Welcome to the Nonviolent Jesus Podcast. I'm
John, Father John Deere, and today I'm speaking
with my friend Brad Wolf, editor of the recent
collection of writings by the legendary activist
Philip Berrigan. This is a project of www .beatitudescenter
.org where you can find many other podcasts and
regular Zoom programs on the nonviolence of Jesus
and practicing nonviolence and working for a
more just, more nonviolent world. So let's begin
with a little prayer. I invite you wherever you
are just to take a deep breath and to relax.
And recenter yourself and together let's all
enter into the presence of the God of peace who
loves each one of us infinitely, personally,
and everyone everywhere. And let's welcome the
risen nonviolent Jesus here in our midst and
take a moment to ask for whatever graces we need
to follow him more faithfully and do God's will.
God of peace, thank you for all the blessings
of life and love and peace that you give us.
Be with us now as we reflect together on your
call to follow the nonviolent Jesus and work
for a more nonviolent, more just world. Bless
us, inspire us, disarm us, strengthen us, and
send us out to do your will. and to do our part,
like Philip Berrigan, to help end war and nuclear
weapons, as well as poverty, racism, greed, injustice,
and environmental destruction, that we too might
be your holy peacemakers, your beatitude people,
and welcome your reign of universal love, nonviolence,
and peace on earth. In Jesus' name, amen. Well,
it's a pleasure to welcome my friend Brad Wolf
from Lancaster, Pennsylvania. Brad is a former
prosecutor, professor, community college dean,
and the executive director of Peace Action Network
of Lancaster. He's the co -coordinator of the
Merchants of Death War Crimes Tribunal and currently
working as the chair of the U .S. Organizing
Committee for the People's Tribunal on the Korean
Victims of the 1945 Atomic Bombings. Brad recently
edited the first ever collection of writings
on peace and nonviolence by Philip Berrigan called
A Ministry of Risk, which is published by Fordham
University Press, which I hope everyone will
get. I just always encourage everyone to read
and study the lives and writings of Daniel and
Philip Berrigan. They were my lifelong friends
and teachers and mentors. Brad Wolf, welcome
to the Nonviolent Jesus Podcast. Thank you, John.
It's good to be here. I appreciate you having
me on. Great. Well, we're going to jump right
into it, and I've sent you some of these questions.
I want to kind of walk through Phil's life and
ask you to reflect or comment on it. Just before
I begin all that, I met Brad about, I don't know,
10 years ago, but we got arrested together just
before the pandemic. with Jane Fonda and Reverend
Barber at the Fire Drill Fridays protests in
Washington, D .C., then the pandemic happened
and we were talking on the phone. And Brad, you
said to me, when are you going to put together
a book of the writings of Philip Berrigan? To
which I said, I just got too much going on. Why
don't you do it? And wow, Brad did it. So thank
you. And you're the only person I know of who's
gone through all of Phil's papers at the Cornell
Archives and the DePaul Archives. I went through
all of Dan's papers for my book, Daniel Berrigan,
Essential Writings. And so that's where you have
a unique perspective. Brad didn't know Phil.
I knew him for 20 years, but he brings a fresh
appreciation that has been really helpful to
me as I reflect on Phil. He was such a large
in the life person in my life. So Phil was a
Josephite priest working in New Orleans, advocating
civil rights. His Jesuit brother, Daniel, both
began to speak out against war and nuclear weapons
around the time of the Cuban Missile Crisis.
But then the Vietnam War started, and they just
both went full -time working against that war.
Dan as a writer, poet, and teacher, and Phil
as a parish priest, but secretly an organizer
of demonstrations. And by 1967, he found that
he wasn't making any difference, writing letters,
meeting with officials. And so that October,
he and three others really shocked the country.
They called themselves the Baltimore Four. when
they walked into a local draft board office and
started pouring blood on the files of young guys
being shipped off to Vietnam. And it ushered
in a whole new type of kind of militant, nonviolent
resistance in the anti -war movement. So, Brad,
tell me about your journey with the writings
and your take on all that led up to what happened
at the Baltimore Four in 1967. Because it was
so shocking. It was indeed. And the journey has
been an incredible one for me. As you mentioned,
I didn't know Phil personally, so I came to know
him through his writings. And that was very powerful
for me to dig into the archives, to see his letters,
his journals, and to get to know the man through
what he wrote while in prison or while planning
these resistance activities. In 1967, as you
mentioned, Phil would become frustrated with
the fact that his speaking out, his letter writing,
and his article writing, and even meeting with
government officials was not doing anything to
change the course of the Vietnam War. And there
were protests with large numbers of people. He
came to believe that something dramatic needed
to be done to really stir debate around the American
dinner table. And nonviolence, as you know, has
to be recreated for the present moment each time,
you know, Mahatma Gandhi holding up the salt
during the salt march and Martin Luther King
with the bus boycott. And so Phil and his colleagues
began asking themselves, what's the symbol of
the Vietnam War? How can we distill that war
to its essence with a symbol and register our
resistance? And they decided that it would be
draft files. which were something that Phil referred
to as human hunting licenses, because they were
compelling young American men to go to a foreign
country and kill or be killed. And he thought
they were an offense, they were an injustice.
And so they became an excellent symbol for Phil
and his colleagues. And then the second question
became, what do we do with that symbol? What
do we do with the draft file once we have it?
And Phil, being a Christian, a Catholic, a priest,
the idea of pouring blood on them attracted him
strongly. It could represent the spilled blood
of Christ, and it could represent the spilled
blood of so many Americans and Vietnamese who
were dying at that time. And so that's what they
did. They distilled the issue to its essence.
They recreated nonviolence for the present moment.
And they went into that draft office and took
out draft files in Baltimore, and they poured
blood on them. And as you say, it garnered enormous
press attention, media attention around the world.
There was a lengthy trial. He received a lengthy
prison sentence. For that act alone, he received
a sentence of four years. And that is what led
him to continue his actions in places like Catonsville.
So let's talk about Catonsville. And I'm just
taking it all in, you know, because I heard these
stories. But they still continued to energize
me. Dan took a busload of 100 Cornell College
students to the big mass mobilization at the
Pentagon that October 1967 with no intention
of doing anything. And all the young people went
and got arrested. And Dan was the only one left
as their chaplain. He was the chaplain at Cornell.
So he got arrested with them. Thousands of young
people were corralled over near RFK Stadium,
that's now the D .C. Stadium, for two weeks held
outside, and Dan was the first priest ever arrested.
He's in the car being driven back to the Catholic
worker from the jail, and he hears on the radio,
Reverend Philip Berrigan and three others arrested
for pouring blood, and he called his mother.
The Berrigan mother, who was a really saintly
person. Brad, I hope you don't mind me sharing
these stories. Listening to you just pushes all
my buttons. And now, you know, thinking about
my own family when I've been in and out of jail,
doesn't normally go over well with the family.
And Mrs. Berrigan, who was just a total saint,
Dan's going, I'm just out of jail. This never
happened before. The priest had never been arrested
in the United States before. And they're both
on front page of the newspapers. And I'm just
out, but I think Phil is going in for many years.
And his mother paused and then said, now let
me get this straight. You're out and he's in?
And Dan said, yes. She said, okay, that's good.
That's all I only comment. She was totally fine.
So Dan goes to Vietnam with Howard Zinn in January.
And he's going to rescue three American pilots
who have been released by the Viet Cong. Only
the U .S. bombs the block they're on for the
entire week. I always thought deliberately targeting
Dan. And in that April, Dr. King is assassinated.
And it was then in May while Phil was out on
bond awaiting the trial that Phil drove up to
Cornell and said, We're going back. We're going
to do it again. And we got a bigger crew and
we have an even better idea. So tell us about
the action and your take on it all that led to
this mythic trial that October 1968, which Dan
then later made into a play that's still being
performed around the world. It was an extraordinarily
bold move by everybody involved. Phil, as you
said, was out on bond at the time from the Baltimore
arrest. He knew he was going to go to prison
for a lengthy sentence at some point in the near
future. But he wanted to do something else to
generate even more interest, more concern about
the Vietnam War. He wasn't satisfied with what
had happened in Baltimore. So they came up with
this idea to go into the draft office again in
Catonsville, Maryland, a different location.
And rather than blood, they were going to burn
the files with homemade napalm. And of course,
napalm is what the United States military was
using extensively. It's jellied ammunition that
is dropped from the air and burns flesh to the
bone. So they used homemade napalm to destroy
these files. So they went in. They take out the
files and Phil, of course, is dressed in his
Roman collar, very much the conservative Catholic
priest. And they take out this files and Dan
is with him this time. And they've notified the
media in advance. And in the parking lot, they
burn over 400 of these files as they recite the
Lord's Prayer. This gets enormous interest from
all facets of the U .S. government, including
the FBI, including J. Edgar Hoover, who then
makes it his lifelong mission to go after Phil
and Dan Berrigan. And what Phil didn't know at
the time was that there were no copies kept of
these draft files. So when they destroyed them.
Those individuals whose files they destroyed
could no longer be called up until a new file
was created. So it was both a symbolic action
but a literal one too in slowing down the draft
process. And again, these files, these human
hunting licenses were something so repugnant
to Phil. He has this quote where he says, those
draft files to us are death or more precisely
the mechanism of death. Our blood upon them is
a tribute to life and a covenant with it. Our
way of saying no more war, war never again. It's
so hard to take in or to remember that, you know,
there were no cell phones or faxes or computer.
Or anything. So to have a little piece of paper
with the name and address of the young kid who's
going to be shipped off to Vietnam is the only
record. So as you said, that was the end of any
connection with this potential soldier. So none
of those guys got drafted. The actions literally
saved the lives of 400 people. people don't know
was that that was just the first of 300 draft
board raids. And that, you know, after years
of this, there were some people burning 10 and
20 ,000 files. Tell us, and I don't remember
much of what Phil wrote about it because now
he's in and out of prison, but he was quietly
driving around and organizing all these incredible...
Very serious civil disobedience actions. If you
got caught, you were doing five to ten years
in prison. Easy for destruction of government
property. But it was ending the war. They couldn't
manage the war because pretty much the whole
northeast country, right, Brad, was losing its
recruits. It was indeed. And as you said, so
many others began to do these same actions because
they realized the potency of them. Destroying
the files was stopping the draft, stopping the
flow of soldiers to Vietnam. It was having an
enormous effect. And from 1966 to 1973, there
were hundreds and hundreds of these draft card
office, draft file office raids. and tens of
thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of files
destroyed. So this was a really effective way
to take government property that Phil believed
had no right to exist, no more right than the
gas chambers of Auschwitz had a right to exist.
It had no right to exist and therefore could
be destroyed. And so creating this kind of new
form of nonviolent resistance spread like wildfire
across the country. Others embraced it. And that's
one of the wonderful things about creative nonviolence
is that when you come up with a particular method,
others will follow and take up the banner. And
that happened here. And Phil continued to spend
his time while out on bond, organizing other
draft file office raids, encouraging others to
take the same kind of risk that he and his colleagues
were taking. And that's why the title of Ministry
of Risk, I felt, was so important when I first
found that quote, because he felt that's what
everybody should do. Not just a priest, not just
a pastor, but everybody should take on that ministry
of risk. Yeah, read us that quote and tell us
why you think everyone should do that. I never
heard such a phrase before. It's a really wonderful
quote. And, you know, I was going through the
files the first day of Cornell. And on the very
first day, I pulled this one typewritten lecture
out of Sills. And I saw it was titled A Ministry
of Risk and Liberation. And I knew right away
that that was going to be the title, A Ministry
of Risk. And the quote is this. A ministry of
risk goes unerringly to the side of the victims,
to those threatened or destroyed by greed, prejudice
and war. From the side of those victims, it teaches
two simple, indisputable lessons. Number one,
that we all belong in the ditch or in the breach
with the victims. And number two, that until
we go to the ditch or into the breach, victimizing
will not cease. I was blown away by that statement.
I thought it was incredibly powerful and I thought
it was... a good representation of what Phil's
life of witness and sacrifice was. He said that
the minister and the church have to concentrate
on awakening God in the people where God joins
them in liberation. And liberation was a word
that Phil used a great deal because he felt liberated
by doing these kind of actions. You're reminding
me of... When I first met Phil in 1982, I'm a
dopey 21 -year -old Jesuit novice, and I went
on the retreat in the basement of a church in
Washington, D .C. with Phil and Liz. There were
about 100 of us. And at the end, we were going
to go to have a demonstration at the Pentagon,
as you do. That was what you did on retreat for
the Feast of the Holy Innocents. And he was just
so—he was this towering figure. He was tough
and just— kind of yelling, we all got to do what
we can to get rid of nuclear weapons and end
war. Okay, yeah, that's good. Yeah, I'm with
you, Phil. And then we drive over to the Pentagon.
And I don't know what they're going to do. And
Brad, they took out like gallons of blood that
they had, you know, nurses had taken the week
before. And in those days, you could walk right
into the Pentagon. You can't now. But there was
a massive mall in the Pentagon. I mean, the Pentagon
is hundreds of thousands of people. And we go
right into the mall. And there's a hundred of
us in a circle. And Phil takes out gallons. And
they just pour blood everywhere. Like 50 yards
of it. I'd never seen blood before. And it freaked
me out. And then others started doing it. And
then they were all hauled off and arrested. I
was scared to death. And Phil had said to me,
you know, if you want to follow Jesus, John,
you have to come and get arrested with us. I
did a couple months later. But, Brad, you're
the first person who's upheld that side of the
Barragans. Risk. Because unlike anybody I'd ever
met before, they were saying, All you people
are completely wrong about Christianity. It has
nothing to do with going to church, sitting back,
being nice and pious. Christianity is we're going
to the Pentagon and we're going to confront it
until they drag us away. Because that's what
Jesus did and that's what happened to him and
we're his followers and that's that. And I was
scared being with Phil even until the week he
died because there was nobody like him. I'm sorry
I'm talking so much, Brad, but it's so much fun
to bring back all these memories. Brad, I want
you to, I could go on and on, but reflect a little
bit about the 1970s. And then I want to ask you
about the Plowshares. So in the 1970s, Phil is
in prison for two and three years. And then there's
the Harrisburg trial. And he and Dan are on the
cover of Time magazine. And they're just all
over the place and just denouncing the war left
and right. As you said, Hooger. J. Edward Hoover
is just obsessed with them. And they're released
from prison. And Phil marries Liz. They move
to Baltimore and create Jonah House, which is
where I first met them. And it was a community
of full -time nonviolent resistance. Now, they
used to have a newsletter, which I got. And they
were writing all the time. I don't know how much
of it you read. But what was so original there
from the 1970s up till... Phil died, was you
had a community that was basically engaged in
nonviolent civil disobedience as permanent new
way of life in the United States, permanent resistance
to the culture of war. So they were always taking
turns getting arrested. And I think that's what's
needed now. I wonder your thoughts about that
whole era of the 70s at Jonah House. I think
that's one of the most important eras, parts
of Phil's life. that we need to look at that
time from 1973 until his death in 2002 because
that demonstrates to us what resistance for the
long haul looks like and it's easy to get very
motivated very energized for a short time about
a particular issue but how do you maintain that
kind of energy for four decades and i think his
time at jonah house and his writings during that
period demonstrate that And it's because he lived
by certain principles. As you say, Phil lived
in community, and that was important to him.
He would emphasize that again and again, that
if you're going to make it for the long haul,
you need to live with others. And you need to
live in this larger human family. this global
human family but at jonah house it was a community
of colleagues and family and their children and
they shared duties and they shared food and then
they would go to prison and then they would come
home and raise children and paint houses for
a few dollars to get enough money to meet the
basic needs and then plan resistance write articles
and go back to prison this is the way it was
done at jonah house for a long period of time
And it's because Phil believed that Christianity
and revolution were synonymous. And he had this
quote where he said, you have to be faithful
enough to suffer and daring enough to serve.
And to do that over the long haul is no easy
task. But I think when you're embedded with others,
when you're working with others, they can pick
you up when you're down. They can help sustain
you. And I think that is what. gave him the ability
to do this for a long period of time certainly
his forceful magnetic personality was a huge
help and though i never met him as you saying
you know he comes across as a truly powerful
charismatic individual and so all these things
are really important to look at and see how he
and liz and others have you know you yourself
have sustained this work over the long haul Well,
Phil was adamant about that with me as a kid.
Like, you're going to be doing this forever,
John, as long as you're alive. You can't pick
and choose your issue. And I watched how they
never let up. And the risks continued. And every
time they crossed a line, it meant more time
in prison because they were repeated offenders,
recidivists. Phil was like a really tough old
ex -con. You know, I spent a year in prison with
him, and, you know, he was happy as Larry is,
a friend used to say, because he's just, oh,
I'm back in my old element here now, you know.
And he was not fazed by anything. I remember
his stories about sharing the cell with Jimmy
Hoffa in the late 60s, and Hoffa said to him,
don't you worry about anything, Father Phil,
I got your back. And Phil was like, I don't want
you to have my back. Because the word was spread
throughout the Lewisburg prison that anybody
touches Father Phil, he'll have to deal with
me. Anyway, the stories are all amazing. But
I guess what I'm saying is when I was with him,
I was always scared. Because you'd hear, like,
how are you doing, Phil? Oh, we just got raided
by the FBI last night. I'd be like, what? What
do you mean, raided? Well, it's just like the
ICE raids now. 30 agents would storm into Jonah
House. They were always trying to get them on
RICO charges and conspiracy to put Phil away
for life. You see, because they were the ringleaders
of all resistance in the country. So what's,
again, so shocking is they keep searching for
new ideas. And that led to the Plowshares Action
of 1980. And then I think he did four actions,
including mine, and got all those many years
in prison. Talk about that and any writings you
want to share about what happened there in King
of Prussia, Pennsylvania. Sure. And just to speak
to a moment about prison and Phil's prison witness,
he has prison journals that were fascinating
to read. He wrote one of them, All of Us Are
Prisoners. And I think he believed that until
we can liberate ourselves. He said, a prolonged
fast in solitary confinement is a profoundly
liberating experience because inevitably this
question arises. What more can they do to you?
And the answer is nothing. So I think he felt
liberated in prison. It's not as if he wanted
to be there, but he did feel it was part of his
Christian duty to be there. Because another time
when he was in prison, I saw that he wrote, obeying
God's word can get you killed. And that's not
something you typically hear on Sunday mornings
in the pews, right? I mean, that's a pretty powerful
statement. But Phil lived it and believed it
and went to prison for it. And as you say, by
1980, we get into this idea of the plowshares
movement. You know, the Vietnam War is receding
into history and the American public's becoming.
you know, bored and preoccupied with other things,
but nuclear weapons are still proliferating and
Phil's very concerned with them. And so he and
others decide to visit this Lockheed Martin nuclear
facility in King of Prussia, Pennsylvania. And
they're going to go in and do what they later
referred to as a plowshares action, which was
to go in. and pour blood on the blueprints of
nuclear weapons and to take hammers and to symbolically
hammer on the nose cones and the airplanes of
nuclear weapons. So once again, they're arrested
for this. It's a great symbol. It's so creative,
right? Nuclear weapons, the hammering on the
nose cones, the beating the swords into plowshares,
the pouring of the blood on the blueprints. All
this is very effective. in a political theater
context and also to rouse the public to awareness
of what's going on right in their own backyard
you know i i live 45 minutes from king of prussia
and there were many people at the time who didn't
know that parts to nuclear weapons were being
produced there so when phil does this again with
dan and they get this lengthy prison sentence
and a long calamitous trial everybody wakes up
and starts doing other plowshares actions. The
same thing that happened with the draft files,
other people start doing with plowshares actions.
And they continue to this day across the world.
There have been hundreds of plowshares actions
in countries all over the world. You, of course,
participated in them. Many of the people I've
met since researching this book participated
in them. And that's what gives life to the movement.
That's a legacy. Part of the legacy of Phil and
Dan Berrigan is that they left these kinds of
legacies behind of Plowshares movements and creative
nonviolence. So again, you know, Phil goes to
prison for the King of Prussia action. In total,
he spends 11 years of his life in prison. That's
a long time. That's not just a day or two or
a weekend. 11 years of his life was spent in
prison. That is truly understanding that obeying
God's word might get you killed. And if I could
just speak to a second to this question that
Phil asked himself so repeatedly throughout his
writings in his life. And the question is, what
does Christ ask of me? And he seemed to be haunted
by that question. And I think he repeatedly asked
himself that question. He later wrote, the sinless
one continues to haunt me. And so I think by
asking that question again and again of himself,
he was able to do these kinds of actions. And
even into his later years, continue to go to
prison. I mean, he was released from prison.
What was it? Just a few months before he passed
away. Yeah. Yeah. It's just such a powerful witness
he gave. And I was there with him literally in
the cell. And I would still be in awe because
he was just. like the Mount Rushmore of nonviolent
resistance. You know, you talk about obeying
God's Word. It's, you know, we have such a crazy
culture and crazy Christian nationalism and fundamentalism,
and everybody's obsessed with the Bible. Actually,
Phil and Dan read the Bible and knew it better
than anybody else I've ever met. And when I've
talked with their biographers, I've tried to
say, look, you're not quite getting it. These
people are biblical people. When I was with them,
it was like being with St. Paul and St. Peter.
Nobody ever wrote about that. But all they did
was wrestle with sentences from the Gospels.
So that when you say, you know, he's coming upon...
Isaiah chapter 2, they shall beat swords into
plowshares and study war no more. Phil's going,
okay, let's do it. You know, unlike anybody else
in 2 ,000, 3 ,000 years, they were the first
people to actually say that's what we're going
to do. What's also amazing, Brad, you know, in
terms of your title, Risk, they didn't know what
was going to happen. You know, no one did anything
like this. So they drive the car that morning.
And they drive right into the GE plant and the
doors are open and they park the car. It's eight
o 'clock. The workers are going in. There's no
security. So they just line up like they're workers
and they march in and they don't know what they're
doing. And they go inside and they're down a
long hallway and they turn right, apparently.
And they open up a room and there are all these
nuclear nose cones lying around and literally
blueprints. And they thought. So the judge is
yelling at them, how did you get in? Who led
you? And Dan's going, oh, the Holy Spirit. Is
there a problem here, Your Honor? So risk the
Word of God and just following Jesus, as you
say. Brad, because our time is coming to an end,
here we are. All these years later after Phil
and the era of Trump, we're closer to nuclear
war than ever. We're in the full unleashing of
catastrophic climate change. But all these other
very horrific wars, the killings in Gaza, Ukraine,
Sudan, more money spent now on nuclear weapons
than ever before in history. And Obama and Trump
and Biden have... pledged with the complete support
of the U .S. Congress over a trillion dollars
to upgrade the nuclear industry. This is way
beyond Phil's imagination. He couldn't even imagine
that that was possible. And all that's normal
now. You don't even hear anybody talking about
it. And yet you spent this time in the pandemic
going through the papers of this great Christian
who I hope will live on like Frederick Douglass
and William Lloyd Garrison. the great abolitionists,
you know, that will look back and realize what
a gift he was and a prophet. What have you taken
from the life and writings of Phil for your own
journey as a Christian and a peacemaker? And
what would you recommend for all of us, like
some basic lessons that you're gleaning from
the life and witness of Philip Berrigan? Well,
there was no better way to spend the pandemic
than immersing myself in the life of Philip Berrigan.
I can say that clearly and authoritatively. It
was a wonderful journey, and I'm so glad that
I took it and that I came to know Phil through
his writings and through his witness. And the
advice I would give, what I learned for myself,
and as I was editing this book and compiling
the writings and editing them, I had to dictate
Phil's writings into my laptop to get them into
a document that I could then manipulate. And
so I had hundreds of pages of documents that
I had photographed, which I read aloud into my
laptop. And by reading Phil's words aloud gave
me a kind of ownership in them that made me question
myself and ask myself, am I up to that task?
Could I do that? Do I believe that to that degree?
And I think if people read these words out loud.
they might have the same kind of effect and it
could energize them. But I can emphasize it's
worth the journey. It's worth the journey, the
one of resistance of going into the breach with
the victims, because at the end, as Phil said,
there is the chance of liberation for yourself,
for your soul, and certainly for the victims
in the breach. So take that chance, take that
risk, go into the breach, follow the journey.
Thank you, Brad. I loved how you began in the
book and you brought it up with that challenge
that he gave at some retreat in the late 50s
that you found. And I concluded it in my afterward
in your book, brought it back. And maybe we could
just end on that question for all of us. Phil
was saying to these young people, what does Christ
ask of you? What does he ask of us today? We
could rephrase that, you know, here in this terrible
moment we're all facing. What does the nonviolent
Jesus call us to do? What have we, you know,
St. Ignatius put it this way, or I'll paraphrase.
What have we done for the nonviolent Jesus? What
are we doing for the nonviolent Jesus? And what
are we going to do with the time left we have
on earth? to follow the nonviolent Jesus and
welcomes God's reign of peace. You've helped
us all, I think, by reclaiming Phil's legacy.
So thank you so much for putting that book together.
And for all those who are listening, I really
urge you to get the book. It's called The Ministry
of Risk, Writings on Peace and Nonviolence, Philip
Berrigan, edited by Brad Wolf. You could get
it through Fordham University Press or any of
your local bookstore and all the other writings
of Dan Berrigan and the Berrigans buying about
them. So, Brad, thank you so much for being with
me today. And thank you, friends, for listening.
to this episode of the Nonviolent Jesus Podcast.
You can hear more and find other upcoming Zoom
programs at BeatitudesCenter .org. Please consider
offering a donation to support this free work,
and if you can, please leave some positive feedback
or review at NCR or Apple or Spotify or whatever
platform you use. Most of all, please tell your
friends and colleagues about the Nonviolent Jesus
Podcast so that it can... spread far and wide.
May the God of peace bless us all. Keep on following
the nonviolent Jesus. See you next time.