WEBVTT

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Good evening. Welcome to Kaleidoscope. My name

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is Ruby Ray Liu. And today I am joined by founder

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of SoulFam Hostel, Chase King, a great hostel

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in Cape Town that I had the privilege of staying

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at a few months ago, and my co -host, Luigi.

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This is Kaleidoscope. perspectives beyond the

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surface. I am what happens when you practice

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touch typing too much on the keyboard and stumble

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onto some websites about podcasting. Chase. That's

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it. Finished. I'm finished. Yeah. I'm not sure

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how there's to connect. Okay. I don't know if

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my intro is going to be as clever as yours, but

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what I will say is that I'm really excited to

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be here and thank you for inviting me to Kaleidoscope.

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So a bit about me. So as you mentioned, I'm the

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founder of SoulFam Hostel and it's the first

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LGBTQ plus inclusive hostel in Africa. And it's

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something that's very near and dear to my heart.

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And I created this space because I wanted to,

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you know, create a space that was based on chosen

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family and inclusive and makes people feel seen

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and welcome. And so I feel like I get to achieve

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that every day and I connect with the most amazing

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people from all over the world. And I really

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feel proud to have created a safe space in Cape

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Town. So thank you for having me. You definitely

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did achieve that for sure. Thank you for that

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lovely introduction. Yeah, that was a really

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good intro. Well. Hello, I'm Luigi porn futurist

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me Ruby discussed this title before the show

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and She declares she says now I Swear, it's something

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that's real, but everyone but but according to

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the internet. It's not So Ruby says it's some

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weird Mandela effect, but I swear to God porn

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futurism is real. Whatever it is I'm just trying

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to sound smart academic Please explain because

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Okay, wait, let's give chase it an opportunity

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based on what you've heard so far chase What

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do you think porn futurism is? Yeah, I'm trying

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to wrap my head around it. I Don't quite understand

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what I had It sounds really smart doesn't it?

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Well, I said it has nothing to do with porn But

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I really I thought I thought I could just defer

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to the internet for the explanation. No such

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thing. Futurism, though, was a movement in like,

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I don't know, maybe the 60s? No, not that far

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back. Further back, sorry. Like in the early

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1900s, futurism was the movement. But I swear,

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within that movement, one artist said he was

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a porn futurist. Or maybe I read it somewhere.

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And it's just so archaic and so cool. And so

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academic the internet can't even find it not

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even chat GPT could tell me what porn futurism

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is So it's about art It's about like it sounds

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like Sounds really hokey. Like everything you'd

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think it is is like just like just going into

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the future like Nice sound really silly It's

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an avant -garde movement And it's about, like,

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just going for it, you know? Hating everything

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old. That's it. Okay. You know, screw traditions.

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I want porn in the future. Everything is about

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for me. I want sex with robots. That's what porn

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future is. Okay. Have you ever heard of it? Anything

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like this, Jay? Never now, but it sounds really

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interesting now. I'm starting a movement. Futurism

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is real though. Futurism is real. I don't know

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if there's anyone in particular that said porn

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futurism. I have a question then for everybody.

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Part of the quick fire round that we have. If

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you have only 10 seconds to respond. If we start

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with Luigi, we'll go to Chase and then finish

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with me. If you had a art exhibition, what would

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you call it? Ten seconds. You have ten seconds.

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Luigi, you're first. Oh, I'm first. I thought

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you were first. Well, then I'd call it porn futurism.

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I'd call it sex with robots. Sex with robots.

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What about you, Chase? It would just be a ripoff

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of... What's that guy's name? Is it Peter Nagel

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or Patrick Nagel, that artist from the 70s? who

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made all those futuristic, sexy robots. Dude,

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just be ripped off with that. That's what it

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is. That's it. Can't be any more creative than

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that. Not in 10 seconds. My brain can't function.

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What about you, Jay? I'm curious. I think for

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me, I would go with something that's, you know,

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probably just more straightforward and simple.

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I call it queer joy, because that's the art in

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my hostel already, is it represents... There

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you go. queer joy, queer identity, so the guests

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can see themselves in the art when they come

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and stay here and they feel represented and seen.

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And it's a way for me to show that I see you,

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I empathize with you, I welcome you. So that's

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the kind of goal of the art in the hostel currently.

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I would call mine lipstick silhouettes. And I

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would just go around putting lipstick on all

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sorts of people and taking like really sensual

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photos of their lips. and printing them out.

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And then it will be like an exploration of identity

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through lipstick. So the art would be like pictures

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of their lips with lipsticks? With lipstick on

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them? Exactly. Yeah. Sometimes it will be like

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bad lips or yeah. That's actually a really good

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idea. I won't be surprised if someone somewhere

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has already done it. But if not. Maybe. Ruby,

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get on that. Just make it happen. Sure. Chase,

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do you have a quickfire question for us before

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we dive into the more meaty stuff? Quickfire

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question. Hmm. So it's funny, actually, we do

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a really cool event every Wednesday called Q

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&A, and I wrote the questions myself. And so

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one of the questions that I find that's always

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interesting is if you were a cent, What would

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I smell when I walk by you? Love it. No, that's

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a great question, because I know what I want

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to smell. I get a lot of abstract answers to

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this question, so it's very interesting what

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people say. What's the weirdest answer you've

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gotten? I think something food -related, like...

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Breakfast or something like that. How is this?

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Like that's not where I was going, but great.

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Baked beans and ketchup. Yeah, it could be. Yeah.

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Pretty strange. Spaghetti and meatballs. That's

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not what I want. I don't want to smell like that.

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No, if, is it what you see? Hey, Italian vibe.

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Right. Now, but okay, is it about what they want

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to smell like or what they think they'd smell

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like? I think that they answer more so in terms

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of what they want people to smell like so what

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they want to give off So yeah, I can I can I

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can talk about my favorite scent I've ever worn

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and that I cannot recapture And it was some lotion

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that I bought from some shop in New York a long,

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long time ago. Because in another life, I was

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selling natural beauty products. And one of the

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scents was of wormwood. And it was the most amazing

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scent to me. And I loved it so much. And they

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discontinued it. And to this day. Like I still

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want that scent and like if I ever found it That's

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all I would ever want to smell like that one

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particular scent of warm wood. So like absent

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is The other like that's what absence made from

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warm wood. So it's got this I don't know how

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to describe this smell Nice, so if anyone's ever

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smelled it, they know It's kind of what? What

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emotion what emotion would I feel? like smelling

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Absent or warm wood like what would I feel when

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I smell that? It's a good question. I can't speak

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for other people, but when I wore it, I just

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felt attractive. The scent makes me attractive.

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I felt like this scent makes me attractive. Makes

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me, you know, seem clean and manly. But it wasn't

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one of those overbearing, like musky man smells.

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Like men often wear perfume that's like musk.

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And like musk, I think, is too strong. I hate

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it. So, like I really like, I feel like men...

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on the topic of scents. Men don't have a lot

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of scents that are like oriented towards like

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fruit and spices like women's and I find those

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scents are a lot more pleasant and smell a lot

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more clean. So like why can't a man, but like

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when a man has to smell, he's got to smell like

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really heavy, like again musk or like woody.

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But the, the absence smell, it was like that,

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but not so much. So, I mean, I would rather smell

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like, you know, eucalyptus and like lemons and

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stuff and oranges and lavender and like jasmine.

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That's another thing. You sound like a yeti sub

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commercial. Do you remember those? Yeah, but

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I know it. They still sell it. Like when I go

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back home in the summer and I'm in the grocery

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store, those Yeti soap bars are still there.

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Every kind of soap maker makes the same sense.

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Like mint, eucalyptus, you know, whatever else.

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So like I guess I kind of defer to mint and eucalyptus

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if I can. Like those are the only kind of light

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scents left for men. But I wish you two could

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smell that. I tend to go to like the stores.

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Okay, so in... And maybe Chase knows this too.

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So there are stores like Marshall's. Do you know

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what Marshall's is? Yeah. Big store that does

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fast fashion, whatever. Everything's sold there.

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So makeup, whatever. And so I go to the section

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with like the makeup and the body creams for

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like the women and I look at their bars and they

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have like, you know. vanilla orange and I just

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smelled it and I'm like, yes, I want to wash

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in this. I don't want to wash in like the manly

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musky soap bars. Fair. My scent, my scent would

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be like orange zest with cinnamon and crushed

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vanilla with just like a hint of freshly cut

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pine. Wow, that's so specific. They're like,

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he's just sitting like, the pine's really nice.

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Yeah. I could talk about scents forever. Now

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I'm just, before today, before I came home, I

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went to a coffee shop to get beans and I wanted

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to get more espresso beans. And then I saw like

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the espresso beans were there. This is espresso.

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And I'm like, I know I need this cause my machine

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is an espresso machine. So I got to get the beans,

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but it said like plum, like sugar plum and. smoked

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vanilla. And I was just thinking like, well,

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if anybody knows what a sugar plum is, it's not

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really a fruit. It's like hard candy. There's

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no scent there. And then the other one was like

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Christmas blend, where it was like, it said spice

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chocolate. And I was like, yeah. But then it

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said, like, I don't know, like pine needles.

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And I was like, that's it. That's the one. Like

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even if it's not espresso, well, it's going through

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my espresso machine. I might hate it, but those

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scents. are what sold me. It's gonna be good,

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yeah. It's gonna be fine. I like pine because

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it makes me feel like it's got that, like...

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The scents I described are fresh and they have

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a homey, like, cottage feel. And that's what

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I like. No, I'm gonna sound really like a bumpkin,

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but do they have pines in South Africa? Yeah,

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of course. I know I don't know what this like

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I think pines. I just think of like the Americas

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Sorry, I'll be back Prove we got a delivery Probably

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they don't they bear they don't really when you

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request something they might take your request

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Otherwise, they're just gonna like bang on your

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door And then say come and get it or they don't

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listen. They're just so rushed to deliver yeah,

00:13:47.019 --> 00:13:49.659
so it's so funny feeling funny how you both answered

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because You guys both answered kind of more literal

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in terms of like an actual scent, but oftentimes

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the responses I get are, I want them to smell

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confidence, or I want them to smell to peel,

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or I want them to smell warmth, you know, like

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more abstract things. Yeah. Well, that's why

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I asked, you know, why people wanted like actual

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scents they wanted to smell like, or what they

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want them to smell. For sure. How do you, but

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how do you smell those, like what does confidence

00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:25.820
smell like? It's something you see. I don't know.

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Walk, walk by me, Luigi, and you'll smell it.

00:14:31.320 --> 00:14:35.139
Pheromones sweat. Yeah. I mean, there really

00:14:35.139 --> 00:14:37.480
is a lot of science behind that, you know, like

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pheromones, like you're attracted to a person's

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pheromones and it's really fascinating in terms

00:14:42.960 --> 00:14:45.259
of just like attraction, you know, like there's

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a whole science behind it. Right. Yeah, and I

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think that's the other thing too perfume can

00:14:52.350 --> 00:14:57.769
kind of like skew that Let's say attraction because

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because if it is all pheromones do the pheromones

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come through, you know shielding them With perfume

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or covering them with perfume and then is that

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like an honest? Assessment or is that a kind

00:15:09.110 --> 00:15:13.480
of like seduction or manipulation? Yeah, and

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that's the funny thing is I feel like the joke

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is on us because we already have natural pheromones

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that attract a mate and So we're actually cutting

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up our natural gift to attract the right person

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and so but I think we've all been conditioned

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to think that you know These scents make us more

00:15:32.059 --> 00:15:34.600
attractive, but really our natural scent is the

00:15:34.600 --> 00:15:37.659
most attractive. Yeah That's a really good point

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I'm not gonna bathe anymore. I've decided Oh

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my god, no. I wouldn't recommend that. I can

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get away with it. You have a naturally nice scent

00:15:50.080 --> 00:15:54.279
when you don't bathe. I always wonder, I always

00:15:54.279 --> 00:15:57.940
wonder, like, do I smell to people? We all have

00:15:57.940 --> 00:16:00.580
our own smells. But, you know, I'm always wondering,

00:16:00.740 --> 00:16:04.039
am I smelly today? What do people think? You

00:16:04.039 --> 00:16:09.960
smell good. Thanks. Thanks, Ruby. I try not to

00:16:09.960 --> 00:16:13.809
smell people. Well, to your mate, you smell irresistible.

00:16:14.009 --> 00:16:17.090
But to your non -mate, your non -soulmate, you

00:16:17.090 --> 00:16:21.210
smell smelly. Yeah, you could look at it like

00:16:21.210 --> 00:16:24.350
that. Like, you know, you could write poems for

00:16:24.350 --> 00:16:26.830
a person that is attracted to you and they'll

00:16:26.830 --> 00:16:28.870
love the poem. And the person that isn't, they'll

00:16:28.870 --> 00:16:31.909
call the cops. There you go, that's all the context.

00:16:36.950 --> 00:16:40.759
That's funny. All right, here we go. Do you have

00:16:40.759 --> 00:16:44.379
a quick -fire question for us? If I did, I forgot

00:16:44.379 --> 00:16:47.759
it. It was just, we just dived into so many interesting

00:16:47.759 --> 00:16:51.240
things. Okay. No, I got to think of one. No idea.

00:16:52.139 --> 00:16:55.320
No, but this scent thing was a good warm -up.

00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:59.360
Fair enough. Glad you enjoyed the question. I

00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:01.259
mean, I could keep talking about it. Yeah, it

00:17:01.259 --> 00:17:02.379
was excellent. Ruby, do you have one? Now you're

00:17:02.379 --> 00:17:04.059
going to have to come back, because I want to

00:17:04.059 --> 00:17:06.220
know every single question you've written down

00:17:06.220 --> 00:17:10.630
for Wednesday. Yeah, there's so many and they're

00:17:10.630 --> 00:17:13.529
really like meant to be just like not normal

00:17:13.529 --> 00:17:16.410
questions just to make people have fun with it

00:17:16.410 --> 00:17:19.490
and be playful and You know, the discussion doesn't

00:17:19.490 --> 00:17:21.869
have to be so serious. And so that's kind of

00:17:21.869 --> 00:17:27.150
the goal Yeah, one of my biggest regrets this

00:17:27.150 --> 00:17:30.329
last time when I went to South Africa, I don't

00:17:30.329 --> 00:17:33.190
regret things right? It's not something it's

00:17:33.190 --> 00:17:36.069
not how I live my life. It's not a mantra I follow

00:17:36.069 --> 00:17:40.160
but I wish I had stayed at SoulFam Hostel longer

00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:43.440
in Cape Town. Yeah, that would have been lovely,

00:17:43.640 --> 00:17:46.740
honestly. And what's great about SoulFam now

00:17:46.740 --> 00:17:49.420
is it's sort of transitioned into a community

00:17:49.420 --> 00:17:52.619
space now. So now, oftentimes, what ends up happening

00:17:52.619 --> 00:17:56.099
is because we're so full, its previous guests

00:17:56.099 --> 00:18:00.119
will ask to come just to hang out, you know?

00:18:00.299 --> 00:18:04.359
And so, kind of my way of just... keeping the

00:18:04.359 --> 00:18:07.119
doors open, even for people who can't stay as

00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:10.339
long and still want to be part of the vibe. Yeah.

00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:12.200
Do you think the guests come to hang out just

00:18:12.200 --> 00:18:15.759
because the place is just so, so amazing? They

00:18:15.759 --> 00:18:18.660
can't afford it. Yeah. That's what I mean. You

00:18:18.660 --> 00:18:21.559
say people come back. Like, I don't want to stay

00:18:21.559 --> 00:18:24.079
the night. I just really like the place. Do you

00:18:24.079 --> 00:18:25.759
sell coffee there? You should just turn it into

00:18:25.759 --> 00:18:28.319
so many things. There must be a coffee shop in

00:18:28.319 --> 00:18:31.099
it. No, there isn't I think honestly what it

00:18:31.099 --> 00:18:34.079
is is they want to stay but because we're sold

00:18:34.079 --> 00:18:36.920
out The next best thing is to just come and hang

00:18:36.920 --> 00:18:39.400
out with the fam but I think it's because they

00:18:39.400 --> 00:18:41.740
honestly really feel connected to the people

00:18:41.740 --> 00:18:45.380
here and so You know when you're a queer traveler

00:18:45.380 --> 00:18:47.660
and you're a solo traveler and you're looking

00:18:47.660 --> 00:18:50.640
for community and you don't you want to just

00:18:50.640 --> 00:18:53.299
have to go to the bars and clubs or use the apps.

00:18:53.619 --> 00:18:55.700
Sometimes it's nice just to go to a space that

00:18:55.700 --> 00:18:58.920
you know is going to be accepting and open and

00:18:58.920 --> 00:19:01.240
you're going to have people who like truly value

00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:03.480
and want to connect with you. So I think that's

00:19:03.480 --> 00:19:07.279
kind of what it's become for people. I was telling

00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:10.980
Luigi before I came on one of the like I was

00:19:10.980 --> 00:19:14.819
blown away searching on on Airbnb for a place

00:19:14.819 --> 00:19:20.329
to stay and I typed in like queer, LGBTQ, and

00:19:20.329 --> 00:19:24.670
suddenly there's this hostile that like unabashedly

00:19:24.670 --> 00:19:29.410
just goes, yes, pro, safe space, chosen family.

00:19:30.210 --> 00:19:35.450
And it was like a no brainer. It made me feel

00:19:35.450 --> 00:19:39.130
so much relief. And then going there and the

00:19:39.130 --> 00:19:43.609
whole vibe was just so welcoming. And Luigi,

00:19:44.390 --> 00:19:49.200
there's like this huge. a horseshoe kitchen and

00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:52.819
it was like one point, I think it was like 12,

00:19:52.839 --> 00:19:57.640
30 a .m. in the morning and all of us were just

00:19:57.640 --> 00:20:01.579
standing there. I was, and just having a chat.

00:20:01.680 --> 00:20:06.359
It was amazing. So I think it represents to me

00:20:06.359 --> 00:20:09.500
what hostels, all hostels want to be. And that's

00:20:09.500 --> 00:20:11.680
awesome. That's beautiful. Thank you for that.

00:20:11.700 --> 00:20:14.559
Yeah, it sounds, it sounds like - Yeah, that's

00:20:14.559 --> 00:20:20.710
my review. I mean, yeah, it sounds great. Right.

00:20:21.009 --> 00:20:24.829
And yeah, I ignorantly said to Ruby like, Oh,

00:20:24.910 --> 00:20:27.329
aren't all hostiles by default? Aren't all places

00:20:27.329 --> 00:20:32.349
by default LGBTQ, you know, like wouldn't they

00:20:32.349 --> 00:20:34.369
just allow them anyway? Why would it be an issue?

00:20:35.210 --> 00:20:40.170
That's my bad cisgender male brain asking these

00:20:40.170 --> 00:20:42.509
questions. No, I think, no, you know what? I

00:20:42.509 --> 00:20:45.779
don't think it's that. I think it's an ally brain

00:20:45.779 --> 00:20:49.579
because because to people who are allies, they

00:20:49.579 --> 00:20:53.240
just don't, it doesn't make sense. Like the exclusion

00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:58.539
doesn't make sense. So. Yeah. And I think, I

00:20:58.539 --> 00:21:02.160
think also too, I think hostiles like by default

00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:05.640
have a diversity policy, meaning that they tolerate.

00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:08.680
people from different backgrounds, but they don't

00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:11.119
necessarily go out of their way to make them

00:21:11.119 --> 00:21:13.279
feel welcome and that they belong. And I think

00:21:13.279 --> 00:21:15.579
that's the difference between diversity and inclusion.

00:21:16.279 --> 00:21:19.400
Yeah, that's a really good point. Yeah, most

00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:22.000
hostels are diverse, but they're not inclusive.

00:21:22.339 --> 00:21:25.829
And so I think... They think that by just simply

00:21:25.829 --> 00:21:28.490
saying that we're LGBTQ friendly, that that makes

00:21:28.490 --> 00:21:31.789
them inclusive. But no, like actually, you know,

00:21:32.009 --> 00:21:34.130
taking time to understand the queer community

00:21:34.130 --> 00:21:36.670
and our needs and taking steps to make us feel

00:21:36.670 --> 00:21:38.670
welcome and creating events that allow people

00:21:38.670 --> 00:21:41.869
to connect, that's inclusion. And so that's kind

00:21:41.869 --> 00:21:44.950
of what we practice here at SoulFam. For sure.

00:21:46.230 --> 00:21:49.056
And I think that's a really good segue into...

00:21:49.049 --> 00:21:52.549
what Kaleidoscope is meant to be, perspectives

00:21:52.549 --> 00:21:57.029
beyond the surface of what we think or see. And

00:21:57.029 --> 00:22:00.970
I would like to invite either one of you to share

00:22:00.970 --> 00:22:03.190
the first perspective. I know Luigi likes to

00:22:03.190 --> 00:22:06.329
go last. Chase, would you like, do you have,

00:22:06.730 --> 00:22:09.589
I have a lot of questions for you, but I'm wondering,

00:22:09.650 --> 00:22:11.190
do you have a perspective that you would like

00:22:11.190 --> 00:22:14.269
to share on Kaleidoscope or would you like me

00:22:14.269 --> 00:22:17.769
to lead? I'm happy for you to lead. Okay. I'll

00:22:17.769 --> 00:22:23.309
start it off. This is the first time in my new

00:22:23.309 --> 00:22:26.690
studio. It's still being unpacked. I've recently

00:22:26.690 --> 00:22:29.750
moved and one of the things that has changed

00:22:29.750 --> 00:22:35.529
for me in this move is realizing that sometimes

00:22:35.529 --> 00:22:39.509
we, and it's crazy that like this made me realize

00:22:39.509 --> 00:22:42.829
it, that sometimes we let things hold us back

00:22:42.829 --> 00:22:47.480
because of what we think we are okay with. and

00:22:47.480 --> 00:22:51.000
people don't go for the thing that they really

00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:53.839
want because they think that they are okay. I

00:22:53.839 --> 00:22:57.079
thought I was okay with my previous apartment

00:22:57.079 --> 00:23:00.480
and it was right next to this main road. The

00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:03.579
move was a disaster. It did not go as planned.

00:23:04.160 --> 00:23:08.440
But now in here, even when everything was a mess

00:23:08.440 --> 00:23:12.460
and before anything was packed out, I felt a

00:23:12.460 --> 00:23:17.819
sense of PTSD from not hearing constant traffic

00:23:17.819 --> 00:23:22.119
noise. And I've been sleeping better, but while

00:23:22.119 --> 00:23:25.720
you were there, my brain just shut it out. So

00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:30.539
that's my perspective. Awareness of your surroundings

00:23:30.539 --> 00:23:36.940
and breaking the Plato's cave, so to speak, of

00:23:36.940 --> 00:23:39.319
exploring other surroundings and going, hey,

00:23:39.420 --> 00:23:43.019
this is better. And then not doing that for yourself

00:23:43.019 --> 00:23:46.660
is a mistake. Always go for what you need. I

00:23:46.660 --> 00:23:53.460
don't know. Always take risks. Yeah. Like push

00:23:53.460 --> 00:23:54.900
yourself to grow. But this wasn't a risk, right?

00:23:54.920 --> 00:23:58.500
Like I didn't take any risks. I just avoided.

00:23:58.500 --> 00:24:01.900
You wanted to change. Yeah. I don't know what

00:24:01.900 --> 00:24:04.220
I did. Yeah. Well, you needed to move and you

00:24:04.220 --> 00:24:07.339
wanted to move. But sometimes we're so comfortable

00:24:07.339 --> 00:24:10.160
or you could say, I'll say this for the sake

00:24:10.160 --> 00:24:14.339
of argument, happy in our misery that. You know

00:24:14.339 --> 00:24:17.519
change is really really tough and stressful and

00:24:17.519 --> 00:24:20.220
overwhelming So even if our lives are bad, this

00:24:20.220 --> 00:24:23.079
is what I hear and I mean, I'm sure I'm probably

00:24:23.079 --> 00:24:25.400
one of these people even if your conditions are

00:24:25.400 --> 00:24:29.140
bad, they're familiar and That's why it's so

00:24:29.140 --> 00:24:31.640
difficult to change because maybe what's out

00:24:31.640 --> 00:24:34.420
there it could be better it but it could be worse

00:24:34.420 --> 00:24:37.140
and Maybe that's why people don't want to take

00:24:37.140 --> 00:24:38.880
the risk. But I think it's more just they're

00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:43.700
just so comfortable with you know, what's familiar.

00:24:44.960 --> 00:24:47.339
You know, they say people are creatures of habit.

00:24:47.559 --> 00:24:50.160
So that's why it's so difficult to change. I

00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:53.240
mean, there's just so much knowledge on this

00:24:53.240 --> 00:24:57.279
subject, but I find it interesting that you were

00:24:57.279 --> 00:25:01.799
affected by the lack of traffic. Maybe it became

00:25:01.799 --> 00:25:03.859
like a kind of white noise for you. I was telling

00:25:03.859 --> 00:25:08.440
someone today that when I wake up in the morning,

00:25:08.579 --> 00:25:11.359
like I remember my last apartment, it was just

00:25:11.289 --> 00:25:14.329
dead quiet. And I loved waking up in the morning

00:25:14.329 --> 00:25:16.769
to just silence. And now, when I came here, I

00:25:16.769 --> 00:25:18.930
was dreading all the traffic. And when I wake

00:25:18.930 --> 00:25:23.569
up in the morning, I can hear the tram. And it's

00:25:23.569 --> 00:25:26.650
this like hum. But that's like white noise now

00:25:26.650 --> 00:25:31.269
that I look forward to in the morning. So, yeah,

00:25:31.289 --> 00:25:35.450
we freak ourselves out. But then, when the change

00:25:35.450 --> 00:25:38.430
happens, it was interesting how we adapt and

00:25:38.430 --> 00:25:42.319
maybe it's not as bad as we. I think a tram is

00:25:42.319 --> 00:25:45.779
more predictable, though. A tram's noise is more

00:25:45.779 --> 00:25:49.200
predictable and kind of soothing. Yeah, well,

00:25:49.859 --> 00:25:52.900
yeah, absolutely. That's for sure. But traffic,

00:25:53.079 --> 00:25:56.619
just like what? What about you, Chase? Like,

00:25:56.619 --> 00:26:00.839
I'm not sure exactly if I may be so bold. Like,

00:26:00.900 --> 00:26:04.599
I remember you telling me a story about getting

00:26:04.599 --> 00:26:08.150
kind of stuck in Cape Town. and then making the

00:26:08.150 --> 00:26:13.190
choice to move and start this awesome hostel.

00:26:15.609 --> 00:26:21.509
What was that like for you? Yeah, no, it's interesting

00:26:21.509 --> 00:26:25.250
because I think I, and this kind of ties into

00:26:25.250 --> 00:26:27.750
what you were saying earlier about like not going

00:26:27.750 --> 00:26:32.269
after what you want. So I think, you know, I

00:26:32.269 --> 00:26:35.130
knew that I wanted to be in hospitality probably

00:26:35.130 --> 00:26:38.480
two decades ago. But I think what held me back

00:26:38.480 --> 00:26:41.839
was this, like, lack of confidence and, like,

00:26:41.900 --> 00:26:44.619
fear of failure. And I think that that becomes

00:26:44.619 --> 00:26:47.640
sort of stifling for a lot of people in terms

00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:50.359
of just going after their dreams, trying to pursue

00:26:50.359 --> 00:26:53.779
what makes them happy. And so, so I think for

00:26:53.779 --> 00:26:56.480
me, last year, I just made the decision to just

00:26:56.480 --> 00:27:00.160
get out of my own way and just stop making excuses

00:27:00.160 --> 00:27:04.160
for not doing what I know I love to do and not

00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:08.109
living my purpose. And, you know, when you find

00:27:08.109 --> 00:27:09.970
your purpose, you're gonna feel it in your bones,

00:27:10.069 --> 00:27:11.970
you're gonna feel it in your soul that this is

00:27:11.970 --> 00:27:15.829
what you're meant to do. I think now that I've,

00:27:15.829 --> 00:27:18.150
you know, finally made the decision to go on

00:27:18.150 --> 00:27:21.750
this journey and to go for it knowing that there's

00:27:21.750 --> 00:27:24.950
very few spaces like this that I can even speak

00:27:24.950 --> 00:27:26.990
to someone else about in terms of like, well,

00:27:26.990 --> 00:27:29.789
how was your journey? How did you create a space

00:27:29.789 --> 00:27:31.869
like this? You know, I kind of had to just sort

00:27:31.869 --> 00:27:35.319
of stay in my lane and just... do what I felt

00:27:35.319 --> 00:27:38.079
like queer community wanted and what would sort

00:27:38.079 --> 00:27:40.099
of benefit them. And I just followed my heart

00:27:40.099 --> 00:27:43.980
and my intuition and my gut. And it's a very

00:27:43.980 --> 00:27:47.259
liberating experience when you take the risk,

00:27:47.420 --> 00:27:50.880
you take the leap of faith, and you just go for

00:27:50.880 --> 00:27:54.720
it. And you don't worry about the outcome. You

00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:59.940
just stay present and stay passionate and curious.

00:28:00.640 --> 00:28:03.779
Um, so for me, it's, this year has probably been

00:28:03.779 --> 00:28:08.799
the most, um, I guess, revelatory year for me

00:28:08.799 --> 00:28:12.480
in terms of just my resilience and my ability

00:28:12.480 --> 00:28:19.019
to just, you know, take huge risk. So, um, yeah,

00:28:19.019 --> 00:28:23.900
so I think, um, I really sort of reflect and

00:28:23.900 --> 00:28:26.640
think about like how the world would be if people

00:28:26.640 --> 00:28:30.819
just got out of their own way and just did. the

00:28:30.819 --> 00:28:32.660
things that their hearts were telling them to

00:28:32.660 --> 00:28:36.240
do. I think that people would feel much more

00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:39.500
fulfilled and find a much deeper sense of happiness

00:28:39.500 --> 00:28:45.500
and purpose in their lives. Yeah. Can I ask a

00:28:45.500 --> 00:28:48.880
question? Ruby, can I ask a question? This might

00:28:48.880 --> 00:28:51.940
sound, I don't know, this might sound silly.

00:28:51.980 --> 00:28:55.000
You might think that's a dumb question, but so

00:28:55.000 --> 00:28:58.680
why South Africa? Were you just passing through?

00:28:59.410 --> 00:29:02.710
No, so I actually discovered South Africa 15

00:29:02.710 --> 00:29:05.670
years ago. I studied abroad here when I was a

00:29:05.670 --> 00:29:08.670
junior in college. And so it was the first country

00:29:08.670 --> 00:29:12.289
I went to outside of the states and it just,

00:29:12.289 --> 00:29:15.650
it made a huge impact on me. And so that's kind

00:29:15.650 --> 00:29:18.390
of what started this whole journey was that sort

00:29:18.390 --> 00:29:22.630
of moment in my college experience. And then,

00:29:22.650 --> 00:29:25.240
and then like I said, it took, it took up until

00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:28.319
now, for me to finally execute a dream that I

00:29:28.319 --> 00:29:33.440
had many, many years ago. Wow. I didn't expect

00:29:33.440 --> 00:29:41.299
such a well -thought -out decision for the place.

00:29:41.819 --> 00:29:45.740
Because for me, listen, I didn't even know South

00:29:45.740 --> 00:29:47.740
Africa was a place until I started living and

00:29:47.740 --> 00:29:49.799
working in China and interacting with South Africans.

00:29:50.019 --> 00:29:53.599
That's how inexperienced I am, but from what...

00:29:53.579 --> 00:29:56.980
I've learned about it from Ruby, it is, it's

00:29:56.980 --> 00:30:00.980
just like a really, in terms of LGBTQ +, it's

00:30:00.980 --> 00:30:06.420
a really tough place. But again, I could be wrong.

00:30:07.680 --> 00:30:09.900
I mean - It depends on where you are for sure.

00:30:10.119 --> 00:30:14.819
Yeah. And so to do what you're doing, like super

00:30:14.819 --> 00:30:18.339
brave, super admirable, I think. So like, I'm

00:30:18.339 --> 00:30:21.039
just wondering, were you, so, and your hostel

00:30:21.039 --> 00:30:25.359
is the first of its kind. So was that an idea

00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:28.880
that just came to you or were there other hostels

00:30:28.880 --> 00:30:32.359
in other parts of the world that did that? Again,

00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:37.000
I'm not very well traveled. I don't know. Yeah,

00:30:37.039 --> 00:30:39.039
so I think it was a combination of things. I

00:30:39.039 --> 00:30:41.900
think I lived as a digital nomad for seven years

00:30:41.900 --> 00:30:45.819
and so I was constantly, you know, moving from

00:30:45.819 --> 00:30:48.589
country to country. two months here, three months

00:30:48.589 --> 00:30:50.849
there, two months there. And what I realized

00:30:50.849 --> 00:30:54.849
during that whole journey is how difficult it

00:30:54.849 --> 00:30:57.890
was to find community as a queer traveler. And

00:30:57.890 --> 00:31:01.450
so for me, it kind of came from my lived experience.

00:31:01.950 --> 00:31:04.329
I'm like, okay, if I'm experiencing this as a

00:31:04.329 --> 00:31:06.089
queer traveler, I'm sure there's other travelers

00:31:06.089 --> 00:31:11.369
as well who find it very difficult to meet people

00:31:11.369 --> 00:31:15.269
and to connect beyond the kind of typical venues

00:31:15.269 --> 00:31:18.720
that we're you know, having to subscribe to,

00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:20.680
which is, you know, bars and apps and things

00:31:20.680 --> 00:31:24.720
of that nature. So that was part of it. The other

00:31:24.720 --> 00:31:28.940
part was that I did discover a town very near

00:31:28.940 --> 00:31:31.119
and near to my heart in Mexico called Zipolite.

00:31:31.380 --> 00:31:34.759
And it's a very interesting place. It's very,

00:31:34.759 --> 00:31:38.720
very queer, very bohemian, nudist kind of vibes.

00:31:38.839 --> 00:31:41.839
And I remember staying in a hostel or like a

00:31:41.839 --> 00:31:45.220
kind of a guest house hostel kind of hybrid place.

00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:48.619
And it was for queer. It was for queer people.

00:31:49.920 --> 00:31:53.059
And it was the first time that I had experienced

00:31:53.059 --> 00:31:56.740
being in an environment that felt like chosen

00:31:56.740 --> 00:32:00.099
family. Like I felt like I effortlessly made

00:32:00.099 --> 00:32:02.759
friends in that environment. I met people who

00:32:02.759 --> 00:32:05.500
were like -minded and shared my sort of energy

00:32:05.500 --> 00:32:09.230
and vibe. And so that was kind of one of my initial

00:32:09.230 --> 00:32:12.269
inspirations, was just experiencing that kind

00:32:12.269 --> 00:32:14.130
of environment. I was like, oh, wow, I would

00:32:14.130 --> 00:32:17.630
love to recreate this type of environment in

00:32:17.630 --> 00:32:22.430
K -Town. So, it was very cool. What was the scariest

00:32:22.430 --> 00:32:25.130
part for you? Like making that decision, going

00:32:25.130 --> 00:32:28.990
from, it's LA, right? Well, I moved to Washington

00:32:28.990 --> 00:32:32.509
DC, but I'm originally from Los Angeles. Yeah.

00:32:32.609 --> 00:32:36.910
Ah, okay. Okay, so... the scariest part about

00:32:36.910 --> 00:32:40.589
going to Cape Town, because I have to admit,

00:32:41.269 --> 00:32:45.009
from the perspective of a South African, and

00:32:45.009 --> 00:32:48.910
that's changed drastically in the past couple

00:32:48.910 --> 00:32:51.809
of years, to the point of another story that

00:32:51.809 --> 00:32:55.109
I would like to share in a little bit. But I

00:32:55.109 --> 00:32:59.589
would never have been able to conceive of someone

00:32:59.589 --> 00:33:04.099
coming from a country that is more financially

00:33:04.099 --> 00:33:08.039
stable and developed to move to South Africa.

00:33:08.180 --> 00:33:13.660
Now, I can definitely see why and how. But what

00:33:13.660 --> 00:33:17.920
was that for you? Yeah, no, it's a good question.

00:33:18.640 --> 00:33:21.839
I think for me, that early experience study abroad

00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:25.380
in Cape Town, what it taught me was that it's

00:33:25.380 --> 00:33:30.579
important to provide, provide spaces like especially

00:33:30.579 --> 00:33:33.900
for queer people, where there's lacking. I think

00:33:33.900 --> 00:33:36.819
US and Europe has tons of infrastructure for

00:33:36.819 --> 00:33:40.500
queer people. There's tons of hotels, bars, you

00:33:40.500 --> 00:33:43.299
name it, organizations, meetups. And so for me,

00:33:43.359 --> 00:33:45.799
I've always been drawn to places that didn't

00:33:45.799 --> 00:33:49.599
have resources or that lack infrastructure. Because

00:33:49.599 --> 00:33:51.920
then it's like you're building, you're creating,

00:33:52.140 --> 00:33:55.480
you're expanding. you're not just adding to like

00:33:55.480 --> 00:33:58.279
the noise that's already there. And so for me,

00:33:58.279 --> 00:34:00.460
I think it's just more exciting of a journey

00:34:00.460 --> 00:34:04.259
to challenge yourself and to, you know, to create

00:34:04.259 --> 00:34:07.380
something that, you know, doesn't exist in a

00:34:07.380 --> 00:34:11.099
particular location rather than, you know, just

00:34:11.099 --> 00:34:13.760
being another bar or another hotel or another

00:34:13.760 --> 00:34:16.659
whatever in a queer friendly place, you know,

00:34:16.699 --> 00:34:21.000
so. So that's kind of the thing. Yeah, I think

00:34:21.000 --> 00:34:24.679
it's a great feeling to blaze trails. For sure.

00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:27.719
I could see why you do it. Yeah, absolutely.

00:34:28.059 --> 00:34:31.760
Kaleidoscope has a... Has a what? Go ahead, Rui.

00:34:31.760 --> 00:34:36.179
Has a five -year plan, Chase. Does it? Yeah,

00:34:36.300 --> 00:34:39.260
I would like for Kaleidoscope to become part

00:34:39.260 --> 00:34:43.099
of your weekly process at SoulFam because in

00:34:43.099 --> 00:34:46.460
the next five years, we want to open a bar in

00:34:46.460 --> 00:34:51.360
Cape Town for comedy events and art and live

00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:55.269
podcast recordings here. That'd be amazing. That's

00:34:55.269 --> 00:35:01.550
so cool. To do that, I've registered it. It's

00:35:01.550 --> 00:35:03.789
going to be a brand house, but we're starting

00:35:03.789 --> 00:35:05.849
with Ember Jewelry and it's going to be selling

00:35:05.849 --> 00:35:10.150
queer jewelry in South Africa and growing from

00:35:10.150 --> 00:35:14.989
there. That's beautiful. I love that you're going

00:35:14.989 --> 00:35:20.730
on that journey. It's not for the faint at heart,

00:35:20.969 --> 00:35:23.650
you know, is what I always tell, you know, people

00:35:23.650 --> 00:35:26.150
who go on this entrepreneurial journey because

00:35:26.150 --> 00:35:29.309
it's just filled with so many ups and downs and

00:35:29.309 --> 00:35:33.849
surprises. But at the end of the day, it's what's

00:35:33.849 --> 00:35:37.849
exciting, you know, to experience that. Chase,

00:35:38.269 --> 00:35:44.110
ever have any, like, was there ever any people

00:35:44.110 --> 00:35:47.130
who antagonized you when you decided to do this?

00:35:48.030 --> 00:35:50.789
You know, everyone's already supportive. Yeah.

00:35:51.610 --> 00:35:54.289
Oh, yeah. No, I get it all the time, actually.

00:35:54.429 --> 00:35:57.730
So, it's interesting. So, a story that I don't

00:35:57.730 --> 00:36:01.710
often tell people is that when I first started

00:36:01.710 --> 00:36:04.769
SoulFam, I actually found a location for the

00:36:04.769 --> 00:36:07.210
hostel in a neighborhood in Cape Town called

00:36:07.210 --> 00:36:12.630
Boca, which I'm sure Ray or Ruby knows that it's

00:36:12.630 --> 00:36:15.170
quite conservative. It's actually the Muslim

00:36:15.170 --> 00:36:18.420
neighborhood in Cape Town. And... Wow. I naively

00:36:18.420 --> 00:36:21.460
thought, well, of course, you know, even though

00:36:21.460 --> 00:36:24.039
it's a conservative area, I thought of Cape Town

00:36:24.039 --> 00:36:27.920
as this, you know, oasis of progression in Africa.

00:36:27.980 --> 00:36:30.699
And so I didn't even think much of it. And so

00:36:30.699 --> 00:36:33.239
when I found the property and I signed the lease

00:36:33.239 --> 00:36:35.900
and I decided to, you know, open the hostel,

00:36:36.019 --> 00:36:39.260
I actually got contacted by an influencer, local

00:36:39.260 --> 00:36:42.219
influencer in Cape Town. And we created a post

00:36:42.219 --> 00:36:45.380
on social media. And because he has such a huge

00:36:45.380 --> 00:36:49.070
following, the postman viral, and it got back

00:36:49.070 --> 00:36:51.690
to the local community that I was creating this

00:36:51.690 --> 00:36:54.510
LGBTQ plus inclusive hostel. And there was a

00:36:54.510 --> 00:36:57.849
huge backlash against it. Basically, just to

00:36:57.849 --> 00:37:00.409
make a long story short, the landlords canceled

00:37:00.409 --> 00:37:03.349
my lease and forced me out of the property. The

00:37:03.349 --> 00:37:05.889
landlord also got death threats and just all

00:37:05.889 --> 00:37:10.190
kinds of hate for even allowing me to occupy

00:37:10.190 --> 00:37:13.780
that space. And it was just very clear from the

00:37:13.780 --> 00:37:16.320
local community that they did not want us there.

00:37:17.599 --> 00:37:21.300
So I decided to take the high road and, you know,

00:37:21.500 --> 00:37:23.619
I kind of bowed out gracefully and it actually

00:37:23.619 --> 00:37:25.639
worked out in the end because I felt the location

00:37:25.639 --> 00:37:29.760
that we have now is a hundred times better and

00:37:29.760 --> 00:37:34.699
way more safe, way more inclusive. But yeah,

00:37:34.699 --> 00:37:36.900
but also when I post on social media, I get all

00:37:36.900 --> 00:37:39.659
kinds of, you know, comments about, you know,

00:37:39.860 --> 00:37:42.690
ignorant comments about this being a sex house

00:37:42.690 --> 00:37:46.289
or this being a brothel, because people automatically

00:37:46.289 --> 00:37:52.570
assume anything queer is sex related. But like

00:37:52.570 --> 00:37:57.389
I said, I think it doesn't really phase me. I

00:37:57.389 --> 00:38:02.030
know that people speak from their own ignorance,

00:38:02.130 --> 00:38:06.510
and so I don't take it personal. And to be in

00:38:06.510 --> 00:38:08.769
this kind of business, you have to have tough

00:38:08.769 --> 00:38:13.150
skins. You just let people be where they are.

00:38:15.050 --> 00:38:18.349
So yeah, that was kind of my initial experience.

00:38:18.409 --> 00:38:20.889
But now it's a lot, I would say, not a lot of

00:38:20.889 --> 00:38:25.789
hate really. It's such an odd thing for me because

00:38:25.789 --> 00:38:32.369
I am unabashedly a sexual being. But at the same

00:38:32.369 --> 00:38:36.010
time, I'm also just a human and queer and also

00:38:36.010 --> 00:38:39.429
a teacher. So all of these things can combine

00:38:39.429 --> 00:38:47.329
and be easily compartmentalized. Adults are humans,

00:38:47.710 --> 00:38:50.550
are sexual beings, right? And this is something

00:38:50.550 --> 00:38:54.670
that we all do and for us to have frank discussions.

00:38:57.260 --> 00:39:01.000
don't really like to mix the term normalized

00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:04.900
into this because it sets people that are ignorant

00:39:04.900 --> 00:39:10.139
and phobic off on a tangent of kids are being

00:39:10.139 --> 00:39:14.320
evolved or whatever. And it's just wild to me

00:39:14.320 --> 00:39:17.679
that it always goes there. It always goes to

00:39:17.679 --> 00:39:24.550
the worst kind of imaginative. BS about what

00:39:24.550 --> 00:39:27.670
might happen behind something that closed doors

00:39:27.670 --> 00:39:31.929
where people have no idea. Yeah. Absolutely.

00:39:32.130 --> 00:39:34.030
And I think it just reveals where people are

00:39:34.030 --> 00:39:37.469
at just mentally in terms of what they think

00:39:37.469 --> 00:39:42.170
about our community, in terms of, you know, preconceived

00:39:42.170 --> 00:39:45.110
notions they have about queer people and our

00:39:45.110 --> 00:39:48.230
culture. And I mean, just the other day, there

00:39:48.230 --> 00:39:52.760
was a guy who came by the hostel and I didn't

00:39:52.760 --> 00:39:54.559
think anything of it. People come by the hostel

00:39:54.559 --> 00:39:56.639
all the time asking for tours because they're

00:39:56.639 --> 00:39:58.480
curious, you know, because we're a new hostel.

00:39:58.719 --> 00:40:02.360
And it's turned out that his whole intention

00:40:02.360 --> 00:40:06.159
was to find a hookup at my hostel. He was married

00:40:06.159 --> 00:40:09.840
to a woman and then he was trying to find someone

00:40:09.840 --> 00:40:13.219
here that he could, you know, have some fun with.

00:40:14.039 --> 00:40:17.099
So again, I think it's just people's reptilian

00:40:17.099 --> 00:40:22.170
brain when it comes to queer. Yeah, it always

00:40:22.170 --> 00:40:25.909
goes to like the lowest common denominator And

00:40:25.909 --> 00:40:28.309
they never sort of acknowledge or realize that

00:40:28.309 --> 00:40:30.190
what we're doing is so much bigger than that

00:40:30.190 --> 00:40:32.869
Not that there's anything wrong with sex or any

00:40:32.869 --> 00:40:36.530
of that But it's just it's just not the foundation

00:40:36.530 --> 00:40:38.869
of soul fam, and it's not the most important

00:40:38.869 --> 00:40:43.590
thing about our mission Right, of course Yeah,

00:40:43.630 --> 00:40:46.949
I listen I don't I hate I hate to pry but for

00:40:46.949 --> 00:40:50.559
the sake of entertainment. How did that man or

00:40:50.559 --> 00:40:53.820
person find out like how did he come in and then

00:40:53.820 --> 00:40:56.119
realize oh that doesn't happen here. I mean I

00:40:56.119 --> 00:40:57.840
think it's good he had that experience because

00:40:57.840 --> 00:41:02.480
then if anything he might tell someone like the

00:41:02.480 --> 00:41:05.679
world might know that isn't what happens at that

00:41:05.679 --> 00:41:09.119
place and it's better than someone never coming

00:41:09.119 --> 00:41:14.159
and and not having the experience I think but

00:41:14.159 --> 00:41:18.579
anyway. Yeah. How did he figure it out? He could

00:41:18.579 --> 00:41:21.599
not have explicitly asked. Well, I guess he could

00:41:21.599 --> 00:41:25.460
have, but I can't imagine he did. Yeah, so he

00:41:25.460 --> 00:41:28.340
actually was pretty explicit. And so what ended

00:41:28.340 --> 00:41:33.659
up happening, yeah, is... So it turned out, yeah,

00:41:33.719 --> 00:41:35.619
like, so he wanted a tour. And so, of course,

00:41:35.719 --> 00:41:37.480
I asked one of my staff, like, do you mind just

00:41:37.480 --> 00:41:40.239
kind of showing him around? And then I guess

00:41:40.239 --> 00:41:43.440
he pulled him... one of my staff into a private

00:41:43.440 --> 00:41:46.079
conversation and asked him point blank, like,

00:41:46.500 --> 00:41:49.079
how do you feel about giving me oral right now?

00:41:50.460 --> 00:41:53.460
You know? Okay. Or even saying like, you know,

00:41:53.460 --> 00:41:56.559
I find you attractive. Like, you know, can we

00:41:56.559 --> 00:41:59.659
can we do something? You know, like it was that

00:41:59.659 --> 00:42:02.980
explicit and that direct. And so I think seeing

00:42:02.980 --> 00:42:06.559
the shock on my staff's face, I think quickly

00:42:06.559 --> 00:42:09.590
made him understand that he was definitely in

00:42:09.590 --> 00:42:12.309
the wrong place and that we're not about that

00:42:12.309 --> 00:42:15.130
here. And so, but sometimes, like I said, you

00:42:15.130 --> 00:42:18.289
know, you'd be surprised at the things that people

00:42:18.289 --> 00:42:21.489
say or think or how they behave when they don't

00:42:21.489 --> 00:42:24.230
have an understanding of, you know, the queer

00:42:24.230 --> 00:42:27.489
community. Absolutely. I think it also speaks

00:42:27.489 --> 00:42:32.809
to like, it's symptomatic of a greater... problem

00:42:32.809 --> 00:42:36.269
too is this kind of, I don't know, puritanism,

00:42:36.469 --> 00:42:40.010
prudishness, like people aren't free to be themselves.

00:42:40.010 --> 00:42:43.690
So they have to go and seek out these kinds of

00:42:43.690 --> 00:42:46.610
trysts. Whereas if we lived in a world where

00:42:46.610 --> 00:42:49.190
everyone was truly tolerant, it wouldn't be so

00:42:49.190 --> 00:42:50.809
much of an issue to be understood. You know,

00:42:50.929 --> 00:42:56.849
it is, it's human nature. Yeah. That's also interesting

00:42:56.849 --> 00:42:59.289
for me for someone like that, like this, this

00:42:59.289 --> 00:43:03.489
married man who obviously doesn't want to leave

00:43:03.489 --> 00:43:08.670
his wife, but wants to experience whatever, you

00:43:08.670 --> 00:43:13.630
know, sex with a different person. This is a

00:43:13.630 --> 00:43:24.349
man who is clearly or probably polyamorous. There's

00:43:24.349 --> 00:43:27.070
a world in which he doesn't have to leave his

00:43:27.070 --> 00:43:29.489
wife He can be completely honest and open with

00:43:29.489 --> 00:43:32.130
her the way that he should be and he can do what

00:43:32.130 --> 00:43:37.329
he wants Right, but he can't be himself. So he

00:43:37.329 --> 00:43:42.750
does this and it's so much more toxic Yeah Absolutely.

00:43:43.550 --> 00:43:45.829
Yeah, and I think I think what you're both what

00:43:45.829 --> 00:43:48.389
you both are saying is so important because it's

00:43:48.389 --> 00:43:51.429
like you're seeing in real time societal conditioning

00:43:51.429 --> 00:43:54.699
and how it creates sort of deviant behaviors

00:43:54.699 --> 00:43:57.239
in people. Because they don't feel free to be

00:43:57.239 --> 00:43:59.880
who they are, it creates this sort of extreme

00:43:59.880 --> 00:44:02.820
where now they're creating situations that make

00:44:02.820 --> 00:44:05.099
other people feel uncomfortable because they

00:44:05.099 --> 00:44:08.800
don't feel comfortable with themselves. And the

00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:12.139
reality is, like you said, Ruby, is that there

00:44:12.139 --> 00:44:15.559
is a world where you can be who you are. If you're

00:44:15.559 --> 00:44:18.619
a polyamorous person or you're attracted to both

00:44:18.619 --> 00:44:22.860
genders, you can do that. But societal conditioning

00:44:22.860 --> 00:44:26.480
tells him that he can't and that he has to, you

00:44:26.480 --> 00:44:30.280
know, attain this facade of being this straight

00:44:30.280 --> 00:44:34.860
cisgender male married to a woman because society

00:44:34.860 --> 00:44:38.179
will reject him and he won't be able to live

00:44:38.179 --> 00:44:40.840
openly the way that he wants to. So for me, it

00:44:40.840 --> 00:44:45.199
was like seeing that scene yesterday, yeah, it

00:44:45.199 --> 00:44:48.380
made me quite sad that in 2025, we still have

00:44:48.380 --> 00:44:51.539
people... who are living a double life and not

00:44:51.539 --> 00:44:55.019
living their truth out of fear of what society

00:44:55.019 --> 00:44:59.820
will think. Yeah. And maybe that's part of why

00:44:59.820 --> 00:45:04.280
the LGBTQ community gets conflated with... Okay,

00:45:04.739 --> 00:45:09.119
there is the problem of sex work from a space

00:45:09.119 --> 00:45:14.179
of desperation or the best way to make money

00:45:14.179 --> 00:45:20.090
safely or whatever exists. But we as a community

00:45:20.090 --> 00:45:24.429
also get conflated with these sexual tropes and

00:45:24.429 --> 00:45:28.889
misconceptions because we are free to be ourselves

00:45:28.889 --> 00:45:31.869
and because other people are not. I've read a

00:45:31.869 --> 00:45:35.369
few times that people who say being gay or being

00:45:35.369 --> 00:45:37.730
trans or being whatever is a choice is because

00:45:37.730 --> 00:45:40.849
they are choosing to be straight. Like, it's

00:45:40.849 --> 00:45:44.590
not a choice. You are what you are, right? Absolutely.

00:45:45.190 --> 00:45:48.710
I totally agree. Yeah, and I think Yeah, I think

00:45:48.710 --> 00:45:52.170
you're onto something there because I feel like

00:45:52.170 --> 00:45:55.610
part of the hate or the aggression that we get

00:45:55.610 --> 00:45:58.909
is because they resent us for the fact that we're

00:45:58.909 --> 00:46:01.690
so liberated when it comes to our sexuality.

00:46:01.809 --> 00:46:04.690
And they wish that they had that same liberation

00:46:04.690 --> 00:46:08.309
within them rather than having to, you know,

00:46:08.309 --> 00:46:11.210
in their minds do the thing that everyone expects

00:46:11.210 --> 00:46:14.429
them to do. But because we don't have those same

00:46:14.429 --> 00:46:18.099
boundaries, it's like we're now being labeled

00:46:18.099 --> 00:46:22.039
the enemy, you know, because they, we get to

00:46:22.039 --> 00:46:24.000
live the life that they wish that they could,

00:46:24.480 --> 00:46:27.239
which is unapologetically ourselves. They want

00:46:27.239 --> 00:46:28.559
that. They want that. You're right. They're,

00:46:28.980 --> 00:46:30.880
well, I can only assume, but it's like they're

00:46:30.880 --> 00:46:33.159
denying themselves something and it's that bravery

00:46:33.159 --> 00:46:36.539
that they envy. So the next best thing is to

00:46:36.539 --> 00:46:39.619
stop you from doing it so they can say to themselves

00:46:39.619 --> 00:46:42.139
or assure themselves they were right all along.

00:46:43.039 --> 00:46:45.500
And then they don't have to. They don't have

00:46:45.500 --> 00:46:50.239
to. like fix themselves or take care and be accountable.

00:46:51.300 --> 00:46:54.380
And then there's a factor of we're talking about

00:46:54.380 --> 00:46:57.820
they, they, they. Of course, not all non -queer

00:46:57.820 --> 00:47:01.219
people are they, like allies are definitely,

00:47:01.400 --> 00:47:06.159
even though LGBTQIA doesn't explicitly include

00:47:06.159 --> 00:47:08.840
allies, they are part of the community, right?

00:47:08.840 --> 00:47:12.119
Because they are the ones who are being themselves

00:47:12.119 --> 00:47:16.460
and they're just straight and that's fine. Yeah.

00:47:18.059 --> 00:47:20.960
Absolutely. No, I totally agree. And that was

00:47:20.960 --> 00:47:25.400
one of the surprises with Soul Fam was the overwhelming

00:47:25.400 --> 00:47:28.500
number of guests that are non -queer that stay

00:47:28.500 --> 00:47:33.079
here. You know, I did not expect when I, you

00:47:33.079 --> 00:47:35.260
know, because I was, as you know, I'm very explicit

00:47:35.260 --> 00:47:38.079
in my branding and marketing that this is an

00:47:38.079 --> 00:47:42.219
LGBTQ plus inclusive space. So I thought automatically

00:47:42.219 --> 00:47:45.820
that that would just turn off. non -clear people.

00:47:46.599 --> 00:47:49.619
But in actuality, it's the opposite is true,

00:47:50.300 --> 00:47:53.519
that people actually like being a part of a space

00:47:53.519 --> 00:47:57.179
that is inclusive and celebrates diversity and

00:47:57.179 --> 00:48:00.440
doesn't judge people based on how they identify.

00:48:00.739 --> 00:48:04.280
So that was, so it shows that society is craving

00:48:04.280 --> 00:48:07.239
this, like they have an appetite for this type

00:48:07.239 --> 00:48:11.579
of space, but I think because it's not as ubiquitous

00:48:11.579 --> 00:48:14.219
quite yet, it still is something that's very

00:48:14.219 --> 00:48:20.199
niche and not as common. But I think people subconsciously

00:48:20.199 --> 00:48:22.679
want to be a part of a society that is inclusive

00:48:22.679 --> 00:48:25.219
and doesn't discriminate or separate people.

00:48:26.400 --> 00:48:29.000
Yeah. I think you're not giving yourself enough

00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:32.179
credit, Chase. I think people also come because

00:48:32.179 --> 00:48:35.920
you've made... Like a really dope hostile because

00:48:35.920 --> 00:48:37.760
I went online and I looked at the website and

00:48:37.760 --> 00:48:41.599
I thought damn this place looks nice Better than

00:48:41.599 --> 00:48:47.860
my apartment Like again like what Ruby says is

00:48:47.860 --> 00:48:49.500
like if you're taller and you're tolerant So

00:48:49.500 --> 00:48:51.619
it's like doesn't even register like who cares

00:48:51.619 --> 00:48:55.000
if someone's queer So like you don't care if

00:48:55.000 --> 00:48:56.760
there's like I mean I can go to a hotel and there's

00:48:56.760 --> 00:48:59.719
people that are queer I don't know So, you know

00:48:59.719 --> 00:49:02.219
when I see a nice place and I can afford it.

00:49:02.219 --> 00:49:05.739
Oh, I'm there Yeah. And I think funny enough,

00:49:05.920 --> 00:49:08.800
Luigi, I really feel like you just highlighted

00:49:08.800 --> 00:49:11.500
a lot of people's mindsets when they book. It

00:49:11.500 --> 00:49:14.059
really is not that deep. It's just very much

00:49:14.059 --> 00:49:17.280
like, oh, nice place. I can afford it. Let's

00:49:17.280 --> 00:49:19.280
go for it. Like they're probably not even reading

00:49:19.280 --> 00:49:22.780
into the fact like the LGBTQ plus mission. None

00:49:22.780 --> 00:49:24.519
of that. Like that doesn't even register. And

00:49:24.519 --> 00:49:27.619
that's why some people come here, not even realizing

00:49:27.619 --> 00:49:30.360
they booked a queer inclusive space. Oh yeah.

00:49:30.420 --> 00:49:35.630
Yeah. Definitely could be. It's just weird to

00:49:35.630 --> 00:49:39.190
think, you know, there are people who think there's

00:49:39.190 --> 00:49:41.210
just some queer person lurking in the shadows

00:49:41.210 --> 00:49:43.349
ready to, like, hit on them so they don't want

00:49:43.349 --> 00:49:47.889
to go somewhere. It's just so silly to me. Like,

00:49:47.889 --> 00:49:50.550
we have no soul control. Like, we just have to,

00:49:50.550 --> 00:49:53.170
like... Yeah, I'm ready. Let's go. ...be fucking

00:49:53.170 --> 00:49:56.710
physically attractive. Yeah, and, like, that

00:49:56.710 --> 00:50:00.150
cliché, like, I mean, there's so much, like...

00:50:00.710 --> 00:50:03.929
So much in art and it sounds bad to say that

00:50:03.929 --> 00:50:06.849
but there's just so much in art and when I say

00:50:06.849 --> 00:50:09.289
art I mean like literature and whatever else

00:50:09.289 --> 00:50:13.849
of this trope of the queer person being bad and

00:50:13.849 --> 00:50:17.570
a big part of that is to like a lot of that has

00:50:17.570 --> 00:50:20.170
origins I think in like American cinema from

00:50:20.170 --> 00:50:22.190
the past things like that. I mean, you know,

00:50:22.309 --> 00:50:26.230
we can think of the more popular things like

00:50:26.230 --> 00:50:29.829
Science of the Lambs Buffalo Bill is a really

00:50:29.829 --> 00:50:31.869
popular one where like, you know, the queer person

00:50:31.869 --> 00:50:34.690
is evil and things like that. And there was another

00:50:34.690 --> 00:50:36.510
one, there's another Michael Caine movie from

00:50:36.510 --> 00:50:38.309
a long time ago where he was like a therapist,

00:50:38.809 --> 00:50:42.469
but a cross dresser and he stalked a woman, things

00:50:42.469 --> 00:50:44.670
like this. So there's all that kind of bad stuff,

00:50:44.750 --> 00:50:47.769
which is just that people see that and think

00:50:47.769 --> 00:50:51.230
it's a window into reality is just so wrong headed

00:50:51.230 --> 00:50:56.409
to me. It's an easy, easy avenue into other ship,

00:50:57.010 --> 00:51:00.289
like the other. A concept of the other. What

00:51:00.289 --> 00:51:03.309
did you say in the previous one? The dark forest

00:51:03.309 --> 00:51:08.610
hypothesis. Similar to that. Oh, right. Yeah.

00:51:08.869 --> 00:51:12.349
At least there's some kind of cross over there.

00:51:12.349 --> 00:51:16.070
A dark, queer forest. No, it does share the same

00:51:16.070 --> 00:51:17.690
elements, right? You're in this place. Sounds

00:51:17.690 --> 00:51:24.099
like a fun place, though. A lot of fairy lighting.

00:51:24.480 --> 00:51:26.139
You're gonna go in there, all you're gonna hear

00:51:26.139 --> 00:51:29.280
is like cats purring and there's gonna be like

00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:32.199
some, there's gonna be some fireplace somewhere

00:51:32.199 --> 00:51:35.920
where everybody's just chatting nicely. But yes,

00:51:35.940 --> 00:51:38.519
I guess you are drawing some parallels. You know,

00:51:38.519 --> 00:51:41.440
you're in a place and you don't know who's there

00:51:41.440 --> 00:51:44.659
and if it could be dangerous or not. Exactly,

00:51:44.760 --> 00:51:48.940
and whatever makes it more strange makes it more

00:51:48.940 --> 00:51:52.789
scary. Yeah. But maybe that's just because you're

00:51:52.789 --> 00:51:55.389
not, you know, in tune with yourself and you're

00:51:55.389 --> 00:51:59.769
afraid of what you might do because for whatever

00:51:59.769 --> 00:52:04.349
reason you think it's not right. That brings

00:52:04.349 --> 00:52:07.489
us full circle to don't be afraid and do the

00:52:07.489 --> 00:52:10.329
things that you need. And we should probably

00:52:10.329 --> 00:52:16.869
move on to the next perspective. Wait, what was

00:52:16.869 --> 00:52:21.500
this perspective? I forget. You know, moving

00:52:21.500 --> 00:52:25.619
house can... You need to identify the things

00:52:25.619 --> 00:52:29.039
in your environment that make you uncomfortable.

00:52:29.199 --> 00:52:31.460
Feel the fear. Feel the fear and do it anyway.

00:52:32.460 --> 00:52:34.840
Yeah. Well, I don't know. I wasn't scared of

00:52:34.840 --> 00:52:37.280
moving. I wanted to move. I just didn't realize

00:52:37.280 --> 00:52:40.400
how toxic that environment was for me. Well,

00:52:40.559 --> 00:52:43.619
why would you think... Why was your old apartment

00:52:43.619 --> 00:52:46.820
toxic though? Just because it had a lot of traffic

00:52:46.820 --> 00:52:50.670
sounds? No, because of the noise and the size

00:52:50.670 --> 00:52:53.429
and the feeling of coming home and the distance

00:52:53.429 --> 00:52:57.789
and all the little things, the little concessions

00:52:57.789 --> 00:53:01.949
that I made to my quality of life in order to

00:53:01.949 --> 00:53:05.610
stay there. Uh, well, I mean, everyone does that,

00:53:05.750 --> 00:53:09.440
right? Yeah, but I'm saying make fewer. Like

00:53:09.440 --> 00:53:11.639
you can definitely make some, but I just made

00:53:11.639 --> 00:53:15.480
way too many. Like I had to walk 400 meters to

00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:18.340
get to my car. I had to like rush to work every

00:53:18.340 --> 00:53:21.000
morning. I had to deal with bad noise. The place

00:53:21.000 --> 00:53:24.500
was too small. All of these things, right? And

00:53:24.500 --> 00:53:29.519
I stayed there for five years. I was overpaying

00:53:29.519 --> 00:53:34.250
for sure. I don't know how much your last, was

00:53:34.250 --> 00:53:36.469
your last apartment more or less than your current

00:53:36.469 --> 00:53:39.610
apartment? Less, but it was also half the size.

00:53:40.989 --> 00:53:43.690
It was three quarters the price and half the

00:53:43.690 --> 00:53:48.269
size. Okay. Yeah. I don't know, I think it can.

00:53:48.969 --> 00:53:54.289
Do you have a perspective to share for us? So,

00:53:54.469 --> 00:53:56.369
and when you say perspective, like, can it be

00:53:56.369 --> 00:54:00.550
on any topic or? Absolutely. Anything, anything.

00:54:00.829 --> 00:54:04.030
Like anything that grinds your gears that you

00:54:04.030 --> 00:54:05.610
want to talk about that will just turn us into

00:54:05.610 --> 00:54:09.329
a bunch of... Or something that helps you carry

00:54:09.329 --> 00:54:12.369
on the region. I was just gonna say gossipy hoes,

00:54:12.469 --> 00:54:14.670
you know, whatever. Just like, you know, spill

00:54:14.670 --> 00:54:18.909
the tea. Anything. Or something that helps you

00:54:18.909 --> 00:54:24.010
become who you are today. Okay. I feel like...

00:54:24.010 --> 00:54:27.809
There's anything... Go for it. Go for it. I was

00:54:27.809 --> 00:54:29.309
just gonna say, if like, if there's anything...

00:54:29.440 --> 00:54:31.579
anything that's come to your mind lately that

00:54:31.579 --> 00:54:33.980
you just thought about and you're like, huh,

00:54:34.820 --> 00:54:40.019
I wonder just anything lately, you know, the

00:54:40.019 --> 00:54:42.519
secret lives of everyday objects. What does the

00:54:42.519 --> 00:54:47.099
table think? Well, it's funny. I feel like the

00:54:47.099 --> 00:54:50.119
thing that popped into my head was leadership

00:54:50.119 --> 00:54:54.159
and the fact that when I embarked on this journey,

00:54:54.159 --> 00:54:57.400
I never wanted to be a manager of people and

00:54:57.599 --> 00:55:01.739
For me, I feel like what's been really fascinating

00:55:01.739 --> 00:55:07.139
for me was just having to grapple with the idea

00:55:07.139 --> 00:55:10.599
of leading a team of people and that dynamic

00:55:10.599 --> 00:55:16.320
and having to navigate people's feelings when

00:55:16.320 --> 00:55:19.360
it comes to being in this space and how often

00:55:19.360 --> 00:55:22.739
those can shift very suddenly. Leadership is

00:55:22.739 --> 00:55:24.519
a very funny thing because it's like I think

00:55:24.519 --> 00:55:26.760
we've all at some point have worked for someone

00:55:26.760 --> 00:55:29.599
and we all have in our mind like what we think

00:55:29.599 --> 00:55:32.099
is a good leader and who we think is a good manager

00:55:32.099 --> 00:55:35.480
and and I think it's so funny when the tables

00:55:35.480 --> 00:55:38.380
turn and then you're now in that position where

00:55:38.380 --> 00:55:42.159
you're now having to lead and Then all of a sudden

00:55:42.159 --> 00:55:46.639
it changes, you know, like before you would You

00:55:46.639 --> 00:55:50.280
know, it's like it's almost like now I feel empathy

00:55:50.599 --> 00:55:54.460
from my previous managers, who probably thought

00:55:54.460 --> 00:55:58.179
that I was such a little a -hole, you know, for,

00:55:58.179 --> 00:56:01.219
you know, giving them such a hard time. And now

00:56:01.219 --> 00:56:04.000
that I'm in this position as a leader, I realize

00:56:04.000 --> 00:56:08.019
how challenging it can be, you know, to embody

00:56:08.019 --> 00:56:10.880
this person that feels authentic, but at the

00:56:10.880 --> 00:56:13.940
same time, you know, creates a sense of, you

00:56:13.940 --> 00:56:19.380
know, inspiration for people. Honestly, I would

00:56:19.380 --> 00:56:21.119
say it's been one of the toughest things I've

00:56:21.119 --> 00:56:24.440
had to navigate on this journey is how to be

00:56:24.440 --> 00:56:27.440
authentically myself, but then also someone that

00:56:27.440 --> 00:56:30.000
people aspire, someone that people are inspired

00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:33.340
by, if that makes sense. And I feel like the

00:56:33.340 --> 00:56:36.400
two don't always converge, but it's a work in

00:56:36.400 --> 00:56:41.059
progress, I'll say. At the risk of being controversial,

00:56:41.239 --> 00:56:45.860
I disagree. Wait, disagree about what? I think

00:56:45.860 --> 00:56:51.579
that you are, maybe this is not true, but I think

00:56:51.579 --> 00:56:54.639
that to me you came across as being completely

00:56:54.639 --> 00:56:58.340
authentically yourself. And you absolutely inspired

00:56:58.340 --> 00:57:07.380
me to take a lot of the risks that I'm... found

00:57:07.380 --> 00:57:11.239
a partner online, a fellow trans woman who lives

00:57:11.239 --> 00:57:15.199
in South Africa. We are now 50 -50 owners of

00:57:15.199 --> 00:57:18.420
a registered company in South Africa. And that

00:57:18.420 --> 00:57:22.480
is partly due to your inspiration. Oh, thank

00:57:22.480 --> 00:57:24.960
you for sharing that. That honestly just like

00:57:24.960 --> 00:57:29.280
makes me want to cry to know that I had that

00:57:29.280 --> 00:57:33.300
effect on you. It just, yeah. And I... And I

00:57:33.300 --> 00:57:34.940
think what you all are seeing in real time is

00:57:34.940 --> 00:57:37.860
I'm my own worst critic. You know, I struggle

00:57:37.860 --> 00:57:41.780
with that. You know, I sometimes do have imposter

00:57:41.780 --> 00:57:46.360
syndrome when it comes to success and building

00:57:46.360 --> 00:57:50.800
things because I still just deem myself as just,

00:57:50.800 --> 00:57:54.320
you know, just like special, but just someone

00:57:54.320 --> 00:57:58.179
who just really truly cares about the queer community

00:57:58.179 --> 00:58:00.440
and just wants to do something great, you know.

00:58:01.039 --> 00:58:05.099
And that's it. And so if I have a positive effect

00:58:05.099 --> 00:58:07.500
on someone's life or I make someone feel welcome,

00:58:07.659 --> 00:58:11.480
then for me, that's a win. The queer community

00:58:11.480 --> 00:58:14.619
is missing, especially in South Africa, because

00:58:14.619 --> 00:58:19.019
the environment is actually so conservative on

00:58:19.019 --> 00:58:21.659
the surface. Cape Town is definitely an oasis,

00:58:22.360 --> 00:58:25.179
but it's an oasis for people coming from the

00:58:25.179 --> 00:58:29.289
outside. There's this conservative net. around.

00:58:29.570 --> 00:58:31.989
I think one of the things that's lacking, and

00:58:31.989 --> 00:58:34.650
I might be wrong in this, but from my perspective,

00:58:34.849 --> 00:58:39.429
is a solid network of, for lack of a better term,

00:58:39.809 --> 00:58:43.590
boss -ass queer people just making a killing.

00:58:45.989 --> 00:58:50.570
And I want to be part of that group of people

00:58:50.570 --> 00:58:53.369
that are making a difference every day, no matter

00:58:53.369 --> 00:58:58.300
how small. So that's kind of my goal. Yeah, and

00:58:58.300 --> 00:59:00.300
that's my general feeling as well, to be honest

00:59:00.300 --> 00:59:05.480
with you. I do feel like there are other queer

00:59:05.480 --> 00:59:08.260
entrepreneurs here, of course, but I don't feel

00:59:08.260 --> 00:59:11.460
like we've developed necessarily like a network

00:59:11.460 --> 00:59:13.940
or community where we're all supporting one another.

00:59:14.159 --> 00:59:17.159
I think everyone is kind of sort of doing their

00:59:17.159 --> 00:59:19.199
own thing more or less. Of course, you know,

00:59:19.199 --> 00:59:21.219
when I started promoting, you know, a lot of

00:59:21.219 --> 00:59:23.480
people approached me to want to do partnerships

00:59:23.480 --> 00:59:26.760
and things like that, but to be honest, a lot

00:59:26.760 --> 00:59:29.769
of them Don't come to fruition. I think people

00:59:29.769 --> 00:59:32.289
just get really excited. Like they get that shiny,

00:59:33.289 --> 00:59:35.730
um, that new shiny syndrome where they see something

00:59:35.730 --> 00:59:37.969
new and they're like, Ooh, I just, I want to

00:59:37.969 --> 00:59:40.070
like learn more about that. But then when it

00:59:40.070 --> 00:59:42.750
actually comes to building something solid or

00:59:42.750 --> 00:59:45.710
like creating a network that tends to not really

00:59:45.710 --> 00:59:48.949
manifest as much. So, and it could be just the

00:59:48.949 --> 00:59:51.010
culture in Cape town. I mean, I grew up in LA,

00:59:51.010 --> 00:59:53.530
so this is a culture that I'm all too familiar

00:59:53.530 --> 00:59:57.349
with people. presenting themselves as genuine

00:59:57.349 --> 01:00:00.210
and wanting to build something only to, like,

01:00:00.369 --> 01:00:04.989
never hear from them. So, um... Ask me about

01:00:04.989 --> 01:00:07.550
authors that want to come on Kaleidoscope. There

01:00:07.550 --> 01:00:10.429
have been a few, and none of them come to fruition.

01:00:11.150 --> 01:00:13.949
Oh, okay. Yeah. I was gonna be like, don't bring

01:00:13.949 --> 01:00:16.650
that up. What if there are authors on Kaleidoscope?

01:00:16.889 --> 01:00:20.050
Shame. I'm sure eventually there will be, but

01:00:20.050 --> 01:00:23.769
so far, none. Everybody wants to be a writer,

01:00:23.829 --> 01:00:29.929
but nobody wants to write. That part I'm full

01:00:29.929 --> 01:00:32.329
of I'm full of pedantic I can say the same thing

01:00:32.329 --> 01:00:36.110
about I could say the same thing about like You

01:00:36.110 --> 01:00:38.269
know partnership and entrepreneur like everyone

01:00:38.269 --> 01:00:40.449
wants to be an entrepreneur, but only to build

01:00:40.449 --> 01:00:43.969
anything It's the same sentiment like as soon

01:00:43.969 --> 01:00:46.590
as they realize the work involved they kind of

01:00:46.590 --> 01:00:54.650
go Yeah, you have to have that grit and like

01:00:54.650 --> 01:00:56.210
really have to push yourself. Like, you know,

01:00:56.210 --> 01:00:58.110
you don't want to do it. It's like you got to

01:00:58.110 --> 01:01:00.269
brush your teeth. Nobody wants to brush their

01:01:00.269 --> 01:01:03.030
teeth, but they know they have to. So there are

01:01:03.030 --> 01:01:05.429
the people who know they have to and they force

01:01:05.429 --> 01:01:08.010
themselves to do it, even if they're miserable.

01:01:09.030 --> 01:01:13.869
And they can see the benefits or hope for the

01:01:13.869 --> 01:01:15.750
benefits of putting in the effort. But most people,

01:01:15.869 --> 01:01:17.730
not most people, but there are people who's saying

01:01:17.730 --> 01:01:20.110
in the back of their heads, you know, ah, it's

01:01:20.110 --> 01:01:23.050
not going to work out. So don't bother. Yeah.

01:01:24.840 --> 01:01:28.280
persistence, perseverance, and the other thing

01:01:28.280 --> 01:01:31.280
that I think that one of the big stoppers of

01:01:31.280 --> 01:01:34.539
people doing cool stuff is somebody else has

01:01:34.539 --> 01:01:37.659
done it already. Yeah, but you have to realize

01:01:37.659 --> 01:01:40.760
there are no new ideas or everything has been

01:01:40.760 --> 01:01:46.380
done already. I can say. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

01:01:46.519 --> 01:01:50.900
yeah. Definitely a younger Luigi always used

01:01:50.900 --> 01:01:53.210
to... He was definitely one of those, ah, someone

01:01:53.210 --> 01:01:54.929
else did it, so what's the point kind of people.

01:01:55.030 --> 01:01:59.309
And then he sees people still doing those things

01:01:59.309 --> 01:02:02.429
and going like, ah, why, why didn't I, why wasn't

01:02:02.429 --> 01:02:05.409
I the kind of person that could be like that

01:02:05.409 --> 01:02:08.869
person who just did it anyway? Yeah. So yeah,

01:02:08.869 --> 01:02:12.429
I definitely, I will, I will admit I am one of

01:02:12.429 --> 01:02:15.530
those defeatist kinds of people. And I'm just

01:02:15.530 --> 01:02:20.210
riding Ruby's coattails by being on this podcast.

01:02:22.170 --> 01:02:25.110
No, you're definitely a positive contributor.

01:02:25.889 --> 01:02:28.670
No, but what you're saying is so true though.

01:02:28.809 --> 01:02:32.489
I think so often people have this false belief

01:02:32.489 --> 01:02:35.010
that in order to be an entrepreneur, it has to

01:02:35.010 --> 01:02:38.369
be like an uniquely idea. Like it has to be like

01:02:38.369 --> 01:02:41.429
never done before. And that's not true at all.

01:02:41.510 --> 01:02:43.469
Some of the most successful businesses in the

01:02:43.469 --> 01:02:46.110
world have our repeats, our copies of others,

01:02:46.190 --> 01:02:49.059
but they just did it better. Yes. That's all

01:02:49.059 --> 01:02:51.340
that they did. They had better execution. They

01:02:51.340 --> 01:02:54.519
had better marketing. They just were just better

01:02:54.519 --> 01:02:59.019
than the competition. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I can

01:02:59.019 --> 01:03:02.579
attest to that. I mean, this is something Ruby

01:03:02.579 --> 01:03:04.480
and I probably know a lot about. If you're in

01:03:04.480 --> 01:03:06.739
the city we're in, my goodness, there are so

01:03:06.739 --> 01:03:10.019
many coffee shops. Everybody has a coffee shop

01:03:10.019 --> 01:03:12.840
and it's just all, the coffee's all the same.

01:03:13.139 --> 01:03:17.000
And we wonder, how do these things operate? First

01:03:17.000 --> 01:03:18.539
of all, it's China, where you don't expect them

01:03:18.539 --> 01:03:21.679
to love coffee so much. But it's such a pastime

01:03:21.679 --> 01:03:25.380
here. And it's just, the selling point of all

01:03:25.380 --> 01:03:27.619
these things, all these shops, is that they're

01:03:27.619 --> 01:03:31.460
just always different. And that's the most interesting

01:03:31.460 --> 01:03:34.760
thing about them is their aesthetic. How are

01:03:34.760 --> 01:03:36.260
they going to do it differently than the other

01:03:36.260 --> 01:03:38.239
ones? And of course, obviously they're the ones,

01:03:38.699 --> 01:03:41.980
they're like the big conglomerate coffee shops

01:03:41.980 --> 01:03:45.460
that are brands and... You know, they operate

01:03:45.460 --> 01:03:46.980
like Starbucks, so they have a million other

01:03:46.980 --> 01:03:50.000
flavors. But the smaller ones, where they just

01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:54.440
have, you know, the usual coffees, Americanos,

01:03:54.679 --> 01:03:58.599
lattes, like cappuccinos, so limited. And it's

01:03:58.599 --> 01:04:02.099
like they don't even make like third wave coffee.

01:04:02.219 --> 01:04:03.860
Like they don't make pour overs. They don't have

01:04:03.860 --> 01:04:06.320
like coffee bean flavor profiles. It's just like

01:04:06.320 --> 01:04:10.760
espresso and lattes. But every one, it's just...

01:04:10.650 --> 01:04:14.429
how it looks on the inside that draws people,

01:04:14.449 --> 01:04:18.269
really. And it's like the space. And I think

01:04:18.269 --> 01:04:21.869
why it works so well here and why people continue

01:04:21.869 --> 01:04:25.170
to do it is because I honestly think people do

01:04:25.170 --> 01:04:27.449
not like being in their apartments. I don't think

01:04:27.449 --> 01:04:31.510
houses here are built in a way that is like a

01:04:31.510 --> 01:04:33.849
space where people want to be, which is weird

01:04:33.849 --> 01:04:36.920
because it's your home, but it's just... So it's

01:04:36.920 --> 01:04:41.119
all these third places that are so sought after.

01:04:41.719 --> 01:04:47.260
So you have so many examples of people doing

01:04:47.260 --> 01:04:49.320
the same thing, but they still have the confidence

01:04:49.320 --> 01:04:52.559
to do it, which is admirable obviously. It's

01:04:52.559 --> 01:04:55.280
great for me because I love a reason to just

01:04:55.280 --> 01:04:58.440
go and sit in a coffee shop and the novelty is

01:04:58.440 --> 01:05:04.510
just exponential. It's great. Yeah, it's so,

01:05:04.510 --> 01:05:07.269
so, so fascinating. Ruby, what are you thinking?

01:05:07.570 --> 01:05:14.289
Am I wrong? No, I'm thinking, so while you're

01:05:14.289 --> 01:05:17.110
talking about this, I'm running my mind back

01:05:17.110 --> 01:05:21.210
to you saying, Saltham looks so cool and you

01:05:21.210 --> 01:05:23.650
would love to stay there. And then I'm thinking,

01:05:23.750 --> 01:05:26.929
I'm going to be going back there. And I'm wondering,

01:05:27.110 --> 01:05:30.190
are you coming with me to Cape Town? Forget Bangkok.

01:05:31.429 --> 01:05:33.969
Hey. Don't ask me travel questions. You know

01:05:33.969 --> 01:05:36.469
how one of my... That's why I'm bringing it up.

01:05:37.349 --> 01:05:42.050
One of my... What's the word? What did we discuss

01:05:42.050 --> 01:05:45.289
before? My lack of growth, whatever. My fear

01:05:45.289 --> 01:05:48.110
to do something is travel. Traveling for me is

01:05:48.110 --> 01:05:51.789
just like... Really? ...such an overwhelming...

01:05:51.789 --> 01:05:54.190
Yeah, most people love travel. Like, oh, it excites

01:05:54.190 --> 01:05:56.070
them. Me, I'm just like... It feels like work,

01:05:56.250 --> 01:06:00.909
like, oh my God. I got a plan. I got to pack

01:06:00.909 --> 01:06:03.849
stuff. And what if I forget something? It's just,

01:06:04.050 --> 01:06:07.190
I am a creature of habit. Like I just love, I

01:06:07.190 --> 01:06:09.070
don't love staying home all day, but I like knowing

01:06:09.070 --> 01:06:12.550
I can, if I can just go back home right away.

01:06:13.630 --> 01:06:16.610
Don't plan. Feeling a conqueror. Yeah, I do.

01:06:17.449 --> 01:06:21.570
Don't plan. That's my favorite part about traveling.

01:06:22.220 --> 01:06:25.599
Like as a South African, I've all my life been

01:06:25.599 --> 01:06:28.920
plagued with the necessity of planning to get

01:06:28.920 --> 01:06:34.320
visas. It's why I love going to Thailand because

01:06:34.320 --> 01:06:36.780
I don't need a visa. It's why I love traveling

01:06:36.780 --> 01:06:40.460
back home because I don't have to plan. I just

01:06:40.460 --> 01:06:45.800
arrive and book a hotel. And then that's what

01:06:45.800 --> 01:06:49.519
I did when I came to you. It was like two days

01:06:49.519 --> 01:06:52.929
before and I was like, hey, I'm coming. Perfect.

01:06:53.849 --> 01:06:57.130
No planning required. And then I'll be like,

01:06:57.309 --> 01:07:00.429
oh, I'm going to go check out this place, maybe

01:07:00.429 --> 01:07:02.889
this place, maybe or not. And that's awesome.

01:07:03.550 --> 01:07:07.449
Okay. I think I could be that person if I had

01:07:07.449 --> 01:07:11.550
a lot of money. If money wasn't an issue, I'd

01:07:11.550 --> 01:07:14.269
be like, that place looks good. Let's go. You

01:07:14.269 --> 01:07:17.030
know me. Chase doesn't know this about me, but

01:07:17.030 --> 01:07:20.849
I feel like I bring it up in every podcast. terrible

01:07:20.849 --> 01:07:25.989
relationship with money. Overspender? No, I'm

01:07:25.989 --> 01:07:28.630
the absolute opposite of that. So you're frugal.

01:07:29.809 --> 01:07:32.750
I will, I will, I will, I will use a paper towel

01:07:32.750 --> 01:07:34.829
and then hang it up to dry and use again later.

01:07:36.230 --> 01:07:38.289
I'm not really like that. Oh gosh. You know,

01:07:38.349 --> 01:07:42.010
you get the sentiment. That's, I gotta work on

01:07:42.010 --> 01:07:44.989
my money. My relationship with money is... You

01:07:44.989 --> 01:07:47.809
gotta enjoy your life. Money is meant to be spent.

01:07:47.829 --> 01:07:49.730
Yeah, that's the other thing. That's what they

01:07:49.730 --> 01:07:51.949
say. It's a tool. I understand it's a tool, but

01:07:51.949 --> 01:07:56.530
I have a really bad emotional attachment to money

01:07:56.530 --> 01:07:59.710
that I am slowly working on. It's true. I'm trying

01:07:59.710 --> 01:08:01.670
to spend a little bit more than I usually do.

01:08:01.869 --> 01:08:04.670
Hey, I bought coffee every day this week. Do

01:08:04.670 --> 01:08:06.710
you know how hard that was? Every day in the

01:08:06.710 --> 01:08:08.949
morning. I'm like, oh, you don't need it, Luigi.

01:08:09.170 --> 01:08:11.150
But I'm just like, no, just do it. And it is

01:08:11.150 --> 01:08:13.050
so painful. The coffee wasn't even that good.

01:08:14.489 --> 01:08:18.680
Tell us about your leadership journey. Leadership

01:08:18.680 --> 01:08:24.340
journey. Me? Yeah. Okay. I don't want to toot

01:08:24.340 --> 01:08:27.000
my own horn and say I'm a leader, but let me

01:08:27.000 --> 01:08:31.579
just say, and this is what I thought of when

01:08:31.579 --> 01:08:33.680
Chase was talking about how he was afraid to

01:08:33.680 --> 01:08:36.359
be a leader, and maybe to agree or disagree,

01:08:36.520 --> 01:08:41.369
but the best kind of leader the world says. is

01:08:41.369 --> 01:08:43.890
the person who doesn't want to be a leader. Like

01:08:43.890 --> 01:08:45.470
those are the people you want to be the leaders

01:08:45.470 --> 01:08:48.470
because the people who seek out leadership are

01:08:48.470 --> 01:08:51.970
kind of sinister, right? They have like power

01:08:51.970 --> 01:08:56.729
issues. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. I mean, I like to

01:08:56.729 --> 01:08:59.989
believe that sentiment, but I think it's very

01:08:59.989 --> 01:09:02.109
possible that someone who wants to be a leader

01:09:02.109 --> 01:09:06.850
can be a good leader. I mean, look at Bernie

01:09:06.850 --> 01:09:09.930
Sanders. I think he'd be a great leader. I don't

01:09:09.930 --> 01:09:12.489
know. I think he's thinking out to be a leader.

01:09:13.229 --> 01:09:16.529
So, you know, there are examples of it, but...

01:09:16.529 --> 01:09:21.189
What about Zoran Mamdani? Oh, yeah. I don't know

01:09:21.189 --> 01:09:26.829
yet. He just happened, so we'll see. I'm super

01:09:26.829 --> 01:09:32.029
excited. Yeah. But... I kind of agree with you,

01:09:32.109 --> 01:09:34.239
Luigi, though. I do think... the best leaders

01:09:34.239 --> 01:09:36.479
are the ones that don't necessarily want to be

01:09:36.479 --> 01:09:38.659
leaders. I think what it is, it's like, because

01:09:38.659 --> 01:09:41.479
you're not seeking recognition. You're not seeking,

01:09:41.520 --> 01:09:45.000
you know, it's almost like people who seek fame

01:09:45.000 --> 01:09:49.000
versus people who are pursuing talent. It's like

01:09:49.000 --> 01:09:51.479
they're not trying to be famous. They just want

01:09:51.479 --> 01:09:54.680
to express their talent. And so I think for me,

01:09:55.239 --> 01:09:59.090
I never wanted... to, you know, achieve notoriety

01:09:59.090 --> 01:10:01.829
or fame or anything for SoulFam. I just wanted

01:10:01.829 --> 01:10:04.550
to build something meaningful. And so I think

01:10:04.550 --> 01:10:07.649
it's really your intention that kind of dictates

01:10:07.649 --> 01:10:11.670
how you lead. Right. And even you, you have empathy

01:10:11.670 --> 01:10:15.270
for your old managers and stuff. So to me that

01:10:15.270 --> 01:10:20.909
tells me, you know, you're not a... I was the

01:10:20.909 --> 01:10:23.510
worst, I was the worst employee, guys. The worst.

01:10:24.689 --> 01:10:28.229
So I guess, My question for you in that regard

01:10:28.229 --> 01:10:31.630
is like, when you have those employees who are

01:10:31.630 --> 01:10:35.810
sassing you at being bad, do you have the patience

01:10:35.810 --> 01:10:39.090
to understand them? Or are you getting mad going

01:10:39.090 --> 01:10:42.090
like, ugh? Yeah, you know, it's funny actually

01:10:42.090 --> 01:10:48.640
because I'm starting to realize that people actually

01:10:48.640 --> 01:10:52.100
respect you more when you're kind. And that actually

01:10:52.100 --> 01:10:56.500
being super assertive or aggressive or being

01:10:56.500 --> 01:10:59.319
a hard ass, it actually rubs people the wrong

01:10:59.319 --> 01:11:02.260
way. And it actually doesn't inspire them or

01:11:02.260 --> 01:11:05.560
motivate them to be their best self. And so I

01:11:05.560 --> 01:11:07.979
found it's so funny, like everything that we're

01:11:07.979 --> 01:11:11.140
taught in terms of what a good leader is, is

01:11:11.140 --> 01:11:13.560
actually the opposite. It's actually the person

01:11:13.560 --> 01:11:17.930
that's relatable and very clear on expectations

01:11:17.930 --> 01:11:23.210
and someone that they can speak to. Those are

01:11:23.210 --> 01:11:25.470
the qualities that I think people actually respect

01:11:25.470 --> 01:11:28.350
in a leader, especially in a hostile environment

01:11:28.350 --> 01:11:32.310
where it's so social and it's so community -based.

01:11:32.569 --> 01:11:36.069
They want someone who embodies those qualities.

01:11:36.670 --> 01:11:41.930
Yeah. Can I just say that? Yeah, I agree with

01:11:41.930 --> 01:11:46.380
the kindness thing, but it's got to be... Like

01:11:46.380 --> 01:11:49.640
it's gotta be real kindness because I think a

01:11:49.640 --> 01:11:52.520
lot of people are good at putting on the mask

01:11:52.520 --> 01:11:56.380
of kindness and It's just it's not it's not genuine.

01:11:56.960 --> 01:11:59.420
It's definitely and I think people can sniff

01:11:59.420 --> 01:12:03.640
that out and I like your expectation thing Definitely

01:12:03.640 --> 01:12:05.460
having clear expectations. Like that's what people

01:12:05.460 --> 01:12:08.739
appreciate in a leader. Absolutely Understanding,

01:12:08.739 --> 01:12:14.180
you know relatability clear expectations then

01:12:14.180 --> 01:12:17.159
that's a lot of in my professional life a lot

01:12:17.159 --> 01:12:22.020
of the like the cut the The conflict thank you

01:12:22.020 --> 01:12:26.579
Ruby the having known your boss Having had your

01:12:26.579 --> 01:12:30.539
boss. I do not envy you and I'm happy to be away

01:12:30.539 --> 01:12:35.159
It's it's yeah, not having those those, you know

01:12:35.159 --> 01:12:38.340
clear expectations, but so okay chase, but you

01:12:38.340 --> 01:12:43.220
also said you want to inspire your employees,

01:12:43.859 --> 01:12:47.640
but why do you have to want to inspire them?

01:12:47.939 --> 01:12:50.640
Why put that pressure on yourself? I think for

01:12:50.640 --> 01:12:55.460
me it's because, and I think you all might have

01:12:55.460 --> 01:12:57.300
experienced this in your life, when you create

01:12:57.300 --> 01:12:59.420
and build something that you're so passionate

01:12:59.420 --> 01:13:03.020
about, it's very natural to want the people around

01:13:03.020 --> 01:13:06.899
you to share that same energy. and to share that

01:13:06.899 --> 01:13:09.319
same commitment that you do. Because I know that

01:13:09.319 --> 01:13:12.239
if they embody that, they're going to be able

01:13:12.239 --> 01:13:14.579
to achieve the mission that we're setting out

01:13:14.579 --> 01:13:17.319
to achieve. But if they don't bring that energy

01:13:17.319 --> 01:13:20.520
and that presence, then it becomes very difficult

01:13:20.520 --> 01:13:25.399
to execute that vision. And so, so yeah, so I

01:13:25.399 --> 01:13:28.960
think for me, it's more so I want them to feel

01:13:28.960 --> 01:13:34.529
like they are, how do I say this? I'm very much

01:13:34.529 --> 01:13:37.569
a person where I'm very sensitive to the idea

01:13:37.569 --> 01:13:42.170
of time and not wasting your time and not living

01:13:42.170 --> 01:13:44.550
a life that you know you should not be living

01:13:44.550 --> 01:13:47.189
or following a path that's not aligned with who

01:13:47.189 --> 01:13:51.890
you are. And so in that sense, if you don't feel

01:13:51.890 --> 01:13:55.569
inspired and motivated here, chances are that

01:13:55.569 --> 01:13:58.270
maybe this isn't the space for you and maybe

01:13:58.270 --> 01:14:00.289
you should be following a different path where

01:14:00.289 --> 01:14:04.840
you do feel inspired, you do feel excited. Because

01:14:04.840 --> 01:14:08.340
I think life is too short to just be miserable

01:14:08.340 --> 01:14:11.500
doing what you do instead of doing what you love.

01:14:12.560 --> 01:14:16.420
Yeah. And I think if you keep doing what you're

01:14:16.420 --> 01:14:20.000
doing, your employees will see that and they

01:14:20.000 --> 01:14:24.260
will admire it so much. It will move them to

01:14:24.260 --> 01:14:27.260
action. And I say this speaking from my experience

01:14:27.260 --> 01:14:32.239
because it's the... You know the bad bosses that

01:14:32.239 --> 01:14:35.460
aren't doing anything and delegating that make

01:14:35.460 --> 01:14:37.380
you disgruntled and angry But when I see the

01:14:37.380 --> 01:14:41.199
ones who are doing it all and you know walking

01:14:41.199 --> 01:14:46.340
beside me That I'm like moved, you know, and

01:14:46.340 --> 01:14:50.270
I've told Ruby this before you know, like when

01:14:50.270 --> 01:14:53.210
we worked together, I would go home and cry because

01:14:53.210 --> 01:14:56.869
I was so stressed. But before the other boss,

01:14:56.909 --> 01:14:59.510
I would go home and cry because I was so moved

01:14:59.510 --> 01:15:02.770
because they were such a good person. And like,

01:15:02.869 --> 01:15:05.529
that's the difference. And I think you don't

01:15:05.529 --> 01:15:09.569
have to tell your employees to be that or you

01:15:09.569 --> 01:15:10.970
gotta say, you gotta be inspired. You just have

01:15:10.970 --> 01:15:14.090
to be and do your thing and they will see it

01:15:14.090 --> 01:15:19.439
and it will happen. Because... I think you only

01:15:19.439 --> 01:15:23.100
get those kinds of bad employees when, you know,

01:15:23.260 --> 01:15:28.340
the boss is just some figure somewhere, you know,

01:15:28.520 --> 01:15:32.520
shouting down at them. Yeah, I totally agree.

01:15:33.600 --> 01:15:37.039
Yeah, and if I may bring it back to me and being

01:15:37.039 --> 01:15:40.140
a leader, there was a time in life where I tried

01:15:40.140 --> 01:15:42.800
to be a leader and tried to seek out leadership.

01:15:43.570 --> 01:15:46.329
It just never materialized. But now I just feel

01:15:46.329 --> 01:15:49.369
like, well, now I'm more like a weird, I found

01:15:49.369 --> 01:15:54.029
myself in positions of being like a consular,

01:15:54.529 --> 01:16:00.710
like just who sees problems and is just so hyper

01:16:00.710 --> 01:16:03.350
aware of dynamics that when a new leader comes,

01:16:03.649 --> 01:16:05.810
just giving them the down low and they've just

01:16:05.810 --> 01:16:09.289
always appreciated that, not to toot my own horn.

01:16:09.390 --> 01:16:11.550
But I think that's why I could never, I will

01:16:11.550 --> 01:16:14.640
never be put into a leadership. position because

01:16:14.640 --> 01:16:16.479
I'm just too useful the other way and people

01:16:16.479 --> 01:16:20.119
see it. So I got to like be lazy or something.

01:16:21.039 --> 01:16:23.539
So you like being a number two. You don't want

01:16:23.539 --> 01:16:25.979
to be Batman. You want to be Robin. I don't know

01:16:25.979 --> 01:16:28.880
if I could be Batman, but the number two thing

01:16:28.880 --> 01:16:33.220
is just like, I think something I just am because

01:16:33.220 --> 01:16:37.920
it's just in my nature instead of like, yeah,

01:16:37.960 --> 01:16:41.880
I like to gossip and complain. But it's not like

01:16:41.880 --> 01:16:45.760
true complaining. It's just like fun. But I do

01:16:45.760 --> 01:16:49.020
actually, I am very proactive in just solving

01:16:49.020 --> 01:16:53.279
problems. Instead of like, you know, oh, it's

01:16:53.279 --> 01:16:55.819
so -and -so's job. Whatever. I'll just do it.

01:16:56.300 --> 01:16:59.579
Oh, we need a ladder? I'll go find one. What's

01:16:59.579 --> 01:17:02.800
that, Ruby? That's fair. Yeah, you're right.

01:17:03.020 --> 01:17:06.560
It's very self -aware and good. I agree with

01:17:06.560 --> 01:17:08.979
your self -assessment, not entirely. I do think

01:17:08.979 --> 01:17:12.460
that you can be a good leader. Well, you did

01:17:12.460 --> 01:17:15.100
work with me, so you would know. In terms of

01:17:15.100 --> 01:17:18.840
being practical and proactive in solving problems,

01:17:19.000 --> 01:17:22.800
yeah, for sure. Thank you. I feel seen. Yeah,

01:17:23.079 --> 01:17:27.239
I see. Luigi, why don't you share your perspective

01:17:27.239 --> 01:17:29.939
with us? You mean the one I was talking about

01:17:29.939 --> 01:17:34.630
today? Well, whatever you want. I don't really

01:17:34.630 --> 01:17:37.930
have a perspective. I feel bad. I had made a

01:17:37.930 --> 01:17:40.550
joke perspective. Like, why am I always being

01:17:40.550 --> 01:17:43.930
ghosted? Yeah, go for it. Oh, is that something

01:17:43.930 --> 01:17:46.829
that you deal with? That's perfect. I'm curious

01:17:46.829 --> 01:17:49.029
about this one, because I have a lot of strong

01:17:49.029 --> 01:17:51.770
perspectives on ghosting. I don't know. Oh, okay.

01:17:51.949 --> 01:17:53.630
Well, then, okay. Well, then let's just talk

01:17:53.630 --> 01:17:55.310
about the topic of ghosting. I just think I'm

01:17:55.310 --> 01:17:59.670
bad at socializing, but I think I try. I try.

01:17:59.840 --> 01:18:05.520
I try, you know, I interact with people. I interact

01:18:05.520 --> 01:18:08.340
with women and I think it's generally positive.

01:18:08.399 --> 01:18:10.399
And then they just like, it just, they just disappear.

01:18:10.520 --> 01:18:12.640
And I'm just, it just, just tell me you don't

01:18:12.640 --> 01:18:14.180
want to talk to me anymore. Why do you gotta

01:18:14.180 --> 01:18:16.520
keep me guessing for days and days? I just don't

01:18:16.520 --> 01:18:19.939
like, I mean, I know ghosting is a symptom of

01:18:19.939 --> 01:18:25.340
like some other kind of emotion you can't process

01:18:25.340 --> 01:18:26.939
because it's too overwhelming, but it's just,

01:18:27.020 --> 01:18:31.310
ugh. Just kill him That's my perspective is why

01:18:31.310 --> 01:18:33.829
why do we have to ghost each other? Why and how

01:18:33.829 --> 01:18:37.609
does it normally go? Like you send a message

01:18:37.609 --> 01:18:40.149
and they just don't respond or how like how does

01:18:40.149 --> 01:18:43.550
it normally go? Yeah, and then you know, I'll

01:18:43.550 --> 01:18:47.390
try and be really, you know nice and amicable.

01:18:47.829 --> 01:18:49.649
And then eventually it always comes to this.

01:18:49.890 --> 01:18:52.789
I'll get to a point where I go like, oh, I haven't

01:18:52.789 --> 01:18:54.189
heard from you in a while and I hope you're doing

01:18:54.189 --> 01:18:56.409
okay. It just seems desperate. But I never say

01:18:56.409 --> 01:19:01.130
like, you know, forget you. Oh, you're such an

01:19:01.130 --> 01:19:02.710
expletive whatever. I don't want to swear on

01:19:02.710 --> 01:19:06.289
the podcast. But yeah, why? Why does it happen

01:19:06.289 --> 01:19:11.449
to me? Do you, I mean, I guess I have a question.

01:19:12.689 --> 01:19:16.420
Do you feel like, do you feel like... are fully

01:19:16.420 --> 01:19:19.939
opening up to the people that you're trying to

01:19:19.939 --> 01:19:22.359
get to know? Like, do you feel like you're letting

01:19:22.359 --> 01:19:25.739
people in? I mean, if, I think I'm not, I think,

01:19:25.739 --> 01:19:28.060
hmm, that's tough to answer. I'm not, I'm not

01:19:28.060 --> 01:19:30.420
opening up, but I'm not, if they were to ask

01:19:30.420 --> 01:19:32.560
me something, I wouldn't deny it. But I think

01:19:32.560 --> 01:19:36.720
I don't open up because I don't want people to

01:19:36.720 --> 01:19:40.539
be, I don't know, uncomfortable, scared away,

01:19:40.859 --> 01:19:43.979
things like that. Because sometimes I have this

01:19:43.979 --> 01:19:45.739
theory, I don't know if you agree, Ruby, I have

01:19:45.739 --> 01:19:51.000
a theory about ghosting that people ghost other

01:19:51.000 --> 01:19:53.479
people that they don't feel an emotional connection

01:19:53.479 --> 01:19:57.039
with. Because see, if you feel connected to someone

01:19:57.039 --> 01:20:00.800
and they're fully opening themselves up to you,

01:20:01.359 --> 01:20:05.539
then it's harder to ghost them because you feel

01:20:05.539 --> 01:20:08.420
bad about it. But when you feel disconnected

01:20:08.420 --> 01:20:12.079
to someone, then it's easy to ghost. Because

01:20:12.079 --> 01:20:15.000
there is no, there is nothing there. There is

01:20:15.000 --> 01:20:18.119
nothing there that makes you feel that guilt

01:20:18.119 --> 01:20:21.140
feeling, you know? I mean, it's also a lack of

01:20:21.140 --> 01:20:23.859
emotional maturity. I mean, let's just call it

01:20:23.859 --> 01:20:27.600
for what it is. But I do feel like that's the

01:20:27.600 --> 01:20:29.659
reason why I ask the question is because I do

01:20:29.659 --> 01:20:31.800
sometimes feel like people who are closed off

01:20:31.800 --> 01:20:35.260
emotionally or who don't open up easily or don't

01:20:35.260 --> 01:20:37.899
let people in tend to get ghosted a lot. Because

01:20:37.899 --> 01:20:41.420
at the end of the day, if... If there's no emotional

01:20:41.420 --> 01:20:44.060
connection, then it's easy for someone to dismiss

01:20:44.060 --> 01:20:47.180
you. But that's just my theory. I don't know

01:20:47.180 --> 01:20:51.800
if you agree, Ruby. Okay, yeah, but I do have

01:20:51.800 --> 01:20:54.180
something to say on this, but first I have a

01:20:54.180 --> 01:20:56.859
question for you. Are you saying that, just to

01:20:56.859 --> 01:21:00.699
tie everything up here, you should take the risk

01:21:00.699 --> 01:21:04.220
and do something like, I knew you were going

01:21:04.220 --> 01:21:08.760
to say that! And take the leadership in sharing

01:21:08.760 --> 01:21:14.149
and being kind. How do we give points for incorporating

01:21:14.149 --> 01:21:19.750
all ideas in the one hack statement? Yeah, you're

01:21:19.750 --> 01:21:26.250
right. Funny. So I do get ghosted. But for different

01:21:26.250 --> 01:21:30.329
reasons. And I do ghost for different reasons.

01:21:30.449 --> 01:21:34.569
I ghost people who are chasers. I have a problem

01:21:34.569 --> 01:21:37.689
with chasers. I think a lot of trans women have

01:21:37.689 --> 01:21:41.539
a problem with chasers. What is, what is, wait,

01:21:41.659 --> 01:21:44.119
is that a term? A chaser? Or are you speaking,

01:21:44.380 --> 01:21:47.619
this is just your own? Yeah. A chaser is a person

01:21:47.619 --> 01:21:51.899
who is interested in speaking to you for the

01:21:51.899 --> 01:21:55.100
sole express purpose of having sex with you as

01:21:55.100 --> 01:21:58.579
a one -eyed sand with zero emotional attachment.

01:21:59.319 --> 01:22:02.960
Yeah. And, and they don't, and it's, it's exasperated

01:22:02.960 --> 01:22:05.279
because these people generally don't want to

01:22:05.279 --> 01:22:07.819
be seen with you in public because they are actually

01:22:07.819 --> 01:22:13.260
transphobic. So that's my problem with being

01:22:13.260 --> 01:22:16.039
ghosted. And I've made it clear in this podcast

01:22:16.039 --> 01:22:19.659
already that I'm an unabashedly sexual being.

01:22:20.380 --> 01:22:24.220
Like things are on the table, but I have to like

01:22:24.220 --> 01:22:28.699
you. Of course. Like it's a very simple, right?

01:22:28.840 --> 01:22:31.340
If you don't want to have coffee with me, and

01:22:31.340 --> 01:22:33.920
if we can't have a good conversation and connect,

01:22:34.520 --> 01:22:38.409
it's not worth my while. So it comes back to

01:22:38.409 --> 01:22:40.489
exactly what you said Chase if I don't feel an

01:22:40.489 --> 01:22:42.949
emotional connection with you and I think that

01:22:42.949 --> 01:22:46.170
or Sorry, I'm saying you like with any person

01:22:46.170 --> 01:22:53.229
It's not it's not gonna happen Ruby as an aside

01:22:53.229 --> 01:22:55.529
question. Are you saying you're a sapio sexual

01:22:55.529 --> 01:22:59.689
and you can't just be? animalistically attracted

01:22:59.689 --> 01:23:03.359
to someone No, I can definitely be animalistically

01:23:03.359 --> 01:23:05.680
attracted to someone and they don't necessarily

01:23:05.680 --> 01:23:08.439
need to be... Like, to fight sapiosexual, how

01:23:08.439 --> 01:23:12.239
smart do you have to be? Like, the bar for sapiosexuality

01:23:12.239 --> 01:23:16.340
is... I never liked that. That's such a loaded

01:23:16.340 --> 01:23:20.060
term to me, sapiosexual. I always never trusted

01:23:20.060 --> 01:23:22.840
the person who says, I'm a sapiosexual. Okay,

01:23:22.979 --> 01:23:25.340
whatever. Yeah, because you only use that term

01:23:25.340 --> 01:23:30.789
if you're trying to sound smart. So... Yeah,

01:23:31.130 --> 01:23:34.529
rather sharp right like I could have intellectual

01:23:34.529 --> 01:23:38.710
conversations about soap, you know But you have

01:23:38.710 --> 01:23:41.810
to be into the the the topic of soaps What kind

01:23:41.810 --> 01:23:43.869
of sap your sexuality that doesn't mean the guy

01:23:43.869 --> 01:23:46.029
who knows a lot about soap is stupid. He knows

01:23:46.029 --> 01:23:49.430
a lot about soap So yeah, but the connection

01:23:49.430 --> 01:23:53.359
thing chase like you just You just totally disqualified

01:23:53.359 --> 01:23:55.220
my whole ghost thing because that one emotional

01:23:55.220 --> 01:23:56.960
connections don't get ghosted. I'm just like,

01:23:56.960 --> 01:23:58.960
yeah, that actually does make sense. Cause I'm

01:23:58.960 --> 01:24:01.699
just, you know, having these kinds of like, I

01:24:01.699 --> 01:24:04.319
don't say vapid, but vapid conversations with

01:24:04.319 --> 01:24:07.619
people in a digital space. And I think a big

01:24:07.619 --> 01:24:09.560
part of it is because of, you know, my location

01:24:09.560 --> 01:24:12.100
and where I am. I've known people. It's funny

01:24:12.100 --> 01:24:16.039
to me. I've known people for so long on the internet

01:24:16.039 --> 01:24:18.800
and we're in the same city and we just have not

01:24:18.800 --> 01:24:21.520
met yet for whatever reason. And they're just.

01:24:21.789 --> 01:24:24.149
They'll always, it seems like they'll always

01:24:24.149 --> 01:24:26.569
make an excuse. But I don't know if it is an

01:24:26.569 --> 01:24:31.189
excuse or just timing, but we still haven't met

01:24:31.189 --> 01:24:34.010
yet. And you know, maybe they're just not comfortable

01:24:34.010 --> 01:24:37.329
yet. But the thing is like, why are they still

01:24:37.329 --> 01:24:40.210
putting up with me? And why am I still putting

01:24:40.210 --> 01:24:43.050
up with them? And why are you taking the initiative?

01:24:43.810 --> 01:24:48.550
I try. I really do. You do? But as a man, right?

01:24:49.050 --> 01:24:55.260
No. I will not do that. No man should just take

01:24:55.260 --> 01:24:58.500
the initiative and show up. That is a recipe

01:24:58.500 --> 01:25:03.640
for disaster. You can't do that. No, here's what

01:25:03.640 --> 01:25:07.539
you do. Okay, so here's what I'm imagining right

01:25:07.539 --> 01:25:10.579
now. I'll give you a situation that I've been

01:25:10.579 --> 01:25:15.500
in. I was speaking to this guy online and he

01:25:15.500 --> 01:25:19.859
lives in another city. And I'm like, I'm in Suzhou

01:25:19.859 --> 01:25:24.880
and he says, you should come visit me. I'm like,

01:25:24.920 --> 01:25:29.840
why? Because I like you. Why? No answer, right?

01:25:30.359 --> 01:25:34.439
So like, we've been speaking for two days. Like

01:25:34.439 --> 01:25:37.300
literally just two days. You expect me to go

01:25:37.300 --> 01:25:40.180
there. I'm like, I'm sorry, there's no reason

01:25:40.180 --> 01:25:43.739
for me to go there. But flip this around to a

01:25:43.739 --> 01:25:47.359
scenario where... He keeps chatting. He never

01:25:47.359 --> 01:25:52.779
asks me to go to his city. And a month or so

01:25:52.779 --> 01:25:55.340
into us chatting, he sends me a message like,

01:25:55.579 --> 01:26:01.239
hey, I'm in town. I'm going to this cool restaurant

01:26:01.239 --> 01:26:05.359
I like. I'm going to go there. Do you want to

01:26:05.359 --> 01:26:10.140
meet up and chat? Yes. And there, right? For

01:26:10.140 --> 01:26:13.819
sure. Compared to like, hey, come to this city.

01:26:14.039 --> 01:26:16.869
Yeah. without even a suggestion. So what you

01:26:16.869 --> 01:26:19.189
could do is like, hey, I'm in town. I saw this

01:26:19.189 --> 01:26:21.810
really cool restaurant. I was wondering if you'd

01:26:21.810 --> 01:26:23.989
be interested in meeting me. You're inviting

01:26:23.989 --> 01:26:27.090
her to a public space in her hometown and giving

01:26:27.090 --> 01:26:29.789
her the choice and power. Of course. Yeah, yeah,

01:26:29.970 --> 01:26:32.010
yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm well aware of those dynamics.

01:26:33.350 --> 01:26:37.729
It's just, you know, there are those people who,

01:26:38.409 --> 01:26:42.579
for whatever reason, will say, oh, I have a cold,

01:26:42.640 --> 01:26:44.739
but maybe next week. And you're like, oh, OK,

01:26:44.840 --> 01:26:47.479
they're rejecting me. That's OK. It's just cold

01:26:47.479 --> 01:26:50.439
feet. Yeah, it's cold feet. But then like days

01:26:50.439 --> 01:26:53.399
later, they'll talk to you again. Yeah, that's

01:26:53.399 --> 01:26:55.640
annoying. A cute little emoji. And you're like,

01:26:55.699 --> 01:27:00.119
oh, hey, what's up? And then push, pull, and

01:27:00.119 --> 01:27:03.920
then ghost it. And one of the most fun things

01:27:03.920 --> 01:27:08.079
I've had, the most fun I've had this year. Yeah.

01:27:08.590 --> 01:27:12.510
You guys will both know about this and the TikTok

01:27:12.510 --> 01:27:18.390
refugee crisis. When, when TikTok got shut down.

01:27:18.390 --> 01:27:22.149
Yeah, months ago. In the States, a bunch of TikTok

01:27:22.149 --> 01:27:27.270
users came to a Chinese app called Redbook. Um,

01:27:27.270 --> 01:27:30.529
and all of the chat rooms just like, boom, spiked.

01:27:30.609 --> 01:27:33.850
There were so many people on there talking and

01:27:33.850 --> 01:27:37.739
suddenly English. And today still. Like some

01:27:37.739 --> 01:27:40.119
of the people have stayed and they keep going

01:27:40.119 --> 01:27:43.279
on to Red Note. I have met personally, face to

01:27:43.279 --> 01:27:47.859
face, seven people that I met online on Red Note.

01:27:48.680 --> 01:27:53.699
Um, and it's been so much fun because you create,

01:27:54.220 --> 01:27:56.640
there was zero expectation. We just started talking

01:27:56.640 --> 01:27:58.939
online and they're like, Hey, I'm going, I'm

01:27:58.939 --> 01:28:01.100
going to go to China. Is it possible that we

01:28:01.100 --> 01:28:04.340
could like meet up? and they're in Shanghai and

01:28:04.340 --> 01:28:06.180
that's a completely different scenario, right?

01:28:06.239 --> 01:28:09.039
I will go, I will pick you up at the airport.

01:28:10.359 --> 01:28:15.720
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And also too, I was going

01:28:15.720 --> 01:28:19.180
to ask you both, have you thought about or reflected

01:28:19.180 --> 01:28:23.800
on your subconscious thoughts when it comes to

01:28:23.800 --> 01:28:27.779
relationships and dating? I will say yes, but

01:28:27.779 --> 01:28:30.100
I don't know if that's actually true. I want

01:28:30.100 --> 01:28:32.930
to think I am reflecting, but... I don't objectively

01:28:32.930 --> 01:28:35.569
know if I'm reflecting the right way. Because

01:28:35.569 --> 01:28:41.689
one thing I've discovered is... Aw. Aw. So cute.

01:28:41.689 --> 01:28:47.170
Ruby, why are you distracting us? This is...

01:28:47.170 --> 01:28:54.449
This is Tesla. She's the dog. Hi, Tesla. Beautiful.

01:28:54.510 --> 01:28:59.250
After the scientist, not the car. Of course.

01:29:00.489 --> 01:29:02.750
It's an important distinction to make. But yeah,

01:29:02.770 --> 01:29:05.289
one thing that I've discovered too that I find

01:29:05.289 --> 01:29:07.949
really fascinating is that sometimes I feel like

01:29:07.949 --> 01:29:10.930
we carry subconscious beliefs about relationship

01:29:10.930 --> 01:29:13.850
into new connections, and we unintentionally

01:29:13.850 --> 01:29:18.510
push people away because they can feel our closed

01:29:18.510 --> 01:29:22.069
-offness. They can feel our negativity when it

01:29:22.069 --> 01:29:24.250
comes to thinking, oh, this is just going to

01:29:24.250 --> 01:29:26.449
be another person that ghosted me or another

01:29:26.449 --> 01:29:30.100
person that disappointed me. When people can

01:29:30.100 --> 01:29:33.319
feel that and what's interesting is that it becomes

01:29:33.319 --> 01:29:36.060
a self -fulfilling prophecy where it becomes

01:29:36.060 --> 01:29:40.880
a cycle now. Because until we shift our subconscious

01:29:40.880 --> 01:29:43.159
beliefs about love and dating and the people

01:29:43.159 --> 01:29:46.239
that we interact with, we just keep manifesting

01:29:46.239 --> 01:29:48.539
the same outcome. And so that's another thing

01:29:48.539 --> 01:29:50.579
that I thought about with ghosting is I think

01:29:50.579 --> 01:29:54.680
sometimes it's hard to admit that we perpetuate

01:29:54.680 --> 01:29:58.359
the ghosting. We perpetuate that cycle. because

01:29:58.359 --> 01:30:02.079
of the energy that we bring to connections. And

01:30:02.079 --> 01:30:04.479
people are simply responding to our subconscious

01:30:04.479 --> 01:30:07.920
beliefs and energy. And really just confirming

01:30:07.920 --> 01:30:10.199
what we already think is gonna happen, which

01:30:10.199 --> 01:30:14.119
is ghosting or disappointment. Yeah, very true.

01:30:14.579 --> 01:30:18.859
Chase, are you sure you're just a hostile? Sure

01:30:18.859 --> 01:30:25.199
not some like LA guru. You weren't, you didn't

01:30:25.199 --> 01:30:27.100
do anything like that in the past, are you sure?

01:30:27.199 --> 01:30:30.420
So you're offering a lot of good advice today.

01:30:31.300 --> 01:30:36.500
I do my best. How is your dating life? If I may

01:30:36.500 --> 01:30:42.340
ask. You said how is my daily life? Dating. Oh,

01:30:42.340 --> 01:30:47.680
dating life. Oh, okay. Yeah. Funny enough, I

01:30:47.680 --> 01:30:51.159
have my own sort of cycles and demons that I

01:30:51.159 --> 01:30:53.800
also need to break. myself, which is why I think

01:30:53.800 --> 01:30:57.359
I can speak on it because as someone who continues

01:30:57.359 --> 01:30:59.979
to come with, you know, challenges in that area

01:30:59.979 --> 01:31:04.640
of my life, it's yeah, it's become very salient

01:31:04.640 --> 01:31:07.260
for me. So I think for me, the cycle that I'm

01:31:07.260 --> 01:31:11.699
trying to break is I tend to move fast because

01:31:11.699 --> 01:31:14.460
I'm a very passionate, I'm a very passionate

01:31:14.460 --> 01:31:19.939
guy. And so when I am into someone, then I'm

01:31:19.939 --> 01:31:24.500
just like, I'm like the opposite of cautious.

01:31:24.600 --> 01:31:27.939
I'm like, let's book a ticket, let's plan a trip

01:31:27.939 --> 01:31:31.420
together, let's go for it. You know, I'm just,

01:31:31.739 --> 01:31:33.640
I'm, cause I'm so, I think what it is is I'm

01:31:33.640 --> 01:31:37.739
so unjaded when it comes to my heart and my heart

01:31:37.739 --> 01:31:40.880
is so open. So I'm kind of the opposite of you,

01:31:41.020 --> 01:31:45.399
Luigi, in that I'm so open and I'm so giving

01:31:45.399 --> 01:31:49.779
of my energy that oftentimes I go too quickly

01:31:49.779 --> 01:31:53.579
and... don't allow the time to really get to

01:31:53.579 --> 01:31:55.920
know the person. So I think if you and I were

01:31:55.920 --> 01:31:59.479
to combine our energies, we'd be perfect. Yeah.

01:32:01.819 --> 01:32:05.600
It seems that way. There's definitely, you need

01:32:05.600 --> 01:32:10.449
a delicate balance. I can admit. I am very patient

01:32:10.449 --> 01:32:14.050
and careful because I do, I think I do on some

01:32:14.050 --> 01:32:15.989
level think like, it's not going to work out.

01:32:15.989 --> 01:32:18.909
That's terrible. See, and I'm the opposite in

01:32:18.909 --> 01:32:20.890
that I think everything's going to work out.

01:32:20.890 --> 01:32:25.050
So I go for it. It's your business acumen. You're

01:32:25.050 --> 01:32:29.569
a go getter. That's what it is. Yeah. At the

01:32:29.569 --> 01:32:32.109
end of the day, I know that I have enough resilience

01:32:32.109 --> 01:32:34.810
to get over the heartbreak if it doesn't work

01:32:34.810 --> 01:32:37.789
out. And so I think that's the difference. It's

01:32:37.789 --> 01:32:41.079
like, I'm willing to put my heart out there and

01:32:41.079 --> 01:32:44.199
be vulnerable knowing that it can be disappointed

01:32:44.199 --> 01:32:48.640
or heartbroken because the alternative is being

01:32:48.640 --> 01:32:53.119
cautious and that person's sensing that and then

01:32:53.119 --> 01:32:57.399
it makes them cautious. It makes them not want

01:32:57.399 --> 01:33:00.539
to put themselves out there. And so then you

01:33:00.539 --> 01:33:03.220
kind of have a stalemate essentially. And so

01:33:03.220 --> 01:33:06.020
I've just become used to being the person that's

01:33:06.020 --> 01:33:08.750
the initiator. And it's like, hey, like, let's

01:33:08.750 --> 01:33:12.109
go for this. And usually it rubs off on people,

01:33:12.750 --> 01:33:17.729
even if it all comes crashing down. Right. Not

01:33:17.729 --> 01:33:20.229
really good advice. I think that's really, really

01:33:20.229 --> 01:33:23.869
useful. Yeah. Now I'm just, I'm going to have

01:33:23.869 --> 01:33:28.470
to uncomfortably push myself. Yeah. To be a go

01:33:28.470 --> 01:33:30.810
-getter. You'd be surprised how people respond

01:33:30.810 --> 01:33:33.810
to boldness. I think people are desperate for

01:33:33.810 --> 01:33:36.090
it. They're desperate for someone to just break

01:33:36.090 --> 01:33:39.270
away from the scripts when it comes to dating

01:33:39.270 --> 01:33:42.470
and just do something completely out the norm

01:33:42.470 --> 01:33:46.390
and just kind of shake them up almost. And then

01:33:46.390 --> 01:33:50.069
you find that, you know, those are the best kind

01:33:50.069 --> 01:33:52.229
of connections, those spontaneous connections

01:33:52.229 --> 01:33:55.449
where you're just letting go and you're not overthinking

01:33:55.449 --> 01:33:59.149
it and just allowing your heart to leave and

01:33:59.149 --> 01:34:01.970
not your head, which I know a lot of cisgender

01:34:01.970 --> 01:34:10.229
males struggle with. Yes. You're all in your

01:34:10.229 --> 01:34:12.630
head when you need to be in your heart space.

01:34:14.069 --> 01:34:18.609
Yeah. Definitely. I mean, yeah, better to just

01:34:18.609 --> 01:34:20.189
go for it. I mean, if you're going to be hesitant

01:34:20.189 --> 01:34:21.569
and you know it's not going to work out, then

01:34:21.569 --> 01:34:24.210
just go for it and make it not work out. Yeah.

01:34:24.369 --> 01:34:26.430
Because then it might work out. It's almost a

01:34:26.430 --> 01:34:29.930
paradox almost. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

01:34:29.970 --> 01:34:32.810
So to answer your question, Ruby, I am single,

01:34:32.989 --> 01:34:36.720
but I am continuing to... you know, put myself

01:34:36.720 --> 01:34:40.560
out there. And sometimes I get it right, but

01:34:40.560 --> 01:34:43.239
sometimes I get it wrong. But at the end of the

01:34:43.239 --> 01:34:50.100
day, I'm enjoying the journey regardless. I'm

01:34:50.100 --> 01:34:52.840
sure the destination is going to be worthwhile

01:34:52.840 --> 01:34:55.359
because you're putting out all the right energy

01:34:55.359 --> 01:34:59.119
and you're going to get exactly who you deserve,

01:34:59.500 --> 01:35:03.859
who is a soulmate, a great person. Yes, I hope

01:35:03.859 --> 01:35:09.050
so. I think that is an excellent spot to wrap

01:35:09.050 --> 01:35:15.090
up today's episode. This has been Kaleidoscope

01:35:15.090 --> 01:35:20.609
PBTS with Chase King, founder of SoulFam Hostel

01:35:20.609 --> 01:35:26.609
in Cape Town, South Africa's first LGBTQIA +,

01:35:26.609 --> 01:35:32.859
positive, expressly inclusive hostel. Find SoulFam

01:35:32.859 --> 01:35:39.000
Hostel on www .soulfamhostel .com. I have stayed

01:35:39.000 --> 01:35:43.199
there. It is a lovely place and I encourage anybody

01:35:43.199 --> 01:35:46.340
to do so. Thank you so much. I was also joined

01:35:46.340 --> 01:35:50.979
with Luigi. You can find Luigi on Kaleidoscope.

01:35:51.399 --> 01:35:58.800
You can find me at echoember .co .uk or on Instagram

01:35:58.800 --> 01:36:04.159
at Fire from heat. Thank you for listening. Goodbye.