Welcome back to Entirely NBA, hosted by Entirely
Media. I'm your host, Darion Robinson. Kyle Murph,
what's good? We got a special guest with us today,
Michael Carter -Williams. What's going on, bro?
Ain't nothing, bro. Thanks for having me. I appreciate
it. I want to ask you this question. What's the
hardest part about being an NBA player? Definitely
the travel. Just, you know, the mental drain,
the physical drain that it has on you, you know.
being in different time zones, waking up, you
know, being tired. The travel, you know, takes
a toll on you. Yeah, I've heard that a lot. So
how do you actually deal with that? And it's
not something you can really take out of it.
It's part of the process, right? So not even
deal with it. How do you learn to cope or make
that something that doesn't weigh on you so heavily?
Just stagger sleep, like, you know, try to sleep.
you know during the plane rides you know make
sure naps are you know essential in in the routine
um that's something that i always did was you
know try to get a nap before you know every game
um just to be real scheduled on that on my sleep
now during this time as you have started seeing
other opportunities other than basketball do
you still follow that same regimen that same
scheme that same schedule no i haven't honestly
okay okay i like i just last year was the first
year that that I didn't play, the first season
that I didn't play. So it's been an adjustment
period for me. Like I'm trying to still get adjusted
to my daily routines, what that looks like, things
I'm doing, you know, off the floor. But I'm getting,
I'm starting to feel like, okay, like I need
to go back to, you know, even doing some hoop
workouts, like just, you know, staying active,
staying in the game. You know, I just, I'm still
trying to figure that out. I'm still trying to
figure out what that looks like for me. my daily
routine and, you know, how I can, you know, most
benefit as for, for, you know, as a human being
for that. Kind of backpedaling. Do you think
that, um, like not having that sleep, did that
affect or that traveling? Did that affect your,
your play in the game? Sometimes, sometimes,
definitely some days I'll go into the game a
little, you know, with a little bit more energy
than, than others. Um, you know, you just get
tired, you know, especially on the back to backs.
Like if you, if you play in, you know, LA, and
then you play a Sacramento on a back, that's
a short distance, but you know, even the longer,
you know, distance from Portland to Sacramento,
like a back -to -back, you know, waking up on
that, you know, second back -to -back and some
days, some guys, some, some seasons, man, we
got like, we had the 12, 1130 game on a back
-to -back. Like I remember a couple of years
ago, I think they took them out now, but, but
for sure. The league, they schedule for that,
though, right? They make sure. Don't they put
that together, like making sure you're not going
from Cali to New York? No, no, no. They don't
do it like Cali to New York, but there's other
distance. You go on a West Coast trip, you could
get a little three-, four -hour flight that,
you know, on a back -to -back night where, you
know, they should just throw one day in between.
They get you sometimes, though. For sure it does.
For sure. So, all right, let's jump right into
Syracuse because I want to talk about this part
of it. And I've watched, trust me, like when
we said these interviews, the research that we
try to do is pretty immense, right? So I've watched
pretty much every interview you did. So some
of this I know is going to be like a rerun for
you. But I want to obviously do this in a way
that provides maybe a different perspective.
So when we talk about Syracuse, obviously being
the guy up until this point, you know, being
behind three other guards. I want to ask you,
what the hell kept you from transferring out
when you were getting little to no playing time?
I know that's frustrating. So why didn't you
transfer out? The honest answer is I knew that
the platform, the keys to the car, would be mine
the next year. Oh, okay. Nah, nah, nah. How'd
you know that? How'd you know that? Well, because
Dion was going to leave. We knew Dion was going
to leave. Scoop was a fifth -year senior, so
he was going to leave, right? So it was going
to be me and Brandon. you know as the as the
you know and it was up in the air if brandon
was going to leave so like i knew that you know
but like nobody was going to take that spot for
me that that next year if i all the dues that
i paid my freshman year of but there was plenty
of times where i threatened to leave where i
was like i'm out of here like there was plenty
of times but then i you'd always have that little
grace period where you sit down and you think
about it and you're like, damn, if I leave and
go somewhere else, then I got to sit out a year.
This was back when the transfer and you couldn't
just transfer and play that year. So I'd have
to sit out that year and then wait for my junior
year. I was like, it just doesn't make sense
for me. If I know I'm going to sit here and play
here and I've been working my ass off this whole
year, I've been competing in practice every single
day, every day were wars in practice. there was
no reason for, you know, it wasn't a good idea
for me to leave. I just thought that like the
best thing for people, it was frustrating. It
was hard. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I want to pivot
real quick because we just came off an interview
with Jeremy Lamb. And so I want to ask you then,
because you said it yourself, you said, I knew
I was going to play. Ain't nobody taking that
spot for me. That's confidence in its finest.
He said that he didn't have that type of confidence.
So I want to ask you, when the hell did you know
you were the man? When, when did that confidence
come for you? I think. And during our, like I
said, our practices were wars. During those practices,
when I, you know, the days I got the better of
Scoop or Brandon or even Deion, I was like, man,
like these guys are playing at the next level
somewhere. You know, Deion was definitely getting
drafted, right? Like playing ones with him, like
if I can do well and be successful against him
and Scoop and Brandon, I was like, okay, then
I know I can, you know, be successful at the
next level. That's what really kind of opened
my eyes. Like, oh, yeah, like I can play at the
highest level of this game. But yeah, like our
first unit was like Scoop, Brandon, Chris Joseph,
James Sutherland, and Fab Mello. And our second
unit was, our second unit was me, Dion, CJ Fair,
Rakim Christmas, and By Musakita. So we had like,
we had a crazy, we had a crazy second unit. Like
sometimes, you know, second unit would get the
better of our first unit, you know, vice versa.
So like every day was, every day was a war. And
I knew that, that was getting me ready to play
in that next level. So that gave me a lot of
confidence. With that confidence, did you still
put the work into that next summer going into
your sophomore year? Or was it just like you
kind of just knew? Did the coach come up to you
and ask you, like, hey, look, here's the keys
to the car. You got to lead us. Is that what
they did to you? Yeah, I mean, it was kind of
like a, even during the year, like I was the
first one to practice, last one to leave. Like
I would like basketball was my outlet, like getting
all my frustration out, like playing scrimmages
in the practices were like games to me because
like I wouldn't play. I remember Coach Hopkins
and I, we got into it. And that's like he was
like a big like an uncle, big brother figure
to me, you know, when I was at Syracuse and he
he subbed me out during practice. And I was like,
man, you subbed me out there in practice. You
know, I don't play in the game like I was going
at him because he subbed me out. and like we
were like face to face damn near and actually
he had one of me on the nose a little bit i kind
of i owe him one for that but uh he but yeah
like so every single day you know i try to do
my best and that that carried over to the summer
for me to you know really prepare myself because
everything that i was asking for everything that
i was bitching about You know, all that was like,
okay, now it's your turn. So now I was like,
all right, I got to be ready now because everything
I asked for now is on the table for me. I got
to be ready to go get it. I like that. So let's
fast forward just a little bit there. After eight
double -doubles you had your sophomore year,
I think five of those were in a row, what, almost
12 points. I think it was like seven assists,
five rebounds, and then almost damn near three
steals, which, first of all, that defense aspect
has always been a staple in your career. We're
going to talk about that. But what was the atmosphere
like around campus at Syracuse when you guys
made it to the Final Four that year? It was lit.
Every game we won in the tournament, when we
come back home, it was exciting. You guys know
Syracuse, they don't have an NBA team. All of
us are the stars in the city. Every single game,
we got... immense support from our you know from
everyone all our fans everyone at the school
um it was a good time so how was that transition
after you know the um the tough losses in the
final four how was that transition transition
to getting ready for the draft to go into the
nba the next year after you knew he was headed
up um it was a lot like everything just kind
of happened so fast um actually my my house had
burnt down during the yeah but during the the
tournament um and you know i i probably was going
to enter the draft anyway i had a good tournament
i you know did well but like that was the final
stamp for me to be like okay things are a little
rocky in my family like i got it like there's
no turning back there's no thinking about going
back to college like i'm going to the nba um
so i kind of was dealing with a lot you know
going into the draft um but you know i just let
you know i leaned on my family leaned on my agents
and you know going through the pre -draft stuff
working out um adjusting to you know the lifestyle
um it was a lot a lot was coming at coming at
me at once did you have like a thought process
of what number you're going in um yeah i knew
i think i knew i was going to go lottery my agent
was confident that i was going to go lottery
i was nervous though because i didn't want to
be that guy that you know the camera panned to
like every time somebody was you know did get
drafted so um i did well in my workouts for teams
i got invited back by a few teams But it was
a good process. It was a cool process. It was
a long summer, man. I couldn't wait to be done
with it. Those emotions, especially with a traumatic
situation like that with your house, being able
to make it there and get to the NBA, like financially
help your family, did that take off some pressure
or did that just make you want to work even harder
to go even further in your career? Yeah, no,
it definitely took off some pressure. I was obviously
able to help out financially. My brothers and
sisters lost everything. A lot of my stuff was...
All my clothes and material stuff was in at Syracuse,
but they lost kind of all their stuff. So being
able to help them out, being able to help my
family out, that took a lot of pressure off from
me and my family. Well, good. I'm glad you were
able to help with that because that's a big step
for you as a man. Right. Now, 76ers. In a process
year, which has been the staple of that damn
city and team for too long. You had lost 26 straight
games that year. I mean, obviously you yourself
had a lot of usage. Number one, congratulations
on that. Appreciate you. No problem. You were
also hitting that rookie wall. So, I mean, I
got to ask, as a man, how did you maintain your
professionalism and your play that year? Man,
it was a learning experience for me. Hitting
that rookie wall was crazy. I remember trying
to sneak in 10, 15 -minute naps on the bus before
games. That was probably the most tired year
I've ever experienced in my life. But I was grateful
for the opportunity just to go out and hoop and
be in the NBA. I was a kid who worked my whole
life to get to the NBA. And I was excited to
play against different guys, going against Brown,
going against Steph, Westbrook. D Rose like you
know playing against the guys that I watched
growing up I'm like man like I finally get to
do that so there was some excitement there and
then all the other stuff that you know happened
um you know losing 26 games straight You're having
new teammates every other game. That was hard
to deal with. As a competitor, that was hard.
Most of my life, I've won games. I've been a
winner on all my teams. So that was hard. I'm
not going to lie. Those were some tough days
where I was upset with losing. Not only losing,
but just even going into games feeling like...
You know, we're heavily, heavily outmatched.
Like I'll never go in a game and be like, we're
going to lose. But like to look over on the other
side and be like, you know how everybody, you
know, games like that where you're just like,
man, like we got to go through this again. And
it was like we'd be close. We'd be so close.
And it was like teams would just chill like against
us for the first three quarters. And then the
fourth turn up and we would lose. How do you
think winning rookie of the year impacted your
career? I think it put a staple on my career.
I mean, first, I mean, to me, it was an accomplishment
that, you know, that I'll obviously remember
forever. You know, it brought light to my name.
People knew who I was. It's funny, though. No
one had picked me to win Rookie of the Year before,
you know, before I got, you know, drafted. Right.
But then, you know, the comments are being made
that I won Rookie of the Year and, you know,
my career seesawed a little bit. From the beginning,
I don't think anyone had me winning Rookie of
the Year or doing the things that I was able
to do in the NBA. So to me, it's a real accomplishment
for me. But obviously, it was tough. It put a
target on my back. A lot of the guys, I was getting
attention, a lot of the guys in the league, especially
when I was a rookie. I remember even bringing
out the best of guys because I was heavily favored
for Rookie of the Year. So it was good, though.
It was fun. It was competitive. I wouldn't want
it any other way. So with that being said, do
you think that you got a lot of criticism for
being Rookie of the Year of the bad draft year
when you came in? Yeah, I mean, I think that's
a misconception. I don't think we had it. It
was a bad draft year. If you look at everybody
who panned out, our draft was solid. It was definitely
solid. I think, like I said before, it's an accomplishment
that I'm happy with. People always say, I peaked
at my first game. I don't know what else you
wanted. I don't even know how I'm supposed to
get nine steals twice in my career. Having 22,
12, 7, 9. Not many people can do that once. Obviously,
it's a... But hey. I'll take it any day of the
week. That bothers me. People, I hadn't read
that, but clearly you've heard it. People said
you peaked after that first game. Yeah, I've
heard it a bunch. You know, I mean, everyone,
you know, fans love to talk. It's part of the
game. Everybody got an opinion. It is what it
is. Yeah, everybody has an opinion. That's wicked
to me. So, I mean, in that rookie year, I think,
what, season starts in October. So November 10th
would have been maybe a week and a half into
your season. You matched up against Kyrie and
the Cavs. Do you remember that game, that double
OT game? Yep, yep. I remember that game. I love
that. So as a young rook coming in and I watched
a hell of a game on your part, what was that
like being matched up? Yeah, I mean, it was a
point where, you know, again, like I'll watch
guys and I'll be like, man. I can't believe I'm
going against this dude. And that was another
one. It was Kyrie, like, going against him. It
was just exciting. Like, yeah, like, I always
had the mindset of, like, guys are, you know,
really, really good. But, you know, they were
never really, really good against me until they
are really good against me. You know what I mean?
Going into that, it was just another one of those
games where I was like, man, I got to win, you
know, and I got to play well. And, you know,
he's going to get the best version of myself.
So then when we talk about. And I want to, I
guess, transition. We'll come back to the guys
you played against, but I want to talk about
real quickly guys that you've played with. And,
I mean, when we talk about your game and your
mentality, Rondo, Kimba, CP3, Giannis, Wade,
Harden, Jimmy, and Evan Turner. I threw him in
there. I know his name is not huge like the rest
of the guys, but Evan. I was about to say you
snuck E .T. in there. I had to. I had to. How
did being, at least viewing those guys, being
around those guys, shape your understanding of
the game and how you played? I mean, yeah, we
talk about Evan, right? Like, he was big for
me, you know, when I first, when I was a rookie,
just in terms of, you know, having somebody to
ask questions to, somebody to show me the NBA
lifestyle, you know, kind of the ins and outs
of the league, you know, what not to do, what
to do, you know, kind of taking me under his
wing a little bit. He did a lot for me. In terms
of the other guys, I saw Rondo with how much
he studied film and what really paying attention
to the game does. um with jimmy you know he was
the ultra ultra competitor um always you know
always ready to compete um every single game
you know he's he gives it it he gives it his
all so it was cool to see that from you know
a guy of his stature um i think you know same
thing with chris paul you know ultra competitive
guy um seeing somebody think the game like he
does on the court you know similar to rondo um
and janice just the the work that he put in was
you know was crazy to see him go from him and
i were you know around the same age at the time
so and it was you know before he he blew up so
to see the steps that he took to get to that
level um you know was was inspiring it was cool
like to be a part of that to you know help him
out with you know things that he needed and you
know building a friendship with him was was great
and then with kemba um it was probably the first
time i was able to see somebody lead just by
being kind of who they are, right? Not even with
their voice. Kemba wasn't a huge talker. He wasn't
a rah -rah guy. He wasn't going to be in your
face about things, but he was able to lead just
by how hard he played. He just has natural leadership
without using his voice. It's kind of a hard
thing to explain, but if you want somebody to...
you know, follow and lead the pack, you know,
Kemba can do that without, like I said, without
his voice. So all those guys are great. And I
try to take bits and pieces from, you know, all
of them. I got, I got excited because you brought
this up when you talk about Kemba leading by
example, one of the biggest knocks of my favorite
all time player is Kevin Durant. Okay. So I want
to hear from your perspective, if you've already
seen him with Kemba. And obviously you're a player.
You've seen it in real time, real live action.
Can a player lead by example without having to
be vocal like Kevin Durant gets knocked for?
Yeah, I mean, if you look at KD's career and
you see obviously the things that he's accomplished,
but if you even look at his losses and the times
that he's won, he's always performed. It's not
like, was him being vocal going to change his
big toe on the line? I guess. It wasn't going
to do that. He played against Braun in Cleveland
when they lost when he was with OKC. You can't
fault him for that either. I'm not agreeing with
KD isn't a good leader. I think he shows up every
day and he plays to the best of his ability.
I think he lets guys play their game. He let
Westbrook do his thing. Westbrook's numbers weren't
going down when playing with KD. Steph's numbers
weren't going down playing KD. Klay's numbers
weren't going down. He lets guys develop and
play their game alongside of him. I just think
people are going to knock guys wherever. People
hate on Bron, people hate on KD, people hate
on Steph. you know, people who hate on Westbrook.
Like, they're just going to find things to do
because that's what critics and fans do. I think
that people just kind of just dislike greatness.
So when you're doing too well or if you hit some
type of peak, everybody's just like, there's
something wrong with this guy. Like, I think
that's kind of wild. But still kind of talking
about the fact that, like, the players that you
play with, being drafted with Leonis, playing
with Leonis, all that good stuff there. Like,
can you talk about, like, you kind of watch them
grow firsthand? Can you talk about how special
Jabari Parker was if he wasn't injured? Like,
what was that dynamic when you were over there?
Yeah, I mean, for a while, there was a debate.
Like, who's better right now, Jabari or Giannis?
Like, who's going to be the guy on the team?
And, yeah, no, he was real good, man. He still
can move. Yeah, he's still good. I don't like
using the word was when people are playing. But,
yeah, man, he... He can hoop. His injuries definitely
affected him. A lot of his game was athleticism,
getting to the rim. I think mentally, I think
the difference between the two of them is mental,
and you can't really blame Jabari on that for
all the injuries that he has gone through. And,
you know, getting traded and being on different
teams, it's not an easy thing. And not everybody,
you know, can adapt to it so quickly. So I think
their career paths, you know, went different
ways. Obviously injuries played a big part. But
for a while, you know, it was like, man, like
they're one and two, you know. And I don't know
who knows which one is one and which one is two.
That's crazy to think about. We were talking
to somebody, and that's the exact conversation
that was brought up. It's like if Jabari doesn't
get hurt and I see you guys still get Chris Middleton
and that team continues on, that's a scary lineup
for a lot of years. It sure is. Well, I'm glad
we're on the Bucs because I do have a quick question,
and obviously we'll talk about more mental stuff
with trades and stuff like that later. But that
2015 -2016 year. Jason's kids, their style of
coaching and motivation, I should say, towards
you, for some, would push them to another level.
And I mean a small amount, right? Like there's
no way I would have been able to cope with some
of the stuff that he was directing towards you.
I'm not saying it was wrong, but that's how it
works sometimes. So it did the opposite for you.
It kind of stripped your confidence. And those
were your words in the article I read. So, man,
what do you think went wrong between you two?
It's tough. It's tough to talk about because
I think that I'm at a place in my life where
I'm not trying to hold animosity towards anybody.
I'm not trying to talk bad about anybody. It's
been a long time. But I think if I evaluate the
situation, and even like you said, there's a
small percentage of people that would have advanced.
I think if I came out and told stories about...
you know him and i's arguments our conversations
the things that he did to me yeah and you guys
knew that background i don't even think you would
say a small amount of people would succeed in
that i just don't see a way where you know the
the things that him and i went through where
anybody could succeed um yeah and i don't know
i i i would hope he's I get asked about him in
a lot of interviews, so again, I try not to just
sit here and bash him. There's things that he
does great, and I give him credit for it. His
in -game adjustments, the approach that he takes
about teammates trusting each other and communication
that he forces on guys. Some things he does the
best I've ever seen, but then there were some
things that him and I went through that were...
And I know he went through it with other guys
that... You know, that's for me is unforgivable.
Right. Like I can't you know, there's there's
no excuses for those things. And a lot it played
a big part on on my career. But I don't blame
him for nothing. I don't like I'm a man at the
end of the day. I take full responsibility for
everything that I did. But, you know, that's
that's probably what I got to say about it. That's
such a mature and responsible answer. And number
one, the big thing of. That we're trying to do
with what we're doing here on this pod is kind
of, one, bridge the gap between normal people
and players, right? So there's not as much animosity.
But two, give you guys a platform to tell your
side of stories where it just, the other media
outlets can't, right? And so for you to sit here
and tell me, you know, hey, it is what it is.
It played out how it played out. And I'm not
bashing someone, bro. Much respect. Appreciate
you. Much respect. Because I know, especially
with that, a lot of people would definitely just
like. Like, oh, this is my time to shine to be
over here and just dog, just person out. Yeah,
yeah, yeah. But I think a lot of people, yeah,
a lot of people just need to communicate, learn
that different people take different types of
communication. But like you said. Yeah, you know
how words carry on and, you know, they can turn
into something. My bad. They can turn into something
that's, you know, it's just not needed, right?
Like, whatever happened, happened. It is what
it is. You know, I felt the way he felt the way.
Still kicking. Right. Moving forward. Exactly.
All right. Now, 2016, 2017, the year was going
well. Rondo got hurt. Give me an example of the
experience of what it was playing with like Rondo,
Jimmy, Wade, like just that solid team that you
had over in Chicago. Yeah, it was it was crazy.
It was an up and down year. But during the playoffs,
it was cool to see like a guy of D Wade and a
guy like Jimmy. you know their stature to kind
of let rondo hold the keys for a little bit um
so they basically rondo was like listen like
i've been watching the film i feel like we can
exploit this against the celtics on the offense
um and they were they were locked in they were
tuned in they were like okay let's let's do this
and um once that happened i think we were up
to 2 -0 um and then rondo got hurt but what he
was showing us was working and we were like man
like that like it was showed rondo's true just
like His mindset, it showed his mind on display,
his knowledge of the game. And it was cool to
see, man. It was cool. I really feel like if
he doesn't get hurt, I feel like we win that
series. Yeah, for sure. For sure. And that's
why, because these were kind of like not the
downside, but the back ends of their career,
of Rondo and Wade's career. And so I don't think
it was expected for y 'all to go as far as y
'all did because of that situation. But what
role did you play on that team? My role was up
and down that whole year. I'm not going to lie.
Like I went from games where Jimmy was hurt.
I was starting to and playing well to to, you
know, I had like DMPs that year, like didn't
play any games, didn't dress for some games.
Right. So my role was up and down. And kind of
once you get into that mix, it's just, you know,
people use them to stay ready. you know all the
time in the nba just stay ready just stay ready
so my minutes were up and down i was six man
sometimes i i was you know backup point guard
sometimes i wasn't um so it was it was like i
said it was it was a crazy year it was fred hoiberg's
first year coaching um so he was going through
you know some of those things as a head coach
for the first year so he was trying to figure
things out um so it was a you know it was it
was a cluster of things going on that year did
you focus on a certain side of the other court
Yeah, I was trying to focus on defense to get
me on the court. I feel like a lot of the times,
if guys are trying to work their way on the court,
they should focus on the defensive end. If you're
getting stops out there, if you're stopping guys,
then you'll get on the court more because most
teams have those guys that are already taking
care of offense. Our game is so isolated right
now, but two or three guys can carry a whole
offense, and then the rest got to fill in the
blanks. A lot of the times guys don't think,
okay, if I can be a lockdown defender and guard
the other team's best guy, I can find my way
on the court. So that's what I was trying to
do. I love that answer because we've seen it
with DeJounte Murray. He talked about that when
he was in San Antonio. So I got to ask, man,
again, we talked about defense earlier on. What
came, how the hell did you learn to focus on
that so primarily? I think I figured it out just
trying to. like like i said finding my way on
the court right there was some times where i
was out the lineup and i was like you know i
gotta find a way and what's my way um again it
wasn't gonna it wasn't gonna be me coming in
and scoring 20 25 a night because i just they
were there was the opportunity wasn't there like
i would have tried to fight something that i
couldn't be able to fight like it wouldn't have
worked um so if i figured you know if i can guard
the best player on the team if i can if i can
be a pest on the defensive end you know kind
of coach would have no choice and then i'll get
more minutes and then okay i can sneak in offense
here and there and keep building that up to eventually
where you know i can be like okay now i can have
a more of a significant role on the offensive
end but the staple was always to you know be
a lockdown defender I love that. Honestly, man,
that's always been one of my favorite fucking
things about the game is not only being able
to get a bucket on someone, but if you can strap
someone on the other end or at least make effective
defensive plays, then that's how you become one
of my favorite players, man. That's how I play
ball. So I love it. Since you focus on defense
so much, how was it like guarding? Who was your
hardest person to guard? Because we was watching
a clip of the double overtime with Kyrie, second
week in the game, and you have to guard. one
of the most elite point guards. So, like, who's
the hardest person you ever guarded? Man, that's
tough, right? It depends on the night. Like,
guarding Kyrie when he's on is, you know, damn
near impossible. Guarding Steph when, you know,
guarding Steph in general is hard because he
doesn't stop moving, so you've got to chase him
everywhere. So, you know, that's another one.
And then Westbrook, when he was, you know, when
he was having that role where he was doing everything
and he was in constant attack mode, you knew
you were in for a long night there, too. All
right. I want to talk about Charlotte again,
especially since we're coming off of Jay Lamb.
Lambo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's my guy. I want
to focus actually on Dwight Howard for a second.
No funny stuff. You know what we're about now.
No funny stuff. It's basketball. Right, yes.
I get it. So at that time when you were there
and you guys were together, Dwight was 32 years
old. He played in damn near, I think he only
missed one game that year, 81 out of 82. But
he was averaging almost 17 points, 12 and a half
boards, and almost two blocks. So what do you
think in your opinion on Dwight Howard? What
was the most slept on quality about him? I think
you said it right, him and the ability to come
in and get those numbers every single night.
Yeah, it's tough because no knock on Dwight,
like I said, he can come in and give you those
numbers. But I think it was just the other things
that people, not even off the court stuff, I'm
saying on the court stuff, I think that... I
think that same year, right, he averaged those
numbers, but he also led the league in offensive
fouls, and he also led the league in travels.
And some things that he would voice to the team,
and again, Dwight's a, you know what I mean,
I liked him as a player. He's a good dude, a
good player. No knocking on him, but I think
the reason why people would start to be like,
eh, on him, given those numbers, was because
a lot of the times he would preach things, and
then like, kind of do the opposite in the games.
But, like, he would still get his numbers, though.
You know what I mean? And, like, the defensive,
you know, on defense, was he following the defensive
plan where it wasn't affecting other guys and,
you know, guys would get frustrated. But, I mean,
it's hard to complain about a guy who does go
out there and does get those numbers. So I think
it was like a – the conversation is happening.
about him because of those other things right
if it was just he was averaging 16 12 whatever
then there would be like no debate like what's
going on here why isn't he getting the respect
that he was supposed to be getting but i think
it's because of those other things that people
started to question like is this still the same
delight as we've seen in a for a while bro that's
interesting take i had uh you can't you can't
you cannot average the most offensive fouls and
travels in the same season like it's got to be
one or the other you can't lead in both you know
what i mean like and that was and i think like
we had team meetings like yo bro like we gotta
we gotta do this we gotta do that and it'd be
like yeah yeah yeah yeah and then when we get
on the court it'd be like what happened you think
he just lacked like fundamentals like I don't
know. I don't know. I don't know. I think he
had a few bad habits. He'd spin baseline, step
out of bounds. The game started to change a little
bit. The flopping on defense started to come
to play a little bit. The game evolves a little
bit, and some guys adjust to it well, and some
guys it takes a little longer. By no means, I
think Dwight is a Hall of Famer. He's one of
the best bigs to ever play our game. In his prime,
he's one of the most unstoppable players that
ever touched the ball. He could do a lot of things.
He was even good as a backup big. He could do
a lot of things. But I think if we are on the
subject of what was going on with him, I think
in having those numbers, I think explaining the
other side, it kind of makes more sense to people.
I respect the answer. It's not one that I've
ever heard, so I appreciate it. So then pivoting
back to... Because you just said Jay Lamb, you
know, your guy. What's some of the best memories
you had on that Hornets team? Man, just kicking
it with me, Jay Lambeau, Kemba, and Marv, Marvin
Williams. Marv, yeah. All of us. Yeah, like three
great dudes, like, you know, playing with them
on the court, hanging out with them off the court,
you know, doing whatever it was, you know. on
the plane you know bobbing up laughing some of
the best times in my career for sure frank kaminsky
him frank yeah frank frank okay what is it about
marv um that so many players are so fond of marv
is probably one of the one of the greatest people
i've ever met in my life like not even just for
basketball like he just has this he has his way
about him where he carries himself he doesn't
say bad nothing bad about nobody He's just an
OG. He's just like a grand pops. You know what
I mean? He's cool. He's cool. He works hard.
He's always giving you inspirational stuff without
sounding corny. He's the type of person that
when he talks, people listen. And I think that
carries a long way in his life. He's just a,
you know, he's just a pure human being. Yeah,
and it was just tough. It was tough. It would
be like in pivotal times where he's setting offensive
foul on the screen and Kemba's coming off and
it's just like. It stopped the momentum. Yeah,
it stopped the momentum. And it's like, you know
what I mean? Then you put coach in the bind.
Like, are you going to play him? Are you going
to not? He's in foul trouble. Like, we need,
we can't. At this point in the game, we can't
afford one of those. Like, we got to take care
of the ball. And Dwight said he's an ultra -competitor
too, so he wants the ball in the post. And that
kind of game of basketball is, you know, is worn
out a little bit. It's diluting. Yeah, so it's
like, it's a hard, it was a hard dynamic to,
you know, to accomplish. Kind of just side note,
if you had to, because like there were comparisons
between Shaq and Dwight. If you're just looking
at their – who would you rather pick? Hold on,
Mike. I think the better question – well, two
questions, and you can answer that one. But mine
off that would be, is he as dominant as we or
the fans think that he is? Who, Dwight? Yeah.
Yep. Because you know how Shaq says, don't put
that D word in there whenever he's talking about
Dwight. Or any big man. no i mean i think the
orlando dwight was definitely the orlando dwight
was definitely him like there's no doubt about
it like he was killing like he made it to the
he made it to the championship like he was doing
his thing but like i i i think the comparison
the shacks i don't think i i just i just i just
can't it's not that you can't do it i mean it's
just not the same like the diesel was he was
a force that we we have never seen in our lives
and probably will never see again like yeah Man,
I think Shaq was a one -of -a -kind player. Like,
there's nothing different about him. Yeah. If
you had to put a starting five of all time for
the people that you played with, who would be
your starting five? All prime? Yeah. Yeah. Man,
that's tough. I'd probably CP at the one. Giannis
would be in there. I'm going to say seven because
I know you're going to – I'm going to say seven.
Let's go seven. Start at seven. Seven? All right,
cool. It would be Giannis, D. Wade, Jimmy. Oh,
wait, wait, wait. James was in there. James was
there. James was in there. Damn, that's tough.
Dwight. I put Dwight in there at the five. I
feel like I'm going to forget somebody, but I
got to go with Kemba. And Rondo. I don't, I don't,
I'm forgetting somebody. So your PG, so you got,
uh, so who's your, who's your starting point?
Yeah. So you got CP at your one. Yeah. CP at
the one. Yeah. Put Jimmy at the two. Oh man.
I don't know. Maybe, uh, I'm, I'm prep. Yeah.
It's, it's the preference that people are going
to look at me crazy for not having D Wade at
the two and his prime. I know. But like, Man,
prime D -Wade is probably tough. I mean, yeah,
I'll probably put – I can put Jimmy at the three,
but then I'll leave James out at the prime. Yeah,
I'll probably – yeah, I'll put D -Wade at the
two. I'll put Jimmy at the three. And I'll put
Giannis at the four and Dwight at the five. I
know, I know, leaving James is crazy. You know
what's even – Leaving James Harden is crazy.
What's even crazier is that when I first put
this question in there, it started off as – you
know, put a starting five together that could
compete actually with Team USA. Because I looked
at the teammates you had, and I'm like, based
on how it goes with this, that team damn near
could actually compete with Team USA. Oh, for
sure. Yeah. For sure. That's sick. So you said
CP, then you're going Jimmy, or D -Wade, then
Jimmy. Yeah, D -Wade, then Jimmy, then Giannis.
You know the defense that's being played out
there? That's what I'm saying. That's what I
got to commit. I got to commit to the defensive
end. Oh, my God. That's sick. I got to commit
there. It's crazy you said that because you put
CP3 first because we did a take a couple months
ago, about a month ago, and a lot of people said
they'll pick Rondo over CP3 just with their accolades.
I think out of 30 ,000 votes, bro, it was like
75 -25 for Rondo. What was the question? Who
would you pick as a point guard, Rondo or CP3?
As a point guard to lead a team in their prime,
yeah. Man, CP3. I mean, it could go either way.
I would pick either one of them. It's just hard
because if you look at today's game, there's
so much shooting in today's game. That's the
only thing that holds me back. With Rondo? Yeah,
but you can't go wrong with either one. It's
50 -50 to me, but that's the only reason why
I chose. I mean, yeah, it's interesting, though.
Rondo got the championships in his career. CP3
is one of my favorite point guards. But you'll
hear so many people say that he's overrated or
that he has no real accolades. He's not that
good of a point guard. I was like, that's crazy
to me. I'm not saying it's a wash, but I just
don't feel like people respect CP3 as much as
they should. They need to go watch New Orleans
CP3. That's what I'm saying. Only that I can
really say about Paul is the fact that somewhat
of a defensive liability, but being the star
he is, you surround him with defensive players
to make him that much. He's like top ten in steals.
In steals, yeah. Steals, never makes turnovers.
But I think everybody's judging him off of...
Yeah, not win the championship and get injured
in the playoffs. Like, what have you done for
me lately type. I get it. It's still one of the
most frustrating things. I mean, I wanted to
go with Satan to win, but I was so pissed we
needed that spin move. I was like, where are
you going? Yeah, no, it's tough. He's had some
tough moments in the playoffs. But, yeah, I mean,
he's an all -time great. Both Hall of Famers,
though. Oh, for sure. I was about to ask about
the – Super team question. Oh, I got a question
for you. Yeah, bro. All right, listen. So we
got a lot of flack here, and we've had multiple
opinions, but I want to get yours. First, define
a super team. A super team has three. I wouldn't
say all -stars. They've got to have three superstars
on their team. Okay. All right, my man. I appreciate
you. Jay Lamb said the same thing. But, okay,
but then how can we say that the Phoenix Suns,
when they picked up obviously Brad, they were
saying that was a super team. Brad wasn't a superstar.
To me, he was an all -star. He was an all -star.
Here's the thing about super teams. We saw the
most super of all super teams when KD went to
Golden State. That put fear in the league. The
league was like, who's going to win it? No question,
Golden State. So now it's like when a super team
is so -called created. There's that fear factor
really isn't there. Right. Because it's like,
you know, we've all we've all played against
Golden State. We've all played against KD with
the Warriors. So like anything less than that
is deemed to be beatable. Right. I think on paper,
I think on paper, I think that Phoenix is a super
team. But do I think that it strikes fear in
anybody? No, not really. That's exactly what
I said. Like the confidence, like the confidence
to beat Phoenix is a lot higher than the confidence
was to beat Golden State. And, like, everybody
going through that run and dealing with how they
played and adjusting to that and, like, finding
ways to, you know, beat a team full of shooters
is, like, now adapted in the league. So, like,
it doesn't – it's hard because, like – and it's
a different dynamic, too, right? Like, Klay was
getting 60 off. four dribbles right like he doesn't
need a dribble like brad isn't like i don't think
he's that type of dude to do that right like
he's gonna put the ball on the floor a little
bit he's gonna take it the rim like there's there's
gonna be a lot more you know that rather than
just a straight sniper on the outside just shooting
threes right all three of those guys like to
put the ball on the floor when for golden state
it was like you know kd can doesn't need to put
the ball on the floor steph doesn't need to put
the ball on the floor clay doesn't need it but
they can spread you out so far that, like, they're
just passing, you know, passing the ball around
and then, you know, they're shooting. So that's
probably my answer. I don't know if that answers
the question, but, like, I think it is a super
team. I just think that it's not something that
somebody fears. Gotcha. Well, you know, the argument
actually started with the question of is currently
the current Boston Celtics team, are they a super
team or can they be considered a super team?
I don't think so. It's a really good team. it's
i think it's just a really really good team like
they're they're they're like i don't a super
team i think is a collective of guys that they
put together that are like have been you know
monsters you know on other teams you know have
been superstars on other teams these guys have
been together for a while people were not high
on porzingis after a while like nobody was talking
about about i mean they talked about you can
shoot the ball well but like He wasn't the unicorn
no more. He wasn't the unicorn no more. And,
like, then they added Porzingis. Like, Al Horford
played real well. Derek White played real well.
Like, these are guys that, you know, aren't superstars
elsewhere. But, you know, they got, you know,
Drew Holiday was a great pickup. People don't
consider him as a superstar, but he's a great
player. Right? Like, I think they're just a very
well -rounded team that fit together real good.
Yeah, I said if you use the word super team.
it kind of discredits the organization for Boston
specifically because, like, they did what they
had to do. They found those pieces. And then
the pushback was, well, the Clippers are a super
team. Last year. I said, no. People were telling
Westbrook to retire. Should he? No. But people
were telling him to retire. And then they put
him on a – like, on paper, you're going to be
like, how did these four guys play together?
But at the same time, if you lived it, they were
not a super team. That's why they lasted for
two years. Right, right. I don't think they were
a super team either. All right, good. So that's
the basketball segment. You know, after essentially
these questions, I got to looking at these damn
things. I was like, man, this is a lot of mental
stuff. So I'm going to pick and choose here,
if you're cool with that. Cool. Yeah, yeah. Because
obviously I want to go deep, but not too deep,
right? So I want to talk about, and you've said
this multiple times, man, but obviously winning
Rook of the Year. being in those discussions
with the GM and the coach. And again, you said
this, you weren't asking for anything, but they
were asking you like, hey, what do you think
about this, this and that? And it made you feel
like, you know, you were really being a part
of something to grow in Philly. And then, yeah,
then you get traded. So how did you deal with
that? What was the emotions going through that
process? It was tough because I felt like it
was the first time in my life, you know, i've
ever been traded um i had to get you know pack
all my stuff in two three days and move um to
milwaukee it was a weird feeling right because
it's like they milwaukee traded somebody that
you know that they you know loved you know the
people loved them the staff loved them the players
loved them so i was walking into a situation
where you know locker room was quiet they just
lost a brother that you know they've been playing
with for a long time um so it was like damn like
I didn't ask for this, but, like, it just happened,
right? So, like, I mean, obviously guys were,
you know, welcoming. So it was awkward there.
And then I was dealing with other emotions that
I felt like a team just gave up on me. You know,
so there was, you know, trying to get over that.
So it was hard. It was hard. There was a lot
of different emotions in my mind. I didn't understand
why. I was constantly trying to figure out why
they traded me, why they traded me. What did
I do? Did I say something wrong? They had me
in all their plans. What did I do to deserve
this? I just won Rookie of the Year, and then
I get traded. It just wasn't making sense to
me. So I think the whys were something that I
tried to figure out for a long time until I was
just like, you know what? I got to stop trying
to figure this out. Let me ask you and answer
this the best you can, or if you don't feel like
there's an answer you can give, then, you know,
obviously let me know that too. But how would
you compare that feeling or what, what is the
equivalent to that for the common person? I don't
know, man. I don't want to be, I don't want to
be too dramatic because like losing your job,
like it is not another one, you know, waiting
for you, obviously getting traded. You're still
getting paid, you know, very, very well. I don't
know. Maybe, maybe. getting transferred in a
position and they're like, yeah, you got to be
here by tomorrow and you got to leave your friends
and family. I don't know. It's a tough thing
to, you know, it's a tough thing to comprehend
if you don't, you know, if you haven't really
been through that situation. Yeah. So my opinion
on it is that I think you separate the two, like
the emotional aspect of it versus what's actually
happening. Like the feeling of why something's
not. Happening for at least why someone would
put you on this pedestal invite you into certain
chats make you feel like you're a part of something
and then Poof it's it's over with that's the
part that that really Gets me not then not the
fact that you know trade to another team. Yeah,
you're making millions. Yeah, you're playing
somewhere else Yeah, that's cool. But that that
feeling lives with you for a very long time,
which for sure I know is rough So that's why
I was trying to see like how we could relate
that to the common folk Say hello Hello, how
are you? How you doing? Say my name is Red. It
is a pleasure to meet you. All right, look, I'm
going down. I'm going down this and then we'll
turn around. But for me, it'd be the equivalent
of like of having a rocky relationship with your
dad or something. And finally, you get that back
a little bit. And he's like, yeah, you know,
we can do this. Giving you all these promises
and they're going to establish a relationship
and then gone. Kind of like that Fresh Prince
episode. Why you don't want it? Right, right,
right, right. So that's what I'm saying. No,
yeah, I get that, too. Yeah, like, you know,
or, you know, a girl telling you the world, we're
going to be this, we're going to be that, and
then she just pails on you. Yeah, go with another
guy. Right, go with another dude. Go with another
guy. Yeah. Houston is a good one. Like, what
was the biggest hurdle at Houston? I don't know.
I felt like I could see, you know, seeing my
way out of Houston. um getting getting cut uh
that was the first time i've ever been cut um
things weren't going well with the team i could
see they started to get away from me i felt like
i didn't really you know get a chance to excel
on the team like there was just a lot of different
things going on um but yeah no i mean i was going
through personal things too like i was um before
i got cut like probably a week before that um
my wife well my fiance at the time she ended
up calling off the engagement she left with my
one -year -old not even she wasn't even one yet
she's probably like six seven months um she had
left me um who to california um so i was there
in houston kind of you know without her without
my daughter um a week later i get released um
and so there was a there was a real it was rock
bottom for me in my life like it i've never you
know been that low i've never been that depressed
i've never you know had that anxiety you know
feeling like that in my life So it was kind of
a moment for me where I'd have been like, who
am I as a person? What do I want to do? What
are my moral values in my life? Am I going to
take basketball more serious? Not that I wasn't.
All these questions were kind of going in my
head and kind of how I could fix everything.
I wanted to be more stable. I was sick and tired
of playing in a new city each year. What did
that look like for me? You know, how was I going
to get my family back together? You know, and
luckily I was able to kind of accomplish all
those things in given time. But yeah, Houston,
Houston was hard for me. It was it was a rough
time for me. I think it was the first time in
my life where I let, you know, the NBA mentality,
you know, kind of get to me, you know, with going
out at night, hanging out with girls, you know,
doing doing a lot of things that, you know, can't
can't. You can't balance. And, you know, I was
trying to be one person and be, you know, and
it was being a different person at the same time.
What were some of the steps that you took to
to get back in your feet? Therapy was big for
me. Started going to therapy. Just started looking
inwards of myself, like thinking about who I
wanted to be as a person. You know, things that,
you know, I needed to fix on a daily habit. You
know, I stopped. I stopped trying to, you know,
figure everything out in one day. I kind of just,
you know, each day I would take it day by day
and just try to do the best I could and try to
be the best person I could be, you know, each
day. So therapy was big for me. Started getting
into reading, started reading things that I normally
wouldn't have. Started being more vulnerable,
being more open with people. And just, you know,
just started to talk about, you know, my feelings
a little bit and not look at it as such a, you
know, negative thing to do. I love that. And
so this actually segues. So seeing your child
there, that was beautiful. So I want to ask you
then, as a father, how did actually becoming
a father influence your approach on life or realistically
even in basketball? Yeah, I mean, it changed,
right? Because I mean, every decision that I
now that I was making, you know, even even even
now is not only about me, right? It's for my
kids. It's for my wife. all the decisions i make
away from them still affect them in some sort
of way you know who i am you know how i speak
how i present myself you know it's not only just
for me it's for them too so you know kind of
realizing that you know kind of grounded me a
little bit and was like okay you know i really
need to start thinking before i do things you
know i can't be impulsive i gotta you know if
i'm going through something how can i handle
it in a healthy way instead of just trying to
you know put a band -aid over something right
like how can i heal you know how can i do things
that You know, that that that they will look
at me and then they'll be like, OK, you know,
if I'm going through that, I saw dad do this,
this and that. And, you know, I could try to
help them in a healthy way instead of me leading,
you know, by a bad example. It's a beautiful
thing being a father. So what's one lesson that
you hope to instill into your children? That's
a good question. I mean, obviously, every every
parent wants their kids to, you know, kind of
be patient through things. But, you know, life's
going to throw a bunch of different things at
them. Life throws a bunch of things at everybody.
It's just kind of how we handle them. Lean on
the people that are close to you. How can you
handle tough times in a healthy way? How can
you build good habits? I think building good
habits is a big lesson that I'm going to try
to teach them. While you were playing or just
while you were growing, just maturing, how did
your vision of success change over time? I think
for a while my vision of success was like...
How can I put the most money in my pocket? What
can I do to make the most money? I was so money
-driven. I'm not saying it's a bad thing to want
money and to chase dollars and to do all those
things, but I think as I've grown more and more,
I think that success is just me being happy every
day. I can be happy. I remember growing up, I
didn't have a lot, and I was the happiest kid
in the world. So finding that happiness. With
what I have, with the people that I'm surrounded
with, not to say that I don't go out and try
to make money and do those things, but just finding
a better balance of, okay, with success, what
does that look like for me is being happy and
also just getting small wins each day. You kind
of answered that question because I had a follow
-up question with that. What do you think is
better? What is more important to you at least?
Being a good person or your basketball career?
Oh, being a good person, 100%. That's always
first for me. I've made it to the highest level.
I played at the highest level for 10 years. I
was plenty good in basketball. Being a good person,
it takes working on yourself each day. And you
can't be a good enough person ever. So working
on that till the day I die is something that...
I'm always going to do. I'm always going to,
you know, I think the people around me would
say, you know, I'm a good dude or, you know,
I take care of my family. I try to live the right
way. I try to treat people how I want to be treated.
And yeah, I heard this the other day and I want
to ask you, have you ever met a player that's
worked literally as hard as you or harder than
you and knew that they'd only play three to five
minutes or maybe even get DMPs? Yeah, I mean,
there's definitely other guys that I've seen
that were. you know played less than me or in
in a similar position to me that that worked
hard every single day um yeah and it's it's tough
it's a grind right like people people people
do a lot just to stay in this league and it's
a hard thing when you're at that level um where
you're you know when you're an interchangeable
you know player um it takes it takes a lot you
got to be you got to be on every day you got
to be the you got to be in there early you got
to be working out hard You've got to be a good
person. You've got to have a smile on your face.
You've got to be willing to take criticism that
maybe you don't deserve. And I think the people
that learn that the fastest are the people that
stay in the league a long time. There's the guys
that are talented that come in the league, and
they're not in the position that they want to
be. So they act out. They do things that necessarily
won't keep them in the league. And, you know,
if they just be patient and they not saying be
a yes man or let anybody disrespect you, but
like if you can be patient and if you can play
that 12th, 11th, 10th, 13th man on the, you know,
on the floor for a little while, your role can
increase. You know, we've seen it time and time
again. We've seen guys from the G League come
up. and be patient and wait their turn and end
up starting, right? A prime example is Fred Van
Fleet, right? He came up from the G League, and
then he earned his way. He wasn't playing, then
he started playing, then he became the backup
point guard, and then he ended up starting. And
then he's one of the top eight guys in the league,
right? But he doesn't get that without being
patient with himself and understanding what's
going to get him on the court. Same thing with
Jimmy, right? He went from being a defensive
guy to... you know, a superstar in the league.
It's just, if you can be patient for how you're
going to get on the court, then you'll have the
opportunity at some point. All right, my man.
So you are now chasing career, I'm sorry, business
endeavors, which you've been doing for a while.
Let me ask you a question about that part of
it. What's some of the biggest challenges you've
faced transitioning from being a professional
athlete and playing professional basketball to
now being a business owner? Um, biggest obstacle
I've had is trusting the right people. Um, I've,
you know, everyone in business has their story
of losing, you know, money and trusting the wrong
people. And, you know, I went through my fair
share of lumps. Um, so, you know, figuring out
that, figuring out people's, um, how do I, how
do I phrase it for figuring out, you know, people's
agendas and what they want from you. Um, every
deal looks good. You know what I mean? You read
a deal on paper and you're like, oh, man, this
looks good. I mean, I want to be a part of it,
right? Kind of pulling back and really dissecting
things and being, you know, figuring out who
people are, getting to know them. You know, do
they want what's best for you or are they just
looking for money? You know, so, you know, that's
been the toughest part for me. Luckily, I've
been in the business for a while that I feel
like I've found good, solid people that I work
with. It's going to take flight soon. What skills
or lessons, at least playing basketball and being
in that realm, well, first of all, from the time
you started playing basketball to the time that
you start to fill your career phases out, what
lessons during that time or skills have you tried
to apply to your business endeavors? I know in
basketball, regardless, there was probably some
days where I didn't do nothing, but that's rarely.
But even if I, you know, on an off day, like
I'll still make sure I do treatment on my body
or, you know, I'll get in the gym and do some
spot shots, do free throws. Like every day I
was trying to do something to keep my mind on
basketball, you know, watching film, doing something.
With business, now that, you know, it's not really,
you know, if you're a part of a company, then
you might be doing something every day. But if
you're, you know, an entrepreneur and, you know,
kind of. figuring out your way and doing deals
here and there. I think educating yourself each
day on something different that you're focusing
on, like with me for real estate, I try to learn
something about real estate each day, whether
it's different terms in real estate, whether
it's talking to different people, whether it's
going to meetings, right? Like I try to do something
each day to keep my mind flowing and keep learning,
right? So taking that work ethic of basketball
into the business world and figuring out what
that looks like. I do have a business mind frame.
I just didn't know. But no, what books are you
reading or what books have helped you get to
that? Um, um, I, I read the money, money and
law of attraction. Um, that's a good one. Uh,
rich dad, poor dad's a good one. Um, Those two,
I mean, those, those two are, those two are rich
dad, poor dad is really good just to start off
on your mindset. You know, I read, I try to read,
try not to just go crazy on, on business. I try
to read like a business book and then, you know,
a self -help or, and then something totally irrelevant
that, you know, whether it's a autobiography
or, you know, fiction, whatever. Just keep a
good balance of everything. Yeah. Yeah. I got
to, got to keep the mind balanced. So your quote,
in the article I read said, I just didn't want
to be looked at as a shitty basketball player.
So my question for you is, in 10 years plus,
when we look back at your career, what do you
want people to say about NCW? I just want people
to, you know, every time I stepped on the floor,
I played the hardest I possibly could. I think
that's the biggest compliment that I get, you
know, especially being in Orlando, right? Like
I'll see a bunch of people and they'll be like,
man, you know, watching you, I knew every time
you were going to give it your all. And I was
like, yeah, like that's what I want people to
see me. You know, that's how I want people to
view me. It's how I've always been, no matter
what level of success that, you know, that I
had. You know, from being the best player on
a team to being the last man on a, you know,
coming into the game. That's all I want people
to realize is that whenever I stepped on the
floor, like I was, you know, sacrificing my body
and giving it all. Yeah. You remind me of something.
You obviously have been around Orlando for, what,
four years, five years now? So, Paulo, what's
one slept on quality about Paulo? I just don't
think he gets like, you can't even name a slept
on quality. I just think he gets slept on in
general. I don't get it. I really don't understand
it. The things that he was doing this year, the
things that he did his rookie year, I was like,
yo, why isn't he on ESPN every day? Why isn't
the league pushing him like that? I don't know
why. That's what I'm saying. I'm like, yo, it's
crazy. The second round of the playoffs, you
know what I mean? As a second -year player, I
don't know. I don't know what it is. And performing
at a high level. If I were to pick one thing,
I would think that people sleep on how competitive
he is. If you watch him play, he's not a super
emotional guy. And even that's his personality.
He's quiet. But, like, he's ultra competitive.
Like, he wants to win. You can see it on his
face sometimes if you're really paying attention
and you really watch, like, you know, if you're
a Magic fan. But, like, no, he deserves more
coverage. He deserves a bigger platform. He's,
like, he's an amazing hooper. This is just a
question, speculation. Is he comparable to Bron?
I don't know. I think they're similar. They have
similar attributes that are the same. at a young
age um i don't know man i know it's hard to compare
anything i know yeah that's right like it's just
it's just it's just a big like it's early it's
way too early to say it too but yeah it's early
yeah it's early it's like yeah yeah it's it's
it's so who are some of your favorite young players
then good question um yeah i like i like paulo
um Rookies or just, I mean, obviously, Wemby
is insane. Anthony Edwards, he's 23, right? I
think he's 22, right? He's tough. Yeah, I like
his game. He's one of my favorite players in
the league right now. Anthony Edwards. I like
Paulo. I like Wemby. I'm trying to think of a
guy who's a little bit under the radar. that
I think is going to be real good. Jalen Williams?
Jalen's tough. I really like Jalen Williams.
He's the perfect fit. I actually was at OKC's
practice, and I was talking to their coach. Yeah,
he's one of my favorites, too. I think he's underrated,
too. He's so efficient. He shoots, like, over
40 from three and, like, over 55 from the field,
like something crazy. And logs down, right? Logs
down on the defensive end. So, yeah, those guys.
Hey, who's your GOAT? Kobe. Oh, man, the GOAT
conversation is tough. I mean, it's either LeBron
or Jordan. I flip -flop depending on the month.
You don't like LeBron. Oh, my gosh. I'm not going
through this again. I'm a LeBron hater. I respect
him. I mean, look at his longevity, though. You
know what I mean? That alone, you can consider
him the GOAT just because he's done this for
so long. At this level. Yeah, at this level.
Or you can say MJ's the GOAT because during those
years in his span, we've never seen anybody perform
like that. The only thing that knocks, the only
thing on the months that I'm pro -Jordan, the
only thing that knocks is that Dallas series
with LeBron. Yeah, that first year. That eats
at me a little bit. I'm like, I just can't picture
MJ ever performing in the finals. Yeah. I know
in other series that he hasn't played that well,
and you can go and pick and choose playoff series
where MJ didn't play that well. on a stage like
that in the championship i just i don't i don't
i just don't see that i don't i don't know what
that counts for but like i don't know but i i
think more often than not i i probably go lebron
i think just because he wow the longevity he's
been doing it for so long he's really still a
top 10 player in the league at age and i didn't
say i don't like brown i didn't say i don't like
brown i just I'm a Kobe fan, so I feel like it's
my duty to be a LeBron. I respect what LeBron
does. He's a great player. Kobe, yeah. Kobe,
true, true Kobe fan. It's my duty. You got to
exit. You got to exit. See you later, buddy.
It's never, it's never, it's never. It's my duty
to be a LeBron hater. That's all it is. So do
you think that Kobe's better than Jordan? So
I don't think Kobe's better than Jordan, but
I think that. He replicated Jordan so much that
he could have surpassed him just because of his
mentality. Jordan had the killer mentality, but
at that time, that time of that era, I feel like
the work wasn't put in as much like Kobe was.
It might be media, it might be something like
that. He replicated Mike. That's my preference.
I grew up with Kobe, so I didn't watch Mike.
I watched Kobe, so that's why I picked Kobe.
What do you think? As far as what? Do I think
he's better than Jordan? Yeah, what do you think?
No. No, I love Kobe. I love everything he represented.
I loved his career, but I just don't see how
people can put him better than him. better than
jordan because every the people who are colby
fans when they argue about him and lebron and
they say that he has five championships they
can't use that argument against jordan so it's
just like a i like him better than jordan but
that doesn't mean he's like there's a lot of
guys that people like that aren't the best player
in the world paul george right now yeah like
all the youngins love great player just you know
what i mean yeah i like it yeah i mean They're
a little dirty. No, no, no, no, no, no. Where
are you going with that? That's funny. No, I
was going to say, yeah, I don't know. I love
PG. He's a great hooper, but all the youngins
think he's the best player in the league right
now. I just don't see that. I mean, if I'm honest,
I do think it's interchangeable Mike Braun, Kobe,
but who I grew up with. I mean, interchangeable
Mike Braun. Mike Braun, Kobe. No. Interchangeable.
Just be honest. It depends what you're looking
at. If you're looking at stats, if you're looking
at gameplay, if you're looking at mentality,
like rings, it depends what you're looking at.
Kobe is three. Yeah. Thank you. I don't know.
I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Like
I'm saying, it's hard. People love Kobe. People
love Kobe. I get it. I don't know. Like, when
you come into a debate and you've got to bring
in, like, you've got to bring in, like, real
facts of, like, what happened, like, in their
careers. I just, some of the things I'm just,
like, it's easy to ignore when it comes to Kobe.
Like what? Like, just like he was a super volume
dude. Like, both Braun and MJ shot way better
from the field than Kobe. Like it's not even
close. And there's like, there's other guy, like,
like he's had, Kobe's had performances that weren't
like great at certain points of his career that
like people like to overlook because they, they
think, you know, that, that he's had, you know,
I don't know. It's just, it's just, it's just
hard. The field goal percentages at times was
like, it's crazy. It wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't
top three ever. you know good like it gets it
got crazy at times right so it's like i don't
know i i don't know i i'm not a co -creator i
am from boston i'm not a co -creator though i
like kobe he's one of the best to ever do it
i just think when it comes to the goal conversation
i think people get a little delusional i think
you're a realist and i appreciate that i think
that's needed in the basketball world especially
when debating that conversation so i'm glad i
asked His name will always float around in there,
though. All right, so excellent episode again,
Mike. I appreciate having you. Appreciate it,
my man. This was a hell of a time. No problem,
bro. Thank you guys for having me.