WEBVTT 00:00:10.270 --> 00:00:13.109 Thanks for tuning in. Hamtalk Live will be on 00:00:13.109 --> 00:00:31.050 the air shortly. Please stand by. Thanks for 00:00:31.050 --> 00:00:33.789 tuning in. Hamtalk Live will be on the air shortly. 00:00:34.090 --> 00:00:43.490 Please stand by. This episode of Ham Talk Live 00:00:43.490 --> 00:00:47.009 is brought to you by Tower Electronics. For cables, 00:00:47.109 --> 00:00:52.549 connectors, and more, call 920 -435 -2973 or 00:00:52.549 --> 00:00:57.869 visit pl -259 .com and by the Ham Station. Get 00:00:57.869 --> 00:01:02.049 your new radio or antenna by calling 800 -729 00:01:02.049 --> 00:01:38.530 -4373 or go to hamstation .com. everyone. It's 00:01:38.530 --> 00:01:41.590 time for another episode of HamTalk Live. It's 00:01:41.590 --> 00:01:47.290 number 78. Some new happenings at WWV, recorded 00:01:47.290 --> 00:01:52.109 live on Thursday, August 24th, 2017. I'm your 00:01:52.109 --> 00:01:56.469 host, Neil Rapp, WB9VPG. Thanks for tuning in 00:01:56.469 --> 00:02:00.299 to another episode of HamTalk Live tonight. We're 00:02:00.299 --> 00:02:05.079 joined by Matt Deutsch, N0RGT, the Chief Engineer 00:02:05.079 --> 00:02:10.120 at Radio Station WWV. And we'll take your calls 00:02:10.120 --> 00:02:14.120 live in just a few minutes. And if you missed 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:17.539 the show last week, Ken Olke, VE6AFO, was here 00:02:17.539 --> 00:02:20.240 to talk about the Quarter Century Wireless Association 00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:24.360 and some of their youth activities and heiress 00:02:24.360 --> 00:02:26.960 donation and more. So if you missed that, check 00:02:26.960 --> 00:02:30.639 us out anytime. Just go to HamTalkLive .com and 00:02:30.639 --> 00:02:33.379 pull up the episode you want to listen to and 00:02:33.379 --> 00:02:37.020 hit play. Or you can catch our podcast version 00:02:37.020 --> 00:02:41.180 on Apple podcasts, Stitcher, iHeartRadio, Google 00:02:41.180 --> 00:02:44.340 Play, TuneIn, SoundCloud, or we're also over 00:02:44.340 --> 00:02:47.580 on YouTube. Before we take a quick break here 00:02:47.580 --> 00:02:49.759 and get started, do want to mention I got an 00:02:49.759 --> 00:02:54.610 email from LloydKC5FM just a few hours ago. uh... 00:02:54.610 --> 00:02:57.490 means with the uh... voice over i p hurricane 00:02:57.490 --> 00:03:02.349 net uh... that uh... they're going to be uh... 00:03:02.349 --> 00:03:06.000 activating tomorrow Harvey has been upgraded 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:09.259 to a Hurricane now and that's down in the Texas 00:03:09.259 --> 00:03:13.280 area and so they are looking for net controls 00:03:13.280 --> 00:03:17.439 for the Voip net and so that's going to take 00:03:17.439 --> 00:03:20.659 place looks like tomorrow afternoon is when that's 00:03:20.659 --> 00:03:25.379 going to happen if not before so make sure you 00:03:25.379 --> 00:03:28.840 check that out if you're on that kind of thing 00:03:28.840 --> 00:03:33.240 if you're just on 20 meters the Hurricane watch 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:39.110 net on 14 .325 has already started, so please 00:03:39.110 --> 00:03:42.139 try to stay out of their way. Unless you have 00:03:42.139 --> 00:03:44.599 something to report and it's a good place to 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:48.759 to listen as well and over on the VoIP side Check 00:03:48.759 --> 00:03:54.719 out VoIP wx .net. That's v -o -i -p wx .net and 00:03:54.719 --> 00:03:58.240 Lloyd just mentioned check out humanity road 00:03:58.240 --> 00:04:04.080 org humanity road org check that out also and 00:04:04.080 --> 00:04:07.900 I wanted me to mention that so Take a look there. 00:04:07.960 --> 00:04:11.240 They're going to be on the air doing some communications 00:04:11.240 --> 00:04:16.899 for Hurricane Harvey. I just wanted to let everybody 00:04:16.899 --> 00:04:21.939 know that that is coming up. And again, the Hurricane 00:04:21.939 --> 00:04:25.420 WatchNet is already going. So we're going to 00:04:25.420 --> 00:04:29.319 talk WWV here in a minute. So get those questions 00:04:29.319 --> 00:04:31.660 ready to go. We'll talk to Matt for a little 00:04:31.660 --> 00:04:34.720 bit. And then you can call us. The phone number 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:45.100 to call when I tell you to is 812. netham126384261 00:04:45.100 --> 00:04:47.800 or you can Skype us at HamTalk Live. You can 00:04:47.800 --> 00:04:50.839 also tweet us tonight. Our Twitter handle is 00:04:50.839 --> 00:04:54.329 at HamTalk Live and I'll let you know. when it's 00:04:54.329 --> 00:04:57.529 time to call in and be back with Matt right after 00:04:57.529 --> 00:05:00.769 this word from the Ham Station right here on 00:05:00.769 --> 00:05:04.449 Ham Talk Live. This episode of Ham Talk Live 00:05:04.449 --> 00:05:07.910 is brought to you by the Ham Station. For over 00:05:07.910 --> 00:05:10.949 37 years, the Ham Station has sold new and used 00:05:10.949 --> 00:05:13.850 radios, antennas, accessories, and equipment 00:05:13.850 --> 00:05:17.629 to hams everywhere. Give Dan or Jeff a call at 00:05:17.629 --> 00:05:24.170 800 -729 -4373 or order online at at hamstation 00:05:24.170 --> 00:05:27.769 .com. Hamstation carries all the major brands 00:05:27.769 --> 00:05:31.550 like Icom, Yezu, and Kenwood. And they have a 00:05:31.550 --> 00:05:35.389 wide selection of radio scanners, MFJ accessories, 00:05:35.709 --> 00:05:38.829 Heil sound products, amplifiers by Mirage and 00:05:38.829 --> 00:05:42.279 Ameritron, Cushcraft antennas, and more. Easy 00:05:42.279 --> 00:05:45.680 online ordering is at HamStation .com or call 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:51.319 1 -800 -729 -4373 to place an order and talk 00:05:51.319 --> 00:05:54.360 it over with the experts. The HamStation, proud 00:05:54.360 --> 00:05:58.699 to sponsor this episode of HamTalk Live. HamTalk 00:05:58.699 --> 00:06:01.139 Live is on your side with traffic and weather 00:06:01.139 --> 00:06:15.959 together on the eights. Welcome back to ham talk 00:06:15.959 --> 00:06:18.620 live the ham station They've got you covered 00:06:18.620 --> 00:06:21.720 for new and used equipment down in Evansville, 00:06:21.899 --> 00:06:25.019 Indiana Give Dan or Jeff a call at eight hundred 00:06:25.019 --> 00:06:29.279 seven two nine forty three seventy three Or go 00:06:29.279 --> 00:06:31.740 to hamstation .com tell them you heard it on 00:06:31.740 --> 00:06:35.600 ham talk live. Thanks to them for sponsoring 00:06:35.600 --> 00:06:38.240 the show they've been with us since the beginning 00:06:38.240 --> 00:06:41.519 and We've got some good stuff down there, so 00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:44.079 make sure you give them a call. We're on the 00:06:44.079 --> 00:06:46.480 air every Thursday night 9 p .m. Eastern Time 00:06:46.480 --> 00:06:50.259 at HamTalkLive .com and of course you can catch 00:06:50.259 --> 00:06:54.779 our replays as well. Well tonight our guest is 00:06:54.779 --> 00:06:59.990 Matt Deutsch. N0RGT has been the chief engineer 00:06:59.990 --> 00:07:05.850 of WWV and WWVB for the National Institute of 00:07:05.850 --> 00:07:09.449 Standards and Technology in Fort Collins, Colorado 00:07:09.449 --> 00:07:16.110 since 1989. From 1979 to 1991 he was an electronics 00:07:16.110 --> 00:07:19.470 technician for the Coast Guard and Matt received 00:07:19.470 --> 00:07:23.850 his amateur radio license in 1992. So Matt, thanks 00:07:23.850 --> 00:07:27.089 for joining us tonight. Well, thank you Neil 00:07:27.089 --> 00:07:30.089 and greetings from the oldest continuously broadcasting 00:07:30.089 --> 00:07:33.149 radio station in the world. I am ready to go 00:07:33.149 --> 00:07:35.470 All right, and we've been we've been trying to 00:07:35.470 --> 00:07:38.790 get you on here for quite a while now and you've 00:07:38.790 --> 00:07:41.370 had some projects you've been working on that 00:07:41.370 --> 00:07:44.589 you wanted to finish up before You talked about 00:07:44.589 --> 00:07:47.970 those so we're we're excited to have you on but 00:07:47.970 --> 00:07:51.750 when I first was trying to get you on we had 00:07:53.089 --> 00:07:57.350 time where WWV was off the air and and that that 00:07:57.350 --> 00:08:00.709 really caught me by surprise because it seems 00:08:00.709 --> 00:08:04.350 like WWV is my my go -to reference and I think 00:08:04.350 --> 00:08:08.149 a lot of people are that way is Okay, let's see 00:08:08.149 --> 00:08:10.509 if this antenna works. Let's see if I can get 00:08:10.509 --> 00:08:16.350 WWV and so All of a sudden there was silence 00:08:16.730 --> 00:08:20.569 on one day, but it was a lot shorter than you 00:08:20.569 --> 00:08:23.649 thought it was. So tell us about being off the 00:08:23.649 --> 00:08:27.009 air for a while. What was going on with that 00:08:27.009 --> 00:08:29.509 and some of those upgrades that took place during 00:08:29.509 --> 00:08:33.889 that time? Yes, it was certainly as uncomfortable 00:08:33.889 --> 00:08:36.129 for us as I'm sure as it was for the listeners. 00:08:36.669 --> 00:08:39.529 We actually received word that we were going 00:08:39.529 --> 00:08:42.980 to get enough money to upgrade the generator 00:08:42.980 --> 00:08:46.580 and the switch gear and the backup UPS for the 00:08:46.580 --> 00:08:51.100 radio station. So we were able to contract that 00:08:51.100 --> 00:08:55.059 out, purchase a generator and but to do all the 00:08:55.059 --> 00:08:58.179 electrical work we needed to shut down the station 00:08:58.179 --> 00:09:01.059 for the safety of the contractor, needed to disconnect 00:09:01.059 --> 00:09:04.860 the station from commercial power and of course 00:09:04.860 --> 00:09:08.500 the generator was uninstalled so we had no power 00:09:08.500 --> 00:09:11.639 and he did a really good job and Actually got 00:09:11.639 --> 00:09:14.299 it done in less time than he said he would and 00:09:14.299 --> 00:09:16.799 so we were back on the air like you said a little 00:09:16.799 --> 00:09:20.139 earlier than we anticipated but certainly Do 00:09:20.139 --> 00:09:22.480 not like to be off the air for that amount of 00:09:22.480 --> 00:09:25.840 time and but the upgrades were sorely needed 00:09:25.840 --> 00:09:29.659 we were using a Caterpillar diesel generator 00:09:29.659 --> 00:09:32.419 that had been around since the 1960s when the 00:09:32.419 --> 00:09:36.210 station was first built and the associated switch 00:09:36.210 --> 00:09:38.129 gear that went with it. We were just starting 00:09:38.129 --> 00:09:41.470 to have a lot of problems with the generator 00:09:41.470 --> 00:09:44.649 and switch gear, though our power quality has 00:09:44.649 --> 00:09:47.690 improved over the years. The generator and switch 00:09:47.690 --> 00:09:50.230 gear were showing its age by sometimes we'd lose 00:09:50.230 --> 00:09:53.169 commercial power and the generator wouldn't start 00:09:53.169 --> 00:09:55.629 or it would start and not transfer to the building. 00:09:55.970 --> 00:09:58.889 And so the division said it's time to solve these 00:09:58.889 --> 00:10:02.769 problems and install a new generator. So we're 00:10:02.769 --> 00:10:06.590 very happy to do that. And of course, right before 00:10:06.590 --> 00:10:10.649 you guys were getting ready to do that, what 00:10:10.649 --> 00:10:15.730 happens? But the station goes off the air. Yeah, 00:10:15.730 --> 00:10:19.370 we, well, we did have, uh, during the, uh, you 00:10:19.370 --> 00:10:21.029 know, after everything was hooked up, we had 00:10:21.029 --> 00:10:24.809 a big snowstorm and, uh, that actually did knock 00:10:24.809 --> 00:10:26.970 us off the area and we lost commercial power. 00:10:27.149 --> 00:10:28.950 Every, everything was hooked up, but the generator 00:10:28.950 --> 00:10:32.639 wasn't ready to go and hadn't been, uh, completely 00:10:32.639 --> 00:10:34.580 installed yet. And so we're off the air for two 00:10:34.580 --> 00:10:39.860 or three hours. And so our transmitters are off 00:10:39.860 --> 00:10:41.799 because we have no generator. But we do have 00:10:41.799 --> 00:10:46.120 a UPS that keeps our timing equipment alive. 00:10:46.200 --> 00:10:47.940 It's sort of like the Olympic flame. We've got 00:10:47.940 --> 00:10:50.759 to keep the timing going. And so even though 00:10:50.759 --> 00:10:54.000 we don't have transmitters to transmit the time, 00:10:54.440 --> 00:10:57.860 we do keep the UPS on. But the UPS was running 00:10:57.860 --> 00:11:00.240 down because we didn't have a generator to recharge 00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:04.210 the UPS. It was a close shave. We almost lost 00:11:04.210 --> 00:11:07.070 our timing, but the commercial power came back 00:11:07.070 --> 00:11:10.809 just in a nick of time. Well, that's Murphy for 00:11:10.809 --> 00:11:13.789 you. You're playing on something, and of course 00:11:13.789 --> 00:11:17.289 the thing never goes down. And then of course 00:11:17.289 --> 00:11:20.090 when your generator's off to switch this out, 00:11:20.330 --> 00:11:27.919 that's the time that this has to happen. Yeah 00:11:27.919 --> 00:11:30.899 Well, you're back on the on the air and you've 00:11:30.899 --> 00:11:34.179 got the the new generator there, which sounds 00:11:34.179 --> 00:11:37.340 like it's working out real Well, so why don't 00:11:37.340 --> 00:11:40.519 you tell us a little bit about how you do get 00:11:40.519 --> 00:11:44.980 the timing from in it in IST and how you get 00:11:44.980 --> 00:11:49.480 that to audio and then how you get that Transmitted 00:11:49.480 --> 00:11:53.100 out with with your antennas and ERP and all that 00:11:53.100 --> 00:11:55.899 kind of stuff and tell us how you how you deliver 00:11:55.899 --> 00:12:00.110 all time all the time. Well, I'd be glad to. 00:12:00.309 --> 00:12:03.149 It's a pretty straightforward process, a lot 00:12:03.149 --> 00:12:05.409 of redundancy, of course, built into it so that 00:12:05.409 --> 00:12:10.289 we don't make timing mistakes. But the actual 00:12:10.289 --> 00:12:12.950 atomic clock, the national standard is in Boulder, 00:12:12.990 --> 00:12:16.730 Colorado, at the Department of Commerce laboratories 00:12:16.730 --> 00:12:19.909 in Boulder. And they got all the fancy stuff, 00:12:19.929 --> 00:12:22.730 the Mazers and the fountains and the cesiums 00:12:22.730 --> 00:12:28.490 and all that. And so What we do is that we have 00:12:28.490 --> 00:12:32.190 a smaller time scale here at the station of bank 00:12:32.190 --> 00:12:35.409 of cesiums. And we average the time of all our 00:12:35.409 --> 00:12:38.409 cesiums together. So we come up with what we 00:12:38.409 --> 00:12:41.250 think the time is. And the folks in Boulder have 00:12:41.250 --> 00:12:43.149 theirs. And by definition, they're the correct 00:12:43.149 --> 00:12:45.590 time. So they have a certain time. And what we 00:12:45.590 --> 00:12:49.009 do is use a GPS satellite as it's going over. 00:12:49.429 --> 00:12:54.360 And we compare our one pulse per second. to the 00:12:54.360 --> 00:12:59.200 GPS and then the folks in Boulder do the same 00:12:59.200 --> 00:13:02.259 thing looking at the same satellite and we compare 00:13:02.259 --> 00:13:05.860 the times and it's analogous to say you have 00:13:05.860 --> 00:13:09.879 a clock tower in a town with a clock on it and 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:12.220 you agree with someone that you want to compare 00:13:12.220 --> 00:13:17.379 times you tell them at exactly 12 noon look at 00:13:17.379 --> 00:13:19.320 your watch and see what time it is and I'll look 00:13:19.320 --> 00:13:22.279 at mine and so at 12 noon you know the guy looks 00:13:22.279 --> 00:13:25.460 at his watch and it's 1159 the other guy looks 00:13:25.460 --> 00:13:28.779 at his watch and he is 1201 and if the by definition 00:13:28.779 --> 00:13:33.019 the guy that's 1159 is the correct time then 00:13:33.019 --> 00:13:34.960 the other guy is two minutes slow and he needs 00:13:34.960 --> 00:13:37.960 to correct himself and so the clock tower falls 00:13:37.960 --> 00:13:40.440 out of the equation so you know a lot of people 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:42.639 have said oh well you're using gps time it's 00:13:42.639 --> 00:13:45.500 like well we use it as a reference we used to 00:13:45.500 --> 00:13:48.480 use a tele television signal it was called a 00:13:48.480 --> 00:13:51.960 line 10 system to compare the time in the past 00:13:51.960 --> 00:13:55.360 but now we use gps and since there's always satellites 00:13:55.360 --> 00:13:57.879 up all day long we can compare it continuously 00:13:57.879 --> 00:14:00.620 and always steer our clocks to the boulder clocks 00:14:00.620 --> 00:14:05.909 quite easily That's common view is what it's 00:14:05.909 --> 00:14:10.929 called and then so then we take that to our our 00:14:10.929 --> 00:14:13.769 sees our clock then puts out an ultra pure 5 00:14:13.769 --> 00:14:16.809 megahertz good to you know one part and 10 to 00:14:16.809 --> 00:14:21.629 the negative 13 and that is fed to the both radio 00:14:21.629 --> 00:14:25.690 stations WWV is here and WWV be the 60 kilohertz 00:14:25.690 --> 00:14:29.259 station Five megahertz is then fed to both stations 00:14:29.259 --> 00:14:32.919 and fed to the time code generators. And the 00:14:32.919 --> 00:14:35.379 time code generators then slice and dice that. 00:14:36.059 --> 00:14:38.899 It comes up with the one pulse per second. The 00:14:38.899 --> 00:14:42.519 ticks that you hear is from, we have a counter 00:14:42.519 --> 00:14:45.240 inside the time code generator. It takes the 00:14:45.240 --> 00:14:48.000 five megahertz, counts five million counts and 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:51.000 puts out a one second pulse. And then that, you 00:14:51.000 --> 00:14:54.980 know, we create audio out of that and our carrier 00:14:54.980 --> 00:14:59.889 frequencies. and all the other ticks, tones that 00:14:59.889 --> 00:15:02.009 you hear, and like I said, the carrier frequencies, 00:15:02.049 --> 00:15:05.110 and they feed the transmitters with the audio 00:15:05.110 --> 00:15:09.509 and produce the carrier signal. And we actually 00:15:09.509 --> 00:15:14.669 modulate the transmitters using desktop signal 00:15:14.669 --> 00:15:17.690 generators. We just put the five megahertz in 00:15:17.690 --> 00:15:21.370 as a reference. We put the audio in as a modulating 00:15:21.370 --> 00:15:25.210 signal, an external signal, and then we can modulate. 00:15:26.850 --> 00:15:31.210 whatever frequency we choose, 5, 10, 15, so on. 00:15:31.950 --> 00:15:34.190 And then we just send that to the transmitter 00:15:34.190 --> 00:15:37.090 at a low level and then it is amplified and the 00:15:37.090 --> 00:15:40.490 transmitter goes out to the antennas, which are, 00:15:40.490 --> 00:15:43.389 you know, there's always much debate about exactly 00:15:43.389 --> 00:15:46.169 what to call them, but they are quarter wave 00:15:46.169 --> 00:15:49.250 radiating element and they're on top of a quarter 00:15:49.250 --> 00:15:54.740 wave grounded antenna. tower section and there's 00:15:54.740 --> 00:15:56.799 insulators in the in the middle that separate 00:15:56.799 --> 00:15:59.620 the two and so their feed point is right in the 00:15:59.620 --> 00:16:03.440 middle and so the top quarter wave section is 00:16:03.440 --> 00:16:05.559 radiating and it has a ground plane that goes 00:16:05.559 --> 00:16:10.080 down at a 45 degree angle to give us the 50 ohm 00:16:10.080 --> 00:16:13.159 input impedance to the matched transmitters and 00:16:13.159 --> 00:16:18.450 signal goes out there omnidirectional Okay, and 00:16:18.450 --> 00:16:22.690 what kind of power and what kind of ERP do you 00:16:22.690 --> 00:16:26.289 get from all of that? And is it the same on each 00:16:26.289 --> 00:16:30.629 band? Yeah, we broadcast, you know, technically 00:16:30.629 --> 00:16:33.649 I guess 2 .5 megahertz is not in the HF band, 00:16:33.649 --> 00:16:37.149 but we always say it is, and so our lowest frequency 00:16:37.149 --> 00:16:40.990 is 2 .5 megahertz, and then we broadcast on 5, 00:16:40.990 --> 00:16:44.730 10, 15, 20, and a new addition in the past couple 00:16:44.730 --> 00:16:49.000 years is 25 megahertz. The three big ones 510 00:16:49.000 --> 00:16:52.740 and 15 are 10 kilowatt radiated power and then 00:16:52.740 --> 00:16:56.200 the Other transmissions are all two and a half 00:16:56.200 --> 00:17:02.440 kilowatts Okay, very good so we're listening 00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:07.960 to to all time all the time and Checking out 00:17:07.960 --> 00:17:11.700 to see if we can You know get our in antennas 00:17:11.700 --> 00:17:17.470 to work, but you're able to hit all kinds of 00:17:17.470 --> 00:17:21.529 devices all over the country with that signal 00:17:21.529 --> 00:17:28.109 that sync up to that digital information that 00:17:28.109 --> 00:17:32.410 you send out as well. So I'm kind of surprised 00:17:32.410 --> 00:17:36.150 that the power is not a little higher than that. 00:17:37.289 --> 00:17:45.549 For the HF? Yeah. As I'm sure the ham community, 00:17:45.750 --> 00:17:49.730 the people that work on HF, propagation seems 00:17:49.730 --> 00:17:52.450 to be king. If you can put out all the power 00:17:52.450 --> 00:17:54.950 in the world and not get a signal through, or 00:17:54.950 --> 00:17:58.309 you can put out a very small signal, and if propagation's 00:17:58.309 --> 00:18:02.990 in your favor, it goes really far. So we had 00:18:02.990 --> 00:18:05.569 to reach a compromise at some power level when 00:18:05.569 --> 00:18:08.769 they designed the station. And virtually, we 00:18:08.769 --> 00:18:10.769 hear from just about every corner of the world. 00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:15.339 We've heard from the South Pole down there. They've 00:18:15.339 --> 00:18:17.660 written to us and said, you know, signals booming 00:18:17.660 --> 00:18:21.960 in. And we've also heard from, like, South Africa 00:18:21.960 --> 00:18:25.819 and Madagascar are sort of the furthest large 00:18:25.819 --> 00:18:28.720 areas from us. We're right below us is the Indian 00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:32.859 Ocean. But as far as large cities, you know, 00:18:32.859 --> 00:18:36.319 in South Africa, they've picked up both the 60 00:18:36.319 --> 00:18:40.359 kilohertz broadcast and some of our HF frequencies. 00:18:41.049 --> 00:18:43.710 pretty much can, you know, if you got the right 00:18:43.710 --> 00:18:47.009 equipment, cover the world at the receiving end. 00:18:47.569 --> 00:18:52.069 Yeah, it does really, really well. So that's 00:18:52.069 --> 00:18:55.769 pretty cool that it's heard all over the world. 00:18:56.529 --> 00:19:00.029 Well, you've been working on another project, 00:19:00.029 --> 00:19:02.470 and that's the one we've been kind of waiting 00:19:02.470 --> 00:19:07.359 on here for you to finish up. So Tell us about 00:19:07.359 --> 00:19:12.220 this new project you've been working on and I 00:19:12.220 --> 00:19:14.660 think there's a there's a little history behind 00:19:14.660 --> 00:19:20.839 that too Yes You know a lot of people know we 00:19:20.839 --> 00:19:24.420 used to broadcast on 25 megahertz back in the 00:19:24.420 --> 00:19:27.099 60s and 70s and then you know with the energy 00:19:27.099 --> 00:19:29.900 crunch in the 70s those of us who remember that 00:19:30.750 --> 00:19:33.009 You know, energy was considered very expensive. 00:19:33.230 --> 00:19:35.390 And so they they wanted to do away with the 20 00:19:35.390 --> 00:19:39.690 and 25 megahertz broadcast to save power. And 00:19:39.690 --> 00:19:43.009 they decided to keep the 20, but the 25 was gone. 00:19:43.930 --> 00:19:47.869 And so all this time, all these years, you know, 00:19:47.930 --> 00:19:52.170 energy isn't a big cost factor like it used to 00:19:52.170 --> 00:19:57.029 be back then. So, you know, about four years 00:19:57.029 --> 00:20:03.130 ago, we had an outage on 20 megahertz and Dean 00:20:03.130 --> 00:20:07.529 Lewis W9WGV wrote to me to let me know that we 00:20:07.529 --> 00:20:10.170 had an outage and I just want to know if it was 00:20:10.170 --> 00:20:13.029 his equipment or ours and I said it's our equipment 00:20:13.029 --> 00:20:16.289 went off for just a minute and he said boy I 00:20:16.289 --> 00:20:19.450 assured you missed the 25 megahertz and I was 00:20:19.450 --> 00:20:22.150 reading the email to the technicians and they 00:20:22.150 --> 00:20:24.730 said well why don't we put the 25 back on what 00:20:24.730 --> 00:20:27.069 what's the big deal why do we have it off anyway 00:20:27.069 --> 00:20:30.859 you know it's not you know as far as power consumption, 00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:35.140 you know, the 60 kilohertz WWDB, you know, broadcast 00:20:35.140 --> 00:20:38.480 70 kilowatts, you know, another two and a half 00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:42.400 kilowatts is in the noise. So, you know, so they 00:20:42.400 --> 00:20:44.240 said, let's put it back on the air. And so I 00:20:44.240 --> 00:20:46.220 wrote back and told Dean, you know, we're for 00:20:46.220 --> 00:20:48.359 a couple hours, we'll put it on the air, you 00:20:48.359 --> 00:20:50.619 know, for old time's sake. And we put it on the 00:20:50.619 --> 00:20:53.740 air. And within a little while, a gentleman in 00:20:53.740 --> 00:20:56.539 Scotland wrote us and said, Are you on 25 megahertz? 00:20:56.700 --> 00:21:00.789 So he was the first to hear us all the way in 00:21:00.789 --> 00:21:03.670 Scotland. We were only doing one kilowatt at 00:21:03.670 --> 00:21:07.069 the time, but it was during the better part of 00:21:07.069 --> 00:21:11.170 the sunspot cycle. So I called the broadcast 00:21:11.170 --> 00:21:14.970 manager, asked him if we'd be able to stay on 00:21:14.970 --> 00:21:18.650 the 25 for a couple days, and he was at a Rockies 00:21:18.650 --> 00:21:22.210 game in Denver, and he called back during the 00:21:22.210 --> 00:21:23.829 seventh inning stretch and said, yeah, sure, 00:21:23.930 --> 00:21:30.190 go ahead, let's do this for a little while. So 00:21:30.190 --> 00:21:32.650 the response was overwhelming. We heard from 00:21:32.650 --> 00:21:34.730 so many people saying, oh, thank you so much. 00:21:35.190 --> 00:21:38.450 Please keep it on if you can. And so we pretty 00:21:38.450 --> 00:21:42.009 much just never shut it off. It's still on. But 00:21:42.009 --> 00:21:45.329 at one point, I was reading an article in QST 00:21:45.329 --> 00:21:52.049 by Eric Nichols, KL7AJ. And this was February 00:21:52.049 --> 00:21:56.920 2013 article. And he was saying, you know, amateurs 00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:00.359 need to contribute to the radio art. We do a 00:22:00.359 --> 00:22:03.039 lot of talking, but we should be doing some science, 00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:06.599 too. So I was intrigued. He talked about channel 00:22:06.599 --> 00:22:11.220 probes and stuff like that. And so I wrote to 00:22:11.220 --> 00:22:15.039 him and said, I'm kind of confined here by exactly 00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:17.359 as much as I can do. I can't change the broadcast 00:22:17.359 --> 00:22:21.960 any. And the signal has to be pretty much omnidirectional. 00:22:22.359 --> 00:22:24.220 You know, that just pretty much leaves me with 00:22:24.220 --> 00:22:27.319 an antenna that I can fiddle with. Is there something 00:22:27.319 --> 00:22:31.359 that would be of interest to amateur radio scientists 00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:34.420 that would be helpful? And he said, well, a turnstile 00:22:34.420 --> 00:22:37.099 antenna would, you know, you could broadcast 00:22:37.099 --> 00:22:40.720 for a few minutes horizontal north -south, horizontal 00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:43.839 east -west. and do a right -hand circularization 00:22:43.839 --> 00:22:46.759 and then do a left -hand circularization and 00:22:46.759 --> 00:22:49.599 then a vertical, go back to the vertical and 00:22:49.599 --> 00:22:51.400 go between those different modes. And he said, 00:22:51.420 --> 00:22:53.119 you know, we could probably learn a lot about 00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:56.160 the ionosphere doing that. So I've been pecking 00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:59.539 away at it here for about two years, you know, 00:22:59.640 --> 00:23:03.339 trying to shoehorn it in around the other things 00:23:03.339 --> 00:23:05.259 going on at the station. And that's why it's 00:23:05.259 --> 00:23:09.460 taken so long. I can't give it a high priority 00:23:09.460 --> 00:23:12.960 since it's just an experiment. I've learned a 00:23:12.960 --> 00:23:15.559 lot. I had to dust off the Smith chart, which 00:23:15.559 --> 00:23:20.240 I haven't looked at in 25 years. That thing is 00:23:20.240 --> 00:23:24.539 fantastic. I would encourage anyone who works 00:23:24.539 --> 00:23:27.019 with matching antennas, and that's the tricky 00:23:27.019 --> 00:23:29.720 bit, matching the antenna to the transmission 00:23:29.720 --> 00:23:35.160 line. The Smith chart is amazing. I was looking 00:23:35.160 --> 00:23:39.220 in my old double RL handbook, you know, our antenna 00:23:39.220 --> 00:23:42.319 book from like the 1990s and they had a really 00:23:42.319 --> 00:23:44.259 good treatment of it there and learned a lot. 00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:48.400 And so the ideas for matching an antenna to a 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:51.059 feed line are pretty numerous. And so, you know, 00:23:51.220 --> 00:23:54.400 being a ham, I wanted to choose the optimum solution, 00:23:54.400 --> 00:23:57.279 but I was realizing I didn't have time to go 00:23:57.279 --> 00:24:00.759 through the many, many solutions. So. we came 00:24:00.759 --> 00:24:03.859 up just with right now we're just feeding it 00:24:03.859 --> 00:24:06.400 it's on the air right now left hand circular 00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:11.019 polarization 25 megahertz and it's not changing 00:24:11.019 --> 00:24:14.079 to any other direction or mode it's just left 00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:16.099 hand polarization for now and i wanted to have 00:24:16.099 --> 00:24:20.059 that up and running for the solar eclipse if 00:24:20.059 --> 00:24:24.500 anyone could use it and so it's been that way 00:24:24.500 --> 00:24:27.819 i need to put it back on the vertical polarization 00:24:27.819 --> 00:24:32.559 and work more on the other different modes of 00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:36.279 polarization. So looking forward to doing that. 00:24:37.700 --> 00:24:40.319 And if KL7 AJ is out there listening, he needs 00:24:40.319 --> 00:24:44.559 to call in and tell us more about channel probes 00:24:44.559 --> 00:24:47.339 or you need to do a show with him on channel 00:24:47.339 --> 00:24:51.799 probes. Once this thing's built, it's going to 00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:53.599 be up to him or someone else who knows a lot 00:24:53.599 --> 00:24:56.680 about the ionosphere to explain to people how 00:24:56.680 --> 00:24:59.140 to use it. I'll build it. We just need someone 00:24:59.140 --> 00:25:02.180 to explain what to do next, how to do the science. 00:25:03.119 --> 00:25:06.180 I'm looking forward to some input. Yeah, there's 00:25:06.180 --> 00:25:09.460 some cool science that happened with the Eclipse 00:25:09.460 --> 00:25:13.380 looking at the ionosphere out at NJIT this week. 00:25:14.319 --> 00:25:17.099 I'm looking forward to hearing some of the results 00:25:17.099 --> 00:25:21.609 from them and find out. what all they were able 00:25:21.609 --> 00:25:24.970 to learn from the Solar Eclipse Q So party on 00:25:24.970 --> 00:25:29.450 Monday. And so it sounds like there could be 00:25:29.450 --> 00:25:33.369 some stuff there. And, you know, I remember, 00:25:33.369 --> 00:25:37.309 you know, back to the 70s, you know, WWV is always 00:25:37.309 --> 00:25:40.529 kind of been the, you know, the standard that 00:25:40.529 --> 00:25:43.529 was the reference that always used to see, well, 00:25:43.670 --> 00:25:46.910 how's the band today, you know, and see how well 00:25:47.859 --> 00:25:53.240 WWV's coming in, and of course set my clock and 00:25:53.240 --> 00:25:58.900 everything, but I think I use that as kind of 00:25:58.900 --> 00:26:03.279 a beacon kind of thing, a reference as much as 00:26:03.279 --> 00:26:08.900 I do the time. So I'm glad you guys are able 00:26:08.900 --> 00:26:13.539 to do that and on the air, given all that information. 00:26:14.160 --> 00:26:16.000 A lot of people have written to me and said, 00:26:16.339 --> 00:26:18.079 well, you know, this is really good for like 00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:21.380 sporadic E and, you know, obviously now that 00:26:21.380 --> 00:26:23.960 we're at the end of the sunspot cycle, you know, 00:26:24.059 --> 00:26:26.460 things like sporadic E and meteor scatter appear 00:26:26.460 --> 00:26:28.900 to be popular too. A lot of people using it for 00:26:28.900 --> 00:26:31.559 that. So yeah, like you say, time, you know, 00:26:31.779 --> 00:26:34.319 people might set their clock to it, but it is 00:26:34.319 --> 00:26:38.720 useful as a probe for other science. So I certainly 00:26:38.720 --> 00:26:43.369 encourage people to do that. Okay, very good. 00:26:43.430 --> 00:26:46.869 Well, we are going to take a break and then we're 00:26:46.869 --> 00:26:50.170 going to come back and take your calls with Matt. 00:26:50.750 --> 00:26:53.069 And so if you have a question about any of this 00:26:53.069 --> 00:26:54.950 stuff we've been talking about or some other 00:26:54.950 --> 00:26:59.269 question about WWV, give us a call. The number 00:26:59.269 --> 00:27:06.890 is 812. or give us a tweet or a call on Skype. 00:27:07.029 --> 00:27:09.910 So I'll be back and we'll do that right after 00:27:09.910 --> 00:27:12.710 this message from Tower Electronics right here 00:27:12.710 --> 00:27:16.390 on HamTalk Live. This episode of HamTalk Live 00:27:16.390 --> 00:27:19.170 is brought to you in part by Tower Electronics. 00:27:19.369 --> 00:27:21.789 Tower Electronics has been the Ham's Dime Store 00:27:21.789 --> 00:27:25.190 since 1978. When you need connectors, mobile 00:27:25.190 --> 00:27:28.450 and handheld antennas, cables or adapters, visit 00:27:28.450 --> 00:27:32.029 Scott or Jill at a HamFest near you. Or you can 00:27:32.029 --> 00:27:38.230 order online at PL -259 .com or call 920 -435 00:27:38.230 --> 00:27:43.250 -2973. Stock up on those supplies like PL -259 00:27:43.250 --> 00:27:46.529 and end connectors, SMA adapters, audio cables, 00:27:46.809 --> 00:27:49.970 soldering supplies, mobile antennas, and hamsticks. 00:27:50.230 --> 00:27:52.369 Their silver -plated end connectors are even 00:27:52.369 --> 00:27:55.029 used on the International Space Station. Tower 00:27:55.029 --> 00:27:58.849 Electronics carries MFJ, Comet, Daiwa, OPEC, 00:27:59.089 --> 00:28:02.349 Workman, and HamPro products. And don't miss 00:28:02.349 --> 00:28:06.430 their 0 % off sale going on now! Tower Electronics 00:28:06.430 --> 00:28:10.670 online at PL -259 .com, proud to sponsor this 00:28:10.670 --> 00:28:18.829 episode of HamTalk Live. My shack are yours. 00:28:20.609 --> 00:28:23.470 Join the conversation. Call us on voice with 00:28:23.470 --> 00:28:27.250 Skype at HamTalk Live or give us a call at 812 00:28:27.250 --> 00:28:33.650 -NET -HAM -1. That's 812 -638 -4261. Now here's 00:28:33.650 --> 00:28:37.710 more HamTalk Live. And thanks to Scott and Jill 00:28:37.710 --> 00:28:39.930 at Tower Electronics for sponsoring the show 00:28:39.930 --> 00:28:43.009 tonight to help bring you HamTalk Live. Coming 00:28:43.009 --> 00:28:46.309 up, they will be at Shelby, North Carolina on 00:28:46.309 --> 00:28:50.509 September 1st, 2nd and 3rd. September 10th, they'll 00:28:50.509 --> 00:28:54.150 be in Findley, Ohio and then September 15th and 00:28:54.150 --> 00:28:58.750 16th at the Superfest in Peoria, Illinois. So 00:28:58.750 --> 00:29:01.710 give them a call. If you can't make it to any 00:29:01.710 --> 00:29:08.789 of those at 920 -435 -2973 or visit them online 00:29:08.789 --> 00:29:12.970 at PL -259 .com. Tell them We heard it on HamTalk 00:29:12.970 --> 00:29:15.470 Live, had a chance to hang out with them a little 00:29:15.470 --> 00:29:20.730 bit down in Huntsville this past weekend. Scott, 00:29:20.730 --> 00:29:26.309 he took care of my connector needs again. I needed 00:29:26.309 --> 00:29:31.849 some adapters for school and he took care of 00:29:31.849 --> 00:29:36.430 me yet again. So thanks to Scott for supporting 00:29:36.430 --> 00:29:42.210 the school effort as well where I teach. And 00:29:42.210 --> 00:29:46.089 for visiting and it was great to see them. So 00:29:46.089 --> 00:29:49.410 Hope if you got to Huntsville you you had a good 00:29:49.410 --> 00:29:52.750 time and got to see hammy hammy was running around 00:29:52.750 --> 00:29:56.849 we've been putting some pictures up from hammy's 00:29:56.849 --> 00:30:01.170 visit to the youth lounge and was Going around 00:30:01.170 --> 00:30:03.670 visiting with people and so we had a good time 00:30:03.670 --> 00:30:07.119 down in Huntsville. So If you haven't been, you 00:30:07.119 --> 00:30:10.119 ought to check that one out. Well, it's time 00:30:10.119 --> 00:30:13.400 for your calls now. So if you have a question 00:30:13.400 --> 00:30:17.859 about WWV for Matt, give us a call at Again, 00:30:17.960 --> 00:30:25.839 the number is 812 -NET -HAM -1. That's 812 -638 00:30:25.839 --> 00:30:30.420 -4261. Or you can Skype us. Just look for HamTalk 00:30:30.420 --> 00:30:33.200 Live on Skype. We're there. And you can also 00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:37.640 tweet us at HamTalk Live if you would want to 00:30:37.640 --> 00:30:41.740 do that. And you know, I was joking around with 00:30:41.740 --> 00:30:47.519 the all time, all the time slogan. A few months 00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:50.539 ago on the show we played this little comedy 00:30:50.539 --> 00:30:54.779 routine that was you know if if WWV was owned 00:30:54.779 --> 00:30:59.299 by clear channel the I heart people That you 00:30:59.299 --> 00:31:01.819 know do all the slogans and everything they had 00:31:01.819 --> 00:31:08.480 all these punny slogans for time so Have you 00:31:08.480 --> 00:31:12.420 ever thought of trying to use some kind of a 00:31:12.420 --> 00:31:18.299 slogan for WWV Well, you know the All the time 00:31:18.299 --> 00:31:21.480 all the time is been so far the best one I think 00:31:21.480 --> 00:31:23.920 any of us have ever heard I haven't come up with 00:31:23.920 --> 00:31:27.740 a better one yet. So if anyone's got any ideas, 00:31:27.740 --> 00:31:32.200 you know that certainly will listen but that 00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:34.720 seems to be the best one so far and that that 00:31:34.720 --> 00:31:37.099 ad about Clear Channel buying us out that gave 00:31:37.099 --> 00:31:45.640 a lot of people heartburn we got a lot of We 00:31:45.640 --> 00:31:47.859 didn't know about it. It was a surprise to us. 00:31:48.259 --> 00:31:50.240 We may have to pull that out of the archives 00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:53.059 here in a minute, but the voice on there, I guess, 00:31:53.380 --> 00:31:56.740 was actually the voice, the real voice of WWV 00:31:56.740 --> 00:32:00.900 for a while. Is that right? Yeah, I guess you'd 00:32:00.900 --> 00:32:03.880 have to ask the creator of that. It certainly 00:32:03.880 --> 00:32:11.079 sounded like it. Like I said a lot of people 00:32:11.079 --> 00:32:13.200 were upset when they they heard that they didn't 00:32:13.200 --> 00:32:15.180 get that it was a joke something You know just 00:32:15.180 --> 00:32:19.460 a small handful of people, but yeah, I Sure sounded 00:32:19.460 --> 00:32:24.559 like Don Elliott Yeah, Doug Grant not not k1dg 00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:27.779 the other Doug Grant told me it was the real 00:32:27.779 --> 00:32:32.880 real voice of wwv for a while so That's pretty 00:32:32.880 --> 00:32:34.720 cool. Now. What were you telling me about the 00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:39.490 voice that's on now? Well, as everyone knows, 00:32:39.690 --> 00:32:44.650 Don Elliott was the voice of WWE forever. And 00:32:44.650 --> 00:32:50.470 until August of 1991, August 13, 1991, we actually 00:32:50.470 --> 00:32:52.869 contracted to get some new time code generators. 00:32:53.990 --> 00:32:57.069 And Don Elliott's voice was on a big magnetic 00:32:57.069 --> 00:33:01.809 drum. It was like a big cassette tape that It 00:33:01.809 --> 00:33:05.049 was about a foot in diameter, and it just sort 00:33:05.049 --> 00:33:08.009 of slowly rotated. And it had all these different 00:33:08.009 --> 00:33:12.410 heads that sat above it that were elevated above 00:33:12.410 --> 00:33:19.289 the magnetic loop. And as the time announcement 00:33:19.289 --> 00:33:22.609 came up, it would, of course, donnelly, it sat 00:33:22.609 --> 00:33:24.609 in the studio and said one, two, three, four, 00:33:24.710 --> 00:33:28.549 and 10, 20, 30, 40. And so the computer, or what 00:33:28.549 --> 00:33:32.329 you would call a computer, put together those 00:33:32.329 --> 00:33:35.789 minutes and seconds and announcements to announce 00:33:35.789 --> 00:33:39.230 the time each time. And so when the right moment 00:33:39.230 --> 00:33:41.130 came around, the head would fall and say, you 00:33:41.130 --> 00:33:43.230 know, at the tone, and then another head would 00:33:43.230 --> 00:33:46.690 fall down and say, you know, so many hours, minutes, 00:33:46.789 --> 00:33:51.670 UTC. And so that was the voice of WWE forever. 00:33:53.130 --> 00:33:56.450 And then we digitized, well, we went to a digital 00:33:56.450 --> 00:34:00.700 system, the new time code generator, and The 00:34:00.700 --> 00:34:05.259 broadcast manager at the time, I wish he'd put 00:34:05.259 --> 00:34:07.660 a crowbar in his wallet because we didn't own 00:34:07.660 --> 00:34:11.960 The Voice. It was, I think, Autocron owned The 00:34:11.960 --> 00:34:14.860 Voice. That was their equipment. We leased it, 00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:16.380 and they said, well, we'll sell it to you for 00:34:16.380 --> 00:34:19.599 $3 ,000. And I wish he had done that. And he 00:34:19.599 --> 00:34:21.139 said, no, we're going to save money. We're going 00:34:21.139 --> 00:34:24.440 to go with somebody else. And they hired Lee 00:34:24.440 --> 00:34:29.110 Rogers of KSFO and John Doyle. to sit in a studio 00:34:29.110 --> 00:34:33.130 and say all those things. And we put Lee Rogers' 00:34:33.190 --> 00:34:36.530 voice on. And of course, going from Don Elliott 00:34:36.530 --> 00:34:39.090 to anybody, nobody liked that. So everybody called 00:34:39.090 --> 00:34:41.809 in and complained for a long time. And so then 00:34:41.809 --> 00:34:47.619 we went with John Doyle. You know, people were 00:34:47.619 --> 00:34:50.300 still unhappy, but you know, the trouble we went 00:34:50.300 --> 00:34:53.320 through on the complaints we got, I wish we had 00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:55.639 just paid the $3 ,000. I wish I'd taken that 00:34:55.639 --> 00:34:57.500 out of my pocket and paid it because it would 00:34:57.500 --> 00:35:00.460 have been so much easier than all the trouble 00:35:00.460 --> 00:35:03.599 it caused. But John Doyle is actually the voice 00:35:03.599 --> 00:35:06.679 now, and if you look at the Wikipedia page, I 00:35:06.679 --> 00:35:08.480 think it's backwards, and I think that's my fault. 00:35:08.840 --> 00:35:11.480 I told the technician, one of our technicians 00:35:11.480 --> 00:35:16.079 was being interviewed, and I told him backwards. 00:35:16.349 --> 00:35:19.269 and it got put in the Wikipedia article backwards. 00:35:19.630 --> 00:35:21.949 So that needs to be fixed. But John Doyle is 00:35:21.949 --> 00:35:24.829 the voice now, and Lee Rogers was the voice for 00:35:24.829 --> 00:35:30.690 a little while back in 1991 or 92. So that's 00:35:30.690 --> 00:35:34.670 the way it stands now. All right. Well, let's 00:35:34.670 --> 00:35:36.750 just go ahead and listen to this. This is just 00:35:36.750 --> 00:35:38.730 under a minute here. We'll go ahead and listen 00:35:38.730 --> 00:35:42.769 to this. Now this is a spoof. This isn't real, 00:35:42.809 --> 00:35:48.349 but this is somebody's Joke of what would happen 00:35:48.349 --> 00:35:53.570 if? WWV was run by commercial broadcasters, so 00:35:53.570 --> 00:36:03.269 here it is WWV all the time all the time Same 00:36:03.269 --> 00:36:12.250 time same station every time WWV One two three 00:36:12.250 --> 00:36:19.820 four Every second counts at WWV. For a good time, 00:36:19.820 --> 00:36:29.480 call 555 -4 -WWV. WWV, for the time of your life. 00:36:32.699 --> 00:36:35.500 We'll be back with the time on WWV in just a 00:36:35.500 --> 00:36:40.400 minute. But first, here's another minute. Alright, 00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:44.219 so there you go. There's another minute. in another 00:36:44.219 --> 00:36:49.440 minute, so. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, it is. It's 00:36:49.440 --> 00:36:52.820 well, it's well done. I laughed and laughed and 00:36:52.820 --> 00:36:55.099 played it over and over again when I found that 00:36:55.099 --> 00:36:59.619 and just, you know, heard that same thing over 00:36:59.619 --> 00:37:03.059 and over again on WWV so much. And then here 00:37:03.059 --> 00:37:07.059 comes all time all the time. Yeah, I played it 00:37:07.059 --> 00:37:08.500 for a lot of my friends. They thought it was 00:37:08.500 --> 00:37:12.980 pretty funny. So, very good. Well, hey, give 00:37:12.980 --> 00:37:20.699 us a call. It's 812 -NATAM -1, 812 -638 -4261. 00:37:21.239 --> 00:37:24.079 And actually, we've got a question here in the 00:37:24.079 --> 00:37:28.079 chat from Carl, KD9HQT, and wants to know, will 00:37:28.079 --> 00:37:32.719 the voices for WWV and WWVH change in the future? 00:37:34.320 --> 00:37:37.460 Will they change we have no plans for changing 00:37:37.460 --> 00:37:42.239 them Jane Barbie is actually the voice They did 00:37:42.239 --> 00:37:46.679 digitize her voice. I think they NBS owned her 00:37:46.679 --> 00:37:49.679 voice and they did our she went into the studio 00:37:49.679 --> 00:37:54.139 maybe and rerecorded but yeah, it's all Been 00:37:54.139 --> 00:37:57.420 digitized and it's all the voices sit on little 00:37:57.420 --> 00:37:59.820 chips and inside the timecode generators and 00:37:59.820 --> 00:38:01.900 they'll play the right pieces at the right time, 00:38:02.099 --> 00:38:08.559 but we have no plans to change the voices. And 00:38:08.559 --> 00:38:11.139 we would like to change the announcement at the 00:38:11.139 --> 00:38:13.179 top of the hour, because it doesn't include the 00:38:13.179 --> 00:38:19.619 25 megahertz. But it's going to be a technological 00:38:19.619 --> 00:38:23.679 nightmare. So we'll just have to say somewhere 00:38:23.679 --> 00:38:27.679 else we're on 25 megahertz. All right, very good. 00:38:27.800 --> 00:38:30.650 Well, again, if you... If you want to get in 00:38:30.650 --> 00:38:33.289 here, we've got about three or four minutes left. 00:38:33.690 --> 00:38:38.210 So give us a call at 812 -638 -4261 or tweet 00:38:38.210 --> 00:38:44.010 us or get on the chat here. Now, while we're 00:38:44.010 --> 00:38:46.250 waiting to see if we get anybody here, let's 00:38:46.250 --> 00:38:49.449 talk a little bit about the time correction because 00:38:49.449 --> 00:38:52.550 every once in a while you got to throw in an 00:38:52.550 --> 00:38:56.980 extra second. So how do you do that? Well, that's 00:38:56.980 --> 00:38:59.239 it. Yeah, it's a everyone's favorite subject 00:38:59.239 --> 00:39:01.480 and that gets us a lot of publicity, you know 00:39:01.480 --> 00:39:04.760 the radio stations and TV stations in Denver 00:39:04.760 --> 00:39:08.880 and Across the country are interested in that 00:39:08.880 --> 00:39:12.639 The their the leap seconds and not being random. 00:39:12.639 --> 00:39:17.050 They are irregular uh... not random but uh... 00:39:17.050 --> 00:39:19.989 every few months maybe every eighteen months 00:39:19.989 --> 00:39:23.090 twenty four months we do put one in i think it 00:39:23.090 --> 00:39:25.849 was last december we were putting one in and 00:39:25.849 --> 00:39:30.050 uh... that's because the earth's rotation is 00:39:30.050 --> 00:39:34.329 slowly slowing down and that's primarily because 00:39:34.329 --> 00:39:37.289 of the moon does title breaking on the earth 00:39:37.289 --> 00:39:40.989 and is slowly dragging the The earth, you know, 00:39:41.150 --> 00:39:43.349 dragging the oceans across the earth, and it's 00:39:43.349 --> 00:39:47.409 slowly slowing us down. But the earth speeds 00:39:47.409 --> 00:39:51.030 up, slows down from season to season, year to 00:39:51.030 --> 00:39:55.269 year. And after it accumulates, we do a DUT1 00:39:55.269 --> 00:39:58.610 correction. You hear the double ticks after the 00:39:58.610 --> 00:40:00.570 top of the minute, and that tells you how many 00:40:00.570 --> 00:40:04.510 tenths of a second we are ahead or behind the 00:40:04.510 --> 00:40:08.110 sun. And so it's important to keep the sun you 00:40:08.110 --> 00:40:11.030 know, the highest spot in the sky at noon time 00:40:11.030 --> 00:40:14.630 or else it would start to drift. Our clock and 00:40:14.630 --> 00:40:16.969 our sun would drift apart and you'd have 12 noon, 00:40:16.969 --> 00:40:20.530 you know, sunrise, which nobody wants. And so 00:40:20.530 --> 00:40:23.409 what we do is after a certain amount of tenths 00:40:23.409 --> 00:40:28.590 of a second, we, or there's an observatory, International 00:40:28.590 --> 00:40:32.469 Earth Rotation, I think in Paris, they send out 00:40:32.469 --> 00:40:34.949 a notice to everyone, a bulletin that says at 00:40:34.949 --> 00:40:36.650 the end of the year we're all going to do a leap 00:40:36.650 --> 00:40:42.510 second. Excuse me. And so I don't know. I don't 00:40:42.510 --> 00:40:44.070 think we have one coming up at the end of this 00:40:44.070 --> 00:40:46.650 year. But after a certain amount of tenths of 00:40:46.650 --> 00:40:49.329 a second accumulate, we actually stall the clock. 00:40:49.570 --> 00:40:52.409 And that's done just by programming in December 00:40:52.409 --> 00:40:56.989 31st. We tell it at the last minute or the last 00:40:56.989 --> 00:40:59.730 second of the last hour or the last day of the 00:40:59.730 --> 00:41:03.809 year, just it stalls for a second, adds an extra 00:41:03.809 --> 00:41:06.860 second. You know, the time could generate. generator 00:41:06.860 --> 00:41:10.699 actually reads goes from 59 seconds to 60 seconds 00:41:10.699 --> 00:41:13.320 and so that gives the earth a chance to catch 00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:17.280 up during that one second and usually we split 00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:20.179 the difference and so then we're ahead just a 00:41:20.179 --> 00:41:21.920 few tenths of a second and you can tell that 00:41:21.920 --> 00:41:25.440 from the double ticks afterwards and it turns 00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:29.130 out that I guess the scientists can actually 00:41:29.130 --> 00:41:31.730 see the earth speed up and slow down in the sense 00:41:31.730 --> 00:41:35.750 that the northern hemisphere has a lot more land 00:41:35.750 --> 00:41:38.110 mass. And in the wintertime when it snows, the 00:41:38.110 --> 00:41:40.690 angular momentum of the earth changes because 00:41:40.690 --> 00:41:44.210 there's more mass up higher. And so the earth, 00:41:44.409 --> 00:41:47.769 you know. slows down, and then when it melts 00:41:47.769 --> 00:41:49.969 in the summertime and all runs off back in the 00:41:49.969 --> 00:41:53.590 ocean, it speeds up again as the radius of the 00:41:53.590 --> 00:41:55.829 Earth changes. So that was very interesting that 00:41:55.829 --> 00:41:58.489 they could see that. They can measure it that 00:41:58.489 --> 00:42:02.510 accurately. Yeah, that's some very precise measurements. 00:42:03.650 --> 00:42:06.610 And what did you say? It was 10 to the negative 00:42:06.610 --> 00:42:13.519 13th on the clock? Yeah, they have a purity of, 00:42:13.519 --> 00:42:16.719 you know, about, you know, 10 to the negative 00:42:16.719 --> 00:42:19.119 13, you know, which is, you know, 10 to the negative 00:42:19.119 --> 00:42:23.360 9th is a nanosecond. And so then less than a 00:42:23.360 --> 00:42:28.199 picosecond of accuracy. Of course, we can't broadcast 00:42:28.199 --> 00:42:32.179 that accurately, especially from the HF, you 00:42:32.179 --> 00:42:34.579 know, because it hits the ionosphere. Ionosphere 00:42:34.579 --> 00:42:37.420 is always moving and so it accelerates and decelerates. 00:42:37.710 --> 00:42:41.369 So the WWV signal is only good to about 10 to 00:42:41.369 --> 00:42:44.110 the negative 7 when it arrives, because it's 00:42:44.110 --> 00:42:46.969 been accelerated, decelerated, and bounces off 00:42:46.969 --> 00:42:50.369 the earth and everything. WWVB, the 60 kilohertz, 00:42:50.630 --> 00:42:53.469 you can pretty much recover about 10 to the negative 00:42:53.469 --> 00:42:57.210 12 by averaging all those variations over several 00:42:57.210 --> 00:43:00.349 days. And you can recover about what the cesium 00:43:00.349 --> 00:43:03.329 is doing. So it works for a lot of people really 00:43:03.329 --> 00:43:07.849 well. That's some interesting stuff, Matt. I 00:43:07.849 --> 00:43:11.170 really am glad you were able to come on the show 00:43:11.170 --> 00:43:15.230 and share that with us and talk to us. And we 00:43:15.230 --> 00:43:19.670 are just about out of time, but that's some really 00:43:19.670 --> 00:43:22.070 cool stuff. I always just kind of had this picture 00:43:22.070 --> 00:43:26.929 of what WWV looked like and how it all worked. 00:43:27.570 --> 00:43:31.039 And you're giving us a good glimpse into... how 00:43:31.039 --> 00:43:33.500 that all goes. So thank you so much for coming 00:43:33.500 --> 00:43:36.639 on tonight, Matt. You're welcome. Glad to be 00:43:36.639 --> 00:43:40.460 here. Really appreciate it. Well, that is a wrap 00:43:40.460 --> 00:43:43.920 for this week's edition of HamTalk Live. Thanks 00:43:43.920 --> 00:43:47.559 to Matt Deutsch, N0RGT, the chief engineer at 00:43:47.559 --> 00:43:51.500 WWV. And he's back to playing all time all the 00:43:51.500 --> 00:43:56.320 time. So you can tune into us next time. Thanks 00:43:56.320 --> 00:43:59.659 for listening out there in cyberspace and thanks 00:43:59.659 --> 00:44:03.780 for writing in and come back at Thursday night. 00:44:03.880 --> 00:44:08.619 9 p .m. Eastern Time next week. And to see our 00:44:08.619 --> 00:44:12.039 upcoming guests, just go to HamTalkLive .com. 00:44:12.159 --> 00:44:15.360 So thank you for your time this time. Till next 00:44:15.360 --> 00:44:20.579 time, this is Neil Rapp, WB9VPG, saying 7375. 00:44:21.280 --> 00:44:26.739 And as always, may the good DX be yours. Thanks 00:44:26.739 --> 00:44:41.760 for watching!