WEBVTT 00:00:00.330 --> 00:00:02.870 Hey, what's up, Toby? How you doing? Hey, doing 00:00:02.870 --> 00:00:06.690 well, buddy. Welcome. Guess what? We're at 32 00:00:06.690 --> 00:00:11.470 because I can't count. What? I know. So the Excel 00:00:11.470 --> 00:00:15.189 guru. Maybe we should have put it in an Excel 00:00:15.189 --> 00:00:19.190 sheet when we started this system. We should 00:00:19.190 --> 00:00:22.850 have. So in my little podcast, we use RSS, which 00:00:22.850 --> 00:00:25.089 is fabulous. They don't report us, but maybe 00:00:25.089 --> 00:00:30.109 they will someday. You put in the episode number. 00:00:30.199 --> 00:00:34.179 And then the season. Oh, okay. And I forgot to 00:00:34.179 --> 00:00:37.579 put in a season. And so we were, we made it to 00:00:37.579 --> 00:00:40.820 32. Wow. I know that's like, that's like just 00:00:40.820 --> 00:00:43.560 flashing forward into the future. I know it's 00:00:43.560 --> 00:00:45.799 amazing. Listeners have been enjoying a bonus 00:00:45.799 --> 00:00:49.159 this whole time. Welcome to have 32. It's very 00:00:49.159 --> 00:00:51.399 incredible. All right. So today's topic. Yeah. 00:00:51.420 --> 00:00:54.659 What are you thinking? Most businesses optimize 00:00:54.659 --> 00:00:58.280 their silos. Yeah. Few optimize what happens 00:00:58.280 --> 00:01:02.560 between them. Ooh, that's the topic. Yeah, I 00:01:02.560 --> 00:01:08.420 love that, Chris. It's the white space. Yeah, 00:01:08.420 --> 00:01:10.519 we play the notes. We don't think about what 00:01:10.519 --> 00:01:12.879 happens between the notes. Everybody's playing 00:01:12.879 --> 00:01:15.900 their instrument. We don't think about the transition 00:01:15.900 --> 00:01:18.019 in between. Let's get into this. I love this. 00:01:18.079 --> 00:01:22.819 Yeah. So what's going on here? Is it failure? 00:01:23.239 --> 00:01:25.739 What do you think about between silos and... 00:01:25.900 --> 00:01:29.799 I think it's human nature. I think by nature, 00:01:30.000 --> 00:01:34.140 we get very myopic, regardless of what we're 00:01:34.140 --> 00:01:40.319 doing. I think we get myopic and then we just 00:01:40.319 --> 00:01:46.180 don't get curious. And so you end up doing things, 00:01:46.200 --> 00:01:48.680 and I see this a lot in product where people 00:01:48.680 --> 00:01:51.799 are like, well, tell me what you're doing. And 00:01:51.799 --> 00:01:55.060 what I'm asking is like, piece of work are you 00:01:55.060 --> 00:01:57.599 delivering downstream or what? Like that's the 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:00.400 question that I'm asking. And what I get told 00:02:00.400 --> 00:02:03.799 oftentimes is they're like, I click the button. 00:02:05.500 --> 00:02:08.280 Yeah. Well, what does the button do? Well, I 00:02:08.280 --> 00:02:12.020 don't, I don't, I click the button. Chris, I 00:02:12.020 --> 00:02:13.580 love that. Cause they're a black box, right? 00:02:13.719 --> 00:02:16.439 We see the input. Yeah. They do whatever they 00:02:16.439 --> 00:02:18.360 do in their black box. Cause they should be an 00:02:18.360 --> 00:02:21.340 expert and then. We want to understand what comes 00:02:21.340 --> 00:02:23.300 out the other end for the next party or for the 00:02:23.300 --> 00:02:26.020 customer. And they're telling you like how they 00:02:26.020 --> 00:02:29.479 tied their shoelaces. And you're like, no, to 00:02:29.479 --> 00:02:33.159 what end? What's the value of having paid you 00:02:33.159 --> 00:02:37.879 for a day? Or like in a client servicing team, 00:02:37.979 --> 00:02:40.180 it's like, but where did you get this? They're 00:02:40.180 --> 00:02:42.780 like, well, the client emailed me. I'm like, 00:02:42.900 --> 00:02:45.539 no, no. Like where did the problem happen? Like 00:02:45.539 --> 00:02:47.780 the client sent an email and you're like, oh, 00:02:47.780 --> 00:02:50.289 I'm going to go sit in the corner. And think 00:02:50.289 --> 00:02:53.789 about what I've just heard, because it's a bit 00:02:53.789 --> 00:02:56.530 rough. I'm going to rethink a number of choices 00:02:56.530 --> 00:02:59.750 that have brought this point. What I love though 00:02:59.750 --> 00:03:01.810 is your point about curiosity, because sometimes 00:03:01.810 --> 00:03:05.669 the questions we ask are answered correctly, 00:03:05.889 --> 00:03:09.650 but we ask the wrong question. And so sometimes 00:03:09.650 --> 00:03:11.449 what I'm hearing is a little bit of how do we 00:03:11.449 --> 00:03:14.490 put things in context to get the answers we want. 00:03:16.310 --> 00:03:19.370 in inviting enough room for people to get super 00:03:19.370 --> 00:03:21.949 narrow and myopic in it or for them to be so 00:03:21.949 --> 00:03:24.909 broad and general to be useless. How do we start 00:03:24.909 --> 00:03:27.210 to find that level? So they're telling us what 00:03:27.210 --> 00:03:30.030 we need to know. Yeah, do you have what kind 00:03:30.030 --> 00:03:31.669 of examples or something that comes to mind or 00:03:31.669 --> 00:03:33.569 why do you think this maybe there's an underlying 00:03:33.569 --> 00:03:35.650 here that we want to touch on first. You said 00:03:35.650 --> 00:03:37.750 human nature, maybe in lack of curiosity, other 00:03:37.750 --> 00:03:41.310 thoughts maybe about why this this silo at the 00:03:41.310 --> 00:03:45.020 cost of systems is continuing to happen. Think 00:03:45.020 --> 00:03:47.539 it's because it's easier. It's easier to make 00:03:47.539 --> 00:03:50.520 your it's easier to make your silo. It's efficient 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:54.259 It's just flat outs. It's flat up super easy 00:03:54.259 --> 00:03:56.520 back to like a span of control thing. What's 00:03:56.520 --> 00:03:59.139 with yeah? Well, I mean it's it's and you're 00:03:59.139 --> 00:04:01.439 you're not being measured on someone else's silo 00:04:01.439 --> 00:04:03.219 or measured on the system You're being measured 00:04:03.219 --> 00:04:07.780 on how well your silo does. Yeah, but Enter the 00:04:07.780 --> 00:04:14.240 world of gamification. That's right AI blockchain 00:04:14.240 --> 00:04:18.779 synergy, baby. Well, what's funny is like, it 00:04:18.779 --> 00:04:23.079 makes me go to like, what do, if you give someone 00:04:23.079 --> 00:04:28.660 an objective, we are just remarkably good at 00:04:28.660 --> 00:04:33.920 tracking whatever that thing is. So a primary 00:04:33.920 --> 00:04:40.060 example is we, so most systems like ServiceNow 00:04:40.060 --> 00:04:43.360 or Zendesk, Yeah. They'll give a little, they'll 00:04:43.360 --> 00:04:45.920 put in a little token or a little ID for the, 00:04:45.920 --> 00:04:50.240 for the, for the ticket. Yep. Yep. And, you know, 00:04:50.360 --> 00:04:53.000 a place that I was working, you know, we, there 00:04:53.000 --> 00:04:58.300 was a SLA to respond to, to this thing within 00:04:58.300 --> 00:05:01.319 X amount of hours, right? Right. But what happened 00:05:01.319 --> 00:05:03.860 was, is they were sending an email, they were 00:05:03.860 --> 00:05:06.560 CCing it, right? So the first email has no token 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:09.740 on it. Okay. Right. All the second and thirds 00:05:09.740 --> 00:05:14.519 have the token on it. Okay. Yep. So here's what 00:05:14.519 --> 00:05:17.600 happens in these implementations. And this is 00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:20.560 why you actually get a thank you for responding. 00:05:21.259 --> 00:05:24.339 Please respond above this line. The reason you 00:05:24.339 --> 00:05:26.699 get that is you get that auto response because 00:05:26.699 --> 00:05:30.620 if you do a reply or send the email to a bunch 00:05:30.620 --> 00:05:33.740 of different people, what ends up happening, 00:05:34.040 --> 00:05:37.060 especially if it's before hours, is you get a 00:05:37.060 --> 00:05:40.250 ton of people replying back and forth. without 00:05:40.250 --> 00:05:45.689 the token, right? So now all of a sudden, what 00:05:45.689 --> 00:05:51.949 you get is you get a ton of duplicates. So in 00:05:51.949 --> 00:05:54.810 this Salesforce instance that I was implementing, 00:05:55.470 --> 00:05:57.829 I was like, we should do auto -reply. And people 00:05:57.829 --> 00:05:59.529 were like, well, that will mess with our SLA. 00:05:59.949 --> 00:06:04.569 And it's like, do you like merging all the cases 00:06:04.569 --> 00:06:08.579 that use duplicates? Yeah, well, I mean when 00:06:08.579 --> 00:06:10.259 we merge them we don't get ranked and you're 00:06:10.259 --> 00:06:13.480 like, oh boy How far do I back up my bus to help 00:06:13.480 --> 00:06:15.860 them understand the value of what I'm proposing? 00:06:16.220 --> 00:06:19.819 Let's try. Okay. So where'd you go next? Yeah, 00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:21.779 I mean I some people were like well we want to 00:06:21.779 --> 00:06:23.500 do it and we don't want to do it so it was like 00:06:23.500 --> 00:06:25.639 a customer by customer basis but was like this 00:06:25.639 --> 00:06:28.079 is ridiculous and then the other thing that they 00:06:28.079 --> 00:06:30.720 the other thing like The like the other thing 00:06:30.720 --> 00:06:32.040 is that they didn't want is they didn't want 00:06:32.040 --> 00:06:36.949 their SLA to be at zero. Yeah, and I'm like Can 00:06:36.949 --> 00:06:38.949 we just make, can we just make it easier for 00:06:38.949 --> 00:06:42.649 everybody? It was so weird. Like, it reminds 00:06:42.649 --> 00:06:44.449 me, it reminds me of like, remember when Wells 00:06:44.449 --> 00:06:46.850 Fargo did their little fiasco on like, we have 00:06:46.850 --> 00:06:50.889 to open all these accounts? I do go, go into 00:06:50.889 --> 00:06:52.790 that. That's a good example though. Yeah. So 00:06:52.790 --> 00:06:54.430 like, I mean, basically it was like, we've got 00:06:54.430 --> 00:06:55.750 to grow accounts. And so, you know what they 00:06:55.750 --> 00:06:58.029 did? They, they grew their accounts. They were 00:06:58.029 --> 00:07:01.839 very effective. Yeah. One for you, one for you, 00:07:01.899 --> 00:07:04.699 and one for you. The thing that they forgot is 00:07:04.699 --> 00:07:07.459 to ask if their clients wanted them to create 00:07:07.459 --> 00:07:09.860 good accounts. They kind of missed that vital 00:07:09.860 --> 00:07:13.319 step, but they were successful and sued. Yeah. 00:07:13.660 --> 00:07:17.720 There's this one ethical step that kind of matters. 00:07:17.920 --> 00:07:21.980 Yeah. Yeah. But it's true. And I think that speaks 00:07:21.980 --> 00:07:26.519 to your point earlier about the incentive. And 00:07:26.519 --> 00:07:30.680 so sales team, your... financial wellbeing, your 00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:34.100 continued success in your career here is driven 00:07:34.100 --> 00:07:37.060 by this activity. Yeah. And so if you're given 00:07:37.060 --> 00:07:39.519 a single carrot and everything else is consequence, 00:07:40.100 --> 00:07:41.800 why wouldn't you just chew up everything that 00:07:41.800 --> 00:07:43.720 looks like a carrot and let somebody else sort 00:07:43.720 --> 00:07:46.139 it out? Cause it's not their problem. That's 00:07:46.139 --> 00:07:49.000 the ethics department. Internal audit will figure 00:07:49.000 --> 00:07:50.699 it out later when they get around to discovering 00:07:50.699 --> 00:07:55.379 what we've done or not. So now that's, it's interesting 00:07:55.379 --> 00:07:58.779 cause you're right. sales guys are notoriously 00:07:58.779 --> 00:08:02.579 awesome at finding all the little white space 00:08:02.579 --> 00:08:05.420 between the rules and bylaws and disclaimer of 00:08:05.420 --> 00:08:09.040 any sales comp plan, which makes comp in general 00:08:09.040 --> 00:08:13.560 a little bit slippery. And, you know, we've talked 00:08:13.560 --> 00:08:16.779 offline over the years about how do you increase 00:08:16.779 --> 00:08:18.939 agency within teams? How do you build a sense 00:08:18.939 --> 00:08:22.060 of ownership? And then the same organizations 00:08:22.060 --> 00:08:24.839 that might say that are also You're exempt. You're 00:08:24.839 --> 00:08:27.439 going to get paid whether you mail it in or actually 00:08:27.439 --> 00:08:29.860 throw your heart and soul into the work. Yeah. 00:08:29.860 --> 00:08:31.519 And we're still going to ask you to work weekends 00:08:31.519 --> 00:08:34.259 because you're a free resource to us now. And 00:08:34.259 --> 00:08:38.080 so, yeah, strangely, you know, how we align people's 00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:40.759 heads and hearts with the broader picture is 00:08:40.759 --> 00:08:43.419 a finer art than we like, you know, acknowledge. 00:08:43.980 --> 00:08:48.940 And so, yeah, I love that. Another example is, 00:08:48.940 --> 00:08:50.539 as you were sharing Wells Fargo, what made me 00:08:50.539 --> 00:08:54.019 think about was, as you and I often do, A couple 00:08:54.019 --> 00:08:55.919 of gray whiskers means that we've been a place 00:08:55.919 --> 00:09:00.879 or two so far in our career. As a young and super 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:03.120 enthusiastic financial analyst, I was working 00:09:03.120 --> 00:09:08.559 in healthcare and it was a spectacular experience. 00:09:08.559 --> 00:09:11.740 This was in the late nineties before Sarbanes 00:09:11.740 --> 00:09:15.200 -Oxley caused large organizations or publicly 00:09:15.200 --> 00:09:18.179 traded organizations to put in a lot of safeguards. 00:09:18.259 --> 00:09:20.720 It was the world of hammer and champy process 00:09:20.720 --> 00:09:23.049 engineering. So we're like. get rid of all these 00:09:23.049 --> 00:09:27.490 unnecessary reviews. Let's chuck stuff out. One 00:09:27.490 --> 00:09:30.070 of the projects where it was less about stripping 00:09:30.070 --> 00:09:32.870 down the process to its core dimension that we 00:09:32.870 --> 00:09:35.309 did was working within the emergency department 00:09:35.309 --> 00:09:39.450 of a county hospital. Oh, wow. And so, you know, 00:09:39.549 --> 00:09:41.509 for anybody that's ever had the misfortune of 00:09:41.509 --> 00:09:43.990 going to an emergency department, we know what 00:09:43.990 --> 00:09:46.889 that experience looks like. And it usually involves... 00:09:46.429 --> 00:09:49.149 you know, bring a brand new 700 page book because 00:09:49.149 --> 00:09:51.289 you'll probably finish it before you actually 00:09:51.289 --> 00:09:55.409 get seen. Yeah. And as the county was growing, 00:09:55.549 --> 00:09:58.269 they said, our wait times just continue to increase. 00:09:58.330 --> 00:10:00.570 And so for them, that was the first time that 00:10:00.570 --> 00:10:02.330 they said, let's take a really hard look at how 00:10:02.330 --> 00:10:06.149 we triage. Sure. And so that's still inside of 00:10:06.149 --> 00:10:09.129 the silo of just the emergency department. Yeah. 00:10:09.129 --> 00:10:10.850 But as we got in and we started talking with 00:10:10.850 --> 00:10:13.450 the nurses and the physicians and then the folks 00:10:13.450 --> 00:10:16.509 that do so much of that diagnostic stuff. You 00:10:16.509 --> 00:10:18.710 know, the lab said, we don't even know a lab 00:10:18.710 --> 00:10:22.009 is needed and stuff shows up and we've already 00:10:22.009 --> 00:10:23.950 got a whole calendar. We haven't, we haven't 00:10:23.950 --> 00:10:26.450 built a schedule, so we don't have enough humans 00:10:26.450 --> 00:10:29.470 on staff. But if you want these two or three 00:10:29.470 --> 00:10:31.309 most common tests, why don't we just set up the 00:10:31.309 --> 00:10:33.809 equipment in the ER? We'll show somebody how 00:10:33.809 --> 00:10:36.490 to do it and they can get turnaround in 10 minutes 00:10:36.490 --> 00:10:39.669 or less. It wasn't the big brains at the top 00:10:39.669 --> 00:10:42.090 of the company that said this. These are day 00:10:42.090 --> 00:10:44.259 -to -day techs. And we went, well, that's interesting. 00:10:44.320 --> 00:10:46.600 Hey, let's go ask the X -ray guys. So we looked 00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:51.100 at the imaging and they said, interestingly, 00:10:51.440 --> 00:10:53.559 X -rays are important. Those we can turn fast. 00:10:53.720 --> 00:10:57.059 I want to say it was CTs. And so management all 00:10:57.059 --> 00:10:58.679 of a sudden is like, well, that's kind of expensive. 00:10:58.840 --> 00:11:01.519 But when we showed them the sheer volume of CTs 00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:04.179 and how quickly those could be turned, they said 00:11:04.179 --> 00:11:06.720 all day long, if we can still build those and 00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:09.480 not disrupt other stuff, that's a great investment. 00:11:09.559 --> 00:11:11.720 Let's push that piece of equipment in. And so 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:16.259 We had this really messy blend of sniffles and 00:11:16.259 --> 00:11:19.440 sneezes and this guy has, you know, a chunk of 00:11:19.440 --> 00:11:22.120 rebar stuck through his skull. I don't know how 00:11:22.120 --> 00:11:25.440 to prioritize these. They started really think 00:11:25.440 --> 00:11:27.639 intentionally about triaging and starting to 00:11:27.639 --> 00:11:30.179 separate these. And it wasn't just getting people 00:11:30.179 --> 00:11:33.679 through the ER. It was also asking where's, where 00:11:33.679 --> 00:11:35.779 do we want to ultimately disposition these humans? 00:11:36.139 --> 00:11:38.679 If it's sneezes, can we get them in and out in 00:11:38.679 --> 00:11:42.440 30 minutes? Yeah. Full of Tylenol. And if you 00:11:42.440 --> 00:11:44.559 guys got rebar, we probably need to figure out 00:11:44.559 --> 00:11:47.720 if we have room in the ICU and we have enough 00:11:47.720 --> 00:11:50.139 corks to thread through there and plug the bleeding, 00:11:50.279 --> 00:11:52.440 or do we need to send them across town to something 00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:56.960 else? And so of so many of my projects, I call 00:11:56.960 --> 00:11:59.919 this out because this is a case where by talking 00:11:59.919 --> 00:12:01.960 with the people that are living with those hard 00:12:01.960 --> 00:12:05.379 handoffs, and it's just causing all this emotional 00:12:05.379 --> 00:12:07.259 grind for them, they already knew the answer. 00:12:07.279 --> 00:12:09.159 And I think this is true of so many companies. 00:12:09.879 --> 00:12:12.340 When we're curious about what's upstream and 00:12:12.340 --> 00:12:16.220 downstream, our peers will tell us why they aren't 00:12:16.220 --> 00:12:18.519 able to perform. And they're probably as frustrated 00:12:18.519 --> 00:12:21.740 as we are. And so interestingly, there was a 00:12:21.740 --> 00:12:24.139 window of time where we did get this down and 00:12:24.139 --> 00:12:27.840 we had a two and a half average wait time in 00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:31.039 the ER from that first sign up and admit at the 00:12:31.039 --> 00:12:33.899 desk being dispositioned. Whether it was back 00:12:33.899 --> 00:12:36.200 home with Tylenol or it's we're going to send 00:12:36.200 --> 00:12:38.639 you upstairs and have a team of surgeons. get 00:12:38.639 --> 00:12:41.440 that metal out of your face. So it's crazy. It 00:12:41.440 --> 00:12:44.179 was insane. And I would kill for that today. 00:12:44.399 --> 00:12:47.720 Maybe not literally, but maybe literally. But 00:12:47.720 --> 00:12:50.419 I mean, you know, that's not the world that we 00:12:50.419 --> 00:12:53.179 live in today. And I think part of it is to your 00:12:53.179 --> 00:12:56.600 point, it's the silo mentality. Yeah. Well, what's 00:12:56.600 --> 00:12:58.879 interesting is like, I mean, here I am just thinking 00:12:58.879 --> 00:13:02.240 like your wait time could have been delayed by 00:13:02.240 --> 00:13:04.799 45 minutes because they don't have enough blood 00:13:04.799 --> 00:13:07.519 texts. Yeah. And that, you know what the blood 00:13:07.519 --> 00:13:11.100 texts were probably saying? Like their bosses 00:13:11.100 --> 00:13:13.019 are like, you need to move faster. And they're 00:13:13.019 --> 00:13:16.320 like, we don't have capacity here. Yeah. You're 00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:18.759 online. What are you doing? Are you guys playing? 00:13:18.899 --> 00:13:22.220 It was pre Xbox sites. Like get off your Polinkovision 00:13:22.220 --> 00:13:26.639 or whatever was your Atari. Yeah. Quit playing 00:13:26.639 --> 00:13:32.659 tank. It's right. There's listeners that are 00:13:32.659 --> 00:13:35.240 like. Never even heard of these platforms is 00:13:35.240 --> 00:13:38.480 this what is party? Yeah, Atari had two three 00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:42.279 buttons. It was amazing Alright, so alright, 00:13:42.379 --> 00:13:47.059 so it's Friday fix it Friday. What do we do today? 00:13:48.440 --> 00:13:52.039 To fix handoffs. Yeah, what is that? What is 00:13:52.039 --> 00:13:55.340 that? I mean, I just shared for me in that example 00:13:55.340 --> 00:13:58.519 It was asking people on both sides of that handshake, 00:13:58.539 --> 00:14:00.879 you know, I'm passing the baton. You're receiving 00:14:00.879 --> 00:14:04.019 it How do we have an intelligent conversation 00:14:04.019 --> 00:14:07.200 so we stop dropping it? Yeah, but I love your 00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:09.200 Wells Fargo one because that's a little bit more 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:14.600 meta Yeah, right and and the the costs are really 00:14:14.600 --> 00:14:16.820 high. I mean you think about the Wells Fargo 00:14:16.820 --> 00:14:19.120 example How might you fix that or how should 00:14:19.120 --> 00:14:21.340 organizations think about that before they start? 00:14:21.340 --> 00:14:23.559 I don't handle stuffing. I don't think you fix 00:14:23.559 --> 00:14:25.779 that. I think that's broken culture and I don't 00:14:25.779 --> 00:14:30.789 I like Yeah, put them out of business No, no. 00:14:31.070 --> 00:14:34.009 I mean, I just don't think you do. But I do think, 00:14:34.649 --> 00:14:37.649 like, individually, I think being curious on 00:14:37.649 --> 00:14:41.549 a Friday to say, why do we do it this way, right? 00:14:42.070 --> 00:14:45.049 Now, ultimately, what you're going to find, I 00:14:45.049 --> 00:14:48.250 think, is you're going to find humans gamifying 00:14:48.250 --> 00:14:50.730 the system. Everybody knows that the system is 00:14:50.730 --> 00:14:53.730 gamified because the KPIs and all of the metrics 00:14:53.730 --> 00:14:56.950 are driven towards the gamified metrics, right? 00:14:57.049 --> 00:14:59.980 But those aren't where the solutions are. That's 00:14:59.980 --> 00:15:03.200 right. And so, and so like, I think, and the 00:15:03.200 --> 00:15:07.080 funny thing is, and I think I'm just ridiculously 00:15:07.080 --> 00:15:11.059 stubborn when I find a problem. Like I literally, 00:15:11.299 --> 00:15:14.419 I was joking because I just did this, I did this 00:15:14.419 --> 00:15:16.200 really cool thing at work that it was literally, 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:19.519 it was, if we had all, and it was, it was with 00:15:19.519 --> 00:15:22.559 three different teams. Okay. And three different 00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:25.659 completely like, it was a, it was a DBA. It was 00:15:25.659 --> 00:15:28.059 a, it was a dev that was offshore. It was a, 00:15:28.059 --> 00:15:32.059 it was a different dev team that I have no, like, 00:15:32.460 --> 00:15:34.679 it's basically influence over this other dev 00:15:34.679 --> 00:15:37.879 team. And we did, we did a solid, it was, it 00:15:37.879 --> 00:15:41.519 was a, it was a solid week of work in about six 00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:45.419 months. Right. Just because, and, and because 00:15:45.419 --> 00:15:47.820 I was bar begging, borrowing and stealing and 00:15:47.820 --> 00:15:50.179 getting into sprints. And I want to make sure 00:15:50.179 --> 00:15:52.580 it took you six months to get a week worth done, 00:15:52.600 --> 00:15:55.539 or you got six months of work in one week. I 00:15:55.539 --> 00:15:58.929 got, it took me. It took me six months to get 00:15:58.929 --> 00:16:00.570 a week's worth of work. We would have got them 00:16:00.570 --> 00:16:02.950 all in the same room. Right. But again, like 00:16:02.950 --> 00:16:04.610 that hurt my brain when you said that, because 00:16:04.610 --> 00:16:08.649 that's such a shit experience. You know, and 00:16:08.649 --> 00:16:10.830 I'm like, no, that's on topic, but I want to 00:16:10.830 --> 00:16:12.730 make sure I heard that right. It is the worst 00:16:12.730 --> 00:16:16.210 possible sequence. And some of it was like this 00:16:16.210 --> 00:16:18.710 one team, you know, the DBAs had to go and create 00:16:18.710 --> 00:16:22.309 the table. Right. Then, you know, the, the offshore 00:16:22.309 --> 00:16:24.389 team had to change the end point and the people 00:16:24.389 --> 00:16:27.190 that own the code locally had to go and write 00:16:27.190 --> 00:16:29.149 the code. And then we found an issue and we had 00:16:29.149 --> 00:16:32.789 to go and update the table. And so, so if you 00:16:32.789 --> 00:16:34.509 think about it, like every single change was 00:16:34.509 --> 00:16:37.070 basically a two week sprint, right? Because that's, 00:16:37.230 --> 00:16:38.909 that's, that's all the capacity. And I wasn't 00:16:38.909 --> 00:16:40.889 asking for a lot of time from these people, but, 00:16:41.269 --> 00:16:44.669 but like, again, like, I think it was my curiosity 00:16:44.669 --> 00:16:47.610 that helped me actually get data to actually. 00:16:48.440 --> 00:16:51.600 realistically solve the problem. But it also 00:16:51.600 --> 00:16:56.799 wasn't something that I could have done in a 00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:59.220 short fashion because there's no way that an 00:16:59.220 --> 00:17:04.119 individual contributor can actually go and actually 00:17:04.119 --> 00:17:09.319 change the KPIs because the system's against 00:17:09.319 --> 00:17:11.460 them. So if you're an individual contributor, 00:17:12.200 --> 00:17:15.480 go get a wild hair and chase something down and 00:17:15.480 --> 00:17:17.319 just be stubborn about it. If you're a manager, 00:17:18.379 --> 00:17:21.420 like figure out how much your stuff is gamed. 00:17:21.720 --> 00:17:23.839 Because your report that you see is not gamed, 00:17:24.119 --> 00:17:26.420 right? The report you see is flashy and it's 00:17:26.420 --> 00:17:29.359 beautiful. If you click down one and you click 00:17:29.359 --> 00:17:32.299 down two, you will find empty shells of work. 00:17:33.579 --> 00:17:35.700 Chris, I love that. I want to restate the same 00:17:35.700 --> 00:17:37.980 idea in the spirit of Fix It Friday. And it's 00:17:37.980 --> 00:17:42.259 that if your goal is to process a task, leave 00:17:42.259 --> 00:17:45.069 your head in the sand, go about your day. If 00:17:45.069 --> 00:17:48.589 your goal is to have an impact and improve the 00:17:48.589 --> 00:17:51.549 system, you've got to paint a broader picture 00:17:51.549 --> 00:17:54.029 than just your desktop. And that means other 00:17:54.029 --> 00:17:57.529 people into the conversation. 100%. So that's 00:17:57.529 --> 00:17:59.349 a, that's a really great example. I love that. 00:17:59.710 --> 00:18:03.069 Well, happy Friday. Yep. Cool, man. We'll catch 00:18:03.069 --> 00:18:04.470 you next week. All right. We'll see you. Have 00:18:04.470 --> 00:18:05.769 a great week. Bye.