Hi, my name is Jordan. I am a special education
teacher from the UK. I share my passion for everything
communication, sensory regulation and fun lesson
ideas for my classroom of disabled pupils aged
4 to 11. Each week I am joined by experts in
the field answering your questions and sharing
our knowledge and experience working alongside
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today. Now to the episode. Hello everybody and
welcome to the Sensory Classroom podcast. My
name is Jordan and today I am joined by Lucy
from Lucy Bates Children's OT. We're going to
talk about sensory circuits today. Lucy has worked
as an occupational therapist for over 20 years.
She has postgraduate training in sensory integration
alongside other topics. For the last 11 years,
she's been working as an independent therapist
running Lucy Bates Children's Occupational Therapy
Collective, a small team of therapists. Hi, Lucy.
Good morning. How are you? I'm good, thank you.
I feel really good about this topic. It's a question
I get lots on my DMs. I think sensory circuits
is a really hot topic at the moment and people
are thinking it's what they need and want, but
don't really know how to implement it or who
it's for or how to do it. So I'm really interested
to have this conversation with you today. Fantastic.
Yes, can't wait to get started. Amazing. So I
suppose the first question would be who... is
a sensory circuit for so a sensory circuit can
be for anybody anybody can benefit from a sensory
circuit we've all got sensory systems as human
beings so we all need you know there might be
periods during our day where we feel we need
to kind of support our regulation and our energy
match to what we're doing so it's about kind
of matching our energy levels to the activity
that we're doing so anybody can benefit from
a sensory circuit Is there any reason why, in
particular, this kind of sensory circuit is bounded
around the SEND schools or SEND children? Is
there anything about that category of children,
I suppose, where they might need a little bit
more input? Yes, so children with SEND particularly
may have differences in how they process sensory
information. So may need a little bit more support
in terms of supporting their regulation generally
to do activities. As human beings, as I've said
already, we've all got sensory systems and we
will have all developed different ways to support
our regulation. For example, I'm quite noise
sensitive. So I know that if I'm going into a
busy open office environment, that doesn't work
for me. I need some headphones to be able to
focus and concentrate and block everything else
out. The majority of us have got our own regulation
strategies that we have learnt and we use and
we implement on a day -to -day basis. Children
with SEND specifically might have more differences
in processing sensory information and haven't
quite worked out what helps them regulate as
yet. So a sensory circuit is one way of supporting
that regulation. Yeah, so I suppose some children
that are maybe more in tune with what their body
needs, can listen to their body and understand
what it needs, might be naturally, almost subconsciously,
regulating themselves throughout the day anyway.
They might be tapping their pen, wiggling their
feet, going for a drink and all of those kind
of things. Whereas maybe some of our SEND children,
especially with those interoception, that can't
really listen to their bodies that well, might
just need that more, you know, so I suppose supported
input. in order to stay regulated, is that right?
Yeah, especially I suppose our younger children
that haven't, as you said, worked out what works
for them yet in terms of working out what different
strategies they need to use at different points
during the day to be able to, as you say, to
kind of energy matching and be able to match
their alertness levels to their activity that
they're doing. So something more structured and
a bit more supported by the adults that are working
with them can then support that regulation. but
a sensory circuit goes through things in in more
of a structured way rather than oh we're just
going to go and have a movement break or we're
just going to go and you know sit with some music
on so it follows more of a structure Are we all
right explaining a little bit more about that
structure? Because you mentioned, you compared
it to movement break. I think that's the perfect
example and comparison of how it is different.
I've noticed that sensory circuits are, because
of the structure of the sensory circuit, my children
are coming back far more regulated and grounded
and ready to work than... just the movement break
alone so a movement break tends to be more focused
just around those kind of alerting activities
so you might find with a movement break if you're
just putting say like a song on the whiteboard
or we're going to get up and do some star jumps
those children that maybe are a little bit more
sensitive to the bigger movements might then
become over alert and then find it much more
difficult to kind of then settle a sensory circuit
follows three kind of distinct zones or types
of activity if you like so you start with your
with your alerting part of your sensory circuit
which is designed to kind of really wake up the
body The organising section, which is your bit
in the middle, involves much more kind of activities
that involve more organisation, planning, sequencing
of movement. And it's really trying to access
that kind of frontal lobe and cortex of the brain
to be able to kind of help. work out kind of
planning and organization of movement so there's
a bit more thought that goes into the organization
section of a sensory circuit in terms of the
movements and the activities that we're wanting
our children and young people to engage with
and then you always end your sensory circuit
with a calming activity and the idea of that
is that you've kind of alerted the sensory system
you've then organized it and then we've kind
of brought it back down again to kind of really
again match the the alertness level of the activity
that you're then wanting to move so i suppose
if you're only doing a movement break or a dance
break you're only meeting that alerting stage
that first stage aren't you you're completely
skipping that organization that kind of coordination
setting your body right And that grounding, which
actually I would say are the crucial bits for
those busy children because they're probably
already in the alerting stage. the fundamental
thing of that grounding and focusing. Yes. So
kind of with a movement break, yeah, typically
you might have said in the past for a movement
break, right, we're going to kind of, we're going
to get up and we're going to run on the spot
or we're going to twirl around in circles or
we're going to do, say like a dance video or
some movement songs, something like head, shoulders,
knees and toes or, you know, anything like that.
basically yeah that the idea of that is that
you're alerting your sensory system so you're
waking it up but what then you're doing with
the movement break as you said is you're kind
of missing out that completely fundamental right
we're now going to organize and calm our sensory
systems down we've just woken them up and then
so you're expecting then children to be able
to kind of be really in this heightened alert
state to then move straight into typically what
happens is kind of a more focused yes activity
so you're kind of alerting children and bringing
their sensory systems wide awake and really kind
of hyper alert and then you're expecting them
to kind of calm down and focus on something and
the jump is too much we need to support with
that organisation and that calming. Yeah. So
if you're noticing in your classrooms or in your
home that you're doing movement breaks and then
children are then wired, they can't then sit
and focus and concentrate. Maybe that's why.
Maybe it's because you're missing these two really
fundamental steps of the organisation and the
grounding. I suppose that leads me on to it's
not just for classrooms, is it? When and where
would be good for you to do the sensory circuit?
So sensory circuit can be done. anywhere so they
could be done at home or at school um anytime
that you're noticing that your child needs to
regulate and to be able to as i say match to
the activity that you're doing so if your child
is at home and is becoming dysregulated i've
got lots of families that i work with that will
do a sensory circuit kind of before that before
a meal time before kind of when they come home
from school so that they are kind of, especially
those children that maybe hold it together all
day at school and that are really struggling
to get that regulation in at school, they will
come home and do a sensory circuit because then
it supports that transition from home to school
and then into their kind of activities after
school or whatever that is. So, you know, and
especially again on weekends, holidays, things
like that, so they can be done. anywhere across
kind of both home or school environments yeah
so anywhere before or after a kind of sitting
activity i suppose it could be from the car or
bedtime or in a taxi anything like that can't
it yeah so if you've as i say if you've kind
of come in and you've had children that have
come into to school on taxis or as kind of long
car journeys doing something to aid that transition
when they come in of a morning or again kind
of vice versa when they get home we would if
It's about kind of interspersing them during
the day. So in an ideal world, you'd have them
kind of across the day at home and at school
for those children that need them so that you're
not almost waiting for that child to become dysregulated
to do it. It's about drip feeding into support
that regulation throughout the day rather than
waiting for a child to become dysregulated. And
then we're going to do a sensory circuit because
if we've waited till they've become dysregulated,
it's probably a bit too late. Yeah, I think that's
really fundamental. And I think that's also where
lots of schools are going wrong is they are waiting
and waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, not realising
the child is bubbling, bubbling, bubbling, bubbling.
And then it's too late before they've realised
that they need it. It is so, it's fundamental
really for it to be before they need it. The
idea is to keep that regulation as much as we
can. So that they don't have to bubble over because
it takes so much longer to get them back into
that regulated state once they've over spilled,
doesn't it? Yeah, completely. And if you've got
a child that's really dysregulated, their ability
to, especially within that kind of organisation
section, if you've got a child that's dysregulated,
they're... they're kind of they're in that fight
or flight they're kind of their reptilian brain
is the one that's working so their ability to
process language to plan their movements to organize
themselves is going to be kind of on the floor
so if you're then asking them to engage in something
that's either really alerting or kind of organizing
their ability to do that is just going to be
kind of non -existent it's going to be really
impacted upon so you need as i say you need to
drip feed it so even if children look like they're
okay actually we still need to be doing these
sensory circuits we still need to be doing these
regulation activities to support that continued
regulation throughout the day you don't want
to kind of spike and wait for that spike because
it's too late it's too late yeah completely we
do whole class sensory circuits as soon as they
come in so lots of my children are transported
on the taxi so some of them have been on the
taxi for 45 minutes which is an incredibly long
time and probably waiting for the taxi before
that so they probably haven't had movement for
about an hour which is massive for my class so
we all do sensory circuit we spend about 45 minutes
to an hour at the beginning of the day but it
doesn't have to be that long it can be you know
15 minutes right at the start of the day we do
it and then we do it after every play time so
after break time after lunch time and then just
before home time as well so that's our whole
class once however some of my students need far
more than that so between every single micro
activity as part of a lesson so even between
moving from table to group area or group area
to the computer area they are doing a mini circuit
so they'll do a little bounce on the exercise
ball and then they'll do some rolling and then
they'll do some squeezes and then back and then
that takes minutes but they need a lot more drip
fed into that so i suppose it works really well
doesn't it as a whole class kind of system with
pillars in the day but for those children need
even more you can then do those little individual
inputs of that Yeah completely so you can do
them as part of a whole group and I was in a
school yesterday and we were thinking about kind
of adapting what we're doing with the sensory
circuit to meet everybody's needs because we'd
got some students that were quite physically
capable and able and up on their feet and then
we'd got some students that had more kind of
motor challenges and were in wheelchairs and
we were thinking about how we could adapt the
activities within that sensory circuit so that
everybody kind of could join in so there's lots
of things there's lots of different ways of adapting
kind of the sensory circuit for kind of children
as i say that are more able and up on their kind
of motor mobility wise they're up on their feet
right through to children with kind of really
severe motor difficulties that are say wheelchair
users to still be able to kind of be alert organize
their movements and then kind of experience that
calming so it's You know, it's something that
can be done with a whole wide range of children
with a whole wide range of needs. Yeah, and a
whole range of interests as well. I find we can
be really creative with how we get that alerting.
I suppose alerting is all about spiking that
kind of heart rate, I suppose. So for some of
my non -ambulant wheelchair users, it looks like
putting on some really fun music and spinning
them around in their chair and wiggling them
and tickling them. uh scaring them like always
like like don't care kind of thing but like some
of them really love that and it's about raising
their heart rate and they really get alert which
is so important when you're a wheelchair user
especially if you um around that kind of physio
time you need that movement you need that alert
alertness what would organizing look like for
a wheelchair user and then as well as grounding
So I think it's important to think about, we
tend to focus on movement and really hitting
that kind of proprioceptive vestibular system
when we're thinking about kind of sensory strategies.
But it's important not to forget your other senses
as well. So in terms of kind of backtracking
a little bit in terms of alerting, you could
use smells to kind of, you know, wake people
up as well as music or as lights. I talk a lot
when I'm talking to... teachers and parents about
kind of the wider environment so it's thinking
about how does our environment change so alerting
you might want to open the doors and put the
lights on and if you've got some you know kind
of bright materials and thinking about kind of
those children with really severe needs that
maybe struggle to kind of access things with
our hands as well you know we've used water bottles
to kind of spray with kind of cold water or kind
of ice and things like that to kind of as you
say really wake the system up so there's so much
that you can do with your other senses as well
as your movement so you haven't got to necessarily
rely just so much on the movement size of things
it's really thinking about your environment so
in your alerting section you know the tone of
voice that you use might be different we might
be really as we kind of coined the phrase, panto
it up a little bit. So you might be loud, your
voice is going to be louder, you might start
singing or... using bottles filled with kind
of rice or lentils or pasta and you kind of shake
it round. And so it's really, you know, hitting
all of the senses. Obviously, you've got to work
with the children that you need and you don't
want to completely overwhelm them and end up
like a rabbit in the headlights. But it's maybe
choosing a few of those different things to think
about. Organising -wise, it's things that, as
I say, take a little bit more planning in terms
of movement. So for our more kind of... physically
mobile children it's having things like stepping
stones or leap pads so even if they're just kind
of walking from one to another even if that's
with a handheld or a peanut ball is almost like
you know your best friend because you can do
alerting organizing and calming with a peanut
ball so with kind of one piece of equipment you
can you can hit all of those things so you know
if parents are ever saying to me what equipment
can i buy a peanut ball is is the is the way
to go for a kind of cheap, easy, accessible piece
of equipment. Another one is tractor tyres or
car tyres. We can do rolling and chasing after
them for their alerting. We can stack them because
they're quite heavy, especially if you've got
bigger. pmld children or bigger disabled children
and they need bigger equipment for to feel that
weight i often find that tires are great so you
can stack them to get that heavy lifting that
coordination or you can balance on them you can
step inside them all that kind of love organizing
stuff and then grounding we can sit in them and
it gives you a lovely hug and you can kind of
squeeze it so yeah car tires and garages give
them away they don't want them so yeah if you
live near me like in cornwall in the countryside
then tractor tires are amazing but if you just
have car tires that works well that works really
well yeah completely kind of organizing is anything
where there's going to be a bit of element of
thought to the movement so say alerting you might
be spinning on the spot and you're just kind
of spinning there there's yes you kind of have
to plan where you're putting your feet but if
that's something that you engage with all the
time then that's not a huge amount of kind of
planning and organization but kind of organizing
wise it might be sitting on a peanut ball and
we've got targets on the wall And we're going
to kind of hit those in a bit of a pattern if
you're kind of at that level to be able to be
working on, you know, remembering a pattern of
different coloured spots. It could be we're going
to jump from one stepping stone to another. It
could be that we've got, my other favourite one
is balloons filled with just a tiny little bit
of rice. And you could do some throwing and catching
with a balloon or even some batting with a balloon.
That's really lovely because the rice in the
balloon makes a lovely sound, but it also helps
guide where the balloon is going a little bit.
So if you've got those children that are still
working on their throwing and catching skills,
the ability for them to have a little bit more
time while they're waiting for the balloon to
come to them to be able to plan their movements
in order then to catch it or bat it works really
well with a balloon if they're really struggling
with throwing and catching with a ball. So that's
another. organizing activity anything where you're
kind of pushing pulling carrying heavy work type
things so washing baskets garden tubs are brilliant
we do things like weighted skittles so again
filling pot bottles up with rice lentils bird
seed and then throwing a ball at them and seeing
how many you can knock down that kind of goes
within your organizing section coordination balance
orientating their bodies that cross motor stuff
even yeah with your hands all of that yeah coordination
kind of stuff it's not as um frantic and uh free
as the alerting stage is it there's a little
bit more planning motor planning yeah do you
sometimes find that i sometimes find that for
some of mine the alerting and then the organizing
and the grounding is kind of a bit too separate
I kind of need to fill in little activities in
between them as well so sometimes I do a few
activities in the organizing stage to kind of
bring it down so we do the alerting which might
be chasing for example and then they're really
alert and then that first organizing would be
maybe a circuit so like an obstacle course maybe
because that's still lots of movement but it's
not It's still quite heightened, but then we
couldn't go straight from that to grounding.
So then we kind of might do some heavy work and
then we might come in and do some puzzles or
threading and then they're ready for grounding.
It's almost like I kind of stretch that organizing
stage into even more kind of STEM almost for
some of mine. Yeah, I think it's finding what
works for the group of children that you're working
with. So I work a lot in specialist settings
where actually they're kind of adults. focused
activity is would be something that's threading
or um you know a jigsaw puzzle or something like
that so that in itself takes so much kind of
almost brain power that you almost need to go
through the alerting organizing calming to then
get to that point whereas i also work across
some mainstream settings where actually yeah
drawing for some children or coloring or you
know sitting doing a jigsaw puzzle is part of
that kind of organisation strategy. So it's really
homing it into the kind of cohort and group of
children that you're working with. And I think
the carving then also is really dependent because
I've got some children that really love doing
yoga. Well, you'd think yoga kind of would fit,
you know, maybe within your organisation because
that takes quite a lot of planning. But for them...
kind of the putting their body into familiar
positions and then really working on their breathing
is really calming so and that's almost quite
a you know yoga itself is quite a nice kind of
transitional activity from that organizing into
calming because you could do some of the kind
of the poses and then actually you're doing the
kind of the lying down closing eyes meditation
being still bit for part of your calming And
again, here, the environment is really important.
So with your calming, you're wanting to have
your lights turned off. You're wanting to be
talking. If you're talking at all, we're talking
in single words and whispers. We're not having
conversations within kind of the group that we're
in. It's actually, you know, we're just being
quiet. The lights are down. And if you're using
smells and scents, you might then use a different
scent for calming as you would do for alerting.
So it's really thinking about. the whole sensory
environment rather than we're just going to do
some movement. Love that. I think that's really
important and that is something that I miss.
That's something that I'm definitely going to
take from this conversation is not just doing
the right activities, but also thinking about
the whole environment. You know, yes, we might
be calming, but if there's adults moving around
and sorting bags and talking to each other, that's
not going to be the calming environment. So it's
about a whole holistic view on what else is going
on, isn't it? Yeah. And you really, really see
a shift. You know, you might be doing a sensory
circuit. And, you know, I appreciate that schools
are busy places and there is a lot to do. And,
you know, teachers and, you know, we're all juggling
lots of plates all at the same time. But the
change in actually we're going to sit here and
we're going to do some calming whilst then the
other four members of staff are moving bags around
and chatting between themselves to actually we're
all going to sit and do this and the lights are
going to be down. And if we have to speak, it's
going to be in the smallest of whispers. The
difference then is. is massive and you'll you'll
kind of reap those rewards yeah and then more
regulated as well you know it's about correlation
isn't it and we couldn't possibly regulate our
children if we're not regulated so the fact that
my team are involved in the circuit is crucial
i think because then we're all regulated together
we're all focused we're bringing the whole room
down it's not about the children Yeah. Completely,
especially our children with SEND who are relying
on us to co -regulate them. If we're not, you
know, if we're still as adults busy moving around
and we're not kind of in that space with them
and especially the calming section, well, all
of the sections, it's actually really lovely
for building relationships and a tuning in and
finding out what works for that child. I suppose
the bonus with your organisation. section is
that you're doing a bit of sneaky fine motor
gross motor work too at the same time so if you're
thinking about okay well we might be doing the
organizing part in different positions so we
might be making marks on a wall with some chalk
or we might be hitting a target or we might be
lying on our tommies to do a jigsaw puzzle Well,
then you're working the core and your shoulder
stability, which is going to then have benefits
for your mark making and your handwriting and
all your fine motor skills. So you're kind of
lots of benefits, you know, you're getting lots
of benefits from doing kind of a set of activities
that is going to then impact on their regulation,
but also on their motor skills and their core
stability, which is going to help with the activities
that you're then going to want to be doing for
the rest of the day. motivation as well if it
looks less like schoolwork like classwork if
it's not at the table if it's on tummies on the
floor outside all of those kind of things I think
children just be more motivated to do it because
it just looks more fun yeah it is and it's about
bringing the fun especially to those those kind
of two bits and then You know, we're going into
school environments and children, you know, schools
are busy places. And especially for some of our
children that are in mainstream settings that
have got those sensory processing differences.
You know, I've been into a reception classroom
in the last few weeks. And my goodness, reception
classrooms are busy, busy, noisy places. But
actually giving those children, especially within
the calming part, just like five minutes just
to be. Actually, everyone's going to be quiet
and everyone's going to be still. And we're just
going to kind of focus on just having that time
to almost decompress is really important for
those children as well. So it's got a huge range
of benefits. You say it's not just for the send.
It helps everybody. It supports everybody, doesn't
it? I suppose a question that I always get is
if a child is already in alert state. If they're
already, say, climbing and jumping and jumping
on others, they're clearly alert state. Is it
still important to follow alerting, organising
or grounding or not? So if a child is already
alert, my kind of first thought is we don't want
to alert them anymore, especially if that's then
a mismatch to the activities. that they should
be or need to be or are expected to be engaged
with. However, you've got some children that
are so routine focused that actually if we suddenly
decided that we're going to miss out the alert
section today, that is going to cause more dysregulation.
So for the children that will notice and get
dysregulated if we've missed that whole stage
of the sensory circuit out, I would say, right,
we're going to... And this is why it's really
useful to have a bank of activities to choose
from. We're still going to do something alerting,
but it's going to be, as you talked about before,
that kind of joining, kind of conjoining section
of that activity that's maybe got a little bit
of alerting, but maybe more organizing to it.
So say an obstacle course where we've got to
kind of slow down and think about what we're
doing, or you do an alerting and it's tiny. It's
literally like, you know. two minutes a minute
and it's like okay we're done with that now if
you're using like a visual task board to support
with that kind of transition from one activity
to another lots of the schools that I work on
with have got powerpoint so if they're kind of
trying to do it in the classroom and they've
got the kind of the classroom space to do it
they've got a powerpoint that they kind of show
up to the whole class with symbols on and kind
of visual support so the children know what section
of the sensory circuit they're doing And it might
be that actually if we've come in from break
time and we're all really quite alert, our alerting
section is going to be super, super tiny today.
And we're going to pick some things that are
maybe alerting, but have got more of an organisation
element to it. Because, yeah, if we're already
alert, then we don't need to be alerting. anymore
yeah that makes sense and after playtime is a
classic example lots of our children will have
been running for ages all lunch times you've
kind of done your alerting already and in fact
even lining up and walking in could be your organizing
you might just need to do grounding so it's about
thinking about the big picture about what their
bodies have just been doing and what they actually
what stage they're already at i suppose completely
and i think it's matching that with the expectations
from the for the children so if they know that
they're doing a sensory circuit and they know
they have to do kind of three activities if you
like if yeah if we're already kind of alert it's
like okay well we've we've done lots of running
you know if you've got a child that you can have
that conversation with we've done lots of running
so we've done our alerting section what are we
going to do now and i think for some of our children
to kind of keep the the motivation and the engagement
mixing it up a little bit as well so not doing
the same things every time we want our children
to be have a wide range of sensory strategies
that they can access so we need to be kind of
trying these out and a sensory circuit is a really
good place to try lots of different regulation
strategies or activities out with children to
find out what they like we're all individual
are all our sensory systems are individual and
what works for one isn't going to necessarily
work for another So if we're changing it up and
swapping it around, you can then find out what
works for that individual child and help them
develop a bank of strategies. Because what we
want eventually is for children to be able to
develop their own self -regulation strategies
and find out what works for them. So it's about
kind of using a different range, but also giving
children the choice. So I've got a young man
that we've got like a bank of activities in each
one, and he likes to feel like he's in control
of what he's doing. doing so he will kind of
choose and put on his sensory circuit board which
activities he would like to do that day and that
and that works for him whereas other times we
kind of move move from kind of alert it into
organizing into calming quite seamlessly almost
within one activity so we'd got some blocks for
example and and we were kind of throwing the
blocks and and then crashing into them so that
was kind of our alerting and then we built an
obstacle course, which then turned into like
a yoga bed. And then he lay down in his yoga
bed and we covered him with blankets and he did
his kind of calming section. And that was his
sensory circuit done. But actually for him, what
we were doing was playing with the blocks. It
was just actually, we were playing with them
in different ways to be able then to support
his regulation. And after that, he went, transitioned
back into class and sat and did some English
work. So it's about finding what works for you.
children that you're working with and what what
kind of motivates them and makes them tick I
do find for those children with a PDA profile,
the more control and autonomy you can give them
over the sensory circuit, the more successful
it's going to be. So yeah, maybe they choose
what they do in their alerting, what they do
in their organising, what they do in their grounding.
So they've got some control over that. And maybe
they decide when they're ready to move on as
well. So there's less demands there. You're joining
and join the fun, I think is the most important
thing. Join them, have it be a co -regulation
rather than an instruction for them to do, I
think are great strategies for those kind of.
children as well yeah and be prepared to get
involved and you know you do it too so we all
did the um we all built the obstacle course and
we all had to go and then you know he had his
yoga bed but i was lying down next to him with
my blanket over me and we were doing it together
so it was we were kind of meeting him where he
was at but we all joined in so it wasn't like
well i'm the adult and i'm gonna sit here and
tell you what to do and you're gonna do it it
was actually we're all gonna do this together
and we talked as we were doing it about how our
bodies were feeling and that's the other really
important part is if you've got children that
can access that level of kind of communication
whether it be through symbols or verbal language
having a chat or making a comment about how your
body feels in those different states and it's
not linking that necessarily to emotions but
it's thinking about actually oh i'm feeling like
quite relaxed now i feel like i could go and
sit and do something or or you know before you
start my body feels like i need to move i'm going
to do some movement and how that then feels so
i think it's thinking You know, it's making those
links between the activities that we're doing
and then how that impacts on our bodies and how
it makes our bodies feel too. It's crucial, isn't
it, for us to join in and be narrating in that
way so that then, because ultimately we want
them to be independent adults as much as they
can be that regulate. and know this themselves
we don't want them to be solely reliant on adults
if that is possible and we want to build that
understanding for them i suppose another question
i always get similar to the alerting model they're
kind of opposite we often have some clients quite
sluggish and slow children that hard to get up
and go their executive function you know is hard
to get them to get up and go they're often in
their chair and and quite slow not focused though
not regular But in that kind of more sluggish
kind of way. Head on the table, completely like,
yes. Really fatigue, it seems. You know, their
body's heavy. Would you still do it in the order
of alerting, organising and finishing with grounding?
Or would you do something different with these
children? So it kind of almost in the flip reverse,
I would do more alerting with those children.
and probably less kind of calming at the end.
So your calming would almost be, right, okay,
we might do some bubbles, for example. We might
blow some bubbles and I want you to blow them
and then I want you to watch them. Okay, that's
our calming done and we're going to move on to
something else now. So it's about kind of catching
them when they, so you want to do maybe more
of that alerting and really thinking about that
whole sensory system alerting. So move, you know,
they probably don't want to get up and move.
But actually, if you put some different music
on or pool noodle drumming seems to be like magic
for some of the kids that I work with. So even
if, you know, they don't want to stand up and
they're like, you know, a bit very, very low
arousal levels. Actually, if you're doing Queen,
we will rock you with some pool noodles and you're
really banging them on the table and you're waving
them in the air and you're kind of doing that
very rhythmic movement. That seems to kind of
wake them up without them having to get up and
get moving in that way. Then your organizing
section is probably, again, a little bit more
on the alerting side of your organizing section.
So you might be doing things with lights or kind
of more movement based. And then your calming
is kind of really short. And then we're going
to move on because you don't want to spend. So
long on kind of your organizing, calming, then
they're kind of back down where they were again
before they start. Right, because, yeah, you've
undone all of your hard work with the alerting,
haven't you, in that sense? Yes. I suppose with
how long they should last as well, that's individualized
too, isn't it? It's hard to say, isn't it? It's
hard to answer that question. I find it really
difficult to answer, but it's kind of a gut sense
when you're working with the child or with the
group, you know, when they're ready to move on
from each section. You can tell a child when
they've done enough alerting, they will automatically
start to wane. You can see that they, you know,
any child, and I've got really busy alert children
in my classroom, but even still, you can see
a change in them from needing that alerting to
actually. They start to come down on their own.
They start to do it differently. And then it's
time to move on. In an ideal world, if you have
got free reign of how long this can take, I suppose,
would there be a minimum time to do a sensory
circuit in total to kind of really, you know,
give it all? I think we tend to, it's really
difficult because I suppose, more you're geared
by what else is going on and how many of the
plates that person is spinning at the one time.
I think, you know, three minutes in each section
is probably like your minimum. Yeah, I agree.
I think with, I suppose, with some of the children
that I work with, that they, and only a handful,
will seek so much movement and then will just
get so wired. that I suppose that's the section
that I'm kind of a bit more wary about going
on for longer periods of time. Because say if
you're using a spinning chair, for example, and
you've got a child spinning for like 10 minutes,
they're either going to come off and feel a bit
sick or they're going to be so wired because
they've had all that rotatory vestibular input
that really has kind of impacted on their nervous
system. There's kind of a general rule that that
kind of input lasts in your system for about
eight hours. So if you've done lots of kind of
changing of head position and spinning and moving
around and loads of rough and tumble and you've
got a child that will seek that out but will
just keep seeking and just don't know when to
stop and then will literally be bouncing off
the walls, then they become kind of a... really
dysregulated because their bodies are so wired
and they almost don't know what to do with themselves
that can last for a long time whereas your proprioceptive
heavy work type input only really lasts for about
two hours the kind of effect of that on the body
so if you're trying to kind of balance or or
yeah kind of tipping point against this rotary
vestibular input that this children really really
really wired because we've done like 15 minutes
of alerting you're almost going to need 45 minutes
of of kind of heavy work proprioceptive type
activity to try and counter balance that yeah
okay so i'd almost be saying actually for the
alerting i'd be a little bit more wary on doing
that for really extended periods of time if you're
doing anything for an extended period of time
it'd be your organizing section Yes. Yeah. Yeah.
That makes sense. It makes perfect sense. Totally.
And yeah, I didn't know about the whole eight
hours thing. That's so interesting. Yeah. And
then that can really impact on sleep. So if you're
thinking about doing these at home, again, it's
thinking about that alertness levels as an energy
batch to what you're doing. So if you were going
out to run a race and you were going out to do
a sprint, then my daughter swims competitively.
So before a race, we really want her to be like
highly alert. We want her to, you know, blood
pumping, heart beating. she's going to go but
it takes her a good couple of hours to come down
after a race before then she's going to sleep
so if you've got a child that is seeking so much
movement so much kind of what we call this rotary
vestibular where there's so much kind of changes
in direction they're hanging upside down they're
spinning they're climbing and then crashing and
you're doing that before they go to bed you're
going to massive energy mismatch them between
where their alertness levels are and where they
need to be in order to settle to sleep so if
you're doing sensory circuits towards or any
sensory regulation activities before towards
the end of the day you really want them to be
organizing and calming rich and you want that
alerting to be like as small as possible because
with your organization as well you are hitting
and you're feeding your proprioceptive sense
and your proprioceptive sense is your organizing
sense and that's what helps you kind of organize
your body and get your your kind of upstairs
brain and your downstairs brain talking to one
another so yeah if you're hitting it with proprioception
you're supporting that but if you're doing lots
of alerting you're gonna have this real mismatch
between where people need to be it makes perfect
sense thank you so much this is definitely a
podcast that i'm going to be sharing Again, in
my DMs, you've just saved me so much time. For
these questions, I can just ping, have a listen
to this. Because so many people want to get it
right. They hear the sensory circuit. They think,
yeah, that's exactly what I need. Movement breaks
aren't working as much as they could. You know,
this is exactly what I need. This is the kind
of stuff we need to know. It's exactly there.
You know, the permission of... And advice on
what you've given is so helpful. So we thank
you so much for joining on this podcast, Lucy.
I know it's going to be really helpful for so
many people. No, thank you. And I think it's
thinking as well about, we think about sensory
circuits for kind of primary school children.
And then it's thinking about, well, hey, I've
got a teenager or a young person that, you know,
how do we do that and how do we make that appropriate?
looking at your joe wicks work it's looking at
your gym equipment it's looking at you know weights
and i suppose more age appropriate things in
terms of adapting that if you've got the principles
of okay well this is what this section means
and this is what this section means and this
is what we're aiming to get out of it you can
really then try and adapt it for for children
and young people of different ages and stages
and abilities Yeah, absolutely. It is suitable
for everybody. The concept is alerting, organizing,
grounding. What that looks like is totally individualized.
And you can work, I would work with the young
person, the young adult on what that looks like
for them. You know, I think that's, I think,
yeah, I think it is suitable for everybody. And
your team as well, your team of adults. If you
work in an office, you know, if you're the boss
in an office, think about... this circuit as
well you know it is really is useful for everybody
that's doing a long sitting focusing activity
isn't um yeah it isn't childish to do that regulated
yeah i think that's great advice on on where
to finish if people want to find out more about
your practice especially if they're in the midlands
area or just find out more about you and your
work and um yeah visit your website where would
they go for that Okay, so we're a really small
team. There's me and about kind of six others
that work across kind of West Midlands, Worcestershire,
Dudley, Sandville, Birmingham. My website is
www .lucybatesot .co .uk and we are also on Instagram
and Facebook with if you put Lucy Bates Children's
OT into either of those platforms, you'll be
able to find us. amazing thank you so much lucy
for joining um and thank you for sharing so much
of your wisdom it's been really helpful thank
you for inviting me i've really enjoyed it