a couple of days ago on my TikTok feed and somebody
was talking about this. And this is one of the
VPs, the big VPs over at Wizards of the Coast.
And he he came out and of course it was on LinkedIn,
right? Came out on LinkedIn. LinkedIn is fucking
useless. Anyway, about the future of Dungeons
and Dragons. And so I'm going to read his statement.
And Jay, I want you to know what I want to know
what you think. He goes. He talks a lot about
coming to Wizards of the Coast and what he's
doing. He goes, here's what we did today. We
shifted our structure internally and D &D moved
to a full franchise model, meaning everything.
Books, video games, film, and TV. Everything
touching the franchise lives under one roof.
The impact here cannot be overstated. This is
massive for D &D and will allow a strong, coordinated,
and well -funded approach for the franchise,
and most importantly, for the fans. So they've
moved on to a franchise model basically saying
nope, we're not we're not really a game publisher
anymore Are you in any way surprised by this
move by Wizards of the Coast? Not really no,
I mean no Are you surprised by this? No, and
I think one of the reasons I wanted to touch
on this story This for a lot of people who were
who've been talking about this and I ran it again
I ran to this a lot of my tick -tock right which
was we're so surprised Dude they've been and
I put this out a few weeks ago my tick -tock
with something else happened They've been telegraphing
this for years for years. They've been talking
about this now I'm going to tell you whose fault
it is It's gamers fault It's y 'all's fault You
did this right Because I and I love you guys
right, but here's the facts, right You guys they
don't especially tabletop RPG players right y
'all don't spend money you spend shit You don't
spend any fucking because it's not like magic.
It's not like Pokemon. It's not like other games
like video games even right Tabletop RPG players
do not spend money right and Every release in
an addition is a law of diminishing returns,
right? And I'm going to explain this and Jay
feel free to jump in here anytime You think what
I'm saying is wrong or you'd like to add to the
record? Okay, let's take an average five player
group five of you In an average five player group,
four of them are going to buy the player's handbook.
Four of you are going to buy the player's handbook.
Why? Because there's always going to be that
one guy in the group that just borrows everybody
else's shit and doesn't buy the player's handbook.
The DM's guide. The DM's going to buy it and
then there's going to be the other guy in the
group who's just kind of a completionist and
a collector and he's going to buy it. That's
two. Monster manual, same thing. DM's going to
buy it. One per group and the one guy who's a
completionist, right? Well, now you've gotten
through the three core books. Now let's talk
about adventure modules. Who buys that? The DM.
You buy one per five players. One, okay? Rise
of Tiamat, Curse of Strahd. Doesn't matter. You're
not buying five copies per play group. You're
just not, okay? Every single release is a law
of diminishing returns, okay? This is why they've
been pushing to a subscription model. This is
why they've been doing all the other BS they've
been doing. And Baldur's Gate 3 taught them a
lesson. The tabletop community is just not that
big. They knew this already and Wizards knows
how big the community is. The amount of people
who play tabletop RPGs compared to the amount
of people who play video games, watch television,
go to movies, right, is miniscule. Right? And
what Dungeons & Dragons has is a very valuable,
very recognizable intellectual property that's
been around for 50 fucking years. Right? And
quite frankly, again, it's a law of diminishing
returns. Okay? And you guys don't spend money.
Right? That's it. I mean, that's really what
it boils down to. Okay? And so am I in any way
shocked that they're going, hey, we got to go
full franchise mode, right? This is MCU of fucking
role playing games, right? Nope, not surprised
at all. And again, I've said this and you can
go back on this fucking channel. You can go to
my TikTok. You can go back to this channel though.
And how many times I've said, if Dungeons and
Dragons, if Wizards of the Coast could never
publish another fucking book again, they wouldn't.
They don't want to be in the printing business
and they don't want to be in the logistics business
Fuck that. Why do I want to print things and
ship it deal with tariffs and all this other
BS? Nope Okay It's it's there okay Before I get
to the the chat questions that are coming in
along this thingy Jay, do you have any anything
to add to my sorry guys like It sucks, but this
is what it is. No, because like, I, I think you're
a hundred percent correct. Like, um, I, this
is something I didn't really understand, um,
because like, once you come out with a rule book,
like, I know that there's multiple additions
to the rule book. I really do. But once you have
a rule book and like, you're a DM, like why would
you need another rule book? Like once you, once
you buy, you can also just like go to eBay, right?
And just buy secondhand. You don't have to buy
books. Um, and then we covered this like a few
weeks ago, I believe like using AI to like help
DMS, like, and then you're just cutting, you're
cutting Dungeons and Dragons completely out.
Like it's, I, Yeah, I, I'm not surprised. And
I, you know, we talked about this, even at Comic
-Con, like the printing business itself is a
horrible business to be in. Like it's hard to
actually make that profitable. So yeah, I'm not
surprised by this. Um, yeah, I don't know. That's
a, that's really all I have to say about it.
Um, somebody in the chat says, Prices have gone
up and paychecks have gone down. This is true.
This is absolutely true. And the cost of this
has changed significantly. And it's also due
to changing consumer habits, right? Because I'm
going to combine two other questions that just
came in the chat. Why did it work for all those
years before? And this wasn't a problem in the
80s and 90s. And I will explain this. Very, very
easily. Right. And I saw this when I was publishing
my game and I've talked to I don't know how many
publishers. OK. And if I knew this question was
going to come in, I would have grabbed a couple
of books. In fact, I'm going to do that right
now. So hang on two seconds. OK, quickly while
he's gone, let's talk about the real topics like.
I think Alex should get better lighting in his
bookshelf. Like, what is that? Like, where is
he? He's in the darkness. Like, he has a lightsaber.
It's a light. Top right corner. That thing turns
on. Like, why is that not on? You know, I mean,
oh, he's back. Okay. Okay. Oh, okay. He's back.
Somebody, somebody asked. Somebody asked the
question so now I'm gonna answer the question
Okay, and we're gonna talk about a design is
an early early 2000s. Okay. This is a pretty
cool little book right here It's for 3o. It's
called the hero builders guidebook. It MSRPed
for $14 and 95 cents. Okay Now I'm gonna kind
of see if I could flip through this book so you
guys can get it a few okay This it's a lot of
words There's not a crap ton of art Okay It's
a total of like 70 pages 64 pages Right and it's
got a lot of like, you know Family stuff and
how to do life events and how to build a character
and it's just kind of a fun little splat book
Okay, this was the last module that was released
for Advanced Dungeons the Dragons second edition
Okay, it's called the apocalypse stone. It was
designed to destroy your campaign again black
and white These are not gloss pages and there
ain't much art in it. Okay Now we're gonna go
this the 2014 players handbook, right? Okay very
glossy pages and art fucking everywhere Art everywhere.
Okay So here's the thing and again, I've talked
to so many publishers about this. Okay Those
first two books, which were like $14, $15, which
are black and white, non -glossy pages with not
much art, but a lot of gaming material. Do you
know what happened to those books? Nobody bought
them. Nobody bought them. Gamers now will not
buy something unless it's in full color, with
glossy pages, right? In hardcover, right? with
lots and lots of art. And do you know what the
single most expensive thing to put into a role
-playing game book is? Art. The art cost for
Identico was somewhere around $25 ,000. That's
how much we spent on art. It was by far the single
largest line item of cost to publish our game.
Okay, and again the problem is gamers Will not
even if the material is the best you could write
the best material ever written. Okay Okay It
will not sell Somebody in the chat saying this
is a Gen Z issue. No, it really starts with Millennials
So I'm gonna fully pull it on the millennial
generation and here's the thing. It's filtered
to the old timers, too They won't buy it anymore
unless it's high quality, right? And I'll tell
you something else. The printing cost, when you
go to that higher quality of paper, that higher
grade paper, that higher gloss paper, and in
full color, right? The printing cost doubles.
Doubles, okay? Somebody's saying, I will, yeah.
You are the exception that proves the rule, okay?
The reason it worked for so long is you could
come out with a splat book like that, like five
times a year, and as opposed to two people in
the group buying it, like three or four of them
would, right? and you can get a lot more out
of it, right, until gamers just stop buying that
stuff, right? It's like DLC. It honestly was
a lot like DLC. You had your core book, your
three core books, the player's guide, DM's guide,
monster manual, and then every little piece of
that, the stronghold builder's guide, the hero's
book, all that stuff. It's DLC. That's what it
is. And gamers right around the mid -aughts decided
they were done with it. right they just weren't
spending money on it anymore and that was not
going to be the style of game they wanted anymore
they didn't want all this stuff they didn't want
crunchy they didn't want more stuff they didn't
want too many words they wanted pretty pity okay
now the other thing that somebody's going to
come at me with is well what about the indie
guys here's the thing i had the largest selection
of independent rpgs in the entire seattle metro
it hardly sold okay for all the talk about people
who say they want indie RPGs they're you know
i'm just gonna say they're fucking lying they
are lying okay most of them are like oh i want
to support it no you don't no you don't okay
i had stacks of that crap and people just didn't
buy it okay um so everybody who's getting upset
that dnd is like oh we're going franchise mode
Right? And Jeremy Crawford and Chris Perkins
left Wizards. And D &D is not for the gamers
anymore. Do you know why? Because you guys don't
spend any money. That's all there is to it. Okay?
Am I happy about this? Not particularly. I think
it's iffy for the brand, but I'm not shocked
because the amount of money they can make in
TV, movies, and video games is ten times what
they make in role -playing games. Yeah Yeah So
if you're out there complaining about this whole
D &D situation first off if you're surprised
I don't know what to tell you I've been talking
about this for Four or five years now on this
show on other shows on every media book. None
of this is a surprise D &D again, I encourage
you to read their investor reports Jay and I
have been over some of the investor reports from
Wizards on this channel Right where we reviewed
them. They've been telegraphing this for years
that this was the way they were going So don't
be don't be surprised and if you're upset I Don't
know what to tell you Like what did you expect?
Maybe actually and let me pose that question
to you Jay Realistically for all the people who
are upset about this. What what are they expecting?
Like what about? What did, what did you expect
to happen? Well, one, I don't know why you guys
do this. You guys get like Alex. So wound up
and upset. Um, come on now. Uh, but so I think,
I, I think this is, you know, a lot of consumers,
not all consumers. Okay. Maybe not the people
in our chat that's watching our stream because
you guys are amazing, but consumers want the
world for nothing really. And you just can't
do that. And I think they get upset when companies
will pivot to try to make sure that they survive.
Cause I mean, I think that, I mean, obviously
they want to become richer and make more money,
obviously, but, but also As a company, you have
to make these pivots to try to stay afloat. Like,
you know, Alex, I was there for the gamers after
dark. That was a pivot for you guys. You have
to kind of like sometimes test new things out,
see how it works to try to stay afloat. So there
you go. Yeah, I Don't know so some of the chance
that gamers need to come to Jesus moment I think
that this is a thing across kind of geek dumb
It's it it comes down to I don't know if that's
gonna happen there have been so many things There
are so many things that have happened over the
last four or five years from the OGL debacle
To everything else that D &D has done sending
Pinkerton's to people's houses and things like
that That every time I turn around it was like
I'm swearing off wizard. No, you're not. No,
you're not The fact of the matter is is that
that there come to Jesus is probably never gonna
happen Somebody else said outside of things like
D &D Beyond this is the end of RPGs. I don't
think it's the end of RPGs Here's the thing about
about RPGs and and a lot of people who know me
know that I play with know this to this right
here That's stacks of RPG books. You know, it's
really cool about that. I own those I Have enough
RPG shit in my thing and enough dice in my house
where I can run campaigns until the day I die
and never run out of material Never Because once
you own the books once you have them they're
yours Right and unlike video games. You can't
take my you can't take my games away from me.
My books are right there. They're mine So unless
my house burns down you're not taking my RPGs
away from me. So I Don't use the end of RPGs.
I do think that this it's another one of the
reasons why this industry struggles, right? And
it goes back to the story we talked about earlier
today, which is the diamond distribution story,
right? Whether it's comic books or tabletop RPGs,
these Geekdom thingies, because of the way the
business runs, because of cashflow, like you
are always two bad months away from done, right?
That's what happened to us with our game store.
We were just... two bad months away from being
done all the time and then it just stacked us
boom boom and then we were toast right um it
was just nothing else we could do so take that
for what it's worth uh jay do you have any closing
thoughts on this particular topic that is how
the cookie crumbles let us know down in the comments
below