What is your gut doing and what role does that
play? And that obsession took form in the world
of poop. Because for me, I really like connecting
with other humans and poop was just such a beautiful
conversation starter. Well, Sarah, I'm so excited
to have you on our podcast. You and I go back.
well over a decade, actually. And when we thought
about today's topic, which is all about the gut
digestion, I couldn't have thought of a better
person than you to be on our podcast. So well,
welcome to Hum's podcast. Really nice to see
you again. Where are you right now, by the way?
I'm right outside of Philadelphia and we just
got a house, which is very exciting. So we're
in the process of making some improvements there
because she needs a little love this house. And
yeah, just closer to my family. I love that.
Well, so Sarah is no stranger to the world of
wellness. She's a registered dietician, a holistic
health practitioner, and she has an obsession
about the guts that made her one of the top,
you know, brains within the space. She really
knows when it comes to addressing gut health
issues, what to do and through a lot of like
personal experience. And maybe we'll start there
a little bit. It's like, you know, how you got
really interested with, you know, to gut health
and like what really introduced you to this world,
which is always evolving very fast. And there
I have my latest obsession. I'll talk about that
in a second, but I'm really curious, like, tell
me a little bit about how you got into the world
of gut health. So for me, it was always a part
of my world. I come from a Jewish background.
And I feel like within that community, we're
always talking about hooping and farting and
constipation. At least that was the household
that I grew up in. And my family had digestive
issues. So it was kind of normalized. And there
was also this obsession with food. So I think
between the two of those pieces, I was kind of
like, I had no other path to go on other than
becoming a dietitian because I really wanted
to understand what happens to your body when
you're eating and then ultimately what is your
gut doing and what role does that play? And that
obsession kind of took form in the world of poop
because for me, I really like connecting with
other humans and poop was just such a beautiful...
conversation starter, because we all do it and
it creates this like, human bond, because it's
just a point of connection. So from this obsession
and deeper education within the gut and the gut
microbiome, my segue into that and the way I've
really educated and connected with people has
been through poop. So it's been a magical, wild
ride. And yeah, it's been really fun. I still
remember those days when you came to the office
and you had a poop emoji mug that was, it's still
in the office, by the way, we capped it. We think
about your poop journey on a daily basis here
in the office. So I really love that. And I think
that's our connection as well. Like I got into
this industry through gut help that ultimately
fixed my skin health. Like I was struggling with
acne well into my thirties and then changing
my diet and changing my supplement routine really
helped me fix my skin from the inside out and
that's really when my interest peaked when it
came to gut health. So then that's how we connected
years ago and then we worked together for a few
years and you know now you're in Philadelphia
and sounds like you're having a great time there
as well. But let's talk about poop a little bit
and let's talk a little bit out like you know
what you're really excited about these days.
Like I have this obsession with fiber at the
moment for so many reasons. There are, and I
want to dive into this with you a little bit
more, like your thoughts in general, but like
purely like fiber is something we don't get enough.
And most of us now have died. I think that's
already like a common thread right there, but
it's so powerful because it can help you fix
your regularity, but it can also... People with
IBS can benefit from a fiber intake as well.
There are studies that show certain kinds of
prebiotic fibers raise your GLP -1 levels, which
is a really hot topic within the wellness space
right now. But let's go into the fiber space.
And I just want to get your take on it and the
different kinds of fibers and all that. And let's
start maybe with a stat where it's like, I don't
know what the exact number is, but it sounds
like more than 80%. Some studies say 95 % of
Americans do not get enough fiber. So let's start
with the basics, really. What is fiber and why
do we need it so badly and why don't we get enough
of it? Yeah. So fiber is a very hot, sexy topic
for dieticians. Before I get into the stats,
I just, I was remembering being at Fincy, which
is this big dietetics conference and fiber was
like the hot ticket item and everything had fiber.
And so you were taking all, I was taking all
these samples and I was eating all this food
and it was just loaded with fiber. So I definitely
exceeded my fiber limits for the day. And it
was quite. Quite an experience. But typically
most people don't get enough fiber, which is
why I think there was this focus on how do we
put fiber into more foods. And fiber essentially
is a non -digestible carbohydrate. So your body
isn't actually breaking it down to use it for
energy or to use it for anything nutrient -wise.
It's really fueling your microbiome or it's helping
create bulk and just... weight in your stool
to help move it through. So you have two kinds.
You have insoluble and soluble. And those are
the predominant types. The insoluble is that
bulk forming fiber. And I always think of it
as like this sweeping and clearing out. Like
it just helps poop move along through digestive
tract. Whereas the soluble fiber helps pull water
in and creates more of like a gel -like texture
and consistency. And it also helps things move
out. But then there's More complexities within
soluble fiber that impact the microbiome in a
really cool way So well, let's let's dive right
into this one in a really cool way. What do you
mean? So we don't our bodies don't use fiber
But our gut bacteria use fiber and our gut bacteria
when you look at it from a genetic perspective
There's more bacterial DNA in our bodies then
there is human DNA. So that always makes me think
like who's really running the show and bacteria
make neurotransmitters, which impact our mood.
So they're really integral to our overall health
and function and just how we move through the
world. And that's what the soluble fiber does
is it's fuel for bacteria and they ferment it
and they create neurotransmitters. They create
short chain fatty acids. They create compounds
that are protective influence and make things
like GLP -1, which we'll talk about. So they're
really, it's really incredible. And it's this
really beautiful relationship of human and bacteria.
Okay, interesting. And prebiotic fiber, where
would that fall? Because I hear that term being
thrown out, you know, thrown out like a lot basically
here all over social media and all that. What
is prebiotic fiber? Yeah, prebiotic fiber is
essentially anything that's going to fall into
that soluble fiber category that's going to feed
bacteria. The insoluble fiber doesn't feed bacteria,
but soluble fiber or like resistant starch is
a big one. It's basically any carbohydrate that
feeds a bacteria. Okay. And that's really where
we see the biggest benefits, I would say, right?
Like in terms of like, um, I mean, it depends
on what you're looking for, but looking after
that gut microbiome is so critical and feeding
the right bacteria, of course, is really critical
as well because they could. good bacteria and
bad bacteria, as we know. But tell me a little
bit more about the different kinds of concerns
that you would address with fiber. I'm just curious
because there's obviously, there's heart health,
there's digestive health, there's regularity.
And maybe just walk me through that a little
bit, how we should think about the different
kinds of fibers and how these different kinds
of fibers can really improve our day to day.
Yeah, I mean, there's so many different benefits.
And I think the first step, the most foundational
piece is how do you get it into your body? Do
you get enough? Because like you said in the
very beginning, Most people aren't getting the
recommended 25 to 38 grams of fiber that you
need in a day. And fiber creates that sense of
satiety, creates a fullness. It feeds our gut
microbiome. So it's really, really crucial. And
most people don't get it. So that's like, first
and foremost is thinking about how can you incorporate
it easily into your diet and getting lots of
variety because it has so many beneficial health
impacts. Like it's just... I don't even think
we know every single thing that it touches in
the body. It's just so crucial. We really don't
know. But we do know it does definitely work.
I mean, I can tell. It works and we don't get
enough. We don't get enough. But if you get a
lot of it, you can feel that too, for sure. So
there's definitely. Yeah. And I see people in
two camps. So I focus primarily on people with
digestive issues. And so when you are told to
eat a lot of fiber, and you have an altered gut
composition or you have an imbalance in your
gut or digestive weakness, whatever it's presenting
as, it's actually hard to get adequate fiber
because it makes you so bloated and then it can
create diarrhea or constipation. So when you
start to get into the nuanced pieces of digestive
issues, fiber is a really big topic because it's
hard to increase it when it's actively causing
you pain. Tell me somebody who is like Looking
for help with regularity because that's often
like a benefit that people really seek when it
comes to fiber consumption What kind of fiber
helps and how much fiber do you recommend? So
I always go back to Basics and look at how many
fruits and vegetables are you eating because
that's really one of the best places to start
and with regularity if it's constipation, you
want to think more about things that are like
pulling water into your gut, the soluble type
fibers. Ground flax is a great one. Pectins are
great. Gums like guar gum, acacia, those are
really beneficial to the overall gut. So thinking
about how we can incorporate those things. And
then again, just simplifying it, right? I have
a tendency to go really far down the science
rabbit hole and be like, oh, well, here's a study
that shows this. And really, if we can just kind
of take a step back and say, okay, are you eating
three to five cups of vegetables a day? Who can
say yes to that? I don't even think I can say
yes to that. So it's like, there's my first,
I personally have the aspiration. And I said,
I would love to say yes to that. But of course,
and I do the math at the end of the day is like,
oh, yeah, well, almost there, but I think more
work to be done, right? Yeah. So it's like just
creating simple, achievable goals. Cause the
world of health and wellness can get so complicated
that it's like, let's get it down to basics.
Like, can you just incorporate one more vegetable
into your diet and start there and see how that
impacts regularity. Water obviously is another
big one that's going to help move things along.
If you have fiber, like pulling water out of
the gut, you got to make sure you have water
in your system. So That's really important. And
if you're on the other end of the spectrum with
diarrhea, things like the good old brat diet,
which is what we used in the hospital and it
worked fantastic, is bananas, rice, applesauce,
toast. So that's always like my tried and true
just to like find things up while you're figuring
out what's going on. Well, I always find like
when you suffer from diarrhea, like a probiotic
does wonders. I mean, it's like, like it really
works so fast and like adding a probiotic into
the mix makes a big difference. But that's a
topic for another conversation where we only
have a few minutes. Like, so I don't want to
like pick your brains. I'm just always like,
whatever I sit down with you, I could spend hours
just chatting through and what's happening in
the world of health and wellness. Let's talk
about the latest. development within fiber, which
got me really excited and interested. And that
is like the ability to raise your GLP -1 levels
naturally, right? And just to be very clear,
of course, we can't compare fiber to a GLP -1
agonist like, you know, semaglutide, all that.
We just want to be very clear about this because
it is, when it comes to potency, obviously not
as strong. However, For people who have lost
a lot of weight, for example, who want to maintain
that healthy weight and are looking for natural
ways of raising their GLP -1 levels, fiber is
actually a really, really interesting hack. And
there are certain kinds of fibers. That's how
I really got really excited about the potential
of fiber, you know, about a year and a half ago
when we started working on our latest innovation.
Tell me a little bit more about that correlation
between GLP -1 levels and fiber and, you know,
what role GLP -1 plays in our system and when
it comes to satiety, etc. Yeah, so whenever I
think about GLP -1, it's primarily made in the
small intestines and L cells. So if you think
about the overall integrity and health of your
gut and GLP -1 production, they're hand in hand.
So we have to look at how are we optimizing the
health? of the gut, especially things like leaky
gut or permeability, that's going to decrease
your ability to make GLP -1. So when we put fiber
into the mix and we have certain fibers that
are feeding certain bacterias that are promoting
GLP -1 production or promoting the integrity
of the gut lining, it's a win -win. So fiber
is a critical part of just maintaining that overall
gut diversity. feeding those bacteria and giving
them what they need so that the system is functioning
really well. So that's kind of how I think about
it, where it's like fiber is always going to
be, like we said, a foundational pillar, making
sure we get it. And when we isolate it and when
we use it in a supplemental form, I'm actually
a big fan of that as well, because then you can
dose it and you can... kind of increase your
tolerance. Whereas sometimes with foods, there's
so much complexity and there's so much going
on that starting with something that's a little
bit more stripped down and targeted is actually
really beneficial. And then, I mean, GLP -1 has
so many functions in the body. It's wild when
you look at every single part that it touches
within like the function of the body. Yeah, well,
tell me about the other functions for a second,
because obviously everybody, and I was shocked
personally, you would go on the street, we're
just up the road here from Hollywood, and like,
you would go on the street and ask people on
the street, like, what is GLP -1? And people
actually know what it is. It is quite fascinating.
So at this point, I mean, there's an awareness
around it, which is truly mind blowing, but tell
me a little bit, and everybody thinks about it.
probably more on weight management, but what
are the other applications where you see a potential
benefit of GLP -1 in the body? So what I think
is super interesting is its role in neuroplasticity
and also its role in the gut. and inflammation
regulation. So there's a lot of people that I
see that have like mast cell activation or histamine
issues. And there's some preliminary research
to show that GLP -1 can have an impact on it.
It can also impact bone density. So it's like
when you look at it, it's like liver metabolism.
And it's obviously, like you said, weight loss
and carbohydrate metabolism and insulin sensitivity.
And then with weight loss as well, decreasing
gastric motility and just decreasing those hunger
and satiety cues. So it's really, really fascinating
for me. I'm like, the thing that always blows
my mind is when we start to look at brain health
and how one is actually made in the brain as
well. So you have it made in the L cells in your
small intestines, but it's also made in macro
glial cells in your brain, which is like your
brain's immune system. And that's kind of, I
would say that's more new knowledge and new research
just with this microglial activation and how
it relates to like Alzheimer's, which there,
you know, some people will categorize it as like
type three diabetes. So it's just interesting
to see how pervasive it is in all functions of
the body. And I think this is a really nice segue
into controlling blood sugar levels as well,
right? I mean, there's definitely like a role
here for fiber to play. Can you walk me through
that, you know, just sort of for those who probably
don't know so much about this side of fiber and
how it can help with blood sugar? Yeah, so I
always think of fiber as something that kind
of slows down digestion, not in a not in a bad
way, but it just kind of keeps everything in
the gut so that it can be broken down and we
don't get these massive spikes in blood sugar.
Because like if you were to eat something like
a pixie stick, which is pure sugar, it's just
going to automatically absorb. But if you mixed
a pixie stick with fiber, it would slow down
that absorption. It would still be pretty fast,
but it just gives you more a slower release of
sugar into the body. And is this why it's often
recommended if you want to seek those satiety
benefits, those, you know, improving those blood
sugar levels to actually take fiber with a meal
instead of like just taking on its own? Is that
the reason? Because the two together create that
magic, if you will? Yeah, it's that and it's
also that bulking effect. So if you're either
is this trendy diet It's not trendy. It's really
cool. It's called volume metrics. And it was
looking at the volume of something like if you're
eating a whole plate of vegetables, it's going
to keep you full. But the calorie amount is very
low, whereas if you're eating a whole plate of
donuts, the calorie amount is very, very high.
And it might keep you full, but you have like
just more capacity and bulk within your body.
So you're not as hungry. I would definitely have
to dive into that topic another time. I'm really
interested in the volume diet. It sounds fascinating.
And I mean, look, I think the bottom line is
there's so many, there's so many benefits to
taking fiber and a lot of people just want to
know, you know, what's the best form and what's
the right amount. And we covered all of this.
And I think your advice of wanting to keep it
simple and then looking at someone's diet as
you know we are big proponents here of like start
with a healthy diet and then build around your
personal experience and like how you eat and
then you can always optimize it because to your
point like it's really hard sometimes to get
those three servings of vegetables and fruit
per day and Um, there's even debate whether that
is enough, right? So, um, I think just like,
there's always good ways of optimizing your diet.
And I really like this, you know, general concept
of like, you know, try to add another fruit and
maybe then add the fiber on top, if you will.
And I think the other takeaway that I have is
like, there are just so many benefits to fiber
and the science is really evolving. Are there
any signs of people, um, not getting enough fiber?
Like when they don't like, what are the things
to watch out for? when it comes to fiber intake.
So I would say one of the main things that I
see or that alerts me to maybe not enough fiber
intake is constipation. And there's a large amount
of people that do struggle with constipation.
So that's kind of my first clue. Sometimes high
cholesterol can also be another indicator that
there's not enough fiber because fiber will bind
to cholesterol and help you move it through the
body. Diarrhea sometimes can indicate, but I
would say the two main things where I'm like,
are they getting enough fiber is constipation
and high cholesterol, just kind of basic ones.
taking religiously our new fiber supplement.
I want to see what that does to my cholesterol
levels, actually. So I'll report back there.
I'll keep you posted. And do you see a difference
since you work with so many different clients
and patients, do you see a difference between
men and women, what their needs are in terms
of like how much fiber and, you know, are there
any other differences we should be aware of?
Well, typically men have higher needs just when
we look at things like RDAs for vitamins, like
men are going to skew a little bit higher. I
primarily work with women because women are predominantly
the ones that have IBS and digestive issues,
not I mean, men still have them, but it's more
likely a woman issue. It's very interesting.
And I've been looking into this. I'm like, why
do women present with these imbalances more frequently?
And women tend to have longer colons, like slightly
longer. So there's just more happening, more
transit time. And then I think there's also this
is like I don't want to open a can of worms here,
but there's emotional sensations. And when you
are emotional, when you are feeling different
things, it impacts your gut in a big way. And
that's like, again, a whole other topic with
neurotransmitters and stress and the nervous
system. But I've seen those correlations. Okay.
And you mentioned IBS specifically and, you know,
how would you recommend people manage that, you
know, is there any sort of like diets you recommend,
like for example, low FODMAP. That's something,
you know, that I heard of a lot. But what are
your recommendations for those people specifically
dealing with IBS and whether fiber can really
help you? So IBS is like Kind of I see it as
like this generalized term for digestive issues
that we can't understand or explain or fix This
is kind of like because people come to me all
the time with IBS and they're confused and they're
overwhelmed and they're the ones that are like
I did all the things and nothing worked or I
tried You know to increase my fiber and it made
me feel horrible so there's not a Blanket for
me. There's not like a blanket statement when
it comes to IBS because even with low FODMAP
I see a lot of people recommend low FODMAP, and
that's good for decreasing symptoms, but long
-term, it can disrupt the microbiome. So that's
a big, it's so hard to say because there's different
variations of IBS. It's complex. I think the
best thing that I can say, and this is a little
bit outside, like, This is more like energetic
and nervous system regulation, but I think really
tapping into your body and Feeling into like
how are you managing stress and it goes beyond
that into like really nervous system regulation
but getting clear on that and just like Slowing
down and being like, oh do I ever am I ever in
my body? That's like a really good question to
start with and then from there you can kind of
start to unpack things The mind really powerful
I'm so with you. It really has an impact when
you do get nervous. I mean, you suddenly could
feel an urge to run to the bathroom, you know,
or like, you know, stress does so much. And I
think, you know, it was like, this is like two
weeks ago, I saw my mum, I haven't seen her for
a long time, we did a little pilgrimage in northern
Greece, but like, I just saw all the Greeks smoking
away, like, but they're all like, 10 years older
than everybody else and nobody knows why. And
I was just like, okay, where's this coming from?
And it's just their social life, I believe. And
the stress levels tend to be so much lower. And
I think, you know, this topic of longevity, which
is not something we're discussing today, but
generally speaking, stress is just something
that really needs to be talked about more because
it has such a general impact. And we try to always
layer on on top the symptoms of stress. but never
deal with like actually the root cause of it,
right? And I think that's a big, big topic. And
I'm glad you brought it up because we always
try to like, you know, paint over the problem
as opposed to saying, hey, where's really the
starting point here? Is it your diet? Is it your
lifestyle? What are, you know, what are these
inputs? And then, you know, let's look at the
inputs first before we deal with the outputs,
if you will, right? Yeah. Yeah. And I think even
the word stress has been kind of generalized
because it's like, what does that mean? It's
like, oh, I'm supposed to breathe or I'm supposed
to meditate. And it's like, when you unpack it,
it's really, really deep. And it is somatic,
it's in your body. So it's a fascinating area
of exploration and it's something, you know,
I've done so much testing and so much physical
deep dives into people and it comes down to what
stories are you telling yourselves? How do you
feel? And also the physical symptoms, but really
like those stories are so critical. They are
so powerful. Well, we're almost done here. A
few more things I want to get through with you.
And the first one is like we have a segment called
Well Yes and Well No. And I don't know if you're
prepared for this segment, but basically I'm
just curious, you know, what's your Well Yes
or your Well No? So we have fermented foods for
gut health. Is that a Well Yes or Well No? It's
so hard for me to be black and white. It's a
well, yes, with the caveat that if you can't
tolerate it, there could be deeper underlying
digestive issues. So it's a good way to see if
you can tolerate it, great. Eventually we want
everyone to have that in their diet. Also, we
need a new category here called well maybe or
something like that. Well gray. Well gray. Okay,
here we go. I love it. How about gluten -free
diets for everyone? I love this topic so much,
the gluten -free piece. I know this is going
to trigger you, so I thought I had to have this
one in here. Okay, well, great. But it's fascinating.
I wanted to mention gluten in the context of
GLP -1 because it's super interesting. So a gluten
-free diet is not healthy. It's not like a blanket.
Everyone should do it. Obviously, if you have
sensitivities to it, if you have celiac disease,
yes. But there are benefits to eating gluten
specifically correlated to GLP -1. So like, it's
a well gray. Well, maybe. Well, OK. I feel like
these are like even just chatting with you today.
I want to do like five more opposites on this.
Like I can't say yes or no. As a dietitian, we're
just not like anything. Let's, let's, let's conclude
this with a rapid fire here. And basically what
I would love you to do is like, um, you know,
we'll have a few items for gut health and would
like you to rate them on a scale from zero to
10. If it's, you know, if it's good 10, and if
it's not so good, maybe a five and like, if it's
really does nothing a zero. Um, let's start with
berries. 10. Full fat yogurt. Seven. Bread. Five.
Kale. Eight. Alcohol. Like in what amount? We'll
give it a four. Sugar. Four. Meat. Eight. Stress.
Zero. Weightlifting. Ten. And meditation? Ten.
Cool. That was, you know, our rapid fire. And
this is really a wrap on today's episode, which
was all about gut health and gut talk. Sarah,
it was really nice to see you. We'll definitely
chat more in the future. We have a few more topics
to cover actually. So even having this moment
with you was a real delight. It was really nice
to catch up. And everyone who's listening to
this, if you love today's episode, please make
sure you subscribe to our channel so you don't
miss any future conversations, whether it's about
gut health or GLP -1. And please also check out
Sarah's platform on Instagram. It's called Fearless
Fig. There's some really incredible content.
I've been following you for years and have learned
so much. And as always, it has been a real pleasure
to have you. Amazing. Thank you for having me.
This was so great to catch up and to see you
and to talk poop. Cheers.