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Good morning, good afternoon, good evening to all you green-eyed fiends and welcome to

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Fiendish and Friends episode three. Real money, real tokens, real talk. Fiendish and Friends,

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what a catchphrase. Thank you, John Galt, for your Fiendish and Friends Caphras competition entry

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and congratulations on winning 80,228 FURU, worth around 0.11 BCH or 60 bucks. We wish you

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loads of fun playing some prediction bets on BCH Guru. This week, Fiendish and Friends are running

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a new competition for a chance to win a big stash of up to 40,000 Fiendish Emerald. Win 5,000 Fiends,

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you are live on Fiendish and Friends episode three at the snapshot, which is a random time during the

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episode. A screenshot of all participants will be taken to win it. Win 20,000 Fiend by listening

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to Fiendish and Friends episode three for the entire live episode and double your bonus,

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double your Fiendish Emerald reward by liking and retweeting this Fiendish and Friends space

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before the end of the show. It's been a week since last time. Now here's a rundown of the weekly news.

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Cauldron Swap's Abra update goes live. Cauldron is a BCH-based decentralized exchange or DEX

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where you can discover many of the tokens and coins BCH has to offer. The update brings a

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fresh layout and improved visualizations to the site, making it easier than ever to track your

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favorite tokens, including Yield Monitor and easy view of token transactions. With Cauldron in mind,

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Fiendish Token rose up a place on the Cauldron Token leaderboard, jumping over a fifth of gaming

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and into fifth position. How ironic. Shout out to David Chateau, founder of AFOG. We love you.

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But that was yesterday and since then, AFOG's came back with a vengeance and has reclaimed the lead,

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moving up to number four spot, leaving Fiendish Token back at number six. Touche. For those

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wondering what this is all about, the Fiendish Token is an integral part of the Fiendish and

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Friends ecosystem that supercharges the community growth through social games, exclusive access to

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goodies and services, and can be traded for either BCH or the most important asset of all time.

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One Fiendish Token is backed by a minimum of one minute of Fiendish services, consultation,

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expertise and fun. Available over at Cauldron Swap, check the comments for links.

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Chipe from the Bitcoin Cash News and founder of the BCH Foundation has reached 71% of his funding

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goal of 120 BCH to continue his efforts in the ecosystem. More info coming up later directly

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from the horses, or better said, cat's mouth, as Chipe joins us to discuss all his work and efforts

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to help the ecosystem and to learn a little more about his fundraiser. Peter Reisen, chief scientist

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of Bitcoin Unlimited, has confirmed he will be a speaker at BCH Blitz Conference in Slovenia, May

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2025. Exciting. Tickets for the ultimate P2P Cash Conference of the year do not go on sale until

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January 2025. Make sure you set a reminder and get yours before they all sell out. Fiendish and Friends

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makes it into the BCH News again. With over 400 people tuning in into episode two, if you didn't

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manage to listen live, no worries, we have your back. Fiendish and Friends is recorded and all

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episodes are available on your favourite podcast platforms such as Spotify, Amazon Music, Apple

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Podcasts, Samsung Podcasts, Pandora, Visa, amongst many others. We are available on YouTube, just

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search for Fiendish and Friends and you'll find us. So if you can't stay for all the fiendishly

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delicious information today, you can always catch up afterwards at your convenience. And don't forget

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to share with your family, your friends, your enemies, your frenemies and anyone that wants

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to keep up to date with the coolest, the hottest Freedom Tech information and money and finance news.

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On today's episode we have joining us Claude from BasePoker to discuss what their platform offers

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and why BCH is their default currency of choice. Milan Deride, sorry Milan Deride if I'm

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pronouncing that correctly, formerly known as Mira Hurley joins to talk about the importance of P2P

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cash, NanoGPT, and what Bitcoin Cash would need to offer to get him to drop everything and become

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a green Bitcoin advocate. Chi P from the Bitcoin Cash News and founder of the BCH Foundation is

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with us to talk about all the things he is up to supporting Bitcoin Cash and his current FUNme

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fundraiser. That was the news. So let's get the party started and give a big warm welcome to our

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first speaker Claude from BasePoker. Hi Claude and welcome to Fiendish and Friends.

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Now what if you're there you have to press the unmute button so that we can hear you.

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It seems like Claude is having some issues with his mic.

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Milan can you hear me? Yep, yeah. Okay good just to make sure that so

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Just to make sure you didn't have to do that entire intro all over again.

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That wouldn't be fun. Okay well hopefully Claude will be able to figure out his problems that he's

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having with Twitter. So we'll move on to our next guest who's come on who we know has can work the

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microphone so please welcome Milan formerly known as Mira Hurley which many of you will probably know

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Nano Advocate and Nano GPT Developer. Milan welcome to Fiendish and Friends. Thank you I think you

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were close with my name by the way but it's a very difficult name it's Dutch so it's not very easy

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to pronounce for people who don't speak Dutch I think. Then could you say your name in four so

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we can hear and maybe I can try getting it right. In Dutch it would be Milan de Rede

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and I see Rob who I know is Dutch so he will be able to pronounce it but for the rest yeah

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Milan or Milan or Milan de Rede everything works I'll accept anything that sounds remotely like my name.

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Fantastic so you're pretty easy going then. Yeah yeah have to be with such a name like

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going abroad is not easy. Yeah sure so I actually live in Germany so I'm used to people calling me

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me by all kinds of different pronunciations for my name and I'm also very accepting of that so for me

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Dutch and German isn't too wide-angle in the end so yeah should be able to pronounce it better.

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Milan before we discuss PTP Cache and the Mira Hurley backstory for those that are listening

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and don't know you would you like to introduce yourself just give a bit about who you are what

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you do and why you're so active in this space. Yeah sure so I'm Milan obviously I've been

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active in crypto since 2012 back then it was only bitcoin of course my activity in crypto is sort of

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wax and waned I guess but have been more active since 2017-18. I then joined the Dutch Central Bank

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around the same time so I have some experience sort of in the system and in the crypto ecosystem

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and then quit the central bank about two and a half years ago nowadays I run a website which

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accepts crypto and which is probably one of the bigger use cases for at least nano but also we

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have a lot of bitcoin cash and other cryptocurrency users essentially it's a way to access all of the

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AI models and pay using crypto so it's better for privacy you can deposit small sums and just not

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need to have a subscription so yeah that's what I'm working on nowadays I am currently in or close

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to Singapore so I am Dutch but currently not in the Netherlands so for me it's actually 8 pm at

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the moment but yeah that's my my short background. Okay that's great thank you so yeah we've got

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someone who was an insider working in the the banking industry so trying to make changes from

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within which I like very much the idea. So I'd love to know what got you so excited invested in

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cryptocurrencies what kickstarted it all off? So what initially kickstarted it was very simple I

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played this online game and we needed to transfer value sometimes internationally because we played

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this in a team and sometimes I'd be paying people sometimes I would be getting paid and someone at

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one point was like oh we can do this with bitcoin because paypal fees are high and back then it was

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just this sort of funny money right like no one took it very seriously but it was fun to play

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around with and send to each other so that was sort of my first contact with crypto with bitcoin

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at the time and then I think I started taking it more seriously around 2016-2017 because it was

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becoming clear that it could actually be very important for the world to have a store of value

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and a medium of exchange that was decentralized instead of relying on inflationary currencies.

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I've always been interested in economic systems it's why I worked at the central bank

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and then working at the central bank you sort of see the other side of the story and that only got

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me more interested in it but I would say initially I started using crypto. Just thinking about that

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sorry could you go a little bit more into what was the other side of the story?

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For those who are very strongly into fiat to call it to give it a name,

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central bankers have a very strong opinion generally on how money should work and on why

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inflation is important, why we need to have centralized money systems and why something

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like crypto is such a bad idea. So it was very interesting for me because at the time I was

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already very active in crypto and discussing on Twitter, on Reddit. So most of the arguments I

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was having on Reddit and Twitter went way deeper than just like is deflation bad or is inflation

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good? They just went way deeper into sort of consensus systems and all that kind of stuff and

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then you see the other side of the equation which is the central bank who literally hadn't even

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reached step one yet of maybe a decentralized fixed supply currency can be good. They were

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very strongly against even that sort of first principle that we have in crypto. So yeah for

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me it was very interesting to see the dichotomy between those two worlds. Yeah for sure.

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I think you probably have more interesting insights than many in the crypto world. So

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I mean this is an interesting discussion. I'd like to come back to this thinking about inflationary

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and what benefits deflationary currencies have. Before we go on though I just really would love to

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know the story. So you've come out now with your real name and we know you now as Milan

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but many of us in the community have had conversations with you over Twitter, myself included

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under the alias of Mira Hurley. So why is it anonymous? Why the name of Mira Hurley and

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what's the story behind that? Yeah so it's very strongly linked to the central bank story because

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if you work at the central bank and you want to discuss crypto there is really no upside at all

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to using your own name because if I would argue against central banks then it would kind of be

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used by people in crypto at some point. You know if I disagree too strongly with what Bitcoiners say

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they would be like okay I'll reach out to the central bank and if I was arguing for a specific

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crypto it would always just be like oh you're a central bank shill right you're like trying to

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infiltrate the crypto system and pushing for this centralized currency which must be centralized

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because you work at the central bank and you must agree with everything they do. So there was very

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little to gain from using my own name so I decided to go anonymous and used this person does not

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exist.com to generate an image or like a picture of a person and I thought she looked very Canadian

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so I just used the redim name generator to get a Canadian name and that was Mira Hurley that's how

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Mira was born. Yeah and I understand you know many people were very disappointed when they found out

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that they couldn't marry Mira Hurley is that correct? Yeah I've had a few reactions which

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were like that's such a shame you know she seemed like wife material and honestly a few

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fair reactions which was like there are so few women in crypto I was hoping this was one of the

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few who was actually a woman but unfortunately no so yeah definitely had a few people disappointed.

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That's actually one of the things I said I was the host of BCH 2022 conference in Sinkits and

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Navis and one of the things I said there was we know we've made it we know it's no longer early

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when the room's full of women and that was why you know Mira Hurley was quite obviously

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very knowledgeable in crypto quite technical so we made some bets there and some assumptions

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that this is a man but you know I mean it's nice you know of course it's nice if there were more

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women in crypto we do have some in BCH but predominantly it's men and now with the loss

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of Mira Hurley we've lost another potential female in the crypto circles but we're glad to have you

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Milana and it's great that you're now honest about who you are and you feel that you are able to

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to come out and you know lose that anonymity that you had under Mira but that's an interesting

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question though what made you ditch that anonymity and what made you go public?

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Yeah so first of all I was just thinking we do have some women in crypto because at the Nano

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Foundation George is one of the two directors and she's a woman definitely not a fake woman

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I've seen her on enough video calls to be able to confirm but what made me ditch Mira was

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essentially I didn't have strong reasons anymore to stay anonymous because I wasn't working at

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the central bank anymore so that reason was kind of gone and also Nano GPT has been growing like

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really fast fast enough that we had to start a company for it and starting a company means you

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enter all of these public registries and then you're in there with your own name your full name

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even address and stuff I think so my anonymity was gone anyway and everyone knew that Nano GPT

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was linked to Mira but then if people look up Nano GPT and they see not Mira as a name but they see

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Milan as a name then it's going to be quite obvious anyway so I figured okay I have some

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upsides from no longer being anonymous I can do this kind of stuff I can join podcasts I can

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join conferences all that kind of stuff and you know I'm going to be doxxed anyway by anyone who

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like makes any sort of attempt so might as well yeah definitely I mean it has some advantages too

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right I mean I was anonymous in the the community for for quite a while using different aliases

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and that has these advantages as I'm sure you are aware it's there's certainly there's some

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disadvantages coming out too but coming out allows for these sort of experiences talking on podcasts

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showing your face which you know we're not doing right now in spaces but but but when you have got

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your face out there and people can see my face for example speaking at conferences of course it helps

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greatly in you know making that connection and people start thinking okay this is real

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as opposed to just anonymous people online just a question about that so since coming out from

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behind your pseudo anonymity what have been the biggest changes for you and overall was that

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change was it positive or negative and what you know what you consider your mission with p2p cash

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so I think the biggest change has probably been these podcasts and streams and spaces and whatever

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you want to call it which I always wanted to do but I was never able to obviously so I've joined

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quite a few now and I honestly I really like doing it so that's been a a big positive change I think

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aside from that honestly the change has not been that big I don't feel like people treat me that

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differently now so yeah in that sense it's it's mostly just being able to do more stuff

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which you know I think is only a positive but I haven't noticed it in many other ways also because

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some people who were like close to me in the crypto space did already know so for them it

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wasn't any sort of surprise but yeah the the podcasts have been a big plus

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yeah and I've seen you've been on a few one of the ones in closer to home was with Jeremy from the

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Bitcoin Cash podcast and it was really interesting you know because I said we've had some interactions

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over the past and to finally be able to see the the name the person behind this account it's

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it's very interesting it's very very cool so I understand that you're against the main banking

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proposition this is one of the things that I've heard you talk about that inflation is good and

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deflation is bad so this is something you're against and I'd love to go into the thoughts here

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with your experience you've been working in the banking industry and you have understanding of

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money so from your perspective why do you think that inflation isn't a good thing and what makes

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deflationary currencies such as nano and Bitcoin Cash a better alternative?

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Yeah so I think inflation is kind of a distorting force so the idea behind inflation of course is

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if you have inflation then you incentivize people to spend their money which is good for the economy

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we keep money flowing all that kind of stuff but also in a way it's a very hidden sort of tax right

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it's if you have two percent inflation that's two percent tax on everyone who's holding money

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and those who are holding cash or holding like direct money instead of stocks or shares or

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whatever are usually those who don't have all of all that much in assets like if you're really rich

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you're not going to be holding it in cash you have stocks so you're not impacted by the inflation

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it's mostly the poorer people who get impacted by it more I think so I think it's a very unfair tax

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I like if you want to have a wealth tax I think that should be democratically decided and then

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you can decide how you want to do it exactly but not this sort of broad ranging regressive sort of

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tax that is undemocratic to be honest because central banks are not democratically chosen

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so yeah I I don't think it's a good idea to have it I also think the issues with deflation or with

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fixed supply are kind of overstated because so it's a funny story I actually told this at

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breakfast this morning I used to teach sort of after school class economics when I was in high

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school and I would have to explain to people like okay this shirt will be cheaper next year so then

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you postpone your purchase right because it's cheaper in a year so then you get more value for

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your money and they were just like no I would still get the shirt now because I want to have

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the shirt and I feel like that's the case for a lot of stuff where it's not so much that people

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are actually going to wait with their purchases because you still need food you still need to pay

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for your rent you still need to pay for a lot of stuff it's not like it's an option not to pay

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not to pay so I feel that argument is kind of overstated to be honest and oh sorry and I

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honestly don't think it's such a big deal like it's already the case that we could wait with

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a bunch of purchases and get stuff cheaper but you want to have the newest phone every time it comes

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out you want to have I don't know a new tv instead of the one the one that was like one year old

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so I think it's a massive overstatement that people have like that people need to be incentivized to

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spend I think the reverse is kind of true I think as a merchant we prefer accepting crypto because

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we prefer to hold crypto so we could accept fiat like dollars or euros but then we would want to

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swap it into crypto because every day we hold euros or dollars we're getting the base so we

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prefer to hold crypto and then if you pay us in fiat we have to convert it into crypto so it's a

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lot more efficient for us to just like accept crypto directly and then you know if it's more

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efficient to accept crypto directly for the merchant then why not also spend your crypto

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or be incentivized to spend your crypto with a small discount or whatever like it makes no sense

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to have something as a store of value swap it into fiat that's debasing the entire time to

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pay someone who's then swapping it back it's far more efficient to just use the money that's also

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a strong store of value on sort of both sides of the equation so yeah I'm rambling a bit no it's

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great I just don't think inflation is necessary it's great and to be honest this is a topic that

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interests me greatly so I studied economics and so I have a background in understanding about

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monetary policy and why certain choices are made and you know thinking about the time limits of

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this basis and the other people we've got on this is a conversation that I could I'm pretty sure I

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could have quite a lot of enjoyment talking about with you for many hours you said that one of the

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things I um a point that I really like on uh that I really like is that inflation is a regressive tax

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and this is something that's because it's not considered a tax uh people really like don't

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don't understand what that means but it is as regressive as a tax because it affects those

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it affects those without assets without shares without things that are buoyed by regression by

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inflation it affects them the most so the person that's living from wage to wage them

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impacted the most by inflation and they'll never be able to afford a house and they'll be able to

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afford to get capital to actually get out of that and the people that are most benefited by inflation

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are those with huge amounts of capital because the capital price is buoyed by inflation you know that's

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why the price of gold continues to go up um would it be going up if we had a deflationary currency

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no um and and so it's it's a tax that really punishes those at the bottom uh the hardest

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which you know whether you're left or right this seems like something we could be united against

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it that this is a bad bad form of tax whether you're for taxes or not this is not a good form

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of tax but the other point that you touched upon which I really like is you know thinking about

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gdp so the idea of inflation is to increase expenditure increase gdp and the thing to counter

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that is well the argument is we consume so much and therefore we damage the planet and with

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inflationary currencies we consume more we buy that crap thing because our the value of our money

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is going down and so rather than saving and buying what we really want we spend quicker and more

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frivolous um and so as an understanding actually how gdp is calculated i'm quite of the mind that

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if people were to spend less because of an inflationary uh sorry a deflationary currency

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so they were to rather save to not buy that new phone every year but to save and spend on the

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things that are the highest quality and the most value for them because if they don't buy that

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shitty phone this year they can buy the best one next year then the gdp will go down right technically

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the gdp must be going down but the wealth of the individual will go up because the idea that gdp

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equals wealth is nonsense it's it's just an accounting game um so it's really really interesting

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and i think on this particular point we're we're very aligned and it makes a lot of sense why you're

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into deflationary currencies into cryptocurrencies such as nano or bitcoin cash and but just to keep

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you know so maybe we could have that conversation and go into some more depth in a in a bit of a

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wider talk milan because that is really interesting i'm sure many people on the on the listening will

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find that interesting but moving on one of the services you created is nano gpt so can you tell

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us a bit what this service offers and what benefits it has over using other ai implementations

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uh yeah sure so nano gpt is essentially a place where we collect all of the ai models in one place

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so really literally all of them so it's chat gpt clod grok perplexity the open source models

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anyone you can think of and instead of having a subscription to one or multiple of those providers

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we just let people use whatever they want and only pay for what they use there's no subscription

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there's no sort of um monthly fees or anything it's just you do a prompt and you pay for the prompt

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which is on average about one cent it depends very much how big the prompts are and what model you're

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using but essentially we wanted to create a way that anyone could have access to the top models

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without needing a subscriptions but also without giving up all of this private information because

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usually for the top models you get a subscription which you get with a credit card which is linked

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to your name you have to input all of this personal information it's honestly a privacy nightmare i

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think because many people share their deepest secrets with all of these models it's like their

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medical history or you know things they're uncertain about or you know anything really people

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really talk a lot to these models i would prefer it if my prompts and everything i ask these ai's

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is not directly linked to my name like it's a sort of honeypot for hackers that's just waiting to be

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attacked i think and what we do is essentially we give you actual privacy so there's no need to

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even create an account you can just visit our website deposit some bitcoin cash nano whatever

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you want to use and start using these models and we don't care who you are we don't send any of

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your personal information honestly also because we don't have any of your personal information

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to these model providers so we try to give people as good privacy as is possible with these models

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all of the conversations and the prompts are only stored on your own device we do not store anything

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so yeah we think it's a great way for people to be able to access all these models even if you have

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just 10 cents to spend you can just put some onto nano gpt get a few prompts to these top models

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we know of people that literally have only spent five cents and that like messages saying it had

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been very helpful for medical stuff or for reviewing a program or all kinds of stuff

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so yeah it feels like we're doing some good we're sort of opening up access to these models to more

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people but uh yeah that's an LGBT in a nutshell we also do image generation but uh that's a whole

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other subject that's great so what i'm hearing is non-kyc and pay as you go which i'm sure will make

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many people in the audience are very happy because kyc is a big topic that most people in the crypto

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community are very unanimous about like it's awful and you should be able to interact with the

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internet and do things in a way that is anonymous and not linked to your name thanks for that it's

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great so what made you choose the coins that you did that you accept for nano gpt so i know one of

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them you accept bitcoin cash which is great for bitcoin cash units so what made you choose that

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coin or any of the others for nano gpt to support yeah so we obviously started with nano because i

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honestly just think it's the best medium of exchange series i also think it's the best

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store of value we use it as our store of value and it's just really easy for payments i have

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been playing around with it before so i knew how to use it my co-founder was also big into nano so

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that one makes a lot of sense i think and then when we were deciding to add a second coin

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it was honestly more of a gut-based thing i would almost say than an actual analysis i interact with

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bitcoin cash people quite a bit on twitter they're always super nice they're very genuine i think in

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wanting to be able to use crypto as money rather than you know being into just a store of value or

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gambling or whatever so it was more of a like this seems like a good group a good group or community

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to try and integrate with so let's add bitcoin cash and see how it goes so we add a bitcoin cash

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next i honestly think that's been a great idea because we had super helpful people to help us

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with the implementation we used prompt cash but anytime we like ran into an issue or needed

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testers there were like 10 people helping us so that was really great and the entire bitcoin cash

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community has given tons of feedback like literally earlier today again there was someone

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giving feedback where i'm like yep that's we really need to add this that's a good idea

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so yeah we've been very happy to to have bitcoin cash on the platform and then after that we just

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and then after that we just sort of looked at bitpay what is used most on there so i think next

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up we added litecoin we also added banano in between because it's a nano fork it actually has

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a pretty big community and then we just sort of went down the list so monero is is used a lot and

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then we started adding bitcoin uh solana the eth eth l2s all that kind of stuff and yeah i think

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by now we cover most of the sort of actually useful payment cryptos yeah yeah definitely

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there's a quite a long list there and i think this is really good and speaks to what i understand

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about you that you're not a maximalist you're just looking to get uh pdp cash out there and having

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all these different coins being able to use your service um must be much better for you as a

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business because then you're not penciling yourself into just one community you can tap into everything

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which makes me interested i mean can you say is it possible to say which communities are using nano

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gpt the most i'm guessing nano is in place one that would be the the logical assumption

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is that the case and what then would be the the second largest used currency for using your tools

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yeah so nano indeed is the largest which yeah obviously makes sense we're going to release

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stats on which coins are on sort of the ranking of which coins are used most in two days because

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then we have data for a full month for november many of these coins we only added in october or

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start of november but so bitcoin cash was always the second biggest and i was actually looking at

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it earlier today but it's sadly been overtaken by monero so right now it's nano then monero and i

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believe it's still bitcoin cash after that one but i haven't done like a deep analysis on it this is

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just volume based so it might be that there are more bitcoin cash payments but they're just smaller

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amounts i'm going to look into it in two days to release this the statistics on it we think it

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would be useful also for others who implement crypto payments to have a sort of second opinion

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on bitpay because as some have said bitpay is maybe a little biased so we're hoping we can

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release a list as well and show sort of which currencies are actually used and then you know

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when other merchants start considering it they can just look at our list and be like okay

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maybe don't implement dogecoin because it's actually not used so much sadly but maybe focus

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on you know actual payment cryptos and it's true it's a discussion that's having earlier you can

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see on dogecoin they have huge amounts of transactions on chain but just like with

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liquidity of tokens or even cryptos you know these online transactions don't necessarily

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mean that there's actually real usage of it it's very something that's very easy to manipulate to

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get people to sort of fomo into that yeah it's really really interesting information insights

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and you know i do hope i think that you will see a good amount of bitcoin cash usage because even

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if you're a nano proponent and even in the end of the back end it gets swapped into nano from a you

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know if you believe in bitcoin cash if you believe in the currency a coin is money then you're using

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it for a service or a good and however that person uses that money is none of your concern

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so if you are interested in using ai without kyc then it's a really good service to spend

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some bitcoin cash on so a biggest question i'm guessing can i add one thing sorry sorry

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i can i add one thing i'm looking at our dashboard really quick to to try and figure it out it turns

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out it's bitcoin cash is being used more than it was it's just others have grown quicker i think

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uh so it's not like the the the amount of bitcoin cash is decreasing it's just since we've added

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other coins they're also being used a lot okay that's interesting um i need to start yeah yeah

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so it's still a good amount of bitcoin cash usage it's just uh also a good amount of other coin

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usage which is nice for us it's great for you and it'd be great information for the community to be

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able to look at that just to see get an idea of which communities are spending their currencies

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and their cryptos um yeah so um milan a question for our viewers likely be from the p2p cash coins

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that are out there such as bitcoin cash and all the others what is it that made you choose nano

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as your coin of choice you didn't already mention a few a few points there but maybe you could just

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go into a bit more detail there why nano yeah so for me um i could make it a very long story or

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very short i'll try and make it a bit shorter i think what you want in money is for it to be

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quickly uh confirmed like quick to transfer and you want it to be cheap to transfer and you want

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it to be scalable and i think we can all agree those are like the important aspects and then

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bitcoin cash does very well on those but i honestly think nano does best because it's like literally

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instant it's 400 milliseconds it's zero fees now and always and it scales very easily it's like it

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has no inbuilt restrictions it's just the further the hardware scales uh the more transactions it

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can do per second so as money honestly it's very hard to beat instant zero fees and scalable i think

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and then for the store of value aspect i see some issues with bitcoin and with proof of work

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and that i think mining tends to centralize over time i also have some issues with the security

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budget in bitcoin i think that's slightly different in bitcoin cash but yeah i think

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many crypto tend to centralize over time which is the opposite of what i want from my

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decentralized currency whereas in nano all of the incentives are to decentralize so everyone who

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holds nano has an incentive to help decentralize the network the chain so for me it would be like

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a lot easier if i believed more strongly in say bitcoin cash or bitcoin or whatever because

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obviously nano is a lot smaller right now but it's just really difficult for me to find something

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that works as well as nano and that i can believe in as strongly for the long term as nano so yeah

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just want to say i'm not a maxi like we accept many coins and i think many coins work really well

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but for me nano just is difficult to beat yeah that's fair points so just you know just thinking

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about the three key points you said so that it's instance this is also something if you've used

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bitcoin cash anyone that's out there so i send money from one wallet to another that's also it

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is instance you know it's literally when i click the send button it receives on the other side so

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i think we're pretty comparable in that with the scaling as well this is a critical point and

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and there was a difference between btc btc which of course has just hobbled its scaling it won't

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scale and the other extreme which is bsv which is let's just you know create terror blocks and

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whatever which of course leads to huge centralization and bch currently has got an

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algorithm called abla the adaptive block limiting algorithm which actually scales with the technology

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so as as people are using the blocks and filling them up within a certain rules the the block size

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grows where nano does win of course is the fact that it's free it doesn't cost ace anything at

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all so bitcoin cash is a fraction of a cent so i think you can send roughly about 10 transactions

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currently for one cent which for me you know when i think of bank usage and what i have to pay for

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my bank fees every month to have a bank card this is more than reasonable to be paying for security

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but i'll give you that you know nano doesn't cost the user even a fraction of a cent for for

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sending so when you know you've said just now you're not a maximalist and i think this is a

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very interesting part of you you said this also on the bitcoin cash podcast and that nano is simply

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the best coin in your mind with that in mind milan what would bitcoin cash have to change for you to

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think that bch was the best p2p coin in the market yeah so the answer will probably be similar to

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with jeremy then so i think in terms of using it as money you're right the differences are not

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that big although i think the feeling of zero fee is just a lot better than any fee at all it's also

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a lot easier to to develop with in a way but the differences are not that huge there i think for me

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the differences are bigger on the store of value side just because i find it hard to convince myself

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that mining does not centralize over time like there are economies of scale in mining especially

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in asic mining never sure if i pronounce this correctly especially in asic mining there just

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are economies of scale and then if you have economies of scale you have the big miners

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getting ever bigger that does not reassure me that consensus stays decentralized and i'm not even

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talking about mining pools it's just the actual miners underlying the protocol or underlying the

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hash rate becoming ever bigger and more concentrated i find that a pretty bad long-term incentive

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so that would be the primary thing that would need to change i think for me to want to switch

387
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:18,800
but then that is so inbuilt in how proof of work chains work and proof of stake to an extent

388
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:24,320
that i think that is really difficult to change also and i think nano is actually the only one

389
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:29,360
probably that has actually solved that with proper incentives for people to decentralize

390
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:35,040
and i think that makes it special more so than the transactions like transactions like let's be

391
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:39,280
honest it's really fun to send something to someone have them get it instantly and be like

392
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:45,440
zero fees paid but it's more of a party trick in a sense because you know you can do that with bank

393
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:51,200
transactions nowadays as well in most countries anyway or in developed countries i guess

394
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:57,200
that is not sort of the competitive advantage in the long run i think i think the long-run advantage

395
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:02,400
is the store of value decentralization aspect yeah and i would definitely agree with the

396
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:08,400
decentralization point if something is not if the cryptocurrency isn't decentralized or if it

397
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:14,560
at any point will centralize to the point that it's broken or it's truly centralized then

398
00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:19,520
then it's game over then we've just replaced the banking system with banking system you know 2.0

399
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:25,280
you say you're not a max minis and i and i believe that and you know as i understand you would

400
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:31,600
happily use another coin if it was proved in your mind to be better than nano i hear your arguments

401
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:36,800
and to be honest i i would quite love to spend uh you know some time delving into that just you

402
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:42,320
know just an episode where we can look into those the the pros and cons of proof and stake and

403
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:46,640
uh proof of work because i think we would have a really fruitful conversation i have a different

404
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:53,200
opinion than you um but you know so those arguments are good but if but it sounds like

405
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:57,680
you know you are someone that is willing to listen to alternative takes as you have been

406
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:01,680
doing over the last few years and that's why you've become stronger proponent of of nano

407
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:06,480
um but of course the only way you can shift your perspective anywhere else is by listening to

408
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:14,320
to such takes and we've got the ultimate p2p cash conference of the year in my mind uh next may

409
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:20,400
uh bliss 2025 so it's in slovenia um is there any chance that we would see you at such a conference

410
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:24,560
where you get to meet the bitcoin cash developers and lots of the people actually working on the

411
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:29,360
protocol people working on products is there any chance of seeing uh yourself at such a conference

412
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:34,800
yeah so i think was it you or someone else who mentioned it to me

413
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:36,720
it'd be me i'm shilling out because i

414
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:45,360
oh nice okay so i already have it in my agenda for may 13 to 15 just to see if i can uh like if i

415
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:50,640
can make it but if i remember correctly i have something else at the time as well but i cannot

416
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:57,680
find it in my agenda so you're waiting for the good excuse no no my my girlfriend is way more

417
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:02,160
structured than i am so i have to ask her what's actually going on uh but no slovenia is pretty

418
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:08,320
close to me so uh yeah honestly sounds fun i like i want to go to more conferences i don't know what

419
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:14,560
bch bliss is like but uh yeah i would definitely go to conferences of other coins than nano so

420
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,680
there's definitely a chance you see me there'd be fantastic if you were there you'd be more than

421
00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:23,360
welcome and uh you know because the the principles that you have are very much in line with what i

422
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,280
understand the bitcoin cash community stands for and i was there at bch bliss uh this year at the

423
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:32,000
start this year um and it was a it was a truly wonderful experience there's lots of great people

424
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:36,800
that really believe in the mission of ptp cash for the world who are doing their best to sort of push

425
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:42,560
that that frontier so maylan if you are able to come um you are you are very welcome and you'll

426
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:49,040
be very warmly received um and and you know i i would love as i said to have a there's so many

427
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:52,000
stuff there's so much stuff that you mentioned that i'd love to go into in more detail but

428
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,160
unfortunately we just don't have the the time today so i'm just going to say it from from my

429
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:01,360
perspective so from freenish and friends we have done quite some research into proof of work versus

430
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:06,000
proof of stake nano being proof of stake bitcoin cash being proof of work and we've come to the

431
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:10,160
strong conclusion that while both have their trade-offs that proof of work offers the best

432
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:16,240
security and protection for some money especially against centralization which is um a fear you know

433
00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:21,040
milan seeing it from a different perspective which you know is also valid but in the worst case where

434
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:26,880
there was a 51 centralization of miners it's always possible to add more mining rigs into the

435
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:32,560
ecosystem to decentralize and allow the network to function as intended so that no payments can be

436
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:39,120
blocked but once someone has 51 of a proof of stake coin such as when two or three large holders come

437
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:45,680
together to form a cartel they control the system for as long as they want and this is just like our

438
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:50,880
current banking system the one that cryptocurrency was designed to replace with a better more

439
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:57,840
efficient decentralized and fairer system and unlike proof of work when proof of stake is hijacked

440
00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:02,080
the fear is the way that i see it is that forking off brings the problems with you

441
00:43:02,720 --> 00:43:07,680
as those entities will still own their 51 percent of the voting supply on the new chain

442
00:43:08,240 --> 00:43:14,160
and this contrasts greatly with proof of work where forking while still incredibly painful

443
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:19,920
as bitcoin cash can contest to it allows for a reset of any co-opting of the network and then

444
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:25,360
followed by regrowth so our position is decentralization and i'm pretty sure Mila

445
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:30,240
and you would agree with this maybe just not the the the way to get there but decentralization

446
00:43:30,240 --> 00:43:37,360
is the key underlining point of cryptocurrency where we will differ is proof of stake for me and

447
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:42,880
for our perspective is simply redoing the current banking system that bitcoin was designed to mostly

448
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:48,000
make redundant to the benefit of almost every person on the planet and the the second point

449
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:52,640
which is important is the needs of people in 2024 are much more than for simply dumb money

450
00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:58,000
which you know we have requirements for direct debits for standing orders for subscriptions

451
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:03,520
for loans digitizing assets or even stabilizing value which is possible on any hedge where you

452
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:10,880
can lock your bch value to things such as gold silver or even btc but that all said the magic

453
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:16,560
of a free market of ideas is there are lots of different implementations and variations of things

454
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:22,320
such as digital p2p cash and different ways of thinking and trying out things that in the

455
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:27,840
competition that comes from that invariably leads to the best possible outcome for the user and for

456
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:34,720
the world so if you find nano interesting check it out give me a line of follow and for all you bch

457
00:44:34,720 --> 00:44:42,160
lovers out there you're all invited to please go and use some of your bch on nano gpt for non-kyc

458
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:49,040
ai services at nano-gpt.com i'll make sure that's also in the comments thank you so much me and

459
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:54,000
for joining today we may be on different teams but i feel very much that we are aligned on the

460
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:59,040
destination and we're looking forward to getting to that destination together under the spirit of

461
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:03,680
cooperation and as i said i would love to have a more in-depth and detailed conversation with you

462
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:08,080
on all of the points we've we've discussed and so much more because i can imagine it being very

463
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:15,120
enlightening even if in the end we don't quite agree on the methods of getting there nice yeah

464
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:21,440
i would love to do that as well and if anyone wants to try nano gpt or nano itself just send me a

465
00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:26,000
message i'll gladly send you some nano otherwise to try with if you don't have any bitcoin cash to

466
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:31,680
put into our website but uh yeah thanks for having me it was fun and i'd love to do the the long term

467
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:36,880
or long form discussion sometimes okay let's let's stay in contact and try and arrange that i think

468
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:41,280
it'd be i think it'd be good if you know of any others to to join in because what this is what i

469
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:45,840
love with the different communities is we may be batting for different teams but um but i've also

470
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:50,160
experienced it from nano is that it's it's a bit different the people there you can have most of

471
00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:54,800
them you can have reasonable conversations with even if there are differences in in the opinion

472
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:59,840
the opinions i think have a lot of validity and they're based on on logic from that person's

473
00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:03,520
perspective so it's really great to have you on here and it's uh it's an it's an honor to have you

474
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:10,320
on here and i i'm really looking forward to having that longer forum for deeper conversation

475
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:19,600
cloud are you able to speak now hello sir can you hear me hey how are you doing i can hear you loud

476
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:26,000
and clear great great i'm doing well how are you guys doing very very good i'm so glad that it's

477
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:35,840
working now um so sorry is it claude or cloud odd claude okay good so yeah claude welcome to

478
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:40,720
finish from friends um i'm sure many people listening and in the bch community have seen

479
00:46:40,720 --> 00:46:46,800
your posts from base poker there's been quite a few adverts over the last few weeks um but maybe

480
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:52,080
you could just give a little introduction about you your company and what base poker has to offer

481
00:46:52,080 --> 00:47:01,280
uh yeah uh great so personally i've been i've been involved with uh crypto and blockchain

482
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:08,640
for a while it's similar to uh milan i i didn't work at the central bank but i used to work for

483
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:17,760
as a consultant for central bank in uh singapore and south korea for a cbdc project actually

484
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:25,600
but it was before i got into the i got into crypto before and then i i sort of the bear market came

485
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:31,440
and i sort of kind of lost the trust in it then i got into the permission chain which is all about

486
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:39,040
cbdc you know depository receipts and all this institutional sort of use cases uh so i worked at

487
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:48,320
so i worked at a company called r3 uh and then i realized that this this thing doesn't work in a

488
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:58,000
permissioned base manner uh it was all sort of the uh just wordplay um so i i left the company and

489
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:04,960
i'm uh i got back to the sort of the real crypto which is permission permissionless uh payment side

490
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:11,280
and uh i founded a company and built a online casino using crypto and then we sold it to a uk

491
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:18,960
company uh after that we were sort of discussing what to do next and i started playing poker

492
00:48:18,960 --> 00:48:26,400
after the acquisition and then i fell in love with it and then i i tried to find uh uh the right

493
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:32,160
product to play using crypto and i i couldn't really find the right one at the time so we

494
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:40,560
we decided to build it uh last year so it's been almost a year we we've been building uh and uh yeah

495
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:46,720
it is fantastic okay that's quite a journey there's a lot more to unpack i look at the time and think

496
00:48:46,720 --> 00:48:52,000
okay i would like to delve in much deeper into that backstory uh such as with the work with the

497
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:59,680
cbdc but um just you said we um so the hints to the fact that it's not just you then behind base

498
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:07,600
poker so my question would be how many people are behind base poker uh we currently have about

499
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:15,120
10 people and including the out sort of outsourcing developers we have about 12

500
00:49:16,720 --> 00:49:23,440
uh yeah it requires a lot of work poker is very complex we didn't even know before we get into it

501
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:29,680
and then we realized that this is this is no this is no joke uh but yeah we're barely barely making

502
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:39,120
it and uh yeah about 10 people okay that that is quite a uh quite a business and just thinking

503
00:49:39,120 --> 00:49:45,760
about at the moment when going on to base poker when you try and when bch is used as a default

504
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:53,040
currency and what made you choose bch from everything that's out there uh bch is the first

505
00:49:53,920 --> 00:50:01,840
sort of non-fiat currency we we have usdt uh well because i have many friends in bch community

506
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:10,880
uh i i've been part of the bch community back in the days actually um i used to host meetups

507
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:16,640
around asia i invited roger veer and and some some other guys too uh i'm a big big believer

508
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:27,120
proponent of big blocks and bch obviously you know uh so follows that trajectory uh yeah and then

509
00:50:27,120 --> 00:50:34,880
and then i remember playing i wasn't a poker player back then i'm still terrible but i i played one

510
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:40,880
one time at at a place called blockchain.poker uh but by the time we started building it was

511
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:47,360
it was shut down so i remember uh i was looking at i was doing some research and then bch community

512
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:54,320
were very missing missing that product they really they very enjoy that product but it's gone so i

513
00:50:54,320 --> 00:51:02,080
just thought that all bch uh communities probably have the similar product experience before so it's

514
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:08,880
it's very easier to to get in and obviously uh zero confirmation micro payment these are very

515
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:17,280
very helpful so uh we actually launched the usdt version first and then bch came later but if you

516
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:23,840
go to our website there are more players more deposits from bch than actual usdt so we kind of

517
00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:32,480
switch the default to bch uh and then usdt is the second currency oh that is great great to hear so

518
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:38,560
that means your bch is the default not out of philosophical reasons but because it's the most

519
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:44,800
used currency on your website yes because when you look at the lobby when you go to the lobby you

520
00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:50,480
have to you have to know how many people are playing and if you have to click bch filter to

521
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:58,320
see how many people play that's that's one step uh more but when usdt player usdt player when

522
00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:05,520
there's no usdt player but when there's like 10 bch players we want to show uh at the first front

523
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:11,600
page oh there you know people are playing so we had to we had to basically make bch's default

524
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:19,840
yeah okay that's um and so how is the growth going with the site how much usage are you seeing is it

525
00:52:19,840 --> 00:52:28,640
where you the level that you're expecting uh it's definitely growing we i think we're adding about

526
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:35,440
five to ten users daily uh but poker is tricky thing a lot of people play poker but they're

527
00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:41,440
a lot of people are not poker players so most of them just deposit and play a little bit and then

528
00:52:41,440 --> 00:52:49,680
withdraw but real poker players uh like people who really enjoy playing poker every day they just come

529
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:57,120
in constantly deposit uh they don't really withdraw money uh they keep playing so we have we have about

530
00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:08,240
120 bch players right now uh so yeah i think deposit amount is going up players number going up

531
00:53:08,240 --> 00:53:16,800
we just i think we didn't tap into the entire entire bch uh community yet but we're trying our

532
00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:24,080
best to to do so yeah okay well come up with some extra information um about this and about how uh

533
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:29,760
some sort of event we're planning to organize to help with this just as a bit of info so yeah you

534
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:32,960
say you're not a great poker player then hey we need to play together right and for some high stakes

535
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:40,960
high stakes i used to play poker semi-professionally um so i actually used to um i used to play uh a lot

536
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:45,600
i was i actually have a really sad story it was also where i you know to as a great reminder that

537
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:50,960
as much skill is in poker there's also a tremendous amount of luck so i actually did a game with um a

538
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:56,800
thousand players it's 999 players it was a low stakes buy-in i come at like 20 bucks or something

539
00:53:56,800 --> 00:54:01,280
but the winner the winner got to go on i can't remember which poker tournament it was this is

540
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:08,560
back in 2008 roughly um but you would get on the on a super yacht where there'd be like the main

541
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:12,640
like world series poker tournament newbie entered in there and i think the cost of getting on that

542
00:54:12,640 --> 00:54:17,440
was about 50 000 or something it was some stupid amount and the prize pot of winning that would be

543
00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:25,280
like you know god knows how many million and i beat 997 of the players and it was just me and

544
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:30,640
the final player and i had all the chips um and they were forced to go all in this is no lie i

545
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:35,520
can't remember the exact amount i think it was 17 but it was somewhere between 13 and 17 like around

546
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:40,320
that times they were forced to go all in because they couldn't cover the big blind and they won

547
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:47,040
every time and then they went on to win and that was that was the point where i was like i'm just

548
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:52,080
going to keep this for fun now this is it's a focus a wicked game it's wicked fun i love it and there

549
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:56,320
is enough skill there to make it interesting but there's enough luck there to uh to make sure that

550
00:54:56,320 --> 00:55:01,200
even the newbs can have some fun there and and sometimes completely obliterate even pro players

551
00:55:02,160 --> 00:55:04,960
so um yeah that was my little my little story

552
00:55:07,360 --> 00:55:14,640
yeah it's poker yeah so yeah currently what are the offers that you're the base poker is

553
00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:20,720
offering to entice people to your site do you still have sorry can can you be any offers or

554
00:55:20,720 --> 00:55:25,440
you know i saw that you were doing an offer that you were giving uh for new new signups there was

555
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:33,920
a a small bonus for signing up or is this something you're still offering uh yeah so anybody who

556
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:41,840
who uh well anybody can dm me dm to the base poker twitter uh anytime i'll give you some bch

557
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:50,560
small amount just to try for for fun about 0.005 bch about two three dollars uh yeah so

558
00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:57,360
yeah that's what we're doing but but we're not doing a lot of sort of heavy uh cost intensive

559
00:55:57,360 --> 00:56:02,480
marketing yet because we don't have the multi-table tournaments yet so once the multi-table

560
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:10,080
tournament comes out we'll be doing a lot of uh free roll you know high gtd uh games going and

561
00:56:10,080 --> 00:56:18,000
that's how that's how usually the most poker sites acquire users it's very hard for a poker site to

562
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:24,640
to sustain with just cash gain so uh yeah tournament mtt is very very important so we're

563
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:29,360
building it i think hopefully it's going to come out at end of this year or early next year

564
00:56:31,440 --> 00:56:37,440
yeah that's exciting it also gives people a chance to enter a game with very low um

565
00:56:38,720 --> 00:56:44,800
upfront fee but with a chance of winning an attractive pot if they're lucky which is it um

566
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:50,320
so yeah for those of you that are listening give a heart or a thumbs up to this particular point

567
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:57,680
who in the audience would like to see a live streamed bch all-stars poker match on base poker

568
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:05,840
we got any hearts any likes for this we've got one one hand up well okay

569
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:10,320
maybe we won't do that well because we're organizing this we've actually got some

570
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:18,560
already uh some bch developers content creators and renowned bch builders that are already really

571
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:24,560
game for this to live stream this um with uh with jeremy from the bitcoin cash podcast and to do this

572
00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:29,680
as a sort of run-up to christmas treat which i think you know can be a lot of fun for the community

573
00:57:29,680 --> 00:57:36,240
it's just all bch's having some fun drinking some whiskey and uh alex i'm sure is going to be there

574
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:42,400
too and uh and playing some poker but it's also a great opportunity to uh advertise yourself a bit

575
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:49,760
based poker and draw some people onto your site um claude just as a quick question because i have

576
00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:54,880
to move on and get cheapy on here to talk about his fundraiser so we've got the hottest p2p cash

577
00:57:54,880 --> 00:58:02,080
conference in may 2025 with bch bliss will we be seeing you or anyone from your 10 stroke 12 man

578
00:58:02,080 --> 00:58:13,600
team uh base poker attending uh hopefully i i would like to be uh there uh if i'm near that that

579
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:20,320
wherever the conference is i'll probably attend i'll be around i i move around a lot so i you know

580
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:26,320
i i go to vietnam i live there for a month i go to bali for two months and stuff like that so if i'm

581
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:32,240
if i'm close there i'll probably fly fly over there and attend it okay we we hope to see you there

582
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:38,160
and anyone else that's listening make sure to join it's it's a real if anyone that loves bitcoin cash

583
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:45,280
it's just a great experience thanks so much claude for joining on today's episode just as a reminder

584
00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:50,240
to our listeners so poker is a game that involves as much chance as does skill hopefully listen to

585
00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:54,240
my story as a sort of a reminder of that so if you're interested in the game and you're interested

586
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:58,320
in my story as a sort of a reminder of that so finish and friend view is the online poker should

587
00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:03,760
be seen as adult entertainment so go and spend some bch and you can have an enjoyable evening

588
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:10,000
playing cards and who knows you might even get your bch back at the end of the night so check

589
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:17,120
out base poker.com i've put links in the comments for all of your online poker needs and base pokers

590
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:23,040
offering means adding yet another bch accepting site and service to the ever growing network and

591
00:59:23,040 --> 00:59:28,960
as a reminder the power and utility of money is exponentially linked to the size of this network

592
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:35,520
so in this regard we are always happy to see new businesses using and accepting bch so thank you

593
00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:41,280
so much claude it was great having you on and on the topic of money now is the time to welcome

594
00:59:41,280 --> 00:59:50,640
our next guest we have got cheapy the founder of the bitcoin cash foundation writer of the bch

595
00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:57,520
weekly news moderator moderator of most well-known bch telegram groups and world famous bch vly

596
00:59:57,520 --> 01:00:02,400
mascot hi gb great to have you on feedish and friends as an official speaker for the very first

597
01:00:02,400 --> 01:00:09,920
time uh hi uh can you hear me i can hear you loud and clear yeah am i coming in stereo so usually

598
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:14,800
on on twitter spaces uh i'm only in the left channel for some reason am i in stereo this time

599
01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:21,200
it's funny because you are on stereo um but when i did the mix last time you were on stereo but

600
01:00:21,200 --> 01:00:28,080
um then it was just in one ear once i'd actually published it so i i i'm guessing that right now

601
01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:34,320
it's in mono and that's why we don't hear yeah so i yeah well we'll find out when it's published on

602
01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:41,520
youtube and on the podcast if so uh apologies for uh people who have uh no hearing in the right side

603
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:51,200
uh or or difficulty so uh i my right ear is not as good as my left ear so uh i i sympathize with you

604
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:56,800
and i'll try to correct it in the future when i joined i was on my phone with my headset but i

605
01:00:56,800 --> 01:01:02,240
couldn't uh become a speaker for some reason uh so i had to switch to the pc which is where this

606
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:07,600
stereo problem comes in but uh thanks for having me on twitter the audities of twitter it's it's

607
01:01:07,600 --> 01:01:14,160
uh lovely to uh talk to you again and i'm uh happy to answer any questions you may have

608
01:01:14,960 --> 01:01:21,040
i may have a few so cheapy you're pretty well known in the bch community nevertheless i imagine

609
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:25,840
there will be some people out there who don't know you on and i think there's probably a lot

610
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:30,480
of people that don't know the full breadth of all the work you're doing so could you just let the

611
01:01:30,480 --> 01:01:37,600
audience know a little bit about who you are and all the activities you're involved in um yeah how

612
01:01:37,600 --> 01:01:46,080
much time do you have um for for a really good in-depth breakdown um i wrote uh my my bitcoin

613
01:01:46,080 --> 01:01:52,800
biography whatever you want to call it it's on read.cash um i've also been on uh the bitcoin

614
01:01:52,800 --> 01:01:57,520
cash podcast with jeremy there's a multiple episodes of me talking about my history there

615
01:01:57,520 --> 01:02:03,920
uh casual bch podcast there's a whole episode of me talking there too but yeah very briefly uh i've

616
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:12,560
i've been in the space since 2011 uh i got my my very first sats from uh gavin's uh faucet

617
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:22,880
um and you know was was was uh not heavily involved until the the split uh when i really felt that uh

618
01:02:22,880 --> 01:02:31,600
things uh you know needed help uh it wasn't i i didn't trust the uh the the miners uh uh and the

619
01:02:31,600 --> 01:02:39,360
core developers to to make uh decisions anymore um and uh so when the fork happened uh i i was

620
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:48,720
you know right on board and even before the fork i i ran uh a node uh uh what's it called now

621
01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:57,120
called now uh that gavin and dagger worked on uh jump in if anybody knows i forget what it's called

622
01:02:57,120 --> 01:03:03,600
now bitcoin xd or bitcoin classic xt xt thank you very much i was thinking bitcoin x but i was like

623
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:11,840
no that's not right uh yes xt um and uh i went to i live in japan and i the very first bitcoin cash

624
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:17,280
conference ever was in tokyo i'd never been to any kind of crypto event or meetup or anything

625
01:03:17,280 --> 01:03:25,280
like that before um and i i thought well i really need to go and and meet some of these people and

626
01:03:25,280 --> 01:03:31,760
and uh you know get get get an idea about what's going on um in the space because

627
01:03:32,640 --> 01:03:38,320
rightfully so i felt like bitcoin the project that satoshi had developed was being hijacked

628
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:44,000
and redirected to something which isn't what i support and what i want for the world um and

629
01:03:44,000 --> 01:03:51,760
that was the first you know meeting of of like-minded uh people uh that i that uh i knew

630
01:03:52,320 --> 01:04:00,000
existed and and of course it was a life-changing experience uh and uh ended up starting the uh

631
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:08,560
osaka bitcoin cash meetup um and uh from from there it has grown over time uh and started doing more

632
01:04:08,560 --> 01:04:15,360
and more things i did uh organized uh when devcon was was here in osaka i organized uh co-organized

633
01:04:15,360 --> 01:04:22,000
i should say the uh you know bitcoin cash devcon after party uh started doing moderation on on

634
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:27,760
telegram because there wasn't really anybody uh in my time zone moderating um started working

635
01:04:27,760 --> 01:04:34,080
with satoshi's angels um they i started off as just english news editor and then they asked me

636
01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:42,000
if i would write the english news um and then of course unfortunately uh they decided to discontinue

637
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:49,200
news activities and i thought it was important enough to carry on uh and so for more than a year

638
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:55,760
now i forget exactly how long it's been i've just been doing it independently uh and uh you know

639
01:04:55,760 --> 01:05:01,200
that sort of went hand in hand oh i guess i you know i should probably talk about the foundation

640
01:05:01,200 --> 01:05:07,440
itself not just my activities but uh uh yeah the foundation uh you know i wrote about that on

641
01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:13,680
read.cash as well check it out uh really just started as because bitcoin cash has nothing official

642
01:05:14,960 --> 01:05:23,200
and yet for the world everyone wants some kind of official contact point or or some official word to

643
01:05:23,200 --> 01:05:32,080
to uh you know give give the give the information from the source right but that's in a decentralized

644
01:05:32,080 --> 01:05:39,120
system like bitcoin cash that's not how it works um but just the the power of an email address

645
01:05:39,120 --> 01:05:46,160
you know cheapy at at uh actually cheap lightning at bitcoin cash foundation dot org uh has a lot of

646
01:05:46,160 --> 01:05:56,000
a lot of power uh behind it um and so if if you know uh cheap lightning at yahoo.com or whatever

647
01:05:56,000 --> 01:06:02,160
emails you and says hey uh we're updating our node you guys should update it yeah i've blocked that

648
01:06:02,160 --> 01:06:08,960
address right right nobody will pay attention to it because who are you and what are you doing

649
01:06:08,960 --> 01:06:15,840
uh but bitcoin cash foundation dot org has has power behind it uh and and it's a it's a contact

650
01:06:15,840 --> 01:06:23,280
and the thing about about a decentralized system um not not just mining but as far as development

651
01:06:23,280 --> 01:06:31,600
etc your proof of work as as a person or an organization etc uh is your reputation and if

652
01:06:31,600 --> 01:06:36,240
you do good work and people trust you then they will endorse you and they will support your work

653
01:06:36,240 --> 01:06:45,120
if you don't do good work well then you will quickly fade away into obscurity um and so i

654
01:06:45,120 --> 01:06:52,800
i never pretend to be you know the official source of of bitcoin cash anything um i am the unofficial

655
01:06:52,800 --> 01:07:01,440
official uh sanitary engineer of the bitcoin cash foundation um well but we're doing the work that

656
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:09,280
no one else wants to but it's important yes um and and so you know for example uh when bitcoin cash

657
01:07:09,920 --> 01:07:17,120
node upgraded last year i sent out literally hundreds of messages and emails to to stakeholders

658
01:07:17,120 --> 01:07:22,560
many of the people in the audience here may have gotten contact me uh contact from me about it as

659
01:07:22,560 --> 01:07:27,680
well uh just to make sure that everyone's on the same same page or at least is notified about what's

660
01:07:27,680 --> 01:07:33,520
going on and then again when there was a bug fix release a few months later i you know i replicated

661
01:07:33,520 --> 01:07:40,240
the whole process over and over again and and hounded organizations as well to get a response

662
01:07:40,240 --> 01:07:47,600
from them because you know it is a bug fix right if you guys don't update your node you may have

663
01:07:47,600 --> 01:07:54,240
some serious problems uh and uh yeah just you know kept hounding them until i finally got a response

664
01:07:54,240 --> 01:08:01,600
uh and uh you know it's just another one of those things that that there is no official body to to

665
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:08,720
take care of uh i of course publish the news there's no official media organization or media wing or

666
01:08:08,720 --> 01:08:14,080
marketing wing or or anything like that so somebody's got to write the news i write the news

667
01:08:14,080 --> 01:08:20,000
other people write the news as well uh there is no official news so uh please subscribe to whatever

668
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:25,040
we really appreciate the news you've got so if anyone's unaware of where to get that news i've

669
01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:30,800
put links under the spaces so you can get that it's also it's in a written format it's in video

670
01:08:30,800 --> 01:08:37,520
format so in any format uh you know that you like you can easily consume um so it's really appreciated

671
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:44,000
yeah i think it's almost uh i don't want to i don't want to say the wrong number but it's

672
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:49,200
it's probably around 15 different platforms where where i publish the news every single week

673
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:56,480
um i write it edit uh film it uh edit it subtitle it you know everything uh all by myself there's

674
01:08:56,480 --> 01:09:03,440
there's uh no assistance involved um and then of course uh you know there's also things like uh

675
01:09:04,640 --> 01:09:10,240
i'm updating uh websites all across the space where they have bitcoin cash information presented

676
01:09:10,240 --> 01:09:15,360
on on their website if it's the wrong logo you know sometimes they they make their own bespoke

677
01:09:15,360 --> 01:09:20,400
handmade thing which nobody can recognize i i fire off a message and like hey guys

678
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:29,200
here are some logos you could use if you want and uh part of that is also managing the coin market

679
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:37,520
cap bitcoin cash page anybody can can submit uh information to it like it's not like i have

680
01:09:37,520 --> 01:09:44,000
exclusive control over it or anything um coin market cap has has a series of forms that you

681
01:09:44,000 --> 01:09:50,240
can use to submit information to you um there's nothing stopping anyone from doing it however

682
01:09:51,360 --> 01:09:56,320
uh the the team at coin market cap probably won't take you seriously if you're bob at yahoo.com

683
01:09:57,520 --> 01:10:03,440
uh they do however know me and they know that the the submissions that i've i've entered uh have

684
01:10:03,440 --> 01:10:13,280
have been reliable and therefore they've accepted them um and absolutely sorry no go ahead and it's

685
01:10:13,280 --> 01:10:17,360
just it's really you know all the work that you're going into there and all the the stuff you're

686
01:10:17,360 --> 01:10:22,880
doing it's like some of it's or is you know people can see such as the news maybe they weren't aware

687
01:10:22,880 --> 01:10:27,520
of all the different formats it's in but all of this work that's in the back end this is stuff that

688
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:32,880
almost no one sees actually um but it's really important and this is what you know is is updating

689
01:10:32,880 --> 01:10:38,560
you know incorrect information on websites the bad logos maybe the bad addresses recommending the

690
01:10:38,560 --> 01:10:46,080
the cash address for example just prevents bch being sent to the wrong chain all of this work is

691
01:10:47,440 --> 01:10:53,280
really important um but you know not very glamorous no one no one gets to see it you

692
01:10:53,280 --> 01:10:57,360
don't get to see uh you know because no one's seeing it then you don't get a pat on the back

693
01:10:57,360 --> 01:11:03,120
to say hey a great job which we'll come to in a second um but just you know that just what you've

694
01:11:03,120 --> 01:11:06,800
done i've stopped you but there's so much here and you're dedicating you know and i know you

695
01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:11,280
personally you know for anyone that's listening you know i would consider cheaply a friend and

696
01:11:11,280 --> 01:11:18,400
i i'm aware of his activities uh not all of them um but a lot of them and i'm always impressed

697
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:23,680
by how dedicated he is to the mission of bitcoin cash and becoming this decentralized currency for

698
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:30,800
the world in like a sentence or two why are you so dedicated what drives you in helping bitcoin cash

699
01:11:30,800 --> 01:11:37,440
and spending so much of your time and energy on this community and project um yeah i think uh

700
01:11:38,560 --> 01:11:46,880
in in a single sentence to change the world uh it may seem uh i don't know uh what's what's the

701
01:11:46,880 --> 01:11:52,640
word i'm awesome amazing the correct way changing the world yes thank you uh it may seem uh uh

702
01:11:52,640 --> 01:12:00,960
uh pithy pithy i don't know something something like that like uh uh you know starry eye starry

703
01:12:00,960 --> 01:12:09,120
eye dreaming or whatever um you know as when i was young uh i i was quite apathetic because i i very

704
01:12:09,120 --> 01:12:14,800
quickly realized that you know voting isn't really going to matter uh my one vote isn't going to

705
01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:20,960
change much if i if i go you know at best if i go to like a town hall meeting i could express my

706
01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:27,040
dissatisfaction with the the angle of the stop sign in the corner or whatever uh and that's not

707
01:12:27,040 --> 01:12:31,920
really going to do much to affect change in a in a meaningful way in the in the world you know

708
01:12:31,920 --> 01:12:40,400
protesting against uh uh you know uh occupy wall street or whatever um certainly could have an

709
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:46,640
effect but again i don't think it's it's going to uh really move the needle nearly as much as

710
01:12:46,640 --> 01:12:53,840
as trying to figure out what what the actual problem behind all of the problems are um and

711
01:12:53,840 --> 01:13:02,480
and when i read about bitcoin i very quickly and clearly saw ah this is a way to actually affect

712
01:13:02,480 --> 01:13:09,040
meaningful change in the world because money is what makes everything go around uh and you know

713
01:13:09,040 --> 01:13:15,280
talking before you talked about decentralization uh you know the the central banks of various

714
01:13:15,280 --> 01:13:20,800
countries have a complete monopoly they're they're completely in control um and there's

715
01:13:20,800 --> 01:13:27,120
nothing you can do to to wrestle uh that control away from them you can't uh you know issue a new

716
01:13:27,120 --> 01:13:33,440
a new currency for for your nation as a as a single individual but the bitcoin movement is is

717
01:13:34,400 --> 01:13:41,920
revolutionizing uh the market and and finance and and just straight up cash for the entire planet

718
01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:50,240
um and and you know just looking at something as simple as as mail right so uh i'm i'm i was i was

719
01:13:50,240 --> 01:13:54,640
born pre-internet and so i wrote letters and postcards and all those other things and then

720
01:13:54,640 --> 01:14:01,280
email came out and i don't remember the last time i physically wrote a letter right uh and

721
01:14:02,080 --> 01:14:08,160
as as we evolve as a society it's really obvious that things are going to get more efficient

722
01:14:08,160 --> 01:14:12,080
they're going to get more decentralized and the world's going to get a lot smaller a lot quickly

723
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:19,120
uh very quickly so obviously money is going to be part of that uh at some point in the future

724
01:14:19,840 --> 01:14:25,680
uh whether you like it or not assuming the human race survives and if you assuming that money is

725
01:14:25,680 --> 01:14:32,000
still a thing that we care about there will be a global currency um and do you want that to be a

726
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:39,840
global concern currency that's uh created and controlled by a handful of people whose whose

727
01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:48,960
motivations you don't understand uh and have no say in or do you want to be part of the revolution

728
01:14:48,960 --> 01:14:54,240
that creates new money for the world and so i know you asked for one sentence but it is changing the

729
01:14:54,240 --> 01:14:57,600
world it's changing the market it's freeing the market it's freeing the world that's it

730
01:14:57,600 --> 01:15:04,000
that was a very long sentence but every single word of it was beautiful so thank you um yeah very

731
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:08,800
aligned so all right let's talk about your your fun me so you've been doing all of this work and

732
01:15:08,800 --> 01:15:13,280
much more um over the last you know several years and i know you've been especially active

733
01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:20,480
over the last 12 months um and as i understand this work has been voluntary so you've you've

734
01:15:20,480 --> 01:15:28,240
put your donation qr code uh in your posts um but overall you know what you what you receive doesn't

735
01:15:28,240 --> 01:15:32,880
even cover the costs what you've actually put out of your own pocket to be able to create all of

736
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:38,720
this content videos and the work that you're doing um which is why you know as i understand

737
01:15:38,720 --> 01:15:44,640
you've you've created a fund me so for those that don't know fund uh fund me dot cash this is a place

738
01:15:44,640 --> 01:15:49,440
where you can set up your particular project um that you want to achieve or whatever you know

739
01:15:49,440 --> 01:15:53,520
you want to raise some money for some particular thing that you want to do or have done and then

740
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:59,280
people get to voluntary uh voluntarily donate to this it reaches its target and then that money

741
01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:05,600
is then free to that person's wallet and cheapie has created such a fun me um so yeah if you could

742
01:16:05,600 --> 01:16:11,840
just discuss a little bit about this like what is your fun me designed for and uh what's the

743
01:16:11,840 --> 01:16:16,480
current status of it and when when's the end date when when do we have to get this over the line by

744
01:16:16,480 --> 01:16:27,040
um so um yeah it's currently about 70 i haven't checked since uh this this space started um it

745
01:16:27,040 --> 01:16:35,440
went over 50 in the first 24 hours which was shocking to me touching uh uh i i feel absolutely

746
01:16:36,240 --> 01:16:41,760
appreciated and validated and and all of those things and i had to be you know i've been i've

747
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:49,200
been kicking around the idea of of fundraising for quite a long time and i to be quite honest i was

748
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:57,680
really fearful that that uh you know it would get like a handful of satoshis and be like thanks

749
01:16:59,200 --> 01:17:05,360
um and and that hasn't been the case at all so i feel uh really good that we've we've you know

750
01:17:05,360 --> 01:17:12,720
rocked uh this hard so quickly uh it ends i believe christmas day uh or maybe the day after

751
01:17:12,720 --> 01:17:22,000
christmas i'm not sure um but uh there's 25 days left um so quite a bit of time but obviously uh

752
01:17:22,560 --> 01:17:29,760
feel free to give me your money as soon as you want give me your money this is the sales pitch

753
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:38,080
of the year extraordinary give me your money so yeah the the fundraiser is at 71.43 percent

754
01:17:38,080 --> 01:17:45,360
completes there's a total of 85.7 bch out of a target of 120 so cheap you know i guess many

755
01:17:45,360 --> 01:17:50,320
people in here would be interested um how many fundraisers have you already done for for bitcoin

756
01:17:50,320 --> 01:18:01,760
cash uh i well uh two or three three technically three uh so i i did a flip starter many years ago

757
01:18:01,760 --> 01:18:06,880
for a project that i was trying to get off the ground called build.cash uh it failed miserably

758
01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:15,360
um and uh i guess at that time i was relatively unknown and so people rightfully thought well why

759
01:18:15,360 --> 01:18:21,360
would i contribute to this uh so that's fair enough um and then when fund me launched i did a very

760
01:18:22,160 --> 01:18:26,800
small test campaign uh that i just called for cat food i think it was about five dollars

761
01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:32,400
uh just just to try out the platform see how it worked and see if if people would contribute

762
01:18:32,400 --> 01:18:39,840
um it also failed um uh which you know doesn't particularly matter you couldn't even get five

763
01:18:39,840 --> 01:18:49,840
bucks yeah well i you know the the expiry time at at the time was uh only in blocks um and i you know

764
01:18:49,840 --> 01:18:55,840
didn't calculate in my brain how many blocks x number of days is um and so it was very short

765
01:18:55,840 --> 01:19:00,480
i think it was less than a week the the campaign and of course at the time nobody knew what fund me

766
01:19:00,480 --> 01:19:07,120
was and of course also many people didn't have uh cash token enabled wallets or or or wallet connect

767
01:19:07,120 --> 01:19:12,160
enabled wallets as well so you know the fact that it failed doesn't matter because it wasn't a serious

768
01:19:12,160 --> 01:19:20,640
thing either but then uh not long after that i i started another fund me campaign just to pay for

769
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:27,760
the pro the pro captcha bot for the bitcoin cash channel which is the main chat on telegram there

770
01:19:27,760 --> 01:19:34,080
was a big uh spam and bot problem and of course because the group is over 3 000 people free tools

771
01:19:34,080 --> 01:19:39,760
uh don't really work anymore so i just fundraised i think it was about a hundred dollars uh just to

772
01:19:39,760 --> 01:19:46,320
pay for the bot and of course once again uh just to give people an opportunity to try out fund me

773
01:19:46,320 --> 01:19:53,600
to try out cash and eyes paytaka zap it uh any of any of the wallets that you could use to contribute

774
01:19:53,600 --> 01:20:00,000
um and i specifically asked whales not to contribute more than a certain low amount of funds

775
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:05,520
because i wanted as many people to have an opportunity to actually try it and see how it works so

776
01:20:06,160 --> 01:20:14,000
uh so yeah that's that's four flip starters so two were failures um even two were failures one was

777
01:20:14,000 --> 01:20:18,960
for um a genuine like is it you know something you actually it was an expense you were just one that

778
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:24,160
organized this and paid for this to benefit the telegram group so this isn't something that paid

779
01:20:24,160 --> 01:20:28,880
for any of your time as i understand it was just just an expense um which means that this is actually

780
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:34,560
the first flip starter though the first fund me the first razor where it's actually about your time

781
01:20:34,560 --> 01:20:40,560
and up until now all of the time that you've been you've been doing um has been voluntary work

782
01:20:41,440 --> 01:20:50,560
more or less yes yes uh completely um well i mean many people have have suggested you know

783
01:20:50,560 --> 01:21:00,640
monetizing what i do in in various ways um um and i i explored it a little bit uh you know trying to

784
01:21:00,640 --> 01:21:07,600
sell uh what what what are what are the realistic numbers about you know selling merchandise t-shirt

785
01:21:07,600 --> 01:21:14,240
t-shirts etc uh what about creating a moderator group uh would anybody be willing to pay to have

786
01:21:14,240 --> 01:21:21,840
like a what i call the mod squad a group of people to to moderate your groups uh and when you look at

787
01:21:21,840 --> 01:21:29,840
the wider crypto community that is a huge thing that that people do um you know you look at token

788
01:21:29,840 --> 01:21:35,520
projects on ethereum or solana or whatever there's entire crews of people who who are paid huge

789
01:21:35,520 --> 01:21:42,640
amounts of money to uh you know do moderation work etc but unfortunately bitcoin cash is still uh

790
01:21:42,640 --> 01:21:52,720
uh too small to to warrant the amount of cost uh that that uh it would take um and of course in

791
01:21:52,720 --> 01:22:00,320
order to make it a business that uh is viable uh would would just the numbers just don't work out

792
01:22:00,320 --> 01:22:08,640
so uh yeah i i was hoping not to have to do a fundraiser i was hoping to to do some kind of

793
01:22:08,640 --> 01:22:16,560
monetization uh but then i also looked into uh the the legal aspects of it uh you know obviously if

794
01:22:16,560 --> 01:22:22,080
i'm going to be doing like a business it has to be registered here in japan and the cost and all

795
01:22:22,080 --> 01:22:29,120
that of of it also just isn't worth it you know uh you know just you have to have a board of directors

796
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:35,920
and all of these things right it's just it becomes a whole a whole mountain of of issues that uh it

797
01:22:35,920 --> 01:22:42,880
just isn't viable um so as much as i do you know want bitcoin cash to succeed i'm dedicated to it

798
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:50,400
at the same time i i do need to eat i do need to to pay for electricity and all those other things

799
01:22:51,680 --> 01:22:59,200
and so uh yeah it's it's really you know just a point of of uh is is this work something that

800
01:22:59,200 --> 01:23:07,680
people think is valuable uh does the weekly news uh help bring eyes to your project do you value

801
01:23:07,680 --> 01:23:17,520
that if you do value that how much do you value that uh and you know donate uh a amount that you

802
01:23:17,520 --> 01:23:27,600
think uh is is uh worthy of of that effort um if you think that uh my work helps bitcoin cash in

803
01:23:27,600 --> 01:23:32,960
general and therefore helps the price go up because more people get exposed to bitcoin cash more

804
01:23:32,960 --> 01:23:39,920
people buy bitcoin cash more people use your platform your product whatever it is maybe maybe

805
01:23:39,920 --> 01:23:47,440
you can uh you know pass a little over and say thank you you know a little tip um but again it's

806
01:23:47,440 --> 01:23:56,480
all it's all voluntary uh i'm happy to help in in any way i can um and uh you know there's there's

807
01:23:56,480 --> 01:24:04,640
no there's no price attached to to my help uh and so like you know and you know milan can can

808
01:24:04,640 --> 01:24:11,120
confirm when he started exploring accepting bitcoin cash for nano gpt he contacted me

809
01:24:11,760 --> 01:24:15,840
we we talked back and forth i helped him you know find the information that he needed

810
01:24:16,400 --> 01:24:22,640
and that's just one of many many examples uh of things that i do all day every day talking to

811
01:24:22,640 --> 01:24:29,520
people trying to coordinate things some way if possible uh last night i was up till uh 5 a.m

812
01:24:29,520 --> 01:24:38,720
not only working on the news but also sending information to all the the major uh defy projects

813
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:47,760
on bitcoin cash about how they can uh quickly and easily uh get their their project uh reflected on

814
01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:56,720
defy llama and hopefully that will then be reflected that bitcoin cash's tvl is higher

815
01:24:56,720 --> 01:25:03,760
you know this is just a off the top of my head uh you know stuff that that uh that i do that

816
01:25:04,640 --> 01:25:12,080
hopefully adds value and uh you know i'm it definitely adds value uh i'm sure many of the

817
01:25:12,080 --> 01:25:16,880
people who know you know what you're doing uh have seen any of you know just a fraction of what it is

818
01:25:16,880 --> 01:25:23,680
that you often know that it absolutely is of value um and any every single stakeholder of bitcoin

819
01:25:23,680 --> 01:25:30,080
cash as you see for milan so milan is not a uh bitcoin cash supporter um nevertheless he's a

820
01:25:30,080 --> 01:25:35,680
stakeholder his business accepts bitcoin cash and gets the benefit from the activities that you've

821
01:25:35,680 --> 01:25:40,240
done which of course you know every service that accepts bitcoin cash uh is a benefit to the entire

822
01:25:40,240 --> 01:25:45,360
ecosystem and every single builder in it so everything you're doing tp it has value and

823
01:25:45,360 --> 01:25:50,240
this is what i can say you know from this is why bitcoin cash for me is such an exciting community

824
01:25:50,240 --> 01:25:55,760
to be part of because there are so many people volunteering their time you know to the project

825
01:25:55,760 --> 01:26:00,320
because of everything that it stands for and and cheapy is one of the ones that i think of the most

826
01:26:00,320 --> 01:26:06,160
when i think of you know the amount of work and value that's being done voluntarily many come for

827
01:26:06,160 --> 01:26:11,600
the gains but they stay for the mission um so for everyone that's listening cheapy's fund can be

828
01:26:11,600 --> 01:26:19,600
found at fun me.cash forward slash campaign forward slash 17 i'll link to that in the comments

829
01:26:20,160 --> 01:26:25,360
finnish and friends fully support and endorse this fun me and we have witnessed all of the time or

830
01:26:25,360 --> 01:26:32,080
at least a good sum for the time that an effort that fellow friend um cheapy has put into the

831
01:26:32,080 --> 01:26:37,760
bitcoin cash mission and doing much important work that no one else is willing to do under the bch

832
01:26:37,760 --> 01:26:43,760
foundation cheapy has invested huge amounts of time and his own capital even to make this all happen

833
01:26:43,760 --> 01:26:49,200
and it's as said to the benefit of all bitcoin cash stakeholders coming at a significant cost

834
01:26:49,200 --> 01:26:55,600
himself not just in time but also financially this flipstarter covers those costs and allows

835
01:26:55,600 --> 01:27:02,000
this important work to continue in the volume that it has been in the past so it's an important

836
01:27:02,000 --> 01:27:06,720
point that i know that cheapy is keen to make is he's part of this community if this flipstarter

837
01:27:06,720 --> 01:27:11,280
isn't reached he's still there and he still loves bitcoin cash and he will do what he can

838
01:27:11,280 --> 01:27:16,560
to make sure and ensure its success but of course everyone has to eat everyone has to pay for cat

839
01:27:16,560 --> 01:27:22,800
food if you have cats and so um so the his time will have to be spent on other things to be able

840
01:27:22,800 --> 01:27:28,720
to uh earn money and pay for those you know life-sustaining activities so therefore finnish

841
01:27:28,720 --> 01:27:34,240
and friends have contributed towards the fun me and we encourage every listener who loves p2p cash

842
01:27:34,240 --> 01:27:39,760
and especially those who want to see bitcoin cash succeed to donate towards the cause are at the

843
01:27:39,760 --> 01:27:45,200
very minimum and this is all we're asking for to just to go and check out cheapy's fun me links in

844
01:27:45,200 --> 01:27:51,680
the comment as said and to give it some consideration thank you cheapy for joining today i wish you all

845
01:27:51,680 --> 01:27:57,760
the luck um with raising the remaining 29 of your campaign we are confident it will be successful

846
01:27:57,760 --> 01:28:05,680
to the benefit of bch and its mission of worldwide mass usage good luck thank you very much okay so

847
01:28:05,680 --> 01:28:09,600
i'm looking at the time we're half an hour out uh past what the intention was isn't this is the

848
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:16,240
issue and having such three such interesting guests on um uh but thank you very much for joining um

849
01:28:16,240 --> 01:28:26,320
thanks again to our special guests joining today sir claude milan derede excuse me and cheapy make

850
01:28:26,320 --> 01:28:35,840
sure to follow them on x.com at base poker hq at milan dereda and at cheap lightning respectively

851
01:28:35,840 --> 01:28:40,560
a fiendish token will be given out to each of our special guest speakers just comment your cash

852
01:28:40,560 --> 01:28:46,000
token address or send it as a private message if you enjoyed the show and want to show your

853
01:28:46,000 --> 01:28:51,520
appreciation please feel free to drop some bch or a fiendish token into our wallet the cash token

854
01:28:51,520 --> 01:28:57,520
address is in the description of our x profile or pick up an exclusive fiendish and friends nft

855
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available for 0.05 bch or get a scorching 75 discount by paying just three nish token three

856
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fiendish tokens or get the ultimate discount by paying just two fiendish tokens along with

857
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100 000 fiendish emerald huzzah reach out to us directly or on x online telegram for more

858
01:29:17,040 --> 01:29:22,080
information there are only five unique nfts per episode of finish and friends also available at

859
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tap swap dot cash finish and friends episode four is at 4 30 central european time next friday

860
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featuring kellen culiani maintain and developer bchn fulcrum and electron cash and calistheni bch

861
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proponent active btc twitter wit battler and developer of salim wallet for all you friends

862
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that can't wait to listen just make sure you pop that one fiendish token into the jukebox and hit

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864
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of the latest bitcoin cash news and updates fiendish tokens are available at cauldron swap with

865
01:30:00,640 --> 01:30:06,160
links in the comments this was finish and friends i wish all you lovely fiends a very good morning

866
01:30:06,160 --> 01:30:13,760
good day and good night