Hey, everybody. Rich here at Leaving MAGA at
leavingmaga .org. As always, want to thank you
for watching and supporting all of our conversations
that we have with our leaders who also left MAGA.
We got a brand new testimonial video for you
today. We are joined by Miss Addie Lugers in
the state of Hawaii. Addie, welcome. It's good
to see you. Hi, it's good to see you. So let's
get right into this here, because I already know
what most of our viewers are going to say when
they meet you and they're going to say, wow,
she is so young. So tell us about how you were
really MAGA before you could even vote and what
that was like. I grew up in a very far right
conservative household and I was homeschooled
and my dad worked from home. So everyone was
just all together all the time in my house, which
was fine. I loved my family. My mom was very
caring. My dad was an alcoholic until I was about
13 or 14. And one of the only things we were
allowed to watch on TV, we had some cartoons
and things we could watch, but the predominant
thing that we watched was Fox News. That, I feel
like, is what set me up to have kind of more
of an extremist viewpoint on politics because
I was only getting my information from one source.
And then growing up homeschooled, my dad really
monitored what I did on the computer. And so
I really wasn't able to fact check too well.
I didn't really know what fact checking was.
The narrative was always like, oh, you can trust
the news. That's what they're for. I slowly just
fell down this rabbit hole of getting more and
more extreme and justifying it by like, well,
this is how my parents raised me or this is what
it says in the Bible or this is what my friends
believed. And it became very closed minded very
quickly. I became really like politically active
when I was like 16. I didn't have the availability
of resources. Or, like, the availability of the
adults in my life to guide me through, like,
politics. It wasn't something we, like, talked
about and, like, discussed. Like, okay, you saw
this. Now let's talk about it. It was just, like,
on a constant loop of this is the news and this
is what's going on in the world. And we didn't
talk about it. So it was a very, like, echo chamber.
I'm going to leave it the way that it is. We're
not going to, like, critically think through
what's going on. Do you feel like all of those
facts made you a little more susceptible to MAGA?
I feel like that part of your upbringing made
you somewhat ready -made for the MAGA movement.
Living in an echo chamber, being a child, not
having access to resources, having undiagnosed
mental illnesses, it was just kind of a perfect
storm that set me up to just fall right into
it. Especially... In certain, like, religious
backgrounds, also, you become very dedicated
to, like, the church leader and, like, you learn
to, like, respect the church leader and listen
to what they say. And, like, it kind of became
a parallel of, like, the Bible and church and
then, like, MAGA and Trump. What was it? If you
take yourself back when you first started to
become enamored with MAGA and with Turning Point,
do you remember what kind of feelings did you
have about it? Did they provide you with a feeling
of community? Because I say all the time that
I feel like MAGA and what the right wing does
very well is it creates community. Yeah. So I
think part of it was because I had very limited
friends and I found community. I felt like I
was a part of something bigger. I've always like
ever since I was little, I wanted to make a difference.
I wanted to be a part of something bigger than
me. Yeah. And so for you, when was the first
time that you voted? Take us through what that
was like for you. I voted for the first time
in November of 2020. So it was Trump versus Biden.
And well, we all know how it went. We were all
there. And it just, the night before election
day, I'm going to see if I can pull up this picture
for you. I'm wearing a Make America Great Again
sweatshirt. And then I put a bunch of, like,
Trump emoji stickers all over it. And it says,
like, four more years, vote, team Trump. There's
one of Trump riding, like, a missile that says
America on it. And I posted that on my social
media the night before the election. And that's
what I show my friends when I'm like, I used
to be MAGA. They're like, no, you weren't. It
was my first election. I had turned 18, not even
six months prior. And I was just like, this is
it. This is what being an American is all about.
I get to exercise my right to vote. I can tell,
even the way you're describing it now, how...
exciting it was for you to vote for the first
time. And did you have feelings at the time of,
I need to vote to save America and save democracy?
Take us through what the mindset was like about
being just so excited for casting this vote for
Trump and MAGA. When it comes to like... the
MAGA concept of, like, I'm voting to save democracy.
I'm voting to save America. I think part of that
was there in the sense of, like, I was wanting
to participate in the democracy of voting. I
think at the time, I was very, like, well, I
had lived through Trump's first presidency. I
was a teenager. I was still in high school. And
I remember sitting with my friend. I was like
this the day after the election, the weekend
after the election. I'm not sure in 2016. And
I told my friend those with me. I was like, this
is going to change my life. Like having Trump
as the president is going to change all of our
lives. And she was like, you're being dramatic.
I was like, no, I'm not. But I do think that
it kind of was like a vote for the greater good.
in my opinion, like because all the things that
he promised and said he was going to run on,
like lowering prices and putting money back in
families' pockets. And like I grew up in like
a middle class family. My dad had his own business.
So the recession hit in 2008. It hit us pretty
hard. But it was just like everything that he
ran on, I was just like in awe of. I was like,
these are all amazing things. Like, why wouldn't
we want? to secure American borders and lower
the price of gas and eggs. And it just seemed
perfect in my head almost. I was like, this is
going to be the presidency that changes America.
I wasn't wrong. Just what kind of change it ushered
in, right? Yeah. Yeah. Well, it was the same.
It was similar for me. I wanted a disruptor.
Someone to disrupt the status quo. And we got
a disruptor. Just unfortunately, it's a disruption
that is anathema and antithetical to our democracy
and our democratic, lowercase d, institutions.
But you were not able to vote, but yet you were
so excited. And I relate so much to that, how
enthralling. MAGA was for me and how exciting
it was and it was new and it was novel and it
was a community and then finally you had a chance
to exercise that vote in 20 and and it was you
know all of the embodiment of that excitement
you finally could take action on yeah exactly
and I was excited and it was like this like voting
is a part of the great like American setup. Like
that was our thing. We get to vote. We put the
people in power that the people want in power.
And like, it just, it was also fascinating and
so cool to me. Like I was so politically active
online. It was, I was playing a lot of nonsense,
but I was, I was proud of my nonsense. Well,
online is another community. Yes. It was, that's
another thing growing up in like the tech era.
is like you can spread information misinformation
you can meet people you can it's all so fast
yeah i if you don't check the misinformation
especially like now we kind of people will put
warnings under posts if it's misinformation now
but even a couple years ago that wasn't really
a thing well i i say in a lot of my interviews
addy that we are in the united states of algorithms
And, you know, and mis - and disinformation,
I think, has reached a level of a crisis proportion
in the U .S. And for me, you know, and I want
to ask you about this because what led me on
my own pathway of leaving MAGA was I started
to diversify my news and information sources.
Did you... happened to do that also what was
that like for you when you started to go through
your own deconstruction and what were some of
the reasons that made you start to that gave
you pause in your support for maga having access
to the internet it's at least now as an adult
i know that like if you choose to not be educated
on what's going on right now like that's a choice
you're making you can't avoid it Unless it's
intentional. But I think back then. I think I
had a handful of friends that would post stuff
on like their Instagram story. And it's like
their post. I'm posting stuff. They're posting
stuff. I'm like reading what they're posting.
And I'm seeing like it's not quite lining up
with what I've seen. And like I started to kind
of fall into the like. I realized that each news
outlet is very different and that whatever political
affiliation that news outlet has can really affect
the quality of news that you're getting. But
I did start to diversify my media intake because
that was the thing for me. I was like, I was
okay with not being right, I guess. I just wanted
to be. as informed as I could be. But what were
some of the reasons for you that eventually led
you to stop and think about your support? There
were small things that I definitely had started
to kind of start questioning and catch up on.
But it all came to a head when George Floyd was
murdered. There was all the Black Lives Matter
protests. And I, like, spout nonsense on the
internet. And I was like, he wasn't murdered.
He was a drug addict. Like, all the things that
they were saying. Like, the police officer did
what he had to do. Like, if you don't want to
die, then, like... Basically, it was like, if
you don't want to die, then do what the law says
kind of thing. Which, like, is really not cool
now. to like think that and that was the one
that my friends like started calling me out on
and they're like you you have this all wrong
like you do not understand what's going on you
are being so loud with your political ideologies
like you're shouting into the void and no one
is going to answer you basically was what my
friends were telling me and I was like you're
wrong like I don't understand like all lives
matter like black lives matter so like exclusive
like I think for me it was like I felt personally
attacked by the Black Lives Matter movement because
I'm a white woman I was like well it does not
make all lives matter why are you saying that
just one matters like what about me and it's
not about me and that was where I finally started
to cave when I realized like I have been an adult
for like a year, like 18, 19 for a little while.
And I just finally started to realize I was like,
this isn't about me. Like, I'm a part of this
and I'm a part of America and I'm a part of the
concepts and hopes and dreams that Americans
and American people have. But I am a page in
this book. I am not the whole book. And that
was what really started to shake my beliefs in
MAGA was that it was very focused on me, me,
me, I, I, I. What does that have to do with me?
And why should I care if it doesn't affect me?
Why should I care about immigrants? Why should
I care about Black people? Why should I care
about Hispanic people and people under the poverty
line? Why should I care? I'm doing just fine.
I'm a white woman that was born, like, basically
with a spoon in my mouth of, like, my parents
were middle to upper middle class, and I had
nothing to worry about. I grew up in a predominantly
white neighborhood. I was Christian. I was homeschooled.
All my friends were white. I know at one point
in time, I even pulled the, like, well, I have
a black friend, so I can't be racist. Okay. But
I finally just, the big thing that made me leave
was I realized that MAGA had killed my empathy
for others. And it was all just like, whatever
the president wants, whatever the president,
like he's doing what's best for this country.
He knows what's best. And I realized I just didn't
care about my neighbors anymore. Like it became
just this grandized thing of. Like, we have to
protect America and, like, illegal immigrants
are sneaking drugs and children across the border.
And it just, I realized that's not who I wanted
to be. Like, I want to care more about my neighbor
and helping the people in my community and doing,
like, my religious deconstruction was something
else. But I deconstructed religiously around
the same time. like to truly live by like the
teachings of Jesus is very like, love your neighbor,
welcome the immigrant type of thinking. And like
my worldview shattered. I was like, this isn't,
this isn't who I want to be. And I realized like
my friends have been telling me since the George
Floyd thing into like 2021, when I finally realized
they were like, you have no empathy. You have
no empathy. You have no compassion. You only
care about you and why people like you. And I
was like, that's not true. Like, I'm such an
empathetic person. I'm so kind, blah, blah, blah.
I was missing the point on pretty much everything.
There's the, there's like a sticker out there.
It was a post someone made, but it's like, more
rights for others is not less rights for you.
Like, it's not pie. And that was what really
clicked in my head for me. I was like, why I
left. I was like. I am being hateful and I am
pushing a political agenda that at the end of
the day doesn't even care about me. But I realized
that like I don't want to be that person that
pushes my friends away. I don't want to be that
person that pushes minorities and people who
are struggling away. Like now as an adult, like
I work in a mental health field and I just want
to be a safe space for other people. And I realized
I couldn't do that and be MAGA at the same time.
Like I had to pick one. I think it's remarkable
that you went through all that at such a young
age. And I say frequently that leaving MAGA was
good for my soul, my psyche, and my mental health.
And that when you leave MAGA, anyone who leaves
reclaims their individuality, their agency, and
their empathy. And I think that's the case with
you. You said how MAGA killed your empathy. And
then when you are going through the process of
leaving, where there is that cognitive dissonance
between your sincerely held beliefs and what
your own eyes are showing you, but you came to
the point where you said that you couldn't support
this anymore. So I think it's pretty remarkable
that you did it at such a young age. And the
way you and I met is through threads. Yes. And
I know you're very active on Thread. So what
I want to ask you in closing is, given all of
your activity, why do you feel it's important
to keep speaking out? Things become less scary
when we speak them into existence. It goes for
mental health. It goes for traumas and struggles.
When you speak it into existence, it has a name
and it's... something you can face so by talking
about my experience with maga and my upbringing
not everyone's gonna believe me um there are
people out there that say oh you've always been
a liberal you look like a liberal like whatever
it may be they they're it becomes a strawman
argument and they just attack what they want
to attack without realizing that people can change
And for me, putting myself out on the Internet
is terribly, terribly, terribly scary. I do not
like being on the Internet. But I can really.
I feel like. It's almost a responsibility that
I carry now of like I. I was loud and put all
of this hatred out into the world. And now, like,
I want to show the people like you can. walk
away from it you don't have to if it scares you
if you feel small if you start even if you started
out like oh this is a great idea you very quickly
realize like crap this isn't what it was marketed
to be like I don't want any part of this what
do I do and that was my thing like I went through
my deconstruction and leaving MAGA by myself
So I was 19, not even 20, and I had to navigate
what to do, how to do it, how to diversify my
newsfeed, how to apologize, how to admit that
I was wrong. And I did it alone. And I don't
want anyone to feel like they have to do it alone
because we can find true community. when we stand
up for each other and when we hold a hand out
and say like it's okay to be scared and I'm here
with you and we're gonna get through this together
I just don't want anyone to have to go through
what I went through even if like I wasn't in
it for years and I wasn't like donating money
to the movement like whatever people want to
say about their MAGA stories like leaving MAGA
is it's valid and The people that leave are valid.
You're allowed to change your mind. It's normal
to change your mind when you're presented with
new information. And that's become such a crazy
rhetoric in today's day and age of like, you
can't change your mind. Like once you've made
your bed, you have to sleep in it. And like,
that's not true. Like everyone can change. Everyone
has the capacity to change. It's just sometimes
people need a little extra help to realize like,
I can do this. it's like even if I'm just one
voice in the gigantic sea of internet like even
if one person sees my account and sees what I
say and say if she can do it I can do it you
can walk away from it it doesn't it'll be hard
and it'll challenge who you are and it'll challenge
your beliefs and your morals and your values
but after you get through it you really can find
a new sense of identity and a sense of belonging
And like your local community and like smaller
Internet communities and you can align yourself
in ways that nourish your soul and align with
who you are as a person. I think your transformation
was remarkable. And, you know, I just I want
to express my gratitude to you for joining our
community at Leaving MAGA. Your intrepidity and
your bravery have not gone unnoticed. And I would
like to welcome you to our community as a newer
and valuable member. Tell us where people can
find you on Threads, your username. So on Threads
and Instagram, my Threads is linked to my personal
Instagram. So it's going to be under. um a lugers
so a l e u g e r s zero two that's my personal
instagram and then i have a political instagram
and a political tiktok they don't have anything
up yet because i'm working on it but that's under
maga underscore survivor And I'll be posting
more there about my experiences, my deconstruction,
challenging different political viewpoints, and
just being a resource for other people in the
community. I want to thank you for being with
me today. It was great to talk to you and to
hear more of your story. We were with Addie Lugers
from the great state of Hawaii. Addie, thank
you for being here today. Of course. Thank you
so much for having me. And any questions that
you have, you can feel free to bring them to
our weekly live stream, which is at Wednesday,
one o 'clock Eastern across all of our socials.
As always, we appreciate you watching. Thanks
for your support.