Today on the Leftful North, we are crossing state
lines, but not literally, to talk with one of
the Texas Democrats making headlines this week,
Representative Trey Martinez Fisher. First elected
at just 29 years old, Trey is now one of the
most senior and effective members of the Texas
House, known for his willingness to fight tooth
and nail for voting rights, fair maps, and public
education. He's been called a, quote, soldier
prepared to do battle, but ready to make peace.
Though right now the battle is front and center.
Trey and his fellow Democrats have left the state
to break quorum and stop an outrageous mid -decade
gerrymander, a move that would hand Republicans
five extra congressional seats, all to cement
Donald Trump's grip on power before the midterms.
We're grateful to him not only for defending
democracy in his home state, but for also crossing
over the border today to join us on a North Carolina
politics podcast. Representative Martinez -Fisher,
welcome to the Left of Old North. Thank you.
It's great to be here. Thank you. And, you know,
I know Adrian already kind of said thank you
in the intro, but, you know, we can't thank you
enough for just what you're doing to kind of,
you know, defend democracy in general. I mean,
this is, you know, kind of just an all -out assault.
And honestly, just kind of a, at least in my
opinion, kind of a testing ground for what else
they can try to get away with in other states
as well. You know, absolutely. I mean, like I
said to other folks, this wasn't the fight that
I picked. I didn't just wake up one morning and
say we're going to break quorum. I mean, the
fight picked us. Texas is unique in lots of respects.
I mean, we're pretty big and whatever happens
in our state will likely show up somewhere else.
We feel that pressure. And then, of course, Texas
is one of only four states that requires a two
thirds presence for a quorum in the state legislature.
And so not everybody has the tool that we have.
And obviously, our founders said we're going
to put it in there for a reason. Well, we're
using it. We took the dust off of it, and we've
been using it for the last couple of weeks. And
in this instance, we are putting up our share
of the fight to save our democracy. Can you walk
us through that decision a little bit? Because
I know it must not have been easy. Governor Abbott
has responded with imposing penalties. daily
fines and is even issuing arrest warrants. The
FBI is currently getting sicked on y 'all. Like
what went through y 'all's mind before this decision
was made? Pretty much all of that, just as you
mentioned. I mean, look, I've been in the legislature
now. This is my 12th term, so I'll be completing
24 years next year. And this isn't my first rodeo.
I mean, quorum breaks are very rare. The very
first one I did was in 2003 when Tom DeLay took
power and wanted to do mid -decade redistricting
in Texas. We went for a few days in Oklahoma
and we were able to stop that measure. But prior
to 03, it hadn't been used since the 1980s. So
this wasn't a tool that we resorted to. We work
out our problems. We sit at the table. We get,
you know, pragmatic solutions just like you do
in North Carolina. Here lately, folks have gotten
really... hyper -partisan, ultra -MAGA. They
don't want to negotiate. They want to act like
their leader. And that's just really not for
us. I mean, that's not the way we handle ourselves
when it comes to civic debate. So yeah, of course,
knowing the stakes, a daily fine. If you don't
pay the fine, they start attaching, deducting
your budget that we have for our employees and
our staff. Questions as to whether we would be
legally challenged for abandoning our offices.
So there's all these professional stressors.
And then look, man, we're married. We have families.
Most of the people I work with, they sign the
back of the paycheck, right? They work for somebody.
They have to explain why they're leaving again
because we just left town. We just left our homes
for six months for a regular session. You know,
and then for other folks who own a business,
try running one a thousand miles away, you know,
always with your suitcase packed because you
never know when the next bomb threat is going
to come and you have to relocate. Right. So a
lot of stress going on. But we recognize this.
We recognize that we didn't pick this fight.
It picked us and we had to do something. And
I'm a proud Texan. I think about the Apollo 13
mission where you hear those famous words about
Houston. We have a problem. This is like America.
We have a problem. We need to wake up. We need
to rise up. This democracy is being stolen right
in front of us. You all are the tip of the spear
in North Carolina. This has been happening in
your state and your litigation is still going
on. We have the same situation. Funny, though,
funny how that is, because states like Georgia,
North Carolina and Texas seem to be changing
demographically. We seem to be recognizing our
political power. And so we're the ones getting
beat up on the most. Right. We're the ones whose
power is trying to be silenced and muzzled because
they're trying to hang on to power and they know
they're losing it. One hundred percent. They're
they're afraid. Simple as that. Now, a second
ago, you mentioned that bomb threat and we wanted
to kind of. Asked about that really quick. You
know, that kind of obviously takes this whole
thing from, you know, it goes from political
protests to being a life -threatening kind of
situation. Like, how did this, how did the group
handle it? You know, what do you think that says
about how high these tensions have gotten? You
know, it's a really good question because it
was real early in the morning, right? And so
just, you know, I don't want to make light of
the moment, but you definitely. At 7 a .m. in
the morning, you recognized who the early risers
were in your delegation. So I was on the verge
of going for a run. So I was actually put together
and caffeinated. And so, you know, I don't think
we expected that. Right. And to add context,
we're regular people. We have single parents
on this trip that have their children with them.
And I'm talking like nine years old and younger.
And so. to have an alarm blaring at 7 a .m saying
evacuate the building there's been a bomb threat
uh you know you don't know what to do uh you
know luckily for me i just had to grab my wallet
and my keys and i ran out uh but for others i
mean you know it was an ordeal i think we all
came together And of course, we were worried
about maybe something else was going to happen
that was bad. And so here's what we did. I mean,
we came together, we stayed together, and then
we put our faith in Governor Pritzker and we
listened to him. And if his experts felt like
we needed to do something else. or, you know,
change the way we travel and how we protect ourselves,
you know, we were fully going to listen. So we
were grateful to have a host in Governor Pritzker
to allow his team to give us the best practice
and advice. And so, you know, we're always looking
over our shoulder, no doubt about it, but we
feel like we're very safe here in the state of
Illinois. And also, most importantly, while this
all happened, it did not deter us from the mission.
And he's not the only governor that's taking
action either. Governor Newsom has essentially
put Trump in check, warning him and Texas Republicans
that they need to stand down or California is
going to redraw on their own maps to benefit
Democrats specifically. You could call this fighting
with fire with fire. But how do you feel about
this kind of cross state solidarity between you
and California? And how do you feel about this
kind of political posturing? No, I think this
is exactly, you know, some of the hope. This
is what we had hoped for. Right. I mean, again,
we can count. We can count votes. I've been doing
it for 23 years. We don't have them in the House
or the Senate. We have some time. We're going
to make the most of it. You know, our job was
to wake up the country. And if we just stayed
home and had this fight somewhere on a Wednesday
evening where nobody cared and had very little
coverage, nobody would have even heard about
it. not even the folks back in the district that
I represent in San Antonio. We knew we had to
fight this in the national arena. And so that's
where we are. You know, we believe we're waking
this country up. We have sent delegations to
many states. We've been to California twice and
met with Governor Newsom and the legislative
leadership there in California. And one thing
is certain. We all agree if Donald Trump is going
to toss out the rule book, if there are no rules,
then OK, we're going to fight fire with fire.
And Governor Newsom said that for every seat
you pick up in Texas, we will offset it in California.
And in fact, Governor Newsom did even better
than that. He sent President Trump a letter.
And he said, if you don't do this, I won't do
this. You stand down in Texas, I'll stand down
in Texas. And so we are now seeing governors
in other states, Governor Hochul in New York,
Governor Moore in Maryland, other Democratic
governors, you know, reevaluating this, even
though they have commissions and so forth, figuring
out what legal options and strategies they have,
because nobody is going to have this election
taken from them before the first vote is cast.
And I don't care if you play sports. dominoes,
cards, or you go to you enter yourself into,
you know, science contest. Why would you ever
enter a contest if you knew the other side was
going to win before you even started? And that's
what's happening with Donald Trump. I keep telling
people he is not the commander in chief. I call
him the commander in chief. Right. Because he's
cheating on America and he's cheating on our
democracy. Sure is. And I don't know if you.
Maybe I'm sure you're very tapped in. So if you
saw Gavin Newsom's version of a Trump letter
that was sent to him via social media, I don't
know if you caught that. I didn't catch it. Well,
we had a briefing a couple of nights ago and
I heard and this is where I learned this information.
It was formatted like one of those rambling Trump
tweets. So if you get a chance, you should look
at it. my team is flying in you know that's awesome
i want to see it now you know with talking about
california maybe redrawing their maps as a response
to this you know new york i've seen i think maybe
illinois mentioned it as well i know a bunch
of like democrat -led states have mentioned this
you know there seems like this could be a way
of kind of spiraling into like a cold political
civil war so to say just kind of this back and
forth and whatnot uh for our at least democratic
processes and you know that's a fight that republicans
seem to be more than ready and eager to wage
do you think that's maybe do you think that's
kind of a dramatic way of looking at it do you
think it might be a little too accurate no i
mean i think that's that's the only thing these
people understand and you know and i'm a democrat
very proud of that uh and i live in a beautiful
democratic city and everybody gets along and
and we get along with everybody i mean you know
we don't have republicans that kind of you know
get that extreme and if they do you know they're
not many of them that being you know that being
said i tell my democratic family all the time
that the difference between us and republicans
is that when republicans get power they use it
and and donald trump is using his power we get
power and we start having a debate between the
perfect and the good, right? And so, you know,
this is a lesson to us. This is what can happen
when we lose elections. This is what can happen
when we lose South Texas Hispanics because they
feel like blue collar issues aren't on the table
when we're looking at national policy. And so.
Yeah, I think this is the reaction we need because
there has to be a grown -up in the room that
says we're not doing this. You know, I ultimately
believe most of this stuff is going to be fought
out in the courtroom. And I certainly hope that,
you know, cooler heads will prevail and recognize
that this is not how to control a democracy.
And so, you know, it's unfortunate, but it is
going to be an escalation before there's a de
-escalation. There are certainly a number of
things that, unfortunately, this is the main
focus right now, but work still has to get done
in the legislature. While this is happening,
other actions are not being taken. Laws are not
being passed or debated. And meanwhile, we have
members of our federal Congress. that are trying
to call for the FBI to basically drag you all
back to Texas. And it seems that Cash Patel is
taking it, that would be Senator John Cornyn
specifically. Cash Patel has seemingly taken
him up on that. Do you think, did you know it
would come to this? Or were you all expecting
this kind of action from the Trump sycophants?
You know, didn't I mean, the FBI was a little
bit rich. That was a new one. Right. But, you
know, I've been told they won't come for us because
we have the Epstein files. Right. So they're
going to stay far away from us. Right. You know,
so so, you know, Governor Pritzker, again, is
pretty much said, hey, you all want to come to
town. You want to visit, have a nice meal, spend
some money. You're not leaving with anybody.
Right. And so, you know, we have not felt the
effect of that threat. And of course, we're not
we're not asking for it either. But but again,
you know, the threats that are being made, you
know, the language that's being used about hunt
us down and and, you know, leaves all this sort
of vigilante, you know, type of justice where
folks want to take the law into their own hands.
You know, our families are back at home. uh you
know and we want to make sure they're safe and
i will comment on this i don't want to paint
law enforcement with one brush you know i'm very
thankful that the law enforcement community uh
you know even even those charged with coming
after us are taking the responses and calls from
our families very serious and providing them
with real protection. And that says a lot about
law enforcement. At least our local Texas law
enforcement, they're not going to get involved
in the politics. They're going to do their jobs.
This isn't the first time you've had to fight
for fair maps either. When you led, well, I mean,
you still do. But when you were the chair of
the MALC, that's the Mexican -American Legislative
Caucus, correct? Yes. in some lawsuits and fought
some chronic inequities. Is this moment differing
from that past, or is this a new feeling, or
is this kind of more of the same? You know, in
truth, it is a pretty significant departure.
You know, the Mexican -American Legislative Caucus,
we call it MALC, has been in existence since
1973. It is the oldest and it's the largest Latino
caucus in the country. We're even larger than
the Congressional Hispanic Caucus in Washington.
We're pretty big and we're pretty proud and we
don't take a lot of BS. And this group sued the
state, took them to the Supreme Court on two
occasions. As a matter of fact, there was a...
There was a very bright on top of it attorney
who was part of the litigation team. Her name
is Allison Riggs. I'm sure you've heard of her.
I remember sitting in the courtroom with her
and watching her present a case. And so Texas
has been a troubled jurisdiction ever since the
inception of the Voting Rights Act and every
decade beginning in 1970. Texas has always been
found to intentionally discriminate against its
voters. And that is a fact that we should not
be proud of. But the intentional discrimination
that happened back then is really, really just
changed in today's environment. Just with the
inception of technology, AI, and the ability
to model with data and elections, you know, you
literally have politicians picking their voters.
And this is where it gets a little nuanced and
we lose people by this. But just think about
all the technology you have on your iPhone and
all the things that you can do with it that you
could never do before. Well, now just take that
technology and put it in the voting space. They
know who you are. They know where you live. They
know what you buy. They know your credit score.
They know your preferences. They take your picture
and they run it across social media. They know
who your friends are. They know what you do.
And so they will compile all that. And they will
profile whether you if you decide to vote where
you would land. And so with precision, districts
are being drawn and they may look like they're
minority districts because they are percentage
minority districts. But they know from political
performance that they will never act like one.
And they know that. So they can walk into a courtroom,
swear under oath that race had nothing to do
with this because this is a majority Hispanic
seat. But they know that the electoral behavioral.
behavior of those folks they will never act like
it because they won't vote and all you all you
got to do is uh go on elections twitter for like
five minutes and you'll see hundreds and hundreds
and hundreds of maps that people have jerry -rigged
and like played around with to see just how far
they can push it and if you think that people
on twitter are the first people to do that you're
you're crazy You know, and how this process really
changed, too. We used to draw our own maps. And
even the members of Congress, they would draw
a map as a Texas delegation, both sides, and
then they would present it to us. We would make
a formal rendition based on our software, and
then we would, you know, put that on the floor.
Now, these maps are coming from the sky. Like,
nobody knows where they come from. Nobody knows
who drew them. They just all of a sudden become
part of the record. And that is what is alarming
about this process. We've got a whole history
of gerrymandering here in North Carolina that's
just absolutely, absolutely insane, to say the
least. You know, we're kind of getting to time,
but just want to ask a couple of real quick questions.
One being, where do Texas Dems kind of go from
here? Right. No, it's a great question. uh you
know again i mean the reality is we know we know
where we stand vote wise um we know the bandwidth
of our members and the personal struggles and
stressors that we have and we also know that
it's a matter of time you know before we you
know sort of you know outstay our welcome i mean
it's tough to to to protect you know 40 or 50
of us in one city and have to be responsible
for moving us around when things get tough. And
so we said that our job was to take this fight
and put it on the national stage and to get other
states and get the public to wake up and rise
up. We have our faith in the American people.
that they will not be underestimated when it
comes to preserving and protecting our democracy.
And we also know that at some juncture, we have
to hand this baton off to the next state that
has fresh legs and fresh ideas. Right now, that
seems to be California. We are hopeful that in
less than one week's time, we're going to see
significant movement in California. And we've
been told over and over again by Governor Newsom.
that this wasn't going to be possible had it
not been for our efforts to be that initial spark.
And so look, I think our job now is we've demonstrated
that we are willing to be part of this fight.
We have sacrificed for this country. We have
given other states time to prepare and be ready.
And I think now we will now maybe find ourselves
sitting in the backseat now, let someone else
take the wheel. And let us provide the support.
Let us keep the momentum going and let us rally,
continue to rally this country around because
this stuff's gonna happen fast. I mean, I don't
know about the laws in North Carolina, but we
start filing for office already in November.
And before you can file for office, you got to
know where you live and where you're going to
run. And the county elections folks got to tell
folks, here's who you're going to vote for. Here
are your districts. And so you just can't change
these maps and expect them to show up at the
ballot box without time. So, you know, we've
got the legislative piece and now we have the
legal piece. And then we're going to have the
national response. So, you know, we've got many
cards to play in this game just, you know, right
now. One last very quick question. People wouldn't
all readily walk into this kind of danger, you
know, with fines, threats and legal action being
taken. What is your message to voters, not just
in Texas, but nationwide to keep up hope? Yeah,
look, I mean, you know, this is real, right?
This is not an exercise or a hypothetical. You
know, literally our democracy is being unraveled
before our eyes. We are looking at a president
who believes in authoritarian rule, right? That
ought to scare you, ought to scare the hell out
of you. And we need to come together. You know,
this is bigger than North Carolina. This is bigger
than San Antonio, Texas. This is the entire country.
And we need to respond like that. And so we have
to come together and do our part. You're in the
middle of a big fight. We've got to figure out
how to support you all in North Carolina and
give you hope. I can't, you know, I'm not giving
up. You can't quit because I can't quit. Like,
we're in this together. And we don't worry about,
you know, the obstacles. We don't worry about
the repercussions. I mean, that's not why we
were elected. I'm not going to, you know, just
sit here on the fence and not get into this fight.
That's why I'm here. That is who I am. And that's
who Texas Democrats are. We're going to, you
know, we didn't pick this fight, but we're going
to finish it. And we can't do it alone. So, look,
I recommend three things. Number one, at least
for us in Texas, as we sit here in Illinois.
If you know us or if you've read about us, send
my colleague a note. Touch somebody. Let them
know that they're fighting a good fight. Make
them feel good because I'm in the room with them,
and our cup isn't full, and it's tough, number
one. Number two, if you are involved and you're
engaged and you're organizing and you are working
on democracy projects in your state, keep doing
it. Don't give up. And then for those of you
who have done both of those things and you're
saying, well, what else can we do? You know,
if you're going to walk into the coffee shop
and drop five bucks on a latte, you're like,
what else can I do with this? Put it, put some
resources where it's going to count. You know,
help us here in Texas, help other groups that
are doing this. We know this fight's going to
California. You may want to help them. I have
an organization called OneTexas .org. Pretty
easy. I wrote it down. A little cheap plug here.
There we go. Thank you. No, that's good. OneTexas
.org. Let me tell you what's good about this.
No consultants, no commissions, no middleman.
100 % of those resources come here to fight this
fight in Illinois. I've got fines. I have three
members of my team babysitting me literally to
make sure everything gets done right. So that
is, you know, three air flights. That's three
hotel rooms. That's nine meals a day. That's
countless Ubers. Who knows what it is? And we
need fuel for this fight. If you can chip in,
great. But if you can't. you know, do one of
the two other things, because that's what we're
going to need to get through this. If we're fighting
fire with fire, let's keep fueling that fire.
Representative Trey Martinez Fisher. Thank you
so much for taking the time to sit down with
us and talk about what's going on. We really,
really appreciate what y 'all are doing. Can't
say that enough. Thank you. Hopefully next time
we come back on, we're going to talk about like
barbecue or something. Okay. Well, we'll have
a good one. All right. Yes, sir. Texas barbecue
on top. Anyway. All right. Adrian? All right,
man. You're going to take it easy. Anything you
holler, okay? Yes, sir. Thank you.