WEBVTT

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Hello everybody and welcome to Family Tree Talk,

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your favourite Family Tree podcast. I'm your

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co -host Nathan Ward and with me as always is...

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Helen Tummy. Hiya Helen, how are you? I'm very,

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very well, yeah. How are you? I'm really good,

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thanks. Just had a right nice long bank holiday

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weekend, haven't we? Mm -hmm, yeah. And shocker,

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some sunshine, which is good. I know, very, very

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good, yeah. And have you had much chance to do

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any family history? I have not. I've done bits

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and bats, but not to the extent that I want to

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do. I'm feeling a little bit guilty about it

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right now. Yeah, that's what it's like sometimes.

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You just have to kind of keep chipping away,

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don't you? Weaving it in. You do. I've done bits,

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like going back on what we said last week, I

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did go and have a quick look at Clifford, who

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is my, oh my gosh, I can't remember what he is

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to my relations now, but he'll be like a great

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-great -granduncle or something. He died at the

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age of 18 and my mum told me it was from a motorcycle

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accident. I'd previously ordered his death certificate

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that said he'd died from complications. That

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was just emphysema, wasn't it? Emphysema of the

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lungs, yeah, due to long -standing heart conditions

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and exertion. So it didn't sound like a motorcycle

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accident, but I guess it could have been. So

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I had a quick dip in to find my past to see if

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I could see any records in the newspapers about

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him. And long story short, I couldn't. But it

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was actually really good fun being in Find My

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Past. I'm actually really keen to get into that

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now. As I've said recently, I'm getting bored

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of dates and numbers and times. I want some texture.

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And just looking through the search and some

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of the results that came up, it was like, this

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is actually really cool because this is like

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living history. It's not living history, but

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you know what I mean? It's people doing things

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and it's all in context. So I'm going to keep

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my eye open for options to actually get into

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those archives and try and find some interesting

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articles because that was cool. Was it the newspaper

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collections on Femopost you're looking at or

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just general search results amongst other collections?

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I think it was just the newspaper ones. But yeah,

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it's just really cool. It's a really cool search

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engine, isn't it? Fantastic. I need to find more

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opportunities to dip into that. So like I say,

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I'm going to keep my eyes open. Anything that

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looks like it's newsworthy, I might jump on there

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and just get a bit more texture. That's exciting.

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Just a quick newspaper 101. Most people already

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know about this, but the Find My Past newspaper

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collections, I think they have 100 million newspaper

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pages now. And they're also the same records

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that you'll find by the British Newspaper Archive.

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So these are all the records, copies of newspapers

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over the past centuries, which have been kept

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by the British Library. Obviously, the newspaper

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and the stories covered, there's national and

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local newspapers. And some of the stories they'll

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be covering will be global. And there is a really

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cool option. So when you go and search, when

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you go to their search interface, the first thing

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you see is really simple. But then if you click

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advanced search, you probably found that, Nathan.

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You can really fine tune your search by maybe

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the title of the newspaper, the date span, any

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particular keywords. And scroll down to the bottom,

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there's an option which says. free newspapers

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and they have about one million free newspapers

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which may or may not cover your area or era of

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interest but it's something free is always worth

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having a look at isn't it it's always good yeah

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yeah so the websites it's just findmypast .co

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.uk or the british newspaper archive lovely lovely

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stuff good yeah i'm hopeful about that um and

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then the only other thing i've done and i was

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so excited about this and it ended up being a

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bit of a Well, yeah, just, all right, okay, I've

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done this. I added in a photograph of one of

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my ancestors. I was, I don't know what I was

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expecting. It felt like it should have been like

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some sort of social media interaction. I can't

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describe it to you. I thought, I'm going to put

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this on. People are going to have her in the

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tree and they're going to be like, oh, that's

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my great -great -grandma, blah, blah, blah. And

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all that happened was I attached the image to

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the profile and now her image. appears next to

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her name and i i don't know i was expecting it

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to like be like a tidal wave of like connections

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it hasn't been no but it could be like a slow

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burn so over time she'll get thrown up as the

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um potential hint to people yeah yeah i also

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i then obviously wanted to add more and i do

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have a collection of photographs that my my great

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auntie sent down to my mum yeah so I was like

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right I'll go get those added and obviously I

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hit my stumbling block straight away didn't know

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who any of them were so I need to find my mum

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and spend some time with her to actually work

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out who they are then I'll get those added but

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I think now that I've got at least a couple on

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I want more yes It's so much more evocative looking

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at your tree when it's got photos on, doesn't

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it? Yeah, it looks great already. It's quite

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amusing as well, because I know we discussed

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this in the past about not using AI images. And

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then you made the reference to the fact that

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in the past, a lot of people didn't have photographs.

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It was like a caricature or etching, et cetera.

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And this one is an etching. So technically, I've

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just put someone's drawing on of this person.

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But we do know who it is. It has been handed

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down. We all know who this person is. That's

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cool. I don't think my, I mean, they all have

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different perspectives, don't they, on AI? So

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I'm not particularly against or pro -AI. I can

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see both sides. But I think for me, let's keep,

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as family historians, we need to keep really

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vigilant. What are we looking at? How factual

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is it? Where did it come from? And increasingly,

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as AI gets better and better at generating old

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pictures, we're going to get in a muddle. We're

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not going to know which ones are AI -generated

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and which ones aren't. That's what I don't like.

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No, I don't like that. Yeah. So as long as it's

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watermarked and carefully labelled up and everyone

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knows this is, you know, somebody from the 1890s

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from that sort of social or occupational background,

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that's what they roughly would have looked like,

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rather than it is definitely great, great Aunty

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Mary Jane, then I'm happy. I think it just needs

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to be flagged up. I mean, that is one thing that

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I didn't do. When I put the image on there...

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It didn't seem to be anywhere for me to add comments

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about the image and it hasn't appeared in a timeline

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or anything like that. So if you go to your gallery,

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so go to the person's profile. Gallery, I've

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never even pressed that button before. Ah, nice.

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It's always, I mean, it's all that we do occasionally

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own or I think lots of people do about Ancestry

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and any of the big websites. do offer us incredible

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tools. And she does have particularly sophisticated

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tools for doing a family history. So you go to

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the person's profile, you can see the tabs along

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the bottom. We've chatted about it before. Normally,

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quite often, we will be spending time on the

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kind of place which says about the facts and

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the sources and the relationships, wouldn't we?

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Yes. But then press gallery. And in gallery,

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you should be able to find your picture that

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you added. Yeah. Yep. And then I'm pretty sure,

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let me go to somebody on my tree who I do. If

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you click on the image, it then gives you the

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option on the right to add a date, a location,

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a category or a description. So you are going

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to do that, aren't you, Nathan? I'm going to

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add a description saying this is not AI. Yes.

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And what you can do, it's nice to say where it

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came from. So I call things, that sounds a bit

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grand, but if I've got something from my uncle,

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then I might call it, I'll call it the. his first

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name, his last name collection. Yeah. Or, and

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if I've just got a few pictures from somebody,

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I will put it, I'll keep a record by maybe in

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the file name or if I have them in a folder,

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I'll say these pictures are from blah, blah.

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And then keep that. It's the provenance, isn't

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it? Where they came from. And what's really interesting

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about that is say you've got that picture and

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then at some point you might via your online

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tree. make contact with a second cousin or third

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cousin or something and they've got that picture

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too or they've got a slightly different picture

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or pictures which are clearly taken in the same

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studio at the same time with different family

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members so if you can keep track of where your

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stuff came from and then where their stuff came

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from it makes a more interesting um makes more

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interesting jigsaw piece puzzles to work with

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it doesn't and everything you said as well about

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ai this could actually have been created with

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ai so just a flag that it isn't ai and it is

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the real picture that's just good isn't it Very

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good. How exciting. Very, very exciting. And

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it's just like lots of things with our family

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history. Sometimes you can feel a bit daunted

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and mean to do something for ages. Then you've

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just got on and done it now. And now you've done

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that one, I can see you adding loads. Yeah, it

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feels like a fun mission, to be honest. It's

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obviously going to be a challenge because there

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are going to be lots of people that there's no

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way I can get an image for. But like you say,

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it just makes the profile look much nicer. So

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you can get as many of them on your tree. It's

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going to be lovely. And your boys will be more

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inclined to find your tree interesting? I mean,

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we can pretend that, but yes. And you might find

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that you get some unusual kind of beard inspiration

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or something and want to grow ridiculous, not

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ridiculous, moustaches or anything? Ridiculous

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is good. I like ridiculous. Yeah, I'd be well

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up for that. Yeah. Why have these gone out of

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fashion? I'm bringing them right back. My great

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-great -grandad would be so proud of me. Yeah,

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yeah. Do you know, Nathan, you've had some really

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lovely podcast emails from podcast listeners.

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Lovely. Yeah. Shall I give them a quick shout

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out? One is a tip for me and you. Really good

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point. And it's kind of saying a tip that I said,

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but turning it around and upside down and making

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a useful point. So last week we've been talking

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over the week. We always talk about our research

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log and how we keep notes. And I was just saying

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to you about how you could. Keep your notes in

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your family tree. So when you go to somebody's

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profile and click the little notes button below

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their name and add notes about your research

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you're doing on them. And what else did we talk

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about? We talked about tweaking the life stories,

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tweaking somebody's life story to add in further

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details and tell their narrative. And then, so

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Steve switched it around and he says, if you

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want other people to be able to see what you're

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writing, then obviously you need to use the comments.

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So he says, Steve says. Thank you for writing,

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Steve. Steve says, in your most recent podcast,

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you were explaining to Nathan how he could tell

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people looking at his tree on Ancestry about

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some family documents by tweaking the life story.

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Steve continues, he could also use the notes

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and comments feature. These are accessed from

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the tools menu. As we note, tools are only visible

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to Nathan and anyone he shares his tree with.

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I think they're with editor rights, but anyone

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who shares his tree with, while comments would

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be visible to everyone, assuming that Nathan's

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tree is public. And he hopes this helps. And

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he gives the URL, which is the Ancestry support

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URL. So support .ancestry .com forward slash

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s, forward slash article, forward slash notes,

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hyphen and, hyphen comments, hyphen any, hyphen

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trees. And notes, comments and trees all have

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a capital T. And I think... Nathan, should we

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just set up a little kind of blog post or something

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where we can put these URLs? Because they're

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a nightmare to read out. Yes, definitely. I think

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that'd be quite a useful thing to do. Let's do

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that. So everyone, we'll let you know. We'll

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find it. We'll create a useful space for you

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so you don't have to listen to intermittently

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long URLs. Anyway, the main point is about the

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comments. If you want other people to see things.

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So let's see. What you were talking about was

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uploading those. First of all, war records, I

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think, because one of your ancestors died and

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he got sent a letter from the king and presumably

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his death penny, a big plaque, which is about

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three or four inches wide. I don't have the penny.

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It was just a letter to say, sorry, that is dead.

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Yeah, he would have got a penny, but maybe someone

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else has got the penny now in your family. But

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anyway, you're going to upload the document and

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then... If you put a comment about it, add in

00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:24.779
comments about that person, then everyone else

00:12:24.779 --> 00:12:26.940
will be able to see that comment. Would the comment

00:12:26.940 --> 00:12:29.720
be tied to the document I upload or would it

00:12:29.720 --> 00:12:33.399
be a general comment tied to that profile? Well,

00:12:33.480 --> 00:12:37.419
I think it would be, let's go to here. It's going

00:12:37.419 --> 00:12:39.600
to be tied to that person. So let's say you're

00:12:39.600 --> 00:12:43.399
on the person. You're on the big, presumably

00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:45.159
you haven't changed the colour scheme. You're

00:12:45.159 --> 00:12:47.940
on the big grey bar at the top. And when it says

00:12:47.940 --> 00:12:50.779
view notes, then it says view comments. And so

00:12:50.779 --> 00:12:54.059
the comments are going to be relevant to that

00:12:54.059 --> 00:12:58.899
person. Yeah. So, but that's okay, isn't it?

00:12:58.919 --> 00:13:01.799
I think that's just fine. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Brilliant.

00:13:01.940 --> 00:13:03.440
Then do you want me to read out the other email?

00:13:03.460 --> 00:13:05.259
So this is a tough one for us. It's got lots

00:13:05.259 --> 00:13:06.740
and lots of information in it, but I'm only going

00:13:06.740 --> 00:13:10.179
to cover a little bit. So Marilyn has written

00:13:10.179 --> 00:13:12.299
in and she says that she loves listening to the

00:13:12.299 --> 00:13:14.500
podcast. It cheers her up enormously and really

00:13:14.500 --> 00:13:16.799
gives her encouragement to start looking at her

00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:19.240
research. So that's great, isn't it? That's just

00:13:19.240 --> 00:13:21.210
what we want. That's perfect. That's exactly

00:13:21.210 --> 00:13:24.690
what we're here for. Yes. And to waffle as well.

00:13:25.110 --> 00:13:27.149
Yes, and to waffle and just to have a fun talking

00:13:27.149 --> 00:13:30.389
about our family history. So Marilyn, I've got

00:13:30.389 --> 00:13:32.649
to look these up online because they sound incredible.

00:13:32.809 --> 00:13:35.110
So she says she comes from the Blue Mountains

00:13:35.110 --> 00:13:37.230
in Australia. Doesn't that sound like kind of

00:13:37.230 --> 00:13:39.450
a fairy story? Sounds lovely already. Yeah, it

00:13:39.450 --> 00:13:42.610
really, really does. And so Marilyn writes, she

00:13:42.610 --> 00:13:44.929
often hears you and I, Nathan, chatting about

00:13:44.929 --> 00:13:47.029
our research and how we found a person on the

00:13:47.029 --> 00:13:51.669
civil registration records. um on free bmd but

00:13:51.669 --> 00:13:54.389
sometimes this puzzles marilyn because how do

00:13:54.389 --> 00:13:56.830
we know for certain that we don't just have a

00:13:56.830 --> 00:13:59.809
namesake without paying for an official certificate

00:13:59.809 --> 00:14:02.570
can we delve into that question a little bit

00:14:02.570 --> 00:14:06.110
more on our podcast so that's a really useful

00:14:06.110 --> 00:14:07.870
and good question and something we'll have to

00:14:07.870 --> 00:14:10.049
keep vigilant to don't we so we find something

00:14:10.049 --> 00:14:13.950
in an index result for instance on free bmd how

00:14:13.950 --> 00:14:16.350
do we how do what do we do to make sure we're

00:14:16.350 --> 00:14:19.279
not just thinking that name fits that It could

00:14:19.279 --> 00:14:21.000
be a namesake, but we'll take our chances and

00:14:21.000 --> 00:14:22.679
just put it on the tree. What do we do to make

00:14:22.679 --> 00:14:25.379
sure we're not going wrong like that? Well, the

00:14:25.379 --> 00:14:29.080
only example I've got of this is when I've been

00:14:29.080 --> 00:14:33.200
finding like a wedding certificate or a reference

00:14:33.200 --> 00:14:36.720
to a wedding. And so it gives you like a volume

00:14:36.720 --> 00:14:40.679
number and a page reference, et cetera, on FreeBMD.

00:14:41.240 --> 00:14:43.500
And the only way that I've been like, right,

00:14:43.519 --> 00:14:45.759
that definitely is the right person is by finding

00:14:45.759 --> 00:14:48.230
the... person they were marrying and seeing if

00:14:48.230 --> 00:14:50.710
those numbers matched up it was like the chances

00:14:50.710 --> 00:14:52.690
of them being on the same page at the same time

00:14:52.690 --> 00:14:54.450
and not being married when I'm thinking they

00:14:54.450 --> 00:14:58.110
are few and far between that's that's my only

00:14:58.110 --> 00:15:00.990
example of that so that's that's interesting

00:15:00.990 --> 00:15:04.659
so when you say you when you say you're Finding

00:15:04.659 --> 00:15:06.639
evidence of people who you think they are. So

00:15:06.639 --> 00:15:09.019
you've already got some sort of clues about who

00:15:09.019 --> 00:15:11.100
you're looking for. You're not going in cold

00:15:11.100 --> 00:15:13.960
with just one of the spouse's names and not having

00:15:13.960 --> 00:15:15.320
a clue who the other one is. You've already got

00:15:15.320 --> 00:15:17.659
some warm leads on the other one. So when you

00:15:17.659 --> 00:15:23.000
find information in the index, those two pieces

00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:25.179
of information are helping to shore each other

00:15:25.179 --> 00:15:27.980
up, even though each one by itself doesn't feel

00:15:27.980 --> 00:15:30.799
so strong. But the more data points, the more

00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:32.740
pieces of information you have, the stronger

00:15:32.740 --> 00:15:35.039
your case feels. Yeah, because obviously with

00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:37.419
FreeBMD as well, you can type in someone's name

00:15:37.419 --> 00:15:39.840
and get 20 people with the same name coming through.

00:15:40.279 --> 00:15:43.299
So I'm already looking for that person in FreeBMD,

00:15:43.340 --> 00:15:46.700
but then the reference numbers match. Say if

00:15:46.700 --> 00:15:48.220
they've married George and George's reference

00:15:48.220 --> 00:15:50.860
numbers are on that page, that's more likely

00:15:50.860 --> 00:15:53.419
to be my relative than anyone else on that page.

00:15:53.879 --> 00:15:56.580
And I would say as well, Anne -Marie, we do order

00:15:56.580 --> 00:15:59.919
quite a lot of certificates because not the marriage

00:15:59.919 --> 00:16:02.059
ones because they're expensive, but the birth

00:16:02.059 --> 00:16:04.259
and death certificates because they're much cheaper.

00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:08.580
Nathan and I, our mindset I think is quite similar

00:16:08.580 --> 00:16:10.639
on this. If we can find a way of getting that

00:16:10.639 --> 00:16:12.700
information, feeling confident about it and not

00:16:12.700 --> 00:16:14.419
spending the money, that's the route we're taking,

00:16:14.600 --> 00:16:18.399
isn't it? 100%. That sounds good to me. But then

00:16:18.399 --> 00:16:21.259
if we have to spend the money because we can't

00:16:21.259 --> 00:16:23.940
think of another way of getting that. kind of

00:16:23.940 --> 00:16:25.980
confidence about the facts that we will spend

00:16:25.980 --> 00:16:28.000
the money. Or sometimes if we're just curious

00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:29.519
about someone's cause of death, we might spend

00:16:29.519 --> 00:16:32.980
the money as well. Very much, yeah. Yeah. So

00:16:32.980 --> 00:16:35.600
we will look at other things. We will basically

00:16:35.600 --> 00:16:39.159
be building up a little, like a biscuit tin.

00:16:39.220 --> 00:16:40.679
We're not just getting one biscuit. We want a

00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:43.600
whole biscuit tin of stuff, don't we? So you

00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:46.860
said just there, some other clue will have given

00:16:46.860 --> 00:16:49.000
you a hunch about both of the spouses' names.

00:16:49.100 --> 00:16:50.759
So when you're going in to search the index.

00:16:51.340 --> 00:16:53.259
you've got those two things that you're potentially

00:16:53.259 --> 00:16:55.759
looking and hoping to match and then we will

00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:57.840
the both of us for our different reasons quite

00:16:57.840 --> 00:17:00.279
keen on trying to find as many children as we

00:17:00.279 --> 00:17:05.140
can do so we will be searching for the children

00:17:05.140 --> 00:17:07.319
with the mother's maiden name so we're getting

00:17:07.319 --> 00:17:09.839
lots of information about the family and that

00:17:09.839 --> 00:17:12.039
helps us know let's say you've got seven children

00:17:12.039 --> 00:17:15.660
all getting born over 10 or 20 time year time

00:17:15.660 --> 00:17:18.119
period You're feeling more and more confident

00:17:18.119 --> 00:17:20.059
that that's the location where the family is.

00:17:20.259 --> 00:17:22.759
We're lucky enough to have the census or the

00:17:22.759 --> 00:17:25.900
1939 register, the other records. We're using

00:17:25.900 --> 00:17:28.339
all of this to help make sure that we're not

00:17:28.339 --> 00:17:31.200
just muddling up one family. We have got definitely

00:17:31.200 --> 00:17:33.539
our family in the right time period, in the right

00:17:33.539 --> 00:17:37.400
place. And I'm really keen on doing a massive

00:17:37.400 --> 00:17:39.539
broad search. I'll start really broad so I know

00:17:39.539 --> 00:17:42.440
how many contenders I've possibly got. You do

00:17:42.440 --> 00:17:46.279
that as well, I think, don't you? Yeah. Because

00:17:46.279 --> 00:17:47.940
it's just useful to know, because you might think

00:17:47.940 --> 00:17:50.779
you have a really, like my surname, Tovey or

00:17:50.779 --> 00:17:52.059
Tovey, you might think that's quite unusual.

00:17:52.259 --> 00:17:54.500
But if you go to the wrong village in Somerset,

00:17:54.500 --> 00:17:57.099
then there'll be lots and lots of them. Yes.

00:17:57.480 --> 00:17:59.619
And so suddenly you're not unusual. It might

00:17:59.619 --> 00:18:02.619
be unusual across the UK, but in the wrong place,

00:18:02.660 --> 00:18:04.920
particularly in centuries past, go through the

00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:06.720
parish registers. It's ridiculous. Like nearly

00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:08.700
everyone's called it. So you have to really know

00:18:08.700 --> 00:18:11.519
that. Yeah. And they're all called Mary. Yes.

00:18:11.619 --> 00:18:15.589
Yes. They're all called Mary. Yeah, getting a

00:18:15.589 --> 00:18:18.490
lie of the land to know how likely is it I'm

00:18:18.490 --> 00:18:20.789
going to get in a muddle with someone. Matching

00:18:20.789 --> 00:18:23.109
up lots of family members. Thinking of different

00:18:23.109 --> 00:18:25.630
record sets, you definitely use parish registers,

00:18:25.750 --> 00:18:27.190
don't you? Because increasingly they're getting

00:18:27.190 --> 00:18:29.710
digitised. So you're already paying for ancestry.

00:18:30.069 --> 00:18:32.109
Yep. And we've talked in the past about all the

00:18:32.109 --> 00:18:33.890
other places you can look for them as well. So

00:18:33.890 --> 00:18:36.509
using different record sets. It's a good question,

00:18:36.509 --> 00:18:39.890
though, to make sure we're not just choosing

00:18:39.890 --> 00:18:41.670
a namesake because that's just a bit devastating.

00:18:42.250 --> 00:18:45.309
Yeah, it's too easy, isn't it? It does give up

00:18:45.309 --> 00:18:47.730
so many results as well. And you can just, even

00:18:47.730 --> 00:18:49.950
for me, finding somebody I think I know, you

00:18:49.950 --> 00:18:52.549
can get four or five examples where it is villages

00:18:52.549 --> 00:18:54.730
around here or in Yorkshire. It's like, oh, they

00:18:54.730 --> 00:18:56.490
could all tie in and you just don't know, do

00:18:56.490 --> 00:18:58.190
you? So you do need to just line it up with other

00:18:58.190 --> 00:19:00.930
stuff as well. And you have to remember, you

00:19:00.930 --> 00:19:02.630
can get it wrong. So the other week when I had

00:19:02.630 --> 00:19:05.210
to lop off, it was only a little mini small branch,

00:19:05.390 --> 00:19:08.150
but I did have to lop it off because I had been

00:19:08.150 --> 00:19:11.420
a bit too, you know. I hadn't been diligent enough.

00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:13.799
And so I had this little Betty Linton. So for

00:19:13.799 --> 00:19:17.019
me, Betty Linton felt like an unusual name. And

00:19:17.019 --> 00:19:19.220
I hadn't done the due diligence thing. And so

00:19:19.220 --> 00:19:21.700
I just muddled up two Betty Lintons. I was like,

00:19:21.740 --> 00:19:23.900
what are the chances of two Betty Lintons being

00:19:23.900 --> 00:19:26.779
born in 1902 in Ireland? The chances are quite

00:19:26.779 --> 00:19:31.640
high, actually. But I didn't know that. So I

00:19:31.640 --> 00:19:33.220
like that the hard way. Because it just feels

00:19:33.220 --> 00:19:34.920
unusual to me. Someone else who's really familiar

00:19:34.920 --> 00:19:37.920
with that kind of island or that name, they would...

00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:40.980
be like how could she make that mistake you get

00:19:40.980 --> 00:19:42.519
excited though don't you when you get new names

00:19:42.519 --> 00:19:45.000
and new surnames because you haven't experienced

00:19:45.000 --> 00:19:48.019
them at all it does feel like oh this is fantastic

00:19:48.019 --> 00:19:50.339
and different I'm getting it the other way now

00:19:50.339 --> 00:19:52.559
where I'm getting further back and suddenly names

00:19:52.559 --> 00:19:55.039
that are on the other side of my tree are coming

00:19:55.039 --> 00:19:58.500
on the on the paternal side so it's like oh my

00:19:58.500 --> 00:20:02.519
god potential for confusion is there but it's

00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:08.359
interesting it is yeah And Marilyn asks lots

00:20:08.359 --> 00:20:10.680
of other really useful questions, which I'm going

00:20:10.680 --> 00:20:13.220
to have to think about more carefully because

00:20:13.220 --> 00:20:15.019
I'm not going to be able to do it due diligence.

00:20:15.220 --> 00:20:18.880
She is a family tree maker user and she has been

00:20:18.880 --> 00:20:22.720
trying to contact Ancestry to get help. So although

00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:24.779
Ancestry syncs with Family Tree Maker, Family

00:20:24.779 --> 00:20:26.500
Tree Maker is a completely separate company.

00:20:26.579 --> 00:20:27.759
So if you've got a Family Tree Maker problem,

00:20:27.880 --> 00:20:30.500
the best thing to do is contact my key of their

00:20:30.500 --> 00:20:33.769
support. And it can be slow, but it's... That's

00:20:33.769 --> 00:20:36.609
the route to go. And also download their free

00:20:36.609 --> 00:20:39.089
companion guide. So just Google Arbitrary Maker

00:20:39.089 --> 00:20:41.410
companion guide. It's hundreds of pages long.

00:20:41.450 --> 00:20:45.069
It's PDF, completely free. Cool. I use it. Yeah.

00:20:51.269 --> 00:20:52.690
So shall I tell you what I've been getting up

00:20:52.690 --> 00:20:56.609
to this week? Please do. So I have this like

00:20:56.609 --> 00:20:59.720
a fractal thing. So I've been concentrating on

00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:02.160
this one small aspect of my tree where I've been

00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:03.779
doing my down and out, blah, blah, blah. And

00:21:03.779 --> 00:21:05.299
then I thought, I'm just going to do a little

00:21:05.299 --> 00:21:09.099
project for my three times great grandfather,

00:21:09.200 --> 00:21:13.599
all of his children, where they emigrated to,

00:21:13.740 --> 00:21:16.940
where their spouses came from, where their children

00:21:16.940 --> 00:21:19.339
were born, et cetera, et cetera. And do the same

00:21:19.339 --> 00:21:25.000
for my two times great grandfather. And I'm gradually

00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:28.519
piecing it all together and it's... It's become

00:21:28.519 --> 00:21:30.839
its own little world. I could see this is another

00:21:30.839 --> 00:21:32.740
little project that I could do for the next 10

00:21:32.740 --> 00:21:39.559
years. And then eventually in like 2036, I'll

00:21:39.559 --> 00:21:41.799
emerge out of this little rabbit hole. I'll be

00:21:41.799 --> 00:21:43.460
like, what was I doing again? Oh yeah, my down

00:21:43.460 --> 00:21:47.099
and out tree. Right, okay. But it is good. It's

00:21:47.099 --> 00:21:50.140
very, very interesting. So what I've been discovering,

00:21:50.180 --> 00:21:53.480
so I have this family, they were three times

00:21:53.480 --> 00:21:56.240
great. generation were being born in the early

00:21:56.240 --> 00:22:00.200
1800s in Scotland. A lot of them emigrated to

00:22:00.200 --> 00:22:03.920
Ireland in the second half of the 1800s, so obviously

00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:06.700
after the potato famine, which I imagine there

00:22:06.700 --> 00:22:08.140
was, in some respects, although there was lots

00:22:08.140 --> 00:22:10.480
of economic hardship in Ireland, there was potentially

00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:13.319
economic opportunities as well because lots of

00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:15.000
people had died and lots of people had emigrated.

00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:18.299
And then lots of my family emigrated directly

00:22:18.299 --> 00:22:21.799
from... Scotland to America and Canada, and some

00:22:21.799 --> 00:22:23.980
of them went via Ireland then to America and

00:22:23.980 --> 00:22:26.839
Canada. And I think that is because they didn't,

00:22:26.839 --> 00:22:30.000
wouldn't necessarily have the fare. Yeah. And

00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:31.660
lots of them did that chain migration thing.

00:22:31.740 --> 00:22:33.380
So some of the family would go over and then

00:22:33.380 --> 00:22:36.099
the wife and the children might follow. Sometimes

00:22:36.099 --> 00:22:39.480
the women left, like little Betty's mother, she

00:22:39.480 --> 00:22:41.779
left before her little tiny daughter. So there's

00:22:41.779 --> 00:22:44.220
all lots of things going on. But what I'm loving,

00:22:44.299 --> 00:22:47.079
this new... realization is lots of their spouses

00:22:47.079 --> 00:22:49.720
they might be in America or Canada and then when

00:22:49.720 --> 00:22:51.880
I found their find their spouse their spouse

00:22:51.880 --> 00:22:54.559
has been born in Scotland or Ireland as well

00:22:54.559 --> 00:22:57.579
so they might even live for a generation in America

00:22:57.579 --> 00:23:00.400
or Canada but then they've still got those really

00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:02.519
strong cultural roots so within their community

00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:05.480
they're choosing people who are recent emigrants

00:23:05.480 --> 00:23:08.759
from their homeland or so there's I'm going to

00:23:08.759 --> 00:23:11.059
see some really interesting connections of those

00:23:11.059 --> 00:23:13.819
bonds and living that people might move Their

00:23:13.819 --> 00:23:16.019
body, but their heart is staying somewhere else.

00:23:16.559 --> 00:23:19.460
Right. So what you're saying, like two separate

00:23:19.460 --> 00:23:22.420
entities go over to America, for example, but

00:23:22.420 --> 00:23:24.660
meet in America and they're both Scottish. Yes.

00:23:24.920 --> 00:23:27.960
Yes. Or I can't see a connection yet. There might

00:23:27.960 --> 00:23:29.920
be a connection. There might be, you know, their

00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:31.480
families may well have known each other really

00:23:31.480 --> 00:23:34.960
well. Yeah. Okay. I've got to dig into it more,

00:23:35.000 --> 00:23:37.200
but it's really, it feels kind of beautiful.

00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:39.059
It's amazing. Might have gone to the same bingo

00:23:39.059 --> 00:23:41.960
club. They might have done. I wonder when bingo

00:23:41.960 --> 00:23:44.160
was invented. That's a whole other thing. Yeah.

00:23:45.220 --> 00:23:49.380
I think bingo's got to be, I think bingo's got

00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:53.359
to be 1930s would be my hunch. And things like

00:23:53.359 --> 00:23:56.519
butlins and people having more leisure time and

00:23:56.519 --> 00:23:59.980
leisure money and going to the seaside. Yes,

00:24:00.019 --> 00:24:02.440
that does tie in. We'll quickly Google it and

00:24:02.440 --> 00:24:05.160
see if we're wrong or right. Go on then. Okay.

00:24:05.259 --> 00:24:08.519
Why not have a rabbit hole? Yes. I quite like

00:24:08.519 --> 00:24:11.470
this one though. The origins of old. Do you want,

00:24:11.509 --> 00:24:13.009
Nathan, before you Google it, do you want to

00:24:13.009 --> 00:24:14.710
have a quick guess? I'm saying 1930s. What do

00:24:14.710 --> 00:24:17.589
you want to say? I'm going to say, I've got no

00:24:17.589 --> 00:24:20.670
context. I'm just choosing a random number. 1823.

00:24:21.809 --> 00:24:25.630
Okay. So, not at all. We're both way out. Apparently,

00:24:25.750 --> 00:24:31.390
it is in Italy in the 16th century. Wow. Yeah.

00:24:31.750 --> 00:24:35.170
Holy moly. That's really old. Like, wow. Yeah.

00:24:35.650 --> 00:24:37.470
I mean, I guess it's a kind of obvious game,

00:24:37.589 --> 00:24:39.789
so we shouldn't be too surprised by it. I know,

00:24:39.829 --> 00:24:44.690
but your logic of making it a big event at Butlins

00:24:44.690 --> 00:24:47.950
made sense. I know, that's the danger of being

00:24:47.950 --> 00:24:50.730
me. Welcome to my family history. I make it all

00:24:50.730 --> 00:24:56.750
sound really plausible. We're only 300 years

00:24:56.750 --> 00:25:01.369
out, it's fine. 500 years out. Oh yeah, too many

00:25:01.369 --> 00:25:03.990
centuries out. Not just even a matter of years.

00:25:04.369 --> 00:25:06.309
Wow. Oh well, there we go, we've learnt something.

00:25:06.670 --> 00:25:12.220
We have. So what I'm doing with my project, I've

00:25:12.220 --> 00:25:14.019
set up an Excel sheet. I started trying to do

00:25:14.019 --> 00:25:15.619
it on a bit of paper. And then you suddenly realize,

00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:17.859
I was like, to get the granular detail, I need

00:25:17.859 --> 00:25:19.140
to have lots and lots of columns. So I've got

00:25:19.140 --> 00:25:21.359
columns of where people were, the place and date

00:25:21.359 --> 00:25:23.440
they were born. So I've done a separate place

00:25:23.440 --> 00:25:26.460
column and a separate date column. And then how

00:25:26.460 --> 00:25:28.460
I'm adding in the place. Oh, Nathan is just going

00:25:28.460 --> 00:25:30.240
to fall asleep on the spot. I'm adding in the

00:25:30.240 --> 00:25:32.940
place backwards. So it goes kind of like USA,

00:25:33.339 --> 00:25:36.960
Virginia, Norfolk. So it will be saying the.

00:25:37.180 --> 00:25:40.119
So then I can search by country. Yeah. And I

00:25:40.119 --> 00:25:43.700
can search by year and I can do lots of analysis.

00:25:44.259 --> 00:25:47.480
Sounds very meticulous. It is being quite meticulous.

00:25:47.680 --> 00:25:51.119
Yeah. I'm impressed. But I'm going to definitely

00:25:51.119 --> 00:25:52.859
have to find out more and more about these spouses,

00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:56.000
which is not going to help my DNA one whit, but

00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:58.920
it will help me. It won't help me anything. It

00:25:58.920 --> 00:26:01.180
will just give me a lot of fun nosing into their

00:26:01.180 --> 00:26:03.700
family history, finding out at least the reasons

00:26:03.700 --> 00:26:06.490
why they made this. I get from your life when

00:26:06.490 --> 00:26:07.849
there'll be these connections, yeah. Well, that's

00:26:07.849 --> 00:26:09.650
the important part as well, isn't it? You're

00:26:09.650 --> 00:26:13.609
having fun doing the research. Yes. Yeah. Yes.

00:26:13.930 --> 00:26:16.250
I have to say, like, you saying that is making

00:26:16.250 --> 00:26:19.089
me think maybe my genealogy journal's a bad thing.

00:26:19.390 --> 00:26:24.829
Why? Because I'm not writing anything else down

00:26:24.829 --> 00:26:27.670
anywhere else. I've suddenly thought I'm not

00:26:27.670 --> 00:26:29.630
actually in my research log. I've stopped using

00:26:29.630 --> 00:26:32.599
that spreadsheet that I created last year. I'm

00:26:32.599 --> 00:26:34.920
literally just making light notes in the genealogy

00:26:34.920 --> 00:26:37.500
journal. No, I don't think that's bad at all.

00:26:37.599 --> 00:26:40.079
So I'm using my genealogy journal and I'm still

00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:44.579
loving it, still using the special pen. And I

00:26:44.579 --> 00:26:46.660
don't write down masses. Sometimes I have written

00:26:46.660 --> 00:26:50.700
a couple of pages and then this week I've only

00:26:50.700 --> 00:26:53.119
written a few notes. I haven't actually written

00:26:53.119 --> 00:26:55.059
what I've done. I've written just things I was

00:26:55.059 --> 00:27:00.500
thinking about. Yeah. Cool. I think it's a nice

00:27:00.500 --> 00:27:02.930
place to reflect because... We're really lucky,

00:27:03.009 --> 00:27:05.150
aren't we? And I guess everyone is. We're lucky

00:27:05.150 --> 00:27:06.789
because we work on Family Tree magazine and we

00:27:06.789 --> 00:27:08.630
get to listen to loads of cool webinars and work

00:27:08.630 --> 00:27:11.490
with experts helping to share their expertise

00:27:11.490 --> 00:27:16.250
with our audience. So we do bits of family history,

00:27:16.309 --> 00:27:18.529
do weave into our daily life. Not as much as

00:27:18.529 --> 00:27:21.390
we might like, I have to say. Our job's quite,

00:27:21.589 --> 00:27:24.190
there's lots of admin in it and there's lots

00:27:24.190 --> 00:27:27.099
of... I don't want anyone to get the wrong idea

00:27:27.099 --> 00:27:28.960
and think we're continuously mucking around in

00:27:28.960 --> 00:27:32.779
data sets. We don't do that. Our job is having

00:27:32.779 --> 00:27:35.140
to, maybe they'll be editing the webinar or I'll

00:27:35.140 --> 00:27:36.819
be talking to someone about when they can actually

00:27:36.819 --> 00:27:39.000
do it, looking at their calendar. And so it's

00:27:39.000 --> 00:27:42.200
much more prosaic. It's not lots of family history,

00:27:42.240 --> 00:27:44.720
but we do get to hear lots of tips and inspiration

00:27:44.720 --> 00:27:46.400
in the meantime. So I've been including some

00:27:46.400 --> 00:27:48.720
of those tips in my genealogy journal. Oh, that's

00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:51.240
good. That is a problem for us. It sounds like

00:27:51.240 --> 00:27:54.609
I'm moaning now, but I'm not. we're doing our

00:27:54.609 --> 00:27:57.170
family history but around us we've got all these

00:27:57.170 --> 00:27:59.230
experts talking about all these things you should

00:27:59.230 --> 00:28:01.990
be doing and it does become quite a lot and i'm

00:28:01.990 --> 00:28:03.789
like oh my god he's saying this and she's saying

00:28:03.789 --> 00:28:05.430
that and do this and do that to the point where

00:28:05.430 --> 00:28:07.650
you become that deer in the headlights and you're

00:28:07.650 --> 00:28:11.910
like i don't know where to go it's it's so expansive

00:28:11.910 --> 00:28:13.769
because we're getting little hints of the entire

00:28:13.769 --> 00:28:17.789
world of family history but actually and also

00:28:17.789 --> 00:28:20.650
because nowadays so in the past a few decades

00:28:20.650 --> 00:28:23.180
ago probably said this before, but people might

00:28:23.180 --> 00:28:25.119
go to their local adult education or they might

00:28:25.119 --> 00:28:27.039
go to their local family history society and

00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:29.539
they would gradually learn from maybe a small

00:28:29.539 --> 00:28:31.819
number of experts about how to do something.

00:28:31.900 --> 00:28:34.380
So you're getting one expert's take on something

00:28:34.380 --> 00:28:37.059
and you're gradually piecing it together. You

00:28:37.059 --> 00:28:40.099
haven't got the riches of literally billions

00:28:40.099 --> 00:28:42.980
of family history records that you can get further

00:28:42.980 --> 00:28:45.900
clues from. And so everything's very much slow

00:28:45.900 --> 00:28:48.619
paced, whereas now you could learn advice from...

00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:51.900
so many hundreds and hundreds of experts and

00:28:51.900 --> 00:28:54.960
about how to use billions and billions of records

00:28:54.960 --> 00:28:57.960
it's like oh my god that's so much we as a modern

00:28:57.960 --> 00:29:00.119
family historian that we're trying to do and

00:29:00.119 --> 00:29:02.079
it is a luxury so I don't want to moan about

00:29:02.079 --> 00:29:05.000
it either it's fantastic but it does mean you

00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:08.720
have to make a plan and just try not to get overwhelmed

00:29:08.720 --> 00:29:10.599
by everything else and just think what's useful

00:29:10.599 --> 00:29:13.559
to me what am I trying to accomplish yeah you've

00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:15.640
got to be selective in the moment don't you yes

00:29:15.640 --> 00:29:19.279
yeah yeah It is easier said than done. I was

00:29:19.279 --> 00:29:20.740
just going to say, that's why it's useful writing

00:29:20.740 --> 00:29:22.299
it down in the research log, because if you can't

00:29:22.299 --> 00:29:23.680
do it right there and then, then you can say

00:29:23.680 --> 00:29:25.140
that you want to learn it in the future. But

00:29:25.140 --> 00:29:27.460
I think that's really true. It is true. It is.

00:29:27.920 --> 00:29:30.019
OK, I won't feel guilty then about my genealogy

00:29:30.019 --> 00:29:32.099
journal. I just I feel like I'm being a bit slack

00:29:32.099 --> 00:29:34.640
at the moment with following up. But maybe it's

00:29:34.640 --> 00:29:37.539
just the fact that I'm saying this again. I've

00:29:37.539 --> 00:29:39.240
just been data gathering. I've not been actually

00:29:39.240 --> 00:29:43.119
challenged yet. I think I need to. Oh, be careful

00:29:43.119 --> 00:29:44.460
what you wish for. Something's going to happen

00:29:44.460 --> 00:29:47.420
now. Well, I know. I know. I want to be challenged

00:29:47.420 --> 00:29:51.799
though. We'll see. Yeah, it does go in flows,

00:29:51.980 --> 00:29:55.039
doesn't it? It's like reading, if you have a

00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:56.539
bookshelf and you've got any number of different

00:29:56.539 --> 00:29:57.980
sorts of books on it and your family history

00:29:57.980 --> 00:29:59.740
can be like that. Sometimes you might be reading

00:29:59.740 --> 00:30:01.799
a manual and other times you're reading really

00:30:01.799 --> 00:30:04.680
a fantasy novel or things you'd never expected

00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:06.779
before. And other times you can be reading a

00:30:06.779 --> 00:30:08.859
book from one of your favourite authors. Even

00:30:08.859 --> 00:30:10.220
if you haven't read the book before, you kind

00:30:10.220 --> 00:30:13.039
of know how it's going to go. Our family history

00:30:13.039 --> 00:30:15.059
is just like that, isn't it? It really is, yeah.

00:30:16.160 --> 00:30:17.839
I'm just treading water at the moment. I need

00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:21.460
to dare to go back and get involved in some of

00:30:21.460 --> 00:30:24.740
the trickier bits. That's my challenge. And you'll

00:30:24.740 --> 00:30:26.220
be greater than when you do, because you've added

00:30:26.220 --> 00:30:28.859
the photo now, which is, you'll be like, why

00:30:28.859 --> 00:30:31.640
was I making a fuss about that? I know. Is that

00:30:31.640 --> 00:30:34.000
what you feel like? I'm a bit embarrassed. It

00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:35.619
was such a non -event doing it. It was like,

00:30:35.700 --> 00:30:37.920
boom, it's there. There wasn't any fireworks

00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:40.119
or balloons or anything. It was just like, yeah,

00:30:40.279 --> 00:30:43.279
she's got a picture now. But now I want more.

00:30:43.380 --> 00:30:46.779
That's going to be cool. I was nosing at my tree

00:30:46.779 --> 00:30:51.359
score the other day. I'm still at 9 .9, but I've

00:30:51.359 --> 00:30:54.559
only got 13 errors in my tree. One is no documentation,

00:30:54.940 --> 00:30:58.980
but it's not telling me who. And then I've got

00:30:58.980 --> 00:31:03.059
12 possible duplicates. So because I've not paid

00:31:03.059 --> 00:31:05.720
for the full works, it's giving me hints as to

00:31:05.720 --> 00:31:07.660
like three of them, like who these duplicates

00:31:07.660 --> 00:31:10.220
could be. But it's people that I've already told

00:31:10.220 --> 00:31:12.849
it aren't duplicates. So it's like Ancestry's

00:31:12.849 --> 00:31:16.950
refusing to believe me. That's what that chap

00:31:16.950 --> 00:31:20.029
said the other day. Yeah. Neil said that. So

00:31:20.029 --> 00:31:22.369
it feels like maybe I'm going to be stuck at

00:31:22.369 --> 00:31:24.730
9 .9 because it's not going to accept any further

00:31:24.730 --> 00:31:27.690
hints about these, or any further reassurances

00:31:27.690 --> 00:31:30.170
from me that these two people aren't duplicates.

00:31:30.289 --> 00:31:34.410
So I'm giving up on that. That's done. How many

00:31:34.410 --> 00:31:37.910
errors I've got in my tree? Go on then. Do you

00:31:37.910 --> 00:31:43.880
want to guess? 163. 221. Woof! Yeah, but how

00:31:43.880 --> 00:31:45.299
many people have you got in your tree? Not very

00:31:45.299 --> 00:31:47.680
many people in my tree. I've got... Oh, don't

00:31:47.680 --> 00:31:50.160
say that. No, I'm just doing shocking. I've just

00:31:50.160 --> 00:31:52.079
shut it down. I think it's so ashamed. Let me

00:31:52.079 --> 00:31:55.400
open it up again. I will have about 700 people

00:31:55.400 --> 00:31:58.640
and that in my whole everything, if I include

00:31:58.640 --> 00:32:01.460
everyone I have, then it's about 1 ,000 people

00:32:01.460 --> 00:32:04.680
that I've never had. Yeah? Well, that's a big

00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:06.859
number to me. It's not. Loads of people have

00:32:06.859 --> 00:32:08.900
masses. And to be honest... I don't think I'm

00:32:08.900 --> 00:32:10.339
ever going to have very many people because I'm

00:32:10.339 --> 00:32:14.339
too bad at dwelling on... Well, not bad. That's

00:32:14.339 --> 00:32:15.839
how I like doing my family issue. That's my style.

00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:18.059
I like dwelling on people and finding out a lot

00:32:18.059 --> 00:32:21.319
about them. Well, I've only got 203 people in

00:32:21.319 --> 00:32:23.900
my tree. So comparatively speaking, it's not

00:32:23.900 --> 00:32:26.119
too bad. Thanks. You're trying to cheer me up.

00:32:26.279 --> 00:32:31.839
I'm trying. Yes. Anyway, well, my tree score

00:32:31.839 --> 00:32:34.079
is nine, so it makes you wonder how many areas

00:32:34.079 --> 00:32:37.769
you have to have to get it lower. Maybe we should

00:32:37.769 --> 00:32:41.930
try that. No. Yeah. Yeah. Go through and strip

00:32:41.930 --> 00:32:43.269
out all the things. What I was going to say,

00:32:43.309 --> 00:32:45.289
so, you know, when you said you added the photo

00:32:45.289 --> 00:32:46.950
and it felt a bit underwhelming and what I was

00:32:46.950 --> 00:32:49.089
going to look at, there used to be a place, and

00:32:49.089 --> 00:32:51.450
I think there might still be, you can see who's

00:32:51.450 --> 00:32:53.789
been looking at your tree, but I can't remember

00:32:53.789 --> 00:32:56.349
how to do this. Can you remember? I've not had

00:32:56.349 --> 00:32:58.269
this happen. I don't know if anyone's looked

00:32:58.269 --> 00:33:01.029
at my tree. Okay. That's what you do. It says

00:33:01.029 --> 00:33:03.930
no one's looked at my tree. Okay. Shall I tell

00:33:03.930 --> 00:33:06.289
you how to find it anyway? Tell me how to do

00:33:06.289 --> 00:33:09.039
this. Yeah. So if you want to see if anyone has

00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:11.440
looked at your tree, go to your tree and then

00:33:11.440 --> 00:33:13.140
over on the left -hand side, you'll see the three

00:33:13.140 --> 00:33:16.380
little dots. And then you hover over that and

00:33:16.380 --> 00:33:18.700
a pop -up menu appears and you click on the word

00:33:18.700 --> 00:33:22.140
activity. And then a little sidebar will appear

00:33:22.140 --> 00:33:24.680
on the right -hand side, which has tasks, changes

00:33:24.680 --> 00:33:28.480
and viewers. And then you can see who has looked

00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:31.940
at your tree. Oh, wow. Yeah. Has anyone looked

00:33:31.940 --> 00:33:34.059
at your tree, Nathan? I've had no viewers yet,

00:33:34.140 --> 00:33:37.009
exclamation mark. No, you know, I haven't either.

00:33:37.349 --> 00:33:39.950
And then the other thing which you can do is

00:33:39.950 --> 00:33:43.230
if you go to your home, then you'll see that

00:33:43.230 --> 00:33:47.289
photographs get suggested as popular photos for

00:33:47.289 --> 00:33:50.950
your bit of the tree. Yes. So I'm pretty sure

00:33:50.950 --> 00:33:54.150
there must be a way of seeing who's looked at

00:33:54.150 --> 00:33:56.509
your photos and who's saved your photos. Yes,

00:33:56.509 --> 00:33:59.309
there is. So if you click on a photo which is

00:33:59.309 --> 00:34:01.450
being suggested to you as a hint, it will say

00:34:01.450 --> 00:34:03.670
saved by and it will have the initials of other

00:34:03.670 --> 00:34:07.599
people who've saved. this person to their tree.

00:34:07.759 --> 00:34:09.659
So that's quite cool. Obviously it's keeping

00:34:09.659 --> 00:34:12.900
their privacy by just giving the initials, but

00:34:12.900 --> 00:34:15.639
it'd be quite fun if you could see who saved

00:34:15.639 --> 00:34:17.860
your photo. So let's go to gallery and see if

00:34:17.860 --> 00:34:20.559
we can work that out. Yeah. Well, it's just nice

00:34:20.559 --> 00:34:22.940
to know who, like, because they are relations,

00:34:23.139 --> 00:34:24.760
so it would kind of be nice if people reached

00:34:24.760 --> 00:34:26.840
out to each other. Then I guess you can, can

00:34:26.840 --> 00:34:28.940
you click into their tree from that? Well, or

00:34:28.940 --> 00:34:30.579
I guess if you want, you could actively just

00:34:30.579 --> 00:34:33.300
go and, so you could go and search on your great

00:34:33.300 --> 00:34:35.880
-granny's name, for instance, and in the search

00:34:35.880 --> 00:34:38.179
terms, click the box that you specifically want

00:34:38.179 --> 00:34:41.320
to get results from public member trees. Then

00:34:41.320 --> 00:34:43.480
anyone else who's got your great -granny's name

00:34:43.480 --> 00:34:45.780
in their tree, you'll be able to see that list

00:34:45.780 --> 00:34:47.079
and then you can reach out to them, couldn't

00:34:47.079 --> 00:34:51.000
you? Yes. If you wanted to. Oh, this is interesting.

00:34:51.059 --> 00:34:53.300
I'm actually seeing quite a lot of pictures of

00:34:53.300 --> 00:34:56.360
potential family members now. Oh, how are you

00:34:56.360 --> 00:34:58.800
doing that? What are you doing? I'm on that photo

00:34:58.800 --> 00:35:02.260
hints on the homepage. And it's just suddenly

00:35:02.260 --> 00:35:05.679
coming up with very old pictures. It is interesting.

00:35:05.780 --> 00:35:08.000
And that's always the kind of moral dilemma because

00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:09.940
some people don't like their photos being copied

00:35:09.940 --> 00:35:12.239
by other people. But I'm not going to copy your

00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:14.539
photos, Nathan, because they're your ancestors

00:35:14.539 --> 00:35:16.699
and we're not related as far as we know. So the

00:35:16.699 --> 00:35:18.639
only people who are copying the photos are...

00:35:19.899 --> 00:35:23.340
I definitely agree. I definitely agree we shouldn't

00:35:23.340 --> 00:35:26.739
copy each other's research. And if we did copy

00:35:26.739 --> 00:35:28.840
aspects of people's research, we should give

00:35:28.840 --> 00:35:32.039
credit where we got that information from. It

00:35:32.039 --> 00:35:34.219
does tell you who originally shared it if you

00:35:34.219 --> 00:35:36.599
save it to your tree. Yes, with the photos it

00:35:36.599 --> 00:35:38.539
does. And that's good. That's really good. That's

00:35:38.539 --> 00:35:41.340
what you want. That's cool. Yeah, you're going

00:35:41.340 --> 00:35:42.400
to have fun. You're going to end up with loads

00:35:42.400 --> 00:35:44.619
of photos all over the place. Yes, as long as

00:35:44.619 --> 00:35:47.750
I... believing that they are my person absolutely

00:35:47.750 --> 00:35:51.489
because they're hints aren't they they are it's

00:35:51.489 --> 00:35:54.090
a little bit scary actually but but equally it's

00:35:54.090 --> 00:35:56.030
pretty cool and so what sort of thing are you

00:35:56.030 --> 00:35:58.550
going to do to help assessment they are your

00:35:58.550 --> 00:36:01.869
genuine ancestor depicted in that photo honestly

00:36:01.869 --> 00:36:06.190
i have no clue how this works like because i

00:36:06.190 --> 00:36:07.829
can't see the original documents like it's not

00:36:07.829 --> 00:36:11.070
like i can look on the back of it to see dates

00:36:11.070 --> 00:36:13.849
and stuff i've got no clue But you have, I mean,

00:36:13.849 --> 00:36:15.210
you've kind of answered a question of one thing

00:36:15.210 --> 00:36:17.610
you would do. So some things you're never going

00:36:17.610 --> 00:36:20.650
to know. If it's a plausible picture, then it's

00:36:20.650 --> 00:36:21.989
really hard to detect there's something wrong

00:36:21.989 --> 00:36:24.969
about it. But then in Family Tree magazine, Jane

00:36:24.969 --> 00:36:26.670
trips with every month. She gives us really good

00:36:26.670 --> 00:36:29.789
tips about how to help date photos. So you would

00:36:29.789 --> 00:36:31.909
do, you would look at the mount. You would look

00:36:31.909 --> 00:36:33.750
at the photographer's name at the bottom of,

00:36:33.809 --> 00:36:36.110
if it's on a cabinet card or a card to see, or

00:36:36.110 --> 00:36:38.289
even since you have a postcard on the back, might

00:36:38.289 --> 00:36:40.739
see the photographer's name. And then you can

00:36:40.739 --> 00:36:43.599
see when those photographers were in operation.

00:36:44.780 --> 00:36:48.079
Detecting like the colour of the card mount and

00:36:48.079 --> 00:36:49.820
things. Jane has talked about this at length,

00:36:49.860 --> 00:36:51.500
but I just find that information really hard

00:36:51.500 --> 00:36:53.420
to hold in my head. So you need to get your hands

00:36:53.420 --> 00:36:56.539
on one of her books. And then you'd be able to

00:36:56.539 --> 00:36:59.659
use that to compare, like if it had a lemon card

00:36:59.659 --> 00:37:02.320
or dark green. Because it's like anything, things

00:37:02.320 --> 00:37:05.239
go in trends. Yeah. So that would help you. And

00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:08.579
then. their clothing and their facial hair and

00:37:08.579 --> 00:37:10.960
their hairstyles, hats and things, they would

00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:14.019
all help. So you could think, is this plausible

00:37:14.019 --> 00:37:16.119
for somebody from this time period? But whether

00:37:16.119 --> 00:37:18.219
it actually, so you can assess that yourself,

00:37:18.500 --> 00:37:21.000
if you don't already learning about the fashions

00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:22.900
of the past, but actually assessing whether it

00:37:22.900 --> 00:37:26.139
is definitely a great, great auntie or something.

00:37:26.639 --> 00:37:29.320
I guess you can do facial comparisons with any

00:37:29.320 --> 00:37:31.960
other pictures you may have, but you do suddenly

00:37:31.960 --> 00:37:35.190
get into more and more best guess. answers rather

00:37:35.190 --> 00:37:38.530
than a hundred percent yeah it's it's a little

00:37:38.530 --> 00:37:43.909
bit terrifying actually this but also quite exciting

00:37:43.909 --> 00:37:47.429
I'll have to be careful with this because I could

00:37:47.429 --> 00:37:49.750
get too excited just just for the want of having

00:37:49.750 --> 00:37:52.349
all these old pictures on my tree but I do need

00:37:52.349 --> 00:37:55.230
to be careful and it's really easy to make a

00:37:55.230 --> 00:37:57.590
mistake with an old photo system I guess you

00:37:57.590 --> 00:38:00.389
could look at somebody's tree and you could assess

00:38:00.389 --> 00:38:02.809
what you feel about their tree so if you click

00:38:02.809 --> 00:38:06.119
through to that person Yeah. And see how many

00:38:06.119 --> 00:38:08.559
sources have they got for that person. Yeah,

00:38:08.559 --> 00:38:11.119
true. I think I've said it before. I saw one

00:38:11.119 --> 00:38:14.199
ages ago of, I can't remember his name, unfortunately,

00:38:14.340 --> 00:38:18.539
a guy on my tree who they've linked this photograph

00:38:18.539 --> 00:38:21.519
to, but I actually think it's his father and

00:38:21.519 --> 00:38:24.900
they've linked it to the son. And I can't for

00:38:24.900 --> 00:38:27.860
any reason know why I think I know that. I must

00:38:27.860 --> 00:38:30.960
have some documents for that one still. So then

00:38:30.960 --> 00:38:33.510
that's really helpful if you add up. you add

00:38:33.510 --> 00:38:36.710
yours, which you believe to be correct, perhaps

00:38:36.710 --> 00:38:39.250
you've got photos in an old album and they've

00:38:39.250 --> 00:38:42.030
been annotated by somebody from the time, then

00:38:42.030 --> 00:38:44.289
that's highly likely to have the correct name

00:38:44.289 --> 00:38:47.230
on it, isn't it? Yeah. So you need to kind of

00:38:47.230 --> 00:38:51.389
upload that as evidence for why you think that

00:38:51.389 --> 00:38:53.469
and then potentially get in contact with them.

00:38:53.750 --> 00:38:56.630
I think there was like a married picture of a

00:38:56.630 --> 00:38:59.710
husband and wife and then somebody else had linked.

00:39:00.170 --> 00:39:02.710
to the son with the same with the picture so

00:39:02.710 --> 00:39:05.170
it could be that they literally were clones like

00:39:05.170 --> 00:39:08.429
actually so identical father and son but it looks

00:39:08.429 --> 00:39:10.969
like it's the father and not the son I think

00:39:10.969 --> 00:39:13.730
I think that was what the situation was anyway

00:39:13.730 --> 00:39:15.530
I could get totally lost in this couldn't I if

00:39:15.530 --> 00:39:17.889
I'm not careful you could and what Jane always

00:39:17.889 --> 00:39:19.809
says that men's clothes are much harder to date

00:39:19.809 --> 00:39:21.530
because they change more slowly than women's

00:39:21.530 --> 00:39:24.889
clothes but you know the son and father are likely

00:39:24.889 --> 00:39:28.909
to be at least roughly 25 years apart from each

00:39:28.909 --> 00:39:31.130
other, aren't they? So if you've got somebody

00:39:31.130 --> 00:39:33.809
that age, you would hopefully be able to have

00:39:33.809 --> 00:39:36.969
a fighting chance of assessing. Let's say you're

00:39:36.969 --> 00:39:39.110
going to know what age they are getting married

00:39:39.110 --> 00:39:41.789
from their marriage record. You could say, is

00:39:41.789 --> 00:39:44.750
this 37 -year -old, do they look like they should

00:39:44.750 --> 00:39:48.269
be 37 in 1920 or should they be whatever 37 plus

00:39:48.269 --> 00:39:51.889
25 is? 63, whatever it is. I've got to hope that's

00:39:51.889 --> 00:39:55.849
the right answer. You can get their age and think,

00:39:55.909 --> 00:39:59.230
should they be this age in the time period that

00:39:59.230 --> 00:40:01.329
these clothes are depicting in this old photo?

00:40:01.889 --> 00:40:05.130
Yeah? Yes. So even if they have a strong father

00:40:05.130 --> 00:40:07.409
-son like he had, you'd still be able to hopefully

00:40:07.409 --> 00:40:10.010
determine for sure which one it was. Yeah, definitely.

00:40:10.590 --> 00:40:13.449
And I feel like I've asked this question before,

00:40:13.730 --> 00:40:16.130
but obviously looking at these photographs that

00:40:16.130 --> 00:40:18.949
other users have uploaded, there's lots of them,

00:40:19.030 --> 00:40:20.889
and then there's actually people have uploaded

00:40:20.889 --> 00:40:25.369
marriage certificates. Hmm. So I guess my question

00:40:25.369 --> 00:40:29.329
is, is it valid to link to these actual certificates

00:40:29.329 --> 00:40:32.590
that somebody else has uploaded if all the information

00:40:32.590 --> 00:40:36.030
looks factually correct? Should you go away and

00:40:36.030 --> 00:40:38.869
do that research yourself? Yes, because the reason

00:40:38.869 --> 00:40:40.769
you should do the research yourself is the same

00:40:40.769 --> 00:40:43.829
that you flagged up. They're all hints. And so

00:40:43.829 --> 00:40:46.610
just because it's an original document doesn't

00:40:46.610 --> 00:40:48.289
mean that it's an original document that relates

00:40:48.289 --> 00:40:51.190
to your family. So you do need to do, if you've

00:40:51.190 --> 00:40:55.400
done all the research. then you can add the photo

00:40:55.400 --> 00:40:57.900
or the marriage certificate or whatever to your

00:40:57.900 --> 00:41:01.800
tree. But if you're just feeling extra confident

00:41:01.800 --> 00:41:04.300
about it because it is an original document and

00:41:04.300 --> 00:41:06.300
that's kind of beguiling you, then you should

00:41:06.300 --> 00:41:08.920
stop, take a breath, go and do your own research

00:41:08.920 --> 00:41:13.219
and then decide. Okay. Shouldn't you? You should,

00:41:13.300 --> 00:41:15.639
yes, definitely. I mean, that is a sensible answer,

00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:18.500
isn't it? Yeah. It's just that thing where you're

00:41:18.500 --> 00:41:21.400
like, oh, this marriage certificate, it's, I

00:41:21.400 --> 00:41:24.869
don't know. bernard saville marion marianne yeah

00:41:24.869 --> 00:41:27.329
and then the file is matched oh you know the

00:41:27.329 --> 00:41:29.510
usual stuff you normally do everything works

00:41:29.510 --> 00:41:30.949
and matches and it's like right well actually

00:41:30.949 --> 00:41:32.590
for me to actually have this document because

00:41:32.590 --> 00:41:34.610
it's not on ancestry i'm gonna have to go pay

00:41:34.610 --> 00:41:37.670
some money to find it yes no due diligence says

00:41:37.670 --> 00:41:39.530
that i should not be doing that i should do it

00:41:39.530 --> 00:41:42.070
properly yes it's just tempting isn't it when

00:41:42.070 --> 00:41:44.789
you see all these documents oh i don't that one

00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:48.280
It is. It is tempting. And it's instant. And

00:41:48.280 --> 00:41:50.139
it's, as you say, it potentially saves you some

00:41:50.139 --> 00:41:52.639
money. So it's got all of these things to make

00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:57.179
us research slightly less sensibly. We don't

00:41:57.179 --> 00:41:59.880
need help with that. No, we don't. I definitely

00:41:59.880 --> 00:42:02.440
don't need any help with that. Yes. Yeah. Oh,

00:42:02.599 --> 00:42:12.030
cool. Oh, no. So this is a, it's funny how a

00:42:12.030 --> 00:42:14.309
week ends up with a theme. This week's theme

00:42:14.309 --> 00:42:17.809
is definitely try to keep accurate, isn't it?

00:42:17.829 --> 00:42:19.769
And how do we actually know the things we're

00:42:19.769 --> 00:42:21.710
looking at are true? That keeps cropping up.

00:42:21.829 --> 00:42:23.789
Right from the start when Marilyn was asking

00:42:23.789 --> 00:42:26.250
about how do we know that those pre -BMD records

00:42:26.250 --> 00:42:28.809
are ours? Yeah, I mean, I think it's probably

00:42:28.809 --> 00:42:32.210
a theme for every week, this one. It's a continuous

00:42:32.210 --> 00:42:34.809
theme, isn't it? Yeah. Always ask yourself the

00:42:34.809 --> 00:42:38.239
questions. Do you know what? This feels like

00:42:38.239 --> 00:42:40.440
it's a shameless plug, but it is a plug because

00:42:40.440 --> 00:42:43.579
it's blooming useful. So Dr. Sophie Kay, who

00:42:43.579 --> 00:42:45.639
we have mentioned in numerous, numerous podcasts,

00:42:45.920 --> 00:42:48.460
at the beginning of June, so only a month away

00:42:48.460 --> 00:42:50.860
from now, she's running a five -week online course.

00:42:50.920 --> 00:42:53.639
It's a family tree brick wall course. And the

00:42:53.639 --> 00:42:55.619
key question that she's going to keep asking

00:42:55.619 --> 00:42:57.579
us to turn over in our minds every single week

00:42:57.579 --> 00:42:59.780
is, is this my ancestor? So when we're looking

00:42:59.780 --> 00:43:02.139
at things. doing exactly what we've been talking

00:43:02.139 --> 00:43:04.420
about today just assessing is this my ancestor

00:43:04.420 --> 00:43:06.539
and so she's got a whole bunch of tactics that

00:43:06.539 --> 00:43:09.820
we can learn and then we can rather than just

00:43:09.820 --> 00:43:13.300
wonder and hope we can actually have a bunch

00:43:13.300 --> 00:43:16.039
of tactics we can think about deeply put them

00:43:16.039 --> 00:43:18.440
into practice in our own family history and then

00:43:18.440 --> 00:43:21.000
feel more confident that we have done that due

00:43:21.000 --> 00:43:22.920
diligence you're talking about so that's well

00:43:22.920 --> 00:43:24.760
anyway you can find out details on our website

00:43:24.760 --> 00:43:29.599
at family -tree .co .uk I won't I won't or make

00:43:29.599 --> 00:43:31.900
your head hurt with another long URL in one session.

00:43:32.440 --> 00:43:34.260
It's nicely advertised on the website, so you

00:43:34.260 --> 00:43:35.460
should be able to just click into it straight

00:43:35.460 --> 00:43:38.380
away. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's a good one, isn't

00:43:38.380 --> 00:43:40.739
it? That is literally everything that we do as

00:43:40.739 --> 00:43:44.400
family historians. It is. It's the perpetual

00:43:44.400 --> 00:43:46.460
question. Apart from me at the minute with my

00:43:46.460 --> 00:43:48.519
rabbit hole of, I've kind of established that

00:43:48.519 --> 00:43:50.599
they are my ancestors, but then I'm just like,

00:43:50.719 --> 00:43:52.219
so what are they doing and why did they fall

00:43:52.219 --> 00:43:53.719
in love? I'm just having that little side tune.

00:43:54.380 --> 00:43:56.639
It's not asking whether they are my ancestors.

00:43:56.719 --> 00:43:58.460
I'm like, what are my ancestors getting up to?

00:43:58.500 --> 00:44:00.559
That's my question for the minute with my thing

00:44:00.559 --> 00:44:03.880
I'm building on. Yeah. Nice. I've given up on

00:44:03.880 --> 00:44:06.719
family history. I'm going to research the origins

00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:09.420
of board games. When was Scrabble invented? When

00:44:09.420 --> 00:44:13.460
did Monopoly start? Yes, I love that. Oh, so

00:44:13.460 --> 00:44:17.460
what should we guess? Scrabble. Why do I keep

00:44:17.460 --> 00:44:20.880
going with the 1930s? I'm going to go for 1854.

00:44:21.539 --> 00:44:23.320
I'm not really doing this. I was joking, but

00:44:23.320 --> 00:44:26.369
now. Oh, no, we've done this. Sometimes, Jim

00:44:26.369 --> 00:44:27.449
and I, when we're having supper, we haven't done

00:44:27.449 --> 00:44:30.789
it for ages, we'd have a guess how old the sweets

00:44:30.789 --> 00:44:33.409
are. So try and guess when lemon sherbets were

00:44:33.409 --> 00:44:36.010
invented or guess when licorice all sorts were

00:44:36.010 --> 00:44:40.369
invented. What did you say for Scrabble? 1930s.

00:44:40.369 --> 00:44:45.230
1938? 1931 it was invented, but the finalised

00:44:45.230 --> 00:44:49.389
version, 1938. Fantastic. Take a pound from the

00:44:49.389 --> 00:44:52.699
till. I'm like 100 years out. Do you know what,

00:44:52.739 --> 00:44:54.480
as well, this is a really interesting insight.

00:44:54.599 --> 00:44:57.619
So in the, just how new that game was, and potentially,

00:44:57.719 --> 00:44:59.539
I don't know how old Monopoly was, but in the

00:44:59.539 --> 00:45:02.000
Second World War, then they had to have had it

00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:04.900
on the Imperial War Museum, I think. Then board

00:45:04.900 --> 00:45:08.820
games were used to smuggle in items to help prisoners

00:45:08.820 --> 00:45:11.500
of war escape from prisoner of war camps in Germany.

00:45:12.159 --> 00:45:15.820
Ah, okay. Really cool, isn't it? Yeah, they would

00:45:15.820 --> 00:45:18.179
have all little secret things hidden away in

00:45:18.179 --> 00:45:21.170
there, in the pieces. That is cool. But it's,

00:45:21.170 --> 00:45:23.369
you kind of feel like, so that's a really new

00:45:23.369 --> 00:45:26.050
board game. It's only come on the market 1938,

00:45:26.590 --> 00:45:29.530
did you say? Yeah. Yeah. And then one year later

00:45:29.530 --> 00:45:32.309
the war starts and immediately Waddington's or

00:45:32.309 --> 00:45:34.909
whoever makes it, they're busy there going, right,

00:45:34.969 --> 00:45:38.489
how can we just like sneak in some handy kind

00:45:38.489 --> 00:45:41.409
of coded messages and escape equipment and things

00:45:41.409 --> 00:45:43.710
like that. Yeah. One of the pieces is actually

00:45:43.710 --> 00:45:46.150
a little bit of dynamite or something. Yes, yes.

00:45:46.699 --> 00:45:48.179
I don't know what it is. I can't remember. I

00:45:48.179 --> 00:45:51.239
do remember definitely things we used to have

00:45:51.239 --> 00:45:53.599
secret messages on. That's cool. That's quite

00:45:53.599 --> 00:45:55.900
intriguing. It's really intriguing. I've never

00:45:55.900 --> 00:45:58.380
got this, but I do want to get one at some point

00:45:58.380 --> 00:46:01.099
in my life. So my grandpa, who was a... prisoner

00:46:01.099 --> 00:46:02.179
of war but he was a prisoner of war in the far

00:46:02.179 --> 00:46:05.019
east japanese prisoner of war and the pilots

00:46:05.019 --> 00:46:07.659
used to get given silk scarves to tie around

00:46:07.659 --> 00:46:09.980
their neck and on the scarf would be printed

00:46:09.980 --> 00:46:12.659
a map of the area that they were serving in so

00:46:12.659 --> 00:46:15.579
he'd have a map of burma etc so that when they

00:46:15.579 --> 00:46:17.559
um land obviously it's waterproof that's why

00:46:17.559 --> 00:46:19.579
it's called it's silk so they might land at sea

00:46:19.579 --> 00:46:22.119
or anything crash land or get shot down or whatever

00:46:22.119 --> 00:46:25.139
yeah then they've got a map to help them escape

00:46:25.139 --> 00:46:27.969
help them get through the terrain That is really

00:46:27.969 --> 00:46:30.929
cool. It's really cool, isn't it? Yeah. It's

00:46:30.929 --> 00:46:33.110
so ingenious, all these ideas, people thinking

00:46:33.110 --> 00:46:37.329
of them. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. Oh, well, shall

00:46:37.329 --> 00:46:40.869
we better get back to work? And for the next

00:46:40.869 --> 00:46:42.369
million years, when you ask me what I'm doing

00:46:42.369 --> 00:46:43.670
each week in my family history, I'll be telling

00:46:43.670 --> 00:46:45.809
you I'm working on those two little families.

00:46:46.429 --> 00:46:49.829
Nice. And I'll be playing board games. You'll

00:46:49.829 --> 00:46:52.250
be playing board games. Oh, we should invent

00:46:52.250 --> 00:46:54.690
a family history board game. We should. Yes.

00:46:55.050 --> 00:46:57.480
Well, thanks for listening, everybody. yeah good

00:46:57.480 --> 00:46:59.019
happy researching bye