WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.040 So a major shockwave has just hit the atmospheric 00:00:03.040 --> 00:00:05.379 science community this week. I mean, a genuine 00:00:05.379 --> 00:00:07.860 earthquake. A huge one, yeah. The White House 00:00:07.860 --> 00:00:11.279 announced plans to, well, to dismantle the National 00:00:11.279 --> 00:00:13.779 Center for Atmospheric Research. NCAR, as most 00:00:13.779 --> 00:00:16.480 people in the field call it. This news came late 00:00:16.480 --> 00:00:19.980 Tuesday night, December 16th, 2025. And it has 00:00:19.980 --> 00:00:22.359 sent ripples not just through Boulder, Colorado, 00:00:22.480 --> 00:00:25.379 where NCAR is based, but... really across the 00:00:25.379 --> 00:00:27.820 entire global scientific community. It's a move 00:00:27.820 --> 00:00:30.339 that many, many leading experts are calling a 00:00:30.339 --> 00:00:32.600 catastrophic step back for American science. 00:00:33.020 --> 00:00:35.759 We're talking decades of progress at risk. It's 00:00:35.759 --> 00:00:38.100 a profound moment. So today we're going to unpack 00:00:38.100 --> 00:00:40.479 what's happening, what NCAR actually does, and 00:00:40.479 --> 00:00:42.640 why this is so much more than just a budget cut. 00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:45.179 Welcome to Meteorology Matters, the podcast that 00:00:45.179 --> 00:00:47.579 dives deep into the science, chaos, and stories 00:00:47.579 --> 00:00:50.369 behind the weather that shapes our world. This 00:00:50.369 --> 00:00:52.909 show was created by meteorologist Rob Jones. 00:00:53.270 --> 00:00:55.509 Now let's get into today's episode of Meteorology 00:00:55.509 --> 00:00:58.369 Matters. So this all centers on a very specific 00:00:58.369 --> 00:01:01.850 directive coming from the highest levels of government. 00:01:02.109 --> 00:01:04.769 Let's start right there. Who exactly announced 00:01:04.769 --> 00:01:07.109 the plan to break up NCAR? And more importantly, 00:01:07.549 --> 00:01:10.269 what was the official reason they gave? The announcement 00:01:10.269 --> 00:01:12.790 came from Russell Vought. He's the director of 00:01:12.790 --> 00:01:15.409 the Office of Management and Budget, the OMB. 00:01:15.530 --> 00:01:18.829 Okay. And he didn't mince words. He declared 00:01:18.829 --> 00:01:21.959 the intent to functionally break up the National 00:01:21.959 --> 00:01:24.739 Center for Atmospheric Research. And the justification. 00:01:25.060 --> 00:01:28.459 It was. Well, it was explicitly political. Vought 00:01:28.459 --> 00:01:31.219 labeled NCAR as, and this is a direct quote, 00:01:31.700 --> 00:01:34.260 one of the largest sources of climate alarmism 00:01:34.260 --> 00:01:37.620 in the country. Climate alarmism. Wow, so that 00:01:37.620 --> 00:01:39.079 phrase right there, that tells you a lot about 00:01:39.079 --> 00:01:41.280 the motivation, doesn't it? It really does. It 00:01:41.280 --> 00:01:43.700 frames the research not as objective science, 00:01:43.780 --> 00:01:46.859 but as some kind of politically motivated advocacy. 00:01:47.120 --> 00:01:49.700 And this fits into a broader pattern we've seen 00:01:49.700 --> 00:01:51.859 of targeting research that deals with climate 00:01:51.859 --> 00:01:54.299 change. Exactly. But here's the interesting little 00:01:54.299 --> 00:01:57.180 caveat he offered, almost like an attempt to 00:01:57.180 --> 00:01:59.819 soften the blow. What was that? Vought promised 00:01:59.819 --> 00:02:02.900 that any vital activities, such as weather research, 00:02:03.019 --> 00:02:05.219 will be moved to another entity or location. 00:02:05.439 --> 00:02:07.640 So they're suggesting they can perform this kind 00:02:07.640 --> 00:02:10.699 of surgical extraction. Keep the good science, 00:02:10.900 --> 00:02:14.139 the daily weather forecasts, and just get rid 00:02:14.139 --> 00:02:16.560 of the bad science, the long -term climate stuff. 00:02:16.659 --> 00:02:18.400 That's the idea they're putting forward. It sounds, 00:02:18.400 --> 00:02:20.419 you know, maybe reasonable on the surface if 00:02:20.419 --> 00:02:22.080 you don't know the science behind it. But is 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:24.080 that even possible? I mean, can you actually 00:02:24.080 --> 00:02:27.020 draw a clean line between weather research and 00:02:27.020 --> 00:02:29.939 climate research? No, absolutely not. OK. It's 00:02:29.939 --> 00:02:31.960 a fundamental misunderstanding of the science. 00:02:32.240 --> 00:02:34.729 Right. As basically every climate and weather 00:02:34.729 --> 00:02:36.789 expert has pointed out since this announcement, 00:02:37.069 --> 00:02:40.009 there is just no clean separation. It's the same 00:02:40.009 --> 00:02:42.129 atmosphere. It's the same atmosphere, the same 00:02:42.129 --> 00:02:45.030 physics, the same fluid dynamics. It's just a 00:02:45.030 --> 00:02:47.229 matter of timescale. You know, weather is what 00:02:47.229 --> 00:02:50.229 you're getting today, this hour. Climate is the 00:02:50.229 --> 00:02:53.189 average of that weather over, say, 30 years. 00:02:53.430 --> 00:02:56.139 Precisely. So the tools you use to understand 00:02:56.139 --> 00:02:59.259 one, the supercomputers, the models, the observational 00:02:59.259 --> 00:03:02.280 data, are the exact same tools you need to understand 00:03:02.280 --> 00:03:04.939 the other. So if you start taking a sledgehammer 00:03:04.939 --> 00:03:07.780 to the infrastructure that supports climate modeling, 00:03:08.159 --> 00:03:11.120 you are by definition damaging the infrastructure 00:03:11.120 --> 00:03:14.520 that supports weather forecasting. You can't 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:16.819 degrade one without degrading the other. It's 00:03:16.819 --> 00:03:19.400 that simple. The whole premise is flawed from 00:03:19.400 --> 00:03:21.620 the get -go. And the reaction from the scientific 00:03:21.620 --> 00:03:24.349 community was immediate. Right. Especially at 00:03:24.349 --> 00:03:26.830 the annual American Geophysical Union meeting, 00:03:27.270 --> 00:03:29.650 the AGU, which was happening in New Orleans when 00:03:29.650 --> 00:03:32.710 the news broke. Oh, the timing was just devastating. 00:03:33.189 --> 00:03:37.530 The mood there was described as profoundly somber, 00:03:37.669 --> 00:03:39.830 almost like a funeral. I can imagine. That's 00:03:39.830 --> 00:03:41.469 the biggest gathering of Earth scientists in 00:03:41.469 --> 00:03:43.430 the world. It is. And this wasn't just, you know, 00:03:43.669 --> 00:03:45.990 professional concern. For many, it felt deeply 00:03:45.990 --> 00:03:48.849 personal. We heard from graduate students, early 00:03:48.849 --> 00:03:52.300 career researchers. They felt the sadness instantly. 00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:54.840 It's their future. It is. There was a graduate 00:03:54.840 --> 00:03:57.580 student, Mohammed Shizaybali, who put it perfectly. 00:03:58.039 --> 00:04:00.060 He said atmospheric science is fundamentally 00:04:00.060 --> 00:04:03.599 built on collaboration, and NCIR is the pathway 00:04:03.599 --> 00:04:05.280 through which we collaborate. It's the central 00:04:05.280 --> 00:04:07.639 hub. It's the hub, the meeting place, the shared 00:04:07.639 --> 00:04:10.219 library of tools that everyone depends on. And 00:04:10.219 --> 00:04:12.300 this announcement came after a really tough year 00:04:12.300 --> 00:04:14.419 for American science in general. Right. This 00:04:14.419 --> 00:04:17.220 wasn't an isolated event. There have been major 00:04:17.220 --> 00:04:19.819 federal funding cuts, scientists being fired 00:04:19.819 --> 00:04:22.959 or pushed into early retirement. Thousands of 00:04:22.959 --> 00:04:25.319 them. So this felt like the culmination of a 00:04:25.319 --> 00:04:28.240 long term erosion of the systems that let science 00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:30.160 function in this country. And you could actually 00:04:30.160 --> 00:04:32.579 see the statistical proof of that instability 00:04:32.579 --> 00:04:34.300 right there at the conference, couldn't you? 00:04:34.519 --> 00:04:37.019 You could. Attendance at AGU was down by a third. 00:04:37.160 --> 00:04:40.759 A full third. Wow. From about 30 ,000 attendees 00:04:40.759 --> 00:04:45.360 normally down to 20 ,000. And you saw fewer recruiters 00:04:45.360 --> 00:04:47.959 from universities, from federal agencies. That's 00:04:47.959 --> 00:04:50.699 a huge drop. It reflects this profound uncertainty 00:04:50.699 --> 00:04:53.319 that's plaguing the entire field. I mean, if 00:04:53.319 --> 00:04:54.980 you're a graduate student, why would you commit 00:04:54.980 --> 00:04:56.800 the next five or six years of your life to a 00:04:56.800 --> 00:04:58.500 field where the primary research institution 00:04:58.500 --> 00:05:01.680 might just disappear? It's a huge gamble. Now, 00:05:01.680 --> 00:05:05.019 let's shift focus to Boulder, Colorado, the home 00:05:05.019 --> 00:05:09.029 of NCAR. Because the local reaction was it was 00:05:09.029 --> 00:05:12.550 furious And it was grounded in very practical, 00:05:12.610 --> 00:05:16.069 everyday realities. Hundreds of protesters gathered, 00:05:16.329 --> 00:05:19.149 not just for NCAR, but near the Federal Facilities 00:05:19.149 --> 00:05:22.250 for the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, 00:05:22.709 --> 00:05:25.470 or NOAA, which is another agency facing huge 00:05:25.470 --> 00:05:27.970 cuts. And this wasn't just a small group of scientists, 00:05:27.970 --> 00:05:30.490 right? No, not at all. This was organized by 00:05:30.490 --> 00:05:32.910 community groups like Forever Indivisible Boulder. 00:05:33.350 --> 00:05:35.629 You had elected officials there. Representative 00:05:35.629 --> 00:05:39.120 Joe Naguse, Senator John Hickenlooper. The community 00:05:39.120 --> 00:05:42.060 sees NCAR as more than just a lab on a hill. 00:05:42.540 --> 00:05:45.399 Absolutely. They stress that NCAR has made a 00:05:45.399 --> 00:05:48.959 huge impact on humanity since 1960. And on a 00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:51.420 more local level, it provides hundreds of really 00:05:51.420 --> 00:05:53.620 important, well -paying jobs for the Boulder 00:05:53.620 --> 00:05:56.079 economy. It's a cornerstone of the community. 00:05:56.279 --> 00:05:57.899 And this is where the story takes a turn that 00:05:57.899 --> 00:06:00.980 is just powerfully ironic. You couldn't write 00:06:00.980 --> 00:06:02.899 it. The protests happened just after Boulder 00:06:02.899 --> 00:06:05.319 County got absolutely hammered by a severe wind 00:06:05.319 --> 00:06:08.019 event. We're talking winds over 100 miles per 00:06:08.019 --> 00:06:11.220 hour. Extreme winds. So extreme that the utility 00:06:11.220 --> 00:06:13.939 company, Xcel Energy, had to preemptively cut 00:06:13.939 --> 00:06:16.660 power to tens of thousands of customers because 00:06:16.660 --> 00:06:19.399 the fire danger was off the charts. So people 00:06:19.399 --> 00:06:22.220 are in their homes. The power is out. These incredible 00:06:22.220 --> 00:06:24.199 winds are howling. And what are they doing? They're 00:06:24.199 --> 00:06:26.180 on their phones, checking the internet for the 00:06:26.180 --> 00:06:30.199 latest NCAR wind speed readings. No way. Yes. 00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:34.379 They were relying on data from the very institution 00:06:34.379 --> 00:06:37.360 being threatened. in the middle of a crisis to 00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:40.319 know how dangerous it was outside. That perfectly 00:06:40.319 --> 00:06:42.360 illustrates the disconnect doesn't it? It's the 00:06:42.360 --> 00:06:44.980 ultimate example. One of the protesters pointed 00:06:44.980 --> 00:06:48.120 it out saying that this crucial local life -saving 00:06:48.120 --> 00:06:52.379 data source would just go away if NCAR is disestablished. 00:06:52.500 --> 00:06:54.399 So on one hand you have this political argument 00:06:54.399 --> 00:06:57.519 about alarmism and on the other you have people 00:06:57.519 --> 00:07:00.680 literally using NCAR's data to protect their 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:03.480 homes and their families in real time. It's a 00:07:03.480 --> 00:07:06.060 stark contrast. It really brings the stakes of 00:07:06.060 --> 00:07:09.160 this whole debate down to a very real, very personal 00:07:09.160 --> 00:07:10.959 level. To really understand what's at stake, 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:14.100 we need to dig into what NCAR actually is. Because 00:07:14.100 --> 00:07:15.800 it's not just another government lab, is it? 00:07:16.100 --> 00:07:18.639 It has a really unique structure. It's completely 00:07:18.639 --> 00:07:20.680 unique and it was set up that way for a very 00:07:20.680 --> 00:07:24.339 specific reason back in 1916. The idea was to 00:07:24.339 --> 00:07:27.160 create a centralized resource to tackle atmospheric 00:07:27.160 --> 00:07:29.920 problems that were just too big, too complex 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:32.620 for any single university to handle on its own. 00:07:33.259 --> 00:07:34.740 So how does that work? Who actually runs it? 00:07:34.939 --> 00:07:37.660 It's operated by a non -profit consortium called 00:07:37.660 --> 00:07:40.379 the University Corporation for Atmospheric Research 00:07:40.379 --> 00:07:44.660 or UTR. Okay. Think of UTR as a kind of... a 00:07:44.660 --> 00:07:47.800 managing partner, it's made up of 129 North American 00:07:47.800 --> 00:07:50.360 universities. So it's the academic community 00:07:50.360 --> 00:07:53.339 itself that stewards NCAR, ensuring its resources 00:07:53.339 --> 00:07:55.480 are available to researchers and students all 00:07:55.480 --> 00:07:57.459 across the continent. And the funding comes primarily 00:07:57.459 --> 00:07:59.279 from the federal government. Its core funding 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:03.089 does, yes. About half its budget, roughly $123 00:08:03.089 --> 00:08:06.230 million for fiscal year 2025, comes from the 00:08:06.230 --> 00:08:08.509 National Science Foundation, the NSF. But it 00:08:08.509 --> 00:08:10.889 gets other grants, too, right? It does. It pulls 00:08:10.889 --> 00:08:13.209 in grants for specific projects from places like 00:08:13.209 --> 00:08:15.750 NASA, even the Pentagon, for mission -critical 00:08:15.750 --> 00:08:18.430 work. So it has a diverse portfolio, but that 00:08:18.430 --> 00:08:21.569 NSF money is its lifeblood. And it's a huge operation. 00:08:22.029 --> 00:08:25.230 830 staff, most of them in Boulder. It is. And 00:08:25.230 --> 00:08:27.329 you can't talk about NCAR without mentioning 00:08:27.329 --> 00:08:30.600 the building itself. The Mesa Laboratory. It's 00:08:30.600 --> 00:08:33.259 an architectural icon. It really is. Designed 00:08:33.259 --> 00:08:36.559 by the world -renowned architect, IMP. The same 00:08:36.559 --> 00:08:38.840 architect who did the Louvre pyramid? The very 00:08:38.840 --> 00:08:42.580 same. And he designed the lab to echo the flat 00:08:42.580 --> 00:08:45.519 irons, those beautiful sloped rock formations 00:08:45.519 --> 00:08:48.139 right behind it. It's made of this pink -hued 00:08:48.139 --> 00:08:50.279 concrete that blends right into the landscape. 00:08:50.480 --> 00:08:52.299 It's a statement piece. What kind of statement? 00:08:52.500 --> 00:08:55.019 That fundamental science is important, that it 00:08:55.019 --> 00:08:57.620 deserves a home that is as foundational and as 00:08:57.620 --> 00:08:59.799 beautiful as the work being done inside it. It's 00:08:59.799 --> 00:09:02.639 a landmark. And that physical presence... really 00:09:02.639 --> 00:09:05.120 underscores its role, which scientists describe 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:07.960 as the global mothership. That's a term you hear 00:09:07.960 --> 00:09:11.419 a lot. Global mothership. An international treasure. 00:09:11.919 --> 00:09:14.480 Because that centralization is the key to its 00:09:14.480 --> 00:09:17.200 success. The whole idea was to have a coordinated 00:09:17.200 --> 00:09:19.500 interdisciplinary approach that you just couldn't 00:09:19.500 --> 00:09:21.580 get in a single university department. That's 00:09:21.580 --> 00:09:24.340 about pooling resources. Exactly. It's so much 00:09:24.340 --> 00:09:27.320 more efficient. If you have one massive world 00:09:27.320 --> 00:09:31.379 -class tool that 129 universities can share, 00:09:31.919 --> 00:09:34.139 the science that comes out of it is exponentially 00:09:34.139 --> 00:09:37.740 better than if you had 129 separate, smaller, 00:09:37.860 --> 00:09:40.559 less powerful tools. Okay, so let's get specific. 00:09:40.960 --> 00:09:43.600 What are the key resources NCAR provides that 00:09:43.600 --> 00:09:46.960 a university, even a huge one, just can't replicate? 00:09:47.299 --> 00:09:49.840 Let's start with the big one. Supercomputing. 00:09:50.139 --> 00:09:52.419 Right. So NCAR operates one of the world's most 00:09:52.419 --> 00:09:55.100 powerful supercomputing centers, and it's specifically 00:09:55.100 --> 00:09:57.500 designed for Earth system modeling. We're talking 00:09:57.500 --> 00:09:59.620 about running models that simulate the entire 00:09:59.620 --> 00:10:02.159 planet's atmosphere. The entire planet. Or, you 00:10:02.159 --> 00:10:04.639 know, incredibly high resolution models of a 00:10:04.639 --> 00:10:07.600 single hurricane or tracking air pollution from 00:10:07.600 --> 00:10:10.019 wildfires as it moves across continents. These 00:10:10.019 --> 00:10:12.980 are calculations that are just... mind -bogglingly 00:10:12.980 --> 00:10:15.059 complex. And why can't a university just, you 00:10:15.059 --> 00:10:17.399 know, buy its own supercomputer? It's the scale. 00:10:17.519 --> 00:10:19.220 I mean, a university might have a computer cluster 00:10:19.220 --> 00:10:22.179 for a department, but the systems at NCAR are 00:10:22.179 --> 00:10:25.039 on another planet. The hardware costs tens, even 00:10:25.039 --> 00:10:26.919 hundreds of millions of dollars. And that's just 00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:29.860 to buy it. That's just to buy it. Then you have 00:10:29.860 --> 00:10:32.299 the building to house it, the massive cooling 00:10:32.299 --> 00:10:34.419 systems to keep it from melting, and a whole 00:10:34.419 --> 00:10:36.480 team of specialized engineers and technicians 00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:39.740 to keep it running 2047. So when scientists say 00:10:39.740 --> 00:10:42.299 losing this would cause severe damage to the 00:10:42.299 --> 00:10:45.679 field, they mean that for thousands of researchers 00:10:45.679 --> 00:10:47.960 around the world, their work would just stop. 00:10:48.100 --> 00:10:51.039 Full stop. It wouldn't happen. It's the difference 00:10:51.039 --> 00:10:54.120 between having a family car and having access 00:10:54.120 --> 00:10:56.600 to a Formula One race track with a full pit crew. 00:10:56.840 --> 00:10:58.779 They're not comparable. That's a great analogy. 00:10:58.919 --> 00:11:00.779 So that's the first key resource. What's the 00:11:00.779 --> 00:11:03.500 second? The second is its collection of specialized 00:11:03.500 --> 00:11:06.059 observational resources. The crown jewels of 00:11:06.059 --> 00:11:08.659 this are the research aircraft. Like the C -130s. 00:11:09.059 --> 00:11:12.019 Exactly. These are heavily modified military 00:11:12.019 --> 00:11:14.679 transport planes that are basically flying laboratories. 00:11:14.879 --> 00:11:17.559 They are packed floor to ceiling with custom 00:11:17.559 --> 00:11:20.200 radars, sensors, and all kinds of data collection 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.220 instruments. And any researcher from a member 00:11:22.220 --> 00:11:24.659 university can propose a project to use one of 00:11:24.659 --> 00:11:27.500 these planes. That's the beauty of it. A professor 00:11:27.500 --> 00:11:29.639 from Penn State or the University of Oklahoma 00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:31.899 can write a grant to fly into the heart of a 00:11:31.899 --> 00:11:34.580 hurricane or to study cloud formation over the 00:11:34.580 --> 00:11:37.720 Arctic. And NCAR provides the plane, the pilots, 00:11:38.279 --> 00:11:42.220 The Whole 9 Yards. A professor at Penn State, 00:11:42.419 --> 00:11:44.740 Ken Davis, said that trying to do that kind of 00:11:44.740 --> 00:11:47.019 airborne research on your own as university would 00:11:47.019 --> 00:11:49.440 be totally impossible. You'd have to buy a C 00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:52.799 -130 for starters. And maintain it and hire specialized 00:11:52.799 --> 00:11:55.419 pilots who can fly in extreme weather and engineers 00:11:55.419 --> 00:11:57.659 who can keep these incredibly complex instruments 00:11:57.659 --> 00:12:01.799 working. NCAR centralizes all that cost and logistical 00:12:01.799 --> 00:12:03.740 headache so the scientists can just focus on 00:12:03.740 --> 00:12:06.919 the science. So NCAR is essentially a massive 00:12:06.919 --> 00:12:09.559 force multiplier for the entire scientific community. 00:12:09.639 --> 00:12:11.500 That's the perfect way to describe it. Okay, 00:12:11.500 --> 00:12:13.279 so let's go back to that charge of alarmism. 00:12:13.399 --> 00:12:16.820 Yeah. How does the leadership at NCAR and UCI 00:12:16.679 --> 00:12:19.639 respond to the accusation that their work is 00:12:19.639 --> 00:12:23.120 political. The president of UCR, Antonio Busalacchi 00:12:23.120 --> 00:12:25.580 Jr., has been very clear and very direct about 00:12:25.580 --> 00:12:29.440 this. He says NCAR produces apolitical science, 00:12:29.840 --> 00:12:32.399 period. Their job is an advocacy. Their job is 00:12:32.399 --> 00:12:35.279 not advocacy. He says the scientists are very 00:12:35.279 --> 00:12:38.080 careful not to cross over that line. Their mandate 00:12:38.080 --> 00:12:40.899 is to collect the data, run the models, and report 00:12:40.899 --> 00:12:43.690 what the science says. That's it. It's up to 00:12:43.690 --> 00:12:45.529 others to decide what to do with that information. 00:12:45.830 --> 00:12:48.629 Exactly. It's the role of policymakers, of the 00:12:48.629 --> 00:12:50.929 public, to interpret the significance of the 00:12:50.929 --> 00:12:53.809 science. The scientists just provide the objective 00:12:53.809 --> 00:12:56.669 facts about how our planet works. And that idea 00:12:56.669 --> 00:12:59.570 seems to be baked into the institution's DNA, 00:12:59.750 --> 00:13:02.570 right down to its name. It really is. The founders, 00:13:02.629 --> 00:13:06.269 back in 1960, showed incredible foresight. They 00:13:06.269 --> 00:13:08.529 deliberately named it the National Center for 00:13:08.529 --> 00:13:10.889 Atmospheric Research, not just weather research. 00:13:10.970 --> 00:13:13.009 Why was that distinction so important? Because 00:13:13.009 --> 00:13:15.210 they knew from the very beginning that climate, 00:13:15.330 --> 00:13:17.450 the long -term study of the whole system, was 00:13:17.450 --> 00:13:19.250 going to be a crucial part of their mission. 00:13:19.750 --> 00:13:22.370 They defined their scope as extending from the 00:13:22.370 --> 00:13:25.169 ocean floor to the Sun's core. A full spectrum 00:13:25.169 --> 00:13:28.190 approach. A full spectrum, holistic understanding. 00:13:28.669 --> 00:13:30.789 They knew you couldn't get better at short -term 00:13:30.789 --> 00:13:33.850 weather forecasts without understanding the long 00:13:33.850 --> 00:13:36.570 -term dynamics of the entire planet. So attacking 00:13:36.570 --> 00:13:39.070 the institution now is really an attack on that 00:13:39.070 --> 00:13:42.419 foundational 60 -year -old mission. about the 00:13:42.419 --> 00:13:44.519 theoretical damage, the loss of infrastructure. 00:13:45.179 --> 00:13:47.159 But let's ground this in really practical outcomes. 00:13:47.580 --> 00:13:50.019 What has NCAR actually done for people's safety 00:13:50.019 --> 00:13:53.200 over the years? The list of tangible, life -saving 00:13:53.200 --> 00:13:55.899 contributions is just extraordinary. And these 00:13:55.899 --> 00:13:57.940 are technologies that are in use every single 00:13:57.940 --> 00:14:00.440 day all around the world. Let's start with aviation. 00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:04.059 This is a big one. A huge one. Back in the 1980s, 00:14:04.320 --> 00:14:06.960 NCAR's research was absolutely essential in developing 00:14:06.960 --> 00:14:10.279 the technology to detect and warn against a phenomenon 00:14:10.279 --> 00:14:13.159 called wind shear. And its extreme form, the 00:14:13.159 --> 00:14:16.000 microburst. Right. A microburst is this intense 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:18.720 localized column of sinking air, usually near 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:22.000 a thunderstorm. If a plane hits one during takeoff 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:24.740 or landing, it can cause a sudden catastrophic 00:14:24.740 --> 00:14:27.139 loss of lift. And this was the cause of several 00:14:27.139 --> 00:14:29.639 major fatal crashes in the 70s and 80s, wasn't 00:14:29.639 --> 00:14:32.460 it? It was a huge problem. So NCAR scientists 00:14:32.460 --> 00:14:35.200 pioneered the development of specialized Doppler 00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:37.580 radar systems, both on the ground at airports 00:14:37.580 --> 00:14:39.940 and on the planes themselves. And these systems 00:14:39.940 --> 00:14:42.940 can actually see the wind shear before the plane 00:14:42.940 --> 00:14:45.879 gets there. They can. They detect those subtle 00:14:45.879 --> 00:14:48.320 shifts in air movement that signal a microburst 00:14:48.320 --> 00:14:51.700 is forming. And NCAR didn't just build the hardware. 00:14:51.980 --> 00:14:54.279 They developed the algorithms and the warning 00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:56.399 protocols that get that information to air traffic 00:14:56.399 --> 00:14:59.240 controllers and pilots in real time. So what 00:14:59.240 --> 00:15:01.980 was the result of putting these systems in airports 00:15:01.980 --> 00:15:04.460 all over the world? The result is staggering. 00:15:05.000 --> 00:15:08.159 The UCR president, Antonio Busulaki, said that 00:15:08.159 --> 00:15:11.120 since these systems became mandatory in the 1990s, 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:13.820 there has been zero loss of life from these weather 00:15:13.820 --> 00:15:16.299 events. Wait, say that again, zero? Zero. An 00:15:16.299 --> 00:15:18.759 entire category of weather -related aviation 00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:21.440 disasters has been effectively eliminated because 00:15:21.440 --> 00:15:23.879 of this research. It has saved, in his words, 00:15:24.299 --> 00:15:27.259 countless lives worldwide. That alone feels like 00:15:27.259 --> 00:15:29.399 it justifies the entire existence of the center. 00:15:29.639 --> 00:15:32.200 Just that one achievement. It's a monumental 00:15:32.200 --> 00:15:34.039 contribution to public safety. And then you move 00:15:34.039 --> 00:15:36.139 on to other extreme weather, like hurricanes. 00:15:36.519 --> 00:15:39.220 What was NCAR's big breakthrough there? The drop 00:15:39.220 --> 00:15:41.820 zone. This is a brilliant piece of technology. 00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:44.580 It's a small tube -shaped instrument that they 00:15:44.580 --> 00:15:46.639 release for research aircraft, like the Hurricane 00:15:46.639 --> 00:15:49.440 Hunters, flying high above the storm. And it 00:15:49.440 --> 00:15:51.299 just falls through the hurricane. It parachutes 00:15:51.299 --> 00:15:53.980 down right through the eye wall in the most intense 00:15:53.980 --> 00:15:57.500 parts of the storm. And as it falls, it's constantly 00:15:57.500 --> 00:16:00.169 measuring and transmitting data, temperature, 00:16:00.450 --> 00:16:03.289 pressure, humidity, wind speed, wind direction. 00:16:03.549 --> 00:16:05.850 So you're getting a real -time vertical slice 00:16:05.850 --> 00:16:07.950 of the inside of the storm. Exactly. Something 00:16:07.950 --> 00:16:10.500 you can't get from a satellite. This technology, 00:16:10.500 --> 00:16:12.940 and I quote, revolutionized the understanding 00:16:12.940 --> 00:16:16.179 of tropical cyclone structure. And better understanding 00:16:16.179 --> 00:16:18.899 leads to better forecasts. Much better forecasts. 00:16:19.240 --> 00:16:21.559 That data feeds directly into the prediction 00:16:21.559 --> 00:16:24.759 models and significantly improves the track and 00:16:24.759 --> 00:16:27.960 especially the intensity forecasts. The impact 00:16:27.960 --> 00:16:30.379 is so fundamental that this technology has been 00:16:30.379 --> 00:16:33.500 cited in over 400 scientific papers in the last 00:16:33.500 --> 00:16:36.960 25 years. So we have life -saving hardware for 00:16:36.960 --> 00:16:40.090 aviation and hurricanes. What about the software, 00:16:40.470 --> 00:16:43.710 the models that power our daily forecasts? NCAR 00:16:43.710 --> 00:16:46.190 is the backbone for that too. They developed 00:16:46.190 --> 00:16:48.269 and they continue to maintain the weather research 00:16:48.269 --> 00:16:50.929 and forecasting model, which is known as WRF. 00:16:51.860 --> 00:16:55.419 WRF model. Right. WRF is basically the foundational 00:16:55.419 --> 00:16:58.100 software used by forecasters all over the world. 00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:01.220 Your local TV meteorologist, national weather 00:17:01.220 --> 00:17:04.339 agencies, private companies, a huge number of 00:17:04.339 --> 00:17:07.000 them are using WRF to predict everything from 00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:10.079 thunderstorms to major winter storms. So if NCAR 00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:13.200 goes away... Who maintains that code? Who keeps 00:17:13.200 --> 00:17:15.859 it updated? That is the multi -million dollar 00:17:15.859 --> 00:17:18.420 question. It's an incredibly complex piece of 00:17:18.420 --> 00:17:21.799 software used by thousands of people. Its stability 00:17:21.799 --> 00:17:24.339 and continued improvement would be immediately 00:17:24.339 --> 00:17:26.039 at risk. And then there's the climate modeling 00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:28.079 site. Which brings us to the Community Earth 00:17:28.079 --> 00:17:31.460 System Model, or CESM. This is NCAR's masterpiece. 00:17:31.660 --> 00:17:34.180 It makes it so special. It was the first fully 00:17:34.180 --> 00:17:36.480 coupled global climate model that was designed 00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:38.740 from the ground up to be open and accessible 00:17:38.740 --> 00:17:41.269 for the entire university research. community. 00:17:41.569 --> 00:17:43.950 It's the gold standard. Can you give us a real 00:17:43.950 --> 00:17:46.410 world example of how it's used to, you know, 00:17:46.609 --> 00:17:48.910 protect people? A perfect example is the research 00:17:48.910 --> 00:17:52.069 that came after the February 2021 cold snap in 00:17:52.069 --> 00:17:54.049 Texas. The one that crippled the power grid. 00:17:54.369 --> 00:17:57.789 Exactly. Hundreds of fatalities, billions in 00:17:57.789 --> 00:18:01.410 damage. Researchers use CESM to run these incredibly 00:18:01.410 --> 00:18:03.950 complex experiments to understand what large 00:18:03.950 --> 00:18:06.289 scale atmospheric patterns lead to those kinds 00:18:06.289 --> 00:18:08.809 of extreme cold outbreaks. So they're trying 00:18:08.809 --> 00:18:10.789 to find long range signals to better predict 00:18:10.789 --> 00:18:13.329 them in the future. Right. And that kind of research, 00:18:13.390 --> 00:18:15.849 which is vital for protecting our national energy 00:18:15.849 --> 00:18:18.490 grid, is just flat out impossible for a single 00:18:18.490 --> 00:18:21.289 university to do. You need the supercomputing 00:18:21.289 --> 00:18:23.609 power and the sophisticated model framework that 00:18:23.609 --> 00:18:26.730 NCAR provides through CESM. So the same institution 00:18:26.730 --> 00:18:29.849 is helping with aviation safety, hurricane forecasts, 00:18:30.009 --> 00:18:32.849 and national grid security. And wildfire behavior, 00:18:33.109 --> 00:18:34.990 and air pollution modeling, and even providing 00:18:34.990 --> 00:18:37.630 real -time operational forecasts for the military 00:18:37.630 --> 00:18:40.630 at critical sites in Alaska. It's not just abstract 00:18:40.630 --> 00:18:43.910 research, it's deeply integrated into our national 00:18:43.910 --> 00:18:46.359 safety and security. And it's so important understand 00:18:46.359 --> 00:18:49.099 that this threat to NCAR isn't happening in a 00:18:49.099 --> 00:18:51.480 vacuum. It's part of a much bigger picture, isn't 00:18:51.480 --> 00:18:54.609 it? It is. Leaders in the scientific community 00:18:54.609 --> 00:18:57.470 are calling this a fundamental disruption of 00:18:57.470 --> 00:18:59.470 the systems that allow science in this country 00:18:59.470 --> 00:19:02.470 to function. It's systemic. So we're seeing a 00:19:02.470 --> 00:19:05.069 broader erosion of the entire scientific enterprise. 00:19:05.289 --> 00:19:07.349 That's right. It's not just the NCAR announcement. 00:19:07.529 --> 00:19:09.890 The administration has been accused of removing 00:19:09.890 --> 00:19:12.410 critical climate data from government websites, 00:19:13.089 --> 00:19:15.430 of freezing or canceling grants that were already 00:19:15.430 --> 00:19:18.829 approved, of weakening environmental regulations 00:19:18.829 --> 00:19:21.650 that were based on science. It creates this atmosphere 00:19:21.650 --> 00:19:24.769 of instability. It does. And if you lose a place 00:19:24.769 --> 00:19:27.450 like NCAR, the risk isn't just that your forecast 00:19:27.450 --> 00:19:29.990 is a little less accurate tomorrow. The real 00:19:29.990 --> 00:19:32.950 danger is a slow, steady decline in our ability 00:19:32.950 --> 00:19:35.150 to ever get better. We stop making progress. 00:19:35.309 --> 00:19:37.329 We stop making progress. And as experts have 00:19:37.329 --> 00:19:39.990 warned, being more in the dark about what is 00:19:39.990 --> 00:19:42.109 coming puts lives and property at risk. It's 00:19:42.109 --> 00:19:44.930 a slow motion crisis. And to see how deep it 00:19:44.930 --> 00:19:46.750 runs, you just have to look at what's happening 00:19:46.750 --> 00:19:48.710 in our oceans. You're talking about the Ocean 00:19:48.710 --> 00:19:52.369 Observatories Initiative, the OOI? I am. another 00:19:52.369 --> 00:19:55.609 massive critical piece of scientific infrastructure 00:19:55.609 --> 00:19:58.509 that's now on the ropes. What is it, exactly? 00:19:58.650 --> 00:20:02.750 It's a huge network of buoys, moorings, and thousands 00:20:02.750 --> 00:20:05.609 of instruments at four key locations in the oceans 00:20:05.609 --> 00:20:08.150 around the U .S. And it cost a fortune to build. 00:20:08.390 --> 00:20:13.390 It did. The NSF spent $386 million to build it 00:20:13.390 --> 00:20:16.329 starting in 2009. The whole point was to have 00:20:16.329 --> 00:20:19.910 this continuous 25 -year -long stream of data 00:20:19.910 --> 00:20:21.950 on the health of our oceans. Like taking the 00:20:21.950 --> 00:20:25.509 ocean's vital signs. Perfect analogy. It's monitoring 00:20:25.509 --> 00:20:28.289 long -term shifts in ocean circulation that drive 00:20:28.289 --> 00:20:31.109 our climate, but also short -term events like 00:20:31.109 --> 00:20:33.730 marine heat waves that can devastate commercial 00:20:33.730 --> 00:20:36.170 fishing. And there's a geological aspect too, 00:20:36.250 --> 00:20:39.109 isn't there? A huge one. One of the observatories 00:20:39.109 --> 00:20:41.250 is off the coast of Oregon, and it's basically 00:20:41.250 --> 00:20:43.609 sitting on top of an underwater volcano that's 00:20:43.609 --> 00:20:46.309 overdue for a major eruption. It's also monitoring 00:20:46.309 --> 00:20:49.609 the Cascadia subduction zone. This is essential, 00:20:49.990 --> 00:20:52.789 life -saving geological research. So this massive 00:20:52.990 --> 00:20:55.529 Nearly half billion dollar system is in place, 00:20:55.529 --> 00:20:57.910 but it needs to be maintained. And that's the 00:20:57.910 --> 00:20:59.890 crisis. It needs about 40 million dollars a year 00:20:59.890 --> 00:21:02.750 to maintain its 900 instruments and the administration 00:21:02.750 --> 00:21:04.529 has slashed that funding. What's happening to 00:21:04.529 --> 00:21:06.549 the instruments now? The project leaders are 00:21:06.549 --> 00:21:09.109 saying things are starting to break. They've 00:21:09.109 --> 00:21:11.390 had to reduce how often some instruments take 00:21:11.390 --> 00:21:14.589 samples just to save money. And they estimate 00:21:14.589 --> 00:21:17.309 they only have about 12 more months of operation 00:21:17.309 --> 00:21:19.809 before the whole thing goes dark. To spend all 00:21:19.809 --> 00:21:21.930 that money to build it and then just let it fall 00:21:21.930 --> 00:21:25.700 apart. It's just staggering. It really is. And 00:21:25.700 --> 00:21:27.880 the same thing is happening at NOAA, the National 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:30.579 Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. What 00:21:30.579 --> 00:21:33.400 are the cuts looking like there? The White House 00:21:33.400 --> 00:21:37.000 has proposed cutting NOAA's budget by 27 percent. 00:21:37.380 --> 00:21:40.200 And even more alarmingly, they want to completely 00:21:40.200 --> 00:21:42.480 eliminate the Office of Oceanic and Atmospheric 00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:46.069 Research, or OAR. Which is what? OAR is the research 00:21:46.069 --> 00:21:48.170 heart of NOAA. It's the part of the agency that 00:21:48.170 --> 00:21:50.529 develops new forecast models and new technologies. 00:21:50.910 --> 00:21:53.410 It's the engine of progress. And we're already 00:21:53.410 --> 00:21:55.849 seeing layoffs at NOAA offices, including in 00:21:55.849 --> 00:21:57.849 Boulder. And all of these cuts, they don't just 00:21:57.849 --> 00:22:00.349 affect the federal agencies. They send shockwaves 00:22:00.349 --> 00:22:02.960 through academia. This is maybe the most damaging 00:22:02.960 --> 00:22:05.339 long -term effect. Universities depend on those 00:22:05.339 --> 00:22:07.839 federal grants to run their labs and, critically, 00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:10.779 to pay their graduate students. The next generation 00:22:10.779 --> 00:22:13.500 of scientists. Exactly. And when that funding 00:22:13.500 --> 00:22:16.500 becomes uncertain, the pipeline starts to break 00:22:16.500 --> 00:22:19.619 down. We saw a really stark example at the University 00:22:19.619 --> 00:22:21.980 of Rhode Island's Graduate School of Oceanography. 00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:24.500 What happened there? They had to cut their incoming 00:22:24.500 --> 00:22:27.079 class of graduate students by more than half. 00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:30.990 From 22 students down to 10? And the school said 00:22:30.990 --> 00:22:33.450 it was a direct result of the uncertainty around 00:22:33.450 --> 00:22:36.470 federal funding for ocean science. That's devastating 00:22:36.470 --> 00:22:38.630 for the future of the field. It is. And we're 00:22:38.630 --> 00:22:41.029 even seeing a shift in the kind of research that 00:22:41.029 --> 00:22:43.890 gets proposed. How so? Some universities are 00:22:43.890 --> 00:22:46.289 moving away from research on how to slow climate 00:22:46.289 --> 00:22:48.950 change, what's called mitigation, and focusing 00:22:48.950 --> 00:22:51.369 instead on how to limit its effects, which is 00:22:51.369 --> 00:22:54.049 called adaptation. Why the shift? The research 00:22:54.049 --> 00:22:56.950 suggests it's a pragmatic political choice. There's 00:22:56.950 --> 00:22:59.890 a bipartisan appetite for disaster preparedness. 00:23:00.430 --> 00:23:02.849 So if you can't get funding to study how to stop 00:23:02.849 --> 00:23:05.029 the problem, maybe you can get funding to study 00:23:05.029 --> 00:23:07.549 how to survive it. But for the scientists who 00:23:07.549 --> 00:23:09.710 have spent their careers building these incredible 00:23:09.710 --> 00:23:12.519 long -term projects like the OOI, or NCAR's models, 00:23:13.059 --> 00:23:15.299 their focus is much more immediate, isn't it? 00:23:15.519 --> 00:23:18.500 It is. Their goal right now is simply, how can 00:23:18.500 --> 00:23:20.700 we save what we built? And that brings us to 00:23:20.700 --> 00:23:23.079 the political fight. We have to be clear here. 00:23:23.500 --> 00:23:25.720 We're impartially reporting on what officials 00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:28.299 in Colorado are alleging, but the timing of these 00:23:28.299 --> 00:23:31.589 cuts... suspicious. It is. Multiple officials 00:23:31.589 --> 00:23:33.910 and reports are suggesting a direct link between 00:23:33.910 --> 00:23:36.630 the attack on NCAR and other Colorado funding 00:23:36.630 --> 00:23:39.410 and a very public feud between the administration 00:23:39.410 --> 00:23:42.450 and Colorado's governor Jared Polis. And this 00:23:42.450 --> 00:23:45.089 feud centers on the case of a former county clerk. 00:23:45.390 --> 00:23:48.109 That's right. A woman named Tina Peters, a former 00:23:48.109 --> 00:23:50.230 Mesa County clerk who was convicted in state 00:23:50.230 --> 00:23:52.430 court on felony charges related to illegally 00:23:52.430 --> 00:23:55.690 accessing voting machines. She's serving a state 00:23:55.690 --> 00:23:58.769 prison sentence. President Trump issued a symbolic 00:23:58.769 --> 00:24:01.069 pardon for her, but because it's a state crime, 00:24:01.309 --> 00:24:03.569 not a federal one, Colorado officials have refused 00:24:03.569 --> 00:24:05.849 to release her. And the allegation is that cutting 00:24:05.849 --> 00:24:09.130 funding for NCAR is direct retaliation for that 00:24:09.130 --> 00:24:12.829 refusal. That is the direct allegation from multiple 00:24:12.829 --> 00:24:15.470 Colorado officials. They've called it blatantly 00:24:15.470 --> 00:24:19.329 retaliatory. And the timing is key. The NCAR 00:24:19.329 --> 00:24:21.390 announcement happened at the exact same time 00:24:21.390 --> 00:24:24.750 that $109 million in other federal grants for 00:24:24.750 --> 00:24:27.109 Colorado were also canceled. And these weren't 00:24:27.109 --> 00:24:29.170 climate -related grants. Not at all. This is 00:24:29.170 --> 00:24:31.730 what makes it look so targeted. The cuts included 00:24:31.730 --> 00:24:34.910 a $66 million grant for a critical rail safety 00:24:34.910 --> 00:24:37.980 project. another grant to help Fort Collins electrify 00:24:37.980 --> 00:24:40.579 its vehicle fleet, and money for Colorado State 00:24:40.579 --> 00:24:43.940 University Pueblo to study powering trains with 00:24:43.940 --> 00:24:46.660 hydrogen. These are infrastructure, safety, and 00:24:46.660 --> 00:24:49.259 economic development projects. Exactly. So Governor 00:24:49.259 --> 00:24:51.640 Polis came out very forcefully saying that public 00:24:51.640 --> 00:24:54.059 safety is at risk and science is being attacked, 00:24:54.380 --> 00:24:57.059 and he vowed a major fight. And that fight is 00:24:57.059 --> 00:24:59.420 already happening on Capitol Hill. What are Colorado 00:24:59.420 --> 00:25:01.880 senators doing? Senators Michael Bennett and 00:25:01.880 --> 00:25:04.799 John Hickenlooper are basically using legislative 00:25:04.799 --> 00:25:07.279 tactics to slow things down. They're holding 00:25:07.279 --> 00:25:09.619 up a major government spending bill trying to 00:25:09.619 --> 00:25:12.500 slow the process for as long as we can. And their 00:25:12.500 --> 00:25:15.339 goal is to protect NCAR's funding. Specifically, 00:25:15.660 --> 00:25:18.240 it's core funding from the National Science Foundation. 00:25:18.779 --> 00:25:21.200 Senator Hickenlooper has said he's confident 00:25:21.200 --> 00:25:23.900 he can get bipartisan support from Republicans 00:25:23.900 --> 00:25:27.599 to keep that funding in place because they recognize 00:25:27.599 --> 00:25:30.619 NCAR's national importance. And at the same time? 00:25:30.859 --> 00:25:33.460 House Democrats are exploring legal challenges. 00:25:33.619 --> 00:25:36.660 That's right. Led by Representative Neguse from 00:25:36.660 --> 00:25:39.619 Boulder, it's a full court press because the 00:25:39.619 --> 00:25:42.319 community understands what's at stake. As the 00:25:42.319 --> 00:25:44.660 experts have said, losing NCAR would be a major 00:25:44.660 --> 00:25:47.119 setback. and would have impact for decades to 00:25:47.119 --> 00:25:49.119 come. So let's just summarize that cost one more 00:25:49.119 --> 00:25:51.819 time. If this dismantling happens, what do we 00:25:51.819 --> 00:25:54.200 lose? You lose that incredible collaborative 00:25:54.200 --> 00:25:57.019 infrastructure that connects 129 universities. 00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:00.160 You lose access to the supercomputers that power 00:26:00.160 --> 00:26:02.900 thousands of research projects. You lose the 00:26:02.900 --> 00:26:04.940 specialized research aircraft that make cutting 00:26:04.940 --> 00:26:07.259 edge field science possible. And all of that 00:26:07.259 --> 00:26:10.319 translates into a slow but steady decay in our 00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:12.440 ability to improve forecasts. For everything, 00:26:12.740 --> 00:26:15.519 wildfires, severe weather, aviation safety, long 00:26:15.519 --> 00:26:18.140 -term risks, you're essentially taking a sledgehammer 00:26:18.140 --> 00:26:20.619 to the keystone holding up our scientific understanding 00:26:20.619 --> 00:26:23.079 of the planet. America loses its competitive 00:26:23.079 --> 00:26:25.859 edge and our ability to prepare for the future 00:26:25.859 --> 00:26:28.519 is fundamentally crippled. That's the bottom 00:26:28.519 --> 00:26:31.099 line. We've seen that in the face of these cuts, 00:26:31.599 --> 00:26:33.619 universities are shifting their research focus 00:26:33.619 --> 00:26:36.720 from researching how to slow climate change mitigation 00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:39.799 to studying how to limit its effects adaptation. 00:26:40.089 --> 00:26:43.309 If research on future risks is cut or compromised, 00:26:43.869 --> 00:26:46.710 how prepared can any community truly be for the 00:26:46.710 --> 00:26:49.089 extreme weather events that NCAR currently helps 00:26:49.089 --> 00:26:51.390 us predict? That's a question that should keep 00:26:51.390 --> 00:26:53.869 all of us thinking about the fundamental, life 00:26:53.869 --> 00:26:55.990 -saving value of our scientific infrastructure. 00:26:56.670 --> 00:26:58.869 You've been listening to Meteorology Matters 00:26:58.869 --> 00:27:01.829 created by meteorologist Rob Jones. We really 00:27:01.829 --> 00:27:04.009 want to know what you think about the NCAR situation. 00:27:04.450 --> 00:27:06.529 Don't say quiet, jump on our socials and let 00:27:06.529 --> 00:27:08.369 us know what you think. Like it, share it, drop 00:27:08.369 --> 00:27:10.509 a comment, or send us a message directly. You 00:27:10.509 --> 00:27:12.990 can follow meteorologist Rob Jones on Instagram, 00:27:13.289 --> 00:27:16.769 Meteorologist, on TikTok, TV Meteorologist, and 00:27:16.769 --> 00:27:18.990 on YouTube follow Rob Jones Hurricane, where 00:27:18.990 --> 00:27:21.269 you can also find the Meteorology Matters podcast 00:27:21.269 --> 00:27:24.109 playlist. Thanks for listening, and remember, 00:27:24.630 --> 00:27:25.990 the weather always matters.