1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,200
Welcome to Leadership Journeys. I'm psychologist Leona Deakin and we are delving into the minds

2
00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:09,360
of successful women to find out how they've achieved the things that they've achieved.

3
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:18,240
On our last episode we heard from their inspirational emerita professor of leadership,

4
00:00:18,240 --> 00:00:25,680
Beverly Alamo Metcalfe, on why great leadership comes from really stereotypically female qualities,

5
00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:31,600
things like showing a genuine concern for others and that these increase our productivity,

6
00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:37,680
our motivation and reduce our stress unlike any other leadership behaviours. It's pretty cool stuff.

7
00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:45,680
Coming up on today's episode, something quite different. I woke up from an explosion,

8
00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:53,600
like it was a big panic. I put my rucksack, laptop, documents, some cash,

9
00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:59,760
took my stuff and I left apartment and I thought probably I will never come back here and probably

10
00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:07,200
I'll never see my apartment again. How do you take a negative life event, even one as extreme

11
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:13,200
as escaping war and turn that into an opportunity to do something good?

12
00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:22,080
Today we have a truly inspirational guest. We have Yana Smaglo, who not only has had to start her life

13
00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:29,200
over again here in the UK as a result of the war in Ukraine, but she has also built an amazing

14
00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:39,840
business, Nenya Distribution, which is now global and sells clothing, lingerie, shoes from Ukraine

15
00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:44,640
into the rest of the world. So she's not only building a business for herself, she is also

16
00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:52,080
helping those who are back in her homeland and very keen to contribute to her adoptive home here

17
00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:56,960
in the UK. So I have no doubt that today's conversation is going to teach us so much,

18
00:01:56,960 --> 00:02:04,880
not only about resilience, but also about having a sense of purpose and a passion that drives

19
00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:12,400
your business life. So Yana, welcome. Hello. Hello. You're such a cute little hello.

20
00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:21,840
So I started to shy. So just take us back a little bit to your life growing up in Ukraine.

21
00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:28,000
So when you were a youngster and in your teen years, what did you expect from life? What were

22
00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:35,600
your hopes and dreams back then? I was born in a small town near Kharkiv. Kharkiv is the second

23
00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:44,000
biggest city in Ukraine, raised by my grandma. We have a lot of money, but in general, I had

24
00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:54,800
quite nice childhood, study a lot. I went to school for special kids, like who special educate

25
00:02:54,800 --> 00:03:06,080
the kids. I don't really remember. I remember that I got my passion for fashion from childhood. So I

26
00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:14,800
really was passionate about it. I draw a lot, I read a lot about it, magazines, everything,

27
00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:20,960
and we didn't have, so it was, I was born in 1992. So it was post-Soviet time and we didn't have a

28
00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:28,400
lot of magazines or something like walk at that time, but still we had some and I learned a lot

29
00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:34,960
and it was interesting for me all the time. But when I finished the school, I actually did

30
00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:46,080
athletic professional at school also, which was really nice and, you know, learned me a lot to be

31
00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:53,520
really organized, to don't give up or something like this. It's like make your character really.

32
00:03:54,000 --> 00:04:02,640
After school, I told my grandma that I would like to go study design, but also she was a post-Soviet

33
00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:07,120
person and she was like, what is it design? I don't understand. It's not real profession.

34
00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:19,760
She was a physicist. If we're talking about math and physics, she had a big expectation for me.

35
00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:28,080
But also she dreamed that I'd been a dentist, but not my thing. I'm really scared of lot of everything.

36
00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:33,200
So she was like, okay, you should think about it seriously. No designing, anything like this,

37
00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:40,160
no painting, nothing like this. You should choose real profession. It was okay. So in general,

38
00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:46,640
I went from my skills, like best skills that I had at that time, and it was math. So I went study

39
00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:55,520
finance. I got master's degree from finance and I worked at the financial department as an accountant,

40
00:04:55,520 --> 00:05:04,480
main accountant during university and a little bit after. Then I decided that I didn't want to do it

41
00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:11,760
anymore. So in general, I already been main accountant at the big manufacturing. I was like,

42
00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:16,320
that's all actually. I should do it all my life. The same thing.

43
00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:18,560
Heather Hyslop That just didn't excite you.

44
00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:25,440
Yeah. It's good profession. I'm not telling that it's bad profession or something, but it wasn't

45
00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:35,360
my passion. At that moment, I had a partner and I asked him, how do you think if I would change my

46
00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:42,800
profession and become a fashion designer? And he was like, yeah, why not? And he told it so,

47
00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:52,640
he like, it was so easy for me. Okay. So next day I went to designing school in Harkiv. I start

48
00:05:53,600 --> 00:06:00,480
learning design. I did my first collection. And actually from that, I started my first business

49
00:06:01,280 --> 00:06:04,000
as a fashion designer, opened the brand. Yeah.

50
00:06:04,000 --> 00:06:08,160
So very quickly after changing from finance to design,

51
00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:12,480
you're producing your own line of fashion. Yeah, actually.

52
00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:17,440
But the big burning question that's occurring to me is what did grandma say?

53
00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:25,840
Oh, no, she was really supportive. So from her perspective, I was really independent financially.

54
00:06:25,840 --> 00:06:35,680
Okay. So she was like, if you want, in this point, she always trust me. If you want, if you see

55
00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:46,080
something in it. So she understood that I always should stay on my own legs if it's clear. And she

56
00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:56,320
was like, if you see your future in it, try. But I think in her own thoughts, she had a big doubt

57
00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:03,360
about it because it's not understandable for her fashion. It's not her side, not her field at all.

58
00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:12,480
So yeah, and I started step by step and I went in that business eight years before war started.

59
00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:18,560
So you had that support though from your partner at the time. He was quite pivotal in giving you

60
00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:25,200
a bit of confidence, was he? Yeah, he was. We just started today. So he was really supportive,

61
00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:31,520
mental support. Yeah. Yes. Then we started to live together. So it was actually financial support

62
00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:40,240
also because your own business needs big financial investment. So I invested all my saving money from

63
00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:47,040
past and he cover all risks financial. So it's good. It's quite good that you have this help.

64
00:07:47,040 --> 00:07:53,120
So he was giving practical support and emotional support. Yeah. And it sounds like he believed in

65
00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:58,320
you. Yeah. He still believes in me. Yeah. That's so powerful, isn't it? To just have somebody. Well,

66
00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:02,880
it sounds like grandma believed in you as well. She just wanted you to get qualified first,

67
00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:07,280
didn't she? I think a lot of parents and grandparents will probably relate to that.

68
00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:16,240
I can tell you that probably if I would have a kid, I would say the same, like not real profession,

69
00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:23,440
but you know, to be, if you go study something, be a really good in it, like get knowledge,

70
00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:29,440
education, like I'm really stricken it for me. Education means a lot. If I would be a parent,

71
00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:34,160
I'm forced probably like this. And that's why I'm not a parent.

72
00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:43,680
Yet. It sounds so straightforward in some ways when you say, yes, I did finance and then I was

73
00:08:43,680 --> 00:08:48,960
bored with it. So I decided to do design and then I sell my own fashion line. But what was the reality

74
00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:53,760
of that in terms of how did that feel? Were you conscious of being on that learning curve? You

75
00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:58,480
said a couple of times, Oh, that was really hard. That was really stressful. So what was the emotional

76
00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:04,560
experience of that? Like when going through your twenties, first of all, you should understand my

77
00:09:04,560 --> 00:09:14,080
personality. I'm really, I'm not really emotional, stable person. So I, um, I got stressed really

78
00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:21,680
quickly, especially when I was younger. Now I'm like with some wisdom or something, I'm more calm,

79
00:09:21,680 --> 00:09:28,000
but still in general, especially when I just started the business and you meeting a lot of

80
00:09:28,560 --> 00:09:34,480
business problems, business questions, a new experience that you'd haven't before.

81
00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:40,160
I thought like, Oh, come on new day. And again, something happened again. Something happened.

82
00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:45,040
Probably I'm a bad manager. Probably it's not mine. I was really stressful. I was like,

83
00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:51,440
I had a lot of panic attacks, but it's again, it's me, a lot of people who had much better

84
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:58,560
stressful situation, you know, like they more stable in this. So, uh, I don't want to scare

85
00:09:58,560 --> 00:10:05,120
anyone or something like this. It's me. And I understood that actually all that I have now,

86
00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:15,040
all that I go through, it's normal. So the idea of the business, it's you as a manager,

87
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:22,880
solving problems every day and this as bigger your business is as more problems you have on

88
00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:32,480
dynamic of your day and more complicated problems. So your main goal as a manager, as a owner,

89
00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:39,040
just be a person who will solve all this problem. This is a business.

90
00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:46,160
So it's not stable in the same day in day out in actual fact, your role as a manager is solving

91
00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:52,400
those problems. So am I right in hearing that even though you were someone who found yourself

92
00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:57,120
getting stressed and had panic attacks and actually recognize that, Oh, maybe I'm a little

93
00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:04,640
bit more emotional than other people around me that your tactic for managing that in yourself

94
00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:11,120
was your intellect. Yeah. That you went off and learned. Yeah. So, but it's actually,

95
00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:17,120
it's only one way, no? So your empirical knowledges. Yeah. So you, you, you're reading

96
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:24,000
something, you do it in real life, implementing it in your real life, in your business and go

97
00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:31,280
through it. It's actually what's making your stronger. So for example, when you come in,

98
00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:38,720
our lives quite complicated, especially for example, people in Ukraine, my generation.

99
00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:47,120
So I'm 32 years old. I was born after Soviet Union. So we had deeper inflation, two revolutions,

100
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:55,680
war, full invasion. Our life, like on just my generation change a lot. Like, and it's,

101
00:11:55,680 --> 00:12:02,640
it's caused with big economical problems, everything like your, your situation, not stable.

102
00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:09,360
So you always have this thing in your head that you should prepare yourself for something worst.

103
00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:14,560
Okay. And was that something that was ever present as you were growing up?

104
00:12:14,560 --> 00:12:20,240
Then that idea that's interesting, isn't it? Cause I was going to say a lot of people who would be

105
00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:24,080
very stressed and be having panic attacks in the environment might just think to themselves,

106
00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:29,920
this isn't for me. I can't do it and change and go and do something else. So, but you didn't do

107
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:36,560
that. You were determined to make that as successful as you could, that career, weren't you?

108
00:12:36,560 --> 00:12:46,320
Probably I'm crazy more than I'm a panic. So it, because it's interesting. And in general,

109
00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:56,560
I'm always try to see, can I do it? And, you know, challenge myself. And for me, for example,

110
00:12:56,560 --> 00:13:06,320
when I had this feeling, when you had a big issue in with your business in your day and you solve it

111
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:15,920
and you like understanding what you've done today, like was really amazing. Like not everyone can do

112
00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:24,400
this, but you did it. And this feeling, it's like one, one or two seconds for me, but it's like,

113
00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:34,400
one second for me, but it gives me okay. So I didn't waste my day. Everything else. It's more,

114
00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:40,160
I'm just really understand that everything like panic attacks and every, all my issues,

115
00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:47,920
it's not about that. I can't do this. It's just about my personal, maybe some traumas from

116
00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:53,440
childhood or something. So in general, if people have it, they should work with professionals.

117
00:13:53,440 --> 00:14:01,120
Like it's, it's okay. It's not, it's not about business and it's not about your actually skills

118
00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:08,880
and knowledges. And it's not about, it's just your issue that probably goes from some deeper problems.

119
00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:14,880
That's really powerful. Isn't it? So the idea that how we react to a situation isn't necessarily

120
00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:23,680
about our ability in that moment. It can be about our history and we can all relate to that, you

121
00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:27,920
know, on some level to a greater or lesser degree, that there are things that have happened in the

122
00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:32,560
past, things we've been told about ourselves, about what we're good at, what we're not good at,

123
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:37,440
where we failed, where we've been blamed, that we then carry around like little scars

124
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:41,840
and they, they can affect us in that moment then, can't they?

125
00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:47,520
Yes, of course. And in general, I think our, our main work as a people, yeah,

126
00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:54,960
work with ourselves. So we're working with ourselves all our life. And as soon as we will

127
00:14:54,960 --> 00:15:03,280
understand our problems, our like straights, yeah. And the weaknesses and we'll work with the

128
00:15:03,280 --> 00:15:13,760
weaknesses as faster we became happy. So for example, we all have someone have, can be more

129
00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:20,800
talented in one area, someone in another, someone have better skills here and here. So you should,

130
00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:26,080
in general, our goal to understand who we are and manage with this.

131
00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:32,080
Yes. And not make unrealistic comparisons. I think one of the things in all the research

132
00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:36,960
around the psychology of imposter syndrome, you know, when we feel like we're not as good

133
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:41,520
as anyone else in this, I shouldn't be in design or I shouldn't be in a podcast or I shouldn't be

134
00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:46,720
doing whatever we're doing is that we look around at other people doing that and we think, well,

135
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:51,040
they're really good with people and they're really good with numbers and they're really good at

136
00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:55,360
selling themselves and they're really, and we take all the positives from a whole number of other

137
00:15:55,360 --> 00:16:00,080
people and compare all of those positives to ourselves without thinking about the fact, well,

138
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:05,200
that's only one positive in that one person and they have got all sorts of other things going on

139
00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:11,360
there that where we might be stronger. Yeah. In general, I have a theory, even with designing,

140
00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:18,320
it doesn't matter, medicine or something. If you want to change a profession and became

141
00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:31,440
an educated professional in some area, you should read 100 books about it and be always in the news.

142
00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:37,120
So for example, about designing, I've been an accountant, became a designer. So I went to

143
00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:44,560
courses and study actually a technology of sewing. I read a lot of books. I research a lot of

144
00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:52,640
history about fashion and I always did, how to say, for making my creation mind,

145
00:16:53,200 --> 00:17:02,800
so some exercises to make it. So I read a lot of ways how you can like, you know, force or like,

146
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,680
you know, boost your creation mind. Yes. And practicing being creative.

147
00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:14,320
Yeah. So in general, you can get anything, any profession that you want, you just have to

148
00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:22,000
just need to give it time, your attention and be really involved in it. That's all. You can do

149
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:30,480
anything. For example, a lot of people asking me if I want to go back to Ukraine or something.

150
00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:39,200
And I always reply that unfortunately, it's no place for my business now there. It's a war there.

151
00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:44,160
If I will come back, probably I need to build a manufacturer, which build the rockets.

152
00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:51,520
And they're like, Oh, probably you can do it. It's just because if you want to do something,

153
00:17:51,520 --> 00:18:00,720
if someone doesn't matter who you are, your man or woman, or if you like, or your educational

154
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:08,560
background or something in general, my theory that you can get anything, you just need give it time.

155
00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:14,880
Give it time, a lot of like attention, energy for it and you will get it.

156
00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:22,720
Yeah. And you've got to be interested, haven't you? So you're saying to be really good in any

157
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:28,640
profession or any world, you need to immerse yourself in that and get to know as much as you

158
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:35,200
can and practice as much as you can and be patient that it might take you many months, even years

159
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:41,280
to get to a level of skill that you aspire to. So you need to be interested in that world. So

160
00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:44,880
you could never have done that in finance, I bet, because you would have just got bored at some

161
00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:49,920
point because it wasn't floating your boat. At that time, I thought like, okay, I will work

162
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,640
like this and maybe I will go teaching. Right. Okay. So you would turn it into something where

163
00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:59,280
you could breathe a bit of life into it, a bit of passion, whatever. So what was interesting,

164
00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:04,960
what you were saying earlier was about when you were facing all of those challenges in Ukraine,

165
00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:10,880
working for the big businesses and learning was paying attention to the moments of joy or the

166
00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:18,000
moments of success, even if it was just a few seconds of, oh, I sorted that or I did that well.

167
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:24,320
And I think, again, that's something that so many people forget to do. Like the brain is hardwired

168
00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:29,040
towards the risks and the threats so much that we can get immersed in the things that have gone

169
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:34,800
wrong or the problems that are coming. But to have the presence of mind to just take a moment

170
00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:41,920
and go, ah, that was great. I mean, that's just brilliant. I absolutely love that. Just that you

171
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:46,960
have that built in ingrained somehow. And, you know, maybe that's come from grandma, maybe that's

172
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:54,640
come from your life so far. In general, it's more from other people around. So I'm the person who,

173
00:19:54,640 --> 00:20:03,200
like, so I achieve something and I already think how I will achieve next level. So in general,

174
00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:09,040
it's usually people around me, like who knows what I'm doing. They're like, oh, wow, you do it. And

175
00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:17,760
like, yeah. And you start to recognize. Yeah, yes. That it's, oh, for example, I'm not really

176
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:26,160
sociable person, really. Like I'm not, but I do my social media, do posts. And in general,

177
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:34,080
I have few followers, but it's not for them. It's more for me. So when I do a post, especially about

178
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:41,200
project or about business and sharing with something, I'm like, you know, how to say,

179
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:49,360
reflecting. So I'm like, okay, we, uh, it was this, this, this, I'm done this, this, this.

180
00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:56,720
And actually we became for this result. So this is a moment when you can, you know, look on it

181
00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:03,680
and like, okay, well done. Actually. Yeah. I have a results. I have a progress because every day

182
00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:11,040
you have like so many tasks, so many thoughts, so many ideas or something or problems, and you

183
00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:16,640
can forget about it. But when you do like this little practices, like you're speaking with your

184
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:23,360
friends or with your colleagues, or you just posting something, uh, it helps you understand

185
00:21:23,360 --> 00:21:28,160
actually what you've done. Yeah. It helps you as you say, to understand it and appreciate it and,

186
00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:33,920
and notice it. There's also, I mean, all of the research into resilience. So people who are

187
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:41,760
more resilient tend to have had more challenging histories. So we tend to think of resilience as

188
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:46,480
something that you have or haven't got, but actually it's a learned skill. And one of the

189
00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:54,160
things really resilient people do habitually is look back and think about what did I learn yesterday

190
00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:59,120
that I can apply today? And that's in essence, what you're saying then, isn't it? And you're

191
00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:04,240
using social media. I've never heard it described like that. So using it, not necessarily as PR

192
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:09,280
marketing or business development and all those things that it's badged as, but you're using it

193
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:16,000
as a personal reflection and tool of recognition. That's cool. I'm going to think about my social

194
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:20,560
media like that. So hopefully that will motivate me to do more of it. Cause I really liked that.

195
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:28,240
How did you feel about your success? Cause you, so you'd been successful before the war came to

196
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:34,160
Ukraine. Quite successful in Eugene. How were you feeling at that point about yourself before the

197
00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:42,960
war came? How did you feel career wise at that point? I was like 29 and in general I felt

198
00:22:45,360 --> 00:22:57,680
really strong and I had my job, can afford myself a lot of things. I separated with my ex partner

199
00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:06,000
and I started life again in new city. So I moved to Kiev. I live in quite nice place. I travel it.

200
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:17,600
So in general, I thought like adult strong woman who can enjoy her life. I had issues of course,

201
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:25,120
we all have it at some point, but in general, yeah, like I felt like I'm really, you know,

202
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:31,280
this feelings of independence of that you like strong, that you can do everything.

203
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:39,600
I like, for example, when I went to negotiate with someone, I always negotiate only with the

204
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:46,160
business owners because that business owners told, Oh, if Yanat come into a meeting, we should be

205
00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:52,480
there because like it will be, she will broke everyone. In general, like when I come into the

206
00:23:52,480 --> 00:24:00,080
office, door will open only when we will get on all my conditions. So like, you know, Yanat,

207
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:09,520
I like this feeling. I hope I will have it again. I have no doubt you will. So you were feeling good.

208
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:14,400
You were feeling strong. You felt your life was going in the direction you wanted it to.

209
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:21,440
And you had this independence and this feeling of confidence. So tell us about that day then,

210
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:29,600
the day you left. So we had a lot of gossips before that something going to happen,

211
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:38,400
but nobody really believe in it. Like how it can be possible center of Europe, this war like this,

212
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:46,400
like, no, no, no. I had a lot of, so in general war started in 2014 and I had a lot of friends

213
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:52,640
who came from Donetsk and Lugansk to Kharkiv and Kiev. So they shared this experience with me before

214
00:24:53,360 --> 00:25:02,560
how they run, what actually you should do. But I didn't believe I made a new collection for brand.

215
00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:10,480
We invested a lot of money in this collection and yeah, in general, I really, so I had the

216
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:19,920
conversation again with my ex partner. He told me like, just in case, take some cash and documents.

217
00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:27,120
And we even had the jokes about this emergency case that should be any, because we all be stressed,

218
00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:37,360
but nobody actually believed. And then yeah, that day, I always wake up early, but it was like

219
00:25:37,360 --> 00:25:47,200
at 5 a.m. I woke up from explosion and I didn't understand what's happened. So I checked my phone,

220
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:56,880
open social media and one of my friends who lives near airport, she told like airport was bombed,

221
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:08,480
airport was bombed, war started. And I was like, what? And wake up and I remember that I had panic.

222
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:17,280
But in general, so I started to call everyone to wake them up. One of my best friends at that time,

223
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:25,040
she already lived here in Huddersfield for years, but her parents, they live really close to the

224
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:33,040
Russian border. So I called her and said like, I know we had a war here, wake up your parents,

225
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:37,440
they shouldn't leave because it's the first territory that they will invade it. And they

226
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:47,200
have in that town, they have like big warehouse with weapons. So it's strategically clear that

227
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:54,960
they go there first. So I called her and then I started to wake up all my friends. And one couple,

228
00:26:54,960 --> 00:27:01,760
they've been in Barcelona and should come back in this day. And I called them to say that they

229
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:07,520
shouldn't come back, but they said, no, we actually already here. And our plane was the last one who

230
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:18,400
landed, which landed. And they told me like, we going to the west of Ukraine. We have one free

231
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:25,280
place in the car. If you want to go with us, we will take you for 15 minutes because like it was

232
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:34,560
big panic and all people start to go and they left the cars. It was actually everything looked like in

233
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:41,840
a horror movie, but it, and you can understand that it's actually it's real life. So this air alarm,

234
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:51,840
there's cars. And so I lived in 15 minutes from my office. So I went to office, took a laptop,

235
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:57,360
clothes, everything like took some stuff. My friends came and I remember this way from the

236
00:27:57,360 --> 00:28:03,360
office to my home. First of all, it was some Russians there. I don't know who are they. So

237
00:28:03,360 --> 00:28:12,000
with some men who walk and laughing. So they see how people like scary and panicking and running.

238
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:19,440
And they walked and laughing. I was so scared about them. So I came home, put my

239
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:29,600
rucksack, laptop documents, some cash, but I took a few purses, like expensive one in case I need to

240
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:36,880
sell them and get some money. And that's all. I jumped in the car of my friends and we went to

241
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:45,920
Lviv. The way were really long and all people like panicking. So the road was crazy. The situation

242
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:53,360
on the road was crazy, really. All like trying to get first, like no rules, nothing like all people

243
00:28:53,360 --> 00:29:03,520
panicking really. Yeah. And I remember that all the way I look at the sky and afraid to see a

244
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:12,640
rocket or something. And you just, you just don't understand like what's happening.

245
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:19,840
It sounds surreal in a way. Like you said, it felt like you were in a movie,

246
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:27,120
like this can't be real, but it's happening. And, but what's the, what's the strange at that moment

247
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:37,280
that you understand that actually nothing, not giving you any value. So I took my stuff,

248
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:46,400
like just rucksack, but all my clothes, all like stuff in my house, which I like, I dream about

249
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:56,800
before I worked so hard to get it, you know, like make my home, like my home. And I left apartment

250
00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:01,840
and I thought, probably I will never come back here and probably I'll never see my apartment again.

251
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:10,320
At that second, you understand how miserable, like miserable is it, how

252
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:16,080
it's not making any value in your life. When, when the question about just survive

253
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:24,800
physically in general, it's not bringing any value in your life. You must grieve for that,

254
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,880
not necessarily the lost possessions, although maybe a few of the lost possessions, but,

255
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:35,680
but to grieve for that life you had and that world that was there, that was yours. And,

256
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:40,960
and someone just came and decided to take it from you. It was funny that they were taking,

257
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:46,400
which I mean, the lack of humanity in that, that that's a whole different psychology going on there.

258
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:52,960
So there was some preparation going on there for you, even though you said none of us really

259
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:57,600
believed it, none of it, you and your partner at the time was still joking about, well, let's just

260
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:05,040
get a bag ready anyway. So, so on some level, there was some kind of, just like, you know,

261
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:12,560
just, yeah, preparation that probably, you know, served you very well on that day when,

262
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:19,600
when you had to go and you were given 15 minutes to go and then you ended up in Huddersfield.

263
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:26,960
And that was that with Anna, the same. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, UKO program wasn't open at

264
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:36,320
the beginning. So I left Ukraine. Uh, I spent some time in Germany, then in France. And then, uh,

265
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:43,200
my friends, uh, heard about the, uh, hosting program in the UK that it will be opening.

266
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:51,680
And they proposed me if I want to move here. And for me, first of all, they are, they are my close

267
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:57,040
friends. And like at that time I was like, yes, of course I want to be with someone because I

268
00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:02,000
didn't understand where I am, what I'm doing. I thought that at least I can speak English.

269
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:12,080
So yeah, I was like, yes, of course I want to go. And they were one of the first people who

270
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:19,200
actually filled the form and sent the request for hosting me. And to go and stay with friends as

271
00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:25,360
well, to not just be, I know a lot of people came over and they were hosted by wonderful people who'd

272
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:30,400
volunteered, which is just makes, brings a tear to the eye. But for you to go to friends, that

273
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:36,240
must've been so, so much more reassuring. And we laughed then about the English because you'd said

274
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:41,360
the Yorkshire accent through you didn't you? Yeah. Yeah. I thought like, okay, I know English. I can,

275
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:45,360
at least I can speak with the people. But when I just came in like, oh my God,

276
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:53,360
I don't understand anyone. The things, one thing that in general, I could say something.

277
00:32:54,720 --> 00:33:04,240
And yeah, so local people can understand me, but I couldn't understand anyone. And it was really

278
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:13,120
strange. I couldn't like, wow, it's totally different English that I know, you know. So yeah,

279
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:23,360
for three months was really strange with adaptation for the language. And my friend's family actually

280
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:33,440
helps a lot because they from Yorkshire also, and we spoke a lot and I met a lot of people here.

281
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:42,880
I didn't speak a lot at the beginning of the most, I'm more like, but it's, it helps me to,

282
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:49,280
in general now I understand almost everyone. Sometimes not, but in general,

283
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:55,680
I think even English people sometimes find Yorkshire people hard to understand. So with a really

284
00:33:55,680 --> 00:34:01,920
broad accent. When we spoke before this, you said that you'd applied for a few different jobs that

285
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:06,640
you wanted to find, you know, something to do. You wanted to earn your own money. You wanted to have

286
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:11,360
a sense of kind of purpose and something to do, but that you struggled with that. And then you

287
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:15,920
said there was this moment, was it standing in your friend's kitchen? Yeah. So tell us about that

288
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:23,840
moment. So yes, I tried to find a job, but in general, you know, like this, my business mind,

289
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:31,760
you can do anything with it. I always put myself in this position. So in this trouble. So yeah,

290
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:37,760
I thought about what can I do because I was struggled with the finding some work. What can

291
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:43,520
I do? How can I use my knowledge and skills and experience because I had quite big experience

292
00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:55,920
and do something. And my main goal was help somehow people in Ukraine. And also, I didn't

293
00:34:55,920 --> 00:35:03,360
like the situation that I'm a refugee here and I'm getting benefit. I want to get like proper money,

294
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:09,760
pay taxes, assimilate and be a part of society here. Like I'm here already and probably I will

295
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:17,440
stay here as long as government will let me to stay. It was like existential problem for me. Like

296
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:26,560
what should I do for it? How can I use everything that I know to do it? And yeah, I came up with

297
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:34,960
this idea to take actually the business model from my previous company and turn it a little bit.

298
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:42,960
So, because I have quite good knowledge and I started to make some research in the local market.

299
00:35:44,720 --> 00:35:51,120
Unfortunately, we have quite powerful industry, fashion industry, like producing the clothes in

300
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:56,560
Ukraine, but unfortunately it works for Russia before. Like Ukrainian market was quite big,

301
00:35:56,560 --> 00:36:04,960
46 million people plus Russian market 160 million people. So, and like Kazakhstan and all that part

302
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:19,120
of the continent. So, I thought if we will turn this and go to another one part and I start to

303
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:31,280
make a research about price, about local propositions, it's really important to find a right idea to

304
00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:41,520
understand the market and bring this idea really useful and something that will decide and solve

305
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:50,000
the lots of questions or problems of decline in the market. So, I looked at the market and I

306
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:57,440
saw empty places in the market and I found that I can feel it by Ukrainian products or services.

307
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:05,440
So, at the beginning it was like I found all these empty places and I said, okay, we can bring it,

308
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:12,640
we can turn this industry and bring it here. And I thought only about UK at that time. Okay,

309
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:22,000
let's try. And I thought that I saw that it should be really popular, it will solve some problems

310
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:27,520
and for local people, of course, for Ukrainians because they need a market.

311
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:36,640
And it was pure experiment, pure risk. So, you were taking that business in the Ukraine that had been

312
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:44,800
focused on the Ukraine internally, but also Russia, Kazakhstan and turning it towards Europe, the UK

313
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:51,520
initially, but then Europe, America's and so you're thinking we'll sell in the other direction. That

314
00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:57,360
was your idea. Who did you go to first? So, you're standing in the kitchen, you have this idea. So,

315
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:03,920
what was your first step in that? I called my ex-partner. Did you? Again, everything again.

316
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:11,200
He's a bit of a rock star in this journey. I called him, share this idea and he again like,

317
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:18,720
okay, try. Easy, easy peasy. Okay, so I started to make a business plan,

318
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:26,080
make it more from idea to some steps to do. Yeah, and I started to do it actually

319
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:35,520
the next day. Then I shared with the family where I live, host family, like a father of this family.

320
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:44,000
He has, he had a friend, he was, I will connect you with him. That friend sent request to Yorkshire

321
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:51,520
Post about that I'm here. And in general, they asking for me for interview just because I was

322
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:58,480
a refugee, first refugee here. And in this interview, I mentioned about my business idea

323
00:38:59,920 --> 00:39:05,920
he was like, what are you going to do? And I'm like, just mentioned about it. So, they made

324
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:14,800
a post in LinkedIn. And I got so many comments, like people who wants to help, who proposed

325
00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:22,880
meeting, I don't know, them services, them knowledges. And it was, oh, wow. So it actually,

326
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:28,640
I just mentioned, and this situation take me and, you know, put me in a place where I'm like,

327
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:37,280
I can't think I can't like, all this amazing people give me so many opportunities, not use it,

328
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:45,920
it would be pretty stupid. So yeah, I'm like, I had no any, no doubts about it.

329
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:52,080
Georgie Tunny That must have been wonderful to get that response. Because not only are you getting

330
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:57,280
the practical help where people are saying, well, we can do this, I can do that. But you're getting

331
00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:03,440
the reassurance of your idea. Yeah, in general, a bit of social support there. You say, do this,

332
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:11,600
you should do this. I found that I'm probably really lucky to start my way here in Yorkshire.

333
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:19,280
Because I found the Yorkshire people is really kind, and really supportive, involved in and,

334
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:24,560
you know, like, helpful, they, they really want to help. They really kind, they always

335
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:36,880
is so many people here, like really, I felt really welcoming everywhere. And that was,

336
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:45,520
that was cool. I think it's, it's something what happened with me in, like, in the right moment in

337
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:49,600
the right place with the right people. Of course, it helps a lot.

338
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:55,280
Georgie Tunny And that's so lovely to hear, I think, because I certainly post Brexit, the UK

339
00:40:55,280 --> 00:41:00,560
has a bit of a bad reputation, maybe across Europe for being, you know, a bit distant and wanted to

340
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:06,480
do our own thing. And I certainly recognized, obviously, you experienced it in real time,

341
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:11,760
but I recognize how much people just wanted to help when the war broke out in Ukraine. I think

342
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:16,240
the fact that we'd all just gone through COVID. And certainly your experience of walking down

343
00:41:16,240 --> 00:41:21,440
the street that day, and war has started is nothing, is so much more than what we all

344
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:27,760
experienced. But I think the fact that we had all experienced a life changing event, where we had

345
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:33,200
to stay home and not go out and not see our loved ones. It's that thing, isn't it, that you have so

346
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:38,800
much more empathy for someone going through a difficult time, if you've experienced a flavor

347
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:44,720
of it, even if it's just a flavor of it. So there was something there about, I think people really

348
00:41:44,720 --> 00:41:49,040
wanted to do something and they leaned into it. That's lovely that they all leaned into.

349
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:57,760
But I think it's something about your DNA, you know, even with the war, like this country, so

350
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:09,440
old, if I can say so, yeah, has a big history, huge history, sometimes cruel history. And all this,

351
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:19,280
I think, maybe it sounds a little bit weird, but all this leaves something in your mentality,

352
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:26,880
how they open them doors for another people who are running from the war. It's a lot of refugees

353
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:35,760
here, a lot. How they're keen to help and, you know, like do something good. It's something,

354
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:44,720
I think, sometimes that's something about your DNA. It's the opposite of the propaganda, maybe,

355
00:42:44,720 --> 00:42:52,640
that you get about the country, in reality. All countries, they have their own, you know,

356
00:42:52,640 --> 00:43:00,640
history and way to go. At some point, this is, this has happened, Brexit happened. At some point,

357
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:08,400
it's nothing about people. It's about some historical moment. Ukrainians didn't deserve

358
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:13,600
a war in general, you know. It's not about us. It's about some historical...

359
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,360
It's just the things that are going on around us. Yeah, no, absolutely.

360
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:21,520
So it's more, I think it's more personality. It's more about how you...

361
00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:27,280
I like that. That's lovely. That's really nice. It's interesting what you say about the UK and

362
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:34,400
having a personality. I think social identity theory, which is big within the world of psychology,

363
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:42,880
teaches us how much we take from the groups that we associate with. So everything from the small

364
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:50,000
groups, we have our own family, our own profession, but to big culture. And we take part of our

365
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:56,240
identity. If we, as a person, we're like a pie and some of us is, Yana, as the personality,

366
00:43:56,240 --> 00:44:01,280
you genetically got from your kind of family history, but other bits of that pie will be fed

367
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:07,760
by the different groups of people, the different social groups. And that big culture is something

368
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:14,560
that feeds into us. And when we're told about our history and our legacy, I know something that's

369
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:20,560
always really made me feel proud of being British, despite some of the things we did in the past that

370
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:28,240
maybe weren't so nice, is that we have always had an open door. There is really very... It's very

371
00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:36,000
hard to trace our indigenous population. We were Vikings, Saxons, Romans, and on it went. So we've

372
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:43,680
always been a melting pot and we've always taken in people, sometimes for industrial economic reasons,

373
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:48,320
sometimes because they were running from something. But I think that forms... We talked about that in

374
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:53,280
school and it forms part of how you see the world, how you see yourself. And then that obviously

375
00:44:53,280 --> 00:45:00,720
drives your values. So when people turn up saying, we need help, part of your social identity is that,

376
00:45:00,720 --> 00:45:06,000
well, we're British, we help. And I think that that's a really powerful thing that you've actually

377
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:11,760
seen that manifest. So you had this support in Yorkshire, the Yorkshire Post, a bit of a lift off.

378
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:16,480
And so where are you now? So we're now, what, two years on from that idea in the kitchen. So where

379
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:25,440
have you taken it to? What are you... Yeah, that two years were crazy. We started from open the first

380
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:32,800
pop-up shop in Leeds, in Victoria Quarter, then in Trinity. I started quite unexpectedly for myself.

381
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:41,680
I started wholesale business and we really quick. So first year, it was only retail in the UK and I

382
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:51,360
couldn't... So in my mind, I was quite scared and I didn't think globally. I thought about UK, we

383
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:59,920
will try here, how to say it, put the feet on the water and then we will see. But wholesale and global

384
00:45:59,920 --> 00:46:08,400
business came quick and unexpectedly for me. So I tried one channel and it's like, boom, exploded.

385
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:20,400
Like I got first few wholesale partners. I feel the wave and just start to grow in this way.

386
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:27,600
So I feel that this wholesale business, it's actually what I need where I can get quick,

387
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:34,720
more money and quickly give it to the Ukrainian manufacturers, pay taxes here, start do it now.

388
00:46:34,720 --> 00:46:42,480
Because retail business quite tricky, needs more investment and it's slower. So you pivoted quite

389
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:50,560
quickly when you saw that... I add. In general, for these two years, I changed my business strategy

390
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:57,760
like thousands of times. So I think, okay, we will go this. Something happened. So I add and like,

391
00:46:57,760 --> 00:47:06,160
I'm, you know, from one stone, I just draw it and try to do. So I see opportunities. Okay,

392
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:11,840
how can I implement it in my business? How can I do? What can I do for make it growing?

393
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:20,880
And in general, yeah, at the moment we have, I count two days ago, 118 wholesale partners across

394
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:31,280
three continents. So we're selling in USA, Canada, Australia, in Europe. I thought about British

395
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:36,720
market, but in general, British market, unfortunately has one of the smallest percent.

396
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:40,000
But that doesn't matter now.

397
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:48,160
No, it's just, yeah, it's just how everything started in my head and how it's totally different.

398
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:53,040
Different. Yeah. So that you need to be really adaptable. So it sounds like you've been really

399
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:58,080
adaptable. You've obviously moved at pace. And again, there's that echo of this was really

400
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:03,040
stressful. This was really scary, but you kept going. You didn't stop and think it's too scary.

401
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:05,600
You just kept going. You kept going, didn't you?

402
00:48:05,600 --> 00:48:15,680
Yeah, but I don't have a lot of choice. So let's say I'm here. I have no home. I have no job. Do

403
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:23,200
I have a lot of ways to move? No, I have this and that's all. It's all that I can do. Probably in

404
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:30,800
general. Now I think that, okay, I could choose easier way to get a job somewhere. And like,

405
00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:37,200
but now when I started and I see that I can do it, I feel really big social responsibility

406
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:45,600
that like few brands in my portfolio, I helped them a lot. Save the working places. We paying

407
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:56,240
taxes, like we do a lot. And I see that I can do it for more and more and more. And it started

408
00:48:56,240 --> 00:49:03,840
grow quite fast. And I see opportunity. I see that I can handle it. But in general, yeah, a lot of

409
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:10,160
people, wow, you start so quick. You like you just came and you already do something. But I don't

410
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:17,680
have, I didn't have options in general. I need to, I need to eat. I need to cover my bills. I need

411
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:25,600
to do so. It's, it wasn't like I sit and think, okay, should I do it? Should, shouldn't I do it?

412
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:31,680
Like it's not that way. Yeah. And it possibly wasn't in you either. I'm sure there are some

413
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:36,480
people that might've just sunk into a bit of helplessness maybe in that situation.

414
00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:42,320
I don't understand the language. I'm in a foreign place. I don't know how to get work. I've been for

415
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:47,920
interviews and I'm not getting the work. And, and I think it would be very easy for people to

416
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:52,560
sink into that. Again, it's about personality also. So it's about character. It's about

417
00:49:52,560 --> 00:50:02,400
all that experience that I had in my life, which applying it. Yeah. And just, which make me my

418
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:08,720
character as who I am. So yeah. And I think the genius of it all is like you say that the

419
00:50:08,720 --> 00:50:13,760
motivationally, there's a necessity there. Absolutely. I get that. But the genius of what

420
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:21,360
you did was you thought what skills have I got to apply to this problem in my homeland? And also the

421
00:50:21,360 --> 00:50:28,960
fact that I feel like I'm being looked after by a country that I do. Like how do I map those things

422
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:35,600
together? And then you found an idea, which as you said, then evolved quite dramatically. So that

423
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:40,880
initial idea probably isn't much like what you have now, but that doesn't matter. It was the thing

424
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:48,720
that got you going, wasn't it? And then that ability to pivot and flex and learn. But most

425
00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:54,240
importantly, I think the thing that's striking me about your personality on it is it's just that

426
00:50:54,720 --> 00:51:00,720
feeling the fear and doing it anyway. Just, you know, it's scary. I don't know if I can do it.

427
00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:07,680
I'm not sure where it's going, but just keep moving. Yeah. And yeah, I know that not all

428
00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:13,840
people can do it. I know that a lot of people have, I had fairs also, but they sometimes can

429
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:23,920
be stuck with the fairs. Or for example, my first exhibition for wholesale, I took three suitcases,

430
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:32,400
really heavy. I don't drive a car. I put it on, like I carry it by myself on a few buses

431
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:44,880
to get somewhere. So it's not every person can do it and even will consider to do it. So it's all

432
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:54,960
about how interested you are in it, how crazy you are. Because I sometimes, if I'm stuck with

433
00:51:54,960 --> 00:52:03,600
something, it's like no way that I'm like, I don't give up with this. But you're picking things that

434
00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:09,200
you're very passionate about or that mean something to you from changing to design when you're a

435
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:15,360
youngster to adapting to this awful life changing experience and thinking, well, how can I do

436
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:22,000
something productive with the things I've got? How can I turn it into an opportunity? And also

437
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:28,880
really important thing that I want to mention that it's also about, for example, I have a business

438
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:37,040
and again, I have startup again. I'm started from the zero. It's hard. I didn't have a lot of money

439
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:47,600
to start it. And yeah, it's hard. It's hard to run it. All depends how prepared you are. For example,

440
00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:56,320
my friends who has regular job, they're having money or stability. Their income is always in time.

441
00:52:56,320 --> 00:53:03,760
They know how much they earn, can plan them life, vacation and everything. When you have your own

442
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:09,200
business, it should be your lifestyle and you should be ready that you don't plan anything.

443
00:53:09,200 --> 00:53:17,280
Anything. So first of all, when you have a startup, your income can be good today and low tomorrow.

444
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:23,920
It's a lot of risks. You should understand it. You should be prepared for it. You should wait.

445
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:31,600
My company has evaluation like publicly evaluation, one million dollar for today or one million pound

446
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:40,000
for today. But I can afford a lot of things. But my friends, for example, who works in a regular

447
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:46,560
work, they can afford a lot of they can afford traveling everywhere. So it's about to be prepared

448
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:52,960
for it and understand it that it's not something that you come in, do it easy and like enjoy your

449
00:53:52,960 --> 00:54:01,760
life. No, it's work. It will be hard. It will be stressful. Your first five years of the business,

450
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:08,880
it's total hell. You don't understand anything. You just have idea. You like trying to make a system

451
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:17,200
and, you know, the right business model and checking what works with it. And the same was

452
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:23,280
my first business. First five years, I haven't seen money. Like you get something, you reinvest,

453
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:29,600
you get reinvest, you get reinvest. And it's like total totally crazy. Sometimes people give up on

454
00:54:29,600 --> 00:54:36,080
this stage because not all ready for it. And it's normal. Not all ready for it. Not all want to

455
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:43,680
handle it. Sometimes I even me sometimes think what I'm doing. Like I'm 32. I want like leave,

456
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:50,400
be like relaxed, enjoy my life. I think that's quite normal that you should have that thought

457
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:57,360
because I think it is like you say, it's really, really hard. And it makes more sense why actually

458
00:54:57,360 --> 00:55:03,680
make taking that time to reflect on the winds along the way and the little successes along the

459
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:10,560
way, the power of your own belief in what you're doing and then the impact that has on other people

460
00:55:10,560 --> 00:55:16,480
who can change your destiny, but also can change the destiny of all those people you're trying to

461
00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:22,160
help back in the Ukraine. So I think you've done something really fabulous and you should feel

462
00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:28,880
incredibly proud. Hopefully I'm like, I don't feel that I've done a lot, but I hope that I will.

463
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:39,360
That I will. Now you don't feel like you finished. No, no, no. It's just, you know, I've found like

464
00:55:39,360 --> 00:55:49,280
the source and I like, and I feel that it's right source of, for my business, for helping. So it's

465
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:55,200
just the beginning. Really. It's just really beginning. So going back to the beginning,

466
00:55:55,200 --> 00:56:01,040
if you think back to your teenage self, so you know, when you're at that age where you're telling

467
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:05,120
grandma wants to do design and she's like, no, no, no, go off and get yourself a proper job.

468
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:11,360
Yeah. What would that Jana think about what you're doing now?

469
00:56:12,240 --> 00:56:16,240
Oh, no, I think that Jana would think that I'm cool.

470
00:56:17,680 --> 00:56:23,680
She would love your outfits. Yeah, at least. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I had totally different pattern.

471
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:30,000
And in general, actually all that I do, I'm treating my inner child. I'm treating that Jana.

472
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:41,760
So I do all her dreams come true. I try to spoil her. I try to give that child all that she wants

473
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:49,680
and couldn't have it at that time. And I try to, yeah, make all her dreams, ambitions. And

474
00:56:51,200 --> 00:56:57,920
in general, probably that's all that I'm doing is to make her dreams.

475
00:56:57,920 --> 00:57:04,480
So when we talk about what motivates you, there it is, isn't it? Yeah. Making her dreams come true.

476
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:11,120
And that's the fuel. And even when faced with setbacks, tricky times, panic attacks,

477
00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:15,840
fleeing war, you're still working hard to make her dreams come true.

478
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:23,120
What advice would you give her? If you could whisper in her ear, what would you tell her

479
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:28,080
that might make her journey a little easier? Maybe don't be afraid. You can do it.

480
00:57:30,640 --> 00:57:36,560
And you are absolute proof of that. It's been absolutely wonderful. Is there anything that you

481
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:41,920
would like to share with our listeners about your wonderful business or about your journey?

482
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:48,960
Anything that you would want to leave as a here? So probably all that I can say, don't be afraid.

483
00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:58,640
Don't be afraid. We all do a lot of mistakes. Life is a tricky. Everything can happen, divorcing,

484
00:57:58,640 --> 00:58:07,360
like, I don't know, wars, everything. But all people can go through it. Just don't be afraid.

485
00:58:07,360 --> 00:58:15,920
Do steps. Don't sit and think a lot. Do steps. And step by step, it will bring you for something.

486
00:58:15,920 --> 00:58:21,440
If you will see it and think about it and, you know, like about risks, about fears,

487
00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:26,240
about everything, it's not bringing you anywhere. You will see it and think about it. It's not give

488
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:34,640
you any results, any benefit. So it's that thing about to survive whatever bad thing has come your

489
00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:42,720
way and to succeed. You've got to take a bit of control and be productive and move forward and

490
00:58:42,720 --> 00:58:50,400
not sit in the anxiety or the sadness that might be going on. We all have our time. Like one day

491
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:55,440
you can see it and I don't know, think about how in your pajamas, eating cake. It's okay.

492
00:58:55,440 --> 00:59:02,720
Yeah, it's okay. That's good. I'm glad you said that. Yeah, me too. But in general,

493
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:10,880
if you want to handle the situation, you should do something. That's all. Put yourself, you have

494
00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:16,960
your time, put yourself together and just step by step. Don't rush. When I just came here, I met

495
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:26,320
a woman, she's a refugee from Venezuela and she also lost her business, but she was here with the

496
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:36,640
family. And she also wrote me in LinkedIn and all her advice was don't be rushed. And at that time,

497
00:59:36,640 --> 00:59:42,880
I was like, no, it's not about me. But in general, I understand why she told it because

498
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:56,720
you shouldn't expect a lot like for one year, for example, step by step, just do it, like do

499
00:59:56,720 --> 01:00:03,120
something that will bring you to the place where you want to be. Don't expect that it will be

500
01:00:03,120 --> 01:00:09,920
tomorrow. And that insight, I think from your leadership journey is that just holding your

501
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:17,920
nerve, holding your nerve, using your intellect, actually leaning into the people who support you,

502
01:00:17,920 --> 01:00:24,400
your friends, your partners, your ex partners, anybody who has those positive words to fuel you

503
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:31,680
and support you, they are really powerful lessons. It's an amazing thing to do with all your skills

504
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:38,080
and clearly it matters very much to you and it matters very much to the people in your homeland.

505
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:43,920
It matters very much to the people of Yorkshire, I believe. And we should be very proud that you

506
01:00:43,920 --> 01:00:49,440
are part of the UK economy, I think doing something really quite innovative.

507
01:00:49,440 --> 01:00:56,000
Yeah, hopefully I can do even better and better. And yeah, I love this country and I love people

508
01:00:56,000 --> 01:01:03,120
here and it's really important to feel yourself at home where you live, especially when you have no

509
01:01:03,120 --> 01:01:12,480
home. So I want to feel here like I belong to it and pay taxes and be like a part of society.

510
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:22,800
It's actually what the feelings coming from. We all, it's how the economy works, not in any

511
01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:29,200
different way, it's only this way. I love it, Yana. I actually just want my daughters to just

512
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:34,240
follow you around with just a message of just listen to every word this woman says.

513
01:01:35,280 --> 01:01:42,160
Because I think your values, your work ethic, your approach, your mindset is all lovely.

514
01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:46,400
It's been an absolute pleasure and I could sit here all day, I think, talking to you about this.

515
01:01:46,400 --> 01:01:50,400
But thank you so much for joining us. It's been a delight.

516
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:53,760
Thank you so much for having me.

517
01:01:56,720 --> 01:01:58,960
Coming up in Leadership Journeys.

518
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:06,000
I grew up in a council house in a part of Bradford called Lilycroft and I didn't know anybody who'd

519
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:11,520
gone to university on our estate where we lived. Don't give yourself false ceilings,

520
01:02:12,160 --> 01:02:17,920
don't give yourself false limitations. It isn't a limitation that you were born in a council house

521
01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:25,520
in Bradford.