1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,000 People! 2 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:05,600 Welcome to the Sunside Kingdom Show. 3 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:12,300 The place where we highlight successful individuals with roots and or associations to the sunny side of the Kingdom. 4 00:00:12,300 --> 00:00:15,700 As you can see, we're on the sunny side of the Kingdom today, baby. 5 00:00:15,700 --> 00:00:24,900 These accomplished individuals show us what it's like to combine hard work, perseverance and focus to achieve their goals. 6 00:00:24,900 --> 00:00:28,400 I'm your host, John Sandiford, aka JamSandiford. 7 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:30,400 Let's get into today's episode. 8 00:00:34,900 --> 00:00:36,200 People! 9 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:41,700 Welcome to the Sunside Kingdom Show. 10 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:45,200 So we have with us today. 11 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:49,300 Today, it's actually, it's a family affair today. 12 00:00:51,700 --> 00:00:52,700 That's what we're going to call it. 13 00:00:52,700 --> 00:00:54,700 We're going to call it a family affair. 14 00:00:54,700 --> 00:01:01,000 I mean, most of these podcasts are a family affair, but then this is like true family blood affair. 15 00:01:02,500 --> 00:01:03,400 What are you talking about? 16 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:05,300 This is the first time I'm meeting you. 17 00:01:05,300 --> 00:01:06,100 Oh snap. 18 00:01:06,100 --> 00:01:06,500 Okay. 19 00:01:06,500 --> 00:01:06,700 Okay. 20 00:01:06,700 --> 00:01:07,800 I guess that's what it is. 21 00:01:09,100 --> 00:01:22,200 So we have with us today, Miss Vincentia Rosen Sandiford, Director of Bureau of Intellectual Property on St. Martin, became Director sub 30. 22 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:23,000 Correct? 23 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:24,400 Yeah, before 30. 24 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:24,800 Yeah. 25 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:25,900 Officially at 29. 26 00:01:25,900 --> 00:01:37,200 Oh, so it's at sub 30 and has grown the organization to a nice successful branch here in the Dutch Caribbean. 27 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:42,500 Has been doing many innovative things with the organization. 28 00:01:42,500 --> 00:01:49,000 Has been leading by example rather than following in all cases. 29 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:56,000 So that's why and because it's a family affair, she's also my sister. 30 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:01,600 And that's why I came on the show because he has to compliment me today. 31 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:04,500 Snap. 32 00:02:04,500 --> 00:02:05,300 All right. 33 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:06,900 All right. 34 00:02:06,900 --> 00:02:14,200 So Vincentia, you know, that's going to be weird for me because we have our household nicknames, but we'll keep that off camera. 35 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:14,800 Off camera. 36 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:19,800 So Vincentia, introduce yourself to the people. 37 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:21,300 Who am I? 38 00:02:21,300 --> 00:02:26,600 Who is Vincentia Rosen Sandiford professionally? 39 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:28,000 Okay. 40 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:40,900 So professionally, I am the Director of the Bureau for Intellectual Property, St. Martin, but I actually prefer to say I hold the position of Director of the Bureau for Intellectual Property, St. Martin. 41 00:02:40,900 --> 00:02:51,400 Because I think when we're younger and even those before us, more seasoned professionals, they define themselves by what they do. 42 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:55,100 But what you do is not who you are. 43 00:02:55,100 --> 00:03:05,000 And because we're making this a family affair and we're talking about me personally, who I am is who God says I am. 44 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,200 We'll put in an applause right there. 45 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:16,800 Since you're my sister, I obviously know a lot more details than the average person. 46 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:24,400 But one of those details is I know it's been a dream of yours ever since you were a little girl to become a lawyer. 47 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:29,600 And that this is still part of your journey. 48 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:35,800 Obviously, with intellectual property, law is a very big aspect of it as well. 49 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:43,600 But there's other aspects to it that sort of are adjacent to law. 50 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:47,100 But let's go back to that dream of that little girl. 51 00:03:47,100 --> 00:03:48,200 Yeah. 52 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:50,700 Where did that come from? 53 00:03:50,700 --> 00:03:51,200 Okay. 54 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:55,000 So I'm the youngest of seven children. 55 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:57,100 You came before me. 56 00:03:57,100 --> 00:03:58,000 Just one year. 57 00:03:58,000 --> 00:03:58,700 Just one year. 58 00:03:58,700 --> 00:04:00,400 One year, nine days. 59 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:02,400 But who's counting? 60 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:06,200 I am. 61 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:10,000 And it started when I was eight years old. 62 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:15,800 So at eight years old, I was watching As the World Turns with my mom. 63 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,900 You know, the soap opera of the 90s. 64 00:04:17,900 --> 00:04:18,200 Yeah. 65 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:19,500 Big hit. 66 00:04:19,500 --> 00:04:27,500 And there was this black, strong, successful woman with luscious hair going to court, 67 00:04:27,500 --> 00:04:29,200 defending people. 68 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:34,400 And I thought, you know, that's who I want to be. 69 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:36,200 I want to make a difference in this world. 70 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,900 And if she can do it, then I can do it. 71 00:04:39,900 --> 00:04:41,600 So, you know, what they say, right? 72 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:42,900 Representation matters. 73 00:04:42,900 --> 00:04:44,400 Representation matters. 74 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:51,700 And this is exactly the reason why the idea of this podcast even came about is because 75 00:04:51,700 --> 00:04:57,900 we need more representation in the media, in the online space of showing, 76 00:04:57,900 --> 00:05:03,100 showcasing the talented individuals that we have hailing from the Dutch Caribbean. 77 00:05:03,100 --> 00:05:05,600 Yeah, that's awesome. 78 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:10,900 Funny enough, I know the story, but then I forgot that detail of it being the law 79 00:05:10,900 --> 00:05:12,000 as the world turns. 80 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:20,400 I mean, a part of the reason to and another reason to wanting to do law is being the youngest. 81 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:24,100 I wasn't the smartest or that's what I was told. 82 00:05:24,100 --> 00:05:26,100 I wasn't the fastest. 83 00:05:26,100 --> 00:05:27,300 That was obvious. 84 00:05:27,300 --> 00:05:32,300 I wasn't the strongest, but the one thing that I had was my voice. 85 00:05:32,300 --> 00:05:39,700 So law just seemed like the natural way to be able to use my voice in a positive way. 86 00:05:39,700 --> 00:05:40,300 Yeah. 87 00:05:40,300 --> 00:05:40,800 Okay. 88 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:44,700 So when you talk about things of not being the strongest, fastest, smartest, etc. 89 00:05:44,700 --> 00:05:55,500 Well, I know there was a bit of a turning point already early in your education that turned you into way more focused in Syria. 90 00:05:55,500 --> 00:05:57,600 So give the people a bit of that context. 91 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:05,500 So just imagine anyone that struggled in a similar way, maybe coming from a big household 92 00:06:05,500 --> 00:06:12,000 and there being a flavor of competitiveness within the household. 93 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:19,300 How do you what were the things that helped you overcome that and then grew further beyond that? 94 00:06:19,300 --> 00:06:26,500 Oh, that's an awesome question because I mean that takes me into you have to have people that believe in you. 95 00:06:26,500 --> 00:06:28,300 I think Oprah said it. 96 00:06:28,300 --> 00:06:29,900 Well, it's okay. 97 00:06:29,900 --> 00:06:34,800 If your family doesn't believe in you, you just need that one person to believe in you. 98 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:40,700 And the transition for me, although at eight years old, I made up my mind that I wanted to go into law. 99 00:06:40,700 --> 00:06:43,900 I still just wanted to play with my Barbies. 100 00:06:43,900 --> 00:06:45,300 Shout out to Barbie. 101 00:06:45,300 --> 00:06:46,300 The movie just came out. 102 00:06:46,300 --> 00:06:48,800 We're not paid to say this. 103 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,300 Hey, copyright infringement. 104 00:06:51,300 --> 00:06:53,700 It's not copyright infringement. 105 00:06:53,700 --> 00:06:54,300 I'm giving. 106 00:06:54,300 --> 00:06:56,900 I'm not educated on the copyright. 107 00:06:56,900 --> 00:06:57,300 All right. 108 00:06:57,300 --> 00:07:02,900 Giving an unpaid shout out because I'm a Barbie fan and my daughter and I are going to go see the movie. 109 00:07:02,900 --> 00:07:09,300 So repeat the question. 110 00:07:09,300 --> 00:07:15,500 Okay. So how did you what were the things to help you overcome? 111 00:07:15,500 --> 00:07:16,900 Yeah, I remember. 112 00:07:16,900 --> 00:07:23,300 So at eight years old, I made up my mind like this is what I want to do and I was like very resolute about it. 113 00:07:23,300 --> 00:07:29,300 But I also was struggling with I want to play with my Barbies and I want to play with my friends and I want to have fun. 114 00:07:29,300 --> 00:07:31,600 And they don't think I'm smart anyways. 115 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,900 So why should I try that hard? 116 00:07:34,900 --> 00:07:44,100 And at 10 years old, we moved back to St. Martin when I was 10 and I had a certain me's teacher called your from Myra. 117 00:07:44,100 --> 00:07:45,900 Okay, shout out to you from Myra. 118 00:07:45,900 --> 00:07:47,600 Yes, definitely. 119 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:53,100 Shout out to you from Myra because she changed my life because she believed in me. 120 00:07:53,100 --> 00:07:58,300 And if I didn't do my homework well, or if I didn't do well on the test, 121 00:07:58,300 --> 00:08:03,700 she held me accountable because she believed that I could do more. 122 00:08:03,700 --> 00:08:10,700 And back in the day, teachers could throw a chalk at you to make you pay attention. 123 00:08:10,700 --> 00:08:11,900 They don't do that anymore. 124 00:08:11,900 --> 00:08:12,500 Okay. All right. 125 00:08:12,500 --> 00:08:16,900 Before they go look for you from Myra 25 years later. 126 00:08:16,900 --> 00:08:18,900 It worked. 127 00:08:18,900 --> 00:08:20,500 Yeah. 128 00:08:20,500 --> 00:08:23,300 So definitely that was the turning point. 129 00:08:23,300 --> 00:08:26,100 All right. 130 00:08:26,100 --> 00:08:28,100 So then continue this journey now. 131 00:08:28,100 --> 00:08:31,900 So that was a turning point at 10 years old, but at 10, obviously, you're not a lawyer. 132 00:08:31,900 --> 00:08:33,100 No. 133 00:08:33,100 --> 00:08:35,500 So how did the journey continue? 134 00:08:35,500 --> 00:08:38,300 And then how did you remain focused? 135 00:08:38,300 --> 00:08:47,700 Because I mean, at eight years old, different kids say I want to be a fireman or astronaut or a policeman or a rock star or whatever. 136 00:08:47,700 --> 00:08:57,300 And not everyone holds on to that eight year old childish dream and continues with it until their adult grown life. 137 00:08:57,300 --> 00:08:58,900 So it's a long story. 138 00:08:58,900 --> 00:08:59,700 You ready for it? 139 00:08:59,700 --> 00:09:06,700 Well, let's go with the short version with some of the highlight moments. 140 00:09:06,700 --> 00:09:10,500 So you found Myra being a highlighted moment to make the switch. 141 00:09:10,500 --> 00:09:18,700 What felt like another highlight moment sort of during the teens to continue to motivate on that journey? 142 00:09:18,700 --> 00:09:22,700 I'm thinking. It's my thinking, you know. 143 00:09:22,700 --> 00:09:27,700 So then afterwards, I got into HAVO. 144 00:09:27,700 --> 00:09:28,100 Yeah. 145 00:09:28,100 --> 00:09:36,900 And at that point, it was in the first six months, like all the teachers were really impressed with me and they were like, keep it up. 146 00:09:36,900 --> 00:09:41,100 And you're going to go to VABO because back then you could go from HAVO to VABO 2. 147 00:09:41,100 --> 00:09:45,700 I think now it's like you go to VABO 3 or something like that. 148 00:09:45,700 --> 00:09:47,500 So they take longer. 149 00:09:47,500 --> 00:09:49,900 Yeah. 150 00:09:49,900 --> 00:10:00,700 And at that point, when things were going really well for me in school, mom was like, hey, I want to move to Dominica because I've always wanted to go back to Dominica. 151 00:10:00,700 --> 00:10:02,300 We got Dominican roots. 152 00:10:02,300 --> 00:10:02,900 Yep. 153 00:10:02,900 --> 00:10:04,100 Barbados roots. 154 00:10:04,100 --> 00:10:06,500 We're Caribbean people, you know. 155 00:10:06,500 --> 00:10:16,700 And at that point, I felt a disappointment because I felt, oh, my gosh, you know, what's going to happen to my dreams and what I want. 156 00:10:16,700 --> 00:10:22,300 This is not part of my journey because I already at 10 years old had the whole thing planned out. 157 00:10:22,300 --> 00:10:24,300 That's me. 158 00:10:24,300 --> 00:10:25,700 How I'm going to get there. 159 00:10:25,700 --> 00:10:28,100 So that was a very nice life lesson then. 160 00:10:28,100 --> 00:10:29,100 That was, yeah. 161 00:10:29,100 --> 00:10:32,500 You can plan all you want and God will laugh. 162 00:10:32,500 --> 00:10:36,100 Well, you know, that's funny because this morning I was thinking about that. 163 00:10:36,100 --> 00:10:38,700 I was thinking about the God will laugh thing. 164 00:10:38,700 --> 00:10:41,900 And instead, I'm like, no, God hasn't been laughing. 165 00:10:41,900 --> 00:10:45,300 He's been saying, I have better plans for you. 166 00:10:45,300 --> 00:10:46,900 And hold my hand. 167 00:10:46,900 --> 00:10:48,100 Okay, he's not laughing. 168 00:10:48,100 --> 00:10:48,900 He's grinning. 169 00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:51,700 You think you got plans? 170 00:10:51,700 --> 00:10:52,700 I got better plans. 171 00:10:52,700 --> 00:10:57,900 At 12 years old, I mean, at 8, 10, 12, I thought I had it figured out, right? 172 00:10:57,900 --> 00:11:02,300 And we went to Dominica and we were there for two and a half years. 173 00:11:02,300 --> 00:11:06,300 And at that time, I thought, oh, my God, this is the worst thing ever. 174 00:11:06,300 --> 00:11:14,700 And coming from the Netherlands to St. Martin was such a big culture shock because, I mean, we spent most of our childhood in the Netherlands. 175 00:11:14,700 --> 00:11:15,900 And then we came to St. Martin. 176 00:11:15,900 --> 00:11:16,900 It was a culture shock. 177 00:11:16,900 --> 00:11:18,900 But we were born here. 178 00:11:18,900 --> 00:11:20,300 So we from here. 179 00:11:20,300 --> 00:11:22,100 So it was still like, yeah, we come in home. 180 00:11:22,100 --> 00:11:22,500 Yeah. 181 00:11:22,500 --> 00:11:25,700 And then we went to Dominica's like, yeah, but what is this place? 182 00:11:25,700 --> 00:11:28,500 Rivers, food and this or that. 183 00:11:28,500 --> 00:11:43,900 But I mean, over there, we had then, but what I at least felt when we went to Dominica was because our mom's family is from there, then we sort of met and interacted with the most amount of family ever in our whole lives. 184 00:11:43,900 --> 00:11:45,100 Oh, yeah, definitely. 185 00:11:45,100 --> 00:11:52,300 But I think in the first like six months or a year, I didn't have the appreciation for it because it was making my plan. 186 00:11:52,300 --> 00:11:56,300 Like, you know, it was like at that time, I was like, this is messing with my plan. 187 00:11:56,300 --> 00:11:57,300 Okay, family. Great. 188 00:11:57,300 --> 00:11:58,300 Hi, love you guys. 189 00:11:58,300 --> 00:12:01,300 But my plan, it's not working. 190 00:12:01,300 --> 00:12:08,500 So but I think in the last month that we were in Dominica, I was really taking it in. 191 00:12:08,500 --> 00:12:14,500 I was going with my friends to rivers, driving around and Dominica is huge compared to St. 192 00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:18,300 Martin. So you take like a three hour drive to get to another spot. 193 00:12:18,300 --> 00:12:30,500 And at that time, I knew that that two and a half years would help shape the rest of my life because, you know, we had formally initially a Dutch education. 194 00:12:30,500 --> 00:12:30,900 Yeah. 195 00:12:30,900 --> 00:12:34,500 But then we got into the English system, which is very different. 196 00:12:34,500 --> 00:12:52,700 So having that kind of added to the chameleons that I would say that we are as Caribbean people and having that diverse background, it kind of opens up the door of being able to connect with a greater group of people. 197 00:12:52,700 --> 00:13:00,300 So at 15, our mom got breast cancer. 198 00:13:00,300 --> 00:13:04,500 And that was another huge turning point. Yeah. 199 00:13:04,500 --> 00:13:08,700 But then that made us move back to St. Martin. 200 00:13:08,700 --> 00:13:11,100 And then I wanted to get back into Havo. 201 00:13:11,100 --> 00:13:19,300 And at that time, they said to me, you can't because you've been going to English school for the last two and a half years. 202 00:13:19,300 --> 00:13:22,100 How are you going to fall back into the Dutch system? 203 00:13:22,100 --> 00:13:26,300 And then they said, okay, you know what? 204 00:13:26,300 --> 00:13:32,500 Write a letter in Dutch and we're going to have a meeting about you like all the teachers that were your teachers back then. 205 00:13:32,500 --> 00:13:34,500 And we're going to have a vote. 206 00:13:34,500 --> 00:13:38,700 And we need all your books from Dominica because we need to determine if it's at the same level. 207 00:13:38,700 --> 00:13:43,300 Yeah. And I got let back into Havo on a trial basis. 208 00:13:43,300 --> 00:13:56,900 So by the first midterm report, if I had more than two failing grades, then I would have to go to one of the English schools, Academy or St. Dominic. 209 00:13:56,900 --> 00:14:04,800 And at the end of Havo four, I was at the top of the three Havo fours. 210 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:14,100 And at the end of Havo five, I was at second best because, you know, challenges life. Mom had breast cancer. 211 00:14:14,100 --> 00:14:27,700 Yeah. Well, I think I think for the folks at home, you can already hear how the perseverance, the dedication was always there throughout all of these legs of the journey. 212 00:14:27,700 --> 00:14:35,900 And it's always interesting because even though you grew up in the same household, your path and your focus on things can be very different. 213 00:14:35,900 --> 00:14:41,500 And yeah, so amazing. 214 00:14:41,500 --> 00:14:45,100 So now we're at 18 and 17. 215 00:14:45,100 --> 00:14:46,500 Oh, yes. Snap. Sorry. 216 00:14:46,500 --> 00:14:48,900 I was 18. So 17. 217 00:14:48,900 --> 00:14:59,700 And you graduate from Havo being in the top two of the class of 2003. 218 00:14:59,700 --> 00:15:04,700 And now we're moving on to the next chapter. 219 00:15:04,700 --> 00:15:10,700 So what were some of the highlight moments in that part of the chapter? 220 00:15:10,700 --> 00:15:11,700 You mean Fontys? 221 00:15:11,700 --> 00:15:13,500 Yeah. 222 00:15:13,500 --> 00:15:25,500 So I was still living with the disappointment of not going to VABO and not being able to go directly to university. 223 00:15:25,500 --> 00:15:33,800 However, I thought to myself, hey, we come from a single parent household. 224 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,500 Our mom is fighting for her life. 225 00:15:36,500 --> 00:15:42,500 I need to get an education as quickly as possible so I can take care of myself. 226 00:15:42,500 --> 00:15:46,500 And at that time, 17, 18, it was see you guys. 227 00:15:46,500 --> 00:15:48,500 You're on your own. 228 00:15:48,500 --> 00:15:55,700 So the smart thing to do was not to do another two years of high school for me personally. 229 00:15:55,700 --> 00:15:58,900 I mean, everybody's journey is different. 230 00:15:58,900 --> 00:16:01,900 But for me personally, it was survival mode. 231 00:16:01,900 --> 00:16:08,100 So get a degree, get a job, and then figure out how to get that law degree. 232 00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:13,700 And that took me into the study management, economics and law. 233 00:16:13,700 --> 00:16:17,300 Because again, I'm thinking, overthinking. 234 00:16:17,300 --> 00:16:20,900 Nobody had yet graduated from the degree. 235 00:16:20,900 --> 00:16:27,500 So I was like, what kind of job I'm going to get? 236 00:16:27,500 --> 00:16:32,100 Nobody had graduated from Jabi Allah in 2003. 237 00:16:32,100 --> 00:16:33,900 That was a brand new study. 238 00:16:33,900 --> 00:16:36,300 It was like two, three years. 239 00:16:36,300 --> 00:16:43,900 Nobody had yet graduated from what I understood at the time from that study. 240 00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:47,100 So I was like, oh, that was similar to the study I did then. 241 00:16:47,100 --> 00:16:48,100 Exactly. 242 00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:48,600 Yeah. 243 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:55,700 So then it was like, I don't want to be a poof, which is like, I don't want to be a guinea pig. 244 00:16:55,700 --> 00:16:56,900 I was going to say lab rat. 245 00:16:56,900 --> 00:16:58,700 Okay. 246 00:16:58,700 --> 00:16:58,900 All right. 247 00:16:58,900 --> 00:16:59,500 Let's keep it neat. 248 00:16:59,500 --> 00:17:00,100 Guinea pig. 249 00:17:00,100 --> 00:17:10,500 So I did the study management, economics and law, which is a bachelor's in business administration 250 00:17:10,500 --> 00:17:13,500 when you translate it for the English speaking territories. 251 00:17:13,500 --> 00:17:19,300 However, that was God setting me up for my talents. 252 00:17:19,300 --> 00:17:21,900 My many talents. 253 00:17:21,900 --> 00:17:22,900 God's plan. 254 00:17:22,900 --> 00:17:23,700 Not my plan. 255 00:17:23,700 --> 00:17:24,500 Cue the beat. 256 00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:30,300 Okay, so that's at the beginning of the journey. 257 00:17:30,300 --> 00:17:37,300 Were there any specific things during your studies that sort of stood out to you as those 258 00:17:37,300 --> 00:17:42,700 other significant moments to help shape you on to where you are today? 259 00:17:42,700 --> 00:17:45,300 Oh, that's a good question. 260 00:17:45,300 --> 00:17:54,700 I quickly realized that not just that I wanted to be a leader, but that I was a leader. 261 00:17:54,700 --> 00:17:56,300 During the study? 262 00:17:56,300 --> 00:17:56,700 Yeah. 263 00:17:56,700 --> 00:17:57,100 Okay. 264 00:17:57,100 --> 00:17:57,900 Definitely. 265 00:17:57,900 --> 00:18:03,900 Because you know at Fonthies and I mean, it's in Dutch education. 266 00:18:03,900 --> 00:18:06,500 Typically, you have to be in project groups. 267 00:18:06,500 --> 00:18:11,700 So the one semester is you're doing subjects, you're doing exams. 268 00:18:11,700 --> 00:18:13,300 That's in Javeo generally. 269 00:18:13,300 --> 00:18:16,500 And then the other semester is project, projects, projects. 270 00:18:16,500 --> 00:18:17,100 Yeah. 271 00:18:17,100 --> 00:18:23,300 And generally, I wouldn't necessarily put myself at the front to be the leader, you know, 272 00:18:23,300 --> 00:18:28,100 growing up being the youngest. 273 00:18:28,100 --> 00:18:32,500 However, it was just like a natural evolution. 274 00:18:32,500 --> 00:18:38,100 It was kind of inevitable because who would be the one who would take the reins? 275 00:18:38,100 --> 00:18:39,500 And it's funny enough. 276 00:18:39,500 --> 00:18:43,500 I had a teacher tell me back then name shall not be called. 277 00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:46,300 Okay. 278 00:18:46,300 --> 00:18:49,700 That you're never going to be a leader. 279 00:18:49,700 --> 00:18:50,500 That was in Javeo. 280 00:18:50,500 --> 00:18:56,300 I think in my third year, she was like, you're too strict. 281 00:18:56,300 --> 00:18:59,500 You're not giving other people a chance. 282 00:18:59,500 --> 00:19:06,100 And she honestly didn't know the whole story because we were working together with, 283 00:19:06,100 --> 00:19:09,300 okay, a little bit of the backstory. 284 00:19:09,300 --> 00:19:15,900 We had a project where we were working together with, I think it was a middle school in Appledorn. 285 00:19:15,900 --> 00:19:16,300 Okay. 286 00:19:16,300 --> 00:19:19,700 So we had to travel pretty far from Aintoba to Appledorn. 287 00:19:19,700 --> 00:19:24,300 And what we were doing with that school, that would be like, what, a two hour? 288 00:19:24,300 --> 00:19:26,300 Two and a half to three hours. 289 00:19:26,300 --> 00:19:26,500 Oh, yeah. 290 00:19:26,500 --> 00:19:28,900 Because by train then with the public transportation. 291 00:19:28,900 --> 00:19:29,300 Yeah. 292 00:19:29,300 --> 00:19:30,700 About almost three hours. 293 00:19:30,700 --> 00:19:31,700 Ove life. 294 00:19:31,700 --> 00:19:32,300 Yeah. 295 00:19:32,300 --> 00:19:33,700 So three hours one way. 296 00:19:33,700 --> 00:19:38,700 So, you know, so that's a whole commitment to do a project there with a school. 297 00:19:38,700 --> 00:19:45,100 And the teachers at the school, the principal of the school commended me, told me that like, 298 00:19:45,100 --> 00:19:46,300 you're really good at this. 299 00:19:46,300 --> 00:19:48,700 You're good with the kids. 300 00:19:48,700 --> 00:19:51,500 Have you ever thought about becoming a teacher? 301 00:19:51,500 --> 00:19:55,100 And that's the funny thing of one of the things that God says I am. 302 00:19:55,100 --> 00:20:00,900 I am a teacher, but not necessarily a teacher in a traditional sense of standing in front of the classroom. 303 00:20:00,900 --> 00:20:08,100 But what I know I teach, whether it is to entrepreneurs, to business people, my life is about teaching. 304 00:20:08,100 --> 00:20:14,500 So we went to the school and we were raising funds for an Afghan school. 305 00:20:14,500 --> 00:20:15,100 Okay. 306 00:20:15,100 --> 00:20:21,500 Afghan girls school because at that time the Afghan war was was pretty. 307 00:20:21,500 --> 00:20:26,700 It was pretty rampant in the early 2000s and girls were not allowed to be educated. 308 00:20:26,700 --> 00:20:31,900 And there were like huts and tents where girls were being educated. 309 00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:33,900 But then obviously they needed funding. 310 00:20:33,900 --> 00:20:38,100 So we worked together with an organization that specifically did that. 311 00:20:38,100 --> 00:20:44,100 And there are many other different occasions that outside of the project from school where. 312 00:20:44,100 --> 00:20:47,300 So did you do that project with your friend that's also from? 313 00:20:47,300 --> 00:20:47,900 Yes. 314 00:20:47,900 --> 00:20:48,700 Okay. 315 00:20:48,700 --> 00:20:49,300 Yes. 316 00:20:49,300 --> 00:20:50,900 That friend that's also from Afghanistan. 317 00:20:50,900 --> 00:20:51,500 She's also from. 318 00:20:51,500 --> 00:20:52,100 Yes. 319 00:20:52,100 --> 00:20:54,100 I also have friends from all over the world. 320 00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:58,700 So that's a project that then sat really close to her heart and you guys. 321 00:20:58,700 --> 00:20:59,300 Absolutely. 322 00:20:59,300 --> 00:21:00,100 Absolutely. 323 00:21:00,100 --> 00:21:03,100 And being my friend, obviously it touched my heart. 324 00:21:03,100 --> 00:21:05,500 You know, hearing the stories of the Afghan people. 325 00:21:05,500 --> 00:21:06,900 Yeah, as humans of the world. 326 00:21:06,900 --> 00:21:14,700 You at least we would hope that people would connect on this human level and help each other out. 327 00:21:14,700 --> 00:21:15,700 Exactly. 328 00:21:15,700 --> 00:21:22,100 And even after that project, we also did outside of school. 329 00:21:22,100 --> 00:21:28,100 We raised funds via the Festival Mundial in Tilber for the same foundation. 330 00:21:28,100 --> 00:21:34,100 So, okay, so that project was something that then sat close to your heart, 331 00:21:34,100 --> 00:21:40,300 which also obviously sat very close to the heart of your friend that's also from Afghanistan. 332 00:21:40,300 --> 00:21:49,500 And within that project, you well, that was the example that you use where you really saw that your leadership qualities grew. 333 00:21:49,500 --> 00:21:49,900 Yes. 334 00:21:49,900 --> 00:21:57,500 But then at the same time, you had a teacher that didn't believe in those leadership qualities and sort of was trying to discourage you. 335 00:21:57,500 --> 00:22:07,700 And I think in general, many of us from the dust Caribbean are faced oftentimes with teachers and mentors, 336 00:22:07,700 --> 00:22:16,100 so to speak, that can't fully relate to our experience and our way of life and also our approach to how we do things. 337 00:22:16,100 --> 00:22:24,900 And because they don't fully understand it, they tend to just dismiss it and want to say that it's wrong 338 00:22:24,900 --> 00:22:33,700 because it doesn't fit sort of their regular norms, even though it's just a different approach and maybe a slightly different perspective on things. 339 00:22:33,700 --> 00:22:45,900 So how do you think your Caribbean background, diverse background has then sort of played a role in how you execute those leadership qualities? 340 00:22:45,900 --> 00:22:48,000 Well, I think that's a great question. 341 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:51,800 But based on what you were just saying, I just want to take it one step back. 342 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:52,600 Okay. 343 00:22:52,600 --> 00:23:03,100 So that project specifically, what made me realize that it doesn't matter what this one person says about me, 344 00:23:03,100 --> 00:23:07,600 what was my effect on everyone. 345 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:14,400 And at that time, she said, you know, this person's getting a nine, this person getting nine, this person getting eight, 346 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,900 you're getting a seven because X, Y, Z. 347 00:23:16,900 --> 00:23:23,700 And there were people who actually stood up and said, Vincentia did most of the work. 348 00:23:23,700 --> 00:23:25,600 Vincentia led the team. 349 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:30,500 We would not have been successful if Vincentia wasn't leading. 350 00:23:30,500 --> 00:23:35,000 The teacher didn't change my grade, but it wasn't about the teacher. 351 00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:46,800 It was about raising the funds for the girls school in Afghanistan and changing the lives of my peers, being a leader. 352 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:48,100 Yeah. 353 00:23:48,100 --> 00:23:59,000 Yeah, that's actually really interesting because again, this is one of those nuggets where oftentimes we are faced with those type of challenges. 354 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:07,400 And it's not really the type of challenges that are broadly known because we are also a small minority group. 355 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:13,700 The fact that because the others that got those grades, they were in your group. 356 00:24:13,700 --> 00:24:14,600 Yeah. 357 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,700 So they all got higher grades than you. 358 00:24:17,700 --> 00:24:24,400 And you being the leader of the group got a lower grade because of whatever reasons and perspective the teacher had. 359 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:25,800 Yeah. 360 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:29,300 And at the end of the day, then all of them stood up and not all. 361 00:24:29,300 --> 00:24:31,300 Okay, because that's the thing. 362 00:24:31,300 --> 00:24:33,800 That's the thing with humans, right? 363 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:39,300 People are often afraid because if you're not a leader, you're afraid to stand up for what's right. 364 00:24:39,300 --> 00:24:45,100 So that to me showed leadership skills in the people that stood up and said, this is not right. 365 00:24:45,100 --> 00:24:47,200 Yeah. 366 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:48,800 All right. Awesome. 367 00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,700 So then let's get back to the other part of the question. 368 00:24:51,700 --> 00:25:03,800 Then how does your Caribbean background diverse influences sort of show up in your leadership skills on a day to day? 369 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,200 That's a great question. 370 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:10,200 I'm going to do a speak. 371 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:10,700 Okay. 372 00:25:10,700 --> 00:25:12,600 Can you speak? 373 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,800 No. 374 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:19,300 You know how you say with technology, is it the fourth revolution? 375 00:25:19,300 --> 00:25:23,300 Yeah, we're now in the fourth industrial revolution. 376 00:25:23,300 --> 00:25:26,400 You say simulate or die. 377 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:28,700 Innovate or die. 378 00:25:28,700 --> 00:25:29,300 Okay. 379 00:25:29,300 --> 00:25:30,900 You say innovate or die. 380 00:25:30,900 --> 00:25:42,000 So when it comes to being Caribbean and how that influences who I am, I actually been saying for years, assimilate or die. 381 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:43,200 Assimilate or die. 382 00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:43,700 Yes. 383 00:25:43,700 --> 00:25:44,700 What is assimilate? 384 00:25:44,700 --> 00:25:47,000 Well, it's kind of like adapt. 385 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:47,300 Okay. 386 00:25:47,300 --> 00:26:00,800 Because I mentioned it earlier, we're chameleons and people misunderstand that they think, oh, in a negative way, this person is pretending to be somebody that they're not in order to be. 387 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:02,800 In order to make somebody comfortable. 388 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,300 But that's not what it is. 389 00:26:05,300 --> 00:26:06,800 It's at the core. 390 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:09,800 You keep your core values. 391 00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:23,500 You remain who you are, but you speak with a language, with a tone, with the inclination, with a vibe that then people can resonate to. 392 00:26:23,500 --> 00:26:24,000 Yeah. 393 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:34,000 So when you go to Barbados, you're different, but you're still the same because then you speak with a Belgian accent. 394 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,000 You go to Dominica. 395 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:38,000 Yes, we. 396 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:39,000 Domnition. 397 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,000 Yes, we boy. 398 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:42,000 Papa met. 399 00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:43,000 Papa met. 400 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:47,000 You don't know. 401 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:54,000 So and that's all of who you are because you're this Caribbean person. 402 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:58,000 You're in the Netherlands and well, you've been living in the Netherlands more than me. 403 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,000 So yeah, then it's good afternoon. 404 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:01,000 Good day. 405 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,000 Speak with a soft G, a Brabant accent. 406 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:07,000 Well, then you're the Brabant now. 407 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,000 You've gone crazy, man. 408 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:11,000 All right, let's get back. 409 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:12,000 Just one more. 410 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:14,000 Can you understand me? 411 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:15,000 A little bit. 412 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:20,000 So yeah, a simulate or die. 413 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:21,000 You know how to adjust. 414 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,000 You know how to actually is about connecting with people. 415 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:25,000 Yeah. 416 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:39,000 So and I think I think the interesting part of that is is that definitely when when when you're I think even more so when you're from a very hot tourist destination. 417 00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:46,000 So the interaction that you have with so many cultures is is on a constant basis. 418 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:55,000 And and you sort of learn to speak a more universal language while still being who you are. 419 00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:56,000 Yeah. 420 00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:05,000 So and I mean, shout out to see Martin, because when it comes to that, see Martin is Martin is agreement a crop is epicenter. 421 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,000 And when it comes to that, see Martin is they they know how to simulate. 422 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:13,000 Yeah, for sure. 423 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:18,000 So going back to going back to. 424 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,000 So let's fast forward now. 425 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,000 We we we we left the HBO. 426 00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:31,000 And then there's some there's some time in between the moment that you graduate to the moment that you become director of VIP. 427 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:33,000 Oh, yeah. 428 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:42,000 So let's let's let's jump into one or two highlights in that period that sort of directed you on that path. 429 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:53,000 So I came back to see Martin with the intention that, OK, I'll start working and I'm going to do law school online. 430 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:54,000 Big mistake. 431 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:55,000 Huge. 432 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:56,000 In two thousand. 433 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,000 What movie is that from? 434 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:58,000 Big mistake. 435 00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,000 Huge. 436 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:00,000 I don't know. 437 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,000 Can't remember. 438 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:02,000 Pretty woman. 439 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:08,000 I grew up in a house and all these women watching these romcoms all the time. 440 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:12,000 As soon as I left the house, I was done with your wife. 441 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:14,000 Your wife doesn't make you watch. 442 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,000 Every now and then I'll join her. 443 00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:20,000 But in general, she'll she'll enjoy. 444 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:23,000 Well, she watches more the romcom series. 445 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,000 So I don't really get into the series. 446 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,000 That's that's too much of a big. 447 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,000 You know, but she also likes action movies. 448 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:31,000 That's true. 449 00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:34,000 So that that that's that's what we enjoy together. 450 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:38,000 That's true. And I am a huge action movie fan. 451 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:39,000 Thanks to you. 452 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:43,000 So my husband is very happy about that. 453 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:48,000 You're welcome, husband. 454 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,000 All right. So grad graduated in 2007. 455 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,000 And so where are we now? 456 00:29:54,000 --> 00:30:11,000 Yeah, you know, I've actually encountered a few young professionals, young Caribbean professionals who have gone on the journey of they were educated with their bachelors and they're trying to do this online school in order for them to still be there for their families. 457 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:14,000 And that's where the huge mistake comes in. 458 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:18,000 Because as Caribbean people, we don't learn to set boundaries. 459 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:23,000 I mean, now it's different, you know, with the Gen Z's and the and the Alphas. 460 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,000 They are setting boundaries from very early on. 461 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:27,000 Yeah. 462 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,000 But then again, their education is different, right? 463 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:34,000 Because they get so much more true to technology. 464 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:37,000 That's already sort of shape in. 465 00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:41,000 They're getting the truth. 466 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,000 We it was hidden from us. 467 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,000 We have to discover the truth as adults. 468 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:49,000 Now we know we can set boundaries. 469 00:30:49,000 --> 00:31:02,000 Yeah, or actually, you know, again, bring God into the conversation being brought up as, you know, a Caribbean person in the 90s, the early 2000s. 470 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:08,000 You were still taught that being a Christian meant that you sacrifice of yourself. 471 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:13,000 Right. So it's like, OK, this class is half full. 472 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:16,000 I'll give you some out of it. 473 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:25,000 And then Ian Levine said on the Oprah show, what's in the cup is mine. 474 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:28,000 What flows out of the cup is for you. 475 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:35,000 And I want to add to that because I can choose who I'm giving my overflow to. 476 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,000 Yeah. 477 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,000 That's that's setting boundaries. 478 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:42,000 So that's really important. 479 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:53,000 Yeah. And and and and during during those times, perhaps those boundaries weren't set as much. 480 00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:56,000 Oh, definitely not. And that affected the studies. 481 00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,000 And the and the cup was becoming empty rather than. 482 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:08,000 Yeah, definitely. And and that definitely led to a much longer journey for me to, you know, obtain that goal. 483 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:11,000 What I had set. Yeah. 484 00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:16,000 So where where where where did the turning point happen? 485 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,000 Oh, there were several turning points. 486 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:23,000 The first one being, ha, that's a good question. 487 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,000 You take me. The first one being when I had my daughter. 488 00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:37,000 OK. And it was about five years, almost five years after it was almost five years after moving back to St. 489 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:46,000 Martin, and I wouldn't go as far as saying that I had like postpartum depression. 490 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:54,000 But I definitely was not happy with where I was in my life because I felt that this dream that I had, 491 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,000 this eight year old girl was not achieving her dream. 492 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,000 And what was the reason? 493 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:05,000 And at the end of the day, I had to be accountable for that, because if somebody calls you and say, hey, 494 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:09,000 pick up my kid, hey, feed my kid, hey, do this, hey, do that. 495 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:11,000 You're the one that has to say no. Yeah. 496 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:16,000 If someone says, hey, give me money, you're the one that has to say no. 497 00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:24,000 And at that time, you introduced me to Tony Robbins and the secret. 498 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:30,000 Oh, yeah. You remember back then, 2012 secret was the hot topic. 499 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,000 It was all the rage. 500 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:40,000 And the funny thing about the secret, OK, I did look it up prior because I don't quote scripture on a regular basis. 501 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:44,000 The secret is about the law of attraction, right? Yeah. 502 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:52,000 And if you look in the Bible, everywhere, there's different parts of the Bible that talks about asking you shall receive. 503 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:58,000 So, and I looked it up today. Matthew, ask and it will be given to you. 504 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:08,000 Seek and you will find knock and the door will be open to you for everyone who asks receives and the one who seeks finds and to the one who knocks. 505 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:17,000 The door will be opened. Which one of you would hand his son a stone when he asked for a loaf of bread or a snake when he asked for a fish? 506 00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:27,000 If you then who are wicked know how to give good gifts to your children, how much will your heavenly father give good things to those who ask him? 507 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:39,000 And the changing point with the secret and the law of attraction was realizing that I deserve to ask. 508 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:46,000 And I deserve to have. Yeah. And that is when the change started happening. 509 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:55,000 And within a year after, then I was able to ask for the job that I want for the pay that I want. 510 00:34:55,000 --> 00:35:01,000 I worked for a year and a half in the Cabinet of Finance. I mean, I had the education to do it. Yeah. Right. 511 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:07,000 But it wasn't I wasn't asking. Yeah. And you need to go out there and get it. You need to go out there and get it. 512 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:15,000 And that's all of those listening at home. You you can get all the education. You can get all the training. 513 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:25,000 You can have all the credentials. But at the end of the day, you have to go out there and fight for it. You have to ask for what you for what you deserve. 514 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:36,000 Yeah. And I was so stuck on wanting to get that law degree that I was actually denying the other talents that God had given me. 515 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:43,000 And that kind of brings me to Matthew twenty five. And that's a really important one. 516 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:49,000 There are two parables in Matthew twenty five. But the one that I'm talking about is the one with the talents. 517 00:35:49,000 --> 00:36:02,000 And this one I'll summarize because it is a lot longer parable. But basically, a master had three servants. Yeah. 518 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:12,000 And to one servant, he gave one talent to the second servant. He gave two talents. And to the third servant, he gave five talents. 519 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:22,000 When he came back from his journey, the one who he had given five talents to had said, Master, you have given me five talents and I have created five more. 520 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:27,000 And the master said, Good job. You have a seat at my table. You will be given more. 521 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:37,000 The one who got two talents came back and said, Master, you gave me two. I made two more. He said, Good job. You have a seat at my table. 522 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:58,000 So both of them doubled up the talent. They double up their talents. And then the third one, he said, Master, you gave me one talent, but I know that you did not that you reap where you do not sow and you plant where you do not scatter seeds or something like that. 523 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,000 I'm not reading it word for word. 524 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:11,000 Paraphrasing here. Paraphrasing. God, sorry. And the master was like, you fool. 525 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:17,000 And basically, that servant was thrown into the dungeons and given nothing. 526 00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:30,000 And if you look at it, right, I was wasting my talents because as director of the Bureau, law is a part of it, but it's not the only part of it. 527 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:39,000 I have to be able to connect with people. So the management part, the management part, I have to be able to where the business administration came in nicely. 528 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:50,000 Oh, the business admin. Yeah, the management part. Definitely. Because with that study was like human resource management, business management, change management, you know, organizational changes like you name it. 529 00:37:50,000 --> 00:38:07,000 All kind of things under the umbrella management, economics, I mean, business economics, accounting, you name it. Like you have to be able to prepare financial statements and prepare budgets and you have to defend them and you have to know the numbers you're talking about. 530 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:15,000 And for those who don't know, probably everybody does know four of our sisters are accountants. So and our parents are really good in numbers. 531 00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:32,000 So it was something that and I mean, I think all of us are good in maps. Yeah. Some better than others. But all of us are really good in maps. And it was something that was just like my natural born talent to be good in numbers. 532 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:59,000 Yeah, but I was so focused on I had to be this. You're so focused on the plan. Yeah, which the plan was sort of one dimensional. Yeah, because because it's very focused. Yes. But you weren't you you didn't open up the peripheral vision to also allow all the other blessings in to color in the plan in a more elaborate form. 533 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:10,000 And thankfully, God did not throw me into the dungeon like that servant who buried his one talent. 534 00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:31,000 He gave me more than one talent. And now I can say that with confidence, not with cockiness, I could say it with humility, I can say it with with pride that God has blessed me with so many talents, and I am at the point in my life where I am ready to multiply them. 535 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:36,000 Awesome. 536 00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:51,000 So, at this point in the journey, you, you started asking for what you actually wanted you started accepting that your other talents are also important to your purpose to your purpose. 537 00:39:51,000 --> 00:40:06,000 You started to embrace those other talents as well. And now we're sort of at the at the dawn at the forefront of transition and into into the director position. 538 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:23,000 Now earlier you mentioned, well actually off camera we just spoke about of sort of letting go of the plan. Yeah, what? Yeah, what does that mean letting go of the plan. 539 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:38,000 That was a long process but I hope for our younger viewers. 540 00:40:38,000 --> 00:41:03,000 You know, God gives us grace, and in the process where I was so focused on achieving that one talent and I was chasing that one talent. But in the meantime, he didn't take away my other talents, he gave me the grace and allowed me to still develop them and continue with them. 541 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:26,000 He put obstacles in my way, jobs in my way that forcefully, including the director of BIP, where I am, have been the director, the sweeper, the liaison, everything in between. 542 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:41,000 So, you know, it's, it's not all glitz and glans. Being a director of a small entity means that you have to, and especially, I'm the first director of the Bureau for intellectual property, St. Martin. 543 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:59,000 Prior to that intellectual property rights were managed in Curacao. Yeah, there was no branch office in St. Martin. And that's because of the 2010 split when exactly when the Netherlands Antilles were decommissioned is the right word I'm not sure but when the 544 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:11,000 Antilles were no more and St. Martin went on to become status apart as well as Curacao. Many of those offices including the Bureau of intellectual property were based in Curacao along with others. 545 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:30,000 And then overnight. It was all gone and has to be established on island. Yes, and well luckily for the Bureau for intellectual property, what they put quickly at fortnight was a provision in the law that five years after 10 10 10, the Bureau for intellectual property 546 00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:43,000 had to be established. Okay, so in the meantime, then you would still go to Curacao. Yes. Okay. So from 10 10 10 until the first of October, 2015, it was via Curacao. Okay. 547 00:42:43,000 --> 00:43:00,000 I started working as interim director at the end of 2014, and started with the setup on and well, when I say, blood sweat and tears to set something up, and I consider myself an entrepreneur, even though you know it doesn't belong to me. 548 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:07,000 It's a public entity that I'm managing. Don't this is something like an employerpreneur or entrepreneur. 549 00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:17,000 I'll put it up and put it right here below. Put it in, but I can, I think what I said at one of the workshops back in 2015 or 2016. 550 00:43:17,000 --> 00:43:27,000 A workshop with if I believe it was dominate 360. One of them. Yes, I said I said you have to have an entrepreneurial state of mind. 551 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:41,000 Otherwise, you're not going to survive. Yeah. So this whole nine to five attitude. Yeah, that's not going to get the job done. You have to be a jack of all trades. Because what I've reached now, the level that I've reached that is I can. 552 00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:57,000 Oh, that comes nice back to the plan. One of those Instagram scenes. You heard it. Which one? The one that the same is a jack of all trades is a master of none. Yeah. But then they say that's part of the quote. 553 00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:11,000 The other half of the quote is a jack of all trades is a master of none, but always better than a master of one. Yes. So the one the one plan had you primarily only focus on law. 554 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:26,000 But then actually all those other talents makes it the perfect fit for what you do. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And it's and I think one of the questions earlier, you were like, okay, so then you got to the director of BIP, right? 555 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:42,000 And then afterwards, like you had that figured out. No, let me reel it back. I figured that out. Walt's being director of BIP because remember, I became director of BIP officially at 29 years old. 556 00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:57,000 I started at 28 as interim director at 29 officially. And in the process, I learned that, you know, give myself grace. Yeah. Yeah. 557 00:44:57,000 --> 00:45:17,000 All right. Awesome. So in those eight years as is eight, nine? Officially. Almost nine. Almost eight officially as director. Yeah. Since working then. Oh, working is almost nine. Almost nine. Yeah. So almost a decade now of experience. 558 00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:28,000 Yeah. And you're making me sound old. Well, I mean, we are getting old. I got way more grades, but I don't have grades. I got silver like my grandmother. 559 00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:49,000 According to most people, I got salt and pepper. So it's all good. Okay. So now in that past decade, pretty much. Right. And then bringing it back to what you said that you really understood then in the HBO experience of the leadership qualities. 560 00:45:49,000 --> 00:46:06,000 Obviously, as a director, you need to have leadership qualities in order to succeed. And well, I think we can say with 10 years experience and doing it successfully, then you have succeeded at leadership. 561 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:10,000 Only compliments on camera. 562 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:31,000 I'm still the bro, you know. So in those 10 years, what would then some of the key highlights of where leadership really needed to take the front seat in making tough decisions or change of strategy, etc. 563 00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:44,000 Give us some examples. That's a good question. You know, because when you go to school, you learn how to learn. Yeah. 564 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:56,000 What I think a lot of millennials have made the mistake was like, I'm educated and I need to get the job. Yeah. Like you have the education, you don't yet have the experience. 565 00:46:56,000 --> 00:47:14,000 Pace yourself. Yeah. You know, there's a lot more to come. Yeah. If you don't pace yourself, burnout burnout. Yep. And it's real. You know, and as Caribbean people on a side note, we're thought, ah, that's a white people thing. 566 00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:28,000 Right. No offense to the white people that are watching. No offense. But I mean, you want to be introduced to our culture. This is some of the things of our culture and the stigmas that we need to let go of. 567 00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:49,000 It's like, oh, mental health. That's a white people thing. And still in the Caribbean, that is how it's being talked about. But I see more and more millennials and Gen Z's, right? They are starting the conversation and they are saying, no, this is a humankind problem. 568 00:47:49,000 --> 00:48:05,000 Yeah. You know, so that's really, really important. And that is the shift that's been happening and that's been allowing us also to like find our voice and step out of that upbringing of endure. Yeah. 569 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:29,000 And if I could add to that, how I've seen that evolve, I think in general, hailing from the Caribbean, especially the Dutch Caribbean, because at least in the larger English islands, you have the university education systems in place. 570 00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:45,000 And we don't have those high level education systems fully in place in the Dutch Caribbean. So Curacao does have a few subjects, a few courses that you can follow and achieve a bachelor, I believe here in St. Martin as well. 571 00:48:45,000 --> 00:49:02,000 There's a few Aruba as well. There's a few. But the plethora and diversity, it's minimal. So in general, we're just, we have to fly, go abroad to get that higher education. 572 00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:19,000 There you're faced with certain amount of culture shocks. You're also faced with mentors and teachers that wouldn't fully understanding graphs, your perspective and your background. So we deal with, and there's a couple other things that we can mention. 573 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:32,000 Let's say light form of discrimination, etc. That these are different things that we're faced with and have to deal with, which also toughens up our skin to be able to deal with more challenges. 574 00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:54,000 So I think in general, also where part of that comes from is that in general, we have to sort of deal with more. So we are also capable of dealing with more. But then the world has also tremendously sped up in all of what we have to deal with as humans in general. 575 00:49:54,000 --> 00:50:11,000 And the technology that's been moving fast forward over all mankind, that now it's starting to hit us also as being too much. 576 00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:31,000 Because all of the stuff that we have to deal with just on a regular basis as with our background and then on top of that, all of the extra that comes with it is then starting to make, well, I guess, I guess this cup, the water is evaporating. 577 00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:38,000 Yeah, that would be the, yeah, it ain't overflowing. It ain't overflowing. Yeah. 578 00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:54,000 How has your leadership skills come into fruition then into you executing on them in over the past decade as a director of BIP? 579 00:50:54,000 --> 00:51:05,000 Well, one of our sisters, I won't call the name because, you know, then they will say, oh, you want to call my name and you ain't call other name? 580 00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:09,000 I know that one's your favorite. We don't want to fire you. We don't want to fire you. 581 00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:20,000 Don't be jealous. Okay. All right. So one of my sisters, you know who, gave me a book by John C. Maxwell. John, hey, how successful people lead. 582 00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:25,000 She actually gave me two books, How Successful People Lead and How Successful People Think. 583 00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:37,000 And there's like this five tier system that he developed in how successful people lead and number one being position. People follow you because they have to. You have the position. 584 00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:47,000 I'm director, right? You're working for me. You have to follow me. But people follow you secondly because of permission and permission has to do with the relationship. 585 00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:57,000 So people follow you because they want to. Yeah. Which is way more powerful than just you being in position and they have to follow you. Exactly. 586 00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:07,000 So then you're on level two with them. Level three is production. People follow you because of the results that you've been able to achieve for the organization. 587 00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:20,000 I mean, BIP has clean audits, approved budgets, approved financial statements. It's public on our website. 588 00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:27,000 We work together with the Benelux Office of Intellectual Property. We have a good relationship with the Netherlands. 589 00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:32,000 We have a good relationship with the other islands in the Caribbean, other IPOs in the Caribbean. 590 00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:39,000 We're a member of the Intellectual Property Caribbean Association. So results, right? Yeah. People see the results. 591 00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:51,000 And then let's also talk about the results of the awareness, because that's one of the things that I believe you guys have done really well. Thank you. 592 00:52:51,000 --> 00:53:05,000 Is creating a lot of awareness around the topic of intellectual property, because in the Caribbean in general, I remember growing up when I was doing music, etc. 593 00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:19,000 The plagiarism that it has happened many times that artists music would get copied outside and they actually can't do much about it because they haven't done their due diligence to copyright their music, etc. 594 00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:27,000 Because a lot of these things were a bit unknown or people didn't understand what were the steps that you go. 595 00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:33,000 And that's one of the things that you guys continue to do is create a lot of public awareness around the topic. 596 00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:41,000 And music is one of the examples that we as Caribbean people can all relate to and understand immediately. But it goes way beyond that as well. 597 00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:52,000 Oh, thank you. I mean, kind of that kind of takes me a little bit on a side tangent. So the Bureau for intellectual property, since we are independent governing body, we're a public entity. 598 00:53:52,000 --> 00:54:03,000 We're here to serve. So I can't advise you on what is the best way to protect your intellectual property, but I can provide you with as much information as possible to get you to think and act. 599 00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:16,000 And that's the difference in what we're doing, not just giving you information because it could fill you up with information, but the information has to be presented in such a way that you think and you act. 600 00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:24,000 And that's what we've done with our SIPA. So communication and IP awareness, which is our sub brand of the best exam. 601 00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:34,000 Before we were told by our stakeholders, you need to come up with a marketing plan. And we're like, yeah, but we not selling soda. We not selling hair products. We can't. 602 00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:43,000 And we have to remain neutral. Yeah. And that's where SIPA was born. Okay. And that's one of the innovative things that we've done at the Bureau. 603 00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:59,000 You know, we're one of the first in the region that has an online register. We're one of the first in the region that is active on social media that has given workshops on behalf of other countries. 604 00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:17,000 The Netherlands asked us to give workshops and Bonaire and Stacia. So definitely collaboration is key. Awareness is key. And just pushing the envelope, seeing where you can stay within the legal parameters, but get people to act. 605 00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:26,000 Yeah. Yeah. So that's with the production, right? Thank you for bringing up awareness. I get totally. 606 00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:40,000 Because I was like, this was all sounding more like compliance. Where is the part where we connect with the people? Yeah. I mean, that part is recently we had Island Frenuer here at Where Are We Now? Yeah. 607 00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:59,000 And right here at Simpson Bay Resort, right? Right here in this room. And you wouldn't believe it, but talking about Kareemian and Chameleon, I thought the energy from Ife Batajou and from Leslie Samuel, St. Martin born, right? Yeah. 608 00:55:59,000 --> 00:56:13,000 They had so much energy that I was like, okay, I have my story. It's a great story. It's interesting. I have my slides. I can talk about that. But how do I connect with the people? How do I show? 609 00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:28,000 How do you jump on that frequency of energy that was in the room? Yeah, because the energy in the room was high. So yeah, well, those two bring the energy. They brought the energy with Leslie Samuel, but transferred. 610 00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:44,000 So I thought, okay, what can I do that's different? So I stepped completely out of my comfort zone and I sang a little bit from Sister Act 2. You know Sister Act 2? When they're in the classroom. Yeah. 611 00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:58,000 Well, now you'll have to sing it for the people because they're going to want to know. I was so embarrassed because I said, oh, you know, I'm going to sing a little bit for you. And then everybody in the crowd. No one is watching right now. 612 00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:06,000 Oh snap. I put everything on airplane mode. 613 00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:22,000 So the first was position. So these are like the five P's. The five P's, but they're the five P's and the five R's. So if you notice, I know with everything I said R, position is the rights. 614 00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:40,000 So, you know, I have the positions, you're following me because of the position. Because, you know, that's my right. The second permission. Permission, that's relationship. You're following me because you want to. The third is production because the results that I've produced and you mentioned the awareness. 615 00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:53,000 Yeah. The fourth is people development, reproduction. At that point, you are developing people to become their leaders in their own right. Yeah. 616 00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:59,000 And at five is the pinnacle, the respect. 617 00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:16,000 So at five, at five, you are developing up to level four leaders. Important to know in the leadership. And I mean, the book talks about it is you can be at a level four with someone, but something can happen that can put you back at a one. 618 00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:23,000 And one thing in the journey of leadership is don't be afraid to let go. 619 00:58:23,000 --> 00:58:24,000 Yeah. 620 00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:32,000 So, I mean, we talked about letting go to plan. It's not necessarily letting go to plan, but it's accepting the journey. Yeah. 621 00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:35,000 And the same thing with the levels of leadership. 622 00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:59,000 Because accepting the journey, accepting the journey means that the plan you make a plan with all the information you have at that time. And then as you go on the journey, you gather more information, more experience, more elements that sort of color your overall life, knowledge, wisdom. 623 00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:09,000 So therefore, the plan has to the plan has to be fluid. It has to be agile. It has to be able to evolve with you on the journey. Yeah. 624 00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:18,000 Be flexible, be open, have grace, evolve, innovate, or die. 625 00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:22,000 That's me like pretend you know pretending like your voice. Okay. 626 00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:28,000 That's what I was I was assimilating. So the pinnacle what what was the R in the pinnacle? 627 00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:34,000 Respect. Respect. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Nice. And at that point, you're developing level four leaders. 628 00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:45,000 And if you are working with people that are not able to get up to the level three at minimum, then they are not meant to continue on the journey with you. Yeah. 629 00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:51,000 They have to be able to at least grow to the level three. Yeah, to be able to produce and yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 630 00:59:51,000 --> 01:00:06,000 If they if they are not able to reach the level three, and they're stuck on like, you know, a level two. Yeah. Then it's a it's time is always interesting these different frameworks and different theories. 631 01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:12,000 So I have one that actually sort of helps color this in. 632 01:00:12,000 --> 01:00:21,000 It's I forgot the guy's name, but it was when I was at Web Summit in Portugal a few years back. 633 01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:33,000 It's entrepreneur entrepreneur from his background is from Southeast Asia, but he lived in Silicon Valley for some while had different startup, etc. 634 01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:44,000 But essentially, it's a diagram that and I guess, editor, you can go ahead and create the diagram right now. 635 01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:50,000 So on the top right, we have A players. 636 01:00:50,000 --> 01:01:08,000 The top left, we have B players bottom right, we have C players and bottom left, we have D players. So we have two accesses and on one access, it's about it's about the skills and experience. 637 01:01:08,000 --> 01:01:13,000 And on the other access. 638 01:01:13,000 --> 01:01:30,000 It's about the trust, the trust and and and the values that because if if if you share the right values with the company, then you you can also build the right type of trust within the environment of the company. 639 01:01:30,000 --> 01:01:39,000 But if your values don't really match up with the company, then the trust that is needed to grow within that company will never sort of really fully match up. 640 01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:51,000 So when when people score high on the value side, they'll either be a B or a player, and they'll be a B player when their experience and skills is not fully where it needs to be. 641 01:01:51,000 --> 01:02:03,000 But that's something that they can develop with training, but it's a lot more difficult to develop values and trust with training that that sort of has to be already a natural fit. 642 01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:06,000 That's right. Otherwise, it's not going to quite work. 643 01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:09,000 So a B player can turn into a A player. 644 01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:25,000 But a C player is very difficult for them to move up and become an A player. And people that don't share your values and and don't have the skills and experience, or because they don't share the values and and and the trust is not there. 645 01:02:25,000 --> 01:02:38,000 And they themselves are blocking themselves from utilizing their skills in the best way possible. They're essentially B players and B players have no place on the team. 646 01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:46,000 Then you have a failing squad. So how are you going to win championships with a bunch of B players? Yeah, failing squad. 647 01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:49,000 No reference to any superhero movies. 648 01:02:49,000 --> 01:03:15,000 So any any final thoughts, final words for for the folks out there on on let's let's let's let's say you go with a top three or top one key advice for young ladies out there right now between 18 to 25 in school or or even up till 30 when they're first start in their career 649 01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:25,000 and and and and have this very stringent plan in their minds, but life is showing all type of bricks and oranges and apples their way. 650 01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:36,000 And they don't know how to deal with it. How how do how do you what advice do you have final thoughts to get them over that hump? 651 01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:43,000 And you're checking your notes. You see this is this is this is classic Vincent here. 652 01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:48,000 You see like now you're making extra extra prepared. 653 01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,000 Extra prepared like full homework. 654 01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:55,000 I'm making me nervous. I'm like, what did I want to say? 655 01:03:55,000 --> 01:04:00,000 I don't remember. Oh, it was right in front of me. Oh, yeah. You see. 656 01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:03,000 See that it's always right in front of you. 657 01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:06,000 It's not always right in front of you. 658 01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:08,000 Okay. All right. All right. 659 01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:19,000 So since we are on the topic of leadership last month, one of my team members at the BIP SXM, they shared a post with me on LinkedIn. 660 01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:24,000 And the post was a diagram on leadership versus management. 661 01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:33,000 And there is a huge circle of management, but there is even a bigger circle of leadership because management is a part of leadership. 662 01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:38,000 Yeah. But and leadership cannot exist without management. 663 01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:42,000 Yeah. However, leadership is a level. 664 01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:49,000 Right. Right. And management would be more be more B level. 665 01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:53,000 I would I would almost say more C level. Yeah. 666 01:04:53,000 --> 01:05:00,000 Because when it when it comes down to it, I believe the leadership part really ties into the values and the trust. 667 01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:05,000 Yeah. Because if if if your people don't trust you to lead them. Yeah. 668 01:05:05,000 --> 01:05:12,000 And and they don't value what you value and what the company values, then you're not moving in that direction together. 669 01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:19,000 And management can be sort of taught. Well, these are the things that you do within management. Yes. So you can have the skills. 670 01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:26,000 So. So a manager can grow into a leader manager. Yeah. 671 01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:39,000 If they also possess those other parts and then they would be more a but then if they don't possess those values and and and and and that trust dynamic with the people that they're managing, then they're not leading them. 672 01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:44,000 And essentially, then they're just executing management tasks. So makes them a C player. 673 01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:49,000 That that is well said. Bravo. I'm going to. 674 01:05:49,000 --> 01:06:10,000 Cue the clap. Awesome. Well, I I I'm also talking from a little bit of experience over the past couple of years, definitely in the past almost five years of doing a corporate high level corporate consultancy. 675 01:06:10,000 --> 01:06:16,000 I've seen it firsthand. The difference between managers that can lead and those that just manage. Yeah. 676 01:06:16,000 --> 01:06:34,000 And I think, you know, leadership skills is something that you are born with. Yeah. But you have to develop it. Yeah. It's some it's something you have to develop. But the talents are there. Yeah. But it's do you bury them or do you let them multiply them? 677 01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:48,000 Multiply them. So leave the sunshine on them. Walk them leave them grow sunshine made me think of a Caribbean song with sunshine, but you know, no copyright infringement. All right. 678 01:06:48,000 --> 01:07:08,000 So when that employee came to me and and and share that post with me, it made me feel grateful. It made me feel humble, because I was like, Wow, you know, I've been trying to achieve this and to hear employees, past employees come back to me, or even when I give a workshop 679 01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:27,000 that people tell me that what I did it touch them that it made them spur into action. It really made me feel it makes me feel like okay, I am achieving my purpose. And that brings me to the last point of Yes, I am looking at my notes. 680 01:07:27,000 --> 01:07:48,000 Oprah said to her friend Maya Angelou that her legacy was a school that she built in South Africa. And Maya Angelou said in her classic Maya Angelou voice, which I can't do, or I'll try to mock Oprah mocking Maya Angelou, your legacy is every life you've touched. 681 01:07:48,000 --> 01:08:08,000 And that helped me further define my purpose that my purpose is to be of service to others to help change lives through leadership. Awesome. I think that's a perfect note for us to end on. 682 01:08:08,000 --> 01:08:24,000 So, Vincentia Rose Sandiford. Yes, John Sandiford. Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So John Sandiford, the jam is Antonio Marcellus. Okay, John Antonio Marcellus Sandiford. 683 01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:40,000 All right, Junior. You told me not to call me that. I know. I know. Anyways, I added it. Whatever. Thank you very, very much for making the time in your busy director schedule for your awesome brother. 684 01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:57,000 So with that being said, thank you guys very much. If you would like to see more of these type of interviews, then we gladly appreciate and accept your support. So please like, comment and subscribe to the channel. 685 01:08:57,000 --> 01:09:11,000 Drop us a comment and let me know some of the questions that you might have missed that you would have loved for me to ask and who knows I might catch it on the flip side. So, signing out from the sunny side of the kingdom. 686 01:09:11,000 --> 01:09:30,000 This beautiful view over here can be yours as well. We're in sunshine, sunshine city St. Martin. And right now at the Simpson Bay Resort and Spa Center. Am I saying that right? All right. I looked over to, may I say your name? 687 01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:45,000 All right, Bri that has been helping us set this whole thing up today. She's done an amazing job and given us the opportunity to make another awesome podcast for you guys in a beautiful location on the sunny side of the kingdom. 688 01:09:45,000 --> 01:09:53,000 So it's a place where we highlight those Dutch Caribbean role models. Thank you very much for tuning in. I'll see you in the next one. 689 01:09:53,000 --> 01:10:00,000 Bless.