WEBVTT 00:00:11.529 --> 00:00:14.490 Welcome to Our Voices, Our Future, the podcast 00:00:14.490 --> 00:00:16.850 where we amplify the voices driving change and 00:00:16.850 --> 00:00:19.149 equity within medicine and beyond. Brought to 00:00:19.149 --> 00:00:21.230 you by the Gender Equity Task Force, a committee 00:00:21.230 --> 00:00:23.429 of the American Medical Women's Association, 00:00:23.890 --> 00:00:26.609 we're here to challenge norms, break barriers, 00:00:26.829 --> 00:00:29.730 and ignite conversations that matter. I'm Rhea 00:00:29.730 --> 00:00:32.170 Munahur, and in each episode, we'll bring you 00:00:32.170 --> 00:00:34.609 candid discussions with leaders, change makers, 00:00:34.630 --> 00:00:37.590 and advocates working to create a more inclusive 00:00:37.590 --> 00:00:41.090 and just world. No more silence, no more waiting, 00:00:41.359 --> 00:00:44.060 You are listening to Our Voices, Our Future. 00:00:44.460 --> 00:00:46.820 Let's get into it. Today we're welcoming the 00:00:46.820 --> 00:00:49.700 creator of our podcast, Megan Etsy, as a guest. 00:00:50.320 --> 00:00:52.479 Megan is a fourth year medical student at St. 00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:55.420 George's University pursuing a residency in internal 00:00:55.420 --> 00:00:57.740 medicine, and she's also a dear friend of mine. 00:00:58.189 --> 00:01:01.829 This podcast was born from her passion for advocacy, 00:01:02.030 --> 00:01:04.950 storytelling and creating space for voices that 00:01:04.950 --> 00:01:07.670 are often overlooked in medicine. Outside of 00:01:07.670 --> 00:01:10.510 her academic work, Megan loves music, exploring 00:01:10.510 --> 00:01:12.930 the world and connecting with new people through 00:01:12.930 --> 00:01:15.890 service and shared experiences. At the heart 00:01:15.890 --> 00:01:18.469 of her work is a commitment to advocating for 00:01:18.469 --> 00:01:21.010 those who cannot advocate for themselves and 00:01:21.010 --> 00:01:23.730 helping build a more equitable human centered 00:01:23.730 --> 00:01:26.489 health care system. Thank you so much for being 00:01:26.489 --> 00:01:28.680 with us today. and sitting on the other side 00:01:28.680 --> 00:01:31.299 of the table, guest. Yeah, thanks for having 00:01:31.299 --> 00:01:35.280 me. Excited to do this today. Okay, so getting 00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:38.219 started, can you share with us your medical journey 00:01:38.219 --> 00:01:41.120 and what fueled your drive to become a physician? 00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:44.739 Yeah, so it actually, I'm not the person who 00:01:44.739 --> 00:01:46.780 like came out of the womb wanting to be a doctor. 00:01:47.400 --> 00:01:50.079 Like some of these people say, up into middle 00:01:50.079 --> 00:01:53.799 school, I wanted to be a lawyer. I loved arguing. 00:01:53.920 --> 00:01:55.840 I was good at it. I was like, we're gonna be 00:01:55.840 --> 00:01:57.959 a lawyer. I'll argue for the rest of my life. 00:01:58.640 --> 00:02:01.040 Until I came to the realization, I think it was 00:02:01.040 --> 00:02:03.200 in seventh grade, that I would probably have 00:02:03.200 --> 00:02:05.459 to defend guilty people. And something about 00:02:05.459 --> 00:02:09.219 that just didn't sit right with me. And so I 00:02:09.219 --> 00:02:11.719 shifted over to medicine. My mom was a nurse 00:02:11.719 --> 00:02:14.099 growing up my whole life. She was a single mom 00:02:14.099 --> 00:02:16.199 for most of my life so she was kind of my go 00:02:16.199 --> 00:02:18.080 -to for everything and she would always like 00:02:18.080 --> 00:02:20.860 come home telling stories of being at the hospital 00:02:20.860 --> 00:02:24.000 and you know, I didn't have that. I don't remember 00:02:24.000 --> 00:02:27.500 a childhood where I grew up thinking that my 00:02:27.500 --> 00:02:29.740 parent was absent, although they were in medicine. 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:34.139 I grew up To this day, I'm like, when did my 00:02:34.139 --> 00:02:36.419 mom work? Because she was always there, you know? 00:02:36.520 --> 00:02:39.080 I don't know how she did it. But she was really 00:02:39.080 --> 00:02:43.800 good at that balance. And so into high school, 00:02:43.860 --> 00:02:45.479 I was like, all right, we're going to be a doctor. 00:02:45.800 --> 00:02:48.039 At first, I was like, I think everybody was like, 00:02:48.139 --> 00:02:49.939 we're going to be a surgeon because everybody 00:02:49.939 --> 00:02:53.099 thinks that's the coolest type of doctor. and 00:02:53.099 --> 00:02:55.180 so of course for a while I wanted to be a surgeon 00:02:55.180 --> 00:02:58.759 and in high school my mom became a nurse practitioner 00:02:58.759 --> 00:03:01.199 so I was kind of like grown and got to see that 00:03:01.199 --> 00:03:03.819 transition from a nurse to a nurse practitioner 00:03:03.819 --> 00:03:06.479 and that was a really cool experience that kind 00:03:06.479 --> 00:03:11.379 of just gave me that strength to want to do it. 00:03:11.599 --> 00:03:14.479 However, I had a couple setbacks. My senior year 00:03:14.479 --> 00:03:20.379 I was touring colleges for pre -med and I went 00:03:20.379 --> 00:03:23.319 to one where I saw everybody had like a 4 .0 00:03:23.319 --> 00:03:27.039 and above a 30 on the ACT and I was like, I can't 00:03:27.039 --> 00:03:29.300 do this. I can do pre -med. I had to take the 00:03:29.300 --> 00:03:32.259 ACT five times to get a 27. Like this isn't going 00:03:32.259 --> 00:03:35.319 to happen. And so I was scared and I actually 00:03:35.319 --> 00:03:39.360 started undergrad as a nursing major. But after 00:03:39.360 --> 00:03:42.460 the first couple weeks of classes, my confidence 00:03:42.460 --> 00:03:44.900 came back. I was like, no, I can do this. I switched 00:03:44.900 --> 00:03:49.169 to pre -med and I would love to say the rest 00:03:49.169 --> 00:03:50.949 was history and it was straight through, but 00:03:50.949 --> 00:03:53.750 it wasn't because come MCAT time, I didn't do 00:03:53.750 --> 00:04:00.210 very well in MCAT. I got a 493. Then again, as 00:04:00.210 --> 00:04:02.189 everybody tells you, if you can't pass the MCAT, 00:04:02.229 --> 00:04:03.849 you can't go to med school, you're not going 00:04:03.849 --> 00:04:07.129 to pass any of your board exams. So then I was 00:04:07.129 --> 00:04:10.669 like having this big Midlife crisis. Okay, so 00:04:10.669 --> 00:04:12.949 did I go to PA school? Did I go to MP school? 00:04:13.189 --> 00:04:15.530 Like I was going through that and my mom really 00:04:15.530 --> 00:04:17.889 pushed me as she's a nurse practitioner. She 00:04:17.889 --> 00:04:21.209 was like, you know, I really see the difference 00:04:21.209 --> 00:04:23.269 between what I know and what the doctors know 00:04:23.269 --> 00:04:25.389 in the training. And I think you're absolutely 00:04:25.389 --> 00:04:27.470 capable of becoming a doctor. I think you need 00:04:27.470 --> 00:04:30.670 to just do it. So it was really tough for a while. 00:04:31.680 --> 00:04:33.959 but we did it and I went to a Caribbean school 00:04:33.959 --> 00:04:37.800 and I think up until about this point in my life 00:04:37.800 --> 00:04:40.079 it was still like a question to me like is this 00:04:40.079 --> 00:04:43.319 truly going to happen but now that I'm like so 00:04:43.319 --> 00:04:46.019 close to the other side of it and successfully 00:04:46.019 --> 00:04:48.079 having interviews for residency and about to 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:51.600 graduate it kind of feels real now that I'm going 00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:54.639 to be a doctor. And so I always came back to 00:04:54.639 --> 00:04:56.620 the kind of that same goal in the end. We had 00:04:56.620 --> 00:05:00.300 a few, a few hurdles and a few questions, but 00:05:00.300 --> 00:05:02.699 here we are. We're doing it and it's, it's for 00:05:02.699 --> 00:05:06.199 real now. Yeah. Well, thank you for sharing that 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:08.500 with me. And I think a lot of people go through 00:05:08.500 --> 00:05:11.920 that. They hear that they must follow this certain 00:05:11.920 --> 00:05:15.439 path or they have to have these certain metrics. 00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:18.060 And there are so many different paths to medicine 00:05:18.060 --> 00:05:22.600 as you and I both know. So a lot of your work 00:05:22.600 --> 00:05:25.199 thus far has focused on advocacy and raising 00:05:25.199 --> 00:05:28.060 your voice. What helped you realize that advocacy 00:05:28.060 --> 00:05:31.180 doesn't have to wait until after residency or 00:05:31.180 --> 00:05:34.459 being in a leadership role? Yeah, so I think 00:05:34.459 --> 00:05:38.899 this really first started during undergrad. When 00:05:38.899 --> 00:05:41.560 I was working in the hospital, actually, I think 00:05:41.560 --> 00:05:45.720 I really learned by watching patients that you 00:05:45.720 --> 00:05:48.220 truly are your best advocate. If nobody else 00:05:48.220 --> 00:05:51.560 is going to advocate for you in this world, then 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:55.980 who? It's going to be you, right? And I truly 00:05:55.980 --> 00:05:59.120 understand that not everybody is able to do that 00:05:59.120 --> 00:06:01.779 for themselves, whether it be they quite literally 00:06:01.779 --> 00:06:03.800 don't have a voice, they don't know how to do 00:06:03.800 --> 00:06:05.660 it for themselves, they don't have the confidence 00:06:05.660 --> 00:06:09.279 to do it for themselves. I think that is so sad. 00:06:09.420 --> 00:06:12.540 And realizing that in undergrad was something 00:06:12.540 --> 00:06:16.459 that kind of gave me a little push. But it wasn't 00:06:16.459 --> 00:06:22.439 quite something that I thought I could do until 00:06:22.439 --> 00:06:25.300 I got to the gender equity task force, right? 00:06:25.319 --> 00:06:28.839 So this is not something that I would go and 00:06:28.839 --> 00:06:31.620 do and just advocate for everybody and whatever, 00:06:31.819 --> 00:06:34.339 even myself. I have not been a great advocate 00:06:34.339 --> 00:06:37.100 for myself because it's scary. It's scary to 00:06:37.100 --> 00:06:42.459 do that stuff. I just started doing it. I joined 00:06:42.459 --> 00:06:49.139 this committee and I at first made interest with 00:06:49.139 --> 00:06:51.439 the blogs and the podcast and I was like, I'm 00:06:51.439 --> 00:06:54.519 going to do this. And as I started doing it and 00:06:54.519 --> 00:06:57.079 like making these posts and seeing people like 00:06:57.079 --> 00:07:00.040 come to me and say, what you're doing is so cool. 00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:02.220 And I was like, wait, really? I thought this 00:07:02.220 --> 00:07:05.220 was like silly business that people hated, right? 00:07:05.600 --> 00:07:08.060 Nobody wants to hear that squeaky wheel. Nobody, 00:07:08.240 --> 00:07:10.899 you know, like yeah the people who advocate like 00:07:10.899 --> 00:07:12.939 this are always known as the annoying people 00:07:12.939 --> 00:07:15.180 so i thought i was going to be the annoying people 00:07:15.180 --> 00:07:17.939 right but it's so not true people come to me 00:07:17.939 --> 00:07:19.300 and they're like what you're doing is so cool 00:07:19.300 --> 00:07:22.019 and they they think it's so cool and then i have 00:07:22.019 --> 00:07:25.680 reflected back on who did i think was cool in 00:07:25.680 --> 00:07:29.040 middle school The high schoolers who was cool 00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:30.939 in high school the undergrad who was cool and 00:07:30.939 --> 00:07:32.939 undergrad the med students You know, there's 00:07:32.939 --> 00:07:35.300 always these people that are looking up to you 00:07:35.300 --> 00:07:38.319 That you can have an impact on regardless I still 00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:41.279 remember people from a long time ago that had 00:07:41.279 --> 00:07:45.019 that impact on me and I guess you don't really 00:07:45.019 --> 00:07:46.939 realize that can happen to you until you're in 00:07:46.939 --> 00:07:48.939 that position where people are vocally saying 00:07:48.939 --> 00:07:51.600 like what you're doing is making a difference, 00:07:51.639 --> 00:07:55.459 right? It's like just starting and in doing it 00:07:55.449 --> 00:07:59.850 is where it starts. I mean, you don't have to 00:07:59.850 --> 00:08:01.870 be in a position of power. And you know what, 00:08:01.870 --> 00:08:04.389 I am in a position of power and I think I'm extremely 00:08:04.389 --> 00:08:06.850 blessed to be in the position that I am in. I 00:08:06.850 --> 00:08:09.649 truly think that just being a med student itself 00:08:09.649 --> 00:08:13.350 puts you in a position to have a voice and to 00:08:13.350 --> 00:08:16.870 say things and people will treat it differently 00:08:16.870 --> 00:08:21.970 as if I wasn't a medical student. And so I take 00:08:21.970 --> 00:08:26.439 that. I take that and really realize what weight 00:08:26.439 --> 00:08:29.560 that carries. And I think we should not take 00:08:29.560 --> 00:08:31.620 it for advantage, you know? I think we need to 00:08:31.620 --> 00:08:33.399 realize, you know what, like being a medical 00:08:33.399 --> 00:08:36.860 student really is a huge privilege. And you have 00:08:36.860 --> 00:08:39.019 this knowledge and this ability to share things. 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:42.220 And I almost think that not doing so is a bit 00:08:42.220 --> 00:08:47.679 of a disservice to others. So yeah, so. not only 00:08:47.679 --> 00:08:50.379 can you take this voice and knowledge and I think 00:08:50.379 --> 00:08:52.860 it seems less scary to advocate for others and 00:08:52.860 --> 00:08:55.139 as you advocate for others not only are you doing 00:08:55.139 --> 00:08:56.799 a service to other people but you're serving 00:08:56.799 --> 00:08:59.360 yourself as well because when you're advocating 00:08:59.360 --> 00:09:01.559 for others you learn how to advocate for yourself 00:09:01.559 --> 00:09:04.220 as well. As I have done this and I've done this 00:09:04.220 --> 00:09:06.360 podcast and I've had many conversations I probably 00:09:06.360 --> 00:09:08.639 have like six books sitting here that people 00:09:08.639 --> 00:09:11.360 recommended to me on how to learn how to advocate 00:09:11.360 --> 00:09:15.340 for myself as well. And yeah, so not only are 00:09:15.340 --> 00:09:17.220 you going to be serving others, but you kind 00:09:17.220 --> 00:09:19.279 of learn how to serve yourself more. And I think 00:09:19.279 --> 00:09:22.659 that's super precious. Definitely. I think something 00:09:22.659 --> 00:09:25.620 that you said was really interesting. As a med 00:09:25.620 --> 00:09:28.500 student, you still feel like you're in a place 00:09:28.500 --> 00:09:32.519 of power and you have this voice. I feel like 00:09:32.519 --> 00:09:34.830 throughout... medical school and you'll hear 00:09:34.830 --> 00:09:37.509 it from other med students and other residents 00:09:37.509 --> 00:09:39.830 and even faculty being like med students are 00:09:39.830 --> 00:09:42.330 the bottom of the barrel in terms of this hierarchy. 00:09:43.070 --> 00:09:46.649 So how do you feel about advocating when you're 00:09:46.649 --> 00:09:49.889 constantly hearing things like that? Yeah, I 00:09:49.889 --> 00:09:51.529 think you have to have a bigger perspective. 00:09:51.850 --> 00:09:54.330 So sure, I am the bottom of the barrel right 00:09:54.330 --> 00:09:56.210 now. I'm going to become a resident. I'm going 00:09:56.210 --> 00:09:58.049 to go back to the bottom. You know, I think it's 00:09:58.049 --> 00:10:00.129 just this big cycle of being at the bottom, but 00:10:00.129 --> 00:10:03.490 that's the bottom of the barrel of a very small 00:10:03.490 --> 00:10:06.470 amount of people in this world. And there are 00:10:06.470 --> 00:10:08.110 many more people in this world than the people 00:10:08.110 --> 00:10:10.809 that are doctors. So in the scheme of becoming 00:10:10.809 --> 00:10:13.470 a doctor, sure, I understand. I am totally at 00:10:13.470 --> 00:10:17.409 the bottom of the barrel. But in the world, and 00:10:17.409 --> 00:10:19.149 I think it comes from a place of like having 00:10:19.149 --> 00:10:20.809 people in my family who are not doctors. If I 00:10:20.809 --> 00:10:22.490 go talk to my dad about something, he's like, 00:10:23.039 --> 00:10:26.259 oh my gosh and it can be such a simple like medical 00:10:26.259 --> 00:10:29.299 thing you know um it just that really humbles 00:10:29.299 --> 00:10:31.840 you and makes you realize like there are a lot 00:10:31.840 --> 00:10:34.019 of people in this world who can use your knowledge 00:10:34.019 --> 00:10:36.179 and you can do a lot of good for it whether you 00:10:36.179 --> 00:10:38.340 are a medical student even if you're pre -med 00:10:38.340 --> 00:10:42.409 if you're a resident i think to some extent it 00:10:42.409 --> 00:10:44.669 has equal effect as somebody who's been a physician 00:10:44.669 --> 00:10:46.809 for 30 years. If you take somebody who's been 00:10:46.809 --> 00:10:48.850 a physician for 30 years and they're not doing 00:10:48.850 --> 00:10:50.490 anything with their voice and you compare it 00:10:50.490 --> 00:10:52.450 to somebody like me who has the podcast and the 00:10:52.450 --> 00:10:56.309 blog and is writing papers, who's using their 00:10:56.309 --> 00:10:59.309 voice more? Who has more power in that situation 00:10:59.309 --> 00:11:02.690 of advocacy? You know what I mean? Sure, a seasoned 00:11:02.690 --> 00:11:05.590 physician 30 years doing great things and taking 00:11:05.590 --> 00:11:09.320 care of patients, that's incredible, but if you're 00:11:09.320 --> 00:11:11.399 not using your voice and advocating for people 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:15.519 in the position of advocacy, who is using their 00:11:15.519 --> 00:11:19.159 power more? So I think it's just that bigger 00:11:19.159 --> 00:11:22.139 look at things, right? Yeah. No, I love that 00:11:22.139 --> 00:11:24.360 you shared that. And I think it's really important 00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:26.759 for people to hear there's always this opportunity 00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:31.700 to raise your voice in different ways. So looking 00:11:31.700 --> 00:11:33.879 back on your journey through medical school, 00:11:34.139 --> 00:11:37.220 what lessons has this advocacy during your training 00:11:37.220 --> 00:11:40.039 taught you about leadership, resilience, and 00:11:40.039 --> 00:11:46.259 the kind of position you want to become? like 00:11:46.259 --> 00:11:48.799 I never looked at me having. I didn't look at 00:11:48.799 --> 00:11:51.759 me being in this position a few years ago. And 00:11:51.759 --> 00:11:54.940 I think it's summed up as the good fight. I think 00:11:54.940 --> 00:11:58.320 that it's hard and it's definitely a fight. And 00:11:58.320 --> 00:12:03.299 there are people who still do not believe. I 00:12:03.299 --> 00:12:06.419 had a family member tell me that gender equity 00:12:06.419 --> 00:12:10.019 is a myth because they were paid the same when 00:12:10.019 --> 00:12:13.080 they worked in factories like 50 years ago as 00:12:13.080 --> 00:12:17.620 their male counterparts. um and that's my family 00:12:17.620 --> 00:12:21.299 you know like this is this is a very interesting 00:12:21.299 --> 00:12:25.740 journey that I'm taking and so I think that what 00:12:25.740 --> 00:12:29.059 that as an example has truly taught me is that 00:12:29.059 --> 00:12:30.960 everybody comes from different backgrounds and 00:12:30.960 --> 00:12:34.620 when I'm a physician it's very important to take 00:12:34.620 --> 00:12:37.840 what people think and say with a grain of salt 00:12:37.840 --> 00:12:40.240 because they may not just have the information 00:12:40.240 --> 00:12:43.419 or understand. I love the family member dearly, 00:12:43.419 --> 00:12:46.620 she's incredible, and that statement changes 00:12:46.620 --> 00:12:50.200 nothing that I think about her, but it gives 00:12:50.200 --> 00:12:54.000 me an opportunity for education, you know? I 00:12:54.000 --> 00:12:57.480 think that it has taught me that in a general 00:12:57.480 --> 00:12:59.940 way of how I will practice in the future as a 00:12:59.940 --> 00:13:02.600 physician. For leadership and resilience, it's 00:13:02.600 --> 00:13:05.179 been a little bit different. I think a lot with 00:13:05.179 --> 00:13:07.960 the political climate right now, I was scared. 00:13:08.110 --> 00:13:12.590 um I think we like questioned publishing some 00:13:12.590 --> 00:13:16.230 papers and we changed titles for blog posts and 00:13:16.230 --> 00:13:18.950 um kind of thought differently about people we 00:13:18.950 --> 00:13:22.149 had on the podcast like oh is this gonna rumble 00:13:22.149 --> 00:13:25.370 feathers especially with um money being taken 00:13:25.370 --> 00:13:28.450 away from organizations and stuff lately you 00:13:28.450 --> 00:13:32.509 know I was scared um mostly for my residency 00:13:32.509 --> 00:13:36.700 application I was wondering like Am I not going 00:13:36.700 --> 00:13:38.539 to get interviews because these things are going 00:13:38.539 --> 00:13:41.059 to be in my publications? Is there going to be 00:13:41.059 --> 00:13:47.620 issues in interviews? And honestly, I have gotten 00:13:47.620 --> 00:13:52.220 the utmost respect and the best conversations 00:13:52.220 --> 00:13:55.440 from my residency interviews over this work. 00:13:55.500 --> 00:13:58.059 I've had incredible conversations with program 00:13:58.059 --> 00:14:00.399 directors and attendings and residents about 00:14:00.399 --> 00:14:04.360 this work, and it really just solidifies and 00:14:04.360 --> 00:14:06.980 reassures me that I'm doing the right thing. 00:14:07.240 --> 00:14:09.299 And although there's some loud voices out there 00:14:09.299 --> 00:14:13.340 that don't agree with the things that I am passionate 00:14:13.340 --> 00:14:15.720 about, it doesn't mean that I'm wrong and it 00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:18.139 doesn't mean the work that I'm doing is not good. 00:14:19.480 --> 00:14:22.460 It just makes times a little scary, but I think 00:14:22.460 --> 00:14:25.940 that that means you need to be more resilient 00:14:25.940 --> 00:14:28.820 in these times and understand that it's okay. 00:14:29.220 --> 00:14:33.179 It's really going to be okay. Oh, that's awesome. 00:14:33.419 --> 00:14:36.620 And I think a lot of med students who have this 00:14:36.620 --> 00:14:38.779 kind of passion for advocacy and public health 00:14:38.779 --> 00:14:41.259 work are feeling that right now. Where do you 00:14:41.259 --> 00:14:43.820 use your voice and how loud do you want to be? 00:14:44.460 --> 00:14:49.679 Yeah, absolutely. You created and host this podcast, 00:14:49.919 --> 00:14:51.899 Our Voices, Our Future, as a medical student. 00:14:52.220 --> 00:14:54.700 Can you walk us through how and why you started 00:14:54.700 --> 00:14:58.419 the podcast and really what gap you hope to fill 00:14:58.419 --> 00:15:02.049 in medical spaces with it? Yeah, so I don't want 00:15:02.049 --> 00:15:05.289 to take all of the credit. Dr. Joanna Georgiakis 00:15:05.289 --> 00:15:10.289 is the OG of the creation of this podcast. She's 00:15:10.289 --> 00:15:12.230 in episode one and then she's going to be a couple 00:15:12.230 --> 00:15:16.090 episodes after this one again. She created a 00:15:16.090 --> 00:15:21.470 podcast when she was way before me. She's a fellow 00:15:21.470 --> 00:15:24.129 now and she created a podcast many years ago 00:15:24.129 --> 00:15:27.250 and the task force was like, hey, we want to 00:15:27.250 --> 00:15:31.059 do this podcast again. and this was at my first 00:15:31.059 --> 00:15:33.440 meeting actually that I came to for the task 00:15:33.440 --> 00:15:36.580 force and I was like I'll do it I'll create a 00:15:36.580 --> 00:15:39.419 podcast we can continue on she can be season 00:15:39.419 --> 00:15:42.340 one we'll continue on with season two and that's 00:15:42.340 --> 00:15:45.799 what we did um it was annoying at first there 00:15:45.799 --> 00:15:48.299 were so many hoops to jump through and I wanted 00:15:48.299 --> 00:15:54.809 to give up but every time that I would go to 00:15:54.809 --> 00:15:56.730 meetings and just give them a little tidbit. 00:15:56.909 --> 00:15:59.509 Oh, I found a way to do this or I found a way 00:15:59.509 --> 00:16:02.110 to do that. Just the faces would light up and 00:16:02.110 --> 00:16:04.970 it was so cool. And that's when I knew like I'm 00:16:04.970 --> 00:16:07.669 doing something good and I'm so happy I continued 00:16:07.669 --> 00:16:10.370 with it. It took several months just to like 00:16:10.370 --> 00:16:15.289 record the first podcast. And I am a big instant 00:16:15.289 --> 00:16:17.509 gratification girlie. Like, I want stuff done 00:16:17.509 --> 00:16:20.809 now. So that was a lot for me. But it's been 00:16:20.809 --> 00:16:23.850 such a great time. We're about to complete a 00:16:23.850 --> 00:16:26.450 year's worth of episodes, which is super cool. 00:16:27.669 --> 00:16:33.250 And I think, like, the gaps it fills, it's just 00:16:33.250 --> 00:16:37.169 so many, you know? I at first thought I was only 00:16:37.169 --> 00:16:39.190 going to be interviewing attendings and talking 00:16:39.190 --> 00:16:42.889 about their stories in medicine, and we have, 00:16:42.889 --> 00:16:46.129 no, like we've stretched so far, like we've done 00:16:46.129 --> 00:16:52.350 medical students, we've talked to PAs, NPs, lawyers 00:16:52.350 --> 00:16:54.950 about negotiating, you know, like we have just 00:16:54.950 --> 00:16:58.730 kind of like gone everywhere and it's been so 00:16:58.730 --> 00:17:03.509 cool and I think that I can't give a quanta - 00:17:04.419 --> 00:17:07.619 or qualification as to how we have filled gaps 00:17:07.619 --> 00:17:09.599 or what gaps we have filled. But I know that 00:17:09.599 --> 00:17:12.799 there are so many gaps and we're putting a little 00:17:12.799 --> 00:17:15.019 bit of putty in each of them, which has been 00:17:15.019 --> 00:17:18.539 super cool. I want to talk a little bit more 00:17:18.539 --> 00:17:21.160 about that storytelling that you've touched on. 00:17:21.779 --> 00:17:24.900 So you use this as a tool for advocacy. How have 00:17:24.900 --> 00:17:28.000 you seen personal stories influence culture, 00:17:28.180 --> 00:17:31.789 policy, or awareness within medicine? really 00:17:31.789 --> 00:17:34.769 in every way. It's been so cool. I think the 00:17:34.769 --> 00:17:37.549 best part of doing this podcast for myself is 00:17:37.549 --> 00:17:39.329 getting to have these conversations with all 00:17:39.329 --> 00:17:42.210 these people in medicine. There have been so 00:17:42.210 --> 00:17:45.029 many incredible women who have amazing stories 00:17:45.029 --> 00:17:47.509 that not only have inspired me through the conversations, 00:17:47.690 --> 00:17:51.410 but inspire so many people. I think One of the 00:17:51.410 --> 00:17:53.910 first people and the first people story I've 00:17:53.910 --> 00:17:56.069 heard about is Dr. Gephardt who created the gender 00:17:56.069 --> 00:18:00.210 equity task force and is a past president of 00:18:00.210 --> 00:18:04.549 ANWWA. She has incredible story about her training 00:18:04.549 --> 00:18:08.809 and just hearing her story like in thinking about 00:18:08.809 --> 00:18:10.910 it just gives me goosebumps because the things 00:18:10.910 --> 00:18:15.589 that she went through and she advocated for many 00:18:15.589 --> 00:18:20.220 years ago it's just like sets me on fire and 00:18:20.220 --> 00:18:24.779 I know these things happen and I'm just so inspired 00:18:24.779 --> 00:18:27.220 by the actions that she took and she was not 00:18:27.220 --> 00:18:29.839 afraid. She was willing to lose her job. She 00:18:29.839 --> 00:18:32.359 was willing to do what she needed for the right 00:18:32.359 --> 00:18:35.440 voices to be heard and it's just incredible to 00:18:35.440 --> 00:18:39.180 hear and so inspiring and then all the way from 00:18:39.180 --> 00:18:42.720 Dr. Gebhard years and years ago Starting with 00:18:42.720 --> 00:18:44.700 those stories, we have stories today. Christine, 00:18:44.779 --> 00:18:48.240 who I interviewed a few episodes ago, she is 00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:50.759 a mom, she's a PA student, and she had babies, 00:18:51.240 --> 00:18:54.359 two babies, she has two little boys during her 00:18:54.359 --> 00:18:58.640 schooling, and just hearing that medical education 00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:02.859 does not have parental leave policies, well, 00:19:02.900 --> 00:19:05.319 I think it's like 85 % of schools do not have 00:19:05.319 --> 00:19:08.059 policies, and if they do, most of them are policies 00:19:08.059 --> 00:19:10.380 for their workers and not for the students, and 00:19:10.380 --> 00:19:12.569 most of the students policies on average are 00:19:12.569 --> 00:19:17.450 like 12 days of maternity leave. Like 12 days? 00:19:17.809 --> 00:19:20.309 That's including like birth and everything. Like, 00:19:20.410 --> 00:19:26.089 oh my gosh, I can't, yeah. Here we are in 2026 00:19:26.089 --> 00:19:29.910 and we're lacking these policies in so many medical 00:19:29.910 --> 00:19:33.319 schools. Like how are we supposed to... have 00:19:33.319 --> 00:19:37.200 women that are practicing medicine that are not 00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:39.220 stopping themselves from going to school because 00:19:39.220 --> 00:19:41.640 they want to have babies. Why can't we have both 00:19:41.640 --> 00:19:45.099 of these things, you know? And that's Christine 00:19:45.099 --> 00:19:50.460 today. She's in PA school right now and she is 00:19:50.460 --> 00:19:53.480 fighting this battle and she is so inspiring. 00:19:53.599 --> 00:19:57.309 She has such a heart for this and she is read 00:19:57.309 --> 00:19:59.990 all of the literature and investigated so many 00:19:59.990 --> 00:20:02.329 different schools' policies and she has come 00:20:02.329 --> 00:20:04.210 up with some incredible things. She's going to 00:20:04.210 --> 00:20:08.109 be presenting at the conference here in March 00:20:08.109 --> 00:20:11.210 and she's just so passionate about it and it's 00:20:11.210 --> 00:20:13.210 so awesome to see her heart and how she just 00:20:13.210 --> 00:20:16.789 lights up the world with how passionate she is 00:20:16.789 --> 00:20:20.509 about this. These are the women that do things, 00:20:20.549 --> 00:20:23.630 that make changes, and I think that it's just 00:20:23.630 --> 00:20:30.200 so cool to see this these women that just treads 00:20:30.200 --> 00:20:34.519 through ends and to make change happen. And I 00:20:34.519 --> 00:20:36.819 don't think in the moment Dr. Gephardt had any 00:20:36.819 --> 00:20:38.700 idea of the change she would make in the future. 00:20:38.799 --> 00:20:41.279 And I don't think Christine has any idea right 00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:43.359 now the change that she's gonna make in the future. 00:20:43.660 --> 00:20:45.579 And I think that's the coolest thing about it. 00:20:45.579 --> 00:20:47.660 And I'm so excited to see that happen in the 00:20:47.660 --> 00:20:50.960 future. Yeah, it's really about like, what can 00:20:50.960 --> 00:20:54.049 you do in this moment? And where is it going 00:20:54.049 --> 00:20:55.990 to go just because you're passionate about it 00:20:55.990 --> 00:20:58.990 and you want to see something happen? Exactly. 00:21:00.710 --> 00:21:03.509 There is a real risk in speaking up early in 00:21:03.509 --> 00:21:05.829 medical education. And we kind of touched on 00:21:05.829 --> 00:21:09.250 this a little bit. Fear of repercussions being 00:21:09.250 --> 00:21:12.089 labeled as difficult or standing out. How have 00:21:12.089 --> 00:21:14.849 you navigated those risks and what rewards have 00:21:14.849 --> 00:21:18.440 you seen? Yeah, I think that's so true. I know 00:21:18.440 --> 00:21:20.119 we talked about it a little before, but I think 00:21:20.119 --> 00:21:22.759 it's super important to really hit on. That's 00:21:22.759 --> 00:21:25.240 something that is always in the back of my mind. 00:21:25.299 --> 00:21:28.660 I know I talked about being afraid back before 00:21:28.660 --> 00:21:31.900 applying to residency and what effect is this 00:21:31.900 --> 00:21:33.819 going to have on my residency application, but 00:21:33.819 --> 00:21:37.299 it's still in the back of my mind every day today. 00:21:37.460 --> 00:21:40.160 I work on this work daily and I still have that 00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:42.839 thought in the back of my mind. which one of 00:21:42.839 --> 00:21:44.799 these projects are going to push me over the 00:21:44.799 --> 00:21:47.059 edge, which one is going to get me in trouble. 00:21:48.539 --> 00:21:53.259 And, you know, I think there's a balance. I think 00:21:53.259 --> 00:21:55.960 there's a way to advocate and be respectful. 00:21:58.500 --> 00:22:02.079 But I also am a true believer that if you go 00:22:02.079 --> 00:22:04.259 in to do something and you're advocating for 00:22:04.259 --> 00:22:07.460 people with a good heart, that the outcome will 00:22:07.460 --> 00:22:12.130 never be ill, that the good intention is what's 00:22:12.130 --> 00:22:14.970 going to get you through. And I truly believe 00:22:14.970 --> 00:22:18.470 that. Like I'm solely here to help and advocate 00:22:18.470 --> 00:22:22.529 for others and myself. And I believe that in 00:22:22.529 --> 00:22:25.210 the end, even if there are small setbacks, like 00:22:25.210 --> 00:22:29.309 we didn't get a grant last year because of the 00:22:29.309 --> 00:22:32.789 public face of supporting the work we're doing 00:22:32.789 --> 00:22:34.750 and the worries that the government would step 00:22:34.750 --> 00:22:37.200 foot in that. And that's fine, this is a small 00:22:37.200 --> 00:22:39.720 setback. We didn't stop our project, we just 00:22:39.720 --> 00:22:42.380 changed what we were doing with the project so 00:22:42.380 --> 00:22:45.920 we didn't need money. There's going to be those 00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:48.440 setbacks and things are going to happen, but 00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:50.299 I think it's all temporary and I think that in 00:22:50.299 --> 00:22:53.279 the end it's all going to be okay, but that's 00:22:53.279 --> 00:22:57.900 a true fear and I think that it's important for 00:22:57.900 --> 00:23:01.480 people to think about it, to be aware of it, 00:23:01.480 --> 00:23:04.400 to understand that it is a possibility, but I 00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:08.160 think that As we say in medicine, the benefits 00:23:08.160 --> 00:23:12.259 outweigh the risks, for sure, with the work that 00:23:12.259 --> 00:23:16.160 we're doing. For sure. And I think this is something 00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:18.480 that you and I talk about on a regular basis, 00:23:19.160 --> 00:23:23.460 like reframing how do we change what we're doing, 00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:27.299 but still keep the essence of that advocacy work. 00:23:27.619 --> 00:23:30.420 And even just like talking with peers and mentors 00:23:30.420 --> 00:23:33.220 about it is an opportunity for us to be able 00:23:33.220 --> 00:23:39.970 to still do these things. Absolutely. So obviously 00:23:39.970 --> 00:23:43.650 you are doing a lot and many students and trainees 00:23:43.650 --> 00:23:45.630 want to advocate but don't really know where 00:23:45.630 --> 00:23:48.589 to start. What are tangible ways that trainees 00:23:48.589 --> 00:23:51.609 can begin building platforms without burning 00:23:51.609 --> 00:23:57.589 out? Talk to somebody. I think like I will talk 00:23:57.589 --> 00:23:59.630 to anybody about this. I will get anybody on 00:23:59.630 --> 00:24:01.809 board. You watched me get dozens of people on 00:24:01.809 --> 00:24:05.559 board with this work. I think you just Find somebody 00:24:05.559 --> 00:24:07.819 who's doing what you want to do and talk to them. 00:24:08.019 --> 00:24:11.019 Start a conversation. That's what I did. And 00:24:11.019 --> 00:24:13.059 here we are. And it's been such a cool journey. 00:24:13.519 --> 00:24:16.180 I think there's so many... I would argue that 00:24:16.180 --> 00:24:18.779 there's not one person who does this advocacy 00:24:18.779 --> 00:24:21.559 work who is not willing to teach somebody else 00:24:21.559 --> 00:24:24.680 how to do it. I think that it comes with full 00:24:24.680 --> 00:24:27.220 good heart, good intentions, and that comes with 00:24:27.220 --> 00:24:32.160 good mentorship as well. And so just do it. I 00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:34.740 think that... Like I said before, not only is 00:24:34.740 --> 00:24:36.799 it one of the best things you can do for other 00:24:36.799 --> 00:24:38.980 people, but it's one of the best things you can 00:24:38.980 --> 00:24:43.099 do for yourself. And so it's a win -win situation. 00:24:43.940 --> 00:24:48.359 And I think that it's so important to get involved 00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:50.809 early because not only does it... matter for 00:24:50.809 --> 00:24:53.450 other people, but it matters for yourself, especially 00:24:53.450 --> 00:24:55.849 as a woman in medicine. Learning how to advocate 00:24:55.849 --> 00:24:58.029 for yourself early in medicine is so important, 00:24:58.230 --> 00:25:01.069 and so just having and sparking that conversation 00:25:01.069 --> 00:25:03.710 with somebody may be life -changing. It might 00:25:03.710 --> 00:25:05.529 completely change your trajectory, and I think 00:25:05.529 --> 00:25:10.500 that is incredibly important. So finally, I have 00:25:10.500 --> 00:25:14.019 one last question for you. For listeners who 00:25:14.019 --> 00:25:17.700 feel their voices are too small to matter right 00:25:17.700 --> 00:25:20.039 now, what would you say to them about speaking 00:25:20.039 --> 00:25:23.359 up, even when it feels uncomfortable or premature? 00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:32.039 I think that it's a lie. Nobody's voice is too 00:25:32.039 --> 00:25:34.420 small. I think it's just dependent upon how you 00:25:34.420 --> 00:25:38.170 use it. I think that I'm walking the truth of 00:25:38.170 --> 00:25:40.210 that statement because I used to believe that 00:25:40.210 --> 00:25:42.730 lie as well. However, I've done some really cool 00:25:42.730 --> 00:25:45.990 things and it's done some really cool things. 00:25:46.029 --> 00:25:49.170 And so I think that you just have to like recognize 00:25:49.170 --> 00:25:53.029 that that is in fact a lie and you need to stop 00:25:53.029 --> 00:25:55.230 lying to yourself and just start where you're 00:25:55.230 --> 00:25:57.710 comfortable and slowly wick your way into areas 00:25:57.710 --> 00:26:00.190 that you're less comfortable in and that's going 00:26:00.190 --> 00:26:05.349 to get you there. I truly believe that you just 00:26:05.349 --> 00:26:10.930 like get your feet wet just a little bit. It's 00:26:10.930 --> 00:26:13.990 gonna feel uncomfortable. Find somebody you're 00:26:13.990 --> 00:26:18.890 comfortable with. Talk to them. And it's never 00:26:18.890 --> 00:26:21.829 premature. We talked about this already. We can 00:26:21.829 --> 00:26:25.690 X that off the dock because it's never premature. 00:26:27.009 --> 00:26:29.910 Even if you think it is and nothing's gonna happen, 00:26:30.029 --> 00:26:32.549 well then start and just get good at it and be 00:26:32.549 --> 00:26:36.430 better when it's not premature. But yeah, I think 00:26:36.430 --> 00:26:39.410 it comes down to just talking to somebody, always. 00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:42.759 For sure. Well, thank you so much for sharing 00:26:42.759 --> 00:26:45.279 your insights and your stories with us today. 00:26:45.940 --> 00:26:48.660 That's a wrap on this episode of Our Voices, 00:26:48.660 --> 00:26:51.720 Our Future. We hope today's conversation inspired 00:26:51.720 --> 00:26:54.059 you, challenged you, and reminded you of the 00:26:54.059 --> 00:26:56.700 power of raising your voice. The fight for equity 00:26:56.700 --> 00:26:59.500 doesn't stop here. Join us in the movement. Subscribe 00:26:59.500 --> 00:27:02.140 wherever you get your podcasts. And if you loved 00:27:02.140 --> 00:27:04.079 this podcast, share it with someone who needs 00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:07.160 to hear it. Until next time, stay bold, stay 00:27:07.160 --> 00:27:09.779 vocal, and keep the conversation going. This 00:27:09.779 --> 00:27:11.380 is our voices, our future.