WEBVTT 00:00:00.719 --> 00:00:04.540 Welcome to Art Unframed. I'm Vulcan, and together 00:00:04.540 --> 00:00:07.839 with My Cohost Kafani, we dive into the raw side 00:00:07.839 --> 00:00:11.380 of creativity. This podcast is about art without 00:00:11.380 --> 00:00:15.240 limits, art that questions, art that pushes back, 00:00:15.419 --> 00:00:19.460 art that shows us who we are. Every episode, 00:00:19.620 --> 00:00:23.320 we sit with artists from around the world to 00:00:23.320 --> 00:00:26.420 talk about their journey, their struggles, and 00:00:26.420 --> 00:00:29.019 the stories behind their work. It's not just 00:00:29.019 --> 00:00:31.980 about galleries and pretty pictures. It's about 00:00:31.980 --> 00:00:35.759 freedom, vulnerability, and the power of creating. 00:00:41.299 --> 00:00:44.740 Welcome back to Art Unframed. This is season 00:00:44.740 --> 00:00:48.200 two. We are going to be opening today with a 00:00:48.200 --> 00:00:51.759 powerful conversation. And today we are joined 00:00:51.759 --> 00:00:56.240 by two amazing artists, Aida Studio and Maria 00:00:56.240 --> 00:00:59.719 Mindal. Together, we will be diving into a topic 00:00:59.719 --> 00:01:04.060 that is bold, honest, and maybe sometimes controversial. 00:01:04.540 --> 00:01:08.359 We'll be talking about art nudity and censorship. 00:01:08.760 --> 00:01:12.700 And we'll be talking about how rules and restrictions 00:01:12.700 --> 00:01:17.120 shape creativity and what freedom really means 00:01:17.120 --> 00:01:23.620 when your canvas is your skin. So first of all, 00:01:23.719 --> 00:01:28.500 I'm going to kind of like keep this. lights by 00:01:28.500 --> 00:01:35.480 starting with your journey as an artist. I would 00:01:35.480 --> 00:01:37.420 like the both of you to kind of like tell us 00:01:37.420 --> 00:01:40.719 about yourself. First of all, I would like to 00:01:40.719 --> 00:01:48.760 start with Aida. Okay. I hope I don't take too 00:01:48.760 --> 00:01:50.799 much time because there are too many details 00:01:50.799 --> 00:01:58.390 within my journey. I will start with the end, 00:01:58.469 --> 00:02:02.849 actually. I mean, the present. Therefore, I'm 00:02:02.849 --> 00:02:06.950 just a photographer in Web3 right now. I even 00:02:06.950 --> 00:02:10.569 ended all the contracts I had with various companies 00:02:10.569 --> 00:02:17.270 or agencies or events within Web3, like Artscrash 00:02:17.270 --> 00:02:20.270 Gallery and NFT Bucharest and MetaVentis, with 00:02:20.270 --> 00:02:23.090 which I was writing newsletters and organizing 00:02:23.090 --> 00:02:27.539 NFT Bucharest and so on. And I think I will not 00:02:27.539 --> 00:02:32.240 take any other commission next, but I will just 00:02:32.240 --> 00:02:34.960 stick to my photography because I have even bigger 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:41.000 plans with it. Yeah, and except what I mentioned, 00:02:41.199 --> 00:02:46.840 you know, I launched a photography album since 00:02:46.840 --> 00:02:53.080 I'm here. many collections one of them was quite 00:02:53.080 --> 00:02:56.099 big 100 one -to -ones which sold out in three 00:02:56.099 --> 00:03:01.759 weeks um and yeah this keeps going and before 00:03:01.759 --> 00:03:05.259 being in web 3 i have been doing photography 00:03:05.259 --> 00:03:13.900 for about 10 years plus and since 2015 i'm working 00:03:13.900 --> 00:03:19.419 mostly with people I have been working also with 00:03:19.419 --> 00:03:25.319 a therapist within my work because my aim through 00:03:25.319 --> 00:03:29.780 my photography, even if it's nude or not, is 00:03:29.780 --> 00:03:36.039 to restore people's self -image. So we are basically 00:03:36.039 --> 00:03:39.520 reminding the people we are working with their 00:03:39.520 --> 00:03:44.259 worth, however they are, and that they are on 00:03:44.259 --> 00:03:46.740 a journey. You know, it's not the end. Right 00:03:46.740 --> 00:03:49.099 now, even if you don't really appreciate yourself 00:03:49.099 --> 00:03:52.259 in this moment, in this specific moment, and 00:03:52.259 --> 00:03:55.080 even so, working with us, they are realizing 00:03:55.080 --> 00:03:59.379 that, hmm, okay, is this me? Can I look like 00:03:59.379 --> 00:04:02.800 this? Wow, I've never been a model, so how come 00:04:02.800 --> 00:04:06.020 that, you know, I look like this in your work? 00:04:06.099 --> 00:04:10.340 So I think that's the inspiration and that's 00:04:10.340 --> 00:04:15.349 also my mission. My photography album is called 00:04:15.349 --> 00:04:19.069 I Never Saw Myself This Way for the same specific 00:04:19.069 --> 00:04:23.050 reason. It's basically a translation of their 00:04:23.050 --> 00:04:25.649 reaction when they see the results that we are 00:04:25.649 --> 00:04:30.610 having after the photo session. And I think it's 00:04:30.610 --> 00:04:33.529 very important also to mention that the people 00:04:33.529 --> 00:04:35.930 I work with, they are not professional models 00:04:35.930 --> 00:04:40.899 like that happens. rarely and even so the models 00:04:40.899 --> 00:04:44.139 are either retired or they were going through 00:04:44.139 --> 00:04:50.879 some specific sad or challenging situations so 00:04:50.879 --> 00:04:56.600 yeah i think uh it's enriching starting with 00:04:56.600 --> 00:05:02.939 myself and with them and then i believe even 00:05:02.939 --> 00:05:07.550 if it's about nudity it's still education tool 00:05:07.550 --> 00:05:11.329 for me the art you know it's soul education is 00:05:11.329 --> 00:05:15.209 social context education is self -worth education 00:05:15.209 --> 00:05:19.009 because we live in a society which pretends to 00:05:19.009 --> 00:05:24.149 be free and pretends to give us the absolute 00:05:24.149 --> 00:05:27.069 freedom and democracy and all that bullshit in 00:05:27.069 --> 00:05:31.170 the end but we know our reality is way better 00:05:31.170 --> 00:05:36.240 than the mass media is portraying them And we 00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:40.180 do know that we are feeling stressed and repressed 00:05:40.180 --> 00:05:43.860 and, you know, negative about how our skin looks 00:05:43.860 --> 00:05:49.779 like and how maternity looks like. And I don't 00:05:49.779 --> 00:05:53.379 know how our hair or gray hair should look like 00:05:53.379 --> 00:05:55.420 and all these things, you know, like all these 00:05:55.420 --> 00:06:00.279 limits and all the push on the market for, you 00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:05.399 know, makeup commercials or... Yeah, it's a lot. 00:06:05.519 --> 00:06:10.980 So, okay. Let's say that's my journey, like the 00:06:10.980 --> 00:06:15.639 actual journey within my art, because I, yeah, 00:06:15.740 --> 00:06:18.740 I want to stop here because the rest is even 00:06:18.740 --> 00:06:21.579 longer than this. But yeah, I did study many 00:06:21.579 --> 00:06:25.040 things and had lots of jobs around the globe, 00:06:25.120 --> 00:06:28.160 living in many countries. But now I'm just a 00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:31.100 photographer in Web3 and thank you so much for 00:06:31.100 --> 00:06:35.220 listening. And I promise next answer will be 00:06:35.220 --> 00:06:40.720 way shorter. Yeah, it's okay, Aida. Thank you. 00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:43.759 You've got, like, a very interesting journey 00:06:43.759 --> 00:06:47.139 when you're kind of, like, sharing, especially 00:06:47.139 --> 00:06:51.019 from when you were a curator in Bucharest. I 00:06:51.019 --> 00:06:53.920 remember being, like, one of the artists that 00:06:53.920 --> 00:06:57.019 was kind of, like, curated there. That was last 00:06:57.019 --> 00:06:59.980 year. And then your book that you kind of, like, 00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:03.790 published recently. the i never saw myself this 00:07:03.790 --> 00:07:06.670 way um which is very interesting i'm going to 00:07:06.670 --> 00:07:09.750 be talking about that as well um it's just like 00:07:09.750 --> 00:07:14.050 very interesting johnny especially um your your 00:07:14.050 --> 00:07:18.509 work which is really amazing um um how's your 00:07:18.509 --> 00:07:22.110 experience as well maria um can you tell us a 00:07:22.110 --> 00:07:31.769 bit about your journey uh hi again yep so um 00:07:31.769 --> 00:07:38.149 i've always called myself an artist with many 00:07:38.149 --> 00:07:44.490 faces just because for many years i used my ipad 00:07:44.490 --> 00:07:49.829 for illustration and i drew in different styles 00:07:49.829 --> 00:07:56.430 like very different styles and now i think i've 00:07:56.430 --> 00:08:03.379 stopped on photography I started like a self 00:08:03.379 --> 00:08:08.480 -portrait photographer and when when I got pregnant 00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:14.160 I decided to try something else like to move 00:08:14.160 --> 00:08:18.279 a little bit and I started to work with models 00:08:18.279 --> 00:08:24.779 like photographers and I really enjoy enjoy it 00:08:24.779 --> 00:08:28.519 and I hope I soon I will come back to self -portraits 00:08:28.519 --> 00:08:38.019 too so a little bit shorter than Aida but yeah 00:08:38.019 --> 00:08:40.720 this is my way in this space I'm here for years 00:08:40.720 --> 00:08:48.080 almost five years I think yeah thank you Maria 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:51.539 I really love your those self -portraits and 00:08:52.339 --> 00:08:55.220 Your work in Tosa is really lovely, especially, 00:08:55.379 --> 00:08:59.820 like, there was one I kind of, like, saw as one 00:08:59.820 --> 00:09:03.399 of your spotlights in Instagram, the one you 00:09:03.399 --> 00:09:05.799 kind of, like, did while you were kind of, like, 00:09:05.799 --> 00:09:09.960 holding your child. It was kind of, like, very 00:09:09.960 --> 00:09:15.899 powerful. Like, it spoke in different ways. It 00:09:15.899 --> 00:09:18.080 was kind of, like, your headline. I think you 00:09:18.080 --> 00:09:20.580 kind of, like, posted it, like, recently as well. 00:09:21.220 --> 00:09:25.720 Your self -portraits, your work in total, your 00:09:25.720 --> 00:09:29.940 body of work is really interesting. And going 00:09:29.940 --> 00:09:33.980 further into the journey of the both of you, 00:09:34.080 --> 00:09:39.200 I want to first start with you, Aida. Your book, 00:09:39.399 --> 00:09:44.799 I Never Saw Myself This Way, is a very powerful 00:09:44.799 --> 00:09:50.750 title. Yeah, what made you come up with that 00:09:50.750 --> 00:09:53.870 title? Just tell me, what was your thought process? 00:09:54.309 --> 00:10:02.029 Thanks for the question. Yeah, I think I included 00:10:02.029 --> 00:10:05.549 it in my first answer. It's basically a more 00:10:05.549 --> 00:10:11.629 artistic translation of people's reaction. As 00:10:11.629 --> 00:10:14.129 for many of them, it's the first time they are 00:10:14.129 --> 00:10:17.720 being models. They really don't know what we 00:10:17.720 --> 00:10:21.899 expect or they are not confident in the fact 00:10:21.899 --> 00:10:25.700 that we'll have at least reasonable results. 00:10:26.279 --> 00:10:29.860 And I do believe we do have amazing results. 00:10:30.039 --> 00:10:35.679 So then they lean into that also and they're 00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:43.000 surprised and, you know, they're shocked. amusement 00:10:43.000 --> 00:10:46.320 and being pleased and you know feeling happy 00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:51.659 about it um inspired me to to give that uh that 00:10:51.659 --> 00:11:00.799 name to the album um yeah i i actually really 00:11:00.799 --> 00:11:04.159 really love your work and i like how you said 00:11:04.159 --> 00:11:06.720 your book connects to like real life people real 00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:08.740 life people seeing themselves and like being 00:11:08.740 --> 00:11:12.259 amazed at um how they could like look like and 00:11:12.259 --> 00:11:14.539 how they look like basically after you photograph 00:11:14.539 --> 00:11:17.960 them and I love that aspect of photography because 00:11:19.019 --> 00:11:21.259 we kind of as photographers we kind of bring 00:11:21.259 --> 00:11:24.299 out the beauty to people and i feel like i've 00:11:24.299 --> 00:11:26.620 always wanted to like take some nude portrait 00:11:26.620 --> 00:11:28.820 of myself like i've always wanted to do that 00:11:28.820 --> 00:11:31.259 like i don't think i've like had confidence to 00:11:31.259 --> 00:11:33.860 do that yet just yet um so i wanted to ask you 00:11:33.860 --> 00:11:36.580 guys here what drew you guys to like nude photography 00:11:36.580 --> 00:11:39.440 because it's not really the conventional photography 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:42.919 um that people tend to lean into so like what 00:11:42.919 --> 00:11:46.600 um What drew you guys into that? If you can just, 00:11:46.700 --> 00:11:49.460 like, anybody can, like, answer first. So, like, 00:11:49.500 --> 00:11:52.419 I just want to know, like, what caught your eye, 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:54.779 what took your interest into doing nude photography? 00:11:59.779 --> 00:12:03.240 Maya, do you want to answer, please? Sorry, I 00:12:03.240 --> 00:12:11.110 just spoke. Okay, no problem. Actually... in 00:12:11.110 --> 00:12:16.149 this space like in nft uh i found a very very 00:12:16.149 --> 00:12:21.269 talented artist who inspired me and when i saw 00:12:21.269 --> 00:12:25.090 her walk i was shocked that nude art could be 00:12:25.090 --> 00:12:31.549 so so so different like not vulgar or obscene 00:12:31.549 --> 00:12:38.659 or something like erotic maybe and That's when 00:12:38.659 --> 00:12:41.720 I decided to experiment with my body, to start 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:47.620 trying to do something very, very gentle, very 00:12:47.620 --> 00:12:56.480 tender. And I think, thanks for this space, I 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.240 decided to try nude photography. I don't know 00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:05.139 why nude, because I think it always brings something 00:13:05.139 --> 00:13:12.879 inside me. like love to body to take picture 00:13:12.879 --> 00:13:19.460 and just and now it's nude photography here and 00:13:19.460 --> 00:13:30.460 I'm really happy about it I will complete Maria 00:13:30.460 --> 00:13:37.120 with her tenderness idea And in my case, I think 00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:46.080 I also wanted to prove a point to the people 00:13:46.080 --> 00:13:51.440 I'm working with again, because of those restrictions 00:13:51.440 --> 00:13:55.100 that we're mentioning. And usually people feel 00:13:55.100 --> 00:14:02.639 more confident if their speech and their... body 00:14:02.639 --> 00:14:07.059 is covered right like if even ourselves we are 00:14:07.059 --> 00:14:11.320 censoring ourselves because that's how we were 00:14:11.320 --> 00:14:15.519 educated under the family religion society school 00:14:15.519 --> 00:14:18.860 kind of protocol right like don't be too loud 00:14:18.860 --> 00:14:21.940 you know don't be too naked don't put too much 00:14:21.940 --> 00:14:24.360 makeup but put some makeup you know don't go 00:14:24.360 --> 00:14:27.960 outside like that don't speak back to me it was 00:14:27.960 --> 00:14:31.889 everything with all these don'ts So then I was 00:14:31.889 --> 00:14:35.710 thinking, you know, physically, emotionally, 00:14:35.870 --> 00:14:40.649 mentally and so on. It would be nice to to take 00:14:40.649 --> 00:14:44.649 away all these layers. And I believe once you 00:14:44.649 --> 00:14:49.850 are standing nude and naked in front of someone, 00:14:49.970 --> 00:14:53.690 you are also emotionally represented like that 00:14:53.690 --> 00:14:57.940 because you are in your most vulnerable. physical 00:14:57.940 --> 00:15:00.620 form you can find yourself in front of someone 00:15:00.620 --> 00:15:12.000 right and except that i like our shapes men and 00:15:12.000 --> 00:15:18.039 women i work with men too so um but yeah this 00:15:18.039 --> 00:15:20.700 is an interesting point because men are less 00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:26.149 open to it even if we are all kind of pointing 00:15:26.149 --> 00:15:30.730 fingers at them you know and i have realized 00:15:30.730 --> 00:15:35.269 that they are even less confident than us when 00:15:35.269 --> 00:15:40.110 it comes to to the self -image because maybe 00:15:40.110 --> 00:15:46.350 uh women we are sort of empowering each other 00:15:46.350 --> 00:15:49.850 when we come together within this kind of relationships 00:15:51.819 --> 00:15:55.379 But when a man has to stay nude and naked in 00:15:55.379 --> 00:15:59.740 front of me, it's like, oh, but, you know, I 00:15:59.740 --> 00:16:03.700 never did this. It's even more awkward for them. 00:16:03.779 --> 00:16:08.419 But, yeah, they still do it under the same amazement. 00:16:09.440 --> 00:16:14.139 Yes, please. Yeah, I wanted to say that. I was 00:16:14.139 --> 00:16:16.700 even going to ask you as a question, yeah, how 00:16:16.700 --> 00:16:19.000 you said the human body is beautiful and you 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:22.009 want to capture the beauty of it. my buddy because 00:16:22.009 --> 00:16:24.370 like it's hard like i don't think i really see 00:16:24.370 --> 00:16:27.889 photographs of men nude photographs of men like 00:16:27.889 --> 00:16:30.289 it's really hard to like see so i want to ask 00:16:30.289 --> 00:16:34.470 like is there like when um when you see or when 00:16:34.470 --> 00:16:36.929 you want to photograph those men in this intimate 00:16:36.929 --> 00:16:40.009 nude mode um nude when you want to take them 00:16:40.009 --> 00:16:43.230 nude photographs basically um is there like a 00:16:43.230 --> 00:16:47.610 way you make them um uh make them is he make 00:16:47.610 --> 00:16:51.090 them feel that it's okay to be vulnerable it's 00:16:51.090 --> 00:16:52.889 okay for you to take their picture like it's 00:16:52.889 --> 00:16:54.750 all right for them to be vulnerable in this moment 00:16:54.750 --> 00:16:57.049 as you're taking their picture because most men 00:16:57.049 --> 00:17:00.950 i've met are not really um realizing all rights 00:17:00.950 --> 00:17:03.230 um with being vulnerable especially in front 00:17:03.230 --> 00:17:06.170 of a woman that is holding a camera so like is 00:17:06.170 --> 00:17:08.789 there a way you make them feel um that it's okay 00:17:08.789 --> 00:17:11.049 for them to be vulnerable when you want to take 00:17:11.049 --> 00:17:15.490 pictures of them basically um i have the same 00:17:15.490 --> 00:17:19.019 process with everyone It doesn't matter if they're 00:17:19.019 --> 00:17:22.619 women or men, because I believe our vulnerability 00:17:22.619 --> 00:17:26.920 comes from the same place, right? I believe it's 00:17:26.920 --> 00:17:30.779 influenced by the same factors. It's how you 00:17:30.779 --> 00:17:33.619 are raised. If you are raised with self -confidence 00:17:33.619 --> 00:17:39.480 or not, it depends on the society you grew up 00:17:39.480 --> 00:17:45.460 in. And in the end, you know, you are still a 00:17:45.460 --> 00:17:51.700 person. Of course, I didn't study this in depth 00:17:51.700 --> 00:17:56.559 when it comes to social groups or nationalities 00:17:56.559 --> 00:18:00.460 or religious aspects. I think then we would see 00:18:00.460 --> 00:18:04.039 a difference, but that would be more like a social 00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:08.000 study. I would need way more time to be able 00:18:08.000 --> 00:18:11.579 to answer this. But yeah, I have the same process. 00:18:11.660 --> 00:18:14.819 I'm just explaining them what's my aim, why I'm 00:18:14.819 --> 00:18:18.059 doing this and how the things will happen. We 00:18:18.059 --> 00:18:20.740 usually even meet before the shooting, right? 00:18:20.839 --> 00:18:23.880 We go for a coffee or tea or something and I 00:18:23.880 --> 00:18:27.220 show them my work so they know what we expect. 00:18:27.559 --> 00:18:30.759 So they will understand that it's nothing, you 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:36.980 know, unpolite or outrageous or like too sexualized. 00:18:38.559 --> 00:18:43.220 So then I think they're relaxing and once they 00:18:43.220 --> 00:18:47.059 understand my motivation, they are. even willing 00:18:47.059 --> 00:18:54.480 and looking forward to to collaborate oh okay 00:18:54.480 --> 00:18:58.200 i i honestly i would not have looked at it as 00:18:58.200 --> 00:19:01.759 just us being that vulnerability comes from the 00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:05.079 same place for both genders and i often i would 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:07.440 say i'm of the opinion that um women are more 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:10.849 vulnerable than men uh but like now that you've 00:19:10.849 --> 00:19:13.150 like opened my eyes to see that actually vulnerability 00:19:13.150 --> 00:19:16.349 come from the same place i actually now have 00:19:16.349 --> 00:19:20.450 a different view of it and um i wanted to ask 00:19:20.450 --> 00:19:24.650 here what do you feel like um your art is about 00:19:24.650 --> 00:19:27.309 except from the obvious that it's nude art like 00:19:27.309 --> 00:19:29.369 when we look at it the first glance is nude is 00:19:29.369 --> 00:19:31.369 people standing naked you taking pictures of 00:19:31.369 --> 00:19:33.970 people like what do you what's your art to you 00:19:34.269 --> 00:19:36.890 like what would you describe your art as if i 00:19:36.890 --> 00:19:39.289 should actually owe like what's the deeper meaning 00:19:39.289 --> 00:19:50.869 of your artwork um either you can go first i 00:19:50.869 --> 00:19:59.529 guess okay um yeah as as even my logo says i'm 00:19:59.529 --> 00:20:02.769 at least trying to restore people's self image 00:20:03.369 --> 00:20:06.069 oh i have to move away from the window just a 00:20:06.069 --> 00:20:09.970 second because i'm cold are only 10 degrees here 00:20:09.970 --> 00:20:18.130 um okay so restoring people's self -image proving 00:20:18.130 --> 00:20:23.029 a point that nudity is not really something to 00:20:23.029 --> 00:20:27.670 be scared of or run away from because in the 00:20:27.670 --> 00:20:29.730 end that means you are just running away from 00:20:29.730 --> 00:20:32.380 yourself i'm not saying that everyone should 00:20:32.380 --> 00:20:35.000 be my model you know that's not the case but 00:20:35.000 --> 00:20:37.480 at least take some time in the mirror and just 00:20:37.480 --> 00:20:41.980 like look at yourself you know like you live 00:20:41.980 --> 00:20:46.259 in this body or the body represents you here 00:20:46.259 --> 00:20:51.740 you know and i think it's basically about being 00:20:51.740 --> 00:20:58.019 awakened into self -love even again No matter 00:20:58.019 --> 00:21:01.480 in what society you live and no matter by what 00:21:01.480 --> 00:21:05.039 rules you want to live, even, you know, social 00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:09.480 ones or religious ones, just love yourself. You 00:21:09.480 --> 00:21:12.339 know, like I think if people are happy with themselves, 00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:19.000 then we would see even less conflict outside, 00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:23.380 like conflict within us. You know, like if we 00:21:23.380 --> 00:21:27.380 are calm, we don't really look. through a negative 00:21:27.380 --> 00:21:32.180 filter towards the others, but we look with understanding. 00:21:32.599 --> 00:21:35.099 So that's why it's all this, like, restoring 00:21:35.099 --> 00:21:38.500 people's self -images, not only the physical 00:21:38.500 --> 00:21:41.859 image, but about everything, right? Like, if 00:21:41.859 --> 00:21:45.319 you respect yourself, it's way easier to understand 00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:47.700 the others and respect their point of view, respect 00:21:47.700 --> 00:21:51.430 their... situation they are going through or 00:21:51.430 --> 00:21:54.910 respect their decisions and all this would lead 00:21:54.910 --> 00:21:59.630 to a more healthy society so i think that's what 00:21:59.630 --> 00:22:04.250 my work is about actually and even many of my 00:22:04.250 --> 00:22:09.049 shots are can't even be considered nude photography 00:22:09.049 --> 00:22:12.509 i mean is you know it's just a collarbone or 00:22:12.509 --> 00:22:17.099 the back or you know it's something that You 00:22:17.099 --> 00:22:19.380 would see even in a summer dress, let's say. 00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:24.960 But yeah, it's about confronting yourself with 00:22:24.960 --> 00:22:36.000 all these aspects of life, of living. Okay, I 00:22:36.000 --> 00:22:38.619 feel like I understand what you're saying because 00:22:38.619 --> 00:22:41.640 personally, I'm a big advocate of self -love. 00:22:41.819 --> 00:22:46.619 I feel like the first step to respect generally 00:22:46.619 --> 00:22:49.359 and kindness comes from a place of self -love 00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:52.779 if you love yourself you're enough to um enough 00:22:52.779 --> 00:22:54.640 if you love yourself enough it's enough for you 00:22:54.640 --> 00:22:57.039 to extend your hand to love other people and 00:22:57.039 --> 00:22:59.660 treat them with kindness so like i totally go 00:22:59.660 --> 00:23:02.099 with the fact that you're trying to restore people's 00:23:02.099 --> 00:23:04.339 self -image of themselves because i feel like 00:23:04.339 --> 00:23:07.299 um people these days lack um confidence self 00:23:07.299 --> 00:23:10.000 -confidence they lack self -love and it's wonderful 00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:13.680 to like see what you're trying to do and i feel 00:23:13.680 --> 00:23:16.420 like even with listening to how you express and 00:23:16.420 --> 00:23:19.079 talk about the human body. I feel like it might 00:23:19.079 --> 00:23:21.440 be time for me to actually love myself enough 00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:25.539 to get that nude photograph of myself done. Maria, 00:23:25.779 --> 00:23:28.640 could you like tell us what you think about your 00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:32.920 art and what you try to express with your art 00:23:32.920 --> 00:23:36.140 outside of it being like nude photograph and 00:23:36.140 --> 00:23:37.920 not just seen as nude photograph? What do you 00:23:37.920 --> 00:23:40.819 like express? As we all know that art is a... 00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:43.660 um form of self -expression so like i would like 00:23:43.660 --> 00:23:45.599 you to like tell us what your art is talking 00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:52.099 about uh first of all aida so sorry that you 00:23:52.099 --> 00:23:56.059 needed to talk a lot just because leo is cry 00:23:56.059 --> 00:24:01.799 great and i need to calm down him and now i'm 00:24:01.799 --> 00:24:09.039 here i'm back um for me nudity is the language 00:24:09.039 --> 00:24:13.559 of nature and it's like we come in this world 00:24:13.559 --> 00:24:21.759 naked that's how nature created us and that's 00:24:21.759 --> 00:24:26.359 why i feel such a strong connection with this 00:24:26.359 --> 00:24:32.720 in my work with nature it's both both vulnerability 00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:39.059 and strength at the same time for me most often 00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:44.000 when someone comes to a nudity photoshoot they 00:24:44.000 --> 00:24:47.559 are like fighting an inner battle with their 00:24:47.559 --> 00:24:57.259 own insecurities and afterwards they feel incredibly 00:24:57.259 --> 00:25:03.000 empowered because they overcome it and I really 00:25:03.000 --> 00:25:08.220 love witnessing those emotions it's like something 00:25:09.099 --> 00:25:15.039 Wow, when people open something new for themselves. 00:25:19.359 --> 00:25:22.500 Thank you, Maria. I really think that the both 00:25:22.500 --> 00:25:26.359 of you have a very interesting viewpoint on how 00:25:26.359 --> 00:25:30.019 you kind of like express your work and what you 00:25:30.019 --> 00:25:33.380 feel people should, what people should feel when 00:25:33.380 --> 00:25:35.900 they look at your work. You really kind of like 00:25:35.900 --> 00:25:40.259 answered. that question well um especially um 00:25:40.259 --> 00:25:44.559 either when kind of like talked about like restoring 00:25:44.559 --> 00:25:50.200 restoring the image of someone uh i i really 00:25:50.200 --> 00:25:53.160 felt that point and then maria when kind of like 00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:57.400 talked about the like nudity being a form of 00:25:57.400 --> 00:26:01.480 expression like it's it's uh yeah i really felt 00:26:01.480 --> 00:26:05.640 the both of your viewpoints about just that question 00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:10.859 so thank you um going further into this i wanted 00:26:10.859 --> 00:26:15.900 to say like um how do you think like censorship 00:26:15.900 --> 00:26:19.819 affects your your craft and how do you kind of 00:26:19.819 --> 00:26:27.680 like manage it anyone can yeah i will answer 00:26:27.680 --> 00:26:31.960 maria maria go ahead if uh if leo is calm now 00:26:31.960 --> 00:26:41.940 just please go first I think censorship is just 00:26:41.940 --> 00:26:46.240 another sign that people are still used to seeing 00:26:46.240 --> 00:26:53.160 nudity as something probably like purely erotic, 00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:56.660 maybe. I don't know how to find right to vote 00:26:56.660 --> 00:27:02.980 for this. And unfortunately... we can't like 00:27:02.980 --> 00:27:06.539 apply a filter like show only certain kinds of 00:27:06.539 --> 00:27:09.660 nudity art of course there is a different new 00:27:09.660 --> 00:27:17.559 dart here um so i've gotten used to blurring 00:27:17.559 --> 00:27:21.160 some of my photos and living inside the subtle 00:27:21.160 --> 00:27:25.380 bands here it's fine uh that means i have to 00:27:25.380 --> 00:27:28.779 fight harder for attention to my work to be louder 00:27:28.779 --> 00:27:35.339 brighter and be like everywhere um so it's both 00:27:35.339 --> 00:27:43.539 like and plus and minus for us i think thank 00:27:43.539 --> 00:27:48.259 you maria um i wanted to kind of like also kind 00:27:48.259 --> 00:27:52.099 of like ask like when you're kind of like submitting 00:27:52.099 --> 00:27:55.720 your works for galleries and things like that 00:27:55.720 --> 00:28:01.119 um how do you kind of like put it in a way that 00:28:01.119 --> 00:28:06.039 would get it accepted by those galleries that 00:28:06.039 --> 00:28:08.319 have this particular type of censorship rules 00:28:08.319 --> 00:28:21.210 um i just um remember it one um one gallery in 00:28:21.210 --> 00:28:27.549 probably in France and when people should came 00:28:27.549 --> 00:28:33.750 to gallery like naked to see naked art nude art 00:28:33.750 --> 00:28:41.130 and I think this is like awesome idea to fight 00:28:41.130 --> 00:28:49.500 with censorship And now I'm trying to find a 00:28:49.500 --> 00:28:53.640 gallery who will be ready to show new art. And 00:28:53.640 --> 00:28:59.480 I don't know, maybe I will rent some room and 00:28:59.480 --> 00:29:08.220 do some exhibitions with my works. But yes, trying 00:29:08.220 --> 00:29:16.619 to show our works to the public. it's hard do 00:29:16.619 --> 00:29:20.480 you also kind of like face that type of challenge 00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:27.819 as well either um actually i have a different 00:29:27.819 --> 00:29:35.000 answer than maria um because the the censorship 00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:40.000 on this platform i think is done with the purpose 00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:44.359 there are Few more things behind this, not purely 00:29:44.359 --> 00:29:49.559 about nudity, as we have heavily worn accounts, 00:29:50.079 --> 00:29:53.339 you know, like which are thriving here. So I 00:29:53.339 --> 00:29:56.339 don't think it's really about that. And as the 00:29:56.339 --> 00:29:59.420 algorithm is kind of like AI trained, I have 00:29:59.420 --> 00:30:03.559 no idea what they train it on, that the beautiful 00:30:03.559 --> 00:30:10.380 fine art, nude art is censored and the rest not. 00:30:11.660 --> 00:30:16.380 I really didn't find an answer here. So maybe 00:30:16.380 --> 00:30:21.119 it's not related to the content, even if we are 00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:25.099 feeling like they are targeting us. But on the 00:30:25.099 --> 00:30:29.079 other hand, I did have a couple of times two 00:30:29.079 --> 00:30:32.000 works which went viral and I had like two million 00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:37.579 views on them. So and they were nude. So I think 00:30:37.579 --> 00:30:43.769 that. My answer is still unclear regarding the 00:30:43.769 --> 00:30:48.410 platform. And overall, I think the censorship, 00:30:48.410 --> 00:30:53.630 again, is not on art. Like the nude art. Yes, 00:30:53.710 --> 00:30:56.609 there will be places which will accept it and 00:30:56.609 --> 00:30:59.750 places which will not accept it. But this happens 00:30:59.750 --> 00:31:03.710 with all the genres. If you go even with, you 00:31:03.710 --> 00:31:07.460 know, like cartoons, some... galleries will accept 00:31:07.460 --> 00:31:11.200 it and some galleries will not accept it so therefore 00:31:11.200 --> 00:31:17.880 I think we need to find our relatable galleries 00:31:17.880 --> 00:31:25.000 and representatives and so on um and I know that 00:31:25.000 --> 00:31:28.619 the nft events at least are trying to host some 00:31:28.619 --> 00:31:33.259 nude art also like at every event we see some 00:31:33.259 --> 00:31:41.180 curators which are are booking, reserving a special 00:31:41.180 --> 00:31:45.940 gallery for this. Sometimes it can be bigger 00:31:45.940 --> 00:31:50.599 and sometimes it can be smaller. But I'm trying 00:31:50.599 --> 00:31:55.500 to look at it from a more positive kind of place 00:31:55.500 --> 00:32:01.470 because until now we really had way less. possibilities 00:32:01.470 --> 00:32:04.970 to share any kind of art and especially nude 00:32:04.970 --> 00:32:11.250 art. And I think the censorship is mostly on 00:32:11.250 --> 00:32:14.549 something else. Again, it comes from the religious 00:32:14.549 --> 00:32:18.910 and social point of views. So I think the censorship 00:32:18.910 --> 00:32:22.990 is actually on the way we are living our life. 00:32:23.049 --> 00:32:27.269 It's not strictly on the art itself. The censorship 00:32:27.269 --> 00:32:33.210 is above this if you ask me right i mean all 00:32:33.210 --> 00:32:37.849 the laws all the like rules from whatever holy 00:32:37.849 --> 00:32:41.569 books and so on which were not even valid until 00:32:41.569 --> 00:32:46.049 the church took over right so the censorship 00:32:46.049 --> 00:32:49.829 is on something else it's the censorship is on 00:32:49.829 --> 00:32:55.690 expression in the end because even if you express 00:32:56.440 --> 00:32:59.299 a different political point of view if you express 00:32:59.299 --> 00:33:02.480 a different religious point of view yours you 00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:07.779 will still be banned right we if you express 00:33:07.779 --> 00:33:14.500 any idea about your body's safety you know there 00:33:14.500 --> 00:33:17.099 are so many girls within the world in so many 00:33:17.099 --> 00:33:21.049 countries which you know, are being abused even 00:33:21.049 --> 00:33:24.569 now, and nobody is speaking about that. That's, 00:33:24.569 --> 00:33:26.930 again, censorship. It's about health. It's about 00:33:26.930 --> 00:33:30.849 boundaries. So I think the topic is actually 00:33:30.849 --> 00:33:36.349 vast, and we are just a tiny part of it. But 00:33:36.349 --> 00:33:41.190 I think it got better in here, at least. Yes, 00:33:41.250 --> 00:33:44.349 we'll not see, you know, the enthusiasm will 00:33:44.349 --> 00:33:48.970 maybe not be absolutely public. displayed on 00:33:48.970 --> 00:33:52.130 super big screens in the center of the city. 00:33:52.309 --> 00:33:54.970 But that's because of the same factors that we 00:33:54.970 --> 00:33:57.710 mentioned earlier. It's not that people wouldn't 00:33:57.710 --> 00:34:00.970 enjoy it or would disapprove of it. It's still 00:34:00.970 --> 00:34:04.430 the governments and the rest of the powers which 00:34:04.430 --> 00:34:08.150 are censoring whatever they don't agree with. 00:34:09.369 --> 00:34:14.889 So, yeah, that would be my take on this aspect. 00:34:15.030 --> 00:34:21.960 Thank you. I think it was so, so deep thought. 00:34:23.059 --> 00:34:30.719 I think I even didn't think about it in this 00:34:30.719 --> 00:34:36.800 way. It was like, okay, wow. I need to think 00:34:36.800 --> 00:34:42.460 about it like deeper. Thank you, Maria. Thank 00:34:42.460 --> 00:34:45.789 you. yeah and apparently you know spaces still 00:34:45.789 --> 00:34:51.250 have their role you guys keep going and let us 00:34:51.250 --> 00:34:55.849 know when when you organize next spaces okay 00:34:55.849 --> 00:34:59.750 thank you so much aida and um actually like your 00:34:59.750 --> 00:35:02.550 um two of you like marianne that's different 00:35:02.550 --> 00:35:07.800 point of view because um although we say that 00:35:07.800 --> 00:35:10.239 censorship censorship doesn't really like apply 00:35:10.239 --> 00:35:12.440 on x anymore basically people are just ensuring 00:35:12.440 --> 00:35:14.719 what they don't like and stuff like that i feel 00:35:14.719 --> 00:35:17.000 like instagram still like i don't know about 00:35:17.000 --> 00:35:20.719 now presently but like i used to think that instagram 00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:23.460 like outrightly censored or like remove nude 00:35:23.460 --> 00:35:25.900 ads from instagram i don't know if that does 00:35:25.900 --> 00:35:29.659 that still happen i don't know um maybe one of 00:35:29.659 --> 00:35:31.659 you will be able to tell us and do you think 00:35:31.659 --> 00:35:35.869 that um instagram um limits you like what you 00:35:35.869 --> 00:35:38.349 can post limit what you can post or limit how 00:35:38.349 --> 00:35:40.909 far you'd have grown right now if they did not 00:35:40.909 --> 00:35:43.710 limit you previously um if you can just help 00:35:43.710 --> 00:35:53.730 us um yeah i think they are removing whatever 00:35:53.730 --> 00:36:01.670 they sense as being nudity but I mean, these 00:36:01.670 --> 00:36:04.750 platforms, again, I don't think they should be 00:36:04.750 --> 00:36:07.829 our unit measure, even if in a way they are, 00:36:07.889 --> 00:36:10.489 because they are like public platforms and we 00:36:10.489 --> 00:36:18.889 cannot share this. But. Yeah, I really don't 00:36:18.889 --> 00:36:25.210 know what to say about this, because I'm just 00:36:25.210 --> 00:36:28.800 trying to work with what I have without. Making 00:36:28.800 --> 00:36:32.920 a fuzz about things I cannot control yet. But 00:36:32.920 --> 00:36:38.360 I also don't have really, so to speak, like nude, 00:36:38.440 --> 00:36:42.760 nude kind of shots. So my art is mostly passing 00:36:42.760 --> 00:36:47.519 on Instagram. But I have heard that many accounts, 00:36:47.760 --> 00:36:50.440 even if they didn't have sensitive shots, they 00:36:50.440 --> 00:36:56.019 were without any, you know, warning or. Yeah, 00:36:56.019 --> 00:36:58.139 anything like that. They were shut down, both 00:36:58.139 --> 00:37:02.619 Facebook and Instagram. But as there are no humans 00:37:02.619 --> 00:37:06.980 actually doing this manually, I think here, again, 00:37:07.059 --> 00:37:09.460 we are starting a different talk, right? Because 00:37:09.460 --> 00:37:12.480 who is analyzing this data is not us anymore. 00:37:12.860 --> 00:37:20.139 So it's a bit awkward, but yeah. Yeah, I feel 00:37:20.139 --> 00:37:23.300 like this time the data is really kind of being 00:37:23.300 --> 00:37:27.340 judged by... ai or something and sometimes it 00:37:27.340 --> 00:37:30.500 can see some content and it's not really about 00:37:30.500 --> 00:37:33.460 nudity or anything but someone can just kind 00:37:33.460 --> 00:37:37.340 of like post something but it can just flag you 00:37:37.340 --> 00:37:40.440 and put you in put the person on another form 00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:44.960 of limitation yeah it's really crazy and just 00:37:44.960 --> 00:37:47.829 like what you said about some you're kind of 00:37:47.829 --> 00:37:50.690 like having some works having that type of traction 00:37:50.690 --> 00:37:54.550 about 2 million insights and everything that's 00:37:54.550 --> 00:37:58.190 to do it's really crazy and it depends on different 00:37:58.190 --> 00:38:05.610 factors so I wanted to kind of like ask how do 00:38:05.610 --> 00:38:12.090 you draw the line between nudity as art and nudity 00:38:12.090 --> 00:38:18.090 as objectification yeah I would first like to 00:38:18.090 --> 00:38:21.210 kind of like start with... Anyone can answer 00:38:21.210 --> 00:38:34.849 the question. Maria? Yep, sure. For me, the line, 00:38:34.869 --> 00:38:44.159 the difference is intention. When I... photograph 00:38:44.159 --> 00:38:48.539 nudity i don't see just a body i see a person 00:38:48.539 --> 00:38:53.940 their story and for me it's about showing good 00:38:53.940 --> 00:39:00.260 honesty and soul and objectification another 00:39:00.260 --> 00:39:04.440 hand takes away the dips and turns the body into 00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:11.360 something purely physical and My goal is always 00:39:11.360 --> 00:39:14.260 to create work where people can feel the human 00:39:14.260 --> 00:39:20.320 being behind the skin. So, like, easy lines for 00:39:20.320 --> 00:39:28.960 me. Thank you, Maria. Yeah, it's really interesting 00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:34.579 and that does a very important take on it. Aida, 00:39:34.739 --> 00:39:41.909 would you like to go? uh yes and before answering 00:39:41.909 --> 00:39:47.690 um this would be almost my last kind of question 00:39:47.690 --> 00:39:50.510 answer intervention i will have to leave soon 00:39:50.510 --> 00:39:54.210 if that's okay um feel free to continue the space 00:39:54.210 --> 00:39:57.090 of course and maybe some other people want to 00:39:57.090 --> 00:40:03.869 come up um this is a difficult question because 00:40:03.869 --> 00:40:09.929 again we are facing The limitations we were educated 00:40:09.929 --> 00:40:16.150 by. But I have realized that these limits, they 00:40:16.150 --> 00:40:21.050 can shift. I mean, for example, I'm coming from 00:40:21.050 --> 00:40:26.070 a very intellectual environment in my family, 00:40:26.150 --> 00:40:28.550 like from grand grandparents, they are doctors 00:40:28.550 --> 00:40:32.349 and teachers. So imagine the shock that everyone 00:40:32.349 --> 00:40:37.909 had, you know. Because I'm a teacher of basics, 00:40:37.969 --> 00:40:43.929 too. So it was funny, I would say. It was not 00:40:43.929 --> 00:40:47.210 difficult because, OK, within an intellectual 00:40:47.210 --> 00:40:49.750 context, it's easier to understand some things. 00:40:50.090 --> 00:40:55.489 But when I saw my parents looking at my work, 00:40:55.550 --> 00:40:58.650 I could see that they are theoretically accepting 00:40:58.650 --> 00:41:01.630 it. But within themselves, there was a battle, 00:41:01.789 --> 00:41:05.489 you know, it's like. this is not okay but on 00:41:05.489 --> 00:41:08.869 the other hand they were like but you know it's 00:41:08.869 --> 00:41:19.289 nice i think slowly they kind of open to it and 00:41:19.289 --> 00:41:22.849 then you run into the next limit which is where 00:41:22.849 --> 00:41:26.090 should we stop where is art and where it starts 00:41:26.090 --> 00:41:31.889 to be just sexual material right um and it's 00:41:31.889 --> 00:41:36.800 very hard to to draw limits within some cases 00:41:36.800 --> 00:41:41.019 because of what you learned. Because even if 00:41:41.019 --> 00:41:45.000 you see a shoulder or a leg in some societies, 00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:53.960 that's already porn. But within myself, I think 00:41:53.960 --> 00:41:57.440 it really depends on the light you are portraying 00:41:57.440 --> 00:42:05.539 that topic. subject and object itself it's about 00:42:05.539 --> 00:42:10.119 the gaze it's about how you present it because 00:42:10.119 --> 00:42:13.360 it can even be you know there are entire books 00:42:13.360 --> 00:42:17.420 of breasts and penises and you know this kind 00:42:17.420 --> 00:42:21.300 of things but i don't think that's actually sexual 00:42:21.300 --> 00:42:24.500 right it's about diversity it's about the human 00:42:24.500 --> 00:42:28.260 body it's about something else so i think depends 00:42:28.260 --> 00:42:34.280 what's your aim and how you do it. Because it 00:42:34.280 --> 00:42:38.300 can be even the organ itself, right? Like, this 00:42:38.300 --> 00:42:42.739 is the reality. And it can be poetical, it can 00:42:42.739 --> 00:42:49.039 be mysterious, it can be beautiful even. And 00:42:49.039 --> 00:42:54.500 in the same time, it can be very unpolite and 00:42:54.500 --> 00:43:00.519 vulgar and not okay because you are encouraging 00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:05.719 the public to look at that person as a sexual 00:43:05.719 --> 00:43:09.579 object that you can own and abuse and destroy 00:43:09.579 --> 00:43:14.659 and have fun with, right? So I think it's our 00:43:14.659 --> 00:43:19.619 responsibility as artists and we have to be very 00:43:19.619 --> 00:43:23.099 careful how we deliver this message because we 00:43:23.099 --> 00:43:26.400 are educating everyone through our work. No matter 00:43:26.400 --> 00:43:29.760 if you are aware of that or not, whatever you 00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:32.880 put out there, even if it's generative art, even 00:43:32.880 --> 00:43:35.519 if it's your, I don't know, cup of coffee or 00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:40.920 nudity or a cat or whatever, your message will 00:43:40.920 --> 00:43:44.280 be seen by all the people that will see it and 00:43:44.280 --> 00:43:48.699 interact with. So you are unconsciously delivering 00:43:48.699 --> 00:43:52.619 something. you are encouraging people into that 00:43:52.619 --> 00:43:55.139 thing like it's okay to drink coffee it's okay 00:43:55.139 --> 00:43:58.139 to take off your clothes so i think it has to 00:43:58.139 --> 00:44:02.619 be done lots of education around the topic it's 00:44:02.619 --> 00:44:05.179 about it's the same with you know drinking alcohol 00:44:05.179 --> 00:44:09.719 like a social thing just you know enjoying some 00:44:09.719 --> 00:44:13.760 wine and so on or getting wasted so i think it's 00:44:13.760 --> 00:44:18.539 the same with with the nudity And this being 00:44:18.539 --> 00:44:21.639 said, thank you, everyone, for being here. I 00:44:21.639 --> 00:44:25.079 really, really appreciate the efforts. And I'm 00:44:25.079 --> 00:44:28.880 happy to see also my collectors within the space. 00:44:29.059 --> 00:44:31.599 Thank you all for being here and my friends. 00:44:32.719 --> 00:44:36.619 And, yeah, I'm looking forward. Maybe, you know, 00:44:36.659 --> 00:44:40.199 in time we can continue this and go more in depth 00:44:40.199 --> 00:44:45.329 and, yeah, taking questions. Wishing everyone 00:44:45.329 --> 00:44:50.590 a lovely day or evening. Thank you. Thank you 00:44:50.590 --> 00:44:55.769 for allowing me to interview you for this episode. 00:44:55.969 --> 00:44:58.449 I really appreciate it. And I really enjoyed 00:44:58.449 --> 00:45:04.150 your take on this topic. It's been a really interesting 00:45:04.150 --> 00:45:10.250 topic. And just before you go, I just wanted 00:45:10.250 --> 00:45:15.170 to kind of just ask like one question. and it's 00:45:15.170 --> 00:45:17.489 really kind of like important because i just 00:45:17.489 --> 00:45:21.590 wanted to know like how how it's going to be 00:45:21.590 --> 00:45:26.530 if there wasn't any type of like censorship essentially 00:45:26.530 --> 00:45:30.269 did not exist at all like what kind of art would 00:45:30.269 --> 00:45:36.269 you create that you can't right now as i said 00:45:36.269 --> 00:45:39.650 earlier i don't really feel like i'm living under 00:45:39.650 --> 00:45:47.050 any kind of censorship um Because we live within 00:45:47.050 --> 00:45:53.250 bubbles somehow. I would like to... I would just 00:45:53.250 --> 00:45:57.150 like to see more kindness. Kindness within the 00:45:57.150 --> 00:46:02.510 world. I think there is some censorship regarding 00:46:02.510 --> 00:46:07.030 this like the normal beautiful interaction. But 00:46:07.030 --> 00:46:12.139 when it's about creating, I... I mean, everyone 00:46:12.139 --> 00:46:14.679 can really create whatever they want. You don't 00:46:14.679 --> 00:46:18.000 really need to show it. And when we show it, 00:46:18.099 --> 00:46:21.059 I'm sure that if you really want to show it, 00:46:21.139 --> 00:46:24.079 you will find ways to put it out there, right? 00:46:25.960 --> 00:46:30.920 So I do already create as if there is no censorship, 00:46:31.320 --> 00:46:34.880 as I don't really feel it myself. I mean, I live 00:46:34.880 --> 00:46:38.780 in Prague and I have the support of people around 00:46:38.780 --> 00:46:42.769 me. Czech culture is quite open to these things. 00:46:43.389 --> 00:46:49.690 So what you see is what you get. But of course, 00:46:49.710 --> 00:46:53.090 I'm looking forward to exploring more sides of 00:46:53.090 --> 00:46:57.110 my brain, soul, you know, interactions with people. 00:46:57.170 --> 00:47:00.489 And that I cannot answer. We'll just have to 00:47:00.489 --> 00:47:06.630 witness it together. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, 00:47:06.630 --> 00:47:12.079 Aida. Thank you, Aida, for joining this space. 00:47:12.280 --> 00:47:14.619 And it has actually been wonderful learning from 00:47:14.619 --> 00:47:17.280 you, learning about your experience. And I hope 00:47:17.280 --> 00:47:20.179 each and every one of us have been inspired to 00:47:20.179 --> 00:47:24.860 restore our self -images and show our self -love 00:47:24.860 --> 00:47:29.670 and treat people with kindness, basically. And 00:47:29.670 --> 00:47:32.230 it was wonderful learning from you once again, 00:47:32.269 --> 00:47:35.329 Ida. And I love the fact that you create as though 00:47:35.329 --> 00:47:37.929 there is no censorship, because I feel like the 00:47:37.929 --> 00:47:41.630 bubbles we create are like what's basically limiting 00:47:41.630 --> 00:47:45.409 us. And it would be wonderful if people get to 00:47:45.409 --> 00:47:49.809 go outside their own self -created bubbles, societal 00:47:49.809 --> 00:47:53.349 restriction, and just create what... they want 00:47:53.349 --> 00:47:55.510 to create. So it's wonderful seeing that you're 00:47:55.510 --> 00:47:58.489 doing that while also restoring people's images. 00:47:59.090 --> 00:48:06.250 And we hate to see you go, but we've just loved 00:48:06.250 --> 00:48:09.570 having you here. And we hope to see you next 00:48:09.570 --> 00:48:13.550 time. And Maria, if you have anything to add 00:48:13.550 --> 00:48:17.949 to if censorship did not exist, we'd love to 00:48:17.949 --> 00:48:25.750 hear that as well. I think I agree with Aida's 00:48:25.750 --> 00:48:32.050 words and I'm not sure it would really change 00:48:32.050 --> 00:48:37.630 what I create. I like to believe that my people 00:48:37.630 --> 00:48:47.110 will find me even with censorship. So short answer 00:48:47.110 --> 00:48:51.130 for me. Yeah, I really love that. Your people 00:48:51.130 --> 00:48:54.409 will find you. regardless of what you create 00:48:54.409 --> 00:48:59.670 um yeah thank you maria really appreciate your 00:48:59.670 --> 00:49:03.510 take on that as well i feel like either and maria 00:49:03.510 --> 00:49:05.889 are like two superpowered women because like 00:49:05.889 --> 00:49:08.230 what are all these quotes you guys are just dropping 00:49:08.230 --> 00:49:12.429 for us like um either wants to change image um 00:49:12.429 --> 00:49:16.070 why maria said her people find her i hope everybody 00:49:16.070 --> 00:49:19.530 in the audience is taking notes because i feel 00:49:19.530 --> 00:49:22.360 like Basically, that's the quote I'm going to 00:49:22.360 --> 00:49:25.280 live by from today on. Because my people would 00:49:25.280 --> 00:49:30.340 find me as a very overpowered quote. And I really 00:49:30.340 --> 00:49:33.719 loved that we had this space with you guys. Because 00:49:33.719 --> 00:49:37.380 when me and Volkan were talking, he wanted to 00:49:37.380 --> 00:49:40.460 bring two amazing women on this space to talk 00:49:40.460 --> 00:49:43.690 about nudity and censorship. When I saw... that 00:49:43.690 --> 00:49:47.010 he wanted to bring you guys on i was so so excited 00:49:47.010 --> 00:49:49.070 to hear what you guys had to share with us because 00:49:49.070 --> 00:49:53.090 um ida i i've not really like um met maria in 00:49:53.090 --> 00:49:56.570 the space um but i've had like um run -ins with 00:49:56.570 --> 00:50:00.300 ida so I've actually really looked up to how 00:50:00.300 --> 00:50:03.340 it works. And I told Volkan that, Volkan, do 00:50:03.340 --> 00:50:06.340 you know this nude photographer, Ida, that was 00:50:06.340 --> 00:50:08.780 like, and we were on the same wavelength. So 00:50:08.780 --> 00:50:11.699 I'm just really glad that this happened. And 00:50:11.699 --> 00:50:14.559 I don't know if anyone in the audience have like 00:50:14.559 --> 00:50:17.380 questions or like have something to input about 00:50:17.380 --> 00:50:19.820 nude photography. Please only nude photography. 00:50:20.159 --> 00:50:22.619 And we'll just be taking the questions. So you 00:50:22.619 --> 00:50:25.719 can feel free to request. And Ida, I hope we 00:50:25.719 --> 00:50:27.989 don't take so much of your time. um thank you 00:50:27.989 --> 00:50:31.150 very much for coming mariatsu it was lovely having 00:50:31.150 --> 00:50:33.570 you here so we'll be taking questions now if 00:50:33.570 --> 00:50:38.070 there are any i might see finance requested so 00:50:38.070 --> 00:50:53.849 i'm just going to accept now um okay find out 00:50:53.849 --> 00:50:56.369 you can like introduce yourself and then um input 00:50:59.720 --> 00:51:03.480 Hello, everybody. This is Fine Art Crypto. And 00:51:03.480 --> 00:51:06.260 I just have been following this conversation 00:51:06.260 --> 00:51:09.380 since for many years. I've been a fine art nude 00:51:09.380 --> 00:51:11.989 photographer since forever. uh we're talking 00:51:11.989 --> 00:51:16.070 years and years uh and discussing i have a actual 00:51:16.070 --> 00:51:19.050 presentation about the arts the nude in the fine 00:51:19.050 --> 00:51:22.150 arts uh which is you know kind of a recollection 00:51:22.150 --> 00:51:24.590 of information about all this going on in the 00:51:24.590 --> 00:51:27.269 in the arts and the news and censorship now even 00:51:27.269 --> 00:51:30.969 with ai all the social media being ai controlled 00:51:30.969 --> 00:51:36.530 in some way is just adding uh more uh limitations 00:51:36.530 --> 00:51:44.409 uh to the Some of you who are in Europe, like 00:51:44.409 --> 00:51:48.150 those Czech countries, etc., that have way much 00:51:48.150 --> 00:51:51.050 more freedom and nudity is more natural, more, 00:51:51.130 --> 00:51:54.949 you know, akin to human people. They don't have 00:51:54.949 --> 00:51:57.429 the many problems that are happening here in 00:51:57.429 --> 00:52:00.409 the U .S. where the religious groups going to 00:52:00.409 --> 00:52:04.170 extremes are, you know, making, you know. a lot 00:52:04.170 --> 00:52:08.710 of pressure into policies, political information 00:52:08.710 --> 00:52:12.090 and influence to block every kind, basically 00:52:12.090 --> 00:52:16.690 to assign the obscenity, pornography tax to almost 00:52:16.690 --> 00:52:19.710 everything that is being photographed, I think. 00:52:20.239 --> 00:52:24.039 the the in some way the social media i mean the 00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:27.559 the web 2 and web 3 elements probably twitter 00:52:27.559 --> 00:52:30.900 x in this case has been a little more open to 00:52:30.900 --> 00:52:33.559 nudity than other channels uh even though you 00:52:33.559 --> 00:52:35.699 can get you know completely you know blocked 00:52:35.699 --> 00:52:38.360 instantaneously with no explanation apparently 00:52:38.360 --> 00:52:42.190 you know twitter is more lenient in that regard 00:52:42.190 --> 00:52:44.849 than all the social media channels, Instagram, 00:52:45.110 --> 00:52:49.130 etc. But I think the religious influence is, 00:52:49.269 --> 00:52:53.309 like Aida or Maria were saying, it's a social 00:52:53.309 --> 00:52:56.769 situation. It's more of a cultural problem because 00:52:56.769 --> 00:53:01.550 I think everything is like a massive lack of 00:53:01.550 --> 00:53:05.789 a healthy sex life. If you are living your life 00:53:05.789 --> 00:53:09.409 with a natural sexual life, you know, this and 00:53:09.409 --> 00:53:11.829 that, healthy with your couples, with your friends, 00:53:11.929 --> 00:53:16.559 whatever you do. You don't suffer from this sexual 00:53:16.559 --> 00:53:18.659 anorexia. You know, it's interesting. I have 00:53:18.659 --> 00:53:22.099 a phrase in my presentation that says that sexual 00:53:22.099 --> 00:53:24.960 anorexia is the same as sexual food. You are 00:53:24.960 --> 00:53:27.519 desperate for the things you are trying to block. 00:53:28.500 --> 00:53:31.000 Anorexics for food, food anorexics, they are 00:53:31.000 --> 00:53:33.780 all the time thinking about food. It's dramatic. 00:53:34.079 --> 00:53:36.880 And sexual anorexics are all the time thinking 00:53:36.880 --> 00:53:39.340 about sex. And the only reason for that is the 00:53:39.340 --> 00:53:43.059 lack of a... decent healthy natural sex life 00:53:43.059 --> 00:53:45.659 that would you know sort out so many of their 00:53:45.659 --> 00:53:50.150 issues in regards to nudity. But then this calamity 00:53:50.150 --> 00:53:52.829 grows to levels, you know, that we're seeing 00:53:52.829 --> 00:53:56.389 the powerful influence of these people, the Christian 00:53:56.389 --> 00:54:00.070 radicals and all these groups into politics and 00:54:00.070 --> 00:54:03.250 policy for life, and the arts are being affected 00:54:03.250 --> 00:54:07.690 massively. I guess my take, my work has been 00:54:07.690 --> 00:54:11.289 more accepted for galleries on IRL in real life 00:54:11.289 --> 00:54:18.010 than actual online venues. And the little few 00:54:18.010 --> 00:54:21.250 deals have been done online for me compared to 00:54:21.250 --> 00:54:24.309 what I do on actual galleries and keeping the 00:54:24.309 --> 00:54:28.869 thing real with people who love the beauty of 00:54:28.869 --> 00:54:32.730 the body. There is no pornographic approach in 00:54:32.730 --> 00:54:34.710 the things we're trying to do. We're trying to 00:54:34.710 --> 00:54:37.610 show the beauty of human body, the way women 00:54:37.610 --> 00:54:41.929 have advanced in society, have done so many amazing 00:54:41.929 --> 00:54:47.219 changes in their own freedoms. And it all manifested 00:54:47.219 --> 00:54:50.840 through the body in one way or the other. So 00:54:50.840 --> 00:54:55.480 it's a constant fight. I have become like an 00:54:55.480 --> 00:54:57.840 activist because of the same situation with censorship, 00:54:58.000 --> 00:55:00.619 just like Aida or Maria and many others here. 00:55:00.960 --> 00:55:03.659 So I invite everybody, you know, to keep pushing 00:55:03.659 --> 00:55:06.940 it because we cannot let those people win, period. 00:55:07.039 --> 00:55:11.019 We cannot let the art be blocked only because 00:55:11.019 --> 00:55:14.039 they have sex problems in their personal lives. 00:55:14.510 --> 00:55:22.429 thank you um thank you so much i'm fine at um 00:55:22.429 --> 00:55:26.650 i feel like um i as i'm i'm not a nude photographer 00:55:26.650 --> 00:55:30.639 here but like i used to think that um nude photographs 00:55:30.639 --> 00:55:34.280 are actually more accepted in Web3 and on the 00:55:34.280 --> 00:55:36.980 internet more than in real life. But it's really 00:55:36.980 --> 00:55:39.880 nice to hear your opinion and hear that it's 00:55:39.880 --> 00:55:43.639 actually accepted where you are from in galleries, 00:55:43.920 --> 00:55:47.469 in real life, more than the Web3 space. online 00:55:47.469 --> 00:55:50.789 um so i don't know much about this um it's maria 00:55:50.789 --> 00:55:53.289 maria do you have anything to like input um to 00:55:53.289 --> 00:55:56.409 what finance they said because um we are always 00:55:56.409 --> 00:55:58.909 open to learning more about nude photography 00:55:58.909 --> 00:56:02.369 and ways that it can always get better so um 00:56:02.369 --> 00:56:04.630 i don't know if anyone has anything to put um 00:56:04.630 --> 00:56:08.070 on what finance said but i also i also feel like 00:56:08.070 --> 00:56:10.829 everyone should join in the facts in the fights 00:56:10.829 --> 00:56:14.960 to compare and combat censorship because um Not 00:56:14.960 --> 00:56:17.440 everybody understands how people are expressing 00:56:17.440 --> 00:56:19.699 themselves with nude photographs people often 00:56:20.269 --> 00:56:22.929 And I will not say generally people, just people 00:56:22.929 --> 00:56:25.550 that are narrow minded or people that don't understand. 00:56:25.690 --> 00:56:28.570 They often see it as an expression of pornography. 00:56:28.769 --> 00:56:32.429 And I find it kind of funny. I will not say funny 00:56:32.429 --> 00:56:35.690 in an offensive way. I just I actually do not 00:56:35.690 --> 00:56:39.650 view it as a lack of sex activity or sexual activity. 00:56:40.230 --> 00:56:43.050 So that's actually another interesting perspective. 00:56:43.269 --> 00:56:45.909 So, Maria, if you have anything to say about 00:56:45.909 --> 00:56:48.289 this, I would love to hear your opinion or any 00:56:48.289 --> 00:56:59.039 other person. I think that everything is in our 00:56:59.039 --> 00:57:04.519 like minds the boundaries and I think I'm agree 00:57:04.519 --> 00:57:13.179 about if I'm sorry I can't repeat like if everything 00:57:13.179 --> 00:57:19.380 is okay in sexuality and blah blah blah and I 00:57:19.380 --> 00:57:27.530 totally agree with that because many people many 00:57:27.530 --> 00:57:31.429 people think that it's like something no i can 00:57:31.429 --> 00:57:35.030 it's something like wrong you're doing wrong 00:57:35.030 --> 00:57:40.829 you are i don't know bad thing and everything 00:57:40.829 --> 00:57:45.610 is because of society and in our minds and we 00:57:45.610 --> 00:57:51.550 need to push new dart as much as possible just 00:57:51.550 --> 00:57:55.289 to show people that it can be different and and 00:57:55.289 --> 00:58:04.150 that everyone can try to be a model to like try 00:58:04.150 --> 00:58:08.530 to open to yourself something new that just body 00:58:08.530 --> 00:58:12.110 it's your body it's natural body there's nothing 00:58:12.110 --> 00:58:16.730 wrong with that to take a picture to be a model 00:58:19.289 --> 00:58:24.210 Like, I think I'm a little bit lost, lost line 00:58:24.210 --> 00:58:33.650 of question. Okay, I wanted to ask another question 00:58:33.650 --> 00:58:36.150 to Fine Art. Fine Art, so are you saying that 00:58:36.150 --> 00:58:39.230 nudity is accepted more in real life, like nudity 00:58:39.230 --> 00:58:42.929 art, than in the web, or like online, online? 00:58:43.090 --> 00:58:50.039 Just for clarity. Yes, well, listen, at least 00:58:50.039 --> 00:58:56.980 the NFT platforms are open to receiving the images, 00:58:57.079 --> 00:59:00.579 the NFTs, and have them available for sale, etc. 00:59:01.219 --> 00:59:06.599 And that part opens up a little extra space for 00:59:06.599 --> 00:59:10.500 nude artists to show their work, no doubt. But 00:59:10.500 --> 00:59:16.159 when you want to promote or talk about your pieces, 00:59:16.300 --> 00:59:19.239 your work in the social media channels, then 00:59:19.239 --> 00:59:22.400 that's when you get the limitations. Instagram 00:59:22.400 --> 00:59:25.900 has become like a guillotine, you know, for these 00:59:25.900 --> 00:59:28.760 kind of things. Sometimes some images pass and 00:59:28.760 --> 00:59:31.039 go through with no problem. Some other artists 00:59:31.039 --> 00:59:34.440 are being blocked with no explanation. And it 00:59:34.440 --> 00:59:37.239 ends up being like a roulette. You don't know 00:59:37.239 --> 00:59:39.579 if what you're publishing is going to happen. 00:59:39.599 --> 00:59:42.699 have this negative impact on your channel. And 00:59:42.699 --> 00:59:45.119 if you've been building a community, a group, 00:59:45.199 --> 00:59:49.960 then it's risky just to throw all that away to 00:59:49.960 --> 00:59:57.190 challenge the system. posting those images. That 00:59:57.190 --> 01:00:01.750 kind of risk level is annoying. It's almost childish. 01:00:01.949 --> 01:00:06.289 And at the end with AI basically being the eventual 01:00:06.289 --> 01:00:08.809 judges at this point, the ones that are reviewing 01:00:08.809 --> 01:00:13.170 the work, it becomes very dehumanized. So, you 01:00:13.170 --> 01:00:16.550 know, when you go IRL and you meet with people, 01:00:16.650 --> 01:00:19.809 you talk to people in person, you know, the discussions, 01:00:20.050 --> 01:00:22.590 I mean, if they have no interest. they wouldn't 01:00:22.590 --> 01:00:25.550 let you arrive to the point of a meeting, for 01:00:25.550 --> 01:00:28.590 example. If you meet and you talk, I mean, there 01:00:28.590 --> 01:00:32.309 is already a level of acceptance in the type 01:00:32.309 --> 01:00:34.190 of work or the type of conversation you're going 01:00:34.190 --> 01:00:37.090 to have about art, which is different, you know, 01:00:37.110 --> 01:00:39.409 from what's happening unilaterally in social 01:00:39.409 --> 01:00:42.130 media, in a moment in which they can block you 01:00:42.130 --> 01:00:46.230 just because, with no explanation. They can even 01:00:46.230 --> 01:00:49.489 reinstate you back with no explanation, no apologies, 01:00:49.610 --> 01:00:53.570 no nothing. They just decide. to put you back 01:00:53.570 --> 01:00:57.309 online. And these kind of situations, I think, 01:00:57.329 --> 01:00:59.570 is the lack of human presence, the lack of human 01:00:59.570 --> 01:01:02.789 interaction, what brings the problem. Listen, 01:01:02.889 --> 01:01:08.530 the religious mix with the sexual thing is so 01:01:08.530 --> 01:01:13.690 dramatic that there is a dramatic statistic from 01:01:13.690 --> 01:01:16.449 Pornhub. I don't know if you know it. Pornhub 01:01:16.449 --> 01:01:18.789 is one of the largest pornography sites in the 01:01:18.789 --> 01:01:22.409 U .S. their servers the the numbers that they 01:01:22.409 --> 01:01:25.989 have already registered indicate that the the 01:01:25.989 --> 01:01:30.340 largest consumers of online porn live in what 01:01:30.340 --> 01:01:33.780 is called the Bible Belt here in the US. The 01:01:33.780 --> 01:01:36.679 Bible Belt being some of the states, you know, 01:01:36.699 --> 01:01:40.139 from North Florida and some states in the center 01:01:40.139 --> 01:01:42.840 area of the United States, which are supposed 01:01:42.840 --> 01:01:46.599 to be the most religious ones, the most radically 01:01:46.599 --> 01:01:50.079 religious people. And those are the states where 01:01:50.079 --> 01:01:53.739 the largest amount of online porn is being consumed. 01:01:54.039 --> 01:01:56.920 So that's the irony about these people. That's 01:01:56.920 --> 01:02:00.059 the reason I allocate. so much weight to the 01:02:00.059 --> 01:02:03.800 sex life part, the aspect of the sex life that 01:02:03.800 --> 01:02:08.099 makes them so completely fanatic against nudity. 01:02:08.360 --> 01:02:19.179 Thank you. Thank you, Fainat. That's a very important 01:02:19.179 --> 01:02:23.920 take. It goes down to the question of what I 01:02:23.920 --> 01:02:28.039 kind of asked Maria about. uh this in and out 01:02:28.039 --> 01:02:32.400 as objectification which she answered so yeah 01:02:32.400 --> 01:02:35.719 i really appreciate your take on that um yeah 01:02:35.719 --> 01:02:38.639 i find that it was really really nice to see 01:02:38.639 --> 01:02:40.599 like an interesting perspective and perspective 01:02:40.599 --> 01:02:44.840 of nudity and like um vulcan said also nudity 01:02:44.840 --> 01:02:47.360 as object objectification like we asked maria 01:02:47.360 --> 01:02:50.980 and well i feel like um it just boils down to 01:02:50.980 --> 01:02:53.139 the fact that everybody is doing what they can 01:02:53.139 --> 01:02:57.239 to make sure make sure that um nudity as an art 01:02:57.239 --> 01:03:00.300 is more acceptable in the society that we are 01:03:00.300 --> 01:03:04.719 in, because it's a long, I would call it a long 01:03:04.719 --> 01:03:07.300 fight. And I don't think humanity has gotten 01:03:07.300 --> 01:03:09.260 there yet, but I feel like one day we'll eventually 01:03:09.260 --> 01:03:15.099 get there. And Kamsi, do you have anything to 01:03:15.099 --> 01:03:18.260 share with us? If you have anything to share, 01:03:18.280 --> 01:03:25.219 you can share now. Hi. Good day, everybody. It's 01:03:25.219 --> 01:03:30.500 quite an interesting topic that is going on here, 01:03:30.659 --> 01:03:35.179 which is the topic of nudity. And I think for 01:03:35.179 --> 01:03:44.260 the longest since the world got so much into 01:03:44.260 --> 01:03:48.139 religion, nudity has always been existent in 01:03:48.139 --> 01:03:51.849 art. I mean, if we all agree. i'm a spiritual 01:03:51.849 --> 01:03:55.570 person so if we all agree if if you're a spiritual 01:03:55.570 --> 01:03:58.289 person and then or if you're religious person 01:03:58.289 --> 01:04:02.429 rather and you agree that there is a divine being 01:04:02.429 --> 01:04:06.030 that created the world you know that the first 01:04:06.030 --> 01:04:09.090 thing the first way we were created was without 01:04:09.090 --> 01:04:13.530 guilt and my own way of seeing it is that's like 01:04:13.530 --> 01:04:16.230 the way we were born and we were definitely going 01:04:16.230 --> 01:04:19.510 to leave this earth and from time immemorial 01:04:20.119 --> 01:04:23.780 artists have always had to work with nudity. 01:04:24.059 --> 01:04:29.619 I mean, when you go to art classes and you're 01:04:29.619 --> 01:04:31.760 being taught to sketch, one of the things you 01:04:31.760 --> 01:04:35.000 want to learn first in your art classes is how 01:04:35.000 --> 01:04:40.320 to sketch the human body in its natural form 01:04:40.320 --> 01:04:46.780 before learning to add clothes to it. So the 01:04:46.780 --> 01:04:52.269 whole, I think the whole idea to nudity being 01:04:52.269 --> 01:04:55.550 something that should be censored or something 01:04:55.550 --> 01:04:59.809 that should be frowned upon did not always exist 01:04:59.809 --> 01:05:02.750 until we started having people that became too 01:05:02.750 --> 01:05:11.230 religious and also for me personally I like to 01:05:11.230 --> 01:05:17.139 say that if you if we can make art with the intention 01:05:17.139 --> 01:05:20.619 to get somebody angry or to provoke someone, 01:05:20.840 --> 01:05:25.179 right? To do something. Or we make art with the 01:05:25.179 --> 01:05:28.860 intention to make someone cry or make someone 01:05:28.860 --> 01:05:33.099 feel something, right? Why is it bad when someone 01:05:33.099 --> 01:05:36.739 makes something to arouse somebody else or to 01:05:36.739 --> 01:05:39.500 arouse the viewer? I mean, if it is okay for 01:05:39.500 --> 01:05:43.809 us to make art that will make us feel... sad, 01:05:43.809 --> 01:05:46.510 depressed, and the rest of that. Why is it not 01:05:46.510 --> 01:05:49.070 okay for us to make works that would also arouse 01:05:49.070 --> 01:05:52.909 us? I mean, loss is also a feeling. So why are 01:05:52.909 --> 01:05:55.150 we shying away from it? And that's one of the 01:05:55.150 --> 01:06:00.070 things too I tend to examine when I talk about 01:06:00.070 --> 01:06:06.710 nude art. And I tell my friends that for me, 01:06:06.750 --> 01:06:10.269 nude art is not just about exploring forms and 01:06:10.269 --> 01:06:13.429 shapes and the rest like that. it's also about 01:06:13.429 --> 01:06:17.210 exploring the erotic part of life too which is 01:06:17.210 --> 01:06:19.730 not which is not even bad i don't know since 01:06:19.730 --> 01:06:23.230 when i don't know what started making us think 01:06:23.230 --> 01:06:25.829 that when there is a mention of the word eroticism 01:06:25.829 --> 01:06:28.909 it's that automatically but and then a friend 01:06:28.909 --> 01:06:31.010 of mine asked me this question he said do you 01:06:31.010 --> 01:06:36.269 think that in this age and time if um michelangelo 01:06:36.269 --> 01:06:42.380 sculpted on someone's ass and kept it in a gallery 01:06:42.380 --> 01:06:44.420 do you think it's going to sell for so much amount 01:06:44.420 --> 01:06:49.380 and after so much dedication on it we found that 01:06:49.380 --> 01:06:52.500 truly it's going to actually it's going to actually 01:06:52.500 --> 01:06:54.980 like be called the masterpiece and at the end 01:06:54.980 --> 01:06:57.639 of the day you just see that it is the emerging 01:06:57.639 --> 01:07:01.920 creators or the emerging artists in the new field 01:07:01.920 --> 01:07:06.739 that gets to like bear most of this role ah no 01:07:06.739 --> 01:07:09.079 it is not something we should see it is something 01:07:09.079 --> 01:07:11.440 that shouldn't be talked about but yeah aside 01:07:11.440 --> 01:07:16.099 from seeing new art apps the exploration of forms 01:07:16.099 --> 01:07:22.480 state and also the way we came to this world 01:07:22.480 --> 01:07:25.900 right i also tend to see nude art too i've also 01:07:25.900 --> 01:07:28.519 had the exploration of the erotic side of humanity 01:07:28.519 --> 01:07:35.500 right and i there was a question that was true 01:07:35.500 --> 01:07:40.460 which is the difference between how was the line 01:07:40.460 --> 01:07:46.360 between objectification and using the body as 01:07:46.360 --> 01:07:51.559 a muse for the art and for me personally it was 01:07:51.559 --> 01:07:53.679 the way the question was answered is actually 01:07:53.679 --> 01:07:55.860 brilliant I think at the end of the day it's 01:07:55.860 --> 01:07:58.659 more of the treatment of the subject how the 01:07:58.659 --> 01:08:00.780 intention I think Maria said is more of the intention 01:08:01.340 --> 01:08:05.239 And I agree with her too. It's the intention 01:08:05.239 --> 01:08:09.639 behind it and also the treatment of subject. 01:08:09.860 --> 01:08:15.239 One of the most controversial paintings in the 01:08:15.239 --> 01:08:19.720 world is a painting called Madame X by John Singer 01:08:19.720 --> 01:08:23.460 Sargent. Was it John Singer Sargent? Yeah, I 01:08:23.460 --> 01:08:27.979 think that's his name. The painting was so controversial 01:08:27.979 --> 01:08:32.989 that people had... the subject rather had to 01:08:32.989 --> 01:08:36.090 be um what was this thing called when you kiss 01:08:36.090 --> 01:08:43.890 people away from the society ex ex i think it's 01:08:43.890 --> 01:08:47.390 exiled yes exactly had to be exiled from the 01:08:47.390 --> 01:08:51.329 society because people felt that the work was 01:08:51.329 --> 01:08:56.090 too erotic and trust me when you see it's actually 01:08:56.090 --> 01:08:58.770 an erotic work by the way but when you see the 01:08:58.770 --> 01:09:01.710 work that you're looking at The woman was actually 01:09:01.710 --> 01:09:06.149 clothed from top to bottom. The only thing that 01:09:06.149 --> 01:09:10.630 was off about it is the fact that one of the 01:09:10.630 --> 01:09:15.829 straps of her gown was brought down. And that 01:09:15.829 --> 01:09:19.789 was the most horrific thing. It caused so much 01:09:19.789 --> 01:09:26.529 loss that they had to exile that woman from society. 01:09:27.279 --> 01:09:29.039 so at the end of it and then you can there's 01:09:29.039 --> 01:09:31.640 also a work i can't remember who painted it and 01:09:31.640 --> 01:09:35.020 the title of the work is lost love love locked 01:09:35.020 --> 01:09:39.659 out there was a new painting of um um wasn't 01:09:39.659 --> 01:09:42.979 of this baby that represents love cupid yes cupid 01:09:42.979 --> 01:09:45.119 was banging at the door and he was crying you 01:09:45.119 --> 01:09:49.420 could literally see um the vases and this of 01:09:49.420 --> 01:09:52.020 flower broken and when you read the story of 01:09:52.020 --> 01:09:54.939 how the work was painted you would get you would 01:09:54.939 --> 01:09:57.500 shed tears and so when you look at these two 01:09:57.500 --> 01:10:00.300 things and i compare them side by side one is 01:10:00.300 --> 01:10:05.260 a nude um walk in in the time that the cupid 01:10:05.260 --> 01:10:07.920 was actually naked there and then the other one 01:10:07.920 --> 01:10:11.939 is a crooked woman right well based on the treatment 01:10:11.939 --> 01:10:14.779 of the subject one is considered the one with 01:10:14.779 --> 01:10:16.579 clothes is considered to be erotic while the 01:10:16.579 --> 01:10:19.239 other one without without clothes is actually 01:10:19.239 --> 01:10:24.539 considered to be um a sad a melancholic art right 01:10:24.989 --> 01:10:27.430 and this just goes on to prove the point that 01:10:27.430 --> 01:10:30.329 at the end of the day it's more about the intention 01:10:30.329 --> 01:10:32.949 and the story behind what you're making than 01:10:32.949 --> 01:10:35.989 how much clothes does the person have fun yeah 01:10:35.989 --> 01:10:38.890 so that's that's my point and my take on nudity 01:10:38.890 --> 01:10:47.609 and nudity per se thank you so much kamzi and 01:10:47.609 --> 01:10:51.189 once again i love that each and every one of 01:10:51.189 --> 01:10:54.470 the nude photographers here have different opinions 01:10:54.470 --> 01:10:58.670 and um them not i will not say different um although 01:10:58.670 --> 01:11:00.569 it's different opinions i will not say they are 01:11:00.569 --> 01:11:04.010 very they vary from each other and it's just 01:11:04.010 --> 01:11:06.710 like it's basically i'll call it an eye -opener 01:11:06.710 --> 01:11:08.869 for each and every one of us here especially 01:11:08.869 --> 01:11:11.750 us um we that are not like into nude photographing 01:11:11.750 --> 01:11:16.449 um it's us just learning more about um the world 01:11:16.449 --> 01:11:20.350 of nudity and i also love the point that um as 01:11:20.350 --> 01:11:24.869 he said on um it just being like how i i like 01:11:24.869 --> 01:11:26.649 the part that he said that oh the person was 01:11:26.649 --> 01:11:30.729 exiled for just um the gown plant is he part 01:11:30.729 --> 01:11:32.430 of the groundbreaking or something like that 01:11:32.430 --> 01:11:35.649 and i just basically in my own opinion or what 01:11:35.649 --> 01:11:39.090 i've learned basically that um nudity just sums 01:11:39.090 --> 01:11:41.850 up to how we see it and people have different 01:11:41.850 --> 01:11:46.689 opinion of um what nudity is basically and um 01:11:47.199 --> 01:11:50.100 i feel like it's just um sometimes people feel 01:11:50.100 --> 01:11:52.579 like just showing a bit of skin is considered 01:11:52.579 --> 01:11:57.000 nude and i feel like um the different artists 01:11:57.000 --> 01:12:02.739 here uses as a mood of um self -expression it 01:12:02.739 --> 01:12:06.079 grows beyond being nudity and just being art 01:12:06.079 --> 01:12:10.079 and just being them giving nudity meaning that 01:12:10.079 --> 01:12:13.659 is so rightly deserved and I I lucky wish that 01:12:13.659 --> 01:12:17.899 we don't have as much constraints placed on nudity 01:12:17.899 --> 01:12:21.239 because it's wonderful and I feel like as tamzy 01:12:21.239 --> 01:12:24.619 um rightly said that if michael angelo like painted 01:12:24.619 --> 01:12:27.920 an ass rock or like molded um a butt it would 01:12:27.920 --> 01:12:31.960 sell for uh much and i feel like okay after he 01:12:31.960 --> 01:12:34.140 said that he got me thinking that is it that 01:12:34.140 --> 01:12:39.760 um the person that makes the art um is it that 01:12:39.760 --> 01:12:42.779 um we view art differently based on who makes 01:12:42.779 --> 01:12:47.489 the art or like um will nudity be more acceptable 01:12:47.489 --> 01:12:51.529 right now if it was all those famous artists 01:12:51.529 --> 01:12:54.130 of the past like if they were really into nudity 01:12:54.130 --> 01:12:57.010 do you think that nudity would be like really 01:12:57.010 --> 01:12:59.930 really acceptable now can anyone answer like 01:12:59.930 --> 01:13:03.109 it's like a conversation like if famous artists 01:13:03.109 --> 01:13:04.909 of the past come back today now and they are 01:13:04.909 --> 01:13:07.210 really super into nudity do we think that nudity 01:13:07.210 --> 01:13:09.770 should be like accepted more than it is accepted 01:13:09.770 --> 01:13:12.890 right now Kamsi you can like feel free to like 01:13:12.890 --> 01:13:20.859 answer like okay so personally i do think i don't 01:13:20.859 --> 01:13:25.399 think it's about um uh i think it's about also 01:13:25.399 --> 01:13:28.939 who's painting by the way and it's not as regards 01:13:28.939 --> 01:13:32.899 to the artist it's more like we human beings 01:13:32.899 --> 01:13:35.739 have these double standards for like a lot of 01:13:35.739 --> 01:13:41.199 things so the the thing that we would share the 01:13:41.199 --> 01:13:42.680 thing that most people are going to like shy 01:13:42.680 --> 01:13:45.649 away from saying or the thing that they are going 01:13:45.649 --> 01:13:47.909 to cause art if it is someone that is growing 01:13:47.909 --> 01:13:50.970 doing it when someone when you're able to like 01:13:50.970 --> 01:13:52.949 break through that barrier and now i'm speaking 01:13:52.949 --> 01:13:56.590 from i'm speaking from my understanding as a 01:13:56.590 --> 01:14:00.229 nude artist in lagos and do that right i maybe 01:14:00.229 --> 01:14:03.930 it's quite different when i mean either ada spoke 01:14:03.930 --> 01:14:09.689 about how um it's quite different in prague um 01:14:09.689 --> 01:14:15.039 being a nude artist but Being in Africa and deciding 01:14:15.039 --> 01:14:18.920 that what you want to do is to work with the 01:14:18.920 --> 01:14:25.000 human body. That's like another whole war under 01:14:25.000 --> 01:14:29.960 the sun. And yeah, I do feel that people would 01:14:29.960 --> 01:14:34.840 actually accept it if it was a big artist. Let's 01:14:34.840 --> 01:14:38.800 not even go so far as to start talking about 01:14:38.800 --> 01:14:41.479 Michelangelo. Let's talk about, say, Sloane. 01:14:41.899 --> 01:14:47.680 or Irinzi or all of these like top painters in 01:14:47.680 --> 01:14:49.560 Nigeria if they are the ones that were like painting 01:14:49.560 --> 01:14:52.859 UDT like yeah sure sure sure and as far as they're 01:14:52.859 --> 01:14:55.520 able to like as far as they see that oh my god 01:14:55.520 --> 01:14:58.220 after that are like accepting it and that's the 01:14:58.220 --> 01:15:01.279 thing about that and that thing about this the 01:15:01.279 --> 01:15:09.060 art in in this particular culture that I find 01:15:09.060 --> 01:15:12.109 myself um again i'm speaking from like a personal 01:15:12.109 --> 01:15:15.770 perspective right um there is always this need 01:15:15.770 --> 01:15:20.789 for the big guys to accept these things first 01:15:20.789 --> 01:15:24.010 before then the people are the other the people 01:15:24.010 --> 01:15:26.210 on the bottom be like okay if the big guys can 01:15:26.210 --> 01:15:28.350 accept it which are like the galleries if you 01:15:28.350 --> 01:15:30.189 guys can accept it okay fine that means you can 01:15:30.189 --> 01:15:31.930 go on with it and that's where the whole double 01:15:31.930 --> 01:15:34.310 standards coming so because these artists are 01:15:34.310 --> 01:15:36.449 already like big if they are painting it it's 01:15:36.449 --> 01:15:38.510 quite like okay they are big artists so do you 01:15:38.510 --> 01:15:40.890 really know what art is Maybe this one is just 01:15:40.890 --> 01:15:42.689 as serious with his life. This particular one 01:15:42.689 --> 01:15:44.569 that does grow is just as serious with his life. 01:15:44.729 --> 01:15:47.289 And that's how I view it. And that's what I most 01:15:47.289 --> 01:15:52.229 think is definitely going to happen is grandmasters 01:15:52.229 --> 01:15:55.489 come back and then they start painting just nude 01:15:55.489 --> 01:15:59.390 works. And again, they actually did paint mostly 01:15:59.390 --> 01:16:02.109 nude works too back then. But yeah, that's my 01:16:02.109 --> 01:16:04.329 own take. I don't know if I not have something 01:16:04.329 --> 01:16:13.729 else. Fine, do you have anything to add? Well, 01:16:13.789 --> 01:16:18.350 I think I may agree with many of the things he 01:16:18.350 --> 01:16:24.079 said. And the point is... The subjectivity is 01:16:24.079 --> 01:16:28.180 the real clue here. The point that everybody, 01:16:28.579 --> 01:16:33.239 the reading that you make of any image is linked 01:16:33.239 --> 01:16:36.199 to your knowledge, to your culture, to your beliefs, 01:16:36.340 --> 01:16:39.699 to your fears, to everything that makes you. 01:16:39.979 --> 01:16:43.399 And then the interpretation of the work is going 01:16:43.399 --> 01:16:46.619 to change from one person to the other, to the 01:16:46.619 --> 01:16:50.170 other a million times. So the artist... uh as 01:16:50.170 --> 01:16:53.470 artists as creators cannot be thinking about 01:16:53.470 --> 01:16:56.390 this i mean the i have to work with the things 01:16:56.390 --> 01:16:59.109 that i love to do and and i only do it because 01:16:59.109 --> 01:17:02.149 i love you know the the what i'm what i'm achieving 01:17:02.149 --> 01:17:06.270 uh and then people come and and you can hear 01:17:06.670 --> 01:17:08.369 So many different interpretations. Some people 01:17:08.369 --> 01:17:11.670 think some images are creepy or mysterious or 01:17:11.670 --> 01:17:15.609 haunting. I did a work on flowers and another 01:17:15.609 --> 01:17:18.489 photographer friend of mine told me that those 01:17:18.489 --> 01:17:21.489 images are the most erotic ones I have done. 01:17:21.750 --> 01:17:25.949 And there was no remote intention of being erotic. 01:17:26.390 --> 01:17:30.390 while photographing flowers so it's his for me 01:17:30.390 --> 01:17:33.590 it is his interpretation of the work and and 01:17:33.590 --> 01:17:36.869 i you know i have no control over that uh so 01:17:36.869 --> 01:17:39.090 you know if probably you ask when you're asking 01:17:39.090 --> 01:17:42.909 about famous people doing doing nudity they have 01:17:42.909 --> 01:17:46.510 i mean well -known artists just involve nudity 01:17:46.510 --> 01:17:49.810 as the natural part of their work and and then 01:17:49.810 --> 01:17:53.250 uh you know it is being accepted as normal uh 01:17:53.250 --> 01:17:57.149 and even at that listen here i think the problem 01:17:57.149 --> 01:18:00.609 is the the the way people capture the image how 01:18:00.609 --> 01:18:04.689 process the image because uh here uh in a school 01:18:04.689 --> 01:18:09.529 here in the us in the state of florida One mother 01:18:09.529 --> 01:18:14.010 made a formal protest that she was complaining 01:18:14.010 --> 01:18:18.449 that one teacher was showing the David, the Michelangelo 01:18:18.449 --> 01:18:22.329 statue, the David, in the school, and the teacher 01:18:22.329 --> 01:18:25.949 was expelled from the school only for showing 01:18:25.949 --> 01:18:28.649 the art of Michelangelo, the statue of David. 01:18:28.890 --> 01:18:32.350 So, you know, you have to have a very twisted 01:18:32.350 --> 01:18:36.029 mind to feel that that statue is pornographic. 01:18:36.840 --> 01:18:39.100 But, you know, that's the way she took it. And 01:18:39.100 --> 01:18:42.399 then she issued a complaint. And the professor 01:18:42.399 --> 01:18:46.539 who was showing that in classroom was expelled 01:18:46.539 --> 01:18:51.020 from his work. So there's no way you can control 01:18:51.020 --> 01:18:56.909 how people see the work that you're doing. regardless 01:18:56.909 --> 01:18:59.529 of your intention. I mean, of course, if you're 01:18:59.529 --> 01:19:02.470 being explicit in showcasing the body, well, 01:19:02.590 --> 01:19:05.449 there is an obvious intention of trying to be 01:19:05.449 --> 01:19:08.689 aroused or to arouse people towards an erotic 01:19:08.689 --> 01:19:11.789 feeling or something. But most of us are being 01:19:11.789 --> 01:19:15.210 very careful not to be explicit precisely because 01:19:15.210 --> 01:19:17.949 that's, let's say, a simple way, a relatively 01:19:17.949 --> 01:19:22.729 simple way of separating what would be an homage 01:19:22.729 --> 01:19:26.239 to the body. than compared to just showcasing 01:19:26.239 --> 01:19:30.539 a gynecological view of the body. So there's 01:19:30.539 --> 01:19:32.819 a very big difference between one approach and 01:19:32.819 --> 01:19:36.000 the other. And then the intention of the creator 01:19:36.000 --> 01:19:39.500 obviously has an impact on the viewer. But if 01:19:39.500 --> 01:19:42.390 you're not trying to be gynecological... then 01:19:42.390 --> 01:19:45.529 there is a secondary levels of readings, the 01:19:45.529 --> 01:19:48.069 different layers in the image that a lot of people 01:19:48.069 --> 01:19:50.329 just don't see it or don't believe in that or 01:19:50.329 --> 01:19:54.609 don't accept them. And the creator cannot control 01:19:54.609 --> 01:19:57.710 that. It's a matter of you doing whatever you 01:19:57.710 --> 01:20:01.170 love and showcasing it to the world and see how 01:20:01.170 --> 01:20:03.970 people react. You don't have no control whatsoever 01:20:03.970 --> 01:20:12.260 on how people see your work. Thank you. Thank 01:20:12.260 --> 01:20:15.500 you so much, Fine Art and Kamzi. Your insight 01:20:15.500 --> 01:20:19.420 to this was well received. We really love learning 01:20:19.420 --> 01:20:23.939 from you guys. You guys give different insights 01:20:23.939 --> 01:20:29.979 to nudity and to how it is received, basically, 01:20:30.100 --> 01:20:34.960 and how people receive it based on who created 01:20:34.960 --> 01:20:38.239 it, basically. And I thank you guys for inputting 01:20:38.239 --> 01:20:41.500 to the space and joining the space. Yeah, thank 01:20:41.500 --> 01:20:45.840 you so much for joining the space and contributing 01:20:45.840 --> 01:20:49.319 to it. And yeah, we've come to the end of Art 01:20:49.319 --> 01:20:52.100 on Frames, season two, episode one, that talks 01:20:52.100 --> 01:20:56.119 about art, nudity, and censorship. And I hope 01:20:56.119 --> 01:20:58.000 each and every one of you learned a lot from 01:20:58.000 --> 01:21:01.279 the different artists that spoke and had to contribute. 01:21:01.579 --> 01:21:05.460 And I hope we can all learn to love ourselves 01:21:05.460 --> 01:21:09.840 and take nude photographs of ourselves. Yeah, 01:21:09.859 --> 01:21:13.020 just keep expressing yourself. And I hope we 01:21:13.020 --> 01:21:15.199 see you next episode. Thank you so much, Faina. 01:21:15.260 --> 01:21:17.619 Thank you, Kamzi. Thank you, Aida. And thank 01:21:17.619 --> 01:21:20.060 you, Maria, for joining us. I'm still your co 01:21:20.060 --> 01:21:23.800 -host, Kafani. And the host is Vulcan. Over to 01:21:23.800 --> 01:21:28.300 you, Vulcan. Thank you guys so much. Thank you, 01:21:28.300 --> 01:21:30.800 everyone. And also, you can tune in the podcast 01:21:30.800 --> 01:21:34.060 on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or anywhere you listen 01:21:34.060 --> 01:21:36.960 to your podcast. Thank you, guys. Thank you very 01:21:36.960 --> 01:21:38.220 much for the space.