fought in the enchanting forests of augusta national
park georgia in the united states it's played
in picture -perfect settings driving up magnolia
lane you're met by a grand old clubhouse which
is the gateway to golfing heaven they say it's
perfect they say it's where god himself hangs
out it could be the garden of eden the fairways
are impeccable the surroundings are idyllic the
trees and flowers as rare as they are stunning
it oozes class the breeze whispers the tales
of legends into your ear the crowd's cheers echo
through the trees it has history at every turn
Mark Twain is said to have described golf as
a good walk spoiled, but he died before Augusta
National Golf Club was formed. He doesn't know
what he's missed. The best contends with the
best on one of the hardest golf courses in the
world. If you win it, you really have earned
the right to be considered one of the masters
of the game. This is the Sporting Almanac. Hi
Ben. Hi Jack. How are you? Yeah, I'm alright,
thanks mate. How are you? Yeah, not too bad.
We're just recording this just after the running
of the Grand National. It was won by Nick Rocket
at 33 -1, which incredibly, I did actually bet
on him this year. I didn't. Well, you know, at
least one of us knows what they're doing. Completely
not just random luck. unfortunately yeah it's
another race not without controversy um there's
a couple of uh horses one horse pulled up one
horse fell and both horses made their way to
the horse ambulance which i only discovered today
was a thing um a good thing uh yes a very good
thing both made it into the ambulance on their
feet so fingers crossed and there'll be no lasting
damage from that but across the meet there has
been horse deaths again and rachel blackmore
who we mentioned in the last episode had a bad
fall On the first day of the meet, her horse
unfortunately lost its life and she had to be
taken away for checks as well. So just another
reminder, it is a dangerous sport and this year
is no exception. Thanks for getting us off to
such a positive, happy start, Jack. It's all
uphill from here. The race itself though, the
Mullins National. The Mullins National, yeah,
absolutely. First, second and third, all trained
by Willie Mullins. And I think fifth as well.
Incredible. And his son was riding the winner.
Yeah, and his son was riding the winner, Patrick
Mullins, as an amateur. I was just going to say,
before we get on to this week's episode, anything
else going on this week that we should cover
before we start? There's a couple of things.
It's not the busiest weekend of sport ever. The
Women's Six Nations continues this weekend. Round
three of that is coming up this weekend. Go on
the Red Roses. Go on the Red Roses, indeed. Anything
else, Ben? Bahrain Grand Prix? Ah, the Bahrain
Grand Prix, yes. Round four of this year's season?
Round four already, yeah. Coming thick and fast.
Coming out of episode one, there is one or two
things I think we should mention because... I
don't know if you're aware of this, Ben, but
we made one or two small errors in the first
episode. We mentioned a few times it was the
176th running of the Grand National, when in
fact it was the 177th running. Ah, there we are.
Don't know if you know that. Can't do maths.
We've corrected ourselves now, and it's my job
to fact check, so I hold my hands up and apologise
for that. In addition... Unfortunately, as good
a story as it was, Easter Hero was not the runner
-up in the 1928 National. He took out the entire
group, somewhere between 20 and 35 other runners
and also himself. But one of the other horses
did fall, get up again and finish. That was Billy
Barton, who was an American horse, I believe,
ridden by Tommy Cullinan. So there you go. Oh,
nice. We have corrected ourselves and we are
back in the game. So you already introduced it,
but do you want to go again? Where are we this
week, Ben? We're at the Masters this week, Jack.
Oh, I can't wait. It's the best. It is the best
tournament in golf. It is the best setting in
golf. I am going to Georgia. I don't know if
you know this. I think I'm going to Georgia later
this year. I'm certainly going to the Deep South
or the South generally. So I don't know if I'll
have time or... the um credits with the people
i'm traveling with to uh pop in there and more
than that i don't actually know if they allow
guests um unless you remember but uh i'm sure
you're swinging by and have a look from the outside
um if i if i get the chance but it's a big state
in a big country so might not get the opportunity
that would be unreal though even just to have
a look around a little tour even get thrown out
If I sneak in, that would be an absolute honor.
Anyway, would you like to tell us about the Masters
Tournament and about Augusta National? Yes, I
would be very happy to. I know that you probably
know some of this already, but for those who
are less familiar with either the game of golf
or the tournament itself, it was founded by the
amateur golf champion, Bobby Jones, and an investment
banker, Clifford Roberts. And they set up the
Augusta National Golf Club, which is the host,
essentially, to the Masters. And the tournament
is pretty unique in that it's the only major
tournament conducted by a private club rather
than a national golfing organization like the
PGA. And it's been held since 1934. And it's
been played every single year except 1943 because
of World War II. Good excuse. 1944. World War
II, good excuse. 1945, World War II, good excuse.
Very solid excuses. But it did prevail during
COVID. It was delayed and it was played at the
end of the year outside of its usual calendar
slot. At the back end of the year, it actually
was the last major in 2020. But it was played.
But yeah, I mean, the purse back in 1934, I think
the winner earned... $1 ,500, and now it's $3
.6 million. So it's done okay. And it was originally
called the Augusta National Invitation Tournament.
And this is quite a fun story, actually. There
was a debate whether to call it the Masters or
the Augusta National Invitation Tournament, which
really rolls off the tongue. Bobby Jones thought
it was a bit presumptuous to call it the Masters.
But the press got wind of it and they ran a story
referring to it as the Masters and it obviously
stuck and has henceforth been known. But it was
officially titled the Masters in 1939, I think.
So there were a couple of iterations of the tournament
under its original name. But yeah, I mean, the
Masters is the Masters. And there's a lot that
we can talk about on this subject. Yeah, it's
the first of golf's four major championships
and the only one that's played at the same venue.
Possibly the most iconic sporting venue in the
game of golf. Oh, that's debatable. Apart from...
Scottish people disagreeing with you there. Exactly.
Well, you've pre -empted me, mate, other than
St Andrews, probably. So, yeah. Which I have
been to. Not played at, but I've been to. I'm
about to say something, which anyone who is interested
in golf who ends up listening to this will...
be astonished by and perhaps dislike me for but
I won free tickets to the 150th Open which was
at St Andrews where Tiger was playing and I couldn't
find anyone to go with me so I handed them back
To be fair that's as much on me as it is on you
You presumably invited me to that and I wasn't
able to go, I imagine. I did. And you turned
me down. So it's a group effort there. Not to
be repeated. Yes. Well, I mean, I certainly wouldn't
be turning down free tickets to the Masters if
I ever got them. So lesson learned. I'd go on
my own if necessary. You and me both. Yeah, exactly.
Well, back to the tournament. 85 to 100 participants.
Invitational only, which is a really interesting
aspect of this tournament, is an official money
event on the PGA Tour, European Tour, I think
Japanese Golf Tour as well, maybe. I don't know
what actually its official title is, but the
Asia Circuit. And yeah, the invitational criteria
is complex, but it essentially ensures that all
the masters, weirdly, turn up at this tournament
all the all the best players so um all prior
champions get a lifetime invite all major winners
from the previous season all winners on the pga
tour as long as they carry some sufficient ranking
points or something uh the current olympic gold
medalist which i guess is a new addition to the
criteria that's interesting yeah the top 50 in
the world the top 30 money winners in the previous
pga tour which is called the fedex cup for those
that aren't informed um the top 12 from the last
tournament and they also have a very long -standing
amateur history and invite basically all of the
um best amateurs from around the world uh through
series of amateur tournaments uh and yeah the
top four players from the previous us open uh
open and pga championship um so yeah like a pretty
a pretty interesting set of criteria there is
one other um way in which you can be invited
and that is through um special invitations which
we'll get onto in a minute Yeah, it's worth pointing
out with that, obviously a lot of people will
fall under multiple criteria there. So obviously
if you have won a major title, you are also probably
in the top 30 of the rankings. Exactly. And they
do, people hit all the, the top 50 in the world
basically hit all the criteria normally. So it's
just the people outside of that. But yeah, special
invitations are a fun thing. They are traditionally
predominantly used to invite foreign players
who don't meet the criteria for an invite. And
it's at the discretion of the club. And the first
to receive such an invitation was Gary Player.
He was the first foreign winner of the Masters
as well, being from South Africa, and a three
-time winner. Sorry, he wasn't the first to receive
it. That's wrong. He wrote to the Masters asking.
This is the reason why it's a fun story. Because
he's the first foreign winner and he got into
his first Masters via a special invitation. That's
what I meant to say. Before he went on to win
three Masters. And he wrote to them requesting
a special invite. And when he was granted one,
he essentially crowdfunded his way to the tournament,
which I think is kind of sweet given the prestige
and the success that he then went on to earn.
Getting all the way from South Africa to Georgia
in the United States. Must have been a mean feat
back in the day. Back in the early 1960s. No,
probably not. But yeah, he's not the only person
of note to have received a special invitation.
The first black player to receive a special invitation
was a chap called Lee Elder, who was given one
in 1975, which is weirdly the same year that
Tiger Woods was born. And people and politicians
have been lobbying for a couple of years for
Elder to receive a special invite because he
was a decent player in his own right. But the
club resisted, not on the basis that they were
obviously racist in the 1970s, but on the basis
that, as they said at least. If black players
were good enough, then they could qualify in
their own right. Convenient reasoning. Well,
you know, weirdly not a barrier to inviting white
players from South Africa who had also not qualified
and met the criteria. So, yeah, read into that
where you will. There's an inference there. But
Elder did obviously get his invite in 75 and
he received an awful lot of abuse. Quite an enormous
amount of hate mail, I think. And he even rented
two houses in the tournament week and moved between
them so that people couldn't track his movements
easily. And he didn't eat alone. He would always
have someone with him. And he would eventually
go on to miss the cut. But obviously, his participation
in the 1975 edition of the tournament was infinitely
more important than his scorecard. But yeah,
he... You know, it's the start of something.
And he would return two more times and earn two
top 25 finishes. And he also finished his career
with four PGA Tour wins and a Ryder Cup in 79.
Yeah. And he'd be the first black player as well
to hit the honorary tee shot in 2021 alongside
one Jack Nicklaus. Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player
himself. Okay. Yeah. I find it incredible that
that was 1975. Obviously, America has a very
long history of segregation, particularly in
the South, particularly in the likes of Alabama
and Georgia, Georgia being where this tournament
takes place. But even so, 1975 is a full decade
after the civil rights movement. It goes to show
the... white conservative nature of golf which
does persist to a certain extent to this day
although obviously has been ruptured somewhat
by certain individuals and their success one
in particular in the late 90s who i believe we
will probably mention once or twice in this episode
he's already mentioned once mr tiger woods yeah
well i mean if you think that's astonishing pal
um elders participation came 15 years before
augusta admitted the first black member so and
that was that was a ron townsend in 1990 um and
i didn't know about this but apparently um there
was a controversy the shoal creek controversy
in the lead up to the pga championships in 1990
shoal creek being a club in alabama designed
by jack nicholas that didn't have any black members
and heavily resisted them and were being panned
in the media in the lead -up to the tournament
that they were hosting. And the PGA nearly removed
them as the host club for the PGA Championship.
But, as I suspect is always the case with tournaments
that bring in quite a lot of money, there was
a lot of lobbying going on and a compromise was
eventually reached. Louis J. Willey was invited
by the Mayor of Birmingham to become an honorary
member. Again, that's incredible. In 1990. Then
again, I guess we're... Let's not get political.
Let's move on. Let's not talk about what's happening
in America right now. Anyway, you were saying?
Well, all I was saying is that... Four years
later, a Tiger Woods, a certain Tiger Woods,
would win the 1994 individual collegiate title
at the same course. And the position had not
changed. There was still only one black member
of the club at that time. That's incredible.
In 1994. But yeah, I mean, that's pretty much
the tournament. I mean, it's, I'm sorry, like
a little couple of tangents on special invites,
but it's... Played across four rounds, traditional
format. Lose half the field after two rounds.
Well, top 50, technically speaking, including
ties. And then you play for the title over the
course of the final two rounds. The final round
obviously traditionally being on a Sunday. And
if there's a tie, you have a sudden death playoff
across the 18th and the 10th until there's a
winner. Although it's never gone beyond the second
playoff hole. yeah it used to be full rounds
for um the playoff and i believe i might be wrong
i'm saying that it went to multiple full rounds
on some occasions presumably when full rounds
were drawn or tied i should say um which is an
incredible amount of playoff golf uh to play
i think the sudden death version they have now
is excellent and it results in brilliant finishes
like if you recall 2012 being a particularly
good finish where a certain Bubba Watson drove
out of the pine with a lot of pull on it, turned
about 90 degrees and left it about 10 feet from
the hole to win that playoff, which is, in my
opinion, and this is notwithstanding Tiger Woods
chipping in 2005, the best shot I've ever seen
in Masters history. I don't know if you're aware
of the one I'm referring to, but it is an incredible
shot. Bubba shot. Bubba shot. Yeah, I'm very
familiar with Bubba's shot. It's just incredible.
It is one of the most iconic shots, I think,
in the tournament's history, as you say. And
in a clutch moment as well. Yes. Which is, you
know, the way these things happen, always enter
folklore when there's heaps of pressure. Indeed.
So that's 2012 is regarded as... one of the the
great tournaments i don't know if you've got
any more of an introduction to talk about at
this point but um we could go on to talk about
the great tournaments in the past well we've
got yeah we could talk about the tournaments
we can talk about the traditions uh whichever
you whichever way around you want to do it mate
i'll defer you know i think i'll give you a voice
arrest you've introduced this beautifully um
but yes so uh there's a few tournaments to stand
out historically as being the greatest amongst
obviously some great tournaments past 1960 Arnold
Palmer the great Arnold Palmer who probably just
now really misses out on the goat conversation
that may or may not be coming later but in terms
of the Masters he has the third highest number
of wins overall with four his best being 1960
where he pulled out clutch birdies on 17 and
18 grab his second win of four in the masters
1997 um very notable for the arrival of a certain
tiger woods on the scene winning his first major
by 12 shots which is still a record and with
the lowest score to par of minus 18 which is
still a record i believe 2004 phil mickelson
um getting his first major at the age of i think
he's about 34 at that point he was uh renowned
as being one of the best players who have never
won one um but uh yeah pulled out of the bag
and famously leapt in the air in joy at the end
of that mickelson's uh back story is so good
man like the how long he had to wait for one
yeah and then to go and get it yes and then same
and then to uh yeah so to win a few over the
next few years but then to go a few more years
without winning one and then win one i think
he's he he might not be the oldest man to ever
win one at 50. or he might be, but he managed
to win one at 50. Who's this, sorry? Phil Mickelson.
Not a Masters, I should say. Oh, okay, yeah.
I was going to say, Nicholas has got the record
at the Masters. He won one when he was 46. Yes,
well, I'll come to that shortly. No, Mickelson
won, I want to say, the PGA Championship when
he was 50, which is obviously impressive. 2005,
the legend, probably... other than the one I
mentioned, Bubba Watson, the greatest shot in
Masters history where Tiger chipped in at the
16th. If you've seen any clip from a golf tournament
ever, you've probably seen this one. This is
one where he chips in from just outside the green.
He lands it on the top of the green, takes about
a 90 -degree turn, rolls slowly towards the cup,
stops right on the edge of the cup, stays, stays,
stays, and then drops in. And you see the camera
vibrating from the chair that goes up from the
crowd. And it is obviously Tiger Fist Pump. It's
iconic. And that was at a point where he was
chasing and he got back into the mix and ended
up forcing a playoff and winning the playoff.
And the chap he was up against in that. Let me
just get the information here. Oh, this is the
unreal. Quote. So he beat Chris DeMarco in the
playoff that day. Chris DeMarco said, I went
out and shot 68 around here on Sunday, which
is usually a very good round, and 12 under is
usually good enough to win. It's just that I
was playing against Tiger Woods. Yeah, it's so
good. Sums it up, really. And it's like that
chip as well. Obviously, everyone would have
seen that chip, or anyone who's interested in
golf would have seen that chip. It's almost as
if it's willed in by the crowd. It genuinely
seems to stop. on like the lip of the cup and
then and then just go again i i it's very hard
to uh do it justice just like you know verbally
but um just if anyone hasn't seen it's youtube
it's insane i was gonna say if you haven't seen
it just watch it and look just look at how much
the camera shakes from the crouching it's one
of the things i love most about sport about watching
sport on tv when something happens which there's
so much joy and so much noise created you can
see it physically i remember it um david beckham
when he scored the free kick against greece watch
his celebration after that and you can see it
there and for anyone who doesn't know going off
topic a little bit but that sealed england's
qualification for the world cup when in a game
we did not deserve to get anything out of whatsoever
um but it happens in in tigers chip as well and
it's just just an outpouring of joy and just
how lucky you must feel to be In that situation,
watching that live. And the commentators, mate.
Incredible. They just lose their partiality.
Or impartiality, rather. Become partial. Yeah,
I love that. And why not? Because they love sport.
Yeah, exactly. Sport is the winner in that situation.
Just cuts through it all, doesn't it? It's unreal.
Yeah, speaking of legendary commentary. Arguably
the greatest. Masters tournament of all time
and you already briefly mentioned this. 1986.
Jack Nicklaus was 46 years old. He had already
won five Masters tournaments but hadn't won one
for a fair few years. He went into the round
seven shots behind. He went into the last five
holes still four shots behind and then he rattled
off an eagle at 15, a birdie at 16, a birdie
at 17. So the iconic moment came on the 17th,
where he had a putt from 10 feet or so. And he
nailed it and unforgettably raised his putter
in the air in celebration. And the commentator
came out and said, maybe, yes, sir, as it went
in. One of the most famous calls in golf history.
And it's just a wonderful thing. It's mythical
almost at this point, as also 2019 was, as you
may recall. For similar reasons, a past champion,
a legend of the sport, someone who'd won the
Masters title four times before. At an older
age, 43 years old, Tiger Woods sealing it in
2019. Fist pump and the noise there as well and
him celebrating with his family. Absolutely iconic.
Mate, these guys write their own scripts. They
genuinely do. Golf is like psychological warfare
against yourself. It is. It's a very good way
of describing it. I don't know if anyone here,
anyone listening has ever played golf, but your
biggest opponent, almost your only opponent is
yourself. I mean, if you're playing against,
if you're playing to a handicap. You should have
had a handicap set up so everyone is at an even
level. You're essentially just playing against
yourself and your own focus and your own calmness
and your own judgment in a situation. I was saying
to my girlfriend earlier, Jack, I was sort of
telling her about what we were doing for this
episode. You can't beat someone at golf. You
can only shoot your best round. and if it just
happens to be better than someone else's then
you end up winning and that's like that's the
way it is like you you can obviously like that
i'm oversimplifying slightly because you can
you can psych each other out and you can get
in your own head someone can do something and
put you under pressure and that sort of thing
so there is that dynamic to it obviously it's
not but you might you might be you know four
or five holes away from your closest opponent
you might not even see what they're doing so
yeah i think it's unique in that sense that you're
effectively playing yourself yeah i mean you
if you're Not in the same group. So for anyone
who doesn't know, in the final two rounds of
major tournaments, once the cut has happened,
you get sorted into groups based on where you
are in the standings. Essentially, so the top
three in the standings will be together, then
the next three will be together, and so on and
so forth. The idea being that it makes it more
likely that the last putt of the day is the winning
putt, which is obviously what a TV audience wants
to see, what directors want to see, and what
anyone watching at the course wants to see. but
it can be the case that someone has a good round
someone has a bad round you do end up in a situation
where you are two or three holes away and you
just you hear the crowd noise and you have to
make judgments over it and it it must just be
very psychological to block that out and to focus
entirely on your own game as opposed to and and
other than maybe you see scoreboards or you're
getting results through or your caddies telling
you or whatever you don't know in that moment
you're lining up a shot what the situation is
you just have to focus on your own game and it
is absolutely unique in that regard. I don't
know why you just jogged my memory there, mate,
but I think it's because of the pairings. One
interesting quirk about the Masters is the US
amateur qualifies, the US amateur champion qualifies,
and every single year they are paired with the
returning champion for the first two rounds,
which is a nice little tradition. It's probably
a nice tradition in that you can probably look
back on it and a lot of the time the US amateur
champion will be someone who later goes on to
succeed in the game. So you probably end up seeing
a 21 -year -old future major winner paired up
with someone who is now in their 40s or 50s legend
of the game. You probably have a lot of pairings
like that when you look back. Very good. Very
cool rule. And I know we've gone slightly off
topic here, but you were waxing... Oh, we do.
Yeah, I know. But you were waxing lyrical about
Jack Nicklaus, and this is not the first time
he's achieved something remarkable at Augusta.
This is not quite as detailed, but it's just
a nice little nod to how damn good he was. In
66, one of his third title, I think it was, despite...
four of his friends dying on the eve of the tournament
in a plane crash on their way to watch him. He
went on to win the tournament still. I can't
tell you any more details of it. It's just a
little nugget I came across when doing a little
bit of reading for this. But yeah, pretty insane.
So when we talk about psychological fortitude,
not just playing yourself, but playing your demons,
playing your emotions, coming through like that
is insane. That's incredible. Yeah, I've got
a couple of notes on that. Yeah, it was friends
from his hometown, so like long -term friends,
friends from his childhood, including the guy
he basically learned to play the game with alongside
a guy called Bob Barton were killed in a plane
crash on their way to Augusta to watch him play.
So, you know, his best friends in the entire
world. One can only imagine what that feels like.
Let's hope neither of us ever find out of whether
this podcast might come to an abrupt end. Yeah,
well, fingers crossed. That would be a bit of
a bummer. But no, that's a remarkable story.
So six titles across, what, like 25 years, 23
years to be precise, I think. Yeah, he also set
up a championship level golf tournament in his
hometown to commemorate them called the Memorial
Tournament as well. Oh, that's cool. Which is,
I believe, still played to this day. Yeah, yeah.
And it should be said, I mean, I think you might
have already said it, actually, but Nicholas
is the tournament's most successful player. Yes.
Eldest winner. Most top tens. Yeah. With 22.
Most cuts made. 37. So, you know, if you were
to be discussing who is the greatest to play
at Augusta, you wouldn't look much further than
the Golden Bear, as he was known. But the wider
debate is one perhaps still to come. Can I chuck
a couple of other stats at you about the players
and the competition itself? Literally always.
You know I like. Let's start at the present day.
Reigning champ, Scotty Scheffler. First winner,
Horton Smith in 1934. I've already spoken about
Jack. Tiger's the youngest winner. with a then
-course record of 18 -under as a 21 -year -old
in 1997. Of course, no, he was beaten, wasn't
he? Yeah, very recently. Was it Scotty Scheffler?
No, Scheffler's a current champ. Who, was it
Dustin Johnson, maybe? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So,
yeah, but still remarkable. And some more fun
stats. Mike Weir, first left -hander to win the
tournament in 2003. He's also the first Canadian.
Yeah, exactly. And the aforementioned Gary Player
has the most appearances with 52, which is quite
insane. I don't know how you rack up 52 appearances
at the Masters. That's crazy. I think in Gary
Player's case, you do it by being nicknamed Mr.
Fitness. That's great. Even into his 80s. Oh,
really? Jeez. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, very, very fit
man. But I mean, it's not all about the winners,
though, Jack. And we should probably make this
very clear. I mean, there's a lot that could
be said. I think Spieth's had a nightmare there
once. Obviously, we know Rory's had a nightmare
there once going into the final round. But perhaps,
well, not perhaps, the unluckiest man in Masters
history is undoubtedly Greg Norman. He has come
extremely close. quite a few times um he finished
in the top five at the masters eight times but
never won and that included 81 he was leading
into the second i say i'm not saying that these
were his top five finishes rather but these are
some this is a snapshot of his fortunes at the
at the tournament 81 he led in the second round
but ended up finishing fourth in 1986 He birdied
14 through 17 to tie Jack Nicklaus for the lead,
but ended up pushing his approach on the 18th
and bogeyed, handing it back to Nicklaus. 87,
he lost in a playoff to Larry Mies, so forgive
me, Larry, if this ever reaches your ears. But
he was, by the way, Larry being the first Augusta
native to ever win the tournament, just a little
sidestep there. Oh, that's cool. Yeah, yeah.
But he lost the playoff to Larry because Larry
chipped him from 45 yards. Yeah, that'll do it.
If you ever thought that you were ever going
to win it, that would probably drain whatever
optimism you had from you. And then in 96 is
the really famous one, which everyone probably
remembers. I remember this. This is probably
the first time I ever remember a golf tournament
because it was an Englishman who won it, Nick
Felder. and um my yeah grandparents were very
into golf and i do i remember this being at the
very least mentioned on tv perhaps um this being
a thing but yeah he was um well up at the end
of the six up six up at the end of the third
round oh my word i found only one by five i know
That's an implosion. It's an implosion. But they
can do that too. When it's happened before. Yeah.
As you say, ultimately it's a game against yourself.
Right. But this is the thing that's so interesting
about Norman. It sounds like we're going in on
him here. But he kept coming back. He kept coming
back for more. So the geezer had psychological
fortitude. But obviously it just wasn't quite
enough because it happened again in 98. So, you
know, sorry, Greg. But he's leading on the back
nine in the final round, but again, faded to
the eventual winner, which was Jose Maria Alathabala.
Again, apologies to any Spaniards, but he picked
up his second green. I think British people have
been butchering that name for many a year, Ben.
You don't need to apologize. But yeah, sorry,
I know just sort of reeled off some stats there,
but I just think it's some fun stories kicking
around as there always are in tournaments like
this. Yeah. Yeah, that was very good. I'd not
come across that in my reading, Greg Norman,
probably because I was, and this is going to
sound like I'm going in on Greg again, probably
because I was focused on people who'd won it.
Sorry, Greg. Greg Norman did win two Open Championships.
He wasn't shit. No, he was not at all. Lots of
high finishes in the other majors as well. Very
talented golfer. I'm sure he made plenty of money
out of it too. I'm sure he doesn't care about
a couple of blokes. We're not criticising him.
Just reading off the history, mate. You can't
run from history. Just like the club can't run
from their... their problematic past and controversies
episode one we're very complimentary for good
reason about an australian episode two it stands
to reason we go the opposite way we are english
after all but yeah i don't know what do you want
to talk about i've got i've got some stuff on
the course that we can talk about stuff stuff
on the club uh itself the traditions what's your
preference where do you want to go next Let's
go for some traditions. Why not? Traditions.
Well, that's often the best thing about sport,
isn't it? The traditions. Should we do it chronologically?
As if we were going into a Masters week? Let's
do it. Anyone who's not as familiar with Augusta
National Golf Club, here are the key traditions.
Champions dinner. You must have heard of the
champions dinner. I've heard of the champions
dinner. Have you heard of the dinners that have
been put on the menu? I've not heard the menu
items and I'd love to hear them. Well, I mean,
I don't have all the specifics because that would
be boring, but it is usually something that the
defending champion has a relationship with. So
like, you know, from their home country or something
like that. But there is one sweet story from
2011, which has a tinge of sadness. But when
Phil Mickelson won. one of his green jackets,
he arranged for a Spanish -themed menu in the
hopes that Seve Ballesteros would be able to
attend when he was poorly. But unfortunately,
Seve wasn't able to, and he actually ended up
passing away a few weeks later. But I thought
that was a lovely touch, because obviously he's
a very wide discretion. Yeah, 1983 champion Seve
Ballesteros. Yeah, so he is probably, in terms
of overseas sportsmen, I don't know anyone who
is as beloved as Tavares in England. Yeah, it's
weird. Absolutely adored. He won, I think, three
Open Championships. So obviously that's the British
Open, as well as a couple of Masters, 1980 and
1983. Legend. And that is actually a very sweet
story. That's kind of made me send a shiver down
my spine there. That was lovely. Yeah, it is
nice, isn't it? And he's also, you omitted the
fact that he's a Ryder Cup legend. Yes, that's
probably why. But that tradition was started
by Ben Hogan, the famous Ben Hogan in 1952. And
it's held on the Tuesday before the Masters.
And it's only open to past champions and, of
course, certain board members because, you know,
the boys aren't going to miss out. But that's
the Champions Dinner, which is a light -hearted
way of starting a tournament week. Sticking with
the food theme just for a second. I didn't know
this, but just because I thought it was weird.
Pimento cheese sandwiches. Yes. I don't really
know what pimento cheese is. I think it's an
American thing. I know what pimentos are and
I know what cheese is, obviously. It seems a
strange combination. But I've heard this, and
also I believe they're still sold for like $2
.50 or $1 .50. They're still sold deliberately
incredibly cheaply at the event. So as you can
imagine, most sporting events behind closed doors,
you tend to jack up the food prices, not keep
them low. So that's nice. Yeah. Even if pimento
cheese is a strange one to go with. Well, I'm
like you. I don't know what pimento is. And I
have no idea why it's a concession that's been
around since the 40s, but apparently it is. It's
basically just a sweet pepper, like a red pepper.
Oh, okay. Well, people who go to the Masters
seem to like it, I guess. I guess so. So yeah,
if you're a patron, you're having pimento cheese
sandwiches. If you're a former champ, you're
having whatever other former, whatever the reigning
champ wants you to eat in the lead up to... it
didn't lead up to the masters but getting back
to the golf they're one of the most fun parts
of it is the par three contest oh yes i love
the par three contest yeah around since 1960
semi -social um par three played on a wednesday
day before the first round um I think it's been
played every year apart from 2017 when it was
washed out. And 2020, 2021, they didn't hold
it because of COVID, although they're obviously
the main tournament. Main tournament did go ahead.
A fair compromise, probably. Yeah, exactly. Apparently,
weirdly, it's a par 27 course in the northeast
corner of the club's grounds. So it's a specific
specialist par three. course single round uh
and traditionally all the contestants participate
um with family members uh caddying for them and
sometimes even allow them to play shots on their
behalf and stuff so taken super seriously yes
exactly as seriously as it should be taken i
think for a par three tournament exactly makes
for very good highlights though yeah well talking
of highlights man it's not shy of a hole in one
There's been 94 of them up to 2019. I don't know
what the up -to -date stats are. I'm sure we
could find them on the internet somewhere. But
that worked out at about one and a half a year.
Although if you were there in 2016, you'd have
had a good day because there were nine. Nine.
That's mad. Exactly. Replace one of the holes
with a bucket or something. Incredible. A lot
of Peugeots given away or whoever was sponsoring
that particular tournament. Yeah, some famous
names have won it though. Padraic Harrington
has got the most wins. He's won it three times.
Tom Watson, Sandy Lyle, Sam Snead. A couple of
multiple winners. And yeah, I think there's only
seven that have won it more than once. A couple
of other notable champions, just to keep name
-dropping people, Arnold Palmer, Gary Brewer,
Davis Love III, Vijay Singh, Louis Oosthuizen,
Luke Donald, and Ricky Fowler have all also won
it. The lowest winning score was by Ben Walker
in 2016, and he hit an eight under, which I actually
think is pretty astonishing. Well, he must have
had at least one hole -in -one there, if not
two. Yeah, yeah. That was a year of all the hole
-in -ones. Oh, that's a great point. I didn't
even pick up on that. Ben Walker just dropping
hole -in -ones the whole way around. But yeah,
it's a bit of a curse, though. Do you want to
know why? Do you know why? No, I don't know why.
You're about to tell me why. No player has ever
won the Par 3 contest and the Masters in the
same year. There you go. Use up all your luck
and your skill on the Wednesday. I'll teach you.
Yeah, and only Vijay and Ben Crenshaw have won
the Masters after having won the par 3. Okay,
in like years to come. Impressive. Vijay Singh,
though, what a guy. What a player. Absolutely.
But yeah, that's a fun part of the tournament
week. I think Rory once had... uh caroline wozniacki
caddying for him didn't he in the par three and
there was i bet that distracted some of the photographers
who were there uh no comment um probably for
the past but uh yeah carrying it on this is fun
right i don't think this is still done anymore
but i i think this is my favorite things uh that
i that i learned about um with the masters they
used to have a thing called i say they used to
this might still go on Obviously, we were talking
about the board members and everything, muscling
on Champions Dinner and their self -imposed discretion
for the invitational aspect of this. So I wouldn't
be surprised if behind closed doors there's some
similar conduct prevailing. But there's a thing
called the Calcutta, which is an unofficial sweepstake
of the players, where all of the entrants for
a tournament were auctioned off to the punters.
And the best players and obviously the favorites
will go for major money. And then some of the
other entrants who perhaps were less fancied
to win would be pulled together so that they
would be sold off in like syndicates, I guess.
Yeah, that would be the correct word for it.
Fair enough. And then all the money that people
bid in order to assign their... their player
of choice, I guess, would go into just a pot.
And now you're thinking, you know, course, Ben,
they must give it to charity. No, no, no, no,
no. It's just, it's for the boys. And so, you
know, an elitist sport it was, and perhaps still
is. And if your player goes on to win it, you
would get the majority of that pot. And then
the second to fourth place would split the rest.
Okay. And there is actually, sorry, go ahead,
go ahead. I was just going to say that would
be a great idea even to persist within the modern
day if 50 % of that money went to charity. That
would be an excellent idea. Somehow it doesn't
feel quite so... There's some connotations there
and it doesn't feel quite so comfortable. uh
in my mind without it being a charitable thing
but but anyway an interesting history an interesting
piece of history there well it's even more fun
than that because um you know you're you're quite
right if there was a formality to it and a charitable
aspect to it and perhaps one could justify it
but um it certainly does undermine the integrity
somewhat of perhaps the odd tournament or two
uh and there's a chap called herman kaiser who's
1946 winner of the masters which was the first
to be held after World War II, which we'll come
back to, because that's something we like to
do. He thinks, or at least he's on record as
having stated that he thinks that the Calcutta
Cup, Calcutta Cup, that's a different thing altogether,
the Calcutta nearly cost him the title. Kaiser
went unsold in the Calcutta and formed part of
a group before the 1946 tournament, and he was
a massive outsider. And across his four rounds,
he encountered a series of issues, you might
call them, which he thinks progressively sort
of contrived or conspired to sabotage him. Sabotage,
yeah. Excellent. But basically, as he went deeper
in the tournament, he remained in the hunt against
some of the more favoured punters who people
had more favoured. players who punters had quite
some major money on um weird things started to
happen and uh during one of the later rounds
he was told the wrong tea time by a club official
and nearly missed his tea time when he was leading
and then he was also given a 13 year old caddy
because this was back in the day where the players
got assigned their caddies and they didn't get
to bring their own caddies or choose them and
it nearly worked because ben hogan came from
five shots back uh and tied but tied with him
but then on the final on the 18th Hogan three
-putted when a birdie would have won it for him
a par would have sent it to a playoff um but
he three -putted for a bogey and Kaiser was champion
so yeah Kaiser described it as the greatest thing
to ever happen to me so yeah a nice a nice ending
but uh yeah interesting things go on when people
are unofficially betting That would make for
an excellent comedy film. Yeah, it would. Basically,
it's like Happy Gilmore Professional. Yeah. Yeah,
like Happy Gilmore Caddyshack, but yeah, based
on a true story. Do you know what I was saying
else about Kaiser? Just because this is completely
unrelated to the Calcutta, but I just thought
it was weird. His nickname was the Missouri Mortician.
Okay, and why was that? I don't know. It's not
clear, but it sounds very sinister. Is it just
no one's sure? Or were you just unable to find
out? I couldn't find the answer. He wasn't a
pathologist, as far as I could tell. I was going
to say that would be the obvious solution, but
yeah, interesting. But he made the 47 Ryder Cup
team as a result of his win. And the USA demolished
us 11 -1 back in the day where the US played
the UK. But the funny thing is that Kaiser was
the one, so denied the clean sweep. Yeah, that'll
teach him. They got him eventually. That's probably
the Calcutta of the Ryder Cup. influencing that
someone uh that must be yeah someone had bet
on an 11 -1 win um yeah but yeah uh that's the
calcutta it's kind of fun the crow's nest have
you heard of the crow's nest i didn't know about
this yes no i have actually heard of this this
is where the amateurs stay isn't it yes exactly
it's like a five bedroom a nice little five bedroom
apartment which is cool Mate, it's like 1 ,200
square feet, so a nice little apartment. A nice
big five -bedroom apartment. Exactly. But yeah,
they get to stay there. It's kind of fun. And
then I think this is a nice rule. So there's
a lot of weird rules at Augusta because it's
very traditional. But no phones, which is cool.
Okay. That is good, actually, as opposed to just
having to mute them. Yeah, exactly. No, I think
that is nice because... You don't get all the
pictures from the course and everything as well.
They kick you the fuck out if you use it. Or
if you get caught using it. I'm sure people do.
They actually do police it. And if you're caught
with your phone on the course, you can get kicked
out. Yeah, I don't disagree with that. If you're
there to watch sport, watch some sports. Exactly.
The amount of events you go to nowadays where
it's just people with their phones out. I approve
of that rule. I wish that rule was... I'm sounding
like such an old man now. I wish that was more
normal. Sky are filming it. They've got better
cameras than you. Just enjoy what you're watching.
You're not going to get better footage than Sky
Sports are. Exactly. If you want to watch it
back, just watch it back on YouTube. Or CBS or
whoever. Anyway, good rule. What else? Caddies.
Oh, yeah. Less good rule. Yes, this was a less
good rule. Do you want to talk about caddies?
Yeah, I can do. Give your voice a rest. You're
doing an excellent job so far. Well done. This
is a slightly more negative tradition and obviously
goes back to the history of the area, the history
of America generally. So until 1983... All the
players in the Masters were required to use the
services of an Augusta National Club caddy, which
obviously on the face of it sounds fine. But
by club tradition, those caddies were always
black, which is a very questionable policy for
a club which, as mentioned, didn't invite any
black members until 1990. Obviously, this being
Georgia, historically in the south of the country,
historically. one of the places that resisted
desegregation for a long time being a private
members club and getting to make their own rules
you could argue it is a persistence of that however
it it was sort of reinforced by the the founders
co -founder clifford roberts is reputed to have
said as long as i'm alive golfers will be white
and caddies will be black yeah um it is is yeah
That is what that is. But however, since 1983,
which is six years after Robert's death, which
may or may not be a coincidence, players have
been allowed the option of bringing their own
caddy to a tournament regardless of the race
of that caddy. So again, I don't hate the idea
of providing of caddies. I guess it would be
an equaliser, but that is just incredible that
that was something that persisted into, well,
into the 1980s. But a handful of years before
our birth, Ben. And to the credit of some other
players, when that rule was changed, I think
quite a few of them employed the club caddies.
And one of those guys that did that was Jack
Nicklaus, I think. Which is a nice touch, obviously.
But perhaps it shouldn't have... Well, not perhaps.
What am I saying? It should not have been necessary
for them to have done so. Yeah, again, the issue
I have is completely not with the club providing
the caddies. Just reiterate that point. Yeah,
exactly. But I mean, in more modern times, I
think the caddies are pretty iconic at Augusta.
Yeah, it's an iconic look. I mean, obviously,
even to this day, they wear the white jumpsuit,
green master's cap, white tennis shoes. They
all look the same, player's name on the back.
Obviously, certain players have certain caddies
they bring to every tournament and the caddies
are rewarded handsomely if they're with a good
player with a percentage of the winnings. It
is a good job to be a caddy and they do work
hard for it. They have to know the course better
than they know themselves and better than the
player knows it and allow their player to focus
on the game, psychological battle against themselves
and not worry about yardage or choice of club.
or any silly things like that. Didn't Tigers
Caddy used to be the highest paid sportsman in
New Zealand at one point? Quite possibly, given
most sportsmen in New Zealand tend towards rugby
and cricket and sports which aren't historically.
Obviously, that's changing, but on historically
well -renumerated. So yeah, he was making even
5 % or 10 % of what Tiger Woods' winnings were.
Tiger Woods won $99 million between 1997 and
2008. $99 million. So 5 % or 10 % of that, whatever
it is, cha -ching. Yeah, it's good money. There's
some pretty cool stories about caddies, or funny
ones at least, associated with the role. Not
just good on the course, good value off it as
well, occasionally, I think. Bert Yancey might
have had one of those experiences. Bert Yancey
himself had an interesting life. He had bipolar
back in the day, perhaps before it was recognised
as a mental health condition. He'd spent some
nine months in a psychiatric hospital at West
Point whilst he was serving. Went on to record
back -to -back third -place finishes in 67 and
68, but had one interesting experience at the
Masters with one of his caddies when he lent
his caddy his car the night before, which, you
know, questionable judgment. And the car also
had Yancey's clubs in it. And when he came to
play the next day... The caddy was nowhere to
be seen. So the assistant caddy master was tasked
with finding this young man and thought long
and hard about where this caddy might be if he
wasn't at the club. Interesting choice of words.
But his instincts were spot on and he found the
caddy in a local brothel and the car and the
clubs were recovered and returned to Yancey just
in time for his tea time. Needless to say, the
caddy was sacked. Fair enough. I think that's
probably the right side of the disciplinary action.
Yancey went on to win seven PGA Tours for what
it's worth and became an advocate for mental
health, which is nice. Oh, that's good. Probably.
when that wasn't such a common thing as well
I imagine given this was the 60s when he was
playing so that's good yeah exactly and not a
caddy but a caddy is another good story Sammy
Bird do you want to you heard about him oh this
Babe Ruth caddy yeah this is the guy uh so he
was a Former Major League Baseball player for
the Yankees. He used to pinch run for Roof and
take over defensively in late innings. If anyone
knows about Babe Roof, obviously legend of baseball.
Going to be on anyone's GOAT argument for baseball.
But towards his later career, perhaps the waistline
was getting a bit large, so needed a pinch runner
and a defensive substitute from time to time
to let him get an early finish. But he used to
play golf with Babe, hence the nickname. So Bird
went on to have a golf career and entered the
Masters five times in 1948. He entered the history
books for shooting one of the worst single hole
scores on the course with a 10, which sounds
like one of my scores for a hole. It's my average,
I reckon. He's a two -sport professional and
the only person to have played in a World Series,
which he won in 1932 and the Masters. and also
achieved a career -high finish at third at the
Masters and six PGA Tour wins. So let us not
mug him off too much, Ben. Yeah, geez. That is
fairly impressive, although I'm sure that probably
about an hour of his life when he was slugging
10 on a hole probably is not one he wants to
be remembered for. Pretty funny that you have
that kind of career and you're just known as
Babe Bruce Caddy. Yeah. I think, if anything,
that just shows what a big deal Babe Ruth was.
That's true, actually. That's fair. And we will
get to baseball. I can't wait to get to baseball.
It's going to be a while, but we will get to
it at some point. We will. And the Babe will
get a mention. It's inevitable, since we're following
the calendar. October, baby. Probably should
doff a cap, actually, to the ladies, because
we haven't mentioned them yet. Whilst we're on
caddies, first female caddy, I think, 1983, a
lady called Elizabeth Archer, her dad, George
Archer, was a champion in 69. And she caddied
for him. And I think she was the first female
caddy. And female caddies are pretty rare, actually,
to be fair, at the Masters. But they do, you
know. The ladies do do their bit. And I think
there have been some pretty big names with female
caddies in the past. Like Henrik Stenson, I think,
comes to mind. I can't remember off the top of
my head all the others. But staying on the theme
of the girls, the women's amateur has just finished,
I think. It started in 2019 and it has just finished
today. And it was won by... Carla Bernat Escuda
from Spain in short of 12 under. Very good. So
that's at the Augusta National on the same course,
presumably just off slightly shorter tees as
per tradition. So it's a bit odd. The final round
is played at Augusta. Okay. Yeah, the first two,
I think, might be held at another club, Champions
Retreat Club. In Evans, Georgia. I might be getting
this slightly wrong. I'm not overly familiar
with the entire round format. No, no, you're
correct. Yeah, it's a 54 -hole tournament. Yeah,
first two roles at the Champions Retreat Golf
Club and the final round at Augusta, which presumably
is maybe after the cut. Fair enough. But it is
an amateur event, so it's not on the women's
PGA. I think a lot of the women playing in it
are collegiate. But not all. They come from all
around the world, but most of them are at university
in the States. But it's pretty cool. And it's
obviously a decent development. I mean, it's
come a bit late in the day, hasn't it? Like 2019
is pretty barbaric. Well, when you bear in mind
that the first female members of Augusta National
was only in, was it 2012? Yeah, man. Yeah. Condoleezza.
Condoleezza Rice. Condoleezza Rice, yeah. Who's
also black. And Darla Moore. So that tells you
what. She is, but she was also a Republican member
of George Bush's cabinet. So I guess that would
adhere her to some of the traditionalists of
the course. But yeah, Condoleezza Rice and Darla
Moore were the first female members. In 2013
it was. Oh, 2013. Jesus. Which is 12 years ago.
There you go. That's pretty mad. It's pretty
funny when, like you say, let's not get too political,
but when Tiger found himself in, let's call it
a pickle. Pickle, that's one way of putting it.
Yeah. And his personal issues and private life
were quite publicly ventilated in around 2010.
I think the chairman of the club was like hammering
him. And it's like, I'm not sure you've got the
moral high ground here, guys. I mean, I know
Tiger, let's not make any excuses for Tiger,
but yeah, if you've got no female members in
a female tournament yet, maybe wind your neck
in. Yeah. Get your own ducks in a row. Maybe,
yeah. Yeah, I don't think with its history, let's
just say it's always been a little bit behind
the times, so I'm not necessarily sure. I'm sure
there are people more who would have more. oomph
behind that particular statement then maybe they
should leave it to someone else to comment on
well yeah especially such matters I think they
quite heavily resisted some campaigning in the
early 2000s the club as well about the no women
membership to the point where I think it might
have even I mean there's a bit of innuendo here
and I couldn't possibly back this up but golf's
obviously now an Olympic sport and quite recently
remade Olympic sport I think went back in in
2016 in Rio And there's some suggestion, though,
that the club's policy and their reaction to
people lobbying for a change in that policy may
have been taken on board by the IOC and delayed
golf's readmittance to the Olympics. Well, I'm
not saying it's necessarily definitely the case,
but it is a fact that the first time it was admitted
as an Olympic tournament came. just after they
admitted female members for the first time. Whether
or not that's coincidence or not, I don't know.
But it is good to see golf moving, or the International
certainly, and just golf in general, moving in
the right direction. It is just the lag compared
to the rest of the world and the rest of the
sport is noticeable, shall we say. Slow and steady
doesn't win this particular race. No. But yeah,
anyway, we've digressed slightly. As we do. Yeah,
as we do. Rounding off the traditions in the
week, honorary tee shot, that's a fun thing.
Past champs, basically, invited to hit an honorary
tee shot in the morning of the first round to
commence play. Nice. In the past, they've included
Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus, Gary
Player, the aforementioned Lee Elder, Tom Watson,
which is... Quite a nice tradition. Only introduced
in 63, maybe? Yes. Well remembered. Then you've
got the awards. Most of these are, you know,
not irrelevant. That's unfair. Nice to haves,
but aren't the one that you're there for. The
lowest score on each. round receives a crystal
vase players who score a hole in one or a double
eagle win a large crystal bowl uh leave it to
the listeners to decide whether they'd rather
a vase or a bowl um yeah eagle gets you a pair
of crystal goblets um there must be a crystal
manufacturer like around the corner oh god there's
a lot of crystal going on here silver cup to
the lowest scoring amateur to make the cut runner
-up receives a silver medal which is only introduced
in 51 but But the winner, well, what does the
winner get, Jack? Legendary status, remembered
forever. Yes, true, true. A master's trophy.
A master's trophy, but more importantly. the
winners get the green jacket. They have the name
engraved on the actual Silver Masters trophy,
but they don't care about that. All they're really
after is that green jacket. So the green jacket
is presented to that year's winner by the previous
year's winner. I believe if it's a back -to -back
win, I think the chairman of the club presents
it. I think that's right. On the rare occasion
that that happens. So yeah, the green jacket,
introduced in 1949 and awarded to the champion.
Previous champions were retroactively awarded
it, so every champion ever of the Masters has
been awarded a green jacket, some just not at
the time. It's the official attire worn by members
of the Augusta National, but only while on the
club grounds. So each Masters winner essentially
becomes an honorary member of the club. So yes,
the jacket is presented to him, the winner, inside
the butler cabin as soon after the end of the
tournament as possible in a televised ceremony.
And the presentation is then repeated outside
the 18th green for the hoi polloi to enjoy. The
one in the cabin is a bit contrived, I think.
Yes. It's always quite awkward, I think, when
you watch it. I think they just want the jacket
on. Get a few pictures with the family. Exactly.
Apparently it's not a hard and fast rule, but
generally speaking, only a first time and the
current reigning champion may remove their jacket
from the club grounds. and the champions must
then return it to the clubhouse one year after
their victory. There's got to be people who've
taken it. Oh, I'm certain. It remains a personal
property, their personal property, but is stored
with the other champion's jacket in a specifically
designed cloakroom. And a golfer who wins the
event multiple times will use the same green
jacket, so they won't just get... Jack Nicklaus
doesn't have six green jackets. He will have
one green jacket unless he has to get refitted
with one later. That's a bit rubbish. I mean,
yeah, terrible. I think they could afford it.
I can't imagine what their fees are. And also,
if it's the thing that is synonymous with the
win, you want it, don't you? I don't know. Give
the man his jackets, is what I'm trying to say.
To reward a multiple winner, keep giving them
jackets and just say, oh, you only have to leave
one at the club. Take the rest home with you.
That's a nice way of putting it, actually. Earn
the right. I can't even imagine what the old
white guys who run the Augusta National would
think about someone going out and wearing an
Augusta jacket to, oh God, like a concert or
a football match or something like that. A nightclub.
Goodness gracious me. Could you imagine? I know.
Yeah, I don't like that. I think give the men
their jackets when they win. But yeah, it's a
pretty... What can you say about the Green Jacket?
The Green Jacket and the Masters. The Masters
is the Green Jacket. The Green Jacket is the
Masters. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, we haven't
really spoken about the course. Probably should.
No, no. I mean, is anyone interested in the grass?
Is anyone interested in the grass? Yeah, they
might be, I guess. Tell me. Maybe I'll be interested.
There might be some farmers. There might be some...
horticulturalists all right well for the grass
enthusiasts out there um it was originally wide
bladed bermuda which you know is one of my personal
favorite um brands of grass bit old -fashioned
personally but it was uh it was replaced by the
short bladed bermuda um common sense yeah but
now it's the bent grass um and i don't really
not what i'd have done but you know each to their
own i don't know what any of this means mate
other than the fact that the putting greens are
lightning um yes like literally so fast that
um many of the greens had to be reshaped and
on occasion entirely redesigned because they
changed the grass um which is excellent pretty
you know well i guess it means there's something
in the grass but uh yeah and the bunkers if we're
interested in sand it used to be might be some
geologists i don't know common beige sand uh
yeah replaced with the now signature apparently
white feldspar um it's a quartz derivative um
of the mining of feldspar and is shipped in from
north carolina so you know who gives a shit basically
Yeah. Couldn't have put it better myself. Yeah.
I mean, the course itself has been through a
few changes. I think the first hole used to be,
the 10th hole used to be the first hole. They
reversed the nines, which now means that the
first was the 10th and vice versa. Been a few,
you know, bunkers have been added, water hazards
extended, tee boxes have been built, like shit
loads of trees. Obviously it's in the woods.
and I don't know, some undulation put in there.
The fun thing about those changes in all seriousness
is that back in the day they used to make the
changes covertly. to make it harder. So they'd
lengthen the fairway to make a drive more likely
to find the sand. Without telling anyone. Exactly.
Yeah, yeah, which is kind of fun. But you can't
get away with that in the modern day, right?
Because the players get so many practice rounds.
See, this is why you need your caddies. This
is what you need your caddies for. Right, exactly.
The sneaking in changes. But yeah, I mean, to
sort of give it some context, the current course
is currently 475 metres or in golfing. money
525 yards longer than it was in 2001 and i guess
that's to take into account the fact that guys
are hitting absolute bombs now so yeah um yeah
and equipment changes as well oh yeah good point
technology etc um i think the first was the second
most difficult hole on the course um so you know
you're just in for a a tough start to the day
uh no escaping that uh and then yeah a couple
of the more famous features amen corner is the
most famous part of the course, right? I mean,
again, without wanting to annoy anyone north
of the border, possibly the most iconic stretch
in all of golf as well. Certainly in terms of
consecutive holes. You could make the argument,
couldn't you? But yeah, most think it's the 11th,
12th and 13th. But in fact, it's the second shot
at the 11th. all of the 12th, and then the first
two shots of the 13th. Oh. Yeah. Well, I say
that, right? That's unverified. But when I was
looking it up and doing a little bit of digging
and stuff, the origins of Amen Corner are a bit
odd. I think it all stems back to the 1958 Masters.
It was the site of an argument between Arnold
Palmer and Ken Venturi. I think Palmer was allowed
a drop or a leaf for a plug ball. Venturi was
arguing with him, claiming that Palmer had not
followed protocol. The ball was unplayable. I
read about that today. Yeah, it's pretty funny.
On the 12th? Yeah, yeah, exactly. And then Venturi
was leading at the time, I think, of the argument.
But then Palmer went on to win. And then Sports
Illustrated basically... came up with the phrase
and then the origins of where it came from, like
the Amen Corner, I think it's disputed, but it's
sort of accepted that there was a jazz record
in the 30s by a group led by Chicago's Mezro
called Shouting in that Amen Corner. And the
shouting, the arguing between Venturi and Palmer
is what coined its name. Fair enough. There we
are. Pretty weird, huh? And the Eisenhower tree?
It's another... It was. Yeah, it was, yeah. Gone.
Forever. Located on the 17th. Basically named
after President Dwight D. Eisenhower, who some
might know as a former president and a fairly
influential bloke in World War II. He just kept
hitting it. Fair enough. So they just called
it the Eisenhower tree. The tree so many times.
No, they just called it, they named it after
him. And apparently, like in 1956 at a club meeting,
he proposed that it get cut down. Because he
kept hitting it. Yeah, exactly. Used his presidential
influence. But the club's chairman, which was
Clifford Roberts, who we've spoken about previously,
didn't want to offend his friend and the president
of the entire country. So instead of answering
his question or even dealing with it, he just
found an excuse to adjourn the meeting. You have
no jurisdiction here. Exactly. And then I guess
another one of the... I mean, there's a lot you
could say about the course, Augusta, but the
Sarazen Bridge is another pretty fun... point
on the course uh it's a flat stone footbridge
covering the dam to the left of the pond on the
front of the 15th green and in the fourth round
of the 54 edition um gene sarazen hold a double
eagle uh to tie with craig wood and force a 36
hole playoff which he then went on to to win
um there you go 36 hole playoff yeah um yeah
which he won but anyway the shot is referred
to um as the shot heard around the world and
i think it's because it was a forward from 235
yards what he hold it yeah yeah like second shot
on a par five maybe it was anyway it's like you
know it's like an insane shot um and it just
yeah just dropped man so you got you got bridge
named after him that seems fair enough that seems
fair yeah well we mentioned eisenhower earlier
and we always talk about the war so you know
always 100 % of the time so far well i mean i
say always not in the context of um the almanac
the podcast yeah yeah but in the in the context
of me and you chatting uh generally um and i
do have a fun war story If you'd like to hear
it. You've got a story? Yeah. Excellent. You
want to hear it? Yeah, go on. Why not? We've
got time. We've got time. All right. Well, our
hero this time is Lloyd Eugene Mangrum, also
nicknamed The Icicle. Nice. Joined the PGA Tour
in 1937. Went on to win 36 events. Good player.
He also played on four Ryder Cup teams in 47,
49, 51, 53. On the last occasion that I just
mentioned there, he was actually playing as a
playing captain of the Ryder Cup team. Oh, cool.
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Decent career. Anyway, Lloyd,
what was his relationship with the Masters? So
he finished in the top 10 at the Masters 10 consecutive
years, and he never won it, but he entered in
the history books when he shot 64 in the opening
round in 1940. which was basically a Masters
record at the time, and it stood for 46 years.
So that's what he was famous for in the context
of the Masters, just shooting unbelievably low
scores. But Butch Jack, he wasn't just being
shot at, or he wasn't just shooting, rather,
on the course. He was being shot at just a few
years later. He actually joined General Patton's
Third Army. as America joined the war. And the
1942 Masters was the last until the end of World
War II, and it was only a couple of months after
Pearl Harbor. Mangrum wasn't the only guy to
serve. Bobby Jones, Ben Hogan, Sam Sneed, I think,
all joined. And Bobby Jones became an intelligence
officer in the Army Air Corps. And I think he
might have been involved in the planning for
D -Day and landed in France on D -Day plus one.
But anyway. I digress because there are obviously
many stories one could talk about in respect
of World War II. But our guy Lloyd, let's get
back to him. He was sent to the Ardennes, which...
Bomb draw. The trees are exploding. Yeah, exactly.
You know, anyone who's seen Band of Brothers.
And he was involved in the Battle of the Bulge
and he was injured there and he received a Purple
Heart and he won four battle stars. But when
he got home, and I think this makes this story
all the better, really. When he got home, he
went on to win his one and only major, which
was the US Open in 1946. And he did tie second
again in 49 in the Masters. Very nice. Yeah,
Lloyd Mangrum from Augusta to the Bulge and back,
which I think is a really cool story. Yeah, that
is cool. The Bulge features again in Masters
history. That's where General Dwight Eisenhower,
as he was known at the time, was. When he was
introduced to the bloke, they would eventually
go on to introduce him to the club, which I think
is a really weird symbiosis. It was a journalist.
I can't remember the newspaper he was working
for. I say he was a journalist. He might not
have been a journalist, but he was working for
a newspaper. Yeah. And he had a reason to meet
Eisenhower during the war, which is all to do
with regulations in France, to do with commerce,
relatively dry stuff. But the two guys got on
really well. And then when, I think Eisenhower
goes on to become the president of Columbia University
and he leaves the army to take up that position.
And he has a... career gap for want of a better
phrase probably just taking some time off after
winning World War II and the guy he met essentially
helps him write his memoirs and then as a present
or a thank you or you know what have you invites
the future president for a golfing away day and
takes him to Yeah, I was going to say, where
would that be? Exactly. Takes him down to Augusta.
And yeah, there we are. That's how Eisenhower
became familiar with the Masters. Well, not just
the Masters. Very nice. But yeah, those are the
World War II stories I have for you this week.
Jack, I'm sure you'll have more for us next week.
But yeah, anything else you wanted to raise?
Eisenhower is an interesting one because obviously
he became president in 1953, 1961. He never attended
the Masters while he was president because he
didn't want to be too much of a distraction,
essentially. But he always made sure he was there
on the Monday to play around with the winner.
Is that right? Yeah, one of the perks of being
president. But yeah, his love for the Masters
was so entrenched that the Major League Baseball
season was shortened by eight games and the season
started later to allow Eisenhower to both partake
in his traditions around the Masters and throw
the ceremonial first pitch of the Major League
Baseball season. Jeez, the influence. It's nice
being Prez. Yeah, that is... Yeah. Nice for some,
isn't it? That's unreal. But yeah, I don't know.
Is there anything else to discuss on the Masters?
I think the only thing we need to finish on is
I think we need to discuss a couple of the big
names in a bit more depth. I think we've already
mentioned them, but I think you and me need to
decide once and for all, right here, right now,
who the greatest golfer of all time is. Not just
the greatest player at the Masters. Let's use
this opportunity. Let's talk about who the greatest
golfer of all time is. I would like to propose
some nominees. In fact, I'm going to keep this
short and sweet. I'm going to propose two nominees.
We know who these are. You say this to anyone,
there's only two people in contention for this
title. It is the golden bear himself, Jack Nicklaus,
or the man who changed the sport. I don't think
either of us would be as interested in golf as
we are if it wasn't for Tiger Woods. Tiger Woods...
Not only was he brilliant, but he was very marketable,
obviously. He was very unlike anything we've
ever seen before. And one of the most amazing
things about Tiger Woods is the Tiger effect,
as they call it. The effect that he had on the
sponsorship in the game, the money going into
the game, the earnings that the players made.
It's ridiculous. Someone did a study on it, and
as I mentioned before, between... 1997 and 2008
no one made more money on the tour as you would
imagine than tiger woods he was full dominant
in that time he won 14 majors i think in that
period um 14 of the 15 he's won uh we're obviously
one during that period um just the 2019 one otherwise
and uh he made just shy of 100 million dollars
um from the tour and uh next on the list was
um one vj singh who i love Vijay Singh who I
think won about 69 million dollars during that
period if I remember the numbers correctly someone
did a study and worked out that if it wasn't
for Tiger Woods Vijay Singh would have made a
not paltry but a much less significant 33 million
dollars during that period Tiger more than doubled
his earnings by the amount of eyes that he turned
upon golf and the amount of people you got playing
golf and if you think about it the video games
the the nike deals the merchandise and just just
the fact we used to love the aura mate like we
were we were 10 year old kids watching golf because
of tiger woods and you could not name a single
other golfer in the world you knew tiger woods
was um so yeah as they say tiger woods he'd beat
you but he'd make you rich I mean, am I supposed
to try and come up with a counter -argument to
that? Because that's difficult. I've actually...
Ben, please. I'm prepared. I've got a pros and
cons list for Jack Nicklaus and CycleWords. I'll
take over from here. Don't you worry. I know
some of the basics. You listen to this and you
make a decision. Because I genuinely put my hand
on my heart and say I think you can go either
way with this. So Jack Nicklaus, the case for
the majors. Jack Nicklaus won 18 major championships.
That is the gold standard. No one's beaten it.
And probably with the levels in today's game,
it would be likely no one is ever going to beat
it. There's too many good players nowadays. Tiger's
three back? Yeah, Tiger 15. So 19 runners up
as well to go with that. He was in the mix for
decades. So his longevity, he won majors across
24 years, 1962 to 1986. And his 1986 Masters
win being one of the most iconic moments in golf
history. His strength of mind, he was known for
his composure, his course management, his clutch
putting under pressure. He out -fought his opponents,
not just outplayed them. And he played in an
era of change as well. So he played against,
at the start of his career. the likes of Arnold
Palmer, Gary Player, and by the end of his career,
Tom Watson, Lee Trevino, fantastic players, but
he consistently came up top. Obviously, Sebi
Ballesteros as well, consistently coming out
on top against these players as Spanderas. The
case against him, so he didn't face the global
depth of talent like Tiger did. That's a good
point. Golf has become, yeah. Golf was very much
Britain a little bit, Australia and South Africa
a little bit, obviously, certain players. But
in America, it was very heavily American. You
didn't get the European players playing at quite
the same level. You didn't get the Asian players
and African players and players from all over
the world that obviously exist in today's game.
So, yeah. Also, fitness and athleticism weren't
quite as big a deal there. You obviously had
people. like Gary Player, who were incredibly
fit, and you had other players who were less
so. It wasn't quite the same as it is now. So
that's the case for and against the Golden Bear.
Tiger Woods, the case for dominance. So Tiger
changed the game. At his peak, no one was close
to him. He's the only player ever to have held
all four majors at the same time. In the year
2000, he won four in a row. Not in the same year,
but across two years, he won four in a row. Is
that the Tiger Slam? He was a holder. The Tiger
Slam. He was a holder of all four at one time.
He won the 2000 US Open by 15 shots. And as we
mentioned, he won the 1997 Masters by 12 shots.
He wasn't winning. He was obliterating people
at that point. He's tied for the most tall wins
ever, 82. Obviously, there is a chance, a small
chance, a chance that he might come and beat
that. he's obviously had a lot of injuries and
he's got 15 majors so he's only he had a legion
a shot of beating Nicholas's 18 before injuries
and certain life choices derailed him somewhat
and obviously he didn't just a flawed genius
yeah transcendence he didn't just dominate he
brought golf to the masses he's the reason prize
money exploded he's the reason kids of all backgrounds
took up golf there's going to be people who are
in the pj tour now who are only in the pj talks
they saw tiger woods on golf uh tiger was playing
golf on tv age you know 10 when they were 997
2005 that kind of time and fell in love with
the sport because of tiger uh and he also the
strength of the field he faced a globalized ultra
comparative bunch of athletes not just golfers
a proper athlete by the time he was playing and
everyone raised their game to try and beat him
and technology kept improving to try and match
him and the most at that point failed now the
case against him did he make the most of his
talent you could say um he's obviously had injuries
you could argue whether or not that's his fault
he's had consistency issues later in his career
and of course what happened in 2009 2010 infidelity
issues um being on the front page of newspaper
not the back pages um it it all is things you
can hold against him i was gonna ask i was gonna
ask sorry to interrupt but yeah go ahead to what
extent would you place an emphasis or a weight
on the personal lives because jack nicholas is
undoubtedly a really nice guy um and i'm not
saying tiger's not a nice guy but tiger's obviously
had his fair share of controversy is that relevant
It depends. I mean, if your argument is who is
the most talented, maybe not. If the argument
is who is the overall best, maybe it is. Because
if Tiger had been in a better place in his actions
and his mental state and his decisions he made
in 2009, 2010 kind of time, would he have gone
on to win majors in 2009, 2010, 2011? And would
he be... I mean, if he had done, there'd be no
debate, I don't think. I think it would be Tiger
all the way. I think the fact that there is a
debate is on account of that plus injuries. I
mean, can he take injuries into account? Don't
know. It's why it's a debate. It's fun. It's
fun. You can also say about Tiger, he never really
dominated the game because of injuries, because
of obviously the things we've mentioned. He never
dominated the game into his 40s like Nicholas
did. Although, of course, he did win the 2019
Masters when he was 43, 42, 43 at that point.
So yeah, there you go. So if your measures longevity,
major championships, it's probably Jack. If it's
dominance, cultural impact, peak performance,
it's probably Tiger. So what do you reckon? You
make the decision, Ben. I'm on authority on this
stuff. And what I say is clearly therefore binding
on everyone. So yeah, no pressure. Such is the
significance of my opinion. I think it's Tiger
on balance. I knew you were going to say that.
Yeah, I know. It's hard to remove yourself from
everything you've experienced. The modernisation
of the game, the professionalisation of the game,
the money and the increased scrutiny and pressure
that comes with that. The extracurricular, and
I don't mean his personal circumstances, I mean
brand awareness, sponsorship, obligations, all
of that stuff, carrying that burden, plus the
fact that he's gone past the guys from the bygone
era on PGA wins. He's in touching distance on
the slams, if not beyond all of them except one.
Yeah, he won more, like you say, internationalization
of the game. And he's an athlete. Like, I'm not
saying that the guys in the 60s, 70s, you know,
and perhaps even 80s weren't athletes per se,
but, like, there's a requirement now. I mean,
you only have to look at, like, full swing or
something. These dudes are, like, you know, they
can bench, like, football players, like, you
know, American football players or, I mean, I'm
obviously being slightly hyperbolic there, but,
like, they're in the gym. smashing balls further
than anyone's hit before like but they've still
retained that precision and that accuracy and
that finesse that's required in the short game
uh i just yeah i think when you put it in that
context and who you who you have to beat in order
to rack up those wins it's probably gotta be
tiger and that's not to diminish the fact that
Jack Nicklaus has you know we read out his stats
in his career some of his career highlights earlier
like you know he's incredible yeah yeah like
to say Tiger's the best is not to say that Jack
Nicklaus isn't nearly the very best do you know
what I mean like it's not yeah the debate doesn't
need to descend into the likes that you see in
football where it's like you're great or shit
like yeah I mean Can we just make that sort of
the mantra of this podcast? Exactly. But yeah,
anyway, I don't want to bleat on about it. I'd
say Tiger. Those are the reasons. I would agree
with you. I think, obviously, this is completely
subjective, but I think if you were to pluck
one and put it in the other era, notwithstanding
the fact that certain issues would arrive from
placing Tiger into 1962, but I think if you were
to do that... I think Tiger dominates more and
I think Nicholas dominates less, simply because
of the competition. Not because either of them
are going to be the worst players in those tiers.
And perhaps, obviously, with the better conditioning
and better equipment, Nicholas raises game. So
maybe that wouldn't be the case. It's an immeasurable
variable, isn't it? It is. I mean, all of it's
immeasurable because their careers didn't overlap.
But I will tell you actually one thing, and this
is going slightly off topic. Some of the most
legendary... um achievements of nicholas's career
um the 1978 open championship at san andrews
which completed his third time over um grand
slam so that was his third uh open championship
he already won the other three at least three
times so that was his third only him and tiger
have done three um three times over all the major
championships um that was how he sealed it so
that tournament there as well as seve winning
in 1983 as well as Jack Nicklaus winning in 1986,
and then Tiger Woods winning in 1997, all of
those events had the same runner -up in them.
So if you're talking about bridging the eras,
a man named Tom Kite was runner -up in all of
those tournaments. Somewhat always a bridesmaid,
but he was... I just want to talk about him quickly
because I really like this guy. He was probably...
He wasn't flashy. He was methodical, analytical,
probably even arguably geeky. He was one of the
first players to embrace sort of psychology in
golf. He wore glasses when he was playing it.
He basically, he popularized the use of an extra
wedge, a lob wedge. So he sort of tried new things
out. And he, he, it was 1992, bear in mind, obviously
1978 when he was playing Nicholas runner up there.
runner up in a lot of events after that 1992
he won his one and only major championship in
the wind and the rain at the US Open at Pebble
Beach and the field collapsing around him Yeah,
I know. He stayed steady. He stayed smart. He
stayed unflappable. Hallmarks of his career.
It was a gritty, well overdue reward for a career
that was built on consistency. He won nine million
in his career, which was still a big total at
that point before Tiger came along and was a
respected Ryder Cup player and the Ryder Cup
captain as well. And he was inducted into the
World Golf Hall of Fame. So, yes, he wore the
rides made dress maybe one too many times, but
he eventually got his walk down the aisle. So
there we go. I just want to end by mentioning
him just because he, I don't know, he tickled
my fancy. He is someone who I admire. That's
a nice way to end it, man. Like, it's not all
about the guys that get the green jacket. It's,
you know, people like Tom Kite as well. They
all play a part in the story and Tom Kite played.
Plenty of parts because he was there for all
of those big majors, all those big events in
these legends' lives. Jack Nicklaus, Tiger Woods,
and Savé as well. Nice. Well, okay, let's leave
the Masters there. Starts this weekend, obviously,
or this Thursday, rather. Wednesday with the
Par 3 contest. True, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I
think if you are interested in watching it, if
you stuck it out this long and you are interested
in watching it, you can find it on Sky here in
the UK. If you have Sky Sports, the BBC will
be showing highlights as well, but it will also
be on their website. Five Live, Islander Sky.
Canada is CTV, which I'm not familiar with, so
forgive me. And then the US is, I think, going
to be CBS and ESPN? It's usually CBS, I think.
Yeah, they might both have rights. I don't know.
But have a look. Yeah, you guys in America will
know better than us if you are even with us and
listening. Cool. We've had a few listeners from.
different parts of the world already which is
nice thank you if you have been listening yeah
um it is hugely appreciated and um yeah i hope
i hope you're enjoying so thank you very much
and where are we going for episode three jack
not not not far especially for me um just down
the road for me um we are in sheffield next week
for the world snooker championship nice so for
for anyone who's not aware of snooker which i
think will be it's certainly a british british
centric sport um we will teach you about it and
we will teach you about the history of this event
and there's one thing you can say about snooker
it's never short of a character very true all
right well um let's leave it there uh and we'll
we'll join again the world snooker champs perfect
Well, I'll see you there. Bye, Jack. Bye, Ben.
Once again, thank you for listening. This was
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