WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.819 Get ready for a rewind of our March 21st episode 00:00:02.819 --> 00:00:05.080 where we kick things off with the latest drama 00:00:05.080 --> 00:00:08.099 between Trump and Musk. After that, we dove deep 00:00:08.099 --> 00:00:10.759 into the complexities of process debt, questioning 00:00:10.759 --> 00:00:13.480 if the systems we rely on at work are fundamentally 00:00:13.480 --> 00:00:16.480 broken. A couple months have passed and the fast 00:00:16.480 --> 00:00:19.160 friends have quickly become enemies. And at this 00:00:19.160 --> 00:00:21.320 point, it looks like Musk is the one that is 00:00:21.320 --> 00:00:24.219 being chewed up more. Hey, what's up, Toby? We 00:00:24.219 --> 00:00:32.180 are to episode 24 of the process debt. podcast. 00:00:32.180 --> 00:00:35.939 I don't even know where to go. I mean, we were 00:00:35.939 --> 00:00:40.679 I mean, we got well, 24, you know, Elon is is 00:00:40.679 --> 00:00:43.719 running amok in the government. Oh, wait, I thought 00:00:43.719 --> 00:00:47.219 he was fixing things. I don't know. I'm not sure. 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:50.579 I didn't understand is is when you hire your 00:00:50.579 --> 00:00:52.799 your politicians that you just bought and paid 00:00:52.799 --> 00:00:55.259 for to promote your product and your stock goes 00:00:55.259 --> 00:00:58.259 down. What's that tell you? I don't understand 00:00:58.259 --> 00:01:01.020 what that message is for the market. I don't 00:01:01.020 --> 00:01:06.879 know, man. But my pay grade, maybe. He's doing 00:01:06.879 --> 00:01:10.439 a bang -up job, though, of really showing how 00:01:10.439 --> 00:01:13.480 value is created or not to all of his Tesla shareholders. 00:01:14.120 --> 00:01:18.500 Yeah, it's very interesting. Very interesting 00:01:18.500 --> 00:01:21.480 stuff. We should probably spend a couple to talk 00:01:21.480 --> 00:01:28.539 about Doze, because I think the short -term the 00:01:28.539 --> 00:01:32.459 the busyness There's a lot of value for a lot 00:01:32.459 --> 00:01:37.159 of people. Yeah And you know the impact The long 00:01:37.159 --> 00:01:39.180 -term impact like how does that how does that 00:01:39.180 --> 00:01:41.579 play? But let's not talk about that today. We 00:01:41.579 --> 00:01:43.719 should we should we're such a tease, man You're 00:01:43.719 --> 00:01:46.000 throwing I am for our listeners in Romania. I 00:01:46.000 --> 00:01:50.120 know shout out. They're gonna Now I know Next 00:01:50.120 --> 00:01:52.140 session. Okay. I know they're not gonna listen 00:01:52.140 --> 00:01:54.819 to us. We're not gonna have anybody in you know 00:01:55.049 --> 00:01:57.930 In Romania, no more Romanian listeners. It's 00:01:57.930 --> 00:02:00.069 terrible. I do appreciate the folks in Grayson 00:02:00.069 --> 00:02:01.890 though. That's sticking out with us. There you 00:02:01.890 --> 00:02:06.569 go All right, so you had an idea. Yeah. My topic 00:02:06.569 --> 00:02:09.430 was people have racy's right? So responsible 00:02:09.430 --> 00:02:14.469 accountable on Consulted and informed they have 00:02:14.469 --> 00:02:16.009 them but they don't always know what it means. 00:02:16.150 --> 00:02:19.509 No, no your acronym. Yeah, it is a familiar acronym 00:02:19.509 --> 00:02:24.770 and I Don't I've seen that people bristle against 00:02:24.770 --> 00:02:27.030 it. I probably, maybe that's because I bristle 00:02:27.030 --> 00:02:30.729 against it. Yeah. You put it, you give out what 00:02:30.729 --> 00:02:33.490 you want back and yeah. It's like, I don't want 00:02:33.490 --> 00:02:36.090 to be responsible or accountable. But the thought 00:02:36.090 --> 00:02:40.090 here is like on the software side, which is where 00:02:40.090 --> 00:02:44.050 I believe most process debt lives. Yeah. Not 00:02:44.050 --> 00:02:46.789 because the systems are bad, but because the 00:02:46.789 --> 00:02:50.840 people don't understand what those. what those 00:02:50.840 --> 00:02:55.340 systems are for like do are we stuck with crappy 00:02:55.340 --> 00:02:59.680 systems yeah because we don't have a baseline 00:02:59.680 --> 00:03:02.759 for what those systems are supposed to do yeah 00:03:02.759 --> 00:03:05.580 and i guess a question you you know this is not 00:03:05.580 --> 00:03:08.840 your first rodeo well i've been a circus clown 00:03:08.840 --> 00:03:15.000 for years what's the what's the worst system 00:03:15.000 --> 00:03:18.610 that you've stepped into I'll tell you, it's 00:03:18.610 --> 00:03:23.449 also probably one of the most popular. It's SAP. 00:03:25.669 --> 00:03:31.389 I've been involved with a number of, a dozen 00:03:31.389 --> 00:03:35.830 plus ERP systems. There's a whole variety, right? 00:03:35.990 --> 00:03:38.849 SAP and Oracle are probably the two most common 00:03:38.849 --> 00:03:45.199 kind of broad base use cases. But the difficulty 00:03:45.199 --> 00:03:50.620 with these very complex systems is that the configuration 00:03:50.620 --> 00:03:55.039 requirements are so high. Yeah. And to do meaningful 00:03:55.039 --> 00:03:58.099 configuration assumes you understand how your 00:03:58.099 --> 00:04:02.560 process works. Yeah. And oh, yes. Right. And 00:04:02.560 --> 00:04:07.259 so that you and I have chatted offline at times 00:04:07.259 --> 00:04:10.280 about just. they have a core piece of software 00:04:10.280 --> 00:04:12.400 and it's like financial software and then they 00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:15.139 keep adding other crap onto it and they acquire 00:04:15.139 --> 00:04:19.120 other companies to keep showing growth. And the 00:04:19.120 --> 00:04:22.819 difficulty is that a client gets a singular idea 00:04:22.819 --> 00:04:25.879 in their mind that the three -letter acronym 00:04:25.879 --> 00:04:30.720 SAP solves everything. This magical panacea and 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:34.660 life will be grand and greener and they're not 00:04:34.660 --> 00:04:37.810 gonna do anything. Is it like Henry Ford's? Model 00:04:37.810 --> 00:04:40.050 T, where you can get it in any color, as long 00:04:40.050 --> 00:04:43.069 as it's black. Well, therein lies the irony, 00:04:43.290 --> 00:04:47.689 right? I would say well over half the big ERP 00:04:47.689 --> 00:04:50.569 systems. One of the early conversations is always, 00:04:50.610 --> 00:04:52.730 you know, it's costly to update when you do more 00:04:52.730 --> 00:04:54.970 configurations. There's all this additional testing 00:04:54.970 --> 00:04:57.689 and, you know, the more you integrate it and 00:04:57.689 --> 00:05:00.449 really try to make it a lifeblood system in your 00:05:00.449 --> 00:05:03.110 business, every step along the way, just there's 00:05:03.110 --> 00:05:06.009 more care and maintenance. Yeah, every you know 00:05:06.009 --> 00:05:08.170 again over half say we're just gonna keep it 00:05:08.170 --> 00:05:14.990 vanilla Reality is Reality is and maybe the title 00:05:14.990 --> 00:05:18.069 of this podcast is nobody likes vanilla, but 00:05:18.069 --> 00:05:21.290 You know the reality is that a vanilla based 00:05:21.290 --> 00:05:25.509 system It lacks any of the nuance that so many 00:05:25.509 --> 00:05:28.939 of our businesses require Yeah, you know a service 00:05:28.939 --> 00:05:31.000 business and a product business can use the same 00:05:31.000 --> 00:05:33.620 software, but they have to have certain considerations 00:05:33.620 --> 00:05:36.019 But what about you? What's the what's the you 00:05:36.019 --> 00:05:38.639 know? It's it's interesting like I think in my 00:05:38.639 --> 00:05:40.459 career I've actually never worked to the company 00:05:40.459 --> 00:05:45.319 that had SAP. Well, you're not good. I know I'm 00:05:45.319 --> 00:05:48.540 getting better as they would say in Monty Python 00:05:48.540 --> 00:05:53.860 I've I've worked with a lot of really good software 00:05:53.860 --> 00:05:56.899 that has just been hacked So this is just not 00:05:56.899 --> 00:06:03.139 usable. And so I think the Atlassian Suite oftentimes 00:06:03.139 --> 00:06:08.000 can lend itself to, you know, someone had a bright 00:06:08.000 --> 00:06:11.319 idea to add a custom field and, you know, someone 00:06:11.319 --> 00:06:13.399 else had a bright idea to add a custom field 00:06:13.399 --> 00:06:16.779 and a thousand fields later, you're stuck with 00:06:16.779 --> 00:06:22.120 which, which, what's the due date? I'm scrolling. 00:06:22.819 --> 00:06:25.870 Yeah. Yeah. I think it's interesting because 00:06:25.870 --> 00:06:28.889 I think most people don't realize that to add 00:06:28.889 --> 00:06:32.889 to anything, like any single software, adding 00:06:32.889 --> 00:06:37.829 is so easy and oftentimes it's so wrong and you 00:06:37.829 --> 00:06:42.389 can almost never take it away. No. Like if you 00:06:42.389 --> 00:06:46.290 look at our wrists, we have all these bones on 00:06:46.290 --> 00:06:48.029 our wrists. What are they for? We're not really 00:06:48.029 --> 00:06:50.769 sure. That's right. But they were added. They're 00:06:50.769 --> 00:06:54.180 really hard to take away. I'm not experimenting 00:06:54.180 --> 00:06:58.300 with that. I'll take your word for that. But 00:06:58.300 --> 00:07:02.040 you're right. It does seem like it's easier to 00:07:02.040 --> 00:07:05.740 add layers. And typically when process changes, 00:07:07.060 --> 00:07:10.079 we do our best to offer some measure of change 00:07:10.079 --> 00:07:14.459 control, but then we tweak what's in place. And 00:07:14.459 --> 00:07:18.379 there's a whole host of really good arguments 00:07:18.379 --> 00:07:22.560 for doing that. To do a wholesale tearout. have 00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:25.879 a process is expensive and can put your businesses 00:07:25.879 --> 00:07:30.040 at risk. Talk to me about, there's probably some 00:07:30.040 --> 00:07:32.759 elements, maybe it's not an ugly acronym like 00:07:32.759 --> 00:07:38.040 RACI, but there's some elements that when you 00:07:38.040 --> 00:07:40.579 bring this up and thinking about how SOC plays 00:07:40.579 --> 00:07:42.939 a role in organizational process, what are some 00:07:42.939 --> 00:07:45.319 of those elements that come to mind? Yeah, I 00:07:45.319 --> 00:07:47.319 think there's workflow, right? So you've got 00:07:47.319 --> 00:07:49.860 Jira Service Management, you've got Zendesk, 00:07:49.920 --> 00:07:56.879 you've got reporting, which, and I delineate 00:07:56.879 --> 00:08:00.379 between reporting and analysis. Whereas reporting 00:08:00.379 --> 00:08:02.680 is something that's delivered on a regular basis 00:08:02.680 --> 00:08:06.420 from a system, it doesn't change. Whereas analysis 00:08:06.420 --> 00:08:11.680 is single, one time, and can't be reproduced. 00:08:12.040 --> 00:08:14.459 However, within business, that is a nuanced thing 00:08:14.459 --> 00:08:18.319 that most people don't understand. In that like, 00:08:18.540 --> 00:08:21.120 an executive asked for something, and they get 00:08:21.120 --> 00:08:26.079 delivered something that's subpar or semi -made 00:08:26.079 --> 00:08:28.959 up. But now the executive says, we want you to 00:08:28.959 --> 00:08:31.480 reproduce this. And so it gets reproduced, right? 00:08:31.680 --> 00:08:35.639 That's right. And then I think there's a prediction 00:08:35.639 --> 00:08:39.580 component or prediction slash roadmap. Like how 00:08:39.580 --> 00:08:46.259 do we do things? And then planning. And then 00:08:46.259 --> 00:08:48.320 the other the last thing that kind of gets lost 00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:51.559 is status updates like I've been thinking a lot 00:08:51.559 --> 00:08:54.759 about like how many tools we use and how we use 00:08:54.759 --> 00:08:58.360 them and It's crazy. Like we literally don't 00:08:58.360 --> 00:09:00.639 realize that probably in a given day. We probably 00:09:00.639 --> 00:09:06.220 touch 30 to 40 different tools Like like what's 00:09:06.220 --> 00:09:12.220 email for yeah Like it's not it like and what 00:09:12.220 --> 00:09:14.279 where this stuff breaks down oftentimes is you 00:09:14.279 --> 00:09:18.529 see you see You see Excel being your reporting 00:09:18.529 --> 00:09:22.590 slash analytics slash workflow slash everything 00:09:22.590 --> 00:09:25.289 tool because it's flexible. Yeah. And then you 00:09:25.289 --> 00:09:28.649 have email being the planning notification. And 00:09:28.649 --> 00:09:31.730 yet the email, I don't think email was ever meant 00:09:31.730 --> 00:09:35.610 for that. No. In that way, we're kind of like 00:09:35.610 --> 00:09:38.309 cavemen, right? We've got a stick and a rock 00:09:38.309 --> 00:09:44.009 and we use them to hunt and we use it for a pillow 00:09:44.009 --> 00:09:50.549 and It's our toy and entertainment. It's just, 00:09:50.549 --> 00:09:54.350 we don't have other alternatives. You're right. 00:09:55.009 --> 00:09:58.549 I personally use email as really kind of my hub 00:09:58.549 --> 00:10:02.730 of communications and tracking. It does have 00:10:02.730 --> 00:10:04.450 some of those fundamental things like reminders, 00:10:04.529 --> 00:10:08.629 but in any given day I may use email and provide 00:10:08.629 --> 00:10:11.509 updates inside of a shared piece of software. 00:10:12.240 --> 00:10:15.659 and use Slack and text and then all the variety 00:10:15.659 --> 00:10:19.039 of mean platforms that we use now. Well, and 00:10:19.039 --> 00:10:20.720 one of the things to think about as you're thinking 00:10:20.720 --> 00:10:24.399 about process debt is we are oftentimes being 00:10:24.399 --> 00:10:29.480 sucked into these like time suck warps, meaning 00:10:29.480 --> 00:10:33.360 if you go into your email. Are you focused? Oh 00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:38.139 no, it's just a distracting area of landmines. 00:10:38.539 --> 00:10:40.820 Oh, and then you just got a text on your phone. 00:10:41.100 --> 00:10:47.679 Why am I playing Angry Birds now? Like, you know 00:10:47.679 --> 00:10:49.639 what I mean? Like, there's this really weird 00:10:49.639 --> 00:10:51.840 thing where it's like, where does the work live? 00:10:53.340 --> 00:10:56.000 Like, where's my process? Where's my workflow? 00:10:56.259 --> 00:10:58.340 And the thing is, is like, we just don't talk 00:10:58.340 --> 00:11:00.460 about it. And so we all assume that we're right. 00:11:00.700 --> 00:11:03.019 and we're all doing it differently, you know, 00:11:03.139 --> 00:11:05.879 and our core tenets of like, is it discoverable 00:11:05.879 --> 00:11:09.220 and is it transferable? Right. We actually don't 00:11:09.220 --> 00:11:11.840 know, but we believe it is. And that therein 00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:16.440 lies the problem. Yeah. Yeah. For a country of 00:11:16.440 --> 00:11:19.679 less religious folks, we have a high degree of 00:11:19.679 --> 00:11:23.480 faith that things will magically happen. Oh, 00:11:23.559 --> 00:11:27.529 yeah. You know. And when it comes to process, 00:11:27.649 --> 00:11:30.090 we take the handoff from person upstream and 00:11:30.090 --> 00:11:31.830 then we give it to the next person downstream 00:11:31.830 --> 00:11:36.409 and we walk away and said we did our job, but 00:11:36.409 --> 00:11:41.509 that's not a finished thing. We've gotten so 00:11:41.509 --> 00:11:43.769 expert, especially in larger organizations that 00:11:43.769 --> 00:11:47.490 we rarely see a transaction tip to tail. Yeah, 00:11:47.570 --> 00:11:50.970 for sure. I don't know that we've talked on this, 00:11:51.330 --> 00:11:54.110 but I've been... recently doing some work around 00:11:54.110 --> 00:11:57.830 real estate renovation for a client. Yeah. And 00:11:57.830 --> 00:12:00.950 this is an opportunity to really see in a very 00:12:00.950 --> 00:12:03.549 physical way what happens when those handoffs 00:12:03.549 --> 00:12:06.190 break. Yep. You know, what happens if you don't 00:12:06.190 --> 00:12:08.590 get your permits or inspections or what happens 00:12:08.590 --> 00:12:11.289 if the cement guy shows up and nobody's there 00:12:11.289 --> 00:12:14.169 to see him and get stuff poured? Like so many 00:12:14.169 --> 00:12:16.730 places stuff breaks. But I think in our digital 00:12:16.730 --> 00:12:20.059 corporate world. There's not that same sense 00:12:20.059 --> 00:12:22.179 of urgency. We don't have the weather beating 00:12:22.179 --> 00:12:24.379 on us to keep us focused and on the timeline 00:12:24.379 --> 00:12:28.799 and so things kind of drift, you know Yeah, well 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:30.600 and the other thing is like the just definition 00:12:30.600 --> 00:12:34.539 of done oftentimes is unclean like You know where 00:12:34.539 --> 00:12:36.299 and I think you know, one of the things that 00:12:36.299 --> 00:12:38.320 we've talked about is like, what are you doing? 00:12:38.419 --> 00:12:40.159 Are you just drafting something up then just 00:12:40.159 --> 00:12:43.740 do a crappy video? Like that's and and then we'll 00:12:43.740 --> 00:12:46.320 figure out if it will figure out if it's important. 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:49.909 Yeah later Yeah. Well, I think, you know, on 00:12:49.909 --> 00:12:52.230 this on this notion of is there a racy for software, 00:12:52.289 --> 00:12:56.250 where should the technology be the the system 00:12:56.250 --> 00:12:59.610 of record? Oh, yeah, for sure. That's that kind 00:12:59.610 --> 00:13:02.250 of accountable piece. Where is it consulted? 00:13:02.929 --> 00:13:08.169 And so oftentimes we took put process into technology. 00:13:08.250 --> 00:13:10.049 But then when we build out the access model, 00:13:10.070 --> 00:13:12.690 we strip out people that need to consult the 00:13:12.690 --> 00:13:16.100 very data we capture. And so now we've. We've 00:13:16.100 --> 00:13:19.220 artificially separated them and made their lives 00:13:19.220 --> 00:13:23.799 harder. But then the informed piece too, back 00:13:23.799 --> 00:13:28.559 to reporting and analytics, they are not the 00:13:28.559 --> 00:13:32.720 same. Oh, it's interesting. I think it would 00:13:32.720 --> 00:13:36.120 be very, not that you could do this, but if every 00:13:36.120 --> 00:13:40.419 single report, you just simply had a stamp of 00:13:40.419 --> 00:13:45.029 this is a one -time analysis. or this is repeatable. 00:13:45.629 --> 00:13:48.289 And what you would find, I think what you would 00:13:48.289 --> 00:13:53.470 find is you would find that most processes are 00:13:53.470 --> 00:13:59.409 driven from a report down versus a process up. 00:14:00.269 --> 00:14:03.029 You're talking hierarchically in the organization. 00:14:05.210 --> 00:14:08.029 Something's missing in a report and therefore 00:14:08.029 --> 00:14:11.179 we need to add this thing to the report. And 00:14:11.179 --> 00:14:14.440 so then we manufacture that into our process. 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:19.159 And the process is really good until they ignore 00:14:19.159 --> 00:14:24.899 the report. But the report lives on for decades. 00:14:27.600 --> 00:14:30.940 But that process either stops, there's entropy, 00:14:31.639 --> 00:14:34.200 or you get a who's on first type thing where 00:14:34.200 --> 00:14:35.980 it's like, I don't know who's doing the report. 00:14:36.720 --> 00:14:38.980 It just magically shows up in the spreadsheet. 00:14:39.360 --> 00:14:42.039 And they realize that that data is stale from, 00:14:42.039 --> 00:14:45.960 you know, 94 or something like that. Chris, that 00:14:45.960 --> 00:14:49.779 we're coming up on the end of time. And so one 00:14:49.779 --> 00:14:52.559 of my favorite memes going around right now is 00:14:52.559 --> 00:14:55.919 a guy's girlfriend is losing her mind. And he 00:14:55.919 --> 00:14:59.000 comes to him and says, hey, I can't keep up with 00:14:59.000 --> 00:15:01.259 all the laundry. You know, the house is a mess. 00:15:01.279 --> 00:15:03.279 He's like, oh, wait, wait, come here. Let me 00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:05.720 show you. He walks her into the laundry room 00:15:05.720 --> 00:15:07.700 and he says, I just dumped my dirty laundry in 00:15:07.700 --> 00:15:10.919 this basket. And a day later, it shows up in 00:15:10.919 --> 00:15:15.059 my dresser and it's clean and folded. And you 00:15:15.059 --> 00:15:18.059 can see you're like starting to boil. And he's 00:15:18.059 --> 00:15:21.620 like, come into the kitchen. I leave my crap 00:15:21.620 --> 00:15:25.299 all over. But when I walk away, it gets cleaned 00:15:25.299 --> 00:15:27.659 up and it's back in the cupboards. And I think 00:15:27.659 --> 00:15:30.799 that people kind of expect process to work like 00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:33.720 that, you know? If I ignore it long enough, somebody 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:37.139 else will, magically, the fairies will come in 00:15:37.139 --> 00:15:39.480 and they'll fix it. You know, they'll put things 00:15:39.480 --> 00:15:45.799 back in the proper places. So, yes. And the closer 00:15:45.799 --> 00:15:49.759 you get to the root of whatever it is, it's just 00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:52.960 nuanced. So nuanced. And like it takes so much 00:15:52.960 --> 00:15:56.379 like I like it takes so much of that slow thinking 00:15:56.379 --> 00:16:00.559 of like, why do we want this? How do we use this? 00:16:00.659 --> 00:16:03.389 Right. Which is why like any time. Anytime someone 00:16:03.389 --> 00:16:05.850 asked me about a report I'm like or creating 00:16:05.850 --> 00:16:07.870 specifically a new report like I had someone 00:16:07.870 --> 00:16:09.350 asked me today I was like they were like hey, 00:16:09.370 --> 00:16:11.730 I need to create this report and I was like do 00:16:11.730 --> 00:16:16.429 it as simple and as easy as you can and If it 00:16:16.429 --> 00:16:19.350 gets used they will tell you if you want more 00:16:19.350 --> 00:16:21.409 information Yeah, and then you will find that 00:16:21.409 --> 00:16:23.230 the information that you're providing is not 00:16:23.230 --> 00:16:24.830 that good and so you're gonna have to clean it 00:16:24.830 --> 00:16:26.929 up But the reality is is they're probably not 00:16:26.929 --> 00:16:29.309 gonna want to clean it up And so it's significantly 00:16:29.309 --> 00:16:33.210 easier to ask for more and more reports and more 00:16:33.210 --> 00:16:35.710 metrics that you don't have to think about. And 00:16:35.710 --> 00:16:37.769 so in some ways it becomes this easy out for 00:16:37.769 --> 00:16:42.210 management. There's nothing more frustrating, 00:16:42.429 --> 00:16:45.429 and I like data, but there's nothing more frustrating 00:16:45.429 --> 00:16:49.629 than just grinding and being asked to deliver 00:16:49.629 --> 00:16:53.870 data, delivering data and have it be dismissed. 00:16:55.620 --> 00:17:00.080 because the data doesn't match the confirmation 00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:04.599 bias that they want, so. Yeah, that must be wrong 00:17:04.599 --> 00:17:06.980 because that's not what I thought. There you 00:17:06.980 --> 00:17:10.480 go. Hey, you know what? I think on our 24th session, 00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:14.700 we may have just created the longest piece. Oh, 00:17:15.180 --> 00:17:18.640 love it. Yeah, this podcast also not brought 00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:21.460 to you by the assholes at Fabletics. That's correct. 00:17:21.460 --> 00:17:23.579 We do not like them. They're not our favorite. 00:17:23.720 --> 00:17:26.299 All right, dude, we will catch you next week, 00:17:26.460 --> 00:17:28.319 man. It's a deal. All right, thanks.