Hi, my name is Jordan. I am a special education
teacher from the UK. I share my passion for everything
communication, sensory regulation and fun lesson
ideas for my classroom of disabled pupils aged
4 to 11. Each week I am joined by experts in
the field answering your questions and sharing
our knowledge and experience working alongside
our beautiful young people. Let's get started.
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today. Now to the episode. Hello everybody and
welcome to the Sensory Classroom podcast. My
name is Jordan and today I am joined by Sophia
and Ellie from Regulate to Communicate to talk
about their system that they have developed and
how that may be able to. help you and your students
or your children. Hello ladies. Thank you for
having us, it's very nice to be here. Of course,
I've been looking forward to it. We've had a
little mini chat before haven't we and it all
sounded really exciting and I tried not to delve
too much because I wanted to learn it all now
but it was really difficult because it all sounds
amazing. Would you like to describe a little
bit about what you do and who you are? What Regulate
to Communicate is? yeah absolutely so regulate
to communicate is an approach to learning that
we've developed and it sort of works on the understanding
that in order for students to be able to engage
when they're at school they have to be regulated
and they have to have the means to be able to
communicate and when you've got those two things
it can really support um you know students who
be able to engage better when they're at when
they're at school yeah it's very much been a
a massive passion project for us so I'm a speech
and language therapist and Ellie's an occupational
therapist And we were both working in the same
setting and we were working on the same cases.
And quite organically, we created this whole
approach because I was finding as a speech therapist,
you can't just look at speech and language. You
can't just look at communication in isolation.
Because a lot of the young people I was working
with were really struggling with their sensory
processing. And Ellie was finding the same. So
Ellie was... trying to support young people to
stay regulated and look at their sensory processing
needs. But actually, you can't look at that without
communication. So we started working together
more and more. We thought, oh, this works. If
you put both of these approaches together and
work on them in a really holistic way, the outcomes
you're getting is so much greater. So from that,
we kind of designed Regulate to Communicate.
The programme made the three stages, kind of
gave it a lot, tried it out a lot, didn't we?
With a lot of different young people in a lot
of different settings. And we found the impact
is, it was huge. It was really huge. And engagement
really increased. So we're really keen just to
kind of share that with as many people as possible,
really, because we know it can make such a big
difference in classrooms, but also at home. What
were you seeing before you started this system,
before you were together? I suppose this is a
question for both of you separately. You know,
what were you seeing in speech and language that
really needed that regulation input? And what
were you seeing in your sensory system work that
really you felt like needed that communication
input? Yeah, I mean. I would often go into the
classroom and say, for example, we've got a child
that's really dysregulated. They're not accessing
anything in the environment. They're just spending
a lot of the time kind of moving around the space,
not really doing anything purposeful, kind of
quite distressed. And they'll sort of call me
in to go, oh my word, they're really dysregulated.
What are we going to do? And I'll go in with
all my strategies around deep pressure and proprioception
and using a gym ball and how we can kind of make
that movement more purposeful to help calm and
regulate. the young person. Had nothing to tell
them what I was going to do, if that made sense.
So I kind of go in and be like, right, well,
this is what I want to do. We need to get to
here. But how am I going to communicate this
to this young person? And if the classroom didn't
already have a communication system in place
for that young person, which was often the case,
you know, you'd go in and you'd go, OK, what
are we using here? Are we using a choice board?
You know, are we using symbols? Are we using
Makaton? And sometimes, you know, that wasn't
there. So it was really difficult. to do without
having that foundation of communication and certainly
see that i've seen that in my room for sure that
yes they're very you know sensory seeking children
and they need that proprioception but also it
wasn't just that that was called that lack of
that that was causing dysregulation it was anxiety
over not knowing what's next over not understanding
or not feeling understood so i guess that kind
of comes in there would you agree Yeah, I mean,
from my point of view, I was often called in
to say, we need to give this young person a voice.
That's, you know, we're trying everything. But
actually this child just isn't engaging in it.
He's throwing these symbols in their face. We've
got sim, we've got choice balls, we've got alien
language displays. But this child isn't responding.
And often what I was seeing was this child whose
needs just weren't being met. So they were in
this state of dysregulation. They were seeking
things out, whether that was more movement, whether
that was deep pressure. So because they were
feeling dysregulated, because they weren't feeling
comfortable in their body, they weren't feeling
safe in their body, they're not going to communicate.
We know how the brain develops, that if we don't
feel safe, the language part of our brain isn't
doing all that lovely firing that we want it
to. So by putting in those sensory strategies,
you can make your child feel really safe and
give them the best chance to engage in communication
systems. So often I was being called in saying,
OK. Can you help us put in a communication book?
I thought, we need to take a couple of steps
back here because this young person does not
feel safe. And until they do, we could use all
the best symbols in the world, but they're not
going to because we're exactly the same. If I'm
feeling anxious, if I'm nervous about something,
I don't really want to have a chat about it.
I want to go and hide under a blanket usually.
We're exactly the same. We don't want to communicate
when we feel anxious. And then what you're ending
up with is if you do go in with, oh, well, yeah,
we could use a communication book and you've
handed that strategy over to the teaching assistant
or the teacher, then it doesn't work. And then...
you know then that's really demoralizing for
the staff that are trying to implement this thing
that this therapist has come in and said to use
but actually there's a bit before that that we
need to do before we even get to that communication
and i think that's where the ot and the speech
therapy works nicely hand in hand and the regulation
the communication it's so complementary and you
really can't do one without the other you've
got to do them both together and that's where
we've seen it work most effective is when we
both go in the classroom together and we see
that young person and we use the strategies together
and then pass that over to the teaching staff
and they use the strategies together and that's
what they've shared is that it only really works
when we're using it jointly. I think it's really
hard as well for teaching staff and also for
parents because they have all these professionals
come in. gives them all this advice and then
the pressure is on them to pull it all together
and to think and sometimes like that is all great
advice and it's all needed yeah but maybe it's
not possible all at once to do everything as
much as you want to do so you might be given
a new AAC system you might be given a full sensory
diet thing to follow you might be given strategies
like it's so overwhelming but it's all great
stuff and yes it is all needed But maybe not
all at the same time. So if the therapists are
coming with one approach, they're also coming
with one target. And I feel like as teachers,
teachers and parents, that is so much less overwhelming.
And we can celebrate those small steps rather
than being judged by that. It does often feel
like judgment from therapists about not doing
everything that they've asked us to do. When
actually, when you look at the whole picture,
what you're asking is so much, even though it's
great. It's so much. And we've seen it. We've
both been practicing for a very long time in
our sort of separate fields. And we have seen
teachers in this really difficult position where
they have all the demands of the curriculum.
They have the demands of multiple professionals.
And it's their job to try and put all of that
in this young person's day. And that young person
might come in absolutely exhausted, hasn't eaten
breakfast, you know. really stressed after being
on the bus and they have to put all these things
into their seven hour day and and it's it kind
of sets teachers and staff up to fail yeah and
as you say can we really demoralize them because
you know these teachers are teaching assistants
and parents are trying their best but you can't
do everything all the time. Well, what happens
is if you're trying to do everything, you just
do a little bit of everything and then you end
up giving up because you burn out. And I feel
like that's what we're seeing lots of actually.
I see it a lot on social media. I think we're
bombarded with all these amazing ideas and actually
you can't do it all all at once. And I think
I'm contributing to that, honestly, because I'm
sharing 16 years of experience of things that
I've been working on. daily for all of those
years and almost expecting or people are watching
expecting to just pick it up when actually you
need to start somewhere yeah and build up over
time and that's the same with everything isn't
it it is and I think that's what we um feel regulate
to communicate does is it is that foundation
of therapeutic practice within the classroom
it is a therapeutic approach to learning you
know it's coming at it from a totally different
angle and we really feel that if there you know
schools are able to get this this basic level
of provision within classrooms then you can expand
on that and you can then go on and create a really
lovely more complex piece of communication tool
that you can then use to um you know really open
the lines of communication with your students
you can do that once the basics are in place
and what we're finding more and more in all these
schools we're going into whether it be mainstream
whether it be resource bases whether it be specialists
we're not we've not even got that basic level
there anymore because staff are so overwhelmed
so stressed you know and there's a lot of very
complex needs in the classroom at the minute
that are really challenging to meet how do you
meet all of these needs you can't do an OT program
for every single young person in your class it's
just not possible to do you've got to be realistic
about it and we have to be realistic as therapists
as well and we need to be realistic about what
we're expecting teaching staff to do and not
be judgmental when they've not followed our program
so we're trying to make it easy you know we see
the struggles on the ground and we you know we
feel it and we want to make it easier for teaching
staff so that they can feel like they're doing
some you know that they're making a difference
in their job and that the young people are getting
something out of it as well yeah and they've
got they've got a plan ultimately let's talk
about the system then uh is there a reason why
you called it regulate to communicate and not
communicate to regulate let's start there such
a good question come with the juicy question
um there's no i mean when we kind of started
designing um the approach and the way it worked
when we are looking at developing a lot of people
come to us as speech therapists and say we want
to hear their voice we want to get them using
a communication system it's great in the modern
world but you see ipads with all these apps and
it makes it seem so accessible it's like it's
just on the tip i could get there but in order
to get there you have to deal with the regulation
first so because of what people were coming to
us and asking for which was for this end result
the end result of having a complex communication
system or having a um a young person who is able
to express themselves fluidly and confidently
we can't look at that until we do that regulation
until we get them feeling safe and we talk a
lot about on our training around safety and around
signs of safety because i think we have to take
it back to that we can get all in our head with
sensory processing and communication all these
jargon words that people fly around actually
what our goal is is that our young people come
into our settings or they're at home and they
feel as safe as possible because if our young
people aren't feeling safe we can't do anything
there's not gonna be any learning going on not
gonna be any social interaction going on it's
not gonna be play going on so that regulation
is also really another word to kind of make our
children feel safe before we're expecting them
to communicate to us. And it really goes back
to the theory around Maslow's hierarchy of need
and that pyramid. At the base of that pyramid
are all your sensory systems. And if those basic
needs are not met, then you're not able to work
your way through that pyramid with the... The
end destination being those, you know, really
complex functional skills and communication is
much higher up on that hierarchy of needs. So
that's why I think we sort of termed it regulated
communication. And I suppose for lots of children,
the reason why communication is so difficult.
comes from proprioception needs and fine motor
skills needs. You know, if they're not able to
know where their fingers are in space, then they're
not going to be able to use the AAC or to point
or sign or to manipulate their mouth in order
to make sounds, for example. So it's almost preparing
their body to do those quite complex skills for
our children if they've got those regulation
needs as well, isn't it? It exactly is. As we
call it, regulate to communicate. But as part
of that regulation is also about what you're
doing with your voice. So a lot of the time,
the way that we use language, whether it's verbal
or symbols or sign, can really impact our child's
feeling of how safe they feel. Because unfortunately,
because of all the reasons you've just listed,
Jordan, language is a really high demand for
a lot of our kids. It's a really, really high
demand. So we're coming in with these really
high demands, even if we want it to be quite
nurturing or proper. solving or whatever you
know the language might be using and if we're
not using our communication right we're not going
to be able to regulate them either so we've kind
of got to get all of that right first we've got
to get all of those things around the sensory
system and also look at our adults and think
about what can you do with your language to regulate
the children that you're working with would you
be happy to share what these three stages or
three steps entail because it sounds really exciting
i'd love to learn more if you're happy to share
that so there's three stages to the approach
sort of actually before you kind of start the
approach you're looking at identifying when a
young person isn't ready to engage basically
so that's really and you know if you come on
our training that first part is identifying people
that need this approach so is this young person
ready to engage are they in a place to access
this activity whatever that might be at school
um or are we seeing signs that they're dysregulated
and that is a really important first part there
is that identifying who needs this approach because
often dysregulation doesn't look the same on
all of our i think sometimes we see the big dysregulation
but they're actually Kids can not be ready to
engage, but be very quiet and actually be just
a little bit withdrawn. And by kind of spending
that time identifying what does that look like
in your child, what does that look like when
they're ready to engage or not ready to engage,
really helps you look at the whole broad spectrum
of our young people rather than just those ones
that might be louder or more physical. Because
actually some of our kids... are really quiet
and they're not ready to engage and we they need
this approach so we spend a lot of time kind
of exploring that and I just wanted just to you
know when we talk we talk about engagement and
not learning because engagement could be using
the toilet eating going outside playing with
their friends could be anything it doesn't have
to be sitting at a table doing a task so Our
approach can be used just to help young people
kind of engage with the routine a little bit
better or engage in play a little bit better
or, you know, engage with the climbing frame,
whatever it might be for that young person. We're
aiming for engagement, not, you know, sit down
at a table, you know. Yeah. Do you have strategies
for if they are and if they aren't showing readiness
or engagement? would you carry on to stage one
if they are or aren't ready i suppose is my question
and so the approach so stage one really is kind
of our universal approach it's appropriate for
all children and young people and our goal with
regulate to communicate the three stages is that
if it's readily available within your provision
what you're actually doing you're kind of preventing
any dysregulation as well so if we if stage one
is well um well established You might not need
to move on to stage two and stage three for children,
but they will always be having that basic level
of provision that maintains that engagement because
things change as the day goes on. People get
tired. People, you know, we get a little bit
fed up from all the input. establishing stage
one having that really well established within
your setting what you find is that some kids
might not need to move through the whole program
but they're always going to have that basic level
of support to maintain that engagement brilliant
so it really works with a two -pronged effect
really doesn't it you know it is that prevention
but it is also that reaction as well you know
when there are times when young people are dysregulated
so once you have identified we would advise that
all you know people in the classroom will benefit
from stage one. And that stage one focuses on
regulation. And a big part of regulation of that
stage is using that whole class approach to get
everyone regulated. Something that we teach in
that stage is how to deliver sensory circuits.
But really effective sensory circuits, because
I think sensory circuits is something that could
be a lot more popular now. You know, there are
a lot of OTs out there that are doing sensory
circuits. But have we got the speech and language
and the communication element of sensory circuits?
Are we doing them, you know, at the right time,
in the right format? Are we pitching the activities
to meet the specific sensory needs of the young
people that are doing the sensory circuits? Where
are we doing the sensory circuits? You know,
there's all these things that we... sort of problem
solve through stage one and we often work on
the premise that most schools kind of know about
sensory circuits now so it's more about refining
those and making those really good so that they
actually work and also teaching staff to recognise
when they don't work. Because that's often, you
know, you can be going along with something because
you've been, you know, this is your sensory circuit
and this is what we do and just do it and you're
doing it, but it's not having the effect you
want it to have. Well, there's no point in carrying
on doing it. We need to look at how we can change
it to make sure we are achieving that regulated
state. And that's something we do in our training
is we upskill staff to problem solve. which I
think is something that, you know, there are
lots of training packages out there and that's
not always something that's covered. within the
training package you get a lot of knowledge a
lot of theory a lot of strategies but how do
we problem solve and we give teachers and teaching
assistants time in the training sessions to do
that problem solving so that they can work through
that themselves okay well why did that activity
not work why did blowing bubbles you know when
we're trying to calm them down not work why was
that oh maybe it's because actually for that
young person it's really exciting when the bubbles
come out so we're not calming them down we're
actually ramping them up and getting them really
excited and it's sort of working through those
things and figuring out okay what is going to
work for your class for your students so um that
sort of stage one is getting that baseline everybody
is set for the day regulated we've done our sensory
circuits we've accompanied that with the right
communication the visuals ourselves how we use
ourselves as a therapeutic tool to communicate
um and then obviously stage two yeah stage one
goes down really well i think because as we've
said there's so many sensory circuits but we
also talk about how you'd make them individualized
how you would if we're often here we do that
sensory circuit but it doesn't really work doesn't
they're not actually ready to engage and that's
because we have they don't want to that's what
i hear all the time they don't really want to
do it and i'm like why why are you doing things
that they don't want to do like If they don't
want to do it, then it's obviously not meeting
their sensory needs because these children want
to meet their sensory needs. The reason they
are ripping paper and climbing on your furniture
and dropping to the floor is because they are
finding suitable ways of meeting their sensory
needs. They might not be the safest way, but
they're meeting their sensory needs. So kind
of take what they're already doing. That's my
mind. Take what they're already doing. Put it
somewhere safer. Yeah. Keen to kind of establish
you're protecting this time for doing sensory
circuits, which a lot of our staff, their time
is so tight. Yeah. So those 10, 15 minutes doing
that sensory circuit are actually really precious.
So we're like, when you're doing it, make sure
you're doing it well and it's having the desired
impact. And also while you're doing it, get your
speech and language in as well. You don't have
to separate them because, especially in our mainstream
settings. Spending those 15 minutes is so hard.
So let's work, let's do all our sensory processing,
but let's establish all our really good speech
and language practice as well. Start as we mean
to go on. And then for those kids who actually
twice a day isn't enough for sensory circuits.
do an individual sensory circuit, top them off,
top their tank up as they go. And as Ellie said,
we spend a lot of time in the training doing
the practical element, writing those sensory
circuits, practicing those sensory circuits,
troubleshooting. So people aren't going away
thinking, I've got all this work to do. I need
to create a sensory circuit. I need to create
symbols. Actually, it's all done in the training.
So the next day, they're kind of good to go.
um so stage two stage two is really then about
how are we getting our young people communicating
so now we've kind of established a good foundation
across the day so our sensory circuits are well
established in the routine and are working well
now we go okay well what's the next stage up
so we use what we've created a speedometer So
what we find is that a lot of emotional regulation
check -ins are really hard for young people to
access. So we've created a speedometer which
adults use firstly just to kind of show young
people where their speed is. Are they feeling
a bit fast? Do they kind of need a lot of movement?
Are they bouncing around the space? Are they
kind of seeking more and more and more? Are they
feeling a bit sleepy? Are they kind of, is it
getting a lot for them to, is it taking a lot
for them to engage in a task? Or are they go
kind of ready to work, ready to engage, ready
to play, ready to do the task? So a big part
of stage two is teaching staff how to use this
speedometer. And it is staff first, like all
communication. We're not going to put it in front
of our kids and go, off you go. Really coaching
our adults to use the speedometer well to talk
about how they're feeling, what their regulation
is like for us. Because some days I start the
day and I'm feeling pretty slow. I need something
to wake me up. But then we're also going to use
it to create a shared language with our students.
So when we're talking about sensory regulation,
let's use this visual and let's use the same
terms and the same colours so we can communicate
about this together. So our adults start modelling
this speedometer and we start looking at individualised
bespoke strategies. So if we've got a child that
we know tends to be fast, as part of stage two,
we upskill staff to understand what does that
child need? So just as you said, so instead of
running around the playground and climbing the
fence, how can we kind of redirect it to get
their sensory needs in a safer way? But we teach
staff how to do that and parents. So if you identify
your child is... more on that side, use that
speedometer to tell them and create that shared
language and then put in those specific individualized
strategies to support them. And a big thing we're
doing today too as well is we look at visuals,
especially now in next boards because they're
a personal bookmare of mine. Just because I find
now our next boards historically have been used
as... Do what I say and then you can do what
you want. Control and compliance, right? Yeah.
Yeah. And it makes me feel really uncomfortable.
And I think, how is that real engagement? How
are we working on intrinsic motivation for our
young people to go, oh, I really want to do that.
I really want to. This is fun and it's engaging.
I don't want to do anything else because that's
so good. so a lot in stage two we pull apart
those visuals that are now really widely used
our next boards you know visual timetable symbol
boards but how are we making sure we're putting
making it child motivated, child first. How are
they going? I really want to do this task. And
then I want to do that other task as well. And
then while I'm doing those things, all of my
sensory needs are being met at the same time.
So we do a lot of work and a lot in the training,
we really pull it apart and around what current
practice is. And through no fault of anybody's,
you know, this is just historically how things
have been. And I think. thankfully twisted don't
they so like how something could be used as a
collaboration tool can be used as a control tool
yeah uh sand timers are a classic example right
sand timers can be used to show a child tangible
passing of time so that they understand that
passing of time so maybe they feel less anxious
about what that means how they're actually being
used in school is a control and compliance tactic
of i don't know you sit still for this lol or
you can't have this until this is done that kind
of thing so i guess it's not the tools fault
But it's how it's put across and how it is being
used, isn't it? So like you said before, if you're
educating these users on the why it's important
to do that and how to do it in a firming way,
then you can be rest assured that the speedometer
won't be used as a negative thing. Exactly, yeah.
Just as, you know, traffic lights, for example.
I mean, I'm so pleased that you use a speedometer
because... So many children have such negative
attachment to past traumas, past classrooms of
traffic lights being used in order to publicly
shame their sensory needs. Honestly, it's just
horrendous what's going on out there in many
classrooms. That's a massive bugbear of mine.
So to be able to use a speedometer. Yeah. it's
completely different it's modeled by the adults
the adults are showing they can be anywhere on
there and it's all okay yeah and i think that
is so important because if it looked like a step
program yeah it could be even though it's it
is an affirming function we're doing all things
right we're modeling it just because the child
has learned in past classes or past years what
that might mean by public shame humiliation feeling
less than low mental health and not being understood
and all those things it's going to be really
hard to use that fantastic approach because it's
already been learned that that's a negative thing
I've had it before using a similar approach and
children just wanted to be on green for example
because it's good good green's good good green
I don't get told off I don't get shamed and actually
you could be doing all the right things and it's
just really hard to unlearn that so by having
something completely different a completely different
system it kind of refresh isn't it let's do everything
how we how you want to go ahead and go forward
with this we try and um help people to understand
the how to use these systems by looking at yourself
first so in our training a lot of the activities
are very practical and they involve looking at
your own regulation state and your own ways of
communicating because when you experience it
yourself you can then have a greater understanding
of how you can help these young people that we're
working with who have many, many, many barriers
to being able to access the environment. So I
think when you feel it yourself, it can really
help you to deliver the strategies better and
using that speedometer and showing that it's
okay to be, you know, wherever you are on that.
And actually, at some points in the day, we need
to be a bit more fast or we need to be a bit
more slow. Because, you know, when we're doing
a PE session, there's no good being go. We need
to be a bit more fast. Otherwise, we're never
going to get jogging around that field. Or if
it's time to do our yoga session or if it's time
to go to bed, no good being go. We need to be
slow because we're winding down now. So it's
recognizing those different regulation states
or speeds. Yeah, I love that. Different speeds,
whether we're going fast, slow, go, or our end
is stop where we're kind of in like meltdown.
overwhelmed that's like everything just needs
to stop and we've got some really good strategies
for you know any young people that are in that
speed so yeah i think it's just kind of removing
all these little things that kind of come along
the way through no like we say for no fault of
anybody but it's it's just picking apart how
can we deliver this in a way and we're not teaching
anything new this is the thing with our approach
nothing that we're going to teach is actually
like a new tool that we're giving you or a new
strategy that we're giving you. It's how we deliver
the strategy, which is really the important thing
because we know. how to do it because we've done
it for years as therapists and that's what we've
you know we've spent years at university studying
how to do it we're now trying to empower you
as teachers who don't get that therapeutic training
at uni you don't get that opportunity to do all
the lovely learning that we've had the opportunity
to do but we want to try and empower you so you've
got those skills to be able to meet the the needs
of the young people yeah yeah i think I think
that's a real big thing in stage two, isn't it?
It's kind of using what you've already got, using
things you might be familiar with, but changing
your approach, changing the way you see things
to take into account all of that regulation.
And also what we know about communication, your
child's not going to communicate if it's not
motivating, if it's not fun, if it's not engaging,
if it doesn't help them feel safe and secure.
So it's kind of trying to change the attitude
when we look at these different approaches. And
on the same as you, Jordan, we could probably
record another podcast all about it. and emotional
regulation but i think a lot of the time we've
got a lot of staff we've got a lot of parents
this is all they've known yeah and they think
okay well if i don't do that what do i do yeah
what do i do also there we are still having therapists
come into our schools and recommended these strategies
so it really could be teachers and parents taking
yeah expert advice and not knowing that it could
be harmful or damaging to the relationship with
their child ultimately you know so it's really
important just like this holistic approach of
one approach that all works together rather than
taking a little bit from this and I watched an
American podcast doing that and I watched a social
media thing doing this naturally it doesn't quite
fit for your child or your setting or together
it's kind of a bit of a muddle And actually,
sometimes you find that these strategies can
contradict one another. And then that's when
you really get in a bit of a sticky situation
because you've got things that clash and have
a lot of contraindications, which can actually
be damaging. So you have got to be careful about
what approach you use. And it's all got to align.
Your OT approach, your speech, your communication
approach. has all got to sort of come to one
and what you were saying um before Jordan about
using the tool as a collaborative tool rather
than a control that is really what stage three
has been built on hasn't it so it leads nicely
onto our stage three which is all about engagement
and how engagement should be built on that collaboration
so once we're in a place where we're regulated
We've got that shared language of our regulation
speeds and we've got those tools in place to
communicate. Now, how are we really building
on that so that, you know, your voice is definitely
heard and so you as a student can advocate for
yourself. So when I'm not here as the therapist
or your one -to -one that knows you really well,
you still know what to do to communicate that
I'm not feeling okay or I'm feeling a bit faster
than I need to go and bounce on a gym ball or,
you know. it's giving that voice isn't it it
stays so you kind of Stage one is our kind of
universal approach. Stage two, we're kind of
looking a little bit more bespoke, but we're
still trying to kind of empower adults to co
-regulate with our children and to put those
things in place. Stage three, we really want
to encourage our students to advocate, give them
the tools to advocate for themselves, really.
So we're looking at working collaboratively with
our students to empower them to say, this is
what I need right now. I don't need to be sitting
at that chair. That is not what I need right
now. I need to be bouncing on that gym ball while
I do this activity. I actually really need to
be. having a little run around before I come
into the classroom. I need to be wearing my ear
defenders when this is happening. So we pull
apart lots of specific communication systems
that will enable our children to use those. And
think about how does that look in the classroom
for you or your daily routine as a parent? Because
we want our kids to be able to advocate, but
that takes us working collaboratively and maybe
changing things up, changing how we see things,
changing our expectations, changing what things
might look like in a box. because if we're encouraging
our children to say, you know what, I don't want
to sit on that chair, what are other options?
Can they lie down on their tummies when they
access it? Can they be standing? Can they be
bouncing? Can they be rolling? You know, can
they be having something in their hand to give
them that feedback? But by establishing stage
one and stage two first, you've put all of that
work in as the adults to co -regulate them and
now stage three is about what. getting children
to say what they need, ask for what they need
and ultimately be provided that by the setting.
Two is also preparing the environment to feel
safe enough that they can ask for those things
and know they'll be received. Because they might
already be trying stage three before your system,
but it's not being heard or they're not sure
how to ask in a safe way. So it's not being received,
it's being received as, I don't know, a negative
or unsafe behaviour. And the adult isn't honoring
that attempt to communicate. So I suppose stage
one and two is also preparing the adults and
preparing the room for receiving that language
and communication as well as preparing the child
on how to ask for that safety. yeah definitely
and going back to our child that might be meeting
their sensory needs by running around by climbing
a fence in stage two what we've given them is
we've empowered them with other options actually
this is what you need and that's okay but we
can climb this climbing front we can bounce on
this trampette so when we get to stage three
it's like i know what's available for me now
i know what's available i know that that adult
is going to co -regulate with me he's going to
honor that request so instead of going out and
climbing that fence outside i'm going to ask
to go to the climb that climbing frame or go
to that trumpet wherever it might be yeah um
we talk about the golden thread throughout our
approach and you've already sort of um delved
into that the environment and making sure that
the environment supports all those stages and
when we talk about the environment we're talking
about the physical environment, but also the
people in that environment. And that's so important.
You are the environment. You know, we say that
to teachers, you are this young person's environment.
So we've got to make sure that that is ready
and in a place where then these tools can be
used to the best of their ability and that students
can access them readily. So that's a really important
part. I mean, obviously, that's something that
I look a lot at. As an occupational therapist,
it's the environment. But thinking about it in
that regulation and communication way, making
it accessible. Have you got that regulation equipment
out there and accessible? Do they know where
it is? Do the staff know how to use it? Are they
confident in using it? If I get a gym ball like
now or a trampette, are you going to be able
to confidently lead a young person to use that?
And I think sometimes you take the granted when
you know how. that you know whether you're a
therapist or whether you're a you know a teaching
staff but there are a lot of teachers teaching
assistants especially you know if they're new
to the profession and they've not practiced using
this equipment and they're not sure and they're
not very confident in helping a young person
to be able to physically get onto a gym ball
or onto a wobble board and knowing well how do
I do it how do I help them how where do I touch
them what can I do what can I not do and it and
it's sort of you know busting all those fears
and giving them the confidence that that is really
what we're very passionate about through the
approach and through our training is to upskill
and give staff the confidence that they feel
okay i know what i'm doing here you know i do
this this and this and this is how i do it and
um you know that that's it's lovely to see when
you when you see staff come through that process
and then you know they are confidently supporting
a young person and seeing the impact I feel like
that clarity will only make it more successful
because everyone knows where they're at. And
if you walk into the room and you see something
happening because the whole school is doing this
approach, they're not going to question it because
they just know, oh, they're obviously feeling
fast or they're obviously feeling slow. And it's
not going to be, well, why are they rolling around
on that and not doing their work? It's clear.
Everyone's doing the same. The expectation is
the same, whether they're in assembly, whether
they're in the playground, whether they're in
the lunch hall, whatever. Everyone's using that
language. Everyone's using those visuals. I suppose
ultimately our aim is to have this system in
every school from nursery to what? Year six and
beyond? Is that kind of your thinking? Is that
it's possible for everybody? In practice, when
we've implemented it, we've implemented it in
both specialist provisions and also mainstream
settings. Within mainstream classrooms of 30
kids or within specialist provisions of five
kids. And it's just as effective. It works just
as well. We've collaborated with a lot of mainstream
teachers around what does stage one look like
with 30 year five kids? what does that look like
and what we have found the need is there we have
a lot of very bouncy very fidgety year five year
sixers who are seeking more regulation and maybe
being marked as disruptive or naughty or you
know more of a behavioral approach has been used
actually when we have put in some really solid
stage one work some of those really solid sensory
circuits but that's individual as a whole class
the turnaround in the class is significant and
We go on about this a lot, but the well -being
of the staff is higher because it's hard to manage.
You've got 30 kids who are all being a bit wobbly,
a bit bouncy, a bit fidgety. It's really difficult
to manage. And I think in mainstream settings,
we've had things in the past like movement breaks.
But actually, staff haven't been given the opportunity
to understand. or everything you need to do in
terms of a sensory circuit to get them grinded
again. It's all well and good getting them up,
jumping in the chair. Then they're up here. Exactly,
yeah. And then you try it through a maths lesson.
Yeah. But actually upskilling all staff to kind
of understand that we need to kind of do the
alerting, do the organising, then really making
sure we grind. And if the adults are joining
in too, which I'm sure you suggest is that the
adults are doing this, then the adults are regulated
too. And then they're making better choices for
themselves, their body, how they're talking to
the child, their expectations of the child is
all regulated too. Because I feel like in my
room, I've got 14. teaching assistants very very
very big team to manage and their mood what's
happened earlier in the morning how they're feeling
has well it's an environmental issue just as
you were saying it affects the whole environment
so you could have the best equipment in the world
you could have 14 adults i mean god what a luxury
you could have all the space in the world we've
got all of it But if they're not regulated, then
our best resource, which is our teaching assistants,
is our most expensive, but also best resource,
is actually doing more damage than good, ultimately,
because they're not receiving that communication
attempt. They're not honoring what the child's
saying. They're not joining in. They're not,
you know, collaborating or any of those things.
So I suppose it's making sure that everybody
is regulated as well, isn't it? Adults included,
almost. just as important from my view of teaching
is that we're regulated we're doing the movement
right we're not finishing until we're grounded
and ready to teach maths just as much as the
children you can't co -regulate if you're not
regulated you can't do it and in our training
we always put out a box of sensory toys in the
middle of the table. Because if I'm sitting on
the train, I want to fiddle with something. I
want to squeeze something. I want to stretch
something so I can maintain my optimum engagement.
And we talk a lot in our workshops and our training
around you've got to get yourself into a regulated
state first. And I think another thing that helps
staff being regulated is when they can see they're
making a difference. They're not just... with
unreal expectations from 20 different therapists
if staff feel like i've put this in place and
i can see the impact that is making on that young
person the more regular staff are happier staff
are more regulated the well -being of the schools
just yeah higher they'll feel ironically they'll
feel more in control yeah so they won't need
feel the need to put in these control and compliance
measures because they're in control they're in
control of their bodies they know what expectations
are on them they're realistic they're grounded
the class is easier to manage because they're
regulated you're more in control than all the
sound timers and all the traffic light systems
in the world which actually just make it more
dysregulated and actually it comes down to wanting
control doesn't it whereas actually you're going
to be more in control if everyone's regulated
you've got a system it's really clear you know
what the next step is you know what happens if
this doesn't work well we just go back to that
you know whatever it is it's really clear it's
supported by senior leadership teams i think
that's the most important thing you know if teachers
are listening like i really want to start this
in the class go to your senior leadership team
because this isn't they can't be isolated I don't
think. I mean, I'm sure it will still help. I
mean, do it better. Do it in one class than none,
of course. Ultimately, I really do think this
needs to be a whole class strategy so that wherever
your children are in the school, whatever adult
they're working with, whether it's a supply teacher,
whether it's an HLTA, whether it's they're bumping
into a TA in the hallway, they're all using this
language, they're all using this system. Just
so it's honoured, it's really respected and it's
kind of embedded in the school so that as children
are moving up the school, this language is the
same so that, gosh, when they leave year six
or year 11, whatever you're doing. They're going
to be so efficient at meeting their sensory needs,
aren't they? That's ultimately what we want for
these children, don't we? And that's why we've
created an approach to learning versus a specific
intervention or a specific strategy, is because
we really want this approach to be embedded within
schools. And some of the skills that we've worked
with who have... really you know have done that
have embedded it within all their classrooms
so that when children are transitioning to each
classes they've got that same basis foundation
that's when it's worked the best and you know
even having like the visuals all to remind them
of the different stages that they're working
through so everyone knows oh yeah we're doing
regulate to communicate we're working through
the stages yeah we've just done stage one okay
or we think that young person might need stage
one again you know later on in the day can we
everyone's using that shared language and we
know what we're talking about and something else
that just made me think of as well when you were
talking about um i remember what what you were
saying georgia boy made me think about permission
about the permission to be able to oh yeah about
co -regulation and how you're feeling and if
you're not feeling okay you can't co -regulate
It's about giving that permission to say, well,
if you do need to have a moment or if we do need
to slow things down or actually if we do need
to spend a bit longer on that sensory circuit.
So we are eating to a bit of, you know, maths
time lesson. But if it means then that actually
everyone, including yourself, are going to be
regulated for the rest of that maths session,
if we've just spent a little bit longer on sensory
circuit, then do it. And it's not, it's not rigid.
the approach in terms of well if you do this
and you do this and you do this and you do this
then it'll always work out like this because
life isn't like that the young people we work
with are not like that we're not like that are
we So it's about looking for, OK, when do we
know? We know when they're dysregulated, but
when do we know when they're regulated and ready
to engage? How do we know that we're at that?
If we're not there yet, then we need to keep
going. We need to try something a bit differently.
And it's really allowing that permission, isn't
it? Saying that's OK. What would you say to,
I don't know, a year six teacher that says...
We're preparing for SATs. We don't have time.
We don't have 15 minutes twice a day to do this.
What would you say to that teacher? So we've
had that. We've had those conversations, Jordan.
And we have spent a lot of time with those teachers,
problem solving, troubleshooting. And it might
be five minutes in seat sensory circuits. What
we really try to do is sit in the class and look
at those moments. So sit in the class. We spend
a lot of time in classrooms alongside our teachers,
sitting and watching a lesson and watching the
amount of times that year six teacher is saying,
right, everyone stop. You're not listening. You
sit down. You need to come and sit at the front
because you're not listening. Over there at the
back, where's your pen and paper? We look at
all of those times, all of those micro moments,
those two minutes there, that one minute there.
And we say, if we just spent five minutes in
seat sensory circuit. When you feel as a teacher
that you're losing the class, the class are getting
a bit fidgety, they've sat down just on a big
sat paper and they're all getting a bit wibbly
wobbly, use those five minutes to do a really
fantastic in -seat sensory circuit. The engagement's
going to... goes for the roof you're going to
be saying a lot like come here sit at the front
you're going to be repeating yourself a lot less
you're going to have better engagement you're
going to save yourself time in the long run but
it is looking at those micro moments that teachers
are spending desperately to maintain the engagement
of our kids who just want to move. Actually doing
a really robust, really fantastic in -seat sensory
circuit for five minutes will save you so much
time in the long run. Save your voice. Looking
at the transitions and maximising those transition
times, we did a really lovely piece of work with
that transition from playtime in the playground.
into the classroom. Because the playground, I'm
assuming, is the alerting stage. Exactly. Yeah.
Hold on a minute. You've got half your sensory
circuit already done. You know, they've been
out at break time. They've had a run around.
They're coming in. And what was happening, it
was taking them ages to get going with a lesson
because they were so... kind of ramped up with
with um the sensory experience of playtime they
needed more of that organizing and more of that
calming and grounding and they were able to do
that literally by you know when they were coming
in we um did some organizing activities on on
the way in and then when they came in the first
thing that they did was all sat down on the carpet
and they did some grounding, some deep pressure
activities. And that just helped everyone to
be in that ready to learn state and ready to
engage state. I also wonder if they were doing
these regular micro circuits, whether they wouldn't
need to go, whoa, at playtime either. So it's
like, actually, it's taken us so long to calm
down after playtime. But actually, if we did
it a few times before then, they might not have
the need to, you know, go mad. playtime and then
you know spend the time else i suppose because
the answer is we're already spending the time
we're just not sending it effectively are we
exactly exactly yeah but it does i think sometimes
it takes that outsider to come in yeah totally
observe and go hold on a minute let's try something
different here and you know we have the privilege
of being able to do that as therapists and being
someone that's not connected to the school or
the class or the pupils or the staff you know
we can go in with a fresh pair of eyes and and
look but that's something that we encourage um
you know teaching staff and class -based to do
as well take that time to just stop a minute
and have a look around and see whether this is
working or not and then, you know, read back.
It goes back to that permission, doesn't it?
That permission for that one member of staff.
We say it's a lot in our sensory circuits. One
member of staff needs to stand away and watch.
Is it actually alerting? Is it actually organising?
Is it actually calming? Because when you're in
it, you don't know. You're in it. You're doing
the sensory circuit. You're actually not observing
your students. kind of giving the permission,
which we give a lot, we talk a lot about on our
training, at each stage for one member of staff
to be allocated to what? That's your only job
is to what? Are we doing what we set out to do?
And if we're not, we need to change things up.
We need to change it. Yeah. Yeah. And stop that
stagnant, mutinated idea of this is how we've
always done it. It's time to change it up. It's
a new year. I'm sure you're all seeing these.
uh needs in your class and you're not really
sure where to go well this would be a really
great start you know what and what an amazing
start to for your children and for your team
to be how to be able to have these really clear
strategies if people have been listening to this
and thinking yep this sounds great sign me up
um what do i send to my head teacher to get her
on board you know what Where do people go to
get this information about your system and you
guys and the training? Yeah, so we've got our
website, which is really informative. on there
is all about who we are what we do the approach
you've got the three stages on there so that's
www .regulate2communicate .com and you can also
look at all of our services on there and our
contact details are on the website as well so
you can contact us and the best way is through
email and we're happy to discuss anything that
your school needs and you know a lot of the time
we create bespoke packages for schools so it
might be that you need a bit of training it might
be that you need some on -site modeling and coaching
it might be might be that you need some remote
coaching of staff and support or you we might
need to look specifically at some more complex
students that need more of a specific program
so website is probably your best place but we
also have our instagram where we share loads
of videos helpful tips and advice and so you
can have a little look at what we're doing and
through there it honestly sounds amazing and
as a yes special education teacher but I'm attached
to a mainstream school so it's a separate class
attached to a mainstream school and I see the
need in my class but I also see the need in mainstream
from nursery to year six it is so I know firsthand
that this is definitely needed and um and I'm
sure can be so impactful for for all schools
so I'm really excited about it and I'm really
excited to follow your journey and and see the
impact this has it's really exciting to me we
are just we're really passionate about it and
I think we've really seen the impact you know
the business is still really early we're kind
of two years into the business and the impact
we've had in the classrooms have been so significant
and the improvement in staff well -being has
been you know so fantastic to see we're just
keen to share with as many people as possible
whether that's within schools and settings but
also with our parents at home because parents
Also are looking for support and not knowing
where to turn and getting mixed messages from
therapists, not finding therapists that can communicate
with each other. So as earlier said, we've got
an Instagram, we've got a website, we've got
a mailing list. We will be updating people regularly
around workshops that people can book on to training
sessions, coaching sessions. And we try to make
it as affordable and as accessible for parents
and also for schools. We just want people to
know about it and know that there is an answer
out there that doesn't... paying a fortune for
a speech therapist paying a fortune for an occupational
therapist and hoping they work together um with
an approach that is you know really a fun practice
as i say people keep in touch on instagram we
can add you to our mailing list and there'll
be lots of options to kind of collaborate and
work together in a way that's affordable and
also accessible amazing thank you ladies for
taking the time today to be on the podcast i've
loved learning more about this system Thanks
so much, Jordan.