And finally, I would write to the representatives
of the journal like, hey, what's the holdup?
I haven't seen the proofs. I haven't seen, you
know, because normally you have to go through
the proofs and the layout. They're not sending
me anything. And then finally, I wrote them an
email and I said, I suspect scientific misconduct
and I will go public unless I get an answer.
So I have a question for you. Ten years ago,
would you ever foresee that you might be one
of the most controversial people in America,
if not if not the world? I could never have imagined
being in this position. I mean, I you know, when
I think about my life before covid, I was. If
there was something wrong with me, it was a little
bit of a workaholic. I mean, I worked a mess.
My specialty, which is critical care, it's one
of the most hours worked specialties out there.
You work in a hospital. In a hospital, yeah.
You have to be in a hospital for ICU, right?
So we worked an immense amount of hours. And
I really liked what I did. But I also taught.
So I did research with fellows and residents.
I taught them and students. And so I was always
writing and teaching. And then I helped pioneer
a sub -genre of my specialty, which was critical
care ultrasound. I learned how to do ultrasound
myself. And I learned how to make life -saving
diagnoses at the bedside of Craig. crashing patients
so that I could turn them around real quick.
And I taught, I wrote and taught that for about
10 years. And so. I was, like, well -known, well
-respected. I kept getting recruited. I got recruited
to one of the top research institutions in the
country, University of Wisconsin. I was literally
about to become full professor when I left academia.
And so, like, I had a really good career. I was
liked. Who wouldn't like me? I was just trying
to help. You're not controversial. No, not controversial
at all. So, actually, maybe started to get into
a little of that before COVID because I became
really interested. and a really aggressive proponent
of high -dose IV vitamin C in septic shock, which
just literally turns people in septic shock around.
If you give it to them early enough, you can
save lives like you have no idea. I started to
run into little controversy there just but that
was more just that was old school. It wasn't
contrary. It was just old school differences
of opinion. Right. So my colleagues were a little
bit more staunch and a little bit more rigid.
You know, just they need the rigorous, large,
double blind, randomized control trial. We debated
that. There was other things that I debated.
I wouldn't say they were always friendly, but
they were professional. There was no personal
attacks. There was no professional sacrifices
or harms that you suffered. You just went your
way. So you were just kind of doing your thing,
really caring about people, really caring about
this global issue. it's at hand and um and then
all of a sudden boom you're thrust into a major
spotlight yeah would it what was that all how
did that feel what was that all about when did
that first happen i wish i have a little backstory
yeah yeah what that spotlight what was going
on i think the spotlight started maybe around
the corticosteroid testimony because after that
i got invited on a couple of like But this is
small time, just like some local radio stations
in Wisconsin. This is May of 2020, right? May
of 2020, yeah. I certainly got attention from
the University of Wisconsin who were coming after
me, got into that fight and had to hire a lawyer
to get them to back off. They tried to cancel
you first. Yeah, yeah. Or actually more just
keep me quiet. and not speak to the press or
the public. In fact, they were trying to demand
that I ask for permission before I go on and
do any media. And that's actually a violation
of First Amendment and also academic integrity
and academic freedoms. Like, a professor should
never have to ask for permission. to speak to
the public. It should be unfettered, unobstructed.
And my lawyer taught me that and taught them
that too. Because after my lawyer sent that letter,
I never heard from the leadership or administration
of a university. I think it actually shamed them.
because they were representing a top university
in the world. And they were literally trying
to infringe on the academic freedom of one of
their professors. This is before May of 2020.
This is May of 2020. This is right around that
time. This is before Ivermectin. You had a smart
lawyer. Yeah. Oh, he was great. He was great.
But to your point about like the publicity thing,
you know, my life changed overnight with that
testimony on Ivermectin because I was really,
I don't know if you guys know, know the backstory
of why i was so impassioned during that because
it went viral with our viewers yeah so what happened
was i was waiting to testify and there's about
eight of us we had varied levels of expertise
but all of our expertise led to conclusions that
were discordant or not in agreement with what
was happening in the country and the consensus,
right? Like, for instance, Jay Bhattacharya,
who's the new NIA, he was on my panel. He testified,
I think, right before me about the ludicrousness
of the lockdowns. We had people talking about
masks. We had various aspects of therapy. And
I was there to talk about early treatment. You
know, Peter McCall and Harvey Risch did hydroxychloroquine.
I did ivermectin. And um what happened is as
the hearing was november 2020 this was december
8th 2020 close december 8th and what happened
was and i hate to admit this and you guys have
to forgive me for this but i used to vote democrat
i used to vote democrat and i didn't pay much
attention to politics i thought they were the
good guys um i but again i was very superficial
into politics okay What happened was at the beginning
of the hearing, you had the majority party, which
was the Republicans and Senator Johnson at the
time, and then the ranking member in the party.
And what's interesting is the Democrats didn't
show up. The ranking member of the committee,
this is the Homeland Security Committee, he showed
up and he made some remarks which were so deeply
offensive to me. basically dismissing us all,
these experts who were fighting on the front
lines. I was treating COVID patients. I was watching
COVID patients die for six months. I was running
ventilators, ICUs, working like you wouldn't
believe. You were right there on the front lines.
And this guy, this politician comes up and calls
us, like, politically motivated. And I can't
even remember what he said, but, like, I was,
like, in a cartoon, like, when the face turns
red. And I'm from New York. I got a temper. I
used to get in a fair amount of street fights.
I literally was like, are you? kidding me? This
guy did not just say this to me. I'm the one
out there on the front lines fighting this thing
and he's going to tell me I'm here because I'm
a politician. Is that video, is there public
access to that? Yes, you can find in the Senate
on Ron Johnson's on the Senate Homeland Security
Committee site, you can see the whole testimony.
Maybe Alex put a little clip of that in here.
You've got to put that in because it'll show
why later when it came my time to speak, I just
went off. I was like, because i was stewing for
an hour over what he said and thank you for uh
holding this hearing i just want to start out
i didn't think i'd have to say this but i want
to register my offense at the ranking members
opening statement i was discredited as a politician
i am a physician and a man of science i have
done nothing nothing but commit myself to scientific
truth and the care of patients. And so it ended
up leading me to be quite emotional and really,
I don't know, maybe aggressive or passionate.
And it turned out that... I think what I was
saying, you know, there was anger, there was
also expertise, and there was also solution.
I think it resonated with a lot of people. And
I didn't know that. So here I am, right? And
you've heard stories from a lot of people who
go viral for different reasons. And suddenly,
and this wasn't really, it met the definition
of viral, which I learned there is a definition.
It's like a certain amount of views in a certain
amount of hours. And it far exceeded that. But
it's still like... like it has nothing to do
with like what true celebrities are because i'll
give you a very um i wouldn't say humbling moment
but my video it was on the most watched site
was on the fox news channel where they showed
my video and my video got to like 8 million views
before it got taken down i remember i was on
youtube one day this is like A couple months
later. And you know how you see all those clips
like on the side that they suggest? And I noticed
that there was an interview with some young blonde
actress who was interviewing with like a Jimmy
Kimmel or something. And I noticed that that
little interview on Jimmy Kimmel's show was like
15 million views. For an actress I didn't even
know the name of. I was trying to put that into
context. Some actress on a late night show gets
15 million. Here I am trying to bring in the
solution to the pandemic, and I got like 8 million.
So it's not the same, you know. Still a lot of
views. But it's still a lot of views. And the
other interesting thing about that, and this
isn't an ego thing. I was actually, it was really
what, I'm not saying, not being falsely minded,
honest it made me happy because more and more
people are hearing the word especially the coolest
thing that happened was after like um so what's
interesting is while i was in the hearing room
and as i testified i finished my phone's blowing
up with my colleagues like paul america's like
oh my god i love you you absolutely crushed it
so everyone's very happy five minutes after i
finish i get a text saying that fox news wants
to interview me like right when i'm done Wow.
So like someone at Fox News was like, we got
to talk to them. I think they saw that it was
an important thing that they just witnessed.
And so I did my first interview walking out of
there. It was a friendly interview? Yes, it was
friendly. It definitely was friendly at that
time. They were just very interested. But this
is, I think, before they learned to be unfriendly,
right? But no, that first one was friendly. But
what was really cool is I started getting contact
from little physician groups around the world,
different countries, like in Austria, a group
wanted me to talk to them, give lectures. So
I was just giving Zoom lectures to various interested
physician organizations. Just like naive and
for the betterment of man, man, that's all you.
doing yeah when did things go yeah at some point
it turned right like at some point you were two
days later it didn't take long okay so the first
let's say the first adverse action okay And this
just shows you how naive and how much we had
to learn. But within 24 hours, we got a request
from the Associated Press that they wanted to
interview me. And we were like, this is amazing.
It wasn't about me getting famous. It was like,
we're going to get our message out through the
Associated Press. You were naive at the time.
You don't want a big Associated Press. They feed
to every newspaper in the country. And we were
like, we're literally going to change history
by getting this information out. I get interviewed
by this woman named Beatrice Dupuis. She's this
young former fashion reporter. Interview's pretty
straightforward. I am burying her with data and
how much I know that ivermectin works, the people
I've talked to around the world, the studies
that I had in hand, how I had already seen people
turn around. And, like, she was pretty deferential,
a little contrarian, like asking a couple of,
like, I wouldn't say difficult questions, but,
like, skeptical. But I thought it went really
well. Interview ends and 24 hours later, headline.
is ivermectin not a miracle drug for covid and
then it goes into me and what i said and then
they use other doctors quoting that you know
i am over my skis that's my term you know just
like insufficient evidence you have to have good
quality and then they talk they almost brought
it up like um it's like another drug to be debunked
like hydroxychloroquine in fact that line might
have been in there And me and my colleagues were
so disturbed by what that interview led to in
terms of an article that we filed an ethics complaint
with the Associated Press. And I got to tell
you, it got their attention. And you know how
we know that is because during our discussions
with various leadership at the Associated Press,
they did a mistaken reply all. So like the president
or the CEO, I can't remember who it was, the
CEO of Associated Press replied all to the colleagues.
So the head of ethics and then like the president.
And all he said was one line. He said, he said,
you know, just buy some time with these guys.
Wow. So you could tell they were a little uncomfortable
that we were starting to make noise with an ethics
complaint. And then like within five days, they
came back with they reviewed the case and everything.
They found no ethical concerns. With their reporting.
None. None. That what she said was true. It's
not a miracle drug. Okay, yes, of course it's
not a miracle drug. No miracle drug. I don't
even know what the definition of a miracle drug
is. Even though it did win the Nobel Prize. But
we won't call that a miracle. But to your question,
so that was the first thing, right? And that
was our first sobering awakening. How you felt.
I want to go to the feelings of it because...
You know, I was in a similar situation, and I
want to hear, like, how did it hit you? I mean,
you're an esteemed doctor that people would study
under you. You were innovative, you were creative,
and you just want to help humanity. What did
it feel like when you read that? I'm going to
say this, though. That article was somewhat personal,
but it... It wasn't as mean or as judgmental
as what would come later. I didn't feel personally
hurt as much as severely disappointed that this
opportunity had been missed to get really important
information out to not only the country but the
world. Because what I've also learned in COVID
is the way the U .S. goes, a lot of the world
follows, especially the FDA and the NIH. All
of the Philippines, a lot of the South American
countries, they follow what the FDA does. So
tell us about the articles that hit your soul.
I'll tell you the time when I really was, I almost
couldn't sleep. What happened next? So the next
adverse action against me was my review paper.
So I had finished my review paper a few weeks
before the testimony. Found a journal right around
the time of my testimony, and I submitted it
for peer review and publication. Actually, my
editor, it was a special issue of an important
journal, and the editor of the special issue
was Robert Malone because he knew that it was
really important to get information around repurposed
drugs. So he proposed this issue on the use of
repurposed drugs. against COVID. So there were
numbers of other papers on repurposed drugs.
Mine was on ivermectin. I submitted it, went
through three rounds of peer review with top
scientists that Robert knew from NIH, CDC, or
NIH and FDA. And I finally passed peer review.
and it was accepted for publication and what
happened next is that it was an online journal
i paid for the um open access right so you don't
have to pay for the anybody could have gone to
the website downloaded it um but they wouldn't
publish it and so day after day week after week
went by this is in the winter of 21 this is like
late january early february of 2021 which is
if you look at all the curves and deaths that
was the peak of all the dying And they weren't
publishing it. And finally, I would write to
the representatives of the journal like, hey,
what's the holdup? I haven't seen the proofs.
I haven't seen, you know, because normally you
have to go over the proofs and the layout. They're
not sending me anything. And then finally, I
wrote them an email and I said, I suspect. scientific
misconduct. And I will go public unless I get
an answer. You were censored. This was your first
experience. This is my first censoring experience.
So when I wrote that, within a day, Robert got
a call from the chief editor of all the journals
that this journal was part of the family of.
And basically what this guy explained to Robert
is that they weren't going to publish the paper
for a number of reasons. Number one, they hired
an anonymous. third -party reviewer who claimed
that my conclusions were not supported by my
data. This is after I passed peer review by senior
scientists in government. They get some anonymous
guy saying that the paper is not supported by
the data. And then they also said that they don't
want to work with me because of my behavior.
And that's actually what crushed me because of
this threatening email that I had sent to the
journal, which is... Now I look back and almost
laugh that I felt bad, but I really felt that
my personal behavior, my criticizing kind of
attack in the journal, had led to deaths because
that is part of the reason why they retracted
my paper from publication. I thought I played
a personal role. My behavior somehow brought
about what happened, and it devastated me. I
think it devastated me. Wait, so I didn't understand
that. So basically you're saying that... You
thought the reason they didn't write about the
paper was because you threatened them. Well,
actually, I could be more clear. What happened
was normally when anyone has a problem with what
you're writing, what you're trying to argue.
Yeah. you revise it so they give you corrections
and then you do revisions and so i pleaded i
was like what do you mean retracted yeah you
know i just went through peer review if there's
if your reviewer has an issue with something
i wrote or something i interpreted i'm happy
to do revisions and i offered yeah to do and
i often even to mute my conclusions because remember
my conclusion of that paper in the original peer
reviewed and accepted was that we recommend the
systematic deployment of ivermectin in the prevention
and treatment of COVID worldwide. Pretty big
conclusion. And I was willing to soften. I mean,
I knew I was playing a game and I knew I was
up against forces that didn't want me to say
that. So I was trying to get something in. But
when the answer was that, no, we're not going
to work with him. because of his behavior and
I'm paraphrasing what it said but it was really
a personal they didn't like how I had behaved
and so they weren't going to go through a revision
process that bothered me at the time now I laugh
that I thought that they were never going to
publish it no matter what and but at the time
I literally thought that I was responsible for
blowing up the opportunity to get this thing
I mean whenever you're canceled or We often go
there and we think, what did I do? Yes. Some
sense of ownership that I did something. You
can't help but feel guilty. When somebody does
something to tell you that they don't like you
or they don't like you for something that you
did, you can't help but immediately feel a little
bit guilty. No, we went through that as well.
I mean, I lost. I had kids crying because their
parents were yanking them out of the school.
And I cried thinking, like, did I do something
wrong? Because this child is crying because they
don't want to leave my school, but the parent
is yanking them out. Could I have done something
differently? It's your fault. You get to feel
it. I felt like that. I felt like I let down
this child so I can understand. But now I understand
it was all an entire propaganda machine after
me, which is what you figured out as well. That
was really – those first few days, I remember
feeling terrible, terrible. And I'll tell you,
another time that I really – Did you cry? I wasn't
crying. I couldn't sleep. I felt really like
– you know you have like that pit in your stomach
so i'm walking around all day just feeling crappy
not feeling good not wanting to want to work
because i just felt really bad and and i wanted
that feeling to go away right probably had a
few more drinks than i should have those days
but like just you know i just didn't feel like
sitting in that kind of crap and the same thing
so yeah and so i'll tell you another um another
time where i remember feeling really low and
this is an interesting one so fast forward So
what we're talking about here is we're February
of 21. Over the next year, I keep advocating,
working with my organization. We're putting out
more and more information. I'm writing white
paper, showing all the evidence around iFormact,
and I'm doing lots of interviews in media. especially
in other countries and so like and i was testifying
in parliaments around the world like in different
countries and stuff i was helping different groups
like i was endlessly busy trying i i wouldn't
say i was an evangelist but i literally was trying
to promote the use of ivermectin to help people
and then come to november of 2021 um i'm in my
third job in covet right so my first john at
the university i resigned because i was uh I'm
morally and ethically objecting to how they were
responding to COVID. This supportive care only
nonsense. I refuse to watch. I was watching people
die in that ventilators that were never improving.
They were just slowly deteriorating to death
and they weren't treating. I said, I'm out. My
second job, I lost the day after my ivermectin
testimony, and that's an interesting, somewhat
funny in hindsight, reason why I lost. But when
I gave the testimony, the chevron at the bottom
or whatever, is that what you call it, like the
little thing at the bottom of the screen? I think
it's a checker. Yeah, whatever the banner thing
is. What is it called, Alex? Chiron. Chiron,
that's it, chiron. So the chiron or the banner
at the bottom of the screen said, the institution
I worked for at the time, which was in Milwaukee.
And so basically the institution I worked for,
they were like, what the hell? You just went
in front of the country and started talking about
ivermectin and made it sound like you were a
spokesman for our institution. I never said I
was a spokesman for them. In fact, in my speech,
I talked about how I was representing my nonprofit,
but it didn't say my nonprofit at the bottom.
It said my institution. And so they flipped because
the next day, in the next few days, Their phones
were ringing off the hook. Everyone in the country
wanted to see Dr. Corey or get ivermectin. So
they were calling Milwaukee. And so the leadership
there were so pissed. And I'm sure they're controlled
by the government because they're getting a lot
of government funding, and you jeopardize that.
I'm sure it's all of the above. And so what they
told me, they called me like a day and a half
later. They said, we need to meet. Do not talk
to the press. And until we meet, we're meeting
tonight, your boss and then the chief medical
officer and someone else were going to meet with
me. And I remember I was fairly prescient at
the time already. And I said to them, I said,
they said, you know, we're going to revise the
terms of your contract. So they weren't firing
me, but they were offering a new contract. And
I told them in that first phone call, I said,
I'm just going to let you know, if you put. any
restrictions on my ability to speak publicly
in that contract, we don't have to have the meeting.
And sure enough, six hours later, we have the
meeting. What do they do? While we're meeting,
they email me the contract. And so I'm opening,
they asked me to open it up on my computer, open
it up. There's literally like six restrictions
to me being able to speak publicly. And I said,
I told you, we don't really need to meet. It
was a pretty short meeting. And so I lost my
second job there. So they canceled you? They
canceled me. And again, Was that out of self
-preservation that I was a loudmouth and they
didn't want a loudmouth doctor? I think there
is some of that. I think they had their own reasons
to not want somebody behind the scenes. You were
stating the other side, which everybody should
hear both sides so they can make a decision.
I gave a professional opinion that somehow they
perceived it was going to be attached to their
institution that they didn't necessarily believe
in. They didn't do the research. They didn't
know that Ivermectin was— The Board of Trustees
might be composed of some influential—some people
that are influenced by outside parties. It's
also the Midwest. Wisconsin is not known for
its swashbuckling, you know, cowboy risk -taking
culture. I mean, these are rule followers. They
drive 20 miles an hour. in a 20 mile an hour
speed limit. Now I'm like a loud New Yorker.
So there's some other aspects there too. But
the point of what I want to say is the other
time that I felt really, I actually didn't feel
that terrible. I actually felt bad for my boss
because I liked him and he spent a long time
recruiting me. And I know he was disappointed
in me. And I feel like he probably got some crap
for hiring me and not knowing that I was going
to testify in the Senate. So I kind of felt bad
just on a personal level with him. But what happened
was my next job, I was out of the ICU for a few
months just doing my nonprofit work. And then
I missed being a doctor. I wanted to go back
to bedside. So then I became an independent contractor.
And I worked in South Carolina in Greenville
for a few months running ICUs there. And then
I went back to central Wisconsin. And I was really
happy at that last job. I was making really good
money because as a contractor, you make good
money. And I loved my partners. They were so
happy to have me join them because they knew
my work prior to COVID. They owned my book, like
my ultrasound textbook. So they knew they were
getting like this master ultrasound expert and
a COVID expert. You were famous before you were
infamous. So I came. I taught them my protocols,
how I was teaching. And like we were getting
along great. The nurses loved me. But what happened
was. The chief medical officer was sending my
partners emails, basically telling them to get
rid of Corey. And he would send articles like
hit job articles, you know, and about fringe
quack, radical, whatever, anti -vaxxer. And he
was just saying, get rid of Corey. And they said,
if Corey goes, we go. And it was very hard to
recruit there. So they were protecting me. They
protected me for six months until one day. I
got home after a long weekend and I woke up.
I was supposed to go back into work. It was like
a Monday or Tuesday. And the chief of the ICU,
the guy who had hired me, he just called me up
and he said, hey, Pierre, we don't need you anymore,
man. And I was like, what? He's like, I'm really
sorry. He's like, we don't need you anymore.
And then he told me why. Apparently, this is
what's called a sham peer review. That's the
term in medicine. When they want to get rid of
a doctor, they make up stuff about the doctor,
put it in the record, and then get rid of the
doctor. Now, they didn't have to fire me. I was
a contractor, right? So it was literally a phone
call. We don't need you anymore. That's how it
ended. Normally, when you're employed and on
staff, it's a much more arduous. Like, that's
what happened to Paul Merrick. They ran the Shampere
review of a Shampere. Because Paul had been there
for 30 years, never had one patient complain.
They devised nine different complaints on him,
put him before what I will call a tribunal, and
they took his privileges. career ended so his
was psychologically so damaging what happened
to Paul for me it was a phone call but I was
really I was really upset because I liked that
job and I was doing a good job at that job and
he told me what the complaint was that I had
apparently told somebody in the ER to not get
vaccinated and what was interesting is I hadn't
been in because remember I'm ICU I hadn't been
in the emergency room for two weeks I thought
it was really interesting that they called me
on that day to tell me about this event that
I had apparently done. The only time I could
have done two weeks prior. But you know what
that firing was timed with? It was timed with
the mandates. So they knew I wasn't vaccinated.
So this is November of 21, and the CMO was calling
me. Hey, we have to prepare for holidays. We
need contingency planning for the schedule. We
want to know if you're getting vaccinated. I
was like, let me think about it. The only thing
I had to think about was whether I was going
to do the fake card or just say no thank you.
So there was no thinking about vaccination. And
I decided to get a fake card. And so he called
me on Wednesday, and I said, I need some time
to think about it. He's like, I'll call you tomorrow.
I'm like, no, give me two days. Friday, he calls
me. And I said, you know, I thought about it.
I was like, no big deal, whatever. I'll just
get vaccinated. And we hung up the phone. That's
Friday. And when do I get fired? Monday morning.
You think they were related? They were thinking
that I was gone over the van mandate. But once
I told them I was getting vaccinated, they fired
me. But here's the point to that story, though.
I got to tell you, it was weird. At that point,
I was pretty wise. I'd learned a lot about the
world. I understood somewhat what I was up against.
I knew what these people were capable of. When
I say these people, people way beyond these,
you know, the CMO of this hospital. But it didn't
take away the feeling of feeling really bad.
I felt like a really bad doctor. I'd never been
fired before. I just got fired. You know what
it feels like to get fired? Even though when
you know that it's unjust and illegitimate, I
felt... I remember just feeling bad. I just felt
bad. I felt icky. I felt like I... could have
and should and then i was thinking about because
i probably said something to someone in the depths
of the er like yeah i wouldn't get vaccinated
either i'm sure i said something like this i
was thinking like is that what i got fired but
then i i knew it wasn't that because i remember
i reviewed the timing and everything but i just
to answer your question david like that that
that actually getting fired like that really
bothered me getting my paper retracted really
emotionally bothered me I got to tell you, I
got pretty used to the media hit jobs. Those
almost became funny because they were so predictable.
Yeah, the media hit jobs of fringe quack and
they would use pictures of me like really angry
or like, it's just like whatever. Memes, yeah.
But when they called to say you're fired, were
you like... it hits your ego a little bit as
well right it that's the thing it was it did
make me feel bad i felt less than that i wasn't
good enough that like why would they fire you
know we all have a high opinion over like why
would they fire such a good guy you know like
and i mean i'm just trying to make a joke there
but like i just it didn't compute and i didn't
like it and it led to a really bad um you know
conclusion but i gotta tell you one other thing
that my friend the chief of the ICU, told me
in that conversation is right before we hung
up, he said, hey, Pierre, he said, listen, man,
the way I see all this is like, this is a war
and you're a casualty. That's how he, and I said,
you know what? I appreciate that, Chris. And
I remember saying this to him because I really
wanted my job. I liked that job. I remember saying
that. I was like, hey, Chris, if things ever
calm down again and we're out of this nonsense.
I was like, if you ever wanted me to come back
and work, I would. He said, I'll definitely call
you. Now, I don't know if he was just saying
that. Sure, I'll call you, Pierre. Like if he
was like winking on the other line. But I'd like
to believe that he was sincere because he's the
one who volunteered that statement. He said,
you know, this is a war and you're a casualty.
It was a war, though. November of 21. It was
a war. And did you get depressed? Did it take
you a while to come out of it? That's a really
good question because it actually only lasted
two or three days. I remember three days later,
I think I had kind of right -sized it in my perception.
I think I'd come, I probably spent... A few days
ruminating and maybe out of self -preservation,
I came to the conclusion that I actually was
a good guy and I didn't do anything wrong and
I'm just fine. And what got you out? Was it praying,
God, your wife? I can't. What pulled you out?
Probably, I would say the support of my newfound
friends and colleagues and my family. I think
they understood. My parents understood. My ex
-wife understood at the time. Did you lose friends
and family along the way as these things were
unfolding? I would say, this is a really cool
question, because I'm going to say I gained so
many. I got to meet. and interact and build this
huge social and professional network of the best
people in the world and i hate to say like this
but these are the people who got this stuff right
that navigated this right figured it out the
right way fought on the right side and so that's
the positive now what did i lose here's the thing
right i've been an educator for so long i used
to run a training program for a doctor's training
in my specialty and so i have i have like years
and years of residents fellows students who really
liked me and and and they would reach out even
difficult cases or just every few months three
six months like an old fellow would who's now
like his own big boss attending somewhere he's
just like hey pierre how you doing what are you
up to you know or they'll send me like a cool
ultrasound clip like we had like this kind of
you know collegial relationship and i'll answer
your question there by saying my my phone got
real quiet with the old guys like most of my
old colleagues with a couple of exceptions like
there's this one fellow uh ravi nalamatu who's
actually in florida um i'm gonna call him out
by name because he was just so lovely because
he um he's a special guy he was a psychiatry
resident doing a rotation in internal medicine
and i was his resident After working with me
for a month, he switched into internal medicine.
Then when I became a fellow in pulmonary critical
care, he did a rotation with me. And then he
went into pulmonary critical care. So he's like
literally the definition of like my protege.
And he never wavered. He would like throughout
the pandemic, he'd be like, keep going, man.
You're on it. And he would give me a little information
of what he was saying. And so there was a couple
of exceptions. But most went quiet, especially
my former, like, close colleagues that I ran
ICUs and ran departments with. They went real
quiet on me. It's a lonely feeling when you're
going through the cancellation journey. Yeah.
Right? What about kids? Did you have kids? Yeah,
I have three daughters with my ex -wife. And,
yeah, they were, oh, boy. They were mostly supportive.
I think they trusted their father. I think they
very quickly understood that their father was
in a unique situation and was really just putting
out his expertise and study. And one daughter,
I think, took a little time. She, and you're
going to understand and empathize with this,
because she went to a private school. And this
was, I think, August of 21. What were their ages?
The time right now, they're 20, 18 and 13. So
this isn't 21 to be three years ago. So she was
probably 17. But at her private school, they
announced in August before school started that
any unvaccinated kid would have to wear a mask
all day. And again, I don't want to go into my
daughters too much, but two of them had catastrophic
cases of pandas and they're immunosuppressed.
They have immunodeficiencies and they already
have a vaccine associated disease. There's no
way in hell I would ever let them get vaccinated.
Now, my daughter doesn't know the harms of vaccines.
She was destroyed at the idea that she was going
to go to her junior year in high school. with
the scarlet letter M on her face, right? You
know, the small cohort of kids who didn't get
vaccinated. Now, what's interesting is by the
time school rolled around, they went back to
masking everybody. So she didn't have to stick
out like that. But I remember she was crying
because she'd had COVID a couple of times and
she thought it was because we weren't vaccinating
her, right? She's believing all this. So she
was very, very upset. But I would say that didn't
last long. I think over time she realized how
bad the vaccines were and what they were doing.
And since then, my kids, and especially since
the publication of my book. But at the time,
though, when she's up, because, you know, we
have two young girls and they can get very emotional.
How are you taking it that your daughter was
like mad at you because she thought. Good cop,
bad cop. remove myself from my ex -wife primary
reassurances. I just like, yeah, she was blaming
it on me. And, uh, but the, the funny thing is,
is my ex -wife was in full agreement that we
wouldn't vaccinate. Yeah. But, and I think I
just gave her space, you know, I wasn't going
to try to convince her. I was going to have a
data argument with her. I did try that. I tried
to send her some data as to why I really didn't
want her. I was, I was using VAERS at the time.
Um, now I could probably. put a stack of data
17 feet high. But at the time, I had done a VAERS
analysis that was so troubling of young kids
dying hours, day after the vaccine and stuff.
But I just gave her time, and she came around.
But now I think my kids really appreciate me,
and I think they understand how important I am.
Each one of my kids have been told by friends
or parents of their friends how much they respect.
Their father. My daughter's a freshman at University
of Colorado in Boulder. And so her and her friends
are looking for an apartment for next year. And
they're with some broker, a realty company. And
so she's going to look at apartments. And the
realtor who was taking my daughter to see these
apartments says to her, like, You related to
Dr. Pierre Kory because she saw that her name
was K -O -R -Y is a very rare name. And so my
daughter's like, yeah, that's my father. And
the broker freaks out. She's like, no. I followed
him since the beginning. He helped me so much.
And, you know, the information, I really appreciate
it. And she just like was heaping praise on me
to my daughter. And that's really cool. You know,
when your teenage daughter is like, wow, my dad
must be pretty cool. It's pretty, it's fun. It's
funny because. Now we get that a lot. Oh, now
you do. Now we do. But in the heat of it, you
feel like the world is coming at you. And now
it's funny when people go to Setner Wellness,
they're like, you know, I couldn't believe you
opened a wellness center. I've been following
you since the school. You know what, though?
Just give me one more anecdote. You guys may
want to use this instead because it's even better.
So actually the best anecdote in this regard
with my kids was actually like two years ago.
Same daughter. You know, in high school, back
in Madison, and she goes to lunch with her friends.
They're in the car. They all have driver's licenses.
They're going in the car to Chick -fil -A, whatever
they do every day. Which is terrible food, but
I guess. So they're going there and apparently
the conversation in the car is somebody mentions
that Eve's dad was on Joe Rogan. And so one of
her friends literally goes to them, no way, your
father was on Joe Rogan? Get out. And they're
all like, yeah. And then one of them's like,
yeah, I watch his stuff all the time. So like
literally my daughter's close friends in high
school like. follow my stuff watch my stuff and
they all like watch the joe rogan episode i mean
what's cooler than having your teenage daughter's
friends think you're like that's a great episode
everybody should re -watch that there you go
great episode but yeah any those those are some
of the high points so i want to talk to you a
little bit about the disinformation playbook
because i feel like um i didn't know about this
playbook first of all it was totally played on
me and um I'd like for you to go over it a little
bit. And we pulled it up on the screen as well.
That summarizes it a little bit. What is this
all about? Let me tell you how I discovered it.
Let me tell you how I discovered it. So it was
March of 2021. And I woke up one morning and
I get this email from someone I don't know. And
it's from a professor named William B. Grant.
Turns out he's like one of the most published
researchers on vitamin D in the world. And he
writes me a two line email. It says, dear Dr.
Corey, what they're doing to ivermectin, they've
been doing to vitamin D for decades. And he includes
a link to that article. I'm like, who is this?
What is he talking about? You know, I click on
the link and that's when like literally like
my, you know, light, whatever the metaphors,
light bulbs are exploding. And like suddenly
I can see the world clearly because. What that
article shows, it basically, it's called the
disinformation playbook. We have it mapped out
on the screen. It outlines the tactics that industries
deploy when science emerges that's inconvenient
to their, let's be honest, financial interests,
right? Ivermectin science is highly inconvenient
to pharma, right, with all the profits from the
vaccines, Paxlovid, Remdesivir, Molipiravir.
I'm reading this article and these tactics were
actually developed by a PR firm hired by the
tobacco industry in the 1950s after Babe Ruth
got jaw cancer. They had a problem on there.
Babe Ruth was like one of the biggest ad salesmen
for cigarettes at the time. And he was like always
smoking and probably on the field smoking while
he's swinging a bat. Then he gets jaw cancer
and more and more reports are coming out that
smokers are getting cancer. And so they develop
these tactics to try. to suppress and distort
the evidence of harm of cigarettes. And since
that time, they've perfected those, and they've
become even more powerful because of their levers
which control media agencies. And they weren't
always in control of the media. No. Because at
some point, they weren't allowed to market. You're
right. No, you had independent media, right?
And you couldn't advertise cigarettes on TV,
right? So they didn't have as much control over
television stations, whereas Pharma runs almost
all major media because it's the single biggest
source of advertising revenue. It's new, too.
That is new. Yeah. So you can see how disinformation,
their ability to do disinformation campaigns
has gotten even more. So anyway, I read the article
and I was just shocked because I had just flooded
with examples coming to my mind of each tactic.
Right. And you got fake the science. The fake
is the that is the most powerful. That is the
foundation of everything they do. So there's
a chapter on a book called The Big Six. It's
actually should be called The Big Seven. Basically,
what they did is they ignored all of the studies
that I brought forth from all the black and brown
countries, the observational trials, the epidemiologic
studies, even the randomized control trials done
from all the positive trials they ignored. And
they actually designed and conducted what I call
the big six. These were large, purportedly high
quality, rigorous, double blind, placebo controlled
trials. And they were so manipulated and so designed
to show that ivermectin didn't work. Didn't they
overdose people too? Hydroxychloroquine. Yeah.
Because that's what they did in hydroxychloroquine.
They gave them way too much. But this is what
I was saying to you before is that. I wrote the
book The War on Ivermectin. One of my colleagues
could have written the book The War on Hydroxychloroquine
because it's literally the same tactic, same
results. But too much too late. What I like about
your question about didn't they overdose, and
I'd like to make this point because hydroxychloroquine
does have a lethal dose. And in one of their
big trials, they used a dose just under the lethal
dose, which no one has explained and I think
is actually a crime that should be prosecuted.
With ivermectin, you can't do that. You can take
100 times normal dose and be fine, or at least
50 times. So what they did with ivermectin is
the opposite. They gave as low a dose for as
short a time as possible. These tactics that
they did in these trials are so brazen. But here's
the thing. They would manipulate and conduct
these trials, show that ivermectin didn't work.
Publish it in the highest impact medical journal
in the world. And then it would launch a media
frenzy across all the newspapers and TVs. Not
only in the country. You know, ivermectin found
ineffective in COVID. Latest high quality rigorous
trial says. And you see it plastered everywhere.
And I would wake up on those mornings and I'd
be like. It was like a PR nightmare. And then
I would get attacked in the media and all that
because for saying for so long that it worked,
but yet this beautifully done rigorous study
from the heights of academia found that stupid
Dr. Corey, it doesn't work. So not only did it
make me look like a fool. They won't talk about
all the previous studies. They will never mention.
They ignore the positives. They won't say any
of this. No, that's just that's the fake. And
then the blitz is what we've actually remember.
This is your guy's show. This is kind of the
topic. Right. So the blitz is where they harass
scientists. Right. And they've been doing this
for a long time. So some of the great case examples
like in that article is the one of Dr. Bennett
Amalu, who first described chronic traumatic
encephalopathy, which is the micro hemorrhages
that befall the NFL football players. There's
a movie about Will Smith plays Amalu in. that
movie i think it's called uh concussion it's
a major motion picture but it talks about the
persecution that amala went under via the nfl
for talking about this brain disease that happens
for getting your head hit too hard on that right
by the way the nfl is a nine billion dollar industry
pharmaceutical industry is $1 trillion. So when
you do something to piss off pharma, you're up
against a pretty formal vote. Although the NFL
was not kind to Amalu. But here's the other thing
is that, remember the Vioxx scandal? Yeah. There's
a really interesting article that when Vioxx,
when doctors started to know how toxic Vioxx
were and started to speak publicly about it,
Merck created a hit list of doctors who were...
talking smack about Vioxx, right? And so they
were targeting doctors, trying to discredit them
and ruin their reputation so that no one would
listen. And shame them in front of everyone to
show the others to not speak out. Yeah, and I
have these lectures. I have this one slide where
I try to give examples of the Blitz. And all
I do is I show the faces of me and the five people
that formed the FLCCC and what happened to us.
So in terms of me, I've lost three jobs. I had
11 complaints to the medical board, which luckily
I survived and I still have my license. But the
worst thing that's happened to me is that my
board, my specialty board certifications were
revoked. And what a board certification is, it's
when you have a specialty. you can take this
higher level exam. And when you pass that, you
can call yourself board certified. So you spend
a lot of money, you take this exam, and then
you can puff out your chest. And board certifications
used to denote like a higher level of knowledge
or skill. That's all it was. And so patients
would get impressed that when you gave a lecture,
you could say I'm board certified and this and
that. So I actually have three board certifications,
had internal medicine, pulmonary disease, and
critical care medicine. And the boards came after
me and Paul Merrick especially. They enacted
this new misinformation policy. Peter McCullough,
same thing. The three of us got the letters on
the same day from the same committee. And we
fought for a year and a half. We defended every
public statement we had made with reams of data.
I think at one point, one of my reports was 67
pages with like 270 references. Wow. Didn't matter.
They just rebutted saying that you say the vaccines
are dangerous. The WHO says they're safe. This
is the level of defense that I was getting. Oh,
you guys are citing the WHO saying they're safe
and effective, but no granular data, no data
to rebut the data. But the fix is in. But ultimately
about, I can't remember when it was, it's sometime
in the last three or four months, they came to
their final decision and they revoked my specialty
board certification. So I'm no longer board certified.
If I was still in the medical system with a career,
my career would end. Because although it used
to be a badge of distinction, they weaponized
board certifications to the point where now to
get on staff at a major institution, you have
to be board certified. To be on an insurance
panel, you have to be board certified. So what's
lucky for me is... So they were trying to...
Yeah, they're trying to get me gone. But here's
the thing. It doesn't actually have any material
implications for my career now because I'm in
private practice and I'm fee based. That's one
other reason why. I can't take insurance is because
I don't have board certifications. No insurance
panel will pick me up. I can't get a job in the
system, which is just fine with me because I
love my private practice. I love the autonomy.
I love what I'm learning. I'm learning about
all sorts of different therapies they don't teach
you in medical school, which I find really helpful.
And I find this to be one of the most stimulating
and inspiring times of my life, my professional
life, to be honest. A little lucky in a way.
Yeah. Yeah, I like that. I do feel like... Like,
here's what I like to say is that the course
and the journey in COVID was really difficult.
I talked about some of the low points. There
were definitely some high points in support and
praise. The fame and notoriety or the whatever,
that's nice. It doesn't really give me dopamine
rushes, to be honest. I don't really care about
that stuff. But the journey was rough. But where
I landed, I never would have landed here otherwise,
and I'm so happy I'm here. I'm so happy I'm living
the life I'm living now. It never would have
happened otherwise. You're free. You're free.
Let me quickly go over these other sections.
You've got the diversion. So we did the blitz.
We did the fake. The diversion is when they just
basically inject doubt to anything you say. So
if I'm out there talking about how I've reacted,
they will just plant articles. citing people
with pedigrees behind them who then talk differently
about what they'll say oh you know the safety
hasn't been proven um you know the qualities
that he's citing are small underpowered low quality
poorly designed um you know all sorts of fancy
things that they just they just want to inject
doubt into the reader that don't listen to dr
cory right so first they attack your credibility
which is like they've done that to bobby kennedy
for forever right because If you can hit him
as a man, whatever he says, you don't listen
to because you already know he's uncredible.
Right. So but here they just try to counter anything
you say. And they plant these articles all over
the place. And, you know, let's remind ourselves
what the definition of propaganda is. Right.
Because I think it's really important that we
remember. I think the best definition is it's
a story. or a message that gets you to think
or act in a certain way just stories and messages
right so when they put in like these anti -ivermectin
newspaper pieces they're just sending you a little
story in a message that like be careful that's
a horse dewormer only really weird fringe quack
doctors think it works and most of the authorities
from the big institutions They cite studies showing
that it definitely doesn't work, right? So little
stories and messages to get you to not use ivermectin.
What's the screen? And the screen is where they
buy alliances with professional societies. So
that's just money, right? So the best example,
we talked about in a prior conversation, we talked
about the horse dewormer PR campaign. That's
where the FDA sent out their tweet, the CDC sent
out a memo, the NIH went on television, you know,
and then the horse dewormer appeared everywhere
in the media. But two days after the third action
that they took, which was Fauci going on television,
the American Medical Association, the American
Pharmacists Association, the American Association
of Hospital Pharmacists, the three of them put
out a joint statement, publicized all through
the media, where they said the AMA, APHA, AHA.
Call for the immediate cessation of prescribing
of ivermectin for COVID in big block letters.
So you had these three professional societies
suddenly put out a public call for immediately
telling everyone to stop prescribing. That's
how desperate they were. Do you guys remember
them doing that for fentanyl? Or oxycodone? No.
They never did that for oxycodone, right? Because
when I see that kind of bold block letter, like
literally screaming all caps to stop, to the
doctors to stop prescribing it, I was like, that
must be a really dangerous drug that they're
calling this a public health medicine, right?
And so that would be an example of, what was
that? Screen. Or the screen, yeah. Where they
literally, and then the last one is when they
go after officials. That, I used to be collegial
and friendly with the top WHO researcher on ivermectin
in the world, a guy named Professor Andrew Hill
from Liverpool. And when we first learned about
each other, we were very collegial. We were shared
data with each other. And I knew what he was
doing. He was collecting every randomized controlled
trial in the world and he's reporting the results
to WHO. And without going to the whole long story,
it's well detailed in my book. They got to Andy
and I talk about how, why, how I knew it. But
he was a very much more sober than I was vocal
advocate for Ivermectin. When I say sober, just
more, you know, first of all, he's British. You
know, I'm a little emotive and expressive and
a little loud. Right. You know, so he was a little
bit more measured, but consistently highly supportive
of Ivermectin in his public lectures. And then
all of a sudden. He started singing a different
tune. They got to him. And, yeah, we have the
evidence, and I detail it in my book. And we
have him admitting on camera, and we actually
released this. We have him admitting on camera
to one of my colleagues that his sponsors changed
his paper. So tell us about your book. What's
the name of the book, and how does one get it?
The War on Ivermectin, pretty much the only place
to get it is Amazon because none of the bookstores
will pick it up. And so I can only – luckily,
at least there's Amazon. It's available now?
It's available now, yeah. It's been out for a
couple of years. It's done really well in a number
of countries. And I found out you make literally
nothing from your first book, but I'm still happy
people are reading it. Well, we really appreciate
your warriorhood and just following your heart
and doing what you think is right. ignoring the
slings and the arrows and rising above it all.
And I'm really happy for you. As you guys have,
too. To be honest, I'm with Auguste's company
here. We love people that fight the system. They
don't sit back and just get beaten into submission.
I hope we are setting an example for those who
come after us. One of the things that I'm on,
and this is not, I'm not trying to pump myself
up or you guys up, but One thing I noticed throughout
all of COVID is how few whistleblowers there
were. I mean, you think about all of those agents,
all of the lies and the crap and the fraud and
the stuff that they've covered up. And so few
people came out and spoke open publicly. And
those that did really got put through the ringer.
But it's funny. There's a study of whistleblowers
that I came across. When they looked at a whole
bunch of whistleblowers from different industries,
they found that the vast majority of them suffered
greatly for being a whistleblower. But when asked
whether they would do it again, they almost all
said yes. I'd love to see that study. Yeah. Because
you feel happier that you lived in integrity
and you weren't silenced. I mean, I could totally
see that. What's the name of it? Well, it was
quoted – I don't actually have the study, but
it was quoted by a man named Peter Gace who himself
was canceled. He's probably the best – you guys
should have him as a guest. He's really famous.
I don't know him personally, but he's a very,
very famous physician who actually started one
of the – top journals in the world, Cochrane
Library, and was later forced out because he
started to comment and fight against the pharmaceutical
industry influence in that journal. And they
sent him on his petard. But he gives this lecture
where he actually reviewed this paper of whistleblowers
and what happens to them. And many of them suffered
real greatly in terms of income, stature, reputation,
profession. But like I said, the majority said
they would do it again. And would you do it again?
Of course. And the thing is, partly because of
what you were just saying, David. Look where
I landed. I'm so happy now. Do I want to go through
it again? No, but I would do it again. And not
just because of where I landed. It's because
I didn't have a choice. When you have that kind
of mindset, like, I'm going to call BS when I
see BS. And I knew that these were lies. I knew
this was incorrect, and I wanted to correct it.
There's no way I'm not going to do that in the
future. Sure. Thank you again. Thank you. Really
appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. It's great
spending time with you. Definitely. Appreciate
it. Thanks for having me, guys.