25:26.140
immediately put UV light on it to harden it.

01:25:26.279 --> 01:25:29.640
Doing like a coating layer on a plastic thing.

01:25:30.180 --> 01:25:31.939
Well, it doesn't have to be a lot of plastic.

01:25:32.039 --> 01:25:34.319
So it can just be a bed. Gotcha. And then you

01:25:34.319 --> 01:25:37.380
print a layer of color. The color is just like

01:25:37.380 --> 01:25:41.340
maybe a tiny thickness. Immediately harden it.

01:25:41.579 --> 01:25:43.640
And then print another layer, print another layer.

01:25:43.760 --> 01:25:47.560
So the same idea as FDM in a way, but you do

01:25:47.560 --> 01:25:51.760
the inkjet. Wow. And this thing was actually

01:25:51.760 --> 01:25:54.920
patented. Obviously, because it's revolutionary.

01:25:55.500 --> 01:25:58.659
This thing was patented by a company called Object.

01:25:58.960 --> 01:26:02.399
And Object was later acquired by none other than

01:26:02.399 --> 01:26:07.399
Stratasys. Of course. Yes. And Stratasys being

01:26:07.399 --> 01:26:11.600
the industrial powerhouse in 3D printing, they

01:26:11.600 --> 01:26:14.600
actually created and trademarked this technology

01:26:14.600 --> 01:26:19.399
under the term PolyJet. And PolyJet is a printer

01:26:19.399 --> 01:26:23.680
the size of my bathtub. Wow. Yeah, and it costs

01:26:23.680 --> 01:26:28.119
tens and thousands of dollars. And so naturally,

01:26:28.220 --> 01:26:30.840
there's no machine really released on the consumer

01:26:30.840 --> 01:26:35.500
front. But this patent expired a few years ago,

01:26:35.600 --> 01:26:39.439
right around when Bamboo Lab started. And if

01:26:39.439 --> 01:26:44.039
someone can make this a consumer -friendly product...

01:26:45.079 --> 01:26:47.800
they could probably revolutionize 3D printing

01:26:47.800 --> 01:26:51.239
just as how bamboo did it for FDM, right? Absolutely.

01:26:51.479 --> 01:26:53.399
Because this thing, you can imagine, is a game

01:26:53.399 --> 01:26:56.600
changer. It has color. Yeah. And guess what?

01:26:57.119 --> 01:26:59.779
It's not only color in terms of like bamboo for

01:26:59.779 --> 01:27:02.560
filaments at a time. It's every color on the

01:27:02.560 --> 01:27:05.960
spectrum kind of color. And just last month,

01:27:06.079 --> 01:27:07.859
and it's great that we're recording this today,

01:27:07.920 --> 01:27:11.859
just last month, a startup called Haygears launched

01:27:11.859 --> 01:27:16.779
the desktop version. Yes, on Kickstarter. Kickstarter

01:27:16.779 --> 01:27:19.000
is where everyone launches their printer nowadays.

01:27:19.720 --> 01:27:22.380
And I checked this morning because the Kickstarter

01:27:22.380 --> 01:27:25.079
is still ongoing. And I'm actually sincerely

01:27:25.079 --> 01:27:27.399
thinking about getting one of these. Well, yeah,

01:27:27.479 --> 01:27:30.680
if you notice that Linda is really like if she's

01:27:30.680 --> 01:27:32.560
checking something more than two times, that

01:27:32.560 --> 01:27:34.840
means she wants to buy it. I know, I know. But

01:27:34.840 --> 01:27:38.140
please stop me. It costs like $3 ,000. There's

01:27:38.140 --> 01:27:40.939
still 29 more days to go in the campaign. Now

01:27:40.939 --> 01:27:43.939
they have about 3 ,000 backers already. And because

01:27:43.939 --> 01:27:46.460
the average price is much higher. It's $12 .5

01:27:46.460 --> 01:27:49.800
million generated. Wow. So legit competition,

01:27:50.199 --> 01:27:52.659
right? But we don't know. There's a handful of

01:27:52.659 --> 01:27:54.600
videos on YouTube of people who have already

01:27:54.600 --> 01:27:59.119
received the pre -release version. But there's

01:27:59.119 --> 01:28:03.460
not that much kind of reviews about how this

01:28:03.460 --> 01:28:06.600
printer is. But I'm feeling positive based on

01:28:06.600 --> 01:28:08.500
the reviews, but also knowing that the reviews

01:28:08.500 --> 01:28:14.310
are likely paid for by hackers. You know, Bamboo

01:28:14.310 --> 01:28:16.949
is a conclusion. Not only have to watch their

01:28:16.949 --> 01:28:20.670
back from Creality, Anycubic, and Elegoo. This

01:28:20.670 --> 01:28:24.149
is the time we mentioned that Elegoo is now backed

01:28:24.149 --> 01:28:29.920
by DJI. It's interesting how your former employer,

01:28:30.000 --> 01:28:32.100
which you walked out, now backs your competitor.

01:28:32.520 --> 01:28:35.060
Well, there was only one thing that I wanted

01:28:35.060 --> 01:28:38.739
to add about Eli Gu and why DJ has to back it.

01:28:38.760 --> 01:28:43.840
In 2025, and it was November, so Tao Ye posted

01:28:43.840 --> 01:28:49.420
a very long sort of... piece on his WeChat moments,

01:28:49.500 --> 01:28:51.399
which is kind of like the Twitter. And then we

01:28:51.399 --> 01:28:53.859
all check and talking about his former employer

01:28:53.859 --> 01:28:57.399
and criticizing Wang Tao Frank, which is the

01:28:57.399 --> 01:29:01.680
founder of DJI. And he was basically explaining

01:29:01.680 --> 01:29:06.119
why Eli Guru was competing unfairly because like

01:29:06.119 --> 01:29:08.420
in the contract, it has a lot of clauses that

01:29:08.420 --> 01:29:12.880
was kind of targeting Bamboo Lab. And he was

01:29:12.880 --> 01:29:15.279
saying that this is the right way of competing.

01:29:15.479 --> 01:29:19.880
And he was quoting something that Frank Wong

01:29:19.880 --> 01:29:26.800
said before Dr. Tao has left DJI. And Frank famously

01:29:26.800 --> 01:29:29.479
said that, oh, you can't let your competitor

01:29:29.479 --> 01:29:33.220
get the money and compete in the product and

01:29:33.220 --> 01:29:34.840
the talent with you. That will be the biggest

01:29:34.840 --> 01:29:38.220
trouble. That was when Dr. Tao was still in DJI.

01:29:38.319 --> 01:29:42.439
And because... DJ didn't want to start 3D printing,

01:29:42.579 --> 01:29:45.720
so that's why he had to leave. And Dr. Tao became

01:29:45.720 --> 01:29:47.960
the biggest competitor. And now he's looking

01:29:47.960 --> 01:29:51.920
back and saying, well... If you had me working

01:29:51.920 --> 01:29:54.539
on this project within DJI, maybe, you know,

01:29:54.560 --> 01:29:56.439
like this would have come. You could have had

01:29:56.439 --> 01:29:58.319
this, but now you're doing this in the wrong

01:29:58.319 --> 01:30:00.800
way. Anyways, so it kind of goes way back. So

01:30:00.800 --> 01:30:03.039
these two people probably, you know, have some

01:30:03.039 --> 01:30:05.979
beef. A bit of bad blood between the two. A bit

01:30:05.979 --> 01:30:08.399
of bad blood, but which kind of makes sense why,

01:30:08.539 --> 01:30:11.100
you know, DJI has to go back and fund Eligu.

01:30:12.520 --> 01:30:14.840
Yeah, and with DJI Engineering, we shall see

01:30:14.840 --> 01:30:17.060
how this competition will turn out. It is still

01:30:17.060 --> 01:30:19.859
very fierce, but so far all in the FDM segment.

01:30:20.119 --> 01:30:23.180
Right, but also I guess what I was trying to

01:30:23.180 --> 01:30:26.560
say earlier is that not only do they have to

01:30:26.560 --> 01:30:29.840
defend themselves in FDM, there's kind of raisin

01:30:29.840 --> 01:30:33.699
technologies popping up everywhere. So Haygears

01:30:33.699 --> 01:30:37.220
is one. Actually, a lot of their Chinese competitors,

01:30:37.520 --> 01:30:40.420
their Shenzhen competitors are dual channel.

01:30:40.479 --> 01:30:44.739
So they also develop both FDM and resin printing,

01:30:44.960 --> 01:30:48.460
3D printers. And Bamboo, because they're so,

01:30:48.579 --> 01:30:51.859
maybe they've added R &D effort, but they're

01:30:51.859 --> 01:30:56.479
very much concentrated on FDM right now. It's

01:30:56.479 --> 01:31:01.020
kind of difficult for us to really conclude that

01:31:01.020 --> 01:31:04.609
they've won the market. Because they're just

01:31:04.609 --> 01:31:07.350
a market leader during the time when technology

01:31:07.350 --> 01:31:10.130
is moving from targeting a small group of people,

01:31:10.229 --> 01:31:15.529
niche, to a wider population. And generally it's

01:31:15.529 --> 01:31:18.369
kind of uncomfortable because a lot of research

01:31:18.369 --> 01:31:23.430
are going on on the side. So if you look up something

01:31:23.430 --> 01:31:26.640
called volumetric printing. that's also in the

01:31:26.640 --> 01:31:29.920
resin space, still academic paper stage, but

01:31:29.920 --> 01:31:32.619
could also fundamentally change how this works

01:31:32.619 --> 01:31:36.600
because it basically shines the UV light and

01:31:36.600 --> 01:31:38.600
make... everything all at once instead of layer

01:31:38.600 --> 01:31:40.800
by layer. So imagine the speed improvement there.

01:31:41.079 --> 01:31:45.199
It's basically magic. Pretty much. Shines a UV

01:31:45.199 --> 01:31:48.560
light upon everything and it's fine. And then

01:31:48.560 --> 01:31:51.359
it's there. Yeah. We're one step close to magic.

01:31:51.819 --> 01:31:53.779
That's what we know. Yeah. And this is, you know,

01:31:53.819 --> 01:31:57.140
it's always research, patent, commercialization.

01:31:57.460 --> 01:32:00.539
Yeah. Well, now I know we also know that the

01:32:00.539 --> 01:32:02.899
speed of prototyping is increasingly faster.

01:32:03.260 --> 01:32:09.039
Thanks to 3D printers. Yeah, so with all of these,

01:32:09.140 --> 01:32:12.079
right, actually before Bamboo started asking

01:32:12.079 --> 01:32:15.659
for money, so their initial investor, IDG, actually

01:32:15.659 --> 01:32:18.119
wanted to invest more, but Bamboo's like, no,

01:32:18.199 --> 01:32:21.779
we got cash, we're good. So they stopped getting

01:32:21.779 --> 01:32:25.199
new rounds of investment after 2023. But with

01:32:25.199 --> 01:32:28.239
this new kind of competition going on and trying

01:32:28.239 --> 01:32:31.039
to fend off their incumbent position, there's

01:32:31.039 --> 01:32:35.220
rumors, rumors only. that they are partnering

01:32:35.220 --> 01:32:37.220
with Tencent and there might be some investment

01:32:37.220 --> 01:32:42.340
coming from Tencent. So kind of going back to

01:32:42.340 --> 01:32:45.720
what this means, right, in terms of let's give

01:32:45.720 --> 01:32:49.619
our audience a flow of the revenue since they've

01:32:49.619 --> 01:32:53.739
started. 2022, their first shipment, 5 ,000 on

01:32:53.739 --> 01:32:57.199
Kickstarter, probably another 5 ,000 -ish after

01:32:57.199 --> 01:33:03.840
Kickstarter. So 10 ,000 units, $15 million. 2023,

01:33:04.539 --> 01:33:07.920
the P series and A series shipped, that went

01:33:07.920 --> 01:33:14.760
up to $300 million. So multiplies. 2024, didn't

01:33:14.760 --> 01:33:19.079
ship anything, but tripled their revenue. I mean,

01:33:19.100 --> 01:33:21.279
didn't release anything, but tripled their revenue

01:33:21.279 --> 01:33:26.100
to $800 million. Last year, 2025, shipped the

01:33:26.100 --> 01:33:31.439
H series and roughly doubled in revenue about

01:33:31.439 --> 01:33:37.880
1 .5%. billion dollars equating to 35 to 43 percent

01:33:37.880 --> 01:33:40.220
of the market depending on which report you're

01:33:40.220 --> 01:33:45.960
looking at shift over 1 .5 million units which

01:33:45.960 --> 01:33:49.760
is 150 times the first year which is only like

01:33:49.760 --> 01:33:53.079
four years ago We can comfortably say they've

01:33:53.079 --> 01:33:57.600
ascended. With that speed of shipping hardware

01:33:57.600 --> 01:34:03.020
products and not having any major missed deadlines

01:34:03.020 --> 01:34:09.300
or major delays or major complaints about hardware

01:34:09.300 --> 01:34:12.300
being put into users' hands. Right. Pretty impressive.

01:34:12.479 --> 01:34:14.800
Pretty impressive. And at this point, the valuation

01:34:14.800 --> 01:34:21.300
is multi -billion dollars. But there's always

01:34:21.300 --> 01:34:24.920
a but. With any company that grows in this speed,

01:34:25.279 --> 01:34:28.479
there's bound to be mishaps and controversies.

01:34:28.539 --> 01:34:31.000
Oh, a lot of lawsuits. So we do have a section

01:34:31.000 --> 01:34:34.140
on that as well. Yeah. They grow so fast and

01:34:34.140 --> 01:34:36.079
then they have so many mishaps that we have to

01:34:36.079 --> 01:34:39.300
designate an entire chapter onto the mishaps

01:34:39.300 --> 01:34:43.100
because that's just the level of conditions that

01:34:43.100 --> 01:34:46.680
they're experiencing. All right. So there are

01:34:46.680 --> 01:34:50.939
four types of mishaps or issues. Number one would

01:34:50.939 --> 01:34:54.579
be, well, once again, reliability issue. A good

01:34:54.579 --> 01:34:56.340
design doesn't mean they don't have any reliability

01:34:56.340 --> 01:35:01.180
issue. Number two would be IP infringement because,

01:35:01.260 --> 01:35:03.159
of course, they always run into that kind of

01:35:03.159 --> 01:35:06.880
problems. Number three, fighting with the current,

01:35:06.979 --> 01:35:11.220
with the aging incumbent. Stratasys is always

01:35:11.220 --> 01:35:14.239
there somehow in the story. And number four.

01:35:14.880 --> 01:35:17.479
the dispute on open source. Fighting with the

01:35:17.479 --> 01:35:19.840
community. Fighting with the community. So let's

01:35:19.840 --> 01:35:22.199
start with the defects, shall we? Let's do that.

01:35:23.600 --> 01:35:27.640
So two defects that I managed to dig up, and

01:35:27.640 --> 01:35:30.170
I think a lot of... Hardware companies have these

01:35:30.170 --> 01:35:32.630
and I think they resolve this pretty well. The

01:35:32.630 --> 01:35:35.390
first one is in 2023 So one year after release

01:35:35.390 --> 01:35:39.729
the x1 It's basically when you send your job

01:35:39.729 --> 01:35:42.470
to a printer and the printer isn't plugged in

01:35:42.470 --> 01:35:45.689
properly It doesn't print immediately, right?

01:35:45.770 --> 01:35:48.609
But when then when then it receives it it prints

01:35:48.609 --> 01:35:50.939
like 10 jobs at once because you kept on sending

01:35:50.939 --> 01:35:52.720
the jobs because you thought it didn't print.

01:35:52.939 --> 01:35:56.079
So this is exactly what happened to Bamboo. User,

01:35:56.279 --> 01:35:58.399
because they use this cloud connectivity, so

01:35:58.399 --> 01:36:00.340
when you send a job from your computer, it goes

01:36:00.340 --> 01:36:02.380
to Bamboo Cloud, then it goes to your machine,

01:36:02.539 --> 01:36:05.520
and it got stuck in the cloud for a while. And

01:36:05.520 --> 01:36:07.420
then users are like, what's happening? I'll send

01:36:07.420 --> 01:36:11.359
a new job, I'll send a new job. So one day, August

01:36:11.359 --> 01:36:16.380
15th, midnight, US time, everything started printing

01:36:16.380 --> 01:36:20.960
while you're sleeping. So, I mean, yes, mishap,

01:36:20.960 --> 01:36:23.640
like awful, but, you know, not creepy. Yeah,

01:36:23.659 --> 01:36:25.979
it's a bit creepy, but not life threatening.

01:36:26.220 --> 01:36:28.279
It's still a good machine. People got over it.

01:36:28.920 --> 01:36:31.779
Second thing, and I think they managed this pretty

01:36:31.779 --> 01:36:35.939
well, which is the A1 recall. So after they released

01:36:35.939 --> 01:36:39.079
A1, which is their entry level printer, they

01:36:39.079 --> 01:36:44.939
realized the cables that are connecting the printer

01:36:44.939 --> 01:36:51.380
to the wall. is not super prune to heat and damage

01:36:51.380 --> 01:36:55.539
and they claim that they did a lot of they they

01:36:55.539 --> 01:36:58.720
have qa while they're developing the product.

01:36:58.859 --> 01:37:00.760
And they did a bunch of tests to make sure it's

01:37:00.760 --> 01:37:04.020
safe. But somehow they missed the fact that when

01:37:04.020 --> 01:37:06.819
a machine is in transit, there's a lot of damage

01:37:06.819 --> 01:37:09.060
done to where you connect the cable. And somehow

01:37:09.060 --> 01:37:12.020
they missed this. And because of how people place

01:37:12.020 --> 01:37:14.119
their printers at their homes, if it's really

01:37:14.119 --> 01:37:18.470
against the wall, it's easy for... the key to

01:37:18.470 --> 01:37:20.350
develop and there's a fire hazard so they had

01:37:20.350 --> 01:37:23.409
to recall this and they did it it cost the millions

01:37:23.409 --> 01:37:25.470
of dollars but they did it in a manner that the

01:37:25.470 --> 01:37:27.789
community was like okay like i got my refund

01:37:27.789 --> 01:37:32.189
or i got a way of fixing it so everyone was fairly

01:37:32.189 --> 01:37:36.489
happy in the end so the defects are yes mishaps

01:37:36.489 --> 01:37:40.970
but not life -threatening next one the next one

01:37:40.970 --> 01:37:47.090
is the most fun one it is pop mart sued bamboo

01:37:47.090 --> 01:37:50.449
lab i know because of labubus because of the

01:37:50.449 --> 01:37:53.270
knockoffs and of course labubu 3d models are

01:37:53.270 --> 01:37:56.710
being uploaded to make a world and people were

01:37:56.710 --> 01:37:58.970
trying to print it out illegally when you print

01:37:58.970 --> 01:38:01.090
it out when you create a model just on your own

01:38:01.090 --> 01:38:03.930
it's not illegal but when you're trying to distribute

01:38:03.930 --> 01:38:07.689
it and that becomes a youtube or a youtube slash

01:38:07.689 --> 01:38:11.310
napster problem right you as a platform is responsible

01:38:11.310 --> 01:38:16.659
for what your users upload question so it didn't

01:38:16.659 --> 01:38:18.960
have to get resolved by trial it was kind of

01:38:18.960 --> 01:38:22.199
pull back but the resolution is bamboo basically

01:38:22.199 --> 01:38:26.020
pulled all the offending labubu files uh aside

01:38:26.020 --> 01:38:29.779
and it was finally settled mid -march 2026 the

01:38:29.779 --> 01:38:32.619
policy became if there is any labubu that is

01:38:32.619 --> 01:38:34.539
being uploaded to bamboo we're going to pull

01:38:34.539 --> 01:38:38.239
it out but it's interesting because i i'm on

01:38:38.239 --> 01:38:41.420
maker world a lot these days i don't see labubus

01:38:41.420 --> 01:38:45.710
yes But I see Marios, I see Pokemons. I know,

01:38:45.750 --> 01:38:48.250
I know. Which is, you know, Labubu isn't the

01:38:48.250 --> 01:38:50.670
only IP that was being uploaded. There's Ultraman,

01:38:50.789 --> 01:38:53.609
there's Detective Conan. There are a lot of IPs

01:38:53.609 --> 01:38:55.569
still being uploaded to that. But it's just,

01:38:55.649 --> 01:38:59.189
PopMart had a problem with that because Labubu

01:38:59.189 --> 01:39:02.750
was kind of its MVP in the year 2024 and 2025.

01:39:03.109 --> 01:39:07.270
It didn't want it to impact sales. And Bamboo

01:39:07.270 --> 01:39:10.550
wasn't the only company that have IP infringement

01:39:10.550 --> 01:39:15.029
issues. maker roles labubu it's thingy versus

01:39:15.029 --> 01:39:18.890
yoda problem it is prusa's lego problem so everyone

01:39:18.890 --> 01:39:22.750
every player before had a similar ip problem

01:39:22.750 --> 01:39:26.680
but this obviously you can always use at least

01:39:26.680 --> 01:39:30.760
your legal policies to say that certain IPs should

01:39:30.760 --> 01:39:34.220
be pulled off. If you're not using it for proper

01:39:34.220 --> 01:39:36.640
uses or if you're using it for commercial uses,

01:39:36.819 --> 01:39:40.239
at least you should get licensed to do that.

01:39:40.460 --> 01:39:42.699
But to be very honest, I think some of the Labubu

01:39:42.699 --> 01:39:44.680
designs are quite cute. They are really cute.

01:39:45.399 --> 01:39:48.199
Yeah, it is a problem. Yeah, but this calls into

01:39:48.199 --> 01:39:51.229
a bigger question, right? At some point in the

01:39:51.229 --> 01:39:53.909
future, I can imagine where a lot more people

01:39:53.909 --> 01:39:57.529
owns a 3D printer. And so if I print at home

01:39:57.529 --> 01:40:01.090
a Labubu that I've designed, is that IP infringement?

01:40:01.149 --> 01:40:03.609
I'm not the IP infringement expert, but because

01:40:03.609 --> 01:40:07.609
you're giving the ability to design, the capability

01:40:07.609 --> 01:40:12.369
to design to the masses, these kind of problems

01:40:12.369 --> 01:40:16.840
will continue, right? So maybe there is a, on

01:40:16.840 --> 01:40:18.840
the firmware that they're able to track it. If

01:40:18.840 --> 01:40:20.319
you were to just print one thing, because it

01:40:20.319 --> 01:40:22.180
all has to go through Bamboo Connect, right?

01:40:22.340 --> 01:40:24.439
If you were to just print out one, they would

01:40:24.439 --> 01:40:26.340
know, oh, you printed out one. But if you were

01:40:26.340 --> 01:40:29.739
to replicate it, a thousand of them, maybe they

01:40:29.739 --> 01:40:31.720
would have a question was, why would you have

01:40:31.720 --> 01:40:34.239
to print out so many of the same copy, right?

01:40:34.420 --> 01:40:37.319
You know, so it's, so I think that's. probably

01:40:37.319 --> 01:40:40.140
why they have to install this level of firmware

01:40:40.140 --> 01:40:43.039
to be able to know that what are you actually

01:40:43.039 --> 01:40:46.619
using your firmware and and thingiverse and you

01:40:46.619 --> 01:40:48.319
know all the previous vintage versions they will

01:40:48.319 --> 01:40:50.520
have similar problems yeah it's impossible to

01:40:50.520 --> 01:40:52.619
avoid but you know everyone is doing something

01:40:52.619 --> 01:40:55.300
is it perfect not it's not yes yeah people will

01:40:55.300 --> 01:40:58.039
do will do what they have to do yes okay imagine

01:40:58.039 --> 01:41:01.869
how people will be upset if Bamboo Labs closed

01:41:01.869 --> 01:41:03.909
down my printer because I was printing out more

01:41:03.909 --> 01:41:06.710
labels. But we'll get back to that in a bit.

01:41:06.710 --> 01:41:08.310
You will get back to that. The next lawsuit.

01:41:08.529 --> 01:41:11.689
The next lawsuit is Shadis' is fighting with

01:41:11.689 --> 01:41:17.890
the aging incumbent. In short, Shadis' sued Bamboo

01:41:17.890 --> 01:41:21.529
Lab greatly. What is actually being claimed,

01:41:21.770 --> 01:41:26.789
10 patents across five different areas, including...

01:41:27.159 --> 01:41:29.779
Purge towers, general extrusion -based layer

01:41:29.779 --> 01:41:32.640
deposition, two -head forest detection, a bunch

01:41:32.640 --> 01:41:35.460
of different technologies. And then there are

01:41:35.460 --> 01:41:38.859
two parallel legal tracks. Two things are being

01:41:38.859 --> 01:41:43.340
put in place. One is a standard district court

01:41:43.340 --> 01:41:46.840
case. That is just seeing financial damages and

01:41:46.840 --> 01:41:49.060
seeing an injunction. And usually it takes a

01:41:49.060 --> 01:41:51.140
little longer time. It's pretty standard in the

01:41:51.140 --> 01:41:54.090
U .S. And the other one is interesting. The other

01:41:54.090 --> 01:41:57.369
one is a separate ITC International Trade Commission

01:41:57.369 --> 01:42:02.689
complaint under Section 337 of the Tariff Act.

01:42:02.989 --> 01:42:06.010
And this is the more consequential one for bamboo.

01:42:06.569 --> 01:42:10.949
The ITC has the power to issue an exclusion order

01:42:10.949 --> 01:42:14.109
blocking bamboo lab printers from being imported

01:42:14.109 --> 01:42:18.949
into the U .S. at all. Yeah, and ITC proceedings

01:42:18.949 --> 01:42:23.310
typically moves faster than the U .S. local district

01:42:23.310 --> 01:42:28.250
court cases. So this mechanism behind, and then

01:42:28.250 --> 01:42:31.550
this is why bamboo labs actually make the headlines

01:42:31.550 --> 01:42:33.810
in a lot of the U .S. news, is because of the

01:42:33.810 --> 01:42:36.430
ITC suing. So there's a future where you can't

01:42:36.430 --> 01:42:39.350
buy a bamboo lab, anything in the U .S.? Well,

01:42:39.390 --> 01:42:41.670
you think about this, DJI is on the entity list.

01:42:42.359 --> 01:42:44.899
So whether Bamboo Lab can actually make it through

01:42:44.899 --> 01:42:48.880
ITC, you have to wait and see. That rhymes. But

01:42:48.880 --> 01:42:51.300
you know what? I think 3D printers in general

01:42:51.300 --> 01:42:54.619
would share similar risks. So if you were to

01:42:54.619 --> 01:42:57.460
ban one, you might as well ban all of them. Yeah,

01:42:57.479 --> 01:42:59.560
I think Stratasys just targets bamboo because

01:42:59.560 --> 01:43:02.300
it's the biggest. But there's also a scenario

01:43:02.300 --> 01:43:06.520
where bamboo kind of, if they, for example, perch

01:43:06.520 --> 01:43:08.680
towers, if you can't say, if you say I can't

01:43:08.680 --> 01:43:11.699
use it, I'll develop my own. alternative towers

01:43:11.699 --> 01:43:15.260
yeah exactly like yeah and and just file a u

01:43:15.260 --> 01:43:17.760
.s patent so obviously there are workarounds

01:43:17.760 --> 01:43:20.260
but currently i think stratus is wildly unhappy

01:43:20.260 --> 01:43:22.800
with the fact that bamboo is you know number

01:43:22.800 --> 01:43:25.439
one in terms of commercial sales which is interesting

01:43:25.439 --> 01:43:28.560
because strategists kind of left consumer space

01:43:28.560 --> 01:43:31.060
well but obviously still wants to get the money

01:43:31.060 --> 01:43:34.819
yes we'll wait and see for this one yeah the

01:43:34.819 --> 01:43:38.560
final one is actually bamboo against the community

01:43:39.199 --> 01:43:42.380
that created 3D printing. This is the messiest

01:43:42.380 --> 01:43:44.539
one. It's a bit messy. It's a bit bigger. But

01:43:44.539 --> 01:43:47.579
before I go into this issue, I do need to explain

01:43:47.579 --> 01:43:51.239
one piece of vocabulary, which is what is a slicer?

01:43:51.619 --> 01:43:56.039
In 3D printing, you can't just make a model out

01:43:56.039 --> 01:43:58.720
of your AutoCAD software or any of the 3D printing

01:43:58.720 --> 01:44:01.779
software and expect the printer to understand

01:44:01.779 --> 01:44:05.020
what's going on. There's actually another software

01:44:05.020 --> 01:44:09.260
called the slicer, which... translates the shape

01:44:09.260 --> 01:44:12.159
of your 3D model into instructions, like where

01:44:12.159 --> 01:44:14.399
does the machine need to move, how much to extrude,

01:44:14.460 --> 01:44:17.819
how thick each layer is. And that's what is called

01:44:17.819 --> 01:44:22.960
a slicer. And it basically slices the model into

01:44:22.960 --> 01:44:25.640
horizontal layers and then writes this path for

01:44:25.640 --> 01:44:29.619
the prints to follow. And here's why it matters

01:44:29.619 --> 01:44:33.180
in our story, because this whole process is fairly

01:44:33.180 --> 01:44:37.180
standard today. because and thanks to the open

01:44:37.180 --> 01:44:39.420
source community that we talked about earlier.

01:44:39.760 --> 01:44:44.899
So in 2011, someone named Alessandro Renalucci

01:44:44.899 --> 01:44:49.479
released a slicer software called Slicer with

01:44:49.479 --> 01:44:53.539
the three, so C3R instead of CER. And this is

01:44:53.539 --> 01:44:58.079
released under the open license AGPL, which means

01:44:58.079 --> 01:45:01.020
free to copy, free to modify. You can even sell

01:45:01.020 --> 01:45:05.409
it. In 2016, This is when Prusa, after Prusa

01:45:05.409 --> 01:45:08.789
released the i3 kit, Prusa actually forked, which

01:45:08.789 --> 01:45:12.569
means built on top of the slicer and made it

01:45:12.569 --> 01:45:15.710
and published it under Prusa Slicer, the name.

01:45:15.909 --> 01:45:17.909
And it's supposed to work better with the Prusa

01:45:17.909 --> 01:45:23.329
models. Furthermore, in 2022, Bamboo Lab forked

01:45:23.329 --> 01:45:25.829
Prusa Slicer and made it into Bamboo Studio.

01:45:25.949 --> 01:45:28.359
So it's like... You know, you have parents and

01:45:28.359 --> 01:45:30.300
then you have child, you have grandchilds and

01:45:30.300 --> 01:45:33.739
etc. Different generations of slicers forked

01:45:33.739 --> 01:45:36.079
on top of the previous one. Exactly. And a lot

01:45:36.079 --> 01:45:38.479
of the functionalities are the same. But what

01:45:38.479 --> 01:45:41.359
Bamboo Studio built on top of PrusaSlicer is

01:45:41.359 --> 01:45:45.180
something called like connectivity network. So

01:45:45.180 --> 01:45:47.560
it connects to their cloud. It also recognizes

01:45:47.560 --> 01:45:51.649
the RFID. tag of the bamboo filaments so you

01:45:51.649 --> 01:45:53.689
kind of build on top of it but fundamentally

01:45:53.689 --> 01:46:01.270
it's the same thing right so so in uh 2022 uh

01:46:01.270 --> 01:46:04.909
another developer actually fort bamboo studio

01:46:04.909 --> 01:46:11.380
who is this person and it's he goes by the named

01:46:11.380 --> 01:46:13.899
soft fever we don't know his actual name but

01:46:13.899 --> 01:46:17.279
uh he created the orca slicer and orca slicer

01:46:17.279 --> 01:46:21.359
works with any printer brand which is why it's

01:46:21.359 --> 01:46:24.399
really popular and it allows people who enjoy

01:46:24.399 --> 01:46:28.060
tinkering to play around a bit more than the

01:46:28.060 --> 01:46:31.739
bamboo studio right so it quickly became very

01:46:31.739 --> 01:46:35.100
popular and back then you can send anything from

01:46:35.100 --> 01:46:40.289
orca slicer to a bamboo printer without any issues.

01:46:40.850 --> 01:46:44.869
But that went on for three years, and Bamboo

01:46:44.869 --> 01:46:48.750
decided to change that, which started this whole

01:46:48.750 --> 01:46:53.529
mess. Wow. So in January 2025, Bamboo basically

01:46:53.529 --> 01:46:57.430
said, we're going to ship a firmware. They didn't

01:46:57.430 --> 01:46:59.949
say we're going to cut off OrcaSlicer. They said,

01:46:59.970 --> 01:47:03.069
we're going to ship a firmware update, and it

01:47:03.069 --> 01:47:07.390
includes authorization control. which blocks

01:47:07.390 --> 01:47:11.750
third -party slicers from talking directly to

01:47:11.750 --> 01:47:16.050
our cloud and the printer. So remember how it

01:47:16.050 --> 01:47:19.569
works is from a slicer software, I have to send

01:47:19.569 --> 01:47:22.529
my job to Bamboo Cloud, and then Bamboo Cloud

01:47:22.529 --> 01:47:25.390
sends it to my printer. So it's not just computer

01:47:25.390 --> 01:47:27.170
to printer, even though they're in the same room.

01:47:27.630 --> 01:47:31.850
So Bamboo blocked the cloud access, which prevents

01:47:31.850 --> 01:47:34.859
cloud from sending the job to printer. And you

01:47:34.859 --> 01:47:39.359
can imagine how angry people are because they've

01:47:39.359 --> 01:47:42.979
lived on open source this entire time. The whole

01:47:42.979 --> 01:47:47.260
philosophy was built on what Dr. Boyer builds

01:47:47.260 --> 01:47:54.439
with RepRap. And so Bamboo was like, okay, we

01:47:54.439 --> 01:47:57.199
did this for your security and for our security.

01:47:58.199 --> 01:48:01.819
And they cited that roughly 30 million unauthorized

01:48:01.819 --> 01:48:04.739
server requests. They're saying a lot of people

01:48:04.739 --> 01:48:06.720
are trying to attack their cloud in that sense.

01:48:06.819 --> 01:48:08.560
That's why I have to block it. Attack the cloud.

01:48:08.720 --> 01:48:11.819
Like try to send jobs. Using your cloud to link

01:48:11.819 --> 01:48:14.520
your cloud to something else that they actually

01:48:14.520 --> 01:48:16.960
use to print the job. Yeah, so they're saying

01:48:16.960 --> 01:48:19.439
that we did this to prevent other people from

01:48:19.439 --> 01:48:22.439
hacking our cloud to print on your printer, which

01:48:22.439 --> 01:48:25.500
is... I don't know. There's so many ways to protect

01:48:25.500 --> 01:48:28.899
people from accessing your cloud, like an API

01:48:28.899 --> 01:48:33.640
key. People didn't buy into that reason, let's

01:48:33.640 --> 01:48:36.840
just say. But to their credit, Bamboo didn't

01:48:36.840 --> 01:48:39.039
really shut the door. They offered two workarounds.

01:48:39.279 --> 01:48:42.319
So the first one is developer mode. So you can

01:48:42.319 --> 01:48:45.279
actually turn on developer mode on your printer

01:48:45.279 --> 01:48:48.699
that bypasses the cloud. So I can send directly

01:48:48.699 --> 01:48:52.039
in my room laptop to printer. But then that...

01:48:52.250 --> 01:48:55.090
Bypasses the cloud, meaning all the cloud functionalities

01:48:55.090 --> 01:48:59.170
are gone, which means I can't monitor live what

01:48:59.170 --> 01:49:02.609
my printing is doing. Well, just basic. Some

01:49:02.609 --> 01:49:08.510
basic stuff. But there's some grumbles with the

01:49:08.510 --> 01:49:12.970
users that bought their machines, but it didn't

01:49:12.970 --> 01:49:16.010
turn into a life -altering decision. They didn't

01:49:16.010 --> 01:49:19.270
burn their... bamboo products because of this

01:49:19.270 --> 01:49:23.010
so uh in on youtube a lot of people posted workarounds

01:49:23.010 --> 01:49:26.569
they also offered orcaslicers to probably change

01:49:26.569 --> 01:49:29.949
their program to then enable them to send to

01:49:29.949 --> 01:49:33.569
bamboo cloud yeah orcaslicer declined because

01:49:33.569 --> 01:49:36.529
they didn't want to do that so that all went

01:49:36.529 --> 01:49:40.729
well until april 2026 when a developer named

01:49:40.729 --> 01:49:45.850
paul jarzak released a new fork of orcaslicer

01:49:46.239 --> 01:49:50.220
And this new fork did one thing, which is restoring

01:49:50.220 --> 01:49:56.100
cloud access to Bamboo. And he did this because

01:49:56.100 --> 01:50:01.260
he kind of hacked what Bamboo published in their

01:50:01.260 --> 01:50:04.579
Bamboo Studio slicer. Remember, Bamboo Studio,

01:50:04.819 --> 01:50:08.619
the slicer program from Bamboo, is open source

01:50:08.619 --> 01:50:11.779
because they got it from PrusaSlicer, which is

01:50:11.779 --> 01:50:15.060
also open source. They had to publish it. which

01:50:15.060 --> 01:50:17.760
gave all the developer access to their code.

01:50:17.960 --> 01:50:21.140
So if you read the code carefully enough, you'll

01:50:21.140 --> 01:50:27.060
figure out a way to hack it. And so he figured

01:50:27.060 --> 01:50:29.739
out a way, this developer, Jarzak. He figured

01:50:29.739 --> 01:50:34.359
out a way, published it as he should with open

01:50:34.359 --> 01:50:39.109
source licensing. So he gave everyone this. new

01:50:39.109 --> 01:50:42.989
orca slicer that restored access. And it could

01:50:42.989 --> 01:50:46.869
have all ended here, but Bamboo decided to call

01:50:46.869 --> 01:50:49.930
their lawyers. Bamboo sent him a cease and desist,

01:50:50.109 --> 01:50:54.609
and they alleged that he was trying to impersonate

01:50:54.609 --> 01:51:00.369
their app and illegally reverse engineering their

01:51:00.369 --> 01:51:05.289
app. So Yarzak, being an independent developer,

01:51:05.329 --> 01:51:07.819
actually took the code down. but he didn't do

01:51:07.819 --> 01:51:11.119
it really quietly. He defended by publishing

01:51:11.119 --> 01:51:17.420
his own case on GitHub. And I know, I mean, you

01:51:17.420 --> 01:51:19.159
can't expect him. And then the fire starts to

01:51:19.159 --> 01:51:22.159
burn. And that's when everything started to burn

01:51:22.159 --> 01:51:26.520
because he claims that Bamboo Studio is licensed

01:51:26.520 --> 01:51:29.880
under AGPL, right? Which inherits from Prusa.

01:51:30.279 --> 01:51:33.520
And that requires that when you build something

01:51:33.520 --> 01:51:36.699
on top of it, you release everything. And he

01:51:36.699 --> 01:51:38.840
claims that Bamboo Studio didn't release anything

01:51:38.840 --> 01:51:41.920
because when Bamboo published Bamboo Studio,

01:51:42.119 --> 01:51:45.680
there's this plugin that connects to the cloud.

01:51:45.800 --> 01:51:49.600
They didn't release the plugin code. Wow. So

01:51:49.600 --> 01:51:53.000
he counterattacked, saying that Bamboo should

01:51:53.000 --> 01:51:54.899
have released this cloud connector in the first

01:51:54.899 --> 01:51:58.300
place. But you did not do your duty in the open

01:51:58.300 --> 01:52:01.699
source community. Exactly. You failed. And that

01:52:01.699 --> 01:52:06.010
upset it. in everyone who participated in that

01:52:06.010 --> 01:52:08.850
open source community and it brought awareness

01:52:08.850 --> 01:52:11.789
to people who are fighting for open source for

01:52:11.789 --> 01:52:16.829
the consumers namely gamers nexus which is a

01:52:16.829 --> 01:52:19.430
major respective hardware outlet they published

01:52:19.430 --> 01:52:22.829
a piece literally titled and i'm sorry for swearing

01:52:23.600 --> 01:52:27.520
bamboo lab and they re -hosted yarzak's code

01:52:27.520 --> 01:52:29.840
because yarzak didn't actually want this whole

01:52:29.840 --> 01:52:32.439
lawsuit to fall upon him he took down the code

01:52:32.439 --> 01:52:36.319
and they not only re -hosted the code they pledged

01:52:36.319 --> 01:52:39.800
ten thousand dollars in legal defense fund if

01:52:39.800 --> 01:52:43.899
bamboo gets sued for this another guy whose name

01:52:43.899 --> 01:52:47.279
is lewis rotman uh he's on youtube right to repair

01:52:47.279 --> 01:52:50.930
advocate pledged another ten thousand and I've

01:52:50.930 --> 01:52:53.449
seen already three videos of him attacking bamboo

01:52:53.449 --> 01:52:57.350
based on this. Right. So this made a lot of news.

01:52:58.109 --> 01:53:01.050
Interestingly, remember Snapmaker? You won. Yeah.

01:53:01.189 --> 01:53:06.409
They send Jarzak their hardware to support him.

01:53:06.829 --> 01:53:09.130
It's like taking a bite out of your competitor

01:53:09.130 --> 01:53:13.550
while you can. So a few days later, this got

01:53:13.550 --> 01:53:18.640
even more pumped up because the... nonprofit

01:53:18.640 --> 01:53:22.500
that published the AGPL licensing. It's called

01:53:22.500 --> 01:53:27.119
Software Freedom Conservancy, SFC. They decided

01:53:27.119 --> 01:53:29.779
that it's time that they stepped in and opened

01:53:29.779 --> 01:53:33.539
an investigation on Bamboo. And they ruled pretty

01:53:33.539 --> 01:53:37.619
decisively. Yarzak did nothing wrong. Bamboo,

01:53:37.760 --> 01:53:41.600
you've been out of compliance for four years,

01:53:41.680 --> 01:53:45.359
ever since you published Bamboo Studio. You shouldn't

01:53:45.359 --> 01:53:48.039
have bundled something closed source, which is

01:53:48.039 --> 01:53:51.819
your network plugin, into an otherwise open source

01:53:51.819 --> 01:53:55.340
software that you got from Prusa. And so this

01:53:55.340 --> 01:54:00.180
is where we stand now. And not only did Software

01:54:00.180 --> 01:54:03.539
Freedom Conservancy said, Bamboo, you're wrong.

01:54:04.100 --> 01:54:08.380
They actually decided to launch a fundraiser

01:54:08.380 --> 01:54:16.880
targeting $250 ,000. To hire legal counsel. That's

01:54:16.880 --> 01:54:21.600
the Baotoubu project, right? Yes. Yes. And so

01:54:21.600 --> 01:54:24.180
this project ended up raising more than this

01:54:24.180 --> 01:54:26.479
amount that they set out. And they're going to

01:54:26.479 --> 01:54:28.520
do a couple of things. One is they'll hire legal

01:54:28.520 --> 01:54:33.000
counsel to probably sue Bamboo Labs in the future.

01:54:33.220 --> 01:54:35.579
And guard the open source community. Exactly.

01:54:35.579 --> 01:54:39.319
And guard the freedom for people who buy machines

01:54:39.319 --> 01:54:43.329
to own their machinery. they also put together

01:54:43.329 --> 01:54:47.789
a team to crack that closed piece of software.

01:54:48.050 --> 01:54:50.670
So they're going to reverse engineer, they hired

01:54:50.670 --> 01:54:53.409
engineers to reverse engineering the network

01:54:53.409 --> 01:54:56.289
plugin because rather than going through legal

01:54:56.289 --> 01:54:59.289
battles, which we know can be very time consuming,

01:54:59.550 --> 01:55:02.529
if we just open source your closed source software

01:55:02.529 --> 01:55:04.989
and published out there and really just screw

01:55:04.989 --> 01:55:09.560
you, it's much easier. We'll just open source

01:55:09.560 --> 01:55:12.960
you whether you like it or not. Yes. I don't

01:55:12.960 --> 01:55:15.899
know who thought of this. It's crazy. Yeah, and

01:55:15.899 --> 01:55:18.699
Jarzak was part of that committee. He's been

01:55:18.699 --> 01:55:21.520
asked to join the committee to hold not only

01:55:21.520 --> 01:55:24.899
Bamboo Lab, but the 3D printing industry in general

01:55:24.899 --> 01:55:30.979
on... Accountable. Accountable. For open source,

01:55:31.100 --> 01:55:34.720
for truly being open source. Exactly. And that's

01:55:34.720 --> 01:55:37.329
where... bamboo slabs right the bamboo lab stands

01:55:37.329 --> 01:55:39.750
right now they're complicated waters to navigate

01:55:39.750 --> 01:55:42.970
through right now yeah this comes with you know

01:55:42.970 --> 01:55:46.109
growing so big so quickly yeah i'm sure they

01:55:46.109 --> 01:55:50.050
would have expected it well now they have to

01:55:50.050 --> 01:55:52.890
put a lot of attention on it yeah it's just ironic

01:55:52.890 --> 01:55:56.090
they could have stopped it by not issuing the

01:55:56.090 --> 01:55:59.829
season to assist wrong move but regardless i

01:55:59.829 --> 01:56:01.989
mean they're still Number one in the world. Still

01:56:01.989 --> 01:56:04.850
very impressive. Still in pretty excellent company

01:56:04.850 --> 01:56:10.029
in hardware making. Yeah. And we both liked that

01:56:10.029 --> 01:56:13.369
it was definitely started by a group of makers,

01:56:13.590 --> 01:56:15.829
hardcore engineers who wanted to start something

01:56:15.829 --> 01:56:18.810
else, who wanted to like build something from

01:56:18.810 --> 01:56:21.550
scratch, not just doing the repetitive engineering

01:56:21.550 --> 01:56:26.149
work. And I think that brings us to the last

01:56:26.149 --> 01:56:28.890
segment of why do you think they've ascended?

01:56:29.449 --> 01:56:31.430
Yeah, there's so many things, but I think the

01:56:31.430 --> 01:56:34.050
main thing is just listen to the consumers and

01:56:34.050 --> 01:56:38.250
trying to tackle problems and having the faith

01:56:38.250 --> 01:56:44.069
that they can. I saw an interview from the team

01:56:44.069 --> 01:56:47.109
where they said, are there any instances where

01:56:47.109 --> 01:56:49.029
you think this could fail? And they said, no,

01:56:49.109 --> 01:56:52.600
because when we looked at 3D printing, Back when

01:56:52.600 --> 01:56:55.239
we started this project, it was pretty clear

01:56:55.239 --> 01:56:58.739
to us that the hardware can be improved to the

01:56:58.739 --> 01:57:01.319
extent that consumers will end up adopting and

01:57:01.319 --> 01:57:05.300
liking it. When I did the research on DJI and

01:57:05.300 --> 01:57:10.640
understanding the hardware business, a couple

01:57:10.640 --> 01:57:16.199
metrics really stood out to me. And well, obviously,

01:57:16.239 --> 01:57:18.819
number one being your growth and your skill,

01:57:18.979 --> 01:57:21.100
like being sustainable as a consumer electronics.

01:57:22.220 --> 01:57:24.720
profitability and efficiency once again if you're

01:57:24.720 --> 01:57:26.640
consumer electronics you may not be the most

01:57:26.640 --> 01:57:29.760
efficient because your need is varying all the

01:57:29.760 --> 01:57:33.199
time consumers always have new demand and the

01:57:33.199 --> 01:57:36.760
next one is ecosystem and platform health yes

01:57:36.760 --> 01:57:39.180
and specifically there is a rate that is called

01:57:39.180 --> 01:57:44.020
attach rate which is the consumables or the accessories

01:57:44.020 --> 01:57:46.859
revenue per hardware unit sold Ooh, they've done

01:57:46.859 --> 01:57:49.000
pretty well in that. Oh, really? Yeah, they're

01:57:49.000 --> 01:57:51.819
the attach rate and platform engagement, the

01:57:51.819 --> 01:57:54.220
MAU and DAU, the software bit, the community

01:57:54.220 --> 01:57:57.619
bit of every hardware sales. And I think for

01:57:57.619 --> 01:58:01.359
Western companies like Whoop or even Garmin,

01:58:01.460 --> 01:58:04.100
the model that they pick is usually a software

01:58:04.100 --> 01:58:06.520
subscription bit. But in China, you know, people

01:58:06.520 --> 01:58:08.460
don't usually pay for a software subscription.

01:58:08.699 --> 01:58:10.720
They like the free software, the free community,

01:58:10.819 --> 01:58:13.060
but they will pay for the thing that they get

01:58:13.060 --> 01:58:16.159
in their hand. So I think that... really made

01:58:16.159 --> 01:58:21.800
it what Bamboo Lab is today. And finally, if

01:58:21.800 --> 01:58:24.659
you have done all three things above right, it

01:58:24.659 --> 01:58:26.920
should manifest in your capital and valuation.

01:58:27.220 --> 01:58:30.920
And it did. You should grow fast. And yeah, so

01:58:30.920 --> 01:58:34.739
to be honest, in terms of every single bit of

01:58:34.739 --> 01:58:36.819
the metrics that we've just talked about, profitability

01:58:36.819 --> 01:58:40.899
and efficiency, the ecosystem, health, valuation,

01:58:41.079 --> 01:58:45.149
you just... tackled everything and on top of

01:58:45.149 --> 01:58:49.529
that um there is the you know like the brief

01:58:49.529 --> 01:58:52.949
discussion on the flagship product right there

01:58:52.949 --> 01:58:55.289
are the better flagships and there are the terrible

01:58:55.289 --> 01:58:57.789
flagships or the product that they've created

01:58:57.789 --> 01:59:02.029
the good flagships would really understand the

01:59:02.029 --> 01:59:04.510
current users problems and try to solve that

01:59:04.510 --> 01:59:06.710
that's exactly what they did that's all you have

01:59:06.710 --> 01:59:09.930
to do it's not necessarily a cheaper one and

01:59:09.930 --> 01:59:12.899
it's not necessarily a oh creating a problem

01:59:12.899 --> 01:59:14.899
out of nowhere and just pretend that's the most

01:59:14.899 --> 01:59:17.399
important problem that's not it don't just don't

01:59:17.399 --> 01:59:20.159
be arrogant yeah be very down to earth do do

01:59:20.159 --> 01:59:22.140
your research and understanding where people

01:59:22.140 --> 01:59:25.420
are actually stuck on these days so that's exactly

01:59:25.420 --> 01:59:28.140
what they have done yeah and i think the success

01:59:28.140 --> 01:59:33.140
of their first kickstarter and x1 is what ultimately

01:59:33.140 --> 01:59:36.600
brought them everything that followed. So imagine

01:59:36.600 --> 01:59:39.260
if they didn't do that correctly, then whatever

01:59:39.260 --> 01:59:42.399
that's followed might not be here today. Yeah.

01:59:42.560 --> 01:59:46.560
It is being very humble, right? And actually

01:59:46.560 --> 01:59:52.319
made an excellent product with DJI level of engineering

01:59:52.319 --> 01:59:55.039
and the obsession of, oh, I just really want

01:59:55.039 --> 01:59:57.520
to make the consumer take it out within one second,

01:59:57.560 --> 02:00:00.520
plug it in and start to use it. So that philosophy

02:00:00.520 --> 02:00:04.359
worked once again. Yeah. And I think lastly,

02:00:04.810 --> 02:00:07.250
also on my end, despite the controversies we

02:00:07.250 --> 02:00:11.289
talked about, right? They're actually really

02:00:11.289 --> 02:00:15.670
good product builders in the end. For sure. And

02:00:15.670 --> 02:00:19.529
so regardless of what ultimately happens with

02:00:19.529 --> 02:00:23.189
all the controversies, if they manage to continue

02:00:23.189 --> 02:00:27.829
to develop good products, we see how they've

02:00:27.829 --> 02:00:31.430
managed to use the A1 to expand their user base.

02:00:32.430 --> 02:00:35.430
The people that are upsetting today are the older

02:00:35.430 --> 02:00:40.310
users who adopted bamboo or who adopted 3D printing

02:00:40.310 --> 02:00:44.649
when it was predominantly open sourced. I personally,

02:00:44.770 --> 02:00:47.789
I'm a newer adopter that came into the scenes

02:00:47.789 --> 02:00:50.689
because bamboo has made it cheap enough for me

02:00:50.689 --> 02:00:53.550
to buy something. And there's going to be users

02:00:53.550 --> 02:00:58.029
after me that decided to try only because bamboo

02:00:58.029 --> 02:01:02.250
has made it feasible. And so they didn't quite,

02:01:02.310 --> 02:01:04.989
I'm not the target audience for Orca Slicer.

02:01:05.029 --> 02:01:08.149
I don't have the capabilities to do that. And

02:01:08.149 --> 02:01:13.569
so I think for them, yes, it's not ideal when

02:01:13.569 --> 02:01:17.310
you're fighting against the community that has

02:01:17.310 --> 02:01:21.270
kind of enabled you in the first place. But commercially,

02:01:21.550 --> 02:01:25.939
I actually don't see. that much of a damage if

02:01:25.939 --> 02:01:28.600
they manage to continue to churn out good products

02:01:28.600 --> 02:01:32.380
because they've decided on the Apple closed source

02:01:32.380 --> 02:01:37.500
system path. Well, also think about this. If

02:01:37.500 --> 02:01:40.220
there is any company in the 3D printing in general

02:01:40.220 --> 02:01:45.119
that is going to, you know, offense and someone

02:01:45.119 --> 02:01:47.670
has to take one for the team. And that someone,

02:01:47.890 --> 02:01:51.390
100%, is going to be a Chinese company. It is

02:01:51.390 --> 02:01:54.130
going to be the company that heads up everything.

02:01:54.289 --> 02:01:56.829
Exactly. So there you go. Whoever is more capable

02:01:56.829 --> 02:01:58.770
will be the first one who will take the hit and

02:01:58.770 --> 02:02:02.390
will have to solve it. So I'm sure... They will

02:02:02.390 --> 02:02:03.909
face more problems in the future. They will face

02:02:03.909 --> 02:02:06.409
more problems in the future. If you grow the

02:02:06.409 --> 02:02:08.130
fastest, you also have to solve the problems

02:02:08.130 --> 02:02:10.930
first. So we shall see. Well, once again, this

02:02:10.930 --> 02:02:14.520
is a... rapidly changing industry a couple years

02:02:14.520 --> 02:02:17.659
ago it was snap maker right and then it was creality

02:02:17.659 --> 02:02:20.960
and now it is bamboo lab so who knows in two

02:02:20.960 --> 02:02:24.159
three years who will be the leader in this game

02:02:24.159 --> 02:02:26.159
all right okay so i'm looking forward to reviewing

02:02:26.159 --> 02:02:30.359
this in our maybe december special series to

02:02:30.359 --> 02:02:32.479
see how much things have changed in six months

02:02:32.479 --> 02:02:37.130
yes we will see how it all goes in the next couple

02:02:37.130 --> 02:02:40.310
of months and I wish them the best of luck and

02:02:40.310 --> 02:02:43.729
then I honestly see them having a better relationship

02:02:43.729 --> 02:02:46.090
with the open source community yeah thank you

02:02:46.090 --> 02:02:49.229
everyone for listening last bit an apology for

02:02:49.229 --> 02:02:51.310
recording this episode so late and as you can

02:02:51.310 --> 02:02:54.890
hear my voice is not in the best shape and I've

02:02:54.890 --> 02:02:57.949
been sick for a while now so sorry guys for up

02:02:58.199 --> 02:03:00.619
dating very late and linda and i we have both

02:03:00.619 --> 02:03:02.840
put in a lot of effort in this so but i think

02:03:02.840 --> 02:03:05.300
in the next episode i shall be fully recovered

02:03:05.300 --> 02:03:06.560
thank you again