But it's got to be Dr. Jeffrey Garth, right?
The worst part of this movie. Yes. Boo. Boo.
Boo. And the amount of screen time we spend on
trying to tie Dr. Garth's bow tie. What's going
on? I did not like that either. I didn't understand.
It's like, what? This has to have some sort of
relevance later. Yeah, it did. It kept going.
Yes, very weird. Hello and welcome to Camp Kaiju
Monster Movie Podcast. We're your hosts, Matt
Levine and Vincent Hannum. And we are talking
about all our favorite monster movies, the good,
the bad, and the downright campy, and asking
if they stand the test of time. Traditional kaiju
creature features, space invaders, the supernatural,
and everything in between. All strange beasts
welcome here. Camp Kaiju is sponsored by Zach
Linder and the Zach Pack, powered by Coldwell
Banker Realty. Your source for real estate, home
rehab, fixing and flipping for investor clients,
and residential buyers. Reach out to the Zach
Pack today for real estate services. Follow the
Zach Pack on social media and contact the Zach
Pack for investment opportunities. Link in the
show notes. Look at me. What do you see in my
eyes? Death. Do you like jewels, Lily? This is
very old and very beautiful. Please don't come
any closer. Her pulse is weak, Dr. Goth. Growing
weaker. All your skill can't help her now. She's
under a spell that can be broken only by me.
Or death. I am Dracula's daughter. Hey Vincent,
how you doing tonight? I'm excited to talk about
this movie. We have Naomi on, which I'm always
excited about. Yeah. Thank you for having me.
Yeah. How are you doing? I'm doing great. I was
super excited that you guys wanted me on this
episode because I have never seen this movie
and good friends show you good movies and that
is what happens. So thank you for having me.
Very happy to be here. Well, thank you as always
for joining us. We really love having you on
the show. Really appreciate your unique perspective
on movies, just how many movies you've seen.
It boggles the mind how many movies you watch.
And always a pleasure to talk with you about
movies. So thanks again for joining us. Of course,
of course. Dracula's Daughter actually was my
130th film that I've watched in 2025. So it was
kind of satisfying to have a nice number on that
one. That makes me think I'm going to check out
my letterbox right now. And not the Camp Kaiju
profile, shameless plug, but my personal one
where I watched non -monster movies. This year,
I've watched 21 movies. Well, that's reasonable.
You know, 130 is just bonkers. And I'm aware
of that. It's high even for me. I thought it
would be higher, though. Yeah, January is cold
and long and as is February. So, you know, you
got to do something. And Vincent, you have a
lot of reasons for only seeing 21 movies this
year. You have a lot going on. So, you know,
don't you shouldn't feel too bad about that.
I feel terrible about it. Shame. I bring shame
to my movie podcast. Well, it's something to
work on, you know, but we all we all have things
we strive for. Tonight on the episode, we're
talking about Dracula's Daughter, like Naomi
said, from 1936, direct sequel to the original
Dracula from 1931. A lot to Dracula's Daughter,
just a lot going on. Very complicated production
backstory, lots of themes, lots of kind of groundbreaking,
but, you know, questionable representations.
So a lot to dive into. Before we get to that,
though, I'm just going to cover our nuts and
bolts real quick. Seems like a weird way to say
it, but... Sorry. I think it's just the way that
I said it. Anyway, thank you all for hanging
out, friends. Please rate and review Camp Kaiju
wherever you listen. You can also send us listener
comments at campkaiju at gmail .com. On our Instagram
page, at camp underscore kaiju is another way
that you can leave us your comments. If you'd
like to be a featured voice on the show, give
us a call and leave a voicemail at 612... telling
us about your favorite monster movies and memories.
Finally, please check out our website, campkaijupodcast
.com, for more reviews and special content. Merch
is also available at campkaiju .threadless .com.
I believe we have a new -ish t -shirt, don't
we, Vincent? New -ish at this point, yes. And
in fact, we have some people snapping it up already.
If you are a fan of Nick Adams and or classic
Godzilla invasion of Astro Monster type stuff,
join the official unofficial Nick Adams fan club
with your Camp Kaiju t -shirt, which features
the face of Nick Adams on your Nick Adams t -shirt.
Does it feature his voice as well? Does it just
like randomly talk every once in a while? We
don't have enough patrons to fulfill that wish,
sadly. Someday, perhaps. On that subject, become
a patron. You can do so at patreon .com slash
campkaiju. You'll get discounts, priority comments,
and access to any live events. Thank you to all
of our current patrons, Jason, Chris, Sean, Peggy,
and our anonymous patron. We really do appreciate
you very much. Thank you again. One last thing
to mention, the three of us, all three of us,
are going to be doing trivia in early May. And
Naomi, this is kind of your trivia show that
Vincent and I are crashing just for one session
in May. Do you want to talk about trivia at all
in the upcoming Hangouts? Yeah, I'm honestly
super excited. I do trivia the first Monday of
every month at an Indeed brewery in the Ox Taproom.
It's called Film Friends and it's free to play.
It's an entirely self -produced event. So I write
all the questions myself and a rotating guest
co -host. Usually it's just one, but when you
guys come on, it'll be two, which I'm super excited
to kind of see what that dynamics like and share
you guys' perspective and taste with our regulars
and anyone else new that comes by. If people
want to kind of keep up on it, we have a Facebook
page. Just look up Film Friends Movie Trivia
on Facebook or follow me on Instagram. But yeah,
it's a great time. People should come out. The
prizes are wonderful. You get tickets from the
Trilon, tickets from the Heights Theater, and
then usually a nice gift card from Indeed Brewery.
So it's super fun to play and a great way to
build community around a shared love of film.
And we'll put links to... film friends and your
Instagram in the show notes. And at this time,
I just got to say, if you are a patron of Camp
Kaiju, you are entitled to one VIP drink, alcoholic
or non -alcoholic. Me and Matt, we're going to,
you know, we'll buy you a drink that's coming
from our Patreon coffers as a perk for our supporters
who we really appreciate. So if you're on the
fence, if you're out there thinking. Ooh, is
this something I really want to do? Go for it.
Join the club over at Patreon. Even if you're
not local, we're sending out free gifts all the
time. Stickers, discounts on shirts, you name
it. Me and Matt, you know, we want to support
those who support us. So check it out. Cool.
Yeah, it sounds good. It'll be fun to meet some
Camp Pride you peeps in person. I really hope
we get some because looking at our analytics
on our podcasting back end here, a majority of
our listeners are local. So we know you're out
there. Come out and say hi. Come hang out. Be
a film friend. Yeah, film friends. And, you know,
if you become a patron, get a free drink out
of it. It's win win. Yeah. Sounds like a good
deal. Yeah. I personally can't wait. Our shared
trivia session is going to be Monday, May 5th.
But Naomi's trivia is the first Monday of every
month at Indeed Brewing. So yeah, should be a
good time. Yeah. Yeah. Can't wait to have you
guys. Thank you. Thank you again. As usual on
Camp Kaiju, we always try to highlight a monster
movie that came out around this time in monster
movie history. I have some listed on our Google
Doc here. Did any of those movies jump out at
you guys or were there any others that you wanted
to call out? There are so many. I mean, oh man,
Trilogy of Terror. It's a classic and a couple
that I've never heard of, but I want to see immediately.
The Mangler, 95 flick about a haunted laundry
machine. You know, I'm a sucker for killer machine
movies. I'm there for it. I read that plot synopsis
and I was like, how I have not already seen this
movie. This sounds incredible. There's another
one. Sorry, go ahead. No, you go ahead. Well,
I was just going to say on the subject of really
crazy sounding plot synopses that I haven't for
movies that I haven't seen. There's a movie called
Bug from 1975. Not the William Friedkin one from
the 2000s, which is also very good. But the one
from 1975 is about mutant cockroaches that can
start fires, which is an amazing idea for a movie.
So that has skyrocketed to the top of my must
-watch list. I just wanted to put that out there.
Wow. That sounds good. When I'm looking at this
list, The Descent pops out for me. I just feel
like there should be more horror movies than
caves. It's really scary. There's a lot of possibilities.
for creatures, for whatever. And I really like
the main character, Sarah, in that I think she's
a really good final girl. And she shows a lot
of strength and humanity and not some of the
purity kind of things that go along with other
final girls. So for me, it's The Descent. Love
that one. Agreed. That is an incredible movie.
Really scary, but also very complex and believable
characters. There's just more of an emotional
charge to that movie than I think you sometimes
get with horror movies. Totally. And it's sort
of refreshing to see I cannot think of any men
in that cast. They're either hardly any or absolutely
none. I'll have to check. But so that's kind
of a fun part of it, too. Sort of different dynamic
there. Cool. Definitely. I was actually thinking
with Dracula's daughter, this movie might be
better if there were just no men in the cast
at all. And it's like only, you know, Dracula's
daughter and like the other female characters.
But we'll we'll talk about that in a little bit
here. I think totally. Yeah, I mean, I was thinking
it would be better if like Dana Carvey was playing
Garth in this movie. The other the other cinematic
Garth that I know about now. I would have liked
him a lot more if it was. Garth Algar from Aurora,
Illinois. Yeah. Yeah, Garth Algar is way more
charming than Dr. Jeffrey Garth in this movie.
Really insufferable character, but we'll get
to that soon. Sorry, didn't mean to jump the
gun there. No, I think we're all in agreement
on that. Hey, I'm just glad that somebody else
thought of the other Garth when seeing that.
Oh, yeah. Not just me. The true Garth. Yeah.
Just real quick, I wanted to shout out one upcoming
release called In the Lost Lands. It's directed
by Paul W .S. Anderson, who has a pretty decent
monster movie resume to his name. He did Event
Horizon, Alien vs. Predator, a lot of other ones
too that I can't really remember right now. But
it has Mia Jovovich in it. She plays like a sorceress
in an ancient land where people can like shapeshift
into werewolves. So this is another movie where
I'm like, I know nothing about this, but the
synopsis itself, I have to see it. It sounds
incredible. Wow. It's based on a short story
by George R .R. Martin. I did not know that,
actually. Wow. This? Yeah. Wow. And then real
quick before we dive into our movie for the night,
a couple of things coming up on Camp Kaiju. On
our next episode, we'll be talking about Godzilla
vs. Mothra, which I'm very excited about, getting
back into some... classic kaiju although that
one's from the 90s i think is that right yeah
right it's from 92 not to be confused with mothra
versus godzilla from the early 60s the pleasure
and sometimes the difficulty of watching all
these movies is just keeping all them straight
the titles are so interchangeable sometimes but
i like all the early 90s godzilla movies that
we've seen really excited for that one yeah me
too And then the following episode, we'll be
talking about The Island of Dr. Moreau, a notorious
flop, maybe the most disastrous production in
Hollywood history. Frank Olson is going to be
joining us for that episode. I've never seen
it, always wanted to, and cannot wait to talk
about that. Same. I can't wait to listen to that
episode. I am Dracula. A moment ago, I stumbled
upon a most amazing phenomenon. Something so
incredible, I mistrust my own judgment. Look.
Dracula. The very mention of the name brings
to mind things so evil, so fantastic, so degrading.
You wonder if it isn't all a dream, a nightmare.
Rats. Rats. Rats. Thousands. Millions of them.
But no, this is no dream. This is Dracula. The
original terrifying story of a maniac and a man
who lived after death, lived on human blood.
took the form of a vampire bat, and lured innocent
girls to a fate truly worse than death. Dracula?
What's he done to you, dearie? Tell me. He came
to me. He opened a stain in his arm, and he made
me drink. When this dead hand moves, the monster
created by a man they called mad is turned loose
to strike terror into the hearts of men. To shock
women into uncontrolled hysteria. To prey upon
the innocence of children. This is the story
you've heard about, talked about. The spine -tingling,
blood -chilling story that stunned your emotions.
Frankenstein. Don't touch that! was killed? Yes.
Find something? Animal tracks. Whoever is bitten
by a werewolf and lives becomes a werewolf himself.
Oh, don't hand me that. You're just wasting your
time. The wolf bit you, didn't he? Yeah. Yeah,
he did. You wouldn't want to run away with a
murderer, would you? Oh, Larry, you're not. You
know you're not. I killed Baylor. I killed Richardson.
If I stay here any longer, you can't tell who'll
be next. Tonight, though, we are here to talk
about Dracula's Daughter from 1936. This, like
I said before, is a direct sequel to Dracula,
although there were five years in between the
two movies. What are your personal histories
with this movie? For both of you. I... I'm sorry.
No, I'm sorry. Go ahead. I'll call on people
from now on. Welcome to the show. It happens.
My... I love talking about classic universal
monster movies. I grew up on this stuff before
I even have like memories of watching movies.
I was always watching classic universal flicks.
However, I somehow never even knew about this
movie until just a few years ago. Cause like
I'd always seen Bela Lugosi's Dracula, but it,
but the sequel, the direct sequel never crossed
my mind. Then I watched it and I knew I started
to get into like the reputation of the film with
its queer subtext and readings, which I'll say
more about in a little bit, but I've seen it
twice since then. Sometimes I watch it and I
really love it. I'm like, this is one of the
best classic universal monster movies. And then
sometimes I watch it and I'm like, eh, I could,
I could, I, you know, I really mixed feelings.
Upon recent rewatch, I'm back into really appreciating
this movie again, despite the criticisms that
I do have. What about you, Naomi? What's your
history with this film? I had no history with
this film. I had heard about it, but I'm by no
means like a universal monster scholar or have
seen all of them or, you know, a few have crossed
my path. Like I've seen the original Dracula.
I've seen Wolfman. I've seen, you know, a few
other ones. But it was honestly such a pleasure
to watch this. I saw it last night for the first
time and then I actually watched it again today
because I didn't realize it was so short. And
I was like, well, you know, let me see that again.
Let's see that again. And it was great. I was
surprised how deeply psychological it was and,
you know, how such an old movie could be about
like such big things. internal horror instead
of external which seems more like a typical of
monster movies yeah yeah similar for me i had
never really heard about this movie until maybe
like a year ago and i was just researching other
classic universal horror movies from the 30s
that i hadn't seen yet and you know i think in
some circles this movie is very well known and
highly discussed But, you know, in other circles,
like, I think, like, maybe the average horror
movie fan might not know about this, even though
there's the Dracula pedigree, there's the Universal
sort of studio backing. So, yeah, I was excited
to see it. I think, like, Vincent, you've pointed
out that I like this word a lot, but it's very
messy. There's a lot to, like, pick apart and
kind of dive into in this movie, which is, like,
my favorite kind of film. But there are definitely
flaws to it, which we'll talk about shortly here.
Yeah, and I just want to say... You know, like,
I don't think you can talk about this movie without
unpacking the queer readings of the film. And
I just, like, for listeners, I just want to be
clear that I, in whatever I, whatever takes I
have of this film and the characters, I am by
no means going to interpret the queer experience
from, like, me, Vincent Hannum. I'll try to be
very judicious in just like reading other people's
quotes and referencing other critics when we
get into some of those thematic messages of the
film. Same. That's a very important, you know,
prologue, I guess, thing to say up front. Yeah,
I mean, we'll quote some other critics' work.
But, you know, just speaking for myself, I don't
come from a LGBTQ background. So, you know, I'll...
certainly give my perspective on the film and
reference other critics, but you know, for other
people out there, please let us know what you
think about this movie. If you've seen it, maybe
this will inspire you to see it and let us know
what you think. I think that's thoughtful. Those
distinctions are good. You know, I, I definitely
wanted to be careful how I talk about this too,
but I would say. Yeah, the way you guys are kind
of approaching it, you know, kind of talking,
you know, quoting other people and so forth is
good. I could see it as a woman. I think that
gives me a somewhat a perspective on it, just
the dynamics you see between characters. And
without getting like too personal into my sexuality
or my identity, I do consider myself a queer
person. Maybe not in the same way she is. But
yeah, so I think I could. offer some thoughtful
perspective on it. Absolutely. And yeah, we'll
all bring our perspective to it. And you know,
this is why I love movies like this, because
any viewer probably will have a different response
and reaction to it. So yeah, a lot to talk about.
First, though, we're going to talk about the
crew of the film before we get into the really
fascinating meat and potatoes of it. We'll talk
about who was behind the scenes. I'll read about
Lambert Hillier, the director. He was mostly
a director for hire. He began in the silent era.
Silent era? He was known for his work on westerns.
Because, of course, at this time, if you were
working in Hollywood, you were typecast and pigeonholed
into your genre of choice. But he did branch
out into other genres. Dracula's Daughter being
a great example of a not western. And he also
directed the sci -fi film The Invisible Ray with
Boris Karloff. And this is fun. In 1943, he directed
the 15 -part Batman serial that later influenced
the Adam West TV show in the 60s. So yeah, that's
Lambert Hillier. It's a pretty cool background.
He definitely seems like a director for hire,
but I don't really mean that as a criticism.
Like, you know, in the studio era, there were
so many... So many directors who just kind of
were hired to work on whatever film they were
forced to direct, but still kind of injected
a lot of style, humor, entertainment, you know,
a lot of personality into it. So I'm not necessarily
saying that's true of Dracula's Daughter or Lambert
Hillier's work on this movie, but he directed
some fun stuff for sure. There was also a very
complicated screenplay process for this movie,
which I will try to convey as quickly as possible,
but we'll see how that goes. The only credited
screenwriter on the film is Garrett Fort, who
was well known for writing horror screenplays
in the 1930s. He either wrote the screenplay
or contributed work on Dracula, Frankenstein,
Island of Lost Souls, The Invisible Man, and
The Devil Doll, which is kind of like a snapshot
of some of the most famous horror movies of the
decade. So definitely a well -known horror writer
from that era, Garrett Fort. However, six other
writers were also credited with contributing
outlines, treatments, and early screenplay drafts.
One of those writers was John Balderston, who
had contributed work to the screenplays for Dracula
and Frankenstein alongside Garrett Fort. Balderson
was a playwright and started off as a journalist.
He had adapted a stage version of Dracula for
the American stage in 1927. That's actually the
stage version that made Bela Lugosi a star because
he was in that theatrical version of Dracula.
Balderson also wrote the screenplay for The Mummy,
an early draft of The Invisible Man that was
not used. And he contributed to the stories of
Bride of Frankenstein and co -wrote Mad Love,
starring Peter Lorre. Peter is still stuck in
the broom closet downstairs. Maybe we can ask
him about that if he's ever met this guy before.
I'll send a message down with tonight's bucket
of fish heads. Sounds good. It'll be at the very
bottom after he eats all the fish heads. Matt,
I don't have the notes pulled up right in front
of me, but do you have information about David
L. Selznick and his workings with Baldristen
on the initial earliest version of this script?
Yeah, I kind of saved that for the production
backstory section, but we can talk about that
now if you prefer. No, we can save it. Okay.
We'll save it. A little foreshadowing. Yeah,
yeah. Yeah, David O. Selznick will make an appearance
in this very convoluted production backstory
for this movie. That tracks. Yeah. Get him in
there. You're right. He was seemingly involved
in like 90 % of all American movies in the 30s,
so why not Dracula's daughter? Kind of to Vincent's
point, Balderson did write an early draft of
a screenplay for Dracula's Daughter when the
rights were owned by MGM and maybe David O. Salzman
was going to produce the movie. Balderson's script
was deemed so illicit it would never get past
the censors. That always is kind of music to
my ears when I hear that. Did you read what was
involved in that early script? Yes. And again,
I saved some of that for later in the Google
Doc here. Is that all right? Sure. What intrigue?
I know, I can't wait. There might be a little
S &M involved, so stay tuned. I'll just real
quickly go through some of the other writers
that were involved with the screenplay. Kurt
Newman contributed a short treatment that was
not used. Newman would go on to be a celebrated
sci -fi writer and director in the 50s, making
such movies as The Fly, Rocketship XM, Kronos,
and She -Devil. So he would kind of rise to prominence
a couple decades later, but was still involved
in a lot of screenplays in the 1930s. Another
writer, R .C. Sheriff, which is a great name.
wrote another early draft that was rejected.
Sheriff also wrote the screenplay or co -wrote
the screenplay for The Invisible Man and other
celebrated films like Goodbye, Mr. Chips and
Odd Man Out. So just a lot of kind of well -known
writer names involved with this project, including
Bram Stoker himself. He is the only other writer
credited in the opening credits for Dracula's
Daughter, supposedly for providing the source
of the film, a short story called Dracula's Guest
from 1914. There's some controversy whether that
story was the excised first chapter of the novel
Dracula, an early draft of a scene that was not
used in the novel, or a totally separate story
that Bram Stoker wrote. This is all kind of irrelevant
because it has nothing to do with the movie at
all. I do think it's funny that Bram Stoker's
name is in the opening credits, but the film
is nothing at all like the short story. So one
of many cases of Hollywood giving credit to an
artist who maybe had a limited impact on the
film itself. That's fantastic, Matt. You are
always so meticulous in your notes. I appreciate
it. Thank you. So just going back to RC Sheriff,
he and James Whale were buddies. They worked
together on Journey's End, which was a stage
play that Sheriff wrote starring Colin Clive
over in England. So these guys come over to Hollywood
and start making movies at Universal, The Invisible
Man being another collaboration. James Whale
was originally slated to direct Dracula's Daughter.
He had just come off the success of Bride of
Frankenstein. And for me, this is one of the
greatest cases of what if. What if James Whale,
no, nothing against Lambert Hillier, but James
Whale has such a strong visual style. And as
a queer director himself, you know, I've heard
arguments that, you know, maybe this was a story
more apt for him to tell than someone else. So
all that said, James Whale absolutely did not
want to direct this movie. In fact, he tried.
Again, lots of sources I'll cite later. There
was there's rumors that he wanted R .C. Sheriff
to continue turning in drafts that would be intentionally
rejected by the censor boards because he's like,
R .C., I don't want to do this movie. He wanted
to direct Showboat, a big, extravagant musical,
and he didn't want to be pigeonholed into the
horror film genre. And it worked. And James Whale
ultimately passed on the film. Dracula's daughter.
Now, the producers at Universal Studios at this
time, I love Hollywood history and especially
Universal Studios, one of the founding major
studios of Hollywood. And they were founded by
a family called the Lemleys. You had Carl Lemley
Sr. and his son, Jr. Carl Lemley Sr. hated horror
movies. He thought they were in poor taste. However,
he had given like this horror picture producing
job to his son, Carl, who was like a man about
town. He was very flashy. He liked to be a bigwig.
And, you know, he's only in his 20s when he produced
Dracula and Frankenstein in 31. And of course,
those were huge financial hits. And his father,
senior, said, OK, fine. Let's make horror movies.
However, by 1936, Carl Laemmle, senior, and I
guess junior, but I think it was the senior,
he had borrowed $1 million to help pay for the
studio from a company called Standard Capital
Corporation. And at the end of 1936, after Dracula's
Daughter had been released, The Lemleys could
not pay that money back. And subsequently, they
lost control of the studio to this corporation.
And with the Lemleys out, the new people in charge
did not want to finance horror movies anymore.
And you wouldn't see another horror movie from
Universal or really other major studios until
1939 with Son of Frankenstein. So there was a
real pause. On the whole genre for a number of
years as a result of this. Yeah, that's crazy.
Yeah, I didn't know about any of that stuff.
It makes me wonder if, you know, like the depression
had anything to do with the inability to for
him to pay back or or that family to to make
good on that. So I was thinking about that with
with Dracula's daughter. You know, it came out
like during the depression and it made me wonder
like like what kind of economic factors went
into. making the movie and how it was received
you know when it came out Yeah. And I was kind
of wondering too, if the start of the production
code kind of like put a damper on horror movies
a little bit too, because like in the early part
of the thirties, studios could get away with
a lot of violence and sex and nudity and adult
themes. And like, you know, movies were like
relatively permissive at the time, not as much
as they are now, but still there's kind of a
lot of shocking stuff in some of those early
thirties horror movies. But then in 1935, mostly
the production code really started. clamping
down on all kinds of Hollywood movies and like
very clearly saying what they could portray and
what they could not portray. And, you know, most
like graphic depictions of violence were off
limits. Any kind of like evil characters had
to be punished. There had to be some kind of
like moral retribution for those characters.
And I just kind of feel like the thrill of horror
movies is some of that stuff, like the violence
and like the amoral qualities and the thrill
of that. So like maybe when the production code
started like really enforcing censorship in Hollywood,
horror kind of went by the wayside a little bit.
Because then even in the 40s, when you do have
some of the like horror comedies of like Eben
Costello meet Frankenstein and stuff like that,
they're fun, but they're not scary at all. They're
like there's not any graphic violence in them
or anything. And like they're, you know, like
the Wolfman is pretty creepy. There are some
really good horror movies from the 40s. So I'm
not trying to say that there weren't. But, you
know, like pre -code horror is just a very different
beast from the horror movies that came out after
this time. And the British censor boards in the
30s, I believe, actually halted the import of
any American horror films. Like they just said
no. And that loss of market. also influenced
the decision to hold off on horror films from
the studios. I guess in short, there were a lot
of reasons why Dracula's Daughter was kind of
the last movie of Universal's initial, very popular,
very successful horror run and sort of the end
of an era in a way. So the cinematography is
by George Robinson, who does incredible work,
really eerie black and white cinematography in
this movie. He also shot Dracula and the Invisible
Ray. So it's kind of a... Small network of horror
and sci -fi artists and crew members all working
on this movie. It was edited by Milton Carruth,
who has a great resume. He edited All Quiet on
the Western Front, Shadow of a Doubt, Pillow
Talk, Imitation of Life. Some real Hollywood
classics on that list on his filmography. The
music is by Heinz Rohmheld, who's from Milwaukee.
I also am from the Milwaukee area, so I have
to shout that out. Judging by his name, there's
some German heritage there too, so I kind of
appreciate that. Romheld did uncredited music
on Gone with the Wind, composed soundtracks for
The Invisible Man, The Lady from Shanghai, many
others as well. And just the last crew member
that I want to recognize here is Albert D 'Agostino,
the art director. Part of the reason, I guess
the main reason I want to call them out is just
because the sets in this movie are so gorgeous.
They're huge and opulent and the kind of like
studio sets that you will never see anymore.
Like the 30s is just that classic era of like
jaw dropping studio sets. And Albert D 'Agostino
is largely responsible for that. He reused the
castle set from the original Dracula, but also
created many new and gorgeous sets for the movie.
I also wanted to say that he did the art direction
for The Magnificent Ambersons, Orson Welles'
best movie, not Citizen Kane in my opinion, and
one of the best American movies of all time.
So I had to work in The Magnificent Ambersons
shout out somehow. I was also really taken with
just the look and feel of the movie, like so
much so. I think atmospheric horror is just so
beautiful and really relies on that cinematography,
you know, to convey the dread, you know, instead
of the violence and all of that, you know, it
had that kind of German expressionism vibe to
it that you see in other movies like Metropolis
and, you know, just any movie that emphasizes
emotion and inner conflict, like over realism.
I thought it was, it was very beautiful. It was,
it was, I was so not surprised, but just in,
in awe. Yeah, agreed. Pretty much from the opening
shot, when we see two policemen like walking
down a really tall set of stairs towards the
bodies of Renfield and Dracula, which is off
screen at the beginning of the movie, like right
away, it's like, oh, this looks incredible. Like
this is synonymous with classic horror, you know,
just has that look to it. Yeah, totally. And,
you know, we just see that that Carfax Abbey
opening scene is so beautiful. And it reminded
me of other, you know, like William Friedkin's
Exorcist. That foreboding staircase. And it just
reminded me of that. And I wondered if it had
any influence on the cinematography in that movie.
Yeah. Yeah, that's a good point. I would not
be surprised. I mean, Friedkin, you know, huge
fan of classic horror. So I can definitely see
that. Yeah. Well, we can move into the cast of
the film a little bit. Does anybody want to talk
about Gloria Holden, who plays Dracula's daughter
in the movie? I didn't know much about her going
in. I still don't really know that much, except
something I read over and over was that she looked
down on horror and that she was not really proud
of her place in that movie. And I think that's
kind of interesting because she just was so good
and she gave a lot to it. But I think that there's
a possibility that that feeling maybe of not
liking horror may be translated into her character.
grappling with her own internal stuff. But yeah,
I just thought it was really interesting and
she did a good job. I thought she had a great
presence. She brought a lot of subtlety to the
character. Yeah, I would like to see more of
her movies, but I have not seen her in any other
roles that I know of. Yeah. I think she had a
somewhat short career. Like a year after Dracula's
Daughter, she was also in The Life of Emile Zola.
And that might be like her most well -known other
film that she was in. Aside from that, I think
it was a lot of supporting roles and a lot of
theater as well, from what I understand. Yeah.
I echo all that, Naomi. I want to talk about
a cast member who's not in the cast. Sorry, an
actor who's not in the cast. Bela Lugosi is not
in this movie. There's a dummy made up to look
like him in the very... beginning of this film.
It subsequently led on fire. But here's a fun
fact from one of my universal reference books.
So Bela Lugosi was paid off because at first
he was cast in the film. But when the script
went through all its changes, he was cut out
of it, but he was paid off $4 ,000. And according
to this book, that was $500 more than he had
earned. Starring in Dracula. Wow. That's kind
of sad. It's a little sad. But funny. Yeah. I
wonder what he thought of the finished version
of the film. Yeah, I think that about James Whale,
too. Like, what did they think? Yeah. Yeah. And
I know part of the reason. Oh, sorry. Oh, no.
Go ahead. I was going to say, Gloria Holden,
I think one reason she didn't like this role
very much is because she was really worried about
being typecast. Naomi kind of alluded to this
before, but she and Bela Lugosi talked about
that a little bit. And I think he kind of, you
know, he didn't sway her to not take the role,
obviously, since she's in the film. But I think
they kind of shared some of those fears because
that had already kind of started happening to
Lugosi a little bit after he had starred in Dracula
in 31. Yeah. Yeah. Couldn't help but kind of
like when I saw her performance, it really reminded
me of Sunset Boulevard. You know that, you know,
the Norma Desmond character, the dramatic, like
the delivery. And I just love kind of because
I know that movie pretty well. And having seen
this one for the first time, it's just like another
piece falls into place. Like when you see something,
you know what it was probably influenced by.
Like, you know, I've seen a lot of movies, but
it just that. the kind of thing that you learn
and that keeps me interested and keeps me passionate
about watching movies, just learning new things
all the time. And well, I guess that's not confirmed,
but it just really felt like it was, you know,
influenced by her performance in this movie.
I had the same thought, very similar performance
styles for sure. And even, you know, Dracula's,
or sorry, the Countess Zaleska's castle, even
has some kind of like similarities to Norma Desmond's
house in Sunset Boulevard. Definitely had the
same thought as you, Naomi. Yeah. Agreed, yeah.
Couldn't help but think that. Yeah. Maybe I'll
talk briefly about my least favorite cast member
in the movie, which is Otto Kruger. I'm a little
snarky about him in the Google Doc notes here.
I won't necessarily read all this out loud. Hey,
he's no Nick Adams, okay? Nobody is. I think
you can maybe say Otto Kruger is the exact opposite
of Nick Adams. And if Nick Adams over is, you
know, just like drowning in charisma, Otto Kruger
is entirely devoid of it, in my opinion. Sorry,
sorry, Mr. Kruger. But he plays Dr. Jeffrey Garth,
a psychiatrist. He originally made a big splash
on Broadway. He was kind of a matinee idol in
the 20s, which is sort of inexplicable to me,
but there you go. He later appeared in Saboteur,
the Hitchcock movie, Magnificent Obsession by
Douglas Sirk, and High Noon. So he was in some
great movies. It might not be his performance.
It might be the character that's so grating in
Dracula's Daughter. But we'll talk more about
that soon. Yeah, yeah. Marguerite Churchill plays
his ostensible girlfriend, Janet Blake. She's
also Dr. Garth's young secretary. The pretty
blonde type of character that you'd see in a
movie like this. Matt, as you wrote, she's inexplicably
in love with him. I agree. I wrote pick me on
mine. Kind of a pick me girl, you know? Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. She's kind of a fun character. I'll
save that for later. Sorry. Okay. She was a child
star. She was in a John Wayne movie, The Big
Trail. She appeared in a few other films. The
Walking Dead with Boris Karloff. That is an awesome
movie. And I highly recommend. It's a gangster,
because it was made at Warner Brothers, of course.
It's a gangster horror movie where he's kind
of a Frankenstein monster, of course. But check
it out if you ever get the chance. It sounds
great. Yeah. The cast also includes Irving Pichel
as Sandor. Pichel, I think is how you pronounce
his name. He started off in theater, then made
the switch to movies around the time that sound
entered cinema in the late 20s. Pachel appeared
in An American Tragedy, The Story of Temple Drake,
which was a very controversial pre -code adaptation
of a William Faulkner novel. Pachel was also
in Jezebel with Betty Davis. He had a pretty
interesting career. During World War II, he became
a director, making a lot of anti -Nazi, pro -British
movies to uplift morale for the war effort. However,
after the war, he was blacklisted as part of
the House Un -American Activities Commission's
investigations into communist sympathizers in
Hollywood. Just kind of a sad backstory here.
Pachel had indeed been a communist at one time,
but he may have actually been targeted because
he was Jewish and he was so adamantly anti -Nazi.
And there was actually quite a bit of anti -Semitism
in the HUAC trials in the 1950s. So whether it
was because Pachel used to be a communist or
because of anti -Semitist leanings for HUAC,
you know, is up for debate. But Pachel was blacklisted.
He had to make his last couple movies outside
of the United States. One of them included the
1950 sci -fi movie Destination Moon, which is
really great if you haven't seen that. Highly
recommended. Landmark science fiction movie.
Indeed. I have not seen that. I'm going to have
to write that down. Really gorgeous. I haven't
seen it either, actually. It's awesome. It's
the kind of space movie where everybody's walking
around on the moon without helmets, which just
kind of adds to the charm of it, you know? But
a really, really good movie, for sure. Awesome.
I'll check it out. Hedda Hopper. What? She's
in this movie. She has a bit role as a socialist,
Lady Esme Hammond. But come on, if you're in
tune with Hollywood history, Hedda Hopper, she
wrote a column in the 30s and 40s. Over 35 million
people read her words. How would you describe
it? She wasn't a critic. More of a gossip columnist,
I would say. That's it. Yeah. Yeah. All the social
goings on and controversies and scandals in Hollywood.
Hedda Hopper was there. And doesn't she have
a part in Sunset Boulevard? She does. Yeah. Playing
herself, I believe. Yeah. Yeah. It's a cool connection.
Yeah, it is. Cool. And then real quickly, Edward
Van Sloan is the only cast member to reappear
in Dracula's Daughter. He also played Professor
Van Helsing in the original Dracula. So he's
the only actor to appear in both these movies.
Minnesota, shout out. Yeah, that's right. He's
from Chaska. Oh, wow. Any Midwest connection,
we always have to point out on this show. No,
I think that's awesome. I had no idea. Yeah,
we love Edward Van Sloan. Production backstory.
It's a long one. Oh boy, lots of meat, lots of
potatoes. Again, the movie was supposedly based
on Dracula's Guest, the Bram Stoker story. Really,
it has more to do with some other earlier literary
influences like Carmilla, which was a novella
from 1872 by Joseph Sheridan Le Fanu. This is
commonly seen as one of the earliest works of
vampire fiction. It actually predated Stoker's
Dracula by 25 years. Carmilla also features a
lesbian relationship between a vampire antagonist
and a female victim, or numerous victims, I believe.
So really, Carmilla is more of a direct influence
on Dracula's daughter than the Stoker short story
is. Vincent, you kind of alluded to this before,
but David O. Selznick had originally bought the
rights to Dracula's Guest for MGM to produce
in 1933. There is, you know, some historians
say that maybe he just bought the rights so that
Universal would inevitably buy the rights from
MGM a couple years down the road because this
was, you know, a property that Universal definitely
would want to make into a movie for a direct
sequel to Dracula. Regardless, MGM still hadn't
made the movie in 19... when Universal was looking
for a sequel to Dracula. So that's exactly what
happened. Universal bought the rights from MGM
with the stipulation that the rights would revert
to MGM if Universal didn't begin production by
February of 1936. Sure enough, February of 1936
rolled around. Universal still hadn't started
production on the movie, so they rushed it into
production as quickly as they could with the
script still unfinished. And I think that maybe
explains some of the... you know, rushed feeling
and maybe some of the sense of like things missing
from the final version. Of course, the production
code censorship had a role to play in that as
well. Yeah, it was filmed in six weeks. I mean,
that seems kind of long for a Hollywood movie
at this time. You know, like some of them were
like two weeks and they're in the can, but a
longer, longer process on this one for sure.
Yeah. Well, it's beautiful. I'm glad they took
the time to execute it right. Yeah, although
it was a very chaotic production, partially because
they were working on the screenplay while they
shot it. Sorry, I'm just looking at my notes
here real quick. So yeah, I talked a little bit
about the screenplays earlier. So Balderson's
first version of the screenplay that he wrote
for MGM and Selznick was supposed to be a direct
follow -up to Dracula, in which Van Helsing returns
to Transylvania and kills Dracula's three brides,
but neglects to investigate a coffin. that contains
Dracula's daughter. The reason why this screenplay
would have had no chance to get past the censors
is because it was full of sadomasochistic themes,
including the suggestion that Dracula's daughter
tortured her male victims, and both she and her
victims received sexual pleasure from it, from
this torture. Wow. Yeah, I mean, of course, that
never would have passed the production code.
We never found out whether it would anyway, because
in 1934, when Universal bought the rights to
Dracula's Guest, they also bought the rights
to Balderson's Scenario and rejected it pretty
much immediately. They probably knew it wouldn't
pass muster with the PCA. That's crazy. I do
want to see that. Oh, yeah, me too. It makes
you wonder if they remade it today, you know,
at least somewhat faithfully, if they would try
to incorporate anything like that. Yeah, it'd
basically be the hostile movies if they made
that today, you know? No, it makes me think of
the Black Cat from Universal from 32, somewhere
around there. Bela Lugosi, Boris Karloff, but
there are explicit images of these sorts of chains
and whips and Satanists and a lot of that kind
of stuff. I'm not equating sadomasochism. with
satanism not doing that i'm just saying the black
cat features imagery belonging to both separate
interests interests yeah we're gonna get hate
mail from both satanists and sadomasochists now
good job Anyway, so yeah, that script treatment
was rejected almost immediately by Universal.
Then they commissioned another screenplay from
R .C. Sheriff. We talked about him before. Sheriff's
version of the screenplay began in the 14th century
and centered a little bit more on the Dracula
legend. Then that movie would kind of jump forward
to the present day when two different couples
would visit Transylvania and stumble upon Dracula's
castle. Dracula's daughter in Sheriff's screenplay
hypnotizes one of the men and forces him to do
her bidding. Von Helsing, as he's known in this
movie, is summoned to rescue the man, and the
ensemble of characters meets on a ship bound
for the Far East where the Countess is escaping
to. So this screenplay got far enough that the
PCA, the Production Code Administration, as well
as the British Board of Film Censors, both reviewed
Sheriff's script and took issue with it, maybe
not surprisingly. The British Board of Film Censors
said that it would require, quote, half a dozen
languages to adequately express the beastliness.
of that screenplay, which is an amazing quote.
I love that. Seems a little over the top, but
who knows? I haven't read it myself. Joseph Breen,
the head of the PCA, pretty much agreed with
that sentiment. He said that Sheriff's screenplay
contains countless offensive stuff, which makes
the picture utterly impossible for approval under
the production code. So yeah, I mean, it was
really clamping down on this time. Censorship
was really strict for Hollywood studios around
this era in the late 30s. Sheriff wrote four
drafts of the screenplay, all of which were rejected
by the production code. Although the second draft
of his screenplay was accepted by the British
Board of Film Censors. Not that that really matters.
Vincent, you suggested this before, but maybe
James Whale was encouraging Sheriff to come up
with like increasingly shocking and scandalous
versions of the screenplay so that this movie
would never get made. Yeah, I think it's allegedly,
but you know, I could see James Whale saying
something like that. Yeah, yeah. I would not
be surprised. Yeah. Yeah. It's fun to think about.
Yeah. So after all these, you know, rejected
screenplays, finally, E .M. Asher, who was a
producer for Universal, told Joseph Breen that
Sheriff's script would not be used and they would
start another one from scratch. This is the one
that was written by Garrett Fort, essentially
the screenplay that was actually filmed that
we see in the final movie with some changes.
Fort's second draft of the screenplay was submitted
to the PCA in February of 1936, so right when
they were supposed to start production on the
film. The production code's only demand with
this screenplay was maybe the most notorious
and I think one of the best scenes in the movie,
in which the Countess Zaleska, Dracula's daughter,
has her manservant, Sandor, abduct a beautiful
young woman, take her back to the castle to pose
for a painting. And there's this really erotically
charged moment where the Countess is kind of,
you know, hungrily staring at this young woman
who is not totally undressing, but kind of taking
off her blouse and baring her shoulders a little
bit. For 1936, a very sexual and erotic scene.
And again, not surprisingly, this is the scene
that the production code took issue with. The
production code said that there must be no indication
of a perverse sexual desire. on the part of Maria,
who is Dracula's daughter, or of an attempted
sexual attack by her upon Lily. Later correspondences
from Breen's Universal producer Harry Zahner
make it very clear how much the production code
dictated the final version of that scene. Breen
was basically like, listen, this is exactly what's
going to happen. Here's what you can show. You
can frame this actress from the shoulders up.
I just think it's fascinating that like you can
read those correspondences and it's kind of clear
proof that the production code had like a very
definite kind of influence on the shape of the
finished product. Just a fascinating example
of that, I think in this, in this movie. Yeah.
It makes me wonder what that actual process was
like. Was it like, I mean, maybe you guys can
give me insight into that. Is it like a committee
of people or is it one individual? Like who enforces
that or who enforced that or who would grant
approval? Yeah, I definitely don't know all the
details. I know Joseph Breen was the head of
the production code. So I think all decisions
would ultimately come down to him. But I think
it was a group of people who had worked in Hollywood,
maybe not like on the production side, but maybe
more of like distributors, exhibitors. And I
know like the Legion of Decency, like strongly,
which was like a Catholic sort of like nationwide
group of Catholic members, kind of influenced
the building and the sort of the entrenchment
of the production code. So I do think it was
a vast group of people that would make those
decisions. You know, they may have been artists,
they may have been in Hollywood, but they were
not looking at these films from a filmmaker's
artist's lens. And I can't say for certain the
demographics of every member, but I'm sure they
were overwhelmingly white and male and straight
and religious. legion of decency comes up time
and time again so it's just interesting to like
think about the forces at play influencing a
movie like dracula's daughter coming from this
group this homogenous group who who may or may
not take issue with some of the themes in the
final film It's honestly amazing that they even
got it out the way it is with everything. It's,
it's very, very provocative. That scene with
Lily is I find it's very erotic. Like it's suggestive.
I'm surprised that they got it, you know, the
way that they did and in the, in the form that
it is now. I agree. And I think that's, for me,
it's something that keeps me coming back to this
movie is it, it feels like an earlier. maybe
pre -code film. It's got those, those strands
of eroticism and, and maybe some taboo subjects,
quote unquote, but like it's still caught in
the crosswinds of a very established censorship
board. Yeah, I agree. I would love to see the
pre -code version of this movie. But at the same
time, I think it's fascinating that this came
out in 1936, which is right on that bridge between
the pre -code era and the era when censorship
really was becoming a lot more strict. And I
think we see both influences in the final version
of this movie, which is fascinating. Yeah, yeah.
The initial proposed cast was like this. It would
have been really something what Universal said
was going to be the cast of this movie, which
included Bela Lugosi, Jane Wyatt, Boris Karloff,
Colin Clive, who was in the original Frankenstein,
Cesar Romero, who played Joker in the Batman
TV series. Herbert Marshall, who's a great screwball
comedy, romantic comedy actor from the early
30s, they were all slated to appear in Dracula's
Daughter, and none of them are in the finished
version, unless you count Bela Lugosi's dummy
that Vincent talked about earlier. That's funny.
Yeah. It's like how many, like these days, how
many star casts are announced, and how many of
them never come to fruition. Yeah. It was true
even 90 years ago in Hollywood. So production
began in February of 1936. Again, Universal really
rushed this into production. They demanded that
the cast and crew shoot seven days a week, pretty
much around the clock. Even so, the film, the
shoot, went seven days over schedule and $50
,000 over budget. So definitely a chaotic production
on this one. Man, I had no idea. I didn't really
look into any of the struggles of production.
So that was all super interesting. Yeah. And
I, you know, kind of like you guys were, like
you both were alluding to before, you know, I
think like we can see some of those like pressures
and just like the quick shooting schedule in
the finished version of the film. Again, I just
think it's interesting that those kind of like
behind the scenes struggles, like you can kind
of see them in some of the, some of the story
and some of the characters maybe kind of. not
being as complex as they might have been. But
then others are still really rich and complicated.
So yeah, we have the good and the bad in this
movie. Contemporary reviews were tepid to positive,
with most reviewers praising Holden's performance
and the gothic atmosphere, which was outstanding.
I loved it. Even so, Vox Alpha's performance
paled in comparison to the original, which is
kind of the opposite, I think, of... films today,
right? Like a lot of times you'll hear about
sequels pulling in really big numbers. So that's
kind of interesting. Retrospective analysis,
however, places the film in the context of depictions
of homosexuality throughout cinema history. So
despite earlier literary depictions of lesbian
romance, particularly in the gothic horror genre,
like the aforementioned Carmilla and Samuel Taylor
Coleridge's 1797 poem, Christabel, even its implicit
portrayal in Dracula's Daughter was absolutely
groundbreaking on screen, and I'm not surprised
at all. It was fun to learn that Anne Rice has
named the film as a direct influence on her writing,
even calling a bar Dracula's Daughter in her
1985 novel The Vampire Lestat. I definitely read
a little bit about that myself, and it kind of
reminded me of the complex queer vampire characters.
her novels so several critics and scholars in
the lgbtq community cite dracula's daughter as
a pioneering work gay film historian vito russo
in his book called the cellulite closet quotes
universal ads from the original release that
actually read save the woman of london from dracula's
daughter an attempt to kind of exploit the movie's
sexual thrills so i guess they kind of allude
to it in the marketing it's kind of funny they
could get away with that a little bit yeah So
retrospective analysis from Entertainment Weekly
wrote that the scene between Zaleski and Lily
is, quote, so hot, it's impossible to imagine
how it ever got past 30 censors. Like we were
literally just saying this. And horror scholar
David Skoll writes that the scene is, quote,
a classic lesbian sequence, although of a decidedly
negative strike. So that's interesting. And indeed.
Russo criticizes that scene and other parts of
the film as indicating a negative portrayal of
the essence of homosexuality as a predatory weakness.
Russo includes the scene in the documentary adaptation
of his book, The Celluloid Closet. Other scenes
have also been noted for their homoerotic undertones,
particularly the moment near the climax in which
Zaleska hovers over the unconscious body of Dr.
Garth's secretary, Janet, a scene that Ellis
Hansen describes as, quote, the longest kiss
never filmed. Yeah, that's a great quote. I love
that. So the Bright Lights Film Journal, that
the essay also criticizes the film for its connections
between lesbianism and mental illness, where
Zaleska believes she could be cured of her illness,
which I completely like. It just made me so mad
watching the way like Garth treated her and was
just so condescending and basically saying that,
what's the word? That willpower is like the key
of what's needed. And it just felt like one step
away from conversion therapy, you know, his approach
on that. Yeah. And then the film has been analyzed
for its influence on movies such as Sunset Boulevard.
Nadja and the 2024 universal film, Abigail, which
was originally planned as a remake of Dracula's
daughter. Now I had read that and actually watched
that Abigail. It had been kind of on my list,
but not a priority. It didn't look very good,
but I figured, Oh, I'll just, you know, throw
it in as part of the research on this. And it
has absolutely nothing to do or any similarities
really to Dracula's daughter. Maybe it takes
place in an opulent home. Maybe there's some
connections there, but yeah, it. I kind of wish
it did. That would have been cool. Yeah. Would
have made it more interesting in my opinion.
Yeah. I have not seen Abigail and I didn't really
have a desire to until I found out about the
connection between this movie and that one. But
yeah, it's, I mean, it seems like there's just
a little girl who's a vampire and that's the
only, even that's not in Dracula's daughter,
but just like that concept is the only connection
it seems. Yes, exactly. Yep. Well, thank you
for reading all that, Naomi. Sorry to give you
a sort of long and complicated section, but yeah,
a lot to this movie's depictions of homosexuality
in both pioneering ways, but also some negative,
questionable ways, especially viewed through
modern eyes. Yeah, I think 1930s, you know, homosexuality
was definitely seen as an affliction. You know,
it was something to be hidden and repressed.
and ultimately punished like the movie wasn't
just an ending it really was a punishment and
i would say that this movie definitely touches
on that a lot like the relationship between zaleska
and the doctor is not only reflective i guess
i i took it very personally and it was kind of
triggering for me as a woman who's kind of struggled
to be validated especially in medical spaces
like I have Crohn's disease. And so 10 years
ago, I was suffering, having the same, you know,
unproductive appointment over and over with male
doctors basically saying, this is nerves, you're
stressed out, you're doing too much, and kind
of making it about, you know, irrational emotions
or something like that. And I feel like, you
know, Zaleska goes through a similar thing where
she's very sad, and she's coming to him for help.
And he just completely like you know dismisses
all of her concerns and is very much yeah i guess
just dismissive and and awful like i'm trying
not to use swear words so it's kind of hard to
talk about him but i think it reflects the 1930s
view on homosexuality being something that is
bad and that should be changed and could be changed
by willpower which is obviously crazy Yeah. And
at this time, up until I think the 50s, the American
Psychiatric Association referred to homosexuality
as a mental illness. So that's kind of a very
sad and sobering example of how, like you were
saying, Naomi, the medical industry is complicit
in the kind of pushing those sexual identities
and orientations to the margins instead of accepting
them as just human nature. That, you know, that
extremely negative influence persisted for much
of the 20th century. And I think Dracula's Daughter
may be against its will. It doesn't seem like
an intentional theme, but like it's kind of evoking
that in a difficult and kind of disturbing way,
you know? Yeah, absolutely. There's a lot more
to say about that. And I think we should maybe
come back to some of these questions in a moment
here. But I do think it's awkwardly time for
our sponsor break. You can cut this up however
you want, Vincent. It might not be the best moment
for it, but I'm just going to throw it in there
right now. Sorry. Camp Kaiju is sponsored by
Zach Linder and the Zach Pack, powered by Coldwell
Banker Realty. Your source for real estate, home
rehab, fixing and flipping for investor clients
and residential buyers. Reach out to the Zach
Pack today for real estate services. Follow the
Zach Pack on social media and contact the Zach
Pack for investment opportunities. Link in the
show notes. Vincent, do we have anything from
Minya's mailbox tonight? Just something real
quick in our episode here. Kind of a tongue -in
-cheek comment from me to include this. So on
our YouTube channel in response to our Invasion
of Astro Monster video, because remember, I upload
the podcast audio to YouTube, so you could listen
to the show on YouTube. There was no video. This
is not the movie. So if you're thinking, oh,
I'm going to watch this movie for free on YouTube,
I hate to disappoint you. And this is for Tarzan
Tabby, who said, yay, more clickbait. So I'm
like, sorry, it's not the movie. It's just us
talking about the movie. I don't even think that's
that unusual. You know, I see that. Yeah, I would
say that's fairly clearly laid out in the video
title as well. But, you know, but. But hey, thanks
for the engagement. We appreciate all the comments.
So it helps us. Listeners, patrons, let us know
your thoughts and we will feature you on Minya's
mailbox. Welcome to the Poverty Row Studios on
the other side of Hollywood, where the stars
were dimmer and the red carpets dripped with
blood. Together, we will watch the best of the
worst. Movies known for their limited budgets,
outlandish concepts, and questionable performances,
but with enough haunted houses, zombies, ape
men, and devil bats to keep you up at night.
This is the Poverty Row Picture Show, and I dare
you to sleep through these nightmares. And perhaps
this week's movie, Invisible Ghost, could be
the first to challenge your droopy eyelids at
the end of a hard day's work. This film is the
second of nine pictures that Bela Lugosi made
with quintessential Poverty Row studio PRC. By
1941, Bela Lugosi was relegated to minor supporting
roles in the horror films at Universal Studios.
But on Poverty Row, producers eager for even
the dimmest of stars readily gave Lugosi top
billing in their pictures. For Lugosi, it was
truly better to be a king in hell than a servant
in heaven. And while the devil bat was a hit,
his follow -up project, Invisible Ghost, leaves
much to be desired in the ways of... Oh, well,
hello, Pierre. And what is it you are holding
behind your... Oh, a bouquet of flowers. Lilac's
my favorite. No, no, Pierre, there is nothing
wrong. I was just concerned about your whereabouts
these several weeks. And how is your skin holding
up? Ah, breaking it in, yes, yes, that makes
sense, Pierre. Oh, all right, I will see you
later. Yes, my place at Matthews. Oh, he will
let you in, I am sure. Well, farewell. Farewell,
Pierre, my little rodent friend. Listeners, listen
closely. Pierre has returned with a peace offering,
or so it would seem. Time will tell if he can
be trusted since that fateful night with the
meat cleaver. That night where I overpowered
him and turned the cleaver on my friend. I thought
that was the end until I returned to Camp Kaiju
and discovered that my producers had stitched
Pierre back together like a furry Humpty Dumpty
from hell. And now Pierre's smile is forever
fixed on his face and burned into my nightmares.
Well, allow me to place these lilacs in a vase
while I continue to review Invisible Ghost. The
film was directed by Joseph H. Lewis, whom we
discussed on Boys of the City. Here, too, Lewis
valiantly imbues the picture with camera flourishes
and dramatic lighting. However, the film cannot
overcome its nonsensical story, whereby Lugosi
mourns his wife whom he thought had run away,
but who secretly lives on the premises. And when
Lugosi sees her, he is bewitched into a murderous
fugue state. Night after night this happens and
as the bodies mount, you are left wondering why
A. folks are still living in the house and B.
why the detective does not suspect Lugosi. Shamefully,
the film takes on unintentional madness when
the police are willing to apprehend the one black
character for the crimes until Lugosi sees his
wife and drops into his crazed somnambulance.
Overall, invisible ghosts will leave you scratching
your head. However, Lugosi and Clarence Muse,
who plays Evans the butler, provide enough charm
to endure this 60 -minute cavalcade of confusion
that will leave you wanting to know what is next
on the Poverty Row Picture Show. Well, well,
listeners, it is our first zombie movie called
Thing of the Zombies. and warner brothers always
alert to progress has included the amazing phenomenon
of bringing the dead back to life in the walking
dead an unusual horror mystery starring boris
carlo supported by ricardo cortez edmund gwen
marguerite churchill barton mclean warren hull
Back to Dracula's daughter. You know, sometimes
I think with some movies we can kind of just
like wrap up the themes into our like personal
breakdowns at the end of the episode. I do want
to leave a little more space to talk about some
of these themes because they are so complicated.
I can pose a question to kind of get the conversation
going. Do you think Zaleska, the Countess Zaleska,
Dracula's daughter, is vilified for her lesbianism?
We've talked about this a little bit earlier
in the episode. Do you think the movie makes
her out to be... And I'm saying, like, maybe
the movie is doing this. Is it making her into
a villain, making her into a monster for her
sexual identity? Or is it possible to read against
the grain and see Countess Zaleska as a sympathetic
figure who the movie is trying to, you know,
trying to make us, the audience, identify with
what she's going through, her persecution, not
only with her sexual orientation, but also the
fact that her father is this, like, you know,
legendary figure of evil, really, who still kind
of continues to haunt her after his death. This
is a rambling question, but how do you think
the movie truly portrays the Countess Zaleska
figure? Well, I would say that she's a really
compelling and complex character because she
plays both predator and prey. And unlike her
father, she doesn't revel in that power. She
kind of despises it. Her struggle with vampirism
is more akin to a psychological breakdown than
to that predator prey dynamic we typically see
in horror films. And I think that her struggle
can be seen as a metaphor for female autonomy
in a patriarchal world. You know, she she seeks
help from a man thinking he can, you know, quote,
cure her. But he fails her just as so many institutions
fail women. And I would say, you know, that scene
between her and Lily. Even though she is the
predator in that scene, I still feel bad for
her that she can't just live her life and be
with women the way she wants to be. There has
to be her manservant going out and kind of fabricating
this lie. And I was wondering, though, what you
guys thought of her ring and kind of the symbolism
there. Have any thoughts? Maybe we could talk
about that later. I just wanted to, like, it
was definitely something I wanted to ask you
about. But I consider her to be a sympathetic
character, very much so. Yeah, I agree with that,
Naomi. I think her, yes, she is killed, but I
don't think we're supposed to go, yes, the monster's
been killed. I think she's a tragic figure. in
the great tradition of all universal monster
movies, Frankenstein, Wolfman, Bride. And yeah,
I was thinking about her ring too, because that's
really interesting. I was thinking about how
that's how she seduces her victims, contrasted
with Dracula in, I guess, her father in his movie.
He's very hands -on, like he touches his victims.
throttles them or whatever and maybe it's maybe
it's a maybe it's a censorship thing like we
can't we actually can't depict a woman murdering
people so we'll do it with this hypnosis ring
tool regardless i think it fits her character
i think it it lends an air of mystery to her
like the film is so the pacing of this film is
so i find I don't find it slow necessarily. I
find it like enticing. It's an enticing pace.
Like what's that wonderful quote? The longest
kiss that never was. I love that quote because
I think that encapsulates the whole movie. And
I think the ring and the hypnosis effect, it
just supports that take of the direction. Yeah.
Yeah, that's interesting. I like that. And I
guess I've heard of other, you know, jewelry
kind of being a part of, you know, Gothic storytelling.
You know, there's the film Crimson Peak and the
film Rebecca. And yeah, I think that's really
interesting. I was going to ask you guys what
you thought about Sandor, but maybe we'll get
there. I don't know. I want to talk about Sandor.
I know. I wanted to hear your thoughts on Sandor.
I just, yeah, go ahead. Let me hear it. Can I
respond to what both of you said before we talk
about Sandor? Sorry, both of you just raised
so many good points. Really, a lot of fascinating
stuff there. And Zaleska has so many quotes about
freedom. Like, finally, I'll be free. You know,
if I can escape the shadow of my father. And
I think, like, the unfortunate implication that
the movie should be criticized for is that if
she... like escapes her urges, like her attractions,
you know, then she'll be free. That's the negative
side of that interpretation or of that line.
But I think the other interpretation, like you
were referring to Naomi, you know, she's longing
to be free. I think she feels trapped all the
time, you know, in her sexuality, living like,
you know, with this, with her father figure.
You know, I was really touched and really moved
by those quotes about like, I just need freedom.
Finally, I can be free. Working with Dr. Garth
is probably not the way to achieve that, but
it's a very moving theme for sure. And I just
think this movie persists and is still so beloved
by some people because it's possible to read
her character. I know I used the term or the
phrase against the grain before, but I think
that's the power of a movie like this. We can
maybe recognize the negative and harmful things
that the movie is doing in terms of Zaleska's
sexuality. But we can also sort of, you know,
come up with our own reading of the character.
And I think if we do that, then she is a really
powerful and sympathetic figure. I just wanted
to bring up those quotes about freedom because
I found that really fascinating. No, I so agree
with you. Like, I think even the ending, we can
sort of, you know, rewrite however we want in
our minds, like, and look at her not as a woman
who's doomed by her desire, but as a woman who's
like freed from a repressive mortal world that
is not ready for her. You know, maybe it's a
good thing. It's tragic, but I like that you
said the word free because I thought of that
too. Yeah. That's a great way to put it, Naomi.
Sorry. Now we can talk about Sandor if you want
to. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to jump ahead. I
just wanted to hear what you guys thought of
Sandor. Yeah. I think... What do I think? All
this is just... So this is my third time watching
the movie. Every time Sandor is one of those
characters that I grow more and more interested
in. I want more of this character, his struggles.
I think he talks about freedom too. Oh, he does
at the end. That's why he kills Zaleska because
she's going to give Dr. Garth eternal life. And
Sandor says, you promised me this. I find, I
find that tragic. And so there's that, but then.
Sandor's depiction is very striking in this film.
A very large person, man, masculine figure, I
should say, who wears a lot of makeup, whose
hair is styled a certain way that I think is
more feminine. And his relationship with Zaleska.
This man and woman relationship, and yet they
have, I don't know, their own complex orientations.
But what does it say about domesticity, which
I read a lot in my readings? This subversion
of the traditional heteronormative husband and
wife relationship that they critique, I think,
as characters. Okay, that's what I'm going to
say. Yeah, you kind of understand where Sandor
is coming. Well, I don't want to maybe give a
plot spoiler at the end here. Sandor makes a
decisive action, and you understand where he's
coming from. You kind of want to do the same
thing. You're like, why are you doing this? You
sort of understand Sandor's frustration at certain
characters not behaving in a way that seems true
to who they are. I think this is the main fault
or the critique of the film. it doesn't dig deep
enough into these things. It gives for me, it's,
it's very surface. Like, Oh, I see because Sandor
has that one line. Okay. But like, I want to
dig more into his character and truly like, there's
a version of this film where I'm probably bawling
my eyes out at the end. Yeah. But we don't get
to say though, that like the Sandor character
kind of functions like a Renfield, but with like
a little more agency. So like, he's not like
a total groveling servant, you know, he kind
of pushes her like towards her dark destiny for
better or worse. You know, she's a companion
to him, maybe even like a bit of a beard to him
in his life. So I guess I just wonder, do you
feel like he's a bit of a evolution from Renfield?
Like, what does he have in common with a Renfield?
Because I feel like he sort of plays that role,
you know, but has more agency than Renfield did.
That's interesting. I don't see Renfield as a
particularly emotional figure, but I do see Sandor
in that way. I think both Sandor and Zaleska
are kind of representing that sexuality as a
spectrum. I think maybe some of the categories
that we often put people into are kind of defied
by these two characters. So I think in the ways
that I find Zaleska sympathetic and moving and
powerful, I kind of find Sandor... poignant for
the same thing i think for the same reason i
think he has unspoken emotional desires that
can never be met and that's that's like not a
thought that i had with renfield at any point
you know but they serve similar narrative functions
but i think sandor like works better as an emotional
figure in my opinion yeah i think that's super
fair i was just thinking of a more as like an
evolution of the assistant like of the helper
uh he is more complex in that way I think it's
really refreshing that we see the master -servant
relationship where the woman is the one in charge
and she has a man doing her bidding. I mean,
so often it's the inverse or it's just two male
characters doing their thing. You can see that
imbalance. between Garth and his secretary, you
know, they kind of have this really sexist way
of talking with each other. You know, she's like
playful and flirtatious, kind of the opposite
of Zaleska in a lot of ways. And, you know, most
importantly, she's interested in men and like,
she kind of exists like to reinforce that idea.
But anyway, like her interactions with Garth
are really laced with sexism. Like he frequently
undermines her competence and their banter. even
though it's playful, I felt like it was really
kind of like leaning into the nagging woman,
exasperated man stereotype. So I love that you
said that because I didn't even really kind of
compare like that, you know, Boston's, you know,
servant kind of thing. But I think we totally
see it between, you know, Janet and Garth. Yeah.
And there's a little bit of a class thing there,
right? You know, like Zaleska and Sandor, like
she has the financial power she has the higher
social standing and you could say that about
garth and and janet as well so i i think like
there's some interesting class stuff in this
movie too which we have not touched on at all
and probably don't have time to do so but you
know the power relations in this movie are also
somewhat dependent on class i would say as well
that's interesting yeah good good call There's
just so much to talk about in this movie, but
we are almost out of time. So I feel like we
should probably get into our individual breakdowns
and maybe wrap up some other stuff into those
final takeaways, if that works for you both.
Absolutely. Cool. All right. So what, Naomi,
we'll start with you if that's all right. What
would you put in the good category for this movie?
The good? Well, the cinematography. I loved the
queer, I guess. undertones, overtones, like subtlety
of the time. I loved the shortness of it, even
though I was not prepared for it. I thought that
like, it was tight. It was zippy, even though
it was quiet and atmospheric. Like I never was
bored. I didn't feel that, you know, they could
have cut that scene or whatever, even though
maybe if I watched it again, I might feel that
way. But I just thought it was a film that would
remain interesting to people. Today, for many
reasons, thematically and executionally. So,
yeah, I just I liked what it said and how it
was made and hearing all the things that it was
up against. I even have a greater appreciation
for it. Yeah. Definitely. Excuse me. Vincent,
what about you for the good stuff? Yeah, everything
we've already mentioned. There's just a couple
of things I wanted to shout out. Back to Sandor's.
I don't know, sexuality or way he's presented.
I don't know if this is intent, if this was an
intentional cut edit in the film, but there was
a moment where I forget who says it. It might've
been, it might've been Garth, but he says a line
to Zaleska, the quote, the lady in question,
but then the camera cuts to Sandor. And just
that, that edit, I was like, Are you trying to,
I don't know, am I reading too much into it?
But there's a clear, who's the lady in question?
And then it cut to Sandor. I was like, okay,
that's something to think about. On another note,
the costuming of Gloria Olden in this movie is
gorgeous, sumptuous, like her dresses and the
way she's lit and the way she's costumed. She
is a dominating screen presence. And every time
she's on screen, I want more of her. This is
such a great, compelling performance. And she's
hardly doing anything, but that's her power.
So, yeah. I can't believe I forgot the costumes.
I'm so glad you shouted that out. They were so
beautiful. Yeah. So beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. Fully
agree. Yeah, like she I think maybe she enters
the movie like about 10 minutes in. And it doesn't
the movie doesn't start slow or whatever. But
it starts with some like campy humor, which I'll
probably mention in a minute here. But then like
she like enters the frame where like we can only
see her eyes because she's wearing like a black
mask over her face. So this is just to your point,
Vincent, like it's it's so arresting. Like the
moment you see her on screen, you're like, oh,
I'm paying attention. I want to see what's going
on. You know, it's really, really well done.
Yeah. I don't have too much to add to the good
category. I fully agree with everything you both
said. I would just make the comparison. This
movie reminded me of some of the Val Lewton RKO
horror movies from the early 40s, like I Walked
With a Zombie, Cat People, The Seventh Victim,
The Curse of the Cat People, which are like really
tight, like 60 to 70 minutes. They also are horror
movies, but they have kind of like themes beneath
the surface that are really complicated, but
hard to portray directly because of the production
code, which didn't allow most of those themes
to be. conveyed explicitly so i feel like dracula's
daughter is kind of similar right like it's messy
because of those things to use that word again
i mean it's not perfect but it's so fascinating
and i feel like honestly we could talk about
it for another hour and still not mention all
the themes and you know sort of like mysteries
in this movie so whenever you have a movie that
complex i'm always gonna appreciate that but
there's a lot of bad stuff here as well all I'm
just going to really briefly start it off. I
think both of you agree with me, and then you
both can take it away from here. But it's got
to be Dr. Jeffrey Garth, right? The worst part
of this movie. Yeah. Boo. Boo. Boo. And it's
not just him, but it's the fact that for all
these fascinating themes about sexuality, it
disappointingly ends, as we already talked about,
with the Countess Zaleska. wanting to have a
heteronormative relationship with him and although
it's a strange one where she wants to give him
eternal life but you know that ultimately is
what happens and that's just so disappointing
that that's the route that the movie takes you
know yeah totally it feels very safe and very
like predictable checking a box kind of you know
decision there yeah oh but like oh but i'm also
like like before even in the midst of that like
When Janet's lying on the table and Holden, to
her credit, gives such a longing look. And it's,
you know, is that the tragedy too? She's choosing
this safe, risk -free life at the expense of
her true nature. I think that, again, that kiss
moment, or sorry, the kiss that doesn't happen.
Wow, I keep coming back to that. Thanks to Naomi,
what you brought up. I hadn't thought about it
that hard before. That's tough. Yeah. I feel
like it's the kind of movie where even the flaws,
you know, you look at them and you're like, but
what if? Like, what if they were mandated by
the production code, but like the filmmakers
sort of had a different intention in mind that
they couldn't. fully put on screen. And I don't
want to give the filmmakers too much credit.
I don't think it's entirely due to the production
code that some of these flaws are in the movie.
And I do think that it's kind of questionable
depiction of homosexuality as being like, you
know, something that makes you atypical or unusual
or whatever, as the movie suggests is an unfortunate
depiction, of course. But it's just the kind
of movie where you're like, man, there's some
bad stuff, but even the bad stuff is fascinating,
you know? Yeah, I totally agree. And I think
the way people view it has potential to change
too as time goes on. You know, I think that some
people would have seen that movie, you know,
maybe even 10 years ago and said, well, is she
a lesbian or is she straight? And society has
evolved as such to where we see queerness many
different ways. You know, there's bisexuality,
there's pansexuality, there's all these different
shades. And I think that as we evolve as a species,
we, you know, there could be more interpretations
in the future that we don't even know about.
So it would be interesting, you know, if you
read a review of this, like every 20 years, you
know, it would say some of the same things, but
I think there would be some evolutions too in
the way it's received. Definitely. And I think
that's why it's still, you know, written about
pretty frequently. I think there was a book in
2017 focused entirely on this movie, which is
kind of amazing. Well, I don't want to take away
from anything you were saying, Naomi. No, the
only other bad thing I would say, which is not
surprising, is there's no people of color that
I can tell in the film at all. Not shocking,
but it would have been nice. Agreed. Yeah. My
overarching bad thing is I feel like the attempts
at humor in this movie are extremely I don't
think the comedy works at all. Every time it's
tried in this film, the actors don't have chemistry.
It's poorly written. It's too sticky. And the
amount of screen time we spend on trying to tie
Dr. Garth's bow tie, like, stake me through the
heart. What's going on? Get on with it. I did
not like that either. I didn't understand. Like,
what? This has to have some sort of relevance
later. Yeah, it did. It kept going. Yes, very
weird. The comedy, for me, is a bummer in this
movie. I was going to put this in the campy category,
but for me, what you're talking about, Vincent,
that starts right away with that policeman character
who's really cowardly and inept and just has
a funny mustache and is kind of just a bumbling
fool, basically. It's a strange choice to start
the movie because, like, he and another police
officer stumble upon the corpses of Renfield
and Dracula. And meanwhile, you have this like
buffoon over here. It's like, what's going on?
You know, it's not played. It's not played as
it would be in that situation. Right. It's played
for laughs. I'm like, that's wrong. Yeah. Sorry.
It's a strange choice to start the movie. Yeah.
I actually, you know, the one comedic thing,
like I sort of like the scene where Janet is
like calling Zaleska's house and like posing
as different characters to like disrupt the meeting
between Garth and Zaleska. And that whole scene,
I was like, Janet is wonderful. Like she's so
funny and charismatic and magnetic. What do you
see in Dr. Garth, Janet? Like get out of there.
Like any, you know, any sane person. Sorry, I
shouldn't say that. You know, if I were Dr. Garth,
I would answer the phone and be like, you're
wonderful. I love you. Like, you know, but of
course, Dr. Garth is this like terrible sexist
condescending figure. So we don't get that in
the movie. But I do like the Janet character.
I think she has moments of humor and kind of
energy, you know? Yeah. Yeah. I think she's breezy
and fun. She's written really well to kind of
contrast, you know, the good woman versus bad
woman. You know, she gets a happy ending, but
women like Zaleska do not. And, you know, she
is very likable. And I did like that scene too.
But I do feel that her main purpose is to kind
of be an opposite, to provide contrast to Zaleska.
Yeah. It's a limited character and a limited
role for sure. Yeah. Anything else in the campy
category before we move on to our ratings? Yeah,
I had some regarding Sandor. I thought maybe
some of his, you know, he was probably the most
campy character for me. You know, he's kind of
constantly brooding in the background, like,
lurking in doorways. And, like, he just delivers
these, like, melodramatic one -liners with such
intense seriousness that, like, I don't know,
you can't help but kind of, like, it's sort of
unintentionally hilarious at times. Like, or
not hilarious, but quieter version of that. He's
just so over the top. And I'd say there were
some line deliveries from Gloria Holden as well.
And facial expressions that were also a little
overdramatic that felt campy boarding on not
comical, but just felt that from today's perspective,
it was a little overdramatic at times and felt
a bit campy for me. Yeah. I love that you brought
up Sandor because for me, this is a rare movie.
Like when we, In terms of Camp Kaiju, when we
talk about camp, it's usually like, oh, Godzilla
movies are campy. But there is an entirely different
context for camp within the queer culture. And
I think Sandor is that. And I'll real quick definition
from the National Archives, the UK National Archives.
Okay, just a quick search. Camp, a word associated
with theatricality, playfulness, and exaggeration.
It's a term that can relate to aesthetics or
the way someone acts and has long been connected
to gay culture and communities. Yeah. I didn't
even think really of the context in queer culture.
That's very interesting. Just, you know, because.
Camp can mean so many different things. There
reminds me of a quote that I really love about
Sandor. This quote is from Harry Benshoff, who
wrote a really classic text about queerness in
horror cinema. We should maybe mention that in
the show notes as well, Vincent, I can give that
to you. But Benshoff refers to Sandor as, quote,
an overly coiffed surly queen, which I just think
is like such a great way to describe him. I love
it. And I think he means it in a complimentary
way, you know? Yes, I think so. So as always
on Camp Kaiju, we have four different ratings.
Number one, it's a timeless classic. It definitely
stands the test of time. Number two, there may
be some antiquated moments, but overall it's
great. It stands the test of time. Number three,
it may be historically significant or just fun,
but it does not stand the test of time. And our
lowest rating, it's not worth revisiting. It
definitely does not stand the test of time. Vincent,
do you maybe want to go first? Sure. I think
I've been all over the map again with this movie.
But upon my third watching, I'll fall into the
second to highest tier. I think there are some
antiquated moments, but overall, it's great.
It does stand the test of time because I think
it's so, so important to talk about these things,
the themes and representation. But then structurally,
just from like a purely cinematic place, the
comedy does not work. And I'm so bummed because
I feel like this has the potential to be something
truly tragic and poignant. And yeah. And Otto
Kruger, stinker. That's no good. Yeah. We're
all fully in agreement on that, I think. Maybe
I'll go next real quick, and then you can have
the last word, Naomi. Does that sound all right?
Yeah, sure. Okay. Well, I agree with you, Vincent.
I'm going to give it our second highest rating.
I do think there are antiquated moments. I think
viewing the movie's depiction of lesbianism with
modern eyes, some things seem very questionable.
Some of the depictions don't age very well. And
again, just like the fact that the movie decides
to ultimately focus on the love triangle between
Garth and Zaleska and Janet is incredibly disappointing.
Despite that, this is just such a fascinating,
complex movie. Yeah, there's too much to say
I can't say anymore, so I'm just going to leave
it at that. Well, I am going to give it the highest
rating. It's a timeless classic. It definitely
stands the test of time. antiquated moments for
me but to me it's just it's such was such a pleasure
to watch this movie and it reminded me of characters
that exist today that were probably influenced
by this film so that gave me like a deeper appreciation
for movies like Jennifer's Body you know where
it's like wow this is a movie that's standing
on the shoulders of movies like Dracula's Daughter
and Cinema, for me, is as much anthropology as
it is entertainment. And for this film is like
such an intellectual and anthropological study
of the time it was made, the representation of
queer people in the media, you know, the evolving
story of vampires and the lore behind that. It's
just it for me, it worked. I liked it a lot.
There were things I would change, things I don't
like. But it is important enough that I think
I would consider it a timeless classic. And as
someone who has only seen it twice, I feel confident
in giving it that. And I would watch it again
and I think even get more out of it. So I'm going
to go with that rating, the highest one. I love
it. I'm very happy that we're ending with the
highest rating. It seems, even though that's
not the rating I gave it, it seems appropriate
for this movie. I love that. Yeah. I think it's
one of the best. Actually, I do think it's a
top -tier Universal monster movie. I think it's
highly underrated, underseen, and I am a champion
for this movie whenever it comes up. So, Matt,
thank you for choosing this movie. Yeah, thank
you both for, you know, talking about it. I mean,
and to everybody who is listening, whether you've
seen this movie already or haven't seen it, just
maybe watch it again or watch it for the first
time. Read up on it. We'll add some links and,
you know, work cited in the show notes. It's
just such a fascinating movie. Please share your
thoughts with us as well. We would love to hear
them. Next time on Camp Kaiju, we're going to
talk about Godzilla vs. Mothra. Stay tuned for
that. And thank you again for hanging out, friends.
Please rate and review wherever you listen. You
can also share this podcast with a friend, subscribe
to the website, and send us listener comments
at campkaiju at gmail .com or on Instagram. Links
in the show notes. If you'd like to be a featured
voice on the show, leave a voicemail at 612 -470
-2612 telling us about your favorite monster
movies and memories. Finally, please check out
our website, campkaijupodcast .com for more information.
Camp Kaiju is recorded in Minneapolis, St. Paul,
with Minya's Mailbox Music by Ben Cook Feltz.
Thanks again, friends, and until next time, stay
campy. Camp Kaiju is recorded in Minneapolis,
St. Paul, with Minya's Mailbox Music by Ben Cook
Feltz. Thanks again, friends, and until next
time, stay campy. Camp Kaiju is sponsored by
Zach Linder and the Zach Pack, powered by Coldwell
Banker Realty. your source for real estate, home
rehab, fixing and flipping for investor clients,
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show notes. Twilight, long shadows on the hillsides.
Evil shadows. No, no peaceful shadows. The flutter
of wings in the treetops. The wings of bats?
No, no, the wings of birds. From far off, the
barking of a dog. Barking because there are wolves
about. Silence, I forbid you.