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Welcome back everyone for another deep dive.

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This time we're really getting into

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the psychology of money by Morgan Housel.

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And this one, it's not your typical Wall Street how-to guide.

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Yeah, definitely not.

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This is about digging deeper, you know?

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Looking at the psychology behind our financial decisions.

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I think what makes Housel's book so interesting is he,

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it's like he peels back the layers

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and shows you what's really going on behind the scenes.

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Exactly, like why we make the choices we do with money.

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And right off the bat, he challenges us

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to rethink what wealth actually means.

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Right, it's not just about being rich.

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He makes this clear distinction between being rich

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and being wealthy.

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And those two things, they can get mixed up pretty easily.

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I mean, we often think of being rich as having all the stuff,

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the fancy cars, the huge house.

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But Housel argues that true wealth, it's something different.

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Yeah, it's more about having that financial freedom,

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that feeling of autonomy where you're not stressing

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about every paycheck.

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Exactly.

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And he brings this to life with a story about his own father.

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His dad was a doctor, but he was super frugal,

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saved a ton of money.

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And that allowed him to retire early

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from a really demanding job.

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So he found happiness by having that freedom

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that his wealth gave him.

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It really makes you think, like, are we so caught up

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in wanting things right now that we're missing out

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on that bigger picture?

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It's so easy to get caught in that trap,

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like you were saying, with Keeping Up with the Joneses.

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We forget what's truly important.

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And Housel points out this kind of crazy thing.

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The average American today, they make twice as much

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as someone in the 1950s.

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Really?

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Yeah, but they're actually less happy.

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Wow.

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That's where this idea of expectations

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and comparisons comes in.

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I feel like we're constantly bombarded

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with these perfect images online.

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Everyone's on vacation, always wearing the best clothes.

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It's hard not to compare yourself.

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It's tough.

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And Housel has this great story about flying first class.

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He remembers being 35 and thinking

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he was the most amazing thing.

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Oh, yeah, I bet.

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But when his seven-year-old son flew first class,

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he didn't even care.

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Because it was just normal for him.

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Exactly, like you was expected.

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So it didn't have the same impact.

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That's a great point.

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Like, what are we comparing ourselves to?

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Yeah.

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And how is that affecting not just our happiness,

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but also our financial decisions?

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Because it probably is.

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Absolutely.

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It ties into why some financial behaviors

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just don't seem to make sense.

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Like, lower income groups often taking bigger risks

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with things like gambling.

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I can totally relate to that.

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Back in college, I was broke.

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And in a moment of pure desperation,

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I gambled my entire student loan payment on a football game.

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Yeah.

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Let's just say I learned a very expensive lesson that day.

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Ouch.

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But Housel suggests that maybe these behaviors come

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from wanting respect and recognition.

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If you don't have other ways to achieve that,

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like through your accomplishments or your personality,

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maybe material possessions or the dream of winning big,

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they fill that void.

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So it's not really about the money itself.

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It's about what it represents.

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Exactly.

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Like the status or validation you hope it will bring.

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It's a reminder that our financial decisions

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are rarely just logical.

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So true.

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They're tied to our emotions, our aspirations.

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Even our sense of identity.

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And that leads to something I found really fascinating

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in the book, the idea of endurance in building wealth.

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Oh, yeah.

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That's a big one.

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Housel really debunks this myth of getting rich quick.

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He says the key to investing, it's

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not about finding that one magic stock or timing

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the market perfectly.

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Right.

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It's about saying the course.

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Patience and consistency.

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That's what matters.

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He has some pretty compelling evidence to back that up too.

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Did you know that like 99% of Warren Buffett's wealth,

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it came after he turned 60?

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Really?

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Yeah.

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That's the power of compound growth over time.

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He also tells this amazing story about Ronald Reed.

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He was a janitor.

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And he ended up amassing an $8 million fortune.

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8 million?

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Yeah.

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Just by investing steadily in blue chip stocks

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and leaving them alone for 70 years.

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70 years.

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Crazy.

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Talk about a long game.

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Exactly.

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And it shows you, you don't need to be some Wall Street

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genius to build wealth.

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It's about discipline, consistency,

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and letting time do its thing.

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It's a message that can be really empowering.

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For sure.

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Because it means anyone can do it.

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Right.

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You just need to be patient.

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And that brings up another important point that Housel makes.

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The biggest risks are often the ones we don't see coming.

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That's so true.

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We tend to focus on the risks we can measure and predict.

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But life, it doesn't always follow the script.

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Things happen.

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Pandemics, natural disasters, economic crashes.

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And those unexpected events, they can totally derail our plans.

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And to show this, Housel shares this crazy story

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about surviving an avalanche.

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Oh, yeah.

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That one was intense.

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He talks about how it was all just random chance,

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a series of small decisions that ended up saving his life.

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He calls it the butterfly effect.

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Where tiny, unpredictable things can

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have these huge consequences.

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And it reminds us that we can't control everything.

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So how do we deal with all this uncertainty?

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Well, Housel's advice is to build a financial buffer that

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feels almost too big.

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OK.

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Prioritize having cash on hand.

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Minimize debt.

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So it's not about being afraid or hoarding money.

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It's about having that security and flexibility

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to handle whatever life throws at you.

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Exactly.

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It feels like having a safety net.

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That makes a lot of sense.

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It gives you peace of mind.

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And that feeling of security, it brings

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another interesting question.

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How much is enough?

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Yeah.

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That's something a lot of people struggle with,

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especially those in the fire movement.

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Financial independence retire early.

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Oh, right.

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The fire phones.

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It sounds amazing.

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Achieve financial independence.

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Retire young.

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Do what you love.

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Yeah.

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It sounds idyllic.

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But Housel points out that a lot of people who do this,

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they end up feeling bored or even depressed.

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Really?

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Why is that?

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Because for a lot of people, work

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gives them purpose and structure,

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and it provides social connection.

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So you're suddenly taking away a big part of their life.

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Exactly.

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And that can be tough to adjust to.

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So it seems like enough.

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It's not about stopping everything altogether.

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Right.

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It's about having the freedom to choose what you work on.

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Aligning your work with your values and passions.

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Exactly.

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And Housel tells this funny story about his friend Shaq.

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After Shaq sold his company, he

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told Housel to take a year off and do nothing.

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Nothing.

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Yeah.

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Like absolutely nothing.

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That's pretty different advice.

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Shaq's point was that if you're always hustling and striving,

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you can burn out.

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You lose perspective.

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Exactly.

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You need time to rest and recharge

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to rediscover what you're passionate about.

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That really resonates with me.

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We're in this culture that glorifies being busy all the time.

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But taking time to yourself is so important.

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It's essential.

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It makes you wonder, what would you

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do if money wasn't a factor?

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That's a great question to think about.

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What kind of work would you do?

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What would truly excite you?

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And Housel doesn't shy away from talking

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about the complexities of success either.

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He even says that success itself can be a trap.

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How so?

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Well, he says that success can lead to complacency.

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We start believing our own hype,

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overestimating our abilities.

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And underestimating the role of luck.

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Right.

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We become blind to our weaknesses

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and less willing to change.

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He uses this great example of Jerry Seinfeld.

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Remember how he ended Seinfeld when it was at its peak?

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Yeah.

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It was one of the most successful sitcoms ever.

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And he just walked away.

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Why would he do that?

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Because he felt like the creative spark was fading.

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He knew that success was actually

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holding him back as a comedian.

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So it's about recognizing when it's time to reinvent yourself.

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To evolve.

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Even if it means getting outside your comfort zone.

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It's a powerful message.

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And this all ties into another concept

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that Housel talks about, the compounding of good and bad.

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OK.

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That sounds interesting.

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Tell me more about that.

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Think about how positive changes usually happen.

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They're slow and gradual, almost invisible.

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Like what?

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Like improvements in health care.

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Right.

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Or reductions in poverty.

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Oh, OK.

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Those things happen incrementally.

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We barely notice them.

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It's like watching grass grow.

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Exactly.

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But negative events, those tend to be more dramatic and sudden.

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Like a pandemic or a stock market crap.

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Right.

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They grab our attention because they're disruptive.

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And we're wired to react more strongly

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to those immediate threats than to those slow, gradual trends.

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And this happens in our personal lives, too.

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Think about unhealthy habits, sleep deprivation, chronic stress.

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Those things might not have immediate consequences.

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But they build up over time.

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And eventually, they have a big impact

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on our health and well-being.

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It's a good reminder to pay attention to those slow burns.

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The seemingly small things that can actually

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have a huge effect in the long run.

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And this leads to one of the most thought-provoking ideas

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in the book, the power of narrative

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in shaping our decisions.

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The best story wins.

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I can see how that applies to things like marketing or politics.

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But how does it work with personal finance?

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Well, think about someone like Ken Burns,

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the documentary filmmaker.

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His success, it doesn't come from uncovering

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brand new information.

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It comes from his ability to tell a captivating story.

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So he brings history to life through storytelling.

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Exactly.

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And that's what makes him so successful.

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So it's not just about the facts and figures.

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It's about how they're presented,

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the story that's built around them.

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And this can be both good and bad.

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Howzel warns us about charismatic people

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who use storytelling to spread misinformation,

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especially in the world of finance.

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It's easy to get caught up in a good story,

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even if it's not true.

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So we need to be careful.

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We need to think critically, evaluate information objectively,

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separate fact from fiction.

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And resist getting swept up by a story

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just because it sounds good.

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Exactly.

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It's about understanding how narratives, both positive

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and negative, they can shape our perceptions

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and influence our financial choices.

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And this goes back to what we were talking about earlier

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with expectations.

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If we set realistic expectations

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and don't fall for those get rich quick schemes,

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we're less likely to be misled by those false narratives.

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Precisely. It's about recognizing the stories we tell ourselves

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about money success and happiness.

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Are those stories helping us or holding us back?

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That's a key question.

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And it leads to this really important question.

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What story are you telling yourself about money?

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Is it a story of scarcity and limitations?

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Or is it a story of abundance and possibilities?

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Because those stories, they often have more influence

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than the numbers themselves.

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It's like those stories become our own personal financial

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blueprint.

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And just like compound interest can grow your wealth over time,

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those negative patterns and beliefs,

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they can also compound.

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And they end up eroding your financial well-being.

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That's a good point.

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It makes you realize how important it is

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to really look at those subtle habits and mindsets

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that might be holding us back, those slow burns

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as we were talking about.

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Exactly.

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And I think that's what makes this deep dive

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with Morgan Housel so powerful.

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It goes beyond just giving you investment tips or strategies.

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It's about understanding that human element of money.

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Yeah, the emotions, the biases, the stories we tell ourselves.

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It's about recognizing that financial success isn't just

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about the numbers.

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It's about making choices that are aligned with your values.

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And that ultimately lead to a richer, more fulfilling life.

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Couldn't have said it better myself.

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So keep questioning those narratives.

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Stay curious.

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And remember, the journey to wealth,

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it's as much about self-discovery

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as it is about dollars and cents.

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Such great advice.

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Thanks for joining me for this deep dive.

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And to all our listeners out there,

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we'll see you next time.

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It's like we're constantly writing our own financial stories,

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even if we don't realize it.

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And just like compound interests can multiply your money

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over time, those negative patterns and beliefs,

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they can multiply too.

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And they end up hurting you financially.

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It makes you realize how important

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it is to really look at those little habits and ways

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of thinking that might be holding us back, those slow burns

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we talked about.

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Yeah, for sure.

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And I think that's what's so powerful about this book,

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the psychology of money.

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It's not just about investment tips or strategies.

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It's about understanding how much our emotions and biases

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affect our relationship with money.

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It's about recognizing that financial success

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isn't just about the numbers.

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It's about making choices that align with what you believe in

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and ultimately living a more fulfilling life.

368
00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:14,560
Exactly.

369
00:12:14,560 --> 00:12:15,400
Well said.

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So keep questioning those stories.

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Stay curious.

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And remember, the journey to wealth,

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it's about self-discovery as much as it is about money.

374
00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:24,680
Absolutely.

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Couldn't agree more.

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It's been great having you on the show.

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Thanks for sharing your insights.

378
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My pleasure.

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Thanks for having me.

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And to all our listeners out there,

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keep exploring those narratives.

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And we'll see you next time for another Deep Dive.