WEBVTT

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Hi, volleyball fans, and welcome back to Volley

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Talk, the podcast created for volleyball lovers

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who want to dig deep into what is going on in

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NCAA and international volleyball. I'm your host,

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Sarah Pavan. I'm an Olympian, beach volleyball

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world champion, former Nebraska Cornhusker, and

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longtime pro, both indoor and on the beach. And

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I'm Adam Schultz, former indoor player, international

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volleyball coach, and the show's resident stat

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guy. Another week, another chance to dissect

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some volleyball. I don't want to say it was a

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wild week, but there were definitely some eyebrow

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-raising moments that happened on the NCAA side.

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The NCAA committee announced their top 16. Still

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confused why they bothered to do that, but we

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will dive into that. Something to talk about.

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Something for the announcers to go over. We had

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some thoughts. Okay. Adams also got a game. He's

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back in action with his game. I like this one,

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too. I think it's going to be fun. I don't know

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what I'm getting into, as always, so we'll see

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what happens. But be sure to stick around at

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the end of the episode because we have an interview

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with an absolute legend in the American volleyball

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landscape and current chairperson of the Love

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Foundation, Kathy DeBoer. So it was a pleasure

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to get to talk to her and we learned a lot. So

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we are very excited for this episode. Let's get

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started. So weekly highlights, happenings, you

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know the deal. We're always a little behind on

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things, but we do them anyway. Things stayed

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pretty consistent. There were only a few jumps,

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I guess, worth mentioning. Miami and Minnesota

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traded spots. Miami went from 18 to 14. Minnesota

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went from 14 to 18. It's still shocking to me

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that they're in the top 26, 25. I don't know

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how they're in the top 25. Obviously, Miami's

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ranking is going to drop after their loss. which

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we will talk about in a second. Baylor dropped

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to 20 from 16. And UCLA made a reappearance in

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the top 25 at 23. So those were the worthy jumps.

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We also obviously go over our unexpected results

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from the week. So Tennessee got upset by Florida

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in five. Florida doesn't get enough credit. It's

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just like a little inconsistent. They have potential.

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They are good. But it's like they can't string

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it together for an extended period. But I definitely

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think they're better than some teams in the top

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25. Yeah. Inconsistent like the rest of the NCAA.

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Yeah. Outside the top two. Yeah. I would say

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it's pretty inconsistent. But I think they should

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be in the top 25. They're definitely better than

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some teams that are there. We watched that game.

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It was fun to watch. Tennessee, I haven't watched

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enough of them, but I enjoyed watching them too.

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After watching them, I thought, here's a team

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that's really well -rounded. They looked well

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-coached. Their execution was good. They're like

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a lot of teams. They don't have a stud, and they

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don't have somebody to lean on. But watching

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them, I thought, this is good volleyball. I'm

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curious to watch more of them. They left me wanting

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to watch them play again, which I will do this

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week. Cal got their first ranked win since...

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February 2021 beating Miami in five. And I'm

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sorry. You've got to not be that team. You've

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got to not be that team. But you also need to

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not be Miami beating Pitt and then completely

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making it seem like a fluke by dropping to Cal.

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And they lost to SMU. And SMU is a good team.

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SMU is a good team. So, like, I'm not blanking

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at that one. But it's completely invalidated

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that win against Pitt by losing to Cal. Yes.

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You guys, come on. It's unfathomable. I don't

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even know what to say about that. Should not

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happen. Because they hammered them the first

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two sets. Do you just forget how to play volleyball

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for three sets after that? Or you're already

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ready to go home? No, but I watched the first

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three sets of that match. Cal is not good. No.

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Okay. You have to try to lose to them. Yeah,

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that was eyebrow raising, to say the least. Another

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one. No offense to Cal. But kind of me. Another

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one. Pitt went five with Notre Dame. But again,

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I'm going to come back to this. I said this would

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happen. I said this would happen. If Babcock

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is not scoring a thousand points for you and

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nobody else is doing anything, it's an issue.

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No, she did though. She scored over 30 points.

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Yeah, I'm being a little facetious here. You

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can't. One man show. Yeah. We'll talk about this

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later because we highlight this in the Louisville

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section. The rest of Pitt needs to remember that

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they're on the team. And they need to be included

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in what's going on. It's not only their fault.

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The team needs to be a team plus Babcock instead

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of just the Babcock show. Washington beat Penn

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State in five. Oregon beat Minnesota in four,

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which brings back the question, how the heck

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is Minnesota still in the top 25? They've been

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decimated, as we talked about last week, decimated

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by injuries. They're not getting like noteworthy

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wins here, anybody. Here's my question to you.

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Do you think those injuries should be taken in?

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to account right when they happen? Or should

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you have to lose? Like, we all know... No, you

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shouldn't have to lose, but they are. It's backwards

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to me. I look at Minnesota and go, okay, they've

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lost three or four of their best players. They're

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not going to be very good. They should no longer

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be ranked. No, you can't be predictive in the

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ranking. You have to go... I think you have to

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go based on performance. Right now, I don't think

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Minnesota's performing at a level that... Because

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they lost to UCLA last weekend, who was unranked.

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Now they lost to Oregon, who is unranked. Fair,

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but they should drop faster. You're not dropping

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fast enough, so take notes. But we know that

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their season's a bit of a write -off due to injury.

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It's nobody's fault, but that's just the reality

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of the situation. They're not going to make a

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miraculous comeback. If they're still in the

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top 25 by the end of conference play, I quit.

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I won't quit, but you know what I mean. And then

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we had USC beating Wisconsin in four. I feel

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like we're not allowed to say anything about

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Wisconsin because there's always somebody mad

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when we do. We ripped them a new one last week,

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so I'm just going to leave that there. Period.

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They lost in 40 USC. Let's move on. I didn't

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get a chance to watch that one, and I haven't

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looked at the stats, but I'm curious. How many

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of me call your plate? We'll let the people do

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the talking on the YouTube comments. So that's

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the rundown of some noteworthy matches. We are

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going to highlight Louisville's weekend. They

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had two big matches against SM and Pitt, so we

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are going to dive into that whole situation here

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in a little bit. But that's the NCAA. Another

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thing that I think is worth mentioning this week.

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Is Corneliano's Italian title streak was brought

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to an end this weekend. Milano beat them in the

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Supercopa final. Corneliano has won 18 Italian

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titles in a row. That is dynasty material, everybody.

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And it just got snapped. My heart is broken because

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I love a dynasty. I love excellence. Throw the

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underdogs away. I don't like an underdog win

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at all. But, yeah. I mean, Milano's not exactly

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an underdog. They're not an underdog, but I feel

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like everybody's an underdog against Corneliano.

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I am meaning it from that perspective. If any

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team was going to do it, I'm glad it was Milano

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because they've been the most consistent aside

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from Corneliano in recent years. But I felt like

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that was worth mentioning because that is huge.

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We'll see if they can get their own streak going

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now from here on out. I wouldn't count on it,

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but it was cool nonetheless. So, you know, the

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typical rundown, ranking update, noteworthy match

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update, a little extra sprinkled in. But that

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is what we had for our highlights this week.

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All right. Let's dive into the NCAA's top 16

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feel. Do you want to go 1 to 16 or 16? Let's

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go 1 to 16 because I feel like there's going

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to be a little more movement of opinion at the

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top. Number one, Nebraska, followed by Texas,

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then Pitt, then Kentucky. I mean, yes. Pitt is

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my question mark. I would put Kentucky ahead

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of Pitt, but then I'm fine with Pitt being at

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four for now. I don't know who I would put ahead

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of them. What about Stanford? I mean, Stanford

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lost to Louisville. Again, you could. It lost

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to Miami. Yes. Babcock's playing really well.

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I don't love where Pitt is going. I think they've

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had a tougher schedule up until this point. Would

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I argue if they would have put Stanford ahead

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of Pitt? No. That's not a deal breaker to me.

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I have no arguments with Nebraska, Texas, or

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Kentucky, though. No, not at all. I think those

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are, I mean, Nebraska and Texas, in my opinion,

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have separated themselves. I think Kentucky's

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a close third. Yeah, I agree with that. Okay,

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five through eight. Okay, so we have SMU at five,

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Louisville at six, Arizona State at seven, and

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Purdue at eight. What's your thought? What have

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any of these teams done? You can't just say that.

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Okay, okay, okay. Who would you put? SMU has

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a number five team. Are you kidding me right

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now? Granted, they beat Louisville. Fine. Yes.

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The thing to remember, though, this is relatively

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formulaic, I think. RPI, KPI. No, they look at

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all that. I don't know how much of it is computer

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driven or like statistically driven. They like

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consider all those factors. Let's go. Who do

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you think is better? Take strength of schedule.

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This is hard because like once Nebraska and Texas

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are out of the mix, falling off a cliff here.

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The drop off is steep. This is the thing that

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I've come to realize over the last couple of

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weeks is that consistency is a huge issue right

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now. It's not really about which team is better.

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It's about who can put somewhat close to their

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full potential on the floor for a whole match.

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Okay, so at this point, we've watched Purdue

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play a couple times recently, SMU a couple times.

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Do you think that SMU and Louisville are ahead

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of Purdue? I do. Do you think they're better?

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I do. I think they have more weapons. I think

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Purdue is a better team. I don't think they have

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the weapons to compete with those two teams.

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Like they don't have. I've watched Arizona State.

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No, no. I would put Purdue ahead of Arizona State.

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Arizona State is getting the nod because of their

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record and the conference they're in. They're

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not that good to me. So would you put Purdue

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ahead of them? Yeah. I would probably put TCU

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ahead of Arizona State as well. But they're in

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the same conference. That's the issue. We have

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to wait and see. I don't think they've played

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that match. But if I had to pick right now, I'd

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like TCU. They haven't beaten anybody good since

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August when they beat the number two Penn State.

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Which everybody was beating Penn State. Exactly.

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They would have lost to an ATU club team at that

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point. Penn State lost to TCU with a full roster.

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Yes. So I think that's the only reason they're

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getting that level. I mean, they've beaten the

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ranked opponents in their conference. So I think

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they beat Utah, they beat Colorado, they beat

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BYU, who are all ranked. But also... Not particularly

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good. Do I think Arizona State is better than

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Purdue? No. Do I think they're better than Wisconsin?

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Probably not. Better than Stanford? Also no.

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Better than Creighton? Probably also no. That

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one seems like a nod to a conference leader.

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More than deserved. The SMU Louisville discussion,

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fine. I'm just not used to being in SMU. It's

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the top five. That's an issue. The top eight,

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fine. We can handle it. But the biggest eyebrow

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raise is Arizona State. Correct. I think they

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belong in the top 16, but maybe 14, 15, 16. 9

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through 12, we've got TCU, Creighton, Stanford,

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Wisconsin. This is where things get dicey for

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me. I think Stanford should be in the top 10.

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Yes. These probably should be. Seven. You think

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that they are not as good as SMU? I understand

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they lost to Louisville. I get it. I'm curious

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to see what happens when they play. I think that

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game is going to be very good. I think as of

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right now, based on who SMU has beaten, they

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have earned a spot higher than Stanford. Do I

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think that that's necessarily going to be the

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case come the end of conference play? No, I predicted

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Stanford to win the conference. I'm going to

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stick with that. But I understand why that ranking

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is what it is, and I can get behind the logic

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of that. I think they need to be way higher.

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I would have put them in five or six. Wisconsin,

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they lost an unfortunate match to UCLA and now

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to USC. I think that they are better than several

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of the teams that were ranked ahead of them,

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though. You have to remember, set or hurt, probably

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not going to be out for that long. Coming back,

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I agree. They're probably better than Arizona

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State. I might have Wisconsin at 10. Has Wisconsin

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played Purdue yet? I don't believe so. And that's

00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:35.179
going to be, I'll have that game circled on my

00:13:35.179 --> 00:13:37.720
calendar. I think that'll be very telling. Stanford,

00:13:37.820 --> 00:13:40.840
Wisconsin, those are red flags to me. I understand

00:13:40.840 --> 00:13:43.740
they're taking into account RPI, KPI, all these

00:13:43.740 --> 00:13:46.860
metrics, blah, blah, blah. Come on. Where would

00:13:46.860 --> 00:13:50.919
you put TCU ahead of Wisconsin at this point?

00:13:51.200 --> 00:13:55.960
No. You're looking SMU, Louisville, Stanford,

00:13:56.320 --> 00:13:59.850
Wisconsin, Purdue. Would that be better in your

00:13:59.850 --> 00:14:03.230
mind? I would do even like an SMU, Stanford,

00:14:03.450 --> 00:14:10.509
Wisconsin, Louisville. Okay. Just leave it to

00:14:10.509 --> 00:14:14.389
me. I will just take care of it. I'm wondering

00:14:14.389 --> 00:14:16.690
if they're also considering matchups in this

00:14:16.690 --> 00:14:19.090
potential top 16 or if they're just straight

00:14:19.090 --> 00:14:21.610
up ranking these teams top 16 or if they're like.

00:14:21.950 --> 00:14:23.570
Oh, but we have to make sure that we have enough

00:14:23.570 --> 00:14:26.669
Big Ten versus ACC versus blah, blah, blah. Totally.

00:14:26.730 --> 00:14:28.750
They have to knock each other out. There's always

00:14:28.750 --> 00:14:32.289
political back -channeling happening. Now, this

00:14:32.289 --> 00:14:34.190
means absolutely nothing, right? They're going

00:14:34.190 --> 00:14:35.990
to redo this. This is not set in stone. It means

00:14:35.990 --> 00:14:38.490
nothing, but it's interesting to discuss. Correct.

00:14:38.850 --> 00:14:41.570
So give me the rest because I believe that there

00:14:41.570 --> 00:14:43.409
are some teams on this list that should not be

00:14:43.409 --> 00:14:47.419
here. So 13. Through 16 is Texas A &M, Indiana,

00:14:47.720 --> 00:14:50.220
Penn State, Minnesota. So Penn State and Minnesota

00:14:50.220 --> 00:14:52.259
for me should not be on this list. Indiana, Penn

00:14:52.259 --> 00:14:54.740
State, Minnesota, what are you doing here? I

00:14:54.740 --> 00:14:57.500
feel like Indiana is getting a nod for a decent

00:14:57.500 --> 00:15:00.340
performance so far. Best ranking that they've

00:15:00.340 --> 00:15:02.980
had in their history. You know what? I'm happy

00:15:02.980 --> 00:15:05.379
for you. Congratulations. Do you need to be in

00:15:05.379 --> 00:15:08.120
a top 16 list? I don't think so. Two questions.

00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:09.779
One, who's getting the snub that should be on

00:15:09.779 --> 00:15:12.019
there? And then... Creighton, to me, is always

00:15:12.019 --> 00:15:14.460
the interesting question because their conference

00:15:14.460 --> 00:15:18.559
play is a yawn fest. They don't play any matches.

00:15:18.620 --> 00:15:21.100
It doesn't mean anything. They always win. But

00:15:21.100 --> 00:15:23.940
where do they rank against the good teams? I

00:15:23.940 --> 00:15:27.019
mean, that's the question. You have to strictly

00:15:27.019 --> 00:15:29.860
go based off of their preseason, which they had

00:15:29.860 --> 00:15:33.059
some losses in preseason. That is going to carry

00:15:33.059 --> 00:15:35.700
them through to a top 10 ranking? I don't know.

00:15:35.820 --> 00:15:38.519
I don't know. Who's missing? If you're replacing

00:15:38.519 --> 00:15:41.720
Indiana, Minnesota, and Penn State, who are you

00:15:41.720 --> 00:15:44.659
replacing them with? So some teams that I'm going

00:15:44.659 --> 00:15:47.340
to throw out here that could be potentials to

00:15:47.340 --> 00:15:50.779
replace them, maybe a Tennessee. Okay, I would

00:15:50.779 --> 00:15:53.960
go Tennessee over Indiana. Maybe a Miami. I know

00:15:53.960 --> 00:15:57.879
they lost to Cal. Okay, fine. But Miami, again,

00:15:57.940 --> 00:16:00.539
if we're discrediting like a couple losses and

00:16:00.539 --> 00:16:03.279
saying, hey, you know, whatever. But yeah, do

00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:05.559
I think Miami is better than Minnesota and Penn

00:16:05.559 --> 00:16:08.240
State? Yes. The big thing, though, is they have

00:16:08.240 --> 00:16:10.019
one person who scores all their points. But guess

00:16:10.019 --> 00:16:13.259
what? So does Pitt. So does Penn State. So does

00:16:13.259 --> 00:16:17.519
Wisconsin. So it's like, who cares? I think that

00:16:17.519 --> 00:16:20.600
they get a nod there. I don't know who else I

00:16:20.600 --> 00:16:24.059
would put in. Maybe Kansas. Maybe Kansas. I just

00:16:24.059 --> 00:16:26.559
think the Big 12 is significantly weaker than

00:16:26.559 --> 00:16:29.759
the other Power 4 conferences. So I understand

00:16:29.759 --> 00:16:32.620
you want to diversify. You want to diversify

00:16:32.620 --> 00:16:34.899
for the sake of the NCAA. But at the same time,

00:16:34.980 --> 00:16:38.179
we're looking for the top team. So who would

00:16:38.179 --> 00:16:41.299
I replace them with potentially in Miami or Tennessee,

00:16:41.460 --> 00:16:45.799
but I don't know how Minnesota is hanging around.

00:16:45.860 --> 00:16:47.700
I don't even know how Minnesota is hanging around

00:16:47.700 --> 00:16:50.460
the top 25, let alone making this list. I agree.

00:16:50.600 --> 00:16:53.000
Okay. And Penn state. Yes, they got it together

00:16:53.000 --> 00:16:55.700
versus Wisconsin, but show me a little more.

00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:59.679
That's it. Like it's literally been, do you know

00:16:59.679 --> 00:17:01.879
who I think has an outside chance of making the

00:17:01.879 --> 00:17:06.130
top 16 USC? I, I like a lot of their pieces.

00:17:06.710 --> 00:17:10.269
They're inexperienced. I think that they might

00:17:10.269 --> 00:17:12.309
crawl their way up there. We'll wait and see.

00:17:12.410 --> 00:17:15.470
I think that's a stretch. It might be. But if

00:17:15.470 --> 00:17:19.150
I'm looking at a team that has potential, that

00:17:19.150 --> 00:17:21.450
I think there's a lot of room for improvement,

00:17:21.529 --> 00:17:23.950
where they have the physical assets to be good,

00:17:24.170 --> 00:17:26.910
they come to mind. I put them in there over...

00:17:27.099 --> 00:17:29.519
Minnesota. Minnesota, like, okay, say what you

00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:31.579
want about Indiana. I know I was harsh. Minnesota,

00:17:31.579 --> 00:17:34.119
Penn State, you're literally, you've been going

00:17:34.119 --> 00:17:38.299
on a downward spiral since August. How are you

00:17:38.299 --> 00:17:40.400
even in this discussion? I mean, Penn State has

00:17:40.400 --> 00:17:43.400
leveled out a little bit, but Minnesota is -

00:17:43.400 --> 00:17:45.240
Leveled out, they won one game in the last however

00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:48.200
long. True. Top eight, I can get behind, minus

00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:51.460
Arizona State, rearrange a few things. Nine to

00:17:51.460 --> 00:17:54.720
16, I'm like - Tough. How did you come up with

00:17:54.720 --> 00:17:57.660
this? Yeah. And who approved that to be published?

00:17:57.920 --> 00:17:59.460
And I want to know what the criteria was. Did

00:17:59.460 --> 00:18:01.980
you have to include X number from Big 12? Did

00:18:01.980 --> 00:18:03.940
you have to... Did you have to make sure the

00:18:03.940 --> 00:18:06.039
matchups would line up? Blah, blah, blah. I'm

00:18:06.039 --> 00:18:08.279
curious what goes into that. But if we're just

00:18:08.279 --> 00:18:11.059
looking at have you earned it and who's better?

00:18:11.220 --> 00:18:16.039
Eh, not a fan. Not a fan. So we didn't address

00:18:16.039 --> 00:18:18.539
these two matches in the weekly highlights, but

00:18:18.539 --> 00:18:23.319
they were somewhat unexpected results. I don't

00:18:23.319 --> 00:18:25.079
know if I would like... They were completely

00:18:25.079 --> 00:18:28.140
unexpected. We expected these to be good matches.

00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:30.640
Both of these matches were on our list of matches

00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:33.619
to watch. We are just going to talk about Louisville

00:18:33.619 --> 00:18:36.380
in general because they were involved in both.

00:18:36.559 --> 00:18:40.240
The matches being Louisville versus SMU and Louisville

00:18:40.240 --> 00:18:44.119
versus it. Louisville was at home for both and

00:18:44.119 --> 00:18:48.230
they lost both in five. Let's start with the

00:18:48.230 --> 00:18:50.650
SMU game. Let's look at the set scores real quick.

00:18:50.829 --> 00:18:53.670
So they lose the first set 22 -25. They win the

00:18:53.670 --> 00:18:58.769
next two 25 -19, 26 -24, lose the fourth 21 -25,

00:18:58.910 --> 00:19:02.509
and then lose the fifth 17 -19. And this is against

00:19:02.509 --> 00:19:06.750
SMU. This is against SMU. What were your initial

00:19:06.750 --> 00:19:10.589
thoughts on that match? I didn't love the match,

00:19:10.690 --> 00:19:14.009
period. I thought it was super messy. I thought

00:19:14.009 --> 00:19:18.339
it was incredibly... inconsistent from both sides.

00:19:18.859 --> 00:19:24.079
Just huge swings of not only swings of points,

00:19:24.259 --> 00:19:26.720
but just hitting percentages were all over the

00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:31.019
place. It was not a fun match to watch for me.

00:19:31.099 --> 00:19:33.500
Well, I think this has been something Louisville

00:19:33.500 --> 00:19:36.539
has been dealing with is scoring points when

00:19:36.539 --> 00:19:38.849
Cressy's in the front row. giving up points when

00:19:38.849 --> 00:19:40.670
she's in the back row. But I don't even know

00:19:40.670 --> 00:19:42.950
if that's the case anymore. These last two matches

00:19:42.950 --> 00:19:44.829
weren't, but I'm saying there has been consistency

00:19:44.829 --> 00:19:47.809
issues in that regard. I don't think they're

00:19:47.809 --> 00:19:50.509
surrounding Cressy anymore, but they're still

00:19:50.509 --> 00:19:54.329
having consistency issues. Let's look at Louisville's

00:19:54.329 --> 00:19:57.869
hitting percentages. Set one, they hit 163. Not

00:19:57.869 --> 00:20:00.549
great. Which they lost. They lost that set. Set

00:20:00.549 --> 00:20:03.769
two, they go 438. They won. Set three, they hit

00:20:03.769 --> 00:20:07.509
209, and they win a squeaker, 26 -24. Because

00:20:07.509 --> 00:20:10.390
SMU's hitting percentage was way worse. 122.

00:20:10.650 --> 00:20:15.390
Set four, they hit negative 028. And set five,

00:20:15.390 --> 00:20:19.789
they hit 138. To me, it didn't seem like it was

00:20:19.789 --> 00:20:24.710
anything SMU did. It was self -inflicted. In

00:20:24.710 --> 00:20:29.569
what way? It was a lack of execution. It was...

00:20:30.109 --> 00:20:32.390
hitting airs the thing about not having a stud

00:20:32.390 --> 00:20:35.210
in my opinion is that you can die by a thousand

00:20:35.210 --> 00:20:37.250
cuts well some people would argue that Cressy

00:20:37.250 --> 00:20:39.690
is a stud she's a very good middle but she's

00:20:39.690 --> 00:20:42.690
not a stud studs hit they have 30 kills they

00:20:42.690 --> 00:20:45.589
have 25 kills she's a very good player it's really

00:20:45.589 --> 00:20:47.789
hard to have a stud in the middle I know they're

00:20:47.789 --> 00:20:49.930
trying and I actually really like that for them

00:20:49.930 --> 00:20:53.089
but you can't it doesn't work we're trying I'm

00:20:53.089 --> 00:20:54.950
gonna go back to what I said before when you

00:20:54.950 --> 00:20:57.579
were like They have runs of points when Cressy's

00:20:57.579 --> 00:20:59.880
in the front and the back, but in opposite ways,

00:21:00.140 --> 00:21:01.920
they're not setting her as much anymore. And

00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:05.059
she's not nearly as effective when she is getting

00:21:05.059 --> 00:21:06.839
set as she was at the beginning of the season.

00:21:06.920 --> 00:21:08.880
Teams are shutting her down. Right. But I think

00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:11.680
this is part of the game plan long -term. So

00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:14.279
she's not scoring as much, but she's still got

00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:18.019
30 sets in that match. Okay. Which is the one

00:21:18.019 --> 00:21:21.240
thing I will say for Louisville, which I really

00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.599
like, is that they run a pretty balanced offense.

00:21:24.279 --> 00:21:26.460
in terms of their set distribution. So if we

00:21:26.460 --> 00:21:29.160
look at that, Blackshear played really well against

00:21:29.160 --> 00:21:31.980
SMU, got 50 sets. She's been getting better and

00:21:31.980 --> 00:21:33.799
better as the season's gone. We'll talk about

00:21:33.799 --> 00:21:40.339
her after. Peterson, 47 sets. Chacoin, 36. Cressy,

00:21:40.359 --> 00:21:43.720
30. And the setter is an offensive weapon. We

00:21:43.720 --> 00:21:45.420
had a question which we can talk about later

00:21:45.420 --> 00:21:47.720
in terms of, if you have a really good player,

00:21:47.900 --> 00:21:50.279
why not just set them in tight matches? Like,

00:21:50.279 --> 00:21:52.980
why would you... distribute the ball around your,

00:21:53.000 --> 00:21:56.039
around your team. And I think this is why running

00:21:56.039 --> 00:21:59.920
a balanced offense will pay off in the end. I

00:21:59.920 --> 00:22:02.119
firmly believe that. I think Dan Maskey came

00:22:02.119 --> 00:22:04.039
out at the beginning of the season saying, we

00:22:04.039 --> 00:22:07.480
are going to set Kara Cressy every opportunity

00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:10.640
we get. She is going to be our top attacker.

00:22:10.940 --> 00:22:13.900
And I'm okay with that. Well, it's not happening

00:22:13.900 --> 00:22:18.019
anymore. Yeah, but she's still, the opponent

00:22:18.019 --> 00:22:21.759
needs to focus on her or she will score. She's

00:22:21.759 --> 00:22:24.339
getting a lot of attention from outside blockers,

00:22:24.339 --> 00:22:27.539
from game plans, and it's freeing up some of

00:22:27.539 --> 00:22:30.019
the outside hitters. They need to keep her as

00:22:30.019 --> 00:22:32.099
a threat. She may not be as effective as she

00:22:32.099 --> 00:22:34.960
was before, but they still need to keep setting

00:22:34.960 --> 00:22:37.640
her for them to be successful. I'm not denying

00:22:37.640 --> 00:22:40.319
that. Everybody knows how I feel about running

00:22:40.319 --> 00:22:43.079
the middle. Everybody knows how I feel about

00:22:43.079 --> 00:22:45.519
setting the middle, even if they're not scoring.

00:22:45.700 --> 00:22:49.890
I am just saying she has taken a dip. Since the

00:22:49.890 --> 00:22:51.890
beginning of the season, makes sense. Teams are

00:22:51.890 --> 00:22:54.349
now aware that she is getting the ball when they

00:22:54.349 --> 00:22:57.049
can get it. I get it. Everything here makes sense.

00:22:57.450 --> 00:23:00.170
I'm just saying, I don't think they're setting

00:23:00.170 --> 00:23:03.549
her quite as frequently as they were. Like, it

00:23:03.549 --> 00:23:06.930
was obscene at the beginning of the season. Things

00:23:06.930 --> 00:23:09.109
have pulled back. Things have come back down

00:23:09.109 --> 00:23:12.930
to earth. And teams have prepared for her, which,

00:23:13.009 --> 00:23:16.789
as I said, makes sense. The crazy thing is they

00:23:16.789 --> 00:23:20.269
lost both those matches in five. And I actually

00:23:20.269 --> 00:23:23.170
like them better after watching those two matches.

00:23:23.490 --> 00:23:26.490
Really? I do. Why? I think. I don't know. I'm

00:23:26.490 --> 00:23:29.130
having a hard time liking them. I know you are.

00:23:29.150 --> 00:23:31.190
But here's why you're having a hard time liking

00:23:31.190 --> 00:23:32.789
them. And I came to this realization watching

00:23:32.789 --> 00:23:35.029
them because you and I generally think the same.

00:23:35.269 --> 00:23:37.529
Blackshear is a little unorthodox. She's got

00:23:37.529 --> 00:23:40.430
a weird approach. She loads her elbow, but not

00:23:40.430 --> 00:23:44.710
her hand. She has a weird arm swing. It's not

00:23:44.710 --> 00:23:49.349
pretty, but she's effective. She's long. When

00:23:49.349 --> 00:23:51.910
she gets the ball, she scores, she makes good

00:23:51.910 --> 00:23:54.789
decisions, and she's been improving all season

00:23:54.789 --> 00:23:57.769
long. You have to give her credit for that. What

00:23:57.769 --> 00:23:59.470
does that have to do with me not liking them?

00:23:59.809 --> 00:24:03.250
What they're doing is it's not pretty to watch

00:24:03.250 --> 00:24:07.769
because it's not all technically sound, but they're

00:24:07.769 --> 00:24:10.410
employing a lot of good principles in my mind.

00:24:10.670 --> 00:24:13.210
Blackshear's getting better. She's big. I like

00:24:13.210 --> 00:24:15.049
what she's doing. She's finding ways to score,

00:24:15.210 --> 00:24:18.140
and I like how competitive she is. So I think

00:24:18.140 --> 00:24:21.359
that's a positive. We were very critical of Chacoin

00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:24.180
at the beginning of the season. My opinion has

00:24:24.180 --> 00:24:27.440
shifted slightly. I generally look at left sides

00:24:27.440 --> 00:24:31.240
or players in terms of what I think their professional

00:24:31.240 --> 00:24:35.579
career or potential would be. And she doesn't

00:24:35.579 --> 00:24:37.740
have any. It's not going to happen for her. It

00:24:37.740 --> 00:24:41.079
won't be a medium PVF player problem. Okay, I'm

00:24:41.079 --> 00:24:42.680
thinking like going to Europe, next level national

00:24:42.680 --> 00:24:44.819
team, right? That's not in the cards for her.

00:24:45.740 --> 00:24:48.950
However... Watching her play at this level against

00:24:48.950 --> 00:24:52.309
good teams, she's very smart. She mixes up her

00:24:52.309 --> 00:24:55.529
shots. She finds holes. When she doesn't have

00:24:55.529 --> 00:24:59.490
a double block, a .k .a. when teams are focused

00:24:59.490 --> 00:25:02.750
on Cressy, she finds ways to score. That is a

00:25:02.750 --> 00:25:06.369
massive caveat, everybody. When she doesn't have

00:25:06.369 --> 00:25:08.930
a double block, she's fine. But you know what?

00:25:09.049 --> 00:25:11.750
It's working for them because they're running

00:25:11.750 --> 00:25:14.920
a balanced offense. They are finding ways. to

00:25:14.920 --> 00:25:17.660
make the most of the players they have. I like

00:25:17.660 --> 00:25:20.720
it. I like it for them. Here's the thing. Chloe

00:25:20.720 --> 00:25:25.680
Chacoin tips way too often against every single

00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:28.640
team I've seen her play against except Pitt.

00:25:29.059 --> 00:25:32.920
She tips the ball all the time. Finally, against

00:25:32.920 --> 00:25:35.380
Pitt, she was just being aggressive and swinging,

00:25:35.500 --> 00:25:38.660
and she was literally unconscious. I don't know

00:25:38.660 --> 00:25:40.900
if it was like an underdog mentality or what,

00:25:41.019 --> 00:25:43.759
or if she felt... Like she had something to prove

00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:46.500
against a quote unquote better team or better

00:25:46.500 --> 00:25:50.339
player in Olivia Babcock. But she was finally

00:25:50.339 --> 00:25:53.539
swinging and it worked for her. Great. But like,

00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:56.000
why the heck are you tipping every single ball

00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:58.319
that isn't absolutely perfect every other time

00:25:58.319 --> 00:26:00.759
I watch you? If she continues to swing, what's

00:26:00.759 --> 00:26:03.019
your opinion of her? It'll probably change. Okay.

00:26:03.079 --> 00:26:05.200
I like what they're doing with Jaquan. I also

00:26:05.200 --> 00:26:07.579
really like their setter. I really like her.

00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:10.059
She's a little inconsistent currently. Setting

00:26:10.059 --> 00:26:13.170
the back ball. setting the back ball on good

00:26:13.170 --> 00:26:15.549
passes. She sets it better from the attack line

00:26:15.549 --> 00:26:17.210
than she does from at the net because at the

00:26:17.210 --> 00:26:18.970
net, it flares off. There's a little bit of a

00:26:18.970 --> 00:26:20.490
tendency to do that on the left side as well,

00:26:20.589 --> 00:26:23.470
but she's super aggressive. I think she went

00:26:23.470 --> 00:26:26.109
10 for 10 against Pitt on her dumping choice,

00:26:26.190 --> 00:26:28.670
so she's a threat, which they also need, which

00:26:28.670 --> 00:26:31.049
balances out the offense and holds the blockers.

00:26:31.150 --> 00:26:33.269
I just think fundamentally, Louisville's doing

00:26:33.269 --> 00:26:37.549
a lot of things that will translate down the

00:26:37.549 --> 00:26:40.210
season. as teams are trying to prepare for them.

00:26:40.269 --> 00:26:41.789
I said this at the beginning of the season, and

00:26:41.789 --> 00:26:44.450
I stick by it. Your combo of Chacoin and Peterson

00:26:44.450 --> 00:26:47.410
is not it. Okay. And people, they're always like,

00:26:47.470 --> 00:26:49.869
Peterson's the top attacker, top point scorer

00:26:49.869 --> 00:26:52.750
for Louisville. That's a problem for me. I don't

00:26:52.750 --> 00:26:55.210
know. For some reason, I am not a fan. I'm not

00:26:55.210 --> 00:26:57.210
saying they're going to make the Final Four.

00:26:57.329 --> 00:26:59.950
I'm saying I think they're doing a good job of

00:26:59.950 --> 00:27:03.069
maximizing the pieces that they do have. And

00:27:03.069 --> 00:27:04.809
I like the fact that they're running a balanced

00:27:04.809 --> 00:27:06.789
offense. Now I have a couple things. I think

00:27:06.789 --> 00:27:10.150
they're missing a huge way of balancing the pieces

00:27:10.150 --> 00:27:12.509
or utilizing the pieces. They don't run a back

00:27:12.509 --> 00:27:15.390
row ball. Well, so this is. At all. This is my.

00:27:15.849 --> 00:27:19.230
Like you're missing a huge opportunity here.

00:27:19.549 --> 00:27:23.230
And an announcer in the game said Dan Meske has

00:27:23.230 --> 00:27:26.430
a love -hate relationship with the pipe. He thinks

00:27:26.430 --> 00:27:28.849
his outsides are too small to run it. You guys.

00:27:29.279 --> 00:27:31.740
In NCAA volleyball, you aren't seeing a triple

00:27:31.740 --> 00:27:34.619
block against any pipe. You're barely seeing

00:27:34.619 --> 00:27:36.880
a double block at this point against a pipe.

00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:39.420
Especially with the middles that you have. Even

00:27:39.420 --> 00:27:41.819
with an undersized left side combo, which you

00:27:41.819 --> 00:27:44.220
have, they can probably figure it out against

00:27:44.220 --> 00:27:46.460
a one man block. And with an aggressive setter.

00:27:46.519 --> 00:27:50.250
To me, that opinion. will be the downfall of

00:27:50.250 --> 00:27:52.690
the team. You need to run one. If they add in

00:27:52.690 --> 00:27:56.750
a medium quick back row ball with both Jacoyne

00:27:56.750 --> 00:28:00.289
and Peterson as a legitimate option, that jumps

00:28:00.289 --> 00:28:02.710
them above a whole bunch of teams. If they don't

00:28:02.710 --> 00:28:05.970
do it, they will struggle. If they add it, look

00:28:05.970 --> 00:28:08.369
out. I think they could be very, very good. I

00:28:08.369 --> 00:28:10.289
mean, I want to be clear. I didn't love their

00:28:10.289 --> 00:28:12.789
games that they played. They can't keep going

00:28:12.789 --> 00:28:14.849
up 2 -1 and then losing the fourth and the fifth

00:28:14.849 --> 00:28:16.890
set. They're not a fifth set team. They lost

00:28:16.890 --> 00:28:19.789
every fifth set game they've played. And they've

00:28:19.789 --> 00:28:21.869
been up 2 -1 in every single five setter they've

00:28:21.869 --> 00:28:25.710
played. They don't have a stud, and studs really

00:28:25.710 --> 00:28:28.329
help in the fifth set. So they need to win in

00:28:28.329 --> 00:28:32.190
four. If they go to a fifth set, the percent

00:28:32.190 --> 00:28:34.750
chance they're going to win is very small. So

00:28:34.750 --> 00:28:37.440
far, it's zero. And that will continue, in my

00:28:37.440 --> 00:28:40.240
opinion. So they need to find a way to be a little

00:28:40.240 --> 00:28:43.440
more consistent with what they're doing, just

00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:45.559
based off the makeup of their team. Because they

00:28:45.559 --> 00:28:47.799
don't have, I think they played Pitt, Babcock

00:28:47.799 --> 00:28:50.240
scored eight points. You're not going to match

00:28:50.240 --> 00:28:53.759
that. It comes down to consistent execution for

00:28:53.759 --> 00:28:56.220
them, given their roster makeup. Can they do

00:28:56.220 --> 00:28:59.019
it? I'm not sure. Blackshear's still young. She's

00:28:59.019 --> 00:29:01.960
getting better. I actually thought their second

00:29:01.960 --> 00:29:04.809
middle, Sherman. has played better in the last

00:29:04.809 --> 00:29:06.470
two matches. I think this weekend was, she had

00:29:06.470 --> 00:29:08.150
a good weekend this weekend. And I think that

00:29:08.150 --> 00:29:10.609
that's really positive for them. Cressy needs

00:29:10.609 --> 00:29:14.710
to be better. She hit 067 against SMU. As a middle.

00:29:14.829 --> 00:29:16.710
As a middle, that's unacceptable. As an outside,

00:29:16.769 --> 00:29:20.990
that's atrocious. As a middle, that's like, where

00:29:20.990 --> 00:29:23.670
did you go? So she does need to find a way to

00:29:23.670 --> 00:29:26.789
do that. I think Cabello as a setter, I like

00:29:26.789 --> 00:29:30.349
what's there. She's a little inconsistent. So

00:29:30.349 --> 00:29:34.680
she needs, again, Louisville dies by a thousand

00:29:34.680 --> 00:29:37.799
little cuts because they don't have a star. It's,

00:29:37.799 --> 00:29:41.980
you know, one setting error, one missed hit on

00:29:41.980 --> 00:29:44.640
the left side, one error from Blackshear that

00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:47.200
kind of grouped themselves together. And in the

00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:48.680
grand scheme of things, it's not a big deal.

00:29:48.700 --> 00:29:51.539
But when those pile up, it's really hard when

00:29:51.539 --> 00:29:53.660
your best outlet is the middle. So those are

00:29:53.660 --> 00:29:54.980
the kind of things that they're going to have

00:29:54.980 --> 00:29:56.720
to clean up. But I think that those are the kind

00:29:56.720 --> 00:29:58.480
of things that get better as the season moves

00:29:58.480 --> 00:30:00.640
on. And I think that's why I'm a little higher

00:30:00.640 --> 00:30:03.450
on them than maybe you are. I have one more thing

00:30:03.450 --> 00:30:05.190
I want to talk about that I don't like that they

00:30:05.190 --> 00:30:07.869
do. Sure. You know what it is? I mean, I can

00:30:07.869 --> 00:30:12.150
think of a couple. It is when Blackshear and

00:30:12.150 --> 00:30:14.410
Cressy are in the front row together. I think

00:30:14.410 --> 00:30:17.630
it's rotation five and they run Cressy on the

00:30:17.630 --> 00:30:19.349
slide because apparently she can't run in front

00:30:19.349 --> 00:30:21.450
of the setter off of two feet. She can only run

00:30:21.450 --> 00:30:23.650
a slide and they bring Blackshear in front for

00:30:23.650 --> 00:30:27.130
like the meter ball. The only time I saw, the

00:30:27.130 --> 00:30:30.390
only time I saw it work. was late in the match

00:30:30.390 --> 00:30:32.490
against Pitt like Blackshear scored a couple

00:30:32.490 --> 00:30:36.390
of them but I'm like if you're gonna run that

00:30:36.390 --> 00:30:40.130
then set Cressy because I they set Blackshear

00:30:40.130 --> 00:30:42.990
on it all the time the percentage that it has

00:30:42.990 --> 00:30:45.130
been working in all the matches I've watched

00:30:45.130 --> 00:30:48.549
very small with the exception of the end of Pitt

00:30:48.549 --> 00:30:50.349
that's a perfect opportunity to run a pipe over

00:30:50.349 --> 00:30:52.650
top of that you're clearly running that play

00:30:52.650 --> 00:30:55.450
because you want to set Cressy up to run the

00:30:55.450 --> 00:30:58.160
slide set her the slide then yeah You know what

00:30:58.160 --> 00:31:00.700
I mean? Or you know what would be great? If your

00:31:00.700 --> 00:31:04.420
middle in Cressy can't run off of two feet, either

00:31:04.420 --> 00:31:06.859
run her on a quick right behind the setter, keep

00:31:06.859 --> 00:31:09.599
Blackshear out there, push a pipe in between

00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:12.759
the middle and the setter and the outside. Or

00:31:12.759 --> 00:31:16.740
if you really want to, run her on the side, bring

00:31:16.740 --> 00:31:19.420
Blackshear on a meter ball behind the setter

00:31:19.420 --> 00:31:22.259
and run a pipe. But I don't like that play. Stop

00:31:22.259 --> 00:31:26.000
doing it. No, it's for whatever reason. They're

00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:28.440
stuck in that, and they think it's a good play,

00:31:28.579 --> 00:31:32.640
and it 100 % is not. Absolutely not. Okay, so

00:31:32.640 --> 00:31:35.940
back to the SMU game. They also had a great opportunity

00:31:35.940 --> 00:31:39.019
because Jaden Livingston went down with an injury.

00:31:39.140 --> 00:31:41.299
What was that, the fourth set? Second set. Second

00:31:41.299 --> 00:31:44.319
set? Yes. Who was leading them in kills? I think

00:31:44.319 --> 00:31:46.380
she had 10 kills at the point that she went out.

00:31:46.680 --> 00:31:50.220
Now, in fairness, SMU's Malaya Jones stepped

00:31:50.220 --> 00:31:52.460
up and played really well. Who was also sick

00:31:52.460 --> 00:31:54.559
for that moment. I sometimes think you play better

00:31:54.559 --> 00:31:57.009
when you're sick. I'm just throwing it out there.

00:31:57.109 --> 00:31:59.710
Yeah. Anyway, that's a conversation for another

00:31:59.710 --> 00:32:02.609
time. But you have to adjust your game plan.

00:32:03.329 --> 00:32:05.170
There's no way she should have scored that many

00:32:05.170 --> 00:32:08.029
points because SMU, you lost their best hitter.

00:32:08.089 --> 00:32:10.930
You need to recalibrate your priorities and make

00:32:10.930 --> 00:32:12.730
sure you're defending the person who's scoring

00:32:12.730 --> 00:32:14.809
points. She should not have scored as much as

00:32:14.809 --> 00:32:16.450
she did. Well, I was going to say I didn't like

00:32:16.450 --> 00:32:18.349
the adjustments. I didn't see any adjustments.

00:32:18.509 --> 00:32:22.150
Well, I'm sorry. They clearly massive red flag

00:32:22.150 --> 00:32:25.509
is like their block defense against a right side

00:32:25.509 --> 00:32:28.210
attack because we saw Malaya Jones go off. And

00:32:28.210 --> 00:32:31.549
then we saw Olivia Babcock completely go off

00:32:31.549 --> 00:32:34.589
for 41 goals. And don't get me wrong. Babcock

00:32:34.589 --> 00:32:37.750
is good, but she shouldn't be that good. 41 kills

00:32:37.750 --> 00:32:40.529
hitting over 400. That is literally. You're doing

00:32:40.529 --> 00:32:43.470
nothing. Whoa. You're doing nothing. Wow. I don't

00:32:43.470 --> 00:32:48.059
love some of the. tactical decisions that are

00:32:48.059 --> 00:32:50.839
being made there so I think not having the pipe

00:32:50.839 --> 00:32:53.819
hurts them a lot I'm looking at Babcock's stat

00:32:53.819 --> 00:32:57.819
line watching that game going okay you have a

00:32:57.819 --> 00:33:01.440
6 -4 player in the front row in Blackshear you're

00:33:01.440 --> 00:33:03.980
not afraid to run her out of the middle move

00:33:03.980 --> 00:33:06.200
her over when you're serving and put her in front

00:33:06.200 --> 00:33:08.799
of Babcock give her a different look I'm sorry

00:33:08.799 --> 00:33:12.569
Babcock Chacoin That's not a great matchup. Okay,

00:33:12.569 --> 00:33:14.309
well, that's how it started. Babcock, Chacoin,

00:33:14.369 --> 00:33:16.670
both in the front row together. Okay, Louisville

00:33:16.670 --> 00:33:19.009
tried to make an adjustment. They completely

00:33:19.009 --> 00:33:21.089
flipped their rotation. But Peterson isn't the

00:33:21.089 --> 00:33:24.569
answer either. Exactly. But then it was like

00:33:24.569 --> 00:33:26.630
Chacoin blocking Babcock when she was in the

00:33:26.630 --> 00:33:30.049
back row, which was also a dumpster fire. So

00:33:30.049 --> 00:33:32.450
I agree with you. The number of times, like as

00:33:32.450 --> 00:33:36.369
a 6 '5 right side for myself, that I had to go

00:33:36.369 --> 00:33:40.539
block on the left side. Yes. I can't even tell

00:33:40.539 --> 00:33:43.359
you the number of times. It's a legitimate strategy.

00:33:43.940 --> 00:33:46.119
As a right side, I had to block on the left side

00:33:46.119 --> 00:33:48.640
to block the other team's right side. But instead

00:33:48.640 --> 00:33:50.660
of doing that, they took a flyer in the fifth

00:33:50.660 --> 00:33:53.779
set, and they brought in Reese Robbins, who hadn't

00:33:53.779 --> 00:33:56.440
played all set. Hey, go in and block Babcock

00:33:56.440 --> 00:33:58.920
for one rotation, because that's the answer.

00:33:59.200 --> 00:34:01.779
Yeah, I'm not sure why they wouldn't do that.

00:34:01.900 --> 00:34:05.220
I'm watching offensively going, okay. I see where

00:34:05.220 --> 00:34:07.660
Louisville is trying to go. I think it can be

00:34:07.660 --> 00:34:10.440
successful. I like what they're doing. And then

00:34:10.440 --> 00:34:12.960
I watch them defensively and go, what? I know

00:34:12.960 --> 00:34:16.659
they get digs, but it doesn't seem like there's

00:34:16.659 --> 00:34:20.239
a concerted strategy around specific players

00:34:20.239 --> 00:34:23.659
who you need to stop. And I also don't love their

00:34:23.659 --> 00:34:27.199
serving strategy. And Adam's like, I like Louisville

00:34:27.199 --> 00:34:31.139
so much better now. No, but listen, I think they

00:34:31.139 --> 00:34:35.630
have potential if they fix a few things. I can't

00:34:35.630 --> 00:34:38.849
buy into that yet. I'm telling you, I like the

00:34:38.849 --> 00:34:41.050
fundamentals they're trying to put in place.

00:34:41.349 --> 00:34:45.030
I think they're stuck in a mentality defensively,

00:34:45.030 --> 00:34:47.090
and they need a little more creativity. They

00:34:47.090 --> 00:34:49.730
need to be able to try a few more things. If

00:34:49.730 --> 00:34:51.690
they can figure that part out, I think they can

00:34:51.690 --> 00:34:55.050
be really tough to beat. A big if. But I will

00:34:55.050 --> 00:34:59.929
tell you, the biggest disrespect I saw happened

00:34:59.929 --> 00:35:03.659
in the pit match, okay? Oh, this is great. Sherman

00:35:03.659 --> 00:35:06.699
was in the front row as the middle. And then

00:35:06.699 --> 00:35:10.099
on Pitt's side, they had Mosher, the setter,

00:35:10.199 --> 00:35:13.460
and Bree Kelly. And, I mean, a left side, either

00:35:13.460 --> 00:35:17.400
one. They put Mosher, who I will say is not a

00:35:17.400 --> 00:35:21.519
good blocker. Mosher is good at serving. He's

00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:24.360
a very good server, very consistent. Yeah. They

00:35:24.360 --> 00:35:27.920
had Mosher in the middle, and they put Bree Kelly

00:35:27.920 --> 00:35:33.159
on the right side. To me, that is saying we failed.

00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:37.219
Do not think that you are a threat at all. If

00:35:37.219 --> 00:35:39.860
that happens, they should have run Sherman every

00:35:39.860 --> 00:35:41.980
ball. We're going to put our worst blocker in

00:35:41.980 --> 00:35:44.699
front of you. We are going to sacrifice Brie

00:35:44.699 --> 00:35:47.260
Kelly being able to block all three hitters just

00:35:47.260 --> 00:35:50.579
because we are telling you we know where you're

00:35:50.579 --> 00:35:55.860
setting the ball. It was like cold. Yeah. Disrespect.

00:35:56.489 --> 00:35:58.610
Dang, okay. But let's look at the Louisville

00:35:58.610 --> 00:36:00.630
Pitt. It's the same thing, but I want to highlight

00:36:00.630 --> 00:36:03.030
it in terms of their hitting stats across the

00:36:03.030 --> 00:36:05.710
different sets. I will say, and I'll say it again,

00:36:05.849 --> 00:36:07.969
because I feel like I've been pretty harsh this

00:36:07.969 --> 00:36:11.469
segment so far. Alicia Coyne stepped up against

00:36:11.469 --> 00:36:15.750
Pitt. She hit the last two balls out to finish

00:36:15.750 --> 00:36:18.369
the match against SMU. She turned it around,

00:36:18.510 --> 00:36:22.269
and she offensively was very good against Pitt.

00:36:22.409 --> 00:36:26.619
I'll say that. So hit 300 in the first set. They

00:36:26.619 --> 00:36:28.820
did lose that one because Pitt hit 325. I think

00:36:28.820 --> 00:36:31.579
Babcock was outrageous in the first set. Babcock

00:36:31.579 --> 00:36:33.960
was just outrageous, period. Right. But then

00:36:33.960 --> 00:36:37.219
in the second set, they hit 394. Third set, they

00:36:37.219 --> 00:36:40.599
hit 379. They win both those sets, and then they

00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:44.440
hit 167 and zero. In the fourth and the fifth.

00:36:44.539 --> 00:36:46.920
And you just can't do that. Like even if you

00:36:46.920 --> 00:36:49.059
can't stop Olivia Babcock. You're going to make

00:36:49.059 --> 00:36:51.039
her life miserable. Even if you're not stopping

00:36:51.039 --> 00:36:53.599
her. You have an opportunity to side out. Like

00:36:53.599 --> 00:36:56.340
get a first ball side out. It's like you can

00:36:56.340 --> 00:36:59.460
play a side out game here. I like their offensive

00:36:59.460 --> 00:37:02.820
distribution. You know Chacon got 46. Blackstreet

00:37:02.820 --> 00:37:05.739
got 32. Peterson 25. They ran a decent amount

00:37:05.739 --> 00:37:07.860
of middle. So again I like those fundamentals.

00:37:08.059 --> 00:37:09.539
And I think that's going to serve them well.

00:37:09.699 --> 00:37:13.360
If they could have stopped Babcock. One out of

00:37:13.360 --> 00:37:17.639
ten times. Even something. Or made her hit more

00:37:17.639 --> 00:37:20.739
balls. She hit a ton of balls, but continue a

00:37:20.739 --> 00:37:23.139
few rallies. Get a couple block touches. She

00:37:23.139 --> 00:37:26.280
scored too many clean kills. And they needed

00:37:26.280 --> 00:37:28.940
to find a way to extend rallies against her and

00:37:28.940 --> 00:37:31.599
get a few stops. And that was just a lack of...

00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:34.719
The thing is, she was just hitting high line

00:37:34.719 --> 00:37:37.599
seam the whole game. She did not have to hit

00:37:37.599 --> 00:37:40.059
angle at all. And against the Louisville Middles,

00:37:40.079 --> 00:37:42.750
who are good blockers, yeah. It makes sense that

00:37:42.750 --> 00:37:45.010
she's going to challenge the outsides first,

00:37:45.190 --> 00:37:48.170
but nobody was stopping her. No adjustments.

00:37:48.570 --> 00:37:52.590
You know what? She is absolutely annihilating

00:37:52.590 --> 00:37:55.130
your left side block. The touches weren't just

00:37:55.130 --> 00:37:57.190
neutral. They were real bad into the stands.

00:37:57.329 --> 00:38:00.329
Okay, the block's not working. Let's slide it

00:38:00.329 --> 00:38:02.789
over. Let's double up down the line with the

00:38:02.789 --> 00:38:06.530
libero and position six, because if she wasn't

00:38:06.530 --> 00:38:08.190
scoring down the line, if she wasn't tooling

00:38:08.190 --> 00:38:12.260
the block to an undiggable tool, She was hitting

00:38:12.260 --> 00:38:15.840
down the line or line seam. Let's wide everybody

00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:18.840
over. Let's shift the whole defense. But that

00:38:18.840 --> 00:38:21.579
didn't happen. No, no adjustments. We need to

00:38:21.579 --> 00:38:25.099
see them be better in that regard. I think personally,

00:38:25.199 --> 00:38:27.059
those were both winnable matches for them that

00:38:27.059 --> 00:38:30.079
they threw away. They had opportunities at home.

00:38:30.440 --> 00:38:32.920
Again, I'm going to say I'm going to give them

00:38:32.920 --> 00:38:34.719
a little more chance because I like the fundamentals

00:38:34.719 --> 00:38:39.820
and what I'm seeing. But can they put some decent

00:38:39.820 --> 00:38:44.469
defensive? strategies in place to slow down big

00:38:44.469 --> 00:38:46.610
hitters. They need to be able to do that. This

00:38:46.610 --> 00:38:49.610
might be the most savage comment yet. Dan Maskey

00:38:49.610 --> 00:38:51.769
needs to spend less time filming his practices

00:38:51.769 --> 00:38:54.150
and putting them on Instagram and come up with

00:38:54.150 --> 00:38:56.849
a list of adjustments and how to counteract teams

00:38:56.849 --> 00:39:00.010
during matches because he does what he does and

00:39:00.010 --> 00:39:03.289
doesn't change. And I'm sorry, you need to have

00:39:03.289 --> 00:39:06.349
like contingency plans for if teams shut you

00:39:06.349 --> 00:39:09.869
down. There are some very good right sides in

00:39:09.869 --> 00:39:14.460
the NCAA. And you have a very small left side

00:39:14.460 --> 00:39:19.139
core. This is a foreseeable problem that needs

00:39:19.139 --> 00:39:21.940
a solution. Just a quick thing on Pitt, though.

00:39:21.980 --> 00:39:24.059
How sustainable do you think what they're doing

00:39:24.059 --> 00:39:28.139
is? It's not. It's not. Olivia ended with like

00:39:28.139 --> 00:39:30.480
70 something sets and the next person had like

00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:34.719
27. What? 27 sets. Like you guys. You can't.

00:39:34.719 --> 00:39:37.119
We're over two times the number of sets. She

00:39:37.119 --> 00:39:40.739
hit like 150 balls this weekend. And here's the

00:39:40.739 --> 00:39:42.960
other thing I'm going to say about Pitt is the

00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:46.239
rest of their players are riding Olivia Babcock's

00:39:46.239 --> 00:39:49.360
coattails at this point. They know she's getting

00:39:49.360 --> 00:39:51.480
the ball. Here's what I'm seeing. Middles are

00:39:51.480 --> 00:39:54.420
not even going up to hit balls to be an option

00:39:54.420 --> 00:39:58.300
anymore. I watched Bree Kelly. slide into a few

00:39:58.300 --> 00:40:00.880
31s as a token play. Didn't even get off the

00:40:00.880 --> 00:40:03.099
ground. They're not taking care of free balls.

00:40:03.219 --> 00:40:05.820
There were two opportunities where got a really

00:40:05.820 --> 00:40:08.159
good touch on Cressy. Bayless is in six. She

00:40:08.159 --> 00:40:10.780
throws a free ball up behind the attack line.

00:40:11.019 --> 00:40:12.820
We know you're going to set Babcock, so it doesn't

00:40:12.820 --> 00:40:14.380
matter. And it doesn't matter where you set her

00:40:14.380 --> 00:40:17.199
from. She's going to score. Ryla Jones came off

00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:19.039
the net, had a free ball, passed it straight

00:40:19.039 --> 00:40:21.460
up in the air at the attack line. I'm sorry.

00:40:21.679 --> 00:40:24.699
You have to take care of the details. Babcock

00:40:24.699 --> 00:40:28.349
is your... golden goose but the rest of you still

00:40:28.349 --> 00:40:31.250
have to do something and part of that is they

00:40:31.250 --> 00:40:33.550
need to get set they need to feel a part of the

00:40:33.550 --> 00:40:35.949
game and they're not the setter's not doing it

00:40:35.949 --> 00:40:38.449
I don't like what she's doing I don't like the

00:40:38.449 --> 00:40:40.949
offense that she runs she's not engaging the

00:40:40.949 --> 00:40:42.710
middles they have two very good middles in Bree

00:40:42.710 --> 00:40:44.789
Kelly and Ryla Jones they need to be getting

00:40:44.789 --> 00:40:46.750
the ball I don't love their outsides especially

00:40:46.750 --> 00:40:49.030
with the injury Bayless hasn't been playing very

00:40:49.030 --> 00:40:51.409
well for me you need to at least have the middles

00:40:51.409 --> 00:40:53.949
going you need to set other people they to me

00:40:53.949 --> 00:40:56.969
are not a team right now They are watching Babcock

00:40:56.969 --> 00:41:00.630
be great. She is. And she is. But it's not going

00:41:00.630 --> 00:41:02.630
to be enough. We're clearly on one today, everybody.

00:41:02.750 --> 00:41:05.230
We're passionate. We have some feelings. We needed

00:41:05.230 --> 00:41:07.630
to share them. Okay? We got a question about

00:41:07.630 --> 00:41:12.610
Louisville. I'm curious if, A, you agree with

00:41:12.610 --> 00:41:15.469
the question, period. Okay. And then, B, what

00:41:15.469 --> 00:41:17.780
your thoughts are. Okay, so here's the question

00:41:17.780 --> 00:41:20.000
that was sent in. From a player slash coach's

00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:23.159
perspective, do you think the confusing way Louisville

00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:26.360
plays, i .e. seeming to always be out of system,

00:41:26.579 --> 00:41:31.880
confusing or just bad passing, is intentional,

00:41:32.179 --> 00:41:35.019
and that's Dan Meske's game plan, or do you think

00:41:35.019 --> 00:41:37.880
because they play six on six so much in practice,

00:41:38.119 --> 00:41:40.539
they feel more comfortable being in these situations?

00:41:41.079 --> 00:41:44.079
Do you think their ability to find unorthodox

00:41:44.079 --> 00:41:47.349
ways to score is because, of a result of that?

00:41:47.989 --> 00:41:50.989
And do you think that this throws teams off so

00:41:50.989 --> 00:41:53.929
they can't get into a rhythm? So I can't speak

00:41:53.929 --> 00:41:56.349
to what they do at practice. Well, he posts about

00:41:56.349 --> 00:42:00.469
it on Instagram. Got it. I think they find unorthodox

00:42:00.469 --> 00:42:03.389
ways to score because they have unorthodox players.

00:42:03.949 --> 00:42:06.889
Blackshear is not, I actually really like what

00:42:06.889 --> 00:42:10.250
I'm seeing from her, minus her arm swing, but

00:42:10.250 --> 00:42:13.550
it's a little funky. And they do offensively

00:42:13.550 --> 00:42:17.429
some weird things. The Blackshear -Cressy movement

00:42:17.429 --> 00:42:22.789
is weird. The no pipe ball is a little weird.

00:42:23.190 --> 00:42:25.070
I think that the setter... Do you think they're

00:42:25.070 --> 00:42:26.989
out of system that much? I don't think they're

00:42:26.989 --> 00:42:28.429
out of system that much, but I think when they're

00:42:28.429 --> 00:42:30.989
in system, they still don't look... Cabello sets

00:42:30.989 --> 00:42:33.610
a few, like, when she misses, she misses. Like,

00:42:33.610 --> 00:42:35.670
she sets left side balls that need to be set

00:42:35.670 --> 00:42:38.150
over from the ref's stand. There are definitely

00:42:38.150 --> 00:42:41.449
times, and especially in transition, like, some

00:42:41.449 --> 00:42:43.639
of their players... Can't put up hittable balls.

00:42:43.679 --> 00:42:45.880
Like when Blackshear has to set, that's trouble.

00:42:46.119 --> 00:42:48.239
I understand the feeling. It's not clean. And

00:42:48.239 --> 00:42:49.860
I think this is one of the reasons you don't

00:42:49.860 --> 00:42:53.639
love them is because it's a little bit messy.

00:42:53.679 --> 00:42:58.059
High technical ability. Yeah. I don't think it's

00:42:58.059 --> 00:43:01.519
intentional from an offensive standpoint. I think

00:43:01.519 --> 00:43:04.280
it's just what they have. The other piece of

00:43:04.280 --> 00:43:07.760
that is their setter is very aggressive, which.

00:43:08.230 --> 00:43:10.710
can kill kind of the flow and the momentum of

00:43:10.710 --> 00:43:13.449
that offensive rhythm. But it's a good thing

00:43:13.449 --> 00:43:15.630
because you keep the other team guessing. It

00:43:15.630 --> 00:43:18.170
does kind of kill that rhythm and what you're

00:43:18.170 --> 00:43:20.769
expecting. I like it for them. I think it works

00:43:20.769 --> 00:43:24.269
for the most part. Again, there's just some consistency.

00:43:24.369 --> 00:43:27.369
Everybody has to make one less mistake in those

00:43:27.369 --> 00:43:31.050
situations. Cabela is young. She hasn't played

00:43:31.050 --> 00:43:33.909
a 5 -1. I think she'll get better. I think Blackshear

00:43:33.909 --> 00:43:36.110
will continue to get better. We're seeing the

00:43:36.110 --> 00:43:38.760
other middle. find a little more rhythm and consistency

00:43:38.760 --> 00:43:41.679
on the floor. Chacoin is elevating her game.

00:43:41.860 --> 00:43:44.420
I think Cabello's connecting a little bit better

00:43:44.420 --> 00:43:45.920
with Chacoin. Now they're finding a little more

00:43:45.920 --> 00:43:48.840
rhythm. I would expect it to look a little cleaner

00:43:48.840 --> 00:43:51.420
as we get toward the end of conference play.

00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:55.760
So things got a little bit messier in the ACC

00:43:55.760 --> 00:43:59.199
this week. As we mentioned earlier, Miami dropping

00:43:59.199 --> 00:44:04.460
that match to Cal. Wowzers. Louisville dropping.

00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:08.599
Two huge matches at home. Pitt going five with

00:44:08.599 --> 00:44:12.519
Notre Dame. We have a lot of mix -ups. Do you

00:44:12.519 --> 00:44:14.980
know what that means? Adam? My prediction of

00:44:14.980 --> 00:44:18.000
Stanford winning the ACC is still alive, baby.

00:44:18.739 --> 00:44:20.480
Everybody thought he was crazy, but here we are.

00:44:20.559 --> 00:44:24.800
There's still a chance. Okay, it is game time.

00:44:25.079 --> 00:44:27.940
Now, for those of you who are new to the podcast

00:44:27.940 --> 00:44:30.389
or... Don't always tune into these segments.

00:44:30.550 --> 00:44:32.550
The way the games work is that I come up with

00:44:32.550 --> 00:44:34.369
something to do and I ask Sarah and she has no

00:44:34.369 --> 00:44:36.829
idea what's going on. So the answers that you

00:44:36.829 --> 00:44:41.349
get are off the cuff. Unprepared. Unprepared.

00:44:41.750 --> 00:44:44.710
And I try to answer as quickly as possible. Yes.

00:44:44.849 --> 00:44:47.869
So that's why this is usually my favorite segment

00:44:47.869 --> 00:44:50.170
because I like being prepared and I like putting

00:44:50.170 --> 00:44:53.550
her feet to the fire. So we will see what happens.

00:44:53.590 --> 00:44:59.030
This game is called Pretender or Contender. I

00:44:59.030 --> 00:45:02.070
am going to list a couple programs, and I want

00:45:02.070 --> 00:45:04.769
you to tell me whether you think they're a legitimate

00:45:04.769 --> 00:45:08.690
contender or if they're a pretender. Now, good

00:45:08.690 --> 00:45:11.929
question. Okay. So for the purpose of this game,

00:45:12.210 --> 00:45:15.389
we are contending for third place. We're going

00:45:15.389 --> 00:45:19.409
to take Nebraska and Texas out because I just

00:45:19.409 --> 00:45:21.590
think they're head and shoulders. But when we

00:45:21.590 --> 00:45:23.610
start looking at some of these other programs.

00:45:24.460 --> 00:45:26.840
Do you think they would have what it takes to

00:45:26.840 --> 00:45:29.500
win? Watch like neither team even make the final,

00:45:29.679 --> 00:45:32.980
which is not unheard of. No. Because every year

00:45:32.980 --> 00:45:34.940
it's like a team is dominating and then they

00:45:34.940 --> 00:45:37.420
just get, they disappear. And that happens. But

00:45:37.420 --> 00:45:39.639
the reality of it is that doesn't mean they're

00:45:39.639 --> 00:45:41.800
not better than the other teams. Yeah, I know.

00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:43.960
Last year Pitt and Nebraska were way better than

00:45:43.960 --> 00:45:46.440
everybody. This year Nebraska and Texas are way

00:45:46.440 --> 00:45:48.780
better than everybody. Okay. And then I want

00:45:48.780 --> 00:45:50.679
you to give me like one or two points as to why

00:45:50.679 --> 00:45:52.400
you think they're a pretender or a contender.

00:45:52.909 --> 00:45:56.389
We're pretending that those two are gone. Okay.

00:45:56.409 --> 00:46:00.389
Program number one. Let's start with Pit. Yeah,

00:46:00.449 --> 00:46:03.849
I think I will say Contender. Simply because

00:46:03.849 --> 00:46:08.829
their middles are competent. They can score when

00:46:08.829 --> 00:46:11.010
they're used. They're not used enough, in my

00:46:11.010 --> 00:46:14.730
opinion. But I think Olivia Babcock is good enough

00:46:14.730 --> 00:46:17.730
that if she is on, she can carry them there.

00:46:18.090 --> 00:46:20.969
Mine's thing for Pit is Pretender. And that's

00:46:20.969 --> 00:46:24.199
nothing against... Olivia Babcock I just don't

00:46:24.199 --> 00:46:25.900
think their setter knows how to run an offense

00:46:25.900 --> 00:46:28.260
or get the middles involved look at Adam getting

00:46:28.260 --> 00:46:31.960
spicy I you know what side of him I have kept

00:46:31.960 --> 00:46:35.199
watching them thinking i'm going to give them

00:46:35.199 --> 00:46:37.099
the benefit of the doubt that they are going

00:46:37.099 --> 00:46:39.980
to start mixing it up or doing different things

00:46:39.980 --> 00:46:42.420
you don't have to mix it up and you can't mix

00:46:42.420 --> 00:46:45.300
it up but you need to set olivia babcock but

00:46:45.300 --> 00:46:47.480
they also yeah they need to run the middles too

00:46:47.480 --> 00:46:49.460
they need something else because when i mean

00:46:49.460 --> 00:46:52.000
i don't disagree with you but i think she is

00:46:52.000 --> 00:46:54.239
good enough to get them there i'm calling pretender

00:46:54.239 --> 00:46:57.599
on this one let's go with kentucky contender

00:46:57.599 --> 00:47:01.150
their outside duo is the top scoring left side

00:47:01.150 --> 00:47:03.449
pair in the country. Honestly, I do like their

00:47:03.449 --> 00:47:06.489
middles. They do a pretty good job with Carr

00:47:06.489 --> 00:47:09.570
and Baltimore. I like the change they made putting

00:47:09.570 --> 00:47:13.030
Daly predominantly on the right side. They're

00:47:13.030 --> 00:47:15.230
pretty, they're solid. Yeah, for those reasons,

00:47:15.289 --> 00:47:17.110
I think you outlined it very well. I think they're

00:47:17.110 --> 00:47:19.050
a contender as well. Here's one where I'm pretty

00:47:19.050 --> 00:47:22.190
sure we're going to disagree. Louisville. I mean,

00:47:22.230 --> 00:47:24.590
I'm not a fan. I'm going to say Pretender. For

00:47:24.590 --> 00:47:27.130
all the reasons that we outlined in the previous

00:47:27.130 --> 00:47:30.760
segment. I'm going to say Contender. I like the

00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:33.699
offensive distribution. I think they're getting

00:47:33.699 --> 00:47:36.340
everybody going. I think as they continue to

00:47:36.340 --> 00:47:37.980
work on that, they're going to be harder and

00:47:37.980 --> 00:47:41.019
harder to stop. I don't see many teams trying

00:47:41.019 --> 00:47:44.599
to make adjustments when they're one trick teams.

00:47:44.800 --> 00:47:47.500
So I think with a little more practice. Well,

00:47:47.519 --> 00:47:49.179
they're not making adjustments either. Well,

00:47:49.219 --> 00:47:50.619
and I was going to say a little less Instagram.

00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:54.599
We might be onto something. Okay, we have three

00:47:54.599 --> 00:47:57.480
more here. And these are all a little more gray,

00:47:57.539 --> 00:48:02.079
I would say. SMU. I don't know, man. I just think

00:48:02.079 --> 00:48:04.880
that the options out there are so limited. I

00:48:04.880 --> 00:48:10.860
think that they are a better end of, like, my

00:48:10.860 --> 00:48:14.840
non -favorite option. I'll say, I don't know.

00:48:14.880 --> 00:48:18.760
I'll say, I don't know. When I compare them to

00:48:18.760 --> 00:48:21.619
Kentucky and Pitt, I'm like, no. Do you think

00:48:21.619 --> 00:48:25.429
the injury? The livings? Yes. That will hurt

00:48:25.429 --> 00:48:28.190
them. Yeah. But they have two freshmen who come

00:48:28.190 --> 00:48:31.389
in to replace her. Okay, fine. I'm going to say

00:48:31.389 --> 00:48:34.849
Pretender just because I, compared to the two

00:48:34.849 --> 00:48:36.510
that I said were contenders, I don't think they're

00:48:36.510 --> 00:48:39.550
as good. I'm going to say Pretender, but for

00:48:39.550 --> 00:48:42.909
a different reason. Okay. I think that you need

00:48:42.909 --> 00:48:45.869
to build culture and you need to go through hard

00:48:45.869 --> 00:48:50.610
things as a team to win big events and to win.

00:48:51.789 --> 00:48:53.989
You can see it. I know they came up with a win

00:48:53.989 --> 00:48:56.489
against Louisville in five, but I think for me

00:48:56.489 --> 00:48:59.909
that has been the exception rather than what

00:48:59.909 --> 00:49:02.070
we come to expect from them. And with the injury,

00:49:02.250 --> 00:49:05.550
I think they have a lot of good pieces, but I

00:49:05.550 --> 00:49:08.949
don't think they're in a place to win yet. If

00:49:08.949 --> 00:49:10.409
they were going to have all of those athletes

00:49:10.409 --> 00:49:12.849
come back next year, different story. I don't

00:49:12.849 --> 00:49:18.469
think so. All right, two more. Wisconsin. I'm

00:49:18.469 --> 00:49:21.349
going to get eaten alive for these. Because if

00:49:21.349 --> 00:49:24.070
I call Louisville and SMU pretenders, then they

00:49:24.070 --> 00:49:27.050
would reason that I should call Wisconsin a pretender.

00:49:27.530 --> 00:49:31.210
Which, okay, fine. I'm going to. Because they

00:49:31.210 --> 00:49:34.349
rely so heavily on Mimi Collier, but Mimi Collier

00:49:34.349 --> 00:49:36.610
is not Olivia Babcock. That's all I have to say.

00:49:36.710 --> 00:49:40.070
I'm going to go contender here. Because that

00:49:40.070 --> 00:49:42.389
is true, but I think they also have middles.

00:49:42.409 --> 00:49:45.610
They're bigger. I like Furbringer as a setter.

00:49:46.269 --> 00:49:49.289
I think that Quest has come in and done a good

00:49:49.289 --> 00:49:51.289
job. I understand that they've lost a few matches

00:49:51.289 --> 00:49:53.429
without Furbringer being there. I don't think

00:49:53.429 --> 00:49:55.550
you can rely on Mimi Collier the same way you

00:49:55.550 --> 00:49:58.590
rely on Babcock. We've seen that. But I do think

00:49:58.590 --> 00:50:00.969
that Furbringer runs a better offense. I think

00:50:00.969 --> 00:50:03.130
she understands she has to distribute the ball.

00:50:03.309 --> 00:50:05.809
If you're looking at them down the stretch in

00:50:05.809 --> 00:50:08.690
the tournament, I would pick them probably over

00:50:08.690 --> 00:50:12.710
SMU. And I'd give them the 60 -40 edge over Louisville

00:50:12.710 --> 00:50:16.099
probably. Well, I would say all of... SMU Louisville

00:50:16.099 --> 00:50:18.500
and Wisconsin, we have seen in real time their

00:50:18.500 --> 00:50:21.780
lack of ability to adjust. Correct. But that's

00:50:21.780 --> 00:50:24.400
a coaching thing. Well, they're all part of the

00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:27.219
same team. Yeah, fair. I think they're a little

00:50:27.219 --> 00:50:29.659
bigger. I think they have a little more room

00:50:29.659 --> 00:50:32.079
for that, and I like their setter. And the last

00:50:32.079 --> 00:50:35.219
one is Miami. I mean, I have my two contenders.

00:50:35.239 --> 00:50:37.440
All the rest are pretenders to me. You have a

00:50:37.440 --> 00:50:40.500
distinct 1A, 1B, and everybody else. I've clearly

00:50:40.500 --> 00:50:43.500
identified my 1Bs, and then there's everybody

00:50:43.500 --> 00:50:49.679
else. I think the discrepancy in, you know, I

00:50:49.679 --> 00:50:52.260
like Rodriguez as a setter. I like at idea Cologne.

00:50:52.340 --> 00:50:55.059
I think she's doing a really good job, but there's

00:50:55.059 --> 00:50:58.340
just like something missing with them. Their

00:50:58.340 --> 00:51:00.099
right side. Like I couldn't even tell you her

00:51:00.099 --> 00:51:01.699
name. Like, I don't know who's playing right

00:51:01.699 --> 00:51:05.679
side for them. And Dahlia Wilson does a pretty

00:51:05.679 --> 00:51:09.699
good job in the middle for them, but no, I've

00:51:09.699 --> 00:51:12.119
identified my, my contenders and the rest. I'm

00:51:12.119 --> 00:51:14.440
just like, you're just not. As good as those

00:51:14.440 --> 00:51:16.619
two teams for me. And I understand those teams

00:51:16.619 --> 00:51:19.320
have lost matches. Whatever everybody does. But

00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:22.780
if I'm just looking at what I've seen. I'm pretender

00:51:22.780 --> 00:51:25.500
as well. I like a couple of their pieces. But

00:51:25.500 --> 00:51:28.199
they play too much on emotion for me. And their

00:51:28.199 --> 00:51:30.940
emotion is not consistent. They're flat. They

00:51:30.940 --> 00:51:33.940
show up. They make errors. Something needs to

00:51:33.940 --> 00:51:37.159
happen to fire them up. And get them going as

00:51:37.159 --> 00:51:40.599
a team. I just don't think the way they play

00:51:40.599 --> 00:51:45.780
is sustainable. And while Cologne can be electric

00:51:45.780 --> 00:51:49.539
to watch, she can also make a ton of mistakes.

00:51:49.960 --> 00:51:52.260
They're not quite there yet for me, even though

00:51:52.260 --> 00:51:54.380
I think they have some good pieces. All right.

00:51:54.400 --> 00:51:56.099
Well, I hope you guys liked that one. I thought

00:51:56.099 --> 00:51:58.460
that was fun. Halfway through conference play

00:51:58.460 --> 00:52:00.980
or a little less than halfway. See who we think

00:52:00.980 --> 00:52:03.119
could be there. But that was contenders and pretenders.

00:52:03.179 --> 00:52:05.780
All right, everybody. It is time for listener

00:52:05.780 --> 00:52:09.599
questions. Question one. Bit of a we've been

00:52:09.599 --> 00:52:12.369
called out. Okay, I was wondering why you mentioned

00:52:12.369 --> 00:52:14.329
multiple times that international players like

00:52:14.329 --> 00:52:16.769
Adriano aren't used to how fast the NCAA sets

00:52:16.769 --> 00:52:19.570
are. But at the same time, you also said the

00:52:19.570 --> 00:52:22.309
recent grads are not used to how fast Poulter

00:52:22.309 --> 00:52:25.809
sets, which seems to imply she sets faster than

00:52:25.809 --> 00:52:29.989
NCAA. You also mentioned that Sage Kahane Torres'

00:52:30.230 --> 00:52:33.070
setting was too college style. So does that mean

00:52:33.070 --> 00:52:36.949
her sets are too slow or too fast? What is the

00:52:36.949 --> 00:52:40.730
actual difference in setting styles between like

00:52:40.730 --> 00:52:44.789
a Bergen -Riley, a Poulter, a Sage, NCAA versus

00:52:44.789 --> 00:52:48.849
international, et cetera? Fair question. It's

00:52:48.849 --> 00:52:53.030
a great question. And I would say the answer

00:52:53.030 --> 00:52:58.210
is nuanced, as always. Fabulous. You have some

00:52:58.210 --> 00:53:02.130
college programs who are trying to push the tempo

00:53:02.130 --> 00:53:06.079
very, very, very fast. Yes. And the balls are

00:53:06.079 --> 00:53:08.719
spraying everywhere. This is the issue. If you

00:53:08.719 --> 00:53:13.159
have the pieces, running fast is a very good

00:53:13.159 --> 00:53:16.739
idea. The U .S. national team runs the 31, which

00:53:16.739 --> 00:53:18.460
is the shoot in the middle, and the left side

00:53:18.460 --> 00:53:20.960
ball over top of it better than anybody else,

00:53:20.980 --> 00:53:22.940
at least in the last cycle. And it's virtually

00:53:22.940 --> 00:53:25.880
unstoppable because the middle can hit it and

00:53:25.880 --> 00:53:27.960
the left side can hit it. And the middle is deciding

00:53:27.960 --> 00:53:29.880
whether I'm going to take it based off who's

00:53:29.880 --> 00:53:31.780
in front of me or I'm going to leave it. It's

00:53:31.780 --> 00:53:33.760
incredibly effective. Same with the BIC over

00:53:33.760 --> 00:53:36.340
top of the middle. College players are not international

00:53:36.340 --> 00:53:38.820
players. They don't have the same level of experience.

00:53:39.119 --> 00:53:42.360
You can see this with Miami as a great example.

00:53:42.800 --> 00:53:46.039
Rodriguez tries to run some very, very fast balls

00:53:46.039 --> 00:53:48.360
out to the left side. And sometimes her hitters

00:53:48.360 --> 00:53:50.619
are standing on the ground and they're volleying

00:53:50.619 --> 00:53:52.420
balls over because they are rocketing outside

00:53:52.420 --> 00:53:55.920
the antenna. There's a consistency piece for

00:53:55.920 --> 00:53:58.820
a lot of setters in college. If their coach wants

00:53:58.820 --> 00:54:02.239
to run very fast, a lot of the balls are unhittable.

00:54:02.420 --> 00:54:05.260
The tempo is not always the same. They're just

00:54:05.260 --> 00:54:07.280
inconsistent because they don't have the experience.

00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:10.099
When you have very, very good setters internationally,

00:54:10.519 --> 00:54:13.460
they can vary the heights based on the hitters

00:54:13.460 --> 00:54:16.579
and keep the tempo fast, which is a very elite

00:54:16.579 --> 00:54:18.780
level skill that not a lot of college setters

00:54:18.780 --> 00:54:21.000
can do it. And I think that's where the disconnect

00:54:21.000 --> 00:54:24.119
comes. I would also say like a lot of the international

00:54:24.119 --> 00:54:26.320
players who are coming over have played like

00:54:26.320 --> 00:54:30.559
A2 or B. They're not playing like the top, top,

00:54:30.619 --> 00:54:34.980
top teams of their country. So combining the

00:54:34.980 --> 00:54:38.599
setters in the NCAA struggling to set with speed

00:54:38.599 --> 00:54:44.099
and height for bigger players and the level professionally

00:54:44.099 --> 00:54:46.119
that these international players are playing,

00:54:46.219 --> 00:54:48.820
I think there's that. But as far as the Poulter

00:54:48.820 --> 00:54:51.860
-Sage discussion, the hitters have come from

00:54:51.860 --> 00:54:55.099
college. So Poulter is like running a lightning

00:54:55.099 --> 00:54:58.440
speed offense. It's flat across the net. So fast.

00:54:58.500 --> 00:55:01.739
And she's big. That's an adjustment piece. The

00:55:01.739 --> 00:55:04.000
reason that I have said that Sage sets a college

00:55:04.000 --> 00:55:06.440
style and while it's bad, she does set slower,

00:55:06.739 --> 00:55:10.500
but it allows, and the connection between the

00:55:10.500 --> 00:55:13.579
hitters might be better right now, but it's so

00:55:13.579 --> 00:55:16.280
easy for the block defense of the international

00:55:16.280 --> 00:55:19.460
teams to get set up, which makes it hard to score.

00:55:20.059 --> 00:55:22.860
So while it might not always be like an execution

00:55:22.860 --> 00:55:26.400
thing of the set, it's like. what the hitters

00:55:26.400 --> 00:55:28.639
are able to do against their competition is taken

00:55:28.639 --> 00:55:31.099
into account as well. The one other thing that

00:55:31.099 --> 00:55:33.840
I will notice is that it seems that college programs

00:55:33.840 --> 00:55:37.099
who want to run very fast, run very fast from

00:55:37.099 --> 00:55:39.539
everywhere. There's not a ton of situational

00:55:39.539 --> 00:55:42.460
awareness. When you watch good international

00:55:42.460 --> 00:55:45.400
teams, you know, they'll run fast from passes

00:55:45.400 --> 00:55:48.280
inside the attack line or around the attack line

00:55:48.280 --> 00:55:50.199
because everybody's on the same page. They understand

00:55:50.199 --> 00:55:52.239
what's coming and then they'll run out of system

00:55:52.239 --> 00:55:54.730
afterwards. I find a lot of times in the college

00:55:54.730 --> 00:55:57.769
game, especially with balls that are moving across

00:55:57.769 --> 00:56:00.750
the net, like you'll get really close to position

00:56:00.750 --> 00:56:03.570
four and then set a lightning fast ball to position

00:56:03.570 --> 00:56:05.730
four. And that needs a little more loop on it

00:56:05.730 --> 00:56:07.889
because the distance isn't as much. And so just

00:56:07.889 --> 00:56:10.389
some of those situational experience things when

00:56:10.389 --> 00:56:12.949
you're trying to run super fast can go sideways

00:56:12.949 --> 00:56:15.909
very quickly. There you go. That probably made

00:56:15.909 --> 00:56:19.489
it more confusing, but. We tried. Okay, question

00:56:19.489 --> 00:56:21.670
two for Sarah. As a player, what's your favorite

00:56:21.670 --> 00:56:25.690
style of uniform? Long sleeve, tank top with

00:56:25.690 --> 00:56:29.889
compression sleeves, short sleeve, spandex leggings.

00:56:30.510 --> 00:56:32.469
How many of those were actually options for you

00:56:32.469 --> 00:56:34.389
back in the day? We were never given options.

00:56:34.590 --> 00:56:36.210
It was just like, here are the uniforms, wear

00:56:36.210 --> 00:56:40.349
them. But I will say I've worn a variety in my

00:56:40.349 --> 00:56:43.690
professional career. I prefer long sleeve with

00:56:43.690 --> 00:56:48.900
spandex or like a short sleeve. with just nothing.

00:56:48.960 --> 00:56:52.820
Leave the arms bare with spandex. I have never

00:56:52.820 --> 00:56:56.420
understood the point of the sleeves. Like, I

00:56:56.420 --> 00:56:58.739
have very sweaty forearms when I play, but I

00:56:58.739 --> 00:57:01.840
just never understood the point of the sleeves.

00:57:02.619 --> 00:57:04.579
They look cool. Yeah, I'm like, why not just

00:57:04.579 --> 00:57:06.539
wear a long -sleeve shirt? Yeah, I don't know.

00:57:07.139 --> 00:57:09.639
Anyway, somebody tell me. I'm sure there's somebody

00:57:09.639 --> 00:57:12.139
out there who will tell me why they are a good

00:57:12.139 --> 00:57:15.400
idea. But long sleeves with shorts or, like,

00:57:15.480 --> 00:57:19.050
short -sleeve with... question three I remember

00:57:19.050 --> 00:57:20.909
when Nicklin Hames was the freshman starting

00:57:20.909 --> 00:57:22.969
setter at Nebraska and every commentator kept

00:57:22.969 --> 00:57:25.150
saying how she's the first freshman to start

00:57:25.150 --> 00:57:28.449
setting ever at Nebraska but wasn't Rachel Holloway

00:57:28.449 --> 00:57:31.730
in 2006 a freshman setter I know she left the

00:57:31.730 --> 00:57:33.869
program after two seasons so because she left

00:57:33.869 --> 00:57:35.769
the program does no one acknowledge or recognize

00:57:35.769 --> 00:57:38.949
that she was a fantastic starting freshman my

00:57:38.949 --> 00:57:43.389
only explanation for that is Rachel was a redshirt

00:57:43.389 --> 00:57:48.659
freshman in 2006 She was brought to Nebraska

00:57:48.659 --> 00:57:53.059
a year early and redshirted that 2005 season

00:57:53.059 --> 00:57:56.579
and then was obviously a freshman in 2006. So

00:57:56.579 --> 00:57:59.440
that would be my only explanation as to why they

00:57:59.440 --> 00:58:02.039
say that. But yes, you are correct. She was a

00:58:02.039 --> 00:58:05.460
freshman starting setter. Question four. Sometimes

00:58:05.460 --> 00:58:07.739
a commentator says, oh, outside hitter X was

00:58:07.739 --> 00:58:10.139
expecting a faster ball. Is a setter supposed

00:58:10.139 --> 00:58:13.039
to know what ball a hitter wants to hit or is

00:58:13.039 --> 00:58:16.449
that discussed before a play? Also, if the setter

00:58:16.449 --> 00:58:18.869
gives instructions which offense to run but the

00:58:18.869 --> 00:58:21.969
ball doesn't go down the first time, how do the

00:58:21.969 --> 00:58:24.190
hitters know what to run in transition if it

00:58:24.190 --> 00:58:26.530
comes to that? Do you want to take it or do you

00:58:26.530 --> 00:58:28.650
want me to answer? I mean, I can tell you what

00:58:28.650 --> 00:58:30.650
I've seen and then you can tell me your experience.

00:58:30.650 --> 00:58:32.530
I think it's pretty common across the board.

00:58:32.710 --> 00:58:35.170
Yeah, I mean, on serve -receive, the setter will

00:58:35.170 --> 00:58:38.170
have a play that they want to run in system and

00:58:38.170 --> 00:58:40.269
out of system and everybody's on the same page.

00:58:40.570 --> 00:58:43.780
Once you get into transition... I find a lot

00:58:43.780 --> 00:58:47.000
of times the hitters will call the play unless

00:58:47.000 --> 00:58:50.179
there's specific game plans against certain players,

00:58:50.300 --> 00:58:52.639
but that usually only happens in the middle.

00:58:52.840 --> 00:58:55.500
So it might be, hey, against this middle blocker,

00:58:55.519 --> 00:58:58.900
we want to run a 31. We want to run a 51. The

00:58:58.900 --> 00:59:00.940
setter and middle may communicate that during

00:59:00.940 --> 00:59:03.239
transition, but the outside hitters are generally

00:59:03.239 --> 00:59:06.219
calling their set. Yep. The setter tells everybody

00:59:06.219 --> 00:59:09.349
what to run before the serve happens. There's

00:59:09.349 --> 00:59:12.369
a general understanding how to adjust if the

00:59:12.369 --> 00:59:15.429
play breaks down or if it's a bad pass. But yeah,

00:59:15.510 --> 00:59:18.550
hitters call what they want in transition. Question

00:59:18.550 --> 00:59:20.730
five. If you had to coach a program next season

00:59:20.730 --> 00:59:23.030
besides Nebraska, which team would you want to

00:59:23.030 --> 00:59:25.469
coach? Purely taking the team into consideration?

00:59:26.349 --> 00:59:30.230
Or like geography? No, the team. The team. I

00:59:30.230 --> 00:59:31.730
was like, I would go to Hawaii. Thank you so

00:59:31.730 --> 00:59:37.579
much. Stanford. Ooh, baby. I, my initial instinct

00:59:37.579 --> 00:59:40.360
without thinking like in depth was Indiana. Cause

00:59:40.360 --> 00:59:42.559
I think of similar reason to why you would coach

00:59:42.559 --> 00:59:45.039
Stanford is they are stacked with freshmen and

00:59:45.039 --> 00:59:47.460
it would be cool to take that group and like

00:59:47.460 --> 00:59:50.079
build something. There's nothing more satisfying

00:59:50.079 --> 00:59:53.840
as a coach as to molding players and teams and

00:59:53.840 --> 00:59:57.039
finding success as a group. And I think those

00:59:57.039 --> 01:00:00.059
programs, your pick is very good as well. No,

01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:03.239
Stanford is a solid pick. Is set up for that

01:00:03.239 --> 01:00:06.820
to happen. Okay, question six. I'm wondering

01:00:06.820 --> 01:00:09.239
what you think about Rebecca Alec and Andy Jackson

01:00:09.239 --> 01:00:11.940
right now. Jackson got so much attention in the

01:00:11.940 --> 01:00:14.559
preseason but has struggled a bit, and Alec is

01:00:14.559 --> 01:00:17.420
doing great. Does this matter for Jackson in

01:00:17.420 --> 01:00:19.460
the long run, or is she still one of the middles

01:00:19.460 --> 01:00:22.340
in the country with a lot of potential? I will

01:00:22.340 --> 01:00:26.800
say it is so hard after a breakout season to

01:00:26.800 --> 01:00:29.579
come back and replicate that because everybody

01:00:29.579 --> 01:00:33.210
is prepared for you. Everybody sets up their

01:00:33.210 --> 01:00:39.670
block defense to stop you. It is so hard to do

01:00:39.670 --> 01:00:42.130
that year after year after year. And I think

01:00:42.130 --> 01:00:44.550
maybe this is what we're seeing with Andy Jackson.

01:00:44.710 --> 01:00:46.670
I'm not worried about her, though. No, she's

01:00:46.670 --> 01:00:49.510
so, so good. Yeah, she has the physical tools

01:00:49.510 --> 01:00:52.610
to play at the next level. I think offensively,

01:00:52.610 --> 01:00:56.050
she's fantastic. I like that she can go behind.

01:00:56.170 --> 01:00:58.590
She can attack in front. Not worried. She's going

01:00:58.590 --> 01:01:01.349
to be great come tournament time. And I give

01:01:01.349 --> 01:01:04.050
all the props in the world to Rebecca Alec. I

01:01:04.050 --> 01:01:08.969
love that story. She came in as, you know, really

01:01:08.969 --> 01:01:11.349
focused on the block and being strong. And she

01:01:11.349 --> 01:01:14.510
put so much work in to be available. She works

01:01:14.510 --> 01:01:17.469
hard to be an option in transition all the time.

01:01:17.690 --> 01:01:20.929
You can just tell she wanted to elevate her game

01:01:20.929 --> 01:01:22.570
and she put the work in. And I have so much respect

01:01:22.570 --> 01:01:24.369
for that. But I also think it's worth saying

01:01:24.369 --> 01:01:27.199
like. One person's success, even at the same

01:01:27.199 --> 01:01:30.019
position, doesn't take away from somebody else's.

01:01:30.039 --> 01:01:33.960
The fact that they are both threats and they're

01:01:33.960 --> 01:01:36.699
both really good and both part of the discussion

01:01:36.699 --> 01:01:40.239
now, I think is incredible. Absolutely. One question

01:01:40.239 --> 01:01:41.760
that I got, I was talking with a couple people

01:01:41.760 --> 01:01:46.219
online, was for these programs who are riding

01:01:46.219 --> 01:01:49.440
one player, do these matches matter in terms

01:01:49.440 --> 01:01:53.389
of should you just set them to win? Or do you

01:01:53.389 --> 01:01:56.050
need to be developing your offense for tournament

01:01:56.050 --> 01:02:00.230
time? What is that balance? And what should coaches

01:02:00.230 --> 01:02:05.010
be doing? And I love this question. I think it

01:02:05.010 --> 01:02:07.409
is a discussion of like, do you want to win now

01:02:07.409 --> 01:02:09.780
or do you want to beat? The best of the best.

01:02:09.960 --> 01:02:12.340
If you want to win now, sure, set one player

01:02:12.340 --> 01:02:15.280
every ball. You're going to win. But once you

01:02:15.280 --> 01:02:18.539
get to, like, a Final Four situation, those teams

01:02:18.539 --> 01:02:21.579
are prepared. Those teams have the pieces to

01:02:21.579 --> 01:02:24.579
shut someone down. And, like, a Kennedy Martin,

01:02:24.800 --> 01:02:27.480
a Babcock, a Lednicki, like, they are outstanding

01:02:27.480 --> 01:02:29.880
players. Am I saying that they can't take down

01:02:29.880 --> 01:02:33.119
a top team? No, they might be able to. But in

01:02:33.119 --> 01:02:35.760
the chance that they can't, in the chance that

01:02:35.760 --> 01:02:38.000
those teams dial in their block defense, you

01:02:38.000 --> 01:02:40.719
need to have the other players have confidence

01:02:40.719 --> 01:02:44.840
and a good connection in pressure moments. I

01:02:44.840 --> 01:02:47.420
totally agree. Nobody cares what you do in conference

01:02:47.420 --> 01:02:51.739
play. No. Nobody remembers. It's about making

01:02:51.739 --> 01:02:54.219
the tournament and making noise at the tournament.

01:02:54.380 --> 01:02:57.739
And in order to do that, your team has to feel

01:02:57.739 --> 01:03:00.920
like they matter. You don't want to play for

01:03:00.920 --> 01:03:03.920
Lednicki's team. You don't want to play for Babcock's

01:03:03.920 --> 01:03:07.340
team. You want to be a part of the success. And

01:03:07.340 --> 01:03:10.780
I firmly believe that the mandate from those

01:03:10.780 --> 01:03:13.739
coaches with those great players should be, we're

01:03:13.739 --> 01:03:15.119
going to distribute the ball. We're going to

01:03:15.119 --> 01:03:18.000
run a balanced offense. And when we need a point,

01:03:18.079 --> 01:03:19.940
everybody knows the ball's going to Babcock,

01:03:20.159 --> 01:03:22.840
and that's fine. But everybody else needs to

01:03:22.840 --> 01:03:25.400
be a part of it because it seeps into their serving.

01:03:25.500 --> 01:03:27.960
It seeps into their defense. It seeps into their

01:03:27.960 --> 01:03:30.960
awareness and their discipline on game plans.

01:03:31.519 --> 01:03:34.500
I wholeheartedly believe that these teams with

01:03:34.500 --> 01:03:36.659
top players should be working on a balanced offense

01:03:36.659 --> 01:03:39.380
to have success at tournament time. All right.

01:03:39.480 --> 01:03:41.920
Those are all of our questions this week. Love

01:03:41.920 --> 01:03:44.300
them. Love receiving them. Love answering them.

01:03:44.480 --> 01:03:47.579
So yeah, favorite segment as always. All right.

01:03:47.679 --> 01:03:50.400
I'm finishing this off solo again. You know why?

01:03:51.219 --> 01:03:55.440
Because baby only has a limited amount of patience,

01:03:55.519 --> 01:03:58.539
which is understandable. So looking forward.

01:03:59.559 --> 01:04:02.360
For games to watch this week. On Wednesday at

01:04:02.360 --> 01:04:05.659
7 p .m. Eastern, we've got TCU versus Kansas.

01:04:06.519 --> 01:04:10.500
On Thursday at 8 p .m. Eastern, we've got BYU

01:04:10.500 --> 01:04:15.059
versus Baylor. Friday at 6 p .m. Eastern, Minnesota

01:04:15.059 --> 01:04:17.880
versus Indiana. Both of those teams have no business

01:04:17.880 --> 01:04:21.860
in the top 16. You know what I mean, okay? And

01:04:21.860 --> 01:04:24.920
Saturday at 2 p .m. Eastern, we've got TCU versus

01:04:24.920 --> 01:04:30.840
BYU. So a big week for both BYU and TCU. Check

01:04:30.840 --> 01:04:34.719
those out. We have not done a ton of Big 12 stuff,

01:04:34.840 --> 01:04:37.039
so that might be worth checking out. And I think

01:04:37.039 --> 01:04:39.849
the other ones are going to be fun. As we talked

01:04:39.849 --> 01:04:43.769
about at the start of the episode, we would love

01:04:43.769 --> 01:04:46.070
if you would stick around for a little bit to

01:04:46.070 --> 01:04:48.929
watch our interview with Kathy DeBoer. She has

01:04:48.929 --> 01:04:52.309
some incredible insights. She has literally done

01:04:52.309 --> 01:04:56.869
it all in the sport. And spoiler alert, she was

01:04:56.869 --> 01:05:00.730
the driving force behind why NCAA beach volleyball

01:05:00.730 --> 01:05:04.789
is a championship sport now. So here we go. Here's

01:05:04.789 --> 01:05:07.489
our interview with Kathy DeBoer. All right, we

01:05:07.489 --> 01:05:11.110
have a very special guest today, Kathy DeBoer.

01:05:11.230 --> 01:05:14.150
If you are not familiar with everything she has

01:05:14.150 --> 01:05:17.730
done, A, you need to educate yourself, but B,

01:05:17.889 --> 01:05:22.010
here is a brief rundown, and I for sure missed

01:05:22.010 --> 01:05:25.750
something. Probably very impressive. But Kathy

01:05:25.750 --> 01:05:27.449
played volleyball and basketball at Michigan

01:05:27.449 --> 01:05:31.190
State. She coached at Ferris State and Kentucky

01:05:31.190 --> 01:05:33.630
and then moved into athletics administration

01:05:33.630 --> 01:05:37.369
with Kentucky for nine years. She has devoted

01:05:37.369 --> 01:05:39.829
much of her life to grow the sport of volleyball.

01:05:40.050 --> 01:05:43.090
So starting in 2006, she became the executive

01:05:43.090 --> 01:05:46.070
director of the AVCA and held that position for

01:05:46.070 --> 01:05:49.030
17 years. Kathy is passionate about creating

01:05:49.030 --> 01:05:51.750
opportunities for players and coaches. And under

01:05:51.750 --> 01:05:54.610
her leadership, within the AVCA, volleyball became

01:05:54.610 --> 01:05:57.610
the top team sport for high school girls in the

01:05:57.610 --> 01:06:00.969
U .S. We saw exponential growth in boys volleyball.

01:06:01.389 --> 01:06:03.989
There were more than 55 partnerships developed

01:06:03.989 --> 01:06:06.489
with state volleyball coaches associations and

01:06:06.489 --> 01:06:09.510
regions of USA Volleyball. The AVC convention

01:06:09.510 --> 01:06:14.289
grew to the huge event that it is today, and

01:06:14.289 --> 01:06:17.949
she helped beach volleyball become an NCAA championship

01:06:17.949 --> 01:06:21.409
sport. Is that the first time you guys met? Yes.

01:06:22.349 --> 01:06:26.570
Well, we met at some ABCA All -American banquets.

01:06:27.269 --> 01:06:30.250
2006 is when she started. That's when I won National

01:06:30.250 --> 01:06:32.070
Player of the Year, and I believe that you gave

01:06:32.070 --> 01:06:35.260
me that award. So we kind of started there. Then

01:06:35.260 --> 01:06:37.519
we met on the beach. There was a beach volleyball

01:06:37.519 --> 01:06:40.000
championship that Jordan Larson and I played

01:06:40.000 --> 01:06:42.519
in. So you were there. Sarah never likes to talk

01:06:42.519 --> 01:06:44.699
about herself, so I will step in. You are the

01:06:44.699 --> 01:06:47.860
first NCAA beach volleyball champion. Is that

01:06:47.860 --> 01:06:50.480
correct? I mean, if you want to count that, then

01:06:50.480 --> 01:06:53.880
yeah, sure. I think some of the schools would

01:06:53.880 --> 01:06:57.440
put up a fight with that. But hang tight. I'm

01:06:57.440 --> 01:07:02.320
not done yet. In 2023, Kathy was inducted into

01:07:02.320 --> 01:07:06.099
the AVCA Hall of Fame. And her motto has always

01:07:06.099 --> 01:07:08.880
been make volleyball matter. And I think it's

01:07:08.880 --> 01:07:11.179
fair to say that she has definitely accomplished

01:07:11.179 --> 01:07:14.860
that, particularly in North America. She continues

01:07:14.860 --> 01:07:16.920
to make volleyball matter today in her role as

01:07:16.920 --> 01:07:19.480
chairwoman of the Love Foundation. So we are

01:07:19.480 --> 01:07:22.260
so excited to have a conversation. And thank

01:07:22.260 --> 01:07:25.579
you so much for joining us. It's great to be

01:07:25.579 --> 01:07:30.159
with you guys. And I'm looking forward to it.

01:07:30.840 --> 01:07:33.920
So I have... a question right off the hop for

01:07:33.920 --> 01:07:36.480
you. Yeah. So you played both volleyball and

01:07:36.480 --> 01:07:40.119
basketball in college, and then you played basketball

01:07:40.119 --> 01:07:42.739
professionally for a little while. That's a fun

01:07:42.739 --> 01:07:46.079
fact, everybody. Okay. Played basketball professionally,

01:07:46.260 --> 01:07:49.840
but then you went back to coach volleyball. So

01:07:49.840 --> 01:07:52.900
can you walk us through kind of that transition

01:07:52.900 --> 01:07:56.739
into going from a two -sport athlete to playing

01:07:56.739 --> 01:07:59.960
basketball and then switching sports as a coach?

01:08:00.019 --> 01:08:03.860
Like, what was that like? Well, I have to start

01:08:03.860 --> 01:08:10.440
with the fact that I talk like a dork. So I have

01:08:10.440 --> 01:08:15.340
to let your audience know I haven't moved to

01:08:15.340 --> 01:08:19.539
another country and picked up a foreign accent.

01:08:19.859 --> 01:08:25.239
I'm still recovering from a stroke land incident

01:08:25.239 --> 01:08:30.600
that I had three years ago. So I will try and

01:08:30.600 --> 01:08:37.930
talk. like a mini -dork. To start out, Sarah

01:08:37.930 --> 01:08:44.310
and Adam, it's not a complex story. When I played

01:08:44.310 --> 01:08:48.529
professional basketball, it was a long time ago,

01:08:48.649 --> 01:08:55.369
from 1978 to 1980. There was no money in it.

01:08:55.739 --> 01:08:59.199
And when I finished my two years, I was broke.

01:08:59.359 --> 01:09:04.560
Not the typical professional experience. I was

01:09:04.560 --> 01:09:09.020
flat broke. I was intending, I wanted to go to

01:09:09.020 --> 01:09:13.279
law school. Oh. You can't go to the law school

01:09:13.279 --> 01:09:16.359
with no money. It's a little expensive. Yeah,

01:09:16.359 --> 01:09:20.720
yeah. So I had to get a job. I have a degree

01:09:20.720 --> 01:09:25.039
in humanities, another thing you can't get a

01:09:25.039 --> 01:09:32.720
job with. And so I looked around and I thought,

01:09:32.800 --> 01:09:37.220
maybe I can get a coaching job. And Title IX

01:09:37.220 --> 01:09:43.039
had created so many opportunities for women in

01:09:43.039 --> 01:09:48.539
the U .S. Everybody was on a body hunt for women

01:09:48.539 --> 01:09:53.239
to coach. So I applied for both volleyball and

01:09:53.239 --> 01:09:57.739
basketball coaching jobs. I thought I would get

01:09:57.739 --> 01:10:03.579
calls for basketball. The phone did not ring.

01:10:05.800 --> 01:10:10.939
Ferris State University, I was from Michigan,

01:10:11.199 --> 01:10:15.569
Grand Rapids, and Ferris State was... the first

01:10:15.569 --> 01:10:20.630
college in the United States that was building

01:10:20.630 --> 01:10:25.250
a building specifically for volleyball. They

01:10:25.250 --> 01:10:29.529
were adding a Division I hockey team, ice hockey

01:10:29.529 --> 01:10:33.590
team. They were Division II, and so they needed

01:10:33.590 --> 01:10:39.470
a counterweight to hockey. They wanted to hire

01:10:39.470 --> 01:10:45.630
this big -time coach. They interviewed Sue Gazansky,

01:10:45.909 --> 01:10:50.569
Rosie Wegbridge, who had won championships and

01:10:50.569 --> 01:10:55.090
were big shots in women's volleyball at the time.

01:10:55.170 --> 01:11:00.010
And the AD wanted to hire a women's female coach.

01:11:00.229 --> 01:11:05.050
Big Rapids is a great town, but it is in BFE,

01:11:05.369 --> 01:11:11.189
Michigan. Northern Michigan. Small town with

01:11:11.189 --> 01:11:14.770
a highway through it. You're talking to two Canadians

01:11:14.770 --> 01:11:16.850
who grew up in somewhere similar, so we understand

01:11:16.850 --> 01:11:20.170
what we're talking about here. The AD interviewed

01:11:20.170 --> 01:11:25.970
Sue and Rosie, and they said they were both in

01:11:25.970 --> 01:11:28.930
Southern California. Well, that's a big change.

01:11:29.369 --> 01:11:34.069
And they said, no, you have a cute little town,

01:11:34.270 --> 01:11:40.210
and you have big plans. No thanks. It was August

01:11:40.210 --> 01:11:45.510
of the season that was ready to start, and he

01:11:45.510 --> 01:11:47.989
was striking out. So the girls were starting

01:11:47.989 --> 01:11:53.210
school soon. Yeah, two weeks was starting preseason.

01:11:53.390 --> 01:11:58.010
I interviewed, and I said to him, I promise you

01:11:58.010 --> 01:12:02.500
I'm awake. your team better than they were, and

01:12:02.500 --> 01:12:07.060
then I want to go to law school and you can hire

01:12:07.060 --> 01:12:11.140
your big -time coach next year. He got stuck

01:12:11.140 --> 01:12:17.880
with me. And the first year, we were 5 -25. So

01:12:17.880 --> 01:12:22.000
I completely failed in my promise to him. Well,

01:12:22.020 --> 01:12:24.140
what was their record the year before? Or they

01:12:24.140 --> 01:12:25.500
hadn't had a... It was a brand -new program.

01:12:25.640 --> 01:12:27.560
It was a brand -new program. No, no, they were

01:12:27.560 --> 01:12:33.189
bad. The year before, too. There you go. But

01:12:33.189 --> 01:12:38.510
I thought I was a great coach. I proved otherwise.

01:12:39.369 --> 01:12:42.050
So we have Ferris State to thank for your prolific

01:12:42.050 --> 01:12:44.529
career in volleyball and everything that you've

01:12:44.529 --> 01:12:47.270
done for the sport. Well, yeah. And thank you,

01:12:47.270 --> 01:12:49.810
Grand Rapids, Michigan, for being such a small

01:12:49.810 --> 01:12:53.609
town. Yeah, yeah. I didn't get into law school.

01:12:53.890 --> 01:12:58.689
I found coaching to... be more than I thought

01:12:58.689 --> 01:13:02.329
it was going to be. I was terrible, I have to

01:13:02.329 --> 01:13:06.210
say that, but I stayed for three more years at

01:13:06.210 --> 01:13:07.850
Ferris State. So you couldn't have been that

01:13:07.850 --> 01:13:12.670
terrible. Well, we did better. Exactly. I think

01:13:12.670 --> 01:13:15.310
that is the mark of a good coach is that you

01:13:15.310 --> 01:13:18.270
keep seeing the improvement. Yeah. So the fact

01:13:18.270 --> 01:13:19.909
that you're interested, that you wanted to go

01:13:19.909 --> 01:13:23.079
to law school, it kind of... to me, makes sense

01:13:23.079 --> 01:13:26.340
how you ended up in administration. But I'm very

01:13:26.340 --> 01:13:30.279
curious at that time, because female sports are

01:13:30.279 --> 01:13:33.720
at the forefront right now. And it is still a

01:13:33.720 --> 01:13:37.649
struggle for women to get equal pay. and things

01:13:37.649 --> 01:13:39.750
like that. So I'm curious what your experience

01:13:39.750 --> 01:13:42.590
was like as a female athlete and coach. I know

01:13:42.590 --> 01:13:45.770
Title IX, you mentioned, helped you get that

01:13:45.770 --> 01:13:48.409
role. Were you made to feel inferior in any way,

01:13:48.510 --> 01:13:52.109
or was it a struggle? No, at Ferris, I was a

01:13:52.109 --> 01:13:56.369
big shot because they had prioritized volleyball

01:13:56.369 --> 01:14:02.310
and hockey. So I had more money than scholarship

01:14:02.310 --> 01:14:06.550
money than most of the other sports. including

01:14:06.550 --> 01:14:11.770
men's sports and women's sports. They were pouring

01:14:11.770 --> 01:14:16.689
money into hockey, and they had to put money

01:14:16.689 --> 01:14:21.029
into volleyball. The only reason I got a job

01:14:21.029 --> 01:14:25.829
coaching was because there was no social media.

01:14:26.050 --> 01:14:31.250
There was no Internet. The people who were interviewing

01:14:31.250 --> 01:14:37.090
me couldn't Google my name and see that I had

01:14:37.090 --> 01:14:42.050
sued Michigan State for Title IX violations in

01:14:42.050 --> 01:14:47.149
1978. Oh, you did? Yes. Yeah. The lawsuit, I

01:14:47.149 --> 01:14:51.850
graduated and the lawsuit had the name of Carol

01:14:51.850 --> 01:14:57.010
Hutchins v. Michigan State University on it.

01:14:58.829 --> 01:15:03.270
You had to read the transcript of the trial to

01:15:03.270 --> 01:15:07.210
know that I was involved. And I just failed to

01:15:07.210 --> 01:15:10.770
mention that on my interview. Well, if they don't

01:15:10.770 --> 01:15:13.250
ask, you don't have to tell. Yeah, yeah. That's

01:15:13.250 --> 01:15:17.090
like not telling somebody. By the way, I have

01:15:17.090 --> 01:15:20.869
six children at home, and I'm a single parent.

01:15:21.050 --> 01:15:24.229
If they don't ask, don't tell. I like that philosophy.

01:15:24.229 --> 01:15:29.340
Yeah, I love that. I credit my whole career in

01:15:29.340 --> 01:15:36.039
athletics and sports now to the single fact that

01:15:36.039 --> 01:15:41.319
I got a job coaching and administrating because

01:15:41.319 --> 01:15:46.000
nobody knew that I had sued the university. I

01:15:46.000 --> 01:15:50.920
was at Michigan State two weeks ago for a 50

01:15:50.920 --> 01:15:55.829
-year anniversary. 50 years! Was that hard to

01:15:55.829 --> 01:15:59.670
believe? Of the team that I had played on in

01:15:59.670 --> 01:16:06.470
the 1975, they called it the Kathy DeBoer Invitational.

01:16:06.609 --> 01:16:11.630
And I think I'm the only one in the U .S., maybe

01:16:11.630 --> 01:16:15.489
Canada too, who has a tournament named after

01:16:15.489 --> 01:16:18.909
them at a school that they sued. I was like,

01:16:18.970 --> 01:16:21.930
they must not have any hard feelings. So they

01:16:21.930 --> 01:16:27.050
have forgotten? Or forgiven. Or both. Or both.

01:16:27.270 --> 01:16:30.470
That's a very interesting story in how you got

01:16:30.470 --> 01:16:32.750
into coaching. So you went on to have a great

01:16:32.750 --> 01:16:34.649
coaching career at Kentucky. And I believe you

01:16:34.649 --> 01:16:37.050
coached there for nine years. I love coaching

01:16:37.050 --> 01:16:39.869
as well. It's my passion. And I couldn't imagine

01:16:39.869 --> 01:16:43.949
transitioning into administrative work. So I

01:16:43.949 --> 01:16:46.210
know you have a love for the sport and you have

01:16:46.210 --> 01:16:49.149
a love for athletes. How do you make that jump

01:16:49.149 --> 01:16:53.859
from a coach to working in administration? What

01:16:53.859 --> 01:16:55.960
parts of coaching did you miss, and then what

01:16:55.960 --> 01:16:59.600
did you like about your new role? Well, Adam,

01:16:59.760 --> 01:17:05.840
I had aspirations. Instead of law school, I got

01:17:05.840 --> 01:17:11.359
an MBA. I had aspirations of being a major college

01:17:11.359 --> 01:17:17.640
athletics director. And C .N. Newton was the

01:17:17.640 --> 01:17:23.350
A .D. at Kentucky and a great mentor to me. And

01:17:23.350 --> 01:17:27.649
he said, if you're going to go into administration,

01:17:28.109 --> 01:17:34.449
you have to learn to fundraise and you have to

01:17:34.449 --> 01:17:38.770
learn to work with power coaches. He first said,

01:17:38.970 --> 01:17:43.569
Kathy, I don't know if the SEC is ready for a

01:17:43.569 --> 01:17:48.550
female athletics director. And he had asked me.

01:17:49.180 --> 01:17:53.939
I had a job offer on the table, and he had asked

01:17:53.939 --> 01:17:59.739
me, what will make your stay? And I said, I have

01:17:59.739 --> 01:18:04.199
aspirations beyond coaching. And so he said,

01:18:04.359 --> 01:18:09.260
how can I help you? And I told him, you asked

01:18:09.260 --> 01:18:13.979
me, and I told you. I don't want to hear that

01:18:13.979 --> 01:18:20.250
the SEC isn't ready. I don't care. You asked,

01:18:20.470 --> 01:18:25.890
and so he said, I will help you. Wow. So when

01:18:25.890 --> 01:18:31.510
a job opened up in the department that was fundraising

01:18:31.510 --> 01:18:36.569
external affairs, marketing and fundraising and

01:18:36.569 --> 01:18:41.670
traveling with the men's football and basketball

01:18:41.670 --> 01:18:45.949
teams, he offered it to me, and that's why I

01:18:45.949 --> 01:18:50.460
loved coaching. But your question, what did I

01:18:50.460 --> 01:18:56.300
miss? I can tell you what I didn't miss. I didn't

01:18:56.300 --> 01:19:03.500
miss three things. Recruiting, camps, and losing.

01:19:05.600 --> 01:19:10.949
My first year, maybe my second year. Out of coaching,

01:19:11.189 --> 01:19:16.130
I went to a match. It was an important SEC match.

01:19:16.409 --> 01:19:21.069
It was Cedar Day. They won the first two sets

01:19:21.069 --> 01:19:25.930
easily. All the parents, they are high -fiving

01:19:25.930 --> 01:19:31.250
all the kids. And they lost set three. They lost

01:19:31.250 --> 01:19:36.090
set four. And they lost set five. All the...

01:19:36.250 --> 01:19:42.789
kids are crying the parents are mad and throwing

01:19:42.789 --> 01:19:49.329
their flowers for senior day in the trash and

01:19:49.329 --> 01:19:54.529
i walked out of the building and got into my

01:19:54.529 --> 01:20:00.149
car and said oh i don't wish this at all I can

01:20:00.149 --> 01:20:04.029
go home and have a beer and watch football or

01:20:04.029 --> 01:20:10.149
whatever I want. And Fran Flory, the coach, is

01:20:10.149 --> 01:20:14.510
going to be in this building till midnight going

01:20:14.510 --> 01:20:18.850
over this loss. I don't miss that. Fair enough.

01:20:19.289 --> 01:20:21.970
And the recruiting, too. That's the reason that

01:20:21.970 --> 01:20:24.170
I haven't gotten into coaching. It's just like

01:20:24.170 --> 01:20:27.210
you travel all season, and then when the season's

01:20:27.210 --> 01:20:31.420
over, you travel again. to recruit, and it's

01:20:31.420 --> 01:20:35.100
just the never -ending cycle. Well, players like

01:20:35.100 --> 01:20:40.460
you were at your level have to talk to kids that

01:20:40.460 --> 01:20:46.899
are never going to be as good as you were and

01:20:46.899 --> 01:20:51.000
possibly still are, and you have to beg them,

01:20:51.079 --> 01:20:55.560
oh, I can help you with your dreams. And you

01:20:55.560 --> 01:20:59.840
look at them and, oh. You're not going to make

01:20:59.840 --> 01:21:04.279
a sweetheart. Anyway, so that's the hard part

01:21:04.279 --> 01:21:09.500
when you are really an elite athlete about recruiting,

01:21:09.819 --> 01:21:12.739
in my mind. You know what? I'm just going to

01:21:12.739 --> 01:21:15.319
say to our listeners, you guys always tell me

01:21:15.319 --> 01:21:18.659
that I am too honest. We need to have Kathy on

01:21:18.659 --> 01:21:22.800
here more often because she's my vibe 100%, okay?

01:21:22.880 --> 01:21:28.029
I like the honesty. Well, I'm retired. I can

01:21:28.029 --> 01:21:30.649
be honest now. I'm retired too, technically,

01:21:30.850 --> 01:21:37.109
right? Honesty is the best. Let's transition

01:21:37.109 --> 01:21:40.770
into your time at the ABCA. Okay. When you got

01:21:40.770 --> 01:21:44.430
there, what were your goals stepping into that

01:21:44.430 --> 01:21:48.010
role? I saw that girls' and women's volleyball

01:21:48.010 --> 01:21:52.090
was growing, and there were not enough scholarships

01:21:52.090 --> 01:21:57.130
to accommodate the growth. So that's the reason

01:21:57.130 --> 01:22:02.710
I went in very quickly with the idea of trying

01:22:02.710 --> 01:22:06.789
to make beach volleyball a college sport. So

01:22:06.789 --> 01:22:10.250
that was an idea for you right away? Right away.

01:22:10.369 --> 01:22:15.510
I saw the sport needed more opportunities for

01:22:15.510 --> 01:22:20.210
college -level play, and I knew that would translate

01:22:20.210 --> 01:22:25.079
into high school -level play also. I wanted to

01:22:25.079 --> 01:22:29.239
grow. Opportunities for kids lead to opportunities

01:22:29.239 --> 01:22:33.439
for coaches. It doesn't come the other way around.

01:22:33.680 --> 01:22:37.880
Kids need coaches. They are playing. They need

01:22:37.880 --> 01:22:41.380
coaching. And so I thought that would be the

01:22:41.380 --> 01:22:46.079
way to grow our community of coaches also. And

01:22:46.079 --> 01:22:49.600
how did you come up with your motto or your slogan?

01:22:49.640 --> 01:22:51.739
Was that something that developed or did you

01:22:51.739 --> 01:22:54.489
just... have that as you went into the job and

01:22:54.489 --> 01:22:57.210
said, this is... No. Yeah. That developed over

01:22:57.210 --> 01:23:03.050
time, Adam. I was just so frustrated at the fact

01:23:03.050 --> 01:23:09.569
that volleyball still is ignored by the mainstream

01:23:09.569 --> 01:23:14.930
media outlets. We're right here. Yeah. What do

01:23:14.930 --> 01:23:16.710
you mean? We're mainstream. Yeah. I'm just kidding.

01:23:16.890 --> 01:23:21.460
You're getting there. Even the women's sports

01:23:21.460 --> 01:23:26.539
-focused organizations ignored volleyball. It's

01:23:26.539 --> 01:23:32.039
the only sport to become mainstream with women

01:23:32.039 --> 01:23:36.520
and girls as the primary athletes. I thought

01:23:36.520 --> 01:23:41.000
we would be celebrated by the Women's Sports

01:23:41.000 --> 01:23:45.800
Foundation and the Center for Women in Sports

01:23:45.800 --> 01:23:50.920
in the media. all those groups, and they ignored

01:23:50.920 --> 01:23:55.800
volleyball just like the mainstream media. Why

01:23:55.800 --> 01:23:59.359
do you think that is? I really think it's because

01:23:59.359 --> 01:24:06.079
we don't have the Title IX bludgeon. And I used

01:24:06.079 --> 01:24:09.800
that bludgeon. I told you, I sued the university

01:24:09.800 --> 01:24:15.000
that I went to, that I love. It's a lot harder.

01:24:15.710 --> 01:24:21.090
to have to stand on your own feet, on your own

01:24:21.090 --> 01:24:25.649
merits as a women's sport or a minor men's sport.

01:24:25.890 --> 01:24:30.970
That's why I'm so excited about the pro leagues.

01:24:31.010 --> 01:24:34.970
I'm excited about the success Beach is having

01:24:34.970 --> 01:24:40.210
producing Olympians in the college ranks. I'm

01:24:40.210 --> 01:24:44.109
excited about love and major league volleyball.

01:24:44.109 --> 01:24:48.529
Also, Athletes Unlimited, because volleyball

01:24:48.529 --> 01:24:55.109
is finally being recognized as a mainstream sport.

01:24:55.739 --> 01:25:01.279
on its own merits. That is not to say that I

01:25:01.279 --> 01:25:05.300
didn't spend a lot of time working on growth

01:25:05.300 --> 01:25:09.720
for boys and men because my experience of Title

01:25:09.720 --> 01:25:14.939
IX, they say turnabout is fair play. When I saw

01:25:14.939 --> 01:25:19.420
the lack of opportunities for boys and men in

01:25:19.420 --> 01:25:24.680
the U .S., I was all in on it. growing that part

01:25:24.680 --> 01:25:27.340
of the sport also. And I think that that's so

01:25:27.340 --> 01:25:30.840
important to reiterate is that we're speaking

01:25:30.840 --> 01:25:35.479
about Title IX, which gave women an equal opportunity.

01:25:35.880 --> 01:25:41.319
But you didn't discriminate. Your love for volleyball

01:25:41.319 --> 01:25:45.579
as a sport, you wanted to include men, which

01:25:45.579 --> 01:25:49.239
women have been fighting for that equality for

01:25:49.239 --> 01:25:52.289
so long. And you were like... But in volleyball,

01:25:52.510 --> 01:25:54.409
men are being left behind. Yes. And the fact

01:25:54.409 --> 01:25:57.789
that you chose to work to elevate them as well,

01:25:57.829 --> 01:26:00.090
I think, really speaks to your character. Well,

01:26:00.250 --> 01:26:07.850
it speaks to my leaning into opportunity. Opportunity,

01:26:07.850 --> 01:26:12.409
where we don't have it. I'm leaning into opportunity.

01:26:12.949 --> 01:26:18.369
And I saw, I did a Title IX interview with NCAA.

01:26:19.689 --> 01:26:24.250
And this was years ago, maybe like 20 years ago

01:26:24.250 --> 01:26:28.750
now. And I said to them, will we have another

01:26:28.750 --> 01:26:32.789
Karch Karai? You need to grow the men's game

01:26:32.789 --> 01:26:34.510
for that to happen. What's going to happen in

01:26:34.510 --> 01:26:39.489
this country if we lose opportunities for boys

01:26:39.489 --> 01:26:45.550
and men? It's all wound together. But I grew

01:26:45.550 --> 01:26:49.939
into, to your question, I grew into the make

01:26:49.939 --> 01:26:53.460
volleyball manner. Well, you definitely have.

01:26:53.659 --> 01:26:59.979
Well, I certainly, Adam, didn't do it by myself.

01:27:00.140 --> 01:27:05.079
I had so many, many people helping me, like Sarah.

01:27:05.239 --> 01:27:11.359
And you're willing to fly out to California in

01:27:11.359 --> 01:27:14.760
the middle of the winter. I know it was hard.

01:27:14.760 --> 01:27:17.579
I had to escape Nebraska. To leave Nebraska.

01:27:17.939 --> 01:27:22.239
Give up one of your playing dates for the whole

01:27:22.239 --> 01:27:28.319
team. You and Jordan Larson, 2007, played in

01:27:28.319 --> 01:27:33.840
the ABCA's first beach event, and that planted

01:27:33.840 --> 01:27:38.279
the seeds. And the fact that John let you go,

01:27:38.359 --> 01:27:42.479
and you were willing to go, Stanford, Penn State.

01:27:42.960 --> 01:27:47.500
Everybody sent teams to the first event. That's

01:27:47.500 --> 01:27:51.300
what I mean. Coaches could have said, no way,

01:27:51.500 --> 01:27:57.000
Kathy, this is crazy. You're crazy. And coaches

01:27:57.000 --> 01:28:00.800
went along with leaning into this opportunity.

01:28:01.399 --> 01:28:03.920
Yeah, because in case the listeners aren't aware,

01:28:04.180 --> 01:28:08.930
in the spring season, you have limited... days

01:28:08.930 --> 01:28:11.810
that you can actually compete and you have limited

01:28:11.810 --> 01:28:16.250
days that you can train. So these programs and

01:28:16.250 --> 01:28:19.569
these coaches sacrificed a day of competition

01:28:19.569 --> 01:28:23.850
in their spring season to send only two athletes

01:28:23.850 --> 01:28:27.250
a piece. to San Diego to compete in this event.

01:28:27.350 --> 01:28:30.029
So I think, you know, shout out to, you know,

01:28:30.050 --> 01:28:32.510
John Cook, Russ Rose, John Dunning, all those

01:28:32.510 --> 01:28:35.350
coaches who saw the future of beach volleyball

01:28:35.350 --> 01:28:38.689
and allowed us to play in that. Well, and let's

01:28:38.689 --> 01:28:40.789
not, I mean, all of those coaches you mentioned

01:28:40.789 --> 01:28:43.449
are uber competitive and they wanted their program

01:28:43.449 --> 01:28:46.270
to win the first. Let's not pretend that it was

01:28:46.270 --> 01:28:52.279
all. So you. touched on the professional leagues

01:28:52.279 --> 01:28:55.359
that are happening in the U .S. What is your

01:28:55.359 --> 01:28:58.760
take on the current landscape of these professional

01:28:58.760 --> 01:29:01.939
leagues? I'm curious your thoughts on the fact

01:29:01.939 --> 01:29:03.760
that there are three of them. Do you think that's

01:29:03.760 --> 01:29:08.300
a good thing? Do you think that is taking away

01:29:08.300 --> 01:29:12.420
from the bigger picture? No, I think that's a

01:29:12.420 --> 01:29:19.279
great thing. So if you go to professional leagues,

01:29:19.899 --> 01:29:24.619
starting up in any sport. There are multiple

01:29:24.619 --> 01:29:28.739
iterations. Everybody thinks they have the best

01:29:28.739 --> 01:29:32.739
idea, they have the best business plan, and the

01:29:32.739 --> 01:29:37.920
fact that three different organizations with

01:29:37.920 --> 01:29:42.920
funders outside of the sport of volleyball. Traditionally,

01:29:43.220 --> 01:29:47.300
volleyball leagues have been started with a dad

01:29:47.300 --> 01:29:51.170
who had a daughter. who had a lot of money, whose

01:29:51.170 --> 01:29:54.609
daughter wanted to play. And the daughter probably

01:29:54.609 --> 01:29:58.550
wasn't very good. Well, they were okay, but when

01:29:58.550 --> 01:30:04.630
they aged out... Then it died. It died. The fact

01:30:04.630 --> 01:30:09.409
that Athletes Unlimited, Major League Volleyball,

01:30:09.550 --> 01:30:15.289
and Love have all invested, people outside of

01:30:15.289 --> 01:30:20.000
volleyball have seen this sport. and have gotten

01:30:20.000 --> 01:30:24.640
excited about this sport and are offering pro

01:30:24.640 --> 01:30:29.880
athlete opportunities. It's just great. That

01:30:29.880 --> 01:30:34.479
brings more sponsorship, that brings more ticket

01:30:34.479 --> 01:30:39.720
sales, more casual fans to the table. Every sport

01:30:39.720 --> 01:30:46.840
competes into a sport with itself. more than

01:30:46.840 --> 01:30:50.479
it competes with the other sports who are really

01:30:50.479 --> 01:30:55.840
the enemy, and sports and entertainment broadly.

01:30:56.340 --> 01:31:02.699
So it's not unusual to have the leagues competing

01:31:02.699 --> 01:31:07.939
with each other. Right now, this is good, because

01:31:07.939 --> 01:31:13.079
if it was only one, they would have an instantaneous

01:31:13.079 --> 01:31:19.340
monopoly. Monopolies are by definition inefficient.

01:31:19.760 --> 01:31:23.579
They don't compete well. They don't control their

01:31:23.579 --> 01:31:26.399
costs. That's a very interesting take because

01:31:26.399 --> 01:31:29.939
my thought process as I've seen these leagues

01:31:29.939 --> 01:31:34.970
pop up and develop was the opposite. I was always

01:31:34.970 --> 01:31:36.590
thinking, you know, if these leagues could work

01:31:36.590 --> 01:31:39.189
together, like maybe they could create something

01:31:39.189 --> 01:31:43.029
amazing. But you bring up very interesting points.

01:31:43.369 --> 01:31:50.510
They were, I'm sure that they will not all survive.

01:31:50.970 --> 01:31:55.289
I'm positive of that. But I hope one of them

01:31:55.289 --> 01:32:01.800
does. Eventually, like the ABA and the NBA, like

01:32:01.800 --> 01:32:09.399
the AFCA and the NFL combined, soccer is still

01:32:09.399 --> 01:32:15.680
in the process of absorbing the quality franchises.

01:32:17.279 --> 01:32:20.260
Lower leagues. Well, we recently saw this in

01:32:20.260 --> 01:32:22.180
women's hockey, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The two

01:32:22.180 --> 01:32:25.539
leagues just merged. Just merged. Three leagues

01:32:25.539 --> 01:32:28.420
now, I guess, now I'm thinking about what you're

01:32:28.420 --> 01:32:31.020
saying, is like they can learn from each other

01:32:31.020 --> 01:32:33.819
and make improvements based on what the other

01:32:33.819 --> 01:32:35.960
ones are doing. Well, and let's look at sport.

01:32:36.340 --> 01:32:38.640
Competition for a spot on the floor makes you

01:32:38.640 --> 01:32:41.140
better. Well, yes. Competition with another organization

01:32:41.140 --> 01:32:45.260
makes you better. It drives innovation. It drives

01:32:45.260 --> 01:32:48.079
you to be. on top of it to compete with somebody.

01:32:48.199 --> 01:32:50.319
So I think that that's a good thing. That's a

01:32:50.319 --> 01:32:55.100
good thing. And investor fatigue, all of them

01:32:55.100 --> 01:32:59.000
are going to have to deal with that over time.

01:32:59.199 --> 01:33:03.560
The WNBA, look at them. They've been in business

01:33:03.560 --> 01:33:08.359
for 30 years, and they're still reliant on the

01:33:08.359 --> 01:33:13.880
NBA for funding. I think it will be quicker.

01:33:14.569 --> 01:33:20.229
In volleyball, I threw my hat in with the love

01:33:20.229 --> 01:33:24.890
model because we don't have a male counterpart,

01:33:25.350 --> 01:33:31.579
a pro male counterpart to feed us money. Like

01:33:31.579 --> 01:33:38.359
the NBA is doing for the W. And like the MLS

01:33:38.359 --> 01:33:43.239
is doing for soccer. And like professional hockey

01:33:43.239 --> 01:33:47.760
is doing for women's hockey. Major League Baseball

01:33:47.760 --> 01:33:52.479
is doing for softball, unlimited. Athletes, unlimited.

01:33:52.979 --> 01:33:59.560
Pro softball. We don't have that. What sustains

01:33:59.560 --> 01:34:04.340
the interest of your investors to stay engaged

01:34:04.340 --> 01:34:12.039
over time? By definition, pro sport loses millions

01:34:12.039 --> 01:34:18.020
for years. By definition. And so the League One

01:34:18.020 --> 01:34:24.340
model of using the economies of scale in the

01:34:24.340 --> 01:34:30.689
youth marketplace to build revenues to drive

01:34:30.689 --> 01:34:37.569
income through the model. They're not using the

01:34:37.569 --> 01:34:43.409
kids to fund the pros, but they're like Ford,

01:34:43.489 --> 01:34:48.970
using the trucks to fund the EV development.

01:34:49.329 --> 01:34:54.350
That's the model. Love is... their investors

01:34:54.350 --> 01:35:00.069
are excited about the growth of the Ford truck

01:35:00.069 --> 01:35:04.710
division, about the growth of the club division,

01:35:05.090 --> 01:35:11.210
and the possibilities for merchandise, for events.

01:35:11.750 --> 01:35:14.210
So why do you think it took so long for this

01:35:14.210 --> 01:35:17.210
type of model to develop in women's sport? Because

01:35:17.210 --> 01:35:23.289
all the other women's pro leagues had... So they

01:35:23.289 --> 01:35:26.149
didn't need to. Yeah, had a male counterpart.

01:35:26.369 --> 01:35:32.109
So they didn't need to develop an entirely new

01:35:32.109 --> 01:35:36.170
model. And I've heard significant criticisms

01:35:36.170 --> 01:35:39.529
from people within the volleyball community.

01:35:39.770 --> 01:35:44.890
This is not the traditional model. This is not

01:35:44.890 --> 01:35:49.550
the... ownership model that people are used to.

01:35:49.649 --> 01:35:53.310
That's the reason it won't work. I say that's

01:35:53.310 --> 01:35:56.829
the reason it has a chance. A lot of people have

01:35:56.829 --> 01:35:59.970
questions, but there hasn't been ways to necessarily

01:35:59.970 --> 01:36:03.189
find answers. So the way that you have presented

01:36:03.189 --> 01:36:06.229
this, like it makes a lot of sense. And I know

01:36:06.229 --> 01:36:09.869
a lot of our listeners have had similar questions

01:36:09.869 --> 01:36:15.180
about it because without the information. It's

01:36:15.180 --> 01:36:17.979
easy to make assumptions. No, yes. If you don't

01:36:17.979 --> 01:36:21.159
know, you make it up. I have done that for years.

01:36:23.739 --> 01:36:28.420
So what do you think the Love and the other American

01:36:28.420 --> 01:36:31.659
pro leagues need to do to be able to enter the

01:36:31.659 --> 01:36:35.600
conversation of being the premier pro league?

01:36:35.779 --> 01:36:37.819
The Italian league, the Turkish league, they

01:36:37.819 --> 01:36:39.739
are considered the cream of the crop right now.

01:36:39.840 --> 01:36:42.619
So what do you think these leagues and Love need

01:36:42.619 --> 01:36:46.140
to do? to kind of enter that conversation? Well,

01:36:46.319 --> 01:36:52.020
we need more fans, more non -volleyball fans.

01:36:52.399 --> 01:36:56.439
We can't just do it with volleyball people. The

01:36:56.439 --> 01:37:01.119
infrastructure or the universe is way too small.

01:37:01.520 --> 01:37:05.680
Love and the other leagues are getting more television

01:37:05.680 --> 01:37:09.220
deals. They're getting more sponsorship deals.

01:37:09.640 --> 01:37:17.260
And what I like about It is the fact that women's

01:37:17.260 --> 01:37:21.520
products and services, providers, are starting

01:37:21.520 --> 01:37:26.880
to lean into volleyball. So that's a differentiator.

01:37:27.159 --> 01:37:32.960
If all we can sell is more pizza, beer, and fast

01:37:32.960 --> 01:37:37.979
food, insurance, I buy all those things. I don't

01:37:37.979 --> 01:37:42.020
have anything against them. For women's sports

01:37:42.020 --> 01:37:46.119
to succeed in the marketplace, we have to start

01:37:46.119 --> 01:37:52.819
drawing many, many more women's eyeballs and

01:37:52.819 --> 01:37:57.779
girls' eyeballs. And when we can do that, we

01:37:57.779 --> 01:38:03.460
can go into skims, hair care products, makeup,

01:38:03.920 --> 01:38:13.939
groceries, diapers. General sporting, no, not

01:38:13.939 --> 01:38:19.779
general products that women buy regularly. I

01:38:19.779 --> 01:38:26.199
think that's the key to the success of women's

01:38:26.199 --> 01:38:31.060
pro sports in the U .S. is not to just go back

01:38:31.060 --> 01:38:35.680
to the same wells. So you talk about getting

01:38:35.680 --> 01:38:39.510
more fans into the game. And I think one of the

01:38:39.510 --> 01:38:42.130
difficult things about volleyball as a sport

01:38:42.130 --> 01:38:45.810
is you can't just pick up a ball and play, right?

01:38:45.970 --> 01:38:47.630
You can pick up a basketball, you can go to a

01:38:47.630 --> 01:38:48.949
park. You can pick up a soccer ball, you can

01:38:48.949 --> 01:38:51.390
go to a park. Volleyball is an incredibly technical

01:38:51.390 --> 01:38:54.689
sport. You can't pick it up at four years old.

01:38:54.770 --> 01:38:56.710
You can do certain things, but you need a lot

01:38:56.710 --> 01:39:00.619
of people to play. And so... I would say volleyball

01:39:00.619 --> 01:39:02.960
is probably a high barrier entry sport. Like

01:39:02.960 --> 01:39:04.460
it takes a little bit of time to get into it.

01:39:04.479 --> 01:39:06.460
It's expensive to play. You can't just go kick

01:39:06.460 --> 01:39:08.840
a ball, you know, in your backyard with your

01:39:08.840 --> 01:39:12.199
friends in general. And I know you have partnered

01:39:12.199 --> 01:39:16.779
with Love to work on making the sport more accessible.

01:39:17.520 --> 01:39:20.140
How are you guys approaching that? And how are

01:39:20.140 --> 01:39:22.279
you growing the game from the grassroots level

01:39:22.279 --> 01:39:25.920
to make it available to everybody? Yeah. Well,

01:39:26.079 --> 01:39:31.670
first, Adam. I disagree fundamentally with you

01:39:31.670 --> 01:39:37.390
on volleyball being more barrier to entry than

01:39:37.390 --> 01:39:42.029
other sports. As much as I have spent my career

01:39:42.029 --> 01:39:46.329
in volleyball, we have done a piss -poor job

01:39:46.329 --> 01:39:51.939
of adapting the sport for kids. Look at soccer.

01:39:52.199 --> 01:39:57.199
You can pass a ball to yourself and to your sister

01:39:57.199 --> 01:40:01.659
and balloons. That's how I got started. Keep

01:40:01.659 --> 01:40:04.960
the balloon off the floor. Shout out to my dad.

01:40:05.100 --> 01:40:11.479
Good for him. Baseball, t -ball, coach pitch.

01:40:11.779 --> 01:40:16.399
I don't like all that adult interaction, but

01:40:16.399 --> 01:40:21.270
we can adapt volleyball for children. We can

01:40:21.270 --> 01:40:24.970
lower the nets. We can make the balls lighter.

01:40:25.270 --> 01:40:29.689
We can allow them to catch the first ball. And

01:40:29.689 --> 01:40:33.810
other countries, and your country being one of

01:40:33.810 --> 01:40:37.029
them. Canada does that. Yeah. have done a much

01:40:37.029 --> 01:40:41.609
better job than the U .S. of adapting volleyball

01:40:41.609 --> 01:40:45.810
for young kids. Well, our kids come down to play

01:40:45.810 --> 01:40:49.189
in American tournaments, and we have a tiered

01:40:49.189 --> 01:40:52.829
net system, so I don't think girls start playing

01:40:52.829 --> 01:40:55.600
on the... full women's height net until they're

01:40:55.600 --> 01:41:00.640
15 maybe or 16 yeah in canada so like our 12

01:41:00.640 --> 01:41:03.680
you girls come down to the states to play and

01:41:03.680 --> 01:41:05.899
it's just a shock to their systems because they're

01:41:05.899 --> 01:41:10.619
like whoa this is really high yeah it's the beauty

01:41:10.619 --> 01:41:15.699
and the disaster of the u .s system there is

01:41:15.699 --> 01:41:17.920
a benefit to some extent you're right but uh

01:41:17.920 --> 01:41:24.260
the u .s there's no volleyball czar like uh Canada

01:41:24.260 --> 01:41:30.939
has, like the other sports. In Brazil, what Bruno

01:41:30.939 --> 01:41:37.779
Dinho says is the law. Facts. Yeah. He can say,

01:41:37.880 --> 01:41:42.500
we are going to play one catch. All the way up

01:41:42.500 --> 01:41:46.500
to the pro leagues, and they do it. That is accurate.

01:41:46.680 --> 01:41:49.399
I played for him professionally. It's true. Yeah.

01:41:49.420 --> 01:41:54.819
Well, there's no czar in the U .S. USA Volleyball,

01:41:54.939 --> 01:41:59.220
just as a guideline organization, and the NCAA.

01:42:00.479 --> 01:42:04.100
is an educational -based organization that is

01:42:04.100 --> 01:42:08.680
more worried about participation. The club model

01:42:08.680 --> 01:42:14.060
is small businesses that are not government -subsidized,

01:42:14.180 --> 01:42:18.340
government -funded. They have to make it based

01:42:18.340 --> 01:42:23.420
on numbers, based on what money you eat, what

01:42:23.420 --> 01:42:28.859
you kill in this system. So all the incentives.

01:42:29.850 --> 01:42:35.609
are unaligned for youth development. But having

01:42:35.609 --> 01:42:41.329
said that, the love model and the other clubs

01:42:41.329 --> 01:42:46.750
not in love are really working hard on getting

01:42:46.750 --> 01:42:49.649
three - and four -year -olds, five - and six

01:42:49.649 --> 01:42:53.989
-year -olds. And John Sparrow has made this a

01:42:53.989 --> 01:42:59.609
priority of development in the U .S. What is

01:42:59.609 --> 01:43:03.609
the Love Foundation's role in all of this? Yeah.

01:43:04.859 --> 01:43:08.600
I'm the volunteer chair of the board of the Love

01:43:08.600 --> 01:43:12.960
Foundation, and our goal is to provide access

01:43:12.960 --> 01:43:17.880
to opportunities. There we go again. And you're

01:43:17.880 --> 01:43:21.439
doing that through camps and clinics? Yeah, we

01:43:21.439 --> 01:43:25.500
are doing that primarily through fundraising,

01:43:25.720 --> 01:43:29.359
and the clubs are doing most of the fundraising.

01:43:29.479 --> 01:43:35.880
Last year, we gave out about... $950 ,000. That's

01:43:35.880 --> 01:43:39.500
double what we gave the year before, and that

01:43:39.500 --> 01:43:44.560
was double what we gave out the first year. $800

01:43:44.560 --> 01:43:50.260
,000 of that was raised directly by the clubs

01:43:50.260 --> 01:43:55.979
through fundraising events, gifts in kind, working

01:43:55.979 --> 01:44:02.829
other events. just kids coaching kids to pay

01:44:02.829 --> 01:44:07.250
off their dues. Our goal for this year is $2

01:44:07.250 --> 01:44:12.789
million. The foundation's main fundraising is

01:44:12.789 --> 01:44:17.649
directed at providing opportunities for kids

01:44:17.649 --> 01:44:22.840
that can't even think about volleyball now. Because

01:44:22.840 --> 01:44:25.760
volleyball is very expensive to play. Not kids

01:44:25.760 --> 01:44:29.520
that are already in clubs and just hanging on.

01:44:29.760 --> 01:44:35.399
They are important, too. And we funded 500 kids

01:44:35.399 --> 01:44:41.159
through need -based aid to the clubs. But we

01:44:41.159 --> 01:44:46.840
also introduced 500 kids to volleyball. Iowa

01:44:46.840 --> 01:44:52.659
Impact did a camp in Des Moines for $100. Middle

01:44:52.659 --> 01:44:56.920
school kids. One of the kids that helped with

01:44:56.920 --> 01:45:00.159
the camp was a high school player. She wound

01:45:00.159 --> 01:45:05.560
up coming to their trials. Her name is Jumi,

01:45:05.760 --> 01:45:13.779
and she made their 16 -1 team. She's 6 '2". I

01:45:13.779 --> 01:45:17.680
have goosebumps. Yeah, full -knee kid, and she

01:45:17.680 --> 01:45:22.640
will make Jumi's life. will be better because

01:45:22.640 --> 01:45:27.340
of volleyball, and Iowa Impact will be better

01:45:27.340 --> 01:45:32.060
because of Jimmy. So how do people access this

01:45:32.060 --> 01:45:34.300
if there are kids who are need -based, if there

01:45:34.300 --> 01:45:36.199
are clubs out there who are listening who want

01:45:36.199 --> 01:45:38.859
to help and get access to some of the fundraising

01:45:38.859 --> 01:45:41.420
or help with that? What is the best way for clubs

01:45:41.420 --> 01:45:44.159
who are not currently attached to love and kids

01:45:44.159 --> 01:45:47.060
who aren't to get access to this or to help out

01:45:47.060 --> 01:45:50.149
or to go to the game alongside you guys? Love

01:45:50.149 --> 01:45:55.949
through Lindsay Rosenthal and Paige Furlock has

01:45:55.949 --> 01:46:00.949
a partnership with Submittable, and they can

01:46:00.949 --> 01:46:06.750
go online and fill out an application. It's all

01:46:06.750 --> 01:46:12.430
need -based. It's not pay -for -play. It's need

01:46:12.430 --> 01:46:16.529
-based aid, and you can fill out an application.

01:46:18.199 --> 01:46:21.619
For people who are listening who want to help,

01:46:21.880 --> 01:46:25.680
we need money. So what's the best way for people

01:46:25.680 --> 01:46:30.739
to donate? Contact the foundation. It's all on

01:46:30.739 --> 01:46:37.420
our website, lovefoundation .org, and you can

01:46:37.420 --> 01:46:44.300
find it through love .com. Contact the foundation,

01:46:44.439 --> 01:46:49.899
and there's... Multiple ways to give. You can

01:46:49.899 --> 01:46:54.520
give cash. You can give stock. You can give your

01:46:54.520 --> 01:47:00.460
inheritance. You can give your firstborn. No,

01:47:00.539 --> 01:47:04.100
no, no. Check that. Sarah's firstborn. You'll

01:47:04.100 --> 01:47:08.220
take her, though, right? Yeah. A lot of the clubs

01:47:08.220 --> 01:47:12.020
will take you guys as first and second and third.

01:47:12.920 --> 01:47:15.079
get going they'll be tall that's a guarantee

01:47:15.079 --> 01:47:18.180
get going well we've got one on the way so we'll

01:47:18.180 --> 01:47:21.500
see how that goes on the way or here wow he's

01:47:21.500 --> 01:47:23.479
used to saying on the way yeah surprise she's

01:47:23.479 --> 01:47:28.800
brand new um donations that people give will

01:47:28.800 --> 01:47:33.579
those go towards the need -based kids or we are

01:47:33.579 --> 01:47:40.100
donor -centered so if you say um kathy i want

01:47:40.100 --> 01:47:46.659
my Donations to go to Des Moines area. We will

01:47:46.659 --> 01:47:51.319
keep your donations local. Most of the giving

01:47:51.319 --> 01:47:56.899
is local. The fundraising is national, but most

01:47:56.899 --> 01:48:01.800
of the giving is to your local area or local

01:48:01.800 --> 01:48:06.039
club. Yeah. I love that. Well, I know our listeners,

01:48:06.079 --> 01:48:10.020
like Adam said, a lot of club coaches, a lot

01:48:10.020 --> 01:48:14.739
of... athletes a lot of club directors so for

01:48:14.739 --> 01:48:18.140
all of you listening so many of you have built

01:48:18.140 --> 01:48:21.079
your careers or have been impacted by volleyball

01:48:21.079 --> 01:48:24.600
in some way even knowing the impact that the

01:48:24.600 --> 01:48:28.140
sport has had on on all of our lives just having

01:48:28.140 --> 01:48:31.779
giving access to kids to be able to learn the

01:48:31.779 --> 01:48:35.560
game get their start as a springboard to potentially

01:48:35.560 --> 01:48:41.109
start a club career or you know for athletes

01:48:41.109 --> 01:48:43.430
that really want to play and haven't been able

01:48:43.430 --> 01:48:46.390
to for financial need reasons highly encourage

01:48:46.390 --> 01:48:49.590
you to head to lovefoundation .org to donate

01:48:49.590 --> 01:48:53.430
and yeah who know we might have the next jumi

01:48:53.430 --> 01:48:56.710
who gets to play on our club team and then that

01:48:56.710 --> 01:48:59.729
will lead to potentially an ncaa career she'll

01:48:59.729 --> 01:49:04.050
get an education like haley washington was a

01:49:04.050 --> 01:49:09.550
need -based aid kid when she was a colorado juniors

01:49:09.550 --> 01:49:14.989
logan eggleston was a neat bass kid lindsey rosenthal

01:49:14.989 --> 01:49:18.649
was a neat bass kid and i have goosebumps again

01:49:18.649 --> 01:49:22.909
because these are women that so many volleyball

01:49:22.909 --> 01:49:26.449
athletes look up to and they want to be like

01:49:26.449 --> 01:49:29.189
them and we've got an olympic gold medalist we've

01:49:29.189 --> 01:49:32.989
got a pro athlete with love austin who has a

01:49:32.989 --> 01:49:37.159
chance to compete in la 2028 like volleyball

01:49:37.159 --> 01:49:39.079
should be accessible to everyone because it is

01:49:39.079 --> 01:49:42.380
such a beautiful game. And I think the work that

01:49:42.380 --> 01:49:44.680
you guys are doing is absolutely incredible.

01:49:45.159 --> 01:49:53.520
Well, not many of us have the talent to be pro

01:49:53.520 --> 01:49:58.600
athletes like you were, like I was 100 years

01:49:58.600 --> 01:50:08.319
ago. But everybody has an opportunity. to benefit

01:50:08.319 --> 01:50:13.600
from their participation in sport. And most of

01:50:13.600 --> 01:50:17.760
us are going to go into coaching or administration

01:50:17.760 --> 01:50:22.500
or club directing or working for love, working

01:50:22.500 --> 01:50:28.960
in community management for a pro team. All of

01:50:28.960 --> 01:50:34.939
those jobs are possible through this infrastructure.

01:50:35.739 --> 01:50:41.199
through the opportunities we are providing through

01:50:41.199 --> 01:50:45.180
the Love Foundation. I think that's so beautiful,

01:50:45.340 --> 01:50:48.140
and you're right. Not everybody will be a professional

01:50:48.140 --> 01:50:51.319
athlete, but the lessons you learn in sport,

01:50:51.460 --> 01:50:55.819
playing a team sport such as volleyball and having

01:50:55.819 --> 01:51:02.729
access to that, the benefits are countless. Thank

01:51:02.729 --> 01:51:05.409
you for sharing about the Love Foundation, and

01:51:05.409 --> 01:51:09.010
I encourage everybody to donate, try to get involved

01:51:09.010 --> 01:51:13.090
in any way you can. And to close, I have one

01:51:13.090 --> 01:51:16.869
last question. Okay. When you look back on your

01:51:16.869 --> 01:51:19.750
involvement in sport, what is the thing you are

01:51:19.750 --> 01:51:24.630
most proud of? Well, this is a non -standard

01:51:24.630 --> 01:51:28.550
answer. We love a non -standard answer. I was

01:51:28.550 --> 01:51:33.340
always a rebel. And it was not always a good

01:51:33.340 --> 01:51:38.680
thing. I was impossible to coach. Chuck Arbery

01:51:38.680 --> 01:51:42.159
would tell you that, and all my coaches would

01:51:42.159 --> 01:51:47.960
tell you that, because I was quick -fused. I

01:51:47.960 --> 01:51:54.880
was quick to anger. But young people today, I

01:51:54.880 --> 01:51:59.689
challenge you to... Lean into the things that

01:51:59.689 --> 01:52:05.890
you want from life. All change starts from not

01:52:05.890 --> 01:52:11.810
people my age. We are trying to preserve the

01:52:11.810 --> 01:52:16.130
things that we created. It starts from people

01:52:16.130 --> 01:52:21.550
your age and young people protesting on campuses.

01:52:21.909 --> 01:52:28.930
Whatever it is, Title IX or I grew up just post

01:52:28.930 --> 01:52:33.729
-Vietnam War. Lean into the country that you

01:52:33.729 --> 01:52:38.329
want to live in and lean into the things that

01:52:38.329 --> 01:52:46.329
you value. I didn't know at the time how history

01:52:46.329 --> 01:52:50.909
would judge me when I sued Michigan State. When

01:52:50.909 --> 01:52:55.229
I... implemented beach volleyball. Now everybody

01:52:55.229 --> 01:53:00.130
thinks it's a great idea. At the time, the number

01:53:00.130 --> 01:53:03.729
of people that were saying, Kathy, you are crazy,

01:53:04.069 --> 01:53:10.949
buck down, quit on this ridiculous thing. And

01:53:10.949 --> 01:53:15.470
the ABCA has just gotten all involved with boys

01:53:15.470 --> 01:53:20.170
volleyball. Who cares? We started as a girl organization,

01:53:20.270 --> 01:53:24.510
and we should stay there. You have to be a rebel,

01:53:24.550 --> 01:53:28.050
and you have to push for things that you want.

01:53:28.229 --> 01:53:32.770
And you don't know whether you will be successful

01:53:32.770 --> 01:53:37.520
or not, but do it. That's the best answer. I

01:53:37.520 --> 01:53:39.720
like teared up hearing that answer. You said

01:53:39.720 --> 01:53:41.560
it was non -conventional, but I think that it

01:53:41.560 --> 01:53:43.939
was absolutely perfect. I love that so much.

01:53:44.239 --> 01:53:47.600
We're out of time, but thank you so, so much

01:53:47.600 --> 01:53:51.100
for joining us. This was such a special opportunity.

01:53:52.800 --> 01:53:54.819
I saw you earlier this week, and I was like,

01:53:54.880 --> 01:53:57.800
I remembered you. I was wondering if you remembered

01:53:57.800 --> 01:54:02.680
me, too. I gave you a lot of awards, so I definitely

01:54:02.680 --> 01:54:06.460
remembered you. Well, to be able to speak with

01:54:06.460 --> 01:54:10.359
you and talk about your career and now the work

01:54:10.359 --> 01:54:12.119
you're doing with the Love Foundation, thank

01:54:12.119 --> 01:54:14.539
you so much for spending time with us. Thanks,

01:54:14.640 --> 01:54:17.939
you guys. That concludes this week's episode

01:54:17.939 --> 01:54:19.960
of Volley Talk. There's always something shaking

01:54:19.960 --> 01:54:22.039
in the volleyball world and we hope you enjoyed

01:54:22.039 --> 01:54:24.800
this little fix. Be sure to follow the show so

01:54:24.800 --> 01:54:26.899
you don't miss any updates and we'd be so grateful

01:54:26.899 --> 01:54:29.659
if you'd leave us a five -star review. You can

01:54:29.659 --> 01:54:32.260
also find us on Instagram at volleytalk underscore

01:54:32.260 --> 01:54:35.300
podcast. If you have a topic you'd like us to

01:54:35.300 --> 01:54:37.420
discuss, you can reach out to us on Instagram

01:54:37.420 --> 01:54:41.520
or at info at sarahpavin .com. Thanks so much

01:54:41.520 --> 01:54:44.000
for joining us and we'll be back next week.