1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,000 Join us on Now We Consume. 2 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:08,000 Take in the knowledge, take in the laughs, indulge in the topics with us. 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:14,000 The Now We Consume podcast will take you through the parts of your day you normally dread. 4 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:20,000 Why suffer through the existential crisis of life alone when you can do it with us? 5 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:22,000 And Now We Consume. 6 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,000 This is not meant to be a conspiracy episode or podcast, 7 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:28,000 but we make over some topics that dance that line like a toddler dances on their mother's last nerve. 8 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:33,000 This podcast is rated "I", for immature audiences only. 9 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:36,000 Hello and welcome back to the Now We Consume podcast. 10 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,000 I'm your host Pip, joined by my co-host. 11 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:40,000 Hi, I'm Gibbs. 12 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:45,000 Gibbs! Hello! 13 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:50,000 So, hey there. So we want to bring you a very interesting episode today. 14 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:52,000 This is our third episode by which we want to give a shout out. 15 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:55,000 Thanks everybody that's been listening so far and commenting, give us great feedback. 16 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:57,000 We really appreciate it. 17 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:03,000 This is one that we teased in our second episode, but the title for this one is Life After Death, a Digital Option. 18 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:08,000 Now, we kind of sort of brushed on this a little bit in one of our previous episodes. 19 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:11,000 We really wanted to come back and do a full episode on it. 20 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:18,000 This is a topic that we both really we've discussed this over years, I think, because we've known each other for a long time. 21 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,000 And this is something we've always joked about. 22 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,000 Oh, yeah. We've known each other for a while. 23 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:27,000 Your therapist knows me by now. 24 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:30,000 Oh, you've kept my therapist in business for years now. 25 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:38,000 So, but we've talked about this idea of, you know, can the human consciousness be uploaded digitally? 26 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:43,000 Is there a way to preserve life? Is there a way to whether be conserved life in a way? 27 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:47,000 Is it still the same? Is it not kind of the whole debate discussion around that? 28 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:53,000 I know you have some opinions on it and I have some very strong opinions on it. 29 00:01:53,000 --> 00:02:00,000 And we're both pulling from either various shows, various TV shows, there's even a couple of discussions I watched. 30 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:03,000 There's a lot of authors on this topic as well. 31 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:09,000 Famous things such like movies, Star Trek, TV shows, upload. 32 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:14,000 There's a bunch of stuff that's really been encompassing this for decades, really. 33 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:20,000 So I'm assuming it's a topic that a lot of people at home can kind of relate to or probably have thought about. 34 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:29,000 So I guess the the question becomes, do we want to start with the first the first kind of thought here of what exactly are we talking about? 35 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:34,000 What is the digital option? What what exactly are we reframing here? 36 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:48,000 So I know from my end, we're talking about the possibility of uploading either in its entirety or a part of the human consciousness to be able to work in a basically a fully digital state. 37 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:55,000 I know, obviously, there is the term of like cyborg where it's kind of like part and parcel where it's, you know, part human, part biological. 38 00:02:55,000 --> 00:03:03,000 But worse, I know for this, we kind of want to start from more of the strictly digital, fully uploaded side. 39 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:08,000 So I know you kind of have some really big topics, really big discussions here. 40 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:12,000 What was your your first big point with this that you were trying to make? 41 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:18,000 So in doing this, does it offer the chance to live forever? 42 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:22,000 Is it a way to digitally cheat death? 43 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:36,000 Can can we do this and extend the human life to one hundred and fifty two hundred five hundred a thousand years? Ten thousand years or beyond. 44 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:39,000 But do we deserve to do that as humans? 45 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:43,000 Well, I guess deserve is a different. 46 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:50,000 That's the topic. Yeah, this this is a topic that's going to get really deep. 47 00:03:50,000 --> 00:04:03,000 Yeah, I. So I guess the the crux of that point being when you're talking about living forever, I feel like that's the one that always jumps out to me as who the hell wants to live forever. 48 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:08,000 I mean, see, I think that's where you and I are completely different opposite sides of this. 49 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:15,000 I I really think back to there's a great quote in Marvel's Age of Ultron. 50 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,000 I know I was going to pull that quote. Yeah, I know. 51 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:28,000 It's another quote exactly where I'm paraphrasing, basically saying life is beautiful because it's finite, because it only has a short, short amount of time because it's not forever. 52 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:38,000 It gives your life meaning. And I know I wonder for a lot of people, I think this like this is a problem of kind of humanity where a life without purpose is not life. 53 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:44,000 And I know a lot of people struggle with a sense of purpose, even in the complexity of today's age. 54 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:58,000 So if humans had the ability to have an infinite lifespan or near infinite, you know, relatively speaking, that that would cause, I think, a lot of mass chaos just with people within themselves to be like, what am I doing? 55 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:08,000 Who am I? What can I do? What can't I do? And what are you as a person? If there's no limitations for what the person can be, then are you really hold that thought right there? 56 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:16,000 I think a lot of that comes down to we are confined so much by the physical world. 57 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:24,000 We have so many limitations in place right now that keep us confined to the lives that we have. 58 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:38,000 If you're able to go out and do something in one digital, let's just say realm or multiverse or portion of the multiverse, whatever that's akin to just changing servers. 59 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:48,000 Yeah, you know, I, I don't want to use a lot of gaming terminology because I don't know how many people listening are into games. 60 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:58,000 If you think of it as changing the disk in a game console, if it being as simple as that, 61 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:02,000 you can do literally anything in the digital realm. 62 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:10,000 Changing a website, changing a disk in a console, downloading and loading a new application on your computer. 63 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:20,000 Once you have digital access to an infinite digital universe, the limitations are gone. 64 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:25,000 But then also life is meaningless. 65 00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:34,000 That that I guess that's that's the inverse of it is if you have everything at your fingertips, if you if you have the ability to learn anything, do anything. 66 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:44,000 If you have the ability to be the world's fastest race car driver, then also learn how to be the best pilot, then learn how to be the best painter because you have infinite time and you have infinite instruction. 67 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:55,000 I guess the question becomes, are you are any of those things really accomplishments or is anything really of your own doing our work when because you have infinite time and infinite resources. 68 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:57,000 Do any of these things even matter? 69 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,000 Do they? 70 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:01,000 Do they have any value? 71 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,000 Right. Because if everyone could be everything, then you're nothing. 72 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:05,000 That's that's the problem. 73 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:07,000 That's what sets humans apart. 74 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:08,000 Yeah. 75 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:12,000 Which you only have so much time to be able to specialize in something. 76 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:19,000 And that's why those people are celebrated because they took the time with a limited time they have to specialize in that thing. 77 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:21,000 I got you. 78 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:41,000 I mean, that kind of touches on a point that we can talk about later about uploading and downloading, you know, using the consciousness transfer as a way to maybe just get a do over at some point. 79 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:46,000 Have it limited in some fashion so that you just get one. 80 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:49,000 See, I do think in terms of like putting a limit in place. 81 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:51,000 Yeah. 82 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:54,000 Like for medical reasons, I feel like it makes sense. 83 00:07:54,000 --> 00:08:01,000 I guess my my worries when you use it as an infinite idea. 84 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:02,000 That's right. 85 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:10,000 The problems with humanity become calm because while people are still going to keep reproducing, it's not only that, but some people are just shit. 86 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:13,000 Oh, I mean, let's face it. 87 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:15,000 That's a real nice way to sugarcoat that one. 88 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:16,000 That's great. 89 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:20,000 Let's be honest. Do we want a bunch of Stalin's running around? 90 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:21,000 No, we do not. 91 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:26,000 No. Do we want you want a bunch of many mustache gentlemen from Europe running around? 92 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:30,000 No, we do not. 93 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:34,000 You're not wrong. 94 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:39,000 But 95 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,000 pause. 96 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:44,000 Yeah, well, 97 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:51,000 we'll kind of go back on that a little bit. 98 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,000 So we can pick back up in 99 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:58,000 321. 100 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,000 But at the end of the day, you have to ask. 101 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:05,000 This is great to talk about. But is it even plausible? 102 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:10,000 I mean, is this something that is a long shot or is it somewhere 103 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:18,000 in between? Is this just a tech dream or is it something that can be done? 104 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:21,000 I definitely have the opinion that it's not possible. 105 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:26,000 I do not think using a binary system. 106 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:30,000 Now, I know quantum computing is something that's around the corner that might change this. 107 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:34,000 I'm not going to go into quantum computing only because we really haven't used enough. 108 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:38,000 It's so new. I don't really know the full capabilities of it. 109 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:43,000 Could quantum computing possibly map the synapses in the brain correctly and learn how to do it? 110 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:49,000 That I will concede. But in terms of as a binary system, as we have it now with computing, 111 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:55,000 there is simply no way for us to be able to accurately map and understand how the brain interacts with neurons, 112 00:09:55,000 --> 00:10:00,000 because the problem is always going to be you might be able to learn some things. 113 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:06,000 You might be able to transfer some things, but there is no way you can ever transfer not only memories 114 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:14,000 and experiences, thoughts and emotions, but how are you going to also be able to translate a personality over? 115 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:17,000 How are you able to translate creativity over? It's like, sure. 116 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:22,000 There are things you can do. I would not be surprised if 10 or 20 years from now, 117 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:28,000 they can basically implant or take off memories or be able to read your mind as you see it. 118 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:32,000 I know there are some studies where they have somebody think about, let's say, a bridge, 119 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:34,000 and then they're reading the brain signals. 120 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:37,000 That way they could say, oh, so that correlates with bridge, and they ask them something else, 121 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:42,000 and they kind of map out so they can sort of see what they're thinking, which is already, by the way, absolutely terrifying. 122 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:47,000 But that already scares me alone for I know the neural thing we were talking about. 123 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:54,000 But to be able to figure out a way to map what makes people unique and human, 124 00:10:54,000 --> 00:11:00,000 with our current technology, even if you had the best supercomputers all tied together with all the best sensors, 125 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:11,000 there's no way because that inherent biological interaction, I don't think can be replicated digitally until you get to quantum computing. 126 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:19,000 Right. So on that. And I promise there will come a day when I quit referencing this. 127 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:25,000 But there's a reason I wanted the stuff to be our first episode. 128 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:33,000 When you integrate AI into a consciousness scan, a high enough level of AI. 129 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:37,000 Yes. Think about that for everyone at home. 130 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:45,000 I didn't think about this beforehand, and I don't like this is his face right now. 131 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:51,000 No. So there's a there's a movie that came out. 132 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:55,000 I'd have to look it up to see. But a while back, it's a Johnny Depp movie. 133 00:11:55,000 --> 00:12:00,000 It's called Transcendence. That's exactly what they did. 134 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:06,000 It is probably one of the movies that you think about after it's over. 135 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:13,000 And you you realize that, oh, shit, we're not that far away from that being able to be done. 136 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:21,000 I highly, highly recommend anybody listening. Watch that one. 137 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:25,000 You want a good a good mind fuck. Yeah. Watch that one. 138 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:30,000 Because you said that you're not sure about how plausible this is. 139 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:33,000 There's a lot of interest in this topic. 140 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:40,000 You've got a few different companies that are interested in this topic. 141 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,000 A few different companies. 142 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:50,000 Some of these you might have heard of Altos Labs and Unity Biotech are a couple of the bigger ones. 143 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:58,000 They're being funded by guys. You might have heard of this guy, Jeff Beasley Beasley. 144 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:02,000 Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 145 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:05,000 He owns a book company or something. Yeah. 146 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:11,000 Yeah. Someone else named Peter Stott file feel. 147 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:15,000 And yes, I know how to pronounce these names, of course. 148 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:21,000 Yeah, there is big money being poured into this. 149 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:30,000 They're trying to figure out if it could ever be possible to actually transfer from a body to a computer and even vice versa. 150 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:39,000 The vice versa is going to be the harder one going from the computer to the body because it's going to be a lot more involved in that. 151 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:47,000 But an uploaded person could control robots and even interact with the world from the digital side. 152 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:50,000 And there's a lot you could do from that point as well. 153 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:53,000 I was feeling that point. Would it even be cost effective? 154 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,000 Wouldn't be just cheaper just to make it a I than have people uploaded. 155 00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:02,000 Well, when you get into the quantum side, I think. 156 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:08,000 No, because even the AI won't be able to add that human flair. 157 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:15,000 So so what I'm hearing is we're going to make a eyes and add in the human element. 158 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:19,000 It's a little spice, a little, little, little software spice, if you will. 159 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,000 Yeah. Break out the spice weasel with it. 160 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:30,000 That's that's scary because like all I can imagine is somebody getting like somebody coming at crime like you're getting a life sentence. 161 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:35,000 You're going to be uploaded and put into a robot working to a factory and just write. 162 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:40,000 And that's going to be your life sentence. Yeah, that's I don't know. 163 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:46,000 So on on that, there's there's another thing to think about this. 164 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:56,000 Instead of being sentenced, you could just be employed and work at a library. 165 00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:08,000 Because as a digital version, you'll have a chance to preserve history, pass on heritage, pass on knowledge, pass on familial knowledge, things that. 166 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:12,000 As it sits right now, three generations, you're completely forgotten. 167 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:18,000 Yeah, I mean, that's it's kind of a hard pill for a lot of people to swallow. 168 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:29,000 Unless you're some kind of like an actor or you do something significant in the world where you go and make your mark, as it were, three generations, you're completely forgotten by the third. 169 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:38,000 You're barely even known. Yeah, I guess that that's kind of part of the human existence where you have to understand that your life being finite. 170 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:45,000 For the vast majority of all humans that have ever existed, your existence only has a meaning to you. 171 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:49,000 Right. And the immediate people, the people like immediately around you. 172 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:54,000 Yeah. You know, you have no effect on the history or humanity or anything like that, which I get. 173 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:58,000 I never thought about that because some people would struggle with that. 174 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:09,000 I think the the intriguing part is being uploaded to them, be able to be used later on for different jobs or tasks or be able to preserve knowledge. 175 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:14,000 I again, never thought of that. But that's not that's not the worst idea. 176 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:20,000 It's just the question of what would your existence be like doing something like that? 177 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:33,000 Yes, that's it depends on how well the virtual environment is built, because as far as like hardware and software goes, that technology doesn't really exist yet. 178 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:40,000 But it's probably not that far away because the basics you're going to need. 179 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:50,000 You've got to have a way to capture and digitize a person's consciousness. And like you already said, that's going to require mapping the entire brain. 180 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:55,000 We're really not that far away from that. That's probably going to be something in the quantum computing realm. 181 00:16:55,000 --> 00:17:06,000 And again, it's kind of right around the corner. And once it's done, we've already done enough stuff with virtual reality where making a digital space is not that hard. 182 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:12,000 Making a digital space where you can interact with the Internet in almost like a physical manner. That's not that hard to do. 183 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:30,000 Right. So you tie that in with really powerful computer systems, basically server level systems for the people that you upload to process the data and combine that with the virtual reality system that's so immersive that it's indistinguishable from the real world. 184 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:41,000 And you're said 15 years, probably maybe 20. And we're there at the current rate of technological adoption. 185 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:55,000 It's possible. But I guess the I guess that's kind of the craziest question is being able to live indefinitely doing something like that. 186 00:17:55,000 --> 00:18:06,000 But would you then I guess we're at the mercy of whoever develops the software. That's the part that scares me the most is that you have to wonder like how much free will am I going to have? Are you going to be able to be let loose on the Internet? 187 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:13,000 Are you going to have restrictions? Where can you go? Where can you not go? Who you can interact with? How you can interact? 188 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:28,000 If there are too many limitations place, do you then have to give up your free will to be uploaded to exist? And I guess the question that comes back to which one I've already asked is, do you even have do you even exist if you don't have free will at that point? 189 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:33,000 You know what those kind of limitations. So and a lot of that crosses into the ethical realm of it. 190 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:43,000 Like, would it even be ethical to keep somebody confined in a digital system? I can't even begin to imagine the legal waivers that would have to be signed. 191 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:52,000 Even this there's no legal waiver waiver to be able to do that, especially when there's no guarantees as to what the system will be or how it will interact or what you'll be allowed to do. 192 00:18:52,000 --> 00:19:10,000 The problem is, will you be guaranteed a certain amount of digital space or like literally hard drive hardware space? Because the other problem is, as technology improves, you have to also think about there are different softwares, different drivers, different things that basically interacting and cross interacting. 193 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:18,000 What happens if you are uploaded, let's just say 20 years from now and 100 years from now, they switched all quantum computing. 194 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:31,000 Are you are you going to be like a little literally legacy hardware that's no longer supported? Are they going to say like, oh, sorry, looks like your great grandpapa was uploading in 2047 and we haven't updated those servers in about 57 years. 195 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:38,000 So he's running on three gigs of RAM. Meanwhile, your brain's like struggling to figure out what an apple is because you have no RAM anymore. 196 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:54,000 It's like, ah, you can't get can't process things. I guess that that is the like the biggest concerning parts as technology improves. Right. Unfortunately, as we've seen with computers, when hardware improves, the software efficiency doesn't always improve either. 197 00:19:54,000 --> 00:20:05,000 It tends to lag. Yes, because they don't have to be as efficient. It's crazy. They didn't like didn't. How much RAM did they have on the computer? But they landed the moon on wasn't so crazy, like 16 kilobytes or something like that. 198 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:27,000 It was kilobytes. Yeah. Yeah. And we we run in the gigabyte spectrum now. And the sad part is like the most basic, basic, basic programs now use hundreds, if not thousands of times that amount of RAM, even the calculator app on the computer uses way more RAM than what took us to get to the moon. 199 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:56,000 Yep. And that's the part that can that concerns is if you're uploaded, there is no guarantee that you'll have the same not only amount of digital space, but the quality of that space. And when you want to face, do you then have to buy space? You have to say, wait a minute, we're going to upload it. I have to buy a server and afford to be able to maintain that. Right. And who there's there's a lot that goes into this. I mean, it's not an easy, easy subject to go into it like the amount of back end paperwork that we have. 200 00:20:56,000 --> 00:21:14,000 We have back end paperwork that will be required, like guaranteeing existence and hardware upgrades, software updates, patches, access, you know, uptime and not too much of backups as well. Power backups. Yeah. And then here, here's a question I've never thought about before. 201 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:22,000 Now, if they make a backup of your consciousness, is that consciousness also active? 202 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:42,000 It is not, but there there there's more ethical questions. So then the question becomes, can they make unlimited copies of you? And do you have the right to own digitally your own copy of your one own consciousness? But then if they copy you, can they incriminate you in crimes or other things? Can they use you to do it? It's limitless. That's the problem. 203 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:58,000 But if I can copy me, that's one hell of a party. We're all screwed. That's the problem. We we will need to copy therapists. That is the problem. Control C, control V on every therapist I know of in the upload. But initiating Freud.exe. 204 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:27,000 But I guess that's the if you can get the get somebody's personality, the whole consciousness once there's no reason why you can't copy it. So you'd have to own the right to your digital consciousness, which if we know anything about every single company in the in the country, really in the world, it's they take all of your they spy on everything, you know, they take all the information they can. I would not trust a single medical company. 205 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:42,000 That said, oh, yeah, we'll take your conscious. We only have one copy of it. No, I don't believe that. I'll be there for a second. The first the first great doctor or somebody that dies, they're just going to make a copy of it, make an AI with it, and they're going to start using it hospitals to save on labor costs. Let's be honest. 206 00:22:42,000 --> 00:23:00,000 So, yeah, to know. Absolutely not. Although I would be willing to take baby possibly like, I don't know, Michael Schumacher's AI figure replace all the cars with it that that might help us out in terms of getting rid of accidents. But besides that, I don't know. I don't trust a single one of them. 207 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:05,000 Yeah. And, you know, barring even the ethical stuff. 208 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:19,000 A lot of this crosses over some touchy lines and this is a realm where I personally, I don't have a lot of weight to speak, but you cross into the spiritual and religious realms. 209 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:38,000 Because is that version of you in the digital realm any kind of a violation of religious rights and I guess it's predication is the right term. I'm not sure. 210 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:47,000 Are you still considered alive? Yeah. In that religion, do the rules still apply? Are you still a member? 211 00:23:47,000 --> 00:24:02,000 I know there's also a lot of religions that would basically ban you from participating that in any way. Most likely. Yeah. You know, I mean, how the which one is it that you can take a photo of them? Was it the Amish or the other one? 212 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:10,000 Not sure. I know there's one of them where they don't like you being beyond cameras or on photos. I feel like it's part of their soul. 213 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:23,000 I was not one of the Indian things. Maybe it might be that too. I don't I don't remember. But the point is, I know there are religions and other things where if you take part in that kind of modern technology and stuff, they feel like, oh, it removes part of what makes you you. 214 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:37,000 Yeah. So I do feel like it would knock out a lot of people participate on that. And I wonder how many people would also struggle with that aspect of are you still the same person? Do you still legally legally, but spiritually qualify as the same person? 215 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:48,000 How much testing are they going to do to make sure that like if you're uploaded and they reupload you to a body and vice versa, are you still the same person still act the same way? 216 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:59,000 Because I don't know. I wonder if that would really affect a lot of people's religion. Yeah, especially because, you know, a lot of people look at it as once the body dies. 217 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:12,000 You know, that's when a lot of the spiritual and religious stuff takes place. But if you come back in another body, doesn't that kind of nullify some of that? 218 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,000 I don't know. It depends on religion. Also depends on the body. 219 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:25,000 Like, that's a discussion I would really like to have with somebody who's like very, very well versed in different faiths, not just one. 220 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:40,000 Somebody who knows a lot about several. Yeah, like in detail. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure there are several where again, like any religion, there's always ones that make exceptions and are kind of willing to bend and flex. 221 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:47,000 But there's quite a few of them that are more on the traditionalist side that would definitely have a problem with that. They'd have a serious problem with it. 222 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:56,000 And I understand why. I totally get it. But I don't know. I really don't think you'd be the same person. If you've been uploading, you come back. 223 00:25:56,000 --> 00:26:09,000 I'd err on the side. Probably not. Probably not the same person. I guess the other question with this too comes before we do this, we'd have to establish what we talked about one of the previous episodes with the Internet and digital Bill of Rights. 224 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:19,000 Because the other question I think comes in here, especially if they're going to be different spiritually or different physically, we would have to then change the laws around you having equivalent rights. 225 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:26,000 If you're a digital person. Right. Because let me let me grab that point right there. 226 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:29,000 If it gets to a point where you can upload and download at will. 227 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:37,000 There has to be a way to make sure that the the body you're downloading into is yours. 228 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:43,000 Preventing some kind of digital impersonation would be paramount. 229 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:51,000 You didn't think about that, did you? No, I don't think about loading into someone else's body. No, I like what I got. I'm good. I'm happy. 230 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:55,000 God, that would be terrifying. Right. 231 00:26:55,000 --> 00:27:03,000 Oh, man. Imagine you go to sleep and you upload. I'm sorry, Mr. Gibbs. We uploaded you into the wrong body. You're now Mrs. Gibbs for today. 232 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,000 No. 233 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:13,000 I mean, hey, if I woke up as Mrs. Pip, I'm I'm going to go exploring for a little bit. 234 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:16,000 But I don't know. I that would definitely mess with me. 235 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:24,000 You would get to experience life a little differently for a little bit, knowing that you could get it redone. 236 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:28,000 I mean, it opens a lot of doors and a lot of possibilities. 237 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:37,000 That definitely opens a lot of doors. We'd have to have an entire conversation at that point where human sexuality would then go in a very different direction. 238 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,000 Very weird direction. That would be a lot of weirdness. 239 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:43,000 But I never thought about the impersonating thing, though. 240 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:52,000 That's interesting because you could theoretically make a copy of someone's body using their DNA, you know, making a copy of them and uploading a different person into it. 241 00:27:52,000 --> 00:28:00,000 So you would then have to have the right to also your body is almost like a schematic, almost like these proportions this way, this whatever this. 242 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:07,000 There you go. With this fingerprint. So then then the problem is in every way that you're unique, you can also be copied. 243 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:14,000 Yeah. And not only copied, then you have to worry about not just being copied, but being hacked. 244 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:19,000 Oh, God. 245 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,000 That is terrifying. Right. 246 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:26,000 It's all fun and games until the USB port in the back of your head gets plugged in by accident. 247 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,000 You know, Jesus Christ. 248 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:37,000 So is it going to be like all I can think of is the matrix or like when they lean back on the thing and the big needle that goes to the back of the brain or something like that. 249 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,000 The head probe. Yeah. 250 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:44,000 Imagine just being able to like be like, and you're not going to remember tonight could do and just, you know, 251 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:52,000 sticking that in just erasing their memories or uploading memories or changing stuff or being able to view like what they view from a live feed. 252 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,000 Because because you're going to have access to all of a person's senses. 253 00:28:55,000 --> 00:29:01,000 If you could upload and download their consciousness and all of their experiences, you have to access all that information. 254 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,000 You you touched on on something right there. 255 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:08,000 Uploading and downloading somebody else's memories and experiences. 256 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:14,000 What if think about information extraction? 257 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:25,000 What if you put somebody through absolute hell and then you record those experiences and instead of doing it to somebody else, you just upload those experiences into their mind. 258 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,000 So as like a form of punishment kind of thing. Uh huh. 259 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:33,000 So I'm actually not 100 percent against that. 260 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:44,000 I liked there was a very specific episode in Star Trek where my just happened a couple of times in Star Trek or referencing one episode where somebody committed a crime on a planet. 261 00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:49,000 So they actually had them re-experience the lifetime of somebody that had to deal with the consequences of that crime. 262 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,000 They experienced like 50 or 60 years, a whole life. 263 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,000 They had a family, kids and everything, lost everything, got put in jail, whatever. 264 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:57,000 It was extremely traumatic. 265 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,000 And the guy came out and had to go through therapy. 266 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:03,000 It took several months to be like understand what was going on again. 267 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:11,000 But I will say you're not going to reoffend if you experience something like that from the other end. 268 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:15,000 So it could have its uses. 269 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:25,000 However, it could also be used to traumatize people en masse or change people's spending habits, change their influence by all of a sudden. 270 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,000 Everybody in the country wants a big Mac. I don't know. 271 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,000 It could be endless. 272 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:38,000 That is concerning at the same point because all this is going to have to be some sort of Bluetooth or over the air capability because it's not going to be always cable connected. 273 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:42,000 Right. So that. Yeah. No, I'll take a pass. 274 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:51,000 And I mean, a lot of this has a potential, sorry, potential or too difficult today to even affect the political structure. 275 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:56,000 If we get a really good president in charge, maybe we want to keep him around for a while. 276 00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:02,000 If we have a really good president that maybe gets assassinated, maybe we want to make sure he didn't die. 277 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:13,000 If we have a if we have a president that gets sick while in office, maybe we make sure that he didn't get sick or she or they then you are getting rid of the human actions, having consequences. 278 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:22,000 And I feel like that just becomes such a dangerous road because then we will end up in a world of where your votes mean nothing. 279 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,000 Your time means nothing. Your actions mean nothing. 280 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,000 You just exist no matter the consequence. 281 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:33,000 That is terrifying or turn it up with Richard Nixon in a jar like a drama. 282 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:41,000 That's that's the problem is we're going to end up with certain politicians that never, ever leave. 283 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:47,000 Right. You know, we've been ruled by the Pelosi's for 75 years. 284 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:50,000 I don't know. Well, that's just California. 285 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:53,000 And that's just because it's true. That's true. 286 00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,000 Yeah. At that point, Mitch McConnell was ever leave. 287 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,000 Oh, my God. Yeah. 288 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:04,000 His always work runs on cocaine. 289 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:14,000 But I think what concerns me about all of this is the fact that all of these things we talk about are going to be available solely to the politically connected to rich before any of us see this. 290 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:22,000 Right. So that's going to be what's going to be the craziest thing besides all everything we've talked about is the fact that, oh, yeah, the ultra wealthy like the Bezos. 291 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:26,000 And that type of Elon Musk, they would have access to the stuff long before us. 292 00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:34,000 So it is very possible we will have a technological oligarchy that basically says, oh, yeah, like Bezos is going to be around for I could see that. 293 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,000 And we will not we will not get access to it until the point where it is. 294 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:42,000 It is outside limited so that, yeah, sure, we can exist. 295 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:51,000 But, oh, yeah, we need your consciousness for eight hours a day to do data mining and data sorting and other stuff that pays for you being able to be uploaded. 296 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:56,000 Right. That kind of stuff. I mean, you could employ the uploads as call centers. 297 00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:02,000 You know what, though, at least then you may be able to change the accent to understand. 298 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:05,000 I mean, instant communication. 299 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:08,000 They could read every language translation. Yeah. 300 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:13,000 Real time translation. You'd never have a communication barrier again. 301 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:18,000 All right. We have we have that capability right now with those those new earbuds. 302 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:20,000 Are those any good? I've never looked into them. 303 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:24,000 I really want to get a set to try. Okay. Well, we'll talk about that later. 304 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:29,000 But that would be cool to be able to translate in real time. Yeah. 305 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:35,000 And have something to work no matter what the language, no matter what else you can be understood. Yeah. 306 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:39,000 That's where I am like, all right, I'm into that. Yeah. 307 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:46,000 So let me let me kind of circle back a little bit. We were talking about the uploading downloading of experiences. Yes. 308 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:54,000 Let me let me get real dark for a minute. How do you think it would affect the ability for people to keep secrets? 309 00:33:54,000 --> 00:34:01,000 There'll be no such thing as secrets. Well, so let's just consider somebody who has not uploaded. 310 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:09,000 But now let's let's assume for a minute that we can upload and download it will. All right. 311 00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:21,000 We're at that point. Alphabet Agency needs information from gentlemen a and he he hasn't uploaded and he's not cooperating. 312 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:29,000 So Alphabet Agency gets a hold of gentlemen a child and they upload the child. 313 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:39,000 And they put the child through all kinds of digital hell over and over and over. 314 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:49,000 And then they download that back into the body. And the kids never write again. Yeah. Or at least that's the threat. 315 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:54,000 But gentlemen a knows that they can do that. Well, they can even upload himself. 316 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:59,000 If it's a wireless technology, they can be able to upload you at any time. Yeah, it could be forced uploads. 317 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:04,000 Well, they could while you're sleeping upload you look through all your memories and then download you again. 318 00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:08,000 You would never know depending on how the technology works. Yeah, potentially. 319 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:15,000 That just basically the in that idea, the FBI would just be a cyber crimes unit or cyber thought unit. 320 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:20,000 Did you ever see vanilla sky? No, I know it was on the list. I never had to see it. 321 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:28,000 Yeah. So for anybody listening, there was a small list for this episode. 322 00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:36,000 Vanilla Sky Transcendence. Those are two movies that I cannot recommend enough for people to watch. 323 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:42,000 The TV series upload on Amazon Prime. The great series. 324 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,000 I know Gibbs is trying to get through some of that right now. 325 00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:55,000 And then on Netflix, Black Mirror. That series in and of itself is great. 326 00:35:55,000 --> 00:36:02,000 But for this episode here tonight, there are three episodes in particular that you want to watch. 327 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:09,000 Those episodes are Be Right Back, USS Callister and San Junipero. 328 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:15,000 All three of those episodes specifically touch on digital afterlife. 329 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:24,000 And all three of those show some different sides of what can go wrong, what can be done, what can be. 330 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:32,000 You know, some of it gets pretty dark. I'm not going to lie, but they're they're worth the watch. 331 00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:37,000 Oh, yeah, I can highly recommend upload. I've liked the first few episodes that I've watched. 332 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:43,000 It's a great show. I would say probably one of the best about this topic, even though it has to do with an android. 333 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:50,000 But what makes a man is an episode from Next Generation where they talk about there's an android that sentient and Star Trek and the ideas. 334 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:56,000 Is he a living person or not? I feel like that kind of this whole the entire episode is basically a legal argument. 335 00:36:56,000 --> 00:37:02,000 That really sums up the discussion we're going to have to have. 336 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:09,000 Kind of as a race at that point, when that when it gets to that point, whereas humanity, are we going to decide how these rights are going to be divvied up? 337 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:15,000 Are they not? Who is going to get what? Who's responsible for what? 338 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:18,000 And also, like, who is responsible for things like memories? 339 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:23,000 Who's responsible for your thoughts are our thought crimes? 340 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:31,000 Really a thing. But I feel like that is something anybody that has read, you know, George Orwell's 341 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:35,000 1984 Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451. 342 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,000 I'm really big into dystopian type novels and that type of stuff. 343 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:49,000 Those two really bring out as ones that really harped on the idea of the thought crime and with the ability to upload consciousness and be able to to be recorded, 344 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,000 analyzed and or policed. 345 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:56,000 That would be something that be readily available. 346 00:37:56,000 --> 00:38:05,000 And I don't think I don't mean to be a pessimist, but I don't think for a second that our police forces would hesitate to use that against us. 347 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:07,000 Absolutely. 348 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:12,000 And unfortunately, it's so easy to manipulate that the thoughts could be implanted. 349 00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,000 They could be removed. They could be taken out. 350 00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:20,000 You could have people that commit crimes and they just delete the thought and then they're innocent. 351 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:25,000 Or what if they take some kind of a mind altering substance where they just physically cannot remember it? 352 00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:28,000 Yeah, they have no memory of the crime. 353 00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:33,000 Yeah. Well, the US government has been known to drug people do. 354 00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,000 I can be a drug. Yep. 355 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:37,000 We're knowing that, but they released many. 356 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:41,000 I'm not going to get too deep into it because we have another episode that we're going to do at some point. 357 00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:50,000 The US government, it's misdoings and you know, but they they release drugs into major cities to be able to get people to, you know, become dependent on them, be more easily manipulated. 358 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,000 It's been something that's been noted and they've really they've released these documents. 359 00:38:54,000 --> 00:39:04,000 So if they did that back in the 70s and 80s, where there was a paper trail and people could be held accountable, we both know what we all know. 360 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:09,000 They would abuse that. Oh, and I'm not I'm not anti-police at all. 361 00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:11,000 We just know how the government works. 362 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,000 Historically, the evidence is always there and tend to have power. 363 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:18,000 They will abuse it. So with this kind of tech, 364 00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:30,000 there is not not only going to have to be so many laws in place and so many safeguards, the problem becomes who do we trust more to trust the government to trust private companies? 365 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:33,000 Is it going to have to be broken up between a bunch of different companies? 366 00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:36,000 Yeah, it there's so many different layers to it. 367 00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:47,000 Yeah, but if if the technology is handed out to private companies and it's for lack of a better word, policed appropriately, 368 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:55,000 then I think the technology does have some good of mankind benefits. 369 00:39:55,000 --> 00:40:02,000 We can use the technology for applications like space travel. 370 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:06,000 I mean, we spoke in our last episode about going to Mars and the moon and whatnot. 371 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:15,000 Yes. You know, the issues of going to Mars or even further out into the solar system, you know, humans need food, air, water, all that stuff. 372 00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:20,000 Well, what if it's the digital consciousness you send and you only have to worry about providing power? 373 00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:25,000 We've gotten pretty good at making power now. 374 00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:37,000 So we could do that if we can get the technology down to grow bodies while they're in route or just store the bodies in some kind of a stasis. 375 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:57,000 Then a hibernation state, even we could drastically reduce the requirements that the ships would need to get people to and from distant planets and eventually distant star systems. 376 00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:01,000 And that's assuming you don't just use cybernetic bodies at that point. 377 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:16,000 Right. You also have the option, again, if we have the upload and download technology, even you could download that consciousness into a robot body where you don't have to worry about spacesuits or the environment that they're going into. 378 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:28,000 You know, you can put them on the moons of Jupiter that don't actually have atmospheres, but we can still get things done. 379 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:33,000 So there are benefits that this technology could offer. 380 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:38,000 But again, it could be abused very easily. 381 00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,000 It's going to be the fundamental reoccurring theme. 382 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:42,000 No matter what. Oh, yeah. 383 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,000 Then he was anything in science. I know. But especially this. 384 00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:54,000 This will be the next big push in humanity, especially when it comes to the intersection of medical and science and tech. 385 00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:59,000 Right. It's going to be the biggest race that we have. You know, AI is big. Don't get me wrong. 386 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:05,000 But this will be the thing after once we get AI fully established. 387 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:10,000 Unfortunately, so as the naysayer, the group. 388 00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:15,000 Yeah. Yeah. Not either this or the war. Yeah. 389 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:20,000 The Skynet War. Yeah. No, thank you. I am good. 390 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:27,000 I will. Robot overlords, please don't hurt me. I think I gladly accept you. 391 00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:32,000 Wink Wink. But yeah, I don't know. 392 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:35,000 I've been I've been thinking a lot about this since we spoke about it. 393 00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:39,000 And I guess I'm just a very negative headspace about the whole thing. 394 00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,000 I see it being more abused than anything. 395 00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:52,000 Like, don't get me wrong, I 100 percent see the potential of it happening, but I'm kind of more in the headspace of me personally. 396 00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:55,000 I want to stick around and see what humanity does. 397 00:42:55,000 --> 00:43:02,000 Like, I'm excited to see what becomes of everything. 398 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,000 Yeah, that's true, because we'll never know. Yeah. 399 00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:10,000 And that's the thing. I like learning things I want to know. 400 00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:15,000 That's always the problem is like if you could be a viewer. 401 00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,000 You just kind of view humanity through that. 402 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:22,000 That might be like if there was limitations properly put on, then sure. Yeah. 403 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,000 But sorry, my phone keeps blowing up. Bitcoin hit one hundred and five thousand a bit ago. 404 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:31,000 So wow. Yeah. We'll have to do a crypto episode. 405 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,000 Yeah, I'm good with that. Yeah. 406 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:41,000 But why that's the list because we got a long list. It keeps growing. 407 00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:46,000 I can I can understand why there's a lot of potential for it to go the wrong way. 408 00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:52,000 And just given the tendencies of humanity, I I can see why. 409 00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:57,000 You know, we tend to fuck things up pretty bad and for the wrong reasons. 410 00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:05,000 Just saying, I mean, we've we've done some pretty bad stuff in our existence. 411 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,000 But I think there's a lot of good left out there, too. Oh, absolutely. 412 00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:15,000 The only way I think it could work is if we did kind of like in the show upload where basically you die, 413 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:20,000 you retire to a nice life, you know, in an uploaded state. 414 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:25,000 Yeah, that's kind of that's kind of dreams, you know, which fine that I'm OK with. 415 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:33,000 Right. That's kind of the last like big point I wanted to make on this is if it's done. 416 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:35,000 Air quote, right. 417 00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:45,000 Then you can kind of confine the digital consciousness that's uploaded to essentially a retirement community. 418 00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:49,000 You don't have to give it full access to the Internet. 419 00:44:49,000 --> 00:45:00,000 You can give it, you know, its own network with its own whatever, maybe limited access to the outside world or something. 420 00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:12,000 You know, stream in, but nothing goes out or limited out, nothing more than like a video call. 421 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:21,000 You could confine the whole thing and and still let people have some kind of a meaningful existence digitally. 422 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,000 To where they could go on as long as they want. 423 00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:31,000 And when they're when they're done, when they're just, hey, I don't want to do this anymore, you know, I'll go to sleep tonight. 424 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:35,000 And when when the update hits, I don't update. 425 00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:46,000 We can also even it won't be that hard at that point to do a simulated Earth where wonder if they could do they could just take another copy of Earth and just basically say just make it all the good stuff. 426 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,000 Just have it put it on a nice positive trajectory. 427 00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:52,000 Have it so eventually all the world's problems are solved. 428 00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:56,000 Everything else. And it looks like a fax. It looks like just like a copy. 429 00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:59,000 But so basically where the 2012 divergence didn't happen. 430 00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:01,000 Exactly. That's what I'm getting at. 431 00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,000 You know, Hiram is still there. We didn't lose her. 432 00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:07,000 We didn't lose her. Exactly. We didn't lose Kobe. You know, all that stuff. 433 00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,000 Exactly. No, Kovac, none of that stuff. 434 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:23,000 And the idea is maybe looking in the positive way you could exist in an Earth where everything passed, you know, 2012, 2014, went in a nice, positive direction, nice and smooth, nice progress. 435 00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:32,000 And that way you could live to see, you know, us going to Mars and going to the planets, doing interplanet interstellar travel, but purposely make it so you never really have any major conflicts. 436 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:38,000 No big issues. People can enjoy a nice retirement for as long as they want. 437 00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:43,000 And maybe people can opt in to say, hey, maybe I want to check in. How is the real Earth doing? 438 00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:49,000 How are things really going? Because also look out and see the dumpster fire. 439 00:46:49,000 --> 00:47:00,000 Oh, I regret looking. But also at the same point, I think the other thing is we're admitting the fact that there could be multiple servers where the idea is what kind of experience do you want to have? 440 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:10,000 Oh, yeah. How do you want to do so? For example, if you're a big Star Trek fan, do you want to have like the holodeck experience where you could just do whatever the frick you want and have whatever you want? 441 00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:20,000 And that's cool. Do you want to have something more like where it's kind of curated for you or maybe you have fewer choices, but they're the ones you get a really nice, really pleasant. 442 00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:28,000 You know, do you also want to have your family there as a just you do want to start a new family? Do you want to start a new life altogether from the ground up? 443 00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:40,000 However you want it, if it was done in a way in which it is detached from the rest of, you know, physical biological beings, then I can see a way of it working. 444 00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:51,000 But there has to be a disconnect at some level that is meaningful. Yeah. Yeah. Server farms, I think, would be the way to go with that. 445 00:47:51,000 --> 00:48:04,000 Because you can just have subsets cordoned off to where, you know, this is the vacation side. This is the space travel. This is the yeah. 446 00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:11,000 Pirates of the Caribbean life, you know, whatever, because humans are still naturally going to want to work collaboratively with other people. 447 00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:21,000 And no matter how good I is, I do feel like at some point humans would need somewhere to do somewhere to go. So why not just put humans in different groups? Like, all right. 448 00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:31,000 If this is your interest, cool. You do your thing and get with your buddies and your friends and make some friends and go sail the ocean or go to other places. 449 00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:36,000 That brings up another another potentiality. 450 00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:46,000 Think about the different science and medical researchers. Let them continue their work, especially in a space where, you know, you don't have to worry about safety issues. 451 00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:58,000 You have to worry about other things. I would not be against that. Right. You know, let the engineers still develop is one of the big problems we have, at least in the 21st century. 452 00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:08,000 There's a fact of safety. Yeah, but only that. But sometimes scientists not being told, no, that's the other half of the problem. Well, yeah, it becomes the Jurassic Park line. 453 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:14,000 You know, they were too worried about whether they could. They never stopped to think about whether they should. 454 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:19,000 And I feel like this would get rid of that gray area entirely where it's like do what you want. 455 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:27,000 You know, if you want to try to make the Manhattan Project in your basement, you are welcome to try. You're not going to make it work, but you are welcome to try. 456 00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:31,000 That's fine. You need a bigger basement. 457 00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:38,000 I do not, sir. You have seen my basement. I have a bigger basement. That is true. 458 00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:42,000 You're basically the house in your basement. It's great. 459 00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:55,000 But if you get where I'm going with that, that way, the human creativity can still be cultivated and we could still make breakthroughs, even with people that, you know, have been uploaded and have the consciousness doing other things. 460 00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:58,000 Now, here's my other question. 461 00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:14,000 Would we then use consciousness or human conscious or uploaded people to then basically make crypto farms to where the idea is their consciousness in order to pay for this part of their consciousness is used to mine crypto. 462 00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:20,000 That way they say, don't worry. We'll give you a spot. We'll upload you for free. You can have whatever you want. 463 00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:30,000 But the limitation is for so many hours, a certain amount of time, you are basically a crypto mining machine and you don't even have to be conscious for it. 464 00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:36,000 But you're still utilized, even in death, you can still serve and still do something. 465 00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:41,000 That's that's the angle I've always thought about where I wonder if they would kind of find a way. 466 00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:45,000 You know what? I would be OK with that. 467 00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:54,000 Yeah, as long as I'm not like Minecraft, like crypto mining, where I have to actually mine shit and like put it in a box and craft it. 468 00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,000 No, as long as it's like, all right, I have to go to bed. 469 00:50:57,000 --> 00:51:02,000 It's been 12 hours on the server and I go to bed and I wake up and I'm like, oh, I guess I went crypto mine last night. 470 00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:06,000 I earned zero point zero zero three Bitcoin. Cool. I paid for my stay. 471 00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:16,000 Like, you know, wouldn't that be kind of funny if it was based on like the IQ of the person? Oh, man. Oh, no. Oh, that'd be rough. 472 00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:24,000 That would be rough. That'd be rough. I get 16 bit afterlife. 473 00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:28,000 I'm truly stuck in the mind forever. You're really on my cross. 474 00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:36,000 That would be my hell. You get some people who get like cyberpunk and other people who get Minecraft. Yeah. 475 00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:43,000 It's like, oh, well, above 130 IQ, we can make $20 an hour with this guy. Forget throwing the cyberpunk. 476 00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:51,000 It's like, oh, this guy's an idiot. All right. You know, he gets Mario Brothers. Oh, no. 477 00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:56,000 This would get started. Valley, that would be cool. 478 00:51:56,000 --> 00:52:00,000 At least it's like aesthetically pleasing. Yeah. 479 00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:10,000 But yeah, there's so many options with the uploaded thing where I bet you this can be in the future, probably 20 years from now, there's going to be so many different ways to monetize it. 480 00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:22,000 And I wonder how many people will choose to just like end their life early, but I'll just be uploaded. Yeah. I mean, honestly, it could be, you know, there are issues with like euthanasia. 481 00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:34,000 Yeah. Maybe that could be an alternative. Here's who have debilitating diseases and whatnot like talking. Exactly. 482 00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:41,000 I'm going to call it right here. I just had a brainwave. Uh huh. What's going to happen is people's consciousness is going to be uploaded. 483 00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:46,000 They're going to mine crypto for enough to where they can afford a new body in a new life. 484 00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:52,000 What will happen is it will become basically an interim stay like, well, I've run out of money. I've run out of options, guys. 485 00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:56,000 I'm signing the paperwork next week. I'll be uploaded. I'll see in 80 years. 486 00:52:56,000 --> 00:53:02,000 And then you just spend the next 70 years crypto mining, putting money away because they get part of it and you get part of it. 487 00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:05,000 Also, 70 years later, it's like, yeah, I've saved up a few million dollars. 488 00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:11,000 I know I want to be, you know, 22 years old with a six pack, six, six foot three, you know, built like hell. 489 00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:21,000 And then you come back and you restart again. I wonder if that will become a thing where your afterlife really just becomes like an interim stay where you just run out of money. 490 00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:29,000 Would would that be more like. Ethical, though, because you just take all the homeless people and you're like, oh, you guys don't have a home. 491 00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:34,000 OK, we'll give you one zap. They're uploaded. Is it ethical? No. 492 00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:39,000 You know what? It would clean up the streets of San Francisco. No more pool everywhere. 493 00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:42,000 Digital poo just goes away. It's fine. They think whoever they want is digital. 494 00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,000 It's OK. Doesn't worry about it. Just leave a smell. 495 00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:50,000 You know, we'll just go if it does. If it does, it smells like pumpkin spice. 496 00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:57,000 Oh, no. Well, John, your poo smells great today. 497 00:53:57,000 --> 00:54:01,000 Thanks. It's called poo. Pari. 498 00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:05,000 Is that a hint of oregano? I just I don't know. 499 00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:10,000 That's the beauty of it. Do you have any great poop on? 500 00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:13,000 You might not be able to get that reference. 501 00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:20,000 No, but there was a time back in the day where you could pull up somebody to stop light and ask them if they had mustard. 502 00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:24,000 And it was funny. 503 00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:31,000 What? Why are you asking strangers that they have mustard? 504 00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:37,000 Who cares? Everybody is listening to this. Who's like under 35 is so confused right now. 505 00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:42,000 Yeah, that's me. Why are you asking strangers for mustard? 506 00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:47,000 Yeah. Was mustard very expensive back in the day? I don't know. I'm not that old. 507 00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:50,000 Nope. I'll just leave that for a conversation starter. 508 00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:55,000 Yeah. Now I'm just confused for the rest of the episode that you're leaving me confused. 509 00:54:55,000 --> 00:55:00,000 Like most times we talk, you're leaving me confused. 510 00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:06,000 All right. So were there any points that we missed on this episode with any of the last minute? 511 00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:13,000 Oh, my. Concerns. Thanks. So I honestly thought this would go a lot longer than it did. 512 00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:17,000 Well, we said we sounds like a you problem, buddy. 513 00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:24,000 But we did touch upon a lot of topics pretty quickly and we didn't go like super, super in depth. 514 00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:33,000 Some of them, which we could have at the same point that was going to get like I say nauseating, but just the level of detail is going to get annoying. 515 00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:36,000 Yeah. If you went too far with it. 516 00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:44,000 I feel like we so basically to bring it back to the original, the original question of is it plausible? 517 00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,000 Is it a long shot or is it somewhere in between? 518 00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:57,000 I have the opinion of where we're kind of somewhere in between where unfortunately I say that because I would really rather us not go down this road personally. 519 00:55:57,000 --> 00:56:04,000 That's just my opinion. But I do think it's inevitable in some capacity. 520 00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:09,000 Yep. The question will be cost versus time versus tech. 521 00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:19,000 Versus civil rights and versus if we have a make it another 20 years, that's the other thing. But if everything goes well, it is possible. 522 00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:25,000 Do I versus probably some kind of an output that you get from it, like you were saying with the crypto mining and whatnot. 523 00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:33,000 That's that's I think the most plausible method, but I think I idealistic probably not. It's going to be somewhere between. 524 00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:37,000 What about you? Yeah, I am going to take kind of a cop out on this. 525 00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:41,000 I'm going to say we are plausibly in between. 526 00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:43,000 The hell does that mean? 527 00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:51,000 Just give the state of current technology the way that it looks like it's progressing. 528 00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:55,000 I feel like we most likely will get there. 529 00:56:55,000 --> 00:57:00,000 Whether or not we actually take the steps to develop it. I don't know. 530 00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:07,000 I think we probably will be capable of it before we start trying to do it. 531 00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:16,000 But I think there's going to be a lot more issues raised more along like the ethical and the rights side, like human rights, digital rights, whatever. 532 00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:26,000 That's going to get raised and probably prevent it and put the kibosh on it long before it's ever done or even attempted. 533 00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:36,000 I think wouldn't you just love getting your brain hacked, getting uploaded, be stuck in like the perpetual one hundred cars for kids ad just forever for the rest of your existence. 534 00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:44,000 Dear Lord, I hate that ad to the point I slam my radio off every time it comes on. 535 00:57:44,000 --> 00:57:46,000 Just imagine hearing that for eternity. 536 00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:49,000 One eight seven seven cars for. 537 00:57:49,000 --> 00:57:52,000 No, that's it. Stop. 538 00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:58,000 Yeah, I know. I feel like that would go so wrong and especially because we live in a relatively wealthy country. 539 00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:01,000 If there's any problems or issues, it would be it would be this country first. 540 00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:07,000 Us in Europe. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Maybe China. Maybe China, depending on how their economy does. 541 00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:10,000 You know, they're reaching a breaking point soon. So, yeah, we'll see. 542 00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:16,000 You know, we we didn't even touch on the military aspect and possible military applications. 543 00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:24,000 I'll just let people head game that out, think back to everything we talked about and then put the military application side on that. 544 00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:28,000 There you go. I don't like that thought. 545 00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:32,000 Infinite meatbags. It's just you kill them and they upload and they read. 546 00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:38,000 Oh, no, no, no, I don't like that. 547 00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:43,000 No, because a bad point. Why bother having training? Well, because you still have to get people to that point. 548 00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:46,000 No, just send them out. If they die, just reupload them. 549 00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:48,000 You still got to get some people to that point, though. 550 00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:51,000 It'd be far cheaper to just have them go out and learn if they die. 551 00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:54,000 Oh, well, especially in a simulated environment. 552 00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:59,000 God, especially if a simulated environment like you can speed up or slow down time. 553 00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:06,000 So, you know, five years worth of training in a matter of days, you lose track of your kid for one day and they come back a master assassin. 554 00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:12,000 What the fuck? Sorry, they've been uploaded to special forces. 555 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:15,000 You have been selected for. Yeah, just oh, God. 556 00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:20,000 Not Jimmy. What if it's like the Matrix where they just upload skills to you? 557 00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:28,000 See, I'd be OK with that. Yeah. Until they until you get like skills that are either incredibly, incredibly overpowered or incredibly useless. 558 00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:35,000 Then you just become Neo. That's the rich, though, you know. 559 00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:38,000 Elon Musk stopping bullets. Oh, my God. 560 00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:49,000 The last thing I'll say on it is if you've ever watched Ready Player One, I'm pretty sure you have you have the possibility of instead of the virtual reality device. 561 00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:54,000 Maybe that's just what it becomes. I just don't like that thought. 562 00:59:54,000 --> 01:00:03,000 Does that it's just going to be like Master Chief with tits out and just weird shit going on and furries everywhere. 563 01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:07,000 It's going to be weird. It's going to be a lot of weird. 564 01:00:07,000 --> 01:00:10,000 It's just going to be freaky. 565 01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:16,000 And not that it wouldn't be entertaining for a while, but like if it was really like Ready Player One. 566 01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:20,000 God, the amount of people dressed as Mario. 567 01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:24,000 Or currently Luigi. 568 01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:26,000 That's a good one. That's a good one. 569 01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:34,000 That's as close as we could touch to talking about that topic. 570 01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:40,000 Oh, man. Yeah, I think that's a basic armament, a jacket and a suppressed pistol. 571 01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:44,000 We are. We are not touching that topic any more than that. 572 01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:49,000 Nope. For illegal reasons, we are not discussing that at all. 573 01:00:49,000 --> 01:00:53,000 Between that and the drones, we got enough recent stuff to talk about. 574 01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:59,000 Oh, God, the drones. We're going to we're going to touch those intimately soon. 575 01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:01,000 You had to break out the saxophone. Oh, no. 576 01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:07,000 And the lube, we're going to we're going to touch and go deep on those. 577 01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:12,000 Could you make it any weirder? Oh, I could. It's not a challenge. 578 01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:19,000 No. Yeah, I feel like that kind of wraps up anything else you had for this topic. 579 01:01:19,000 --> 01:01:21,000 I know we kind of keep saying, oh, yeah, I think we're done. 580 01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:23,000 We keep saying stuff. But just one of those one of those weeks. 581 01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:27,000 I think we're I think we're all wrapped up for life after death, a digital option. 582 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:31,000 So definitely let us know in the comments how you guys like this episode. 583 01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:35,000 If any questions, comments, concerns, you know, any criticisms or anything like that. 584 01:01:35,000 --> 01:01:39,000 I know a couple of times you probably kind of tease what our next episodes are going to be. 585 01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:43,000 Feel free to leave us in the comments section. Any other topics you guys have watched to discuss? 586 01:01:43,000 --> 01:01:50,000 I know we're definitely on that when you're saying comments, the socials are still in progress. 587 01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:55,000 The YouTube channel is able to have comments put on it. 588 01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:58,000 If you want to go there and leave some or you can send us an email. 589 01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:02,000 Now we consume it. Gmail dot com. 590 01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:05,000 We'd be happy to get back to you there. 591 01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:11,000 But until the socials go live and we have the discord put out for everybody to use, 592 01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:17,000 it will probably be launched on YouTube along with the socials first. 593 01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:21,000 And then once everything else is live, we'll tell you here. 594 01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:26,000 Absolutely. And that's my fault for socials being a little bit later. I did a whoopsie. 595 01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:30,000 So well, that and the validation verification process is broken. 596 01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:34,000 So, yeah, that was really weird. It's been a pain in the butt for whatever reason. 597 01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:38,000 And I don't know why. Yeah. But we'll figure that out. 598 01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:42,000 But yes, we'll get there. Oh, absolutely. But yeah, we'll have socials up soon. 599 01:02:42,000 --> 01:02:46,000 We have everything else up soon. You know, feel free to let us know where you're watching from. 600 01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:50,000 If you have any problems, any issues, any questions, comments, concerns, constructive criticism, let us know. 601 01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:56,000 And thank you all so very much for listening. And we will catch you next week. See you then.