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Hi, my name is Jordan. I am a special education teacher from the UK. I share my passion for

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everything communication, sensory regulation and fun lesson ideas for my classroom of disabled

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pupils aged 4 to 11. Each week I am joined by experts in the field answering your questions

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and sharing our knowledge and experience working alongside our beautiful young people. Let's get started.

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Hello and welcome to another podcast episode. This week we are joined by Lisa from Peachy

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Speech. She's a speech and language therapist that I have been following for about six or seven years

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now. Out of all of the guests we've had on the podcast, I think she's the one that I've been

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following the longest. I've definitely put on the pressure for her to come on today. I've been liking

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her for a few months now to come on because I love all of her posts and everything she's about.

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Hello Lisa. So I said you're a speech and language therapist. There's so much diversity to that,

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isn't there? And how you specialise and who you work with. So do you want to explain a little bit

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about who you work with and how you do that? Yeah, sure. So I'm a speech and language therapist

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and I work privately or independently now. So I used to work for the NHS and yeah I support

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lots of different needs. So it might be children who are going on an unusual language development

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journey or finding communication difficult developmentally. I support children with

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fluency and stammering or speech clarity issues. So quite often as our little ones edge towards

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being like nursery and school age, we notice that they're saying a lot of stuff that it's really

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hard for us to understand what they're saying. And it's because they're mixing up a lot of the

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sounds that they're using within their sentences. So I would help unpick which sounds they're using,

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which ones they're not using and kind of support them to increase their sound system. And then I

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support a lot of children who are autistic and are finding their voice and finding their communication

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methods that works for them. And I do that all through play. So all of my therapy is play based.

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And yet no matter what a child's need is, I look at a way that we can layer in connection and play

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and regulation as part of our therapy. That's amazing. It just sounds like the best job in the world.

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It is. I get to play and hang out with kids and support them. Yeah that's exactly it.

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What age range do you work with? Is there like a limit or do you get to work?

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No, not really. There's not really a limit. So most of the children that I work with are

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kind of year two and below, I would say. And actually that's, it's almost happened

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accidentally over time that those kind of preschool years are where a lot of the children found me.

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That's really great though because I spoke to an early years teacher last week who was saying about

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the huge need to speak to language. In fact it was one of the main concerns was how every single

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year it seems to be getting poorer, their speech and language. Even children that don't seemingly

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have a cognitive delay or a disability or neurodiversity are still finding that their

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speech and language is really poor when they come to nursery and and perception depending on,

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she was saying depending on their previous experience of school settings and nursery settings

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and things. Is that what you're finding as well? Is that a national worldwide thing and what do

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you think the reason is? Yeah I think it's a really complicated combination of factors. I think a huge

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part of it is access to services. So my very first role as a speech and language therapist was

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within the NHS as part of what was called the early intervention team and we used to go in

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to children's centres and nurseries and run like free groups for parents with like babies and

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toddlers to go to and talk about like talking to your baby, talk to your bum. We were on like

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maternity wards supporting parents before they even became parents to understand the importance of

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those early language stages and how you can feed language into those routine activities with your

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children and how going to the park can be a communication activity and doing your food shop

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can be a communication activity and there's not those services aren't available anymore so

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like that that team that I worked with doesn't exist anymore and children's centres don't exist

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in the way that they they used to and I think it's harder for families to access that information

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before there is a delay and before there is support that's needed and I think it was the first

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service to get shut down because it wasn't seen as essential but actually then what happens is

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you have this knock-on effect where then we have children arriving at school without a way of

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communicating with us and we go oh gosh like now we need a lot of support in schools.

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It's a classic example isn't it of like them obviously needing to save money and wanting to

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save money on something but it still costs them probably the same or if not more down the road and

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we're seeing that a lot in adult services as well aren't we they're cutting over here but

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actually it's causing spending over here it kind of seems like a domino effect and that is a classic

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example of what you've said you're stopping these early interventions of when all of these things

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could be found out I mean tongue ties and things like that also I'm sure you'd be picking up on

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those and picking up on stammers and and all sorts and autism and all kind of things that parents

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might necessarily not realise so if you're not seeing it there then that's a lot of pressure on

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nurseries and the UIFS is to pick out those those things and to get them on the pathway and to get

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the paperwork done whereas actually it could have been started years before. Yes yeah I love how you

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explain that then because you're right it is at home but you're absolutely right it is because

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of the lack of support and if they don't know what to do then how could it be done any differently

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and I do worry hearing you that you know that only stopped a few years ago and already we're

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seeing the impact and I feel like we're going to see a generational impact there aren't we of

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you know the parents now had those early interventions when they were young so they

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had a childhood of that I would like to think but then the children now never even had it as children

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so when their parents they wouldn't even know what it looks like or what it sounds like you know and

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I feel like there's gonna be a generational gap there of how to interact and teach communication

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to your children. Yeah and I think it's the we're we're parenting now in in a different world where

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there's a mixture and a balance of working and parenting and technology and play and have we got

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enough of this and enough of this and do your reading and but do your homework online that's on

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the computer but don't use screens too much but use them to regulate if your child needs to regulate

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and and I think one of the things that I talk to parents so often about is about blame and the blame

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that parents carry when there's when there's a difficulty and when a child is struggling with

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something I think our automatic reflex is to go what have I done wrong like how did I miss this

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how have I not managed to support that and I think it's so important such an important message to

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to share with families that you you aren't the cause of a delay you don't you don't cause a

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difficulty as parents we and as humans we have like an inbuilt kind of motivation to connect and

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communicate with our children all those like ridiculous noises and faces that you make at

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your babies or any baby that you see that's that's nature's way of going look show your baby how

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important your face is and how your intonation rises and falls and how you know they can copy

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that with their o's and their r's and that's that's an early conversation and it's so when

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a child needs more than that that doesn't mean that you haven't done enough yes that means that

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you did everything that came to you instinctively and and your child needs something different

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their brain works in a different way their access in communication and the world around them

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slightly differently and you need someone that's trained and qualified to help you work out what

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that way is and they have done the right thing they're filled in the paperwork they've gone

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through the pathway and they've come to find you and you said that people have probably waited a

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really long time you and you said and when we spoke before you said lots of your the people that

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employ you are our parents they're paying carefully for it you know they're going above

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they're going above and beyond to help their children and they're doing everything i mean even

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even the families that aren't able to do that right actually are will still be trying they'll

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hopefully still be following accounts on instagram and watching social media things and kind of

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frantically googling things you know i know that yeah families are more often than not like working

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as hard as they can to put as much support in place absolutely and we see it in our dms all

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the time don't we you know parents that are just seeking answers trying to put it all together

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whilst they're waiting so many of my messages start with so we've been on the waiting list

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for 18 months and i'm just trying to work i'm just trying to put things in place whilst we're

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waiting so many thoughts like that and i just think wow it's amazing i mean what a lucky child

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to have such dedicated parents that are willing to just piece things together and do you know

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the work i mean they shouldn't have to should they but they are and yeah the parents are incredible

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and i think similarly for you that's that's why i started my account on on instagram was that there

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i could just i could see that there was this big gap in in provision and in service and i had this

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knowledge that i was happy to like give to people because a lot of the things that i suggest aren't

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like magic or expensive or kind of mind-blowing they're quite simple things that actually through

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kind of knowledge and practice and rehearsal and tweaking like they work they work really

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really effectively and it feels almost unfair to have this like very simple set of things that

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that you could add to your life and not to get out it's exactly it felt it felt criminal to

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have this knowledge like you say of simple techniques and tips and strategies just just

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that i've picked up over the years you know it's not that i went to autism school or anything i

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just picked them up over the years and you know you work with different therapists and things and

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you just pick stuff up don't you yeah yeah i mean i trained as a mainstream teacher you know the

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people say what was your um what did you train in you know how did you get so knowledgeable it

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literally is working with people like you it's working with occupational therapists and

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and speech and language therapists and physios and other colleagues and my teaching assistants

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that have so much experience other parents foster carers all of those people just getting

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and asking questions and getting yeah all of this but then when you do it for that long then you

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gain quite a lot don't you that's the thing as well i think is that um for you and i i think

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it's like it's more than a job isn't it it's a it's a real passion and say you do absorb stuff

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because you ask questions and you read and you go oh i saw this today and i'm going to find now

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find out everything about it yeah well it well it is my special i don't know how i can integrate

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that into all other parts of my therapy now so this is the neurodiversity in us as well isn't

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it i feel like well that's where it really plays into its own because it definitely is my special

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interest and i feel like people will see my account and think you know teachers shouldn't have to work

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that hard teachers shouldn't have to put in all these hours teachers shouldn't have to pay for

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the things for their class like no no no they shouldn't and i actually don't have to i don't

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need to i want to because this is my special interest this is my you know hobby almost as

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well as a job it is kind of intertwined in a way and i feel like when you work with children in

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the way that we do it's really difficult for it to not just like it can't just be a job it is so

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much more when you work with the children and when you work with the families and you feel the

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impact that you're having it drives you to just do more and i only have 10 children in my class and

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yeah it just feels criminal to have this knowledge that i've built over the last few years like and

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same for you as well and it only goes to 10 children just was just it just isn't enough for me

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when i'm watching a failing system i'm seeing these awful documentaries and tiktok videos about

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these and messages about these awful interventions that i'm so against there has to be another voice

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there has to be another option because the parents that we were talking about before they're

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innocently looking for answers while waiting we'll find these videos and think let's try it and it

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can be really harmful to children and yeah but the videos look like it is a magic wand and the

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problem is these therapies do work because they do fix behaviors and help children to speak but

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to the detriment of mental health. I think you've got to look at the cost because you can learn

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anything if you're willing to give up everything and i think that's the difference for when you're

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doing neurodiversity affirming therapy is that you're not willing for i'm not willing for

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for this skill progression to cost you your emotional well-being. Yes even if it takes longer

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even if we have to try 20 different things in order to get there eventually you know even if

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actually it doesn't even happen in my time with you and i think that's the real cause i think

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when you work with autistic children and disabled children actually they're incredibly vulnerable to

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being compliant and controlled because it comes with the rigidity of how their brain works you

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know they see patterns and they quite like the black and white of yes and no this is right this

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is wrong and i think we need to be really we need to have been really aware of our responsibility

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with that power almost i definitely see have seen it in my classes over the years adults coming in

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with seemingly good intentions but actually finding that the control and compliance side of

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things maybe feels a trigger or a trauma in their own experience in their own background you know i

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don't know where that comes from but i'm sure that was kind of something in their background and and

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i've had to kind of pull the plug and say yeah this this job isn't for you because i could see

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what was happening that seemingly on the surface the child was being compliant and yeah and behave

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manage they were managing behaviors and looked like a good relationship almost in a way but

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quite a reliant relationship and actually what was happening was it was incredibly toxic and

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controlling and compliant and mask a lot of masking going on there and i could just see

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that that isn't something that i want to have in my classroom it's such a huge shall we talk about

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masking it's such a huge thing to be aware of and i find myself questioning it like in everything i

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do at the moment i think as i work is is thinking about am i teaching this child a new skill or am

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i teaching them how to really effectively mask what they wish they could really do

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and just really checking in with myself about whether what what we're working on and what are

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what my hopes from the activity is is beneficial for this child or is it beneficial for like

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everyone else around them because actually it means that they're like conforming or they're

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behaving in a more neurotypical way and i think it's even as someone who i consider myself to be

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very neurodiversity affirming it's still i think it's important to always have that in the

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forefront of your mind like what's the what's your what's your motivation for this for this activity

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or for this interaction and if you find yourself going actually it's it's because that will help

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like the class work better or actually it's because that will be less disruptive for assembly time

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then you've really really got to stand back and go then that's not right that's not that's not

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what we want to teach this child because later on they're going to have to unlearn that in order to

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get back in tune with themselves and what feels right and i think so often if we let children

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guide us in terms of regulation what their body needs what feelings they're getting what feedback

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they're getting from their environment they actually do a really beautiful job of regulating

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themselves and it's us as the people in their environment that kind of get in the way of them

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doing that and then they're dysregulated and we wonder why you know we're not getting activities

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done or behavior is is tricky for us within that environment it is because we've stopped them

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spinning and so now they're throwing things all around us and we're not getting them to do

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anything about them and that's actually more tricky but why did we stop them spinning because

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actually they were regulating themselves in the first place i've got a question actually

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we're already doing they were already doing exactly what their body needed and it wasn't hurting

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anybody and it was it wasn't inappropriate and so i've got i always get questions about spitting

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and this is how i feel about spitting spitting doesn't hurt anybody at all actually and it's

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dangerous and it's actually maybe a very good way of meeting a sensory need you know writing with

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spit on windows or whatever you know you're not hurting anybody but adults find it absolutely

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repulsive and it's one of the main things i get that they want to stop and i'd say i'm like yes

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i i offer things like i don't know what like washing up liquid mixed with water is a great

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thing to draw with that feels like spit if they like it dripping maybe try slime water play writing

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in water there are lots of different things that you can try but are you seeing that as the main

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is that actually the main behavior or are you seeing it the main behavior because it's affecting

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you most is it affecting them most or is it affecting you most and i feel like is that

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actually where we want to start what is it what in their being is affecting them most i bet you it

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isn't spitting i bet you it isn't i bet you that isn't the biggest thing in their life to help them

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with i bet maybe it's actually adding in communication or adding in more sensory regulation and you know

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what with those things they might stop spitting actually yeah i am talking about communication i

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would i would want a lot more information about what the spitting is communicating to us because

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because it could be that they want something to feel with their fingers but actually maybe it's

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the sensation within their mouth and so actually we need to look at is this a child that like needs

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access to drinks more often is this a child that needs like ice to crunch in between meals is this

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a child that needs more water play that's safe for them to take or are they sitting at someone else

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which is communicating go away get out my space i don't want you to be near me right the spitting

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actually away of them going please give me more space this is a it's too noisy in here and i

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don't i don't know how else to tell you that i wish i was by myself if that is the point if that is

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what it is then that's the most important thing they don't feel safe in their space that's the

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big thing that's the thing that we want to actually work on it's not the spitting the spitting is

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almost a it's a fringe behavior it's a tiny it's a very superficial part of the behavior that

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actually if we if we can dig away in quite a deep way i think what to uncover when are we doing it

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how have we got to this point i think is is kind of where i always kind of chatter people about

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if you're going into schools aren't you or they're coming to your home

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and i'm sure a parent or a teacher will say to you oh they're doing this no what does that mean and

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and how would you work that out because you're only working with them so often do you have kind

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of observations in the way what how do you do it to determine why i suppose so i think i talked to

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teachers and parents about being being a detective really for any behavior so actually looking at

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um if they can keep a note or track kind of when it's happening how often it's happening what

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the situations it's happening in so if it was spitting kind of i'd say like or in the next week

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you just jot down like all the all the times that it happens so that we can see like how frequently

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it is because especially for a tricky behavior sometimes we can feel like it's happening all

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the time and actually when we note it down we're like oh it's three times in a in like a full

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in like a full school day i mean the explosion afterwards with everyone else responding to this

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fitting took a long time and took a lot of our day but it but it was only three times and we

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thought it was like every 20 seconds i think sometimes that helps just break down that that

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barrier of how huge the problem feels but i find knowing what time and what else is going on around

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that child usually cues me into okay it's interesting that it's always after lunch or

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it's interesting that it's always after that child has eaten or it's interesting that it's always

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when they come in from being outside maybe their mouth feels dry or maybe they're overwhelmed by

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the cloakroom and you can start to kind of unfold yes the story a little bit more from that and then

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to put the what to put in place then yeah don't you that gives a bit more of a clue rather than

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stopping the spitting like that's not our focus then it's yes yeah it's not the main that would

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that's just an an after effect maybe if if that comes to if we actually if we've got the right

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why if we've done it right if we've got you know if we've been a good detective then and we give

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them a different time to go to lunch or a different time to come in or a different way of entering the

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building or a way of asking for space or whatever it is whatever our reason is then we will see a

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reduction in spitting if we've done that first bit right yeah but not straight away yes that's

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what's really tricky is that one or two strategies will not change things straight away i would say

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it usually takes between seven and ten days doing something really consistently um obviously not to

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the child's detriment if you start something and you see that they're really upset by that strategy

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then i wouldn't say power through for something i would say stop immediately

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what can happen is that we can we can start a couple of strategies and they can not not really

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make a difference so we kind of swap in a different one and then we change to another one and then we

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go oh none of the strategies are working so we just stop but actually what's tricky is we're

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working with children that thrive on consistency but also dislike change often so a new strategy

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is change and actually for it to become a consistent part of how their day works we have to

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work with them in making it feel safe and making it feel not new and making it feel

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not only when it's really really really needed but all the time so something like using a visual

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schedule don't just use it when they're looking like they're becoming dysregulated use it when

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they're regulated to use it all the time i was talking about this before christmas actually with

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someone um and we were talking about having time out of the classroom when things were getting

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really busy um everyone's sensory load was very bushy over christmas obviously

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um and i was suggesting some things that they they could try but then i was saying don't try them when

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when they're already upset because otherwise they've not had a chance to understand that that's

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supportive you need to play them you need to play the games and play the activities at a time where

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they're already rested and settled and feeling really positive about being at school in the classroom

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and tell them like oh these are going to help our body feel so nice while we play these activities

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and then as they're getting upset at another time you can go you know that box of things that helped

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our body feel nice it looks like you might need those should we go and do that and then they've

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already got that that kind of pre-learn experience of oh yeah that box is good like let's go and do

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that because that's gonna help me feel better it's not so obvious when you say it like that because

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when we're feeling dysregulated if my husband came and offered me like oh it looks like you need this

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brand new thing that i bought when you get like no i definitely did can you imagine like no wonder

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the kids are like no obviously not like what are you putting in and then they're autistic and they

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don't like new change either like let's just think about the layers here let's think about what we're

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asking our children to do here they've never seen a strategy before it looks like a demand you know

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let's not put extra demands on anything like this we've got all of these layers on all of those possible like pda

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yeah and even if they haven't got pda when you're feeling dysregulated you don't want extra demands

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it comes from anxiety often so that's just going to bring more challenge more pressure and more

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language and things actually we kind of just want less when we're dysregulated but we know that

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when children are dysregulated that their their brains aren't in a learning state they're in this

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fight flight freeze mode yeah and so actually if we're then trying to teach them a new strategy

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to support this dysregulation their brain's not ready for it and actually any language that we use

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any props that we use any symbols that we use are going to be are going to add to that overwhelm

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rather than support it so i think yeah the pre-teaching and the rehearsal and the practicing

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of of these kind of strategies is really important definitely and practicing at the level that they

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can access when they're dysregulated as well because i find lots of my children i don't know

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maybe they use an ipad to communicate typically in a day when they're regulated and that's great

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but we also need to be practicing photos and sound buttons and objects too because when they're when

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this particular children i'm thinking about is dysregulated it's absolutely no way he could access

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his talker on his ipad yeah because he can't like he he seems to it's not even object reference

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it's not even symbols it's not even photos he goes right back to just needing an object not even

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choices either he goes right back to where he was you know five years ago of yeah tell me what i

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need to show me what i need no language and give it to me and then we'll go and do it together and

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that's what he needs and i think we need to remember that as well when they're regulated is also

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don't if they've moved on don't stop don't stop using the sound buttons and the objects and the

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photos have it all have it always because you'll find that that's comfort and that's understandable

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when they're in that dysregulation isn't it there are so many points in i'm just thinking about like

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the academic year there are so many points in the academic year where i talk to staff and where

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i i know and expect the children that i support are going to be starting to get wobbly there are

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there are really key times kind of across the year and it they're very frequent key times but it's

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when their their capacity for all that they have to do all the time very actively just runs out and

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so quite often staff will will be worried that children are losing skills or they're they're

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showing signs of regression and and they're worried about um you know they they used to need all of

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this stuff at the start of term and you know we've worked we've worked so hard and and now you know

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it's it's all we're you know they they're not coping again and it's it's because we know gradually

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over the term you've kind of taken away all of those supports because they were doing well

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they could cope but actually you know they they just need it back and it's it's not that they've

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lost skills it's that other other factors are in play now and so they're full and they they need

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they need you to help them um yeah that's right i spoke to an author a few weeks ago on the podcast

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who explained it as a cup so when they come we can't see their cup their cup is invisible but

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sometimes when they come into school their cup is already really really full and they can only they

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only have a little little little bit of space and then a child makes a bit of noise and then there's

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a supply teaching assistant in and we're a bit late for for register and their cup is full and

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they dysregulate whereas the day before maybe they had a really good sleep and the morning went

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smoothly because i don't know mom and dad were home i don't know you know like they had their

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breath i don't know every whatever it is that went well and then they come into school and their cup's

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only an inch full and actually they've got lots of capacity so all those same things happen in the

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day but they've still got a space to manage that and i think that's a really lovely visual of that

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invisible cup because we don't know i mean sometimes schools have home school books and that's

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fantastic if parents are engaging with that talking about sleep and if they've been under the weather

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if their change has happened if grandma's picking them up from school you know all these things

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actually really important for a school to know and reverse as well same at home for them to know

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what's happened at school maybe they had a photo day or maybe they had a different teacher that

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day whatever didn't have peer that day it's really important because it just lets us know

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how full their cup might be and what they can manage and cope with when they get into that

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next environment absolutely and i think sometimes there can be like a delayed knock-on effect for

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those cups as well so maybe photo days on wednesday and actually we're all right on thursday but friday

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we're absolutely exhausted because we kind of you know we did we did really well with wednesday and

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we kind of managed thursday and now we just were done for friday and actually then it's really

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surprising almost for us as supporting adults because it seems like such a long time ago that

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that we were surviving that that unusual day but actually we've come to friday and we're

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and we're empty and we have to just completely adapt where we are and what we've got on that day

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absolutely we it works quite well in my class actually because i only teach in my classroom

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on thursdays and fridays i come on thursday and they're all exhausted and the adults are exhausted

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as well and actually it's a really lovely way of finishing the week because we can be a little bit

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more flexible in the structure so i think the structure is pillars so there are structured

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pillars throughout the day that keep us in check but actually if they need a sensory break when

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they need it they can have it and if they need a sensory diet break or a snack when they need it

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they can have it and i think by the end of the week it just gets us through those last few days

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of feeling that i feel like if my two days were on a monday and tuesday i'd probably work a little

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bit differently actually they could probably hope with that because they've had the weekend they

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actually just want some rigid ditty and they want some black and white yes and nose piece because

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they've just had a bit more slothful weekend and i think that work just works really nicely in my

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room anyway i work with mainly autistic non-speaking learners and it just works it works really well

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for us and then by friday friday and swimming in the morning and then ips and attentional

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to swim in the afternoon it's a wonderful wonderful way to end the week and it's really fun it's really

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adult led it's all about relationship building and yeah being child led in interaction in that way

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and then they're ready for the week and it kind of flows through it's a really

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love i mean i did build the time table friday is a wonderful wonderful day i have very lovely days

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to be fair i have picked the best lessons and sometimes my husband says so what are you up to

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today i'm like i feel embarrassed saying because it just sounds like i'm going swimming and then

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then yoga and then bikes all afternoon exactly and then if it's snow day it all goes to pot and we

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just play in the snow yeah absolutely yeah i sometimes i think the same as i pack up my car

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or like as i'm packing my bag and i'm like i wonder where the shaving foam is i wonder how many people

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wonder that to themselves if they pack up on a friday they can't be many oh it's so fun what a

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fun way to what a fun way to work though isn't it what what an honor and i really do think that as

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well it's such an honor to uh build relationships with these children because my goodness are they

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so capable of such beautiful and rich relationships which i feel like lots of people will never have

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the pleasure of realizing so much is shown on tv shows and movies so wrongly that they are their

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people and and children and adults lost in this world that don't want the outside world and can't

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can't and don't want the outside world and um and are kind of locked in i suppose it's kind of often

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how autism is portrayed isn't it and actually my goodness once you build trust in relationships and

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and learn their language i like to say learn their language of movements and learn their language of

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vocalizations and eye contact and hand flicks and stimming my goodness they are they're screaming to

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to be communicated with and to build relationships with and they're so social it's just we're not

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speaking their language right um yeah i think there always used to be a a phrase on assessment

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forms and things where children would be described as being like in their own world or like i still

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see that lost within their lost within their own world and i think it's i think it's such an unfair

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way to to describe a child because i think i think we are trying to drag them into our world instead

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of go what are you up to like what's what's going on for you obviously finding something super

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interesting what what is it like let me be part of it like let me come and see what it is and

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understand why that's fascinating for you and and join you and talk to you about it and connect with

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you about it and communicate about it and actually then you are connected but i think they're not

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children that want to be dragged into a world that it's scary it doesn't make sense or there isn't

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very supportive often um or repeating or is a bit noisy or a bit loud or a bit

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too bright and so actually you know there's so many factors that that mean actually staying where

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they are in their place feels happy and safe and so instead of kind of dragging them out a bit i

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think if we can kind of connect and become part of what they're doing i find i mean that's the

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um the the kind of the rationale for all of my therapy planning is is looking at like what what

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makes this child like love play what what do they love about play um what do they find real joy in

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and what can i create for us to do together that kind of combines these things they love number

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if they love number blocks then how can i create a play that means me being there is going to make

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the play better for them and so actually they want me to be there rather than me going no you must

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play with me how can i control their behavior yeah how can i yeah how can i set this play up so

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actually having me there is so helpful they're like passing me the blocks to unclick them because

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i've accidentally brought them all clicked together so we better just you know and you know

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thinking about things like that so that actually we can work together within the play and connect

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that way whereas actually if we like sat at the table and i like went through numbers with them

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because they like numbers face to face and you know and and it's just it's not it's what brings

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them joy and so actually again if we think about when our brain is in its best learning state it's

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when we feel safe and happy and motivated and we're getting a nice little kind of dopamine kind of

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happy you know all those lovely chemicals that happen for us when we're finding joy in something

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and so you know if we can weave therapy and learning into that then our brain is just going

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to absorb that we're going to make so much so much progress because yeah yeah the children are kind

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of happy and willing and ready for new information but yeah like dragging children off to go and do

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something that i've picked you can see why that type of therapy is less effective yeah and it

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comes from a good place that you i know you're trying to help them i know you're not saying that

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but it's just more effective to be led by them isn't it what i like to use is intensive interaction

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it's completely relaxed and child led in that way and i think as you were describing it then i thought

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yeah that's exactly what affirming practice is if we were wanting to describe it it's that we're

390
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:14,160
bridging the gap between us and their world but we're crossing the bridge in affirming practice

391
00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:18,800
whereas in non-affirming practices we're asking them to cross the bridge and i feel like that's

392
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:24,960
the difference and we're asking them to fit into our world whereas actually we need we need to cross

393
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:32,320
the bridge and and and make sense to them in their language and in their way of playing yeah and when

394
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:38,880
we say play as well some parents um they will my child doesn't play and i think okay but do they

395
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:47,600
line up do they flick things off do they tip do they uh post do they you know that's that's what

396
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:54,720
we mean by play do they spin do they really anything that anything that a child does that

397
00:39:54,720 --> 00:40:05,280
brings them joy is is play yeah and quite often i think for autistic children their play is autistic

398
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:12,080
play and so you almost have to kind of erase from your mind what you might traditionally think of

399
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:18,240
as as play like setting up a doll's house or kind of like rocking a baby and putting a blanket over

400
00:40:18,240 --> 00:40:26,000
them and actually just watch what your child does and notice any patterns or any sequences or

401
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:32,160
anything that they seem to do over and over again um and then go that's their play that's what that's

402
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:37,680
what they picked like out of everything in this room they have picked six bottle tops from the

403
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:43,440
washing up rack and they are putting them in a line and then flicking them out of a line and then

404
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:47,520
putting them back in a line that's that's their play like that's what's bringing them joy right

405
00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:53,920
now so for that i would say then you can go and sit next to them and every time they flick the

406
00:40:53,920 --> 00:41:00,080
bottle top away from them you can go and you can kind of add a little bit of a person reaction to

407
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:04,000
it i love how you describe that then because sometimes they're like oh but they don't let me

408
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:08,720
do it with them or for them like no they probably won't because actually they have a certain way of

409
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:13,200
doing things and they've done this for an awful long time by themselves and we messed stuff up

410
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:22,960
all the time our intentions are so good but very often as adults we really mess it up because they

411
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:27,920
have got a system they've got a thing that they want to do they don't need us and no and we're

412
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:34,560
so desperate to be part of the play and to join in that we accidentally get in the way and what we

413
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:40,400
then do is we prove their point which is that other people get in the way and so what yeah again

414
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:49,200
one of the the best kind of tips is to just sit alongside for a while to sit alongside be present

415
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:57,360
but not actively involved and then what i tend to do is like a stepping stone into their play is i'd

416
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:04,800
maybe find my own bottle top and just have one and i just do the same thing as them but but separately

417
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:12,160
and alongside sometimes i even have to have invisible things because sometimes me having

418
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:17,360
something that they're not part of their set is really upsetting and dysregulating or they want

419
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:23,280
everything that i've got and then it becomes a bit of a battle so if you're finding that do try that

420
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:27,280
but if you're finding that sometimes i have invisible things and i just copy the movement or

421
00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:36,080
the sound or the something because i'm still joining in without that weird battle and if you

422
00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:39,920
feel that they're uncomfortable with how close you are then take a step back or if they feel

423
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:45,280
that you're so comfortable with how you're sitting then sit somewhere else but but they're obviously

424
00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:50,640
aware of you and that's good that is your start it's just we want them to be as comfortable as

425
00:42:50,640 --> 00:42:56,400
possible and and yeah and this isn't a magic wand it takes time and that's the point isn't it but

426
00:42:56,400 --> 00:43:03,280
if you're committed to it then gradually yeah and quite often when we do something new and we're

427
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:11,520
trying this this kind of play and interaction therapy to start with it will feel new and and

428
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:16,400
maybe a little bit too much for children and so they might watch you do your invisible bottle top

429
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:24,880
and they might take their seven over to the other side and kind of say no thank you this was actually

430
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:30,400
a me time activity and again that's absolutely fine i tend to just narrate along with it and go

431
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:36,640
oh i had a turn but now it's time for you to play by yourself i understand i'll come back later and

432
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:43,120
you know just narrate alongside it and almost give that like advocating phrase to them as they

433
00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:48,480
as they go so they move along and i go oh i need a bit of space and they kind of as if i'm talking

434
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:53,360
as them so that they can hear that phrase they might use it another time if they can

435
00:43:53,360 --> 00:44:00,160
um it means that you've had this this very equal interaction there like i didn't come in and insist

436
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:06,080
that i must be part of your play um i haven't taken over i haven't taken your toys i haven't

437
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:14,000
touched your play yeah i've offered to be part of it i've asked for an invite and then you've either

438
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:20,240
replied saying yep join in or no thanks not today and both of i think we have to show children that

439
00:44:20,240 --> 00:44:25,840
both of those things are an option like they can say no thanks for you joining into this play it

440
00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:30,640
feels too special exactly exactly and sometimes it is we all like me time don't we and and that

441
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:36,160
that relationship and trust will have to build won't it and and if you're showing them i respect

442
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:42,320
your space and i allow you to advocate for yourself and you give consent to me working with you and

443
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:48,960
playing with you and i honor when you don't give that then next time they might be a little bit

444
00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:55,040
less anxious that you're going to slip in because they'll realize that this person doesn't do that

445
00:44:55,040 --> 00:45:03,280
in you know and i think it's a huge gesture of connection to allow a child to say oh i'd like

446
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:10,560
to do this by myself and for an adult to respect that yeah i think that it can be really new for a

447
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:15,680
child they might not have ever experienced that before because there are so many other times where

448
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:20,560
as adults we have to lead them and we have to guide them and we have to show them and

449
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:25,280
you know we have to be in charge of whether you can eat whether you can eat that and whether you

450
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:32,640
can climb on that but actually in play they can be fully in charge of that and so it's really

451
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:41,040
empowering for them in a paid environment it is your job you're paid to work with this child

452
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:46,800
you might be being watched by the parent you know it takes so much always being watched so it might

453
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:54,800
take so much confidence to step back because you almost want something to happen i can imagine yes

454
00:45:55,600 --> 00:46:01,840
yeah yeah but i think it's it's about explaining that there's a reason for that for that space

455
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:09,040
and that distance and that my my motivation is not to make them talk or or to make them play with me

456
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:16,880
like that's not my aim my aim in therapy is for us to build a connection through play and a connection

457
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:24,000
is a two-way thing like i can't make them connect with me but so often that offering of like this is

458
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:29,680
up to you means that we do connect because you know they go off and they do their thing and then

459
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:35,840
maybe i play something different over here and they are curious about it and so they come over

460
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:40,000
and maybe they take all of my bottle tops that i started to play with but all that's okay

461
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:47,680
we're still interacting now and i say you need them all okay here they are and we you know i'm

462
00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:54,560
then i'm then helping yeah passing the bottle tops over are there any more in this basket i will go

463
00:46:54,560 --> 00:47:00,880
and check for you i found three more here you go you know and we're now in a collaborative play

464
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:07,040
accidentally yeah um but it started actually with me being rejected and accepting that rejection

465
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:15,600
yes yes it was really important isn't it yes yes that builds that um cool in this absolutely

466
00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:21,840
and they're not even equal but they're actually in charge of this interaction are they they're

467
00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:28,720
fully in charge and in control and okay yeah great yeah and that's that's right and then

468
00:47:28,720 --> 00:47:34,400
meanwhile you're thinking in your head right how can i do this different next week or do i do i

469
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:39,200
have all the bottle tops all over the room and we have to look for them or whatever that you might

470
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:44,560
be yet your next time you're just thinking aren't you like how can i extend this how can i move this

471
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:50,160
on a little bit or or what could have been better you know all we're constantly questioning that

472
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:54,880
aren't we we're constantly questioning that aren't we and kind of improving our own practice in that

473
00:47:54,880 --> 00:48:01,520
way and it's yeah and it no it very rarely is what we plan i love your instagram post when you say

474
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:07,520
this is what i set up and this is what we ended up doing we actually played because it's so true

475
00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:15,760
yeah and it has i think it has to yeah you have to be willing to be really flexible and have an

476
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:22,240
idea and a plan because that's important you know you know what you're hoping for but also be very

477
00:48:22,240 --> 00:48:28,240
accepting of the fact that the children that i support usually have a very clear plan for

478
00:48:28,240 --> 00:48:35,360
themselves and and and our plans may or may not kind of cross over with each other and that's okay

479
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:42,080
we might have to just work with with with where we are and like you were saying earlier each

480
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:48,720
each visit that i do or each session that i do like i have to look at where that child's at on

481
00:48:48,720 --> 00:48:55,680
that day so how you know where's where's their cup at where's their you know did they skip lunch

482
00:48:55,680 --> 00:49:00,720
today because it wasn't what they liked is it friday or is it monday did they have a school

483
00:49:00,720 --> 00:49:06,640
trip earlier in the week you know has mum been poorly and so the routine's been off because

484
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:14,960
auntie's been in to to help run the show you know it's you know children are i think the children

485
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:20,480
aren't aren't robots and so we can't plan for robots we have to plan for tiny humans that are

486
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:25,520
going to have very different feelings very different expectations every single time you see them

487
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:34,080
so yeah that's the best bit of the job isn't it yeah yeah absolutely i think you have to yeah you

488
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:39,680
have to really love that that kind of on the go okay this is where we're at how are we going to

489
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:46,000
like weave that that therapy idea into this now instead yeah yeah i mean thank goodness children

490
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:51,760
aren't robots and children aren't all similar like i love that i have 10 very much individuals in my

491
00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:56,480
room because it just keeps it so interesting i've never i've never i've probably worked with over

492
00:49:56,480 --> 00:50:03,360
400 children i've never worked with the same like even remotely similar child that was diagnosed

493
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:09,760
autistic by the way you know like such diversity which is so exciting i'm always learning and

494
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:15,120
learning new shows and learning new phrases that are interesting and learning new ways of playing

495
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:20,960
and bouncing and stimming and all these things that every child enters my room every year i kind

496
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:26,720
of like oh yeah that is so cool ah that student five years ago would have loved this you know like

497
00:50:26,720 --> 00:50:31,760
i'm constantly like learning and it's just what keeps it so interesting isn't it the fact that

498
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:37,600
you can do this for so many years and work with so many individuals and and yeah that is exactly

499
00:50:37,600 --> 00:50:42,240
what they are they're just so unique aren't they and it's just it's just really wonderfully

500
00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:51,920
exciting yeah and yeah it's really i think that that diagnosis will only ever teach you a very

501
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:58,240
small amount about how that child perceives the world but everything else about them will be

502
00:50:58,240 --> 00:51:05,440
entirely unique and so i think it's really important that when we when we know that a child

503
00:51:05,440 --> 00:51:11,680
has has a diagnosis and is autistic that that doesn't it doesn't end there there's like there's

504
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:17,440
a lot more for you to explore about who that child is and how you can support them and what

505
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:22,560
their passions are what their strengths are what their struggles are because otherwise sometimes

506
00:51:22,560 --> 00:51:30,000
we limit them honestly we assume that they are incapable of x y and z and that's a real issue

507
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:37,760
real issue because that can mean that they become incapable of it because we're not allowing or

508
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:44,320
facilitating opportunities in order to build equal friendships with mainstream students i don't know

509
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:51,920
we're not allowing opportunities to prepare their snack independently you know we're not allowing

510
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:57,440
to not become too prompt independent prompt dependent sorry because we're always prompting

511
00:51:57,440 --> 00:52:02,560
because we're assuming that they can't you know all of these kind of things that i need to remind

512
00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:08,640
myself of constantly like you said it's the forefront of my mind not only is is this affirming

513
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:17,840
but also am i doing too much for them as well am i being too much i call this a gentle stretch

514
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:23,600
so that we're we're always looking for a gentle stretch for our children so we we don't want to

515
00:52:23,600 --> 00:52:30,000
push them into a level of discomfort because we know that children don't learn through discomfort

516
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:38,080
that's a very old-fashioned way of working where we power through difficult things and we repeat

517
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:43,440
difficult things to try and create kind of resilience to them but actually we know that

518
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:48,080
actually we know that particularly for autistic children that doesn't support their learning it

519
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:54,560
actually just creates trauma and an ability to mask how they they really feel about something

520
00:52:54,560 --> 00:53:02,640
so we we don't want to push too far and create distress but also we don't want to limit we don't

521
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:09,360
want to over support them when they actually have capacity for this gentle stretch but again like

522
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:14,320
we were saying we've got to look at like where they're at which is on monday they've got capacity

523
00:53:14,320 --> 00:53:18,880
for this gentle stretch and on friday they they don't and yesterday they did it and today they

524
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:24,560
can't and it is like an elastic band in that way isn't it of just working it out i like to start

525
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:29,760
every single day with interaction time so we have at least half an hour 45 minutes before we even

526
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:34,400
start register time of whatever the child wants so sometimes it's snacks sometimes it's sensory

527
00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:40,160
diet sometimes it's reading pacing bouncing whatever they want but what the adult is doing

528
00:53:40,160 --> 00:53:47,200
in that time is connecting so if it's snack they're saying oh yummy or so like oh yeah or whatever

529
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:51,760
it is you know or if they're bouncing they're bouncing to my ten yorta whatever it is whatever

530
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:56,240
it is or sometimes being in the room quiet with their invisible things whatever whatever works

531
00:53:56,240 --> 00:54:00,720
for that child but it's a really lovely way to start the day because then whatever happens after

532
00:54:00,720 --> 00:54:07,280
that you've already built that connection you've already grounded in that co-regulation in that way

533
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:12,560
and it is it's a really wonderful thing to do and i highly recommend all adults that work with children

534
00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:18,640
kind of try and co-regulate when you first start working with them in that way i know that lots of

535
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:24,320
caregivers or supporting adults in whatever capacity will be listening to this thinking

536
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:32,080
this sounds wonderful i work with or care for somebody that's non-speaking that i've always

537
00:54:32,080 --> 00:54:37,040
thought couldn't build a connection with me that doesn't really need me it's quite independent

538
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:44,800
is it as simple as starting by with rather than even the child even noticing that you're doing

539
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:48,960
anything different maybe don't even do anything different but just a mindset shift of i'm going

540
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:54,800
i'm going to attempt to connect with you by me crossing the bridge to you is that a great place

541
00:54:54,800 --> 00:55:02,960
to start yeah i think so i every every i've never met a child that i i wasn't able to build a

542
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:09,280
connection with i don't think that as humans we're built to not connect with people i think it's a

543
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:15,840
really important part of of who we are i think that we all have really different ways of of

544
00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:23,280
connecting with people and so quite often it's about working out what connection means to that

545
00:55:23,280 --> 00:55:32,400
child because again i think we have a really neurotypical standard in our head of connection

546
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:39,600
lanes we'll be face to face we'll both be laughing we'll both have these like really relaxed joyful

547
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:46,240
expressions on our face you know yeah we'll we'll be yeah we'll be connected positively and emotionally

548
00:55:46,240 --> 00:55:52,880
and and it will be the same toy and we'll be taking turns and and talking to each other with our words

549
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:59,040
and actually that's that's not what connection feels like for a lot of children actually connection

550
00:55:59,040 --> 00:56:04,320
can feel like having their back to you but leaning on your arm because they can feel your warmth and

551
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:10,320
they know that you're there and they can lean on you and you can kind of help them to rock while

552
00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:15,600
they're doing their activity and they like you to just sing the frog song while they organize their

553
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:20,720
frogs and actually that's yeah we're still connected we're still playing we're still doing

554
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:29,600
an activity that brings us both joy and we're both involved in the same task but it's not what

555
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:35,280
what the books and the videos tell us connection looks like and i think sometimes that that helps

556
00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:40,320
yeah exactly and what we experience ourselves as connection sometimes that can make you feel

557
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:45,280
a disconnect and that isn't because there's a disconnect that isn't because there's not a

558
00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:52,720
connection there we just need to put our personal feelings aside and our wants and wishes aside

559
00:56:52,720 --> 00:56:59,520
and put them at the forefront of of working for them i always think that as soon as you become

560
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:08,720
either embarrassed or disappointed or hurt all of a sudden it's because you've put the spotlight on

561
00:57:08,720 --> 00:57:13,360
yourself and actually to build a connection the spotlight has to be on them you have to just be

562
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:17,760
thinking about them and what they're doing and them and as soon as you start thinking about

563
00:57:17,760 --> 00:57:21,040
yourself because you've become embarrassed whatever then that means you to just become

564
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:26,720
you're too self-aware you need to switch that and then and then tune in again you're not tuned in

565
00:57:26,720 --> 00:57:34,640
if you're feeling those feelings of embarrassment or disconnect i guess if we think back to

566
00:57:34,640 --> 00:57:41,040
our analogy of kind of like crossing the bridge it means that you've accidentally gone back in

567
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:46,400
you've gone back over the bridge and you need to just work your way back across and that's okay if

568
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:50,240
you start to do these things and all of a sudden become embarrassed or aware of everyone around you

569
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:58,000
or whatever that's fine take a breath yeah go for a little break and then and then tune back in again

570
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:02,640
because it can be quite exhausting i mean it's interesting actually because what we're asking

571
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:08,480
the children to do every day all day and coming over to the bridge to meet us when you try it

572
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:13,840
over there and try their sounds that you can't make and their movement and not getting an

573
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:21,920
interaction how you think you should interact it's really exhausting it's really tiring and i like

574
00:58:21,920 --> 00:58:27,760
i'll quite often say to families you know like what i've done today in this hour like what we've done

575
00:58:27,760 --> 00:58:34,960
together like it's it's too hard for you to do this all day every day like my expectation for

576
00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:41,600
therapy is not for you to lift everything you've seen here and do it 24 hours a day seven days a

577
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:50,000
week because i mean it's just it's not it's not a doable target for anyone yeah because it's called

578
00:58:50,000 --> 00:58:55,920
intensive interaction for a reason it's it's really intensive and you're and you're having to change

579
00:58:55,920 --> 00:59:02,960
everything about how you would typically interact yeah like you say that is also sometimes the

580
00:59:02,960 --> 00:59:09,040
expectation that we place on our children so it's quite a nice way of us helping that empathy and

581
00:59:09,040 --> 00:59:15,840
that that mindset shift and thinking like okay hang on this am i expecting something that i'm

582
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:21,600
actually not able to do myself like within today and if i am let's just let's just meet in the

583
00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:27,200
middle a little bit more it's a really great place to start of it of noticing and accepting

584
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:34,000
what they're better than you at yes it's a really humble great place to start building a connection

585
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:41,360
as a as a supporting adult i can't make that sound i can't make that that ribbon spin like you do

586
00:59:41,360 --> 00:59:48,960
you are the expert in that yes me it's a really wonderful way and often they were up and that is

587
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:53,840
exactly what how you will feel you will feel well i can't make that noise what a wonderful way to

588
00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:58,480
start building a connection because all of a sudden they're the expert of this interaction

589
00:59:58,480 --> 01:00:04,640
they're in charge and you are the learner and i think that how wonderful how affirming is that

590
01:00:04,640 --> 01:00:12,960
too yeah and if you can show that genuine joy and that genuine curiosity curiosity and kind of

591
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:18,640
inspiration in it like oh my goodness that is marvelous that's amazing look what you've managed

592
01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:28,000
to do here yeah i'm not in not in not not faking it like yes yeah genuine you can see children

593
01:00:28,000 --> 01:00:33,040
really respond i see children really respond to that almost i'll be see children a bit taken

594
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:39,520
aback by it as if oh yeah thanks like i'm gonna do it again and then they get this this kind of

595
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:46,080
really surprised kind of magical reaction from from an adult and that's motivating to to do the

596
01:00:46,080 --> 01:00:50,480
thing again and to see if you can get that reaction again from someone and so the theme will be

597
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:55,040
boosted confidence will be boosted it's very easy to like someone that's boosting you up all the time

598
01:00:55,040 --> 01:01:02,560
i mean absolutely this is like friend i want exactly yeah exactly and then you're in exactly

599
01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:10,480
and then you're in so my target for this week then after this chat is to make myself vulnerable

600
01:01:11,600 --> 01:01:18,880
to these connections to to cross over to the bridge to be to put myself in a position where i

601
01:01:18,880 --> 01:01:25,280
i might not know the answer i might not be able to do the thing and to sit with that uncomfortable

602
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:30,640
feeling as a lovely beautiful reminder that in this interaction with this connection i'm not the

603
01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:36,640
expert and actually they can teach me far more in this in this world than than i can teach them i

604
01:01:36,640 --> 01:01:53,520
can teach them i think it's a really wonderful thing for the week so thank you so much