Hello and welcome to Family Tree Talk, your favourite
family history podcast. My name's Helen Tovey.
I'm editor of Family Tree and with me as usual
is... Nathan Ward. Hello there. So how's your
family history week gone? If I'm honest, not
very well. I've been all over the place. So I
haven't found much time to do my family history
this week, which irritates me a bit. Really,
really random. I've literally, I've not been
focused. I've been all over the place. I'm a
little obsessed with my tree score. So that's
become, it's awful. That's become my priority.
I've gone on and done the little hint. It says,
is this person a duplicate? No, they're not.
So I keep doing, I keep doing the three little
hints it gives me, thinking that's going to tidy
my tree score up and eventually I'll become elite.
I've done that, but that also sends you off on
tangents. So I did a couple of them and then
I found one where it was asking me about a duplicate
that then involved me going in and checking this
woman's age and then her sister's age and making
sure it all lined up. And from that, I accidentally
discovered a death date of one of the parents,
which if I'm honest, I don't remember which layer
of my tree. Well, it might have been my third
time's great grandparents. So one of them accidentally
got a death date, which was great because obviously.
That was one of your goals, wasn't it? Yeah,
that was one of my goals. But I was actually
meant to be doing that on my second time great
grandparents. But I'll take it. I'll take it
as a win. It's a little bit of information. I
still have three people on my second time great
grandparents list that I haven't got death dates
for because I literally haven't looked. Despite
everything we talked about last time, I haven't
looked at them. That's where I'm stuck at there.
I did go back to the Catherine, the lady that
I tagged as dangerous. Yes. She is dangerous.
She's like Maverick from Top Gun. Anyway, she's...
Yes, do you know what? She isn't dangerous. She
is the son... No, she's not. She's the daughter
of Joseph Blackburn. And she was born seven years
before he married my direct descendant, whose
name... It's going to be Mary. It's a Mary. It's
before he married a Mary. And, yeah, he... How
do I describe this? So she was born six or seven
years before they got married. And when they
got married, this might not be from a marriage,
actually. It might be from one of the censuses.
One of the censuses says he's like 44 and she's
20 -something. So there's a big age difference.
So I'm pretty much certain that he was married
beforehand. Yeah. But I don't have a marriage
certificate for them, so I don't have anything
saying... widow or anything like that I've taken
their marriage from finding the oh I've forgotten
the name of it now the one where it tells you
the the page the folio and the number and stuff
just the index entry the index entry yeah I had
two index entries this is what we talked about
last time I had one index entry from one of them
and then I used that information to try and find
the other person on free birth marriage death
and I did So the page numbers lined up and everything
matched. That's how I knew they were married,
but I don't have the certificate. I've also done
a cheeky cheeky and seen someone else's tree.
And they've got the exact same information as
me. So they do have this Catherine, been born
before this marriage, but they still also don't
have any record of an earlier marriage. Yeah.
I'm very stuck. I don't know how to find. An
early marriage. Maybe there even wasn't one.
Who has a clue? But you kind of imagine there
would have been. But his age points to the fact
that maybe he probably was widowed. Again, I'm
guessing, aren't I? I'm just assuming too much.
Do you think there's a few potential kind of
easy answers which can help put you out of your
research misery? Put me out of my misery. Let's
do it. Well, maybe I'm not in proper concentrating
mode. So you've got the index entry. It's the
kind of golden rule of the value of tracking
down the original records, isn't it? Because
at the moment, you're hazarding a guess based
on some circumstantial evidence and some other
bits of evidence that he is on his second marriage
at the point when you find this marriage index
entry. So if you've got the original record,
then that's going to potentially tell you about
his marital status. Yeah. So getting that marriage
record, so obviously a marriage certificate with
the GRO, you can get the digital versions of
the births and deaths nice and cheaply as JPEGs
and PDFs, but you can't do that for marriages,
so you're looking at whatever is roughly 12 quid.
Yeah, 12 quid. Exactly. So that feels expensive.
So the other option you could do is having a
look online and see whether the marriage parish
register has been... digitized for the place
where your ancestors are. So you could look on
ancestry, family past, family search. They would
all be really good places to look. And also with
the local family history society. So between
them, can any of them for less money give you
this information? And like the beauty of family
history societies, for instance, if they have
done lots of, might not be original work, but
they might have transcripts and more detailed
indexes and things for you to work with your
entire annual. Membership fee could very likely
be 12 quid and that's the price of one certificate.
Right. Well, you know me, I like to do things
for less money. Exactly. It's all appealing.
Yeah. So I think because you've already got a
membership to Ancestry, have a look there. Then
have a look on FamilySearch in case they've got
any useful parish registers, which they do have
loads of them. And that FamilySearch is free
to use. And then the next thing would be to go
to FindMyPast. Potentially you could do a free
trial or you could... See if you want to take
the plunge and start spending money there as
well. Yeah. Definitely. So get some further facts.
You've got some facts which are leading you to
some thoughts, but you need more facts to know
whether you're on the right track. It's just
that money thing, which is not just a money thing,
because it's hard, isn't it? Money's blooming
annoying. It is, yeah. And it's kind of like
picking and choosing where is the right place
to spend that money. I mean, this is a direct
descendant. Oh, it's tricky, isn't it? Because
I could potentially go backwards without knowing
the details of this potential other marriage
quite happily. But then it's not making the story
work correctly, is it? So then it's like, well,
I do need this information. But actually, it
doesn't actually get me any further back. It's
just fleshing him out. Tricky. It's really tricky.
And the more I think about it, the more I think
about all these other side branches, they do
tell. They give us such rich insights to what
it was actually like to be our ancestor, didn't
they? The ones which we call kind of the main
events, the main lines or whatever it is, not
the ancillary branches. Yeah, I'd just like to
confirm who the mother is for Catherine to feel
like she's floating there without necessarily
knowing who her mother is. And like I said, I've
looked at someone else's tree and... they have
the exact same setup as me. Catherine's been
born before the marriage and then all these other
children appear. Yeah, I just want to clarify
it and have it as a solid fact. And then it's
that weird thing where, you know, in like a few
months' time, I'll have forgotten who Catherine
is and where she is on the tree and why she was
so important. And the answer is probably she
wasn't and she isn't. But right now it's an interesting
mystery. After weeks of just fact -finding in
a sort of meticulous, organised way. I kind of
want to get lost in a few people and a little
bit of a family history mystery. I think that's
allowed. I think that's the main point of it.
Yeah, I think it's where I need to go, to be
honest. Just a bit of indulgent reflecting. We're
not databases. Exactly, exactly. We're human
beings. We're human beings, not computers, aren't
we? That's right. Yes. That's our story and we're
sticking to it. Yes. People might think we're
robots and we're just machines, but no, we're
real life humans with feelings. Yes. Yep. So
that's it. That's largely where I'm at. I feel
frustrated that I'm not actually getting anywhere.
I feel like I'm stagnating a little bit, but
I do know what I have to do. It just feels less
like fun at the moment. Oh, if it feels less
like fun, then you've got to change it. Yeah,
I think I will follow the Catherine path. I guess
I'm teetering, aren't I? I'm on the edge of the
census has been helpful for where I've got back
to. And then maybe there's a bit of laziness
in me that's like, oh my gosh, if I go back further,
this is actually where it's going to get really
hard because I don't have anything to rely on
for facts. I've got to start finding new records
and learning new skills. What a lazy boy. I should
just do this, shouldn't I? No, I don't think
that's lazy. I think that's a really natural
kind of fear point. I think that's such an understandable
thing to do. It's the comfort zone factor, isn't
it? You're having to go somewhere a little bit
new. And before you know it, once you have branched
out into that area, it is always going to be
harder. It's not you being stupid or unknowledgeable
that it's harder. It is harder, but it will soon
become fairly familiar territory. Yeah. We found
a little bit of research for this Catherine.
I found Joseph Blackburn, who's her father, on
the 1841 census. And it's just a different world,
isn't it? Like you said the other week, the Ancestry
weren't pulling the information. So you've got
to then go and read the document slightly more
than you would normally because you don't have
to go back. I found Joseph and I found his parents.
So that's great. I can get my tree one generation
further back. but Ancestry won't naturally pull
it in, so I've got to manually then go and find
that document again and pull in Joseph's dad
and his mum. It sounds like I'm being lazy again,
but it's just a different process from saying,
yes, they're there, click, click, click, click,
boom, and then going into them. You actually
have to take the time and look at each person
individually, which I guess, for being meticulous,
is a good plan. Speaking of which, I was having
a... a cuppa with a couple of friends the other
day and one of my friends was saying how she'd
um taken an ancestry track trial and she decided
she was going to get her entire tree done in
the time that she had with the trial been live
yes oh my god i was in a hot sweat it was awful
she was just like yeah i was just clicking buttons
and adding to my tree and and you could tell
she's clearly just got loads of it wrong and
just pressed buttons and was just you know the
dirtiest tree you've ever seen probably But she
was quite happy with it. I was like, no, that's
wrong. Stop it. But also, if she's been doing
it that quickly, then she will just be grabbing
names and dates in the odd few places. She's
getting pumped out by the hint machine. And lots
of that information is going to be accurate.
She's not going to know which bits are accurate
and which bits aren't. But so far, she has just
collated a database, a tree. Whereas what we
do, whether it's right or wrong, but we get really
emotionally attached to our ancestors. I'm not
saying it is right or wrong, but anyway, we do.
And we build up their stories and we try and
imagine what it was like for them to live and
work and lose their job or lose a child or a
spouse or whatever. And we try and get it really
accurate because otherwise any false assumption
we've made is a totally... fictitious story we're
trying to understand their lives so yeah so for
her her smash and grab tree it's i don't i wouldn't
want to squash anyone's enthusiasm for doing
their family history but if she's got it wrong
she'll be like hey ho i've got a little branch
wrong there whereas we'll we would be really
devastated about it because we've gone on the
journey we've traveled the ocean with them over
to america we've seen their twins die or whatever
it is you know i mean like really tragic things
yeah We're like, oh, that wasn't actually my
family. Yeah, she was very blasé about it. She
was like, oh, I don't know which information
was right and I don't know who they were, but
I just kept pressing yes. And I was like, oh
my God, please don't let me reconnect to your
screen anyway. Yes, yes. Well, that's also a
useful insight. It's like all of us, we all think,
we're always surprised when other people think
differently to the way we think. And that's just
useful to know. That explains a lot about some
of the trees we find. And it was quite interesting
as well because this woman, I know, she, in my
head, she was always quite an analytical type
person. Yeah. And it's like, wow, wow. Why have
you done this? Why are you so breezy? Yeah. Yeah.
I think she's having fun doing her family history.
Yeah. Just during the trial, though. Yes. Yes.
Yes. I've done that now. Tick. New hobby. I don't
know whether you're going to see her again soon.
Could you just invite her to look at some of
the records that she's got onto her tree? Because
then she'll start seeing the stories once she
actually looks at the records, not just quickly
grabbing hints and grabbing. I've actually stopped
talking to her now after that conversation, so
no. You don't want your brain to get infected.
Your tree school will be taking a nosedive. Yeah,
I don't want any association. I just don't think
she's probably that bothered. She said she was
interested at the time and, like I say, did this
slapdash one, but who knows? Maybe I can tell
her some evocative stories from my history and
get her interested in a deeper way. I find it
incomprehensible, to be honest. But I do know
loads of people don't do any family history and
I do know that I have phases in my life where
I do more or less family history, depending on...
Sometimes it's depending on how busy I am or
sometimes the more I do, the more I want to do.
It depends what time and resources and headspace
is available. But I'm not ever planning on stopping
it. I don't know how you can. Exactly. It's not
even something I'd want to do. I wish I had this
attitude to exercise and cleaning the house,
but I don't. That's weird because I tie my mindset
for exercise. Very much with my mindset for family
history. I think the two are the same thing.
I think they are, because I'm quite envious of
you for that, because you are much more disciplined
with your family history than me. I do do some
things really well, but I'm really hit and miss,
and I'm not consistent in being good. And over
the years, I've gone from really good to really
bad, to really good to really bad again. It's
not a one -way path to progress. I've got better
at doing all the good stuff. But equally, I guess
you're judging yourself by your own standards
as well, aren't you? What you think is good practice
might annoy someone else. So you're judging yourself
by this is what I think is good, but I'm not
doing it. Fascinating. Yes. So I've had a really
fun week myself doing lots of family history,
and I haven't written a single thing in a research
log. Nice. Must jot. I'll see you from now on.
Yeah. I'm feeling, yeah, I'm feeling a bit rebellious
against research logs now. After a year of preaching
about them, I'm like, no. They are so useful.
And I know, I know I should be doing it. And
I like the whole time, you know, when you're
finding useful things or when you've kind of
had to unpick and piece together puzzles. And
I've got the answer and it's all clear as day
to me. And I know I should be writing down why
I thought those things. I have had a lucky win
though. So a few months ago. I can't remember
if I talked about this. Family Tree Maker is
an update. So when you write a note in Ancestry,
when you sync your tree between Ancestry and
Family Tree Maker, the notes you put for your
ancestors on your Ancestry tree then get sucked
into your Family Tree Maker tree. So that feels,
I feel a little bit OK with this because then
it feels, it's not the same as a research log.
It's random notes on random profiles, but it
does feel I've got. I've got things written down.
They're just not done in a research log. Concise
and gathered somewhere. Yeah, yeah. The update
happened a few months ago, but I didn't get around
to doing the update. I kept being like, must
do the update, must do the update. So I've done
that this week. Nice. I thought you were going
to say that you'd accidentally found a note you'd
forgotten and it's given you a massive hint.
No, no. I found some bizarre things. I mean,
yes. So my project is... With my three times
great grandparents to build all their trees down
and out, yeah? Yes. To help with my DNA thing.
I'm just saying in case anyone is just tuning
into the podcast for the first time. So the aim
of me researching all of these side branches
down and forward to the present day is so that
I can try and work out who more of my DNA matches
are. And so it's a random, weird project because
what you want is you want, ideally, all of those
people. 100, 150 years ago who I'm researching
forward. You want all of them to have lived,
hopefully had children and descendants and long
lives and everything else. But then an awful
lot of them don't. They die when they're under
one or three or really young. And so on my cold,
horrible ancestry tags where I'm keeping track
of what's happening, even though I've got their
death in there. just to remind myself that clearly
they've died too young. They're not going to
have any descendants. Then I'm like out and down,
complete. So I just tag them that. And it sounds
like I'm on a space mission or something. And
I just tag them. And it's such a horrible little
label for a tragic aspect of my family history.
So I keep doing this. Yeah, I don't really like
it, but I'm doing it because it's efficient.
Ooh, it feels horrible. But like you say, you've
got to log it in somewhere, don't you? I have
to keep track of it because it's a very unwieldy
beast chasing your tree forwards. Because you
haven't, you know, you've got your eight great
-grandparents, your 16 great -great -grandparents,
your 32 great -great -great -grandparents, whatever
it is. Anyway, whatever I've just said, you keep
doubling. Whereas going forwards, somebody might
have no descendants or 13 descendants or anything
in between. So it's very shifting sands. Yeah,
it sounds massive. Sounds like a massive undertaking.
It's cool. What I'm astonished about is the number
of them who emigrate. Man, they just can't get
off the island quick enough. Because there's
a 1926 census for Ireland coming out soon. So
I have my great granny grew up. I was born in
Ireland in the 1890s. And she's... the younger
end of this run of 13 children. So I was expecting
that I was going to find heaps and heaps of Irish
kin in Ireland in this 1926 census. And yeah,
all of their descendants and things like that.
No, it's not going to happen. Yeah, because they're
all just, they're all leaving and going to America
and Canada. That's cool. That's another cool
story for you to follow at least. It's really
cool. I mean, yeah, so I keep... I keep finding
them over there. And sometimes they're living
near each other. And even people who I wasn't
expecting. So I found one of her, oh my God,
it's her auntie. So my great -granny's auntie.
Found her out in America. And then her husband
was a knitter. And I was like, ah, that's really
interesting. Because my family, my Scottish and
Irish family, lots of them worked in the woolen
trade, framework knitters, things like this.
So I was like, ah, that's interesting. Like,
did she meet her future husband some way on the...
employment scene or whatever. Turns out that
he was from Scotland as well. And then I got
in a real muddle because I found a census record
and it didn't have a head of a household. It
just had saying father -in -law, mother -in -law,
niece, nephew, a whole bunch of people. I thought,
oh, of course it is going to have a head of a
household. I just need to page back to the previous
page, find out who the head is. And the head
was living with about eight different family
members. Right. It's just bonkers. So they're
all, all these people who are emigrating are
keeping in touch with each other and living with
each other. Okay. It's kind of nice. Yeah, it's
cool. Yeah, it is. Everything seems, every record
I seem to be getting at the moment, I find immediately
confusing. Like I'm reading it upside down. Like
that's just an American census record, 1910 census.
But because it had such a weird mixture of family
members, it didn't have a nuclear family, like
parents and kids together. It had... All these
other disparate relations. Yeah. All on one roof.
Yeah. And then I'd found out a previous record.
I'd found a woman's death record. And I was confused
by that because she was too young to have died.
And I was like, why are these other people on
here? And it's because this person, my great
-grandma's aunt's daughter. So my great -grandma's
aunt's daughter had died, sadly, of breast cancer
in her 30s, which is tragic. Because it was her
parents who were there being recorded on the
death record for their daughter's death. Then
I'd assumed she hadn't married. And so I just
carried on with my building, my forward and down.
And then when I came to this 1910 census, there's
my great granny's aunt with her husband, with
one of her other daughters and her other daughter's
husband and with a different niece and nephew,
a different surname. And I was like, wait a minute,
that surname is... The name of my great -granny's
aunt's daughter. Yeah, who's the one who died
of breast cancer. I'm following. Then my great
-granny's aunt's daughter had had two kids before
she died in her 30s. And this is the bit where
I've got up to now, my little personal cliffhanger,
is what was the precise stage that she died?
Because on the 1910 census, she's got a... Her
two children are there, and they're a nine -year
-old and a three -year -old, okay? And my great
-granny's aunt's daughter died of breast cancer
in 1907. So I've got to get those precise dates,
but that little baby boy, Raymond, who's three,
he would be a tiny baby when his mum died. Yeah.
Awful. That's really sad. And so it's really...
It kind of feels like, what the heck are you
doing going off on these really random side branches?
But that's the whole point of it. So it's really
tragic that my great -granddaughter's daughter
died young, but she still, from the point of
view from my DNA research, she did have these
two kids, the little daughter who's nine, her
name escapes me, little Raymond who's three.
So I've now got to trace these two forward, keep
going forward, forward, because potentially they
might have a... person my age or younger or whatever
who's done a dna test and they're on my match
list but i just would never recognize their surname
when there will be a small match at that stage
i don't know how precisely how many centimorgans
we're going to share but it's going to be not
right there's a good chance they'll be like full
-on americans then i guess and that's sitting
on another train is what that is i really thanks
for reminding me of that so this year we are
going to be remembering or celebrating, depending
on which side of the pond we are, the 250th anniversary
of the Declaration of Independence. Yeah? All
the tea party stuff that we learned about at
school. So I feel like this is history and I'm
like, mm -hmm, so you did this right. Whereas
they'll be like, woo -hoo! And they're my distant
cousins. Yeah? Yeah. And that also got me thinking.
So they'd... These Irish family and Scottish
family as well were moving out to America in
the late 1800s, lots of them in the 1920s, which
I think is really interesting because Ireland
obviously was a tumultuous place to live in the
20s and lots of economic hardship. So it kind
of makes sense you want to leave to try and get
a better job just to earn money for your family.
So they're all leaving and I'm like, how long
do you have to live in America before you...
are feel american and that fourth of july is
really important to you and and and how long
before that story of the boston tea party you
change allegiances on how you view that chapter
of history i don't know yeah that's that's very
interesting isn't it actually hmm that's cool
though it is really fun isn't it yeah and it
feels my so my my I've had such a fun time this
week. It's been so interesting trying to piece
all these little bits together. And my geography
is so awful. I haven't done it yet. I need to
get a map and find out where all these places
are, like even really obvious places like Pennsylvania
and Massachusetts. And I need to find out where
I've got smaller place names. I need to find
Ontario. Yeah. I've got a lot of Triendi right
now. It's really fun. It's really, really fun.
I bet if you trace your family forward, you'd
find... lots of you're going to find people in
the states as well I mean I like what you're
saying but I disagree entirely I've yeah I'm
so excited like um this branch that I'm doing
the Blackburns they came from Newcastle and I'm
like oh it's somewhere somewhere new and interesting
but then when you get to I'm when I'm about 18
1833 roughly let's say yeah and but by the time
he dies he lives in Pudsey Everybody's drawn
here. So, yeah, my tree doesn't do what yours
is doing. Yours sounds fantastic. Perfect excuse
for a trip. It is an excuse, isn't it? Somebody's
got to let me stay. Got to go out and stay with
them. Whereas I can just go to my local fish
and chip shop. Yeah. And I don't know what your
ancestors did, but so mine, this particular line,
if you go back to the early 1800s, they're in
Leicestershire. It's fine, but it was very unexpected
when I found these Leicestershire ancestors.
I had no hint of a family story that we had any
ancestors from there or whatever. And it's not
even very far away from where I live today. And
I've been back to the village where they lived.
And it's kind of fairly, not home turf like yours,
good hours drive, but it's not a million miles
away. If you go to the 1840s, 1850s, the dad
is hopping up and down. He keeps going back and
forth between Leicestershire and Scotland for
work. I think I've banged on about him before
because there's a woollen factory up there and
it's really tough work, working as a framework
lifter in Leicestershire at the time. But in
Scotland, the Industrial Revolution, I think,
from that perspective, is slightly... Slower
behind. So his old trade is still a valid line
of work in Scotland. He pursues that in Scotland.
And the next generation below him, they move
from Scotland. One of my direct line, Alexander,
they moved to Ireland again to follow up the
textile trade. And so now we're in like the 1870s.
So lots of people a couple of decades before
died in the potato famine. There's an opportunity
for him to continue with his textile skills.
And then. Lots of his children, his 13 children,
they work in the textile industry. Then lots
of them, when they go into the States, they're
continuing to work in textile. So this textile
trade thing is what is leading them to keep moving,
always moving for work, always working in a slightly
precarious line of work that has seen better
days. Yeah? A bit like being a graphic designer
now. A bit like being an editor on a paper magazine.
It's in my jeans. It's just work is things like...
Years ago, my dad used to live opposite somebody
who was a coal merchant. And they always used
to joke, because my dad was a priest and the
neighbour was a coal merchant. And they're like,
back in the day, that would have been a great
line of work to be a coal merchant and a priest.
But once you get to the 20th century, it's all
solar panels. alternative religion thank god
yeah so what am i what's my project i'm having
fun with this i'm not giving up on it and it's
like it's although it sounds quite dry from the
start gang i'm going to research my tree down
and out and i'm just going to populate my tree
with more of these random side ancestors descendants
more descendants of my direct ancestors their
siblings and things like that, and their spouses
and their kids and going on and on back to the
future. It kind of sounds really practical, but
it's such an adventure. I'm loving it. Really
loving. It sounds amazing. It really does. Even
just to explore documents from a different country
sounds fantastic. It is. I mean, the American
censuses, I don't know whether they all do this
because I'm not familiar with them enough yet,
but the 1910 will say which country the person's...
parents were born in right that's good i guess
if they've had a lot of immigrants coming in
then that is vital information isn't it yes but
for me it's like super handy because let's say
i'm looking at um i don't know bessie messier
or whatever and then i which is her name which
looks quite cool name um and you know it'll say
where their parents were like dad ireland mum
scotland don't quit me on that but i can't but
you know that's really helpful going i just think
they were born there And I have to do all the
things that I keep telling you to do because
I'm really unfamiliar with the documents. I keep
having to scroll up to the top and read all the
column headings really, really diligently to
go, what is this information? What's it telling
me? What's this random word? Yeah, that's good
practice. I think, again, going back to me, that's
my problem at the moment. I'm sort of snatch
and grab, snatch and grab, grab and snatch, whichever.
I'm going and getting information as quickly
as I can. I'm not actually just sitting down
and willing to learn. I think I'm clearly getting
to the point where I do need to slow myself down,
really take these older documents in and get
comfortable instead of just getting scared and
not really getting anything done. Yeah. So I
think learning about the documents is so useful
because partly the information that is given
there, then you're understanding what you're
actually being told and you're not kind of adding
two and two and making five. But also you're
noticing every, you're turning over every single,
every clue that is given, you're getting every
bit of juice out of it, aren't you? Yeah. But
then also you're learning that as you go back
in time, some of the records just aren't very
detailed. You're not being stupid that you haven't
managed to extract a bit of information from
it. It just wasn't recorded on it. You're not
daft. Get what you can and then keep thinking,
right, how else can I try and accomplish? this
goal of getting those details. Yeah. Slightly
more challenging, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. We've
got some really cool things happening soon, which
are really going to be really helpful to loads
of people. I'm excited about them. Shall I talk
about them a little bit? Please do. Please do.
Okay. Well, write very, very soon. If you're
listening to this on the day it comes out, then
the very next day, then we have our research
skills studio. So that's absolutely fantastic.
It's a four week course with Dr. Sophie Kay.
And in there, she teaches us lots of research
and search skills and research log, a bit of
a research log boot camp. So for anybody who
is naughty like us and fallen off the research
log bandwagon, honestly, over the years, I've
kept them and not kept them. always regret not
keeping them and I always feel impossibly smug
and pleased with myself when I do keep them it's
they're so useful we've got that coming up so
if anybody would like to put themselves on there
there's still time it's the research skills studio
and it starts on the 7th of April and you can
find out more about it on our website and then
another thing we've got lined up in the May issue
of from a tree which is coming out very very
soon in a few days time if you're listening to
this live on the day the podcast comes out then
we've got well the whole issue is jam -packed
with useful stuff there's an article by mike
gould and he's i think he's a systems engineer
and he's got a very kind of scientific background
he's written an article about how to do accurate
research so that's just useful stuff david annal
in that issue is reminding us about the value
of original records there's lots of stuff to
kind of you think right i need a little bit of
a pep talk to get myself my research you know
sharpen up my research skills there's lots and
lots of stuff in there and then the next thing
is this is going to be starting in June really
but Julie Johnson's going to be taking us over
a year this is where it's really relevant to
you Nathan every month in the magazine she's
going to be researching somebody's life story
but every month looking at different records
to help build up their life story from their
birth going all the way through 12 months later
to their death obviously not twice 12 issues
in the past and it was a long, long life. Yeah.
So, but anyway, she's going to be covering all
sorts of records which are useful for 19th and
20th century research. Well, it sounds really
good. Really good. Yeah. I'll be reading that
as I lay the pages out. You will. You will. Yes,
you're going to find it super useful. Have we
had any fun podcast mail? Yes, we have. I had
a quick hint slash tip from Frances on... Oh,
yeah. She was talking about the stresses of using
research logs from obviously us two saying about
how we are in and out of them. It suggested that
maybe we just use a microphone and do voice notes.
Yes. We've all got access to mobile phones with
speech recorders. Yes. It's a quick way to do
it. If you can't actually get your time to actually
go down and open a Word document and start typing.
Yes. Do it live. It is a good idea. Another thing
I thought is, even if I don't do a research log,
even if you didn't... So I really hope that I
am going to get back into the research log thing.
But let's say I don't. The thing I've been mulling
about, but haven't even done this yet, is the
thought of once a week, just write up a journal
piece to myself. I could put it as a blog if
it's got things which might interest other people,
other family members. But just write a... Get
a journal and once a week go, this is what I've
been thinking about and this is what I've been
doing in my family history. And I think even
that would be useful. Looking back over a year,
just imagine you did that for a year. You have
52 little pieces. They might even be just 50
if you wrote one side of a piece of paper. If
you have 52 of them at the end of the year and
look back and go, wow, I'd forgotten I was doing
this. And it would be just a really enjoyable
thing to reflect back on. Yeah, it's a simple
way to chart your journey as well, isn't it?
And it won't be super detailed, but you could
have the key headline act. Yeah, if it gives
you enough to get back to where you want to be
on that particular branch, then that works really
well. It sounds so simple when you say it like
that as well. Like, oh, yeah, just one note a
week. It's attainable, isn't it? I think your
enthusiasm is making me think, I am going to
do this. I'm definitely going to do this. Because...
When I do do research logs, I have definitely
sometimes gone a little bit on research notes.
Sometimes I go a bit over the top, a bit too
much of a good thing, and then I have too much
to wade through. Well, like you say, something
done badly, I can't remember your phrase, something
done badly is better than not done at all. So
if you can just literally go in and say, this
week I've done nothing, and it's as simple as
that, but next week you've done something, that's
better, isn't it, than nothing? I'm going to
try that. Okay, shall we both do it? Yeah, I've
got really high pitch then, so I must be interested.
That's good. And I think I might go really old
school and just write it on a piece of paper,
like in a book. Nice. My year of family history.
Lovely. Shall we talk about this amazing email
we've had from podcast listener Neil? Yeah, go
for it. Okay, so... Neil, we asked a while ago
for people to let us know if they had a tree
score above 9 .8, i .e. Nathan, have you got
any contenders, anyone who's as good as you?
And, well, Neil has now. So I'll read out his
email. He says, well, finally, after starting
with a tree score of 9 .4 and over 500 errors
back at the beginning of August last year, he
has finally got his score to 9 .9. Congratulations,
Neil. Nice one. Well done. Yes. Are you feeling
nervous, Nathan, that you're going to get beaten?
Yes. Okay. Always. Well, it's fun. I think having
a competition is a bit of fun, isn't it? Anyway,
he says he's very, very pleased, but he's still
got 97 errors left to fix, which he plans to
fix them soon. And he's going to let us know
if he reaches the magic score of 10, which if
you have found out is going to be called the
elite. So anyone who actually have... has a score
of 10 on that ancestry tree. It's called an elite
researcher, which is fantastic. And then he's
shared a few statistics about his tree, which
are impressive as well. He's got 3 ,527 people,
496 photos, 9 ,621 records. Yes. Wow. That's
a lot of stats. That really actually puts my
tree score to shame then, doesn't it? Like my
9 .9 is based on like 200, 300 people. To have
that many people on your tree and be 9 .9, that's
some doing, isn't it? Well, it is really impressive,
but don't denigrate yourself. I think it's really
amazing what you're doing already. So, yeah,
keep going. Yeah, but hats off to Neil. That's
amazing. It is really amazing, isn't it? He's
got 265 direct ancestors on his tree. Like you
and me, he's got all of his three times great
grandparents, all 32 of his three times great
grandparents. Out of his three times great grandparents,
15 of them, he's confirmed with DNA matches as
well. So that's exciting. And then he's given
us further details about going back through the
generations. And he's got fewer and fewer of
the preceding generations. When he gets back
to his nine times great grandparents, he's got
one of his 2 ,048 nine times great grandparents.
Maybe he's a little bit like you in this respect.
He says every single one of these ancestors he's
found is from England. Nice. How irritating.
Nine times, though. That's really good, isn't
it? Wow. Yeah. I'm terrified that I won't get
past my fifth, but nine, that's really good.
Really amazing. And he said also he's been, he's
doing everything. He's just on fire. Neil's on
fire. He says he's had to start learning about
records in Australia, Canada, New Zealand and
America because he's also researching his tree
doing the down and out method. So, like me, he's
suddenly had to branch out to these overseas
records. Yeah. Well, overseas from the British
Isles perspective anyway. I'm a little bit terrified.
Imagine your tree is that big with that many
people and I don't know how you would manage
it and keep it organised. I guess a good research
log is the answer. But that's a lot of people
to contend with, isn't it? You have to be in
the know and on the ball for that. I think a
research log would do some of it, but I think
also just the tree itself, if we use the tools
that the tree gives us, then in a way that is
a really... super comprehensive thing, isn't
it? So you've got your tree with thousands of
people on, like Neil, if you do, or even if you've
just got hundreds, it's hard to keep track of
hundreds. But it has capacity there, doesn't
it, for us to add our sources, for us to add
images, for us to see their story in a timeline,
for us to add notes about them. And even if the
notes field isn't big enough, we can add word
documents and things ourselves. We can add these
things. So that's okay. The other 3 ,000 times.
Oh, boy. Yes. Yes. Oh, wow. That's brilliant.
Yes, really good. I'm impressed. And it shows
it's possible as well. It does. Yeah. I mean,
what a contrast. The friend doing the free trial
and just whacking out a tree in a seven -day
free trial and then somebody with thousands of
people on their tree and still an amazing tree
school. Yeah. It can appeal to everyone, can't
it, I guess, in different ways. It can, yeah,
yeah, yeah. I think that's the whole point of
it. Yeah, definitely. So are we just going to
carry on next week then? Yes, I am going to try
and find more out about Joseph Blackburn and
Catherine Blackburn, see if I can find anything
to do with this wedding. I do want to just get
lost in somebody. You know, like when I got lost
in George Horatio Nelson, that was fabulous.
I loved all that. I want that sort of involvement.
But you can't force these things, can you? You
find your hook or you don't. So I'll try and
do that. Oh, I'll say it out loud, but I probably
won't do it. I'll try and find the death dates
for my three missing two times great grandparents
death dates. That's it. And I'll write a weekly
note saying what I haven't done. Hey, nice. I'm
going to carry on with my down and out. Don't
know where it's going to take me. I just know
it'll be interesting though. And I'm going to
do my weekly note. We could read our weekly notes
out. We could do that. Every week. Okay, let's
do that. Yes. Today I lied to the podcast viewers
and told them I was going to do some research.
And if anybody else, anybody listening decides
they want to start doing a weekly note, just
as a kind of gentle genealogy journaling thing
rather than a really official research log, then
do send us your weekly note, depending on how
long it is. We will read out all of it or some
of it. And I think that sounds fun. I'm invested
in this idea. I actually think it's really attainable.
Yeah. I feel guilt with the research log. I feel
like, like you've said, I can get too involved
in it and put too much details and put too many
random questions that just sound like splurge
from my head. But an actual just quick summary
of what I've done this week. It is attainable.
I guess we'll find out how useful it is in a
few months' time. We'll be like, oh, yeah. And
literally, when we press stop on this podcast
recording, then I am going to go and get myself
a lovely notebook. I always have a stash of notebooks.
I'm going to get a brand new one out, and it's
going to be my little journal. And I'm quite
a forgetful person, so I have to have it in plain
sight. It can't be stashed on a shelf. It needs
to be left somewhere that I keep coming across
it. And I go, oh, yes, I'm doing that. I'm filling
that in. Well, I don't have one, so I'm going
to have to go shopping for one, but that's great
because I love biostationary. Yes, yes. It'll
be a nice task for the weekend. Really nice.
Okay, bye then. Thanks for listening, everybody,
and we'll see you all next time. Yep. Happy researching.