Hey, what's up, man? We are to episode 29 of
that podcast. We made it another week. We have
yet to fire ourselves. Performance plans may
be coming. Yeah, that's right. I just don't know
who administers them. So our, you know, our longevity
may be greater than most people would think.
And that would be fair. I mean, we, we, I didn't
put you on a PIP at the beginning of the year.
Sue. He got to wait a whole year. Damn it. Climbing,
baby. You got to cut the bottom 10%. So next
year it's either you or me by yourself or something.
We better get some guests on this show so we
can at least have options, you know, in the year
ahead. That's funny. All right. Today's topic
is what happens if you're dealing with a customer's
process debt? You mean all of our customers don't
have their act together? Oh, man. Do you remember
being in your 20s and just thinking, man, all
of those big, big businesses, they just must
have their act together. How else could they
be such big businesses? Look at how successful,
look at their buildings and everybody wears a
three piece suit and they have three martini
lunches. I really wanted the three martini lunches
and the corporate jet when I was in my 20s. I
couldn't believe I, I mean, I got fired a couple
of times in my twenties because I just, I couldn't
handle the lack of efficiency. Yeah. No. When
I realized that, when I realized that the guys
that got those corporate jets were just people
that were completely oblivious and they just
demanded everyone around them figure it out.
I'm like, I guess I could be that asshole or
I could fix stuff. Contrary to popular belief,
it turned out that I pursued the fix -it stuff.
I'll let it go. That's all right. I have a bicycle.
I don't need a corporate jet. There you go. Give
me some examples that come to mind. I love this
thought about sometimes we have our act together,
at least in the narrow space that we're serving
customers. When you say customers, that can also
be this huge range of stakeholders. Yeah, yeah.
We're head out when you say customer. Your customer
could be as simple as your boss. Yeah. Right.
It could be a lot more complicated than, you
know, your B2B business sale. Yeah. Right. But
if they, you know, if, yeah. Like it's hard because
sometimes you just have to deal with the customer's
always right. Even when they're not, right? Like,
and that's, you know, I've been thinking about
this a lot. Like, is the customer always right?
You're like, do they even know what they want?
I mean, they'll know what they want after you
show it to them. But. And then they'll think
that they helped you create it. But like, that's
not how this works. Well, how many times have
we heard that, right? Henry Ford said, if I'd
asked customers, they would have told me they
wanted a faster horse. Yep. Oh yeah. You know,
Steve Schaub says, people are stupid, so I made
cool shit they wouldn't bring up on their own.
That's not a precise quote, but there's something
akin to that. No, it's true. Like I think customers
tell us they're paying, but it doesn't mean that
they're always ready. To participate in the solution.
Yeah. Yeah, you know, so I I'm I'm shocked that
like we don't know what we want until we find
it It's almost like it's almost like things are
not obvious, right? So and this is what the customers
right like things are not obvious until it becomes
obvious Why so like with with this gen AI stuff?
It's like we're gonna make a million dollars
and then you move to fast forward nine months
and you're like well mean Open AI is doing okay
and Microsoft's doing fine, but like, where's
the money? That's right. Well, I think the money
is going to come out of licensing our own DNA
and medical records back to us. Well, there you
go. I'm eager to see what company that spins
out of. Is that going to be Hole in the Ground
or Neuralink? I don't even know. Maybe Elon,
Elonski has a new venture where I can license
back my own... My own saliva. Yeah, he's gonna
he's gonna he's gonna launch body X. Okay Don't
love the body you're in love the body you want
He's good. What's the body acts? Yeah, he's gonna
and he's gonna he's gonna have body X by open
AI He does all these like financial like Nuancy,
you're like, oh, that's brilliant. We're not
sure just it's the financial show game that he's
playing anyway Processed debt with clients. I
have to say quick sidebar All right. Have you
watched Dark Mirror? I think it's on Netflix.
I have not watched Dark Mirror. And to listeners
everywhere, it is disturbing the way the world
could turn in just a couple of short decisions.
And so it's what happens if you throw another
three to five years into one of these strange
technology revolutions. And so everything from
somebody was explaining an eye surgery to me
recently where lens transplant was done, but
then they were kind of able to like zoom it in
and adjust it for perfect 2020 vision. Now, here's
the shitty part, Chris. I don't remember who
told me. I think that sounds awesome, but now
I don't remember who to go ask. Listener, if
that was you, please. Yeah, it's weird though,
because I feel like we still have a lot of things
that have always been true. trying to interact
with people, try to serve those around us, try
to be a team player when others aren't quite
ready for us to be on the team. Then we also
have so much technology getting spewed at everybody.
And it's not in the anals of wacky tech magazines
or scientific Americana anymore. It's hitting
everybody's Facebook feed, those of us over 40.
And it's showing up in television advertising.
So when our parents are talking, It's a different
world all of a sudden. Yeah. Well, it's interesting,
like back to the, like, just the customers having
deficiencies, right, in their process. I think
it's interesting if you think about AI, right?
Like that's the thing that CEOs are buying, right?
If we don't need people. Yeah. And yet oftentimes
we need people to understand what the person
is asking. You know what I mean? Like, it's funny,
right? Like, our customer, right? Like, let's
just assume it's our customer and they want something,
right? And how often is it like that the salesperson
directs them in the direction they want and or
need to go, but they don't really, they're stuck
on that one thing, right? And then the salesman's
able to just walk them through and then it's
all of a sudden they just let go. And I think
we run into situations like that a lot, where
the people that we're dealing with on a Friday
are going to want something. And based on all
of our expertise and everything that we know,
we're going to assume that they want and or need
something. And that may or may not be what they
need. I love that call out, Chris, that idea
of positional power. And sometimes it's the hierarchy.
Sometimes it's simply, I'm obligated to perform
a service for you. But I think about taking somebody
to a nicer restaurant where they're like, I only
eat what people serve me, so I don't know how
to order. And for the longest time, they'd say,
well, how would you like your steak? And I remember
the first time I was asked that, I was probably
a teen, late teen, with family, friends, or something.
I'm like, I want it cooked. You know, I don't,
I don't understand your question. And so in today's
world, the thing I more often hear at restaurants
is how would you like it? The chef recommends
medium rare. Right. And that little bit of priming
that waiter's doing is at least indicating the
kinds of answers they're looking for. Oh yeah.
And then if you don't have a sense of the right
answer, then you can say, well, of course I'm
going to have it. However, the chef. Yeah. So
I think there's something super interesting about
is the customer always right and When you said
that a moment ago made me think oh, this is why
we have to stay curious Yeah, because the customer
may not they're giving us the best language they
have sure trying to communicate effectively Sometimes
they've misdiagnosed their need. Oh, yeah Yeah,
I think we talked about that last week or the
week before like, you know, we feel the symptom,
but we're missing the source of the pain Yeah
Well, so how do you, this doesn't need to be
tell all, we'll get to that in your autobiography.
Thinking about a recent customer that you've
had, how did you feel about that interaction?
Did you just try to like, yep, you asked for
a Big Mac and I gave you a Big Mac even though
you're vegetarian or did you kind of hold some
space for curiosity to try to invite some clarification?
I find when I can hold space. I'm generally at
my best. Yeah. Right. Where it's like, I know,
I realize that this is an immediate, this is
very urgent or whatever. And I will get to it
at this point and this is why. And that, that,
that has always been helpful. And I'm not always
that good at that. The other thing, the other
thing that I realized, wait, that's right. Not
an AI. Yeah. The other thing that I realized
is sometimes like, Sometimes my C minus work
is someone else's A plus work. Yeah, and and
so I I and I think I've learned this this year
which is I Would always rush towards perfecting
whatever I was delivering And then I would get
so offended when I got corrections Yeah on a
PowerPoint or a delivery or whatever it was right
now and over this year I've let go of some of
that perfection, which has been very helpful
when I've received feedback Because one it makes
it better I include oftentimes, you know, this
is a manager type person like I include that
manager person and they actually Get to assist
and help me grow as a person Right. And so when
I was aiming for perfection, oftentimes I would
just be so wound up around the axle about like,
well, they don't understand how hard I worked
on this. And so if I took it back, you know,
from, you know, 110 % down to like 85. Yeah.
I was less stressed to deliver. And I knew that
it had room to improve and it was super helpful.
Yeah. Chris, I love that. I wish I could remember
who the genius was. Um, it was about the time
that I started consulting. I could have even
been into a consulting engagement or two, but
the request was, um, we were doing, we were doing
some strategy and starting just to organize some
of the pillars. And the request was just give
it a very basic first cut, but then I want you
to take it around and socialize it. And it's
not that we hadn't had a really clear conversation,
but the idea of leaving it pretty raw and kind
of in this draft form. taking it out to stakeholders
or to my customer to say, here's kind of the
direction I think I'm going. Yeah. Gave them
an opportunity to go, oh, now you've given me
something more to respond to, didn't have, your
doesn't match what was in my head. Yeah. And
it does create this safe space. I remember, you
know, this was probably on the heels of a very
bespoke PowerPoint where I'd invested, like you
just said, so many hours. And they're like, that's
not what I wanted. I wanted an Excel sheet. You
know, you're like, Oh, hell. And so it is, there's
something really powerful about early drafts
and involving people, you know, process dead,
the language barriers, you know, all experience.
Well, you figure out where your communication
drops, right? Like, and I think that's, that's
maybe the topic that we're hitting on is like,
when it's dealing, when you're dealing with customers,
it's often, it's often, or even relationships,
it's the communication breakdown. That's where
the, that's where the process breaks down. I
love that, Chris. Because you hear something,
you run off, you know, you're like, Oh my God,
you know, I haven't, you know, I haven't forbid
this happens with our spouses or significant
others where it's like, you said this, you're
like, I was doing this. And then it becomes a
circular, you know, crazy cycle where it's just
the community. It's the process of the communication
breakdown that, you know, they, you know, the
spouse, they know those trigger points. Yeah,
they do. It's pretty impressive. That's, that's
a legitimate thing. And I think, you know, I
think, um, we, we hear the term work spouse,
you know, we usually think about that in a gender
context, but people we work with closely also
come to understand. Like your, your response
is not correlated with the exchange here. Something's
out of sync. And so I love that you name this
as a communication breakdown. So oftentimes it
has nothing to do with their day -to -day process.
That might be on absolute rails. Hits it perfectly,
but these gaps in our communication, the gaps
in understanding are certainly a process, right?
And the more we can do to bridge it, the healthier
everybody is. Well, and heaven forbid a salesperson
sells something that's just a little out of range.
Imagine if you will. Yeah. In a world where everything
works. And Genii solves all of your problems.
Can I check now? Take all my money. That's funny.
Wait, it doesn't do dishes. It doesn't change
the sheets. It doesn't do toilets. Maybe Genii
is not perfect yet. No, it's getting there. It's
not bad. Chris, this is a great episode. We've
got 15 seconds. Anything else you want to say
before we wrap it up and come in under the 15
minutes? No, just fix something today. Make your
life better. Give yourself some space. I love
it. Our man. Thank you, sir. All right. See you
next week. Bye.