WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.160 Hey, everyone. Welcome to the show. Great to 00:00:02.160 --> 00:00:04.660 be diving in again. Can you imagine a family 00:00:04.660 --> 00:00:10.279 argument escalating so dramatically that it literally 00:00:10.279 --> 00:00:13.699 redrew the borders of the entire world? It sounds 00:00:13.699 --> 00:00:16.339 incredible, doesn't it? But that's essentially 00:00:16.339 --> 00:00:17.960 the core of the story we're looking at today. 00:00:18.140 --> 00:00:20.699 It really is. This isn't just, you know, dusty 00:00:20.699 --> 00:00:23.420 old history. No, not at all. It's a really gripping 00:00:23.420 --> 00:00:25.780 narrative. You've got political maneuvering, 00:00:25.780 --> 00:00:28.800 these ambitious. frankly, dangerous voyages. 00:00:28.920 --> 00:00:31.719 And consequences that just ripple outwards, things 00:00:31.719 --> 00:00:35.039 nobody expected. Exactly. Unintended global consequences 00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:38.340 that you could argue we still feel today. It's 00:00:38.340 --> 00:00:41.159 like a real life geopolitical thriller almost. 00:00:41.299 --> 00:00:43.979 Yeah, definitely elements of that political intrigue, 00:00:43.979 --> 00:00:46.200 exploration. It's all in there. Instead of just 00:00:46.200 --> 00:00:48.380 one kingdom, the prize was, well, potentially 00:00:48.380 --> 00:00:50.429 the whole planet. Okay, so if you're finding 00:00:50.429 --> 00:00:52.530 these deep dives into the past as fascinating 00:00:52.530 --> 00:00:55.570 as we do, please take a second to hit that like 00:00:55.570 --> 00:00:57.689 button and subscribe. Yeah, it helps others find 00:00:57.689 --> 00:00:59.549 the show and you won't miss what we uncover next. 00:00:59.829 --> 00:01:02.729 So today we're plunging into Stephen R. Bound's 00:01:02.729 --> 00:01:07.769 1494, how a family feud in medieval Spain divided 00:01:07.769 --> 00:01:10.859 the world in half. Great book. Really lays out 00:01:10.859 --> 00:01:12.579 the complexities. It really does. We'll put a 00:01:12.579 --> 00:01:14.579 link to it on Amazon in the description below 00:01:14.579 --> 00:01:16.459 if you want to grab a copy. Highly recommend 00:01:16.459 --> 00:01:18.640 it. This book really takes you behind the scenes, 00:01:18.719 --> 00:01:22.319 doesn't it? It shows how this seemingly localized 00:01:22.319 --> 00:01:25.140 power struggle in Spain. Right. A fight over 00:01:25.140 --> 00:01:27.400 the crown. And the excitement over these newly 00:01:27.400 --> 00:01:30.480 discovered lands, how that all led to this absolutely 00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:33.079 pivotal treaty, a treaty that shaped centuries 00:01:33.079 --> 00:01:35.840 of global history. And Bowen highlights some. 00:01:36.219 --> 00:01:38.299 surprising connections things you wouldn't necessarily 00:01:38.299 --> 00:01:41.099 link together definitely so let's set the scene 00:01:41.099 --> 00:01:44.780 to understand this huge drama what was the iberian 00:01:44.780 --> 00:01:47.359 peninsula actually like in the late 15th century 00:01:47.359 --> 00:01:49.400 it feels like a real pressure cooker it really 00:01:49.400 --> 00:01:52.439 was okay so for you to picture it you've got 00:01:52.439 --> 00:01:55.280 these two rising christian powers dominating 00:01:55.280 --> 00:01:59.299 the peninsula spain which was itself just starting 00:01:59.299 --> 00:02:01.719 to come together from Castile and Aragon and 00:02:01.719 --> 00:02:04.040 its neighbor Portugal. And Spain wasn't exactly 00:02:04.040 --> 00:02:07.120 a unified happy family yet, was it? Far from 00:02:07.120 --> 00:02:11.580 it. Internally, Spain, especially Castile, was 00:02:11.580 --> 00:02:15.319 pretty unstable. Isabella's claim to the throne 00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:18.340 of Castile was seriously contested. Because of 00:02:18.340 --> 00:02:21.740 Enrique V's daughter, Juana. Exactly. Juana, 00:02:21.800 --> 00:02:26.199 often called La Beltranea. Many people whispered 00:02:26.199 --> 00:02:28.740 or outright believed that her father wasn't the 00:02:28.740 --> 00:02:31.520 king. This created these deep political fault 00:02:31.520 --> 00:02:35.139 lines. And Isabella marrying Ferdinand of Aragon, 00:02:35.360 --> 00:02:38.199 that added another layer. Oh, absolutely. It 00:02:38.199 --> 00:02:40.219 definitely strengthened her position militarily 00:02:40.219 --> 00:02:42.180 and politically. But, you know, it also worried 00:02:42.180 --> 00:02:44.819 a lot of Castilians. They feared being overshadowed 00:02:44.819 --> 00:02:47.039 by Aragon, losing their influence. It was a really 00:02:47.039 --> 00:02:49.060 delicate balancing act. So it's not just about 00:02:49.060 --> 00:02:50.819 who wears the crown. It's about the whole future 00:02:50.819 --> 00:02:53.259 direction of these emerging nations. Precisely. 00:02:53.500 --> 00:02:55.500 And then you have the social and religious context 00:02:55.500 --> 00:02:57.639 layered on top of all that political entry. Right. 00:02:57.740 --> 00:03:00.919 What was that like? Well, it's hard for us now, 00:03:01.039 --> 00:03:02.960 I think, to fully grasp how central religion 00:03:02.960 --> 00:03:06.520 was. You had this uneasy coexistence between 00:03:06.520 --> 00:03:09.259 Christians, Muslims and Jews, but it was becoming 00:03:09.259 --> 00:03:11.240 increasingly fragile. This is around the time 00:03:11.240 --> 00:03:14.439 of the Reconquista finishing. Yes, exactly. And 00:03:14.439 --> 00:03:17.039 you see the rise of the Kiversos Jewish people 00:03:17.039 --> 00:03:19.840 who converted to Christianity, often under duress, 00:03:19.960 --> 00:03:22.780 which added another layer of social tension and 00:03:22.780 --> 00:03:25.479 suspicion. And the Inquisition is looming. The 00:03:25.479 --> 00:03:27.580 Inquisition is looming, exactly. It signals this 00:03:27.580 --> 00:03:30.919 hardening of religious attitudes, a much less 00:03:30.919 --> 00:03:34.319 tolerant atmosphere developing. Life was mostly 00:03:34.319 --> 00:03:37.460 agrarian infrastructure, pretty basic. You could 00:03:37.460 --> 00:03:40.300 still feel the echoes of centuries of conflict. 00:03:40.830 --> 00:03:42.949 So while Castile is wrestling with all these 00:03:42.949 --> 00:03:46.069 internal issues, Portugal's looking outwards. 00:03:46.210 --> 00:03:48.129 That's the key difference at this point. Portugal 00:03:48.129 --> 00:03:50.629 had this clear vision, this focus on maritime 00:03:50.629 --> 00:03:53.110 expansion. A lot of that is credited to Prince 00:03:53.110 --> 00:03:55.590 Henry. The navigator. The navigator, yeah. Although 00:03:55.590 --> 00:03:58.430 how much actual navigating he did is, well, debated. 00:03:59.180 --> 00:04:01.120 But the drive was there. And what was the goal? 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:03.719 Just discovery? Oh, no, it was much more strategic 00:04:03.719 --> 00:04:05.900 than that. For you to understand their focus, 00:04:05.960 --> 00:04:07.979 they were after the source of African gold, for 00:04:07.979 --> 00:04:10.919 one. Maybe finding the mythical Christian kingdom 00:04:10.919 --> 00:04:13.039 of Prester John somewhere out there. Right, the 00:04:13.039 --> 00:04:16.699 potential ally against Islam. And crucially, 00:04:16.759 --> 00:04:20.149 establishing a direct sea route to India. That 00:04:20.149 --> 00:04:22.269 was the big one. To bypass the existing trade 00:04:22.269 --> 00:04:25.050 routes. Exactly. Bypass the Venetian and Arab 00:04:25.050 --> 00:04:27.610 middlemen who controlled the incredibly lucrative 00:04:27.610 --> 00:04:30.529 spice trade and other valuable goods coming into 00:04:30.529 --> 00:04:33.050 Europe. By the time Columbus shows up pitching 00:04:33.050 --> 00:04:35.810 his idea, Portugal was already well down this 00:04:35.810 --> 00:04:38.029 path. Dias had already rounded the Cape of Good 00:04:38.029 --> 00:04:40.420 Hope. Bartolomeo Dias, yes. He had rounded the 00:04:40.420 --> 00:04:44.079 Cape. And the king, Joan II, was a very shrewd, 00:04:44.079 --> 00:04:47.600 very focused leader. He was laser focused on 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:50.480 making that eastern sea route a reality for Portugal. 00:04:50.680 --> 00:04:53.899 He'd consolidated royal power and knew exactly 00:04:53.899 --> 00:04:56.420 what geographical discoveries could mean for 00:04:56.420 --> 00:04:58.800 Portugal's wealth and influence. So Portugal's 00:04:58.800 --> 00:05:01.439 charting Africa, getting closer to India, while 00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:03.800 Castile is mostly looking inwards. Pretty much, 00:05:03.920 --> 00:05:06.689 yeah. For you to appreciate the difference, Castile 00:05:06.689 --> 00:05:08.470 had been caught up in those internal dynastic 00:05:08.470 --> 00:05:11.110 fights, even civil war, for a big chunk of the 00:05:11.110 --> 00:05:13.509 late 15th century. So no resources or attention 00:05:13.509 --> 00:05:15.949 for exploring westwards. Not really significant 00:05:15.949 --> 00:05:18.629 ones, no. They had claims on the Cary Islands, 00:05:18.649 --> 00:05:20.709 sure, and some vague claims on the African coast, 00:05:20.889 --> 00:05:24.149 but their main energy was internal consolidation. 00:05:24.769 --> 00:05:28.149 But once Ferdinand and Isabella get a firm grip... 00:05:28.410 --> 00:05:31.009 Then things change. Then they start looking outwards, 00:05:31.009 --> 00:05:33.750 looking west. They wanted to catch up with Portugal, 00:05:33.870 --> 00:05:36.410 maybe even challenge their growing maritime power. 00:05:36.610 --> 00:05:40.149 You can almost feel the FOMO, the fear of missing 00:05:40.149 --> 00:05:42.649 out. Right. And this is where Christopher Columbus 00:05:42.649 --> 00:05:46.610 walks onto the stage, this determined Genoese 00:05:46.610 --> 00:05:50.430 sailor. How does his big idea get mixed up in 00:05:50.430 --> 00:05:52.970 this whole Spain -Portugal rivalry? Well, Columbus. 00:05:53.850 --> 00:05:56.389 He was clearly a man of immense self -belief. 00:05:56.550 --> 00:05:59.610 Some might say more persuasive than scientifically 00:05:59.610 --> 00:06:02.089 rigorous, but definitely persistent. He'd been 00:06:02.089 --> 00:06:04.329 shopping the idea around. For years. He went 00:06:04.329 --> 00:06:07.230 to King Joan II of Portugal first. Makes sense. 00:06:07.250 --> 00:06:09.370 They were the leaders in exploration. But Portugal 00:06:09.370 --> 00:06:12.170 turned him down. Why? Okay, so for you to see 00:06:12.170 --> 00:06:13.870 why, think about it from Joan's perspective. 00:06:14.209 --> 00:06:16.730 He already had his own exploration project, the 00:06:16.730 --> 00:06:19.430 route around Africa, which looked much more promising, 00:06:19.509 --> 00:06:21.370 much more viable. And it was already underway. 00:06:21.920 --> 00:06:25.220 Well underway, exactly. And importantly, backed 00:06:25.220 --> 00:06:28.720 by papal bulls. These decrees from the pope gave 00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:31.660 Portugal a kind of monopoly on new trade routes 00:06:31.660 --> 00:06:34.519 and lands discovered southwards in Africa towards 00:06:34.519 --> 00:06:37.839 the Indies. So why fund this risky westward voyage 00:06:37.839 --> 00:06:41.040 Columbus was proposing? Precisely. Why risk resources 00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:43.699 on a long shot that might even fall outside his 00:06:43.699 --> 00:06:46.819 existing papal authority? Plus, Columbus wasn't 00:06:46.819 --> 00:06:49.509 just asking for funding. What did he want? He 00:06:49.509 --> 00:06:52.370 wanted a significant cut of the profits, hereditary 00:06:52.370 --> 00:06:55.129 titles, governorship of any lands discovered. 00:06:55.329 --> 00:06:58.110 These were pretty big demands. And John II was 00:06:58.110 --> 00:07:00.769 trying to centralize royal power, not hand out 00:07:00.769 --> 00:07:03.730 massive privileges. So Portugal said no. Okay, 00:07:03.790 --> 00:07:06.829 Portugal passes. What makes Isabella and Ferdinand 00:07:06.829 --> 00:07:09.329 of Spain decide to, you know, roll the dice on 00:07:09.329 --> 00:07:11.389 him? Several things kind of came together for 00:07:11.389 --> 00:07:13.829 Columbus in Spain. First, that intense rivalry 00:07:13.829 --> 00:07:16.029 with Portugal we talked about. Columbus offered 00:07:16.029 --> 00:07:18.189 a potential backdoor to the riches of the East. 00:07:18.569 --> 00:07:21.470 A way for Spain to maybe leapfrog Portugal. A 00:07:21.470 --> 00:07:23.529 gamble, but potentially a huge payoff. A huge 00:07:23.529 --> 00:07:25.569 payoff, exactly. Second, Columbus was apparently 00:07:25.569 --> 00:07:27.810 a very skilled salesman. He knew his audience. 00:07:27.970 --> 00:07:30.990 He really emphasized the religious angle, the 00:07:30.990 --> 00:07:34.050 chance to spread Christianity to new lands, convert 00:07:34.050 --> 00:07:37.850 new peoples. This resonated deeply with Isabella, 00:07:37.910 --> 00:07:40.069 who was known for her strong religious convictions, 00:07:40.410 --> 00:07:42.629 especially coming right after the Reconquista, 00:07:42.769 --> 00:07:45.129 the reclaiming of Granada. And the expulsion 00:07:45.129 --> 00:07:47.730 of the Jews. Right. That religious fervor was 00:07:47.730 --> 00:07:49.670 high. And then, of course, there was the lure 00:07:49.670 --> 00:07:52.990 of gold. Plain and simple. New territories. New 00:07:52.990 --> 00:07:56.069 wealth. That appealed directly to Ferdinand and 00:07:56.069 --> 00:07:58.290 Isabella's ambition. And they needed ways to 00:07:58.290 --> 00:08:00.189 reward people who'd helped them. Definitely. 00:08:00.230 --> 00:08:02.670 They had all these hidalgos, the lower nobility, 00:08:02.670 --> 00:08:05.189 who'd fought for them and now needed new opportunities 00:08:05.189 --> 00:08:08.009 for wealth and status. Exploration offered that. 00:08:08.329 --> 00:08:11.350 They were also frustrated, remember, by Portugal's 00:08:11.350 --> 00:08:13.629 papal monopoly blocking them from the southern 00:08:13.629 --> 00:08:16.579 routes. So despite maybe some doubts from their 00:08:16.579 --> 00:08:18.500 own experts. Oh, yes. Their own advisors had 00:08:18.500 --> 00:08:20.980 reservations, too. But the potential rewards 00:08:20.980 --> 00:08:22.939 Columbus was dangling just seemed too good to 00:08:22.939 --> 00:08:25.540 pass up. The potential upside outweighed the 00:08:25.540 --> 00:08:29.240 risks in their calculation. And then 1492, Columbus 00:08:29.240 --> 00:08:31.879 sails the ocean blue, lands in the Americas, 00:08:31.980 --> 00:08:35.320 thinking he's near Asia. What was King Juan II's 00:08:35.320 --> 00:08:37.440 reaction in Portugal when the news got back? 00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:39.740 Incandescent with rage is probably putting it 00:08:39.740 --> 00:08:42.649 mildly. Really? That's strong. Absolutely. For 00:08:42.649 --> 00:08:45.649 you to grasp his perspective, João firmly believed 00:08:45.649 --> 00:08:48.710 that existing papal decrees, especially the Treaty 00:08:48.710 --> 00:08:51.889 of Alcaçovas from 1479, which had settled an 00:08:51.889 --> 00:08:54.129 earlier war with Castile. Right. That treaty 00:08:54.129 --> 00:08:57.009 gave Portugal rights south of the Canaries. Exactly. 00:08:57.250 --> 00:08:59.529 South of the Canaries and along the African coast. 00:09:00.029 --> 00:09:02.990 So in João's view, these lands Columbus found 00:09:02.990 --> 00:09:05.450 to the west directly violated Portugal's established 00:09:05.450 --> 00:09:08.269 monopoly granted by the pope. So he saw it as 00:09:08.269 --> 00:09:11.559 pain trespassing on his turf? Pretty much. And 00:09:11.559 --> 00:09:13.639 he wasn't just going to complain. He immediately 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:16.120 started preparing a Portuguese fleet to sail 00:09:16.120 --> 00:09:18.440 west and claim these new Indies for Portugal 00:09:18.440 --> 00:09:21.320 himself. Wow. So a real threat of war. A very 00:09:21.320 --> 00:09:23.759 imminent threat of war between Spain and Portugal. 00:09:23.899 --> 00:09:26.639 A major diplomatic crisis blowing up. Okay, so 00:09:26.639 --> 00:09:29.120 war is brewing. How did they try to defuse this? 00:09:29.200 --> 00:09:30.620 This is where the Pope gets pulled in, right? 00:09:31.179 --> 00:09:34.360 Precisely. Ferdinand and Isabella, they really 00:09:34.360 --> 00:09:37.450 wanted to avoid a war. They'd just finished consolidating 00:09:37.450 --> 00:09:40.149 their power. A war with Portugal would be costly 00:09:40.149 --> 00:09:43.129 and risky. So they appealed to the highest authority 00:09:43.129 --> 00:09:46.149 they could deserve, the Pope in Rome. And the 00:09:46.149 --> 00:09:48.529 Pope at the time was Alexander VI. Alexander 00:09:48.529 --> 00:09:52.730 VI, yes. Rodrigo Borgia. A fascinating and controversial 00:09:52.730 --> 00:09:55.809 figure in his own right. His rise to the papacy 00:09:55.809 --> 00:09:58.889 was, let's say, politically charged. And he had 00:09:58.889 --> 00:10:01.490 connections to Spain. Oh, yes. Strong connections. 00:10:01.629 --> 00:10:03.649 He was Spanish himself, a Borgia from Valencia. 00:10:04.009 --> 00:10:05.830 And he had a long history with Ferdinand and 00:10:05.830 --> 00:10:08.250 Isabella. He'd even helped facilitate their marriage 00:10:08.250 --> 00:10:10.909 years before. So Spain had an in with the pope? 00:10:11.110 --> 00:10:13.990 You could say that. So in 1493, Pope Alexander 00:10:13.990 --> 00:10:17.289 VI issues a series of papal bulls' official decrees. 00:10:17.389 --> 00:10:19.009 The most important one for this story is called 00:10:19.009 --> 00:10:21.190 Intercedera. Intercedera. Okay, what did it do? 00:10:21.549 --> 00:10:23.230 Essentially, for you to understand the impact, 00:10:23.529 --> 00:10:26.169 it declared that by the authority God had supposedly 00:10:26.169 --> 00:10:28.909 given him, Ferdinand and Isabella and their heirs 00:10:28.909 --> 00:10:32.370 had exclusive rights. Rights to explore, trade 00:10:32.370 --> 00:10:34.549 with, and colonize the lands Columbus had just 00:10:34.549 --> 00:10:36.789 found and any others they might find in that 00:10:36.789 --> 00:10:39.470 direction. Exclusive rights. So locking Portugal 00:10:39.470 --> 00:10:43.110 out. Pretty much. And crucially, the Pope drew 00:10:43.110 --> 00:10:46.809 a line. An imaginary line running north to south 00:10:46.809 --> 00:10:49.850 down the Atlantic Ocean. Spain got everything 00:10:49.850 --> 00:10:52.740 to the west of that line. The East was implicitly 00:10:52.740 --> 00:10:54.720 left for Portugal and their existing sphere. 00:10:54.899 --> 00:10:57.580 An imaginary line dividing the world. Just like 00:10:57.580 --> 00:11:00.100 that. Just like that. The official justification, 00:11:00.220 --> 00:11:02.779 of course, was about preventing war between good 00:11:02.779 --> 00:11:05.460 Christian kingdoms and rewarding Spain for their 00:11:05.460 --> 00:11:07.460 crusading efforts and potential missionary work. 00:11:07.679 --> 00:11:10.600 Preventing war, spreading the faith. Sounds noble. 00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:14.399 But how did King John II in Portugal react to 00:11:14.399 --> 00:11:17.740 this rather convenient papal line? Predictably, 00:11:17.740 --> 00:11:20.179 he was furious. He absolutely refused to accept 00:11:20.179 --> 00:11:22.259 this initial line. Why? What was his argument? 00:11:22.720 --> 00:11:25.019 Well, for you to appreciate his stance, Portuguese 00:11:25.019 --> 00:11:27.399 ships were already sailing far out into the Atlantic. 00:11:27.639 --> 00:11:30.220 He argued the Pope's line was drawn too far east. 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:33.000 It severely hampered Portugal's existing sailing 00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:35.120 routes down the African coast and potentially 00:11:35.120 --> 00:11:37.200 limited their future ambitions in the Atlantic. 00:11:37.379 --> 00:11:39.700 He basically said, this isn't fair. It boxes 00:11:39.700 --> 00:11:42.279 us in. So he pushed back. He pushed back hard. 00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:45.100 He demanded the line be moved further west. This 00:11:45.100 --> 00:11:48.159 led to direct, very intense negotiations between 00:11:48.159 --> 00:11:51.559 Spanish and Portuguese diplomats. High stakes 00:11:51.559 --> 00:11:54.179 stuff. And this leads to the Treaty of Tordesillas. 00:11:54.399 --> 00:11:57.230 Exactly. All this negotiation under the threat 00:11:57.230 --> 00:11:59.590 of conflict culminates in the signing of the 00:11:59.590 --> 00:12:02.909 Treaty of Tordesillas in June 1494. Think of 00:12:02.909 --> 00:12:05.269 it as a global territorial negotiation under 00:12:05.269 --> 00:12:07.250 extreme pressure. The Treaty of Tordesillas, 00:12:07.330 --> 00:12:09.889 that name really does echo, doesn't it? What 00:12:09.889 --> 00:12:11.870 were the key changes? What's most important for 00:12:11.870 --> 00:12:14.009 us to understand about its terms? The absolute 00:12:14.009 --> 00:12:17.090 crucial point for you to grasp is that the treaty 00:12:17.090 --> 00:12:20.190 moved the Pope's original line. It shifted it 00:12:20.190 --> 00:12:23.759 significantly westward. 370 leagues west of the 00:12:23.759 --> 00:12:26.779 Cape Verde Islands. 370 leagues. How far is that, 00:12:26.899 --> 00:12:29.519 roughly? It's debated exactly how long a league 00:12:29.519 --> 00:12:32.980 was then, but roughly 1 ,200 miles or so. A substantial 00:12:32.980 --> 00:12:35.200 shift westwards. And that was a win for Portugal. 00:12:35.419 --> 00:12:38.120 A major diplomatic victory for Joan II. It gave 00:12:38.120 --> 00:12:39.899 his ships much more room to maneuver in the South 00:12:39.899 --> 00:12:42.200 Atlantic on their way around Africa, but it also 00:12:42.200 --> 00:12:44.519 had this completely unforeseen consequence. That 00:12:44.519 --> 00:12:47.559 westward shift. inadvertently place the eastern 00:12:47.559 --> 00:12:50.000 bulge of south america what would later become 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:52.399 brazil squarely on the portuguese side of the 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:55.700 line whoa so portugal got brazil because they 00:12:55.700 --> 00:12:58.779 pushed the line west essentially yes now some 00:12:58.779 --> 00:13:01.899 historians debate whether juan ii maybe already 00:13:01.899 --> 00:13:04.279 had some secret reports some inkling that there 00:13:04.279 --> 00:13:07.460 was land out there interesting but the official 00:13:07.460 --> 00:13:10.610 european discovery of brazil by cabral Doesn't 00:13:10.610 --> 00:13:13.070 happen until 1500, six years after the treaty. 00:13:13.649 --> 00:13:16.370 Regardless of whether João knew or not, the treaty 00:13:16.370 --> 00:13:19.610 effectively gave Portugal dibs on Brazil. So 00:13:19.610 --> 00:13:22.830 Tordesillas carves up the known and unknown non 00:13:22.830 --> 00:13:25.889 -European world into two zones. Spain gets the 00:13:25.889 --> 00:13:28.830 West, Portugal gets the East, including Africa, 00:13:29.129 --> 00:13:31.509 the route to India, and, accidentally or not, 00:13:31.590 --> 00:13:34.250 Brazil. That's the essence of it, a bilateral 00:13:34.250 --> 00:13:37.120 agreement dividing the globe. So this treaty, 00:13:37.220 --> 00:13:39.399 it did manage to head off immediate war. Well, 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:41.299 the time being, yes, it preserved peace between 00:13:41.299 --> 00:13:43.320 Spain and Portugal. But what were the consequences 00:13:43.320 --> 00:13:45.580 for Spain and Portugal? What did this division 00:13:45.580 --> 00:13:48.139 mean in the short and medium term? Well, for 00:13:48.139 --> 00:13:50.360 both of them, the immediate consequence was, 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:53.120 frankly, a massive boost. It propelled them into 00:13:53.120 --> 00:13:56.080 becoming the world's first truly global superpowers. 00:13:56.240 --> 00:13:58.679 Because of the monopolies. Exactly. The monopolies 00:13:58.679 --> 00:14:00.860 granted by the treaty, which were later reinforced 00:14:00.860 --> 00:14:04.360 by other papal bulls, gave them exclusive access, 00:14:04.620 --> 00:14:07.519 at least in theory, to vast new resources and 00:14:07.519 --> 00:14:10.639 trade routes. So Portugal gets rich from? Portugal 00:14:10.639 --> 00:14:13.179 absolutely flourished from controlling that eastern 00:14:13.179 --> 00:14:16.419 sea route around Africa. Spices, silks, precious 00:14:16.419 --> 00:14:19.159 stones from India and the Spice Islands. Incredible 00:14:19.159 --> 00:14:22.059 wealth flowed into Lisbon. And Spain? Spain, 00:14:22.080 --> 00:14:24.139 with its claim to the Americas, eventually hit 00:14:24.139 --> 00:14:28.389 the jackpot too. After the brutal conquests of 00:14:28.389 --> 00:14:31.870 the Aztec, Mayan, and Inca empires, a staggering 00:14:31.870 --> 00:14:34.049 amount of gold and silver started pouring into 00:14:34.049 --> 00:14:36.950 Spain from the mines of Mexico and Peru. By the 00:14:36.950 --> 00:14:39.289 mid -16th century, these two Iberian nations 00:14:39.289 --> 00:14:42.009 were the dominant global players, shaping world 00:14:42.009 --> 00:14:44.850 trade and building vast overseas empires. You 00:14:44.850 --> 00:14:46.669 really had to visualize them as the two giants 00:14:46.669 --> 00:14:50.409 on the world stage. But surely, the rest of Europe, 00:14:50.549 --> 00:14:54.049 England, France, the Dutch... They weren't just 00:14:54.049 --> 00:14:56.750 going to sit back and politely watch Spain and 00:14:56.750 --> 00:14:59.250 Portugal carve up the entire planet. Absolutely 00:14:59.250 --> 00:15:01.809 not. No way. For you to see their perspective, 00:15:02.169 --> 00:15:05.610 this treaty explicitly excluded them. All these 00:15:05.610 --> 00:15:07.769 potential riches, these new lands, these trade 00:15:07.769 --> 00:15:10.429 routes, they were locked out. That must have 00:15:10.429 --> 00:15:12.470 created huge resentment. Deep resentment, yes. 00:15:12.789 --> 00:15:15.629 And a growing determination to challenge this 00:15:15.629 --> 00:15:18.370 Iberian duopoly. Now, initially it was tricky. 00:15:18.509 --> 00:15:20.899 Because of the Pope's authority? Exactly. Especially 00:15:20.899 --> 00:15:23.039 before the Protestant Reformation really took 00:15:23.039 --> 00:15:26.220 hold in Northern Europe. Openly defying a papal 00:15:26.220 --> 00:15:28.799 decree that divided the world was a serious risky 00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:31.460 business. But that changed. It did change. As 00:15:31.460 --> 00:15:34.399 the 16th century wore on, and especially as papal 00:15:34.399 --> 00:15:36.779 authority weakened in some areas, these excluded 00:15:36.779 --> 00:15:39.639 nations started looking for ways, anyway, to 00:15:39.639 --> 00:15:41.419 get a piece of the action. They started trying 00:15:41.419 --> 00:15:43.500 to circumvent the treaty's restrictions. Oh, 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:45.539 what did that look like? Well, it started with 00:15:45.539 --> 00:15:49.120 things like piracy, smuggling. Basically, ignoring 00:15:49.120 --> 00:15:52.220 the monopolies. And eventually, it escalated 00:15:52.220 --> 00:15:55.000 into outright military conflict. Think of them 00:15:55.000 --> 00:15:57.919 as determined gatecrashers at a very, very exclusive 00:15:57.919 --> 00:15:59.919 party. And they're starting to push the doors 00:15:59.919 --> 00:16:02.019 open. So this division, this line meant to bring 00:16:02.019 --> 00:16:04.919 peace between Spain and Portugal, it actually 00:16:04.919 --> 00:16:07.480 ends up becoming a major source of conflict for 00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:09.840 everyone else. That's a key takeaway, I think. 00:16:10.169 --> 00:16:13.409 It became a central grievance, a major catalyst 00:16:13.409 --> 00:16:16.970 for centuries of competition and conflict on 00:16:16.970 --> 00:16:19.549 a global scale. So how did these challenges actually 00:16:19.549 --> 00:16:21.950 play out? You mentioned piracy. Right. You see 00:16:21.950 --> 00:16:25.169 the rise of English privateers, state -sponsored 00:16:25.169 --> 00:16:27.309 pirates, essentially, figures like John Hawkins 00:16:27.309 --> 00:16:31.210 and later Sir Francis Drake. Drake, right. Famous 00:16:31.210 --> 00:16:34.190 for raiding Spanish ships. Exactly. They aggressively 00:16:34.190 --> 00:16:36.600 challenged Spanish power. Particularly in the 00:16:36.600 --> 00:16:38.980 Caribbean, they engaged in illegal trading in 00:16:38.980 --> 00:16:41.539 Spanish ports, raided settlements, attacked the 00:16:41.539 --> 00:16:43.379 treasure fleets carrying gold and silver back 00:16:43.379 --> 00:16:45.679 to Spain. And the Dutch, they challenged Portugal. 00:16:46.159 --> 00:16:48.360 The Dutch became major challengers, particularly 00:16:48.360 --> 00:16:51.179 to the Portuguese monopoly in the East Indies, 00:16:51.220 --> 00:16:54.080 modern day Indonesia and surrounding areas. They 00:16:54.080 --> 00:16:56.980 formed powerful trading companies like the Dutch 00:16:56.980 --> 00:17:00.019 East India Company, the VOC. The VOC, yeah. Almost 00:17:00.019 --> 00:17:02.100 like a state within a state. Pretty much. It 00:17:02.100 --> 00:17:05.319 had its own armies, its own ships, and they fought 00:17:05.319 --> 00:17:07.279 numerous wars with the Portuguese throughout 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:10.000 Southeast Asia, eventually displacing them from 00:17:10.000 --> 00:17:12.000 many key trading posts in the spice trade. So 00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:13.920 these weren't just minor skirmishes. These were 00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:17.119 serious challenges. shaping global power. Absolutely. 00:17:17.460 --> 00:17:19.859 These were major conflicts that fundamentally 00:17:19.859 --> 00:17:22.680 altered global trade networks and shifted the 00:17:22.680 --> 00:17:24.880 balance of power away from the initial Iberian 00:17:24.880 --> 00:17:27.180 dominance. And it's against this backdrop of 00:17:27.180 --> 00:17:29.819 conflict and challenge that new ideas start to 00:17:29.819 --> 00:17:32.299 emerge, right? Ideas challenging the whole concept 00:17:32.299 --> 00:17:34.180 of dividing the world up like this. Exactly. 00:17:34.279 --> 00:17:36.480 The concept of the free sea really starts to 00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:38.420 gain traction here. How did that come about? 00:17:38.759 --> 00:17:41.539 Well, a really pivotal moment for you to understand 00:17:41.539 --> 00:17:45.220 this shift happened in the early 1600s. The Dutch 00:17:45.220 --> 00:17:47.839 captured a Portuguese merchant ship, the Santa 00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:50.500 Catarina, in the Strait of Malacca. Okay. An 00:17:50.500 --> 00:17:53.059 act of piracy from the Portuguese view. Definitely 00:17:53.059 --> 00:17:55.500 piracy from the Portuguese perspective. But the 00:17:55.500 --> 00:17:58.579 Dutch East India Company needed a legal justification 00:17:58.579 --> 00:18:01.559 for seizing the ship and its valuable cargo. 00:18:01.700 --> 00:18:04.440 So they hired a brilliant young Dutch lawyer. 00:18:04.829 --> 00:18:08.490 Hugo Grotius. Hugo Grotius, yes. And in 1609, 00:18:08.750 --> 00:18:11.829 Grotius published, initially, anonymously, this 00:18:11.829 --> 00:18:15.609 groundbreaking work called Mer Liberum. Mer Liberum, 00:18:15.609 --> 00:18:18.329 the Free Sea. The Free Sea. And for you to grasp 00:18:18.329 --> 00:18:20.910 its significance, Grotius' arguments went way 00:18:20.910 --> 00:18:23.630 beyond just defending this one specific ship 00:18:23.630 --> 00:18:26.549 seizure. He launched a fundamental attack on 00:18:26.549 --> 00:18:28.829 the entire legal basis of the Treaty of Tordesillas 00:18:28.829 --> 00:18:31.349 and the papal bulls it rested on. How did he 00:18:31.349 --> 00:18:33.720 argue that? He argued that the oceans, the high 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:35.960 seas, by their very nature, they're vast, they're 00:18:35.960 --> 00:18:38.240 constantly moving, they're essential for communication 00:18:38.240 --> 00:18:41.019 and trade between all peoples. They simply cannot 00:18:41.019 --> 00:18:43.400 be owned or monopolized by any single nation 00:18:43.400 --> 00:18:46.019 or pair of nations. So nobody can own the sea. 00:18:46.259 --> 00:18:48.339 That was his core argument. He asserted that 00:18:48.339 --> 00:18:50.359 the freedom of the seas was a fundamental principle 00:18:50.359 --> 00:18:53.420 of natural law derived from God or reason and 00:18:53.420 --> 00:18:55.460 therefore accessible to everyone, to all nations. 00:18:55.920 --> 00:18:58.539 Wow. So Grotius is essentially dismantling the 00:18:58.539 --> 00:19:01.359 whole legal and moral framework that Spain and 00:19:01.359 --> 00:19:03.859 Portugal had built their empires on. He's laying 00:19:03.859 --> 00:19:05.640 the groundwork for a totally different way of 00:19:05.640 --> 00:19:08.160 thinking about international waters. Precisely. 00:19:08.279 --> 00:19:10.680 Now, his immediate goal was obviously to serve 00:19:10.680 --> 00:19:12.720 Dutch interests, justifying their breaking into 00:19:12.720 --> 00:19:15.259 the Portuguese and Spanish monopolies. But... 00:19:15.630 --> 00:19:17.869 He framed his arguments in these universal terms, 00:19:18.049 --> 00:19:20.170 appealing to natural law and the common good 00:19:20.170 --> 00:19:22.109 of humanity. Advocating for the right of all 00:19:22.109 --> 00:19:25.049 nations to sail and trade freely. Exactly. He 00:19:25.049 --> 00:19:28.269 directly attacked the idea of a closed sea, a 00:19:28.269 --> 00:19:30.690 mariclausm, controlled by just one or two powers. 00:19:31.049 --> 00:19:33.109 And for you to appreciate its lasting impact, 00:19:33.710 --> 00:19:36.109 Mario Libero, even though it caused outrage in 00:19:36.109 --> 00:19:38.710 Spain and Portugal, even got put on the Vatican's 00:19:38.710 --> 00:19:42.019 list of forbidden books. Really? Oh, yes. Despite 00:19:42.019 --> 00:19:44.220 all that, it became a foundational text for modern 00:19:44.220 --> 00:19:47.299 international law, especially maritime law. It 00:19:47.299 --> 00:19:49.299 profoundly shaped how we think about the oceans, 00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:53.140 navigation rights, resource access, even today. 00:19:53.470 --> 00:19:55.809 That's incredible. Truly remarkable how a treaty 00:19:55.809 --> 00:19:58.809 hammered out in 1494, stemming from essentially 00:19:58.809 --> 00:20:01.410 a family succession crisis. Right. And fears 00:20:01.410 --> 00:20:04.210 of war between cousins. It could have such incredibly 00:20:04.210 --> 00:20:06.569 far reaching consequences, spanning centuries, 00:20:06.730 --> 00:20:09.029 leading to global conflict and even sparking 00:20:09.029 --> 00:20:11.069 the development of entirely new legal principles 00:20:11.069 --> 00:20:13.950 like the freedom of the seas. What do you see 00:20:13.950 --> 00:20:16.970 as the ultimate legacy of Tordesillas for us 00:20:16.970 --> 00:20:19.569 today? I think the Treaty of Tordesillas stands 00:20:19.569 --> 00:20:23.250 as this powerful example of how agreements made 00:20:23.250 --> 00:20:25.630 in one specific historical moment can ripple 00:20:25.630 --> 00:20:28.049 outwards in ways the creators never imagined. 00:20:28.559 --> 00:20:31.400 Born from that feud and papal politics, it became, 00:20:31.539 --> 00:20:34.079 as we said, a major point of friction. Fueling 00:20:34.079 --> 00:20:36.859 conflict for centuries. Fueling nearly two centuries 00:20:36.859 --> 00:20:40.839 of conflict, piracy, smuggling, espionage, outright 00:20:40.839 --> 00:20:44.000 war across the globe. It profoundly shaped how 00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:47.000 European colonialism unfolded, how European powers 00:20:47.000 --> 00:20:48.799 interacted with each other and with the rest 00:20:48.799 --> 00:20:51.400 of the world. If you really think about it, a 00:20:51.400 --> 00:20:53.599 seemingly simple line on a map had this immense, 00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:56.319 complex, and lasting impact on global politics, 00:20:56.440 --> 00:20:59.099 on trade, and as we saw with Grotius, on the 00:20:59.099 --> 00:21:01.170 very foundations of international law. It's a 00:21:01.170 --> 00:21:03.509 potent reminder, isn't it, that decisions made 00:21:03.509 --> 00:21:05.890 long ago, often for reasons specific to that 00:21:05.890 --> 00:21:09.269 time, can cast incredibly long shadows. Absolutely. 00:21:09.309 --> 00:21:11.569 They continue to shape the geopolitical landscape, 00:21:11.849 --> 00:21:14.289 the economic realities, even the legal frameworks 00:21:14.289 --> 00:21:16.630 we live with today. Okay, so just to quickly 00:21:16.630 --> 00:21:19.109 recap for everyone listening, we started with 00:21:19.109 --> 00:21:22.329 this contested throne in Spain, tangled up with 00:21:22.329 --> 00:21:25.569 Portugal's big maritime dreams. Then Columbus 00:21:25.569 --> 00:21:28.750 arrives. finds land across the Atlantic, and 00:21:28.750 --> 00:21:31.910 King João of Portugal is furious, threatening 00:21:31.910 --> 00:21:34.750 war. Which leads to the Pope stepping in, drawing 00:21:34.750 --> 00:21:37.670 that first line. A line Portugal rejects, leading 00:21:37.670 --> 00:21:40.269 to negotiations and the crucial Treaty of Tordesillas 00:21:40.269 --> 00:21:44.150 in 1494. Shifting the line west, giving Portugal 00:21:44.150 --> 00:21:47.049 Brazil, and setting up Spain and Portugal as 00:21:47.049 --> 00:21:50.250 the first global superpowers, thanks to their 00:21:50.250 --> 00:21:52.690 monopolies. But those monopolies didn't sit well 00:21:52.690 --> 00:21:55.250 with England, France, the Netherlands. Nope. 00:21:55.740 --> 00:21:58.839 leading to centuries of challenge piracy, privateering, 00:21:58.960 --> 00:22:01.799 trade wars. And ultimately new ideas challenging 00:22:01.799 --> 00:22:05.039 the whole concept, like Hugo Grotius and Mare 00:22:05.039 --> 00:22:07.940 Liberum, the freedom of the seas. It's an incredible 00:22:07.940 --> 00:22:10.259 chain reaction, really. What started as a way 00:22:10.259 --> 00:22:12.460 to prevent war between two neighbors ended up 00:22:12.460 --> 00:22:14.599 reshaping the entire world and the rules governing 00:22:14.599 --> 00:22:18.779 it. In ways no one in 1494 could possibly have 00:22:18.779 --> 00:22:22.099 foreseen. Not even close. For you, it really 00:22:22.099 --> 00:22:24.059 underscores how interconnected the world was 00:22:24.059 --> 00:22:26.759 even back then and how actions in one corner 00:22:26.759 --> 00:22:29.460 could have global repercussions. It really does 00:22:29.460 --> 00:22:31.500 make you think, doesn't it? For you listening, 00:22:31.700 --> 00:22:36.119 consider this. How do seemingly arbitrary decisions 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:39.359 like drawing lines on maps centuries ago continue 00:22:39.359 --> 00:22:42.220 to echo in our present world order? Can you think 00:22:42.220 --> 00:22:44.880 of other historical lines in the sand that have 00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:47.579 had similarly profound, unexpected consequences? 00:22:48.680 --> 00:22:50.940 That's a great question to ponder. Or maybe think 00:22:50.940 --> 00:22:53.000 about it this way. Given our modern ideas about 00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:55.240 international law, sovereignty, human rights, 00:22:55.460 --> 00:22:58.319 how do we even begin to reconcile the justifications 00:22:58.319 --> 00:23:01.359 used back in 1494 for dividing up the world between 00:23:01.359 --> 00:23:04.339 just two European powers? Vital questions. Lots 00:23:04.339 --> 00:23:06.000 to chew on there. Well, that brings us towards 00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:08.619 the end of another really fascinating deep dive. 00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:10.799 Thank you so much for joining us as we unpack 00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:13.619 this pivotal world -altering treaty. Yeah, thanks 00:23:13.619 --> 00:23:15.819 for tuning in. It's a story that really highlights 00:23:15.819 --> 00:23:20.130 ambition, rivalry. Unintended consequences, all 00:23:20.130 --> 00:23:22.589 writ large on a global scale. We hope you found 00:23:22.589 --> 00:23:25.809 it insightful. We genuinely love to hear what 00:23:25.809 --> 00:23:28.130 stood out most to you. What was your biggest 00:23:28.130 --> 00:23:31.869 aha moment from our discussion today? Or maybe 00:23:31.869 --> 00:23:34.410 what surprised you most about the Treaty of Tordesillas 00:23:34.410 --> 00:23:37.789 and its impact? Let us know. Share your favorite 00:23:37.789 --> 00:23:40.089 takeaway or surprising fact in the comments section 00:23:40.089 --> 00:23:43.170 below. We do read them. And if you enjoyed this 00:23:43.170 --> 00:23:45.930 deep dive and you think maybe a friend or colleague 00:23:45.930 --> 00:23:48.430 might find it interesting too, please do hit 00:23:48.430 --> 00:23:50.549 that like button and share it with them. It really 00:23:50.549 --> 00:23:53.329 helps. Thanks again for tuning in. We look forward 00:23:53.329 --> 00:23:55.809 to our next exploration into the depths of knowledge 00:23:55.809 --> 00:23:56.349 with you all.