That nighttime attack when the bear attacks the
camp. It's like what we love in King Kong Lives.
It's a quintessential. Everything goes bananas
at once. Cars explode. There's bodies on fire.
It's just pandemonium. Yeah. Totally ridiculous.
Yeah. Hello and welcome to Camp Kaiju Monster
Movie Podcast. We're your hosts, Matt Levine
and Vincent Hannum. And we are talking about
all our favorite monster movies, the good, the
bad, and the downright campy, and asking if they
stand the test of time. Traditional kaiju, creature
features, space invaders, the supernatural, and
everything in between. All strange beasts welcome
here. Camp Kaiju is sponsored by Zack Linder
and the Zack Pack, powered by Coldwell Banker
Realty. your source for real estate, home rehab,
fixing and flipping for investor clients, and
residential buyers. Reach out to the Zach Pack
today for real estate services, follow the Zach
Pack on social media, and contact the Zach Pack
for investment opportunities. Link in the show
notes. This paper company, the Pitney Mills Paper
Company, bought the timber rights to 100 ,000
acres of forest in Maine. The Indians claim the
land is theirs. I'm a doctor. And you know how
to deal with human beings. The Indians are angry,
and so is the lumber company. Everybody's ready
to kill each other. People start disappearing.
The Indians spread the word that they were taken
by Katahdin. That's one of their legends. I'm
here to study the environment. My people are
violently ill. And this has nothing to do with
alcohol. My people are fishermen. Their lives
are clean. I've seen children born dead. Born
and born. The end of this forest is the end of
my people. Is that from Mercury? It was created
by man. And it will mindlessly, mercilessly kill
every living thing it meets. Vincent, it's good
to be here with you. How are you doing? I'm good.
Actually, I had the day off of school today.
On September 23rd is Rosh Hashanah and Minneapolis
Public Schools gives the day off. So it's like
a random four day week for me, but that's okay.
I went to the zoo with my kid. What a beautiful
day for it too. It was kind of like cool, like
in between summer, fall weather, you know, that's
great. I'm glad you had a chance to do that.
Yeah. She is obsessed with gorillas and I think
it's just so coincidental. So are we King Kong
Congo that we spent a lot of time with the gorillas
and they were funny. It's like early, we went
early in the morning and they were like, just
derping around. Still trying to wake up in the
morning, drinking their coffee, you know? Yeah.
That's awesome. I love that. That Ada, you know,
I think she's sort of like sensing your King
Kong. Like we just talked about King Kong lives
in the last episode. So I feel like she knows
that she's trying to pay homage a little bit.
Yeah, I'll get her there. Right. How are you
doing? Good, good. Yeah, I had a job interview
today. It's kind of a crazy time to be applying
to jobs right now, but yeah, applied to a job
today. I'm excited that, you know, right now
as we're recording this episode, it's late September,
but when this episode comes out, it'll be October,
best time of the year. So horror movie marathons
will be taking place for the next three or four
weeks. I can't wait. Yeah. So... A lot of stuff
playing at the Trilon Cinema in Minneapolis throughout
the month of October. Maybe there's a conflict
of interest here because I also volunteer for
the Trilon. I feel like I should say that. But
it's a great theater. And throughout the month
of October, like after October 4th, when this
episode will premiere, they'll be playing movies
like Koroneko, a really great Japanese horror
movie. Scream, Blackula, Scream, which I haven't
seen, but very excited for that. That's a sequel
to Blackula. Indeed, yeah. Which, and I've actually
never seen Blackula either, but this is a good
reminder that I should do that at some point.
Ditto. Yeah. So I'm excited about that. Rosemary's
Baby, my favorite horror movie of all time, is
playing at the Trilon. And then one more movie
that I want to shout out at the Heights Cinema
in Minneapolis. Another of my favorite theaters,
The War of the Worlds from 1953 is playing there
on October 16th. So those are just a couple titles.
I'm sure there are some other ones that are playing
in the Twin Cities as well. Or you listeners
out there, wherever you live, I'm sure there
are great horror movies playing. So check them
out. Honestly, now's the time, folks. I think
even big mainstream theaters are getting into
it. are discovering that like bringing back classics
and especially horror films for special showings
makes them money so yeah i don't know if there's
an alamo draft house near you all they always
do special events but just just do a quick search
support your theaters because they probably have
some special events going on for october totally
yeah and that's it's a good Like you said, good
reminder, go out to your local neighborhood movie
theater, whatever it is, because now is the time
to get back into theaters. Let's keep movie going
alive, you know? Yeah. Cool. Well, thank all
of you for hanging out, friends. Please rate
and review Camp Kaiju wherever you listen. You
can also send us listener comments at campkaiju
at gmail .com or on our Instagram page at camp
underscore kaiju underscore podcast. If you'd
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You can become a patron at patreon .com slash
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and access to any live events. As always, we
want to shout out our current patrons. Thank
you so much to Jason, Beast Drool, Chris B.,
Sean, our anonymous patron, and Peggy. We appreciate
you so much. Thank you again. Thank you so much.
Coming up on Camp Kaiju, next we're going back
to the silent era with Lon Chaney's Phantom of
the Opera. Right now, we have slated to join
us movie critic Paul McGuire Grimes. Follow him.
You'll get to know him on the listeners. You'll
get to know him on the Phantom episode. But he's
a great dude, knows his stuff. So we're looking
forward to diving into some movie history, some
classic, classic horror movie material there.
Matt. Yeah. I bought, I pre -ordered. He Who
Gets Slapped. Oh, you haven't seen it yet, though.
Or have you? I have seen it once before. Okay.
But Flickr Alley. Are you familiar with Flickr
Alley? Yeah, yep. Great company. Yeah. Yeah,
they just released this edition of He Who Gets
Slapped. And it's gorgeous casing and slipcover.
Yeah. It's got audio commentary, some other silent
shorts from the era. Ooh. I think a silent cartoon.
Yeah, I'm in love with this. I can't wait to
watch it. I love that movie. It's fantastic.
It's one of the earliest examples of like scary
clowns in movies, even though scary is not quite
the right word. It's more about just a man who
is like humiliated and like beaten down by life
and like the toll that it takes on him. You know,
it's a brutal movie, but it's also like really
entertaining. There are elements of comedy in
it. And that is Lon Chaney, right? If I remember
right. Yeah. He's fantastic in it, of course.
Yeah. Wonderful movie. Yeah. And Victor Seastrom
directed it, who did The Phantom Carriage, which
you introduced me to. Yeah. Love that movie,
too. Yeah. He Who Gets Slapped is brilliant.
Horrific. Funny. Just like you said. Awesome.
I'm a little envious of that Blu -ray. Or is
it a DVD? Oh, it's a Blu -ray. And it's going
to be remastered. I can't wait. It's going to
look so good. So I'm going to do a whole... launch
anything with when i re -watch phantom oh that
reminds me okay listeners this is important so
phantom of the opera the release date is 1925
however this where you know over 100 years things
get a little convoluted so the film was re -released
in 1929 with Some original scenes omitted, some
added. It's a different cut. However, and I'm
just speaking for me, most readily available,
I believe, versions of the film you'll find are
the 1929 version. And if you're like me and you
own, if you own like the Kino Lorber Blu -ray,
it's going to have both versions on there, 25
and 29. The 1929 version is remastered. That's
the one that studios put their energy into. So
it looks really good. It sounds really good.
I have seen the 1925 version. It's not remastered.
It's very poor film stock. It's a little harder
to get through in that regard. So Matt, listeners,
watch whatever version you want, but just know
that going into it. That is good to know. Thank
you for that. I might have to pick up that Blu
-ray before I watch it myself. Yeah, I'm excited
to rewatch it. And you know what? The first time
I watched Phantom of the Opera was on YouTube,
and I believe it was the 29 cut. So I'll put
that link in the show notes for Prophecy. And
listeners, you can just follow that link if you
want a little help finding the version you want
to watch. Nice. Yeah. I'm very glad we're bringing
both Lon Chaney and silent movies to the podcast.
It's a momentous occasion. Oh, we can't. Oh yeah.
We got to find some way to celebrate. Yeah. By
maybe it's a dumb joke. Maybe our episode will
just be us silent the entire time. There'll be
nothing to listen to. It'll be great. It'll be
an hour and a half of music. Just like orchestral
music. Sounds great. That's like that movie,
the Mel Brooks movie, that's like almost all
silent. Is it just called Silent Movie? What's
that called? Yeah. But there's like one line
in the movie. I don't want to ruin the joke.
It's a funny movie. You should check it out if
you haven't seen it. Yeah. It's an ironic joke
at the end. It's pretty good. Love that movie.
We won't actually do that to all you listeners
out there, though. Just the Patreons. Yeah, exactly.
The special silent episode of Camp Kaiju. Man,
so much good stuff coming up. It's great. Good
time to be a movie lover wherever you are. Fun
stuff, for sure. Oh, yeah. Speaking of which,
so this episode is going to come out October
4th. So many great classic horror and monster
movies came out around this time in movie history.
We have a long list here of some movies that
came out around this time. Do any titles on this
list jump out at you, Vincent? Yeah, actually.
The Black Scorpion from 1955. Do you know that
one? No, I love the title though. It is right
in the fad of big bug sci -fi pictures, but the
special effects, so the giant scorpions are brought
to life via stop motion from Willis O 'Brien.
So it's a late entry from him. By this point,
Ray Harryhausen had certainly eclipsed him as
like the master of the stop motion. But Willis
O 'Brien, I think, does some really good work
with bringing giant scorpions to life. It's a
classic creature feature that I like to talk
about. That sounds amazing. I definitely need
to watch that. You know, you've turned me on
to like, well, many different kinds of movies
here on the podcast, but like, you know, giant
animal, like especially like ants in the movie
Them and stuff like that and scorpions in this
case. Maybe my favorite new subgenre that you've
kind of opened my eyes to. So thank you for that.
All right. It's an honor. I'm excited to check
that out. I will definitely have to do that.
Which one am I going to call out on this list?
Let's see here. Well, I mean, the first one I
want to mention is The Addiction from 1995, but
only because we're going to be talking about
that later this season on the podcast. So I'm
excited to watch that. It's by Abel Ferrara.
I have not seen that yet. That's a vampire movie.
Maybe I'll just call out The Old Dark House.
I feel like I've mentioned that on the podcast
before. It's by James Whale from 1932, maybe
even earlier than that. But a really great horror
comedy. I feel like it's kind of like a warm
up for Bride of Frankenstein, which is one of
my favorite movies of all time. The Old Dark
House is indeed set in an old dark house. And
it's kind of like a parody a little bit of like
haunted house stories. And it goes in like very
bizarre directions from there. That's a really
great movie. One that I'm due for a rewatch.
I haven't seen that in a long time either. Same.
I think about that movie and that's just an easy
one to watch in October. Perfect, scary. cozy
up under the blankets of some popcorn type of
movie. Totally. Yeah. Cool. I think I just decided
what my October 1st screening is going to be.
The Old Dark House. Love it. I see that you highlighted
Night of the Lepus on here too. Oh, you could
see that? Yep. That's deserving of a shout out
as well. I've never actually seen that though.
Me neither, but I know of it. Folks, it's about
killer rabbits. which is right in line with prophecy.
The 70s, like when I think of 70s horror movies,
I think of eco -terror, nature run amok films.
So that's interesting because Night of the Lepus
comes out in 1972. It's about killer rabbits.
But it's before Jaws, 1975. So like before Jaws,
you have movies like Lepus, you have... Oh, of
course I'm blanking on, on, Oh, like frogs 1971.
I think these are going to be in the tradition
of the birds riding the coattails of, of that
eco horror film. But then post jaws, the genre
like reinvents itself in the mold, like the exact
mold of Spielberg's film. So then you get movies
like Orca, like prophecy, like grizzly, like
piranha. So it's either the birds or Jaws, but
either way, the 70s has all these killer animal
movies, which I love. I love talking about these.
That's a good point. Yeah. There, you know, there's
a difference between pre -Jaws like creature
features and post -Jaws for sure. And that seems
like an obvious thing to say, but it's like so
clear, like where that distinction is, you know?
Yeah. Because afterwards they just, they're like
cookie cutter, beat for beat. remakes of Jaws.
Right. Yeah. With some like, you know, eco -friendly
themes thrown in there. Yeah. Yeah. I'd say,
you know, it wasn't like, this is maybe a little
bit of a tangent, but I feel like the EPA was
formed in the early seventies, right? The Environmental
Protection Agency. So maybe it was just like
on people's minds at that time as well, you know?
Right. Yeah. I think there was something, I mean,
these are all notes I have writing down prophecy
that I think it is, especially in the beginning
of this movie, It hits on the, I think the reform
minded mentality of the seventies. Everyone was
so disgruntled. The government sucked because
of Vietnam and Watergate and the economy was
terrible because there was an oil crisis. And
we have the creation of the EPA of the endangered
species act, like all these things to preserve
the, or to conserve wild areas. And I think Prophecy
is exemplary of that. Yeah, for sure. It's a
weird movie. We'll obviously talk about that
coming up soon here. It has those eco -friendly
themes. It's kind of a character study. It's
obviously a very schlocky monster movie at the
same time. There are themes of encroachment upon
Native American lands and disrespect toward the
Native American peoples. So yeah, lots of, you
know, very 70s era themes going on here. And
some messy... And interesting ways. I'll just
say that for now. I love my movies. Messy, but
interesting. Yeah, I feel like that's what we
usually go for here on Camp Kaiju. Maybe not
always. Killdozer, I don't know if you would
say that's interesting, but maybe it is. I don't
know. I have special animosity toward the movie
Killdozer, and I don't really know why, but sorry.
You know, I always come back to Killdozer as
like my litmus test. You know, is prophecy...
Better than Killdozer. I think it is. In my opinion,
almost everything is better than Killdozer, but
you like that movie more than I did. So let's
dive into Prophecy. A motion picture is coming
that does not cater to fantasy. You will see
nature's most savage man eating animal. By its
size alone, it can overpower and devour any human.
Grizzly. Over 18 feet tall. Over 2 ,000 pounds.
The largest carnivorous brown beast in the world.
As the campers come in here, they leave food
around, the bears get the smell of it, and that's
it. Well, this is different. This bump's eating
his victims. one is fair game because this grizzly
preys on the easiest food of all man 18 feet
of man eating gut crunching terror the deadliest
jaws on land belong to grizzly suppose nature
gave a war and everybody came the snake the bird
The lizards and frogs. And suppose that the polluters,
the species on Earth called man, were the enemy
in that war. I still believe man is master of
the world. And then, suppose that the human race
lost. Sam Elliott, Joan Van Ark, Adam Rourke,
Judy Bates. That night science made its greatest
mistake. What unknown terror was born that night?
What is the terrifying mutant that strikes from
behind the shroud of night? The Leap Us. A night
of total terror. More shattering than your strangest
nightmare. What caused the unnatural death, destruction,
and panic that night of The Leap Us? Janet Leigh.
Stuart Whitman. Rory Calhoun. And Paul Fix. Night
of the Leapus. Kill one and thousands take their
place. What devil creatures growing weight and
size every day are hidden behind the eyes of
horror? What can stop them? Night of the Leapus.
from mgm maybe i'll just talk about a couple
of these crew members here i'll just blaze through
them real fast because they have some interesting
titles on their resumes but like i don't you
know not not a lot to say about them per se but
if you want to add anything about any of these
crew members please feel free vincent okay I
was directed by John Frankenheimer, kind of an
inconsistent director. He made some classics
early in his career, like Birdman of Alcatraz,
Seconds, The Manchurian Candidate, The Train.
And later in the 90s, he made the movie Ronin,
which is pretty good, some of the best car chases
of all time. But Frankenheimer also directed
Reindeer Games and another movie that we've talked
about on the podcast already, The Island of Dr.
Moreau. So hit or miss, and maybe... I don't
know. The early part of his career, maybe a scene
is better than the latter part, but maybe that's
unfair. Well, I'll tell you, this movie is better
made than The Island of Dr. Moreau. Yeah, for
sure. I think I could say that. Yeah, and of
course, The Island of Dr. Moreau had so many
production difficulties that impacted that too,
you know? Yeah. But yes, it's absolutely more
competently made than Dr. Moreau was. A low bar,
perhaps. Prophecy was also written by David Seltzer.
He wrote The Omen pretty shortly before Prophecy,
so he was kind of riding the high of that. He
also wrote some other movies like The Other Side
of the Mountain, Bird on a Wire, My Giant, and
Dragonfly, and wrote and directed the movie Shining
Through, a war movie from the 90s. Some of those
titles may be not considered very highly, like
My Giant, for example. So David Seltzer, maybe
another inconsistent artist working on this movie.
Cinematography on Prophecy is by Harry Stradling
Jr. He shot some well -known movies in the 70s
like Little Big Man, McQ, Rooster Cogburn, and
Convoy, the latter of which was directed by Sam
Peckinpah, but is generally not seen as very
good. Music is by Leonard Rosenman. I was surprised
by some of the great movies Rosenman did the
music for and won some Oscars for them as well,
like East of Eden, Rebel Without a Cause, Barry
Lyndon. several of the Planet of the Apes movies,
and then some weird outliers like RoboCop 2 and
Star Trek 4, The Voyage Home. So these filmographies
are all over the place for these guys. One last
example here, the editing is by Tom Rolfe, another
very accomplished crew member. He edited films
for directors like Martin Scorsese, such as Taxi
Driver and New York, New York. He worked with
Paul Schrader on Blue Collar and Hardcore, Michael
Cimino on the movie Heaven's Gate. Ridley Scott
on the movie Black Rain, and Michael Mann on
the classic action movie Heat. So some pretty
accomplished titles for the crew members in this
list. I'll say. You know, yeah, I'm going to
keep coming back to how I perceive Prophecy to
be rather well made. At least better than I thought.
It's the bear costume notwithstanding this movie.
I can take seriously, actually, because I noticed
the music and I didn't know anything about Leonard
Rosenman, but I thought this music is effectively
underscoring or setting the atmosphere. So I
find that pretty interesting. For sure, yeah.
I feel like I have good and bad things to say
about the formal style of this movie. For me,
generally, I think it works better towards the
beginning. The beginning is really striking,
and I was kind of engaged in the movie right
off the bat. And then there are some things later
on, aside from the bear costume, that maybe don't
work for me very well. But I'll get more into
that later. Okay. Sounds like we're actually
running parallel on this. It sounds like we're
not too diametrically opposed. So far, yeah.
We'll see if that continues to be the case, though.
Yeah, okay. I don't want to, you know, spoil
the lead or whatever right away. Oh, yeah. But
yeah, similarly, I feel like the cast is kind
of a strange hodgepodge in this movie. Do you
want to talk about any of the cast members? Sure.
We have Robert Foxworth as Dr. Bob Verne, who's
a longtime TV and film actor, and he plays our
lead male in Prophecy. Joining him is co -star
and everyone's favorite. star of the Rocky series,
Talia Shire. She plays Maggie Verne, Bob's wife.
She was a member, is a member. She's still with
us. She is a member of the Coppola family, Francis
Ford's sister. I always forget that. I always
forget she's a Coppola. Yeah. Crazy. Big family.
Yeah. And Nick Cage too. Yup. Yup. Giovanni Ribisi,
I think is as well. Some others. Yeah. Crazy.
Well, Talia Shire is here. She was well known
at this point for her appearances in The Godfather
and Rocky. She also appeared in The Dunwich Horror
in 1970 and Old Boyfriends in 1979. She was nominated
for the Academy Awards for Best Supporting Actress
and Best Actress, respectively, for The Godfather
Part 2 and Rocky. Nice. God, I need to revisit
Part 2 of The Godfather. It's been a long time.
Yeah, yeah, for me too. And the Rocky movies.
It's been a very long time for me. But yeah,
I mean, it's the 50th anniversary of the first
Rocky, I think. Or was it 76? It's right around
there anyway. So good time to revisit. I think
it won Best Picture that year over Jaws. Right.
Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Good reminder that
I have to watch those movies. I also want to
shout out Old Boyfriends real quick. That's written
by Paul Schrader and directed by Joan Tewksbury,
I think is her name. It's a really good kind
of romantic comedy drama. And Talia Shire is
fantastic in it. So I want to shout out that
movie as well. Nice. Maybe I'll check that out.
Joining both Talia Shire and Robert Foxworth
is our third big actor in this movie, Armand
Asante. Armand Asante plays the Native American
activist John Hawks. However, Asante is not Native
American. He is Irish -Italian. And he, you know,
Matt, as you rightly say, not a good look. But
maybe best known, Armand Asante is for playing
Gotti in the 1996 film of the same name. Also
appeared in bombs like Judge Dredd, Striptease,
and Fatal Instinct. I will say Armand Asante,
I think gives a very, I think he's very good
in this movie. I think he's very committed. That's
the word. He's very committed and plays it sincerely.
Yeah. Casting, however, is not a good look. Right.
And, you know, that's the, you know, this movie
was made in 1979 when I was probably, I mean,
certainly less of a consideration for filmmakers
and producers than it is now. It's, I'm, you
know. It's obviously a good thing that like we're
paying more attention to representation and the
actors that are playing those roles nowadays.
But yeah, maybe they didn't even consider that
at the time, you know, which is a shame. Right.
And then rounding out our selected cast here
that we're going to play. Oh, is the monster
Kevin Peter Hall. Yes, he was a seven foot two
actor. He also played the Predator in the first
two movies of that series and Harry in Harry
and the Hendersons. Yeah, I didn't know Kevin
Peter Hall was in this movie. Yeah, he's great.
I like him. I love Harry and the Hendersons.
We have to talk about that movie at some point
as well. Yeah, and more Predator movies too.
Yeah. I mean, these are iconic roles that you
have to credit the actor and the suit for bringing
to life. Totally. Yeah. You do that a lot with
the, you know, Godzilla and other kaiju movies,
like shouting out the actors who are in the suits.
And I think that's great. Like, you know, most
people don't really know their names or maybe
even really pay a lot of attention to the actors,
but they do a lot of great work. Yeah. Good job,
Kevin Peter Hall. Yeah. Right. I mean, look,
even though everybody ridicules the monster in
this movie, it's not Kevin Peter Hall's fault,
you know? Yeah, that's where my mind was going.
He could have been directed better. Like everything
around the portrayal of this monster should have
been tighter. Yeah. Yep. Exactly. Which we'll
talk about in a moment here with the production.
So the screenwriter, David Seltzer, he based
the story partly on a real life tragedy that
took place in 1958 in the Japanese city of Minamata.
At that time in Minamata, mercury waste was dumped
into a nearby river from a chemical plant and
caused severe mutations and neurological degenerations
among the locals, which included paralysis, you
know, insanity. I forget some of the other examples
that were listed there of the side effects, but
really devastating. And I think I read that something
like 100 ,000 people were affected by this. So
just like an enormous tragedy in Japan at the
time. Yeah, and including pregnant women and
their fetuses. So all that narrative and prophecy
is ripped straight from the headlines. Yeah,
right. And, you know, maybe it's no surprise
that if that happened in 1958, and then there
were, although I can't think of other specific
examples, like other similar tragedies throughout
the 60s, maybe no surprise that themes of, you
know, toxins in the environment and corporate
pollution and things like that were pervasive
at the time. Yeah, and since we're on the topic.
Are you familiar about the thalidomide scandal?
It sounds familiar. Yeah. Billy Joel mentions
it in We Didn't Start the Fire. Children of thalidomide.
But all jokes aside, this was a tranquilizer,
sleeping pill sedative that was prescribed to
women in the 50s and 60s. And it caused horrendous.
birth defects in children. And it was a huge
deal. The pictures are downright heartbreaking
when you look it up on Wikipedia of these children.
So that went through my mind. I've read up a
lot on Larry Cohen's It's Alive, which is from
the early 70s. That film as a metaphor for anxiety
around toxins and pollutants affecting And, you
know, women and parents not knowing, like, is
my baby going to come out okay or is it going
to be a monster? So I think prophecy is also
tapping into that same pool of anxiety. So, yeah,
I just wanted to throw that in there too. Yeah,
no, it's a good point. And I guess there's the
controversy around DDT too, which became a little
more pronounced or more widespread in the 1960s.
I know there was a book, A Silent Spring, that
was kind of about that. So, you know, all these
stories and all these kind of controversies coming
out in the open around the same time. But you're
totally right that the theme of pregnancies being
affected by these things, it's an emotional kind
of subplot, I think, in Prophecy. A lot of the
stuff in this movie is pretty silly. But I think
Talia Shire's character, she's... pregnant, but
she doesn't initially tell her husband about
that. And then when she finds out that there's
this, you know, mercury poisoning in this area
where they are in the movie that is affecting
the wildlife, including this kind of monstrous
bear creature, and that kind of adds to her emotional
anxiety that she's already feeling, it's really
powerful. And I think Shire does a great job
of conveying that. Yeah, agreed. So Prophecy
was filmed in British Columbia, Canada in 1978.
This was actually one of the first movies that
made the region very popular for film production.
Ever since then, it's kind of become one of the
new Hollywoods or the Canadian Hollywood. A lot
of movies and TV shows have been filmed there.
And Prophecy was one of the first to take advantage
of that filming location and tax breaks and things
of that nature. The design of the monster. Here
we go. We're getting into the good stuff in the
movie right now. The not so good stuff, perhaps.
The design of the monster went through a lot
of changes in the movie. It was initially supposed
to be much stranger. It was kind of meant to
be like a chimera of all the different animals
in the forest. So it was supposed to be this
totally one of a kind monster that nobody had
ever seen before. And then Frankenheimer saw
the initial concept and he was like, no, it needs
to look more like a bear. And that's the direction
they went in, which, you know, for better or
worse, it is amusing, but I feel like the initial
concept probably would have been a lot scarier.
Yeah, I'm thinking of it from a producer's point
of view. I'm thinking just straight up bear is
going to save me money on the production side,
on the makeup side. So, I mean, I don't want
to say that that decision was driven by money.
But it could have been a motivating factor. Yeah,
I think you're totally right about that. Yeah.
Yeah, so on that note, the producers tried to
hire Rick Baker and Stan Winston to do the creature
effects, but they were unable to do so. They
eventually got Tom Berman to do the creature
effects instead. You know, no shade against Tom
Berman. I don't really know a lot about him,
to be honest. I get the sense that, like, the...
not so great creature costume in this movie is
not necessarily Berman's fault, but maybe more
the overall concept and the direction they went
in. Yeah, perhaps I'm looking them up. He, he,
he worked with John Chambers on planet of the
apes. He went on to do a lot of TV Emmy nominated
work. Yeah. So he obviously, so he had a resume.
Yeah. So yeah, no shade to him. It seems like
there were other extenuating circumstances, perhaps,
for this bear costume. Yeah, right. If I can
go on a brief tangent, what did you think of
the effects for the bear cubs, the babies that
the monster has in this movie? I was just thinking
how those are more effective, I think. Maybe
because they're smaller scale. Maybe they're
just probably puppets. They could be animatronic,
but they're probably puppets. And yeah, I think
they are revolting creations of creature effects.
I found myself, it was uneasy looking at them.
Just like their skin is peeling off and their
cries. They're seeing extreme close -ups. Yeah,
I thought they were done really well on a small
scale. Very good. Yeah, I thought so too. They
reminded me of, you know, first of all of It's
Alive, a movie that you just mentioned, and certainly
a lot of overlaps there. But the design of those
cubs reminded me of Eraserhead too, the David
Lynch movie that came out two years before Prophecy.
Of course, a very different movie. Eraserhead
is just so surreal and dreamlike, like many of
David Lynch's movies are. But there's like a
visual similarity between the baby in Eraserhead
and the bear cubs in this movie. which I doubt
was intentional, but just a strange coincidence.
Initially, Prophecy was much more violent than
the finished cut that we got, and it actually
is still pretty gory. There are some decapitations,
there's some, you know, like, well, we haven't
even talked about the sleeping bag scene yet,
which isn't really gory, but is, like, very amusing.
But there's definitely some violence in this
movie. Initially, though, the movie had even
more scenes of gore and violence. Frankenheimer
cut those out before the film was released. I've
read differing stories as to whether that was
Frankenheimer's own decision or if the studio
kind of made him do that to try to get a PG rating
and thus more ticket sales. I feel like the truth
is probably somewhere in between the two. Right.
And that's a good call out. At this time in 1979,
there was no PG -13. So you're either PG or you
are R, which could be a big difference when you're
talking box office. So PG, you're still probably
going to get. younger people kids come into this
movie i think that's a mistake right it's not
not family friendly even jaws ostensibly is not
and yet it's i think it's it's okay in terms
of the violence in jaws yeah but the violence
in in prophecy it's it's brutal at times Yeah,
absolutely. And there are like heavy human themes
in this movie, too. I mean, we already talked
about some of them, you know, oppression of Native
American communities. Abortion is mentioned at
one point and whether Talia Shire and her husband
want to make that decision. So, yeah, you would
not think that kids who saw this movie would
really get a lot out of those themes. No, but
what they will get a lot out of is a duel between
a chainsaw and an axe. Yeah. Yeah, that's a strange
scene. I feel like maybe we should describe that
a little bit more, which I'm happy to do if you
want. So initially when the Verns go, well, maybe
we should talk about the story of the movie a
little bit more. So the Verns, the scientist
played by Robert Foxworth and his wife, go up
to Maine to investigate the disappearance of
three lumberjacks. And there's this lumber mill
that has recently opened in this community. And
the lumber mill, like the director of the lumber
mill says that the disappearance of the lumberjacks
is due to the Native Americans who live here,
whose land has been intruded upon, who have been
disrespected by the lumber company. But of course,
the director of the lumber company is just like,
oh, no, they're just rowdy and violent and it's
all their fault. And of course, the Native American
community rightfully says this is our land and
they are harming the environment. So that's like
the violence and the animosity between these.
Two communities. So this scene that you're talking
about is like one of the employees for the lumber
mill has a chainsaw, and then the Native American
character John Hawks has an axe. And there's
this duel between them almost immediately when
the Verns go up to this kind of forest community.
It's a strange scene. It's like an action brawl
moment that almost is out of Dukes of Hazzard,
but it's also like very unsettling at the same
time. Because the threat is real. It wasn't played
for laughs. I mean, it is campy just on the surface.
But again, Armand Asante is taking this very
seriously. Nobody has a tongue in their cheek
here. And the way it's directed, you don't know
if the John Hawks character is going to die or
not. Because he's willing to die under this chainsaw
to protect the forest. So I think it's directed
completely for, I don't know, seriously. Yeah.
But, but it's, it's also silly. It also scratches
that 10 year old itch that I have as a boy where
I'm like, yeah, this is awesome. Let me see a
chainsaw versus an ax. Right. Yeah. And I think
everything is so over the top. Well, maybe not
everything, but like the political commentary
is over the top in this movie. It's, it is meant
very seriously, very earnestly. And yet there's
no subtlety to it at all. And not really very
much depth to it either. It's kind of just like
the evil corporation against the, you know, oppressed
native Americans. And that's a worthy theme,
but it's like, just so like melodramatically
portrayed. It does kind of come off as a little
campy. Yeah. Yeah. It's a pulp film, you know,
you dress it up with all the talent behind the
camera in front of the camera, but like, In its
DNA, this is a B -movie thriller, and you're
going to get a lot of goofy moments for all the
heart that it does have. Yeah, right. Yeah. I'm
just, you know, how weird this movie is becomes
increasingly clear the more we talk about it,
you know? And the longer it goes on, too. Like
you said, I was with you. Like, in the beginning
of this movie, I'm like, all right, this is like
a drama, getting to know characters. getting
to know the world the stakes but then yeah by
the end you're just like all like all the dressing
falls apart and you're just left with this this
bare bones story no pun intended and yeah it's
it's it just like do like devolves on itself
it's yeah it's weird yeah it is indeed yeah One
possible reason for that, and the last thing
I'll mention in our production backstory section
here, is Frankenheimer later admitted to his
biographer, Charles Champlin, that he was going
through a tough period of alcoholism around this
time. He said that he was drunk pretty much every
day on set. Robert Foxworth, or no, actually,
it was the writer, David Seltzer, who also kind
of said that, like, Frankenheimer was just drunk
every day. And that's, you know, I mean, that's
unfortunate, and I don't mean to, like, attribute
the movie as sort of, like, What's the word?
I guess sloppiness. I'll just use that word again.
Like for that reason, that seems a little bit
insensitive to Frankenheimer, but he was maybe
not going through a great period when he made
this movie as well. Yeah, yeah. But all of that
contributed to a kind of not super successful
release of this movie in 1979. It was released
by Paramount in June of that year, one week before
20th Century Fox released Alien. So you have
maybe the best monster movie of all time coming
out a week after Prophecy, which is a sort of
unfortunate coincidence for this movie. And I
read a lot of reviews, including Siskel and Ebert,
comparing Prophecy to Alien, which is so unfortunate
for Prophecy. But also, I don't think it's totally
on the money. Because like Ebert says, Prophecy
is just Alien, but in a forest. Like, I get it,
but... Also, then Jaws is just, or Alien is just
Jaws in space. Like, you could play that game
all day. I think what Prophecy and Alien are
doing are different, ultimately. But yes, they
both have monsters hunting down a team of people.
Yeah. Yeah, and the similarities pretty much
end there. Like, I love Alien. It's one of the
best monster movies ever, of course. But like,
you know... prophecy is trying to include some
social commentary and some like human relationships
that alien doesn't really even try to attempt.
So for me, that's the main reason that comparison
is like not really fair to, to either movie really,
you know, but maybe also helps to explain why
this movie didn't do very well at the box office.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's a stark value in or
a stark difference in, in value. Yeah. In these
two movies. Yeah, yeah. For sure. Case in point,
Prophecy made $22 .7 million at the U .S. box
office that didn't quite make back its budget,
including its marketing budget. And it was really
negatively reviewed when it came out. You already
alluded to that with Roger Ebert's review. Some
other critics called it trivial, an indoctrination
course in liberal guilt. Other critics, which,
you know, I understand what they're talking about
there. Although it does seem kind of unfair.
Other critics complained about its cardboard
characters and a story so stupid it's irresistible,
which is kind of a funny quote. And the story,
I don't know if the story is stupid, although
its execution is kind of stupid sometimes. Agreed.
Yeah. I'm always a fan, and I've written stories,
I've written plays like this, of just kind of
like, keep it simple. Like, you don't need to
reinvent the wheel with a genre movie sometimes.
If you want to write a movie, about a group of
people coming together with competing interests,
but ultimately they have to overcome those differences
to defeat the monster. You know, Spielberg did
it with Jaws. Nobody's knocking him for his story.
So it's like, I don't know. It all comes down
to execution, obviously, which I agree. Prophecy
is not well executed a lot of the times, but
I'm not going to knock it for just doing a classic
story. As cliche as it might be. Right. Yeah.
Yeah. Ultimately, it's a monster movie, again,
with social commentary and attempts at human
drama. And like that, you know, that's a worthwhile
template. Like a lot of people have done that
before. So, yeah. But, you know, the critics
weren't the only ones who did not like this movie.
Even many of the people involved with it did
not like it after it came out. John Frankenheimer
himself said that the potential of the project
was much greater than the finished version. He
admitted that he was unhappy with the way it
turned out. And then the screenwriter, David
Seltzer, had even more vicious things to say
about it. David Seltzer later said, No, it really
sucks. As a matter of fact, I really would like
to have that remade. I was on that set, Seltzer
goes on to say. I'd even taken my kids to Vancouver
and I saw everything falling apart. When that
monster showed up and was nothing but some big
ballet dancer wearing huge shoes and a bear costume,
I said, that's it to my kids. We're going home.
That movie does not hold up. So I like that whole
quote. Obviously, Seltzer is no big fan of this
movie. And I can't argue with him on that. I
will say I think this movie in retrospect has
more love. It definitely has a cult classic following.
I had heard about this movie. Oh, we didn't talk
about our personal histories, but I had heard
about this movie from a friend. It had been recommended.
So I was excited when you brought it to the podcast
because I finally had a reason to watch it. So
I think there's love for this movie out in the
populace. And then I did watch a clip, an interview
with Talia Shire for a recent Blu -ray edition.
And she she defends the movie in terms of its
themes and its messaging. She's like, look, we
were trying to make a movie warning, warning
mankind about the dangers of destroying the earth.
And like the Earth Mother is going to get you
in the end if you continue down this path. So
that was 40 years ago. I think we're still having
that conversation today. So I think that is still
worth. Worthy of discussion. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
I think I would agree with Talia Shire on that.
I also read that Quentin Tarantino kind of likes
this movie as well, and he said, like, I have
a soft spot for that stupid movie. And he said,
Shire's really great. Like, that was one of his
favorite things about it. And he said that, like,
the bear costume is totally ridiculous and absurd.
And those are maybe the two best things about
it, and the sleeping bag death scene. You're
right that we didn't talk about our personal
histories with the movie, and I apologize for
that. But that's kind of how I learned about
this movie, just by watching that YouTube clip
of, well, I don't want to ruin it too much. Just
search for Prophecy 1979. If you see anything,
any titles with like sleeping bag death or sleeping
bag anything, watch that clip because it is strange,
hilarious. And that's the first thing I saw from
this movie. So, of course, I was like, oh, we
have to talk about this on the podcast. My jaw
dropped. The pizza roll I had in my mouth at
the time fell out when I watched that scene.
magical it's really amazing i have no idea if
it's meant to be funny or not but it is and it's
also shocking uh what a moment yeah yeah honestly
it's just it's just uh you know it uh it begs
so much wonder from oneself yeah right um with
scenes like that you can't totally hate this
movie you know all right well it's time for our
sponsor break Camp Kaiju is sponsored by Zach
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show notes. Vincent, do we have anything in Minya's
mailbox today? We do, and it's from a patron
of ours. We'll keep it anonymous and I will kind
of paraphrase some of our our supporters emailed
to us. But folks listening, join us over on Patreon
and a perk you get to enjoy is priority comments.
And I got to tell you, we have a whole our mailbox
is overstuffed right now with mail. Our Space
Amoeba episode was very popular. We got a lot
of love from that. So I'm writing all these down.
I'm keeping track of them. But we have to honor
our patrons first and foremost. So let me just
paraphrase a little bit here. Just listen to
your Space Amoeba episode. You made a comment
about the English dub. I hope to clarify. And
we thank our listeners for helping us because
sometimes the classic kaiju films, the history,
especially with the dubs and the different releases,
international, Japanese, American. It can get
kind of complicated sometimes. Okay, so he goes
on to say, I just wanted to point out the difference
in the dubs. There's a distinct difference between
calling dubs English and US. Although both are
English dialogue, the international dubs are
almost always inferior. Something else to remember
is that a dub is just another translation. Sometimes
the dubs are a better translation than some subtitles
you get, which I think that's an interesting
point. For instance, the Criterion subtitles
for many of the Godzilla movies aren't that accurate.
Criterion prefers brevity over accuracy. So right
there, I think that that's something I never
even thought of, but seems to make sense to me.
Yeah. Okay, goes on a little bit. One last thing
I'll mention is the titles. My Doctor Who fandom
kicks in here, so I tend to refer to the actual
titles to define what I'm talking about. What
I mean is that Space Amoeba is just the name
given to the international version by Toho and
thus only refers to the international version.
If you're reviewing the Japanese version, well,
that is only called Gezira Ganymede's Kamibas
Battle Giant Monsters of the South Seas. And
the U .S. version is Yogg Monster from Space.
So our listener says, to me, that's how I refer
to these Toho movies when it comes to talking
about the films. He does go on to say or admit
that no one thinks about all this quite as much
as he does. But I love thinking about this stuff
all the same. So thank you, listener, dear patron.
We really value that kind of insight. Absolutely.
That's yeah, a lot of good points. Very fascinating
stuff there. And yeah, it's true. Like we. You
know, I'll speak for myself, Vincent, but I try
to do research and try to like track down different
like versions of the movie and figure out all
that all that backstory. But I admit it can be
tough and we might be pressed for time sometimes.
So we always love getting corrections and information
like that. So thank you. Thank you for that.
Yeah, because it's to me, it's it's just like
getting an email like that. It adds to our conversation.
Yeah. You know, because you and I admit we don't.
We don't know every in and out of these movies.
So we welcome the listener feedback to add to
the conversation. Absolutely. Yeah. And just
one more thing about the title. Space Amoeba
is one of my favorite movie titles of all time.
So I definitely appreciate the accuracy. I might
continue. And this is on me. I'll probably just
call it Space Amoeba just because I love that
title so much. Well, I think that's the default.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. but that's great stuff um yeah
thanks to thanks to that patron for sending those
comments absolutely and peter laurie uh matt
did you even notice he moved out you know it's
been so quiet and peaceful here that explains
it that must be why yeah well now well now i
can't sleep at night because i got I got some
hoodlum moving in to my basement down here. It's
Peter Lorre. Oh, man. There must be a high -pitched
German muttering down there all the time now.
Ada's asking me what is going on. You know, I
can only keep Lorre from her for so long. That's
terrifying. You gave them my address. I did no
such thing. I might have given them a general
direction, but, you know. Some landmarks, possibly.
I didn't think he was even going to survive all
the way over there. Well, he did. And now I have
to find accommodations for someone else in my
house. Thank you. Oh, I'm sorry about that. I'll
offer you some tips to like make it a little
bit easier. Maybe I'll give him like a parting
gift, you know, since he's not in my place anymore.
But yeah, good luck. That's all I can say. I
brought this on myself, but we'll see. We'll
make it work. We'll make it work. All right.
He's going to talk to us about a 1944 movie called
The Monster Maker. Oh, that's a good title. to
the Poverty Row Studios on the other side of
Hollywood where the stars were dimmer and the
red carpets dripped with blood. Together we will
watch the best of the worst. Movies known for
their limited budgets, outlandish concepts, and
questionable performances, but with enough haunted
houses, zombies, ape men, and devil bats to keep
you up at night. This is the Poverty Row Picture
Show. And I dare you to sleep through these nightmares.
Greetings, ghouls and gals. And happy October.
It is the gravest season of all. And thanks to
Bela Lugosi for covering me last week. That man
can really vamp on the mic. But now I return
to continue the Poverty Row Picture Show. Coming
to you now. From all new digs. That's right.
I have left the unfriendly confines of Matthew's
dirty, rotten, stinking, lousy, two -bit, flea
-infested excuse for a home. And now I find myself
in the basement dwellings of Vincent's own abode.
Hmm. What do we have here? Yes, this is good.
A full liquor cabinet. And a color television
set. Well, I am sure that Vincent will not mind
if I make myself comfy. We haven't exactly established
the house rules, but... But... Ah, what the heck.
Now, what movie are we reviewing tonight? Ah,
yes. 1944's The Monster Maker. This devilish
B -movie concerns a mad scientist played by J.
Carol Nash. who injects his would -be adversaries
with the serum of acromagaly. This is the disease
of the Elephant Man, Rondo Hanton, and that scientist
from Universal's Tarantula. In reality, it is
a rare disorder that causes the enlargement of
the face, arms, and legs. Certainly no laughing
matter, and its use as a monstrous plot point
in this film and others is morally dubious. even
for the films of the poverty row. However, how
does the monster maker stack up against others
of its ilk? Well, J. Carol Nash brings a certain
Oscar -panted resume to the film, but he can
only do so much as the one -note doctor. Then,
would you believe there's even a killer gorilla
in this one? Yes, I did not see that one coming
either. What do you know, the big ape? It's more
of a curious cameo than even a subplot. The whole
film is meandering, confusing, and paced so slowly
you may find yourself checking the time. Well,
that's it for now. And I thank you for listening
and for all the support. I think next time we
will discuss my fellow horror actor, that man
with the acromegaly, Rondo Hatton, in a little
film called The Brute Man. Yes, well... Necromagily
does factor again as a sinister storyline, but
does the Brute Man out -disfigure the Monster
Maker? Stay tuned to find out, and raise a glass
until then, to this autumnal season of Monsters
and Mad Men! How do you do? My name is Alfred
Hitchcock and I would like to tell you about
my forthcoming lecture. It is about the birds
and their age -long relationship with man. It
will be seen in theatres like this across the
country. In my lecture, I hope to make you all
aware of our good friends, the birds. Theirs
is a noble history and through it all, man has
played a conspicuous part. This cave drawing
is one of man's earliest sketches of his feathered
friend. One can see at once the loving care with
which the artist depicted his subject. The story
of man and his friends, the birds, is filled
with many fine examples of ways in which these
noble creatures have added to the beauty of the
world. Back to Prophecy by John Frankenheimer.
We've already talked about a number of the themes
in this movie. Eco horror probably being the
number one theme in the film. Anything else you
want to add about that theme in the movie? Yeah.
So we mentioned like the concept of the earth
mother, but also that people, this is a belief.
This is a rat. I mean, at the time I think it
was radical for the Western mindset to, to think
of human beings and nature as one in the same.
And. I have been exposed in my time to Native
American speakers and readings that that is a
very indigenous concept that humans are not separate
from the earth, that we all are part and parcel.
So I think prophecy admirably brings those themes
to the surface. And I appreciated that. Yeah,
absolutely. There's a really good dialogue scene
between Dr. Verne, Bob Verne, and John Hawks,
the Native American activist character played
by Armand Asante, where Bob Verne basically says,
listen, I'm just here to check the environment.
I'm just looking for chemicals and toxins. And
Hawks kind of interrupts him and he's like, what
do you mean by the environment? We are part of
the environment. You can't talk about the environment
without talking about us. And that's a good point.
I thought that scene was pretty believable. Not
even, you know, won't talk about the acting or
like the casting, I should say, in this particular
moment. But the dialogue is really trying to
get at a deeper theme than I expected in that
moment. Yeah, it was a good biting response by
the character John Hawks. That was good. Yeah.
Right off the bat, I mean, the depiction of class
and the class struggle in this movie. Dr. Verne,
he's treating tenement dwellers in a poor neighborhood
in New York City. And he's treating a baby who's
been bitten by rats. And it's just heartbreaking.
And it's a real baby actor. And it's just a really
powerful scene of the depiction of not just poverty,
but the neglect of the masses by a system that
truly doesn't care about them. And if it weren't
for Bob Verne, like what would happen? Like,
and so, so it also highlights the people who
do social work, the people who are public health
servants who are willing to go into, who are
willing to do really hard work that most people
don't or aren't willing to do, or don't even
think about it. And it's not malicious. They
just, I mean, if you don't live in it and you're
not exposed to it and you live you know, maybe
a more comfortable life. We're all guilty of
it. I know there are people starving right now
on the streets of Minneapolis. What am I doing
about it? Nothing. But Bob does in this movie,
like he's going into these places. So like it's
the first scene of the movie and it, it starts
off very, it kicks this movie off into a very
high gear for me. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Agree
with all that. I have two, two responses or two
thoughts about that. The first of which, the
scene set in that, it's referred to in the movie
as a ghetto, like the New York ghetto, basically.
And I appreciate the message of that scene. And
I think it's pretty poorly done. The street in
front of the building where he treats the baby
and talks to the baby's mother. There are bombed
out cars. There's stuff on fire. Every single
person on the sidewalk is giving them dirty,
threatening looks. And it's like... I feel like
you can tell this movie was directed by somebody
who is not of this community. I feel like it's
trying to provide shorthand as quickly as possible
for a crime -ridden, impoverished sort of city
slum. The theme is interesting, and I do think
the message is well -intentioned, but it's one
of many things in this movie that I just think
is poorly executed, even if, like, the idea behind
it has potential, you know? And I think there's
a lot to blame for that. I think it's Frankenheimer.
I think it's the set design. I think it's even
just, like, the editing, because, like... You
know, we we see these two white men because Bob
Verne is joined by another man who works for
the EPA, I think. And like they're just, you
know, it's the two of them talking, surrounded
by all this like crime and like graffiti and
all this stuff. So it's an interesting moment.
And it kind of did also rub me the wrong way
a little bit at the same time, you know? No,
I I'm going to I'm going to lend credence to
a critique you could read into this film. That
it's. you know, a white savior narrative. I don't
think that should take away from the, the well
-meaning good work that that's, you know, public
health officials do that social workers do, even
if they're, you know, white people, but in this
movie, especially with the dynamics between the
native communities and, you know, and, and in
this one city scene, you know, everyone's of
color, everyone's like shooting up. It's just,
yeah, it's. It's not it's not a scene painted
by, like you said, someone who might know that
kind of community more genuinely. Yeah. So I
think you I think you could lay that critique
on the film, even if it's not necessarily all
there for me. But I could see it totally. And
I'm you know, I. Yeah, I agree with what you're
saying. I just don't like the way it's presented
in the movie, you know, but like that doesn't
like totally diminish the theme or anything.
It's still there in the movie. So I appreciate
that about it. Yeah. Yeah. But Prophecy is a
it's it's it's a movie like that, though. It's
and it made me think about Orca as well. Do you
remember there was a native community in that
movie, too? Yeah. Portrayed by native actors,
I believe, for the most part, at least the main
one. But prophecy like Orca still traffics in
that mysticism around natives. Yeah. Like, oh,
this bear, it's the embodiment of Katahdin, their
forest god. And it's still, yeah, that's problematic.
Right. There's still a veneer of racial caricature
with this film. Absolutely. Yeah. I also read
that Katahdin does not exist. It was made up
for the movie and is actually named after a mountain
that's in Maine. I think it's in Maine. Maybe
it's in British Columbia, actually. But yeah,
it doesn't exist. So that that part of it. And,
you know, I mean, like artists have creative
license to a certain extent. But that kind of
thing is like, oh, you're kind of just making
this up as you go along, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
But and, you know, again, like maybe a product
of its time and place. I think like. you know,
filmmakers like Frankenheimer maybe weren't thinking
as much about these things as they probably should
have, you know? And then at the same time, that's
why this whole conversation we're having is,
I appreciate this conversation because there,
to me, it's not so black and white. Because in
the 70s, you also had the American Indian movement.
So Native rights were a topic of discussion.
They were on the front. or the headlines. Yeah.
So prophecy and Orca, and I'm sure there are
countless others are also reflecting the times
in which they're made in a positive way. Yeah.
So, yeah, you just kind of take it for everything.
Absolutely. The good and the bad and the ugly
and the campy. Yeah. It's all there for sure.
Yeah. Fascinating ways. Oh man. You said another
thing, too, though, that I picked up on and I
thought was one of the more interesting themes
in the movie, which is like, you know, Dr. Verne
does want to do good in the world. He wants to
play a positive role. He's idealistic. You know,
he's not a cynic. And then like we on the other
hand, we get like the director of the lumber
mill, who at least initially seems to be cynical
and in it for the money and power hungry and
all that stuff. But then there's kind of like
a character dynamic where. You know, he learns
like the negative effects of like his company
and like he himself, like what he's done to this
community and like it's animals and it's people
and the environment itself. And like he kind
of has a change of heart. And I think he shifts
a little bit from cynicism to idealism. And that,
I think, is a relevant theme to all of us right
now. And there's like, you know, just so much
right now that seems kind of. tense and difficult
in the world. It's like, ah, I want to, and you
said this too before Vincent, it's like, I want
to make a difference, but what do I actually
do? You know? And that's like a sub theme or
like, yeah, not a subplot, but like a sub theme
in the movie that I think is, is, is always relevant.
And like the, the, the critic, the critic who
said in their negative review that this is like
course and liberal guilt or whatever. I don't
know. It sounds kind of mean to me because that
just seems like a different way of saying this
movie is. trying to ask, like, how do you make
a difference in a world that seems like full
of problems, basically, you know? And that, you
know, like, for how silly this movie is, it does
get to some of those questions, which I was surprised
by. Yeah, there's this scene in the nighttime
bear attack. Everyone's hunkered down in the
tunnel. And John Hawks and the leader of the,
or the boss of the paper mill, like, they share
a look. It's a nonverbal, but it's full of understanding.
And that's when they had like the, like you said,
that white character has that change of heart.
Yeah. So, you know, we're talking about deep
themes of the prophecy, but that bear is a metaphor
for everything, all the problems, all the struggles.
And, you know, we got to come together. Yeah,
really. I mean, wish these monsters. Right. It's
yeah, like it sounds like kind of hyperbolic
to say that, but it's true that the movie is
at least trying to wrap all that up in this movie,
you know, wrap it up in a sleeping bag and then
whip it with its tail into a tree. That's what
it's trying to do. That's bad metaphor. Sorry.
Into an explosion of feathers. Yeah, exactly.
Oh, that also reminds me, I'm sorry, I don't
want to dwell too much on just this one theme,
because there's more to the movie. But like,
I read that the novelization of the film, which
was also by David Seltzer, who wrote the screenplay.
So he wrote the screenplay, and then he wrote
the novel to go along with the film to like make
some extra money. But the ending of the book
is even more bleak than the ending of the film,
which actually isn't all that bleak. The end
of the book ends with, like, the Supreme Court
ruling against the Native American tribe that
lives in this area and ruling with the Lumber
Corporation, which, you know, is a powerful...
I haven't read the book, I should admit that,
but, like, it just sounds like a powerfully pessimistic
and maybe more realistic way to look at the outcome
of the story. Yeah, I have thoughts about the
ending of the movie. I'll get to with my bad
category, actually, but, you know, we'll get
there. Yeah, thanks for sharing that. That's
interesting. Yeah, I thought so too. All right,
what other themes do we have in this movie? We've
talked about prejudice against the Native American
communities. And like you said, Vincent, you
know, it's eco -friendly themes. It's themes
about preservation. And it's themes about Native
American communities are, there are lots of parallels
between them, lots of overlaps. Is there anything
else we want to say about its themes of, you
know, co -opting Native American land and oppressing
those communities? I mean, always. But I think,
well, yeah, I'll say one more example of how
I feel like prophecy is just such a snapshot
of 70s politics. You know, abortion is talked
about rather candidly in this film. And I just
think that that is, I think that word and that
topic is so controversial these days. And I'm
not saying it wasn't then because I wasn't alive
then. I don't know. But a mainstream movie. science
fiction movie is just dropping that into conversation
like Talia Shire the first time you meet her
she's talking to her friend about whether or
not she wants to keep the baby and I found it
interesting maybe a subversion of what I would
expect she the woman is is hoping to keep the
pregnancy and it's the husband who would be in
favor of the abortion I just in the at least
the stories I consume Those roles are usually
flipped. Right. Yeah, and that I think kind of
goes back to the theme of like idealism versus
cynicism a little bit because even though Dr.
Verne, sorry, the male character Bob Verne is
like, you know, idealistic in some ways because
he's trying to help. the community, the, you
know, primarily black community at the beginning
of the film, he doesn't really want to bring
new life into the world because he thinks that
there are so many problems that are unfixable
and like the future is going to be even darker
and more difficult to deal with. And that's why
he doesn't want to have a child. Like that's
an interesting dynamic, you know? And I find,
I found that extremely relatable just personally,
you know, Ellen and I had conversations like
that before we decided to start a family. And
I think a lot of people out there, whether you
have children or not, think about it in those
terms. Like, do I want to add more, another human
to this, this God forsaken world? You know, and
I'm not blaming anybody. I'm not judging anybody.
And it's, it's a deeply personal conversation
to have that, but this movie touches on it. And
I, I found that effective. Yeah, yeah, for sure.
And maybe kind of gets to some larger themes
about gender dynamics too, not to give the movie
too much credit, but like, you know, I mean,
Bob Verne doesn't really listen to his wife all
that much. She numerous times tries to bring
up the subject of conversation and he just kind
of ignores her and like tries to make out with
her in one scene. And, you know, there's one
moment too, where he like, he's fishing and he
catches a fish and that's arguably what like,
you know. what's the word, impacts Talia Shire's
baby in the movie is eating that tainted fish
or whatever. But anyway, what I'm getting at
is there's a line of dialogue where he's like,
oh no, actually Talia Shire says that. She's
like, you fish and I'll make the food or I'll
eat the food or something like that. And I was
like, oh, that's kind of a throwaway line. It's
kind of about, it says a lot about their power
dynamics and their views on gender and their
marriage, you know? I mean, if you really want
to go into it, she's like this top flight or
top tier. cellist in an orchestra in new york
which you know okay okay she's an independent
woman she has this amazing career as an artist
but she follows him to his work and then she
just like we never see her play the cello again
man there's like one scene but but her whole
character that's set up in the beginning of this
movie completely fades away and that's like a
function of the script and just like how seltzer
Wants to flesh out his characters, but it's,
I think it's a, again, I think it's a lost. I
think it's a missed opportunity to not give her
more agency in this movie. Cause I think, I think
by the time they get to the woods, she, she is
more or less justifiably concerned about one
thing only. Am I going to give birth to a monster?
yeah does she do anything more than just kind
of cry about that not really and you know maybe
maybe you could have played around with some
some deeper more dynamic characterization there
yeah i agree with that for sure yeah i do think
she plays the role very well i think she's like
pretty powerful in this movie and like the scenes
where she's cradling one of the cubs And seemingly
horrified and also like very compassionate towards
it in a motherly way. Those are pretty devastating
moments in this movie. And I was not expecting
that also. I completely agree. And then I what
how did you feel about this moment? The bear
cub like rips into her neck. It turns. Yeah.
And that's a strange moment. And also, I think
that's another moment that's poorly executed
because you can't even really tell what's going
on. There are some like close shots that are
just like, you know, abruptly edited into everything
else. But yeah, thematically, it's like why?
I don't know. Nature turning on humanity or or.
Well, yeah, like a child turning on its mother,
you know, which, of course, is her her greatest
fear at that moment. Yeah. which we see in it's
alive and you know the fly touches on that with
gina davis so like we've seen that before i think
it's always an effective metaphor even if it's
not executed maybe to the best of its ability
yeah yeah it's that is a strange moment that
didn't make a lot of sense to me narratively
but thematically it's pretty interesting A hundred
percent. Like so many other things. And how did
she not die? I think like ripped her jugular
out. Like, yeah, I couldn't even tell who was
being attacked at first. Like I thought it was,
there are several other characters that are kind
of hiding out with them at that same moment.
I think there's a native American woman who's
kind of joining them. And I thought it was her
that was getting attacked at first. So yeah,
maybe. Yeah. That's an example. I think by the
end of this movie, The wheels come off, honestly.
And Frankenheimer clearly might have been drunk
or just didn't care. But the precision that this
movie starts with is missing by the end. By the
end, it is just a schlock fest. Reason be damned.
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yep. I think one of the
critics reviews said it devolves into pure hokum,
which I think is pretty accurate. Absolutely.
Yeah. Yeah. There's still maybe some interesting
stuff in there, though. I loved it. Yeah? Spoiling
the ending here. Is that any other themes we
want to mention? I feel like there honestly are
probably more, but those are the major ones at
least. Which is very surprising that there are
so many things packed into this little film,
but I think we can end it there. Okay. Do you
think it's time for our individual breakdowns?
We could wrap up our formal conversation in there.
I think that'd be awesome. Okay, cool. So yeah,
let's talk about the good, the bad, and the campy.
You know, as I think we've alluded to, there
is some good stuff in this movie. It's, you know,
I feel like this is kind of seen as like ridiculous
and campy and like just kind of so bad it's good
by some people. But there's some genuinely good
stuff. And I'll just say, you know, I'll start
it off and then I'll turn it over to you. But
I think there is an attempt to make a significant
emotional movie. You know, I don't know if it
totally pulls that off, but like it is trying
to build complex characters who have very human
fears and desires and like anxieties. And it's
talking about negative forces in the real world
that obviously are still with us to this day.
And anytime a movie is that ambitious, I'm going
to appreciate that attempt at depth and complexity.
Yeah, yeah. This movie had a stronger impact
than I ever thought it would. I just heard mutant
bear movie. I said, okay, that's enough to keep
me. But everything you just said is enough to,
well, the schlock is getting me into the door.
But what you just said is keeping me in my seat.
I'm like, okay, I can sit with this movie. I
can grapple with this movie. I liked a lot of
choices with the camera. I like the direction.
For example, the whole sequence when they are
down in the tunnel hiding from the bear. This
shot, this whole scene to me is the best of the
movie because you have the... The soundtrack
of the bear and men screaming, you can only hear
the terror, which I find very effective. And
everyone down below is as still as death. Like
they're so quiet because they're petrified, right?
If you make a sound, you're dead. And Frankenheimer
is visually communicating by just focusing on
people's eyes because now people are just communicating
with their eyes. And there's some like, maybe
it's the diopter shot. I can't tell. Or it looked
like that. But I just found that scene as suspenseful
as it could be in this movie. With the sounds
and the lack of sounds as well. Yeah, I love
that whole sequence. Yeah, totally. I agree with
that for sure. And if I can just bring up one
more example of a scene that I really loved formally,
it's actually just the beginning of the movie
where before the credits, all we see is like
three beams of light. It's like flashlights that
are being carried by the lumberjacks before they
are killed by the monster. And the only thing
on the soundtrack is like the sound of wind and
like some of the animals in the forest. It's
really creepy and minimalist. And then... That
cuts to like the men's corpses the following
morning. And there's like classical music on
the soundtrack. I was like, oh, that's a weird
choice. Where is this coming from? And then it
very slowly dissolves to a performance space
where Talia Shire's character is playing the
cello during a performance. And that whole opening
is really strange and kind of like dreamlike
almost. And I was like totally hooked. And then
I think it does kind of go downhill from there.
But that opening really grabs you. I agree. This
is the John Frankenheimer of Manchurian Candidate
of all those other movies. You're like, oh, he
could do it. He could elevate this movie. But
then, yeah, it just devolves into nonsense by
the end. With that said, I love in the end sequence,
it involves a lake at night and there's a lot
of fog on this lake. I just found the whole thing
visually striking and really beautiful. I was
like, I love. everything i'm seeing right now
and then that dumb bear costume enters yeah it
could have been so great if just the monster
itself was like looked a little better you know
or a lot better a lot better yeah yeah and some
other stuff i'm sorry i'm gonna look up a character's
name real quick because i can't remember what
it is offhand it has to do with that ending though
let's see here Yeah, so there's another Native
American character named Ramona, who's kind of
John Hawk's significant other in the movie. And
Ramona's grandfather, I think, Hector, is kind
of along for the ride. He doesn't really have
a lot to do. Maybe that's part of the, he might
be part of the campy category for me, to be honest,
which is kind of unfortunate. Played by the same
actor who appears in Little Big Man. What's his
name? I feel like I should call him out. George
Clutezi. Canadian First Nations actor. Anyway,
like in that ending, you know, like he kind of
is just like is fodder for the bear. He's killed
almost immediately. But like the moment really
falls flat. And it's like, oh, this could have
been like a really striking moment with that
atmosphere and the fog and the lake. And then,
you know, it's just kind of a wasted moment.
So it's like it looks great and it should be
better. But it is like formally a striking scene
for sure. But let's talk about the bad stuff,
because obviously there's a lot of bad stuff,
too. You know, you probably have to start with
the bear costume, right? I mean, it's so, it's
laughable in this movie. It's, it's, but it's
like, confusedly so. Like, what, why did, who
did, how did this thing pass any sort of test?
Like, did the, is that on the producer to say,
well, well, well, this is not what we're going
to put on camera, right guys? Like it is so bad.
Yeah, it is. It's yeah, it should be like inexcusable.
Somebody along the line should have been like,
we are not doing this, you know? Yeah. But why
is it bad? Let's let's be clear for our listeners.
Let's be good critics. Why is it bad? I think
the it's like I think it's a poorly made rubber
type suit. So when the actor inside is running,
the thing just kind of flops around. It looks
like it's on wheels at times, the way it moves
through the forest. And it could have been on
wheels. I've seen that in other movies of this
ilk. Yeah, it's just not a believably animalistic
suit. Yeah, and I think because it is just like
a big rubber thing. Like a big rubber salami,
basically, you know? I think another critic used
that line. But, you know, I think like because
of that, we barely ever see, we don't really
get a good look at it. Like usually it's like
split second shots or it's from the distance
when it's like not really lit very well, you
know? And obviously that makes it even worse.
If you can't even see the monster and it's like,
what I see of it's bad, but I don't necessarily
know what I'm seeing. That's just the worst of
both worlds, you know? Yeah. I think the scale
of this creature is way off. Like, I don't understand
how tall it is. Different scenes have it being
the size of like a tree, like gargantuan. But
then there are some shots. There's so much close
ups of this thing that I don't really get a sense
of it. Yeah. Yeah. It also doesn't make narrative
sense because there's a line of dialogue. I think
the main character, Dr. Verne, is saying like,
you know, this seems to be an amalgamation of
all the creatures in the forest, like going through
evolution at a rapid pace. But like. sort of
like a human fetus does. So that kind of brings
in that theme, you know? I don't know if the
science of that is accurate, but I'm not like,
I'm obviously not a doctor, so I can't speak
to that. But anyway, the character is like, this
creature seems to be all the animals of the forest
put together. And then you see this thing and
it's just like a sloppy, bloody bear. It's like,
what's going on here? It makes no sense. Well,
that's a holdover from the chimera idea that
they had. Yeah. But you would think then they
would like cut that line of dialogue or something,
you know? You would think. Right. In a more carefully
made movie. Yeah. I know you said you had other
stuff in the bad category. What else do you have?
Well, two things. So the whole attack with the
raccoon, A, was extremely campy, but it also
made me question the treatment of animals on
this movie. Like with that raccoon, that raccoon
looked scared. Like it looked, it was in distress.
And I know the 70s with these creature features
didn't always have the best track record with
taking care of their animals. So I want to call
that out. Yeah. I still don't really understand
why this public health worker is contacted to
work for the EPA. Yeah. That just seemed like,
well, we need you to do this, so we're going
to do it for the sake of the plot. Come on, Seltzer.
You could have justified it a little bit more.
Yeah. Why not just make him an employee for the
EPA? That's like a much easier way to set it
up. Bingo. There you go. Yeah. I thought that
was weird too. With the raccoon thing, if I may,
can I add something real quick? Sorry. My research,
I did learn that like, so like the American Humane
Society did monitor like animal treatment at
this time in like the late seventies, but they
were not present on like every production. They
just kind of had to get like, you know. paperwork
and like reports and stuff like that. So I learned
that like during the filming of that scene, the
actor was told to like. to terrorize the raccoon
and hit it and kill it. And like the actor at
first was like, no, I don't want to do that.
Like, I'm not going to kill a raccoon for this.
And Frankenheimer was like, no, just like beat
it up, like smash it against the wall. So like
one of the crew members told the American Humane
Society about this. And like somebody from the
AHS did go to the set and like stop them from
killing this raccoon. From what I read, Frankenheimer
wanted to throw the raccoon in the fire and kill
it. And like then they had to use a dummy instead
because like. the AHS representative was there.
So you're right to call out that scene. That
was an animal clearly being mistreated and it's
a hard scene to watch. I hate everything you
just said. Thank you for sharing it, but that
makes me so uncomfortable. Yeah, it's rough.
That belongs in the bad category for sure. That's
pretty terrible. Different time, I suppose, but
that doesn't age well, right? That's like a dated
bad. type of thing. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, my
main criticism was with the ending of this film.
I think it ends way too abruptly. We don't get
any resolution, closure with the baby subplot,
with Talia Shire. They just take off in a plane,
and yeah, spoiler alert, there's another mutant
bear out there, which is where this movie has
gone. By the end of this movie, we only care
about the monster. But there's that movie from
the beginning with the whole emotional roller
coaster of will she keep the baby or not that
we don't get any closure on. And in a movie like
this, I do need that closure. This isn't a movie
where I needed an open -ended mystery. I need
to know how this couple fares in the aftermath
of this horrific weekend in the woods. Yeah.
Yeah, 100 % agree. That to me is the most emotionally
effective subplot in the movie, and it goes nowhere.
You don't find out what happens with it. It's
very frustrating. Terrible. Yeah. You do find
out what happens in the novelization, but maybe
I'll just, I won't go into detail about that.
If anybody, I don't know who would want to read
the novelization after watching this movie, but
if you do want to, they wrap up that story a
little bit more. Maybe I'll tell you off camera
a little more about it. All right. But I think
you hit the nail on the head when you said that
all the movie cares about at the end is the monster.
And that's maybe the worst part of this movie,
which is unfortunate because we're on a monster
movie podcast. But, you know, like, yeah, there's
a lot that's compelling and kind of admirable
about this movie at first. And then it just all
falls apart. And even like formally, I feel like
there are way too many scenes towards the end
where like it's so repetitive. It's the same
thing over and over again. It's like. A long,
slow, silent scene where there are a bunch of
close -ups of the actors waiting in suspense,
and then suddenly a loud musical sting, and this
terrible -looking bear jumps out of nowhere,
and then the music's really loud and abrasive
for a while, and then they escape, and then the
same thing happens. It's just a very poorly made
movie in the end. Maybe not initially, but like,
yeah, wasted opportunity, because it could have
been way better than it is. Totally, yeah. Oh,
man, so frustrating. But where this movie also
is bad, I find it charmingly campy, wonderfully
insane, just gonzo crazy moviemaking. Maybe I
didn't use that term properly. No, I agree for
sure. It is gonzo. Yeah. I mean, the sleeping
bag scene, right? That's got to be a campy moment
number one. It's incredible. Number one. Number
one. Well, number one is when the giant fish
leaps out of the water. Good point. It foreshadows
the effects you're going to see later in this
movie. I went, oh, no. If that's what we have
in store here, this movie's not going to be what
it was in the beginning. Yeah, yeah, for sure.
And like that happens when Bob is fishing and
then they like cook and eat the fish. And it's
like, dude, you just saw like a 10 foot fish
jump out of the water right next to you. Maybe
you should not be eating this fish right now,
you know? Yeah, that nighttime attack when the
bear attacks the camp. It's like what we love
in King Kong Lives. It's a quintessential. Everything
goes bananas at once. Cars explode. There's bodies
on fire. It's just pandemonium. Yeah. Totally
ridiculous, yeah. And, like, it defies the laws
of physics. Like, a human body just, like, erupts
into, like, feathers, you know? It's, like, so
bizarre, that moment. It was that. Oh yeah. When
the bear knocks anybody, they go flying, you
know, a hundred yards. It's very funny. The decapitation
came out of nowhere. Sick fact about me. I love
a decapitation in a movie when it's just like
comes out of nowhere and you're like, Oh, that
guy just lost his head. Yeah. It's a, it's a
great, reliable, gross out moment. For sure.
It's so jarring. The bear at the end goes like
full like wolf and the three little pigs and
just blows the house down. Just knocks it to
smithereens. And I'm like, oh my God, what is
happening right now? It was so fun. Yeah. That
reminded me of King Kong lives that moment in
the climax of King Kong lives when he like rips
off like the roof of the barn that they're hiding
in or whatever, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's
all about connections on Camp Kaju. There's one
more if I may. Yeah, absolutely. It's with the,
first of all, well, the title Prophecy, I don't
understand. I could say it's a bad title because
unless it's like this movie is a prophetic message
about the environment, but I think it's a bad
title. But what's campy about it is there's a
subtitle, which is The Monster Movie. It's literally
called Prophecy the Monster Movie as if somebody
went and said, hey, we have to add this because
otherwise nobody knows what it's about. So I
think it's campy that it's called the Monster
Movie. Yeah. It kind of makes sense because the
name Prophecy does not suggest a monster movie.
So it's just like a weird conflation, you know?
Yeah. It's like a parentheses. Yeah. Just in
case you watch this movie and you're not sure
what you're watching, it is indeed a monster
movie. Yeah, all of that, obviously super, very,
very campy. I briefly mentioned the Hector character
before, who I think, unfortunately, I think he's
the campiest example of the sort of simplistic
mysticism of the movie, where he's like, you
know. all god's creatures are are one i think
it's something like that and like he doesn't
really say any more than that and it's like oh
it's it's hard to know the point of that character
and then he's kind of just like suddenly killed
at the end and you're like oh i guess he didn't
really have a point that's not campy in like
a very funny way like it's more of like an unfortunate
unsettling way but i did find that character
pretty campy yeah Yeah, like all this, like,
you know, giant fish, like a giant tadpole that's
the size of a frog. All that stuff is so ridiculous.
Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, definitely a lot
of campy, a lot of bad and some good. So now
it's time to give the movie a rating. Is it our
highest rating? It's a timeless classic. It definitely
stands the test of time. Our second rating, there
may be some antiquated moments, but overall it's
great. It stands the test of time. Our third
rating, it may be historically significant or
just fun, but it does not stand the test of time.
And our lowest rating, it is not worth revisiting.
It definitely does not stand the test of time.
Tough choice. Do you... Do you want to go first?
Is that, is it all right? I'll go first. Cause
this was your pick. So I'll give you the, you
know, the honors there, but okay. I was pleasantly
taken with this film. I love a camp fest. I think
this movie puts the camp and camp Kaiju. So,
you know, if it's ever playing at a screening,
I'm there. I, you know, so, so I think it's campy
in all the best ways. But I also found it surprisingly
deep in its thematic messaging. There are some
bad things, especially that thing with the raccoon.
So I cannot give it our highest honor. I am sorry
to say I can't do that. But I can give it our
second highest. I think there are antiquated
moments in racial caricatures, in animal abuse.
Those sound really terrible now that I say it
out loud. Those are bad. Those are bad. But this
movie is so dumb that it's a thrill ride for
warts and all. So I think it does stand the test
of time. Nice. I love that. I wish I could give
it the same rating, but I think I will give it
one rating less than that. I'm not going to give
it our lowest rating because there is a lot of
stuff to admire about this movie. And I think
it's trying, even if it doesn't succeed. So yeah,
this movie. It's maybe sort of historically significant.
I think it's an interesting reflection of when
it was made. And it's certainly fun at times.
Like you said, a total thrill ride. You never
know what's going to happen next. But it is frustrating,
like the wasted opportunities. I think it's ultimately
pretty poorly made. I think a lot of its themes
are pretty simplistic. Even if I do admire what
they're trying to get at, there's not a lot of
depth to them. And then, of course, just like
the monster elements, the horror elements are
pretty poorly done, I would say. So there's a
lot that I like about this movie, but I don't
think it stands the test of time. It is worth
watching, though, for anybody that has not seen
it. It is so interesting. Please, folks, let
us know your thoughts on this one -of -a -kind
movie. Yeah. One -of -a -kind. Absolutely. Yeah.
This was a fun one. A lot to talk about. I'm
not going to forget this movie anytime soon.
Next time on Camp Kaiju, we'll be going back
to the silent era and talking about Lon Chaney's
Phantom of the Opera. Thank you again for hanging
out, friends. Please rate and review wherever
you listen. You can also share this podcast with
a friend, subscribe to the website, and send
us listener comments at campkaiju at gmail .com
or on Instagram. Links in the show notes. If
you'd like to be a featured voice on the show,
leave a voicemail at 612 -470 -2612 telling us
about your favorite monster movies and memories.
Please check out our website, CampKaijuPodcast
.com for more information. Camp Kaiju is recorded
in Minneapolis, St. Paul with Media's Mailbox
Music by Ben Cook Feltz. Thanks, friends. And
until next time, stay campy. Camp Kaiju is sponsored
by Zach Linder and the Zach Pack, powered by
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in the show notes. It's a tadpole. I told you
things grow big here.