WEBVTT 00:00:46.020 --> 00:00:48.719 Welcome to Our Voices, Our Future, the podcast 00:00:48.719 --> 00:00:51.119 where we amplify the voices driving change and 00:00:51.119 --> 00:00:53.500 equity within medicine and beyond. Brought to 00:00:53.500 --> 00:00:55.859 you by the Gender Equity Task Force, a committee 00:00:55.859 --> 00:00:58.200 of the American Medical Women's Association. 00:00:58.859 --> 00:01:01.200 We're here to challenge norms, break barriers 00:01:01.200 --> 00:01:04.079 and ignite conversations that matter. I'm Meenu 00:01:04.079 --> 00:01:06.400 Menene and in each episode, we will bring you 00:01:06.400 --> 00:01:08.859 candid discussions with leaders, change makers 00:01:08.859 --> 00:01:11.620 and advocates working to create a more inclusive 00:01:11.620 --> 00:01:14.379 and just world. No more silence, no more waiting. 00:01:14.819 --> 00:01:17.400 You're listening to Our Voices, Our Future. Let's 00:01:17.400 --> 00:01:20.299 get into it. Today, we're welcoming Dr. Amber 00:01:20.299 --> 00:01:23.459 Shirley, who is a PGY -1 transitional year resident 00:01:23.459 --> 00:01:27.540 at Baptist Memorial Hospital, DeSoto, and will 00:01:27.540 --> 00:01:29.980 be starting neurology residency at the University 00:01:29.980 --> 00:01:32.680 of Tennessee Health Science Center next year. 00:01:33.260 --> 00:01:35.659 She is looking forward to a career in neurology 00:01:35.659 --> 00:01:37.980 and interested in potentially subspecializing. 00:01:39.060 --> 00:01:41.439 Hi. Hi, Dr. Shirley. Before I get into it, I 00:01:41.439 --> 00:01:44.799 just wanted to kind of welcome you. Hi. Thank 00:01:44.799 --> 00:01:48.579 you so much. I'm super excited to be here. Dr. 00:01:48.719 --> 00:01:51.439 Shirley, during medical school at Lincoln Memorial 00:01:51.439 --> 00:01:53.780 University, the Bus College of Phosphopathic 00:01:53.780 --> 00:01:56.019 Medicine, she realized her passions for health 00:01:56.019 --> 00:01:59.079 care policy and advocacy, which led her to leadership 00:01:59.079 --> 00:02:02.189 and involvement with Omega Beta Iota. the American 00:02:02.189 --> 00:02:05.090 Osteopathic Association and the American Medical 00:02:05.090 --> 00:02:07.450 Association as well as the Tennessee Medical 00:02:07.450 --> 00:02:10.469 Association. She's excited to continue this involvement 00:02:10.469 --> 00:02:14.310 as the inaugural Osteopathic Scholar Advocacy 00:02:14.310 --> 00:02:17.050 Certification Program resident coordinator for 00:02:17.050 --> 00:02:20.490 Omega Beta Iota, a healthcare advocacy fellowship 00:02:20.490 --> 00:02:23.270 for osteopathic medical students she co -founded 00:02:23.270 --> 00:02:25.990 as she was inspired to create more opportunities 00:02:25.990 --> 00:02:28.389 for outstanding student advocates to develop 00:02:28.389 --> 00:02:30.150 their advocacy skills and build their career. 00:02:30.349 --> 00:02:33.770 She also serves as the vice chair for the American 00:02:33.770 --> 00:02:37.050 Medical Association resident and fellow section 00:02:37.050 --> 00:02:40.289 committee on legislation and advocacy, leading 00:02:40.289 --> 00:02:42.810 grassroots advocacy initiatives and reviewing 00:02:42.810 --> 00:02:46.270 healthcare policy. She also serves on the American 00:02:46.270 --> 00:02:48.889 Osteopathic Association's Bureau of Emerging 00:02:48.889 --> 00:02:52.389 Leaders collaborative cohort and communications 00:02:52.389 --> 00:02:55.539 workgroup. Additionally, she has been recently 00:02:55.539 --> 00:02:59.439 named the HRSA Champion DO Health Policy Fellow 00:02:59.439 --> 00:03:02.379 through the American Osteopathic Association's 00:03:02.379 --> 00:03:05.259 Training and Policy Studies, a fellowship for 00:03:05.259 --> 00:03:07.379 resident physicians to gain more experience in 00:03:07.379 --> 00:03:10.550 healthcare policy. And in addition to all of 00:03:10.550 --> 00:03:13.409 this, she's also passionate about social media, 00:03:13.689 --> 00:03:17.770 where she finds, where she herself finds a fun, 00:03:17.889 --> 00:03:19.949 creative way to share her experience in medicine, 00:03:20.409 --> 00:03:21.889 connect with other healthcare professionals, 00:03:22.430 --> 00:03:25.050 and advocate for healthcare policy. priorities 00:03:25.050 --> 00:03:27.430 outside of traditional methods. You can also 00:03:27.430 --> 00:03:29.449 find her active on TikTok, where she focuses 00:03:29.449 --> 00:03:31.830 on sharing her life outside the hospital and 00:03:31.830 --> 00:03:34.590 advice for medical students. And outside of medicine, 00:03:34.830 --> 00:03:36.650 Dr. Shirley is passionate about the outdoors, 00:03:37.110 --> 00:03:38.969 hiking, crochet, and exploring the beautiful 00:03:38.969 --> 00:03:42.469 rich history of Memphis, Tennessee, especially 00:03:42.469 --> 00:03:45.509 the music and food. She's a proud cat mom to 00:03:45.509 --> 00:03:48.810 a precious tuxedo and a mischievous orange cat. 00:03:49.469 --> 00:03:52.650 And last but not least, most importantly, she 00:03:52.650 --> 00:03:55.409 got recently engaged to her fiancé. Welcome again. 00:03:55.969 --> 00:03:58.009 Can you tell us more about yourself and your 00:03:58.009 --> 00:04:00.370 journey into medicine and kind of what led you 00:04:00.370 --> 00:04:02.129 to Korean osteopathic medicine in particular? 00:04:02.479 --> 00:04:05.599 Yeah, so thank you so much for having me today. 00:04:06.020 --> 00:04:09.539 So I grew up in rural South Alabama and one of 00:04:09.539 --> 00:04:12.879 the major things that affected my life through 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:15.000 all of that and the lives of those around me 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:18.360 was lack of access to health care. I mean, we 00:04:18.360 --> 00:04:21.720 had a small community hospital that didn't even 00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:26.420 have, for example, a OB -GYN there to deliver 00:04:26.420 --> 00:04:29.519 children. So patients were having to travel hours 00:04:29.519 --> 00:04:33.009 for that, any sort of specialist. outside of 00:04:33.009 --> 00:04:35.430 your basic family medicine doctor, we were having 00:04:35.430 --> 00:04:38.889 to travel for hours. And I realized very early 00:04:38.889 --> 00:04:41.490 on that one way that I can make a really big 00:04:41.490 --> 00:04:44.410 difference in the world and affect my lives and 00:04:44.410 --> 00:04:47.129 the life of my family was to go into medicine 00:04:47.129 --> 00:04:50.250 and focus on healthcare policy and advocacy, 00:04:50.490 --> 00:04:54.009 especially in underserved areas, and work to 00:04:54.009 --> 00:04:57.870 address those healthcare disparities. So when 00:04:57.870 --> 00:05:00.629 I got to college, I was talking to one of my 00:05:00.629 --> 00:05:04.420 professors about this. And he had been involved 00:05:04.420 --> 00:05:06.660 with several students over the years who had 00:05:06.660 --> 00:05:12.459 gone to osteopathic medical schools. And he kind 00:05:12.459 --> 00:05:14.879 of got me started on interest in that. And one 00:05:14.879 --> 00:05:16.399 of the main things that stood out to me about 00:05:16.399 --> 00:05:19.819 osteopathic medicine in particular was their 00:05:19.819 --> 00:05:24.420 focus on rural areas, underserved areas, and 00:05:24.420 --> 00:05:27.480 additional avenues for advocacy through being 00:05:27.480 --> 00:05:31.810 a DO. that are not available in other aspects 00:05:31.810 --> 00:05:37.370 of medicine. So I was very excited to be an incoming 00:05:37.370 --> 00:05:40.670 DO at LMUDECOM a few years ago. It was a great 00:05:40.670 --> 00:05:43.509 opportunity. It was a great experience that I 00:05:43.509 --> 00:05:47.740 had and I absolutely loved it. My next question 00:05:47.740 --> 00:05:50.779 for you is, what role do you think advocacy plays 00:05:50.779 --> 00:05:53.259 in addressing gender equity within the medical 00:05:53.259 --> 00:05:56.220 field? Can you share any experiences where you've 00:05:56.220 --> 00:06:00.000 engaged in advocacy efforts regarding that? Yeah, 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:03.920 so I think one of the biggest things that happens 00:06:03.920 --> 00:06:07.360 when you're advocating and you're someone who 00:06:07.360 --> 00:06:10.660 doesn't look like the stereotypical physician 00:06:10.660 --> 00:06:14.420 is just your presence and your perspective being 00:06:14.420 --> 00:06:19.959 there. So just being so I'm kind of underrepresented 00:06:19.959 --> 00:06:24.079 in both in two different ways. So as a Dio and 00:06:24.079 --> 00:06:27.079 then as a female, and then I also come from a 00:06:27.079 --> 00:06:29.879 lower middle class family. So I think all of 00:06:29.879 --> 00:06:33.360 that like my gender experience, my socio economic 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:37.680 experience, my interesting experience and perspective 00:06:37.680 --> 00:06:40.920 I have in medicine as a DO all combine and create 00:06:40.920 --> 00:06:43.899 my perspective when I'm engaging in these advocacy 00:06:43.899 --> 00:06:47.040 efforts, a lot different than those around me. 00:06:47.480 --> 00:06:52.480 So I guess an example of this is when I'm just 00:06:52.480 --> 00:06:54.420 every day when I'm lobbying, well, not every 00:06:54.420 --> 00:06:56.379 day that I lobby, but you know, when I'm lobbying. 00:06:56.759 --> 00:06:59.079 Yeah, when you're in those spaces. Yes, within 00:06:59.079 --> 00:07:03.339 those spaces, I'm surrounded by older, usually 00:07:03.339 --> 00:07:07.060 male, MD physicians, and they have their one 00:07:07.060 --> 00:07:10.060 perspective, their one thought process. And I 00:07:10.060 --> 00:07:14.560 bring my young female DO perspective and thought 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:18.959 process. And not only am I sometimes able to, 00:07:18.959 --> 00:07:25.500 like, coordinate and work with, especially the 00:07:25.500 --> 00:07:27.319 younger staffers in the congressional office, 00:07:27.480 --> 00:07:29.040 because when you lobby, you're usually meeting 00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:31.699 with a younger staffer. So not only can I level 00:07:31.699 --> 00:07:34.399 with them on a different level, I'm helping connect 00:07:34.399 --> 00:07:37.120 older generations of medicine to newer generations, 00:07:37.399 --> 00:07:40.959 because we're in a space where I am this physician's 00:07:40.959 --> 00:07:43.139 equal, even as a medical student, we're in a 00:07:43.139 --> 00:07:47.459 space that kind of equalizes. that hierarchy 00:07:47.459 --> 00:07:49.899 and I was able to bring my perspective more and 00:07:49.899 --> 00:07:53.379 kind of change some minds and change some thought 00:07:53.379 --> 00:07:56.480 processes and perspectives there. Yeah, I love 00:07:56.480 --> 00:07:59.980 many things you said. I'm also a DO and a female 00:07:59.980 --> 00:08:02.680 in medicine. And I think the perspective that 00:08:02.680 --> 00:08:04.899 we I think that's really good to highlight, I 00:08:04.899 --> 00:08:07.560 feel like for other DOs are out there and other 00:08:07.560 --> 00:08:09.600 female physicians that are out there as well. 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:11.819 I feel like your identity in those spaces is 00:08:11.819 --> 00:08:13.959 really important. And just showing up is really 00:08:13.959 --> 00:08:16.990 important. But I also like the thing you said 00:08:16.990 --> 00:08:19.110 about kind of connecting and bridging the gap 00:08:19.110 --> 00:08:21.610 and leveling the playing field and showing up 00:08:21.610 --> 00:08:24.550 in these advocacy spaces of lobbying and things. 00:08:24.569 --> 00:08:26.790 And I think that's a different perspective. So 00:08:26.790 --> 00:08:29.949 thank you for sharing that. And I feel like I 00:08:29.949 --> 00:08:32.669 love how you kind of sum that up and like different 00:08:32.669 --> 00:08:37.809 aspects of how we can advocate. In your opinion, 00:08:38.129 --> 00:08:40.889 what are effective strategies for engaging members 00:08:40.889 --> 00:08:44.080 in the medical in medical organizations to kind 00:08:44.080 --> 00:08:48.500 of promote diversity and gender equity. I think 00:08:48.500 --> 00:08:52.379 the first thing is just showing up. Just showing 00:08:52.379 --> 00:08:55.200 up as you and I, people like you and I just showing 00:08:55.200 --> 00:08:57.720 up to these organized medicine events, going 00:08:57.720 --> 00:09:00.559 to your local medicine medical societies, networking 00:09:00.559 --> 00:09:05.019 events. I think that's the main thing is just 00:09:05.019 --> 00:09:08.539 showing up and networking at these events. I 00:09:08.539 --> 00:09:12.570 know, especially when I was involved, in certain 00:09:12.570 --> 00:09:16.529 organizations in the past, I've been the youngest 00:09:16.529 --> 00:09:21.169 different voice in the room. And maybe I didn't 00:09:21.169 --> 00:09:24.470 need to walk in and say, hey, let's address diversity, 00:09:24.649 --> 00:09:26.769 equity, and inclusion today. But I could walk 00:09:26.769 --> 00:09:29.210 in and say, hi, my name is Amber. I'm a medical 00:09:29.210 --> 00:09:32.190 student at LMUDECOM. I'm super interested in 00:09:32.190 --> 00:09:36.450 this particular topic that we're discussing on 00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:42.940 diversity in medical school today at the House 00:09:42.940 --> 00:09:44.759 of Delegates. Can you tell me your perspective? 00:09:45.139 --> 00:09:48.179 That's so awesome. This is how I view that and 00:09:48.179 --> 00:09:50.320 my lived experience in that. And I think just 00:09:50.320 --> 00:09:53.460 having those conversations and just bringing 00:09:53.460 --> 00:09:56.399 yourself to the table. One of my favorite sayings 00:09:56.399 --> 00:09:59.460 is if you're not at the table, you're on the 00:09:59.460 --> 00:10:02.100 menu. So I think just really showing up. and 00:10:02.100 --> 00:10:04.460 making sure you're always at the table and your 00:10:04.460 --> 00:10:07.340 viewpoint is always there is a really good way 00:10:07.340 --> 00:10:10.960 to start having those conversations. I love that 00:10:10.960 --> 00:10:13.700 saying, I've never heard of them. I've heard 00:10:13.700 --> 00:10:15.620 the first part like about being at the table, 00:10:15.679 --> 00:10:20.460 but not the menu part. I guess my follow up question 00:10:20.460 --> 00:10:23.129 from all of this kind of is like for the person 00:10:23.129 --> 00:10:27.190 who hasn't done any work in advocacy or the early 00:10:27.190 --> 00:10:30.490 medical student who wants to get involved, did 00:10:30.490 --> 00:10:33.210 you ever have that imposter syndrome, the doubt 00:10:33.210 --> 00:10:35.509 of showing up in these spaces? And what advice 00:10:35.509 --> 00:10:39.289 did you, I guess, implement in yourself to kind 00:10:39.289 --> 00:10:42.169 of let yourself show up? But also something probably 00:10:42.169 --> 00:10:44.789 someone needs to hear about showing up at these 00:10:44.789 --> 00:10:46.809 spaces, because I feel like sometimes they tend 00:10:46.809 --> 00:10:49.929 to be scary kind of, in our brain at least, they 00:10:49.929 --> 00:10:54.090 tend to be scary. Yeah, so my first experience 00:10:54.090 --> 00:10:57.450 with lobbying was the Tennessee Medical Association's 00:10:57.450 --> 00:11:01.669 Doctor's Day on the hill in Nashville. So I recommend 00:11:01.669 --> 00:11:03.649 to all students, if you have an opportunity like 00:11:03.649 --> 00:11:07.500 this, this is like the prime. place to go so 00:11:07.500 --> 00:11:11.539 our local medical society rented a bus and they 00:11:11.539 --> 00:11:14.679 were bringing in physicians who have done this 00:11:14.679 --> 00:11:18.860 for years who know every lawmaker who have coffee 00:11:18.860 --> 00:11:22.159 with these lawmakers outside of this day right 00:11:22.159 --> 00:11:23.759 like they are bringing in all of these people 00:11:23.759 --> 00:11:27.299 and they offered a limited number of LMU students 00:11:27.299 --> 00:11:30.840 to go with them and the great thing about this 00:11:30.840 --> 00:11:34.960 particular setup was they had the physicians 00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:37.419 lobby but they had the medical students there, 00:11:37.440 --> 00:11:39.639 and we were there to learn, we were there to 00:11:39.639 --> 00:11:41.259 observe, and we were there to kind of figure 00:11:41.259 --> 00:11:44.720 out. So we got to go to the policy briefings, 00:11:45.139 --> 00:11:48.139 we got to sit in these rooms with all of these 00:11:48.139 --> 00:11:51.700 great leaders, physician leaders, and we got 00:11:51.700 --> 00:11:55.090 to hear how they approach things, and then being 00:11:55.090 --> 00:11:57.110 on the bus, you know, we were seated amongst 00:11:57.110 --> 00:11:59.750 all of these cool physicians. So we got to chat 00:11:59.750 --> 00:12:02.350 with them about their experience and how they 00:12:02.350 --> 00:12:04.750 got to where they are. And that was a wonderful 00:12:04.750 --> 00:12:08.090 first experience because I got to see everything 00:12:08.090 --> 00:12:10.769 firsthand to be there, but without the pressure 00:12:10.769 --> 00:12:13.230 of me having to speak up and me having to ever 00:12:13.230 --> 00:12:15.009 speak to the politicians for the first time. 00:12:15.250 --> 00:12:17.970 Now I would, I would, like a lot of times the 00:12:17.970 --> 00:12:20.190 politicians, there were several who were physicians 00:12:20.190 --> 00:12:22.250 themselves. So they would see medical students 00:12:22.250 --> 00:12:24.519 and they were so excited and wanted to talk to 00:12:24.519 --> 00:12:27.500 us and so we would chat but that was a really 00:12:27.500 --> 00:12:31.000 great first opportunity. Another great way to 00:12:31.000 --> 00:12:32.820 kind of get involved and get your foot in the 00:12:32.820 --> 00:12:37.559 door I think is sometimes I know double ACOM 00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:41.440 sends these out and the AOA sends these out especially 00:12:41.440 --> 00:12:43.759 the osteopathic advocacy network you can sign 00:12:43.759 --> 00:12:47.440 up and you can get like emails and you basically 00:12:47.440 --> 00:12:50.730 go into the dashboard and you put in a little 00:12:50.730 --> 00:12:53.610 personal story and you find your congressional 00:12:53.610 --> 00:12:56.389 leaders and you send and it sends an email for 00:12:56.389 --> 00:12:59.990 you. Yes. It's a great way to like do something 00:12:59.990 --> 00:13:02.330 substantial. You can also just pick up your phone 00:13:02.330 --> 00:13:05.950 and prepare a script, like go online, figure 00:13:05.950 --> 00:13:08.389 out like who your representatives are, figure 00:13:08.389 --> 00:13:11.110 out what's a big policy issue with either AAMC 00:13:11.110 --> 00:13:14.210 or ACOM or AOA right now. And just write up a 00:13:14.210 --> 00:13:19.049 small script and call your Call your representative, 00:13:19.070 --> 00:13:21.990 call your senator, and just read off your script. 00:13:22.889 --> 00:13:25.250 One thing I say to a lot of people, you're not 00:13:25.250 --> 00:13:27.269 going to be talking to the senator. You're not 00:13:27.269 --> 00:13:29.190 going to be talking to the representative. You're 00:13:29.190 --> 00:13:31.570 going to be talking to a staffer who is basically 00:13:31.570 --> 00:13:33.690 your peer, and they're going to take down your 00:13:33.690 --> 00:13:38.330 message. And I think that kind of removes that 00:13:38.330 --> 00:13:41.269 intimidation factor. It's not going to be much 00:13:41.269 --> 00:13:42.970 different than a conversation between you and 00:13:42.970 --> 00:13:45.090 I when you call each other. Because they're going 00:13:45.090 --> 00:13:49.330 to be talking to someone like you and I. As far 00:13:49.330 --> 00:13:52.350 as imposter syndrome, I feel like it's one of 00:13:52.350 --> 00:13:54.990 those things that gets better with time and experience. 00:13:55.110 --> 00:13:57.690 And I hate to say that you just need to trust 00:13:57.690 --> 00:13:59.970 the process and trust that you'll get there one 00:13:59.970 --> 00:14:03.889 day. But everyone starts somewhere. And the fact 00:14:03.889 --> 00:14:05.529 that you're just starting and getting yourself 00:14:05.529 --> 00:14:08.909 out there, you're already doing so much more 00:14:08.909 --> 00:14:14.320 than most anyone else. And so yes, it's scary. 00:14:14.519 --> 00:14:16.320 Yes, you're going to feel like I am completely 00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:20.179 unqualified to be doing this. But the more you 00:14:20.179 --> 00:14:22.500 do, the more qualified you become, the more you 00:14:22.500 --> 00:14:26.679 learn, the more confidence you have in your ability 00:14:26.679 --> 00:14:31.879 to do that. I love that practice until you're 00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:36.659 confident. Exactly. Practice confidence. Yes 00:14:36.659 --> 00:14:39.139 yes and just kind of kind of fake it till you 00:14:39.139 --> 00:14:41.379 make it you know the first few times you're going 00:14:41.379 --> 00:14:43.940 to be shaky on the inside but just breathe say 00:14:43.940 --> 00:14:46.940 you know what I'm going to come here I have a 00:14:46.940 --> 00:14:48.759 few facts up my sleeve that I'm going to share 00:14:48.759 --> 00:14:50.879 with this lawmakers I'm going to come here I'm 00:14:50.879 --> 00:14:53.679 going to say it I'm going to share my perspective 00:14:53.679 --> 00:14:56.139 and it's going to be scary but it's okay we're 00:14:56.139 --> 00:14:58.759 going to do it. Yeah, it's like we're gonna show 00:14:58.759 --> 00:15:00.480 up for clinicals. I feel like sometimes that's 00:15:00.480 --> 00:15:03.100 the same spiel we give ourselves. It might be 00:15:03.100 --> 00:15:04.759 scary, but we're gonna show up. We're gonna do 00:15:04.759 --> 00:15:08.039 this. Exactly. And it gets so much better every 00:15:08.039 --> 00:15:12.440 time. Nowadays, when I see a policy priority 00:15:12.440 --> 00:15:14.259 going off, I just pick up the phone. I don't 00:15:14.259 --> 00:15:15.919 even write up a script. I pick up the phone. 00:15:16.279 --> 00:15:18.620 I call Senator representative, be like, hey, 00:15:18.720 --> 00:15:22.059 this is Dr. Shirley, practicing physician, or 00:15:22.059 --> 00:15:24.460 I usually say practicing resident physician in 00:15:24.460 --> 00:15:26.860 the Memphis mature area. I'm very concerned about 00:15:26.860 --> 00:15:29.419 this bill coming forward for a vote in two days. 00:15:29.580 --> 00:15:33.139 I need to tell you how this affects me. Don't 00:15:33.139 --> 00:15:35.100 even think about it. It just rattles off now. 00:15:35.679 --> 00:15:38.570 Lovely. And you said you gave some resources 00:15:38.570 --> 00:15:40.470 of like where to kind of keep current of like 00:15:40.470 --> 00:15:42.409 the different policies. Are there anything like 00:15:42.409 --> 00:15:44.289 in terms of like within your state and region 00:15:44.289 --> 00:15:46.389 like places you go or you'd recommend people 00:15:46.389 --> 00:15:51.649 to go? Local medical society is for me. I'm involved 00:15:51.649 --> 00:15:54.009 in the Memphis Medical Society. They have their 00:15:54.009 --> 00:15:56.769 own political action committee. They send advocacy 00:15:56.769 --> 00:15:59.690 alerts. They are very involved. Physicians. State 00:15:59.690 --> 00:16:02.210 Medical Society is a good place to get involved. 00:16:03.070 --> 00:16:05.950 For medical students, your local AMA and SOMA 00:16:05.950 --> 00:16:10.490 chapters are super, usually are super active, 00:16:10.690 --> 00:16:14.480 have a lot of resources for you. That's where 00:16:14.480 --> 00:16:16.960 I would start. I know there's some awesome other 00:16:16.960 --> 00:16:20.340 organizations out there. I mean the AOA of course, 00:16:20.580 --> 00:16:24.320 big fan of them obviously. The AMA has well been 00:16:24.320 --> 00:16:26.740 super involved, but many other organizations 00:16:26.740 --> 00:16:29.639 like Doctors for America, American Medical Women's 00:16:29.639 --> 00:16:32.559 Association, a lot of your specialty organizations 00:16:32.559 --> 00:16:35.360 have a lot of opportunities to do advocacy with 00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:39.320 them as well. Lovely. So my next question is 00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:41.799 kind of about you, your experience kind of matching 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:45.299 into neurology. Can you talk a little bit more 00:16:45.299 --> 00:16:47.399 about that and maybe also like how you think 00:16:47.399 --> 00:16:49.379 gender disparities kind of affected the process 00:16:49.379 --> 00:16:53.820 if it did any? Yeah, so I did not decide to do 00:16:53.820 --> 00:16:57.059 neurology until third year of medical school. 00:16:57.120 --> 00:17:01.100 So I was somewhat interested in it, but I came 00:17:01.100 --> 00:17:04.599 in pretty set on wanting to do a primary care 00:17:04.599 --> 00:17:08.450 specialty based off of being raised in Alabama 00:17:08.450 --> 00:17:12.609 and wanting to serve the underserved. But as 00:17:12.609 --> 00:17:15.769 I got into my clinical rotations, I quickly realized 00:17:15.769 --> 00:17:23.289 that having a very broad scope and having 20 00:17:23.289 --> 00:17:25.710 different things come at me every 15 minutes 00:17:25.710 --> 00:17:30.589 was not it for me. I felt so overwhelmed and 00:17:30.589 --> 00:17:35.119 I felt like I could never get a good grasp and 00:17:35.119 --> 00:17:39.059 get ahead of what I needed to get ahead. And 00:17:39.059 --> 00:17:42.539 so I realized very early on, I needed to go into 00:17:42.539 --> 00:17:45.960 a specialty where I had a little bit more of 00:17:45.960 --> 00:17:49.539 a limited scope where I could almost, you never 00:17:49.539 --> 00:17:51.740 really perfect anything, right? It's the practice 00:17:51.740 --> 00:17:55.319 of it, but where I could perfect my craft a little 00:17:55.319 --> 00:17:58.599 bit more. a lot more comfortable and confident 00:17:58.599 --> 00:18:02.980 within what I knew. So while I was on my family 00:18:02.980 --> 00:18:05.400 medicine rotation, I had a lot of patients with 00:18:05.400 --> 00:18:09.859 neurological diseases and processes going on 00:18:09.859 --> 00:18:14.119 and I found it fascinating. I loved every minute 00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:19.940 of those headaches, Parkinson's, tremors, neuropathy, 00:18:20.380 --> 00:18:24.349 you name it. It was so fascinating. I really 00:18:24.349 --> 00:18:27.250 enjoyed it. So I set up a neurology clerkship. 00:18:28.069 --> 00:18:32.069 So I'm, I don't know. Well, I do know this is 00:18:32.069 --> 00:18:34.970 kind of more of a DO thing. We don't have neurology 00:18:34.970 --> 00:18:37.730 as a core clerkship. Yeah, I didn't either. Yeah. 00:18:38.029 --> 00:18:40.970 Yeah. I don't think there's maybe one or two 00:18:40.970 --> 00:18:43.269 DO schools that do, but we don't, we don't have 00:18:43.269 --> 00:18:46.549 the matching like co -map for it either. Yeah. 00:18:46.589 --> 00:18:49.390 We just kind of lose that exposure there, which 00:18:49.390 --> 00:18:52.180 is sad. And I can talk. more about that anytime. 00:18:53.200 --> 00:18:56.500 So I set up a neurology clerkship and it was 00:18:56.500 --> 00:18:59.640 outpatient general neurology clinic. Loved it. 00:19:00.559 --> 00:19:04.460 My worst day on that rotation was better than 00:19:04.460 --> 00:19:07.940 any of my best days on any other rotation. I 00:19:07.940 --> 00:19:09.940 enjoyed it. I wanted to go back. So I decided 00:19:09.940 --> 00:19:14.039 then I was going to do neurology. And so I went 00:19:14.039 --> 00:19:17.799 in from there kind of halfway through third year 00:19:17.799 --> 00:19:22.410 pivoting everything. to neuro from primary care. 00:19:23.210 --> 00:19:27.269 It was really interesting. I was thankfully able 00:19:27.269 --> 00:19:30.569 to present one of my neurology cases from my 00:19:30.569 --> 00:19:32.910 family medicine rotation. I did a poster on that. 00:19:32.930 --> 00:19:36.150 It was a very interesting manifestation of an 00:19:36.150 --> 00:19:40.269 action tremor. And so I was able to present that. 00:19:40.309 --> 00:19:42.950 I got involved with the student section of American 00:19:42.950 --> 00:19:46.630 Academy of Neurology and started making connections 00:19:46.630 --> 00:19:53.160 to get into neurology. And neurology, there's 00:19:53.160 --> 00:19:55.759 a lot more women coming up in neurology than 00:19:55.759 --> 00:19:59.900 there used to be. Out of my intern class, there's 00:19:59.900 --> 00:20:03.200 seven of us and four of us are female. So I think 00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:06.859 that's a really neat kind of change in the tides 00:20:06.859 --> 00:20:09.640 that we're seeing. I feel like most of my friends 00:20:09.640 --> 00:20:13.220 from LMU at least half that went into neurology 00:20:13.220 --> 00:20:15.839 were also female. So I think we're seeing a really 00:20:15.839 --> 00:20:20.119 neat shift in the field lately. But additionally, 00:20:20.319 --> 00:20:23.980 being a DO, only 14 % of neurology applicants 00:20:23.980 --> 00:20:29.799 are DOs. So that was a really interesting, like 00:20:29.799 --> 00:20:34.579 I was coming in underdog into this because I 00:20:34.579 --> 00:20:38.190 am late into kind of knowing what I wanted to 00:20:38.190 --> 00:20:42.170 do. I had not taken, I had not taken USMLE step 00:20:42.170 --> 00:20:45.930 one because I wanted to do primary care, so complex 00:20:45.930 --> 00:20:49.390 level one. And I would still argue that complex 00:20:49.390 --> 00:20:53.309 should be sufficient. But in reality, a lot of 00:20:53.309 --> 00:20:55.609 your more academic programs want to see USMLE. 00:20:55.710 --> 00:20:57.910 So I had not taken USMLE step one. I didn't have 00:20:57.910 --> 00:21:01.869 a lot of neurology research. I'm going into a 00:21:01.869 --> 00:21:11.130 field where I am largely not. What? And so I 00:21:11.130 --> 00:21:13.859 felt like I was playing catch -up, but It ended 00:21:13.859 --> 00:21:16.339 up working out really, really well. I utilized 00:21:16.339 --> 00:21:18.400 a lot of the connections that I had made through 00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:21.400 my advocacy work and organized medical medicine 00:21:21.400 --> 00:21:25.059 work and was able to secure a couple of audition 00:21:25.059 --> 00:21:28.259 rotations at some programs I was very interested 00:21:28.259 --> 00:21:30.960 in, ended up here at Memphis on my audition, 00:21:31.819 --> 00:21:35.359 fell in love with the program. I had a great 00:21:35.359 --> 00:21:39.759 time. One of the things that really Drew me to 00:21:39.759 --> 00:21:42.759 the program was the diversity of the residents 00:21:42.759 --> 00:21:48.519 here. They were male, female, IMG, USMD, USDAO, 00:21:48.819 --> 00:21:51.640 older, younger, first career, second career. 00:21:52.740 --> 00:21:57.779 It was so amazing to me to see all of these people 00:21:57.779 --> 00:22:00.319 in this neurology program and how they all have 00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:04.640 their different perspectives and different experiences 00:22:04.640 --> 00:22:11.039 to the field. I also love the city. I'm a music 00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:13.480 person, big music person, grew up playing the 00:22:13.480 --> 00:22:17.420 piano. Memphis, of course, is home to so much 00:22:17.420 --> 00:22:20.200 rich music history. I live like five minutes 00:22:20.200 --> 00:22:22.740 from where Elvis lived at one point. That is 00:22:22.740 --> 00:22:26.539 wild. I can just drive down past Elvis's old 00:22:26.539 --> 00:22:29.559 house. Are you kidding me? I was walking past 00:22:29.559 --> 00:22:32.359 a theater the other day and then I later found 00:22:32.359 --> 00:22:34.500 out that's the theater that Elvis used to rent 00:22:34.500 --> 00:22:36.380 out on the weekend for him and his buddies to 00:22:36.380 --> 00:22:38.950 hang out in. Are you kidding me? I'm just standing 00:22:38.950 --> 00:22:43.130 there. I'm just standing there. I'm like getting, 00:22:43.450 --> 00:22:46.470 I'm eating a burger at Huey's and across the 00:22:46.470 --> 00:22:48.730 street is a record studio that the Rolling Stones, 00:22:48.849 --> 00:22:51.690 my favorite band of all time, recorded an album 00:22:51.690 --> 00:22:56.569 like 10 years ago at. What insane. Anyway. I 00:22:56.569 --> 00:22:58.890 love your passion for both neurology and music. 00:22:59.230 --> 00:23:03.349 Thank you. Thank you. But I really did fall in 00:23:03.349 --> 00:23:07.690 love with the city and the program and was absolutely 00:23:07.690 --> 00:23:11.269 stoked to end up matching here and so excited 00:23:11.269 --> 00:23:13.529 to see what the future holds. I'm definitely 00:23:13.529 --> 00:23:16.829 interested in subspecializing. There's a lot 00:23:16.829 --> 00:23:20.529 of different areas of neurology to go into, which 00:23:20.529 --> 00:23:24.150 I love. I love that I have a narrower scope of 00:23:24.150 --> 00:23:28.440 expertise, but still a broad variety of things 00:23:28.440 --> 00:23:31.380 I can do. So I can do outpatient clinic, I can 00:23:31.380 --> 00:23:34.859 do inpatient, I can do neuro critical care, I 00:23:34.859 --> 00:23:37.680 can do interventional neurology, I can do telehealth, 00:23:37.819 --> 00:23:41.720 I can do all of these different things within 00:23:41.720 --> 00:23:43.740 this field. And I think that's so awesome. I'm 00:23:43.740 --> 00:23:45.839 super excited, excited to explore it over the 00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:49.259 next few years. Currently, I'm more of an inpatient 00:23:49.259 --> 00:23:52.920 girl, I do enjoy the shift work, I enjoy going 00:23:52.920 --> 00:23:58.400 in. getting there, spending a few hours dedicated 00:23:58.400 --> 00:24:01.180 to my hospital patients and then signing off, 00:24:01.319 --> 00:24:05.240 finishing up my stuff for the day and not having 00:24:05.240 --> 00:24:08.299 anything else. I really enjoy that separation. 00:24:09.299 --> 00:24:12.660 But we'll see how things pan out. I still have 00:24:12.660 --> 00:24:15.980 a lot to see, a lot to do, a lot to learn. Yeah, 00:24:16.140 --> 00:24:19.099 I think that's the beauty of our journey in medicine 00:24:19.099 --> 00:24:21.880 is that we get to explore it, especially during 00:24:21.880 --> 00:24:24.920 our clinicals if we haven't done before already 00:24:24.920 --> 00:24:28.079 and same in residency if it's subspecialty of 00:24:28.079 --> 00:24:30.759 choice or anything anything that's I love that 00:24:30.759 --> 00:24:35.559 we get to learn and explore. I'm so excited too. 00:24:36.539 --> 00:24:38.859 So with doing the transitional year, we're allowed 00:24:38.859 --> 00:24:42.099 to rotate through neurology three times. So they 00:24:42.099 --> 00:24:44.019 have us rotate with our program because it's 00:24:44.019 --> 00:24:47.900 all within the same area and same hospital system. 00:24:49.579 --> 00:24:52.619 So I've gotten to do general neurology and epilepsy 00:24:52.619 --> 00:24:56.980 already in patient. I get to do it again in a 00:24:56.980 --> 00:24:59.660 couple of months. So it's been so nice to have 00:24:59.660 --> 00:25:03.589 that early. exposure and that early ability to 00:25:03.589 --> 00:25:08.650 get in there and do neurology. It's a nice little 00:25:08.650 --> 00:25:10.730 something to look forward to after months of 00:25:10.730 --> 00:25:15.869 inpatient wards. No, but that makes sense. I 00:25:15.869 --> 00:25:18.109 feel like it's what you want to do and what you're 00:25:18.109 --> 00:25:20.289 passionate about too, so I think that's a good 00:25:20.289 --> 00:25:26.319 thing to be able to look forward to. Yes. question 00:25:26.319 --> 00:25:29.240 is, we kind of talked about support in a little 00:25:29.240 --> 00:25:31.960 bit, but what resources or support systems have 00:25:31.960 --> 00:25:35.460 you found helpful while you're navigating like, 00:25:35.880 --> 00:25:38.440 medicine as a whole in different stages of your 00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:42.720 life? So for me, one of my biggest support systems 00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:46.099 has been the friends and mentors that I've made 00:25:46.099 --> 00:25:50.039 through organized medicine. I was so like, I 00:25:50.039 --> 00:25:54.559 was so lucky to be able to represent our state 00:25:54.559 --> 00:26:00.180 and my school on levels outside on a bigger stage. 00:26:00.519 --> 00:26:04.039 Like I served in the AMA, I served as a delegate 00:26:04.039 --> 00:26:06.839 to the House of Delegates. So I sat with the 00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:09.759 Tennessee Medical Association and I got to know 00:26:09.759 --> 00:26:13.059 a lot of those physicians incredibly well. And 00:26:13.059 --> 00:26:15.940 they have been so supportive of me throughout 00:26:15.940 --> 00:26:20.180 medical school and getting into residency. They 00:26:20.180 --> 00:26:22.279 have just been wonderful. I mean, some of them 00:26:22.279 --> 00:26:25.680 came to my graduation from medical school. Several 00:26:25.680 --> 00:26:27.759 of them are hopefully gonna be at attendance 00:26:27.759 --> 00:26:31.039 in my wedding. I lived with some of, I lived 00:26:31.039 --> 00:26:33.299 during all of my auditions, they were all within 00:26:33.299 --> 00:26:37.140 the state. I lived with them while I did my auditions. 00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:42.359 It was such a sweet, sweet relationship that 00:26:42.359 --> 00:26:44.400 I've been able to build with these physicians. 00:26:45.259 --> 00:26:47.960 And that's been one of my biggest sources of 00:26:47.960 --> 00:26:51.380 support. Additionally, the American Osteopathic 00:26:51.380 --> 00:26:54.440 Association, being a DO in and of itself is like 00:26:54.440 --> 00:26:56.339 being in a big family, right? We're still kind 00:26:56.339 --> 00:27:00.099 of a small profession. And especially when you 00:27:00.099 --> 00:27:04.279 get involved in like SOMA or COSGP or the AOA, 00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:08.539 you meet so many people, other osteopathic medical 00:27:08.539 --> 00:27:11.599 students, residents, physicians, even staff from 00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.130 around the nation that are very passionate, are 00:27:15.130 --> 00:27:17.410 very excited about the osteopathic profession, 00:27:17.569 --> 00:27:19.349 are very excited to meet you. And some of my 00:27:19.349 --> 00:27:23.970 closest friends have come from that. I talk to 00:27:23.970 --> 00:27:27.710 my friends from OBI especially, at least weekly, 00:27:27.849 --> 00:27:31.450 some of them daily, we're besties. I love them 00:27:31.450 --> 00:27:34.819 so much. This goes to one of my biggest pieces 00:27:34.819 --> 00:27:37.700 of advice for people who might be afraid to get 00:27:37.700 --> 00:27:40.319 involved in leadership or advocacy or organized 00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:42.660 medicine outside of their school. Man, when you 00:27:42.660 --> 00:27:44.420 do that, you meet some of the coolest people 00:27:44.420 --> 00:27:46.200 and you become friends with some of the coolest 00:27:46.200 --> 00:27:52.259 people. I share this experience because it's 00:27:52.259 --> 00:27:56.279 so special to me. I recently engaged. There's 00:27:56.279 --> 00:27:59.559 this big conference. that DOs have every year. 00:27:59.700 --> 00:28:02.579 It's called OMED, the Osteopathic Medical Education 00:28:02.579 --> 00:28:04.819 Conference. So she was in Nashville, Tennessee. 00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:09.640 And there's so many of my friends that go to 00:28:09.640 --> 00:28:12.559 this. My school friends, my friends from Omega 00:28:12.559 --> 00:28:15.559 Beta Iota. I have friends that I've made through 00:28:15.559 --> 00:28:17.660 different organizations that all come to OMED. 00:28:18.140 --> 00:28:21.700 And so my boyfriend at the time, when he was 00:28:21.700 --> 00:28:26.029 scheming his proposal, We were both going to 00:28:26.029 --> 00:28:28.130 attend OMED. He's a pharmacist, so he's very 00:28:28.130 --> 00:28:30.650 interested in that sort of stuff. And they have 00:28:30.650 --> 00:28:33.910 an advocate track for spouses. Oh, really? I 00:28:33.910 --> 00:28:39.750 did not know that. Yes. And they have like an 00:28:39.750 --> 00:28:42.000 exhibit hall, and they have different... lectures 00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:44.980 and all with different like medications and pharmaceuticals, 00:28:44.980 --> 00:28:49.740 which he was interested in. So his thought process, 00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:53.160 which he's right on the money with, was if I 00:28:53.160 --> 00:28:55.359 figure out how to propose to her, oh, Med, she'll 00:28:55.359 --> 00:28:57.839 be able to celebrate with all of her friends. 00:28:58.430 --> 00:29:01.710 Yeah, that's so sweet. My best friend from medical 00:29:01.710 --> 00:29:04.349 school lives an hour outside in Nashville. She's 00:29:04.349 --> 00:29:07.609 finishing up her clinical rotations. And so he 00:29:07.609 --> 00:29:11.069 schemed with her and got her to come over and 00:29:11.069 --> 00:29:12.769 we went to the Centennial Park right in front 00:29:12.769 --> 00:29:15.990 of the Taylor Swift bench. And we were just going 00:29:15.990 --> 00:29:21.150 to have a picnic with him and my best friend 00:29:21.150 --> 00:29:23.450 and her family. And next thing I know, he was 00:29:23.450 --> 00:29:28.099 down on one knee. That's such a sweet memory. 00:29:28.460 --> 00:29:31.740 And it was so great because we got to celebrate 00:29:31.740 --> 00:29:34.960 with so many close friends that weekend and it's 00:29:34.960 --> 00:29:37.720 just so special. He did good. He planned really 00:29:37.720 --> 00:29:41.240 well. He did! Oh my gosh, he did so good. He 00:29:41.240 --> 00:29:42.740 planned it perfectly. I didn't have a clue, which 00:29:42.740 --> 00:29:44.559 is how I wanted it. I didn't have a single clue. 00:29:45.059 --> 00:29:48.259 That's how I wanted it as well. I was like, I 00:29:48.259 --> 00:29:50.240 want to be surprised. I was like, I'm going to 00:29:50.240 --> 00:29:53.200 be purposely oblivious. And whenever we go out 00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:55.500 to do a date, I'm going to have my hair and makeup 00:29:55.500 --> 00:29:57.900 done and in a cute outfit. So that way you won't 00:29:57.900 --> 00:30:02.099 have to worry about it. Yeah, planner, you are. 00:30:03.920 --> 00:30:06.500 But those are important things to plan. They 00:30:06.500 --> 00:30:12.490 are. Yeah. I love that. I think my last question 00:30:12.490 --> 00:30:14.309 for you is kind of retouch on it a little bit, 00:30:14.609 --> 00:30:16.710 but advice you would love to give young women 00:30:16.710 --> 00:30:20.549 or those who are underrepresented in medicine, 00:30:21.170 --> 00:30:23.049 especially in terms of leadership and advocacy 00:30:23.049 --> 00:30:27.990 roles and seeking them out? I say show up. Show 00:30:27.990 --> 00:30:32.029 up as much as you can. Call people, email people. 00:30:32.840 --> 00:30:36.839 Reach out to your local medical societies. Reach 00:30:36.839 --> 00:30:41.279 out to if you have a professor or a dean at your 00:30:41.279 --> 00:30:44.420 school who you know is involved in some aspect 00:30:44.420 --> 00:30:46.920 with leadership or advocacy. Reach out. See if 00:30:46.920 --> 00:30:48.640 they're willing to mentor you. See if they're 00:30:48.640 --> 00:30:50.720 willing to just sit down and have a little 30 00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:54.099 minute conversation about their experience in 00:30:54.099 --> 00:30:57.240 leadership and what it means to be a woman in 00:30:57.240 --> 00:31:00.960 medical leadership. I found so much advice and 00:31:00.960 --> 00:31:02.900 so much support from just being willing to reach 00:31:02.900 --> 00:31:06.259 out. There's one of my close mentors now, Dr. 00:31:06.500 --> 00:31:08.960 Caparelli. He is former president of the Tennessee 00:31:08.960 --> 00:31:13.380 Medical Association. We have that relationship 00:31:13.380 --> 00:31:18.779 because I just I had gotten his number from an 00:31:18.779 --> 00:31:21.160 event we had on campus. And I just called him 00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:24.039 one night and asked him if he would come speak 00:31:24.039 --> 00:31:26.099 to a group of medical students and shared with 00:31:26.099 --> 00:31:28.619 him some of my interests in medicine. And then 00:31:28.619 --> 00:31:32.140 he came and spoke to us. And then I reached out 00:31:32.140 --> 00:31:34.039 again a couple of times about other things. And 00:31:34.039 --> 00:31:36.859 we just, we got close to that. And he's been 00:31:36.859 --> 00:31:39.059 one of the closest mentors that I've had throughout 00:31:39.059 --> 00:31:42.960 medical school and now in residency still. And 00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:45.930 that was all because I didn't. Well, I did hesitate 00:31:45.930 --> 00:31:47.970 because I was scared. I'm like, who am I a second 00:31:47.970 --> 00:31:49.710 year medical student picking up the phone to 00:31:49.710 --> 00:31:51.910 call the president of the Tennessee Medical Association? 00:31:52.269 --> 00:31:54.609 That's horrifying. I did hesitate, but because 00:31:54.609 --> 00:31:58.029 I didn't let the hesitation stop me. Yeah, I 00:31:58.029 --> 00:32:00.890 reached out. I put myself out there and now. 00:32:01.500 --> 00:32:04.079 I've built that relationship and now I have that 00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:06.380 support and now I have that greater confidence 00:32:06.380 --> 00:32:09.019 built from that. And so my biggest advice is 00:32:09.019 --> 00:32:12.180 to just show up, reach out. It's okay to hesitate, 00:32:12.279 --> 00:32:16.059 but get over your hesitation and do it. I love 00:32:16.059 --> 00:32:18.339 that advice and I think that's great for someone 00:32:18.339 --> 00:32:20.799 to hear. I think showing up is really important. 00:32:21.799 --> 00:32:25.059 Like you said, I think the hesitation is natural. 00:32:25.500 --> 00:32:27.380 I think just don't let the hesitation stop you. 00:32:27.549 --> 00:32:30.170 Exactly. And I think hesitation is good because 00:32:30.170 --> 00:32:32.650 in a way it makes you think about what you're 00:32:32.650 --> 00:32:34.710 doing. It makes you be a little bit more prepared 00:32:34.710 --> 00:32:36.630 because instead of just being like, oh, let me 00:32:36.630 --> 00:32:40.289 call this person, you're like, okay, I need to 00:32:40.289 --> 00:32:43.769 call this person. I feel like I should. I'm scared. 00:32:44.509 --> 00:32:47.210 What should I say to them? How should I go about 00:32:47.210 --> 00:32:49.990 this in a good way? And I think having a little 00:32:49.990 --> 00:32:52.190 bit of hesitation is okay. There's a reason our 00:32:52.190 --> 00:32:54.529 bodies make us hesitate sometimes, and it's okay. 00:32:54.769 --> 00:32:58.619 Just don't let it hold you back. Yeah. Well, 00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:00.480 it's really been lovely chatting with you, Dr. 00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:03.140 Shirley. I've had a wonderful time. I hope you 00:33:03.140 --> 00:33:05.720 have had a wonderful time as well. Yes, this 00:33:05.720 --> 00:33:09.619 has been so great. Lovely. And that's a wrap 00:33:09.619 --> 00:33:12.180 on this episode of Our Voices, Our Future. We 00:33:12.180 --> 00:33:14.559 hope today's conversation inspired you, challenged 00:33:14.559 --> 00:33:17.019 you, and reminded you of the power of raising 00:33:17.019 --> 00:33:19.480 your voice. The fight for equity doesn't stop 00:33:19.480 --> 00:33:22.079 here. Join us in this movement. Subscribe wherever 00:33:22.079 --> 00:33:24.339 you get your podcast. If you love this episode, 00:33:24.380 --> 00:33:26.990 share it with someone who needs to hear it. Until 00:33:26.990 --> 00:33:29.509 next time, stay bold, stay vocal and keep the 00:33:29.509 --> 00:33:32.309 conversation going. This is Our Voices, Our Future.