Welcome back to the Left of Old North. I'm your
host, Adrian. And I'm CJ. This week, we're getting
into the cracks forming inside of the North Carolina
Democratic Party. But first, we want to announce
that, well, he's already announced, but Wiley
Nickel is officially challenging Tom Tillis for
the Senate. But with Roy Cooper hovering in the
background, and there's been a little bit of
buzz about that this week. things could get a
little complicated pretty fast. Plus, we're going
to cover David Hogg's progressive push to primary
establishment Democrats, or as Donald Trump loves
to put them. do nothing Democrats. And that push
is gaining momentum. There is a clear divide,
I think, between the obvious recipients of this
push and also the younger generation, especially
the ones that are more vocal on like TikTok and
Instagram. And there's some real warning signs
for state figures that we'll cover later. And
then finally, we'll talk a little bit about party
leadership and what that means for 2026 and how
we're going to move forward from this. But of
course, something big happened this week. So
there was a major court decision. A huge W for
Democrats and especially for Alison Riggs to
thwart the Republican efforts to take control
of the North Carolina, both the state board of
elections and also their attempt to try and just
throw out a bunch of ballots out of hand and
basically win this thing without actually winning
it. So we got two dubs in the middle of a whirlwind,
in the middle of a hurricane. It seems like a
never -ending slurry of political fallout from
both the 2024 election and also just North Carolina
being North Carolina. But CJ, as our resident
policy guy, can you explain a little bit? to
me and everybody else, really what went down
this week with these court decisions. Yeah. So
here in, again, North Carolina, the Federal Appeals
Court halted the ballot curing process from beginning
in this case of Riggs Griffin. So essentially,
there's a three -judge panel on the Fourth Circuit
Court of Appeals. And this past Tuesday, so that
would have been, what, the 22nd, I think? Yeah.
22nd, ordered the state to not mail any notices
to the about 1 ,400 voters whose ballots are
being included. in the cure process while all
this litigation continues, right? And so I want
to point this out really quick. So just Toby
Heaton's Paul Niemeyer, who were both appointed
by Joe Biden and George H .W. Bush, respectively,
proved the halt while Trump appointee judge Marvin
Quattlebaum. That's a fun name. That is a fun
name. So, I mean, I think one thing that is really
interesting is this is a bipartisan. panel, this
is a bipartisan decision right here. We've got
Republicans and we've got Democrats saying, hey,
maybe let's stop this stuff right now and, you
know, slow things down so that, you know, Reagan's
team can kind of figure out their next move.
Right. And that that was an interesting dynamic
that kind of happened. Like in that one, it was
unanimous. Right. And then in this other court
decision that I was talking about, kind of alluding
to earlier, specifically about the state auditor
shift of election control. But in this one, it
was a two to one decision. There was there were
two Republicans on the panel and then there was
one Democrat. And remember, here in North Carolina,
as I'm sure some of you listening probably know,
we were referring to them that way because our
judicial races are. So, I mean, it's not a secret.
But both the Democrat and the Republican sided
with the side that was saying that this is unconstitutional
because you cannot just place the electoral process
in the hands of the state auditor. Which, keep
in mind, Dave Boliak, who didn't even change
his affiliation from Democrat to Republican until
2023, a guy who has said publicly that he is
only in politics for Donald Trump. And has absolutely
no electoral experience. working with an elections
body or anything, this was the guy that they
were going to hand the reins over to take control
of our state elections, specifically because
it would deny our incoming Democratic Governor
Josh Stein the ability to do so. And what do
I mean by that? I mean that they would be in
charge of all of our election boards, all 100
election boards, that they would be in charge
of a lot more than just overseeing the election.
And for that to be a partisan position in the
hands of a state auditor, which doesn't even
make sense, huge, a bunch of red flags here.
right the question you have to ask yourself is
this if democrat jessica holmes had won this
state auditor race do you think that this would
have been in the bill that they pushed through
in december this senate bill 382 do you think
that that provision would have been in there
oh god absolutely not absolutely not yeah definitely
not no i mean this is as it has been said before
just a partisan power grab plain and simple that's
it partisan hackery it 100 like the fact that
this The fact that one of the Republican judges
basically said that because the General Assembly
still kept the power of the election boards within
the Council of State, which technically the governor
is a part of, it was constitutional. The other
two said, nah, our state constitution specifically
says that it's within the power of the governor
to do this. That makes what the General Assembly
did unconstitutional. So again, a big dub for
people on the left this month, this week. We
got two, and my soul has been sustained on that
for the last few days. Amongst all the other
bullshit that we've had to deal with, I have
been flying high because I know that at least
some of it has been stopped. I mean... You know,
whenever you're in a desert of shitty news, a
drop of water feels like an oasis. Exactly. But
at the same time, that's not to undermine, because
this is absolutely huge. And we should say that
Bullock has said that he will appeal this ruling.
Because, of course, he will. Because that is
just the Republican playbook. You know, if you
don't like the result, they say, fuck that. We're
going to sue our way to try and win. Yeah. And
here's the issue. Right? Are y 'all ready for
this? The issue is that if they appeal it, there
are 15 judges on the Court of Appeals. Three
of them are Democrats. The rest are Republicans.
And when a case goes up to the appellate courts,
they pluck three people to sit on that panel
and judge. Now, if they happen to get a couple
of judges who are willing to just kind of let
this partisan hackery take its course, again,
we're setting really, really bad precedent here
in this state if that happens. not not a lot
i can say beyond that because it's just kind
of like shit i hope it doesn't come to that yeah
i guess say um there's something kind of funny
or ironic about um a statement that destin hall
destin hall for all we don't know is the speaker
of the house here in carolina he said that he
is going to appeal this as well and expressed
confidence in the law and also said that the
board of elections God. Operates elections, quote,
much like in a banana republic. What the hell
does he even mean by that? I'm not sure he knows
what it means, but... I mean, he did use the
buzzword banana republic, which scares conservatives
like no other, apparently. Which... It's funny
because if you know the history of what a banana
republic is, it is pretty much the most capitalist
thing you could possibly think of. You said,
from failing to properly clean up our voter rolls,
to determining third -party ballot access based
on the political winds, to completely bungling
simple voter registration requirements, the partisan
Democrat board is a national embarrassment. Well,
you know what? All sorry you, but anyway. Well,
and the other side of that coin too is like,
but who pushed them to be partisan? Who pushed
election boards to be partisan, if I remember
correctly, and I probably should have double
checked this research before recording, but I
think it was under Tillis's reign as Speaker
of the House that they changed. the rules so
that it was partisan to appoint election board
members the problem was that they thought they
were going to get a lot more uh time with governor
pat mcrory and unfortunately well fortunately
for us unfortunately for them governor roy cooper
put a very quick end to that yeah he kind of
you know put him in his place but i mean i guess
that's that's what happens whenever you pass
the law that cost the state billions of dollars
in lost revenue Yeah, well, Republicans are extremely
good at that. And pretending like money is just
there, even though it's not going to get funneled
to where it was supposed to go. Colleen. Anyway,
so what does this mean for the midterms? Like,
because we're speaking really, really, really
micro level right now. This just happened in
the last couple. days really this we don't know
what's going to happen within the next few weeks
we don't know what's going to happen within the
next few months when it comes to 2026 uh where
do you see this going i mean i see and i would
love for what i'm about to say to be me just
being cynical but i think it's more me being
realistic i do see them trying to take this as
far as they can republicans that is trying to
sue their way to you know taking control of it
because that's their playbook at this point sure
you know we've said this before i've said this
before they know their policies suck They know
that them as a party is not perceived very well.
And their perception is being dragged down even
more by Trump and his policies. And so what are
they going to do? They're going to try everything
they can to consolidate power so that whenever
they have to deal with fallout of whatever the
hell Trump does, that they are affected as little
as possible. Yeah. So they are going to try to
steal a state Supreme Court seat, and they're
going to try to steal all the State Board of
Elections stuff. They're going to continue to
draw insanely shitty gerrymandered maps. Because,
as we said before, they don't care about your
voice. They don't care about your vote, dear
listener. They care about empowering themselves,
not empowering the people who they're supposed
to be representing. I wish that was me just being
cynical, but we see the evidence. Well, I mean,
it's not cynical when it's very clear, again,
very clear partisan hackery. Like this isn't
for the betterment of the North Carolina citizen.
This is for the betterment of the North Carolina
GOP. Yes. So that they can retain power in a
state that is far more purple than they are willing
to admit. We are being just suffocated by the
amount of... force that they have put into the
way that they govern it has been relentless so
and and i take from a meme here no you don't
in fact gotta hand it to them but at some point
you gotta be like god damn all right they really
they really put forward their best foot and one
of the people that you kind of have to give it
a hand give a hand to is the guy who's sitting
in our senate seat right now one of them is tom
tillis dude was instrumental in creating the
North Carolina GOP that we see today. He was
the Speaker of the House during the Tea Party
movement when they flipped it from blue to red
back in 2010. He was the guy that managed to
coordinate a sustaining campaign here for Trump
in 2016. He was the guy that managed to get millions
and millions of dollars in funds and donations
directly into the vein of NCGOP politics here.
And not to mention, the guy who is currently
the... RNC chair was basically handpicked by
Tom Tillis. So I'm not handing it to him, but
Tillis operates as if he is kind of a moderate
Republican, like, oh, well, I'm going to use
my best judgment and go that way. Make no mistake,
he is not and never has been. So dear listener,
if you are on the cusp. And or, you know, somebody
who is like unaffiliated is like, yeah, but Tom
Tillis isn't that bad. He's not as bad as other
Republicans. No, he is as bad, if not worse,
because he is able to make you think he is not
as bad as other Republicans. And we're going
to get into that here in a little bit. But for
the 2026 midterms, what this means is that if
we care about democracy and we care about not
just the rule of law, but trying to maintain
some balance in this state again in this. very
purple state, more purple than most. We have
to make sure that we are organizing. for 2026.
We have to make sure that we keep the seats that
we already have, and I'm talking specifically
the Democratic Party, and we have to ensure that
we expand the minority in the House, expand the
minority in the Senate, keep Justice Anita Earls'
seat in the North Carolina Supreme Court, and
flip some seats in both 2026 and 2028 for the
Court of Appeals. Because like I said before,
the Court of Appeals is stacked with Republicans.
They have no shortage of people in there, one
of whom is the very guy who is trying to overturn
the election that allison riggs just won jefferson
griffin he's on the court of appeals he's one
of those guys and he has refused to recuse himself
from anything right scruples be damned yeah integrity
be damned really soul be damned but anyway so
that that is on On that front, the message is
clear. The viewpoint should be clear for now.
That the focus for 2026 is making sure that we
hold on to the footholds and the handholds. I'm
using a bad rock climbing analogy here, but we've
got to hold on to what we've got right now. And
I know it doesn't seem like a win, but trust
me, if you don't, it's going to get way worse
than it already is. Because now there's no recourse.
We're stuck with people who are not willing to
fight for us. Which, if you've been paying attention
to the news, and we've talked about this a little
bit on the last episode, there's been some interesting
developments in the DNC with David Hogg, as we,
again, we say last week, with his push to...
it rid of kind of what's the word useless well
i don't want to say useless how would you phrase
it feckless probably um okay yeah yeah spineless
works too yeah democrats okay ones who aren't
willing to take a stand or who have just been
complacent and are just kind of showing they're
willing to kind of let whatever happened happen
and you know over the past week i thought this
was kind of interesting but uh the new barely
new chair this was he just got I like to share
what February or something. I think Ken Martin,
but yeah, Ken Martin. Yeah. David Hogg ultimatum,
essentially saying, Hey, you can back off of
this or you can, you know, leave essentially.
Yeah. So, you know, you start a job, you say,
Hey, I'm going to come in and change some things.
And everybody's like, cool. We can't wait to
see what you do. And then you start doing it.
And they're like, no, not like that. I mean,
I think, I think it's very interesting to see
this response. Oh, it's interesting. And it's.
Also just disappointing, but not surprising.
Like, I mean, you said before, you know, the
definition of insanity is doing the same thing
over and over and expecting different results.
Yeah. Again, maybe this plan was the most well
rolled out, but the idea behind it is at least
a good one. Yeah. There are people who need to
be primaried. There are people who need to lose
their seats and be replaced with someone who's
actually willing to do the work. Yeah. Because
he didn't say like, oh, we need more progressive
people. I mean, he may have said that specifically,
maybe. But I in my own head, when I think about
getting new people in, I don't necessarily picture
just more progressives or more leftists or whatever.
I'm picturing people who are like going to represent
the district that they live in better and that
are willing to win when the time comes that you
actually need to step up for your both your party
and also your constituents that you can you can
balance those things. Right. It's kind of like
what we talked about with Cecil Brockman is is
vanishing. When a vote comes across the floor
and you actually have a chance to, like, you're
in the room. You are down there and you are able
to cast a vote. You're one of 100 and, what is
it, 115 people? 110? Something like that, yeah.
Yeah. You're one of a small number of people
in North Carolina that actually has a direct
line to be able to say exactly what you want
to do in our government. And you skip a vote?
That's not what people elected you to do, man.
It's just not. that's what i'm talking about
maybe cecil brockman reflects his constituency
better than most would like with his politics
fine but if you're not showing up for a vote
at all it doesn't matter it doesn't and like
one it's also 120 members by the way 120 okay
but then you know there's there's the other there's
the other side of that where people are just
completely disconnected from how they're supposed
to be representing us um one great example that
has only he's only continued to make it worse
for himself is minority leader senator chuck
schumer um the man seems allergic to good press
right now i ever told him all presses get oppressed
lied to him and should be fired i'm gonna send
him a strongly worded letter oh good god you
know I'm going to send so many strongly worded
letters and he's going to have to respond. Because
this is the mindset they have right now, CJ.
This is the top guy in the Senate for the Democratic
Party. He thinks that we are back in 1980 where
you can send somebody a strongly worded letter
and they may choose to do something about it.
Does he forget that Trump cannot read? Okay,
I don't know. Have you ever watched the show
The Good Place? No, I have not. And I'm sorry
if I lose hands for that. Uh, it's a good show.
You really should watch it. Okay. It's the same
guy who did like some wreck in the office. Anyway.
Um, so the whole concept is it's the afterlife
and you find out that souls aren't getting into
heaven because there's this whole like. messed
up system and so our main character goes like
this group of angels they're like like oh you
gotta like fix this system you know people are
like going to the bad place like you know every
day in droves like no one's been to the good
place in years and this like council of angels
are like oh yeah no you know what that is a very
serious problem you know what this is something
we should talk about uh you know what we're gonna
do we are going to form a committee to discuss
taking action and we will give ourselves no uh
longer than 1 000 years to discuss whether or
not we want to actually form this committee to
take action or not right that's the mentality
just to form the committee not even to not even
to like do the thing not even to like make a
decision just to form the committee it's going
to take like a thousand years yeah well and yeah
like that that is the sheer mentality like like
we said before he's actually like we're still
playing baseball but like they've gone and created
a whole new sport yeah meanwhile they're going
around kneecapping people with the bats and he's
like guys get on base You can't red tape your
way or, you know, write your way out of authoritarianism.
You know, like this guy, like Schumer, I think
for Schumer at this point, getting Trump on the
back of the hand with a ruler would be considered
too extreme. You know? Yeah. My mind all day
since this story dropped has been going to that
moment when Chamberlain lifts up that piece of
paper on the flight line, says peace in our time.
But we didn't even get to that point. Like, he's
not going to read that letter, dude. Like I already
discussed, I don't think that Trump is actually
literate. I think that he I mean, it's been pretty
clear when you watch him say speeches. He's like
squinting real hard. He messes up on a bunch
of words. Sometimes he'll just make shit up as
he goes along. He'll just riff like maybe he's
dyslexic. I don't know. I'm not trying to be
ableist here. The point I'm trying to make is
that kind of what you were saying. This is a
different ballgame. And when Chuck Schumer's
just dragging the Democratic Party into the depths
with him like an anchor in terms of popularity,
in terms of people's belief in their ability
to actually be the opposition party. No, he's
just saddling us. And then, as if it wasn't bad
enough. When all this is happening, he thinks,
you know what? I'm going to go onto a major network
television and tell them I wrote a strongly worded
letter to the president. That'll show him CJ's
got his head in his hands. As do we all. I'm
looking at my liquor shelf right now debating
if I'm going to drink. When I heard that little
snippet of that interview, I just kind of paused
the video. And just kind of sat there for a second,
just in sheer awe, I guess, of just how out of
touch and how unable, I should say, there we
go, how enable, whatever, that Schumer is to
rise to meet this moment. Like, he does not have,
he either does not have the ability, the willingness,
or the just knowledge, or the balls, I guess,
to meet the moment, to rise up and be like, hey,
let's cut the shit. You know, Trump is just really...
kind of speed run authoritarianism yes maybe
we should throw some fucking balls and do something
about it i mean it's not even just balls it's
just like what you said before we've tried the
same thing and nothing's working so maybe you
should change tactics man we've tried nothing
and we're all out of ideas that was how we started
this year yeah and and so far you know we we've
had a few little glimmers of hope from the democratic
party with chris murphy going on his speaking
tours um with senator chris van hollen going
to el salvador and meeting with kilmar rego garcia
like that was a huge boost for him and people
were like he should run for president i'm like
why because he did like the bare minimum yeah
and i'm not saying that i'm not saying that to
discount what he did but like that should be
what we expect out of the leaders of our country
that shouldn't be the the the that should not
be the exclusion to the rule yeah exception to
the rule thank you That should not be the exception
to the rule. So why is it? Why is our confidence
so low? Because we got people like Chuck Schumer
sending letters instead of going down to El Salvador.
We have people saying in closed door meetings
that they're really not approving of what they're
doing right now. What we need is a senator who's
going to barge into the Oval Office and say,
you, sir, are a rat fucker or something. I don't
know. Anything. Get it on camera. Just the last
few weeks, we had Gretchen Whitmer get sidelined
or get sideswiped by the press when she thought
she was going to meet. president drum for for
just a meeting for her state and then she had
that embarrassing moment where she put a folder
in front of her face but when you think about
it it's like okay this is how you do it This
is how you embarrass the other side, by getting
them off kilter. And we're not doing that. We've
become the reactionary side of the political
aisle. And we shouldn't be. Like, this is not
the time for defense. It's the time for offense.
It's the time for balls to the wall, pedals to
the metal, full, just full on offense. Like,
we don't need to be waiting for whatever insane
bullshit executive order Trump signs to drop.
We need to actively be anticipating it. The DNC,
I don't know off the top of my head, the DNC.
gets how much fucking money per year right um
yeah multi i don't actually pay their advisors
their consultants whatever but they need to either
pay them less or fucking fire them and hire people
who can consult on this shit who can again rise
to meet the moment yeah you know here's something
you and i We have at least some idea of maybe
the justifications internally. Like we can at
least kind of figure it out. Sure. I'm not sitting
here saying like these people are, he's just
stupid or whatever. Yeah. But like to the just
average everyday person who could not give less
of a shit about this in everyday life. If they
look at the TV and they're like, they see Schumer
and they're like, a letter? Well, they're going
to just think, well, that guy's fucking stupid
or that guy is a coward or what party is it?
is he democrat oh yeah i guess they're right
and that's what i was gonna say is the the latter
half it's like at this point they republicans
would not be doing that they would not be sending
a strongly worded letter they would be they would
be rallying people to if not riot get right up
to the point where they might and yeah To an
extent, we have seen that, right? We were seeing
like 50 -51. We're seeing all of these groups
putting together like town halls. Just as an
aside, maybe I can use this later, but I went
to a town hall where our representative did not
show up. And like, that is a good through line
to say, see, they just do not care. They don't
want to meet with constituents. The RNC has specific,
well, not the RNC, but the House Caucus, the
Republican House Caucus has instructed people
not to hold town halls anymore. And then some
of them still did. You know, I'm not going to
give them props. But at the same time, it's like,
OK, you make the bed. That you want to sleep
in, right? Town halls are doing nothing except
providing a through line for us to show that
they are incredulous. They do not care. They
don't care what you actually have to say. They
will say anything to get reelected. Unless you're
in somebody like Marjorie Taylor Greene's district
where she can just be as brazen as she wants.
People can get tased in her audience. And it
doesn't matter. She doesn't care. She laughs,
actually. And something I want to say really
quick. Before we get too far away from it. Yeah.
Talking about the 51 stuff and like these national
movements, these protests. These groups shouldn't
have to be doing the work that the Democratic
Party should be doing. I agree and disagree a
little bit because I don't think that it's incumbent
upon the political party to do these things.
I think it's good in a way that these movements
are happening independent of the Democratic Party,
right? Yeah, I agree with that. They should be
independent. But at the same time, if you're
comparing the two, I'm looking at 50 -51. I'm
going to say them just as count catch -all for
these groups. If you're looking at 50 -51 compared
to the DNC, compared to the Democratic Party,
you're like, oh, well, obviously the Democratic
Party isn't doing anything, and these guys are.
But I think that lets them off the hook a little
too easily. They should at least be somewhat
on a similar level. Maybe. But I think that's
also letting them off the hook a little too easily,
you know? Yeah. You want to see action taken
by the Dems. I agree. I think that they do want
to see action, but I also think that when we
see action, it's not the kind of action that
people want. Because unfortunately, there is
a set of rules in Congress, and those aren't
always clear. This is where the base fall metaphor
comes back into play. It's like... They'll pull
out some rule from like 200 years ago and people
are like, what the hell are you talking about?
It's like, actually, it's already, it's always
been in the rule book. We've just never used
it. When we talk about political maneuvering,
right? These people aren't experts, but they're
just going to like come across something and
use the tools they have and see if it works for
the most part. With independent organizing, you
don't necessarily have to abide by that. With
like 50 -51, they don't have to worry about the
image tied to a political party because there
was everybody out there, right? At this town
hall, there were Republicans there, too, that
were there specifically to voice their concerns
about veterans issues, about Medicare and all
these other things to our representative. And
he was not there. And my district representative
is a Republican. So I get what you're saying.
And I tend to agree that, like, yes, the Democratic
Party should be stronger. But at the same time,
don't you think it's a little bit cringe if they
try to do too much? I think it turns some people
off, to be honest. I mean, maybe. But the question
then is the number of people it turns off versus
the number of people that gets engaged worth
it. That's a good point. What is your return
on investment, so to speak? Yeah, exactly. What
is the ROI? Yeah. No, that's a good point. And
I think with like, when we talk about recruiting
and stuff, it's like, what is the, we always
have to look at what the purpose of an organization
is, right? And I was talking about this with
somebody the other day. What is the actual purpose
of a political campaign? Is it to start a movement?
Is it to headline a candidate and make them like
the center of a conversation? Or is it to raise
money? And in some cases, it can be all three.
It can be one or none of them. But I think ultimately
what a campaign serves to do is to raise money
for a campaign so that it can be self -sustaining.
Would you agree with that? I'd say so, yeah.
And I think that a candidate is just kind of
an addendum to that in a certain sense, right?
It's like a circus act. If not to be too on the
nose, maybe not a circus act. It's like a magic
act, right? For the magician to keep doing his
trade. I mean, yeah, he could do magic on the
streets. He could probably be the best magician
ever. But if he doesn't have a good PR team behind
him, if he doesn't have people behind him that
he's going to be able to tour with. And, you
know, he doesn't have people to help out with
his tricks. He doesn't have an assistant, a sexy
assistant, right? The lovely assistant. If he
doesn't have. All of that as part of his act,
it doesn't matter what his tricks are. He's still
just a guy on the side of the street begging
for change with magic tricks. It is a movement,
but it is also a business in some sense. But
that's my take on that, I guess. We're kind of
getting off track, I think, a little bit here.
But I think that I can bring it back around to
the whole David Hawk thing and why we run candidates
in the first place, right? Because, yes. Very
true that campaigns are better to raise money.
But if the candidate is no good, it doesn't matter
how much money you raise, right? Now, here comes
a conversation we have to have about Representative
Cecil Brockman and potentially somebody else
on the Senate side. Now, this is a new development,
right? I'm just going to read something I wrote
down here. So State Senator Dan Blue, he's a
longtime state senator who recently stepped down
as minority leader. And there's a bit of conversation
there about whether he actually stepped down
or if he was going to. get beat out for reelection
by sydney batch i don't know the the behind the
scenes of that all i know is that he was that
she took the mantle right he's still in the senate
but she's the minority leader and while senator
dan blue remains a respected figure the change
is kind of opening the door for new voices and
perspectives within the party like Not unlike
Sidney Batch's voice. But the problem is that
now he is actively, at least according to the
News and Observer, and this was something that
just happened in the last couple days that they
reported on, that he's, quote, going his own
way, end quote, and voting with Republicans on
four key bills, including the state budget. Do
you think he's in the crosshairs now for something
like this? I mean, I wouldn't be surprised. I
think that right now where we're at as a party,
as a country, as a state, whatever, people want
two things. They want loyalty. Well, they want
a lot of stuff, but two of the things they really
want are loyalty. In the moment, you mean? Like
right now? Yeah. Yeah, they want loyalty and
they want to know that they can trust you as
a representative of the party, as a member of
the party. And, you know, we have seen, you know,
Dems be primary before and lose their seat because
they can be trusted. Just look at Michael Ray
last year up in C -27 when he got beaten by Rodney
Pierce. And I'm just saying that not just because
I managed Rodney's campaign, but because it's
true. Nice little pat on the back there for yourself.
Hey, I'm not going to knock you for it. But yeah,
that's a good example. Yeah. But I mean, I think
that this definitely puts Dan Blue on some on
people's radars because they're like, well, they'll
look at a couple different perspectives. One
is, you know, is he doing this because he no
longer has to be a minority leader so he can
be free to vote however he actually wanted to
the whole time, whatever. Right. Or is he doing
this because he lost his position and now he's
pissed and now he's being spiteful and vengeful?
I don't think it's the spite part necessarily.
Oh, yeah. But, you know. People might start asking
themselves that. And whenever they start asking
themselves that, that does put him in the crosshairs
potentially to bring it back to your world. And
I think you're right about the initial reaction
from a lot of people is going to be on. Some
kind of sliding scale of loyalty and trust, because
the initial reaction from this story where they
mentioned that he was going to be working with
Republicans more on like the budget and some
of these other key bills that they want to pass
was not vitriol, but just kind of like a resigned
indignation. Maybe this this kind of like, well,
primaries are coming up, Dan. And that was a
lot of the comments that I saw online. Now, granted,
these do not represent the vast majority of voters
here in North Carolina. But I think when. That
is the initial reaction from people who are active
online that are engaged with politics, and they
see that. That's a bad sign. Not bad for them.
It's bad for the Democratic Party. It's bad for
the North Carolina Democratic Party. And, you
know, we've said it before, but people like Cecil
Brockman need to be primaried. Senator Dan Blue,
that remains to be seen, right? He hasn't actually
done anything yet. But the mere fact that he
says that he wants to try and work with Republicans,
and we can understand why, right? Because, like...
we're in the minority here in the state the we
have the governorship we have four other members
of the council of state but we do not have power
within the general assembly we don't have power
within the courts so if you can maneuver your
way into the good graces of the majority party
sure i can understand politicking like that but
when we are at a current junction that requires
some gumption that requires some willingness
to stand up to pretty much anything that Republicans
want to do right now, especially if they are
even adjacent to the Trump agenda. That's important
for your, not just your donor base, that's important
for your base of support. These people want you
to do something substantial. They need action.
And what you're offering them is complacent or
is complicit. Sorry. And what you're offering
them is that you're going to be complicit with
the majority party, the people that you are in
opposition to. So I'm not holding out hope. I'm
not necessarily like tied to it, both, you know,
politically or I don't have strong feelings about
Senator Dan Blue one way or another. Love to
get him on the podcast. Dan, you up for it? We
can talk about this a little bit more in depth,
but, you know, share your share your feelings
about this. But, you know, just understand where
we're at. in this moment, I think is what we're
really saying. Yeah. And I, um, I said, I think
maybe this is, I don't think there's going to
be some sort of like, uh, Trisha Coughlin situation
or anything like that, where you like turns red
or anything. No, not at all. But I do definitely
think that he, a lot of people are going to be
paying closer attention to what he does now.
Yeah. While they try to assess that whether or
not they can trust him or not. Yeah. And he,
he's definitely painted a target on his back.
Um, Probably unintentionally, in a way. But,
you know, people are saying he's the new swing
vote. And that remains to be seen, in my opinion.
The real swing vote is going to be in 2026 with
this Senate run. And that's what we want to spend
this last section on. We've avoided talking about
it for a little while. Sort of as a joke. But
like we said at the top of the episode, Wiley
Nickel earlier this month announced that he was
going to be running for Senate. We knew that
he was going to run way ahead of time just because
of FEC filings and that his Twitter and Instagram
accounts were following a bunch of people that
it was like Wiley for Senator Wiley for Wiley
2026, something like that. The Republican incumbent,
Tom Tillis, who we've already sort of talked
about, he has served two terms as the. senator
from North Carolina. And what's going to be interesting
is that Wiley Nicol is kind of positioning himself
as like a moderate Democrat. That was how he
ran when he originally was the representative
from the 13th district. That's the district I'm
in right now, ironically enough, until he was
gerrymandered out of his seat. So he previously
represented the North Carolina 13th congressional
district. And he positioned himself as a moderate
Democrat then. I'm sure he's going to do it now.
I don't know how well that's going to work on
a statewide race like this. especially when Senate
races, as we know, are kind of national affairs.
I mean, you are running to represent your state,
but there is a much broader reach in terms of
just national appeal, in terms of how much money
you're going to bring in from outside of your
state. You can look at any Senate races from
the last 10 years and see that to be true. So
with this happening, there's also a lot of, as
I'm sure that... You are probably aware, dear
listener, that there's a lot of buzz about whether
Roy Cooper, former Governor Roy Cooper, is going
to run. He has been like the bell of the ball
that the National Democrats are trying to get
to run here. And it's no shocker that he's the
guy that they want, right? He's won statewide,
not twice, four times. twice as AG as attorney
general and twice as the governor. So that's
something to really consider. He, it cannot be
denied that he is popular in the state, but the
problem is a lot of people see him as too old,
which compared to tell us is kind of like, come
on. Wiley nickel is not as well known throughout
the state. And that's a big problem. Um, I mean,
if he's the guy that they're going to run, if
we don't even have a primary, it's going to be
a bit of an uphill battle there. But there's
another factor to this. And CJ, it's time to
play the game you've all been waiting for. How
much money? did they make in quarter one CJ are
you ready to play sure I feel like we need some
theme music right here please don't sue me uh
price is right because that was definitely the
price is right I was gonna say uh what was it
10 seconds is fair use yeah something like that's
like five to ten seconds or something um so what
one thing that this is going to really be in
2026 is a money game. And we kind of know that
going in with most of these Senate races now,
because like Senate races are becoming multimillion
dollar affairs right out the gate. But we really
need to talk about how much money each of these
candidates has raised in quarter one. So CJ,
are you ready to play? Sure. So your first. candidate
is going to be tom tillis now keep in mind tom
tillis does have a good little coin purse on
his belt and he has been in the senate for a
long time has a lot of backers has a lot of packs
on buying them so cj if you can get within a
hundred thousand dollars you will get something
you will get a prize i can't tell you what it
is if you win i will think of it So how much
money do you think Tom Tillis has raised in quarter
one? Now quarter one is the 1st of January through
the 31st of March. Right. Of this year. Total
donations. I'm sorry. You've run out of time.
I'm just kidding. Yeah. Total donations from
independent small dollar donors plus PACs. Not
counting cash on hand prior to, just how much
he's raised in receipts this quarter. I'm going
to take a wild but not so wild guess and say
like 1 .9. You were pretty close. You weren't
within $100 ,000, so I'm sorry. You do not win
the prize. Tom Tillis raised $2 .2 million in
quarter one. Counting everything that he had
already, he currently has a... pretty substantial
war chest so cj you have a chance of redemption
okay okay you will get two of the same prize
of which i have not divulged yet nor thought
of but if you can get within 250 000 of what
tom tillis currently has cash on hand then you
will win how much money does tom tillis plus
the 2 .2 million dollars that he has raised have
in cash on hand right now let's say 50 million
oh no Way too much. How about more like $10 million?
Not quite. Okay, so it's about $4 million cash
on hand. Somehow that's better than I thought
it'd be. But here's the other part of this, and
this is what people don't typically think about
when these campaigns raise money. That is with
zero debt. Yeah. And that's something we're going
to talk about here in a second. Because it's
time for round two. Wiley Nickel is your candidate.
Now, how much money do you think he raised in
quarter one? I don't know how much longer I'm
going to be able to do this game show host voice.
Quarter one, so January through end of March.
And keep in mind, he... announced april 9th was
the official like day that he announced that
was the official day but there's no way in hell
that was when he started raising money no you
are correct using that logic using that logic
if i'm running that i want to make sure that
i feel i'm in a place where my campaign is at
least somewhat viable finance wise before i actually
announce yeah i have enough money to pay for
whatever promotional stuff i'm going to be putting
out there whatever so i'm gonna say 20 000. Dude,
you were right on the money. That's crazy. Nice
job. I had to redeem myself after saying 10 million
for Tillis. Wow. Yeah. No, you hit it. Right
on the nail. He's raised $20 ,000 in contributions
in about three weeks since he announced. There's
been some more since then, just from little packs
here and there. But yeah, that's how much he's
raised. Now, here's the real question. How much
money do you think he has cash on hand? That,
I feel, is a lot less. That, I feel, is probably
going to be like, I don't know, maybe like $10
,000. $10 ,000? No, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry,
no. No, how much he has cash on hand? On hand,
my bad, my bad. Y 'all, I think he might be stalling,
so he can look this up on his phone. he's showing
his hands now for those who can't see my hands
are in front of my computer so adrian cannot
accuse me of that yeah he's got his hands and
i can't see where his hands are right now i'm
just just straight up lying this is how we're
going to actually start doing the video uh yeah
this is videos of this this is when cj this is
this is the episode where he demanded that we
do video every single time because he's like
adrian i'm sick of your shit So we're like Penn
and Teller. We don't we don't talk outside of
this show. I'm sure he has more money or money
left over from his like previous campaigns and
whatnot that you can just do whatever with. So
that's that. Yes. Maybe half a mil. Yeah. Yeah.
Five hundred twenty thousand. That's how much
cash he has on hand. Here's the here is the rub,
though. And this is where I'm not going to make
you guess. He owes close to a million in expenditures.
Right. So that's so kind of what you were talking
about before, where there's a lot. of just base
level like getting your campaign off the ground
i i don't i haven't poured through what all that
is based in but like i mean and all of this if
anybody's interested all of this is free and
available on the fec website you can go and check
all this stuff out for yourself right now this
is not some like secret way that i was able to
pull together this stuff like it's all publicly
available adrian's actually uh actively hacking
into wiley nichols I actually hacked into Tom
Tillis' campaign committee, and they had already
hacked into Wiley Nickel. So it was a secondhand
hacking for legal reasons. I did neither of those
things. Anyway, so yeah, that's kind of where
we're at right now with those two campaigns.
Tom Tillis has... a metric shit ton of PAC money
just rolling in. 5 ,000 here, 5 ,000 here, 5
,000 here, 5 ,000 there. We're getting donors
like UPS, Walmart, Lowe's, Home Depot, all sorts
of big dollar donors, not just from interest
groups, but also from companies, right? What'll
be interesting to see over the next few months,
at least until 2026 really starts to pick up,
if there are any other primary challengers, is
how much money can Wiley Nickel actually get
pulled together? let's say at the end of quarter
three because that'll be a good indication of
how viable this campaign actually is and again
this isn't this is just the brass tacks this
is not implying anything negative or positive
campaigns are a marathon they are not a sprint
it takes there there have been races won on way
less money money is not the end all be all so
i do not encourage anybody to say you know oh
his campaign's dead in the water because while
tom tillis raised 2 .2 mil, he only raised $20
,000. Let's keep things in perspective here.
I will say it's going to be interesting if, say,
Roy Cooper does up in this, which from what I've
heard, right now it's a solid 50 -50 chance.
At least that's what I heard last week from some,
I think, article. 50 -50, huh? Let me find a
coin. Keep going. no it's gonna be interesting
to see which way the money kind of breaks like
you know what packs throw money whose way or
where the small donor donor dollars kind of end
up it's gonna be for those who are like really
nerdy about this so like you know you and me
and you know all of our campaign friends i'm
if cooper does run i'm looking forward to that
quarterly report same same really want to do
that yeah but that's some you're right that is
something that only people who are political
nerds would actually be excited for like hearing
you say it out loud i'm like yeah hell yeah and
then i'm like i stepped outside of myself for
a second i'm just like anyway okay okay adrian's
holding up a coin to the camera for y 'all everyone
because if it is indeed 50 50 i want you to call
it right now heads cooper's running tails he's
not i'm gonna say heads all right unfortunately
You're going to have to find out what I actually
flipped. On the next episode of Left of Old North,
I am so sorry. We are out of time for today.
Thank you for listening all the way through.
And you can follow us on social media. We are
on Blue Sky's Left of Old North, where pretty
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We're going to have a website up and running
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just make sure to follow us so you can keep up
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it pretty consistently now, I think. Also, follow
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and we're going to start writing some articles
and also doing video content. If I have finished
recording it and everything, the video will be
up on our YouTube channel today while you're
listening to this episode. So please make sure
to check that out as well. Talk a little bit
more about Cecil Brockman and all that stuff.
So we hope that regardless of how you feel about
today's episode, and if you're still mad at me
about the coin flip, I understand. But at the
same time, I sure hope that you will stay with
us on the left of Old North. Have a good day.