Hi, my name is Jordan. I am a special education
teacher from the UK. I share my passion for everything
communication, sensory regulation and fun lesson
ideas for my classroom of disabled pupils aged
4 to 11. Each week I am joined by experts in
the field answering your questions and sharing
our knowledge and experience working alongside
our beautiful young people. Let's get started.
Hello everybody and welcome to the Sensory Classroom
podcast. My name is Jordan and today I'm joined
by Kelly who calls herself The Different OT and
we're going to be talking about occupational
therapy and sensory co -regulation today. Hi
Kelly. Hello. Welcome. We can tell from your
accent that you are not from the UK. Can you
tell us a little bit about yourself please? Yeah,
I've never even been to the UK. It's on my to
-do list. I am from New Zealand. I have been
an occupational therapist since graduating in
2010, and I've worked in the paediatric space
pretty much that entire time. Yeah, I am a mum
of two beautiful girls, five and nine, and I
just am incredibly passionate about my profession,
occupational therapy as a profession, and particularly
about helping children and everyone really regulate
and feel regulated. So you said you worked in
paediatrics the whole time. When did you choose
to specialise in sensory needs? Is that quite
early on? Yeah, so I did... what we typically
call over here a gap year. I went to Canada when
I was just out of high school and that's when
I learned I wanted to do paediatrics. I was working
at a summer camp and I had a non -speaking autistic
girl who was 11. Her name's Amanda and I fondly
remember her and the way she communicated with
me during that week at camp was very tactile.
very physical that was the way that she communicated
her needs and on day three she had her occupational
therapist visit and by the end of the day her
communication style had changed dramatically
and my the physical demands on me had reduced
and I was like what is this magic what's happened
and that was just like this moment for me I want
to be able to help others in the way that that
OT helped her and so that's what prompted me
to even go down that track and I didn't know
what OT was before that. So I really was passionate
about getting into that field pretty much straight
away. It's amazing, isn't it, what an impact
a professional can have because that person would
never have realised the ripple effect of that
one visit. And who knows that you could be having
the same ripple effects to other people that
are supporting other children. And it just shows,
doesn't it, that as professionals, our reach
is so much further than we'll ever realise. Absolutely.
And I think that's so, so powerful when you find
a thing that you are so passionate about because
it spreads out to others and it feels contagious.
And when you can actually see change being created
and you can see this like really tangible evidence
that something's working, it's just, you just
want to do more of it. Absolutely. It is. It's
like a dopamine hit, isn't it? I suppose it's
not always like that, but I suppose it's important
to acknowledge that. These aren't quick fixes.
You know, sometimes you see that immediate impact,
but other times it can take weeks and months
to really build that rapport, to build that understanding,
to have an impact. How do you navigate those
times and keep that motivation to keep going
and keep trying? I have to tell you, I've lost
motivation at times. I've felt like I'm just
not making any difference. I feel like when I'm
ready to go and see a client, I'm thinking, is
this even going to do anything? Is this making
any impact? And I think it was really important
learning for me in my early years was that reflecting
on that occupational therapist that I met that
day, she had known Amanda for at least a year
and she was coming to camp to help Amanda, but
to also educate us and show us the ways to support
her. And to really remind myself that you're
just one piece of the puzzle. And when you go
in, you go in with the best intentions, you try
your best in every session. But actually, the
way that I work in a therapeutic model is it's
only a small little piece of their day. And so
to just be realistic with myself, I think about
what can be achieved, what is on top for them
and not trying to look too big picture, just
stay in the moment and really support whatever
you're seeing from them at that time. Otherwise,
if you go too big, it can be quite disheartening
or you feel like nothing's working. Yeah, I love
that about targeting what's needed in the moment.
How do you, I suppose, yeah, one of my pre -plan
questions actually is what are the signs that
a learner is dysregulated? What are you looking
for? Yeah, it's interesting because there is,
you hope that there would be like this. go -to
book that says if you're in a classroom you're
going to see this and this and this and I guess
in a lot of ways we've kind of summarized people
summarize you're going to see maybe excessive
movement you're going to see an increase in volume
or you're going to see an attempt at avoiding
or escaping a situation you might see those things
and think those are the typical signs but it's
actually not until you know a person deeply that
you would sense that they're dysregulated I may
someone off the street may walk into a classroom
and look around and go that child's wobbling
a lot on their stool they're gazing out of the
side of their eye and they're chewing on their
silicon tool they're very dysregulated I may
walk into the same space and go they're doing
such a good job regulating themselves that's
awesome and so it's really a case of knowing
what dysregulation looks like per person When
you think about the whole classroom space being
dysregulated, there are ways to identify that,
oh, this perhaps, there's not limited engagement
happening or there's a sense that, hey, this
isn't quite flowing properly. But in specific
terms, it's really dependent on the person. Yeah.
Yeah, it makes sense, doesn't it? Knowing their
individual baseline of what regulation looks
like for them, I suppose, is a really good start,
isn't it? Yeah, and I think that... That ties
into what is regulation. Regulation is about
getting to your baseline. So whatever your baseline
is, being at a calm, regulated state for you
is what regulation is. So we can look at the
definitions of regulation and we can understand
that as a construct. But then when we apply it
to five people in a line, it's going to look
very different for everyone. So I can't say,
you're doing this, therefore you're dysregulated.
They may reply to me, speaking or non -speaking,
that that... that they're fine. They're not dysregulated.
This is their baseline. But until you know those
cues and you know them well enough, it's easy
to make those judgments. Absolutely. And it's
about, it's very ableist, isn't it, to assume
that being still or static and quiet is regulated.
It's a lot of learning I've been doing this year,
honestly, of kind of doing unlearning of the
focus and the goal isn't still and static and
looking. Because it's ingrained in us, isn't
it, to think like that. That isn't the goal here.
And actually this year, really recently, I've
been actually thinking about regulated state
as matching it to the activity. So if we're doing
a really exciting activity that involves lots
of movement, say if it's a sport or we're outside
playing, actually regulated state doesn't look
like stillness and quietness and looking in that
state. Let's match the regulated state. It's
actually quite excited. We want everybody to
be moving and up and moving their bodies and
alert and really quite excited about that activity.
That's the matched and regulated state. And it's
completely undone all of my focus, honestly,
on regulation. And now when I'm planning, I'm
planning my lessons, I'm thinking, OK, what would
the regulated state be for my class? This instance,
I want them to be up off their chair. I want
them to be up on their toes and moving their
arms and moving their bodies. It wouldn't be
appropriate in this activity to be sat and passive.
Yes, yes, I hear that. And I think that's when
you're seeking engagement or you're looking for
that. just right spot where they're ready for
learning they're ready for engagement if we can
create that sense of regulation in the nervous
and sensory systems then we'll have more engagement
and so going into an activity that may stimulate
more excitement and more movement and things
like that to know that you've front -loaded that
and they're ready for that activity means that
you will get the best out of them And in that
moment you go, wow, look at them running around
and doing these things. This is them. Maybe that's
even a source of regulation for them. They could
have gone into that being less regulated and
then they're like, now my body feels just right.
Yeah. And that is that, isn't it? And us believing
them because we can't go into their heads or
into their bodies and know that they feel just
right. I guess that comes back to knowing them,
having a relationship with them, knowing what.
their baseline is knowing what their goals are
and working alongside them to achieve that you
can't again you can't just walk into a room and
know those things no and it's really unhelpful
to to make assumptions or to go in expecting
to see a certain thing to walk into a classroom
and go I've been in some classrooms where the
school principal will walk do a walk along and
they'll walk in and go room five everyone in
here is so quiet. It's so lovely to see everyone's
so calm. And I can look and see specific kids
who are not calm at all. Their sensory system
is just like, they're not coping in their nervous
system. They're masking, they're keeping it together,
they're following the rules. And there's no way
that they're taking in the new information. They're
just like, I have to sit still, I have to face
the front, I can't bite on my nails, I can't
wriggle in my chair. But they get praised for,
oh, wow everyone's so calm and so when we start
attaching words to what we're seeing if that
doesn't fit what the child is feeling inside
it's actually really confusing for them because
we're getting told that we're calm but hey I
don't feel calm Yeah, and it's always been a
good practice to name emotions that you see as
an adult so they get to link what they're feeling
in their bodies to that emotion. But ultimately,
how do we really know what they're feeling? So
I guess that takes us on to how can we be the
best supporting adults around these children?
You know, we don't know what's inside their bodies.
We don't genuinely know what they're feeling.
What can we do to work alongside them, to support
them, to know what regulation is for them, to
meet their needs safely, to name what they're
feeling? How can we do that effectively in a
non -ableist way, I suppose? Yeah. Well, I don't
know that your audience is going to like that
I don't have a solid answer for this, except
for... using yourself as the tool. So I strongly
believe that when you are able to identify your
own likes and dislikes, it makes it easier for
you to have compassion and curiosity with those
around you. So as an example, if I go into a
classroom and I say, this student of mine has
these sensory preferences and we're using these
tools to support them. And they say to me, oh,
but they're doing this thing and it's really
annoying. They're constantly doing this thing
and I don't understand why they do it. Those
teachers, I often go, okay. there's some learning
to be done here let's let's give them some tools
let's hold up a magnifying glass for them to
become a detective and go hmm why are they doing
these things but unless you know why you do what
you do it's really hard to relate to others excuse
me so to be able to I guess delve into your own
preferences why do I like my tea at a certain
temperature Why do I prefer those type of pyjamas
over those type of pyjamas? Why is it that when
I'm sitting in traffic, I bite on my fingernails?
If you can have understanding of your own self,
then I think it makes you a far better educator
and also a more patient and curious caregiver
parent because you go, oh yeah, I kind of get
why they're doing that thing. Like I can see
why they would like that or it doesn't work for
me, but I can see they're getting a lot of joy
out of that. And so I think knowing yourself
is the best tool, is the best thing that you
can do to move forward with your students and
your children to understand them properly. Does
that make sense? Yeah, it really does. And I
suppose if you're working with learners that
you're able to have that conversation, you don't
have to name their emotions, but you could certainly
name your own. I feel really frustrated that
X, Y, Z, or I feel so excited about this thing
that's coming up. And then that's true because
you're talking about you and you know that's
true, regardless of what your student feels or
not. You're not putting those words on them.
But it opens up that conversation of, huh, we're
all sensory beings and this is what they're feeling.
Maybe I'm feeling that too or different or whatever.
Totally. And then you can approach every interaction.
You can observe every behavior with curiosity.
As you say, labeling it for yourself helps them
to observe. We can talk about why we're doing
this thing. Like I've got these things in front
of me and I'm playing with them behind here.
I picked one that was stretchy and that I could
pull the legs off if I wanted to and one that
would do this. And I can sit in a session with
a child and say, My goodness, I'm feeling overwhelmed
right now because there's so much noise happening
outside. I've got a hungry tummy. I can hear
it rumbling. I'm going to go and get one of these
to pull on. And when I pull on it, I start to
feel calmer. And then I'll say, oh, look, this
came off. That feels good. Would you like a turn?
And then I can welcome them. I can invite them
into, let's explore this together. Is this something
you like? And they may throw it away and say,
no, I don't like it. And you go, okay. squishy
things aren't for them what about this thing
it's firmer it makes you know and and it just
allows that back and forth rather than us doing
you know when we do things to children when we
put them in front of something and we go oh well
I saw them they really loved the swing so every
time they're dysregulated I'm going to tell them
you have to go to the swing now rather than swing
or wobbly stool swing or duck then you know offering
them things because you've allowed them that
I guess autonomy but also that respect to be
like what is it that you like yeah and also also
dysregulation comes from lacking I suppose sensory
regulation but it also often stems the trigger
often is a lack of control or autonomy or voice
or lack of being heard and all that that's often
the trigger for that over spill of of it as well
as lack of movement or whatever they need it
kind of goes hand in hand doesn't it not being
understood and lacking sensory regulation input
yeah so i suppose if you're not giving them them
choices then you're only putting that extra demand
on them helping them to feel even less in control
even less you know and all of those things so
yeah it's just making it harder for them to gain
control gain that idea of being heard and so
often those hurting behaviors come from that
frustration you know they come to me and say
oh they're doing the sensory thing and what i
see is an unregulated child but i'm also seeing
an unheard child and i'm not understood child
whether they've got words or not they might not
be able to voice them when they're feeling dysregulated
um they might not be listened to when they're
You know, they're trying to explain as best they
can of what they need and it's not being honoured
maybe, you know, and that goes for speaking children
and minimally speaking children. I see it a lot.
So I think it goes hand in hand with those choices,
that communication, that believing them and also
that regulation. Absolutely. Considering them,
like considering us all as sensory beings and
thinking about, let's say you've got one child
who has, I don't know how it works. in the schooling
system there, but we might have learning assistants
that come and go. So over the course of a week,
a student may see three, four different learning
assistants throughout that week. And it could
be, you know, we're doing ABCs, we're recording,
you know, what's happening before, during and
after a behavior. We're trying to record data.
You might start to see a pattern that when they're
with that particular person, something's happening.
And often I will engage with those. those staff
who are so willing and so wanting to help and
they're going, I don't know what's going wrong.
I don't know what it is that I'm doing. And actually,
it could be something as little as the perfume
that they're wearing or the frames of their glasses
or the fact they're wearing dangly earrings.
It could be the nail polish that they're wearing.
It could be the gruff sound of their voice. To
be able to delve lower and go, sensory sensory
sensory let's look at all of these different
eight systems and actually realize that it's
not without trying it's not because you don't
have the compassion and the willingness it's
that that child is responding to something about
you that maybe they can't explain why but they
just know when they see that person come in the
door this feels hard I don't like how they smell
I don't like the tone of their voice and we it's
very hard for us to get to the bottom of that.
But if we can look at it as they're communicating
to us that something doesn't feel right and it's
not because we're a bad person, it's because
it just isn't the right fit or it just isn't,
you know, something's not gelling and allowing
the adults as well to just sort of take that
pressure off themselves and go, it's okay. We
don't all have to be the right fit. Yeah, as
a manager of my... team it's something I have
to handle with a lot of care um on how I approach
that because yeah you're absolutely right sometimes
it just isn't a right fit whether it's tone of
voice or patterned clothing or rising difference
you know whatever if you're a manager listening
to this how I manage that is I Ignorate my own
faults and flaws and the reasons why I might
not be the right person for a particular child.
And I do it all the time. I'm constantly saying,
can we swap out? Because actually, I'm feeling
dysregulated and I don't think I'm helping the
situation. Or I narrate saying, oh, yeah, I'm
wearing perfume today. They're not going to like
that. Can you take that on? And by me doing that
as the manager, I'm creating an ethos of it is
nothing to do with me. You know, I'm the specialist.
I'm the expert in the room. And yet I am saying
I am not the right person for this job right
now. because either i'm dysregulated or i'm too
little like i'm only five foot often it's a physical
reason why i can't be the person that's involved
or i'm wearing patterns today or whatever it
is i'm or i'm the person that actually gave the
demand in the first place so actually they're
really angry at me can you step in and be that
be the good cop yeah or whatever it is so i think
by me doing that so openly and so confidently
and we every day constantly I'm constantly stepping
back or swapping in and all of those things it
then hopefully allows my team to when I say oh
can I step in or can we swap out they're not
taking it personally because it's not personal
it's something that we're just practicing all
the time a bit like a muscle Rather than waiting
for those big, big moments, those crisis moments
to then propel. Actually, if you're doing it
regularly all day, every day, actually, you haven't
had a break yet. I've noticed you haven't had
a drink yet. Step out and take your drink for
a couple of minutes and I'll step in. Just doing
it, even when it's not needed, doing it regularly
just really helps, yeah, breathe that ethos of
we're all doing this together. And that leads
on to co -regulation, doesn't it? Beautifully.
And I think. When you can model that as a manager
and you can create that ethos, it's almost as
though you're creating your own versions of sensory
activity schedules. You're acknowledging, hey,
throughout the day, we're going to need sensory
breaks and our sensory cups are getting depleted.
And perhaps we're triggered by certain things
in the classroom environment, the stimulus, the
constant stimming of a certain child that maybe
triggers something in you. And you go, OK, I
know that I've got a 20 minute window here. Once
I pass that, I'm going to become dysregulated.
regulated and so it's acknowledging that hey
all of us need to have our own breaks our own
do our things that are going to help us if if
we want to wear loops in our ears these little
discrete buffers of noise then if that's going
to allow you to do the best job then hey you
go for it too because it's one thing to promote
that to our children and support them but if
we're not regulated then we can't co -regulate
it's it's just true I don't know if you find
this too, that the people that go into this field,
either in special education or occupational therapy,
especially sensory occupational therapy, we seem
to have a heightened awareness of our own sensory
needs. And I don't know if that's because those
that are neurodivergent or have sensory regulation
needs go into those fields or that we just have
a heightened awareness of our own because we're
talking about it and aware of it every day. It's
so obvious in our rooms and in our work. So I
don't know where that's from, but it's certainly
true that... the teams i work with have a heightened
awareness of their own regulation needs like
they often say well yeah i don't like that or
oh i love that and we're constantly having that
conversation yeah and it was a revelation for
me when i started this podcast one of the first
people i had on said well yeah i have my own
chewy and i have my own ear defenders and when
i need them i use them in front of my students
and i was like huh what we can do that that's
that makes much sense like why didn't i ever
consider that of course sensory children become
sensory adults you know that yes of course of
course we're going to need them and model them
and not in a patronizing way but genuine in that
need um and i've been doing it ever since it
was a revelation to me that oh yeah i could have
my own savia defenders and we often need them
in class yes isn't that awesome like it just
feels really empowering and it feels really really
supportive to ourselves it's like you know putting
on your own oxygen mask before the person anyone
else it's like I'm going to support myself with
what I need and what you're then doing is facilitating
these young people to become the adults who sit
in the co -working space and can identify hey
these lights are a bit bright for me I'm going
to have tinted glasses or I'm going to have air
defenders or I'm going to have a cold glass a
cold bottle of water beside me and I sip on it
regularly throughout the day because they know
that that's what helps them and they can go into
the adult world and advocate for themselves because
I think what we're seeing a lot of in the adult
space are people that have been masking for a
long time and also have felt as though their
needs aren't that they're not big enough it's
like well I can just I'll just get through it
I'll just get through my work day even though
I've got all of these sensory triggers or stimuli
that just are tricky for me I'll just push through
that then leads to the next part of their day
where they go home to their children they've
got all these triggers of of the noise and everything
and mum mum mum mum mum and there's less to offer
at that point because they've put all of their
needs to the side And actually, if we can have
what we say about our learners is if we can have
regular bursts of sensory input throughout the
day, then we're going to be better able to engage
and able to learn. Yeah, it's so cool that we
can be doing this for young people now. I hope
that the flow on effect is that once they're
adults, they'll have more of that within them
than what we and particularly the older generations
currently have. Yeah, I completely agree. And
I think that's why I find it so frustrating when
people say things like, but we don't have time
for full movement breaks. We don't have time
for full time circuits. And I just think it's
learning. Don't see it as other than the lesson.
Don't see it as other than the learning is the
learning. In fact, it's probably one of the most
important lessons we're going to make because
if we're going to be lifelong learners, we need
to know how to get in a regulated and focused
state in order to read that book or do that research
or listen to that lecture or do that job, do
that work. whatever it is that we want our children
to be as independent as possible whatever that
looks like they're going to have to understand
their regulated state they're going to have to
understand how to meet those needs as independent
as possible you know within yeah there's so much
that we do as adults that compensates for the
trickiness of our days and I think when you as
you say you have this lens when you work in the
profession you kind of go into it with some compassion
or this awareness of yourself if you're neurodiverse
or however you've ended up in that field you
just can naturally kind of do the things that
you need when your cup is full and you've got
capacity you can employ those strategies but
when we think about like a parent who goes oh
I have to go to the supermarket on my way home
and get these things for dinner and they get
into the supermarket and they don't have their
list and they go I don't even know what I need
for dinner and then they just grab something
random they get home and they go oh we'll just
have takeaways for me when I think about how
we got to that point there's so much that's happened
to get them there that that the stimulus of being
in the supermarket and all the other things happening
around them is just like oh my gosh like they
might go into like the fight flight freeze sort
of mode they might get grumpy at the driver in
front of them who actually on another day they
wouldn't have got grumpy and just being able
to be kind to yourself and acknowledge hey actually
this this is the reason why this has happened
because we commonly will be like oh my gosh that
person is so grumpy today or that person was
so rude to me or they did this but if we look
at them and go maybe they're just really overstimulated
maybe maybe they just haven't had their cup filled
today they've there's all these reasons why people
behave the way they do and I just think being
compassionate to them and to yourself is so important
I don't yeah I kind of don't track it makes you
a far more understanding just part of society
doesn't it because there is always a reason behavior
is communication and so all everything that happens
to you from that's done by other people is some
kind of communication and coming at it with empathy
and being a detective definitely removes anything
personal from the situation and just makes you
question you know it puts the onus back on them
doesn't it i wonder what they need and it does
help you're less angry about it when you're in
the queue or whatever absolutely and i i think
this i would like to just touch on the concept
of sensory diets here because so often like i
i I worked with a really amazing occupational
therapist in Australia who did a lot of research
into the concept of sensory activity schedules
as opposed to a sensory diet and the sensory
activity schedule was scheduling into the day
regular sensory breaks but it wasn't prescriptive
in the sense that we need to do this at this
time. It was like a schedule that had options
and these are your choices and we acknowledge
that at these points in the day some regulation
may be useful what is it that you're going to
take from this as opposed to at this time you
need this thing and we as adults will model that
by sitting doing two hours of work and then going
I need to go and get a coffee or I'm just going
to go and talk to my colleague and you don't
sort of realize that the reason you're doing
that is because you actually just need to move
your body you need some vestibular input you
need some oral input you need just a break when
we do those things We're not doing it because
we've been told that at this time we need to
do it. We're doing it because we've recognized
that our body needs it. So if we can have options
available to children to go, hey, I'm noticing
this. Do you need this? It gives them the choice
rather than stop what you're doing on your sensory
diet. It says at 10 .45, we have to go and do
this thing. Sometimes that's not actually going
to be beneficial to them. yeah I completely agree
I completely agree it makes no sense to me to
have a particular movement break at a particular
time for so many reasons so many of my autistic
learners need to finish an activity have it completed
in order to move on and feel successful in that
and to transition out of that yeah stopping an
activity halfway through because we need to do
a sensory diet just would not be a regulating
thing to do in fact it would be a The complete
opposite would be a very dysregulating thing
to do. Even if it's an enjoyed activity and they're
not enjoying what they're doing, I still think
they would prefer to complete it than to move
on halfway through. So I suppose that's one thing
of why not to. But yeah, offering choices as
well. Like we said at the beginning, you know,
who are we to say they need alerting at this
point? Maybe they already alert because of what
we've been doing already in the day. And then
maybe they need something else to. to yeah fill
up their cup to not feel dysregulated um and
to feel like they can focus and choices are a
really great way to go if symbols are a really
great way um if your children can't understand
symbols if they're or if they're dysregulated
in the moment then objects or photos a really
great option sometimes when my students are regulated
uh dysregulated even though they can usually
use a communication book or a high -tech AAC
device to communicate they just can't because
they're in this fight fright freeze mode and
they can't process that question and all those
symbols or navigate their device so I will simply
show them two physical options that they can
do like a scooter board or an exercise board
or literally hold the exact objects in front
of them and they will either like reach for one
or look at one I think cool right that's what
we'll go for then so it's kind of moderating
your expectations I suppose as well on what's
realistic in that moment even though you know
that they can do it they might not be able to
do it right now absolutely and that is true for
all of us like we have so many skills and abilities
and when we're in a high pressure situation when
we're overstimulated when our needs aren't being
met all of our skills dwindle in their effectiveness
or our our capacity is like man like I can't
find the words right now I don't I can't locate
objects I can't do the things I need and so being
yeah giving giving them tangible options I always
say reduce stimulus and reduce demands wherever
possible go back to the basics and it's not about
trying to change or do something for the child.
I think the hierarchy here is what can we do
in the environment that's going to be supportive?
What can we do as ourselves, as the tools, the
humans around them before going to the child?
Because if we just focus solely on the child
and go, oh, you need to stop that. You need to
move from here. You need this. You need that.
And we're not going, actually, I could just dim
the lights a bit. I could turn the volume here
down. I could remove these things that are close
by them. I can myself. tap out to another person,
or I can take five deep breaths, wriggle my toes.
Once all of those things are done, if there's
still that level, that acuity of dysregulation,
then we go, okay, what does the child need? And
it's requiring you to do it really quickly. Like
this isn't, you're not stopping with a checklist
and going, okay, just give me five minutes. I'm
just going to look around the classroom. I'm
just going to check in with myself. You get,
over time, you practice this and you get really
quick at going, okay, environment, boom, boom,
boom, me, yeah what do I need okay and then you
go to the child so often though educators will
go straight to the child this child needs to
move we need to get them out of here we need
to do this thing to them or for them rather than
what's around them and what am I doing what what
how is my regulation impacting on them right
now that co -regulation stuff if I'm not feeling
regulated and it could have been because something
happened in my morning I ran out of coffee I
My son's school bag was dripping wet because
his drink bottle leaked from yesterday. I've
got an overdue bill. I come into school feeling
dysregulated. I'm already going to be more sensitive
to these things. But if I can recognize that
in myself, I'll go, okay, just give me a moment.
I'm just going to get my fidget. I'm going to
have a cold drink of water. When you approach
the child in a calm, regulated state, you're
going to get so much more. and responsiveness
and mirroring from them too. They mirror what
they feel. It's so true. I've noticed a massive
difference in how my team manage situations by
we all start a sensory circuit at the beginning
of the day and we all have, it's 45 minutes.
We all have 45 minutes at the beginning of the
day of connecting, having a snack, going on a
walk. doing a laminated task if you want to like
whatever you need going outside and then we so
we all do that and then we all come together
for the movement organizing and then grounding
stuff before we even start register and what
i've noticed because the adults are well it's
the luxury of special education right but what
we're what i've noticed is that it's so much
more effective that the adults leaving their
stuff at the door because they come in with it
and then they're co -regulating they're connecting
they're having snack with the children they're
having a drink they're having up going outside
we're doing movement we're doing organizing and
then we're doing grounding that stuff's gone
we've let it go so even if it has no impact on
the children whatsoever which it actually does
even if it didn't just regulating the adults
at the beginning of the day makes for such a
better day and then again after lunchtime because
you've checked your phone maybe something else
has stressed you out you've checked your bill
or you had a phone call from your student at
your children's school or whatever it is and
then you do the movement break again and again
you just let it go so that you can be present
in the moment because if we're in our own heads
there's no way we could connect with a child
because we're up here absolutely and that is
to me that's co -regulation is doing it together
and almost yeah being selfish in that of putting
our own mask on before we even attempt to support
them. I mean, who are we to say that we can support
somebody else in their recognition if we aren't
supporting ourselves, I suppose. It's a bit ironic,
isn't it? Which is why work on ourselves is the
biggest tool, I believe. Like, we can have as
many sensory resources, we can attend as many
courses. If you've done as much as you do and
you still sit there going, well, I... I don't
really know what I like, but I know that that's
annoying and I wouldn't do that myself, then
you haven't got the understanding of the whole
person, your whole self. I often give an example
of when I was young, it was told to me that I
was scared of having my blood taken or having
injections. I was very scared of needles. I was
told that I had a phobia because when I went
to have that done, I was dysregulated. I would
get upset. I would... You know, I don't think
I ever screamed and kicked, but it certainly
was showing that I didn't want to participate
in this. Sometimes it was necessary and it still
happened. As I got a bit older into my early
teens, I realized that I didn't have a phobia
of needles. The thing that I was afraid of was
the cotton wool. So the cotton wool that they
would put on to stem the bleeding and to hold
it there to apply pressure. I'm still so afraid
of that. I would rather hold a spider or a snake
than hold cotton wool. And so many people I come
across have no understanding of that. They're
like, that is so weird, Kelly. I completely agree.
It's so funny you say that. Do you know the name
of it? It's called Bamback Malleophobia. And
it's the cotton wool. It's a real thing. And
I totally agree. At my 16th birthday. I can't
even watch adverts with cotton wool in them.
But for my 16th birthday, one of my friends thought
it'd be really funny to stick my birthday card
at the bottom of a box full of like cotton wool
balls. And I cried. I would too. It's a real
thing. So yeah, I totally am validating your
fear of that. It's called Bambachomania phobia
and I have it too. There's no survival reason
why we should be. so horrified by that but it's
a thing it's a thing and it's crippling like
oh I can't like no thank you but once I got to
the point yeah I understood that about myself
and then I could say to the phlebotomist can
you just use a piece of tissue or hey here's
my arm stick the needle in like I've got lots
of tattoos and things now I have no fear of needles
But even to explain that to my mum down the track,
to be like, no, mum, I'm not afraid of needles.
She'd be like, well, how can you be afraid of
cotton wool? It's not a thing. But it is a thing
and it's real for me. If she had kept telling
me what I was afraid of and I wasn't able to
understand and learn about myself, it would have
been such a barrier for me moving forward. So
that narrative that... that we give to children,
we need to be so careful about what it is that
we're telling them. When we observe something,
say, oh, it's because of this. You feel this
way. You don't like this. But that's actually
quite unhelpful for them. Yeah, and it just comes
back down to just believe them. Even if it doesn't
make any sense, even if they're not in any danger.
or it's not hurting them. If they are reacting
as if it is, then we have to believe them. 100%.
And so if you and I were in the same room together
and there was cotton wool, we can protect each
other. Like, I am so fine to just like... I mean,
when I'm in that fight -flight mode, I'm not
protecting anyone. I am getting out of there.
Getting out! The flea response, like, get me
out of here. I feel clammy just thinking about
it. It's true, isn't it? It comes down to us
understanding our own regulation needs and being
confident enough to be able to voice those. And
then that allows others to be confident enough
to voice theirs. I suppose Christmas is a classic
time for cotton wool fears, isn't it? That everybody's
making snowman and stuff. And I've never done
that in my classroom. So my students have been
deprived of the cotton wool ball snowman because
I just will not do it. And I suppose what...
Then I need to also respect when my teaching
assistants say, I can't put my hand in that mud
or shaving foam. I have to wear gloves. Or to
respect my students when they say, I can't taste
that thing because I don't want to. And it just
comes down to, okay, that's obviously not good
for you. It doesn't mean that it's not, I don't
offer the opportunity to try. It's not that I'm
not curious about ways of supporting you with
that. It's just also doing that alongside believing
them. believing them absolutely and and having
the tolerance and patience to know that that
might change again just like when you know the
the ladder for eating different types of foods
knowing how many times it takes to try a different
food before you know if you like it or not saying
okay right now that you don't want to be around
that that's okay we might try again another day
and also knowing that some of those things just
won't they won't leave you like i some things
just don't leave and that's okay you just work
around them right you just you still go have
your blood taken but you don't and you don't
look at the things in the cosmetic aisle and
when your children say I want this to do a snowman
because I want to make Olaf you're like let's
use some paper yeah I suppose this leads perfectly
on to I need to be really aware of the privilege
and luxury that I have. I have other people in
the room to swap with. Lots of parents don't
have that luxury. They might be single parents
or lots of. as teaching assistants or paraprofessionals
are it's quite isolating they could maybe just
work with one -to -one with a child there's nobody
to swap with in those instances when you feel
yourself as an adult become dysregulated when
your children are asking of you what you cannot
give because it will lead you into a dysregulation
are there any strategies in those moments that
these isolated adults can use in order to help
themselves co -regulate with the child um to
be more effective than with them because swapping
out isn't an option or leaving and getting a
drink or leaving and doing a bit of break maybe
isn't an option yeah that's a great question
and it's so important to be compassionate towards
those people where that where their options are
limited i think depending on the situation the
environment you would look at it and say well
in this situation this could be an option but
on a broader level i think When we think about
feedback loops and we think about how when one
person is dysregulated, it feeds into the other
person and we kind of think of it as a circuit
that just keeps going around and around. I would
be imploring people when they're calm and able
to think about what could be some really good
circuit breakers. So I'm working with a family
at the moment where the mum and the daughter
are really feeding off each other a lot and we've
created a list of circuit breakers whereby one
of them... They have agreed that when there is
a feedback loop happening, when the adult is
getting quite dysregulated, it's okay for the
child to put on some music, to blast. There's
a certain song that they have both agreed, it's
okay if we play this music, and that's a way
of breaking the circuit. It's okay for one of
them to leave the situation. It's okay for one
of them to physically just go away from the room.
creating a list of circuit breakers to sort of
think, okay, it's not actually about fixing this
situation right now, and we don't know how long
this dysregulation will last. But if we continue
in this circuit, it's really going to get us
nowhere. We can see we're just going round and
round. But if we can find something that breaks
that circuit and sends us on a different path,
even if it just distracts us for two or three
minutes and then we come back, then we have another
circuit breaker. I really like the power of making
a fool out of myself, doing something that's
unexpected or just doing something that is going
to throw everything off. That can be a really
good... circuit breaker when you can't you know
change things around you or you don't have another
person to tap out with that makes sense yeah
that's really great it's really great to have
to when you are in a calm state have pre -planned
ideas maybe have grab and go bags maybe have
grab and go activities that either help you or
the child that you're working with to just give
yourself that minute that you need to just take
those breaths or give yourself those squeezes
or take yourself just pace yourself to have those
grab -and -go bags ready so that when they are
needed you can just get them and use them is
really great advice and and just yeah I would
love to hear more about this from those people
as to how they manage that um and I think a lot
that I've spoken to it's they end up in disassociation
there is no way out so their body finds them
a way out which is then not healthy long term
is it and yeah I want to get better at supporting
the people that don't have the option to do all
of those wonderful things that I can do in my
classroom I'm very aware that there's a different
community out there that maybe can't happen and
out yeah can't do those things so yeah Thank
you so much for joining me today. This was such
an important conversation of co -regulation.
I'm certainly going to take this conversation
into the week of a self -awareness of what I'm
feeling, an awareness of maybe what the other
adults in my room are feeling, and just making
sure that I'm narrating my needs as much as possible
to embed that ethos in my room of that we're
all. sensory beings and that it's it's all good
and that start from me i think is something that
i'm going to be taking in from the week so thank
you from that for that kelly you're welcome people
want to learn more about you and your work and
uh yeah follow your journey where can people
find you so i have a website www .thedifferentot
.co .nz and i'm also on social media as the different
OT. I really admire what you do in terms of putting
yourself out there and being front -facing in
terms of what you do. And I think it's really
awesome. It's something that's a goal for me
moving into the new year is to just be more vulnerable
and front -facing for potential clients and give
advice, support, ideas to people. So you can
check me out there if you want. And obviously
those that are actually in my country. And we
can potentially see each other inside my sensory
caravan. But I also do virtual support as well.
It sounds amazing, Kelly. Thank you so much.
And I really hope that you're listening to this
and feeling validated and seen and that you leave
with some realistic ideas on how to co -regulate
with the people that you work with. Thank you
so much, Kelly. You're welcome. Thank you for
having me.