WEBVTT 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:03.660 May I have your attention, please? The following 00:00:03.660 --> 00:00:10.779 is not the real Jeff Fox release. If your teenage 00:00:10.779 --> 00:00:14.599 son wants nothing more than to live the life 00:00:14.599 --> 00:00:23.100 of a drone bee, you might be a beekeeper. If 00:00:23.100 --> 00:00:29.550 you do more splits than a gymnast, You might 00:00:29.550 --> 00:00:36.170 be a beekeeper. If you refer to your divorce 00:00:36.170 --> 00:00:42.850 as swarming behavior, you might be a beekeeper. 00:00:43.990 --> 00:00:46.369 I'll give you a minute to think about that one. 00:00:54.119 --> 00:00:57.020 Welcome welcome to Be Love Beekeeping presented 00:00:57.020 --> 00:01:00.719 by Man Lake. Our guests today are coming to us 00:01:00.719 --> 00:01:03.880 all the way from Florida and Argentina as we 00:01:03.880 --> 00:01:06.659 will have David and Paulo from Vita Bee Health 00:01:06.659 --> 00:01:09.519 on the show. We will be discussing all things 00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:13.480 Varroa and Vita's new oxalic acid based strips. 00:01:14.180 --> 00:01:16.640 Before we check in with them we have a brief 00:01:16.640 --> 00:01:20.659 update on this year's record colony losses. Researchers 00:01:20.659 --> 00:01:23.799 from Washington State University are projecting 00:01:23.799 --> 00:01:26.939 that U .S. honeybee colony losses could be upwards 00:01:26.939 --> 00:01:31.799 of 70 percent this year. The last figure we heard 00:01:31.799 --> 00:01:35.799 was 62 percent, so this news is getting even 00:01:35.799 --> 00:01:40.319 worse. While colony losses average 40 to 50 percent 00:01:40.319 --> 00:01:43.359 annually, this number is a big increase. Here's 00:01:43.359 --> 00:01:46.579 a quote from their press release. This year, 00:01:46.760 --> 00:01:49.980 a combination of nutrition deficiencies, mite 00:01:49.980 --> 00:01:54.599 infestations, viral diseases, and possible pesticide 00:01:54.599 --> 00:01:57.420 exposure during the previous pollination season 00:01:57.420 --> 00:02:00.920 led to the higher losses. Sorry for the bad news, 00:02:01.040 --> 00:02:04.480 but we did promise updates as they came in. Now 00:02:04.480 --> 00:02:06.579 to learn more about keeping our bees healthy, 00:02:07.120 --> 00:02:12.400 let's get to today's interview. I would like 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:15.259 to welcome to the show today two very special 00:02:15.259 --> 00:02:19.039 guests coming to us, one from Florida and that 00:02:19.039 --> 00:02:23.639 is David Westervelt and all the way from Argentina, 00:02:24.080 --> 00:02:26.759 Paulo Miego. How are you this morning, guys? 00:02:26.939 --> 00:02:30.219 Doing great. Yeah. Hello. Hello. Thank you. Thank 00:02:30.219 --> 00:02:33.219 you for the invitation and for the time. You're 00:02:33.219 --> 00:02:35.139 welcome. And Paulo, I know I didn't pronounce 00:02:35.139 --> 00:02:38.360 your name perfectly. I apologize. It was perfect. 00:02:38.580 --> 00:02:41.550 Close enough. No, it was perfect. Tell us what 00:02:41.550 --> 00:02:47.669 it means. So, Mielgo is a Spanish surname from 00:02:47.669 --> 00:02:52.930 Extremadura, Spain. And the first part of the 00:02:52.930 --> 00:02:56.150 of the surname, which is Miel, is honey in Spanish. 00:02:57.289 --> 00:03:02.229 So yes, quite unique name for this job. You were 00:03:02.229 --> 00:03:06.800 destined to... to have a job here. Now these 00:03:06.800 --> 00:03:10.419 guys both work with VitaBee Health and so we're 00:03:10.419 --> 00:03:13.780 going to be talking about all things Varroa and 00:03:13.780 --> 00:03:16.719 I know we get sick of hearing about Varroa but 00:03:16.719 --> 00:03:19.240 I don't know about you but I always have something 00:03:19.240 --> 00:03:22.860 to learn. These guys know the ins and outs of 00:03:22.860 --> 00:03:26.099 it and other ailments that are hurting our bees 00:03:26.099 --> 00:03:28.120 out there and they can give us a lot of great 00:03:28.120 --> 00:03:31.490 information. David? Would you first tell us a 00:03:31.490 --> 00:03:33.650 little bit about your experience in beekeeping 00:03:33.650 --> 00:03:36.389 and then Paula will let you do the same? Sure, 00:03:36.830 --> 00:03:39.289 that'd be great for me to tell you about beekeeping. 00:03:39.909 --> 00:03:42.210 I started beekeeping when I was about five and 00:03:42.210 --> 00:03:45.280 a half years old. I got interested into it. Because 00:03:45.280 --> 00:03:48.379 a neighbor of my dad's had bees on our property, 00:03:48.680 --> 00:03:51.860 ran about 40, 50 hives of bees on our property. 00:03:52.280 --> 00:03:54.800 And my dad thought I was nuts. He's like, why 00:03:54.800 --> 00:03:57.879 are you going out to work, play with bees? And 00:03:57.879 --> 00:04:01.060 I was in shorts and nothing else. So as I got 00:04:01.060 --> 00:04:03.520 involved in them, I went further and further. 00:04:03.580 --> 00:04:05.939 By the time I was in senior and high school, 00:04:06.060 --> 00:04:10.419 I had about 125 hives and actually wanted to 00:04:10.419 --> 00:04:14.509 become an inspector. Unbeknownst to me, I decided 00:04:14.509 --> 00:04:19.129 to go into the Army and spent 14 years in service 00:04:19.129 --> 00:04:21.629 going throughout the whole world. But during 00:04:21.629 --> 00:04:25.389 that time, I got to check on bees throughout 00:04:25.389 --> 00:04:29.069 28 different countries and then came back to 00:04:29.069 --> 00:04:33.470 the States and went into the Florida Department 00:04:33.470 --> 00:04:37.769 of Agriculture working as a other personnel service, 00:04:37.949 --> 00:04:40.350 they call it OPS. So you're virtually nobody. 00:04:40.850 --> 00:04:44.290 And I worked through there doing research and 00:04:44.290 --> 00:04:47.990 working on then a new pest called varroa mites 00:04:47.990 --> 00:04:50.490 and tracheomites. And so we were testing different 00:04:50.490 --> 00:04:54.350 products. I worked all the way up to being the 00:04:54.350 --> 00:04:57.449 Chief of Apiary Inspection for 28 years with 00:04:57.449 --> 00:05:00.310 the Department of Ag there in Florida. Retired, 00:05:01.110 --> 00:05:03.250 and Sebastian asked me if I wanted to come to 00:05:03.250 --> 00:05:07.350 work for VITA, and I was very happy. I'd known 00:05:07.350 --> 00:05:11.350 them through the ApiGuard, which is one of the 00:05:11.350 --> 00:05:14.790 products that we also sell, which is a thymol 00:05:14.790 --> 00:05:18.029 product, and I've enjoyed every bit of retirement 00:05:18.029 --> 00:05:21.689 working with Paula. Sebastian, Max Walken, it's 00:05:21.689 --> 00:05:24.250 a whole group. It's a wonderful group. Thank 00:05:24.250 --> 00:05:26.689 you, David. And my apologies, I pronounced it 00:05:26.689 --> 00:05:31.029 Vida. So thank you. Vida, Vida Bay Health. Well, 00:05:31.029 --> 00:05:34.170 you know your stuff. Go ahead, Paulo. OK, well, 00:05:34.170 --> 00:05:38.430 I'm second generation of beekeepers here in Argentina. 00:05:39.329 --> 00:05:43.069 I've been working with bees since I remember. 00:05:43.889 --> 00:05:46.850 Argentina is the only country in the world that 00:05:46.850 --> 00:05:51.000 you can go to the best school. became a big bet. 00:05:51.420 --> 00:05:56.579 So I am a big bet. Instead of studying all the 00:05:56.579 --> 00:05:59.959 animals during your five years of university, 00:06:00.680 --> 00:06:08.120 you focus only on honeybees. So that is my degree 00:06:08.120 --> 00:06:12.769 in this world. And I'm starting. giving some 00:06:12.769 --> 00:06:16.029 talk when I was very young to be keepers as a 00:06:16.029 --> 00:06:18.670 consultant here in Argentina. And after that, 00:06:18.970 --> 00:06:23.750 I agreed to go in Mexico and other South American 00:06:23.750 --> 00:06:28.209 countries. And I end up accepting a job for a 00:06:28.209 --> 00:06:31.990 company in Argentina that tried to develop a 00:06:31.990 --> 00:06:36.050 few feet for the honeybees back in 2011. So that 00:06:36.050 --> 00:06:41.569 is when I started to work on R &D. In 2016, I 00:06:41.569 --> 00:06:45.769 received an offer from VITA, VITA Europe or VITA 00:06:45.769 --> 00:06:48.910 V Health. We call VITA because it's an Italian 00:06:48.910 --> 00:06:52.269 word, which means life. And they offered me the 00:06:52.269 --> 00:06:57.689 possibility of being in charge of the R &D department. 00:06:58.290 --> 00:07:03.370 And I accepted and I moved to the UK. And since 00:07:03.370 --> 00:07:08.589 then, I'm working for VITA in R &D. But you're 00:07:08.589 --> 00:07:11.209 back in Argentina, your home. I'm back in Argentina. 00:07:11.470 --> 00:07:13.550 Yes. Yes. I'm back in Argentina now. Before we 00:07:13.550 --> 00:07:18.470 get into all the Varroa everything, David, give 00:07:18.470 --> 00:07:21.629 us a wild and crazy beekeeping story. You said 00:07:21.629 --> 00:07:24.550 earlier you have tons of them. I'll go back to 00:07:24.550 --> 00:07:28.129 one that happened about 45 years ago. When I 00:07:28.129 --> 00:07:31.189 was 12 years old, we decided to go to North Carolina, 00:07:31.269 --> 00:07:34.250 which we have a cabin in North Carolina. And 00:07:34.250 --> 00:07:37.660 my mom and dad and I drove up there in a Datsun 00:07:37.660 --> 00:07:40.600 pickup truck. If you can remember, you're talking 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:44.540 in the 70s. So we drove up there and bought 35 00:07:44.540 --> 00:07:48.300 hives of bees. At the time, the hives of bees 00:07:48.300 --> 00:07:52.879 were about $15 apiece. And that was my savings 00:07:52.879 --> 00:07:56.920 I had saved from working on bees. And so we loaded 00:07:56.920 --> 00:08:00.819 the bees up. They were all in singles. And we 00:08:00.819 --> 00:08:03.920 could fit about 17 in the back of a Datsun pickup. 00:08:04.319 --> 00:08:06.779 The problem was, mom could sit in the front, 00:08:06.899 --> 00:08:09.959 my dad could sit in the front. So I got the fun 00:08:09.959 --> 00:08:14.220 of riding on the back of the truck with 17 hives 00:08:14.220 --> 00:08:18.120 of bees all the way from North Carolina down 00:08:18.120 --> 00:08:21.939 to, well, we got down to Orangeburg, South Carolina, 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:24.439 I think it was, and we were getting a little 00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:29.079 low on fuel. So we stopped. to get fuel. And 00:08:29.079 --> 00:08:31.120 where we stopped at, there was this little guy 00:08:31.120 --> 00:08:34.700 airing up his bicycle tire. And he looks over 00:08:34.700 --> 00:08:39.019 at me and says, Mr, what are you sitting on? 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:41.820 And I said, beehives! Like, you know, nothing. 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:44.320 The bees were, it was cool. They were inside. 00:08:44.960 --> 00:08:48.440 About that time, the inner tube on his bicycle 00:08:48.440 --> 00:08:52.779 went pow! And it sounded like a gunshot. He took 00:08:52.779 --> 00:08:55.740 the car for a run and left his bicycle sitting 00:08:55.740 --> 00:08:58.769 there. I think he was more scared of the bees 00:08:58.769 --> 00:09:02.490 than anything else. But we also found out that 00:09:02.490 --> 00:09:06.169 day they had a bank robbery that had happened 00:09:06.169 --> 00:09:09.330 just right on the Georgia -South Carolina border. 00:09:09.870 --> 00:09:13.149 And they had traffic stop checking everybody. 00:09:13.509 --> 00:09:16.029 And we found out if you have a load of bees on 00:09:16.029 --> 00:09:18.149 the back of your Datsun and you're riding in 00:09:18.149 --> 00:09:21.470 the back of it, they let you ride on through 00:09:21.470 --> 00:09:26.200 the checkpoint. Guided us right through and told 00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:28.440 us to keep going. They figured I guess there 00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:32.779 wasn't any bank robber in our truck We got those 00:09:32.779 --> 00:09:36.720 hives home and I was probably the youngest North 00:09:36.720 --> 00:09:41.139 Carolina Registered beekeeper because I got registered 00:09:41.139 --> 00:09:43.460 in order to purchase the bees They had to be 00:09:43.460 --> 00:09:46.299 inspected and in order to get them into Florida. 00:09:46.299 --> 00:09:50.159 They had to be inspected So I was registered 00:09:50.159 --> 00:09:53.629 as a North Carolina beekeeper when I was 12 years 00:09:53.629 --> 00:09:57.250 old. So we did get all those bees back down to 00:09:57.250 --> 00:10:00.590 Florida. By the way, our family had a Datsun 00:10:00.590 --> 00:10:07.350 B210. I had one, had a red one. It was red. It 00:10:07.350 --> 00:10:10.690 did not have a heater. That was like a luxury 00:10:10.690 --> 00:10:14.870 add -on at the time. That was my first car that 00:10:14.870 --> 00:10:20.100 I drove, B210. All right, back to bees. For those 00:10:20.100 --> 00:10:23.980 of us that are in cooler climates and spring 00:10:23.980 --> 00:10:26.620 is upon us now, the bees are starting to fly, 00:10:27.179 --> 00:10:29.500 is now a time that we need to be concerned about 00:10:29.500 --> 00:10:33.879 Varroa? Or have they had a nice long brood break 00:10:33.879 --> 00:10:36.980 and we can just ignore it for a while? Yes, now 00:10:36.980 --> 00:10:39.580 is when you want to definitely do your spring 00:10:39.580 --> 00:10:41.779 checks to make sure where your mite level is 00:10:41.779 --> 00:10:44.840 at. Hit them while there's a... brood break as 00:10:44.840 --> 00:10:47.320 they're coming out of that brood break get your 00:10:47.320 --> 00:10:49.919 treatment started get the mites under control 00:10:49.919 --> 00:10:54.700 so you can have a good honey flow coming on your 00:10:54.700 --> 00:10:57.620 mites will start multiplying about doubling every 00:10:57.620 --> 00:11:01.299 six weeks so it's better to have a low number 00:11:01.299 --> 00:11:05.080 or a non -detectable than have them you know 00:11:05.080 --> 00:11:08.299 through the wintertime months. What's a low number? 00:11:08.340 --> 00:11:10.440 Because I used to hear three or four percent, 00:11:10.460 --> 00:11:13.960 now I'm hearing one or two percent. What is acceptable 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:17.580 before I need to treat? Yeah, we recommend below 00:11:17.580 --> 00:11:20.039 three percent. So at three percent and above, 00:11:20.139 --> 00:11:23.720 you need to treat anything below that, preferably 00:11:23.720 --> 00:11:26.000 non -detectable, meaning you're getting pretty 00:11:26.000 --> 00:11:29.580 much all zeros and maybe a one is the best level. 00:11:30.139 --> 00:11:33.779 Your main problem isn't necessarily the mites, 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:36.759 it's the viruses, a vector. I want to hear about 00:11:36.759 --> 00:11:40.379 some of your products. I know some of them like 00:11:40.379 --> 00:11:43.340 Apigard, Apistan have been around for a long 00:11:43.340 --> 00:11:47.639 time. Could you maybe, Paulo, give me just a 00:11:47.639 --> 00:11:51.820 brief what the different products are. And listeners, 00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:54.539 we promise not to turn this into an infomercial, 00:11:54.940 --> 00:11:58.019 but this is good information. What they are. 00:11:58.100 --> 00:11:59.919 And then I want to talk about your new product. 00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:05.179 Go ahead. Yeah, sure. So we have Epstein in the 00:12:05.179 --> 00:12:08.820 U .S., which I'm sure it was the first Prada 00:12:08.820 --> 00:12:12.879 register for borough control in the U .S. and 00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:15.919 many, many other countries was the first Prada 00:12:15.919 --> 00:12:19.519 that worked very, very well for many years until 00:12:19.519 --> 00:12:24.080 the resistance to tau flu ballinate arrived or 00:12:24.080 --> 00:12:27.779 occurred. And so from that moment, the Prada 00:12:27.779 --> 00:12:31.500 started to have some efficacy problem. not because 00:12:31.500 --> 00:12:35.500 of the product, but because of the active ingredient 00:12:35.500 --> 00:12:39.799 resistance. So, VITA have been working on that 00:12:39.799 --> 00:12:42.860 matter for many years, investing a lot of money 00:12:42.860 --> 00:12:47.399 on researching how to work on the resistance 00:12:47.399 --> 00:12:51.779 to tau fluvalinate. And we proved that if you 00:12:51.779 --> 00:12:55.519 do not use any tau fluvalinate or flumethrin 00:12:55.519 --> 00:12:58.679 for three years in a row, the products start 00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:03.799 working very well again. and these studies have 00:13:03.799 --> 00:13:07.700 been for the last 20 years proving that if you 00:13:07.700 --> 00:13:11.159 treat every three years with apistan, the product 00:13:11.159 --> 00:13:17.879 works 95 % or above. Let me just take a minute 00:13:17.879 --> 00:13:20.799 here to thank our presenting sponsor, Man Lake. 00:13:21.179 --> 00:13:23.919 Whether you're a seasoned beekeeper or just getting 00:13:23.919 --> 00:13:27.740 started, Man Lake has the equipment and the expertise 00:13:27.740 --> 00:13:30.960 that you need to set your bees up for success. 00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:35.679 Including my new favorite woodenware, Man Lake's 00:13:35.679 --> 00:13:39.700 wax dipped hive kits. They are absolutely beautiful 00:13:39.700 --> 00:13:42.840 with a natural finish and they're made to last, 00:13:43.000 --> 00:13:46.539 in fact, for up to 25 years. No painting necessary. 00:13:46.909 --> 00:13:50.190 And don't forget your discount code MLBlove10. 00:13:50.409 --> 00:13:53.690 It's in the show notes. For $10 off your first 00:13:53.690 --> 00:14:01.210 $100 purchase. Now, back to the guest. So Epistane 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:04.450 still is a very important tool for the beekeepers 00:14:04.450 --> 00:14:09.590 in the US. It is important that you can use this 00:14:09.590 --> 00:14:12.169 product only if you don't use it for the last 00:14:12.169 --> 00:14:14.690 three years, at least two or three years. So 00:14:14.690 --> 00:14:17.129 be watching for that resistance build up, in 00:14:17.129 --> 00:14:21.070 other words. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. The 00:14:21.070 --> 00:14:24.809 second product is what we call Apigar. In the 00:14:24.809 --> 00:14:29.070 US, you call it Apigar. Well, Apiary. That's 00:14:29.070 --> 00:14:33.490 why I used the long A. Yeah. Yeah. I will say 00:14:33.490 --> 00:14:36.529 many times Apigar. I'm sorry for that. But you 00:14:36.529 --> 00:14:42.129 mean Apigar. That's OK. So Apigar is a thymole 00:14:42.129 --> 00:14:45.620 -based product. with a very unique technology 00:14:45.620 --> 00:14:50.940 because it's a prada that works by contact and 00:14:50.940 --> 00:14:55.960 by vapor. So we need bees to go and pick up the 00:14:55.960 --> 00:14:59.080 shell and remove the shell from the tray or from 00:14:59.080 --> 00:15:04.759 the doscar because in that way the small tiny 00:15:04.759 --> 00:15:08.120 thymol particles remain on the body of the bees 00:15:08.120 --> 00:15:11.419 and they distribute the thymol through the colony. 00:15:11.639 --> 00:15:14.700 and in that way is how the Prada works, apart 00:15:14.700 --> 00:15:18.419 from the vapor. Regarding the unique formula 00:15:18.419 --> 00:15:22.700 of APgar, because it works by contact and by 00:15:22.700 --> 00:15:26.539 vapor, these two modes of action make Varroa 00:15:26.539 --> 00:15:30.600 very difficult to develop any resistance to the 00:15:30.600 --> 00:15:34.120 Prada and to the active ingredient. So this is 00:15:34.120 --> 00:15:37.440 a very important tool for the beekeeper, even 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:41.120 more now in the US and Canada, because the last 00:15:41.240 --> 00:15:44.240 two or three years, you have the increase of 00:15:44.240 --> 00:15:47.759 the resistance to amytras has been developed 00:15:47.759 --> 00:15:52.299 and moved through every state in the U .S. and 00:15:52.299 --> 00:15:55.840 having a lot of problems with this kind of product 00:15:55.840 --> 00:16:01.519 based on amytras. So Apigar is one of the best 00:16:01.519 --> 00:16:04.679 tools to help and to reduce the varroa resistance. 00:16:05.279 --> 00:16:07.620 Are there times when you should or shouldn't 00:16:07.620 --> 00:16:11.169 use these products? based on heat, based on brood 00:16:11.169 --> 00:16:15.289 cycle? APR, yes. APR, you cannot use when you 00:16:15.289 --> 00:16:20.330 have the super on because the potential of no 00:16:20.330 --> 00:16:23.210 contamination of the honey, but it may transfer 00:16:23.210 --> 00:16:27.330 some odor of thyme mold to the honey. Never happen. 00:16:27.629 --> 00:16:31.029 Yeah, but it cannot be used when you have the 00:16:31.029 --> 00:16:35.250 super on. And also if the temperature is high 00:16:35.250 --> 00:16:40.320 above 77 Fahrenheit. you can reduce the dose 00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:43.879 to the half. And that is allowed in the US, and 00:16:43.879 --> 00:16:46.879 that will have a similar efficacy as the full 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:50.379 dose at lower temperature. Epistan also you cannot 00:16:50.379 --> 00:16:53.600 use during the honey flow when you have the super 00:16:53.600 --> 00:16:58.519 on, but Epistan hasn't got any temperature restriction. 00:16:59.019 --> 00:17:02.000 It works with a low or high temperature. Also 00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:05.880 it's very cold. Apiga will not work as it should 00:17:05.880 --> 00:17:09.549 be because it needs temperature for the vapor 00:17:09.549 --> 00:17:12.450 and for the activity inside the colony so the 00:17:12.450 --> 00:17:17.049 bees can go and pick up the shell. That is also 00:17:17.049 --> 00:17:20.509 important. So the range of temperature for AP 00:17:20.509 --> 00:17:24.029 guard is important. All right, but let's be realistic 00:17:24.029 --> 00:17:26.549 here. There are times that we need to treat when 00:17:26.549 --> 00:17:29.369 we do have honey supers on. What do we do then? 00:17:30.089 --> 00:17:35.799 So we, after many years of hard work, We got 00:17:35.799 --> 00:17:39.859 the registration of barroxan, which is an oxalic 00:17:39.859 --> 00:17:43.640 acid strip. It's a very unique type of cardboard 00:17:43.640 --> 00:17:46.940 strip, which is allowing the US to be used during 00:17:46.940 --> 00:17:53.059 the honey flow with super on. So this is a very, 00:17:53.059 --> 00:17:57.539 very important tool for the beekeepers. And even 00:17:57.539 --> 00:18:02.400 more now that the summer treatment is being very 00:18:02.460 --> 00:18:06.019 key point to arrive to the fall with the lower 00:18:06.019 --> 00:18:10.680 number of mites before the full treatment in 00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:15.000 the fall. So, varroxan is a new product that 00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:19.119 is in the U .S. market ready for the beekeepers. 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:23.759 Last year, a lot of us saw Randy Oliver's formula 00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:27.480 online and experimented with it. Is this similar 00:18:27.480 --> 00:18:31.240 to that, this varroxan? It is that it's oxalic 00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:35.660 acid. The efficacy is actually a little better 00:18:35.660 --> 00:18:40.640 than that. And the thing with a homemade product 00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:44.559 like Randy's, you're having to heat your product 00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:47.619 mature solution and everything. So let's say 00:18:47.619 --> 00:18:49.680 you're in Florida where we're at pretty much 00:18:49.680 --> 00:18:53.119 sea level. 212 is your boiling point. If you're 00:18:53.119 --> 00:18:56.720 up north 4 ,000 or 5 ,000 feet, you may have 00:18:56.720 --> 00:19:00.119 a total different temperature. So when you're 00:19:00.119 --> 00:19:03.799 heating oxalic acid in your other products in 00:19:03.799 --> 00:19:06.220 there, you can actually change the chemical. 00:19:06.940 --> 00:19:10.900 So using a strip that is produced under a control 00:19:10.900 --> 00:19:14.220 that releases at a certain rate is a lot better, 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:18.000 gets you a better efficacy than what you do with 00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:21.160 a homemade product. It's a lot safer. Speaking 00:19:21.160 --> 00:19:24.920 of safer, I did Randy Oliver's recipe last year. 00:19:25.130 --> 00:19:29.210 And I wondered, is it going to be safe to now 00:19:29.210 --> 00:19:32.809 cook soup in that pan that I just made this in? 00:19:33.190 --> 00:19:36.049 You know, can I get clean enough? Some of the 00:19:36.049 --> 00:19:40.509 strips had a lot more of the formula on them 00:19:40.509 --> 00:19:42.710 than some of the others. I don't know if that 00:19:42.710 --> 00:19:46.630 makes sense for the bees or not. So while it 00:19:46.630 --> 00:19:49.390 actually did work, I really had concerns about 00:19:49.390 --> 00:19:52.390 it, too. Frankly, I'm glad to hear that there's 00:19:52.390 --> 00:19:56.269 something that's formulated safely and is just 00:19:56.269 --> 00:19:58.309 going to make sense. I think a lot of people 00:19:58.309 --> 00:20:01.769 are going to like it. So basically, Varroxan 00:20:01.769 --> 00:20:06.170 is safe because why? Because of many things. 00:20:06.410 --> 00:20:11.089 It's safe for bees and safe for beekeepers because 00:20:11.089 --> 00:20:15.450 it's manufactured under GMP rules. That means 00:20:15.450 --> 00:20:20.109 that every step is controlled. And when the Prada 00:20:20.109 --> 00:20:24.049 leaves the factory, each strip will have the 00:20:24.049 --> 00:20:27.890 same amount of active ingredient per strip. And 00:20:27.890 --> 00:20:31.450 that is very, very important for the final dose 00:20:31.450 --> 00:20:35.869 to the colony. There have always been sentences 00:20:35.869 --> 00:20:39.470 that organic Prada will not develop resistance. 00:20:39.950 --> 00:20:44.049 And that is not true. That is not true at all. 00:20:44.250 --> 00:20:46.849 If you apply the same active ingredient, even 00:20:46.849 --> 00:20:50.250 if it's organic, all the time, all the time, 00:20:50.329 --> 00:20:53.430 all the time, Varroa can develop a different 00:20:53.430 --> 00:20:55.650 type of resistant, which is not chemical like 00:20:55.650 --> 00:20:58.769 for amitrase or tau fluvalinate, could be a behavior 00:20:58.769 --> 00:21:02.250 of resistant, either a different type of resistant. 00:21:03.309 --> 00:21:07.029 So applying an overdose of the same active ingredient 00:21:07.029 --> 00:21:10.829 all the time, even if it's organic active ingredient, 00:21:11.130 --> 00:21:14.289 it will develop resistance. Maybe it will take 00:21:14.289 --> 00:21:18.309 longer, but at the end, you will have problems 00:21:18.309 --> 00:21:22.269 with that active ingredient. Again, barroxan 00:21:22.269 --> 00:21:25.950 is based on oxalic acid, which most of the honey 00:21:25.950 --> 00:21:30.450 already has oxalic acid on it. Many foods that 00:21:30.450 --> 00:21:33.589 we normally eat every day have even more oxalic 00:21:33.589 --> 00:21:37.930 acid than the full dose of barroxan, but it is 00:21:37.930 --> 00:21:40.970 important that we control the dose and we know 00:21:41.000 --> 00:21:44.920 overdose to avoid any risk of oxalic acid into 00:21:44.920 --> 00:21:47.539 the honey, because at the end of the day, the 00:21:47.539 --> 00:21:50.579 honey goes to the consumer. So it is important 00:21:50.579 --> 00:21:55.440 that we know which dose we are giving to the 00:21:55.440 --> 00:22:00.079 colonies. So for this reason, the barroxan is 00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:05.000 safer for the bees and for the beekeeper. Living 00:22:05.000 --> 00:22:08.319 outside homemade product that, yes, when you 00:22:08.319 --> 00:22:13.400 mix oxalic acid, and glycerin, and you overheat, 00:22:13.720 --> 00:22:18.660 you produce formic acid. So that is very, very 00:22:18.660 --> 00:22:23.140 dangerous for the cookers that way. It's very 00:22:23.140 --> 00:22:27.339 dangerous. So yeah, this should be taken on consideration. 00:22:28.099 --> 00:22:30.700 And David mentioned the boiling point. I happen 00:22:30.700 --> 00:22:33.680 to be at 5 ,700 feet elevations. I'm not even 00:22:33.680 --> 00:22:36.759 sure what our boiling point is, but yeah, it's 00:22:37.289 --> 00:22:39.829 It's higher up here. But if you're at sea level, 00:22:39.950 --> 00:22:41.970 yeah, things are different. My next question 00:22:41.970 --> 00:22:46.289 is, when I do an OA vaporization, I have to wear 00:22:46.289 --> 00:22:50.970 safety goggles and protective gloves and a big 00:22:50.970 --> 00:22:54.490 mask and stuff like that. What kind of safety 00:22:54.490 --> 00:22:57.890 measures do I need to take when I'm using Veroxan? 00:22:58.289 --> 00:23:02.650 If you go through the label, still those safety 00:23:02.650 --> 00:23:06.539 guidelines are on it. because when the product 00:23:06.539 --> 00:23:10.319 was under registration process, in order to get 00:23:10.319 --> 00:23:13.000 the product into the market, we accepted all 00:23:13.000 --> 00:23:16.299 the safety that was on the oxalic acid label. 00:23:17.339 --> 00:23:20.259 Because the oxalic acid registration and boraxan 00:23:20.259 --> 00:23:24.339 are linked. So we accepted those safety guidelines. 00:23:24.819 --> 00:23:28.400 But to be honest, when you use a boraxan strip, 00:23:28.480 --> 00:23:32.160 there is no vapor going out. So there is no problem 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:36.589 of any danger. breathing in the apiary. So the 00:23:36.589 --> 00:23:39.970 only thing that you need to wear is gloves, with 00:23:39.970 --> 00:23:43.609 a keeper's glove or any latex glove, just to 00:23:43.609 --> 00:23:47.349 avoid the direct contact with the strip. That 00:23:47.349 --> 00:23:51.349 is the main thing that you need to wear when 00:23:51.349 --> 00:23:55.210 you are using Barroxan. And then don't wipe your 00:23:55.210 --> 00:23:58.890 eyes with those gloves. No, no, no, no, no, no, 00:23:59.269 --> 00:24:02.430 no, no, no, no. Remove it before or wash them. 00:24:02.690 --> 00:24:08.099 OK. What is the efficacy of Roxanne? The efficacy 00:24:08.099 --> 00:24:14.259 is over 95 percent, is what we have on our studies. 00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:19.279 In the U .S., we have very good efficacy on tests, 00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:23.079 trials done in Washington and in California. 00:24:23.859 --> 00:24:28.839 In Missouri, we have run many studies in the 00:24:28.839 --> 00:24:32.240 U .S. with universities. probably investigate 00:24:32.240 --> 00:24:36.619 a researcher. Everything is done with the universities. 00:24:37.960 --> 00:24:41.079 But the efficacy will depend on many different 00:24:41.079 --> 00:24:44.380 things. You can have higher efficacy or lower 00:24:44.380 --> 00:24:47.259 efficacy depending on the time of the year that 00:24:47.259 --> 00:24:51.680 you treat. Summer treatment, you may have 15 00:24:51.680 --> 00:24:54.720 frames of growth. So the number of Varroa inside 00:24:54.720 --> 00:24:57.890 the colony are really, really high. And even 00:24:57.890 --> 00:25:02.509 if the product kills 95, 94, 98 % of the mite, 00:25:02.910 --> 00:25:07.170 if you started with 1 ,000 mites, you finish 00:25:07.170 --> 00:25:10.829 with a slow number of mites. But if you start 00:25:10.829 --> 00:25:14.990 with 10 ,000 mites, even with 95 % of efficacy, 00:25:15.509 --> 00:25:17.609 when you wash your bees, at the end, you will 00:25:17.609 --> 00:25:22.329 see mite. So the efficacy will be 95, but you 00:25:22.329 --> 00:25:25.779 may need a follow -up treatment sometime. Also, 00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:29.160 if there are refestations, the efficacy will 00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:33.380 be affected where you place the strip, how you 00:25:33.380 --> 00:25:37.619 apply the product, that is really, really important. 00:25:38.359 --> 00:25:42.900 Barroxan needs to be in contact with the bees 00:25:42.900 --> 00:25:47.759 all the time because you need the bees to go 00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:51.240 and chew the strip, remove the active ingredient, 00:25:51.539 --> 00:25:53.819 and distribute the active ingredient through 00:25:53.819 --> 00:25:57.869 the colony. So it is very important that when 00:25:57.869 --> 00:26:01.130 you place a strip, you place in frame with brood, 00:26:01.349 --> 00:26:03.569 if that is possible, because you will know that 00:26:03.569 --> 00:26:06.109 bees will be taking care of the brood. So you 00:26:06.109 --> 00:26:09.250 will have all the time bees walking around the 00:26:09.250 --> 00:26:13.710 strip. And so that is important because we receive 00:26:13.710 --> 00:26:16.069 some questions from beekeepers that they place 00:26:16.069 --> 00:26:20.089 the strip between the boxes, like the homemade 00:26:20.089 --> 00:26:23.720 product at the tower. And in that way, the efficacy 00:26:23.720 --> 00:26:28.000 will not be the same. The strip should be folded 00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:31.019 in half and placed between the frames in the 00:26:31.019 --> 00:26:34.980 middle of the cluster, so we know that bees are 00:26:34.980 --> 00:26:39.019 in contact all the time. On the label, it's allowed 00:26:39.019 --> 00:26:42.640 that you move the strip from one side to another 00:26:42.640 --> 00:26:46.240 side. And why is this? Because you are applying 00:26:46.240 --> 00:26:49.940 four strips. Folding in half are eight strips. 00:26:51.089 --> 00:26:55.609 a half a strip. So it's a lot of trip for the 00:26:55.609 --> 00:26:58.990 bees. So some bees, they used to move away from 00:26:58.990 --> 00:27:02.250 the strip because they don't like it, because 00:27:02.250 --> 00:27:04.990 it's an acid. At the end of the day, it's an 00:27:04.990 --> 00:27:07.150 acid because it's something that is not normal 00:27:07.150 --> 00:27:12.650 for the bees. So they move away. And if they 00:27:12.650 --> 00:27:15.630 are not in contact with the bees, you don't have 00:27:15.630 --> 00:27:19.769 good efficacy. So if you go back three, four 00:27:19.769 --> 00:27:22.359 weeks, after the application of barrock sand, 00:27:22.759 --> 00:27:25.519 and you see that the nest has moved away from 00:27:25.519 --> 00:27:28.339 the tree, you need to take the tree and place 00:27:28.339 --> 00:27:32.299 it again in the middle of the business in order 00:27:32.299 --> 00:27:37.240 to ensure that the tree is in contact with the 00:27:37.240 --> 00:27:42.380 bees. So this small thing will improve the final 00:27:42.380 --> 00:27:45.609 efficacy of the product. Makes a lot of sense. 00:27:45.970 --> 00:27:48.589 For our listeners that are in parts of the world 00:27:48.589 --> 00:27:53.950 where tropyl -alapsed mites have also infiltrated, 00:27:54.450 --> 00:27:58.809 do these work on those mites as well? No, no, 00:27:59.230 --> 00:28:03.690 no. There are a few old studies on thymol that 00:28:03.690 --> 00:28:07.690 work. Probably formic acid, but oxalic acid in 00:28:07.690 --> 00:28:11.890 this way, no. Maybe if you make evaporates, maybe 00:28:11.890 --> 00:28:14.880 yes, but... We need to test it, but I don't believe 00:28:14.880 --> 00:28:18.059 we have a big efficacy. Still work to do there 00:28:18.059 --> 00:28:21.160 then. Yeah. David, I get asked this question 00:28:21.160 --> 00:28:24.740 a lot. Why is an alcohol wash so important versus 00:28:24.740 --> 00:28:29.039 a sugar roll test? Your accuracy. If you do an 00:28:29.039 --> 00:28:31.059 alcohol wash and you're getting the bees that 00:28:31.059 --> 00:28:33.720 are older bees from, let's say, outside the dive 00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:37.319 or from off of a window seal or somewhere, you 00:28:37.319 --> 00:28:39.640 know, if you're in your hunting house, you will 00:28:39.640 --> 00:28:42.569 not get an accurate mite count. So you always 00:28:42.569 --> 00:28:46.049 have to take the bees from emerging brood, young 00:28:46.049 --> 00:28:49.109 bees coming out, and you'll have a more accurate 00:28:49.109 --> 00:28:52.950 mite count using 300 bees. So if you get 300 00:28:52.950 --> 00:28:56.769 bees and you end up with nine mites in that alcohol 00:28:56.769 --> 00:29:01.109 wash, you're at that 3 % level. You can take 00:29:01.109 --> 00:29:05.329 that and really figure out if there's a mathematical 00:29:05.329 --> 00:29:09.309 equation you can look at to figure how many bees 00:29:09.309 --> 00:29:11.829 or how many mites are in your whole hive from 00:29:11.829 --> 00:29:16.170 that and which is fairly simple to do but that 00:29:16.170 --> 00:29:18.710 gives you your most accurate where powdered sugar 00:29:18.710 --> 00:29:22.710 you'll get about probably 75 % of your mites 00:29:22.710 --> 00:29:26.069 off of the bees but since you're using such a 00:29:26.069 --> 00:29:29.710 small sample size 300 bees you're not getting 00:29:29.710 --> 00:29:34.240 an accurate count. So alcohol is the best. And 00:29:34.240 --> 00:29:36.799 a lot of people say, well, if you use powdered 00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:39.220 sugar, you're not killing the bees. There's been 00:29:39.220 --> 00:29:42.119 some research now that after you've shaken the 00:29:42.119 --> 00:29:45.019 bees without powdered sugar on them, they end 00:29:45.019 --> 00:29:49.539 up dying within 72 hours anyhow. So you're not 00:29:49.539 --> 00:29:52.940 doing anything else but slowly killing the bees, 00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:56.380 the three or four hundred. How often should we 00:29:56.380 --> 00:30:00.329 be testing? I recommend every four weeks, four 00:30:00.329 --> 00:30:03.430 to six weeks. I know some backyard beekeepers, 00:30:03.430 --> 00:30:08.170 it's hard for them to do that. But because reinfestation, 00:30:08.730 --> 00:30:10.849 it's not that your mite level builds up. You 00:30:10.849 --> 00:30:12.950 know that it's going to double every six weeks 00:30:12.950 --> 00:30:16.289 after springtime starts because of your brood 00:30:16.289 --> 00:30:19.809 cycle, the way the mite regenerates or their 00:30:19.809 --> 00:30:23.079 mite cycle. But what ends up happening is we 00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:26.039 have what are called mite bombs or hives that 00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:30.180 are dying away from your actual apiary. And so 00:30:30.180 --> 00:30:33.599 your bees go over for a free meal and get their 00:30:33.599 --> 00:30:36.019 leftover honey and everything. But they also 00:30:36.019 --> 00:30:39.859 bring all their mites back because that hive's 00:30:39.859 --> 00:30:44.039 slowly dying. And so they bring all these mites 00:30:44.039 --> 00:30:46.880 back. So that's why it's good to do every four 00:30:46.880 --> 00:30:50.029 to six weeks, check your bees. So is it true 00:30:50.029 --> 00:30:52.690 that drones tend to drift around from different 00:30:52.690 --> 00:30:56.029 hives to different hives also? Yes, actually 00:30:56.029 --> 00:30:59.369 what we're finding is we used to say that worker 00:30:59.369 --> 00:31:01.890 bees didn't drift that much unless it was in 00:31:01.890 --> 00:31:04.730 a bee yard like your commercial operation where 00:31:04.730 --> 00:31:07.450 they're all in a row. But there's some new studies 00:31:07.450 --> 00:31:10.450 out of actually here in the University of Florida 00:31:10.450 --> 00:31:13.869 that shows worker bees do a lot more drifting 00:31:13.869 --> 00:31:17.420 than we originally thought. what happens with 00:31:17.420 --> 00:31:21.119 workers and drones. Drones are welcomed pretty 00:31:21.119 --> 00:31:24.420 much all the time back to any hive. But workers, 00:31:24.420 --> 00:31:26.920 as long as they have some nectar coming in or 00:31:26.920 --> 00:31:30.519 pollen, they're accepted to any hive too. And 00:31:30.519 --> 00:31:34.000 they were doing some work at a UF here. And it's 00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:37.779 amazing that they were finding bees drifting 00:31:37.779 --> 00:31:41.640 within the yard to apiary, but also drifting 00:31:41.640 --> 00:31:45.730 upwards of two miles away to other hives. What 00:31:45.730 --> 00:31:48.630 we used to think we knew, we're finding out with 00:31:48.630 --> 00:31:52.349 better research and more research that some of 00:31:52.349 --> 00:31:54.990 the books that we've got out there may have been 00:31:54.990 --> 00:31:57.509 correct at the time, but some people used to 00:31:57.509 --> 00:32:00.569 say that it was a king bee and now we know for 00:32:00.569 --> 00:32:03.569 sure it's a queen bee. How about some advice 00:32:03.569 --> 00:32:06.819 for brand new beekeepers? I think a lot of people, 00:32:07.079 --> 00:32:09.619 especially hobbyists, they think, oh, yeah, I've 00:32:09.619 --> 00:32:11.559 heard of these Varroa mites, but I'm going to 00:32:11.559 --> 00:32:14.200 be treatment free because I believe in organic 00:32:14.200 --> 00:32:19.440 everything and I won't have those mites. My bees 00:32:19.440 --> 00:32:21.700 are healthy and they're all by themselves here. 00:32:22.140 --> 00:32:25.140 Any advice for them? I love to talk about that 00:32:25.140 --> 00:32:27.920 because actually with Vita, we have a couple 00:32:27.920 --> 00:32:32.019 products that you can incorporate in with IPM 00:32:32.019 --> 00:32:35.039 integrated pest management. And one of them, 00:32:35.319 --> 00:32:38.980 it isn't a product we sell, but having bees that 00:32:38.980 --> 00:32:42.640 are hygienic or resistant somewhat to mites, 00:32:42.779 --> 00:32:45.619 definitely. Now for a backyard beekeeper, some 00:32:45.619 --> 00:32:49.359 of these strains of hygienic bees, or let's call 00:32:49.359 --> 00:32:52.299 them Russian bees, some of them, may not be what 00:32:52.299 --> 00:32:55.059 they're suited to manage because they're more 00:32:55.059 --> 00:32:58.690 defensive bee. those genetics are out there. 00:32:59.009 --> 00:33:02.970 So then we also have some products that are via 00:33:02.970 --> 00:33:08.029 Vita cells that are actually they cause the bees 00:33:08.029 --> 00:33:11.549 to groom themselves and remove the mites. It's 00:33:11.549 --> 00:33:14.430 called the bee gem. And so it helps where the 00:33:14.430 --> 00:33:16.630 mites or the bees are coming in with the mites 00:33:16.630 --> 00:33:19.210 on them to remove them off. So if you're wanting 00:33:19.210 --> 00:33:22.250 to go chemical free, there's a couple different 00:33:22.250 --> 00:33:24.450 things. There's actually a couple of nice papers 00:33:24.450 --> 00:33:28.720 out there that give you a huge amount of opportunities 00:33:28.720 --> 00:33:32.359 to be chemical free. But I'll tell you, after 00:33:32.359 --> 00:33:35.720 about 18 months to two or three years, you'll 00:33:35.720 --> 00:33:38.460 find out that as hard as you try to be chemical 00:33:38.460 --> 00:33:42.900 free, you'll finally have varroa mites. So using 00:33:42.900 --> 00:33:46.079 something, you know, if you want to be more organic, 00:33:46.279 --> 00:33:50.240 which our varroxin is organic, thymol product 00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:53.240 is a very chemical free, even though it's a thymol 00:33:53.240 --> 00:33:57.009 product, it's very easy to use. Be aware that 00:33:57.009 --> 00:33:59.210 you're going to have mites, you're going to have 00:33:59.210 --> 00:34:01.990 other pests like small high beetles and things 00:34:01.990 --> 00:34:05.910 that are there. Knowing what's out there and 00:34:05.910 --> 00:34:09.110 educate yourself, get a good mentor, get involved 00:34:09.110 --> 00:34:12.969 at the beekeeping club. Not necessarily always 00:34:12.969 --> 00:34:15.489 go checking on the internet because some of the 00:34:15.489 --> 00:34:18.769 stuff you find on the internet isn't necessarily 00:34:18.769 --> 00:34:21.849 what you need. Oh come on, half of the information 00:34:21.849 --> 00:34:25.050 there is great. You just don't know which half. 00:34:25.710 --> 00:34:29.409 The half. 75 % of the half is correct. Yep. And 00:34:29.409 --> 00:34:32.510 by the way, new beekeepers, you will get Varroa 00:34:32.510 --> 00:34:35.670 and Varroa will kill your bees, period, unless 00:34:35.670 --> 00:34:38.710 you do something about it. Yep. Or the viruses. 00:34:39.190 --> 00:34:42.349 The viruses that are associated. You know, we're 00:34:42.349 --> 00:34:47.030 now saying there's roughly about 72 to 75 viruses 00:34:47.030 --> 00:34:50.289 that are associated with honeybees and Varroa 00:34:50.289 --> 00:34:53.590 mites. And there's actually some new viruses 00:34:53.590 --> 00:34:58.269 that aren't even Varroa part, meaning they're 00:34:58.269 --> 00:35:02.269 not vectored by Varroa. But there's some new 00:35:02.269 --> 00:35:05.110 information coming out on some wax moth viruses 00:35:05.110 --> 00:35:08.969 that we would never think that wax moth would 00:35:08.969 --> 00:35:11.989 harbor a virus that would be lethal to anything. 00:35:12.710 --> 00:35:14.849 Guys, I appreciate your time. I think we could 00:35:14.849 --> 00:35:18.210 spend hours and hours on all of this. If people 00:35:18.210 --> 00:35:20.369 have more questions, where should they go for 00:35:20.369 --> 00:35:24.780 some guidance? There are a few options. One of 00:35:24.780 --> 00:35:29.219 them is going to a VW Health website. The other 00:35:29.219 --> 00:35:33.000 one is contacting David. David, if you can tell 00:35:33.000 --> 00:35:36.760 your phone number or email, we'll help. We'll 00:35:36.760 --> 00:35:38.800 stick something in the show notes for people. 00:35:39.420 --> 00:35:41.980 Guys, is there anything else that's imperative 00:35:41.980 --> 00:35:45.010 that we talk about on this topic? Actually, yeah, 00:35:45.110 --> 00:35:47.130 something I'd like to put out, you know, beekeepers, 00:35:47.130 --> 00:35:50.389 I get called all the time that wax moths killed 00:35:50.389 --> 00:35:54.550 by hives. And something that I like, I was just 00:35:54.550 --> 00:35:57.769 at University of Florida teaching our 18th year 00:35:57.769 --> 00:36:01.329 of bee college. And I'm the one person that I 00:36:01.329 --> 00:36:04.630 should have graduated by now, but I did all 18 00:36:04.630 --> 00:36:08.429 years of either teaching or always in that capacity. 00:36:09.070 --> 00:36:13.670 But wax moths are a secondary They're there to 00:36:13.670 --> 00:36:17.469 really destroy the old comb so a new hive can 00:36:17.469 --> 00:36:20.010 move into there. Having a good, strong, healthy 00:36:20.010 --> 00:36:23.070 hive will control wax moths. All right, Paulo. 00:36:23.329 --> 00:36:26.150 Do you have a wild and crazy beekeeping story? 00:36:26.170 --> 00:36:29.050 You've been doing this for a long time. Yeah. 00:36:29.309 --> 00:36:32.610 So it is funny today. It wasn't at the time. 00:36:32.829 --> 00:36:38.429 So I was very young. I went to Mexico to help 00:36:38.429 --> 00:36:43.800 400 beekeepers to convert from normal honey producer 00:36:43.800 --> 00:36:47.440 to organic honey producer in Chukatan. So I've 00:36:47.440 --> 00:36:50.880 been there working for one year and traveling 00:36:50.880 --> 00:36:55.019 every day to visit different communities in the 00:36:55.019 --> 00:37:00.059 middle of nowhere. So hours on a van in the middle 00:37:00.059 --> 00:37:05.280 of the Chukatan. And most of these small communities, 00:37:05.659 --> 00:37:09.940 they do not speak Spanish. They speak Masha. 00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:15.900 which is their all local language. So when I 00:37:15.900 --> 00:37:19.219 arrived there, there was always children that 00:37:19.219 --> 00:37:23.480 they helped us with the translation from Spanish 00:37:23.480 --> 00:37:28.559 to the Magia. So we used to go to different apiaries 00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:32.280 and see the colony, watch colony and give some 00:37:32.280 --> 00:37:36.840 advice. And it was one day that there was a very, 00:37:36.840 --> 00:37:40.969 very old beekeeper, very old beekeeper. and he 00:37:40.969 --> 00:37:45.590 only speaks Maya, so we went with the... I don't 00:37:45.590 --> 00:37:48.409 remember exactly, but it was a 12 -year -old 00:37:48.409 --> 00:37:51.889 nephew or something like that to the abjury. 00:37:52.289 --> 00:37:55.949 It was a two -hour walk in the middle of the 00:37:55.949 --> 00:38:00.530 jungle. At some point, we get lost in the middle 00:38:00.530 --> 00:38:06.650 of... of that. Uh -oh. Yeah, you cannot speak 00:38:06.650 --> 00:38:09.500 with the man because he... doesn't speak Spanish, 00:38:10.400 --> 00:38:14.219 so only Maya. We were walking and walking and 00:38:14.219 --> 00:38:18.480 walking for different places until some point 00:38:18.480 --> 00:38:21.559 that he saw a tree and said, oh, I found the 00:38:21.559 --> 00:38:25.920 way back. And finally, after eight hours of walking 00:38:25.920 --> 00:38:30.780 around the middle of Xucatay, we returned to 00:38:30.780 --> 00:38:35.360 the small village in this part of Mexico. So 00:38:35.360 --> 00:38:38.980 it was very fun. after that. But at the time, 00:38:39.539 --> 00:38:42.659 it was scary to spend the night in the middle 00:38:42.659 --> 00:38:46.059 of the jungle there. So yeah, that was one of 00:38:46.059 --> 00:38:51.320 the funny... Glad you made it back. Any experiences 00:38:51.320 --> 00:38:53.820 where bees treated you in some kind of way you 00:38:53.820 --> 00:38:59.139 didn't expect? Well, in Mexico was complicated. 00:38:59.480 --> 00:39:03.429 In the south of Mexico, the bees... They were 00:39:03.429 --> 00:39:07.190 waiting for you. They heard the engine of the 00:39:07.190 --> 00:39:11.070 van arriving miles away, and you start dressing 00:39:11.070 --> 00:39:15.909 up far away, and they start arriving and giving 00:39:15.909 --> 00:39:20.409 you the welcome to Mexico. It's a chilly place, 00:39:22.030 --> 00:39:25.929 but really lovely place to work with bees. It's 00:39:25.929 --> 00:39:29.670 amazing. Everything is virgin, and yeah, it's 00:39:29.670 --> 00:39:33.380 a potential. There's the honey. 100 % organic, 00:39:33.559 --> 00:39:36.800 because they don't do much with those bees. And 00:39:36.800 --> 00:39:40.539 they have a lot of barroa. So what happened with 00:39:40.539 --> 00:39:43.940 those bees and barroa, why they don't die, is 00:39:43.940 --> 00:39:48.039 because naturally, the colony swum, and they 00:39:48.039 --> 00:39:51.179 go and they left empty the colony. And because 00:39:51.179 --> 00:39:54.320 they return every six or eight weeks to that 00:39:54.320 --> 00:39:57.000 apiary, because they are far away, so they are 00:39:57.000 --> 00:40:00.019 walking only to... harbored the honey, whatever 00:40:00.019 --> 00:40:03.199 honey that is there. So in that period, there 00:40:03.199 --> 00:40:07.619 was another swarm going into that hive. So it's 00:40:07.619 --> 00:40:11.360 not always the same hive. You always have new 00:40:11.360 --> 00:40:15.260 hives, and so they produce three to five kilos, 00:40:15.300 --> 00:40:20.599 which is two and a half... About eight to 11 00:40:20.599 --> 00:40:26.059 pounds? Yeah, with the potential of making 40, 00:40:26.059 --> 00:40:30.119 50 kilos of honey. because they have eight, nine 00:40:30.119 --> 00:40:34.380 months of bloom everywhere, beautiful weather. 00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:40.019 And yeah, so Baroa killed the hives, even now. 00:40:40.099 --> 00:40:44.460 So this is the truth. Are there a lot of Africanized 00:40:44.460 --> 00:40:47.500 genetics? Is that why they were so hot? Yeah, 00:40:47.579 --> 00:40:51.780 yeah, yes. Most of the south of Mexico, they 00:40:51.780 --> 00:40:55.360 have that Africanized bees, which is OK for them. 00:40:55.940 --> 00:40:58.739 It's the way that they always have bees because 00:40:58.739 --> 00:41:02.539 they go and return, go and return. But as a commercial 00:41:02.539 --> 00:41:05.519 beekeeping, it's very hard to do it in that way. 00:41:06.000 --> 00:41:08.039 Well, I love how you put it. They were waiting 00:41:08.039 --> 00:41:11.519 to welcome you. Yeah. Paolo and I both have been 00:41:11.519 --> 00:41:16.940 throughout Guatemala, Costa Rica, Guyana. I travel 00:41:16.940 --> 00:41:20.780 significantly through the Caribbean. Now, it's 00:41:20.780 --> 00:41:23.460 funny because a lot of the bees in the Caribbean 00:41:23.460 --> 00:41:27.769 act like Africanized bees, but when we've done 00:41:27.769 --> 00:41:31.250 tests on them, they're actually just Apis mellifera 00:41:31.250 --> 00:41:35.269 mellifera or a form of the European honeybees. 00:41:35.289 --> 00:41:39.409 They're just more defensive, but throughout Costa 00:41:39.409 --> 00:41:44.429 Rica and Guyana, they're very Africanized and 00:41:44.429 --> 00:41:46.530 yet they still manage them. They make a lot of 00:41:46.530 --> 00:41:49.130 honey on them. They do meet you when you come 00:41:49.130 --> 00:41:51.750 up to the with the truck. You better be suited 00:41:51.750 --> 00:41:55.480 up and they will. introduce themselves to you. 00:41:55.739 --> 00:41:58.059 I'll take my nice friendly bees here anytime. 00:41:58.519 --> 00:42:01.019 Hey, David and Paulo, thank you so much for your 00:42:01.019 --> 00:42:03.800 time today. Appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. 00:42:05.599 --> 00:42:07.880 Thanks again for joining us here on Bee Love 00:42:07.880 --> 00:42:11.659 Beekeeping, presented by Man Lake. Another great 00:42:11.659 --> 00:42:14.820 place for more information on everything related 00:42:14.820 --> 00:42:18.300 to this podcast is in our email newsletter. You 00:42:18.300 --> 00:42:20.900 can sign up for it for free at BeeLoveBeekeeping 00:42:20.900 --> 00:42:23.929 .com. And remember, if you're not just in it 00:42:23.929 --> 00:42:26.230 for the honey or the money, you're in it for 00:42:26.230 --> 00:42:27.909 the love. See you next week.