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Hello, hello, everyone. Super pumped, as usual. Honestly, I say that every single day. But really,

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like, I have the best people in my network and I'm just so happy and thankful for that. So,

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today on the 99 Dev Problems Show, we have Flo. Flo, I'd love for you to introduce yourself and

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just tell us a little bit about you. So, hello, everyone, and happy new year. I'm Flo from France,

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and, well, in short, I have 10 years of work experience as a founder of VC and more recently,

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an individual contributor. In the last, yeah, I worked my entire career with technical agencies,

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so developers, engineers, PhDs, you name it, and I love doing this. So, recently, I was a marketer

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in real great, the first companies like clerk, like Minlify. And more recently, I co-founded a

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community of DevTool founders and marketers. So, we have more than now 2000 community members,

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people from awesome, the first companies like Algolia, Versailles, SuperBase, they're all in.

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And also, I started working on Launchweek.dev, a place where you can discover

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new developer products and find inspiration. Have a good day.

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I love it. I love everything that you said. You're doing such awesome work. We got to chat

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about Launchweek quite a bit before we got on the stream. And I'm really, really, really excited

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about Launchweek. I think, like you had shared, like Product Hunt obviously has grown and evolved,

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and it's still a great, beautiful place to go find lots of new, awesome tools and products.

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But when you're in the specific developer tool space and trying to launch, right,

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it's really difficult to sort of get that level of awareness you could get from Product Hunt

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when there's all these other products around. And I thought that was just such a beautiful

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sentiment that you had shared previously. And so, I'm so excited for Launchweek.

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I think a lot of my clients will really enjoy Launchweek, and I think it has a really beautiful

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future. So, Launchweek.dev, for anyone who's like, wait, what are they talking about? What is Launchweek?

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Any questions? Definitely reach out to Flow. If you don't know how to reach out to Flow,

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I will connect you. So, diving in, I just wanted to obviously drop that little pitch there.

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What's your developer education in terms of like sort of what you, how you kind of have

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built the technical chops that you have today?

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Okay. So, honestly, with Launchweek.dev, I really wanted to sheep fast. So, I was familiar with

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Manify, that next-gen base platform for the clinician sites. And that worked pretty much

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was the idea of that I had for Launchweek.dev. I really wanted this product, a documentation site.

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So, that both lists the different paths that are coming out weeks and also work on the content.

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So, nothing big here. It's mostly bored by Manify. So, next-gen base platform, and then it's mostly

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GZN and markdown. But, you know, I wanted also something to be, to sheep fast. And so, that's

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why I started very simply. I love that. Okay. Let me reframe the question because I made it

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sound like I was talking about Launchweek's developer education. But I'm curious more about you

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and like your formal education, if you are self-taught or if you have a college degree or

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anything in that regard. But honestly, that's a very exciting information. Yeah. So, I would say

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it's a combination of both. I mean, I started learning coding on my own. I was a teenage.

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I was doing like union activities and I wanted a website for that union. And my brother, who was

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studying computer science, will just introduce me to HTML and CSS. He started writing a few lines

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of code, HTML, head, body. And then he pushed it live and it was on the web. And I was like, whoa,

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amazing. And this is basically how it started. And so, then I started doing a lot of design,

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web design, and also, well, web integration. And then I joined a, then I went to college to study

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computer science. But I dropped off in order to, I got bored with studies. So, I went to the US to

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start my first company. And then went back to Europe to, he failed. So, I went back to Europe and

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started another company. And then, well, so, I had the opportunity to launch a, a nonprofit in order

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to back and fund more DevTools with funding. And that was a fantastic experience. And very good.

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Oh, my gosh, that is so fun. Okay, so two things super resonated with me. When you were sharing

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the HTML and CSS thing, that reminded me of, so I had this really fun experience. And I want to

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share this because it was just such a like a beautiful thing. This was probably back in like

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2017 or 2018. And I was living in the Minneapolis area. And so, I was doing a lot with sort of local

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tech there and had been a chapter leader for Girl Develop It was teaching a lot of women to code.

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And someone actually presented an opportunity to me. And he's like, Hey, they really need a program

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in South Minneapolis at a very, very diverse school, like an actual high school. And they're

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like, essentially how this high school operated. It was very low income, very, very diverse in terms

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of, in terms of students, right? So, there was a very heavy, like, African American population,

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a very heavy, like Hispanic population, very heavy Somalian population, but, but very low on

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very low on sort of white Caucasian population. So to kind of paint that picture sort of in the

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US, right, you're looking at, unfortunately, you're looking at sort of a lower income school,

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right? And so in that school, they tried to offer a lot of after school curriculum because these

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kids were going home to no parents, no care, no one home, no one around. And so they were trying

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to keep the kids at the school for as long as possible. So, so I came in and started teaching

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them how to code. And I remember the first time that I went in there, I was like, okay, great,

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like, you know, I didn't really know what I was doing. I had been teaching adults, like,

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I understood kids fundamentally, I had little kids. And so I was like, okay, and they all sort of

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were just like, in an uproar and like just acting sort of, I'm gonna say like naughty, but that's

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kind of the right word, I can't think of the best word, they were not behaving. And I'm like, okay,

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I got to figure out how to like reign this in, right? I'm not a teacher, I don't know how to

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get high schoolers to behave. And so I'm like, okay, let's just check this out. Before we have to

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learn any of this technical stuff, because at the end of the day, they had to pick one of these

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after school things. And they were like, Oh, learning to code is the least, the least worst

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of all the options, right? And so I basically was like, I got to do something. So I FTP'd a file

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up to the internet, like literally was like, boom, boom, boom, this is what we're going to write,

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I put a GIF on there, I was just goofy about it. I'm like, boom, it's on the internet, go to this

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website. And they were like, wait, what? And then all of a sudden it was just like silence. And

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they're like, show us again. And it was like, literally the trigger to get those kids to see

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that like coding was really cool. So I love that your brother did that because that was

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in a moment of like, Oh my gosh, I have to figure this out. I did the same. And it ended up like

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intriguing them about code. And it was so beautiful. I met so many cool kids. It was awesome. But

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nonetheless, I think it's it's such a cool way to be like, whoa, I can literally make the internet.

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So I also, second follow up, dropped out of college because I just couldn't do it. I was bored,

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I can't stand lectures, I'm like, give me the thing and I'll solve it myself or I'll do it. And

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that's my way. So it sounds like we're very, very relatable. Yeah, I want to, I want to

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something concrete, right? Something tangible, something that I can touch and feel or or or at

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least yeah, or at least I want to work on my own. That was the feeling I had. So that was now 15 years

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ago. But I remember that feeling. And and so yeah, when I was 14, 18, and also an opportunity to go

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to the US to to start that thing. And and and that was a fantastic experience.

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Oh, I love that so much. Just want to say hey to David and Nick in the chat. They're both

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Hello. All right, so you get to solve a lot of challenges. So thinking about sort of, well,

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let's walk through your day to day. Like, I know that your day to day has obviously shifted a bit.

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You did a lot of work with launch week last month, really exciting stuff. If folks haven't

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seen it again, go check it out. Really cool things got launched. But what is like your day to day

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look like today and sort of as you're diving into it? So that's a good question. I think that

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you know, right now I'm trying I want to grow launch with that dev. Because I feel that

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for dev to founders and marketers, that is the way the right way to to show your products and

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your dev tool to the world in a very efficient way. And so and so I'm exploring different

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different stuff on my day to day. And and so what does it mean means that when I work on the

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on the product, so exploring different layouts in ways for for people to discover those those

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those new products, and also work on I think that there's a huge piece on content, because there's

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not a lot of literature on that topic. And so I think that working on the content also is something

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that's that that's part of my day to day job. Nowadays, and with that in mind, so that's the

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building part. There's also this this distribution part that it's making sure that

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I engage with the right people having fun on social platforms and on communities.

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Again, was that mindset of being as helpful as possible for all of them? Yes. Oh, I love that so

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much. We got to talk about that in the pre show about being as helpful as possible. And I honestly

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think we should we should chat about it because for me, and I'm sure that it's likely this

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conversation, but giving back and helping and in like creating that content right that you were

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like, that's the kind of stuff that brings in those natural opportunities, it brings in those

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roles, it brings in client work, it brings in new beautiful relationships. So I'd love to hear

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like, I'd love to just basically tap into that, right? Like, you feel very passionately about

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give, give, give, give. What's kind of your story behind that? Like, how do you see that coming to

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fruition? And how has that happened for you? Very, again, an only very good question. I'm not for

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you to share out into that. I like asking loaded questions. So honestly, I don't know where it

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started out started probably that could be related with my story with my developer education, because

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you know, the web started as an open source project, right? It was a lot about

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being in the open, building in the open and sharing the knowledge so it's, it can spread all over the

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world. Yes. And I think that's that's a mindset I that I'm loving this idea of keeping things open,

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right? I had past experiences with blurred conversations and dark, that was dark patterns and

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so on. And I think that being open is and transparent is so important to me, at least. And I think

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that's something that reflects when you when you give to the community, it also means being open.

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And when you try to when you when you give, give, give, it also means that you can have all the answers,

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right? But because you give, you just do your best to be as helpful as possible. And it doesn't

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mean you absolutely you need to have the answer. It means that you create the right connections or

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at least, you know, you just do your best to be helpful. And I think that ultimately that's

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those two stories are very related. So yeah, the origins of internet,

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this, this open source community, this open mindset. And I think that this could be very

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related to that give, give, give mindset when when you when you think of community engagement.

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Oh, my gosh, I so, so, so agree. So that actually, I think that's a really important

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step when you when you when you think of community engagement. Oh, my gosh, I so, so, so agree. So

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that actually like has me questioning a couple things and like, not in a bad way in a good way,

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but I'm sitting here thinking and as I've been growing my business, right, and I feel like you

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probably can relate to this is, I've had so many people who are like, Oh, just, I can help you,

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just let me know how I can help. And I'm like, I don't but I don't want to ask someone for help

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if I'm not going to pay them right. And so it's been this very interesting thing where I'm like,

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fine, I can handle it or I can do this or whatever it might be. But then when given the opportunity,

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right, if I've done a developer event, or I've posted something, instead, they've chosen to be

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like, here, just let me go share or they'll like go in and do something. And when I say they, I'm

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referring to developers. And so it's been very interesting for me to see and I know this, right,

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because I'm constantly like, let me just give you everything that I have, let me connect you to

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everyone I know, let me tell you everything that I know that can help you, because that's what I

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wanted, right, very similar to what you said. I learned Dakota a while ago, it's been a hot minute.

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So like back then, there wasn't the resources that we have now, right, it was like W3 schools,

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and that was kind of it. I'm going to guess you're in the same timeline, because it's about that

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same mark of what you said, it's around like that 15 years, right. And so it do you think,

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because now there are developers who are younger than us who are sort of newer in their career,

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right? Do you think that that sentiment is just developers? Because I honestly feel like when

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I talk to developers, yes, there aren't are the exceptions, right, that maybe have an ego or they're

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on a sort of a power trip. And those are the people maybe not helping, right? But I feel like for

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the most part developers are like, if you're a dev, I got you, like, what do you need? I'll drop

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everything I'm working on to help you. I know I have stuff to do, but like you're a dev too. So

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like, let me help you. Do you think this is a developer thing?

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Frankly, I'd say yes, I would. I do think so. You know what I enjoy the most. I think that's also

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why I really enjoy engaging with developers is because

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it's because when you're a developer, it's a type of audience that is very humble.

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And because, you know, there's, there's so much different frameworks, programming languages,

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you can't know everything. Right. And so you have to be very humble in the way you approach your work.

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And I think that also could be so humility. And I think that's also this mindset of

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transparency in building in the open also could be very related because, you know, there's this

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there's this strong and open source culture. No matter what you're working on right now,

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you can be in a you can work in a in a close source company, you still have that.

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Internally, you can you still have that mindset in culture somewhere because

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at the very beginning, you probably, yes, as you mentioned, you probably were, you probably

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started learning how to code by by doing so it means that you had to read code and probably

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probably comes from an open source project. And so and you and you're experiencing it on your own,

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you you broke the code from a business project. And I think that that ultimately it's, you know,

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it has an impact on your life on your on your work as a developer, no matter where you work

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now, if it's a it's a close source company or this company and so on. At some point in your career,

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at some point in your education, you were you were impacted by that open source mindset. And I

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think that's ultimately that makes you also be be be transparent and be ready to just help.

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I agree. And it was so I've been saying this for the last, you know, I would say the last six weeks,

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okay, so it hasn't been a long time. But I went to commit your code in Dallas. So Danny Thompson

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put this event on sort of it really quickly ended up being just a beautiful event, everything that

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us developers like really want to see coming back after COVID the authentic developer curated

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events where it's not these giant sponsorship boosts and people aren't trying to push stuff in

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your face. It's really just developers getting together and learning from each other. It was

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so beautiful. But I constantly say this and it's just been so interesting that developers are not

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anti social. We are anti social to the rest of the world. But to each other, we are like, hey,

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friend, how are you like, and we don't have to be friends, right? Like we can meet them for the

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first time. And we're like, Oh, I know you on Twitter. I know you on LinkedIn. Like we are

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instantly best friends. Here's how I do this. How do you do this? Like, do you want to go to

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lunch? Let's go get coffee. Like it's just this instant click if they know that they are like you.

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And so do you think that this plays into that? Yeah, I'm so biased on this topic because I'm

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personally considered, you know, if you there's probably zero chance you would meet me on a

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on a live event, zero chance. It was before the pandemic. My wife and I would decide to

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move out from from town. We decided to to settle here in the countryside. And great was that,

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you know, I'm kind of an introvert. But so I'm just right here, alone in front of my of my computer.

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But this is my small world. This is where I thrive. Because I also know that there's a lot of

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connections and live conversations like the one we're having right now. And so yeah, I mean,

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I'm biased on that. And I feel that I feel that. Yeah, it's, it's kind of, it's like there's a

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there's a life on the grid. If if you're familiar with with with Tron, with Ray Payone,

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it's, you know, this inspired science fiction. And I think there's a lot of true stories.

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If if in, if you read science fiction. So so yeah, I can I can I can't think more on this.

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Yeah. I mean, honestly, it's it's interesting too, because like you said, it doesn't have to be

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in person, right? It can be anywhere like you and I were just talking in the pre show and we were

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like, Oh, hey, launch week would be great for my clients. Maybe there's things that your clients

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need that I have. And like, you're like, Oh, maybe there's like some, you know, revenue share. And

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I'm like, I know, we just like partner, right? Like, we just help each other. And I think that's,

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that's what's so beautiful about like the developer ecosystem. And I think it's interesting.

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And maybe, right, this is why we see sort of the developer relations and some of the other

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types of functions. Because if a developer were to start to have a conversation with a

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marketer, right? And like, you and I can call ourselves marketers. But at the same time,

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we are also developers and we understand their ecosystem. But if, say, a traditional marketer

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comes in and is like, Hey, I want to just start talking to you. It's like, they can tell, like,

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they can just tell that they're not, they're not the same, right? They're not the one that's coding,

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they're not the one that's technical with them. And it's not that they're going to be mean to them,

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but it'll be like, Oh, it's great to meet you, right? And like, turn away and start,

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whether physically or virtually, right? And start going to the relationships that they do want to

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thrive for. But it's just been very interesting for me to sort of see it from a business side of

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how much developers really do want to spend time with their peers. And I think that it's coming

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back to sort of launch week and the techniques of driving growth, right? It's like, that's where

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it's at is like, how can you bring those people together? How can you bring the users together

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that already love your product, and then find those users that are not a part of that circle

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already and let them build that community with those other developers and tell those stories.

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So I, yeah, anyways, I feel like you probably have the same sentiment and opinions.

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So something weird with our roles is that, you know, we're talking about giving, giving, giving,

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and on the other end, if you have, if you, if you have that business view, how do you,

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how could you possibly justify your work? How could you possibly, well, yes, just if I divide that

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you engage in communities by giving, giving, giving and not, and not getting back and how do

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you make sure that your, your, your other stakeholders or your top management could, could

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possibly accept that. I think that's something that is very specific to this death to industry also is

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that developers are, so we talked about the, the specificities of that audience and something

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that is very important also is that developers, they share the love. The moment you have one

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developer that, that is on board, that use your product, love it and use it in production,

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you know that you have a lifelong customer, you have, and that is beyond a lifelong customer.

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It's an advocate, it's someone that can talk about your product. And I, and the problem is that

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it takes time and you won't solve it with quick wins, with ads and so on. You have to bet long

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term and that's something that is very specific and very tough to explain in our industry.

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You know, very, very, this give, give, give mindset is something I, I talked about with a,

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with a fellow, with a fellow technical marketers very recently. So someone that started in that

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industry and, and so said, hey, Flo, how do, how do I engage in community successfully? And, and I

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said, okay, first you have to give. Okay, but when I just show my content, no, no, you don't share

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your company. First, you give, first you give, you give first, you give back, you give more,

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and you do this repeatedly. And only then, and only the moment she started helping others,

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that moment, you can potentially eventually share your content. But even that is not the

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rule, right? It's not like, okay, I engaged in, in three posts, I have the right, so I have the

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right to share one blog post, there's no rationale here, there's no ratio here. So that's, that,

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that's a mindset that is very specific. And, and, yeah, I'm glad that we had this conversation,

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because if we could advocate and in this is that is for getting advocate on this, and if there's

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one key takeaway to, to get from that conversation is that you have to give first, you have to give

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back, you have to give more. And this is only what matters when you, when you engage with developers,

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it's to give, to be as helpful as possible. And that's the only thing that matters. And,

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and when you have that in mind, and in the show, also the, well, the resources also to,

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to play that game, ultimately, that pays off. Yes. It takes time. It does take time. And it's

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really interesting, because like you said, right, it's, we're always kind of, well, I mean, obviously

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the internet and social media and phones and everything has provided us this, like, we need

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results now type of a, you know, mentality. And I think in this space, it's just not something that

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is like, yes, you can do different things that are going to drive growth, right? But at the end of

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the day, exactly what you said is, is how it operates. I had this, it reminds me, and I need to come

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back and revive this piece of content. But I had this piece of content I wrote called the Building

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Trust Model. And it was essentially like three steps, right? So the first step was like, do your

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research, figure out who that person is, what have they built, what do they do, what do they care about,

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like, what are they, what do they seem to be proud of, right? And now, honestly, we probably could

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use chat GPT or Claude to like, go and search this for somebody and maybe get answers even easier.

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But the first step was research. The second step was provide a value. So for me, that was like,

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it didn't mean you had to give them something that was a lot of work, right? But like you and I talked

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about even network connections, like, hey, you should meet so and so, or have you been exposed

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to this tool? Or would you like to co-create a piece of content, right? Just some form of value

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that if you did your research, right, you know exactly what type of a value they can get if

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they're on the job market, can you introduce them to people who are hiring, etc. Right. And then the

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third step was like, you gave that value, you've nurtured that relationship, you can now finally

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make your ask, right? And so it was a lot of actually give a true piece of value before you even ask

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for anything in return. And when you do that, right, that true piece of value that was given,

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puts them in that place where they're eager to be like, oh, you need help, how can I help you?

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And so I think that that's, there's a lot of validity to that to what you're saying, right? And

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sort of this give, give, give mentality of being able to finally say, hey, would you like to try

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my product or hey, would you like to check out this piece of content or whatever? So yeah.

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So I think taking, taking that sort of like grain and vein of conversation and bringing that in,

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how do you think about your work when it relates to that? Because you're also very technical,

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right? And so you're still building things and bringing things together, but then also driving

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growth, right? And so I know personally, when it comes to sort of driving growth and building these

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different whatever it is that we're building, right? It is often hard to track those types of

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things. So when you are sort of give, give, give, giving, do you have sort of secrets or behind

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the scenes things that you do to try to associate some of that giving to maybe some of the results

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that are potentially coming from that? Another loaded question. Honestly, I don't know if I,

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the secret source here, but at least, at least what I'm trying to do is to first,

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okay, when you, when you, when you interact with these people on communities, I want to make sure

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that I can measure the fact that the different links I could share, the different resources

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that I could share, that those are helpful. And beyond the fact that people could,

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people could reply, okay, thank you. I'd like to have a measurable, well, metric.

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I think that using a link manager is at least something that I use and that could be also

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really helpful for me to understand. Okay. These resources at Clix, it worked, it was helpful,

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and I posted it and it works. So that's something, that's one thing. Then when you,

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a second thing also is trying to, so, you know, again, when I, when I interact with developers,

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I will produce content, actually. And so the idea is to, the problem is that when you do this in,

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in communities or on socials, it has a short lifespan. So the, the objective is to convert those

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small pieces into kind of a evergreen content or repurpose it somehow. So that's, that's also the,

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the building part number two. So one is tracking with, with a link manager and two is

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trying to, to have a place somewhere. It doesn't mean that I've already published the, the blog post

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or, or, or what, but at least I have a place where I store all the different interactions that,

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and all different content that I created. And once, once a week, once a month, you know,

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I go through all these, this piece of content, those, those snippets and try to think, okay,

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is there, are there any links between all of them, something that I could reuse in

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a more evergreen content? And so basically this is, this is the, again, is there's no secret

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source here. Those are at least the, the small methods that I'm trying as much as possible to do

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in order to, to value that, that work that's giving. So, so yeah, one is tracking the,

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the, the, the different resources that I could share and two is making sure that every piece of

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content, because it, it has a very small, I like stand trying to, to, to store it somewhere,

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somehow and making sure that I could be used later on in more evergreen content.

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I love that. Honestly, like, I don't think that anyone really has a secret sauce. Like,

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I think as it relates to sort of this work, right, it's like, there's a lot of vibes,

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which is really not great, you know, when it comes to sort of reporting some of this,

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especially if you're in sort of a developer advocate type of a role, right? I think there are

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a variety of different ways to actually start to track it. But when we're talking early stage,

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and we're talking dev tools, and really the spaces that you and I are, are driving growth,

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right? It's very early, and we're really trying to expand, I shouldn't say it's always early,

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you know, you're definitely in different stages and such. But when you're in that stage of trying

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to create that, that early audience, right, it really is a lot of, okay, what am I putting out

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there? What am I getting back? How can I take what I'm getting back and like, just sort of funnel

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that through understanding are there trends? Are there end results? Does it lead to feedback?

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If this piece of content landed, like you said, right, sort of those vanity metrics, but vanity

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metrics that still very much feed into insights, it's like, how many views did I have on that

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piece of content? Because like even my live stream, right, I can go back and be like, wow, okay,

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that piece of content, like that guest that came on was like really, really, really fire, right?

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And not that they're not all fire, but you know, comparing one to another, and being able to sort

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of see those different statistics back and forth. And that gives you sort of that, that sentiment

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of like, okay, I should keep going down that path or keep having that conversation or keep

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sharing that piece of content. So it is, it's a really interesting sort of game there. The thing

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that I've really been trying to dive into the most is like figuring out with a developer engagement,

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right, as developers are engaging with each other. Because honestly, like, the thing that has become

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the most clear to me throughout sort of my developer relations and kind of developer growth type of a

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career is that like developers opt into wanting to use something, be a, because that advocate that

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you talked about was like, Oh my gosh, I love this product or tool. And the dev is like, wait, what?

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Why do you love it? Tell me about it. Like, I want to know why you think it's great, because we really

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very much trust the recommendations of our peers going back to the entire conversation that we've

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had, right, the essence of the internet. But then from the other side, there's this opportunity to

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like spark a conversation around that pain point. And that's actually what I've been kind of double

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down doubling down on throughout my business is like, can I find these use cases for a product

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within that use case, there are pain points that come with that, right? And so, like, let's say

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for like one of my clients is ArcJet, which is a really cool and I'm just gonna drop it because

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I'm like, y'all should check it out. It's for modern JS stacks. And it's very much about a security,

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but it's for developers. And so it's about putting those those bits and pieces in there that are

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going to ensure you don't have the security issues to begin with. It's like security in that that

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actual code. So one of the use cases that we started to work around was actually an AI endpoint

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abuse, right? So if someone is coming in, you've created an AI agent, you're kind of opening up

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your new AI product, right? And the whole world could come in, obviously, that's not going to

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happen right away. But you don't know, right? A bunch of people can come in and maybe they're not

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valid users, and they're hitting that endpoint, and they're starting to actually hike up that

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infrastructure costs, they're hiking up anything that you have for your actual costs behind the

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scenes. And so I've started to pivot to, can I find conversations that are around this pain

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point, like spam abuse or like form abuse, someone just tweeted about form abuse. And I was like,

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Hey, you should check out Arcjet. And I actually think that that has has landed to be the most

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lucrative path to trying to deliver that content. But still, like, how do you track that, right?

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You're in a conversation, you're in this piece of engagement. And really, like at the end of the

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day, we're, we're still just trying to have these meaningful conversations inside of community. And

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it's, like you said, it's a it's a long game. So anyways, I don't know where I was going with that,

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but I thought that you'd, you'd have some opinions and thoughts on that, because I think it's,

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it's, it's been an interesting angle for sure. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah.

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Okay, so we are nearing our time. The question that I like to ask at the end, and, you know, we got

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pretty deep into some really fun work that I don't always get to talk about. But I like to ask

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developers or guess how they solve their problems, right? Like we have a variety of different things

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that we do when we get stuck on something, whether we're writing code, whether we're planning it,

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whether we're whatever it is that we're doing. And everyone sort of has a different answer. So I

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would love to hear when you're stuck on something, technically, what is your path to get unstuck?

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Honestly, right now, I'm really excited by the, the new wave of AI products. And so basically,

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the moment I'm stuck into something, I'm just trying to find if there's, there's an AI way to

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yeah, to help me solve this. And again, it's trying to, it's probably not the most

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um, another way to solve it, but at least, you know, it helps me go fast. And it helps me

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quickly identify what, what could go possibly go wrong. And, and at least with that first insight,

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then I could start digging a lot more into, into the code to trying to understand what could

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possibly be wrong and, and how it could solve the problem. Yeah, I love that. I hear that answer

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a lot, honestly. And I think it's, it's good though, because I think it allows and sort of

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expands the understanding for all of us, but we all are kind of using AI in some way, shape, or form

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to really help us get unstuck. So when you do that, what are sort of your tools of choice? Or

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are there different tools that you use for different reasons?

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Well, nothing, nothing very, no magic here. Honestly, I'm a big user of Raycast. And I'm a,

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I'm a pro user. And what's really interesting is that you can play around with different models.

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And, and so I really like it. And then I'm a Zed user. So that's my type of, of code editor.

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And so I rely on this. So most of the time I have my, my dual screen setup was one side,

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my code editor, and the other side, a, may I chat with, with Raycast and I'm, I'm mixing between

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those two in order to, well, yeah, trying to, to, to solve the different provenance that I could have.

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00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:16,080
I love that. What's your IDE of choice?

371
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:25,680
That's, that's honestly Zed works great. And I, you know, I, I experimented with,

372
00:41:26,720 --> 00:41:31,040
well, I have a long experience with this code, I experimented with cursor.

373
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But I also enjoy beautifully crafted products. So when I'm, when I build my stack, I also,

374
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I pick a product that's helped me do my stuff. But I'm also trying to find a product that's

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inspired you inspire me doing and building better products too. And so personally, I'm quite happy

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with Zed. I love the, the, the polished interface and, and yeah.

377
00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:20,160
Well, that is good to know. I have never heard of Zed. So apparently I'm like under a rock when

378
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:24,800
it comes to Zed. So I'm going to have to check that out. But see, like a developer, right? I'm like,

379
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:29,120
okay, I got to go check out Raycast. I know what Raycast is, but I need to go think about Raycast

380
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:33,360
more and what is Zed, right? So like this conversation alone is like, left me to think

381
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:37,200
about it. And I think that's why I like to ask this question at the end is like, either we're

382
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:41,680
learning some tips or tricks about how developers are asking their peers or finding different

383
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:46,320
techniques. One person was like, Oh yeah, I talked to Claude like audibly while I'm on a walk. And

384
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I'm like, how smart is that? And like, he has Claude sort of interview him so that he can get

385
00:42:50,640 --> 00:42:55,520
some results at the end of it, right? Or it's like the AI tool answer, which I think is always

386
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:59,840
really beautiful too. We're, we're definitely finding and evolving and how we're like solving

387
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:04,080
our problems. And I think it's, it's just always interesting to hear how other people are doing

388
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:09,840
the same. This has been a lovely conversation. Our pre conversation was great. It's always great

389
00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:14,720
to chat with you. I'm excited about things that we get to partner. Yeah, things we get to partner

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00:43:14,720 --> 00:43:18,880
on throughout the rest of the year. So if anyone is listening and they need DevTool growth, you've

391
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:26,400
got the two, two of many amazing developer growth people in one single place. So on that note,

392
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:32,720
where can folks find you if they want to find you and reach out to you? So probably the easiest

393
00:43:32,720 --> 00:43:40,160
way would be to, to reach out on, um, either LinkedIn or Twitter X and, uh, and also you could

394
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:46,000
join, uh, you could join my community. It's a, it's a slight group, uh, nice people. So still

395
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:53,280
2000 people, but still, still quite, um, small and, uh, and very friendly. Uh, so it's marketing

396
00:43:53,280 --> 00:44:01,920
to dev, um, join anytime and, uh, and say hi. Yes, you should. It's an absolutely amazing community.

397
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:07,360
I am in there not as active as I probably should be, but definitely an amazing community. Um, and

398
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:16,400
also launch week.dev. Go check that out. Yeah. Yes. I love it. Okay. Well, this has been such a

399
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:23,440
fabulous conversation. Um, I hope that folks reach out to you. You are an amazing human. Um, and I

400
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:29,040
hope that everyone has, uh, I hope that everyone has a fabulous rest of their new year, but also day.

401
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:33,520
Absolutely. Enjoy your day and thank you so much for the conversation.

402
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:38,400
This, uh, of course, absolutely.