WEBVTT

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is this on video or just audio just audio we

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don't do anything okay yeah i was like i'm not

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putting on a dress shirt for this so where yeah

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where's your tie guys come on let's class it

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up a little bit here welcome to county connection

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the official podcast of the Washington State

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Association of Counties, where we dive into the

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legislative issues shaping the future of our

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communities. From budgets to public safety, infrastructure

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to elections, we'll break down what's happening

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in Olympia and how it impacts counties from across

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the Evergreen State. Stay informed, stay engaged,

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and join us as we amplify the voice of Washington's

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39 counties. Welcome back, everybody, to the

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County Connections podcast. I'm Paul Jewell,

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the Government Relations Director for the Washington

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State Association of Counties and your host on

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County Connections. I know it's been a while

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since we've done a podcast. We've kind of taken

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a little bit of time off since the session. We've

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only had a couple, but we have a really big treat

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for you today. I'm super excited about our podcast

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and the guests that we have. It's something that

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I've actually been wanting to do for quite a

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while. A couple of guys from Snohomish County.

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that I know not a lot of you know. I'll let them

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introduce themselves. But Councilmember Meade

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and Councilmember Nearing, welcome to the podcast.

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Thanks for joining us today. Good to be here.

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Yeah, thanks for having us, Paul. Yeah, you bet.

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You guys are actually not here in the studio.

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You're hanging out via Zoom. So how's the weather

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up in Snohomish County today? I've been trapped

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inside. I have no idea. I have no windows in

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this room. No windows. It's not. Yeah, it's not

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too bad. It's not raining. It's just nice. I

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think the rain is coming tomorrow. Yeah, we're

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certainly starting to enter that fall period.

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Council member Meade, are you which one of you

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is newer to the council? Are you newer or is

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council member Meade? OK, that's you. And you're

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the chair this year, right? Nate's the chair

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this year. I was the chair last year. Oh, OK.

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So you guys have flipped everything that I did

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as far as research on your podcast. Talk about

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you being the chair. In fact, I read I read one

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article that called you the president of the

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county. And Council Member Nearing was the vice

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president of the county. So that's that's. Well,

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Council Member Nearing, so you're the chair.

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For those who maybe don't know you very well,

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maybe just introduce yourself, talk about your

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background really briefly and how long you've

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been on the Snohomish County Council. Sure. Yeah.

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So I'm Nate Nearing. I represent the northern

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part of Snohomish County, which is District 1.

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And I joined the county council in 2017. I was

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appointed at the age of 21 and then ran for election

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that year. And I'm now up for reelection to a

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third term this year. And so I've really enjoyed

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working in county government. I love the issues

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we get to tackle and great community organizations

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to work with, great colleagues like Jared and

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others on the council. And so just really enjoy

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the work. personal side, my wife and I live in

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Arlington. We've got four kids. We have a six

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-year -old, a five -year -old, a three -year

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-old, and a three -month -old. So I like to tell

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people we're playing the zone defense and having

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a lot of fun with that. And we were just talking

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a little bit before the podcast started about

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our weekends. And I spent all day Saturday at

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the soccer field. So that's a good weekend. But

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that's a little bit on the personal side. But

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yeah, again, just really enjoy getting to work

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in county government and look forward to this

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discussion. So four kids and a county council

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member. That's a lot to put on anybody's plate.

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You don't have any pets, too, do you? No pets.

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Yeah, the kids are enough, I think. Yeah, I think

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so. So I ran into a dog breeder this weekend

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who had some really cute little puppies, lab

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puppies. And I took a picture of one and sent

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it to my wife and she just sent over one word,

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divorce. Yeah. So I know the feeling of trying

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to balance all those all those different competing

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interests. Councilmember Mead, so you've been

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you're you're a little newer to the council.

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You know, you served in the state legislature

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at one point as well, did you? Correct. Yes.

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Why don't you introduce yourself for the folks

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who are listening? Yes, I'm. Jared Mead. I'm

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Snohomish County Council member. I represent

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District 4, which is the south part of the county.

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It's actually the smallest geographic district.

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And Nate's District 1 is the largest geographic

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in the north. So it's an interesting piece. I'm

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a Democrat. He's a Republican, but also our districts

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are vastly different. Yeah, before I served,

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I've been serving on the county council since

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2020, April of 2020. I was appointed to fill

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a vacancy after my predecessor vacated his seat.

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So I've been on the council now for five years,

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over five years. But before that, I served in

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the state legislature, as you alluded to. In

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the 2019 and 2020 legislative session, I served

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the 44th Legislative District. And before that,

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I served on the Mill Creek City Council. That

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was where I first was elected to office. Before

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that, I had ran campaigns. So our Secretary of

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State, Steve Hobbs, he represented the 44th District,

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same district as me, where I live and grew up

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in. and eventually represented. I ran his reelection

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campaign in 2014 when I was in college. And then

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Guy Palumbo, who was a District 1 senator, I

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ran his race in 2016 before eventually running

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for city council and then the legislature myself.

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On the personal side, just as Nate said, I mean,

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I've got four kids as well, a six -year -old,

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four -year -old, three -year -old, and a one

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-year -old. So my youngest is a little older

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than his brand new three month old, but we're

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competing. I'm winning because I have two dogs

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and he has no. For now, he's winning for now.

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And and also we had a pet scenario where my wife

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texted me this weekend about getting a cat for

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one of my daughters. Oh, wow. So I got to get

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the reverse end of that. No, thank you. Yeah.

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Yeah. That's a, it's always a bit of a negotiation

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when you're talking about bringing a new pet

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home, regardless of the family situation. Especially

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when you have three bedrooms. Yeah. Four kids,

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two dogs. That's where we were stuffed. All right.

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So is it two girls and two boys? Are you guys

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completely even, or is it three in one, all four

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of boys or girls? What's the, what's the status

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there? We're two and two and two. Yeah. So you're

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both. So, okay. So a three bedroom house works

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out really good when you're two and two because

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the kids can share, right? Yeah, except they're

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opposite ends of the age. So I have boy, girl,

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girl, boy. So the one year old and the six and

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a half year old are not ready to share a room

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yet. We'll see. We'll cross that bridge when

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we get to it. Right now, we're OK with the baby

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still in the walk in closet. Well, those are

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big families, especially by today's standards.

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I don't think you see a lot of folks out there.

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going all the way to four kids as much as maybe

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in the past. So you guys must be busy all the

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time. So you have a lot in common, right? I mean,

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you were both appointed. to the council. You're

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both fairly young gentlemen. I'm not going to

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say how old you are. We don't have to divulge

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that. He's the youngest, just so we're clear.

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That's why he does not have a furry beard on

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his face in that photo that you can't see on

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this podcast. Nate's the youngest. Paul tried

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to card me. He tried to ID me before we started

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the podcast. That isn't true, but no one would

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blame me if I did. But, you know, big families,

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you live in the same community. A lot in common.

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And that's kind of what we want to talk about

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today, because even though you have all those

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things in common, Councilmember Meade, you mentioned

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you're a Democrat. You mentioned Councilmember

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Nehring is Republican. Obviously, those are,

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in most cases, opposing positions ideologically

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when you talk about politics. But you guys are

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kind of forging a new path. And I wanted to talk

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about that a little bit. Even though you might

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be from opposing parties, you're working together

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on quite a few things, including a pretty big

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project that you guys have been putting out there

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called building. It's called Building Bridges.

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Is that right? Yep. The Building Bridges project.

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Yeah. Let's talk about that a little bit, because

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I think this is one of the most interesting things

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that I've seen in quite a while in this idea.

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Well, first of all, whose idea was it? Was it

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both your ideas or did one of you bring it to

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the other? I think it was really combined. Yeah,

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honestly, genuinely, I think it took years for

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us to get to the point that we're at, even with

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starting an actually official project in a nonprofit.

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The evolution, it kind of got us there almost

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naturally, I'd say. And we could go over the

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origin of it and maybe it would make a little

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bit more sense to do that. Yeah, I think that

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would be good to hear. Since you both kind of

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came up with it together, what spurred it? What

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was the... What was the catalyst? What was the

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reason behind it? And then maybe we'll talk a

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little bit about what it is. Yeah, so I joined

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the county council, like I said, in April of

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2020. And if you could get your head back to

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2020, that was especially in April of 2020. That's

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right at the very beginning of COVID. smacking

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washington in the face that's what i was thinking

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about was 2020 that's the pandemic right yes

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and i i so i had left the legislature joined

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local government april may or may one month later

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george floyd's killed so all of the basically

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we lost our in my this way i describe it at least

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lost our collective minds in america In the summer

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of 2020, we had the reforms or defund police

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movement happening during that summer. You remember

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the Summer of Love in Seattle? And then you're

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also dealing with the pandemic. And in local

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government, you and your position in WASAC understand

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this better than any, that local governments

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were where COVID really hit the worst, budget

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-wise, but then also policy -wise when it comes

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to defund the police. You're not talking about

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defunding the State Patrol or federal, police.

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You're talking about local PDs and sheriff departments.

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So local governments are also where that is the

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hottest. And so I joined the county council in

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the heat of that in 2020. And I had known Nate

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kind of peripherally, but I knew his dad more.

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His dad's the mayor of Marysville. And Marysville

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was a city in the district, the 44th district

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that I represented. And so when I joined the

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county council, everything was Zoom. Everything

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was, you know, it was remote. We were all distanced

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from each other. I didn't get to meet staff or

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any of the county council members in person.

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You must have been wondering, have I lost my

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mind? What did I do? It was wild. The only thing

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that would have been more wild was being in the

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legislature during COVID. The session looked

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like hell from the inside. I can tell you, you

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know, being an active lobbyist during those sessions,

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it was crazy. Right. It was, I mean, like we

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had, you know, hearings going on simultaneously.

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I'd have three screens going, you know, in my

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office. And believe it or not, they would actually

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sometimes call me to testify at exactly this.

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I believe it. I believe the odds of that were

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crazy. But, you know, all the pressure that you

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were talking about around defund of the police,

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masking, right, shutdowns for businesses, a lot

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of that stuff is coming from the higher levels,

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federal level, state level, et cetera. But you

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guys were catching the brunt of a lot of that,

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right? People were they were banging on your

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offices. They were making demands of you guys

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in the paper and on Facebook to do something

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about it. That must have been really stressful.

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Right. It was. It was heated politically. And

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I'm a Democrat. Like I said, Nate's a Republican

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and a lot. And the county council is a split

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council. We have three Democrats and two Republicans.

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And that's been the makeup since I've been on

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council, even as we've switched who fills those

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roles. And so it's been a split council. It was

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it was very politically tumultuous during the

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2020 and 2021 time periods. And so I'm starting

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to get to know the council members, how to work

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with each other. I started to build a lot of

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respect for Council Member Nehring and how he

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handled himself during that year. And so we started

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to build a little bit of a connection. We're

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both similar ages. We both have young kids. We

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both are into sports. We're both born and raised

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in Selmish County. Wives are both school teachers,

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like a lot of similarities on a personal level.

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Then you fast forward to January 6th, 2021 and

00:12:36.629 --> 00:12:39.809
the D .C. Capitol riots. And you start seeing

00:12:39.809 --> 00:12:42.370
what's going on on social media and you're watching

00:12:42.370 --> 00:12:44.889
whether I'm watching MSNBC or CNN at the time.

00:12:44.889 --> 00:12:47.029
And maybe Nate's watching Fox or some conservative

00:12:47.029 --> 00:12:51.149
influenced media. And we started to message each

00:12:51.149 --> 00:12:53.350
other back and forth, like watching this unfold

00:12:53.350 --> 00:12:58.179
live on TV. And we realized quickly that we were

00:12:58.179 --> 00:13:00.720
both kind of in the same mental state as far

00:13:00.720 --> 00:13:03.519
as a response to what's happening in D .C., that

00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:05.899
it's it's wrong. And it also gives us a lot of

00:13:05.899 --> 00:13:07.779
concern for where we're headed as a country with

00:13:07.779 --> 00:13:10.100
deep political polarization and what that means

00:13:10.100 --> 00:13:12.820
for our kids. And at that time, our future kids,

00:13:12.919 --> 00:13:14.899
because we hadn't had all four of them yet. And

00:13:14.899 --> 00:13:16.779
I believe. Did you believe what you were seeing

00:13:16.779 --> 00:13:20.100
at the time? It was really concerning, really

00:13:20.100 --> 00:13:22.120
wild. Absolutely could not believe it, to be

00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:25.100
honest. And we realized that both of us were

00:13:25.100 --> 00:13:28.100
having the same response. And so Nate said, you

00:13:28.100 --> 00:13:30.340
know, we both have a similar perspective here.

00:13:30.480 --> 00:13:32.580
I think it'd probably be powerful for us to say

00:13:32.580 --> 00:13:35.740
something, maybe publicly, as a Democrat and

00:13:35.740 --> 00:13:37.679
as a Republican and as young elected officials.

00:13:38.240 --> 00:13:40.539
And so we just started doing a back and forth,

00:13:40.639 --> 00:13:43.379
creating what ended up being an op -ed that we

00:13:43.379 --> 00:13:45.820
submitted to our local paper, the Everett Herald,

00:13:45.879 --> 00:13:48.279
and they put it out. And the op -ed was essentially,

00:13:48.460 --> 00:13:51.179
you know, what we just talked about, like this

00:13:51.179 --> 00:13:54.000
is unprecedented and this is a concern for the

00:13:54.000 --> 00:13:55.759
future. And we've got to try to reel it back

00:13:55.759 --> 00:13:57.940
and work together on some things. And we can

00:13:57.940 --> 00:13:59.679
send you those links if you haven't read that

00:13:59.679 --> 00:14:01.700
op -ed, but that's kind of what launched it because

00:14:01.700 --> 00:14:05.419
we both got. What I would say some really negative

00:14:05.419 --> 00:14:08.919
fervor from our local political parties. So the

00:14:08.919 --> 00:14:11.759
Democratic Party and like the local PCOs and

00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:13.820
the local legislative district Democrat organizations

00:14:13.820 --> 00:14:16.919
were not excited that I was willing to work on

00:14:16.919 --> 00:14:20.399
anything with a Republican. And Nate got the

00:14:20.399 --> 00:14:23.679
same thing from his party. And so initially we

00:14:23.679 --> 00:14:26.000
were feeling a lot of backlash, but pretty quickly

00:14:26.000 --> 00:14:28.259
we started to get pleasantly surprised with the

00:14:28.259 --> 00:14:30.860
response we were getting from like our local

00:14:30.860 --> 00:14:33.740
chambers of commerce and our local Rotary groups

00:14:33.740 --> 00:14:37.720
and Kiwanis clubs and local government teachers,

00:14:37.960 --> 00:14:40.840
a college professor at UW Bothell. They all reached

00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:42.299
out to us and said, hey, we like what you're

00:14:42.299 --> 00:14:44.379
saying. The message is really important right

00:14:44.379 --> 00:14:46.259
now. Would you be willing to come speak with

00:14:46.259 --> 00:14:48.399
our group? And so we started just saying yes

00:14:48.399 --> 00:14:51.120
to all these. So for like a year. We were just

00:14:51.120 --> 00:14:53.379
saying yes to a bunch of different group invitations

00:14:53.379 --> 00:14:56.320
to have these conversations. And that so that

00:14:56.320 --> 00:14:58.080
was not a nonprofit at the time. We were just

00:14:58.080 --> 00:15:00.639
going and speaking and talking like this and

00:15:00.639 --> 00:15:03.120
showing how, hey, you know, Nate and I have been

00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:04.679
on the council for a couple of years together.

00:15:04.899 --> 00:15:07.519
We disagree on plenty. He's a Republican and

00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:09.620
I'm a Democrat. If we were in Congress, we would

00:15:09.620 --> 00:15:11.759
vote opposite on a ton of these emotionally charged

00:15:11.759 --> 00:15:14.360
issues that, you know, draw people to the various

00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:17.480
parts of the different parties. We vote differently

00:15:17.480 --> 00:15:18.860
on the county council and you can see it in our

00:15:18.860 --> 00:15:22.419
voting record. But we've found ways to work together.

00:15:22.539 --> 00:15:25.159
In fact, we've found ways to co -sponsor ordinances.

00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:28.299
At this point, we've got like six or seven ordinances

00:15:28.299 --> 00:15:30.159
that we've co -sponsored, a Republican and a

00:15:30.159 --> 00:15:32.659
Democrat, that are now county code because we

00:15:32.659 --> 00:15:35.000
were able to compartmentalize and set aside some

00:15:35.000 --> 00:15:37.279
of these bigger differences to work together

00:15:37.279 --> 00:15:39.279
on things we can find agreement on. And that

00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:41.889
message was really resonating with people. And

00:15:41.889 --> 00:15:43.789
then you fast forward one more year and we decided

00:15:43.789 --> 00:15:45.590
to get a little bit more proactive rather than

00:15:45.590 --> 00:15:47.809
just reacting to people inviting us. And we created

00:15:47.809 --> 00:15:50.070
what we called the Building Bridges Tour. And

00:15:50.070 --> 00:15:51.950
that was, again, before a nonprofit was ever

00:15:51.950 --> 00:15:54.710
established. And we put together these town halls

00:15:54.710 --> 00:15:57.129
on the four corners of the Snohomish County region.

00:15:57.350 --> 00:15:59.590
Yeah, I read about those. It was like a series

00:15:59.590 --> 00:16:03.190
of four, right, across the county. Now, that

00:16:03.190 --> 00:16:05.090
op -ed that you mentioned, is that the same one

00:16:05.090 --> 00:16:07.710
that was published in the Seattle Times? Because

00:16:07.710 --> 00:16:10.049
that's the one that I read. I think that was

00:16:10.049 --> 00:16:12.049
a different one. Yeah, there's been a few at

00:16:12.049 --> 00:16:15.029
this point. But yeah, the first one was right

00:16:15.029 --> 00:16:17.889
in the aftermath of January 6th. Okay, so this

00:16:17.889 --> 00:16:21.450
whole thing. So the creation of the nonprofit

00:16:21.450 --> 00:16:25.529
really wasn't how you started. You didn't say,

00:16:25.549 --> 00:16:27.309
let's create a nonprofit. It sounds like you

00:16:27.309 --> 00:16:29.610
just said, hey, let's speak up. And let's speak

00:16:29.610 --> 00:16:34.570
up as opposing ideological viewpoints on the

00:16:34.570 --> 00:16:37.460
same council. And then it sounds like it just

00:16:37.460 --> 00:16:40.460
kind of grew organically from there. Yeah, that's

00:16:40.460 --> 00:16:43.519
exactly right. I think the impetus was, you know,

00:16:43.519 --> 00:16:46.379
we don't want to live in a society or have a

00:16:46.379 --> 00:16:49.080
future for our kids where you can't even talk

00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:51.360
to somebody who thinks differently from you or

00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:53.259
has different political perspective. And so how

00:16:53.259 --> 00:16:55.799
can we in our roles as council members, you know,

00:16:55.799 --> 00:16:58.720
work to change that or turn the tide? And so,

00:16:58.720 --> 00:17:00.340
you know, one of the ways that we could do that

00:17:00.340 --> 00:17:02.200
was by penning that op -ed and then going out

00:17:02.200 --> 00:17:05.039
and speaking to whoever would listen about. you

00:17:05.039 --> 00:17:07.440
know, our experience together as members of different

00:17:07.440 --> 00:17:09.700
political parties, but people who, you know,

00:17:09.700 --> 00:17:11.660
we're personal friends and respect each other.

00:17:11.759 --> 00:17:14.359
And so, you know, talking about the importance

00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:16.480
of being able to do that, like setting politics

00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:19.880
aside and being able to humanize people who are

00:17:19.880 --> 00:17:21.740
on maybe the other side of the political aisle

00:17:21.740 --> 00:17:25.160
from you. And I think that, you know, for me,

00:17:25.180 --> 00:17:26.779
that's what was so important, because whether

00:17:26.779 --> 00:17:29.519
it was January 6th or some of the other, you

00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:32.059
know, events we saw throughout 2020 and, you

00:17:32.059 --> 00:17:35.000
know. rhetoric that we still see today, there's

00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:38.160
just such a dehumanization of those who we might

00:17:38.160 --> 00:17:40.519
disagree with politically. And I think that that's

00:17:40.519 --> 00:17:43.819
wrong. And so any way that we can encourage people

00:17:43.819 --> 00:17:49.299
and exemplify, you know, being able to communicate

00:17:49.299 --> 00:17:53.910
in a respectful way and disagree. You know, disagree

00:17:53.910 --> 00:17:56.009
without being disagreeable, I think is the quote

00:17:56.009 --> 00:17:58.230
I heard from somebody. And so any way that we

00:17:58.230 --> 00:18:00.430
can do that and demonstrate that and encourage,

00:18:00.569 --> 00:18:02.430
you know, future generations to do that is really

00:18:02.430 --> 00:18:04.750
important. And so that that kind of spurred this

00:18:04.750 --> 00:18:06.970
effort of going around and setting up this building

00:18:06.970 --> 00:18:09.349
bridges tour and the town halls that we hosted,

00:18:09.430 --> 00:18:12.450
along with other organizations like Braver Angels

00:18:12.450 --> 00:18:14.430
and the Snow Owl Libraries and others throughout

00:18:14.430 --> 00:18:17.289
Snohomish County. And what was really cool about

00:18:17.289 --> 00:18:19.769
that was we had people from different geographic

00:18:19.769 --> 00:18:22.809
areas, you know, coming together at these events.

00:18:23.490 --> 00:18:25.829
And I remember one of the events we had some

00:18:25.829 --> 00:18:28.690
precinct committee officers from both of the

00:18:28.690 --> 00:18:31.009
political parties there. So there were some really

00:18:31.009 --> 00:18:33.569
hardline Republicans and hardline Democrats there.

00:18:33.690 --> 00:18:35.670
Yeah, these are the ones who give it their weekends.

00:18:35.849 --> 00:18:39.190
Yeah, that's right. So these are this is a tough

00:18:39.190 --> 00:18:42.710
crowd that you attracted. It was. And as Jared

00:18:42.710 --> 00:18:44.829
mentioned, you know, when we started this, like

00:18:44.829 --> 00:18:46.789
with the with the initial op ed, we got a lot

00:18:46.789 --> 00:18:48.630
of flack from the political parties. I mean,

00:18:48.650 --> 00:18:51.049
they were not happy. I'd like to talk about that

00:18:51.049 --> 00:18:52.769
a little bit more. Can you go into some details

00:18:52.769 --> 00:18:55.849
there? Because, you know, the idea of bipartisanship

00:18:55.849 --> 00:18:58.269
for some of the really hardliners, I think, on

00:18:58.269 --> 00:19:01.049
both sides of the major parties, it's almost

00:19:01.049 --> 00:19:03.190
like it's almost like they want to spit that

00:19:03.190 --> 00:19:05.529
word out like vinegar. Right. It's certainly

00:19:05.529 --> 00:19:07.029
not something that they're willing to swallow

00:19:07.029 --> 00:19:10.519
under most occasions. And I'm not surprised that

00:19:10.519 --> 00:19:12.539
there were folks who didn't think this was a

00:19:12.539 --> 00:19:15.779
good idea, being how, you know, Jared, you're

00:19:15.779 --> 00:19:19.440
a Democrat and and Nate and I should be calling

00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:21.019
you council members. Sorry about that, guys.

00:19:21.119 --> 00:19:24.299
No, but I only made my wife call me council member.

00:19:24.740 --> 00:19:27.920
Well, it's a tradition here at Wasatch, so I

00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:30.640
will try to adhere to it. But council member

00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:32.359
Meade, you know, you're a Democrat council member

00:19:32.359 --> 00:19:34.819
and you're a Republican. You guys have already

00:19:34.819 --> 00:19:38.240
kind of mentioned you got some pushback. But

00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:40.440
I have to imagine there were some folks within

00:19:40.440 --> 00:19:43.240
the party structure, within your county, who

00:19:43.240 --> 00:19:46.680
really thought this was a bad idea. And I'm just

00:19:46.680 --> 00:19:48.940
curious, could you share with the listeners kind

00:19:48.940 --> 00:19:52.339
of what some of that pushback was and how you

00:19:52.339 --> 00:19:58.910
felt about that? Yeah. Go ahead, Jed. All right,

00:19:58.930 --> 00:20:02.089
I'm going. No, you're exactly right. And I think

00:20:02.089 --> 00:20:04.109
Nate and I probably felt almost the same feeling.

00:20:04.130 --> 00:20:06.329
And we've talked about this over the years since.

00:20:06.390 --> 00:20:08.349
It's easier to talk about now, but it was harder

00:20:08.349 --> 00:20:12.609
back then to hear people call you names who wore

00:20:12.609 --> 00:20:15.430
your T -shirt when you're running for state house

00:20:15.430 --> 00:20:18.210
a year prior to that. Pictures of people holding

00:20:18.210 --> 00:20:21.710
your two week old first born son who are now

00:20:21.710 --> 00:20:24.809
calling you that I was called a racist by association.

00:20:25.569 --> 00:20:28.930
Wow. Wow. Homophobic by something. Basically,

00:20:28.930 --> 00:20:31.450
just you're friends with the Republican and all

00:20:31.450 --> 00:20:33.750
Republicans are racist and all Republicans are

00:20:33.750 --> 00:20:36.529
homophobic. Therefore, you are those things or

00:20:36.529 --> 00:20:38.390
complacent in those things, which is even worse

00:20:38.390 --> 00:20:41.190
kind of thing. And at first it's hard, but then

00:20:41.190 --> 00:20:44.289
you start to realize those are really minority

00:20:44.289 --> 00:20:48.170
voices. You mentioned when you were responding

00:20:48.170 --> 00:20:52.210
about what a PCO is, the PCOs are really active.

00:20:52.940 --> 00:20:55.039
people in the party, and they do a lot of good,

00:20:55.119 --> 00:20:57.619
they do a lot of good act, they do a lot of good

00:20:57.619 --> 00:21:01.339
activation of voters, they do a lot of activism,

00:21:01.559 --> 00:21:03.720
they get a lot of attention to issues that maybe

00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:05.299
people aren't paying attention to, etc, etc.

00:21:06.039 --> 00:21:09.539
But also just the nature of being in that organization,

00:21:09.839 --> 00:21:12.039
you're in a bubble, you're self selecting to

00:21:12.039 --> 00:21:14.680
be in this bubble. And so you are associating

00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:16.920
yourself with a lot of people who think the exact

00:21:16.920 --> 00:21:20.940
same way as you and the, the most extreme version

00:21:20.940 --> 00:21:24.720
of that thought process. So I'm a Democrat, which

00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:28.400
means the furthest left, and I have to ascribe

00:21:28.400 --> 00:21:31.440
to all of the policy platform of the party. But

00:21:31.440 --> 00:21:35.180
that cannot be true. Nobody agrees with anybody

00:21:35.180 --> 00:21:37.700
100%. I don't agree with my wife 100 % of the

00:21:37.700 --> 00:21:39.519
time. You guys don't agree with your spouses

00:21:39.519 --> 00:21:41.680
100 % of the time. We're usually the ones that

00:21:41.680 --> 00:21:44.180
are wrong. But essentially, you're saying when

00:21:44.180 --> 00:21:47.390
you join a party that... I have to say yes to

00:21:47.390 --> 00:21:50.450
all of this. And nobody actually feels that way.

00:21:50.509 --> 00:21:52.450
And I've knocked on enough doors of voters and

00:21:52.450 --> 00:21:54.210
talked to enough voters at this point in my life,

00:21:54.230 --> 00:21:57.809
for my career, to know that everybody is different.

00:21:58.089 --> 00:22:02.670
I could not agree more. I mean, I can't even

00:22:02.670 --> 00:22:04.289
tell you how many times I've run into Republicans

00:22:04.289 --> 00:22:08.490
who are pro -choice, right? And Democrats, some

00:22:08.490 --> 00:22:11.970
Democrats who are pro -life. But they are afraid

00:22:11.970 --> 00:22:15.769
to say it in public most of the time because

00:22:15.769 --> 00:22:18.349
of the strict adherence. It feels like I think

00:22:18.349 --> 00:22:21.490
a lot of us have to, you know, these party ideologies,

00:22:21.490 --> 00:22:23.269
these party platforms. And if you want to be

00:22:23.269 --> 00:22:25.470
a member of the club, you know, so to speak,

00:22:25.589 --> 00:22:29.069
then you have to play by the club's rules to

00:22:29.069 --> 00:22:33.049
the point where you, you know, that free thinking

00:22:33.049 --> 00:22:38.380
flexibility that. uh used to be out there at

00:22:38.380 --> 00:22:41.779
least in the 19 i think the 1980s and 1990s around

00:22:41.779 --> 00:22:44.799
party ideology seems to have gone by the wayside

00:22:44.799 --> 00:22:48.140
and been replaced by a more strict adherence

00:22:48.140 --> 00:22:50.359
you either are or you're not you're with us or

00:22:50.359 --> 00:22:53.539
you're against us right yes and that's one that's

00:22:53.539 --> 00:22:56.259
the one piece to it absolutely and but the other

00:22:56.259 --> 00:23:00.940
piece is that i think unless we describe what

00:23:00.940 --> 00:23:03.359
we mean by bipartisan and nate does a great job

00:23:03.359 --> 00:23:06.390
about reminding Me to do it when I forget or

00:23:06.390 --> 00:23:07.930
certainly bringing it up when we're speaking

00:23:07.930 --> 00:23:09.950
to groups and we haven't talked spoken about

00:23:09.950 --> 00:23:12.950
it yet about what like finding common ground

00:23:12.950 --> 00:23:16.049
and bipartisanship means, because a lot of people

00:23:16.049 --> 00:23:19.630
like to say, especially when you're in the rigid

00:23:19.630 --> 00:23:23.470
ideological circles, you're like, well, bipartisan

00:23:23.470 --> 00:23:25.809
just means you're giving up on your values or

00:23:25.809 --> 00:23:27.329
you're just you're becoming more Republican.

00:23:27.509 --> 00:23:31.609
It doesn't have to mean that it can mean that

00:23:31.609 --> 00:23:34.450
you see a difference. And you're OK with that

00:23:34.450 --> 00:23:37.170
difference being there. And maybe you never agree

00:23:37.170 --> 00:23:39.009
with that person and they can't get you to their

00:23:39.009 --> 00:23:41.690
side. But you can see the other things that you

00:23:41.690 --> 00:23:45.109
can agree on, et cetera. And that's that's what's

00:23:45.109 --> 00:23:47.109
frustrating is. But I think it just takes work

00:23:47.109 --> 00:23:49.859
on our end. It's it's harder. It's harder work

00:23:49.859 --> 00:23:53.359
to try to be bipartisan and open minded and curious

00:23:53.359 --> 00:23:55.740
and thoughtful than it is to be like strictly

00:23:55.740 --> 00:23:58.500
rigid in a world where you get so much information

00:23:58.500 --> 00:24:01.099
thrown at you nowadays with social media and

00:24:01.099 --> 00:24:03.859
news media having this incentive to pull your

00:24:03.859 --> 00:24:05.680
attention in by telling you exactly what you

00:24:05.680 --> 00:24:07.440
want to hear and what makes you really angry.

00:24:07.619 --> 00:24:09.960
Right. It takes a lot of work to be open minded

00:24:09.960 --> 00:24:12.119
and curious. It's really easy to just say, tell

00:24:12.119 --> 00:24:13.660
me what I'm supposed to think. What's the Democratic

00:24:13.660 --> 00:24:15.859
Party platform? OK, here's the top 20 issues.

00:24:16.039 --> 00:24:17.559
This is how I'm supposed to think about all those

00:24:17.559 --> 00:24:20.130
20 issues. If I don't think that way, then I'm

00:24:20.130 --> 00:24:22.769
a Republican. You know, it's I think that is

00:24:22.769 --> 00:24:25.269
the biggest misnomer, too, is this idea that,

00:24:25.269 --> 00:24:27.410
you know, finding common ground or talked about

00:24:27.410 --> 00:24:30.029
the word bipartisan, that that means, you know,

00:24:30.029 --> 00:24:32.150
you're not allowed to hold on to those core values

00:24:32.150 --> 00:24:34.029
you have. If they're a progressive or conservative,

00:24:34.269 --> 00:24:36.230
you have to just everybody meet in the middle

00:24:36.230 --> 00:24:38.650
and sing Kumbaya and we all have to be centrist.

00:24:38.710 --> 00:24:40.829
And that's not at all what it's about. You know,

00:24:40.869 --> 00:24:44.170
you can be a super progressive elected official

00:24:44.170 --> 00:24:47.019
or a super conservative one. but still have that

00:24:47.019 --> 00:24:50.140
commitment toward respect and trying to find

00:24:50.140 --> 00:24:52.660
ways to find common ground. And like Jared said,

00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:54.019
that doesn't mean that you're gonna agree on

00:24:54.019 --> 00:24:56.180
every issue. Probably there's gonna be a lot

00:24:56.180 --> 00:24:58.759
of issues that you do disagree on, but you gotta

00:24:58.759 --> 00:25:00.859
acknowledge that difference and say, okay, well,

00:25:00.940 --> 00:25:03.680
where can we move forward and find agreement

00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:05.440
on a different issue? How can we work together

00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:07.240
to better our communities in some other way?

00:25:08.420 --> 00:25:10.980
I'm so glad you guys brought that up. One of

00:25:10.980 --> 00:25:13.079
the things that I've written down in preparing

00:25:13.079 --> 00:25:15.660
for this was, a question that i was going to

00:25:15.660 --> 00:25:18.180
throw out there that i was you know that i was

00:25:18.180 --> 00:25:20.759
thinking about when i knew you were going to

00:25:20.759 --> 00:25:22.559
talk about some of the backlash that you got

00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:24.819
and and councilmember neary and i'd like you

00:25:24.819 --> 00:25:28.500
to talk about um that backlash from your point

00:25:28.500 --> 00:25:30.880
of view as well and how you experienced it maybe

00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:34.619
either similarly or differently than uh councilmember

00:25:34.619 --> 00:25:39.319
mead but what i was wondering was you know do

00:25:39.319 --> 00:25:42.279
you think that some of the really hardcore folks

00:25:43.039 --> 00:25:46.259
who really have those firmly held beliefs, who

00:25:46.259 --> 00:25:49.740
even believe that those beliefs are rooted in

00:25:49.740 --> 00:25:52.039
not just talking points that they memorized,

00:25:52.200 --> 00:25:55.680
but strong core values, et cetera, do they see

00:25:55.680 --> 00:25:59.200
a commitment to civil discourse, a commitment

00:25:59.200 --> 00:26:03.140
to respectful political discussion as a commitment

00:26:03.140 --> 00:26:06.759
to compromise? And is that one of the driving

00:26:06.759 --> 00:26:11.640
forces behind some of that criticism beyond just...

00:26:11.819 --> 00:26:14.079
blanket, you know, party loyalty, et cetera.

00:26:14.880 --> 00:26:17.000
So, you know, maybe you could comment on that,

00:26:17.059 --> 00:26:19.720
but also council member, if you wouldn't mind

00:26:19.720 --> 00:26:21.859
just kind of talking a little bit about, you

00:26:21.859 --> 00:26:25.539
know, how you experienced that backlash as well

00:26:25.539 --> 00:26:28.059
from your side of the aisle. Sure. Yeah. I think

00:26:28.059 --> 00:26:30.200
there could be some of that, maybe that hesitation

00:26:30.200 --> 00:26:32.880
with compromise and not wanting to, not wanting

00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:35.440
to see compromise. And, you know, people are

00:26:35.440 --> 00:26:36.920
in different camps on this. I mean, there's a

00:26:36.920 --> 00:26:39.299
lot of people who, you know, they want to win.

00:26:39.400 --> 00:26:42.690
They want to see their issue. Uh, you know, win

00:26:42.690 --> 00:26:45.329
over the opposing side. There's others who are

00:26:45.329 --> 00:26:47.490
more interested in sort of that incremental progress,

00:26:47.789 --> 00:26:49.549
you know, not letting the good be the enemy of

00:26:49.549 --> 00:26:52.910
the great. And so I think the latter are more

00:26:52.910 --> 00:26:55.730
open to this idea of finding common ground or

00:26:55.730 --> 00:26:58.029
compromising when, you know, when it's beneficial.

00:26:58.690 --> 00:27:01.450
Whereas the former, you know, they don't want

00:27:01.450 --> 00:27:03.549
to hear about compromise or any sort of work

00:27:03.549 --> 00:27:06.130
with the other side, which I think is to their

00:27:06.130 --> 00:27:08.509
detriment to moving issues forward and to serving

00:27:08.509 --> 00:27:10.670
the community, which is our job as elected officials.

00:27:10.970 --> 00:27:14.119
Right. And in terms of the response that we got,

00:27:14.220 --> 00:27:16.359
I mean, I remember one of the meetings I attended,

00:27:16.440 --> 00:27:22.339
one of the local Republican meetings, and this

00:27:22.339 --> 00:27:24.000
was brought up. You know, I was there talking

00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:25.579
about something else. And they said, what about

00:27:25.579 --> 00:27:27.380
this work that you're doing with Jared Mead?

00:27:27.480 --> 00:27:29.160
And so I explained it a little bit. And they

00:27:29.160 --> 00:27:30.980
said, well, why are you doing an apology tour?

00:27:31.539 --> 00:27:33.680
I remember them asking me, it stands out in my

00:27:33.680 --> 00:27:35.779
mind. And I remember thinking, I'm not apologizing

00:27:35.779 --> 00:27:38.079
about anything. You know, that's never come up.

00:27:38.940 --> 00:27:41.519
characterize it yeah yeah but i thought what

00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:44.339
a strange way to view it as as if it's you know

00:27:44.339 --> 00:27:47.119
as if it's almost like we're going around talking

00:27:47.119 --> 00:27:49.400
about the the democratic platform and i'm just

00:27:49.400 --> 00:27:52.880
apologizing for all the all the republican viewpoints

00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:54.660
on things and nothing can be further from the

00:27:54.660 --> 00:27:56.950
truth right we're both talking about how we have

00:27:56.950 --> 00:27:58.849
our own views and we need to be respectful of

00:27:58.849 --> 00:28:01.970
each other's views. And I just thought it was

00:28:01.970 --> 00:28:03.869
so interesting that it was perceived that way

00:28:03.869 --> 00:28:05.730
by somebody who is sort of, you know, a little

00:28:05.730 --> 00:28:08.349
bit more entrenched in the in the conservative

00:28:08.349 --> 00:28:10.849
political realm. But what's funny about that

00:28:10.849 --> 00:28:15.170
is the same exact thing. Just the inverse is

00:28:15.170 --> 00:28:19.529
said to me at the local Democrat. organization

00:28:19.529 --> 00:28:24.170
meetings. Unless you sit in the audience or participate

00:28:24.170 --> 00:28:26.670
in one of these conversations or do the research

00:28:26.670 --> 00:28:28.529
like you have where you go online and you look

00:28:28.529 --> 00:28:30.710
at some of the work we're trying to do, it's

00:28:30.710 --> 00:28:35.230
so easy to just dismiss it as an apology tour

00:28:35.230 --> 00:28:39.369
or whatever. Political stuff, maybe? Political

00:28:39.369 --> 00:28:41.789
stuff, for sure. That's for sure, but that could

00:28:41.789 --> 00:28:44.529
be a separate category, I think, of criticism.

00:28:45.849 --> 00:28:48.029
you can't really dispel that. There's no, I,

00:28:48.089 --> 00:28:49.589
we could easily be doing this for publicity,

00:28:49.769 --> 00:28:52.190
even if it's for the right reasons to, you know,

00:28:52.190 --> 00:28:54.329
both. Cause I'm on a podcast now because we have

00:28:54.329 --> 00:28:57.390
a nonprofit. So that's, but it's a separate criticism

00:28:57.390 --> 00:29:00.259
as. You're basically just a Republican, Jared,

00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:03.500
and you're only doing this to because these these

00:29:03.500 --> 00:29:06.140
audiences are Republican leaning. And so it's

00:29:06.140 --> 00:29:08.160
easy for you to be in that room because you basically

00:29:08.160 --> 00:29:10.339
believe that stuff anyways. I'm called a dino

00:29:10.339 --> 00:29:12.920
for that. And then the same exact criticism is

00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:15.539
happening for the same exact actions that we're

00:29:15.539 --> 00:29:19.160
taking together for Nate being, you know, a rhino

00:29:19.160 --> 00:29:22.099
and apologizing for basically just being a Democrat.

00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:24.460
And it's like, if you look at our policy positions.

00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:28.200
Even the votes that we take year over year when

00:29:28.200 --> 00:29:30.940
the budget comes along, you can see we clearly

00:29:30.940 --> 00:29:34.640
not only disagree on things, but vote opposite

00:29:34.640 --> 00:29:38.619
and argue opposite from the dais. And so to say

00:29:38.619 --> 00:29:40.460
that it's just you're just basically a Republican

00:29:40.460 --> 00:29:42.420
or you're just basically a Democrat, it's just

00:29:42.420 --> 00:29:44.140
a really easy way to dismiss it and not have

00:29:44.140 --> 00:29:46.819
to really lean in and actually want to understand

00:29:46.819 --> 00:29:48.579
what's what's happening, because it is it is

00:29:48.579 --> 00:29:52.099
easier human beings just instinctively. And evolutionarily,

00:29:52.220 --> 00:29:54.299
we just want to be tribal. We want to be a part

00:29:54.299 --> 00:29:56.519
of a group and a louder group. And so I want

00:29:56.519 --> 00:29:58.599
to be a Democrat. And if I want to be accepted

00:29:58.599 --> 00:30:01.859
into the Democratic circles, then I need to yell

00:30:01.859 --> 00:30:05.299
orange man bad. And anyone who even knows a Republican

00:30:05.299 --> 00:30:08.359
is basically just a Republican. And if you hold

00:30:08.359 --> 00:30:09.640
that line, then you're going to have a little

00:30:09.640 --> 00:30:11.680
bit more friends in this small circle that you

00:30:11.680 --> 00:30:17.000
choose to attend. So interesting. Thank you for

00:30:17.000 --> 00:30:19.670
sharing that. I really. I think our members can

00:30:19.670 --> 00:30:23.789
really relate to that. You know, anybody who

00:30:23.789 --> 00:30:27.809
serves any real time as an elected official is

00:30:27.809 --> 00:30:30.089
going to find that there are solutions out there

00:30:30.089 --> 00:30:33.450
that don't necessarily fit a box or an ideological

00:30:33.450 --> 00:30:37.410
definition of Republican or Democrat. Right.

00:30:37.450 --> 00:30:39.049
Especially when we're dealing with partisan offices.

00:30:39.130 --> 00:30:42.750
There's a lot of gray. And the key is, is the

00:30:42.750 --> 00:30:45.650
elected official who recognizes that willing

00:30:45.650 --> 00:30:49.170
to. take action on that. And that's one of the,

00:30:49.210 --> 00:30:52.750
I have these three characteristics that I usually

00:30:52.750 --> 00:30:57.190
speak to kids. So they're, they're more, they're

00:30:57.190 --> 00:31:00.069
easier words, but I use, I tell them to, in order

00:31:00.069 --> 00:31:02.950
to work, to make this community better and to

00:31:02.950 --> 00:31:05.690
better this type of effort and be more civil

00:31:05.690 --> 00:31:08.589
and less polarized, you need to be humble. curious

00:31:08.589 --> 00:31:11.309
and brave. You need to be humble enough to set

00:31:11.309 --> 00:31:13.069
aside your ego and to say, maybe I don't know

00:31:13.069 --> 00:31:15.369
everything. And maybe somebody can teach me something.

00:31:15.430 --> 00:31:17.730
That's one. That's the first. I need to be curious

00:31:17.730 --> 00:31:19.750
enough to dig in and try to find the answer.

00:31:19.910 --> 00:31:22.789
But then what you just said, the key is once

00:31:22.789 --> 00:31:24.890
you find out that the answer isn't politically

00:31:24.890 --> 00:31:26.769
convenient, if you're an elected official, for

00:31:26.769 --> 00:31:28.890
instance, and you're like, I'm a Democrat, but

00:31:28.890 --> 00:31:32.000
that data, I'm not. I don't know if that's really

00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:34.059
the policy position I'm supposed to take, but

00:31:34.059 --> 00:31:36.880
my party is taking that or if you're in the legislature,

00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:38.200
the Speaker of the House is telling me to do

00:31:38.200 --> 00:31:41.680
this. Are you brave enough to say, OK, I was

00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:43.039
humble enough to admit I didn't know everything,

00:31:43.140 --> 00:31:44.740
curious enough to find the answer. Now that I

00:31:44.740 --> 00:31:47.480
know the answer, am I brave enough to take the

00:31:47.480 --> 00:31:49.980
stand or take the vote or at least say out loud?

00:31:50.619 --> 00:31:54.690
And the problem is our political system. currently

00:31:54.690 --> 00:31:57.930
is really not set up to incentivize that person

00:31:57.930 --> 00:32:00.410
to take that next step and say, actually, I got

00:32:00.410 --> 00:32:02.890
to go the other way on this. The political structure

00:32:02.890 --> 00:32:04.990
incentivizes that person to shut their mouth

00:32:04.990 --> 00:32:06.390
and take the vote they're supposed to take. And

00:32:06.390 --> 00:32:08.349
you see a lot of elected officials through political

00:32:08.349 --> 00:32:11.769
expedience and strategy doing that and climbing.

00:32:11.930 --> 00:32:13.710
You know, they're the ones that benefit. They're

00:32:13.710 --> 00:32:16.529
the ones that get the tweet that goes viral.

00:32:16.690 --> 00:32:18.089
They're the ones that start to get all the national

00:32:18.089 --> 00:32:19.329
attention. They're the ones that get recruited

00:32:19.329 --> 00:32:22.619
to run for Congress, etc. Yeah, it takes real

00:32:22.619 --> 00:32:26.480
leadership, takes real courage. And real courage

00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:29.740
is hard to come by in today's world, at least

00:32:29.740 --> 00:32:32.660
in the political world. And you guys are showing

00:32:32.660 --> 00:32:36.960
that today. And I just wanted to mention that,

00:32:37.019 --> 00:32:39.380
wanted to congratulate you a little bit on that,

00:32:39.440 --> 00:32:42.099
because, you know, taking a stand when you're

00:32:42.099 --> 00:32:44.019
getting that pressure, even from your own team,

00:32:44.059 --> 00:32:48.559
is hard. And sticking together for something

00:32:48.559 --> 00:32:51.980
that you know is the right path. that isn't necessarily

00:32:51.980 --> 00:32:54.500
politically convenient takes real courage and

00:32:54.500 --> 00:32:56.519
that's real leadership. So I think you described

00:32:56.519 --> 00:33:01.680
it extremely well, Council Member Mead. So as

00:33:01.680 --> 00:33:05.640
we talk about the regression here, you guys were

00:33:05.640 --> 00:33:07.579
both moved by kind of what was happening. January

00:33:07.579 --> 00:33:10.759
6th sounds like maybe it was a turning point.

00:33:11.019 --> 00:33:13.960
You started, you know, you did the op -ed, you

00:33:13.960 --> 00:33:15.839
got together, you said, okay, collectively, we've

00:33:15.839 --> 00:33:18.500
got a strong voice here. There are some things

00:33:18.500 --> 00:33:20.420
that we think we can do, at least in our community,

00:33:20.420 --> 00:33:21.839
to make a difference. Then you started having

00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:24.680
these series of, were they town halls? Were they

00:33:24.680 --> 00:33:28.299
workshops? How would you describe them? Yeah,

00:33:28.339 --> 00:33:30.180
I think it was basically a roadshow, right? We

00:33:30.180 --> 00:33:32.819
had been getting invitations to speak to different

00:33:32.819 --> 00:33:35.400
groups, Rotaries, Chambers of Commerce, you know,

00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:38.099
school classrooms. And so we decided, well, why

00:33:38.099 --> 00:33:39.779
don't we go out and partner with organizations

00:33:39.779 --> 00:33:42.480
that are doing this work, you know, like libraries

00:33:42.480 --> 00:33:44.500
and Braver Angels and some of these other groups

00:33:44.500 --> 00:33:47.160
and and just host our own events and invite the

00:33:47.160 --> 00:33:49.019
public to attend, you know, sort of a town hall

00:33:49.019 --> 00:33:52.259
style format. And so did people did people come?

00:33:52.799 --> 00:33:55.359
Yeah, we actually got I was shocked by the turnout,

00:33:55.460 --> 00:33:57.579
you know, anywhere from like. probably 70 to

00:33:57.579 --> 00:33:59.759
100 people at each of the four events. Well,

00:33:59.779 --> 00:34:02.059
that is to do one in each corner of Snohomish

00:34:02.059 --> 00:34:04.400
County. So we did four events, one per quarter

00:34:04.400 --> 00:34:08.280
in a different geographic location. And. Again,

00:34:08.440 --> 00:34:10.619
the organizations we partnered with were a huge

00:34:10.619 --> 00:34:13.420
help. And yeah, very, very successful events

00:34:13.420 --> 00:34:15.199
from my perspective. It was great to have that

00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:17.599
community turnout and a lot of really good, really

00:34:17.599 --> 00:34:20.800
valuable conversations. What was most fulfilling

00:34:20.800 --> 00:34:23.159
for me out of it was getting to hear from people

00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:25.840
afterward who I think came in very skeptical

00:34:25.840 --> 00:34:29.300
and left feeling like. OK, there's there's an

00:34:29.300 --> 00:34:31.079
action. There's a call to action here. Like we

00:34:31.079 --> 00:34:32.900
can make a difference if we're if we're willing

00:34:32.900 --> 00:34:35.300
to humanize the other side and just get to know

00:34:35.300 --> 00:34:38.199
somebody and and find ways where we can, you

00:34:38.199 --> 00:34:40.000
know, work together, find common ground outside

00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:42.840
of or in spite of political disagreement. So

00:34:42.840 --> 00:34:45.179
Braver Angels is somebody that we've heard of.

00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:48.239
We haven't talked to them to them on this podcast,

00:34:48.440 --> 00:34:52.239
but I know that as an association, we've talked

00:34:52.239 --> 00:34:55.579
with Braver Angels in the past. We've had. Some

00:34:55.579 --> 00:34:58.659
of our Zoom meetings, I know at least one of

00:34:58.659 --> 00:35:00.039
them or two of them. And I think they came to

00:35:00.039 --> 00:35:01.800
our conference one year, if I'm not mistaken,

00:35:01.880 --> 00:35:03.940
and put together. I remember being at a WASAC

00:35:03.940 --> 00:35:05.940
conference and I think it was like the Braver

00:35:05.940 --> 00:35:08.280
Angels president who came from out of state to

00:35:08.280 --> 00:35:10.099
speak at the conference. And they're a national

00:35:10.099 --> 00:35:11.960
organization, right? And they're committed to

00:35:11.960 --> 00:35:14.679
exactly the same thing. Right. And they've they've

00:35:14.679 --> 00:35:17.239
got local chapters. I know there's a group out

00:35:17.239 --> 00:35:19.159
of Spokane that's been working with them in Washington

00:35:19.159 --> 00:35:21.179
state. There might be some on the west side as

00:35:21.179 --> 00:35:22.539
well. Well, obviously, there were a few were

00:35:22.539 --> 00:35:25.099
able to use them in Snohomish County. Did you

00:35:25.099 --> 00:35:27.579
basically just draft on their membership, their

00:35:27.579 --> 00:35:29.719
infrastructure to kind of get the word out about

00:35:29.719 --> 00:35:32.699
this and to decide on a basic format? Is that

00:35:32.699 --> 00:35:36.480
how that started? I think they it was it was

00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:39.980
less on getting people out and more on like I

00:35:39.980 --> 00:35:42.039
had as an elected official. I'd previously gone

00:35:42.039 --> 00:35:43.739
to some of their workshops that they had hosted

00:35:43.739 --> 00:35:46.239
in Snohomish County, and I found their format

00:35:46.239 --> 00:35:49.320
to be really helpful. And like the the different.

00:35:51.319 --> 00:35:53.280
for lack of a better word, or the way that they

00:35:53.280 --> 00:35:54.860
structured it to be really helpful. And so we

00:35:54.860 --> 00:35:57.099
leaned on them for that part of it. Like, okay,

00:35:57.139 --> 00:35:59.980
we're doing a town hall. Here's our goal. We're

00:35:59.980 --> 00:36:02.320
inviting the community. How do we make it successful

00:36:02.320 --> 00:36:04.380
in terms of the format? And they were very helpful

00:36:04.380 --> 00:36:07.019
in working with us there. Yeah, we didn't want

00:36:07.019 --> 00:36:09.199
it to just be Nate and I stand up on a stage,

00:36:09.280 --> 00:36:11.679
talk, and then take questions, and then it's

00:36:11.679 --> 00:36:14.659
over. And so we used, because we were new to

00:36:14.659 --> 00:36:17.230
that. We could have done a million town halls,

00:36:17.349 --> 00:36:18.949
but we haven't done anything that would be this

00:36:18.949 --> 00:36:21.750
engaging in community. And so we leaned in with

00:36:21.750 --> 00:36:24.050
them to say, how do you guys do your structure,

00:36:24.190 --> 00:36:26.610
your events to get more participation and get

00:36:26.610 --> 00:36:29.289
actual actionable items and information from

00:36:29.289 --> 00:36:32.070
people? And and so they helped us come up with

00:36:32.070 --> 00:36:33.889
the ideas of having different table groups and

00:36:33.889 --> 00:36:37.010
breakout sessions and whiteboards where we'd

00:36:37.010 --> 00:36:39.250
write stuff down and things that weren't just

00:36:39.250 --> 00:36:42.489
the standard politician on a. because we really

00:36:42.489 --> 00:36:44.230
didn't want it to be that. We didn't want it

00:36:44.230 --> 00:36:45.630
to be a political thing. We wanted it to be completely

00:36:45.630 --> 00:36:48.769
separate and really be driven by the community

00:36:48.769 --> 00:36:50.389
wanting to have a conversation with each other.

00:36:51.489 --> 00:36:54.389
Interesting. Well, how did you go from that,

00:36:54.489 --> 00:36:56.010
because it sounds like these were pretty successful,

00:36:56.369 --> 00:37:01.789
to your own nonprofit? I mean, why not just partner

00:37:01.789 --> 00:37:05.050
with a group like Braver Angels and continue

00:37:05.050 --> 00:37:09.590
that work locally or even regionally? Why decide

00:37:09.590 --> 00:37:13.980
to... Start your own nonprofit. You know, how

00:37:13.980 --> 00:37:15.579
was it different? What were you doing there that

00:37:15.579 --> 00:37:17.739
that you felt like you needed your own organization

00:37:17.739 --> 00:37:22.699
for? I can go with that. So, well, basically,

00:37:22.820 --> 00:37:26.960
we we didn't want to, one, have to have. Well,

00:37:27.019 --> 00:37:28.559
I don't want to characterize it as baggage, but

00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:30.760
we didn't want to have anyone else's any other

00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:32.780
organization structure. We didn't want to have

00:37:32.780 --> 00:37:36.000
any. We don't want to piggyback on that. We kind

00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:38.199
of had started something locally, homegrown.

00:37:38.760 --> 00:37:41.340
And we saw it as more of a Snohomish County specific

00:37:41.340 --> 00:37:44.039
effort because of the connections that we had

00:37:44.039 --> 00:37:46.460
with elected officials and community groups,

00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:48.599
him all over North County, me all over South

00:37:48.599 --> 00:37:50.760
County. So it seemed like it made a lot of sense

00:37:50.760 --> 00:37:53.139
to kind of start it small in this bubble rather

00:37:53.139 --> 00:37:56.099
than hop on to a larger organization that's already

00:37:56.099 --> 00:37:58.039
doing something that might not be exactly aligned

00:37:58.039 --> 00:38:00.119
with what we're trying to do. I also think we

00:38:00.119 --> 00:38:03.099
had something unique in the sense that we are

00:38:03.099 --> 00:38:07.019
both. were and are currently both elected, currently

00:38:07.019 --> 00:38:10.360
elected officials from different parties on the

00:38:10.360 --> 00:38:14.219
same legislative body. And so even though that

00:38:14.219 --> 00:38:17.579
wasn't the focus of and isn't the focus of the

00:38:17.579 --> 00:38:20.800
Building Bridges Project, we kind of symbolized

00:38:20.800 --> 00:38:23.539
it. We personified it in what we actually were

00:38:23.539 --> 00:38:26.179
and still are today, a Republican on a county

00:38:26.179 --> 00:38:29.280
body and a Democrat on a county body. And so

00:38:29.280 --> 00:38:32.139
being able to speak the two of us together and

00:38:32.139 --> 00:38:35.030
kind of show it was, the F the initial effort,

00:38:35.090 --> 00:38:36.789
at least that's what people were attracted to

00:38:36.789 --> 00:38:38.610
at the beginning and why we think that they were,

00:38:38.610 --> 00:38:41.590
it had been successful early on. So we want to,

00:38:41.590 --> 00:38:44.269
I wanted to keep it in that scope. And then Nate,

00:38:44.309 --> 00:38:45.630
you can jump in and correct me if I'm wrong,

00:38:45.670 --> 00:38:48.449
but we also started to have conversations kind

00:38:48.449 --> 00:38:50.989
of in parallel with that after that, after that

00:38:50.989 --> 00:38:53.829
year that we did the, cause that for. that County

00:38:53.829 --> 00:38:56.750
tour or whatever we want to call it was over

00:38:56.750 --> 00:38:58.369
the course of basically the year. It was, we

00:38:58.369 --> 00:39:00.730
had one town hall per quarter. And at the end

00:39:00.730 --> 00:39:02.929
of that year, we said, how do we take this to

00:39:02.929 --> 00:39:05.070
the next level and make it a little bit more

00:39:05.070 --> 00:39:09.369
palpable and a little bit more in a little bit

00:39:09.369 --> 00:39:13.769
more, I don't know, direct and also youth oriented

00:39:13.769 --> 00:39:16.369
because we had had young people come in and talk

00:39:16.369 --> 00:39:18.690
and we had a lot of. successful conversations

00:39:18.690 --> 00:39:21.690
with young people and saw the response. And so

00:39:21.690 --> 00:39:23.329
it was kind of in that where we're like, we're

00:39:23.329 --> 00:39:25.030
starting to throw out a lot of different ideas.

00:39:25.110 --> 00:39:27.329
We have this idea to have, and we still have

00:39:27.329 --> 00:39:29.429
this pledge on our website where elected officials

00:39:29.429 --> 00:39:31.989
and community members could sign a pledge, a

00:39:31.989 --> 00:39:33.550
civility pledge. So we kind of had all these

00:39:33.550 --> 00:39:35.869
ideas we were thinking through, and we thought

00:39:35.869 --> 00:39:37.789
it made sense to put it under this umbrella and

00:39:37.789 --> 00:39:39.409
get an organization put together that we could

00:39:39.409 --> 00:39:42.860
then start housing them. And that's... That's

00:39:42.860 --> 00:39:44.780
where the idea of the nonprofit came. But then

00:39:44.780 --> 00:39:46.960
very quickly after that, it started to get oriented

00:39:46.960 --> 00:39:48.719
more towards youth because that's where the best

00:39:48.719 --> 00:39:51.239
engagement was happening. And that was the Future

00:39:51.239 --> 00:39:53.880
Leaders Academy. And that's kind of now what's

00:39:53.880 --> 00:39:56.380
taken full front and center with the nonprofit.

00:39:57.119 --> 00:39:59.119
Yeah, I definitely want to get into that a little

00:39:59.119 --> 00:40:01.739
bit. But before we get there, I still want to

00:40:01.739 --> 00:40:04.460
kind of maybe talk about this idea of how you

00:40:04.460 --> 00:40:06.920
actually decided on the nonprofit itself. I mean,

00:40:06.940 --> 00:40:10.239
you went through the series of town halls you

00:40:10.239 --> 00:40:12.960
worked with. braver angels at some point you

00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:15.199
decided we're not just going to continue with

00:40:15.199 --> 00:40:17.960
them we're going to do our own thing it sounds

00:40:17.960 --> 00:40:19.860
to me like from your description council member

00:40:19.860 --> 00:40:22.440
me that it's slowly kind of developed and and

00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:24.380
and that seems to be kind of the theme here right

00:40:24.380 --> 00:40:26.820
i think i used the term organically earlier that

00:40:26.820 --> 00:40:29.780
it was just a series of events but was there

00:40:29.780 --> 00:40:32.500
and maybe that maybe there wasn't but was there

00:40:32.500 --> 00:40:35.980
a memorable you know event or happening or moment

00:40:35.980 --> 00:40:37.599
where you just where it just clicked and said

00:40:37.599 --> 00:40:39.840
hey here's the next step this is what we should

00:40:39.840 --> 00:40:42.389
do I don't know that there was an event. I think

00:40:42.389 --> 00:40:44.949
it was gradual. But I do I do remember a conversation

00:40:44.949 --> 00:40:49.449
we had that really, you know, sparked my my desire

00:40:49.449 --> 00:40:51.449
to kind of go in this direction, forming a nonprofit.

00:40:51.530 --> 00:40:54.030
And that was, you know, we're we're currently

00:40:54.030 --> 00:40:56.309
elected officials and we both really enjoy the

00:40:56.309 --> 00:40:58.969
work of public service, you know, in county government.

00:40:59.449 --> 00:41:01.289
But we're not always going to be elected officials.

00:41:01.369 --> 00:41:03.769
Right. At some point, we'll either, you know,

00:41:03.829 --> 00:41:05.289
we'll be we'll be doing something different.

00:41:06.050 --> 00:41:10.000
But this work of. civic health and engaging the

00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:12.920
community on finding common ground and stability

00:41:12.920 --> 00:41:15.940
and mutual respect is something that we're both

00:41:15.940 --> 00:41:18.780
really passionate about. And we don't want it

00:41:18.780 --> 00:41:21.539
to just go away once we're not in elected office

00:41:21.539 --> 00:41:23.900
anymore. And so I remember we had probably a

00:41:23.900 --> 00:41:26.119
few conversations about this idea of how do we

00:41:26.119 --> 00:41:29.260
keep this train going so that even when we're

00:41:29.260 --> 00:41:31.880
no longer on the county council or no longer

00:41:31.880 --> 00:41:36.639
in elected office, we can continue to do this

00:41:36.639 --> 00:41:40.010
work and to advocate. And so one of the ways

00:41:40.010 --> 00:41:43.489
was by taking it kind of out of the role of county

00:41:43.489 --> 00:41:46.150
council members and forming this nonprofit so

00:41:46.150 --> 00:41:48.230
that, you know, regardless of whatever comes

00:41:48.230 --> 00:41:51.250
next or what happens down the road, we have the

00:41:51.250 --> 00:41:54.230
ability to continue this work. And that was important

00:41:54.230 --> 00:41:56.550
for me to know that, you know, it's not just

00:41:56.550 --> 00:41:58.750
going to end as soon as we're no longer in office.

00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:01.880
Yeah. Thank you for that part, Nate. I failed

00:42:01.880 --> 00:42:04.179
to mention that, but at everything we had done

00:42:04.179 --> 00:42:07.059
prior to starting the nonprofit was done essentially

00:42:07.059 --> 00:42:10.400
with our County council member hats on. So we're

00:42:10.400 --> 00:42:12.440
even with the town halls, we were council members

00:42:12.440 --> 00:42:14.960
doing the town halls. Sure. We're working with

00:42:14.960 --> 00:42:17.139
angels or the YMCA, the boys and girls up in

00:42:17.139 --> 00:42:18.860
the library. We were the council members doing

00:42:18.860 --> 00:42:22.920
that. And as nonprofit. As a nonprofit, we're

00:42:22.920 --> 00:42:25.539
not doing it as our elected official hats. We

00:42:25.539 --> 00:42:28.320
don't use our county emails and our county resources.

00:42:28.539 --> 00:42:30.320
Our county staff can't help us with any of it.

00:42:30.360 --> 00:42:33.260
So we're trying to take it out of county government

00:42:33.260 --> 00:42:35.900
and create something that can be bigger than

00:42:35.900 --> 00:42:40.239
that. So it's interesting that you say that.

00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:43.039
I mean, it's obvious that as Snohomish County

00:42:43.039 --> 00:42:46.460
Council members opposing parties. The way you

00:42:46.460 --> 00:42:48.380
guys did the op -ed and you organized this, you

00:42:48.380 --> 00:42:51.260
would be kind of seen as council members orchestrating

00:42:51.260 --> 00:42:54.699
this movement or these conversations. Were other

00:42:54.699 --> 00:42:57.099
members of your council involved? I think you

00:42:57.099 --> 00:42:58.900
guys have seven up there in Snow, which is that

00:42:58.900 --> 00:43:03.219
right? Five. Oh, five. Okay. Five is probably

00:43:03.219 --> 00:43:08.039
a little easier to manage than seven. But were

00:43:08.039 --> 00:43:10.199
the other council members, were they part of

00:43:10.199 --> 00:43:14.119
the discussion or the movement or was there ever...

00:43:14.380 --> 00:43:17.860
you know, a thought to, you know, make this an

00:43:17.860 --> 00:43:21.340
official Snohomish County Council project? Or

00:43:21.340 --> 00:43:23.559
was it really just the, you know, Councilmember

00:43:23.559 --> 00:43:26.119
Meade, Councilmember Nehring kind of going off

00:43:26.119 --> 00:43:29.780
on their own doing this? Yeah, you're Councilmembers,

00:43:29.800 --> 00:43:32.199
but not necessarily endorsed or supported by

00:43:32.199 --> 00:43:37.699
the County Council itself. So we have we started

00:43:37.699 --> 00:43:40.400
an event called Civic Education Day where we

00:43:40.400 --> 00:43:42.320
invite students from all over Snohomish County

00:43:42.320 --> 00:43:44.420
to come in. And part of it was learning about

00:43:44.420 --> 00:43:46.599
county government, like different roles and responsibilities.

00:43:46.780 --> 00:43:49.179
But part of it was also like when Jared and I

00:43:49.179 --> 00:43:51.039
would talk to the students about that civility

00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:53.480
piece and how we you know, how we treat each

00:43:53.480 --> 00:43:57.000
other, essentially. So that did get sort of adopted

00:43:57.000 --> 00:43:59.300
by the full council. And so that's now like an

00:43:59.300 --> 00:44:02.599
annual event that we. That is hosted by by county

00:44:02.599 --> 00:44:05.139
government or by the county council. So that's

00:44:05.139 --> 00:44:08.219
kind of an endorsement of the concept. Sure.

00:44:08.280 --> 00:44:12.940
But in terms of like the direct work, yeah, we

00:44:12.940 --> 00:44:16.420
it really has, I think, gone away from our council

00:44:16.420 --> 00:44:19.380
roles and more toward this nonprofit role. I

00:44:19.380 --> 00:44:22.300
mean, for example, a lot of what we do is is

00:44:22.300 --> 00:44:24.760
reactive, right? Like somebody will reach out

00:44:24.760 --> 00:44:27.420
and ask us to speak at a chamber meeting. And

00:44:27.420 --> 00:44:29.460
so, you know, the two of us will go and do that.

00:44:31.419 --> 00:44:35.820
obviously our council role, you know, is significant

00:44:35.820 --> 00:44:38.800
in that. Like we share examples of county policies

00:44:38.800 --> 00:44:41.659
that we've been able to co -sponsor and work

00:44:41.659 --> 00:44:44.719
together on. But part of it, you know, it's kind

00:44:44.719 --> 00:44:46.780
of like what we've described on the podcast here

00:44:46.780 --> 00:44:50.300
so far is, you know, our origin story and some

00:44:50.300 --> 00:44:52.460
of the experiences that we've had with, you know,

00:44:52.460 --> 00:44:54.780
with our own political parties and what we hope

00:44:54.780 --> 00:44:57.039
to see for our kids' futures. And so, yeah, I

00:44:57.039 --> 00:44:58.699
would say for the most part, it's gone outside

00:44:58.699 --> 00:45:00.849
of county government. So how did you actually

00:45:00.849 --> 00:45:03.590
get started? I think people would be interested.

00:45:04.570 --> 00:45:06.469
Did you basically just say, look, I'm going to

00:45:06.469 --> 00:45:08.010
fill out the paperwork. We're going to get the

00:45:08.010 --> 00:45:10.409
designation. And it just kind of grew from there.

00:45:10.670 --> 00:45:13.269
How did you fund it? Or are you funding it? Is

00:45:13.269 --> 00:45:15.989
it all volunteer? How does the actual structure

00:45:15.989 --> 00:45:18.510
of the nonprofit work? And I noticed when you

00:45:18.510 --> 00:45:20.269
get on your website, you're not the only two

00:45:20.269 --> 00:45:22.949
people listed as the founder of the nonprofit.

00:45:23.070 --> 00:45:26.170
There's another gentleman by the name of John

00:45:26.170 --> 00:45:30.130
Estes. I hope I'm saying that right. Is that

00:45:30.130 --> 00:45:34.989
Josh Estes? Oh, Josh. Yes, Josh Estes. And it

00:45:34.989 --> 00:45:38.349
looks like he plays a pretty prominent role in

00:45:38.349 --> 00:45:40.150
the nonprofit as well. Maybe you can just describe

00:45:40.150 --> 00:45:43.530
that process and how he came on and kind of what

00:45:43.530 --> 00:45:45.929
your roles are. And then we'll get into maybe

00:45:45.929 --> 00:45:48.250
a little bit more about the work that the nonprofit's

00:45:48.250 --> 00:45:51.010
been doing. Yeah, well, so once we decided, I

00:45:51.010 --> 00:45:53.369
think I do think I think it's fair to say and

00:45:53.369 --> 00:45:56.679
Josh wouldn't disagree with this that. After

00:45:56.679 --> 00:45:58.679
we had done the kind of four corner scenario

00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:02.420
and decided, hey, we should be more intentional

00:46:02.420 --> 00:46:04.860
about this. This should be a nonprofit. We should

00:46:04.860 --> 00:46:06.519
really take this organization outside of the

00:46:06.519 --> 00:46:08.699
county so it can live outside of us, et cetera.

00:46:08.920 --> 00:46:11.380
That was a conversation Nate and I had originally.

00:46:11.820 --> 00:46:14.559
And we decided we wanted to do that, but we were

00:46:14.559 --> 00:46:17.750
like. How do you do that? Since you just asked,

00:46:17.769 --> 00:46:20.070
you just file like, how do you do it mechanically?

00:46:20.190 --> 00:46:22.710
Right. And what are the pros and cons to it,

00:46:22.769 --> 00:46:25.130
especially as elected officials starting a nonprofit,

00:46:25.349 --> 00:46:30.590
et cetera. And so we both had a mutual acquaintance

00:46:30.590 --> 00:46:32.590
friend. I mean, he Josh is somebody who's been

00:46:32.590 --> 00:46:34.010
in Snohomish County for a long time. I've known

00:46:34.010 --> 00:46:36.909
him for years, more on like a campaign side of

00:46:36.909 --> 00:46:40.739
politics. And so he's someone who is on a bunch

00:46:40.739 --> 00:46:42.840
of boards for different elected, not elected,

00:46:42.840 --> 00:46:44.739
if it was different nonprofits within Snohomish

00:46:44.739 --> 00:46:46.699
County. He's very involved with an organization

00:46:46.699 --> 00:46:49.139
called Leadership Snohomish County in Snohomish,

00:46:49.139 --> 00:46:50.699
which is one that Nate and I have been involved

00:46:50.699 --> 00:46:52.860
with and given speeches to, et cetera. And so

00:46:52.860 --> 00:46:54.539
we just reached out to him as a friend and said,

00:46:54.599 --> 00:46:56.119
hey, how would we go about doing something like

00:46:56.119 --> 00:46:58.420
this? He ended up giving us a ton of advice.

00:46:58.500 --> 00:47:01.239
He loved the idea, leaned in a lot. And so then

00:47:01.239 --> 00:47:03.199
we just asked him, would you want to found this

00:47:03.199 --> 00:47:06.449
with us? And so then we. created it and he helped

00:47:06.449 --> 00:47:08.690
us with much of the technical stuff and all the

00:47:08.690 --> 00:47:11.650
mechanical all of that and then as as it evolved

00:47:11.650 --> 00:47:13.329
into like well what do we actually want this

00:47:13.329 --> 00:47:17.190
to be um are we just doing like speaking speeches

00:47:17.190 --> 00:47:19.090
everywhere is that what the not is the non -profit

00:47:19.090 --> 00:47:22.769
just a an umbrella name that we could just use

00:47:22.769 --> 00:47:24.550
to go give speeches to chambers and just like

00:47:24.550 --> 00:47:27.780
more professional looking or is it is there a

00:47:27.780 --> 00:47:29.179
mission is there something we really want to

00:47:29.179 --> 00:47:31.940
accomplish so we started to create what our mission

00:47:31.940 --> 00:47:33.960
wants to be and our focus and that's the stuff

00:47:33.960 --> 00:47:35.400
that you'll see on the website now but that really

00:47:35.400 --> 00:47:38.019
did evolve over you know the first months of

00:47:38.019 --> 00:47:41.440
the origin of this and we started to get a little

00:47:41.440 --> 00:47:43.780
bit more focused and that's when you start to

00:47:43.780 --> 00:47:47.460
see the actual The Future Leaders Academy program

00:47:47.460 --> 00:47:50.019
actually pop up on our website and us to lean

00:47:50.019 --> 00:47:51.940
in and get really involved. At first, it didn't

00:47:51.940 --> 00:47:53.739
have anything to do with being able to fundraise

00:47:53.739 --> 00:47:55.460
because there was no we didn't think anything

00:47:55.460 --> 00:47:57.360
was going to cost money. All we're doing is just

00:47:57.360 --> 00:47:59.559
Nate and I sweat equity, just showing up and

00:47:59.559 --> 00:48:03.380
talking and trying to be trying to be trying

00:48:03.380 --> 00:48:05.960
to grow the movement. But then as we started

00:48:05.960 --> 00:48:07.619
to think about these ideas, specifically the

00:48:07.619 --> 00:48:09.690
Future Leaders Academy is like, well. If we really

00:48:09.690 --> 00:48:13.750
want this to be a big, sustainable project, we'll

00:48:13.750 --> 00:48:16.050
probably need some money invested into it to

00:48:16.050 --> 00:48:19.150
give, whether it's student scholarships or the

00:48:19.150 --> 00:48:22.210
charter buses to Olympia or various things that

00:48:22.210 --> 00:48:24.489
we're going to be spending money on. okay well

00:48:24.489 --> 00:48:26.710
then we do need to raise some money and now that

00:48:26.710 --> 00:48:28.309
means you got to file as something different

00:48:28.309 --> 00:48:31.349
and you got to have these designations as a 501c3

00:48:31.349 --> 00:48:33.269
and all these other things somebody's got to

00:48:33.269 --> 00:48:35.449
file taxes for that stuff exactly so it kind

00:48:35.449 --> 00:48:38.570
of slowly formulated into that that was not the

00:48:38.570 --> 00:48:40.550
original intent the original intent was just

00:48:40.550 --> 00:48:42.809
to make it a stable kind of like more of an organization

00:48:42.809 --> 00:48:45.650
take it outside of county and make it its own

00:48:45.650 --> 00:48:48.250
separate entity but now it's evolved into something

00:48:48.250 --> 00:48:51.010
where we are We do fundraise, not a ton, but

00:48:51.010 --> 00:48:53.150
we do fundraise in order to run the program that

00:48:53.150 --> 00:48:54.630
we are doing with the Future Religious Academy

00:48:54.630 --> 00:48:56.909
specifically. Well, and you probably have to

00:48:56.909 --> 00:48:59.730
think about things like insurance, right, and

00:48:59.730 --> 00:49:02.769
other liability concerns, especially if you're

00:49:02.769 --> 00:49:06.090
renting buses and taking kids around to Olympia

00:49:06.090 --> 00:49:08.389
and things like that. So it sounds like it's

00:49:08.389 --> 00:49:11.030
getting more sophisticated. Is someone assigned

00:49:11.030 --> 00:49:13.250
to actually running that kind of day -to -day

00:49:13.250 --> 00:49:16.230
stuff? Is that the role of... of one of you or

00:49:16.230 --> 00:49:18.329
is josh taking that on or do you have other staff

00:49:18.329 --> 00:49:21.449
that's taking that on well we have a uh we have

00:49:21.449 --> 00:49:23.530
somebody helping us with the treasury and the

00:49:23.530 --> 00:49:26.889
reporting just basically giving us pro bono help

00:49:26.889 --> 00:49:30.630
because they believe in our mission um but it's

00:49:30.630 --> 00:49:32.530
basically us just kind of bootstrapping it and

00:49:32.530 --> 00:49:35.170
with with josh obviously yeah the three of us

00:49:35.170 --> 00:49:38.489
well let's talk about some of the projects because

00:49:38.489 --> 00:49:41.429
you've mentioned um you've mentioned the future

00:49:41.429 --> 00:49:42.949
leaders program a couple of times that seems

00:49:42.949 --> 00:49:48.679
to be The maybe flagship project so far of of

00:49:48.679 --> 00:49:50.719
the nonprofit, it's certainly very prominent

00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:52.980
on your website. You've got a couple of videos.

00:49:53.019 --> 00:49:55.679
So shout out to the website. Folks want to learn

00:49:55.679 --> 00:49:57.920
more about this. There's some really nice videos

00:49:57.920 --> 00:49:59.639
on your website. There's lots of great information

00:49:59.639 --> 00:50:02.199
to read as well. But if you're not into reading

00:50:02.199 --> 00:50:04.360
and you just want to watch a video, there's a

00:50:04.360 --> 00:50:06.199
couple of I think there are three to five minutes,

00:50:06.260 --> 00:50:08.739
maybe one to seven minutes. The talk about the

00:50:08.739 --> 00:50:12.760
building bridges project itself, and then talk

00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:14.860
about the future leaders program. And then there's

00:50:14.860 --> 00:50:17.739
a great one about the actual field trip that

00:50:17.739 --> 00:50:19.659
the students who are part of the future leaders

00:50:19.659 --> 00:50:22.980
program got to take in Olympia. I think, well,

00:50:23.079 --> 00:50:25.320
I don't remember which year it was, 2023 or 2024.

00:50:25.699 --> 00:50:30.400
So it was 2025. It was this session. We're going

00:50:30.400 --> 00:50:33.199
to be going next year too. Great. So let's talk

00:50:33.199 --> 00:50:34.900
about that. How did that get started? Whose idea

00:50:34.900 --> 00:50:38.059
was that? And why are you targeting kids with

00:50:38.059 --> 00:50:42.599
this project? So when after we did the kind of

00:50:42.599 --> 00:50:44.619
the roadshow or the town halls around the different

00:50:44.619 --> 00:50:46.980
areas of the county and we're talking about,

00:50:46.980 --> 00:50:49.059
you know, what what do we know? Then we form

00:50:49.059 --> 00:50:50.679
the nonprofit. We're thinking, what do we want

00:50:50.679 --> 00:50:52.480
our mission to be like? What's what's the end

00:50:52.480 --> 00:50:56.139
game? What would success look like? What direction

00:50:56.139 --> 00:50:58.679
do we want to head? And both Jared and I felt

00:50:58.679 --> 00:51:01.300
really passionate about working with young people.

00:51:01.900 --> 00:51:03.639
And there's several reasons for that. I mean,

00:51:03.679 --> 00:51:05.679
we both have young kids. And so we're very interested

00:51:05.679 --> 00:51:10.880
in the future success of the community. I'm a

00:51:10.880 --> 00:51:13.219
former school teacher. And so I have some, and

00:51:13.219 --> 00:51:15.440
Jared's wife is a school teacher. And so we have

00:51:15.440 --> 00:51:18.559
some interaction with students in school districts.

00:51:18.800 --> 00:51:20.599
And so we both just felt really passionate about

00:51:20.599 --> 00:51:23.559
engaging young people. We also found that in

00:51:23.559 --> 00:51:25.420
our various interactions, like when we had been

00:51:25.420 --> 00:51:28.619
invited to speak with schools, young people and

00:51:28.619 --> 00:51:30.579
high schoolers in particular are much more open

00:51:30.579 --> 00:51:32.599
-minded to this sort of a thing. That's not to

00:51:32.599 --> 00:51:34.539
say that people of all ages aren't receptive

00:51:34.539 --> 00:51:36.820
and we had great experiences with the different

00:51:36.820 --> 00:51:39.179
groups that we were invited to speak to, but

00:51:39.179 --> 00:51:42.019
it was really cool in particular to get to talk

00:51:42.019 --> 00:51:43.679
with high school students who aren't already

00:51:43.679 --> 00:51:46.940
entrenched in a political party or have these

00:51:46.940 --> 00:51:50.880
views that have solidified. They're much more

00:51:50.880 --> 00:51:54.159
open and curious. We just felt that that was

00:51:54.159 --> 00:51:58.579
a really great population to try to interact

00:51:58.579 --> 00:52:01.099
with and work with more on this sort of a thing.

00:52:01.980 --> 00:52:04.539
And so Then the question was, well, how do we

00:52:04.539 --> 00:52:06.860
do that? I mean, we get lots of invitations to

00:52:06.860 --> 00:52:08.320
go speak at high schools, but can we make it

00:52:08.320 --> 00:52:10.780
something more formal? So I think Jared was the

00:52:10.780 --> 00:52:13.019
one who had what turned out to be a great idea

00:52:13.019 --> 00:52:15.940
of the Future Leaders Academy and making a flagship

00:52:15.940 --> 00:52:19.079
program where we actually worked with some different

00:52:19.079 --> 00:52:21.980
groups to develop a curriculum that then we brought

00:52:21.980 --> 00:52:24.320
into the high school. And maybe, Jared, I'll

00:52:24.320 --> 00:52:26.340
let you talk about how it started at Jackson

00:52:26.340 --> 00:52:28.079
and kind of what we did over the school year

00:52:28.079 --> 00:52:31.590
last year. Yeah, so we kind of all put our heads

00:52:31.590 --> 00:52:33.730
together and decided, well, we want to be youth

00:52:33.730 --> 00:52:37.769
oriented. Do we create a program that we do outside

00:52:37.769 --> 00:52:40.070
of school where we're recruiting high school

00:52:40.070 --> 00:52:44.989
and college age kids to join us? And then then

00:52:44.989 --> 00:52:47.170
you mentioned liability insurance and all this.

00:52:47.170 --> 00:52:49.570
Well, OK, so that all kind of that. Do we have

00:52:49.570 --> 00:52:51.550
to do the transportation for them? Do we have

00:52:51.550 --> 00:52:55.019
to rent out a space? Right. If they're under

00:52:55.019 --> 00:52:56.900
18, do they all have to be over 18? Can you do

00:52:56.900 --> 00:52:59.579
16 and 17 year olds? But can you orient 16 and

00:52:59.579 --> 00:53:01.820
17 year olds with 21 year olds? That's complicated.

00:53:01.960 --> 00:53:04.300
So we're just like, okay, that maybe is a little

00:53:04.300 --> 00:53:06.300
too much for us to take on. And maybe years down

00:53:06.300 --> 00:53:07.940
the road, maybe this turns into something like

00:53:07.940 --> 00:53:09.619
that. And I think that's still kind of the North

00:53:09.619 --> 00:53:13.860
Star is to be able to own the project. But in

00:53:13.860 --> 00:53:16.260
the first year, which was starting last school

00:53:16.260 --> 00:53:20.239
year, the 2024 -2025 school year, we decided.

00:53:20.829 --> 00:53:22.929
Well, we have, you know, both Nate and I went

00:53:22.929 --> 00:53:24.449
to high school in Snohomish County. I went to

00:53:24.449 --> 00:53:26.909
Jackson High School. We went to Marysville. And

00:53:26.909 --> 00:53:29.650
the teachers that taught me are still at Jackson.

00:53:29.769 --> 00:53:33.289
So I reached out and their AP government teacher,

00:53:33.469 --> 00:53:35.289
Ms. Shafty, she's amazing. And she's in that

00:53:35.289 --> 00:53:37.550
video that you referenced. I reached out to her

00:53:37.550 --> 00:53:40.329
in like February or March and said, hey, here's

00:53:40.329 --> 00:53:43.519
what we're thinking. We don't. have a lot of

00:53:43.519 --> 00:53:46.440
meat on the bone yet, but we have this idea.

00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:49.579
And she had been a teacher who'd invited Nate

00:53:49.579 --> 00:53:52.159
and I over the last four years to come to Jackson

00:53:52.159 --> 00:53:55.320
and speak to her students with one off, you know,

00:53:55.320 --> 00:53:58.739
50 minute period interaction once a year. And

00:53:58.739 --> 00:54:00.280
so we already had a good relationship with her.

00:54:00.300 --> 00:54:01.920
She really trusted us. She understood the kind

00:54:01.920 --> 00:54:04.860
of stuff we talk about and our missions. And

00:54:04.860 --> 00:54:07.260
so she was to her credit, not only her credit,

00:54:07.300 --> 00:54:10.139
but the principal of Jackson, Sachin Tower and

00:54:10.139 --> 00:54:12.900
the superintendent, Ian Saltzman of the Everett

00:54:12.900 --> 00:54:15.159
School District. They were all almost immediately

00:54:15.159 --> 00:54:17.739
on board. And so they said, yeah, let's do this.

00:54:17.840 --> 00:54:20.599
So we partnered with her and she gave us every

00:54:20.599 --> 00:54:23.340
third Thursday of the month through the entire

00:54:23.340 --> 00:54:25.880
school year. So nine visits over the nine months

00:54:25.880 --> 00:54:30.349
where Nate and I. and Josh got to go in and basically

00:54:30.349 --> 00:54:33.449
give a curriculum. We wrote out like this whole

00:54:33.449 --> 00:54:36.369
schedule, the kind of almost a syllabus of the

00:54:36.369 --> 00:54:38.489
nine visits, what we were going to teach. We

00:54:38.489 --> 00:54:40.449
gave it to the school district. They approved

00:54:40.449 --> 00:54:43.030
it. They were good with it. So we got like permanent

00:54:43.030 --> 00:54:44.909
volunteer passes basically. And we were showing

00:54:44.909 --> 00:54:46.829
up every third Thursday for the entire school

00:54:46.829 --> 00:54:49.630
year. And we put them through essentially a curriculum

00:54:49.630 --> 00:54:53.199
that was. initially just getting to know us,

00:54:53.219 --> 00:54:55.300
meet us, et cetera, in our first meeting. And

00:54:55.300 --> 00:54:57.599
then the second meeting, a little bit about political

00:54:57.599 --> 00:55:00.380
polarization and some civics. So you get some

00:55:00.380 --> 00:55:03.679
foundational stuff, history over the 250 years

00:55:03.679 --> 00:55:06.119
of our country, some polarizing events, et cetera.

00:55:06.579 --> 00:55:08.619
Then for the rest of it was really focused on

00:55:08.619 --> 00:55:12.039
training that muscle. of working together through

00:55:12.039 --> 00:55:14.039
differences we had some debate classes where

00:55:14.039 --> 00:55:16.539
we put out political topics and we tried to assign

00:55:16.539 --> 00:55:18.480
like if we knew one of the kids was a little

00:55:18.480 --> 00:55:20.420
bit more of a democrat versus republican assign

00:55:20.420 --> 00:55:22.179
them the opposite positions that we assumed that

00:55:22.179 --> 00:55:24.980
they had and then had them create debate and

00:55:24.980 --> 00:55:27.599
even in front of the class defend a position

00:55:27.599 --> 00:55:30.199
that they don't actually hold with abortion and

00:55:30.199 --> 00:55:31.800
gun rights all these things you could tell they're

00:55:31.800 --> 00:55:33.840
uncomfortable at first but the reason we really

00:55:33.840 --> 00:55:36.559
liked the idea of doing like an elongated nine

00:55:36.559 --> 00:55:38.940
-month program versus the one -off you know,

00:55:38.940 --> 00:55:40.360
two hour meetings that we were doing in town

00:55:40.360 --> 00:55:43.340
halls is because we've noticed and what has been

00:55:43.340 --> 00:55:46.340
successful for Nate and I in our careers together,

00:55:46.579 --> 00:55:49.619
our professional partnerships, is that there's

00:55:49.619 --> 00:55:51.340
the ability for us to humanize each other because

00:55:51.340 --> 00:55:53.179
we know each other well enough now. He's held

00:55:53.179 --> 00:55:55.639
my kids in the first month of all of their births

00:55:55.639 --> 00:55:57.280
and then vice versa. Like we know each other.

00:55:57.559 --> 00:55:59.420
And so it's really hard to demonize each other,

00:55:59.559 --> 00:56:01.679
nor would I ever want to. So when we disagree

00:56:01.679 --> 00:56:04.679
on something, we can have really passionate disagreements.

00:56:04.699 --> 00:56:07.159
I remember when Roe v. Wade was over with the

00:56:07.159 --> 00:56:09.929
Dobbs. This decision happened. Nate and I have

00:56:09.929 --> 00:56:13.150
a different view on abortion policy. We had like

00:56:13.150 --> 00:56:15.090
a three hour phone conversation the day that

00:56:15.090 --> 00:56:16.869
that decision came down. And we did this long

00:56:16.869 --> 00:56:19.289
back and forth. And I would never repeat the

00:56:19.289 --> 00:56:20.969
things he said. He never repeat the things that

00:56:20.969 --> 00:56:23.289
I said and nothing that I asked him. Stupid questions,

00:56:23.409 --> 00:56:25.710
questions he'd think were terrible, et cetera,

00:56:25.710 --> 00:56:27.590
and vice versa. None of it ended up on Twitter,

00:56:27.690 --> 00:56:29.650
et cetera. We had good intent with that conversation.

00:56:29.789 --> 00:56:32.860
I learned a ton and I felt safe doing that. And

00:56:32.860 --> 00:56:35.300
that only was the case because we had years of

00:56:35.300 --> 00:56:37.780
learning who each other were and becoming personal

00:56:37.780 --> 00:56:40.500
friends. So the reason we like the idea of an

00:56:40.500 --> 00:56:42.719
elongated conversation with these students is

00:56:42.719 --> 00:56:44.940
if you spend a month or two getting to know each

00:56:44.940 --> 00:56:48.260
other and before you then introduce, now let's

00:56:48.260 --> 00:56:51.539
debate abortion or now let's debate guns or debate

00:56:51.539 --> 00:56:55.159
death penalty, etc. You can now humanize each

00:56:55.159 --> 00:56:58.159
other easier and have the more robust, curious

00:56:58.159 --> 00:57:00.119
conversations. And you can set aside some of

00:57:00.119 --> 00:57:02.079
the stuff that maybe you initially, that initial

00:57:02.079 --> 00:57:04.679
bias that you bring to a conversation with someone

00:57:04.679 --> 00:57:07.400
you don't know or that you haven't really intentionally

00:57:07.400 --> 00:57:10.460
leaned in to try to understand as a human before

00:57:10.460 --> 00:57:13.440
talking about policy differences. And we noticed

00:57:13.440 --> 00:57:16.440
a ton of success, a ton of change in these students.

00:57:16.619 --> 00:57:18.639
We've grown a lot and learned from them. By the

00:57:18.639 --> 00:57:21.079
end of it, you know, we did the Olympia trip.

00:57:21.159 --> 00:57:24.230
We did a... community service project. We did

00:57:24.230 --> 00:57:26.190
an essay competition. So we had some other things

00:57:26.190 --> 00:57:28.050
other than just this curriculum. And then by

00:57:28.050 --> 00:57:30.210
the end of it in June of this last year, so a

00:57:30.210 --> 00:57:32.710
few months ago, we had a summit where we invited

00:57:32.710 --> 00:57:36.429
two of the students back to sit in front of 300

00:57:36.429 --> 00:57:39.349
people from Snohomish County and their principal

00:57:39.349 --> 00:57:41.469
and a Republican and a Democrat legislator was

00:57:41.469 --> 00:57:45.030
John Lovick and Ron Mazzal, I think, who were

00:57:45.030 --> 00:57:47.210
then willing to have these like big conversations

00:57:47.210 --> 00:57:49.750
on a stage in front of people. And these kids

00:57:49.750 --> 00:57:52.940
gave the most emotional. answers and got everybody

00:57:52.940 --> 00:57:55.079
like teared up. I got choked up on stage hearing

00:57:55.079 --> 00:57:56.719
some of these responses from some of the things

00:57:56.719 --> 00:57:57.940
that the kids were saying about how much they

00:57:57.940 --> 00:58:01.480
had grown because of that experience. And so

00:58:01.480 --> 00:58:05.780
we're like extremely excited about how that went.

00:58:05.840 --> 00:58:07.480
We were super nervous going into the first year.

00:58:07.539 --> 00:58:09.039
Like, I wonder how this is going to play out

00:58:09.039 --> 00:58:11.840
where Nate had a teaching background. I didn't.

00:58:11.860 --> 00:58:13.679
So I was like, okay, we've gone and done like

00:58:13.679 --> 00:58:15.760
a 45 minute presentation to kids before, but

00:58:15.760 --> 00:58:17.980
we've never like owned a classroom curriculum

00:58:17.980 --> 00:58:23.150
for nine months. And 150 kids. And it was amazing.

00:58:23.250 --> 00:58:26.269
And it was something that gave me like a lot

00:58:26.269 --> 00:58:28.849
of confidence in what we're doing and that we're

00:58:28.849 --> 00:58:30.929
actually having an impact. And so we're doubling

00:58:30.929 --> 00:58:32.250
down this year and we're going to be bringing

00:58:32.250 --> 00:58:34.550
it to Marysville now. In two weeks, we have our

00:58:34.550 --> 00:58:37.369
first class with the Marysville cohort. You mentioned

00:58:37.369 --> 00:58:40.690
and I had no idea. You mentioned there were 150

00:58:40.690 --> 00:58:44.030
kids that were part of this program. I was going

00:58:44.030 --> 00:58:46.610
to ask, so did these so was this like a particular

00:58:46.610 --> 00:58:50.369
class or did these kids? self -select that wanted

00:58:50.369 --> 00:58:52.090
to be part of this program. But it sounds like

00:58:52.090 --> 00:58:56.130
this was an entire, maybe an entire grade or

00:58:56.130 --> 00:59:00.190
maybe an entire class from a particular high

00:59:00.190 --> 00:59:03.769
school teacher. And you got, I mean, 150 kids

00:59:03.769 --> 00:59:07.269
is a lot. How did that selection process actually

00:59:07.269 --> 00:59:09.750
work? Was it just by happenstance that this particular

00:59:09.750 --> 00:59:12.130
teacher had kind of these different students

00:59:12.130 --> 00:59:14.710
cycling through her classroom and it was that

00:59:14.710 --> 00:59:19.289
number? Yeah, we just had every one of Ms. Shafty's

00:59:19.289 --> 00:59:22.329
five AP government classes. She's the AP government

00:59:22.329 --> 00:59:25.050
teacher. She happens to have all five of her

00:59:25.050 --> 00:59:27.869
classes, class periods, were AP government students,

00:59:28.030 --> 00:59:31.289
seniors. So she had 130 kids per class, 150 students.

00:59:31.550 --> 00:59:35.130
So we were there from 7 a .m. to 2 .30 p .m.

00:59:35.170 --> 00:59:40.170
doing all five periods once a month. So you know

00:59:40.170 --> 00:59:41.570
what it feels like to be a high school teacher

00:59:41.570 --> 00:59:44.829
at least once a month. Council Member Neering,

00:59:44.909 --> 00:59:47.250
one of the quotes that I picked up from you in

00:59:47.250 --> 00:59:51.869
your interview on TVW was, and this is something

00:59:51.869 --> 00:59:54.190
that you said, making sure our differences don't

00:59:54.190 --> 00:59:56.010
divide us, but allow us to learn from each other.

00:59:56.869 --> 01:00:00.809
And it sounds like by Council Member Mead's description

01:00:00.809 --> 01:00:03.570
that the high school students really took that

01:00:03.570 --> 01:00:06.309
pretty seriously, that they took that to heart

01:00:06.309 --> 01:00:09.949
and were willing to be open -minded in that regard.

01:00:09.989 --> 01:00:12.590
Did you feel like that was the case as well?

01:00:13.259 --> 01:00:15.460
Absolutely. Yeah. And I think it can be easy

01:00:15.460 --> 01:00:18.659
when you're used to the news or social media,

01:00:18.780 --> 01:00:21.719
just putting caricatures up of whatever the opposing

01:00:21.719 --> 01:00:26.519
view is, and sort of painting out political opposition

01:00:26.519 --> 01:00:29.159
to be either dumb or evil or whatever it may

01:00:29.159 --> 01:00:31.559
be. It makes it really easy just to make those

01:00:31.559 --> 01:00:33.780
assumptions when you encounter it in day -to

01:00:33.780 --> 01:00:36.159
-day life. And so I think it's really important,

01:00:36.380 --> 01:00:38.039
particularly with young people, but for people

01:00:38.039 --> 01:00:42.670
of all ages to show that somebody who has the

01:00:42.670 --> 01:00:45.250
opposite political stance is just as much of

01:00:45.250 --> 01:00:49.889
a human and, you know, has a family and interests

01:00:49.889 --> 01:00:51.650
and all these different sorts of things. And

01:00:51.650 --> 01:00:54.030
so being able to. Probably a lot of the same

01:00:54.030 --> 01:00:56.409
goals, right? A lot of shared goals about what

01:00:56.409 --> 01:00:58.289
they want their future to be like, et cetera.

01:00:58.969 --> 01:01:01.650
Absolutely. Yep. And so I think being able to,

01:01:01.650 --> 01:01:04.590
you know, to demonstrate that and to have the

01:01:04.590 --> 01:01:07.349
students get to practice that was really critical.

01:01:08.750 --> 01:01:11.909
So. I'm really interested in, and I just want

01:01:11.909 --> 01:01:15.869
to ask a little bit about the history of polarization,

01:01:16.150 --> 01:01:18.829
because that's something that you talked about,

01:01:19.030 --> 01:01:22.869
Councilmember Mead, and it's something that's

01:01:22.869 --> 01:01:24.849
on your website as well as part of this program.

01:01:25.070 --> 01:01:27.929
You educated the students on kind of the history

01:01:27.929 --> 01:01:30.110
of polarization. And the reason that that is

01:01:30.110 --> 01:01:32.630
interesting to me is it seems like no matter

01:01:32.630 --> 01:01:35.849
where we go today. You listen to the pundits,

01:01:35.849 --> 01:01:39.210
you listen to the media, you're on social media.

01:01:39.349 --> 01:01:42.449
A lot of people talk about how we're as polarized

01:01:42.449 --> 01:01:45.730
as we've ever been. There's statistics out there

01:01:45.730 --> 01:01:47.889
that show polarization growing in the United

01:01:47.889 --> 01:01:51.269
States. And I think we all feel that compared

01:01:51.269 --> 01:01:55.809
to maybe our reality as younger people, as children

01:01:55.809 --> 01:01:58.670
growing up at different times. And the way that

01:01:58.670 --> 01:02:01.309
we communicate today is different. But when you

01:02:01.309 --> 01:02:03.940
look back. Right. Well, and the other thing,

01:02:03.980 --> 01:02:05.860
of course, is, you know, the one that I always

01:02:05.860 --> 01:02:08.480
love is this is the most important election of

01:02:08.480 --> 01:02:12.139
our lifetimes. Right. Yeah, I've heard that every

01:02:12.139 --> 01:02:13.840
election. I was just in New York. My current

01:02:13.840 --> 01:02:17.559
election, 2025 Council District 4 is the most

01:02:17.559 --> 01:02:19.320
important election of all time. Without a doubt,

01:02:19.460 --> 01:02:21.219
Council Member Mead. And I felt the same about

01:02:21.219 --> 01:02:24.159
mine several years ago. Right. We all feel that

01:02:24.159 --> 01:02:27.289
way. And we all want to say that. And it's that

01:02:27.289 --> 01:02:29.309
kind of line. I was just in New York City two

01:02:29.309 --> 01:02:31.809
weeks ago. And you may have heard, unless you're

01:02:31.809 --> 01:02:33.630
living in a cave somewhere, that there's a mayoral

01:02:33.630 --> 01:02:36.389
race going on in New York City. Right. Biggest

01:02:36.389 --> 01:02:39.130
city in the country. Huge issue. Three candidates.

01:02:39.349 --> 01:02:43.889
And of course, the lead into every single political

01:02:43.889 --> 01:02:46.929
ad was this is the most important election of

01:02:46.929 --> 01:02:49.130
our lifetime. You must vote in this election.

01:02:49.230 --> 01:02:52.789
Right. And and and there's there's there's a

01:02:52.789 --> 01:02:55.559
reason. People say that. There's a reason the

01:02:55.559 --> 01:02:57.639
media says that, right? There's a reason pundits

01:02:57.639 --> 01:02:59.780
say that. There's a reason candidates say that.

01:03:00.260 --> 01:03:02.340
But when you look back at the history of polarization,

01:03:02.900 --> 01:03:05.679
are we really as polarized today as we've ever

01:03:05.679 --> 01:03:08.659
been? I mean, are things as bad today as they

01:03:08.659 --> 01:03:11.440
were during the Civil War? You know, are they

01:03:11.440 --> 01:03:13.519
as bad today as they were during the Civil Rights

01:03:13.519 --> 01:03:16.320
Movement? What about the Gilded Age, you know,

01:03:16.340 --> 01:03:19.380
between the fights of, you know, the haves and

01:03:19.380 --> 01:03:22.920
the have -nots, the labor? agriculture right

01:03:22.920 --> 01:03:25.559
the new money versus the old money the robber

01:03:25.559 --> 01:03:29.000
barons etc i mean when you look back at what

01:03:29.000 --> 01:03:32.940
there used to be fights with weapons on the floors

01:03:32.940 --> 01:03:35.699
of congress where one member of a party would

01:03:35.699 --> 01:03:38.719
end up you know beaten and bloodied that was

01:03:38.719 --> 01:03:43.280
normal that doesn't happen today so uh it's interesting

01:03:43.280 --> 01:03:46.199
when you when i'm curious what you talked about

01:03:46.199 --> 01:03:49.139
uh when you talked about the history of polarization

01:03:49.139 --> 01:03:51.869
and i'm not trying to minimize polarization today

01:03:51.869 --> 01:03:54.170
at all, because I think it's a big problem. And

01:03:54.170 --> 01:03:56.909
the way we communicate has made it so different,

01:03:57.050 --> 01:04:01.269
right? It's created so much anonymity that in

01:04:01.269 --> 01:04:04.369
many ways it goes over the top and over the edge

01:04:04.369 --> 01:04:07.710
and people, you know, some folks on, you know,

01:04:07.710 --> 01:04:10.090
the most extreme parts of both of them really

01:04:10.090 --> 01:04:12.710
thrive on that. But I'm curious as to what you

01:04:12.710 --> 01:04:14.909
taught, what you talked about and what the reaction

01:04:14.909 --> 01:04:17.369
of the students were when you kind of discussed

01:04:17.369 --> 01:04:20.260
the history of polarization. In the United States,

01:04:20.300 --> 01:04:23.159
you just did half of our talk, basically. I mean,

01:04:23.159 --> 01:04:25.940
it's literally that I start with I have a whole

01:04:25.940 --> 01:04:29.579
timeline and I turn it into a game at the end.

01:04:29.619 --> 01:04:32.920
But it's a timeline of the United States history.

01:04:33.159 --> 01:04:36.340
And I start with the Continental Congress. I

01:04:36.340 --> 01:04:39.039
say I because that's my that's our second visit

01:04:39.039 --> 01:04:40.480
of the curriculum. And that's my presentation

01:04:40.480 --> 01:04:43.559
I have to do. And the Continental Congress, the

01:04:43.559 --> 01:04:46.440
beginning of the country. So I talk about I kind

01:04:46.440 --> 01:04:49.030
of try to set the stage of. Yes, exactly what

01:04:49.030 --> 01:04:50.530
you said. People say we're the most polarized

01:04:50.530 --> 01:04:53.210
we've ever been. And to some extent, as far as

01:04:53.210 --> 01:04:56.949
like how quickly social media helps exacerbate

01:04:56.949 --> 01:05:00.730
that. And with some new media, which is fine.

01:05:01.130 --> 01:05:04.190
Yes, yes. So in some ways it can feel like that.

01:05:04.230 --> 01:05:06.809
And in some ways it is depending on how you what

01:05:06.809 --> 01:05:10.309
you mean by the worst. But we have always we

01:05:10.309 --> 01:05:12.530
were created. The country was literally founded

01:05:12.530 --> 01:05:16.320
in deep political. polarization. If you look

01:05:16.320 --> 01:05:18.219
at the First Continental Congress, the Second

01:05:18.219 --> 01:05:21.199
Continental Congress, and the half of the people,

01:05:21.320 --> 01:05:25.800
half the founders were viciously opposed to the

01:05:25.800 --> 01:05:27.619
perspective of the other half of the founders

01:05:27.619 --> 01:05:29.039
and what kind of country we're going to have,

01:05:29.099 --> 01:05:32.440
even to the idea of, are we going to split from

01:05:32.440 --> 01:05:36.039
England? Or are we going to figure out a way

01:05:36.039 --> 01:05:38.280
to work with them? And we're okay with some taxes?

01:05:38.320 --> 01:05:40.860
And oh, no, we're not at all. And so you go into

01:05:40.860 --> 01:05:43.860
like the actual debate that was happening. In

01:05:43.860 --> 01:05:46.440
the Continental Congress, first and second. And

01:05:46.440 --> 01:05:48.000
then all the way through, you said civil rights

01:05:48.000 --> 01:05:50.260
or the Civil War, sorry, civil rights movement,

01:05:50.440 --> 01:05:53.800
women's suffrage. And then we end on the D .C.

01:05:53.820 --> 01:05:55.840
riots just because that's kind of our little

01:05:55.840 --> 01:05:57.980
bit of our origin story and what happened on

01:05:57.980 --> 01:06:00.360
January 6th. So we talk about all that stuff

01:06:00.360 --> 01:06:04.480
to make the point that polar, like disagreement

01:06:04.480 --> 01:06:09.400
is not bad. In fact, like deep emotional disagreement

01:06:09.400 --> 01:06:12.920
is not. bad inherently. It's how we respond to

01:06:12.920 --> 01:06:15.039
each other, how we interact with each other during

01:06:15.039 --> 01:06:17.679
those disagreements. And sometimes they can turn

01:06:17.679 --> 01:06:20.719
into the Civil War. And sometimes they can turn

01:06:20.719 --> 01:06:24.280
into good policy that was really hashed out and

01:06:24.280 --> 01:06:27.099
molded through this rumble tube and polished

01:06:27.099 --> 01:06:30.139
because of that fight because of the back and

01:06:30.139 --> 01:06:32.480
forth. And you mentioned the just because you

01:06:32.480 --> 01:06:34.880
mentioned this, the the bloodiness on the Senate

01:06:34.880 --> 01:06:39.579
floor 100 years ago, and Nate and I were In D

01:06:39.579 --> 01:06:41.420
.C. was the last year, a couple of years ago,

01:06:41.460 --> 01:06:43.099
I think, for NACO, for the county's conference.

01:06:43.340 --> 01:06:45.780
And we went and we stood in the spot where the

01:06:45.780 --> 01:06:48.039
guy's name is Charles Sumner, who got caned.

01:06:48.039 --> 01:06:50.420
He's a senator who got caned almost to death.

01:06:50.639 --> 01:06:52.500
There's like blood spots on the carpet there

01:06:52.500 --> 01:06:56.079
in the old Senate floor. And so. That's not happening

01:06:56.079 --> 01:06:58.059
right now. I mean, we're not shooting and killing

01:06:58.059 --> 01:06:59.980
each other in the United States Senate floor.

01:07:00.280 --> 01:07:03.079
So are we as polarized as we've ever been or

01:07:03.079 --> 01:07:05.219
are we seeing it in a different way? And is it

01:07:05.219 --> 01:07:06.900
getting is it because it's spread a little faster

01:07:06.900 --> 01:07:08.780
because of social media and other things like

01:07:08.780 --> 01:07:11.519
that corporate media influence? Maybe so. So

01:07:11.519 --> 01:07:13.920
it's really about. It's not that humans have

01:07:13.920 --> 01:07:16.880
never disagreed vehemently. They have. It's more

01:07:16.880 --> 01:07:20.460
so we need to train ourselves to use the tools

01:07:20.460 --> 01:07:23.420
that we have and live in this new world of social

01:07:23.420 --> 01:07:26.300
media and media and kind of start training that

01:07:26.300 --> 01:07:28.440
muscle in a different way to engage with each

01:07:28.440 --> 01:07:30.219
other differently because there's just different

01:07:30.219 --> 01:07:32.579
inputs now. And that's what we try to talk to

01:07:32.579 --> 01:07:33.940
young people about. That's why we're focused

01:07:33.940 --> 01:07:37.300
on young people because they're the future. They're

01:07:37.300 --> 01:07:39.039
the ones that have had a smartphone and social

01:07:39.039 --> 01:07:41.059
media since they were born. I mean, even Nate

01:07:41.059 --> 01:07:43.860
and I. Facebook, it's younger than me, but Facebook,

01:07:43.940 --> 01:07:46.679
you know, came of, we came of age in high school

01:07:46.679 --> 01:07:49.079
when Facebook was just starting versus these

01:07:49.079 --> 01:07:50.820
kids now have had TikTok since they were eight

01:07:50.820 --> 01:07:53.880
and they've got a smartphone and all of that.

01:07:53.920 --> 01:07:56.420
So they're just dealing with. polarization and

01:07:56.420 --> 01:07:59.260
political polarization differently than any generation

01:07:59.260 --> 01:08:01.760
previous. So it's just about making sure that

01:08:01.760 --> 01:08:03.860
they understand that when they're young, and

01:08:03.860 --> 01:08:05.780
that it does not have to be this way. And that

01:08:05.780 --> 01:08:07.840
if you train this muscle and you're intentional

01:08:07.840 --> 01:08:11.260
about being humble and curious and brave, then

01:08:11.260 --> 01:08:15.000
you can grow out into the adult world and be

01:08:15.000 --> 01:08:18.420
a good functioning civil member of society rather

01:08:18.420 --> 01:08:21.199
than joining a team. And now I'm a Democrat,

01:08:21.279 --> 01:08:23.760
I'm blue, team blue, period, or I'm red, etc.

01:08:25.130 --> 01:08:28.350
One thing that gives me hope is when I look at,

01:08:28.409 --> 01:08:30.170
you know, we talked at the beginning of the podcast

01:08:30.170 --> 01:08:32.529
about some of the backlash that we received from

01:08:32.529 --> 01:08:35.069
the political parties. But, you know, when I

01:08:35.069 --> 01:08:38.810
see polling nationally or even anecdotally through

01:08:38.810 --> 01:08:40.609
our own experiences, when Jared and I have gone

01:08:40.609 --> 01:08:43.329
and talked to various audiences, the vast majority

01:08:43.329 --> 01:08:46.250
of the public, whether it's young people, adults,

01:08:46.409 --> 01:08:49.340
any ages. are yearning for more of this sort

01:08:49.340 --> 01:08:51.100
of thing. They're yearning for more civility,

01:08:51.239 --> 01:08:54.920
more respectful dialogue about important issues

01:08:54.920 --> 01:08:57.500
and wanting to see people work together to better

01:08:57.500 --> 01:09:01.039
the communities. It's a very vocal minority on

01:09:01.039 --> 01:09:04.539
either side that is like, you know, the enemy

01:09:04.539 --> 01:09:06.359
is evil. We don't want to talk to the other side

01:09:06.359 --> 01:09:10.039
of the aisle. But we hear it so much, like Jared

01:09:10.039 --> 01:09:12.100
said, because of the prevalence of social media

01:09:12.100 --> 01:09:14.279
and news media and because that's what gets clicks.

01:09:14.920 --> 01:09:17.000
But it is refreshing when you go out and actually

01:09:17.000 --> 01:09:19.720
talk with people. And like I said, when you look

01:09:19.720 --> 01:09:23.180
at polls, they see just how many, just how big

01:09:23.180 --> 01:09:26.699
the proportion is of Americans that want to see

01:09:26.699 --> 01:09:29.659
this sort of positive change in our civic dialogue.

01:09:30.180 --> 01:09:32.340
There was a New York Times study. I'll just say

01:09:32.340 --> 01:09:34.149
this really quickly. on this topic. There's a

01:09:34.149 --> 01:09:36.829
New York Times study in the end of 2024 that

01:09:36.829 --> 01:09:39.350
said 80, it was like 8 ,000 people were surveyed

01:09:39.350 --> 01:09:41.649
as a gigantic study that they did. And it said

01:09:41.649 --> 01:09:44.869
86 % of Americans that were surveyed refused

01:09:44.869 --> 01:09:48.000
to identify with either party. meaning only 7

01:09:48.000 --> 01:09:50.859
% on either side were willing to say I'm a Democrat

01:09:50.859 --> 01:09:54.239
or I'm a Republican. 86 % of Americans said both

01:09:54.239 --> 01:09:56.239
the parties have gone insane. Neither of the

01:09:56.239 --> 01:10:00.260
parties represent my perspective to the degree

01:10:00.260 --> 01:10:02.420
that I'd be willing to then identify myself as

01:10:02.420 --> 01:10:05.300
one of them. So yeah, we have a two -party system.

01:10:05.340 --> 01:10:07.640
And yes, a Democrat or a Republican will be president

01:10:07.640 --> 01:10:10.590
for the foreseeable future. But that does not

01:10:10.590 --> 01:10:14.250
mean that's reflective of the American mind and

01:10:14.250 --> 01:10:16.609
the American populace. It's reflective of the

01:10:16.609 --> 01:10:18.810
most extreme voices and then the system. It's

01:10:18.810 --> 01:10:20.569
like a symptom of the system that we have set

01:10:20.569 --> 01:10:23.890
up, the two party system. So anyways, that's

01:10:23.890 --> 01:10:25.770
that's that's something that gives me solace

01:10:25.770 --> 01:10:28.750
to know, like, OK, most people, in fact, the

01:10:28.750 --> 01:10:32.170
vast majority of Americans are somewhere in between

01:10:32.170 --> 01:10:33.890
a little bit left, a little bit right, whatever.

01:10:33.989 --> 01:10:36.229
But everybody is sick of the system we have in

01:10:36.229 --> 01:10:40.039
both parties. So this is. super interesting.

01:10:40.100 --> 01:10:41.859
I certainly have my own theories. I think we

01:10:41.859 --> 01:10:44.960
probably all have our own theories about this.

01:10:45.079 --> 01:10:48.260
But it's interesting to hear you say, you know,

01:10:48.260 --> 01:10:51.439
touting some of those statistics when that's

01:10:51.439 --> 01:10:53.319
certainly not what we hear in the mainstream

01:10:53.319 --> 01:10:56.100
media, right? And it's not what we see on our

01:10:56.100 --> 01:10:58.479
social media feeds. Or if you look at the legislative

01:10:58.479 --> 01:11:01.939
makeup, you don't see that represented in your

01:11:01.939 --> 01:11:04.359
life. Exactly. Yeah. In fact, you know, you could

01:11:04.359 --> 01:11:06.140
make the argument that, you know, it's impossible.

01:11:07.000 --> 01:11:10.100
in most cases, to get elected unless you're affiliated

01:11:10.100 --> 01:11:12.159
with one of the major parties. It's certainly

01:11:12.159 --> 01:11:15.020
not what we see around the Thanksgiving dinner

01:11:15.020 --> 01:11:18.220
table when the conversation gets a little spicy,

01:11:18.500 --> 01:11:22.439
shall we say, about politics. If you don't have

01:11:22.439 --> 01:11:25.560
a rule at your house, no politics at Thanksgiving.

01:11:26.899 --> 01:11:33.039
But when we think about other parts of our political

01:11:33.039 --> 01:11:36.199
reality, like, for instance, political patronage.

01:11:36.520 --> 01:11:40.180
and how not only commonplace it is, but accepted.

01:11:40.439 --> 01:11:42.899
It's almost accepted now that that's going to

01:11:42.899 --> 01:11:46.779
happen when a new party comes into power, right?

01:11:47.140 --> 01:11:49.079
These are things that were unheard of in the

01:11:49.079 --> 01:11:50.859
past when you talk about the history of polarization

01:11:50.859 --> 01:11:54.100
and the history of politics. The team of rivals

01:11:54.100 --> 01:11:57.000
that you had that so famously was in place under

01:11:57.000 --> 01:12:00.010
the Lincoln administration, right? that's gone.

01:12:00.369 --> 01:12:02.550
That's probably never going to happen again,

01:12:02.710 --> 01:12:05.869
right? Anybody who tried to do it would be ostracized

01:12:05.869 --> 01:12:07.470
from their own party. I mean, you guys thought

01:12:07.470 --> 01:12:10.569
you took a little backlash for an op -ed and

01:12:10.569 --> 01:12:14.109
some conversations. Holy cow, right? If you were

01:12:14.109 --> 01:12:17.630
elected and then started appointing people who

01:12:17.630 --> 01:12:20.250
not only opposed you, but were maybe members

01:12:20.250 --> 01:12:23.109
of another party, could you imagine the backlash

01:12:23.109 --> 01:12:26.319
that you'd get there? You know, things like that

01:12:26.319 --> 01:12:28.140
have become commonplace. They're norm. They're

01:12:28.140 --> 01:12:30.720
almost accepted as inevitable. Nobody talks about

01:12:30.720 --> 01:12:33.180
them anymore. We see all of this polarization

01:12:33.180 --> 01:12:35.600
in the media, on social media, et cetera, about

01:12:35.600 --> 01:12:37.199
what you're telling me is you're going out and

01:12:37.199 --> 01:12:39.960
talking to people and they don't like that. And

01:12:39.960 --> 01:12:42.520
they want to have these conversations and they're

01:12:42.520 --> 01:12:46.180
looking for relief. Why? Why do you think that

01:12:46.180 --> 01:12:49.180
is? What's driving that desire? Are you saying

01:12:49.180 --> 01:12:51.239
that what's driving them to respond positively

01:12:51.239 --> 01:12:55.260
to what we're saying? Yes. Absolutely. I think

01:12:55.260 --> 01:12:57.899
it's that most like human, it's in human nature.

01:12:57.960 --> 01:13:01.079
We want to be part of a tribe. We want each other

01:13:01.079 --> 01:13:03.079
to be successful through evolution, thousands

01:13:03.079 --> 01:13:05.960
of years of human evolution. We have evolved

01:13:05.960 --> 01:13:08.659
to want to help each other, to want to have the

01:13:08.659 --> 01:13:12.180
race succeed, etc. And so I think it's natural

01:13:12.180 --> 01:13:14.239
for us to see each other and want to help each

01:13:14.239 --> 01:13:17.500
other. What's unnatural is us to only orient

01:13:17.500 --> 01:13:19.539
ourselves with each or only interact with each

01:13:19.539 --> 01:13:22.449
other. through 3D screens like this or on social

01:13:22.449 --> 01:13:24.189
media where we don't even actually see each other

01:13:24.189 --> 01:13:26.890
or through video, whatever. When we're in person,

01:13:27.010 --> 01:13:29.710
nobody says what we say on social media. Nobody

01:13:29.710 --> 01:13:32.329
says the stuff I get an email about that I should

01:13:32.329 --> 01:13:34.670
get cancer and die for my vote on some housing

01:13:34.670 --> 01:13:37.050
development or that somebody is going to come

01:13:37.050 --> 01:13:39.210
harass my pregnant wife and yell with the megaphone

01:13:39.210 --> 01:13:42.109
outside of the window because I voted on a tax

01:13:42.109 --> 01:13:44.640
or something. That stuff is never said in person

01:13:44.640 --> 01:13:46.020
and they don't even follow through with those

01:13:46.020 --> 01:13:47.720
threats that they're talking about. That's the

01:13:47.720 --> 01:13:49.520
stuff that people are willing to say because

01:13:49.520 --> 01:13:51.979
we can, our natural human instinct to be kind

01:13:51.979 --> 01:13:54.300
to each other and to help each other and to cringe

01:13:54.300 --> 01:13:57.140
when we see each other in pain, et cetera, that's

01:13:57.140 --> 01:13:59.439
diluted or completely numb when you're doing

01:13:59.439 --> 01:14:01.800
it on a 3D screen. So I think a lot of it is,

01:14:01.840 --> 01:14:04.319
it's natural human instinct to want us to get,

01:14:04.399 --> 01:14:06.699
to want us to work together, to want us to succeed.

01:14:07.319 --> 01:14:09.619
And then we see that it's not working the way

01:14:09.619 --> 01:14:11.520
that it's the way that we're operating now. We

01:14:11.520 --> 01:14:14.319
see when we're fighting on social media that

01:14:14.319 --> 01:14:17.260
we get policy that hurts us all. Most people

01:14:17.260 --> 01:14:20.420
now have to have a two income household, a dual

01:14:20.420 --> 01:14:22.140
income household in order to pay their mortgage

01:14:22.140 --> 01:14:25.739
and feed the kids. Whereas, you know, just a

01:14:25.739 --> 01:14:28.569
generation ago and every generation. previous

01:14:28.569 --> 01:14:31.489
you were able to with one income you're able

01:14:31.489 --> 01:14:34.310
to pay the bills and you could run the family

01:14:34.310 --> 01:14:36.829
and all that with less less money so i think

01:14:36.829 --> 01:14:39.470
we're dealing with a different station economically

01:14:39.470 --> 01:14:43.270
than we have seen in decades in the country where

01:14:43.270 --> 01:14:45.090
it's getting people more frustrated and worried

01:14:45.090 --> 01:14:47.369
concerned about what how we're getting the policy

01:14:47.369 --> 01:14:49.069
that we're getting and the frustration that makes

01:14:49.069 --> 01:14:50.569
people feel like the system isn't working right

01:14:50.569 --> 01:14:53.289
now the way that it is and so i think people

01:14:53.289 --> 01:14:56.500
when they then see this like I think it's refreshing

01:14:56.500 --> 01:14:58.460
for them to then see like, oh, it's a Republican

01:14:58.460 --> 01:14:59.720
Democrat. You assume they're going to hate each

01:14:59.720 --> 01:15:01.760
other. And now not only do they not hate each

01:15:01.760 --> 01:15:03.720
other, they're proud that they don't hate each

01:15:03.720 --> 01:15:05.579
other. And they're out there trying to show people

01:15:05.579 --> 01:15:07.819
that they don't hate each other, which is rare.

01:15:08.079 --> 01:15:10.560
So I think people will naturally gravitate to

01:15:10.560 --> 01:15:13.100
it because it's what's in most people's hearts.

01:15:13.180 --> 01:15:15.859
86 % of people polled said they won't even refer

01:15:15.859 --> 01:15:17.479
to themselves as a Democrat or a Republican.

01:15:17.939 --> 01:15:20.100
That number is even bigger for people who want

01:15:20.100 --> 01:15:21.800
Democrats and Republicans to work together, because

01:15:21.800 --> 01:15:24.739
even those 14%, there's a huge chunk of even

01:15:24.739 --> 01:15:26.930
those people. that want to see the two parties

01:15:26.930 --> 01:15:29.390
work together, you know? I think part of it too

01:15:29.390 --> 01:15:32.229
is like people are busy, right? Especially now

01:15:32.229 --> 01:15:35.270
in the modern era, you know, everyone's busy

01:15:35.270 --> 01:15:38.609
with stuff. People don't have time to get into

01:15:38.609 --> 01:15:41.069
like the nitty gritty of partisan politics and,

01:15:41.149 --> 01:15:43.909
you know, educate themselves on everything that

01:15:43.909 --> 01:15:45.970
both parties are doing. So I think to Jared's

01:15:45.970 --> 01:15:48.670
point with the, you know, I think both political

01:15:48.670 --> 01:15:52.279
parties nationally, like the brand is a... has

01:15:52.279 --> 01:15:54.279
to be like an all time low, both for Democrats

01:15:54.279 --> 01:15:56.079
and Republicans, like people are not wanting

01:15:56.079 --> 01:15:58.600
to identify with either side. And I think people

01:15:58.600 --> 01:16:01.300
are, you know, they want to see more of this

01:16:01.300 --> 01:16:05.300
civic engagement, this sort of respectful dialogue

01:16:05.300 --> 01:16:08.859
or the, you know, the healthy interaction between

01:16:08.859 --> 01:16:11.880
people from differing perspectives, because that's

01:16:11.880 --> 01:16:14.779
what works, right? Like, I don't, you know. I

01:16:14.779 --> 01:16:16.800
don't think people have time to say, OK, well,

01:16:17.000 --> 01:16:19.479
the Republicans say the Democrats are evil and

01:16:19.479 --> 01:16:21.159
the Democrats say that Republicans are evil.

01:16:21.260 --> 01:16:23.779
But, you know, no matter what, when things change

01:16:23.779 --> 01:16:25.939
each election, each side just takes it too far

01:16:25.939 --> 01:16:28.239
and isn't really interested in governing or working

01:16:28.239 --> 01:16:31.859
across the aisle. They're just sort of playing

01:16:31.859 --> 01:16:34.000
to their own jump beat and things don't change.

01:16:34.079 --> 01:16:35.880
So I think that's part of it, too, is people

01:16:35.880 --> 01:16:37.619
just want to, you know, they're focused on their

01:16:37.619 --> 01:16:39.359
own life, on everything that's going on with

01:16:39.359 --> 01:16:42.560
kids and sports. anything else they might be

01:16:42.560 --> 01:16:44.840
dealing with. And they just want to see, you

01:16:44.840 --> 01:16:46.619
know, kind of your meat and potatoes issues being

01:16:46.619 --> 01:16:48.520
dealt with. They're not that concerned with just

01:16:48.520 --> 01:16:52.199
the more extreme things that I think some of

01:16:52.199 --> 01:16:54.880
the parties are more interested in. So I think

01:16:54.880 --> 01:16:57.119
those are good points. And I appreciate that

01:16:57.119 --> 01:17:00.739
perspective. But let me just ask maybe another

01:17:00.739 --> 01:17:05.100
question to follow up on it really quickly. I

01:17:05.100 --> 01:17:08.279
think people, I'm glad to hear that people are

01:17:08.279 --> 01:17:11.210
saying that that's what they desire. And I'm

01:17:11.210 --> 01:17:13.409
glad to hear your guys' perspective, especially

01:17:13.409 --> 01:17:15.310
on the local level, that people want, you know,

01:17:15.329 --> 01:17:17.470
they want a system that works right. They want

01:17:17.470 --> 01:17:20.689
legislators that people represent them, you know,

01:17:20.689 --> 01:17:23.149
to work together to achieve the outcomes that

01:17:23.149 --> 01:17:25.170
I think are better for everybody. But when you

01:17:25.170 --> 01:17:27.369
look at how the parties act and when you look

01:17:27.369 --> 01:17:29.409
at how people vote, especially in some of the

01:17:29.409 --> 01:17:32.189
statewide elections, the national elections,

01:17:32.750 --> 01:17:35.289
et cetera, their votes don't necessarily reflect

01:17:35.289 --> 01:17:38.909
that desire. Right. The the outlandish positions

01:17:38.909 --> 01:17:42.479
that you hear. The really polarized rhetoric

01:17:42.479 --> 01:17:45.859
that you get from each side, you know, the one

01:17:45.859 --> 01:17:48.560
liners and the debates and the, you know, the

01:17:48.560 --> 01:17:51.960
campaigning. There's a reason that the parties

01:17:51.960 --> 01:17:54.119
are doing that. Right. There's a reason the candidates

01:17:54.119 --> 01:17:56.359
are doing it because it actually works. It's

01:17:56.359 --> 01:17:58.979
what people react to. They're not reacting, at

01:17:58.979 --> 01:18:00.979
least on those broader levels to those more,

01:18:01.060 --> 01:18:03.720
you know, hey, let's all work together sorts

01:18:03.720 --> 01:18:07.779
of, you know, platforms and positions. And I'm

01:18:07.779 --> 01:18:10.079
wondering, you know, do you see that changing

01:18:10.079 --> 01:18:13.000
in the future? And, you know, I assume movements

01:18:13.000 --> 01:18:16.380
like yours are geared to try to do that. But

01:18:16.380 --> 01:18:19.939
what's it actually going to take for people's

01:18:19.939 --> 01:18:22.560
desires that they're communicating to you, you

01:18:22.560 --> 01:18:24.859
know, to follow up with real action at the ballot

01:18:24.859 --> 01:18:27.180
box when we're selecting our leaders, you know,

01:18:27.199 --> 01:18:31.479
at all levels? So that's another two hour podcast.

01:18:31.760 --> 01:18:34.239
Yeah, probably. What we're focused on is what

01:18:34.239 --> 01:18:36.659
we're focused on with the Future Leaders Academy

01:18:36.659 --> 01:18:39.479
and the Building Bridges Project writ large is

01:18:39.479 --> 01:18:42.720
more like the voter sentiment. But I think there's

01:18:42.720 --> 01:18:44.960
two pieces to your question. The voter sentiment

01:18:44.960 --> 01:18:46.739
piece of like, how do you get people to start?

01:18:47.480 --> 01:18:49.960
demanding of their elected officials that they

01:18:49.960 --> 01:18:52.300
are willing to work across the aisle, aren't

01:18:52.300 --> 01:18:54.239
as bombastic, et cetera, et cetera. That's, I

01:18:54.239 --> 01:18:56.000
think, the piece that our project kind of can

01:18:56.000 --> 01:18:57.600
work on is to try to help people, especially

01:18:57.600 --> 01:18:59.760
young people who are going to be the next voter

01:18:59.760 --> 01:19:05.220
block to demand that rhetoric cools down, that

01:19:05.220 --> 01:19:06.859
they're more bipartisan, et cetera, et cetera.

01:19:07.159 --> 01:19:09.300
That's the one. But then the second piece is

01:19:09.300 --> 01:19:12.520
the system, like the structure that we have with

01:19:12.520 --> 01:19:16.239
the corrosive influence of. dark money in politics,

01:19:16.380 --> 01:19:19.039
how much money can be spent in campaigning. And

01:19:19.039 --> 01:19:20.960
Nate and I aren't totally on the same page about

01:19:20.960 --> 01:19:22.800
all the what we see as the structural issues.

01:19:22.960 --> 01:19:27.340
But I think money being spent in massive boatloads

01:19:27.340 --> 01:19:30.880
is a huge problem, because you're talking about

01:19:30.880 --> 01:19:33.659
a primary election that really decides everything

01:19:33.659 --> 01:19:36.220
in Washington. And in the primary elections,

01:19:36.260 --> 01:19:39.500
if a ton of money is spent on one side and that

01:19:39.500 --> 01:19:41.399
person's getting all of the endorsements and

01:19:41.399 --> 01:19:43.920
those things snowball because they are the most

01:19:43.920 --> 01:19:46.600
extreme and they're going to the SEIUs and the

01:19:46.600 --> 01:19:49.180
different unions that the Democrats have to go

01:19:49.180 --> 01:19:50.659
to or the environmental groups, whatever. And,

01:19:50.739 --> 01:19:52.159
you know, those are the endorsements that you

01:19:52.159 --> 01:19:54.180
need so that they will send out to their mailing

01:19:54.180 --> 01:19:56.640
list, which are their avid voters, because you're

01:19:56.640 --> 01:19:58.760
talking about a primary election, an odd year

01:19:58.760 --> 01:20:01.100
primary election, which is going to be a 25,

01:20:01.199 --> 01:20:03.760
it was 24 % turnout in Snohomish County last

01:20:03.760 --> 01:20:06.470
month in August. 24 % of people are deciding

01:20:06.470 --> 01:20:09.010
who's coming out of the primary. That's a huge

01:20:09.010 --> 01:20:12.109
problem. That 86 % of people who were polled

01:20:12.109 --> 01:20:14.489
that said they don't identify, the 14 % are the

01:20:14.489 --> 01:20:16.489
only ones that are voting. The 86 % of people

01:20:16.489 --> 01:20:19.710
are like Nate said, they're working. Both parents

01:20:19.710 --> 01:20:22.130
have the jobs in order to bring in money to pay

01:20:22.130 --> 01:20:24.930
the mortgage and the rent. They've got kids and

01:20:24.930 --> 01:20:27.229
they got sports. They're worried about their

01:20:27.229 --> 01:20:28.890
debt. They're worried about their hobbies. They

01:20:28.890 --> 01:20:30.590
got all this other stuff happening and so much

01:20:30.590 --> 01:20:32.050
information being thrown at them through social

01:20:32.050 --> 01:20:34.430
media and all this. How can I make what's what

01:20:34.430 --> 01:20:36.289
of all this? It doesn't change anyway. They're

01:20:36.289 --> 01:20:38.289
all assholes. I'm not even going to vote. So

01:20:38.289 --> 01:20:39.930
they don't. And then when they vote in the general,

01:20:40.069 --> 01:20:42.310
if they vote in the general there, it's a decision

01:20:42.310 --> 01:20:43.970
between the most extreme Democrat and the most

01:20:43.970 --> 01:20:45.750
extreme Republican, because that's that's who

01:20:45.750 --> 01:20:47.930
makes it out of the primaries. So the system

01:20:47.930 --> 01:20:51.569
we have also is broken in the sense that I give

01:20:51.569 --> 01:20:54.069
voters the choice, but then I totally aren't

01:20:54.069 --> 01:20:56.329
voting. So they're not telling people. I totally

01:20:56.329 --> 01:20:58.590
agree with you about the primary system, but

01:20:58.590 --> 01:21:03.039
it still persists when you have. say a nationwide

01:21:03.039 --> 01:21:06.039
presidential election and local turnouts at 82%,

01:21:06.039 --> 01:21:09.260
right? It still persists. We still don't see,

01:21:09.420 --> 01:21:12.300
at least not today, not yet, a change in behavior

01:21:12.300 --> 01:21:15.659
at the ballot box. Well, but how much money is

01:21:15.659 --> 01:21:17.920
being spent and which candidates are getting

01:21:17.920 --> 01:21:21.340
the snowball endorsements? So yes, okay, yeah,

01:21:21.420 --> 01:21:25.220
you say you get a big turnout, but if $250 ,000

01:21:25.220 --> 01:21:27.760
was spent in a state legislative race primary,

01:21:28.820 --> 01:21:31.800
And $250 ,000 was spent for one candidate because

01:21:31.800 --> 01:21:33.819
they were willing to say what SEIU wanted them

01:21:33.819 --> 01:21:35.380
to say, what the teacher union wanted them to

01:21:35.380 --> 01:21:36.699
say, what the environmental groups wanted them

01:21:36.699 --> 01:21:38.640
to say. And then the more centrist candidate

01:21:38.640 --> 01:21:41.399
had a more nuanced approach. All those groups

01:21:41.399 --> 01:21:43.239
say, F you to the Democrat, you're not far left

01:21:43.239 --> 01:21:44.979
enough on our issue. They're not going to get

01:21:44.979 --> 01:21:46.819
Republican support or any conservative or the

01:21:46.819 --> 01:21:48.159
other side of the issue support because there's

01:21:48.159 --> 01:21:50.319
going to be a Republican willing to say. crazier

01:21:50.319 --> 01:21:52.939
things than that to get their support. So then

01:21:52.939 --> 01:21:56.979
$20 ,000 gets spent for the more centrist Democrat.

01:21:57.340 --> 01:22:00.439
$250 ,000 gets spent for the more extreme or

01:22:00.439 --> 01:22:02.779
rigid Democrat. And then the voters, even if

01:22:02.779 --> 01:22:05.359
it's 80 % turnout, a quarter million dollars

01:22:05.359 --> 01:22:07.680
is being sent to those people telling them that

01:22:07.680 --> 01:22:10.140
the more centrist person is the devil or they're

01:22:10.140 --> 01:22:13.220
basically just Trump or whatever it is. And so

01:22:13.220 --> 01:22:16.279
it's the system. together that the low turnout

01:22:16.279 --> 01:22:18.300
in primaries, which is typical in local elections,

01:22:18.439 --> 01:22:20.979
and then how the endorsement processes and how

01:22:20.979 --> 01:22:23.260
much money is being spent or allowed to be spent

01:22:23.260 --> 01:22:25.359
in order to bolster the candidates that are willing

01:22:25.359 --> 01:22:27.060
to say what they need to say to get the money

01:22:27.060 --> 01:22:29.300
rather than what they should say to be palpable

01:22:29.300 --> 01:22:31.619
to voters. Because I could have all the best

01:22:31.619 --> 01:22:33.840
policy positions in the world. But if I don't

01:22:33.840 --> 01:22:36.579
have $250 ,000 to get that message to the voters

01:22:36.579 --> 01:22:38.560
and break through all the noise during a presidential

01:22:38.560 --> 01:22:41.680
election season with my direct mail of one direct

01:22:41.680 --> 01:22:43.920
mailer for that week or whatever, where the president's

01:22:43.920 --> 01:22:45.960
all over TV and sending you text messages and

01:22:45.960 --> 01:22:48.220
all stuff, no one hears that I'm like the more

01:22:48.220 --> 01:22:50.720
sane candidate. Well, the extreme person who

01:22:50.720 --> 01:22:52.779
gets a quarter million dollars spent, they get

01:22:52.779 --> 01:22:54.439
to at least get their face in front of people.

01:22:54.520 --> 01:22:57.340
And so I think it's a, it's a, it's a amalgamation

01:22:57.340 --> 01:22:59.560
of all of those issues, the low turnout, the

01:22:59.560 --> 01:23:01.960
money that's spent, the way the endorsement processes

01:23:01.960 --> 01:23:05.319
go, the primary system, all that. I think I would

01:23:05.319 --> 01:23:07.239
add to I agree with all that. I would also add

01:23:07.239 --> 01:23:09.819
the perverse incentive on media, especially with

01:23:09.819 --> 01:23:12.000
legacy media. I mean, how many times do you turn

01:23:12.000 --> 01:23:15.420
on the TV, whether it's Fox, CNN, MSNBC, and

01:23:15.420 --> 01:23:17.560
you see them interviewing or showing soundbites

01:23:17.560 --> 01:23:19.880
from a centrist or like a moderate Republican

01:23:19.880 --> 01:23:22.859
or Democrat? It's always it's Marjorie Taylor

01:23:22.859 --> 01:23:25.859
Greene or it's AOC. You're getting, you know,

01:23:25.859 --> 01:23:28.260
quick soundbites of the most extreme from either

01:23:28.260 --> 01:23:31.520
side. And that's all. Busy people are going to

01:23:31.520 --> 01:23:33.340
see they're not they're never going to get exposed

01:23:33.340 --> 01:23:36.100
to. But I think you're starting to see a transition

01:23:36.100 --> 01:23:37.840
away from that. Right. And that these legacy

01:23:37.840 --> 01:23:41.100
media outlets are kind of deteriorating in some

01:23:41.100 --> 01:23:43.000
sense. And you're seeing this rise in independent

01:23:43.000 --> 01:23:45.359
media, podcasts and all these other things where

01:23:45.359 --> 01:23:47.789
people are. digging in a little bit deeper and

01:23:47.789 --> 01:23:49.890
being a little bit more nuanced. So that I think

01:23:49.890 --> 01:23:52.729
is reason for hope and for optimism is seeing

01:23:52.729 --> 01:23:55.310
that shift and kind of how media is working.

01:23:55.670 --> 01:23:58.430
But to Jared's point, I think the influence of

01:23:58.430 --> 01:24:00.909
money in politics, I mean, you have all sorts

01:24:00.909 --> 01:24:03.430
of super PACs for the far left and the far right.

01:24:03.470 --> 01:24:06.229
You have very few PACs who are interested in

01:24:06.229 --> 01:24:09.310
like boring. centrist candidates who just want

01:24:09.310 --> 01:24:11.890
to work together, right? Let's pave the roads

01:24:11.890 --> 01:24:14.170
and make sure the bridges are safe. Yeah, right,

01:24:14.329 --> 01:24:18.329
right. It's an uphill battle, but my experience,

01:24:18.550 --> 01:24:20.289
and again, I think the polling data suggests

01:24:20.289 --> 01:24:22.369
that that really is what the vast majority of

01:24:22.369 --> 01:24:24.350
Americans want to see. Whether that's going to

01:24:24.350 --> 01:24:26.470
result in a huge change in elections in the near

01:24:26.470 --> 01:24:29.130
future, I don't know, but at least there's cause

01:24:29.130 --> 01:24:32.729
for optimism. Well, speaking of a cause for optimism,

01:24:34.730 --> 01:24:37.149
Not continuing the conversation on who and what's

01:24:37.149 --> 01:24:39.930
to blame, because I feel like we could go on

01:24:39.930 --> 01:24:41.810
forever about that. And you're right, Council

01:24:41.810 --> 01:24:44.189
Member Mead, that probably is another two hour

01:24:44.189 --> 01:24:46.170
podcast. But I did want to throw that out there

01:24:46.170 --> 01:24:49.890
just at least for an initial reaction. You know,

01:24:49.890 --> 01:24:52.010
just thinking about optimism, thinking about

01:24:52.010 --> 01:24:55.930
the future. What's the future for building bridges?

01:24:56.350 --> 01:24:58.449
What's the next step? You guys have got this

01:24:58.449 --> 01:25:00.909
this project that you're working on with the

01:25:00.909 --> 01:25:03.750
future leaders. You've done this whole series

01:25:03.750 --> 01:25:06.090
of discussions. It sounds like you're still talking

01:25:06.090 --> 01:25:08.590
to folks. People are still interested. There's

01:25:08.590 --> 01:25:10.909
still media kind of coming out about it. Your

01:25:10.909 --> 01:25:12.989
intention here was really plant a stake in the

01:25:12.989 --> 01:25:16.329
ground so that there was something beyond just

01:25:16.329 --> 01:25:19.770
you as council members. So what's the future?

01:25:19.850 --> 01:25:22.210
What's the next step? Where do you see this thing

01:25:22.210 --> 01:25:26.569
going a year, five years, 10 years, 20 years

01:25:26.569 --> 01:25:31.350
down the road? Well, we have other projects besides

01:25:31.350 --> 01:25:33.090
the Future Leaders Academy that we're looking

01:25:33.090 --> 01:25:35.069
at under the umbrella of the nonprofit. We're

01:25:35.069 --> 01:25:37.529
trying to find ways to talk to different different

01:25:37.529 --> 01:25:41.689
groups of people, younger, older. And so but

01:25:41.689 --> 01:25:43.369
we're not ready to announce one of the ones,

01:25:43.409 --> 01:25:44.750
but we're trying to get into a younger audience

01:25:44.750 --> 01:25:46.850
and talk to even younger than high school students.

01:25:47.130 --> 01:25:49.170
And that will be announcing in the next few months.

01:25:49.489 --> 01:25:51.350
So there's other projects besides the Future

01:25:51.350 --> 01:25:53.069
Leaders Academy. But the Future Leaders Academy

01:25:53.069 --> 01:25:56.250
certainly is our like. big flagship focus. It's

01:25:56.250 --> 01:25:57.770
the only thing we're really raising or spending

01:25:57.770 --> 01:26:00.529
money on. And it's something that we have mass

01:26:00.529 --> 01:26:03.350
have felt the massive impact of being we worked

01:26:03.350 --> 01:26:06.789
with 150 students who now are going off into

01:26:06.789 --> 01:26:08.689
college and doing other things and cannot wait

01:26:08.689 --> 01:26:10.810
to see, you know, we want to be resources for

01:26:10.810 --> 01:26:13.109
them in their futures and whatever they do, but

01:26:13.109 --> 01:26:14.729
also watching what they're able to accomplish

01:26:14.729 --> 01:26:16.930
is going to be wonderful. So we want to figure

01:26:16.930 --> 01:26:19.670
out a way to make that sustainable outside of

01:26:19.670 --> 01:26:23.050
us. And that could look different. depending

01:26:23.050 --> 01:26:25.350
on what Nate and I end up doing with our careers.

01:26:25.569 --> 01:26:27.170
But what we'd really like to do, and we've talked

01:26:27.170 --> 01:26:29.869
about this, is find a way to get other elected

01:26:29.869 --> 01:26:32.569
officials involved, other Democrat and Republicans,

01:26:32.829 --> 01:26:36.989
to maybe do what we're doing instead of us, or

01:26:36.989 --> 01:26:39.729
that we can package a curriculum together and

01:26:39.729 --> 01:26:41.970
do a training course in each school district

01:26:41.970 --> 01:26:43.689
and go to the different city councils in those

01:26:43.689 --> 01:26:45.210
different school districts and see if you can

01:26:45.210 --> 01:26:47.800
get a left -leaning and a right -leaning. city

01:26:47.800 --> 01:26:49.760
council member to agree to do this and take it

01:26:49.760 --> 01:26:51.479
on at their local school district. And we could

01:26:51.479 --> 01:26:53.359
have the prepackaged curriculum for them and

01:26:53.359 --> 01:26:55.119
we could sit with them and do a training or whatever

01:26:55.119 --> 01:26:59.199
or visit. And we were bouncing around the ideas

01:26:59.199 --> 01:27:00.960
actively right now. If I told you I knew what

01:27:00.960 --> 01:27:02.500
we wanted to do over the next five years and

01:27:02.500 --> 01:27:04.760
what what success looked like and we had it perfectly

01:27:04.760 --> 01:27:07.640
identified, I'd be lying. But we have a bunch

01:27:07.640 --> 01:27:10.020
of ideas of what we'd like to happen. And the

01:27:10.020 --> 01:27:12.380
main goal in North Star is to make it sustainable

01:27:12.380 --> 01:27:15.350
outside of us, because. Although I think that

01:27:15.350 --> 01:27:18.350
is, we'd be naive to say that it wasn't just

01:27:18.350 --> 01:27:20.850
the fact that it was two elected officials, one

01:27:20.850 --> 01:27:22.350
Democrat, one Republican that kind of helped

01:27:22.350 --> 01:27:25.109
us catch fire and get initial momentum. We don't

01:27:25.109 --> 01:27:29.270
want it to die when one of us is unelected. And

01:27:29.270 --> 01:27:32.029
so finding a way to make it more sustainable

01:27:32.029 --> 01:27:34.510
outside of us is the goal. And I think we're

01:27:34.510 --> 01:27:35.810
going to be successful in that. It just doesn't,

01:27:35.810 --> 01:27:37.130
we don't know exactly what it's going to look

01:27:37.130 --> 01:27:39.399
like five years from now. Yeah, I think that

01:27:39.399 --> 01:27:41.640
organic growth that we've seen so far, we'd love

01:27:41.640 --> 01:27:43.619
to see that continue. I mean, earlier today,

01:27:43.760 --> 01:27:45.720
we had a conversation with the Attorney General's

01:27:45.720 --> 01:27:47.380
office who's interested in this sort of work.

01:27:47.460 --> 01:27:49.039
We've worked with Lieutenant Governor Denny Heck

01:27:49.039 --> 01:27:51.960
before. So I think this is starting to grow larger,

01:27:52.119 --> 01:27:54.140
which is great to see. And then I haven't even

01:27:54.140 --> 01:27:55.939
shared this with Jared, but earlier today, I

01:27:55.939 --> 01:27:57.819
had a conversation with two city council members

01:27:57.819 --> 01:28:00.859
in Snohomish County who said, you know, we love

01:28:00.859 --> 01:28:02.680
what's happening with building bridges and we

01:28:02.680 --> 01:28:04.119
want to be a part of this. We want to kind of

01:28:04.119 --> 01:28:06.899
take this to our local community where we serve.

01:28:07.020 --> 01:28:08.489
And so that's really inspiring. inspiring to

01:28:08.489 --> 01:28:10.029
hear those sorts of things. And it'd be great

01:28:10.029 --> 01:28:13.229
to have this, like Jared said, not just be us,

01:28:13.350 --> 01:28:15.289
but have others in different communities, whether

01:28:15.289 --> 01:28:17.350
they're city council members or school board

01:28:17.350 --> 01:28:21.510
members or just citizens in various areas of

01:28:21.510 --> 01:28:23.970
the county or the state take on this work and

01:28:23.970 --> 01:28:27.210
watch it continue to grow in that sense. So I

01:28:27.210 --> 01:28:28.810
think that's my biggest hope is just for this

01:28:28.810 --> 01:28:32.289
to organically grow. So if there are folks who

01:28:32.289 --> 01:28:34.369
are listening to this podcast, fellow council

01:28:34.369 --> 01:28:36.510
members or commissioners across the state who

01:28:36.510 --> 01:28:39.020
are interested, in the work that you've done

01:28:39.020 --> 01:28:42.420
or maybe have a few ideas for building building

01:28:42.420 --> 01:28:45.039
bridges uh or want to partner with you guys can

01:28:45.039 --> 01:28:48.779
they reach out to you absolutely yeah yep and

01:28:48.779 --> 01:28:51.159
we can uh we can give you the info to share out

01:28:51.159 --> 01:28:53.659
or our email is info at the building bridges

01:28:53.659 --> 01:28:56.439
project .org um but i think most of them probably

01:28:56.439 --> 01:28:59.039
have our our contact info so anybody can well

01:28:59.039 --> 01:29:01.319
you guys you're reachable through the website

01:29:01.319 --> 01:29:04.699
too right yes yep yep all right Well, Council

01:29:04.699 --> 01:29:06.680
Member Neering, Council Member Mead, thanks for

01:29:06.680 --> 01:29:08.899
being here today. Great conversation. Really

01:29:08.899 --> 01:29:13.699
appreciate you spending the time. And good luck.

01:29:13.760 --> 01:29:15.420
Good luck on the work that you're doing. Keep

01:29:15.420 --> 01:29:17.479
it up. It takes a lot of courage to do that work.

01:29:17.640 --> 01:29:19.819
It's not easy work. And it's certainly, you know,

01:29:19.840 --> 01:29:21.819
probably not what you signed up for when you

01:29:21.819 --> 01:29:26.199
joined the county council. But I think it's really

01:29:26.199 --> 01:29:29.539
critical work. And, you know, folks had a lot.

01:29:30.319 --> 01:29:33.300
They should be thanking you. for all the work

01:29:33.300 --> 01:29:36.680
that you're putting into it. So from us here

01:29:36.680 --> 01:29:39.739
at WASAC, we thank you and hopefully we'll see

01:29:39.739 --> 01:29:41.880
you soon. Thank you, Paul. Really appreciate

01:29:41.880 --> 01:29:48.659
you having us on. You bet, guys. Thank you. Thanks

01:29:48.659 --> 01:29:50.939
for tuning in to County Connection. Stay in the

01:29:50.939 --> 01:29:52.859
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01:29:52.859 --> 01:29:55.180
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01:30:02.119 --> 01:30:04.819
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