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Welcome to our deep dive into AI.

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And today we're gonna be talking about something

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called AI distillation.

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It's super fascinating.

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Yeah, it really is.

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So imagine you could take like a massive super complex AI

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and kind of shrink it down into a more efficient model.

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Like how would that change the game?

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It really is a paradigm shift

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and we're seeing it play out in a bunch of different ways.

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Yeah, and one of the things that's really caught our eye

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is this company DeepSeek.

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They're using distillation to do some pretty incredible things

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and in a fraction of the time

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and costs that you would normally expect.

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Like they built a model that rivals

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some of the biggest names in AI.

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Yeah, in just two months.

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And for under $6 million for the final training.

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Yeah, for the final training phase.

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Which is crazy when you think about it.

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And the really cool thing is they're not just copying

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what others have done.

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They're bringing real innovation to the table.

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You know, building upon distillation

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to create something totally new.

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It's like they found a shortcut

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and now everyone's trying to catch up.

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But here's the thing,

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instead of keeping their secrets locked away,

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they decided to open source their model.

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It's huge.

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Yeah, they're basically giving away the blueprint.

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Which is a pretty big deal when you think about

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how companies like OpenAI have traditionally

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kept their models proprietary.

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Right, it's a total shift in thinking.

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And Arvin Jane, the CEO of Glean put it perfectly.

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He said, my joke is everybody's model is open source.

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They just don't know it yet.

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It's funny, because it's true.

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It really is.

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So it feels like we're at a turning point

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in how AI is developed and shared.

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For sure.

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And speaking of sharing,

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we've got all these stories of other researchers

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and developers doing some crazy things with distillation.

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Like you have researchers at Berkeley

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building a near state of the art reasoning model

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for just $450 in 19 hours.

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That's insane.

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It is.

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And then you have Stanford and the University of Washington

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doing it in 26 minutes for under $50.

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It's mind blowing.

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And then there's the 24 hour challenge by Hugging Face

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where they built an entire research agent.

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It seems like everyone's getting in on the action.

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And that's what's so exciting about all this.

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It's like AI is finally becoming accessible

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to anyone, even if you don't have a billion dollar budget.

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Yeah, it's leveling the playing field,

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which begs the question,

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what does this mean for the big guys

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like Google and Microsoft?

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You know, they've poured billions into their AI research.

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Do they lose their edge if smaller teams

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can just catch up using distillation?

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That's a great question.

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And honestly, it's not that simple.

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While distillation is amazing for replication,

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it might not be the key to achieving

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what's considered the holy grail

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of AI artificial general intelligence or AGI.

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AGI being the concept of an AI

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that can basically do anything a human can.

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Exactly.

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It's been the dream for a long time.

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And companies like OpenAI are all in

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on being the first to get there, no matter the cost.

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They call it their AGI at all costs strategy.

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Which is kind of wild when you think about it.

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So they're still going full steam ahead

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with these massive models and closed development.

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But then you have deep seek over here.

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Like there are one model costs a measly 2.19 per million

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tokens to run compared to OpenAI $60 for the same thing.

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That's like almost 30 times cheaper.

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I know.

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It's insane.

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It completely changes the economics of AI.

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It does.

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And here's another twist.

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Some of our sources are saying that with distillation data

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might not be as important as it used to be.

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Yeah.

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If models can just learn from each other,

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effectively the size of your data set

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might not matter as much.

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It's a wild thought.

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Like what if you didn't need access to all that data

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to build powerful AI?

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That's what companies like Glean or Xamaloring.

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Right.

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They're building platforms that make AI accessible

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and applicable to real world problems

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regardless of data limitations.

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And Glean's CEO, Arvin Jane, believes

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there's no plateau in sight.

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He says there's no plateauing on any front, by the way,

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when it comes to AI.

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So the landscape is shifting constantly.

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And it's exciting to watch it all unfold.

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But let's take a step back for a second

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and talk about how AI itself is evolving.

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Like we're seeing some crazy advancements

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in its ability to reason, analyze, and even understand

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complex processes.

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It's what some people are calling the reasoning revolution.

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Right.

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It's like AI is learning to think.

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For itself.

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Yeah.

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Exactly.

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It's changing everything.

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A great example is DeepSeek's R1 model.

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It has this feature that lets you see the AI's thought process

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as it works through problems.

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It's kind of like peeking into its mind.

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It's fascinating.

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It really is.

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And this is key for building trust and transparency,

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especially as AI becomes more integrated into our lives.

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Absolutely.

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We need to be able to understand how AI is making decisions,

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especially when it comes to things that impact our lives.

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Exactly.

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So this reasoning revolution is something

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we're going to explore in more detail later.

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But for now, let's shift gears and talk

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about the elephant in the room, open source.

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Open source has been a game changer.

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And with DeepSeek's decision to open source their model,

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it's created a ripple effect throughout the industry.

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Researchers and platforms like Huggingface

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are following suit.

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And it's really making us question the closed source

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approach of companies like OpenAI.

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It's like a philosophical debate about the nature of knowledge.

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Should these powerful AI models be controlled or shared

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for the benefit of everyone?

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It's a tough question.

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And one will unpack more thoroughly in a bit,

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but for now, we'll leave you with that thought.

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I'm going to start with an aponder.

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Exactly.

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Stay with us.

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Yeah.

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It's a tough one, for sure.

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There are definitely strong arguments on both sides.

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On the one hand, you have the whole safety thing,

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making sure these powerful AI models aren't misused.

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Especially with all the concerns about AI being used

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to create fake content or manipulate information.

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It's definitely a valid worry.

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Yeah.

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And then on the other hand, open sourcing

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allows for crazy fast innovation and collaboration.

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And it makes these advancements accessible to way more people.

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It's a tough trade-off.

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It really is.

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And it seems like the pressure's on for companies

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like OpenAI to change their stance on open source.

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I mean, even Sam Altman, their CEO,

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recently admitted that they might have been wrong about it.

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That's a big deal coming from him,

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especially since he's been a huge advocate

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for closed development.

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Yeah.

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It feels like a damn breaking.

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Once the flow of information starts, it's hard to stop.

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And for developers and businesses,

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this open source wave is a game changer.

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They're not stuck with just one provider anymore.

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And that puts pressure on pricing, too.

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Exactly.

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Open source keeps those proprietary players in check.

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They have to stay competitive, both in terms of price

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and performance.

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It makes for a much more dynamic and innovative environment.

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And with models like DeepSeqs R1 being so much cheaper

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than the competition, it really lowers the barrier

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to entry for smaller players.

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Yeah.

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It's like the cost of entry just went way down.

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So now we could see an explosion of new AI-powered applications

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and services.

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As more and more people can actually afford to experiment

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and build with this technology, it's pretty exciting.

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It really is.

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And it makes you wonder, what kind of world-changing ideas

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are going to come out of this?

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It's like we're on the verge of something truly revolutionary.

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And open source is a big part of that.

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It promotes transparency and collaboration,

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which are super important for a responsible AI development.

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Right.

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By working together and sharing knowledge,

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we can create better, more reliable AI systems that

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benefit everyone.

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Exactly.

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It's a win-win.

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But that being said, this doesn't

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mean the big tech companies are going away anytime soon.

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They still have tons of resources and expertise.

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Yeah.

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Google, Microsoft, Amazon, they're all investing heavily

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in AI research and development.

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And they're going to continue to shape the industry.

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What's changing is the nature of the game.

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It's not just about having the biggest model or the most

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data anymore.

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It's about building the best ecosystems, platforms,

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and tools that utilize AI in innovative and responsible ways.

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And that creates a more collaborative and competitive

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environment, which ultimately benefits everyone.

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And speaking of innovation, we can't forget about the incredible

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advancements we're seeing in AI reasoning.

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We touched on it earlier, but it's worth diving a little deeper

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into what this reasoning revolution really

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means for the future of AI.

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I agree.

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The progress we're seeing is mind-blowing.

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These models are going beyond simple instructions

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and actually starting to understand context logic

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and problem solving.

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It's like they're learning to think more like us.

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Analyzing situations, weighing different perspectives,

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coming up with logical solutions.

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Exactly.

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And this has huge implications for how

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we can use AI to solve complex problems and automate tasks

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that used to require human intelligence.

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Like, think about the thought process feature

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in DeepSeq's R1 model.

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Being able to see how the AI reaches its conclusions

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is so important for building trust and transparency.

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Especially when AI is making important decisions.

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Exactly.

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We need to understand how it's working and make sure it's

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being used ethically and responsibly.

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And as AI reasoning continues to improve,

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we'll probably see a lot more sophisticated AI agents

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being developed.

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Capable of automating even more complex tasks,

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from managing workflows to analyzing data,

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to maybe even helping with creative endeavors.

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It's pretty wild to think about the potential impact

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on different industries and the workforce as a whole.

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Definitely something worth exploring more in the future.

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For sure.

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But shifting gears a bit, let's talk about data for a minute.

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Traditionally, it's been seen as the fuel that powers AI.

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Well, more data, the better.

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Right.

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But with distillation, that might be changing.

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What are your thoughts on that?

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Well, if models can learn effectively from each other,

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the size of your data set might not be as crucial anymore.

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It's like saying you don't need the biggest library

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in the world to be incredibly knowledgeable.

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You can learn just as much from someone who's already

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studied all those books.

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Exactly.

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And this is huge for businesses that

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don't have access to those massive data sets.

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They can still leverage the knowledge that's out there.

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And that's where companies like Blean are doing amazing work.

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They're building platforms that make it easier for anyone

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to access and use AI regardless of how much data they have.

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They're making it a more level playing field.

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It's like creating an educational system

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where everyone has access to the knowledge and tools they

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need to learn and grow.

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I love that analogy.

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And as these techniques continue to develop,

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I think we'll see even more innovative approaches to AI

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that challenge our current assumptions about data.

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It's definitely shaking things up.

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But before we wrap up, I want to circle back

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to something you mentioned earlier about OpenAI's AGI

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at all cost strategy.

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What exactly does that mean?

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Basically, it's their commitment to achieving

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artificial general intelligence as quickly as possible,

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even if it means using a ton of resources

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and keeping things closed sourced.

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So they're going all in on building those big complex

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models while others are finding ways

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to get similar results with smaller, more efficient,

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distilled models.

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Exactly.

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They believe that achieving AGI first

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is super important for shaping its development

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and making sure it benefits everyone.

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It's like two different philosophies clashing.

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Yeah, you have the pursuit of ultimate intelligence

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on one hand and the democratization of AI on the other.

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It's fascinating to see how this plays out.

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And it raises some big questions about the future

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of AI research and development.

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It's a debate that's going to continue for a while.

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And it's exciting to be a part of it.

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I agree.

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This whole deep dive has been an incredible journey so far.

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And I'm sure our listeners are feeling the same way.

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But before we get too carried away,

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let's bring things back down to earth for a moment.

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Good point.

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Amidst all this excitement about AI,

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we need to remember that these are powerful tools

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and we need to use them responsibly.

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Yeah, it's easy to get caught up in all the hype,

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but we've got to remember that AI has a real impact on society.

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As it gets more powerful and easier to access,

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we have to make sure it's used for good, not for bad stuff.

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Absolutely.

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We have to think about the ethical side of things,

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the potential for job displacement,

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and making sure AI aligns with human values.

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It's not just about the technology itself.

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It's a big conversation, and one that everyone

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needs to be a part of researchers, developers,

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policymakers, everyone.

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But even with all the challenges,

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I'm still optimistic about the future of AI.

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Yeah, me too.

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I mean, AI has the potential to solve some of the world's

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biggest problems, like climate change, disease, poverty.

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It can help us make better decisions

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and create new opportunities.

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It feels like we're at the beginning of something huge.

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It does.

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And it's up to us to make sure this new era is a good one,

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one where everyone benefits.

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Well said.

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This deep dive into AI distillation

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has been pretty eye-opening.

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We've covered a lot of ground from the technical stuff

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to the impact on open source, the reasoning revolution,

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the changing role of data.

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Yeah, it's been a wild ride.

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And hopefully, our listeners are walking away

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with a better understanding of what's

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happening in the world of AI.

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We've seen how distillation is making AI more accessible,

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accelerating innovation, and pushing the boundaries

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of what's possible.

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And we've talked about the ethical considerations

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that we need to keep in mind as we move forward.

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So as we wrap up this deep dive,

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the question for you listening is this.

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How are you going to engage with this world of AI

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that's constantly changing?

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Are you going to sit back and watch?

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Or are you going to jump in and help

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shape the future of this incredible technology?

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It's up to you.

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And as we keep exploring this amazing world of AI,

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one thing's for sure, the future is full of possibilities.

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And the only limit is our imagination.

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That's a great note to end on.

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So thanks for joining us on this deep dive

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into the world of AI distillation.

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It's been a pleasure.

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And until next time, keep exploring and keep asking

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questions.

