WEBVTT 00:00:00.529 --> 00:00:04.009 Hey, what's up, man? We are to episode 29 of 00:00:04.009 --> 00:00:08.210 that podcast. We made it another week. We have 00:00:08.210 --> 00:00:12.150 yet to fire ourselves. Performance plans may 00:00:12.150 --> 00:00:14.630 be coming. Yeah, that's right. I just don't know 00:00:14.630 --> 00:00:17.350 who administers them. So our, you know, our longevity 00:00:17.350 --> 00:00:20.129 may be greater than most people would think. 00:00:20.449 --> 00:00:23.910 And that would be fair. I mean, we, we, I didn't 00:00:23.910 --> 00:00:26.030 put you on a PIP at the beginning of the year. 00:00:26.809 --> 00:00:30.920 Sue. He got to wait a whole year. Damn it. Climbing, 00:00:31.140 --> 00:00:37.219 baby. You got to cut the bottom 10%. So next 00:00:37.219 --> 00:00:40.600 year it's either you or me by yourself or something. 00:00:41.520 --> 00:00:43.799 We better get some guests on this show so we 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:45.380 can at least have options, you know, in the year 00:00:45.380 --> 00:00:48.100 ahead. That's funny. All right. Today's topic 00:00:48.100 --> 00:00:53.020 is what happens if you're dealing with a customer's 00:00:53.020 --> 00:00:57.380 process debt? You mean all of our customers don't 00:00:57.380 --> 00:01:01.719 have their act together? Oh, man. Do you remember 00:01:01.719 --> 00:01:04.540 being in your 20s and just thinking, man, all 00:01:04.540 --> 00:01:07.219 of those big, big businesses, they just must 00:01:07.219 --> 00:01:10.079 have their act together. How else could they 00:01:10.079 --> 00:01:13.180 be such big businesses? Look at how successful, 00:01:13.180 --> 00:01:15.620 look at their buildings and everybody wears a 00:01:15.620 --> 00:01:18.019 three piece suit and they have three martini 00:01:18.019 --> 00:01:23.159 lunches. I really wanted the three martini lunches 00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:27.519 and the corporate jet when I was in my 20s. I 00:01:27.519 --> 00:01:30.180 couldn't believe I, I mean, I got fired a couple 00:01:30.180 --> 00:01:32.819 of times in my twenties because I just, I couldn't 00:01:32.819 --> 00:01:38.079 handle the lack of efficiency. Yeah. No. When 00:01:38.079 --> 00:01:40.560 I realized that, when I realized that the guys 00:01:40.560 --> 00:01:43.939 that got those corporate jets were just people 00:01:43.939 --> 00:01:47.540 that were completely oblivious and they just 00:01:47.540 --> 00:01:49.799 demanded everyone around them figure it out. 00:01:50.260 --> 00:01:52.799 I'm like, I guess I could be that asshole or 00:01:52.799 --> 00:01:57.469 I could fix stuff. Contrary to popular belief, 00:01:57.930 --> 00:02:00.189 it turned out that I pursued the fix -it stuff. 00:02:00.709 --> 00:02:03.450 I'll let it go. That's all right. I have a bicycle. 00:02:03.549 --> 00:02:06.049 I don't need a corporate jet. There you go. Give 00:02:06.049 --> 00:02:08.229 me some examples that come to mind. I love this 00:02:08.229 --> 00:02:10.969 thought about sometimes we have our act together, 00:02:11.009 --> 00:02:13.169 at least in the narrow space that we're serving 00:02:13.169 --> 00:02:16.009 customers. When you say customers, that can also 00:02:16.009 --> 00:02:19.990 be this huge range of stakeholders. Yeah, yeah. 00:02:20.090 --> 00:02:22.629 We're head out when you say customer. Your customer 00:02:22.629 --> 00:02:25.810 could be as simple as your boss. Yeah. Right. 00:02:25.990 --> 00:02:28.550 It could be a lot more complicated than, you 00:02:28.550 --> 00:02:32.949 know, your B2B business sale. Yeah. Right. But 00:02:32.949 --> 00:02:37.250 if they, you know, if, yeah. Like it's hard because 00:02:37.250 --> 00:02:41.509 sometimes you just have to deal with the customer's 00:02:41.509 --> 00:02:45.409 always right. Even when they're not, right? Like, 00:02:45.550 --> 00:02:46.689 and that's, you know, I've been thinking about 00:02:46.689 --> 00:02:48.569 this a lot. Like, is the customer always right? 00:02:48.629 --> 00:02:50.409 You're like, do they even know what they want? 00:02:50.490 --> 00:02:52.930 I mean, they'll know what they want after you 00:02:52.930 --> 00:02:55.400 show it to them. But. And then they'll think 00:02:55.400 --> 00:02:57.479 that they helped you create it. But like, that's 00:02:57.479 --> 00:02:59.719 not how this works. Well, how many times have 00:02:59.719 --> 00:03:02.039 we heard that, right? Henry Ford said, if I'd 00:03:02.039 --> 00:03:03.340 asked customers, they would have told me they 00:03:03.340 --> 00:03:06.659 wanted a faster horse. Yep. Oh yeah. You know, 00:03:06.979 --> 00:03:09.360 Steve Schaub says, people are stupid, so I made 00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:11.699 cool shit they wouldn't bring up on their own. 00:03:11.900 --> 00:03:16.259 That's not a precise quote, but there's something 00:03:16.259 --> 00:03:19.180 akin to that. No, it's true. Like I think customers 00:03:19.180 --> 00:03:22.020 tell us they're paying, but it doesn't mean that 00:03:22.020 --> 00:03:25.460 they're always ready. To participate in the solution. 00:03:25.780 --> 00:03:29.520 Yeah. Yeah, you know, so I I'm I'm shocked that 00:03:29.520 --> 00:03:32.439 like we don't know what we want until we find 00:03:32.439 --> 00:03:35.180 it It's almost like it's almost like things are 00:03:35.180 --> 00:03:37.560 not obvious, right? So and this is what the customers 00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:40.039 right like things are not obvious until it becomes 00:03:40.039 --> 00:03:44.379 obvious Why so like with with this gen AI stuff? 00:03:44.400 --> 00:03:46.460 It's like we're gonna make a million dollars 00:03:46.460 --> 00:03:49.219 and then you move to fast forward nine months 00:03:49.219 --> 00:03:53.539 and you're like well mean Open AI is doing okay 00:03:53.539 --> 00:03:55.780 and Microsoft's doing fine, but like, where's 00:03:55.780 --> 00:03:59.699 the money? That's right. Well, I think the money 00:03:59.699 --> 00:04:03.539 is going to come out of licensing our own DNA 00:04:03.539 --> 00:04:05.580 and medical records back to us. Well, there you 00:04:05.580 --> 00:04:08.680 go. I'm eager to see what company that spins 00:04:08.680 --> 00:04:11.120 out of. Is that going to be Hole in the Ground 00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:15.120 or Neuralink? I don't even know. Maybe Elon, 00:04:15.639 --> 00:04:19.240 Elonski has a new venture where I can license 00:04:19.240 --> 00:04:22.620 back my own... My own saliva. Yeah, he's gonna 00:04:22.620 --> 00:04:27.860 he's gonna he's gonna launch body X. Okay Don't 00:04:27.860 --> 00:04:30.660 love the body you're in love the body you want 00:04:30.660 --> 00:04:33.540 He's good. What's the body acts? Yeah, he's gonna 00:04:33.540 --> 00:04:36.339 and he's gonna he's gonna have body X by open 00:04:36.339 --> 00:04:41.019 AI He does all these like financial like Nuancy, 00:04:41.180 --> 00:04:43.120 you're like, oh, that's brilliant. We're not 00:04:43.120 --> 00:04:45.800 sure just it's the financial show game that he's 00:04:45.800 --> 00:04:48.519 playing anyway Processed debt with clients. I 00:04:48.519 --> 00:04:51.680 have to say quick sidebar All right. Have you 00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:53.959 watched Dark Mirror? I think it's on Netflix. 00:04:54.060 --> 00:04:56.899 I have not watched Dark Mirror. And to listeners 00:04:56.899 --> 00:05:01.500 everywhere, it is disturbing the way the world 00:05:01.500 --> 00:05:03.939 could turn in just a couple of short decisions. 00:05:04.500 --> 00:05:06.720 And so it's what happens if you throw another 00:05:06.720 --> 00:05:09.800 three to five years into one of these strange 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:13.639 technology revolutions. And so everything from 00:05:13.639 --> 00:05:16.579 somebody was explaining an eye surgery to me 00:05:16.579 --> 00:05:22.139 recently where lens transplant was done, but 00:05:22.139 --> 00:05:24.500 then they were kind of able to like zoom it in 00:05:24.500 --> 00:05:29.000 and adjust it for perfect 2020 vision. Now, here's 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:30.439 the shitty part, Chris. I don't remember who 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:32.839 told me. I think that sounds awesome, but now 00:05:32.839 --> 00:05:35.079 I don't remember who to go ask. Listener, if 00:05:35.079 --> 00:05:39.279 that was you, please. Yeah, it's weird though, 00:05:39.399 --> 00:05:42.279 because I feel like we still have a lot of things 00:05:42.279 --> 00:05:44.779 that have always been true. trying to interact 00:05:44.779 --> 00:05:47.199 with people, try to serve those around us, try 00:05:47.199 --> 00:05:49.139 to be a team player when others aren't quite 00:05:49.139 --> 00:05:52.560 ready for us to be on the team. Then we also 00:05:52.560 --> 00:05:55.680 have so much technology getting spewed at everybody. 00:05:56.300 --> 00:05:59.639 And it's not in the anals of wacky tech magazines 00:05:59.639 --> 00:06:02.980 or scientific Americana anymore. It's hitting 00:06:02.980 --> 00:06:06.459 everybody's Facebook feed, those of us over 40. 00:06:08.519 --> 00:06:10.620 And it's showing up in television advertising. 00:06:11.199 --> 00:06:15.060 So when our parents are talking, It's a different 00:06:15.060 --> 00:06:17.439 world all of a sudden. Yeah. Well, it's interesting, 00:06:17.620 --> 00:06:22.019 like back to the, like, just the customers having 00:06:22.019 --> 00:06:27.300 deficiencies, right, in their process. I think 00:06:27.300 --> 00:06:30.379 it's interesting if you think about AI, right? 00:06:30.379 --> 00:06:35.100 Like that's the thing that CEOs are buying, right? 00:06:35.100 --> 00:06:38.480 If we don't need people. Yeah. And yet oftentimes 00:06:38.480 --> 00:06:41.879 we need people to understand what the person 00:06:41.879 --> 00:06:44.540 is asking. You know what I mean? Like, it's funny, 00:06:44.660 --> 00:06:46.360 right? Like, our customer, right? Like, let's 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:48.540 just assume it's our customer and they want something, 00:06:48.740 --> 00:06:56.019 right? And how often is it like that the salesperson 00:06:56.019 --> 00:06:59.120 directs them in the direction they want and or 00:06:59.120 --> 00:07:04.720 need to go, but they don't really, they're stuck 00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:08.420 on that one thing, right? And then the salesman's 00:07:08.420 --> 00:07:10.579 able to just walk them through and then it's 00:07:10.579 --> 00:07:12.899 all of a sudden they just let go. And I think 00:07:12.899 --> 00:07:16.100 we run into situations like that a lot, where 00:07:16.100 --> 00:07:20.079 the people that we're dealing with on a Friday 00:07:20.079 --> 00:07:23.839 are going to want something. And based on all 00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:25.899 of our expertise and everything that we know, 00:07:26.040 --> 00:07:31.019 we're going to assume that they want and or need 00:07:31.019 --> 00:07:33.600 something. And that may or may not be what they 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:37.259 need. I love that call out, Chris, that idea 00:07:37.259 --> 00:07:40.899 of positional power. And sometimes it's the hierarchy. 00:07:41.389 --> 00:07:44.569 Sometimes it's simply, I'm obligated to perform 00:07:44.569 --> 00:07:51.350 a service for you. But I think about taking somebody 00:07:51.350 --> 00:07:53.870 to a nicer restaurant where they're like, I only 00:07:53.870 --> 00:07:55.449 eat what people serve me, so I don't know how 00:07:55.449 --> 00:07:58.750 to order. And for the longest time, they'd say, 00:07:58.850 --> 00:08:01.230 well, how would you like your steak? And I remember 00:08:01.230 --> 00:08:03.829 the first time I was asked that, I was probably 00:08:03.829 --> 00:08:06.490 a teen, late teen, with family, friends, or something. 00:08:06.689 --> 00:08:09.839 I'm like, I want it cooked. You know, I don't, 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:13.920 I don't understand your question. And so in today's 00:08:13.920 --> 00:08:16.379 world, the thing I more often hear at restaurants 00:08:16.379 --> 00:08:19.879 is how would you like it? The chef recommends 00:08:19.879 --> 00:08:23.920 medium rare. Right. And that little bit of priming 00:08:23.920 --> 00:08:27.600 that waiter's doing is at least indicating the 00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:30.420 kinds of answers they're looking for. Oh yeah. 00:08:30.560 --> 00:08:32.220 And then if you don't have a sense of the right 00:08:32.220 --> 00:08:34.100 answer, then you can say, well, of course I'm 00:08:34.100 --> 00:08:36.909 going to have it. However, the chef. Yeah. So 00:08:36.909 --> 00:08:39.529 I think there's something super interesting about 00:08:39.529 --> 00:08:42.509 is the customer always right and When you said 00:08:42.509 --> 00:08:44.909 that a moment ago made me think oh, this is why 00:08:44.909 --> 00:08:48.110 we have to stay curious Yeah, because the customer 00:08:48.110 --> 00:08:50.649 may not they're giving us the best language they 00:08:50.649 --> 00:08:54.629 have sure trying to communicate effectively Sometimes 00:08:54.629 --> 00:08:57.809 they've misdiagnosed their need. Oh, yeah Yeah, 00:08:57.830 --> 00:08:59.389 I think we talked about that last week or the 00:08:59.389 --> 00:09:02.049 week before like, you know, we feel the symptom, 00:09:02.309 --> 00:09:04.870 but we're missing the source of the pain Yeah 00:09:06.239 --> 00:09:10.039 Well, so how do you, this doesn't need to be 00:09:10.039 --> 00:09:12.840 tell all, we'll get to that in your autobiography. 00:09:14.000 --> 00:09:16.200 Thinking about a recent customer that you've 00:09:16.200 --> 00:09:20.460 had, how did you feel about that interaction? 00:09:20.679 --> 00:09:23.360 Did you just try to like, yep, you asked for 00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:25.779 a Big Mac and I gave you a Big Mac even though 00:09:25.779 --> 00:09:28.919 you're vegetarian or did you kind of hold some 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:31.840 space for curiosity to try to invite some clarification? 00:09:32.379 --> 00:09:35.879 I find when I can hold space. I'm generally at 00:09:35.879 --> 00:09:39.759 my best. Yeah. Right. Where it's like, I know, 00:09:39.779 --> 00:09:42.299 I realize that this is an immediate, this is 00:09:42.299 --> 00:09:47.460 very urgent or whatever. And I will get to it 00:09:47.460 --> 00:09:51.580 at this point and this is why. And that, that, 00:09:51.580 --> 00:09:53.899 that has always been helpful. And I'm not always 00:09:53.899 --> 00:09:57.659 that good at that. The other thing, the other 00:09:57.659 --> 00:10:00.240 thing that I realized, wait, that's right. Not 00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:02.360 an AI. Yeah. The other thing that I realized 00:10:02.360 --> 00:10:08.129 is sometimes like, Sometimes my C minus work 00:10:08.129 --> 00:10:12.370 is someone else's A plus work. Yeah, and and 00:10:12.370 --> 00:10:15.929 so I I and I think I've learned this this year 00:10:15.929 --> 00:10:23.970 which is I Would always rush towards perfecting 00:10:23.970 --> 00:10:28.850 whatever I was delivering And then I would get 00:10:28.850 --> 00:10:34.779 so offended when I got corrections Yeah on a 00:10:34.779 --> 00:10:38.100 PowerPoint or a delivery or whatever it was right 00:10:38.100 --> 00:10:41.179 now and over this year I've let go of some of 00:10:41.179 --> 00:10:44.019 that perfection, which has been very helpful 00:10:44.019 --> 00:10:50.419 when I've received feedback Because one it makes 00:10:50.419 --> 00:10:53.279 it better I include oftentimes, you know, this 00:10:53.279 --> 00:10:56.220 is a manager type person like I include that 00:10:56.220 --> 00:11:00.480 manager person and they actually Get to assist 00:11:00.480 --> 00:11:04.269 and help me grow as a person Right. And so when 00:11:04.269 --> 00:11:07.049 I was aiming for perfection, oftentimes I would 00:11:07.049 --> 00:11:09.490 just be so wound up around the axle about like, 00:11:09.570 --> 00:11:11.370 well, they don't understand how hard I worked 00:11:11.370 --> 00:11:14.210 on this. And so if I took it back, you know, 00:11:14.330 --> 00:11:18.769 from, you know, 110 % down to like 85. Yeah. 00:11:19.190 --> 00:11:23.450 I was less stressed to deliver. And I knew that 00:11:23.450 --> 00:11:26.090 it had room to improve and it was super helpful. 00:11:27.009 --> 00:11:29.669 Yeah. Chris, I love that. I wish I could remember 00:11:29.669 --> 00:11:34.049 who the genius was. Um, it was about the time 00:11:34.049 --> 00:11:35.769 that I started consulting. I could have even 00:11:35.769 --> 00:11:39.190 been into a consulting engagement or two, but 00:11:39.190 --> 00:11:43.149 the request was, um, we were doing, we were doing 00:11:43.149 --> 00:11:45.370 some strategy and starting just to organize some 00:11:45.370 --> 00:11:48.470 of the pillars. And the request was just give 00:11:48.470 --> 00:11:51.110 it a very basic first cut, but then I want you 00:11:51.110 --> 00:11:54.250 to take it around and socialize it. And it's 00:11:54.250 --> 00:11:57.250 not that we hadn't had a really clear conversation, 00:11:57.250 --> 00:11:59.889 but the idea of leaving it pretty raw and kind 00:11:59.889 --> 00:12:03.799 of in this draft form. taking it out to stakeholders 00:12:03.799 --> 00:12:06.340 or to my customer to say, here's kind of the 00:12:06.340 --> 00:12:08.919 direction I think I'm going. Yeah. Gave them 00:12:08.919 --> 00:12:11.960 an opportunity to go, oh, now you've given me 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:14.740 something more to respond to, didn't have, your 00:12:14.740 --> 00:12:17.779 doesn't match what was in my head. Yeah. And 00:12:17.779 --> 00:12:21.340 it does create this safe space. I remember, you 00:12:21.340 --> 00:12:23.639 know, this was probably on the heels of a very 00:12:23.639 --> 00:12:26.419 bespoke PowerPoint where I'd invested, like you 00:12:26.419 --> 00:12:29.340 just said, so many hours. And they're like, that's 00:12:29.340 --> 00:12:31.559 not what I wanted. I wanted an Excel sheet. You 00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:34.629 know, you're like, Oh, hell. And so it is, there's 00:12:34.629 --> 00:12:36.830 something really powerful about early drafts 00:12:36.830 --> 00:12:39.889 and involving people, you know, process dead, 00:12:40.450 --> 00:12:43.090 the language barriers, you know, all experience. 00:12:43.429 --> 00:12:45.809 Well, you figure out where your communication 00:12:45.809 --> 00:12:48.309 drops, right? Like, and I think that's, that's 00:12:48.309 --> 00:12:50.870 maybe the topic that we're hitting on is like, 00:12:51.529 --> 00:12:53.269 when it's dealing, when you're dealing with customers, 00:12:53.529 --> 00:12:56.370 it's often, it's often, or even relationships, 00:12:56.470 --> 00:12:59.230 it's the communication breakdown. That's where 00:12:59.230 --> 00:13:02.279 the, that's where the process breaks down. I 00:13:02.279 --> 00:13:03.860 love that, Chris. Because you hear something, 00:13:04.059 --> 00:13:06.019 you run off, you know, you're like, Oh my God, 00:13:06.840 --> 00:13:07.940 you know, I haven't, you know, I haven't forbid 00:13:07.940 --> 00:13:10.279 this happens with our spouses or significant 00:13:10.279 --> 00:13:13.200 others where it's like, you said this, you're 00:13:13.200 --> 00:13:16.299 like, I was doing this. And then it becomes a 00:13:16.299 --> 00:13:19.620 circular, you know, crazy cycle where it's just 00:13:19.620 --> 00:13:22.019 the community. It's the process of the communication 00:13:22.019 --> 00:13:24.840 breakdown that, you know, they, you know, the 00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:28.259 spouse, they know those trigger points. Yeah, 00:13:28.559 --> 00:13:31.120 they do. It's pretty impressive. That's, that's 00:13:31.120 --> 00:13:33.340 a legitimate thing. And I think, you know, I 00:13:33.340 --> 00:13:37.519 think, um, we, we hear the term work spouse, 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:40.039 you know, we usually think about that in a gender 00:13:40.039 --> 00:13:42.559 context, but people we work with closely also 00:13:42.559 --> 00:13:46.460 come to understand. Like your, your response 00:13:46.460 --> 00:13:49.960 is not correlated with the exchange here. Something's 00:13:49.960 --> 00:13:53.450 out of sync. And so I love that you name this 00:13:53.450 --> 00:13:56.190 as a communication breakdown. So oftentimes it 00:13:56.190 --> 00:13:58.490 has nothing to do with their day -to -day process. 00:13:58.590 --> 00:14:02.750 That might be on absolute rails. Hits it perfectly, 00:14:02.809 --> 00:14:05.970 but these gaps in our communication, the gaps 00:14:05.970 --> 00:14:10.409 in understanding are certainly a process, right? 00:14:10.669 --> 00:14:12.230 And the more we can do to bridge it, the healthier 00:14:12.230 --> 00:14:15.169 everybody is. Well, and heaven forbid a salesperson 00:14:15.169 --> 00:14:18.690 sells something that's just a little out of range. 00:14:21.059 --> 00:14:25.059 Imagine if you will. Yeah. In a world where everything 00:14:25.059 --> 00:14:29.200 works. And Genii solves all of your problems. 00:14:30.340 --> 00:14:35.019 Can I check now? Take all my money. That's funny. 00:14:35.100 --> 00:14:37.360 Wait, it doesn't do dishes. It doesn't change 00:14:37.360 --> 00:14:39.980 the sheets. It doesn't do toilets. Maybe Genii 00:14:39.980 --> 00:14:43.019 is not perfect yet. No, it's getting there. It's 00:14:43.019 --> 00:14:45.700 not bad. Chris, this is a great episode. We've 00:14:45.700 --> 00:14:47.779 got 15 seconds. Anything else you want to say 00:14:47.779 --> 00:14:49.460 before we wrap it up and come in under the 15 00:14:49.460 --> 00:14:52.879 minutes? No, just fix something today. Make your 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:56.220 life better. Give yourself some space. I love 00:14:56.220 --> 00:14:59.519 it. Our man. Thank you, sir. All right. See you 00:14:59.519 --> 00:15:00.559 next week. Bye.